Ep. 249- Are EMAIL NEWSLETTER Sponsorships Effective?✔️❌ GUEST: Co-founder of Media Intercept - Jeffrey Eisenberg [Biggest Player in Email Newsletter World!]🌎

Summary

Episode Summary: "Are EMAIL NEWSLETTER Sponsorships Effective?✔️❌" (Ep. 249)

Podcast Title: Do This, NOT That: Marketing Tips with Jay Schwedelson
Host: Jay Schwedelson
Guest: Jeffrey Eisenberg, Co-founder & Chief Revenue Officer of Media Intercept
Release Date: January 3, 2025

In Episode 249 of "Do This, NOT That," host Jay Schwedelson engages in an insightful conversation with Jeffrey Eisenberg, the co-founder and Chief Revenue Officer of Media Intercept. As a leading figure in the email newsletter sponsorship landscape, Jeffrey shares his extensive knowledge and expertise on leveraging email newsletters as an effective marketing channel.

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1. Introducing Jeffrey Eisenberg and Media Intercept

Timestamp: [00:40]

Jay welcomes Jeffrey to the show, highlighting his role at Media Intercept and the company's prominence in the email newsletter sponsorship arena. Jeffrey provides a brief overview of his journey, starting from media ad sales in radio and digital platforms to founding Media Intercept. He emphasizes the company's mission to bridge the gap in the newsletter sponsorship market, catering to both B2C and B2B clients with nearly 100 advertisers and thousands of newsletters under their management.

Jeffrey Eisenberg [01:34]: "We saw sort of a gap in the newsletter business... there was a proliferation of newsletters out there. It's still sort of the wild west in terms of how to properly gauge the value of those audiences, sponsor it, do so in the right way."

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2. Email Newsletters as a Marketing Channel

Timestamp: [03:08]

Jay dives into the core topic by questioning how businesses of varying sizes can effectively utilize email newsletters in their marketing strategies. Jeffrey explains that email newsletters function as a mid-funnel solution, offering both branding and performance advantages. He outlines different pricing models, such as Cost Per Click (CPC) and Cost Per Acquisition (CPA), which reduce the risk for marketers compared to traditional flat-fee sponsorships.

Jeffrey Eisenberg [03:41]: "It's still very much like what I would call a mid funnel solution. Right. So you get a lot of the benefit of say just branding and awareness, but there is still a large performance component to it."

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3. Getting Started with Newsletter Sponsorships

Timestamp: [03:41]

Jeffrey breaks down the initial steps for marketers interested in exploring newsletter sponsorships. He emphasizes the importance of understanding marketing objectives, whether it's targeting a niche B2B audience or building broad consumer awareness. He advises aligning these goals with the right newsletter creators who resonate with the brand's audience and interests, moving away from programmatic approaches to more contextual, strategic partnerships.

Jeffrey Eisenberg [05:17]: "Innovators are moving away from programmatic in newsletters to a much more contextual way of thinking... identifying those creators that you think best align with your brand."

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4. Effective Content Formats for Newsletter Ads

Timestamp: [07:20]

When discussing the best content formats for newsletter sponsorships, Jeffrey highlights the effectiveness of combining text and images. He advises against relying solely on banner ads, noting that integrated, content-driven ads that blend with the newsletter’s narrative tend to perform better. This approach leverages the trust between the newsletter's author and its subscribers, enhancing engagement rates.

Jeffrey Eisenberg [07:20]: "It's clear that it's text plus image, but it's written text, hard HTML5, just implanted in the newsletter as content... when you're reading something from a trusted voice and they're then pitching you a product or service that's relevant."

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5. Personal Brand vs. Publisher Brand Newsletters

Timestamp: [08:48]

Jay inquires about the effectiveness of sponsored content from personal brands versus established publisher brands. Jeffrey responds that both have their merits, depending on the advertiser's objectives. Personal brand endorsements can offer higher credibility and relevance, especially for niche products, while larger publisher newsletters provide broader awareness and access to sizable, targeted audiences.

Jeffrey Eisenberg [08:48]: "If you're selling a wellness product, you love to have Arnold Schwarzenegger in the Daily Pump, basically pitch that product as something that, you know, he endorses. There's just credibility there."

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6. Managing Performance Expectations

Timestamp: [10:22]

Managing expectations is crucial for successful newsletter sponsorships. Jeffrey advises setting clear objectives and aligning them with publishers from the outset. He cautions against overestimating metrics like open rates, suggesting more realistic benchmarks (e.g., a 35-40% open rate) to gauge performance effectively. Understanding the relevance of the audience and the purpose of the campaign—whether it's driving clicks or enhancing awareness—helps in setting achievable goals.

Jeffrey Eisenberg [10:48]: "Set expectations with that publisher in advance... for example, if a publisher says, 'I have a list of a million subscribers with an 80% open rate,' that's probably not accurate. A realistic benchmark is 35 to 40%."

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7. Monetizing Your Own Newsletter

Timestamp: [12:19]

Jay poses a common question about the minimum audience size required to monetize a company’s own newsletter. Jeffrey counters that monetization potential isn't solely dependent on subscriber count but also on the quality and specificity of the audience. A niche newsletter with 12,000 highly engaged, targeted subscribers can be as valuable as a larger, more general one. He also mentions strategies like backfilling to help smaller newsletters generate revenue and sustain operations.

Jeffrey Eisenberg [12:19]: "If they're 12,000, marketers like that are all active buyers for a specific Martech SaaS product that costs $100,000 a year. That's an attractive potential audience for a marketer."

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8. Connecting with Jeffrey Eisenberg

Timestamp: [17:03]

As the conversation wraps up, Jeffrey provides avenues for listeners to connect with him and explore Media Intercept’s offerings. He encourages reaching out via their website and LinkedIn for tailored assistance in navigating the newsletter sponsorship landscape.

Jeffrey Eisenberg [17:20]: "mediaintercept.com is a great place to start... We're here to help people save time and invest in this space in a way that's going to have meaningful impact for their businesses."

---

Key Takeaways

• Email Newsletters as a Strategic Channel: Email newsletters offer a blend of branding and performance benefits, suitable for various marketing objectives.

• Content Integration Over Traditional Ads: Engaging, content-integrated ads outperform standard banner ads by leveraging trusted voices and storytelling.

• Tailored Approaches for Different Objectives: Whether aiming for niche targeting or broad awareness, selecting the right type of newsletter (personal vs. publisher) is crucial.

• Realistic Performance Benchmarks: Setting achievable metrics and aligning expectations with publishers ensures better campaign outcomes.

• Value of Audience Quality: The engagement and specificity of the audience can outweigh sheer subscriber numbers in determining sponsorship value.

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For marketers looking to delve into email newsletter sponsorships, Jeffrey Eisenberg's insights provide a comprehensive guide to navigating this evolving landscape effectively. To learn more or engage with Media Intercept, visit mediaintercept.com or connect with Jeffrey on LinkedIn.

Transcript

[Jay Schwedelson]

Foreign.

[Podcast Host]

Welcome to do this, not that.

[Jay Schwedelson]

The podcast for marketers.

[Podcast Host]

You'll walk away from each episode with actionable tips you can test immediately. You'll hear from the best minds in marketing who will share tactics, quick wins.

[Jay Schwedelson]

And pitfalls to avoid.

[Podcast Host]

Also dig into life, pop culture, and the chaos that is our everyday. I'm Jay Schwedelson. Let's do this, not that.

[Jay Schwedelson]

We are back for do this, not that, presented by Marigold. And we got a guest, we got a smart dude, somebody way smarter than me, and somebody that knows a lot about email newsletters. And we're going to dig into all that today. So who is here? We got Jeffrey Eisenberg. He is the chief revenue officer and co founder of Media Intercept. And Media Intercept is like the leading organization. If you're trying to get involved with sponsoring newsletters and sponsoring content, they're crushing it. Jeffrey's been doing this for way too long and he's got a wealth of experience. I cannot wait to talk to him about all this. Jeffrey, welcome to the show.

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

Appreciate it, Jay. Thanks for having me.

[Jay Schwedelson]

All right, so this is going to be fun. I've known Jeff for a long time, so we're going to crush it. So before we get into email newsletters, the good, the bad and the ugly, how what is your deal? Why is email newsletters your world? How'd you get involved with this chaos?

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

It's a long story. Not super interesting. Started my career in media ad sales and I've done everything from starting in radio, gotten digital relatively early, video specifically. So we're talking 2008, which is really pre YouTube monetization and was in the really the video branded content world for a long time and did that in New York and then ended up moving to Florida and started consulting and consulted for a few media companies. And one of them was really a commerce company that was looking to monetize some media that they had. And we sort of stumbled upon newsletters as a business and did that for a number of years before a business partner of mine and I decided to launch Media Intercept. Really because we saw sort of a gap in the newsletter business. There was a proliferation of newsletters out there. It's still sort of the wild west in terms of how to properly gauge the value of those audiences, sponsor it, do so in the right way. So we launched the company a couple years ago and as Jay mentioned, we have become one of the market leaders in the space. We do B2C, we do B2B. We work with thousands of newsletters and almost 100 advertisers at this point. So we're pretty good scaled business and it's been interesting. There's certainly a lot to learn in the space. I think we're still really not even on first base. We're still in the batter's box in terms of this channel growing as a real go to channel for marketers. But yeah, that's a little bit of my story.

[Jay Schwedelson]

So let's dig into that for a second because people are listening. Whether you're a tiny B2B business to business or consumer marketer or you're really big, you may not be isolating out email newsletters as a marketing channel, but it is, right? It is a marketing channel and we all get it. We sign up for newsletters and you see ads in those newsletters. So how does somebody put their toe in the water? How does somebody get involved with testing email newsletters as a paid vehicle to drive their marketing programs? How do they do it?

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

Yeah, I mean it's, it's really interesting because you know, where the space is today, you know, it's still very much like what I would call a mid funnel solution. Right. So you get a lot of the benefit of say just branding and awareness, but there is still a large performance component to it, which does make it easier for a lot of marketers to jump in because there's, there's not as much risk as just, hey, I'm going to buy a sponsored article for a flat fee or even sponsor a newsletter on a flat fee. You know, we as a company work on a CPC basis which we think of as a shared risk model, but there's CPA models out there as well. And I think it really starts with like understanding what your objectives are as a marketer. What am I trying to do? Am I B2B really focused on a specific, you know, selling a specific SaaS product to a very particular audience, which is very narrow and in some ways easier because you know you're going after. Or am I, you know, Procter and Gamble and I just want people to be aware of like my latest deodorant or whatever. So, so understanding those objectives, thinking about audiences. And I think interestingly we're moving away from programmatic in newsletter to a much more contextual way of thinking and then really identifying those creators that you think best align with your brand, both from an audience and an interest perspective. But I think companies like ours are really, our goal is to help marketers navigate the space because there's a lot of fragmentation out there and it is it is hard to just dive in. So it's good to find somebody, whether it's us or other companies out there that are aggregating and providing guidance in terms of best practices.

[Jay Schwedelson]

So for me, the way I always thought about email newsletter sponsorships was always like an add on, oh, I'm going to run, I'm going to take the, you know, these run of site on this website, whatever it is, and then, oh, they're going to throw in their newsletter as an add on to the program. Is that really not the way it is anymore? Are newsletters now a vehicle that people just literally, that's the media buy and it's not just the throw on with a, with a larger buy.

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

So yes and no. I would say like there are companies out there, like big media companies, for example, that really want to sell you, you know, what they consider to be higher value items to them from a revenue perspective. So video branded content. And they're going to throw in newsletter because primarily for them, in what many cases, their newsletters are retention tools for their audiences. So they're not really effectively monetizing it. Now that's changing as a lot of companies sort of pull back from again, programmatic, just putting banner ads and newsletters and actually being thoughtful about the content they're creating, capturing new audiences and really viewing it as a separate media channel. And then you have other companies that are newsletter first companies. I mean, the big ones out there like the Skim and Morning Brew, the Hustle, that interestingly was acquired by HubSpot and HubSpot just uses that as a marketing channel. And those companies, like, you're buying the newsletter, you're buying the content that goes out there. You're buying the fact that those readers have raised their hand and said, hey, I'm going to subscribe to this, I'm going to be engaged and I want to be a part of that content as an advertiser. And that's what you're buying.

[Jay Schwedelson]

So, okay, so I get it now. You can just buy it as a solo. That's great. And I would have to imagine now when you all are selling a newsletter, inclusion an ad, and someone's like, okay, we want to put this in. It's a big, you know, image or whatever, sometimes you're looking at like, well, that's not going to work. We know this works. We know this doesn't work. This type of copy works. This doesn't work. So if somebody's out there like, all right, I'm going to try paid newsletter, email Newsletter sponsorships, What is the content format or what is the ad that's going to do the best that people should be using?

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

Yeah, I mean, I think for us it's clear that and the industry, it's clear at this point that it's text plus image, but it's written text, hard HTML5, just implanted in the newsletter as content. With everything else you have links in there, but you make the links specifically clickable. It's not the whole image that's clickable and it blends in with the rest of the content. And I think viewers in any medium, whether it's TV or online, are just trained at this point to tune out ads, and that includes banner ads. But when you're reading something from a trusted voice and they're then pitching you a product or service that's relevant to the content that they're already producing and relevant to you as an audience, you're much more likely to engage with that. And we've seen tremendous results with that type of formatting.

[Jay Schwedelson]

So, okay, I get a lot of newsletters where it's coming from, like a person, like a personal brand person, maybe they're an expert in AI on marketing, whatever. And they have a huge following and, and they got a newsletter, right? And then I open up the newsletter and in that newsletter it's this like quasi endorsement style ad. Like, hey, by the way, this is what I use. This is my favorite thing, whatever. And you got to check them out and blah, blah, blah, blah. But it says, you know, this is a sponsored ad, whatever. Does that do particularly well? Like, if you're on the hunt for the right newsletter to sponsor, should you be looking like for something from a personal brand or something that's more generic, like a, like a publisher brand, which one does better?

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

I mean, you know, I think there are merits to both, like, and again, it depends on your objective, right? It depends on what type of product you're selling, what sort of service you're selling. I think the benefit overall, and this is sort of what we're getting at with using text and having just a Runway, is storytelling, right? The ability to make a pitch, whether it's in 40 words, 75 words, 100 words, but certainly more than just an image to explain at least a little bit of your value proposition. And then depending on, like, how narrow your audience is, like, of course, it's always great to have like a respected voice, like a Jay Schwedelson come out, write something positive about your product because it's also relevant to what they're doing right. If you, you know, if you're selling a wellness product, you love to have Arnold Schwarzenegger in the Daily Pump, basically pitch that product as something that, you know, he endorses. Right. There's just credibility there. And I think credibility in any form of advertising is going to be more effective than just simply running an ad wherever. But you know, the flip side of that is at some point you also want awareness. And I think that there are just some more, you know, larger newsletters that are focused, for example, like on news aggregation. Right. And you just want to get in front of that audience. Specifically if that audience, like the Skim is a good example, it's women, they're at this point older, 30 to 45 moms, professionals. I want to be in front of them and the Skim is credible as a publication and so I want to put my story in front of that audience. So I think both can be effective. It just depends on what your objectives are.

[Jay Schwedelson]

How do you manage your expectation of performance? I mean, I get it that you guys do cpc, you do cost per click or cost per acquisition for your model. But if you're buying a newsletter ad and you're buying it on a cost per thousand email sent or whatever, what is an expectation of performance? I mean, are there averages that people should be, oh yeah, I'll get a 3% click through rate or whatever?

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

Yeah, I mean, I think that's tricky, right? Like, you know, you're big in the email space, you know all the pitfalls with list sizes and open rates and then bots clicking on links before people ever open them, whether they're nefarious or not. And I think like anything else, like you set expectations with that publisher in advance, like here are my objectives. How are you measuring things? How are we measuring things? Let's go in with a goal to begin with so that like we're not going to be disappointed. So you could say, like you should know, for example, if a publisher says, hey, I've got a list of a million subscribers and but they give you a number like my open rate is 80%. Like that's probably not accurate. I think more of a benchmark you can go off of that's realistic is 35 to 40%. And so then you look at that number and you say, what is the CTR average? Well know there's a lot of variables there, right? Like how relevant is the brand of the audience? Like are you trying to get a click or are you trying just to create awareness? So again, like setting Expectations in terms of these are my goals as a brand. This is what I'm trying to accomplish. And aligning that with the publisher is going to set you up for success.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And I think having that conversation is super important. All right, one more thing before we get on to some stupidity. I'm out there, I'm like, you know what? I have a newsletter. My company has. Newsletter goes to 12,000 people. Maybe I should be taking ads in my newsletter. What is the tipping point where you could actually monetize a newsletter you have or your company has? Like, how big does it need to be?

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

I don't think there's a floor to it. I mean, I think that like, again, it depends, like what the content's about, what the audience is. Right? Like 12,000, you might say that's a small number. But if they're 12,000, marketers like that are all active buyers for a specific Martech SaaS product that costs $100,000 a year. That's an attractive potential audience for a marketer or for a company that's trying to sell to that audience to approach. So I think it just depends again, what is the content. If it's sports and you have 12,000, you're going to have a harder time monetizing it. You can still do it with backfill, which is a lot of how we fill inventory. We help publishers grow, you know, be able to pay bills even though they're not getting flat rate sponsorships because, you know, they're smaller. So I think it depends on the type of content. But you know, the reality is, and you're seeing it a lot like brands becoming publishers. So, you know, my wife, she's a doctor, she still had med school loans. We refinanced them with SoFi. SoFi now sends out like three or four times a week a newsletter that's got nothing to do with like pitching you sofi. It's just about financial advice. So, you know, will they monetize that outside? I mean, it's possible, right? You see the Walmarts of the world and best Buys becoming publishers, becoming like advertising companies. So I think there's something to that. But yeah, I don't think there's a floor to it. I think there's, there's possibilities all across the board.

[Jay Schwedelson]

100%. And I think you'd also leverage it for trades and swaps and all that. So if you have a newsletter, it's an asset that you should really think about. All right, let's get into Some nonsense. And this is totally off script. I didn't tell Jeffrey. We're going to talk about this. I know Jeffrey lives in Orlando. Orlando, Florida. And for anybody that doesn't know this, that's where Disney World is, amongst other entertainment venues. So I want to know something. What is someone that goes to Disney, that is a tool, that is a newbie, that they would do that. You're like, oh, they don't know what they're doing. They're going to Disney. They don't get it. Versus you're like pro level Disney human. Like, how do you go to Disney? We crush it because we know these four things. Give us the inside Orlando scoop. Probably the most important thing we're going to share on this podcast.

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

I think we need to do a whole nother podcast.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Yeah.

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

I mean, so what is the biggest mistake? I think that's maybe one way to look at it. Like people who are like, okay, I'm going to go to Disney World specifically. There's four parks there that are massive. I'm going to go there for four days. I'm going to show up at 8am, going to do every single ride and attraction and I'm not going to leave until midnight. And I'm going to do that every single day. And then it becomes like a war of attrition, right? Like we're just, we're just going to power through versus like, listen, I live here. I get it. I can just pop in and out. But like I will literally go to Epcot for dinner and it's just such a pleasure to go there at 4:00. Maybe we'll go on a ride, maybe we won't have a drink, have dinner, get out of there by seven. No one's crying. Except for maybe, maybe me because I'm being forced to leave. But yeah, I think that just generally like take break days. Like don't make it your mission to do and see everything in a short period of time because it's just going to be miserable.

[Jay Schwedelson]

What is the worst ride and what is the best ride to go on, whether it's at Universal or Disney.

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

So I think it's what is my favorite. There's a tie right now, I would say.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Have you actually have a list?

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

Oh yeah. Oh yeah.

[Jay Schwedelson]

It's.

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

I mean it's really like we talk about it on almost a weekly basis. Certainly my six year old has running count. Like personally, I like Velocicoaster at Islands. Adventure is like the most insane, awesome roller coaster. And then I'm really into The Guardians of the Galaxy coaster at Epcot, but those are more thrill rides. That's just sort of, that's what I like. But what is the worst? I mean, there's a ride at Epcot that will guarantee to make you sick. And it's Mission Space on the red side. It's basically like Gravitron, but in a little box with a screen pressed up to your face so it simulates a rocket launch. You can't breathe, you can't see, and you get off and you just want to lay on the floor and die. So, okay, yeah, that's aggressive. So if you come visit, we, we'll go do that.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Yeah, No, I, honestly, if I go on a merry go round, just in a circle, I'll throw up. I don't know why. As I get older, I can't do anything that either goes in a circle or loop de loop or anything. I, I, I vomit. Have you ever vomited, like, coming out of a ride?

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

No, but I'm, I'm, I like, you know, I don't, I don't have motion sickness. You know, my wife, she vomits like 80% of the time. So, but that could just, that's because I'm just standing there. So it could be, I was about.

[Jay Schwedelson]

To say, I was about to say, because you're near her.

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

Right.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Which is totally understandable. Well, we won't hold that against her, as a matter of fact. That makes sense. Well, Jeffrey, before we let you go here, how does everybody find you on LinkedIn or your website? Everyone got to follow you. If you care about email newsletters. Jeffrey is the guy. Tell everybody everything.

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

Yeah. So mediaintercept.com is a great place to start. That's our website. There's opportunities to get in contact with us there. Obviously, LinkedIn. Jeffrey Eisenberg, media Intercept. We do a ton of business with obviously, publishers and newsletters, but again, work with a hundred plus brands that are focused on B2B, that are focused on B2C. A lot of direct consumer brands, but we work with the Nikes and hps of the world. So we've got something for everybody, really, and, you know, open to conversations. And I think, you know, ultimately what we're here to do is help people save time and help them invest in this space in a way that's going to have meaningful impact for their businesses.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Yeah. Awesome. I suggest getting in contact with Jeffrey. He really knows this newsletter space. Appreciate you being here, man.

[Jeffrey Eisenberg]

Yeah, I appreciate you having me. Thanks for the opportunity.

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