Creativity Miniseries: The Toolkit

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Creativity Miniseries: The Toolkit"

Podcast Information:

• Title: Don't Cut Your Own Bangs
• Host/Author: Danielle Ireland
• Description: This podcast bridges the gap between where you are and where you aspire to be, addressing feelings of comparison and loneliness. Each episode delves into personal insights from Danielle's work as a therapist, focusing on the intricate middle ground between before and after stories. Danielle aims to demystify intense emotions, making them more approachable and manageable, often infusing humor along the way.
• Episode: Creativity Miniseries: The Toolkit
• Release Date: March 31, 2025

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1. Introduction and Natural Conversation [00:00 – 05:23]

Danielle Ireland kicks off the episode alongside guest Emily Sutherland, emphasizing the organic flow of their conversation. Rather than following a rigid structure, they engage in a genuine dialogue about creativity, which seamlessly transitions into the core topic—the creativity toolkit.

Key Points:

• Organic Evolution: The episode began as an unplanned conversation, showcasing the beauty of letting discussions naturally unfold.
• Encouragement to Engage: Danielle acknowledges that some listeners might prefer to dive directly into the toolkit, assuring them they can skip the introductory chatter if desired.

Notable Quote:

Danielle Ireland [00:00]: "But I really loved the conversation we ended up having and I decided I wanted to keep it."

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2. Clarity and Ownership in Creative Processes [05:23 – 12:42]

Danielle and Emily delve into the importance of clarity in creative endeavors. They discuss how defining what you want to own and understanding your strengths can empower your creative journey.

Key Points:

• Prioritization: Using the jar analogy, Danielle illustrates the necessity of prioritizing significant elements (big rocks) before addressing smaller tasks (pebbles and sand).
• Authenticity Over Originality: They differentiate between being original for originality's sake and being authentic, emphasizing the value of genuine self-expression.

Notable Quotes:

Danielle Ireland [05:23]: "I know how to make heavier content approachable and digestible...I felt more empowered going in because I knew what I was doing."

Emily Sutherland [08:04]: "The things that cut through the noise are the things that are authentic."

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3. Authenticity vs. Originality in Creativity [12:42 – 21:39]

The conversation shifts to the balance between being original and maintaining authenticity. They stress that true creativity stems from one's unique voice rather than mimicking others.

Key Points:

• Authentic Voice: Authenticity allows creators to connect genuinely with their audience, as seen in the examples of Amy Schumer and Chelsea Handler.
• Heart-Driven Creativity: Danielle emphasizes that projects driven by personal passion yield more sustained energy and fulfillment compared to those motivated solely by external rewards like money.

Notable Quotes:

Danielle Ireland [10:25]: "If you're doing it for praise or acceptance or accolades...if it's heart-fueled, it gives me endless energy."

Emily Sutherland [12:42]: "People who are aging are actually really good at this because you just don't have the energy for stuff that drains you anymore."

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4. Creativity Toolkit: Process Tools [22:31 – 30:26]

Danielle and Emily introduce their creativity toolkit, focusing first on process tools that aid in nurturing and managing creative ideas.

Key Points:

• Write It Down: Encouraging the habit of capturing ideas as they arise, whether through writing or voice memos.
• Journaling: Using journaling as a method to stay connected with the creative flow without the pressure of immediate outcomes.
• Discerning Sharing: Deciding when and with whom to share ideas to foster constructive feedback while maintaining vulnerability.

Notable Quotes:

Emily Sutherland [19:06]: "Write it down when you feel it...even just like speaking it to another human can help you not feel solely responsible for that spark of an idea."

Danielle Ireland [22:35]: "Don't share it right away...Maybe think about when it's at its most tender stage. Who are your tender people?"

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5. Creativity Toolkit: Electronic and Physical Tools [30:26 – 51:37]

The duo explores various electronic and physical tools that can enhance the creative process, sharing personal favorites and practical applications.

Electronic Tools:

• Scrivener: Emily praises Scrivener for its organizational capabilities, especially for complex projects like manuscripts that require extensive research and non-linear writing.

  Notable Quote:

  Emily Sutherland [34:38]: "Scrivener is great because it's a really inexpensive one-time download...it keeps all of these notes, all of our conversations, audio recordings, URLs in one place."

• Google Docs & Voice Memos: Danielle shares her experience using Google Docs for her children's book and voice memos for capturing ideas on the go.

  Notable Quote:

  Danielle Ireland [37:15]: "Voice memo apps help me get out of my head to get the heart of whatever message I'm trying to convey."

• IngramSpark: Emily introduces IngramSpark as a valuable platform for self-publishing, detailing its features for on-demand printing and distribution.

  Notable Quote:

  Emily Sutherland [41:37]: "IngramSpark can distribute and print on demand so that all you do is upload your files from there."

Physical Tools:

• Favorite Pens: Danielle advocates for the Sharpie fine-tip pen, while Emily prefers the Pilot G2 for its smooth writing experience.

  Notable Quotes:

  Danielle Ireland [47:32]: "The Sharpie pen...is the best pen in the world."

  Emily Sutherland [48:17]: "The Pilot G2O...so great. They come in all colors."

• Notebooks: Emphasizing the importance of tactile tools, they discuss their preferred notebooks for journaling and idea capture.

  Notable Quote:

  Emily Sutherland [51:19]: "Rifle Paper Co. little notebooks are perfect because I'm left-handed and they don't have spiral on the left side."

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6. Building Community and Support [51:37 – 52:18]

Recognizing the significance of community, Danielle and Emily highlight the role of supportive networks in sustaining creative endeavors.

Key Points:

• Workshops and Online Communities: They encourage listeners to engage in workshops and online communities to find support and share experiences.
• Storytelling Community: Emily mentions her Substack initiative, "Storytelling Community," which serves as a platform for creatives to connect, share resources, and offer mutual support.

Notable Quotes:

Danielle Ireland [46:32]: "Community is another resource...sometimes you just need to know that you're not alone in doing it."

Emily Sutherland [47:39]: "Connection is huge...there are ways to make almost any idea live in the world we live in."

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7. Final Thoughts and Encouragement [52:18 – 53:39]

Wrapping up the episode, Danielle and Emily reinforce the episode's main themes: the importance of tools, community, and authentic creativity.

Key Points:

• Overcoming Challenges: Danielle shares her personal experience with self-publishing, highlighting how confidence grows through tackling challenges.
• Encouragement to Create: Both hosts urge listeners to continue their creative pursuits, emphasizing that every creative journey is unique and valuable.

Notable Quotes:

Danielle Ireland [53:35]: "Wherever you're listening, wherever you are in your creative process, keep going because we want your art."

Emily Sutherland [53:39]: "This has been really fun. Thank you for letting me talk about my favorite thing."

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Conclusion

"Creativity Miniseries: The Toolkit" offers a comprehensive exploration of the creative process, blending personal insights with practical tools. Danielle Ireland and Emily Sutherland emphasize the significance of authenticity, the strategic use of tools, and the power of community in nurturing creativity. Whether you're a seasoned creator or just beginning your creative journey, this episode provides valuable guidance to help you navigate and enhance your creative endeavors.

Transcript

[Danielle Ireland]

Hello. Hello. This is Danielle Ireland and I'm sitting here with Emily Sutherland, and you are listening to the Toolkit episode in the creativity miniseries on don't cut your own bangs. That was a mouthful. Yeah, great, thank you. Thank you. We're doing a little separate intro because Emily and I, this wasn't the plan, but it turned out to be really beautiful and it just sort of evolved naturally. But rather than having a, you know, a very hard kind of like clip and begin, we just started recording and having a conversation and it evolved into the episode. So the first 15 minutes or so, it's not going to be a traditional, like, welcome. Boop. Here's the topic. You're gonna hear us chatting about creativity and art and our own processes, but I assure you that it will evolve into the Toolkit itself, which is what this episode is titled and what it's for. But also, if you wanna skip ahead and you're like, just get me to the tools. I never wanna slow down your enthusiasm. You can skip ahead. That's what the little fast forward button in a podcast is for. So you can skip ahead if you choose. But I really loved the conversation we ended up having and I decided I wanted to keep it. So this is the proper intro. Thank you for being here. Thank you for listening. And now here's the episode I'm just kind of playing around while. But you said you were what?

[Emily Sutherland]

I did this for 20 years for a company that, you know, we started a website that had zero members and it was like a. There was a free side with concert schedules and things like that, but there was a paid side where it was like behind the scenes stories, interviews with the artists, all this stuff. And thousands of people joined this website and I was the only content writer for it. So I know how to communicate with the masses in ways that the connect with because they were paying money to be part of this community in which I was basically bringing the artists to them, telling the stories about what, how this or that tour went or what new things coming out or whatever, but making it personal. So I know I have the skillset to do that. Yeah. But for whatever reason, I just talk myself out of the fact that I have something to say about it that people haven't heard before.

[Danielle Ireland]

You're reminding me of a time when I was like first wanting to declare basically to, like, LinkedIn in the world that I wanted to do public speaking and presentations and things like that. I remember spending, oh, gosh, I don't know how much time I went to a coffee shop Because I thought that's what young professionals did. They took a computer to a coffee shop and oh, a hundred percent and tippity typed. And I was trying to take the presentation that I essentially had and the content I had and fill and try to like, I was trying to basically Google search corporate jargon acronyms and trying to figure out how I could sell, how the benefit of what I do would help them earn and, or save more money and, or retain people.

[Emily Sutherland]

Right.

[Danielle Ireland]

When the truth was that was me getting in that business's business. Yes, that's actually not my business, is not my area of expertise. And I think also too, the thing that I didn't realize was by doing somebody else's business, I was owning a solution that I didn't have any control over. I had no influence or ability to, to really have impact. I realized that I was taking on the responsibility of an outcome that one I couldn't really control and that I didn't want to own. And so I got clear on what is it that I. And I did this actually for my therapy practice too. What. And we can actually, this could actually roll in great into the toolkit in a way. We'll find a way to pull it all together. But I remember a therapist I was actually seeing at the time said, what do you want to be responsible for in the therapy room? And I didn't realize as a recovery and codependent that I probably had like a good boilerplate statement of like to establish a, you know, healthy rapport and create safety and blah blah, blah, like whatever I had to do to pass the exams. But under that context, what I was also probably running a program that was like, well, I want my client to like me. I want my client to think that I'm smart. I want my client to think that I'm good at this and I want them to feel better and give me the credit for that. And again, it was, it was not top of mind and I wouldn't have admitted to it then and I could admit to it now because that's not, that's not true for me now. So I've got some safety and distance.

[Emily Sutherland]

That's huge.

[Danielle Ireland]

But I think asking the question of what do you want to own and why do you want to do this? It just helped me kind of zero in on oh, what I can influence or what I feel like I've got a good impact on is like if someone signs up for a workshop, I can hopefully make it not a terrible 30 to 90 minute experience for them. I know how to make heavier content approachable and digestible. I also think I'm kind of entertaining and charming, so it's not going to feel dry or boring, but, like, those were elements. I'm like, I have impact here, so I don't know what they're going to take, but I also know that I can drill in the same point 10 different ways from 10 different perspectives, and they'll walk away at least understanding this thing. So those became more action. I felt more empowered going in because I knew what I was doing. And not that I didn't know what I was doing as a therapist, but I knew what I was going in that room to do.

[Emily Sutherland]

Right. You were clear on your objectives and your strengths and all that stuff, and.

[Danielle Ireland]

Even to loop it into the book and this whole creativity miniseries that we've done, as we're starting to kind of, we're crescendoing into our toolkit content. But I think the work became alive when I knew what I. When I knew what it was.

[Emily Sutherland]

Right.

[Danielle Ireland]

And it's like the momentum and my confidence to talk about it continues to grow the clearer the project is right. And so when there's a lack of clarity, maybe a lack of clarity is not the right way of saying it, but maybe when there's. When there's some hesitance or shrinking or contracting or that sort of like, butterfly in the stomach, nervousness of uncertainty, I think that uncertainty is calling in a need for clarity. There's something that needs to be clarified.

[Emily Sutherland]

Right. That's good. Yeah, that's really good. Yeah, we could talk about that. Because. Because I have thoughts.

[Danielle Ireland]

Let's do it.

[Emily Sutherland]

Here's the thing. Whether it's a business, whether it's a project, what you would view as a creative project, or you're coming to a new idea or product you're developing or seminar, that you're creating that type of thing, experience for anybody, you have to come into it with the combination of, like, what do people need? But also, what is the thing that makes me want to do this, that puts my own unique spin on it. If your seminar or my retreat or anything like that was going to be just like somebody else's, why would we do it? And I do think that bringing experience, bringing a comfort level with just playing with an idea, there's a lot that, for me is unknown when I step into it. But like you said a minute ago, and we were just talking, it's calling out for clarity when you're like, what if I did it this way? Or this doesn't feel like me. How could I make it more me? I do think that there is a lot of unknown territory that we walk into, and we realize that we need to differentiate from just what everybody else is doing. You know, that's why people open businesses every day, because they bring something to the table that's not identical to the business next to them. But that uniqueness, you tell yourself in fear or imposter syndrome or whatever, that it's. It's not going to make a difference, or it's. It's too different, people aren't ready for it, or. And I just think even me right now trying new things, it's so important to continue to come back to what unique story I have, Whatever experiences I have that can help somebody else who's already in a different space or a different business or whatever, want to interact with me or my idea or my business. You know what I mean?

[Danielle Ireland]

I do. Hearing you say, there's something about the word original, and you said original. And differentiate. I guess I'm not marketing this podcast to be a business expert or a business coach. So just take what I'm about to say with a grain of salt or take it however you want to take it. You can listen, you can decide. I think that sort of lateral scan of comparison of, okay, who's next to me, who's doing the same thing, who's got this over there? There's already things like that. And I think that originality in the pursuit of being original, I think sometimes we can betray ourselves 100%. I think that. Or I should even say I feel. I feel more safe in the presence of a coach, a teacher, or I feel more safe even viewing a film because, you know, you're gonna invest some time watching a movie, and you can kind of tell just from the beginning, like, how established is the world. And, you know, are they overusing the protagonist's first name to make sure we don't forget it? Like, are they not giving us credit? Like, those little cues? But I think authenticity, like, Amy Schumer does what Amy Schumer does better than anyone else because it's her voice. Like, I was listening to Chelsea Handler. She's promoting this new book that she just released. And I just love some of the things that she can say. The truth through her own filter is so unique to her that if I said those exact words, people would probably think terrible things. Because it's just. It's not my tone, it's not my tenor, it's not how I move through the world. But I love that about her, but it's authentically her. And again, I'm not a business coach, but what stops me or gets me in the way if I'm trying to figure out the business plan before I understand the heart of it, it's almost like reversing the order. It's not that those things don't matter or they're not important. It's if I try to get those types of nuts and bolts in place and then try to fit my heart in there. You know, my husband just gave me a great analogy yesterday. He was like, it's like if you had a jar and you had large stones, pebbles, and sand, and if you put the large stones in first, the big things that matter most to you, and then you pour in the smaller pebbles, they're gonna find ways to make space, and then you'll even find place for sand to settle. But if you pour all the pebbles in and the sand in, you're going to find that there won't be room for your big rocks.

[Emily Sutherland]

Yes.

[Danielle Ireland]

Like, they're going to either kind of be bunched up on the top or even kind of like fall out.

[Emily Sutherland]

Yeah.

[Danielle Ireland]

And so making the stable space for the things that matter most to you and then grounding all the other things that also matter but maybe don't matter as much to you. Like, for me, if it's not heart driven, it's not that I don't like money. I'm not a fool, y'all. Okay, Money's great, Money is awesome. But if I. If the decisions I make are driven by that first, they usually either drive anxiety comparison, they run out of steam, or I lose interest. But the heart fueled things, I love those give me endless energy. It's like rocket fuel. I'm a little less concerned with the outcome because I've gained so much. And then all the other things that could come from it too, like, oh, well, this would be really fun if this also made money.

[Emily Sutherland]

Right.

[Danielle Ireland]

But I'm not. That's not the drive. Some people are driven by that and they crush it because that's authentically them. I'm only speaking for myself here, but again, I don't think you're listening to don't cut your own bangs if you're trying to give business advice. So I'm just assuming.

[Emily Sutherland]

Right. But the things that cut through the noise are the things that are authentic, you know? So I think you're giving an idea the very best chance it has when it's coming from that deep place inside you and what you Just explained with the jar and all the pieces and parts that you could try to squeeze into it. That is the perfect illustration of why so many people burn out.

[Danielle Ireland]

Yes.

[Emily Sutherland]

In a business that they started because they thought it was the thing to do. And it wasn't really creating space for the things that mean the most to them or felt authentic to them. It was just like, well, this will make my previous generations proud. Or this is what I think is my only option. But I think what we have to find. And I think people who are aging are actually really good at this because you just don't have the energy for stuff that drains you anymore. And, you know, people call it a midlife crisis. It's probably just a midlife awakening to who you even are, you know? And I think as people get older, sometimes they're more clear on, hey, you know what? I want to start painting again. Or I want to start painting for the first time, or I wanna lean into this part of myself that I didn't think fit into my jar before, but it really needed to because I got so tired and drained.

[Danielle Ireland]

Yeah. God, it reminds me of the gift of hindsight. If you can look through the lens of compassion is you can just. You can see yourself at a different time. Like whether it's last week or 10 years ago. But I. I'm having a moment like that right now where. Oh, I'm remembering I was sitting in a workshop, just like an eager, fresh little. I had my freshly printed diploma and I was starting in a private practice, and I went to a workshop with other fellow speaker entrepreneur people. And it was about creating basically, like, what did you want your position to be? What. How were you going to carve out what your. What's your niche? What are you going to talk about? What's going to make you unique and stand out? And it was a. Absolutely. It was a great workshop. It was just. It was. I was putting the cart before the horse. It was more like I was putting the cart before the heart in a way. Because I did. I wasn't clear on my why.

[Emily Sutherland]

Yeah, that even rhymed. I just had a moment with that.

[Danielle Ireland]

Cart before the art. Okay, well, so maybe that needs to be. That'll be a new book. 2.0. Or I'll find. Yeah, I need to find something to do with that.

[Emily Sutherland]

That's really good. We're gonna save that.

[Danielle Ireland]

Thank you. I remember I created this whole thing. Cause I went first from the perspective of what does the world need from me? And I was like, well, everyone's having a Hard time with social media. That'll be my unique position. How to, how to reduce anxiety with social media. And like it sounded good, it was catchy, it had all the right buzzwords and I could also market to fear like the three things not to do, like all the things that grab your attention when you're scrolling. And it was so boring for me. Maybe boring is not the right word but I just found the behaviors that I thought were procrastination or self sabotage I now recognize like, oh, it just wasn't heartbreaking. There was no, it wasn't hurtful.

[Emily Sutherland]

Yes. That wasn't the thing that you were most passionate about.

[Danielle Ireland]

No. I thought I was being like a good student of business and being successful. But I also, I don't begrudge doing that because I think doing it wrong and I'm using air quotes with wrong. I write I don't want to judge. But doing it wrong a bunch of times did eventually help me land on whatever that form of right is.

[Emily Sutherland]

I think what you're describing is the path to success is figuring stuff out. And just side note, I met you and heard you speak for the first time when you were doing that and if that was the only thing that came out of it, I'm really glad you did it.

[Danielle Ireland]

Oh, that's so.

[Emily Sutherland]

I didn't even know that I was in a Meekin.

[Danielle Ireland]

Yes.

[Emily Sutherland]

And you were speaking and I was so excited to hear you speak and it was so good. Like to me that was a really relevant thing to present at a meek end. It's like how am I interacting with social media? It makes you think stop and be mindful about it so nothing's wasted.

[Danielle Ireland]

Oh man, you just made me sweat. You are sweating. Oh my gosh. That is. Here it comes. Oh man, that what a fun. See hindsight through my lens and hindsight through another lens. We never see ourselves clearly.

[Emily Sutherland]

We don't.

[Danielle Ireland]

That might be the only thing salvageable. None of us know and we may never know. And then. Oh God. Well, so this was lovely. If you stuck with us for the first roughly 15 minutes or so us warming up into this conversation about the creativity toolkit. We are going to get to the tools, I promise you. We both have lists and handouts in front of us. We're going to break them down for you and it's going to be great. But also it's sometimes it's nice to put tools into context. So I think we kind of framed a lovely context and I think it would be otherwise it would just be an audio format of us bulleting things.

[Emily Sutherland]

Yep. I do think sometimes when you're warming up and you just talk about what's on top of mind, there can be a little bit of magic in there that maybe somebody needs out there. So I think that's kind of what happened. Warm up with an actual conversation about something. Cause you never know what you're going to get. That's the first. First tool.

[Danielle Ireland]

Well, so warming up. That makes me think of. I'm going to give a shout out to a woman named Betsy Murphy. She has a great substack. She writes from the heart. She creates journal prompts like a daily. She doesn't call them journal prompts, she calls them writing prompts. But if you're looking for another tool and resource to lift some writing and creativity for you. She shared a clip where John Mayer was being interviewed on a podcast and how like basically almost all of his songs start with just like a little riff. That's a warm up. He's just warming up with his instrument, he's warming up in his space, he's warming up in the studio. And then just something catches his ear in a way and he just kind of plays with it. So yeah, I think there's so many examples that probably validate exactly what that point.

[Emily Sutherland]

I love that.

[Danielle Ireland]

Me too.

[Emily Sutherland]

And I'm a massive fan of John Mayer's music.

[Danielle Ireland]

Same.

[Emily Sutherland]

I'm really glad to hear that.

[Danielle Ireland]

I can go to a show. It can be on in the background. It's always. It's always pleasant. He's a good storyteller.

[Emily Sutherland]

Absolutely.

[Unknown]

If you've been enjoying this time with Emily Sutherland and myself, I want you to know that there are still ways that you can connect and collaborate with her and continue to learn from all of the wisdom she has in a more in depth and personal way. We have another upcoming event, Storytelling for business. It's April 4th and this is great. If you're a solopreneur, part of a marketing team or a presenter and you want to take your storytelling to the next level in the workplace later in the year, on May 9, there is another really special event called nurturing your creative self. This is for anybody who used to lose time when they were coloring as a kid or loves to just mix new ingredient combinations together in a bowl and see what you can bake. However creativity manifests for you, it doesn't have to be writing, but this event does give you the opportunity to reacquaint yourself with your creativity and hopefully reignite a spark. So if you need help, support, you need a Community. And you don't want to figure this out alone. You don't have to check out the link in the show notes. And you can have all the detailed in depth information and can sign up there.

[Danielle Ireland]

The creativity toolkit. So we've tried breaking it down in a couple of different ways. So there's a process toolkit, like the actual big picture process, and then electronic tools, and then we even have physical tools, like things that you hold in your hand. Would you like to start with process? Where would you like to start?

[Emily Sutherland]

Process.

[Danielle Ireland]

So what I have in process is a few different little notes. And I call it a tool because it seems like a tool for me. Write it down when you feel it. Like, put the cart before the heart or before the art. That is something I wrote down because I was like, ooh, there's something sparkly in that, right? And sometimes you never know when those little blurbs are gonna come out. And maybe you don't have a pen and paper with you all the time. I think Jerry Seinfeld, like, there's a few people who very famously always keep something to write with and on on their person if that's not you. If you listen to the creativity miniseries, I spoke my book into a voice memo or sometimes initially I didn't even think about writing it down. I just spoke it to Emily. So even just like speaking it to another human can help you not feel solely responsible for that spark of an idea, but write it down when you feel it.

[Emily Sutherland]

I think too, in the middle of the night, you can either get a brilliant idea that you're not going to remember in the morning, or it can be bad pizza and you think it's a good idea. But regardless, you need to write it down. I usually try to keep something and a pen by the bed because if there is something that I need to capture, I can decide later whether it's bad pizza or good writing, you know, But I'm not. I'm not going to know in the middle of the night. Probably it's going to feel like genius in the middle of the night. But regardless, I do think it's important to have something in reach all the time, because as you turn on the faucet for ideas, then they flow. And so once you start realizing that you're ready for them, they bless you and come to you.

[Danielle Ireland]

Yeah, and that's another way of thinking about warming up, too. So there's almost like the more granular warmup like we were talking about in the context of warming up to do a podcast. But there's also. I feel like I have been warming up. There's like, I no longer feel as, like, stiff. Like I'm dusting off the cobwebs of engaging with my creativity because I've been more present with this book for the last six months or so. So it's almost like I'm warming up to a new habit. And then there's also the, like, more nuclear present tense warmup. But to your. It's like once you start engaging with it more regularly, more things are just gonna come. So, yeah, give yourself the freedom to not feel like you have to be panic stricken. Like, there's an idea. I can't forget it. So, yeah, write it down when you feel it, when you hear it, when you see it, however your ideas come to you, and then be ready for the idea. For me, what that looked like was wanting. And I know that sounds so silly, but it's kind of like you feel the hunger before you think about what you want to eat or even where you want to go.

[Emily Sutherland]

Yes.

[Danielle Ireland]

So it's like being ready for the idea. I'm not hungry now. I know I will be. And I have a fridge full of food. I'm very blessed in that way. And so, like, I'm ready for my hunger. So it's like, fill the fridge. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, I've heard Elizabeth Gilbert talk about, like, she creates creativity traps for herself. So she has an area in her home that always has, like a notebook and pencil, an area that always has her paints out. So it's not something she has to think about. It's just if she walks by and it catches her eye, she just goes bloop. And just kind of does something with it. My version of being ready for the idea was my walking. That was a big one. And just kind of that excited anticipation. It's like when you know you have a vacation planned months down the road, occasionally you're gonna think about, oh, yeah, I need to get the rental car. Oh, I should probably like thinking about it. Creating some safe distance from it can also help you be ready for the idea.

[Emily Sutherland]

Absolutely.

[Danielle Ireland]

I also put. Don't share it right away. What do you think about that?

[Emily Sutherland]

I think it depends. If I don't share it, I'll talk myself out of it.

[Danielle Ireland]

Ooh, that's good.

[Emily Sutherland]

But there's a lot of vulnerability with that because the reason I don't share it is because I'm not sure if it's a great idea or not. So you might think I'm silly or dumb or like, oh, my gosh, you know, I can't believe she had that. That idea. That's so weird. But at the same time, we have ideas for a reason. So it's like, is this an idea for me that I need to work through something or an idea? Maybe I just need to get out in my garden and dig through dirt. And maybe that's just for me. Or maybe my family is gonna want this food. And, you know, it translates to any area of creativity. But when you share it with somebody or know that you might share it with somebody, it I think helps you take it seriously instead of just being like, man, that's silly to go dig in the dirt or to pick up my paints or write this lyric that may somebody may never sing.

[Danielle Ireland]

And I maybe as I'm thinking of this more, I think it. For me, I was thinking more in the context of being discerning about what to share, when to share, and who to share it with. So, like, what, when and who? So, like, sometimes I'll get like a spark of something or some. Something that just feels really exciting. And then if I go to my husband while we're trying to feed the kids, or like we just put the kids down and we're tired and I still have a little bit of this bubbling enthusiasm, and he's just finished a day and we're both covered in whatever, pasta sauce or whatever, and I'm like, hey, what do you think of Blank? I'll probably be met with cool. And not because he doesn't love me, not because he doesn't care, not because it's not a great idea. So I think it's. I have made that lapse in awareness a number of times where maybe I've shared it with the friend who kind of. Maybe they're like a straight shooter and they're gonna like, give me an edit when it's still a brand new idea. I'm not ready for an edit yet. Right. I maybe need a cheerleader.

[Emily Sutherland]

Right.

[Danielle Ireland]

Like when I came to you, I didn't know what I would be met with, but the idea was solid enough with me that I was like, I think I have something. Do you see something? And now I think I could with confidence now, if I had a spark of an idea, text it to you. Do you think this is anything but? I think that that's because we've developed more of a relationship than we have before. So it might even be. Maybe it's not a blanket statement, don't share it. But maybe it's. Think about when it's at its most tender stage. Who are your tender people?

[Emily Sutherland]

Yeah, that's really good.

[Danielle Ireland]

And then, like, when you're ready for it to kind of be chipped away, who are the people that can do that respectfully and kindly and safely? Yeah, but. But still do it.

[Emily Sutherland]

Absolutely. And on this side of the. The. The other side of the idea, when somebody comes to you and they have a little baby idea, I do think it is important to understand that ideas are tender and that you don't go right in if you see an edit right away. Maybe don't start with that, you know, because I do think that especially with people we're close to a. Or whatever, we do tend to be really honest about things. And I know that I've done that with my husband's ideas. He'll say, you know, I'm thinking of a idea for an event. He's a wonderful event planner, and he's very good at all the details and figuring it out. And sometimes I'll be like, isn't that place really expensive? Or some dumb thing like that. Instead of, like, really meeting his idea with a. An openness to say, wow, that would be really cool. I know you have a lot to work out to make it happen, but I like the idea because who knows? We all know that every great idea starts as a. I don't know if it's great idea, and then we step on the stones until we're at a different place with it. I do think that as the receiver of an idea, it is a little tender baby. And we have to remember that that's.

[Danielle Ireland]

Sweet and that's nice to think of it from both sides, because, yeah, I have absolutely taken the. A bludgeoning tool to some of my husband's sweet, tender ideas. So it's good to have that humility and recognize it. That goes both ways. Yeah. I wrote journal as another process tool. For me, you referenced creativity as like a faucet and letting the water flow. And I think whether it's writing or whatever your process is, it could be sketching, it could be humming, it could be, you know, whatever it is to actively participate in a process that doesn't require an outcome or a deadline that there isn't. You're just letting the water drain a little. And I find that that helps me stay a little bit more in that flow of that creative. That creative flow. But not. Here's another way of thinking about it, because we're. This process is intimate. There's an account that I follow online. I'm trying to think of the name, like Vanessa and Alexander. She's a sex therapist and her husband, they create content together about, like, sex and intimacy and committed relationships. And really, they do really, really great stuff. But they talked about something called the bristle response. And it's. It's an interaction where every time your partner touches you, the other person kind of bristles, flinches, or lifts their shoulders or tightens or contracts. It's generally a response that develops when every time your spouse touches you, you think they're trying to initiate something. And so the way to move through that was to allow for and create touch that feels good to both of you consistently. It's not about not touching or getting super heady in your mind, but, like, holding hands, snuggling, like, reintroducing touch more frequently in a way that's not always leading to an outcome or that you don't associate with leading to an outcome. And so I think for me, in this instance, journaling is a way that I can every day show up or nearly every day show up. I've written some words on a page, but it may not be a newsletter. It may not be for a book. It doesn't have to be for an outcome. That way, when I do show up with it, I don't have this bristle response of, oh, okay, I gotta get my ideas going.

[Emily Sutherland]

And you're speaking to something that is true of creativity. Because I've really been leaning into that part of me for a long time, decades and decades. I used to think that the more that I wrote, the more that I would write out of ideas. But the more you write, the more you see that there is to be written, and the deeper that you're able to go. And it's like putting your feet in the ocean and letting the water. You're like, I'm in the ocean. And you don't realize that the more you step into the ocean, the bigger it feels and gets. And all of a sudden you're swimming in this eternity of water that you didn't really know how it felt to be in that until you started with the little bit on the shore, you know? And I do think that creativity is very much like that. It's very fluid and it's immersive. Once you learn to trust the process. And so process as a toolkit, as we're talking about that, trust that ideas come to you because either they want to live or they're trying to bring their friend ideas to you so that you can really immerse yourself in creativity. And that way, if one idea doesn't work, you're not like, well, that was my only idea. I am a terrible person. I am not a good creator because I had one bad idea. But maybe you have a hundred ideas with potential, you know, And I. I do think that the more I live, the longer I live, the more I'm like, you know what? If I have an idea, I'm just gonna start taking steps and see if it's anything. And if somebody else sounds like it, you know, hey, hey, yeah, that sounds like a good idea. Then maybe I'll take another step. And then I realize, you know, there are all these other ideas out here. So I do think it is very much like a faucet. And you're not gonna run out of ideas if you start down the road with one.

[Danielle Ireland]

Gosh, I never really even thought of that, but that I could absolutely see that. Especially if you have done something that maybe has achieved some degree of success, and you're like, oh, God, was that my one. Was that my one hit? You know?

[Emily Sutherland]

Absolutely. I worked with artists for 20 years, and one of the most brilliant artists that I knew, he passed away. But he was a child prodigy, and he did this epic project, and I did a review on it and an interview with him about it. And later he told me. He was like, you've got that project. And it was like a soundtrack of our life. And it combined classical music and gospel and hymns and all these different kinds of music. And so I talked to him about it, and he was like, yeah, but I. I don't know if I'll ever do anything that good again. Everybody wants to write that album where you're just like, I can't do any better than that. But he's glad he did it. He doesn't regret doing it. You know, of course, it might be the best idea you ever have, but then maybe it's not. Maybe you'll go on and have an even better idea that appeals to a whole different group of people.

[Danielle Ireland]

Yeah. Just goes back to, I think, the heart. If you're doing it for praise or acceptance or accolades, which, my God, who does not want those things? I mean, of course. But I think as. As long as you maintain some level of a personal sense of why it matters to you, the outcome, it's like, great. If it's this, it's okay if it's not Erykah Badu. I'm referencing an interview that someone was quoting her. So this is like a quote of a quote of a quote. She was Speaking to this other artist who was, I guess asking her about, like, how do you make things that appeal to people? How do you get the people who are listening to your art or looking at your art to understand? Like I want them to understand. And her response was, I cook what I like to eat and I serve it and then what they choose to take in, that's not my business.

[Emily Sutherland]

True.

[Danielle Ireland]

There was just something about the I cook what I like to eat. It was a much more simple and succinct way of saying it. Keep cooking what you like to eat. Well, I want to shift a little bit into some nuts and bolts tools. I know you've got a handout in front of you that's beautiful. And you're teaching me about the technology pretty much in real time. So I'm going to let you take the helm. What are some of your favorite electronic tools?

[Emily Sutherland]

First and foremost, Scrivener is a manuscript software that a friend of mine recommended. He was like, I'm hearing about this Scrivener, I wonder if you've ever, do you know anything about it? And I went searching, you know, to see what, what are the reviews? And I was like, oh, I think this is going to help me write my first book. And he told me this just as I was beginning to compile stories and notes and things for Auntie Ann for the first book that she and I wrote together. It was called the Secret Lies within. And it was a traumatic story. So I had a lot of resources to gain. I had a lot of interviews and research and things that I needed to keep together. Scrivener helped me keep all of these notes, all of our conversations, audio recordings, URLs in one place and write at the same time so I could split my screen and I could have all of the research in front of me, our conversations, all the tools at a click. But I can be writing in the manuscript draft and it kept it all organized. And my mind is not linear. It doesn't just line things up. So even when I'm writing something, like a recipe, I was writing a recipe last night, I'm writing something and then I have to go back and like add carrots of like, you know, because my mind just doesn't naturally just line things up linearly. So Scrivener is great because it's a really inexpensive one time download and they will upgrade it for free if they have updates or anything like that. And it is such for me, a great tool not only for the writing process and to keep it organized, but Also then you can compile all of your chapters and things. You can create a table of contents and it automatically puts in the page numbers and like, knows where things are. It's amazing time saving tool. You can put it out into drafts and you compile it into manuscripts that are formatted for sending out a publication. You know, like if you want a traditional or hybrid publisher, usually you need to send sort of a proposal. You have to format the manuscript in a certain way for those purposes. And this automatically does all of the that for you and shows you, oh, you need a table of contents, you need a title page. And those are things that not everybody knows when they're writing the book.

[Danielle Ireland]

Right? You're just jumping into the idea. And I'll just say, I didn't use that. I used Google Docs for my little. My little Children Wrestling a walrus. But having heard this, I'm definitely, I'm gonna get it. And also, Emily has an affiliate link for you that will be linked in the show notes. And I promise, this whole thing wasn't one long ad for Scrivener. And the affiliate link, however, it's like, why not? Why not, right? Use it. Use it.

[Emily Sutherland]

Oh, my gosh. I was sending people to this before I even know they had an affiliate link. And one time I set an intention in the new year one time to say, you know, if there are relationships that I need to forge with people that I already refer people to or use. And this was just one of those things. I was like, I wonder if Scrivener has an affiliate link because I'm sending people there anyway. You know, I didn't care. But it really is one of the most powerful tools I've ever started using. And we've talked a little bit about how I'm gently wading into the screenwriting world. It also has screenwriting software built in so I can can choose formats. It also is good for research papers and has formatted templates for all of that stuff. There's a little learning curve. Okay. There are some videos that they provide, many videos that they provide on how to do things, how to compile, how to do this so that you can get the most out of it. And I honestly haven't even watched them all. I got enough to function for what I need to do, but it's all there. If I am like, oh, I don't know how to do this one thing, or I'm having trouble compiling, you know, I can always go back to their tutorials because they're all built in so.

[Danielle Ireland]

Learning this technology may be your form of, you know, preparation, or it could be some perspiration. I know sometimes when I approach new technology, I get a little. I get a little sweaty. But also it's like all that to say, these are tools. And it's, it's like that expression that, you know, if all you have is a hammer, everything you see is a nail. The tool is most useful when it's applied, when it's needed. So, like, if you're just a baby bird and you haven't left the nest and you're just trying to hold on to this, like, little wisp of an idea, that's okay. But if Scrivener excites you, or if understanding how something like that works gives you more confidence to jump into an idea wherever you jump in. I mean, that's the beauty of. You never know when inspiration is going to strike. You never know when the idea is going to come. So maybe you start preparing before you even have the inspired idea. Maybe that's what invites it in. Or for me, overcoming the hurdle of technology kind of reminds me, oh, I'm better at stuff than I give myself credit for. Oh, calm down, internal critic. So wherever you are in the process, just know that these tools are there. They're not going anywhere. This is just one example. Google Docs was a tool for me.

[Emily Sutherland]

Yes.

[Danielle Ireland]

I wrote my first children's book using Google Docs. So just know that is an option too. Is it the most efficient?

[Emily Sutherland]

Sounds like it's not for a children's size manuscript though. You know, that worked.

[Danielle Ireland]

Yeah. And no, no judgment. I'm not judging. I'm just saying that that was a tool. Voice memo apps. I love voice memo apps because what I have realized is I love writing in a particular way, but I wouldn't call myself the way that Emily is a writer. I love telling stories, and I have a lyrical way of telling stories that's really pleasing to my ear. I think I'm a pretty strong communicator, but there are people who understand the English language and the punctuation and editing in a way that's like, on a deeper, richer level. For me, the Voice Memo app helps me get out of my head to get the heart of whatever message I'm trying to convey. And either the Voice Memo app or even most phones now have a talk to text function that's brilliant because you can just ramble, ramble, ramble, and then copy and paste that into Scrivener or onto a Google Doc wherever you choose. And Then you have, I mean it might be misspelled and you know, a lot of FFFT KKKK's like, you know, they, they don't get the word right. But then you're not starting with a blank page. You have the wisp of an idea already and you're not trying to chisel it into stone. Because I think that's so much of what keeps me from maybe just starting to write a first draft is I feel like, well, I don't want that to live out there. I want only the good version to live out there. But there's something about speaking it out that makes it feel non threatening to me.

[Emily Sutherland]

I love that. I have worked with number a number of clients who were wanted to write a book and they never touched a computer because they told me the story and I did all that part for them. And I do think there is so. You get so much life and so much vibrancy from hearing someone say the story out loud. If they're not used to capturing their own voice in writing, it can get lost. And so I love writing with people who will let me interview them and then I can take that, talk to text and transcribe it or companies and online platforms will do that for you really inexpensively if you do that for yourself. It was such a great way to really capture somebody's voice, but also then to clean it up because we don't write exactly how we talk. But what you're saying about getting that heart, getting that personality and your unique voice, that is such a strong way to do it. And to start with that, I have a client right now. I'm coaching her through her book and she doesn't even own a working laptop and she's using the notes app in her phone and sending that to me and I'm putting it in a subscription or for her. So it's like whatever, whatever you have at the time you have it, that's enough. Use what you have to start where you're at.

[Danielle Ireland]

Also YouTube, I quite literally before we started recording this podcast, I got some new equipment. I was trying to set it up. I didn't realize until maybe 45 minutes before we pressed record. I was half set up and I didn't have two mics running through. Running through which we need because there's two of us here. And so I had a little moment. I wouldn't call panic, but just a little like drop of dread in my gut, like, oh no. But thankfully there's YouTube and what a great resource. I learned how to Use a power drill. Lord help. My husband was like, I am going to be drilling the shit out of. I'm just like, I want this hung up. This hung up. But anyway, like I watched a YouTube video on how to anchor and measuring and all the things. I have very successfully hung many items in our home. Currently because of YouTube, I'm learning all.

[Emily Sutherland]

Kinds of gardening right now. This is the time of year I start putting things in and I'm just like, how do you not kill your eggplant in Indiana in the spring? YouTube video boom.

[Danielle Ireland]

It's kind of like when I, when I have clients who are struggling with anxiety. I'm like, don't go to Google. Google's not your therapist. They're not your doctor. However, for a creative person, when you're trying to figure out a how to. Don't diagnose. Don't go to the Internet for diagnosing. Oh no. But if you're like, how do I open Scrivener? How do I self publish a book? There's lots and lots and lots and lots of resources there which leading to self publishing. Do you want to talk a little bit about ingramspark? Which that word sounds funny in my ear so I'm going to spell it out. I N G R A M S.

[Emily Sutherland]

P A R K Self publishers can upload your art and your text files to be printed on demand. It's an on demand printing platform and many hybrid and traditional publishers will send it to Ingram. They just have professionals to do all the behind the scenes stuff which is why often you'll pay a hybrid publishing team to do all the things. But you can go straight to Ingram yourself. It's just going to take a little bit more prep work and knowledge. Again, YouTube is very helpful and IngramSpark can distribute and print on demand so that all you do is you upload your files from there. And there is a resource guide on Ingram as far as steps. How do I format my files? And that could fall into the perspiration that we talked about before as well. Because you're like trying to make sure that you're whoever's doing your cover art and you know the inside pages. You have to have certain dimensions and they have tools on the IngramSpark website where you can figure out okay, how much would it cost me to create this in an 8 by 10 book versus a 5 by 9 book? There's all of the dimensions that, that determine how many pages long it is and those types of things. They have guides and charts and pricing. You can play with the pricing calculators and stuff like that on there to figure out what your files need to look like. And once you decide on a dimension, then it will tell you, okay, if you're having a full color title or I mean, a cover and black and white interior pages, this is how much it will be. And you just kind of have to play with that. But it will, in essence, guide you through the self publishing process and get it on Amazon and get it on online platforms for book retailers. So my children's book, and soon to be your children's book, Wrestling with a Walrus, will be in barnes and noble.com Even if the store doesn't have space for all of the books that people write, it's still on their website. It will still be on their website. If you go through IngramSpark and you approve that you want them to do that, they do have a printing fee and a shipping fee for whatever you decide to print and order for yourself, but that depends on how fast you want it. And all this stuff, you know, there are variables there, but there's not currently at the time of this recording, there's not an upload fee and all you're paying for, if you want to have an artist or a author booth at the local author fair or just sell on your website or anything like that, you're just paying for the books as they're printed. So you can order one and see how it looks, which I recommend doing. Order one, see how it looks, make sure all is as you want it to be, and then if it is, you go in and order however many you want for your book table or whatever, it's a very, very nice platform because it gives a lot of power to authors.

[Danielle Ireland]

When Emily and I first met for breakfast months ago, that initial meet when I was like, I think I have an idea, she gave me the IngramSpark breakdown just like she did. And it was equal parts. Oh, my God, I can do anything. It's like if I can push past the sweatiness, I can do anything. It was equal part empowering and terrifying because I'm quickly approaching this process and it's making me feel some feelings, sweaty feelings, but all that to say, if you want to do it, it can be done. Yes, there. There's a lock for every key. And yeah, you can totally figure this out. I hope that this space is a good place of encouragement for you in that process. Discomfort doesn't mean it's dangerous, and doubt doesn't mean don't do it. And you just may need some support. And that's what this is for, for sure. Speaking of support, I want to add another resource too is Community. It's listed in the Show Notes and you know, there's an ad for it in the episode these workshops that Emily creates. But I just want to also invite that too. It's like sometimes you just need to know that you're not alone in doing it. You know, I got very lucky that I got to connect with Emily and. But I have kind of toggled together this community that supports me in the process of making this book. It's like four people kind of in my corner that are just there. And I think the benefit of going to a workshop like Emily creates is that you're going to build that community. You just, you go to those places, you're working on creativity. It's an intimate thing. And you're gonna walk away with somebody in your corner and new, valuable information. So I just wanna say, like, wherever you're listening, you know, if you're in the Indianapolis area, please go to the show notes and check out her upcoming workshops this year. But if you're outside of that, then I really wanna encourage you to just do a cursory search. Cause there are, there are other Emily's and me's doing our own versions of this in other parts of the world too, and try to find them.

[Emily Sutherland]

Yes. I also want to throw out something that has happened since we talked after the storytelling retreat that I did in February. I noticed everybody saying, how can we stay in touch? And this happens at the end of every event that I've ever done. Because people do need support. They're ready to go home and embark on this project or the idea that that sparked. And they're like, I don't know how I'll do this without support. So I did start on substack, something just simply called Storytelling Community. It's free. I don't have any paywalls at this point because I just want people to feel that they have a place to go and say, hey, has Anybody ever used IngramSpark or Kindle? Direct Publishing is another one. What are the pros and cons? And probably somebody, especially over time, you know, I mean, I'm. I'm monitoring it, so I'll. I'll bite. Bite on those questions. But also, as more people come, more experiences are shared. And we can sort of just like you're saying, you know, just throw out ideas or just know that each other is there. Or we can even just say, hey, my inner critic Is really loud today, and everybody's gonna be like, oh, my gosh, I'm so sorry. You know, worth sending you love.

[Danielle Ireland]

Yes. So, yeah, not only are there in person communities, but there's online communities. And so last but not least, I wanna end this tools conversation. And you can't tell because you can't see me yet. Video episodes are actually in the works. That's a little, you know, a little Easter egg. But I am holding my favorite pen, and I think talking about tools is important to talk about nuts and bolts tools. The Sharpie pen, the fine tip. Sharpie pen in black is the best pen in the world. I will go to the mat for anyone who says otherwise.

[Emily Sutherland]

We might have to go to the mat.

[Danielle Ireland]

Oh, no. Oh, no. Emily, is this gonna be our first bite? It might be. What's your favorite pen?

[Emily Sutherland]

The Pilot G2O. It's just so great. And they come in all colors. I have purple and pink and turquoise and green and blue and black, and I just love every single one of them. Burgundy.

[Danielle Ireland]

The pilot G2. Okay, well, I will. I'll consider it. Okay. I'll just. I am so partial. The sound that this pen makes on the paper, it's so smooth and buttery. It doesn't have the. It doesn't have the, like, scratch, scratch, scratch sound the other pens. And also, I think because the way I write, I write fast, I don't have to press very hard because it's just. There's just so much pigment in that tip. It's just so great. But, you know, it's good to have variety and so on that. And don't worry, Sharpie pen's not a sponsor. Although maybe they should be. Maybe they should be a dual sponsorship.

[Emily Sutherland]

I don't know who owns both companies, but maybe a merger is necessary for us.

[Danielle Ireland]

That's fabulous. But, yes, if you have a favorite pen, that's the. That's the tool that you want to have in abundance. Like, if you have your favorite chapstick or your, like, emotional support water bottle. It's, like, for your creativity traps or for keeping things near. Have something you want to write with and something you want to write on. So true. Oh, yeah. The Pilot G2. Emily's faves. She wrote it in our shared note. So I see the pilot G2 pen.

[Emily Sutherland]

And read the rest of the line.

[Danielle Ireland]

Emily's faves in multiple colors.

[Emily Sutherland]

In multiple colors.

[Danielle Ireland]

You must.

[Emily Sutherland]

That's very important.

[Danielle Ireland]

So that's interesting. I only use black, and she likes multiple colors. So this really is a. Choose your own Tool. Another favorite of mine is Big Magic, the book Big Magic, Bird by Bird and the Artist's Way. Those are three books that's like after this podcast wraps and you're like, I want to dive more into the how and how do I do and how do I get in touch with and all the different layers of everything. We talked about those three books, I would just order them, go to your local bookstore or go to your library. Big Magic Bird by Bird, the Artist's Way. I like writing on notepads when I have big ideas, but I also like to journal in a little note and like a little journal. I also have a journal that I sell. It's always linked in the show notes. It's talked about just about every episode of this podcast. It's not new, but it's really helpful for anybody who's wanting to do some emotional excavating and doesn't want to look at a blank page in that process. It's a great tool for that. I love it. It's called Treasured. But when I'm working on big ideas, particularly like podcast or a broad story, I like a big sheet. And so I use the same notepads that I use for my therapy CL for their note and record keeping. But that's me.

[Emily Sutherland]

I love me some rifle paper company little notebooks because I'm left handed and they don't have spiral on the left side. It's about sensory experience for me. So I have all these little ones. They look, they're thinner, but which is good because I like to start journals more than I like to use the whole thing. Like, you know, I've started many journals and these are thinner but they're always pretty. I always feel like writing in them and I don't feel like I'm ruining a whole fat journal if I start one and kind of go halfway through it and then be like, oh, I need to start a new journal about this other project I'm doing. Yes.

[Danielle Ireland]

One thing I stopped doing is I turned my idea notebook and my journal into the same so that I wasn't juggling multiple notebooks. Cause I was almost making a process that was meant to make my life easier, harder. But that's just a very specific to me thing. So everything goes in one.

[Emily Sutherland]

It's actually a really good idea.

[Danielle Ireland]

Well, thanks. It's a tool you can use if you choose. I just rhymed again. Well, I feel spent on ideas. Is there anything else that you feel like. Any more juice left to squeeze? Emily, before we wrap this up?

[Emily Sutherland]

We live in the day of the Internet and, you know, we can find one another and ask each other questions. And I think there is a lot of power in just knowing that we're out here and that we're cheering for your ideas and that there are tools for even the most beginning beginners to find your way to make your idea live. There are ways to make almost any idea live in the world we live in. And there's a way to find out how to do it. So connection is huge.

[Danielle Ireland]

I think that's so good. And I will say, because we're doing this on the podcast, I think I wouldn't have felt the confidence in myself to approach a platform like IngramSpark. I almost did one of those like intermediary sort of supported self publishing places that I would have paid probably somewhere between 25 and $3,500 for them to basically do what I'm going to do, sweating in front of a computer by myself. And there's nothing wrong with that too, by the way. But I think confidence, I think, comes after you do something challenging. A lot of times we try to reverse engineer that orders. I want to feel confident and comfortable before I begin. And I felt confident in my ability to figure it out because I have approached technology with this podcast so many times and come out on the other side and figured it out. So sometimes the thing that gives you confidence may not be directly the thing you wanna work on or do, but I have evidence that I. Technology has scared me and I sat down and I slowed down and I breathed deep and I didn't over caffeinate and I figured it out. So I have confidence that I will be able to do that because I've done that before in other contexts. So just take that last little anecdote. I hope you enjoyed the toolkit. It was a much more robust episode actually than I thought it was going to be, but it was really lovely. What a great way to kind of bookend the. The whole creativity miniseries. And I'm sure we're gonna have Emily back.

[Emily Sutherland]

Oh man, this has been really fun. Thank you for letting me talk about my favorite thing.

[Danielle Ireland]

My pleasure. This was an absolute joy and a gift and gosh, the best things, the best things that Cher is just like the gift that keeps on giving. I'm gonna wrap up here and I hope everybody listening hops on over to the show Notes. Check out the affiliate links. Links to things that we referenced in the episode as well as the other upcoming workshops. Wherever you're listening, wherever you are in your creative process, keep going because we want your art. And thanks for listening.