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- [00:01]
Ashley
Everybody, no matter how much money you make, no matter where you shop, no matter how you vote, deserves quality food that supports the people growing it. The people eating the food, their health matters, their ability to make financial decisions that are within their means matters, and the farmer's health and well being matters. The decision makers who are deciding what to put in the crackers and the cookies and things that we eat. It isn't just one person. And companies need to have a top down ethos that creates incentives, incentives for people all along their supply chain to make the right decision. It does have to be pervasive. It cannot be a single person trying to carry the weight of an organization on their shoulders.
- [00:51]
Eric
Ashley, welcome to the D2C podcast. This is a little bit different for us. We're usually dealing with D2C brands and in this case we're talking about a new kind of cooking oil that is available to D2C brands who might be wanting to formulate products down the road. It's an oil I had never heard of and we talked a little bit about it in the pre interview. I'm really caught up in this discourse right now around seed oils. I think with Trump getting in and RFK Jr. Kind of targeting seed oils as what he perceives as a reason for a bit of the obesity epidemic. When I saw your lead come through as an opportunity to chat about this, I thought it might be interesting because I just never heard about it. So why don't you give us a little rundown of Terrviva and your product.
- [01:36]
Ashley
First of all, thank you Eric for having me. I'm really excited to be here and to talk about our company and of course this oil and the other products that you can make from what is essentially a supertree. So Terrviva is an agriculture innovation company. We partner with farmers to grow and harvest Pangamia. Pangamia is a super tree that's known for use in reforestation and in the Ayurveda. From the tree grow these amazing beans and we transform those beans into sustainable food ingredients, both oil and flour. And by growing more Pangamia we can help revitalize land and communities worldwide. So really we are making these food products from the beans of the tree, but it's all about getting more of these trees in the ground because they're good for communities and they're really, really good for soil. It's actually a regenerative crop. But today I think we're talking mostly about the oil. So just like any product you how olive oil is made, you Press the beans and you get oil and you get basically what's left over. The oil itself is an extremely high quality mid oleic oil that contains omega 9s. It's got a rich mouthfeel and kind of a beautiful buttery golden color that works really well in culinary applications.
- [02:51]
Eric
Super interesting. And I know it's not a huge focus, this seed oil discourse is not a huge focus of what you guys are kind of going for right now, but Panova does profile favorably against things like canola and these other like highly extracted oils mainly because of its light extraction process. Is that right?
- [03:10]
Ashley
Yeah. So essentially the discourse around seed oil comes from three main really good reasons. The first one is how is it grown? The second one is how is it processed? And the third is what are those things do to actually like the human body? Right. What's the nutrition on it? So first off, how is it grown? Traditional oilseeds are industrial agriculture products, almost all of which are GMOs. This is not an industrial oil. Terrific. Pangamia does not come at an environmental cost. It's naturally suited for sustainable growth in challenging environments. That's why I got involved with a company, is that this tree can actually grow in distressed soils. It heals the soil. It's a legume. Right. So it requires fewer resources. It's naturally pest resistant. The way it's grown is just not the same industrial processes with the oils you tend to think about. In terms of seed oils, the second piece that you started to allude to is how is it processed? Traditional oil seeds are associated with harmful byproducts, including trans fats and harmful chemicals. They're produced through really high heat and chemical extraction processes. And some of that stays with the oil. We don't process our oil that way. In fact we can't. Because what we're doing is we're trying to remove some of the flavor compounds that make the bean pest resistant in a really gentle way. And so our process is a light refining process because you have to like prepare it. People aren't just like eating beans out there. That does not create chemical contaminants and processing. The third part is like, well why do we care about all these things like how it's grown and how it's processed? It's nutrition. Traditional seed oils are known to create non healthy saturated fats and also they have pro inflammatory fatty acids like omega 6. Soy is really rich in omega 6. And I'm not going to get into the dorkiness of like what are omega 3 versus 6 versus 9 but typically that omega 6 and inflammation. And you talked about obesity. That's part of the problem. Our oil isn't that it is heart healthy omega nines mid oleic oil. So it's actually a heart healthy oil. Now what you think about, when you think about what we want to replace, but what's really interesting is we talk about replacing oils, right? So is can this oil actually replace those oils? Scalability, functionality? Yes. I mean, it's really that simple. Can we scale with this? Absolutely. Is it functionally equivalent? Yes.
- [05:49]
Eric
And you're doing it in a way that is less damaging and potentially even regenerative to the soils, which I know is an ongoing huge issue.
- [05:56]
Ashley
The soil health is a huge, huge issue. You know, I've been in the food industry for a really long time and I. It can be as complicated as you want it to be. But actually the more I'm in the industry, the more I see that planetary health and human health totally connected, 100%.
- [06:12]
Eric
We're all. I did LSD one time in Laos and I realized we're all one thing. So I think you're.
- [06:18]
Ashley
You know what's funny actually is I mentioned Ayurvedic medicine. That's kind of one of the roots about the Ayurveda is like this connectedness. And that's not why, you know, this is a business podcast, so we'll keep that to the side. But it's all totally connected. Right. And so we're taking care of our planet and we're also taking care of the communities. Right. Right now the oil we're using is wild harvested because that's where the trees are. It's used for reforestation. And these are individual collectors. And so we can actually raise their standard of living and we can pay them to collect these beans that otherwise would literally just, you know, fall on the ground. Nothing would happen to them. It's pretty incredible.
- [06:59]
Eric
So I kind of remember when I was a kid, I guess canola oil, I guess also known as like rapeseed oil, which is probably a branding issue, changed their name. But I remember when it was like, it became, I think it was invented in Canada, actually.
- [07:14]
Ashley
Canada, oils, Canola.
- [07:17]
Eric
Yeah. I remember why, when it got, you know, when it became much bigger, I know when like McDonald's switched from tallow to seed oils. And I know, I think they're trying to make maybe a push back. But I'm just curious, what did you learn about like the rollout of and popularizing of canola oil that you're now trying to like what's the playbook for? Like letting the world know that there's this new, there's this oil that you can use. Cause I bet a lot of people, like almost everyone I've talked to does not know about this yet. What's your plan for the rollout?
- [07:47]
Ashley
That's a great question. So, yes, canola oil definitely was a sort of new oil. And that playbook took a really long time. It obviously had lots of branding and we can talk about that a lot. But for our oil, we are leapfrogging some of that process. The way we've done that is first thing, you have to be able to make enough. Right. And so our company has spent 12 years with this crop. How do we make a non GMO cultivar that has low inputs? It's really good for the planet, but actually also makes enough yield for this to make sense for farmers. If we're not taking care of the farmers that are growing it, game over. There's no point in doing this. They're not going to grow it. They need to be able to make income. So we have spent the past 14 years working on that part of it. And then the end product use. So our trees can actually produce about seven times the yield of soy acre per acre, which is pretty incredible. And we can use the entire bean. So I mentioned that when you press the bean, you get sort of oil and you get meal. What's left over? The same simple refining technology or similar anyway that we use for the oil we can use on the meal. And we can actually make like a high protein flour, which is delicious. I've had it before. We make it like graham crackers and stuff in the office with it all the time. And on the other end with the products, we actually have the patented technology to remove the flavors and make this oil that was traditionally been used in the Ayurveda and for medicine. We can actually make a really healthy human food out of it. And so by managing both of those sides of the supply chain, we can guarantee scale, which is really important. You know, you think about grains and things that could have been awesome, like Kernza. Right. Kernza has not been able to scale. I don't know if you. Are you familiar with Kernza?
- [09:35]
Eric
No.
- [09:35]
Ashley
This rad wheat that has these crazy long roots and it's a perennial instead of an annual crop. So it's better for the environment. But yield is an issue, right. If farmers aren't making what they need to make to keep their businesses alive, kind of a moot point. And so we have actually taken this amazing tree, created our cultivars out of it and done test orchards in Australia, Florida and Hawaii. And it's. Anybody can take a tree and like copy it, you know, green side up, plant it in the ground. But what we've actually done a lot of research on is how do you have a whole orchard system? How are you taking care of the pollinators, how are you making sure that your whole system of your orchard is growing in a way that's healthy and high yield and not just taking a tree and making lots of copies of the same tree? Because that actually doesn't do a lot. And our first test product was with an amazing company called Aloha. They have a bar, they're a certified B corp, climate neutral fair trade company and they've taken the oil that comes from our Hawaii orchards and they've put it in their bars. And we worked with them on some of those launches and we wanted to see like, how do people respond to this before we go big out in the world. It's become their best selling SKU and we've launched multiple bars with them now. And there's actually another one coming up soon, which is going to be very exciting, which I can't probably say too much about, but they are crushing it. And I think the fact that they're a high values company has been a really fun way to like test the boundaries with our oil so far.
- [11:10]
Eric
How are the ways, like how are they messaging your product? Because is it something. Because not like do people know that there's, you know, your oil in this or is it messaging around the this, you know, soil erosion and things like that? How are they taking advantage of that?
- [11:24]
Ashley
Yeah, so the Aloha bars, they're special edition Hawaii bars, are made with local Hawaiian ingredients. So multiple kinds of Hawaiian ingredients like macadamia nuts, Kona coffee, things like that. And the oil is actually also featured on the label and on the boxes. So they've got these beautiful graphics of the Panova leaves with their gorgeous beans and they talk about it right on pack because it's a really cool part of the story. They've talked about it in their social media, they've talked about it in their PR because they want to talk about the land and traceable supply chains. And so with our product they have a story that they can talk about. And frankly, for the next year or so, my job is to identify the partners who are we going to be launching this flower and this oil with and the customers that we want to launch with are those who want to talk about the ingredients, they want to make a commitment to their consumers and they want to say, hey, we're paying attention to the food that you eat and it's not just about the nutrition, but it's also about the land. Although those things, as we discussed, are linked and those are the partners we're looking for.
- [12:30]
Eric
Yes, Circular E Commerce. I remember I had blanking on his name right now, but he worked for, he had worked for Patagonia and some other big brands and he was really about, you know, looking at the whole footprint of E commerce. When you're, when you're kind of selling things on the amount of, you know, fibers and microfibers and all these microplastics that you're kind of putting out into the environment. So it's kind of cool for CPG brands, grocery brands, to go all the way down to their supply chain and think about, you know, partners, ingredient partners that are thinking the same way about circuit circular E commerce. So if there are, there's people listening to this podcast, so the CPG brands that are out there, maybe listening to this podcast, what's your message for them? Who, what, what kind of partners are you? You're looking for partners that are sort of better for you, I guess, in that better for you kind of like category reinvention kind of space. Who are you looking for to try this product?
- [13:19]
Ashley
Customers who have consumers who care about the quality of their ingredient. We also have a lot of consumer research that we can share with any interested customers that talk about what our target market is and who is most passionate. And we do find that the individuals who see that connection between planetary and individual health tend to be more interested. Now, the sustainability benefits are incredible. And if you've ever worked in the food industry, which you obviously know from your 10,000 podcasts and things like that, is that if it doesn't taste good, if it isn't convenient, if a truck isn't going to actually show up with the amount that they ordered, none, no amount of storytelling matters. And so what's really cool about this product is that it is actually a functional, high quality product. You know, consumers are getting fatigued, right? You look at labels and there's like 10,000 stories on the back about someone's mom who planted something and she had celiac disease and all of this stuff. Like there's 10,000 of those stories in the grocery store and it can be kind of exhausting. So it is up to the decision makers at food brands to do the right thing. You can't just say consumers will choose what's right. Everyone's exhausted. I mean, and everyone only has so many dollars in the bank and food is expensive. Food companies and decision makers at these companies who want to do the right thing also have to have products that are high quality and functional and fit within their price point. And those are the partners that we're looking for. Somebody who wants to do big things, who wants to do the right things, and who, you know, pretty pragmatic about their business.
- [15:10]
Eric
Yeah, I just watching this US Election cycle and this.
- [15:15]
Ashley
Did that just happen?
- [15:16]
Eric
That just happened.
- [15:17]
Ashley
I missed that. Yeah, everyone.
- [15:19]
Eric
I was trying to hide my head in the sand as a Canadian. We don't watch it all. We're obsessed. Canadians are obsessed with American politics for some reason. But just sort of like watching RFK's press conference where he's calling out drudgery, he's calling out America's food laws about having all these different ingredients and products that other countries ban. I just, I feel like there is, you know, you want brands that are conscious of that. And I just feel like in this D2C space, everyone, you know, that's kind of like the rebels in this space. Right. We're sort of like standing up against these giant conglomerates that put all these ingredients in food. So I can see there being a real cause for brands to evaluate the ingredients that they're using. What does, what does the cost profile for your product look like versus something like a more traditional canola oil?
- [16:00]
Ashley
Yeah, it's actually right in line with other ingredients that they would buy. Now, it might be. Which still working on that. I think the scale of what people purchase is going to dictate a little bit of price. Definitely way cheaper than olive oils and stuff like that. So we're right in the sweet spot. And that matters. That matters to these companies that are trying to make the right ingredient decisions is we want consumer pull through. We want a product that we know consumers want to consume. And we also need a product that is going to fit within the guardrails of companies who are selecting ingredients for procurement. You know, it's funny. I had a meeting a year or so ago. I will say no names, but their website, everything they talk about was just like, we're the kings of sustainability. We are. That's all we do. And then I go in and I have this meeting and I watch. I sat at the table and I watched the power dynamics in the room. It was completely obvious within 10 minutes that the only person who had any influence in the room was the one procurement guy and he is only incentivized against cost. And so how am I as a salesperson and product marketer going to make the biggest, most positive possible impact on the planet and on the people growing our food? Because the people growing our food matter. And I just cannot say that loud enough. The people growing our food matter, how do I impact them? And it's not just through sexy sustainability messaging. It's that procurement guy's got to have a product that works for him and for what he's incentivized. Because as much as I would love to say all companies need to change their incentive systems, you need to have a sustainability person on every single team. I also am a realistic human being. I know how people eat, I know how people buy. And this has to be a product that works for everybody 100%.
- [17:55]
Eric
I'm just, I went, my mind goes to Midday Squares. They're one of my favorite Canadian brands here. I know they're, they're sort of American wide. Yeah, Midday Squares, they're just out, they're building in public. They're one of my first podcast guests actually. And they've kind of become friends. But they have this better for you kind of category redefining functional chocolate bar. And I was just going to their, their ingredients here and they've got, you know, they use olive oil, they use organic pea protein, they use all these, these different kinds of things. I could see it fitting, right? And I imagine there's probably a lot of, I bet a lot in the bars category are products that could use this and they could probably use both the bean and the oil. I imagine in a lot of cases, to the people who are listening, where do you see if they were to make, wanted to make a change, what would they be substituting specifically? Would it be people wanting to do this over olive oil? Would it be over soy or canola oil? Where does it fit in there?
- [18:45]
Ashley
Yeah, we have worked with a lot of really cool product development firms to see where they would put it. And it works very well pretty much anywhere where you use these oils. So plant based butters mayo salad dressings makes a really delicious like cooked, crispy cracker. Obviously it's in bars. It does really nice creamer. And what's really cool about some of these products is the color is really nice. So it's a pretty functional, pretty simple oil. So our vision is that we see it in every aisle of the grocery store. We are an impact based company. So working with other companies is how we're going to make that impact. We want to plant millions of trees. We're going to do that with partners who are going to put our product in all of their products. And so if a company wants to plant trees and make a positive impact and maybe also get some of that carbon credit, we're the people they should call. The flour is super interesting because you talk about things like pea protein with maybe need a little bit of, you know, flavor maskers. This is a pretty neutrally flavored flour. But what's really cool about it is some of the plant based proteins, they have kind of like a, I don't know if you've ever noticed it, there's like almost a grayish color to them. Like when you have like an almond milk and you go to bake with it and it gets like grayish looking. This is actually like a really warm neutrally color. So it's kind of got like a, like when you see, you're like, oh, this is real food. So it's a really nice color for people who are doing product development.
- [20:21]
Eric
Super cool. Is it? I was just, I was listening to this. One of my favorite influencers names cancel this clothing company. And he's sort of a rebel and he, he was just drawing my attention. This app that I thought was interesting, it's called Seed Oil Scout and it's literally. Yeah, it's an app that allows you to find products that don't use seed up seed oil. It's an app, it also allows you to find restaurants. And I feel like it's just, I could see it as a trend just kind of going forward that a certain segment of the audience, maybe not everyone, but starts becoming more aware of the kind of products that they're using. And I could see you guys being really well positioned. Is it something, it's not something you can deep fry in though, right? Is it too heavy of an oil to deep fry in?
- [21:02]
Ashley
You can.
- [21:02]
Eric
Interesting.
- [21:03]
Ashley
Yeah, absolutely. You can.
- [21:04]
Eric
I'm still gunning for beef fat to come back. I'm still a big tallow. Big tallow guy. Big whole ingredient. I was, I, I'm looking at starting a tallow skincare brand. I was just looking. It's just absolutely exploded on like trends tallow has.
- [21:18]
Ashley
Interesting. Yeah, it's obviously used in like in a sustainable fuels and you know, non petroleum based fuels, I should say. Yeah, I mean look, we don't have to talk about the beef industry, but I think that there's a pretty broad, pretty broad range of qualities also within that category.
- [21:35]
Eric
Yeah, it's got to be grass fed, grass finished anyways. We don't, we can go, we can go down the rabbit hole on alternative health, but I think now's the time. Like now is especially now. Like there's already been the hubermans of the world and the, you know, all of these people kind of putting out alternative theories on how our nutritional systems have been maybe co opted or sort of misguided in some ways like the food pyramid kind of leading to the obesity epidemic. So I feel like we're in a really interesting time of upheaval and especially after this election if people like RFK Jr and his brainworm are given, you know, the reins of this system, it's going to be really interesting to see what shakes out.
- [22:14]
Ashley
Yeah, I think, look, people becoming more educated about what they're eating and people taking their food quality seriously is really good. I think your audience is probably leaning towards a more food educated. So I know I'm sort of speaking preaching to the choir here but there's a lot information out there and there's a broad, broad range and quality of information. So I've worked in food marketing for 20 plus years at this point and look at where you're getting your information. And the one thing I will tell anybody who's looking at whether or not a food is good or bad and you're looking for a shortcut is if you are following someone on a blog who says all processed foods are bad and then you go to their website and they're selling you supplements or some other highly processed food, you should think about that because bread is processed but it's pretty different, pretty different than some of the other things like living off of a meal, beverage or something like that. So I really want people to be paying attention to what they're eating and I think it's really good that people are paying attention to fats. I think fats are an important part of the diet and I think oils are really important part of the diet. And I think even just it's confusing. Omega 369 like, you know, it's not super straightforward for somebody who frankly it's exhausting. People have.
- [23:43]
Eric
I was drinking Bioseal the other day, my friend's like, did you know that their folate's not methylated? And I'm like what? I'm just like, I'm just like, I know it. I have all my, like, I didn't know I had to methylate my folates. I just this, I've been eating Lindt chocolate. Like I Always have like a bar of Lindt chocolate at home. And I just saw this big study came out about how much lead there is in Lindt chocolate. I'm just like, oh my God, it is, it's an. It's exhausting. As a consumer, it is exhausting.
- [24:06]
Ashley
I was on a panel last year and one of the other panelists said, I'm a firm believer that consume you just should let consumers decide. And it just kind of made me really depressed because I'm highly educated in the food world. I've been to 10,000 food industry conferences and sat in on the panel presentations. And you know what? It is confusing. And I am not a food scientist. And so I rely on people whose opinion I respect to help educate me about what I want to eat and frankly, when I want to feed my children. And I'm glad people are paying attention and being obsessive. Fear. Fear mongering. Nutritionists are probably trying to sell you something. If somebody is trying to play up tons of fear, I'm concerned about that. So I think that, you know, on our side of the street, transparent, equitable supply chains matter. The health of the planet, the health of the soil matters. Paying attention to the fats that you consume, macronutrients, micronutrients, not eating a bunch of processed junk food, eating oils that are healthy, but also just being balanced and realistic. Stressing and obsessing is also bad for you. So like, let's make all good choices.
- [25:26]
Eric
Oxidizing.
- [25:27]
Ashley
Exactly. That's very good point. It's exactly oxidizing. And I just. My rallying call is for the people who are in decision making power, the people who are making purchasing decisions on behalf of the foods that we eat as a population, they need to be doing the right thing. They have so much power and they think of themselves as like, oh, I work in supply chain, whatever. You're a really important job, make good decisions. And I think you'll be on the right side of history because I'll tell you, busy moms and dads and parents and grandparents, you know, walking down the grocery store aisle, it's a lot.
- [26:04]
Eric
But at the same time, those people making those decisions, it can't necessarily be in a silo, right? Like if you're making a food decision for like a big company and then do you have to champion internally? Oh, well, we got to start putting that this oil is far more environmentally sound or you got to be able to kind of work up and down your organization in order to get buy in. I imagine when you're Dealing with a new product or like a new category. Who, who in our who listening to this podcast, like, what, what are your dream brands? Like, are there any dream brands that you'd just be like, okay, these guys need to be using our product.
- [26:40]
Ashley
Okay, well first of all, Graza, I need to call those guys. What a, what a. Oh, yeah. I mean the simplicity of like, oh, hey, you know what, 10 billion brands of olive oil. I've never thought to just do what all chefs do, put in a functional bottle is like, yeah, you know, it is so smart. And I buy it, it's a great oil. So I got to talk to those guys. I think that, you know, obviously like Patagonia Provisions has a great storytelling device and I think this building out for scale. Everybody in the country, no matter how much money you make, no matter where you shop, no matter how you vote, deserves good quality food that supports the people growing it. The people eating the food, their health matters, their ability to make financial decisions that are within their means matters. And the farmer's health and well being matters. And so the decision makers who are deciding what to put in the crackers and the cookies and things that we eat, it isn't just one person. And companies need to have a top down ethos that creates incentives for people all along their supply chain to make the right decision. It shouldn't be a sustainability person who's super far away from everything else trying to bang a gong within their organization. The procurement person should be incentivized to make decisions that are long term focused, that think about things like changes in water and climate and soil health. The person in marketing should be incentivized. The person in legal, I mean like our legal teams matters. Every single person should be incentivized to do things that fit the values of a company while still meeting their financial objectives. And I think that can happen. But it does have to be pervasive. It cannot be a single person trying to carry the weight of an organization on their shoulders.
- [28:43]
Eric
And then it has to be translated to the customer in a way. Not every product is going to put a seed oil free stamp on their product using, using an alternative. But I bet we'll see more and more in the coming years of people kind of taking a stand on some things like that in order to differentiate. It's funny, I was looking just for chips the other I was trying to find a chip that was not in seed oil and I saw that it was only avocado oil chips, for instance. And I've heard that a lot of avocado oils. Like adulterated is. There is. That is. I wanted to ask you about that. I'd heard different discourse around things like olive oil and how much of it's adulterated or how much of it is actually. Do you have any, any comment on. On that, on the olive oil industry and how pure it is?
- [29:22]
Ashley
I actually don't. I don't know a lot about that specific claim.
- [29:26]
Eric
I'd read it was bogus. I read a report actually that someone actually just. There was a report that went out that might have been a canola scaremonger, but that actually then someone did a test of a bunch of different olive oils and found that even the basic grocery store ones were not generally adult. They're pure.
- [29:42]
Ashley
Olive oil is a very established industry. I think that olive oil, as we've all seen in the news, has been impacted by climate change and by weather events. And so prices of olive oil have shifted. Spain is a huge player in olive oil. Italy, California. It has grown in climates all over the world. And so there is a lot of supply of it. And I think when I seed oil free labels, you mentioned. And I think it's really interesting because I think the risk for the procurement person is really interesting. So if you think about a gigantic company, like just massive company, and they make a bazillion bottles of creamer a year, whatever it is, and they commit to something like, I'm only going to buy this particular product and put it on my label. And then all of a sudden there's a war, as there was with Ukraine and sunflower oil, and for months they can't get the product they need or there's a really, really terrible crop and prices triple. That is a major risk. And switching out an ingredient is a huge challenge. You can't do it overnight. You have to change the labels. You have to alert people. God forbid there's an allergen difference between what you have on your label and what you want to put into that product. So we also have to have a little bit of empathy too, if we want companies to have. If we're going to buy a cracker that's available in every state across this gigantic country and maybe in Canada as well. It's actually more complicated than just like they should have only this product. Well, okay. Their challenges are actually pretty big and I think we need to be kind of empathetic to that if we want to buy those products. So, yeah, I think that there's. I think it's. It's a tough. It's A tough thing to be in. But I think that there are ways to do things that are really sustainable and I think there are ways to do things where you are, you know, like what we're doing with Aloha, you know, they're focused on our oil. They're using the oil from our Hawaii Orchard and they're using it in some limited edition bars and as you grow, scale, God, I would love to expand with them. They're a great brand.
- [31:55]
Eric
Yeah, super cool. Well, if you want to know more, go to terrviva.com where do you recommend people follow you? Can people follow you on LinkedIn?
- [32:04]
Ashley
Follow us on LinkedIn. We do have a Instagram account that doesn't do a ton since we're a B2B company. But yeah, you can follow us there.
- [32:12]
Eric
Yeah, it's real different for us. It's funny. This will actually come out. This will kind of come out close to the holidays, actually right now with where we're booking. And it's funny, one of our last episodes of last year was one that we did with someone that was on the supply side as well that was sort of B2B. It was an ingredient sourcer called Ingredient Brothers. And I think this kind of fits in this category of something a little bit different. But I just think it's cool for people in our audience to know about alternatives, especially to the seed oils, which I won't villainize. I know. I think that's a good point that obviously these huge organizations, it could be difficult to take that kind of stand. And it might be a little preemptory right now with the science where it is. But anyway, super interesting discussion. Nice to meet you, Ashley.
- [32:56]
Ashley
Great to meet you. Thanks for having me.
- [33:04]
Eric
Thanks so much for listening to today's episode. If you're not a subscriber to our newsletter, you can do that right now at direct to consumer all one word co. I'm Eric Dick and this has been the D2C podcast. We'll see you next time.