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- [00:00]
Kyle Hitchcox
I think when people think about conversion rate optimization, they're not looking at in chaos. In change, there's always opportunity. In any recession there's more entrepreneurs that come out from that now more than ever. Especially going into potential downturn in the market. You're going to have to monetize more of the traffic that you have and do that efficiently and in a way that's cost affordable. And so everyone knows they need landing pages, everyone knows they need cart upsells, everyone knows that they need these things. They know their site needs to load fast. But if you're just getting started and or you know you need to do work but you don't know where to start. Conversion rate optimization is not and cannot be binary. People think of it as one thing or the other. It needs to be the whole brand experience On Shopify and Beyond.
- [00:51]
Eric Dick
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- [02:20]
Kyle Hitchcox
Good man. Yeah, stoked to be back. Been busy but been having a lot of fun these days.
- [02:26]
Eric Dick
We're on the verge of heading to Shop Talk, which I'm really excited about this will come out kind of after Shop Talk. I'm getting to interview Kevin O'Leary, which should be a lot of fun. Mr. Wonderful himself. We're going to be doing some other on the, on the show floor type interviews and things like that. You've been doing a little traveling, talking about Warp Drive. How's that been getting out in front of a new product?
- [02:48]
Kyle Hitchcox
Yeah, it's been really rewarding. It's been cool. Getting out from behind the scenes of building an operating agency and just connecting and meeting with people that I haven't seen in years and meeting lots of, lots of new people. It's been a lot of fun.
- [03:03]
Eric Dick
Nice. What are you hearing out there? What's the, what are the vibes among the D2C folk that you're running into at these events you've been to?
- [03:10]
Kyle Hitchcox
There's the economy concerns and everything else that goes with that. But you know, and actual, actual impact maybe more so than, you know, the worry of the recession that never came a couple of years ago. But the established brands, they're not really focusing on it. It doesn't seem like they're just moving forward and optimizing their business as per usual. And generally I think the sentiment is quite positive. There's still a lot of new stuff being launched. There's still a lot of great brands that are scaling and selling and exiting. There's a lot of news recently with some big brands that are, that are actually, you know, exiting for, for a lot of money.
- [03:51]
Eric Dick
We're talking Poppy, we're talking Poppy Pepsi.
- [03:54]
Kyle Hitchcox
Poppy's won the most recent. Absolutely. What a, what a win for them, man. So, so happy for that team. But yeah, generally I, I think people are just moving forward and in, in chaos in change, there's always opportunity and in any recession there's more entrepreneurs that come out from that. It's proven time and time again. So yeah, I think, I think we're, we're moving forward strong and united in the DTC space.
- [04:16]
Eric Dick
Very cool. What are you looking to accomplish? What kind of conversations and what are you looking to do at Shop Talk this week?
- [04:22]
Kyle Hitchcox
Well, I'm going to ride your coattails for one. I know that you're on the floor and you're integrated into the show for the first time and so I just wanted to be a part of that. But also connecting with clients and just, you know, seeing what's going on with them and helping them, you know, find solutions to problems. And of course, you know, meeting people and talking about post click, which is this year's agenda for me?
- [04:45]
Eric Dick
Why is 2025 the year of Post Click?
- [04:48]
Kyle Hitchcox
Oh, really? Good question. Well, I think now more than ever, especially going into potential downturn in the market, you're going to have to monetize more of the traffic that you have and do that efficiently and in a way that's cost affordable. And so, you know, for those that have heard me talk, it's the same thing. I love Post Click to, to drop your cost to acquire customers. And I just know we do that well. And so I think that's why for 2025, I think brands will need it more than ever.
- [05:18]
Eric Dick
We love Inside Baseball here on the All Killer no filler show. Almost everyone listening to this probably knows what we mean by post click and we've talked about it throughout the years. But as someone who's focused on pre click or advertising, the advertising side of things, whether it's creative or the algorithm, talk to me about exactly what you mean by post click.
- [05:39]
Kyle Hitchcox
Well, postcloft optimization. So anything from your paid traffic or regardless that your customer interacts with, it's just making sure that every piece of that shopping experience drives a conversion through different means. So be it through persuasive copy, be it through cart mechanics, or be it through split testing and optimizing and building customer experiences in an efficient way that drive more sales.
- [06:08]
Eric Dick
We've talked about this a little bit on the podcast, but talk to me about how Warp Drive fits into brands.
- [06:13]
Kyle Hitchcox
Post Click needs maybe more holistically. There's a bunch of different ways to do conversion rate optimization. So maybe not making it so much about Warp Drive, but more just holistically. There's some important things and I think when people think about conversion rate optimization, they're not looking at the whole experience and different teams are built for different parts of that experience for optimization. So you'll have a brand manager. That's the look and feel of your store or brand. And then you have your marketer who's coming up with hooks, ad creatives. And then you have your developers that are working on Shopify, likely driven internally, or you're working with a CRO agency who's doing that work. Or you have an internal team or you're a founder and you're just doing as much as you can yourself. You know, going top down from say ad click off meta down into the conversion on your on your store. We just have some kind of fundamentals that we look at. And so you know, the baseline is your store must load in less than 2 seconds that's just table stakes at this point. If your store doesn't, you're leaving money on the table and going beyond that too. First impressions, you need to have organic content in the search results because people are leaving your ads and they're going to look for you and they might be buying your competitors or trying to get an understanding of if you're a real business. And so it goes beyond just a cart optimization. It's a full perception from the customer. And then we break it down like this. You've got two seconds to load your store on mobile. You've got two to four seconds to project professionalism. You need to look real, you need to look like an established company, a brand. You've got four to seven seconds to engage and explain what your product and offer actually is so that it's easy to understand in that moment, so that they're psychologically more associated and motivated to continue down your path. Or funnel. 7 to 17 seconds to verify and validate. So does the person that visited your shop actually need what you have, knowing that only 3% of your, of your target market is actually target audience rather is in market to make a transaction or a purchase at any given time. Are you matching your, your brand benefits to the customer's need in that, in that moment? And then you've got about 17 seconds to about a minute and a half to capture and convert that customer. And so when we're talking about CRO, we're looking at all that stuff and as you go down that, down that ladder or that funnel, if you fail at any step in that, your bounce rate increases and you obviously lose that, that customer opportunity. You might get them later through retargeting campaign or whatnot. But if you can drive, drive customers down through, through this idea, you'll, you'll be more successful.
- [09:17]
Eric Dick
It's funny. So I was just done and they're going to come on the podcast. So I don't mind saying it, but the head of E Commerce from Uniqlo, one of my favorite apparel brands, is going to come on the podcast and I was just on their site the other day trying to buy some new spring clothes. And they're on the one end of the spectrum where it's like before you can even get to their, like find the men's, you know, shirts or pants, they, they, they're making you go through these like brand lookbooks and like the only way to find what you're looking for is to go down and like search or to click into here and they've Made it. They've. They put such an emphasis on the brand and this like brand projection that it's literally a just massive headache what I wanted to find. And so you've got that end of the spectrum and then the other end of the spectrum would be something like click funnels. So like my own, my old marketing heads out there will know, you know, ClickFunnels is just all about just dead simple driving people to the next step kind of thing which converts way, way better in a lot of cases. But isn't going to give you that brand experience. Isn't going to give you even the ability to shop, you know, across a large selection of goods. So how, how do you think about balancing branding with performance in, in the, in the post Click experience.
- [10:31]
Kyle Hitchcox
Well, Uniqlo is interesting. I was golfing with my grandpa. I actually was rocking a hoodie I bought there in Tokyo from last year. But funny I guess Eric, the first thing is like you, you are a loyal customer and so you'd already know what you want. Right. And so you don't generally of going through that lookbook or whatever. So I would say that strategy probably is them trying to bring retail online, you know, having the in store shopping experience and help. I'm guessing that's what they' I don't, I don't know. I haven't looked at it. On the opposite end of that is clickfunnels. Yeah, I mean was a very fast growing tool and promoted. Promoted very well. Not for brands. It. The experiences were a little rocky as you went through there as a customer. Great for new product launches and getting started as a, as a new brand. But yeah, so the difference there approaching the two, what we're doing is not for everyone. I wouldn't even try to work with Uniglo as an example. What we would do is let's find the middle ground. A big blanket as an example. A unique product in the market, lots of demand. We approach it kind of in three ways. It's adding to the existing store and creating stories and storytelling through landing pages and video content and things like that. But the design and feel is all on brand. Unlike say a click funnels and then making sure that the basics and fundamentals are done right. So are you starting with the right offer? I think a lot of brands skip that part when they launch a business. They throw a bunch of products into a store. It might be designed well, it might be a great theme or template loading fast, whatever, but they'll just send traffic to products they're not thinking about. Shaping those products into something that's more captivating, that a consumer is likely more willing to purchase. And that captivation piece I think is one of the things we're doing alongside landing pages and also offer shaping as well as the basic fundamentals on your purchase mechanics and things like that that are table stakes these days.
- [12:46]
Eric Dick
We just did a podcast a couple weeks ago with Aves about founder stories and how effective they can be. But if you're going to then drive right to a PDP or something that doesn't like, you know, help you understand the promise of a founder story ad through, you know, if you're going right to the pdp, it's probably going to be a jarring experience. You probably need something in the middle there that, you know, builds on that brand promise that they were, they were given in the ad.
- [13:09]
Kyle Hitchcox
Yeah, exactly. Thinking about this and you know, simplifying how people listening should work on these things because everyone knows they need landing pages, everyone knows they need card upsells, everyone knows that they need these things. They know site needs to load fast. But if you're just getting started and, or you know, you need to do work but you don't know where to start, we start closest to the money. So in the cart, get all those fundamentals right. Get your, get your offer and pricing organized well and make it captivating and make sure those, those, you know, basic mechanics to increase conversion rates and increase your average order values are dialed like start there. Secondly, getting closest to the traffic, that's where you get into more of the storytelling. You get into the earlier top of that, that ladder I just mentioned where you're projecting professionalism, you're engaging and explaining those two things together are a very powerful way to essentially grow your business. And I've been talking with a lot of people lately and it's the brands that are in the 50 to 150k mark, it seems like per month in revenue, that seems like one of the, maybe the second ceiling of growth. And every single one of them knows that it's doing those two things well. They just maybe don't have the bandwidth or capacity to get it done. And that's kind of where we come in. And then there's an upper echelon of brand that the 10 to 50 million a year, the appetite for this because they already know that they need to do it. They know they have the resources to get it done and they know that they just need a good team to do it. And that market for us and the conversations that I have had have been the most interesting and the fastest moving.
- [14:59]
Eric Dick
So what are people doing? Like when a brand comes to Pilot House to talk with us, how are they thinking about post click most often?
- [15:06]
Kyle Hitchcox
Right now that's a great question. I mean, if we back out to interest based lead Gen, our funnel of people who come in and actually want to speak with us about performance marketing or growth marketing, about a third or half of the people actually collect select conversion rate optimization as an interest to have us work with them on. So starting there, you know, it's probably a good metric if you're looking at how many people think that they actually need it because that's a pretty large sample size. And again, everyone's stage is different. So summarizing, I suppose it's a big topic of interest and there's a lot of ways to do it, but if you want to expand on that, I might be able to give you some more valuable information.
- [15:53]
Eric Dick
People think about CRO probably in a bit of a static way sometimes where it's like arranging different things above the fold or below the fold or different button colors or different calls to action. But I think one of the beauties of what we're doing at Pilot House is it becomes this like much bigger. You're thinking about the full funnel. You're not thinking about like individual things on individual pages. You're thinking about the whole experience from AD all the way to checkout. And there's so many different ways that you can kind of play in that space.
- [16:22]
Kyle Hitchcox
Yeah, exactly. I mean, that raises a good point. So. So we have some golden rules. I'll riff one of them now. Golden rule number two, Conversion rate optimization is not and cannot be binary. I think people think of it as one thing or the other, but it is the whole, to your point, the whole, the whole shopping experience working together and going beyond. Again, just what's on Shopify. It needs to be the whole brand experience on Shopify and beyond and the storytelling. That's how we think about it. Which is. Which is not normal, I don't think.
- [16:57]
Eric Dick
Let's keep going on these golden rules. First back up. What's the first golden rule?
- [17:03]
Kyle Hitchcox
Okay, here we go. Without a strong foundation, you will not succeed. Basically meaning that is your store functioning to what the market expects. Now that is the baseline. You can't build a house on a broken foundation. And it's the same thing for a DTC brand.
- [17:21]
Eric Dick
And then how much of that is mobile? I think this is a given at this point. I remember we came up in the. I don't even want to say, but in the 2010s when like mobile was just starting. And so mobile optimization was like a bit of an afterthought for a lot of people. But at this point it's the bulk of the traffic.
- [17:37]
Kyle Hitchcox
It is somewhere between 50 and 70% depending on target, demo and vertical and which platform you're coming off of for sure. But that happens to be golden rule number four. So fast load times are non negotiable on Mobile in 2025. And for those listening, go put your site into Google site speeds or pingdom and you can see how long it actually takes to load anything under 2 seconds on mob while you are burning cash.
- [18:04]
Eric Dick
Okay, well then I like this. We're doing this in a quantum fashion. Let's go back then to golden rule number three. What is golden rule number three?
- [18:12]
Kyle Hitchcox
I covered this earlier, but only 3% of your audience is in market for your product at any given time. And so basically we're signaling that you need to captivate that audience in that moment because 3% of your visitors hopefully are willing to buy in that moment. If you do your job right, you can, you can capture them.
- [18:31]
Eric Dick
And then what are we doing with the other 97%?
- [18:34]
Kyle Hitchcox
You're retargeting them and you're trying to bring them back and you're filtering out people who you deem as a bad audience through appropriate cookie settings.
- [18:43]
Eric Dick
Because ideally that 3% you're giving them, if they're ready to buy, they're in market, you're giving them the cleanest. You don't put speed bumps on a, on a Runway, as they say. So for that 3%, you're trying to get them to the checkout on their product as quickly as possible. But for the other 97%, there is that opportunity to kind of meet them where they're at and kind of whether you're giving them a founder story, whether you're, you know, whether it's, it's something else, a sales page that, that, that really focuses on brand, whether it's a lookbook because you want to people to understand how to, you know, put their apparel pieces together. But they're, but is that part of the idea that with that 97%, like that's really where you're trying to do some of the other, you know, content marketing within your funnel.
- [19:30]
Kyle Hitchcox
So you raised, you raised a good question there. And that takes us to golden rule number five.
- [19:36]
Eric Dick
I'm keeping track.
- [19:38]
Kyle Hitchcox
Okay? Not all traffic is equal and must be optimized differently. And so if we're talking about that 3%. It's not that you're trying to push that person to cart straight away, depending on the traffic source. So we look at traffic in two groups. High intent, obviously. Google shopping, Google search, Bing, Amazon, for the most part it's search keyword base for social platforms like Pinterest, TikTok or meta, Facebook, Instagram, etc. You are trying to convert them in a different way. And so that 3% applies to both traffic sources, but how you funnel them into your cart varies greatly. And so search, yeah, get them into the cart as soon as possible. Socials, you need to persuade them. So you're actually trying to slow them down. You're actually trying to inform and educate and persuade in those first 20 seconds that I mentioned. In contrast to search where you are trying to get them to the cart as soon as possible.
- [20:40]
Eric Dick
Well, I think my math tells us we're on golden rule number six. What's that?
- [20:44]
Kyle Hitchcox
It's a lot easier to get your conversion rates up than it is to decrease your traffic costs. So every media buyer, brand owner, DTC brand, every year says costs are rising on Meta. Costs are rising on Meta. They have their quotas and quarterly targets and it's our job as post click experts to help you drop your cost to acquire customers. Knowing that your traffic costs likely aren't going to drop anytime soon and we're.
- [21:10]
Eric Dick
Seeing some wonky stuff in market right now. I'm kind of going more from the users that we're bringing in on the DTC side of things, but it's like there is a lot of trepidation in the market right now. I feel like with tariffs, with all of this stuff going on and so your traffic costs aren't likely to be coming down. So it really behooves you to make sure that people who are in your funnel are getting the optimum path to purchase.
- [21:35]
Kyle Hitchcox
Yep. And as a business owner, founder, marketer, agency, whoever, you probably should just be building in your future projections like a 10% increase every year on your traffic costs. You know, it's probably beating inflation, but it's never going to come down. And it's auction based. Right. So even if, you know, consumers do slow down a bit, hopefully nothing major here coming up, someone else will just fill up that inventory because as we all know, Meta is the king, I guess, with regards to conversion rates and the right audience to buy DTC products.
- [22:11]
Eric Dick
All right, golden rule number seven.
- [22:12]
Kyle Hitchcox
What is it in Finale here? Your customers don't care how innovative your product is. They care how it makes their lives better. And so as we think about conversion rate optimization, obviously partnering with the right products and people and partners set up for growth is important. But it's our job to explain and persuade customers and tie the benefit of your product to their actual need.
- [22:37]
Eric Dick
Those are all the golden rules. Talk to me about golden rule number seven and how what that actually looks like in a post click experience. I don't know if you can give me an example of somewhere we've really focused on this for a client but like what does that actually translate to when it comes to building out an effective post click experience?
- [22:55]
Kyle Hitchcox
It's a demo. Like explaining it over voice probably won't do it justice. But the tool itself allows us to create infinite shopping experiences and it's all connected where the customers going through one or many landing pages with different storytelling. A founder story as an example which you referenced earlier, could be one. And then the second step we can choose which build offers. So maybe you want to run a bundle builder against a subscription only against a standard subscribe and save and then perhaps you want to test and figure out which product is actually generates the most margin for you against your cost of goods. We can do all that in the same experience on the back end with our funnel builder and we just give one link and then we optimize those pages and experiences while traffic is coming through live and you don't have to change anything on your ad platform. So we're optimizing like you optimize meta campaigns, we're optimizing the funnel behind that. If you could visualize and there's no disruption to your traffic. So I hope that's clear. Eric.
- [24:09]
Eric Dick
Yeah, I think. Well, this goes back to the tool I forget. It was originally called Rubik's, which you guys were running for performance marketing campaigns.
- [24:17]
Kyle Hitchcox
That's right.
- [24:18]
Eric Dick
For years and years and years at Helmkin. And that was a big differentiator in that ability to optimize post click as aggressively as you can optimize pre click.
- [24:28]
Kyle Hitchcox
Yep, totally. We've been working on this for six years. Coming up on seven, it's been through one, two. This will be the third business now that this tool has been through. It helped us scale our affiliate business where we made money spending our own money, where advertisers would pay us say 100 bucks, we'd try to spend 80 and we'd make 20. And we did that at scale using the tool and then we moved that into Pilothouse, which grew from that business. And there's anywhere from 40 to 70 active accounts where our media and creative teams are using this tool at any given time to help optimize post click experiences for Pilot House's clients. And now warp drive. Taking it out to the world as a separate business. Helping brands independent of Pilot House scale.
- [25:16]
Eric Dick
We did a podcast you came on, I guess, I don't know, like four weeks ago or something. We talked about this a little bit and we had then a huge company reach out to us and say, this is what I need. And I kind of wasn't there for those calls. Can you kind of summarize what it was, what resonated, resonated with them? Exactly. And what you're kind of talking about building out for them?
- [25:40]
Kyle Hitchcox
Absolutely, yeah. I'll keep it anonymous, but business is in the 40 million a year range. They have fantastic infrastructure. They're strong marketing leaders and operators. They know what they need. The interest is essentially what I just riffed on. It's the funnel persuasion, CRO optimization, slash cart mechanics stuff that we do. They're looking to double or triple their free sample side of the business where they have a sales team connected to, they're in the house goods space. They have a sales team connected to essentially following up with customers who bought a free sample and just paid for shipping. And then they try to essentially do like a retail style deal over the phone and so they want to triple or, or double or triple rather that business. And what we're going to do is build, build a ton of splash pages, a ton of landers, a ton of content hooks. I'm going to get my, I'm going to get my marketing brand in there and, and we're just going to build it out and start split testing everything. We're really excited.
- [26:48]
Eric Dick
Super cool. And then we've been running this with some of our bigger clients already. You referenced big blanket. I know. Our friends at four Sigmatic have been part of this as well. Can you give us some anecdotes about some of the wins that you've been able to find or some of the tests that you've been able to run that have kind of borne fruit for a client?
- [27:07]
Kyle Hitchcox
Yeah, absolutely. We did a headline test recently inside of a listicle which is 7 reasons to buy X product just from that headline test alone. So just literally duping a page that we already know performed against the, the standard Shopify store. I think that page against the Shopify store had like a 25% lift or something like that as the original test. And so we prioritize traffic to that page and then we go further. So we just duped that page eight times, created eight different headlines that were contrasting split test all of those in literally, you know, it takes minutes to set up, run that for a couple weeks or a week or so depending on how much, how much traffic. And we found another. I think it was 15 and a half percent gained from that. So I don't know what the actual, you know, group shared lift is on that. But you know, within two, three weeks, that's pretty, pretty sizable for a brand that needs some extra margin. Another thing that came up, I was actually chatting with Big Blanket and I think it's something like 2,000 pages over five years tested and you know, experiences. That's everything from Black Friday promos through to, you know, product drops and whatnot. And there's just been countless gains inside of that. But because of the volume and the time, it's hard to be specific. But the thing that I took away from that was just the flexibility and just the simple idea of having one link that you don't have to change your campaigns and optimize behind to make those changes. That, that was, you know, with that much testing, those campaigns as a result can keep going and we can just keep building on founder ideas, things that people want to test. We just continue and continue to find.
- [29:01]
Eric Dick
Success that way without sacrificing the social proof that you build up on your ads on platform.
- [29:06]
Kyle Hitchcox
Yeah. And you can just keep feeding those, those winners. You can launch your, your promos in the same funnel. You can, you know, date, switch them out and there's tons of stuff without, you know, there's tons of stuff. And then the final thing is just being for Sig, just being able to test different offers. I think, you know, we, the, the community doesn't think about offers enough. So subscription only, like I said, versus a bundle builder, versus your standard checkout with upsells has been cool.
- [29:39]
Eric Dick
I was just talking with a subscription brand who's going to be coming on the podcast. And so often I hear brands are for instance trying to get people right into subscription right away. This brand discovered it was far better to be doing a one time purchase and then following up with someone to get them onto subscription. And it's this kind of testing that you can sort of take what you might assume to be the case and really run it against all the different variables to see what actually over a three, six month period or whatever actually produces the highest revenues.
- [30:10]
Kyle Hitchcox
Yeah, except you can do it in weeks, not months.
- [30:14]
Eric Dick
Beautiful. Well do a little manifestation who in Our audience needs to be reaching out to you. We're kind of going off a bit of a presentation you put together here, which we can make available in the show notes here for anyone that might want to see it. But who do you want to be reaching out to? You.
- [30:31]
Kyle Hitchcox
Brands and agencies. Honestly, I'm just putting myself out there again. Just chat, see what's up. If you want me to build a funnel live on a call, I'll do that for you. No pressure, no strings, no commitment. There's more than enough, enough demand, demand right now for, for our bandwidth. So we're, yeah, just, just going out and chatting with people. So always happy to help too, if you, if you just need some advice with your business.
- [30:55]
Eric Dick
If people want to get in touch and find out more, what do you recommend they do? I know you're, you're starting to be more active on some of the social platforms. Where should people find you?
- [31:03]
Kyle Hitchcox
LinkedIn. Trying to keep it simple, keep it, keep it businessy. So, yeah, LinkedIn's good. Or you can email me at Kyleilothouse Co k y l eilothouse Co perfect.
- [31:15]
Eric Dick
And I think this is going to come out after Shop Talk, but I hope we're going to run into a lot of our listeners at Shop Talk. I'm going to be walking around wearing the big blue DTC hat. Hopefully people can recognize my mug. Although I'm sure most people just listen to it. So maybe I'll just need to talk a lot, lot and then people will be able to hear my baritone.
- [31:33]
Kyle Hitchcox
It's called Shop Talk for a reason.
- [31:35]
Eric Dick
That's right. Yeah, we'd be talking, we'd be having a few drinks, we'd be maybe top golfing. What else are we gonna do in Las Vegas?
- [31:44]
Kyle Hitchcox
Oh, man, I, I was just there in January. I. I'm, I'm in and out. I'm. I'm gonna meet some people and bounce. So I'm, I'm sure it's gonna be a good time.
- [31:52]
Eric Dick
It's been over a year for me, so I'm gonna soak it all in. I'm gonna. Just can't wait for all those. I just love how, how it just. It's just so dense, so busy. Everyone there is, whether they're deluded or not, is like. Feels like they're living their best lives or, or not. There's just so much going on in Las Vegas. I always have such a fun time there. So come say hi if you see us. And otherwise we're also going to be. I don't know if you're going to be there, but we'll just say we're also going to be at grow. The D2C team is going to be at grow in LA. So if you don't catch us at Shop Talk, then hopefully you can come catch us at Grow in la and then we're planning some other things. I think for D2C, this might be the first of many kind of things that we do with Shop Talk, which is really exciting. So you might be able to catch us in Europe, in Chicago, and potentially even in Abu Dhabi at Shop Talk. Luxe for their luxury show that they're putting on. I'm just looking for an excuse to get to Abu Dhabi.
- [32:44]
Kyle Hitchcox
I've been there once. It's a beautiful city. It's. Yeah, it is absolutely stunning. Maybe I'll join you there too, Eric.
- [32:50]
Eric Dick
Perfect place for a luxury show. All right, Kyle, well, thanks for coming on today. Look forward to checking back in soon on Warp Drive.
- [32:55]
Kyle Hitchcox
Yep. Thanks, man.
- [33:02]
Eric Dick
Thanks for listening to today's episode. If you're not getting the D2C newsletter, you can subscribe for free at directtoconsumer Co. And if you want to learn more about Pilothouse's all killer no filler services, take off to Pilothouse Co. I'm Eric Dick and this has been the D2C podcast. We'll see you next time.