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- [00:00]
A
Consumers visit three to four different websites or brands before making a purchase for something that they're in the market for. Those brands might not be on the shelf next to you, but they're fighting for cognitive awareness from the consumer. So you have to show up in a way that drives the appeal. And that ultimate action.
- [00:18]
B
It's all about bringing that experience online. Whether it's comparison or focusing on USPs. What are the creative levers that you have to create more of a interesting but also educational experience?
- [00:31]
C
What are some things that brands should look into today to determine whether their merchandising is coherent and really working for them? This episode is brought to you by Contentful Marketers. You know that feeling when your creative clicks, when that social post sends engagement through the roof, when your outside of the box campaign hits ROI positive, when a personalized homepage turns prospects into customers, Its utter marketing bliss. Contentful helps you create tailored omnichannel experiences without working overtime. No stress, no limits, only possibilities. Get the feels@contentful.com it's all killer, no filler. And I am back with a absolutely killer art and science mashup here with both Taylor and Aves representing the technical genius of modern digital marketing and the creative genius. But I did just call you both geniuses. Guys, how do you feel about that?
- [01:34]
B
I don't like it. I also don't like Thought Leader. I'll say it on the record, when someone says thought Leader it really gives me the ick because I have like two brain cells. So I'm not even leaving my own thoughts. How I appreciate it.
- [01:47]
C
Can I call you unicorns? Is that or is that even more hype bound?
- [01:51]
B
I would say that's worse.
- [01:53]
C
That's worse. I guess in the Silicon Valley. I meant in the more mythical context.
- [01:57]
B
I was thinking like people are talking a lot about like 2016, 2014 right now. I feel like unicorn is something that would be used at BuzzFeed during that time. So actually I'm kind of open to it.
- [02:07]
A
Okay, good.
- [02:08]
C
All right. I'm glad we're retro into that phase. Well, let's get right into it. Taylor, you brought up an interesting topic today. I'll let you describe it a little bit more, but it centers around the concept of merchandising, how to how to properly merchandise your sort of digital funnel. And I'd kind of always thought of merch, the term merchandising more being more applicable to just the retail environment. You're physically merchandising your product across all these different stores. How do we think about merchandising at Pilothouse at a high level. Digitally.
- [02:35]
A
Yeah. So I think when it comes to merchandising for E commerce compared to a retail environment, it's a little bit different that like when you're running ads to shopify or you're selling things on a Shopify store, you don't necessarily have competitors right next to you and there's different considerations and like luxuries but also ways that people shop. But ultimately what that comes down to is then knowing that creative and content and messaging and ultimately what we're offering and how we combine that all together is what drives through growth and the results that we're looking for with our E Comm brands. We have to think about how we show up in that environment and remain as competitive as possible in that environment, knowing all those variables in place. So really it's how we show up from the intersection of all those things together, to put it simply. And I think it's really interesting. Right. Because one stat that I think is really powerful is as far as consumer research data goes from this last couple of years, they say that consumers visit three to four different websites or brands before making a purchase for something that they're in market for. That means that you know, those, those brands might not be on the shelf next to you, but they're, they're potentially top of mind or fighting for cognitive awareness or, or thought from the consumer. So you have to show up in a way that drives the, the appeal and that ultimate action and that is seen.
- [04:02]
C
And I think we're in the, we're in a period now. We're in the holiday, we're in the like first two weeks where people are just trying to get going in the new year kind of thing. And so there's a bit of a frame change that happens from Q4 and, and I bet there's some brands kind of stuck in the January doldrums. Is there anything creatively you're, you're seeing from that side? Aves?
- [04:20]
B
Yeah, it's really interesting. I mean I have just from someone who likes to look at ads, like seeing holiday ads still live, I feel like I've been seeing a lot of that on Pinterest because it's sort of like, I think for a lot of brands, I set it and forget it type of platform. So seeing like holiday themed products that you're still spending money on. Big yikes. I'm just going to come back to this idea around merchandising and applying it to a more creative lens as well. I feel like I have had a lot of mentors who did the brick and mortar actual merchandising thing in tandem for brands. And it's really interesting to think about the experiences they taught me about, which was creeping on consumers in physical stores and seeing them pick up one bed sheet and then another. And what are the things they're looking at between those two differentiator products. And I think what's really interesting about what Taylor mentioned about looking through like three different potential brands to say in this day and age, like buy sheets from online, you're not getting that same experience of if you go to like Bed, Bath and Beyond and you have that like, okay, this one feels physically softer. When you go to three different websites, you don't get that direct competition, which is a nice thing if your product is a little lackluster. But if your product is actually the best one, it makes it really difficult. On the creative side, when we're talking about merchandising, it's almost thinking about how to bring that experience into a digital space. Because like I mentioned, that's like a really easy decision right there in the store to make. It's like, I like the way this one feels more, so I'm going to buy it. But just looking at the stuff online, looking at reviews, it can draw out the consideration window. So I think it's mostly at this point in time. Q1, Q2 for brands all about thinking about, like bringing that experience online and how do you, you know, whether it's comparison or focusing on usps, like, what are the creative levers that you have to create more of a interesting but also educational experience.
- [06:26]
C
A lot of the things that we're talking on the podcast, I just did a podcast with Dougie where we're talking, where he's talking about sort of tailoring your advertisement more to meet the customer where they're at. And this is again, this is not new, but this idea of like funnel congruency, understanding the context of when and where a user is consuming the content and tailoring the experience for that, that's all merchandising, I guess, right? All merchandising is how the merchandise appears to the customer. Taylor, how are you thinking about kind of segmenting?
- [06:53]
A
Yeah, it's a great question. I think one reference point I really like to go back to is what the most talented retention marketers do with Evergreen Flows and how you think about pushing someone along through their journey of engaging with a brand. So often what that might look like is we talk about it all the time. It's everything kind of everybody knows. But I think it is a really focused approach to trying to have clarity in what connects with someone in that initial visit or that initial brand moment that you create, what then re engages them when they're warm but they haven't committed yet, and then what do they need to get over the line? And what are your competitors doing? What's happening in the marketplace? What might these users be feeling in their lives that then influence how they perceive that at each point? So a huge practice that I'm using a lot right now is looking full funnel and trying to understand how the data that I'm analyzing and whether it's social proof I'm reviewing in ads or various components, what story that's telling me about the customer journey so that we can further move it in the direction that we want it to. Because at the end of the day, if you invest in a ton of content up funnel to educate, engage, connect, but you have a bucket with holes in it, so things are leaking out the sides, you're going to end up pouring a lot of water in without filling the bucket. So that's kind of how we're, how we're approaching it from that pov.
- [08:23]
C
Give me an example potentially of what information you would act on. You know, after you view your competitor sites, after you understand that your, your, your customer may have visited three or four other websites, are you looking then in an ad to speak to an objection maybe that your product has versus that product or what sort of creative actions are you taking once you take into account where your customer's at in regard to your competitors? A's, I guess.
- [08:47]
B
Yeah, I think something to like call out to the language we're using. And I was doing this like talking a lot about competitors. I think a really important part of merchandising to update this conversation for digital marketing is part of it is merchandising on social feeds. And so recognizing that a competitor is not necessarily that other sheep brand, but rather whatever the heck is going. I mean we, before we started recording we were talking about like memes and viral songs. So I think it's important to reframe and recontextualize what merchandising means when we are showing up on digital feeds. That being said, what I tend to do and the information that I look for is absolutely like actual product competitors are important, but what is going on in their digital landscape? And I've talked about this, I think here on all killer, no filler. I've talked about it on adventurous but I do a lot of work to figure out where the Personas within my segmentation live online and what they're doing and what kind of content they are consuming. And so I look at like language being used. I look at style. So is someone using like basic TikTok captions versus fancier ones? I look at the speed of content that they're watching. So are they watching like tweaked out Minecraft tutorials that are 5x speed and you barely understand it's like a chipmunk. Or are they watching low vibrational yoga videos figuring out all of that stuff. And then there's this really delicate dance of trying to speak that language but do it in a way that is different so that it stands out and you are truly merchandising and standing out. And so a lot of the times speaking the same language. I refer to that as again type of captions use really simple language stuff. But then what is the messaging? And I think that's kind of what Taylor was alluding to. Where you really want to cut through and figure out what that person needs to hear. I anecdotally find most of the time now it is not like us versus them. It is how is this going to make your life better? Because most people's feeds these days are not that positive. It's kind of a weird wacky time. So I do find that really getting to like the heart of what will make someone's day to day life a little bit more fun or comfortable is usually the type of messaging that helps stand out from an actual merchandising point of view. And looking at yourself and comparing okay, on this side it's like what's just going on on social feeds. On this side it's competitors. Where can we land? Somewhere in the middle that feels really engagement worthy and feels really exciting to click on.
- [11:22]
C
Very cool. That's so from a creative standpoint that all makes sense. And then Taylor, from like a info architecture, something I talk about at D2C all the time, the way the hierarchy of, of information on your page is, is sort of laid out there. How. How does I guess info architecture play into merchandising on your E commerce site?
- [11:41]
A
Yeah, place plays a huge part because when you're. When we're going through and looking at it like if you think about it as far as like the journey. So more like the linear architecture, a pretty standard flow that a lot of brands will do is you try to hook with something really engaging speaking to how you merchandise in the Feed a lot of what AVES has been talking about and forming that connection around how this is going to benefit you in your life. So that's like linear step one pretty commonly. And then you go into, okay, what are the objections that these people are facing? How do we, maybe it's price related, maybe we can give them an offer, maybe we need to do this other thing to get them over the line and move them into our, our conversion funnel, turn them into a purchaser. But when you're going down the page, I think a lot of it works pretty similarly. Like you want to, you want to engage someone, you want to use storytelling to be able to connect with them in a way that aligns to what we would call their emotional truth. It's one thing One of our VPs has shared with me as a term that I've really been kind of hanging on to in the last last month or so as we kind of go through this next wave of, of growth planning for our clients. And that might be this truth that connect that really strikes a chord with someone that they're facing right now and that you can tap into at scale. So you want to follow that all the way through. So like, oh, you know, on a PDP you're going to have social proof where you can see other people who have gone through something similar. There's a subtle signal that they're engaging with that there's clear, you know, solutions languaging happening in the product description and then there's clear choice and opportunity to select what you know the right style to fit your own personal need is because not everything's going to be problem solution, right? But I think being able to take that kind of linear approach and make sure that's reflected through the journey that someone goes down and looks and engages and builds their learning of what you're offering is that's really important in anchoring behind what you're investing in at top of funnel.
- [13:36]
B
I think like one example that comes to mind is some work that we did with a specialty coffee brand. Part of this was like being kind of fresh eyes on this brand and this product. But I remember thinking really deeply about like how to drive conversion because it was a pretty high AOV and thinking again doing the like research into what like matters to someone who's going to spend this much money on a piece of coffee equipment. And I created a landing page. I wrote the copy, I did not mention the product until the very end. Like I talked about what they the sensation is like to wake up and drink a really good cup of coffee or to have a friend over and share experiences over a cup of coffee. Like, there was not a single mention of the product until the very end of the page. Because the, the point was to like create an environment where they felt they belonged already. So it was like a very sleek, minimalistic page. The language I used was very, like elevated. Most of the time when you work in advertising, you try to make things as simple as was like kind of in my bag writing that copy because it got to be a little bit pretentious. But it was all about the senses that are engaged when you were drinking a really good cup of coffee. And yeah, like I said, the product wasn't even clear. It could have been like coffee pods, it could have been an espresso machine. You really had no idea what it was going to be until you got to the bottom of the page. Because all the visuals used as well were just cups of coffee or coffee beans. Like they were sort of, but barely related to the product itself. But that was our top performing page and drove a ton of single session conversions for this product with a realistically pretty long consideration window. And I think a big part of that was thinking about merchandising and thinking about how other people in the space were showing up where they immediately wanted to show you for your money. This is the value you're getting. It's an expensive product, but taking it back a step and like Taylor was talking about, what is the emotional truth behind someone spending that much money on a piece of coffee equipment? Most of the time, to be honest, they all kind of do the same. I have a very nice espresso machine, but it kind of does the same as one that would cost significantly less. So it's like almost giving yourself the freedom to like break away from the product USP is and break into what actually is going to resonate with someone.
- [15:59]
C
I love that. I was actually just thinking, right, I made a coffee before this call or before my previous one, and I just was thinking about, like, I've pulled two to three shots on this machine for the past 10 years, like almost every day. And it's about that rich that you can connect with, right? Is like meeting someone where they're at. Like, if I got hit an ad about like, you know, how much is this daily experience worth to you? You know what I mean? With how much money you're saving from doing it out or whatever. And if you can connect to that, you can tap into that, you can sell. Makes sense.
- [16:29]
B
Yeah. It was so interesting Too, coming at people with a, like, price offering where it was like, oh, it's so expensive to go out and get coffee every day. Like, it just didn't ever click. And then as soon as it was like, this isn't a piece of equipment. Like, this is part of your life. This is part of your identity. This is part of your family gatherings. That's when it started to click. Because, yeah, like you said, you. It's one of those things that you see and look at every day. And I feel like a lot of DTC products fit into that category. Whether it's like a water bottle or a phone case, whatever it is, it's like, this is part of you. And I've been talking a lot about this idea of, like, an omnipresent brand era that we're in post death of the millennial brand. And I think it, like, speaks to exactly what we're talking about here, where it's, like, less about function that something's bringing to me and more about, like, I am a person with a BKR water bottle because I don't want to follow trends. Stanley or Nawala. Like, it's so much more tied to someone's identity nowadays that, yeah, I think you really, to be successful, have to think about what Taylor's talking about here.
- [17:33]
A
Yeah. And I think just to add to that, too, I love where you guys have gone with this because to me, it's. It's this combination, like, being able to create this kind of emotional impact and forge that kind of a connection combined with, like, consumers are getting smarter and smarter with the rise of AI and trying to discern what online people are more and more in tune and more skeptical, and it just continues to happen. So, like, being able. You know, when I think about the subtle. The subtle impact that like, a lifetime guarantee highlighted on a PDP does to me and makes me think, oh, that's a real product that, like, to Eric's point, you know, maybe that coffee maker is going to last me 10 years, even if I don't actually go to the effort of returning it. Like, I at least know that there's real value trying to be created here. And so that intersection of value and identity, I think, is just such a huge lever for brands to be focusing on this year.
- [18:20]
C
People are looking for that. They're looking for things they can invest or I. People in my area are looking for things that they can invest in once and not have to replace all the time, I think. And so if you've got a product that fits that category, It's a great idea to lean into it. Taylor, I wanted to nerd out a second and maybe you could tell me there isn't a connection here, but we're talking a lot about these, the steps in the funnel, being aware of where people are in the funnel, what content they might need, what other content they're viewing instead. And maybe think of something I was learning about Andromeda and the way Meta is working these days and how important event based features are to like the way the algorithm works now. And are these two things related?
- [19:00]
A
Yes, definitely. It's really interesting because you combine that with the pattern that we're generally seeing, which is there's more and more, I think attention to how you, how you and Meta's been moving this way for a long time, but I think now more than ever there's more of a call to avoid over optimizing your ad account or your campaign within it. So a good example is there's always the temptation to turn off ads that look like they're not performing. But usually when you go like a little deeper into the data, you'll notice maybe there's a lower CPM and higher ctr. And when you're running a flexible structure that can mean that that's serving to that awareness level where the other, other ones are serving a little bit further down. Like maybe your social engagers are a slightly warmer audience. So there is an element of this and being able to decipher that and interpret that kind of data is becoming more and more important within channels and from an omnichannel perspective because knowing when to put lean in and when to kind of carry on business as usual is a, is a really important skill in this environment where you're trying to understand how do I optimize that intersection of value and identity in my messaging and make sure I'm not pulling messages but I'm investing in the right ones as well.
- [20:12]
C
What are some just just to end maybe today, what are some maybe quick spot checks that brands who are listening to this, because this is a pretty interesting topic, it's very wide ranging but also like we've gotten down to some specific creative concepts. What are some things that brands should look into today to determine whether their merchandising is, is coherent and really working for them?
- [20:34]
B
I can start on the creative and brand side. I think I've talked about this a lot, but it's like if you don't know kind of the things I outlined at the top, which are where are people spending their time? So within your larger net. And also if you don't know who we're referring to when you're saying who are your sort of target Personas, that's step one. I don't know what the heck's going on with you, but it's like scary. So if you don't even know who the people are, that would be like number one, spot check, a little bit scary. But if you do know who those people are, if you have just like a brand document, and I see this all the time, auditing brands, they've got a brand document, they've done some customer feedback surveys. That's the extent of it. And they come to us and they say these are our Personas. And that's sort of it. They have an idea of who these people are. If you don't have some form of documentation for each of your main Persona that outlines like where they spend their time, Something that I do that is incredibly helpful is outlining who are the mainstay sort of creators or important people to your Personas. So who are the like trendsetters for them, who are they looking at online or in the real world? And then also going through sort of like what other competitor brands they might be looking at. I think, you know, previously things like demographic data that is still really important to understand, like household income, where we're shopping, all of these things. But at this stage it pales in comparison to knowing these things. So where do they spend their time online, who are they looking at? And then how do they like to digest content is kind of the first step because if you don't know those things, you can't truly merchandise for a Persona because you don't know where you're showing up and what's on either side of your ad. So really understanding like where you live with them I think is the most important thing on the creative side.
- [22:23]
A
Yeah, I think to add on to that when it comes to the traffic side, like where I'll typically start is one thing I love to do is I think an underutilized feature when people are looking at competitor ad libraries on Meta, for example, is clicking out and seeing where certain styles of ads are routing to. Because to Aaves's point, if you start looking at this kind of ad that looks like a recapture a middle of funnel ad, you see it links to a certain kind of offer structure they're running. You have all of this laid out from the Persona work that you've done that Aves has been talking about and you know generally what your audience is likely to engage with or not likely to, you can start to really understand the gaps with that your competitors aren't filling, how you can fill those gaps and then how you show up in a way that makes a lot of sense. So when it comes to the kind of quick places to look for that I highly recommend as people are planning out this year and working through it all, looking at how your top of funnel, your middle of funnel and your bottom of funnel are all functioning, using the segment breakdowns in meta, using your UTM based filters and Shopify reports or GA to understand where the weak points and areas of strength are and then cross referencing against your competitors to see where you can show up and how you can ultimately beat the competition and convert those customers. Nice.
- [23:41]
C
Well, this seems like an ongoing conversation. We will continue to have to find the best ways to kind of meet customers where they're at. So for now, let's bid farewell. Thanks for coming on today guys. Thanks for listening to today's episode. If you're not getting the DTC newsletter, you can subscribe for free at directtoconsumer. Co. And if you want to learn more about Pilothouse's all killer no filler service is Takeoff to Pilothouse co. I'm Eric Dick and this has been the D2C podcast. We'll see you next time.