Brothers Osborne: Unapologetically Unique

Summary

Podcast Summary: Brothers Osborne: Unapologetically Unique

Dumb Blonde hosted by Bunnie XO delves deep into the lives and careers of Brothers Osborne, John and TJ Osborne, in the episode titled "Brothers Osborne: Unapologetically Unique," released on June 16, 2025. This comprehensive conversation explores their musical journey, personal struggles, and the unique qualities that set them apart in the country music landscape.

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1. Introduction to Brothers Osborne

Bunnie XO warmly welcomes John and TJ Osborne to the podcast, expressing admiration for their style and brotherly bond.

• Bunnie XO [03:56]: "Brothers Osborne, the brothers who have rocked country music, redefine brotherhood, and prove that being different might just be your greatest hit."

2. Early Life and Musical Beginnings

The brothers discuss their upbringing in Deal, Maryland, a blue-collar town by the Chesapeake Bay, and how their environment influenced their musical style.

• TJ Osborne [09:24]: "We grew up on the Chesapeake Bay. It was so beautiful and an amazing place to grow up."
• John Osborne [15:09]: "We played a lot as kids and were always in bands together with our dad."

3. Musical Influences and Style

John and TJ elaborate on their blend of country and rock influences, acknowledging their diverse musical tastes from a young age.

• John Osborne [17:10]: "Guitar became my favorite thing in the world when I was like 12."
• TJ Osborne [18:29]: "I rebelled against the country music our family listened to and was into Nirvana and Pearl Jam."

4. Navigating the Music Industry

The brothers share their experiences facing challenges in the industry, including being unconventional in a genre that often favors conformity.

• TJ Osborne [19:35]: "For us, it was really about focusing on what we like and our fans like, finding those people."
• John Osborne [23:17]: "We've been doing it for a while, and we've built a core fan base of diehards who really ride with us."

5. Personal Struggles and Mental Health

John opens up about his struggles with anxiety and depression, detailing his journey towards seeking help and the importance of mental health awareness.

• John Osborne [30:02]: "I had to immerse myself in understanding mental health and decided to change a lot in my life."
• Bunnie XO [34:40]: "I suffer from severe anxiety and depression also."

6. TJ's Journey of Self-Discovery and Coming Out

TJ discusses his realization and acceptance of his sexuality, the challenges he faced, and the liberation he felt upon coming out as a gay man.

• TJ Osborne [37:24]: "I knew I was gay when I started liking boys."
• TJ Osborne [40:02]: "Coming out was a huge part of me that I had marginalized."

7. Family and Fatherhood

John and TJ talk about their relationships with their family, the support they receive, and the profound impact fatherhood has had on their lives.

• John Osborne [56:03]: "Fatherhood changed me for the better. It's 99% better because I'm just more tired than I was."
• TJ Osborne [58:51]: "We've got a lot of family, and we have a big, fun family."

8. IVF Journey and Expanding Their Family

The brothers share their emotional journey with IVF, the challenges they faced, and the joy of finally welcoming their twin children.

• John Osborne [52:21]: "We tried several rounds of IVF before it finally worked. It's the greatest thing in the world."
• TJ Osborne [53:15]: "IVF is brutal. You don't realize how heavy it is until you go through it."

9. Future Plans and Musical Projects

Looking ahead, Brothers Osborne discuss their current work on new music, plans for touring, and the desire to remain authentic amidst industry pressures.

• TJ Osborne [75:16]: "We're working on self-producing our new projects, which feels like a return to where we started."
• John Osborne [77:00]: "Our career is great, but nothing compares to family and love."

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Bunnie XO [03:56]: "Brothers Osborne, the brothers who have rocked country music, redefine brotherhood..."
• John Osborne [15:09]: "We played a lot as kids and were always in bands together with our dad."
• TJ Osborne [18:29]: "I rebelled against the country music our family listened to and was into Nirvana and Pearl Jam."
• John Osborne [30:02]: "I had to immerse myself in understanding mental health..."
• TJ Osborne [37:24]: "I knew I was gay when I started liking boys."
• John Osborne [56:03]: "Fatherhood changed me for the better..."
• John Osborne [52:21]: "We tried several rounds of IVF before it finally worked..."
• TJ Osborne [75:16]: "We're working on self-producing our new projects..."

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Conclusion

In this heartfelt episode, Brothers Osborne offer an intimate look into their lives beyond the music. From battling personal demons and embracing their true selves to cherishing family bonds and pursuing authentic artistry, they embody the essence of being unapologetically unique. Bunnie XO skillfully navigates these topics, allowing listeners to connect deeply with the duo's journey of resilience, authenticity, and unwavering brotherhood.

Transcript

[Bunny XO]

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[John Osborne]

Welcome, boys. Thank you.

[Bunny XO]

Thank you. I worked hard on that.

[TJ Osborne]

That made me feel good.

[Bunny XO]

Good. I love you guys. My husband loves you guys.

[TJ Osborne]

Well, we love, we love you guys. Honestly, I feel like, I mean, you know, his career is just like taking off to the stratosphere, but in such short period of time. But I, I love that I've gotten to know you guys just a little bit before that happened. You guys haven't changed at all.

[Bunny XO]

We, we appreciate you guys. And I have always been obsessed with you because of how you dress. It's so cowboy couture. And I'm just like, it's so, like, tailored. And just every time I see you, I'm like, this outfit is amazing.

[TJ Osborne]

Thank you. That means a lot coming from you.

[Bunny XO]

Well, I mean, where, where does the style, the sense of style come from? Like, is it something that you obsess about?

[TJ Osborne]

I think it's a multi. Multiple things. One, it's probably the fact that I'm a gay man. Gay man. You're in there somewhere. Some. Certainly doesn't hurt, right? And then, you know, we have stylists that help with this stuff. And of Course, Abby is very stylish, so, you know, that's always at the last. You know, every time I, like, even I got dressed for the awards, I'm like, this jacket. This jacket?

[Bunny XO]

Yeah. No, it's always. It's. It's amazing. Top tier, always.

[TJ Osborne]

Even when I was a kid, I kind of love, like, wearing oddly. I mean, before I even had any clue what my sexuality was. I make. When I look back now, I'm like, oh, my God, you were so gay. Like, I would wear, like, striped shirt, like a TGI Fridays red and white striped shirt with, like, a bow tie when I was, like, eight.

[Bunny XO]

That's hot, though. I love that.

[TJ Osborne]

Like, have my hair comb. Super neat. Yeah, it's kind of like, have you seen Righteous Gemstones?

[Bunny XO]

Of course. I just watched the finale last night.

[TJ Osborne]

Okay, so the latest season when there's the. What's this character? He's the little boy.

[Bunny XO]

Yes, yes, Yes, I was.

[TJ Osborne]

That was basically me.

[Bunny XO]

No, I think that's phenomenal. Because fashion. I have. I love fashion. So even as a kid, like, I wore a plaids. A red plaid skirt and an I rode the Bullet Gillies T shirt all the time, and you couldn't tell me any different, but I. Oh. But even when I think back to it now, like, I wear, like, band tees and, like, plaid skirts still. And it's like, it's. Sometimes it's something you're. You're just born with, too.

[TJ Osborne]

I know. Isn't it weird? Like, John's kids know he's got twins.

[Bunny XO]

The twins, yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

And to watch just one just be a boy. And the girl, you know, she just naturally. Like, she couldn't even speak yet. And she showed up. I don't know if it was to Christmas or something or Thanksgiving. And she has this. She's a year and a half, and she's like, check out. Check this out.

[John Osborne]

Like, she's like, want to see it? She does, like, a turn and she's looking at it.

[TJ Osborne]

She's like, ah. Like, check this badass out.

[Bunny XO]

She's got Uncle TJ's fashion sense. I love that my son was covered.

[John Osborne]

In dirt and his own gunk. He's got my fashion sense.

[Bunny XO]

Oh, boy.

[John Osborne]

Yeah.

[Bunny XO]

I love that. So you said you had a story to tell me that I was.

[John Osborne]

Yeah. So this is probably a year.

[TJ Osborne]

This is on the record.

[John Osborne]

This is on the record.

[Bunny XO]

It's on the record.

[John Osborne]

A year ago. A year and a half ago, it was not long after we had kids. And my wife gets hit up from her management. She's an artist as well. Amazing singer, songwriter. And then. Yeah, you got asked to do your podcast, right? And she was like, okay, yeah, I don't. I'm not sure why. I don't really have any music out. But, you know, we. We've talked about like fertility stuff and kids, and she's like, maybe she wants to maybe go into that or whatever. Turned out it was a scam.

[Bunny XO]

Oh, no. Yes.

[John Osborne]

And it was basically someone said, well, you. We have to sign on, but you have to give us like, log into your computer so we can access it from afar. And Lucy signed on and then got kind of freaked out and was like, this doesn't seem right. And then close the tab. Fortunately, they didn't like going and get all of our information, but they were seconds away from it. And she thought she was doing your podcast. Isn't that sad? I told you it was a little bit tragic.

[TJ Osborne]

I know.

[Bunny XO]

I hate that people. The scam shit is just getting so out of control.

[John Osborne]

It is so specific. Not only like, I get. If you're like. If you're sitting like, you know, I'm a prince from Africa and you sit.

[Bunny XO]

Down, remember the Nigerians?

[John Osborne]

Yeah, but this is so. This is so specific. Targeted at people, where they would go. I. They probably know that we know you guys, at least to some degree. Yeah. And I was kind of. I know I was a little pissed, but also kind of impressed about the. The move, the scam.

[Bunny XO]

No, it. The way that they can even access people is just kind of. It's really scary.

[TJ Osborne]

Someone was actually texting her mom, pretending to be me. But the thing. I was in the room with my mom, she's like, is that you? And I'm like, what me? He's like, are you texting me? I'm like, why would I text you? Why is that?

[Bunny XO]

People always fall for one.

[TJ Osborne]

I know. Well, that's like. That's the saddest part. They're often victims of that st. Which honestly, I feel like I'm pretty savvy. And there's still. All the time. I'm like, is this ups?

[John Osborne]

Yeah, well, Lucy was really upset. She was like, I feel like such an idiot. But I'm like, look, but it came through your management. It wasn't like she got an email somewhere from a sketchy ass website.

[TJ Osborne]

I get emails from John all the time. It's like, check out these pictures. And I'm like, my brother would never send me up.

[John Osborne]

He doesn't open any of my dick pics.

[TJ Osborne]

What the hell?

[Bunny XO]

Look at these pictures. I'm like, somebody's. Somebody would be trying to get a hold of those for sure.

[TJ Osborne]

It really was him the whole time.

[Bunny XO]

He just wanted to, if you responded or not. Well, tell Lucy that I'm so sorry and that we will have to revisit that for sure now that I know that she's even willing to do that.

[John Osborne]

Oh, of course. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I'll tell her. That'll make her.

[Bunny XO]

And I actually wanted to talk about you guys IVF Journey too, on the podcast, which we'll get into it later. Sure. I want to kind of paint a picture for my viewers at home who don't know you guys kind of like, you know, your rise to fame. So if we could start where you guys grew up and go from there. Tell me a little bit about your childhood and what inspired you guys.

[TJ Osborne]

The interesting thing, because, you know, for those who don't know, we're, we're east coast boys. We grew up in a little tiny water community called Deal, Maryland. And to a lot of people that do know that, they're always so surprised to hear that, they're like, how do you get into country music being from there? And we shot our music video for a song, one of our first singles called Rum in our hometown, to kind of give people a bit of a look, see into where we grew up, because it makes total sense when you see it. And on the new music that we're working on, we've kind of are going back to visiting that again where we're having a lot of. We'll go back and short shoot videos and stuff back there in the hometown. But yeah, I mean, it's, it's a very blue collar town. It's paradise. I mean, we grew up on the Chesapeake Bay.

[Bunny XO]

How beautiful was that?

[TJ Osborne]

It was so beautiful and an amazing place to grow up. But, you know, a lot of places like that tend to be, you know, like really fancy. It was not, I mean, it was really blue collar.

[Bunny XO]

Right.

[TJ Osborne]

And, and so growing up around there, it was usually like, you know, people were mostly listening to rock or they listen to country, which is pretty, I think for us to kind of have the blend of both, I think makes total sense.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

And then our, both of our parents really tried their, their hand in music. Our dad sang and wrote songs and so did our mom, but then they had five kids and very little money. You know, her mom's a hairdresser, her dad's a plumber.

[Bunny XO]

And so you guys are two of five.

[TJ Osborne]

That's right. Yeah.

[Bunny XO]

Okay. I never, I didn't even. That didn't even come up on Google. So where are the other three at?

[TJ Osborne]

So our oldest brother Jimbo lives in Delaware.

[Bunny XO]

Jimbo.

[TJ Osborne]

Jimbo.

[Bunny XO]

We love Jimbo.

[TJ Osborne]

Exactly. Yeah. One step down from Jim Bob. But we got Jimbo and then we got Rachel. She's in Florida. And then our sister Natalie works here in Nashville. She's in the music business as well. I think you may or may not have met her.

[Bunny XO]

But are they super supportive of you guys?

[TJ Osborne]

Extremely, Extremely so and so. But I think, you know, for us it was really kind of started as like our parents dream. We just kind of grew up around music all the time. We didn't really know any different. And then, you know, just kind of playing local bars and stuff. In fact, this tattoo, a lot of people want to know what's about. It's the first band that me and John and our dad was, was in called Deuce in a quarter after our car.

[Bunny XO]

That's a great name.

[TJ Osborne]

I know.

[Bunny XO]

It is actually a really good name.

[TJ Osborne]

And so we did that. And then slowly but surely we're like, okay, we need either do this full time or not. And we were definitely like, you know, the, at that time a big fish in a small pond. And. And so we came here, kind of did the opposite. But that was our, that was our upbringing. Yeah.

[Bunny XO]

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[John Osborne]

Yeah, so I mean, yeah, we played a lot as kids and we're always playing on bands together, playing with our dad. And then I moved here in 2000 to go to college, met a bunch of different musicians and I ended up in a separate band with some other great musicians or friends of mine, Charlie Worsham. I don't know if you ever done anything with Charlie or. I'm sure Jelly might know Charlie.

[Bunny XO]

I think he does.

[John Osborne]

Yeah. But a great session musician in town. This guy Josh Matheni, plays Dobro and a bunch of other really great musicians. And we had a band. It was called King Billy. It didn't really kind of pan out the way we wanted, but it was a great learning experience. Traveled all over the country in a van. Way too many hours. Way too many hours sleeping on a bench seat in a van. But it was totally worth it. In your early 20s, you can get away with that. Yeah. And. And he was writing for the same publishing company at the same time, so he was still in town. We had written a few songs together for the band, and when that band broke up, he was doing his own project. So we were joining together, joining forces, writing a lot together, playing shows. And people kept going, man, we. It's so cool that you and TJ are finally in a band. We're like, well, no, we're not. We're not doing a band. We're just writing together. I'm playing guitar for him. People kept showing up, showing up, and it just started to gain a lot of interest, and it was not our intention at all. Everyone's like, yeah, let's go. All the brothers are playing tonight. And eventually we had to just go, is this, like, official?

[TJ Osborne]

Then what we had to do was go, okay. Our mom was right. Yeah, she wanted this the whole time.

[Bunny XO]

Mom knows best.

[TJ Osborne]

She didn't want it the whole time. We were like, no.

[John Osborne]

Mom popped out. She was like, finally, I got a duo, and Natalie popped out. She's like, I got a trio, so she's still waiting on that one.

[TJ Osborne]

And.

[John Osborne]

And, yeah, it kind of. Then everything kind of took off after that. It just seemed like we follow the natural course of things. It was like the universe was almost like. It was, like, divine. Something was making it happen.

[Bunny XO]

Right.

[John Osborne]

And then we listened to it, and then the rest was history.

[Bunny XO]

I love that. So have you guys always had a super close relationship, even growing up?

[TJ Osborne]

Yeah, we have. I mean, it's. I mean, about as close to, like, twins as you would get without actually being twins. We just did everything together.

[Bunny XO]

What's the age difference?

[TJ Osborne]

Two over two years. But there's. We. You know, we slept in bunk beds our whole lives. Shared it, you know, shared a bedroom.

[John Osborne]

Together and still do on the bus.

[TJ Osborne]

And now we joke as we. We do. We. We've grown up and. And have you live in separate Houses. But we sleep half the year with each other on a bus and bunk beds again. So we haven't. We haven't gotten that far.

[Bunny XO]

Where does the rock influence come from? Because you guys, for being country, you guys have a pretty rocker sound.

[John Osborne]

I think this is also a lot to do with where we grew up. Like, I grew up listening because I grew up. Guitar became my favorite thing in the world when I was like 12. Who.

[Bunny XO]

Taught you the guitar?

[John Osborne]

My dad. Our dad taught me some chords. My cousin Johnny taught me how to solo, or my Uncle Bill taught me a little bit. It was a bit of everyone. They wouldn't let me sit down with the family and sit around the table unless I would practice. And I was good enough to hold my own. So if there's a. If you want to get me to do anything, just tell me that I can't, and I'm gonna fucking do it. So just sat in the other room practicing, practicing, practicing.

[TJ Osborne]

You can't paint my house.

[John Osborne]

Yeah. Yeah. Damn it. And yeah, I do a lot of things out of spite mostly. But anyway, so I did that. But I was obsessed with, like, guitar and rock music is just like, go hand in hand. And we grew up listening to the country. I rebelled against that a bit because it was like what our whole family listened to. And my early teenage years, I was like, love Nirvana and Pearl Jam and Stone Temple Pilots.

[Bunny XO]

Like, that was an iconic time. My first concert was Stone Temple Pilot.

[John Osborne]

Oh, my God. Amazing fucking love, Stone.

[TJ Osborne]

I don't think there hasn't really been anything quite like it since.

[Bunny XO]

No.

[TJ Osborne]

A complete change.

[Bunny XO]

Why do you think that is, that we can't recapture that sound?

[John Osborne]

Because.

[TJ Osborne]

Because now you have to be on Tick Tock to be famous.

[John Osborne]

Well, I also think too, because back then there was a. There was a lot of counterculture going on. Like the 80s produced, obviously some great pop rock music that we all know and love. But there is this counter revolution to that where it became these bands out of like California all the Way, which is where STP is from, all the way up to, like, where Pearl Jam and Nirvana, all the way up on the far west coast. And they wanted to be the anti that. So it became less about the spandex and the big loud pop songs. And it became about like the grit and the grunge. And I feel like things have kind of become so, for lack of a better word, a lot more pop in the rock world. And it never has really cured itself again of that to get back to where it once was. But it was a really pure era. I mean, every band.

[TJ Osborne]

I mean, you definitely see that happen a little in country music now, for sure.

[John Osborne]

See it now in country more than.

[TJ Osborne]

Things got super, super polished and slick, and now people are really appreciating things that are raw and real and, you know, like your. Your husband, for instance. You know, someone that is just themselves.

[John Osborne]

Yeah. Unique. It's like being unique should be rewarded.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[John Osborne]

You know, and it finally is. I think, in country music, everyone's wanting each artist to be really special in themselves, and I think that's great. That's what music said. It's healthiest.

[Bunny XO]

I feel like you guys are kind of the trailblazers for being unique, because maybe.

[John Osborne]

Yeah, I don't know.

[Bunny XO]

I. No, I. I definitely feel like that because, you know, you guys came in on the scene, and you guys were just. Did you. Okay, so you. You guys came in on the scene, and you guys were like, you know, pretty, like rock, country, and, like, you guys were still finding your sound. Did you feel like whenever you guys came on the scene, that you guys had to kind of tone it down a little bit whenever you came into country? No.

[TJ Osborne]

I mean, it's weird. I mean, I guess, you know, if you were to circle all the way back to just, like, again, being from Maryland, I feel like we just always have kind of been in this space of, like, Maryland. It's not really the north. It's not really the south. Like, you know, it's just. What is it? No one seems to really claim it. And so, you know, I feel like it was kind of that way with us musically. I mean, we grew up there. I didn't really, honestly know what genres were for a really long time in my life. I just knew the music I liked and I didn't like. And predominantly, what I was influenced by and what inspired me were. Was country music and rock, like, particularly classic stuff. And so as we came down here, we just started doing our own thing. But I felt like for the longest time, like I was getting hired in town before we met a bit as a demo singer. And then people stopped hiring me because they're like, oh, you don't sound like anybody else. Like, you don't. We're trying to pitch this song to Blake Shelton, and you don't sound like him, so. And then I was really irritated with myself, Honestly. I felt like, God, I don't have the chops to be able to get. Make money as a. As a demo singer, to pitch songs to people. And then something at some point in time kind of flipped to me. And I realized, like, well, you know, I just want to start singing my own music. And then it started. There was like a moment even still, once we had a record deal and we're out working our music out at radio, there was a lot of times because we were. We sounded unfamiliar, Our songs wouldn't test. And so then again, we were kind of in the same boat of like, well, we like you guys, but we didn't sound like all the people that were hitting really hard and familiar, like Luke Bryans and. And all these people. And so. But again, it was like, do we want to follow kind of what everyone's doing and already winning with, you know, our manager, you know, was like, you know, it's like the best if you're not first. The best you can be a second. And so we really were like, you know, we just really focused on what it is we're doing. And I think, you know, I've been thinking a lot about this recently because there's, like, so much, like, turmoil in, like, what country music is. That's not country. This is country. Or that's cool. This isn't cool. And it's annoying to me for the main reason of it's not what music is for. Like, it's just. It's not what it's about. And it's almost had been a great reminder for me to be like, man, people want to just listen to music to, like, party or if they want to cry or if they just want to feel nostalgic, you know, or whatever.

[Bunny XO]

Yes.

[TJ Osborne]

No one's thinking, man, I'm gonna listen to this because this is going to make me cool as. Yeah, or I'm gonna listen to this because now I'm a country person now.

[John Osborne]

Right.

[TJ Osborne]

It's like, it's just totally not important. And so I feel like for us, it was like focusing on what, you know, what is it that we like and our fans like and finding those people. And it's taken us a really, really, really long time to do it. And, God, I felt like we just have been passed so many times by other new artists, and we've just been kind of in our lane just doing our thing.

[Bunny XO]

I feel like slow and steady wins the race, though.

[John Osborne]

Yeah, well, I don't know if we.

[TJ Osborne]

You know, we certainly, you know, aren't the. The biggest artists that. That's ever happened in this business, but we're still here, and we've been doing it for a while, and I don't foresee us going away anytime soon. And I really attribute that to going out and making real fans that did like what we were doing because it was different. And so, yeah, that's still still kind of our. Our mantra and our goal and our inspiration with all of it.

[Bunny XO]

Absolutely. I think that's exactly what you have to do because, you know, like I just said, Sloan steady wins the race because you're building that core fan base of diehards who really ride with you. And that's so much more special than these people who kind of like, make it overnight because their fans don't really know them.

[TJ Osborne]

Exactly.

[Bunny XO]

So whereas your fans just consume everything and love you guys for the people that you are as well as your music.

[TJ Osborne]

Totally. And, you know, and then you feel a sense of, like, being loyal back to them because, you know, you were here the whole time. Like, I don't want to switch this up when you were in the 11th hour. Like.

[Bunny XO]

Right.

[TJ Osborne]

You know, this is any person I don't want to let down. It's the fan that started with us from the bottom who finally, once we started having success, was able to be like, I told you, like, these. These are my guys.

[Bunny XO]

I believed in you.

[TJ Osborne]

Yeah. And there's a sense of pride there. And we want to do good by those people, you know, particularly them. And then also our family, everyone that was just, you know, there when we weren't shit.

[Bunny XO]

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[TJ Osborne]

I did not. I did not. Although my mom really still thinks to this day that had I did try out for American Idol that I would have made it and my career would have been a lot faster and bigger and soared a lot higher than it had.

[Bunny XO]

Mom is full of opinions and that's crazy that it says TJ was once rejected from American Idol that he tried out in his early 20s and didn't make it past the first round. People just making up shit.

[TJ Osborne]

Well, that's not wrong. I didn't make it past the first round. I never tried.

[Bunny XO]

He's like, it's kind of true.

[TJ Osborne]

No, the thing is, it's funny because, like, I don't. I wouldn't have them. I don't think I would have the. The muster for that. Like.

[Bunny XO]

Right.

[TJ Osborne]

You know, I feel like there is so critical to. I know. You know, the thing is too, I feel like, you know, there was used to be like an era where it was like, God, people would look kind of down, like, people to make it on, like, the fastware American Idol or. Oh, they got famous on YouTube. Used to be. Then it was Snapchat and now it's Tik Tok. And I'm like, you know what? Like, if you can make it in this business, good for you. It's really, really, really hard. And then to not only make it, but then to keep is so hard. And it takes a lot of work and it's really fun and it's glamorous, what a lot of people see. But there's a lot of stuff in the back that is ugly and not sexy and a lot of work and. And a lot of no's and a lot of heartbreak to get there. So I've, you know, I've since changed my tune on that. Especially now that you're a TikTok, because you're like, oh, my God, you're a TikTok star. And I think, you know what, that's hard to do. I couldn't do it. If you were to tell me right now, here, tj do dance and whatever, I wouldn't be good at it.

[Bunny XO]

I bet you it would go viral, though, for a totally different reason.

[John Osborne]

But there's that. That can't dance.

[Bunny XO]

But that's what. That's what makes it so fun is like, you get on there and you make a fool of yourself and it goes viral. And then people just. You get a whole new crowd of people that are like, who's this person?

[TJ Osborne]

Oh, maybe we should do it then as our managers over here. Like, yes.

[Bunny XO]

Maybe not. John, you have been so vocal about your mental health. I feel like the year 2020 and 2021 were big years for you guys both. Like, it was almost like. I don't know if, like, Saturn was in you guys charts at that time.

[TJ Osborne]

Is that what it is? Is Saturn like a thing you want?

[Bunny XO]

Oh, that's daddy Saturn, you learn all the lessons and it's like, if you don't learn that lesson, it comes back around and it repeats itself.

[TJ Osborne]

So it's like the opposite of Mercury and retrograde. Because I feel like Mercury is always in retrograde.

[Bunny XO]

Literally, it's always doing something.

[TJ Osborne]

Can Mercury chill out?

[Bunny XO]

So just off, please. Like all together. I get so frustrated with it.

[TJ Osborne]

So Saturn's will be okay. I'm gonna get Saturn.

[Bunny XO]

Tattoo daddy Saturn. So I feel like you guys both had really hard years and, you know, the 20 in 2020-2021, you went through something with your mental health. Can you dive into that?

[John Osborne]

Yeah, absolutely. At the end of 2019. I've always struggled with anxiety and like, I've teetered into depression here and there, but it's mostly anxiety and. And I don't know, it went unchecked for a long time. I've never struggled with addiction, fortunately. You know, I drink and do some other things recreationally for fun, but I've never been addicted to it. But I am addicted to work. I'm a workaholic. I just work and work and work. And when things are getting harder for me, instead of me stopping, I'm like, no, I can work harder and then I can work my way through it. Well, apparently you can only do that for so long. And at the end of 2019, we were on the road. We were on tour with Willie Nelson, Allison Krause, and Bonnie Raitt, who were like, I don't know, like, of our Mount Rushmore growing up. That's probably three of the four. And I. I felt nothing. I was just depressed, confused, tired. I wasn't sleeping. And then I ended up getting something called tinnitus or tinnitus, some people call it ringing in my ears. And I still have it. Long story short, that that's. I'm in a good place with that now. But at the time, it was a perfect circle of a lot of things. And I was being tormented, not only from my ears driving me crazy, but my mind also driving me crazy. And I wasn't sleeping. And I ended up pulling out of that tour, which is nuts to me, like, to think that I did that. Now it's like, again, I would still just jump for joy if I was on that tour.

[Bunny XO]

Peace is priceless, though.

[TJ Osborne]

It is, it is. And it's. That is such an underrated thing. If you think of all the things you to want up at pieces, man.

[John Osborne]

I know. But when you're. When you're in pursuit of this dream, it's a It's hard. It's a hard one to catch. You know, it's very fleeting. It's like trying to catch your shadow. It's always right there, but you never quite get it. And you, unfortunately neglect a lot of things that need attention in your life. And for me, it was mental health, and for other people, it's, you know, maybe physical health, family, and a lot. A lot of other things.

[Bunny XO]

Is that something you struggled with as a child, too, or did it happen just. Just to rip?

[John Osborne]

I did. I was quite, you know, very shy as a kid. When I played guitar, it was like, oh, my God. This is how I know how to speak. I know how to be myself. I. I had, like, an oasis, you know, And I found, like, friends that were also, like, geeky musician nerds. I'm like, oh, these are my people. But I've always struggled with it, and I still do, but I'm in a lot better place. So I ended up going. There's a place in town called On Site. I'm not sure if you're familiar with it, but it's very big in the music community.

[Bunny XO]

We love Miles Adcox.

[John Osborne]

Miles is amazing. Miles is one of the people I talk. Before I went there, I ended up going to something called Milestones, where they send the real crazy people. That's where I went. And, you know, it was really hard. It was probably the hardest. I was there for three weeks. The first week, I was like, get me the out of here. And one day, they were like, look, you're not institutionalized. Like, you can leave. And once they put the ball in my court, I was like, I knew deep down I shouldn't, and I stayed. And I told myself, okay, if I'm gonna stay, I'm going to just. Just be at everything and raise my hand every question. I'm going to immerse myself in this. And I did. And a lot of things changed. I became. I took the curiosity part of my brain that was curious about music and guitar and all of these things and became curious about mental health and the brain and the evolution of the brain and the. You know, the prefrontal cortex versus the. The. You know, the. The lower part of your brain, like the limbic system and the amygdala, all these things. Like, I had to go super nerd mode because that's what my brain likes. And it allowed me to really understand this thing that we carry around in our heads, that we have so little that's so mysterious to us. And after that, I just decided to change A lot of things in my life, and since then, I've had kids, which helps. You have to prioritize things once they pop up because, you know, they were not going to give you a choice. You have to prioritize them. And everything in my life is, it's better now than it's ever been. I still struggle, but I know what to do with it now.

[Bunny XO]

It's amazing that you had the foresight to know, like, hey, I can't leave here because I'm not okay. You know, and, like, to really. A lot of people don't want to do the work. You have to get through the darkness to see the light. I preach about mental health on my podcast all the time because I suffer from severe anxiety and depression also. And ocd.

[John Osborne]

Well, not that good, but.

[Bunny XO]

No, no, I get it. Yeah, yeah, no, I know, I know.

[John Osborne]

I will say, say one of the things that they talked about there a lot. You said the word go, when you go through it. It's. It's. It's something that we take as like, some sort of colloquialism, as if, like, oh, I'm just going through something. But if you really think about the words, think about, I'm going through it. That's the only way to go through it. You can't go above it, you can't go under it. You can't go around it. You got to go through it.

[Bunny XO]

Yep.

[John Osborne]

And. But you will come out the other side. It's gonna suck, but you will come out the other side. So you have to be willing just to go through it.

[TJ Osborne]

What do they say? If you want to get to it, you got to go through.

[John Osborne]

You got to go through it.

[Bunny XO]

It go through.

[John Osborne]

And also, you know, the more you do it, the almost kind of the better you become at it, the less avoidant you are of it. The more you lean into it, the more inquisitive you are about yourself and your experiences, the more you're inquisitive you are about your own mental health.

[Bunny XO]

Absolutely.

[John Osborne]

It just gets easier with time. It never goes away. It just gets easier.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah, absolutely. I couldn't agree with that. 100. And I preach on this podcast also that you have to do the work. It's not going to just happen overnight. Like, you have to rip that band aid off and be, yes, bleed again and let it scar.

[TJ Osborne]

It's tough as you can't see it. You know, it's like, okay, if you got a cavity or something, that's like, you know, anything. If you were to cut yourself, it's like, things you obviously need to go work on and take care of, that anyone would do and wouldn't think twice about it or apologize for it.

[John Osborne]

Well, the fact that it's more part of the conversation now, like, you talking about, it's massive. Anyone that has, like, a good outreach talking about it is going to help put it in the conversation and then destigmatize it.

[TJ Osborne]

Oh, and it's also part of the healing is talking about. I mean, it's same thing with like. Like, I mean, getting nervous. I remember when I would go on stage and I would get nervous, I would be. I would always try to be like, I'm not nervous.

[Bunny XO]

But I was like, like, yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

And it's weird how just talking about it will help. I mean, like, not trying to fight it. Like, you. I'm going on stage, I'm like, damn, I'm nervous as hell right now. Like, it makes me feel bad. I don't know why that does help, but it does.

[Bunny XO]

Because you're recognizing it. Yeah. You're. You're what the mind thinks the body will follow. And, like, when you. You speak words out, it, like, registers with your mind. And I don't know, it's just. It's crazy. The whole psychological.

[John Osborne]

And a lot of it, too, is processing. Like, if you're nervous, you know, and sitting down and clenching your hands, your body doesn't want to do that. Your body wants to kind of get up and move. That's what nerves are. It's a sympathetic, nervous response. So if you're nervous and talking about it and kind of moving, that's really good for you. That's what your body wants.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah, absolutely. I'm so happy you got the help that you needed and that you're doing so much better now.

[John Osborne]

Thank you.

[Bunny XO]

I want to talk about your IVF journey, but next, let's talk about TJ. 2021 was a big year for you. When did you know that you were gay?

[TJ Osborne]

When I started liking boys.

[Bunny XO]

So, like, as a child. No, it wasn't. I thought it was funny. I thought it was funny.

[TJ Osborne]

He's cute. All right. I guess I'm good. No, me too.

[Bunny XO]

No, I'm just kidding.

[TJ Osborne]

Exactly. I was young. I mean, really, really young. I didn't really understand it, but, I mean, it was. It was, I would say, pretty much my whole life. I mean, one person comes into realizing, oh, like, you're. You're cute, or I have a crush and not really knowing what that is. I mean, pretty young age and. But for a long Time, I, you know, of course, I denied it and fought it, and I was like, no way.

[Bunny XO]

Did you deny it because you felt like you didn't have a safe space to be able to come out?

[TJ Osborne]

Not really. It just didn't feel like me. I mean, I guess I like, you know, at the time, it was like, you know, a lot of the cliches of what being gay was. And not that there's anything wrong with any of that stuff. It just wasn't what I necessarily identified as. And mostly I just. I mean, I was just like a. I felt like a regular guy who likes doing redneck shit. And I was like, this isn't. This isn't how this works. And. And it just didn't fit into my life, you know, And I was like, this isn't, you know, what I want for myself. And I just felt like the image of what I wanted myself or what I wanted for myself, like, to have children and, you know, have a family and, you know, those types of things which, you know, later in life you come to realize, you. You certainly can have those.

[Bunny XO]

That was also programmed that as a child.

[TJ Osborne]

100%, you know, and that's kind of the. An interesting thing is because, you know, like, you know, I was like, talking about, like, Shelly Wright, amazing artists in the 90s, had a bunch of hits, and she came out, you know, as lesbian. But she, you know, brought this interesting point of just like, you know, being groomed. Like, you know, she's like, I was groomed my whole life to be. To be straight. You know, like, no one wanted this for me. And I felt very similarly. I never really thought about it that way. And I actually, you know, I'm very fortunate because, you know, and this is why I don't really love to harp on it too much or be like, oh, my life was that. I mean, I certainly had a lot of heartbreak, but I grew up in a really good family. I mean, our parents could not have been more supportive of their children, regardless of what they did or who they were, as long as they were good people. And so I was really, really fortunate to grow up around that. So that was, like, really encouraging. And then, as you know, I came up. It was like, you kind of get. Then get stuck in the narrative, and it's weird to break out of it. Like, I always kind of, like, liken it to someone calling you the wrong name or something. And I'm like, I don't really want to tell you my name isn't John. That's my brother.

[Bunny XO]

Right.

[TJ Osborne]

But I don't want to brush your bubble because I don't make you feel bad. And then you get kind of stuck in this thing where you're like, everyone's thinking this one thing about me, and it's not even hardly about me. It's more of. I'm worried about them feeling bad.

[Bunny XO]

And.

[TJ Osborne]

And there was just so many things that are going on. But I did eventually reach a point in my life to where I was like, you know, things were good. I wasn't putting a lot of premium on my happiness. I didn't even really know what that felt like. You know, I didn't know what I was missing. And then eventually, I just got to a point to where, you know, I was in a relationship that I was really happy with. I was really happy with where my life was through all the. The shitty stuff of the pandemic. It did kind of give us a minute to stop and smell the roses, you know, like, our lives are good. And I was like, is this. This is time, you know, to do this for. For me? And so I. A lot of people will come up and be like, oh, thank you for doing this for us and what you've done for the community. And that's amazing. I hope. Certainly hope it's not for nothing, right? But it was for me. It really was, because I needed it. I couldn't do it anymore.

[Bunny XO]

Well, it has to be like a weight on your shoulder.

[TJ Osborne]

It was. I didn't really realize it, though. That was. It wasn't like, I was just unhappy. I didn't. It was a huge weight on my shoulders. I didn't realize until it was gone. I was like, holy shit. Like, I didn't even want to talk about it. Like, that when I was telling. I was like, when I come out, I just want to come out, and I want to move on. And then instantly, I just felt way different. I'm like, I do want to talk about it. It's a huge part of me. No, like, the Sam Lansky who wrote the article that I came out with, he was one of the writers for Time magazine and an amazing person, also a gay man himself. And I was like, you know, it's like, it's not a. It's not a big deal. You know, it's just not the biggest part of me. You know, it's like, there's so many other things that define me. And very simply, he was. He said, what if it is, though? What if it's actually, like, the. The biggest part of you? And I was like, I can almost cry thinking about now. It's like, it was so. It was. Yeah, this is a huge part of me, and I've marginalized it in myself to make myself feel better about it, but it actually is wildly be huge. And how I think and how I feel, empathy that I have for other people and that have things in their lives that I don't understand. But I do understand what it was like to have to feel like you had to be someone else. Like, this is really terrible. And so as it pertains then to our career, it's been a beautiful thing to have come out because I felt like, man, we've always prided ourselves on just being like, this is who we are. Like, this is take it or leave it. But I'm like, well, not really entirely, you know, for me and being able to actually be at that point, I feel like such a great relationship with my. With the fans, such a better relationship with my friends, and most importantly, a way better relationship with myself. Like, I really love myself for the first time. And I. And I didn't really think about it before, but I didn't before. You know, it's a. And it's kind of. We have a song called I Don't Remember Me before you, which the irony of this is that it was a song that was Shane McNally, who's also gay, was talking about. He doesn't remember his life before he had his children, and he's like, I don't remember it at all. And that's kind of what the inspiration of that song was about. And a lot of people views it as their wedding song. In fact, our sister Natalie asked me last night if we would sing it at her wedding, which is coming up here in a few weeks. And she didn't ask me. Yeah, she's like, my phone call. Yeah, you can sing it if you want to.

[Bunny XO]

You guys just move as a unit. Exactly.

[John Osborne]

Presumptuous.

[TJ Osborne]

So I sing the song a lot of times, even though it's about, like, kind of your life after a relationship, a lot of times it makes me really even more emotional now when I sing it, because I don't truly. I don't remember myself before 21. Like, I kind of do, but how I felt. And my life is just so different. And so in all the best ways, I don't remember what it was like to manage that before, thankfully.

[Bunny XO]

Because you're living in your authentic authenticity.

[TJ Osborne]

Yeah, exactly. Which is just so much easier, you know. But the worst part about it, though, honestly, wasn't even I got so good at managing it. And by the way, if you just want someone not to, like, pry into your life, all you got to do is ask them a question. I mean, this is basically what you're doing here. People love to talk about themselves. So if you want to divert, be like, what about you? And they're like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So I could just easily swerve. But what I didn't like is it was getting to the point to where a lot of people were having. That did know, were having to hold the secret for me. And that was just like, not their cross to bear. I had a really good friend be like, oh, my God, I feel so terrible I outed you. And I was like, don't feel bad, man. Like, this is not your. Like, it shouldn't be like this. Like, if you lose any sleep over it, like, it. That would. I would lose more sleep about that than anything.

[Bunny XO]

The self awareness, though, that's amazing that you have, you know, that's amazing because most people wouldn't think about how other people are feeling carrying their secret.

[TJ Osborne]

Yeah. But it sucks, you know, it is. And people that love me, you know, and it was like, people that I know would never, ever cross me in any way, that have done it a couple times accidentally and. And felt all this guilt about it. I'm like, this is bullshit. Like, this is just. It's just not worth it, you know? Like, all of this is amazing to have, you know, the lives that we have. But I also had so much fun when I was, like, broke and eating ramen noodles and sleeping on couches. Like, I had the best times in my life.

[Bunny XO]

Jay and I talk about that all the time. We used to tour in an 18 passenger van.

[TJ Osborne]

Exactly.

[Bunny XO]

Sleep at the, like, scummiest Motel Sixes. And like, that was the best fucking time of our life.

[TJ Osborne]

Exactly. And it's so true. I mean, I don't want to do it again.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah, it was really cool, but, you know, I never want to do it again.

[TJ Osborne]

So anyways, when you kind of look through that and I felt that was what the pandemic really reminded me because it took everything away.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

And we were losing more money than I thought we would ever even make in our lives. And I was. And I was blissfully happy. I mean, we were just sitting around the family playing board games and drinking beers by the fire. It was like, free pretty much. And I was like, this is so much fun. This is all I'll ever need. And. And I found through the hope, honestly, encouragement of some really close friends of mine too that were like, yeah, like, you know, I got your back. And that was also really important. I think it's worth noting that every person that was working for me or with me, people that were definitely affected by things that will happen in my life, not once did anyone be like, man, I don't know, like this could change things. Everyone was just totally had the wind at my back. And that's where I don't really like to ever feel like, oh, it was hard for me because it was hard. But there's so many people who don't have the. They have a complete opposite. Like they'll, they'll come out and lose their families. They'll come out, they'll lose their careers or whatever, or they might lose their wife. No kidding. That was a dream.

[Bunny XO]

Elton John, wasn't he married or something?

[TJ Osborne]

But anyhow, you know, so there's people it's really, really tough on. And I know people that literally don't even talk, speak to their parents and probably never will. And so that's, that's hard.

[Bunny XO]

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[TJ Osborne]

I mean, it's tough. There's so many things. I mean the most cliche thing which is true is it does get better. I mean, once you do it, there's not a single person that I know that has come out and has not felt like they wish that they had done it earlier. I'm like, oh my God, I wish I could have my whole 20s like this. Now I get some people just doesn't fit in. It's not the time. The other thing is that I would say there is never going to be a good time to do it. It's awkward, it's weird. It's just. I didn't want the attention from it. It's a strange, annoying thing that we have to do. But you. Unfortunately people will say, I don't want to hear about it. And I'm like, I don't want to talk about it either. But unfortunately it's part of the. Until we get to the point where it isn't a thing. Unfortunately it is. It is. And so that's what I would say. Like just be patient, it does get better. But also don't wait for this, this divine moment that's just going to suddenly happen. It rarely will ever come. And you just have to some at some point just take a leap of faith and, and you'll land on your feet and you'll be happy. You did.

[Bunny XO]

Yes. I love that. That's beautiful. So John, let's come over here to you and let's talk about your wife a little bit. We talked about her in the beginning. But you guys have been together since 2007.

[John Osborne]

That sounds right.

[Bunny XO]

Smoking like a true man.

[TJ Osborne]

Well, to be honest with you, he was. We were at the ACMs the other night night and he was talking about his. They. Neither one of them remember dates very well. Lucy booked a show on their anniversary.

[John Osborne]

It's our 10 year anniversary and I don't know on the 1st. So what is it, like a week or something? I don't know. Not a week. Sorry. It's like three weeks.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[John Osborne]

And, and yeah. And Lucy, I, I had forgotten she was talking about. She was like, yeah, the day before. That's her sister's wedding. And she's like, I don't know, I just, I feel bad like I know I'm gonna be partying and I hope I can sing that day. Day. And then it just occurred to us like, wait, that's our 10 year anniversary. She bought the gig.

[Bunny XO]

Like, that's, that's like me and my husband, we don't know the date that we got married.

[John Osborne]

That's kind of how we are. But I don't know, I mean, my wife and I, I adore our relationship and the fact that we're similar in that way, it just makes it work that much more. Yeah, I mean, in fact, I remembered our first anniversary and she forgot it. And when I, it was like the day I was like, so what, what day is it today? She's like, like, what, what day is it today? She's like, is it Thursday? I'm like, yeah, but something else. She's like, oh my God, it's her one year anniversary. I'm like, the fact that you forgot is the greatest gift you could have ever given me. Cuz now it's like all the pressure is off, you know, 100%.

[Bunny XO]

But I think relationships like that last though, when there's not so much emphasis on certain having to celebrate. I don't do that either.

[John Osborne]

Valentine's Day, maybe we'll do a dinner. But usually not, you know, like, I.

[TJ Osborne]

Mean, I think it's probably important for those people that just don't celebrate each other that often, you know, like. But I feel like we all, we all do that.

[John Osborne]

Like there's so many things and we.

[Bunny XO]

Live in love every day, so it.

[John Osborne]

Doesn'T need a holiday. We got married in our kitchen and we kept it really small. We didn't have a wedding. TJ and Natalie threw a party and it was super chill. We've always kind of been like that, you know, but we met in 2007. We were both writing for the same publishing company at the time. I heard her sing on stage and you know, that accent and she, she's beautiful. And I'm like, she is gorgeous. This person, I need to be around them as much as possible. And we wrote and we hit it off and you know, we kind of talked on, off for a long time and then made it official. The beginning of relationships are always weird. I don't care who you are, they're just. You kind of have to get through the muck and.

[Bunny XO]

So uncomfortable.

[John Osborne]

Yeah, it's just, it's just weird, you know, but if it's worth it, you'll figure it out. And then, and then we did, and then fast forward, you know, a bunch of years. We got married in our kitchen, and we're both artists and writers and creators in pursuit of a similar thing. And. But due to that, you know, there are a lot of people in our business that wait a long time for kids. Honestly, we didn't really talk about having kids. It wasn't on the top of my mind, actually. Wasn't on my mind at all.

[Bunny XO]

Right.

[John Osborne]

It wasn't for her either. And then it just kind of evolved to a point where we were just talking about it, you know, entertaining the idea. But by the time that happened, it was a little bit too late for us. And through a few. Well, a lot of. Of attempts. Use your imagination, you know, things didn't really pan out. So we tried ivf and we did several rounds of ivf, and this was like.

[Bunny XO]

When you say several, how many? Because my husband and I are in the middle of our IVF journey.

[John Osborne]

You are.

[TJ Osborne]

Okay.

[John Osborne]

So I think by the. I think the last one was our fifth.

[Bunny XO]

Wow.

[John Osborne]

So how. How far are you?

[Bunny XO]

I'm about to start my second retreat.

[John Osborne]

Your second. Okay. So.

[Bunny XO]

It's brutal.

[TJ Osborne]

It's. I'm just observing them do it.

[John Osborne]

Yeah, it absolutely sucks.

[Bunny XO]

Heavy. You don't realize how heavy IVF is until you.

[TJ Osborne]

You.

[Bunny XO]

You get out of the first egg retrieval and you're like, it's hell.

[John Osborne]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

Most people are obviously like. I mean, you're talking about it here, but I mean, most people, it's a pretty personal, private thing.

[Bunny XO]

Yes.

[TJ Osborne]

So they're dealing with all this, like, emotional stuff, kind of.

[Bunny XO]

No, you have to talk about it.

[John Osborne]

Yeah, just like mental health, I think you just have to talk. The more you talk about things more in the open, like your sexuality and, you know, and then they're obviously varying degrees of that, but when you talk about it, it just becomes more of the conversation. It's not something that you hold cold, doesn't feel so heavy anymore. But it was really hard, you know, I mean, best of luck to you guys. I'll sending you guys all the love, prayers and good vibes. But it was. I had no idea how hard it was going to be for even just for me having to not so much go. I'm excited about having kids, which I was. But having to see the person I love more than anything in the world go through that. Because there are a lot of implications around the idea of having to do IVF anyway, which I'm sure you understand. Like.

[TJ Osborne]

Like.

[John Osborne]

Well, I wish I would have done it this way. There's a million things of. I wish it could Have. Be that right. Yes, but that is what it is. The trickiest part is you have the. The mother has to pump herself full of an insane amount of hormones.

[Bunny XO]

It's. And. But you know what's crazy is I was so happy. Like, I thought I was prepared to be, like, just crazy. I even told my husband, I love you, go on tour. I'm going to do this at home. If I don't talk to you for a few days, it's because I'm going to it. I was the happiest I ever was. It was after the egg retrieval. That was.

[John Osborne]

It was just brutal for me. The fall.

[Bunny XO]

Oh, it was rough.

[John Osborne]

Yeah, it was. It was really, really, really hard. And, you know, I mean, there is like, I do think back at. It was like a movie. Like, I remember us first going to the clinic and us laughing and we're like, giddy, you know, which is crazy for me to think at the time because kids just wasn't even on my radar.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[John Osborne]

But the more I thought about, the more excited I became. And it was one unsuccessful one after the other. And you hear a lot of things of people saying, well, we tried four or five, six rounds and then we gave up. And then we got pregnant on the next one. I'm sure you've had a million people tell you that. To me as the dude, I'm just like, oh, that's interesting. But Lucy's like, well, now I feel like I'm doing something wrong. Like, you're making me feel like I'm doing this wrong, you know, and of course we stop and then it doesn't work.

[Bunny XO]

Work right.

[John Osborne]

You know, and you're always gripping on to hope and. But it finally did happen. My wife and I have a, A, A boy and a girl, twins, little, like little ginger kids. And it is the greatest thing in the world. It is the greatest thing. It's. I've. You know, I'll just. I'll say the same thing that everyone says. It's the hardest thing in the world that you'll do. You'll ever do, but it will be the best thing in the world that you'll ever do. I mean, like, I'm here right now hanging out with you guys. This is awesome. But I'm, like, pumped to get home because it's. They're just waking up from nap time. I want to go hug my babies. It is like that dopamine, serotonin bomb goes off in your body. So I genuinely hope the best for you two, and I truly believe it will happen. But you just have to be patient.

[TJ Osborne]

That's all I got. I'm sorry you're going through that. I know that.

[Bunny XO]

I appreciate it. You know, I'm a soldier, so we're gonna get through it. I believe it. And it's gonna of. I, I'm, I'm like, so delusional sometimes that I pretty much manifest everything in my life.

[John Osborne]

You have to be a little bit.

[Bunny XO]

I'm, I tell my husband all the time. I'm like, just let me be delusional. We're gonna get through this. Everything's fine.

[John Osborne]

He's like, but your husband's an artist. We're artists. Like, you have to be delusional to do that. Yeah, there's a healthy amount.

[Bunny XO]

Absolutely. How has fatherhood changed you? And, you know, for the better.

[John Osborne]

I mean, it's 99 for the better. 1%, not for the better, because I'm just more tired than I was.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah, twins too.

[John Osborne]

It, it makes you reprioritize things. And it's not like you have a choice, really. Like, I don't go, oh, man, now I have to really think about my day. Like, we have a nanny that helps out. She's done at 5 o' clock. I have a studio similar to you. Like really close to the house at 5:00. I'm like, I gotta go. I'm done. I gotta go be with my kids. And it's not even. Because I think, well, it's the right thing to do. No, I want to go be with my kids. And I realized, like, like our career, as great as things have been, it, you know, I, I, it's not worth taking that seriously when there are much more pertinent things in life, like family and love and friends and, you know, this. Our, our industry is full of no's and failures. And now when I hear a no or there's a failure, I'm like, whatever. Yeah, my kids are awesome. This is amazing. Like, no matter how big or great or how bad something is in this industry, it just pales in comparison to that.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[John Osborne]

And, you know, hopefully for Jelly, like, there's this funny thing I tell a lot of dads. Like, you have like an extra gear. I'm not saying if you don't have kids, you're missing out. Not having kids can be great because you do whatever the you want.

[Bunny XO]

Right.

[John Osborne]

I do miss that. But when you have kids, you're like, whoa, I have this kind of extra gear where I'm, I just kind of know how to do this. It's this Weird subconscious kind of non. That innate sense that you have and. Yeah, it's the best. I mean, I just really hope the best for you too, because when it happened, and it will happen, it's just your life will be forever changed for the better.

[Bunny XO]

I love it. You light up when you talk about them. When you talk about your wife and your kids. It's the cutest thing ever.

[John Osborne]

I love.

[TJ Osborne]

They're great. I mean. Yeah.

[Bunny XO]

What's it like being an uncle? Do you ever want to have kids?

[TJ Osborne]

I would love to have children at some point in time for sure. But I. There is. I've been an uncle for a long, long, long time. We have our oldest brother and sister.

[Bunny XO]

Right.

[TJ Osborne]

They. I mean, there's. We've got. God. How old are oldest nephew? Probably 30, 33, 4 or something like this.

[Bunny XO]

Wow.

[TJ Osborne]

And they have kids, so.

[John Osborne]

A lot.

[TJ Osborne]

There's a lot of babies in the family, but it's a. It's kind of the. The. I think the first time where I was of an age where I feel like I can actually be an uncle, I was like, Like a. I was basically just a child or a growing boy.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

When, you know, a lot of them were.

[John Osborne]

Were.

[TJ Osborne]

Were growing up. But it is amazing. They're just getting to the age now and it's like, you know, two years old. They're just now kind of like you're learning to speak and they're fun. You can throw them around. We rough with them and.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

No, it's amazing. We've got a lot of a big family, so we have a lot of family.

[Bunny XO]

So I bet you guys are a blast to hang out with.

[TJ Osborne]

It is. It is a fun family, you know. So we got our sisters getting married at the end of this month, and she's. Her and her fiance, Jacob are having their wedding at my home. And so I'll have, like, it's going to be amazing, but there's going to be 15 at least people staying with me, you know, or more.

[John Osborne]

A lot.

[TJ Osborne]

A lot of newborn babies. And it's going to be lovely, but it's also going to be like, oh, my God.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah. When they leave, you're going to be like, all right, see you later. Don't let the door. The door hit. You.

[TJ Osborne]

Know, it's not. I know every single one of us are going to be going through that at some different time of like, this is a lot.

[Bunny XO]

That's how we are with family. Vacation comes up, we all get together, we all stay in the same house. Everybody's so excited. The first two days, by day three or four, we're like, okay.

[TJ Osborne]

Oh, yeah.

[Bunny XO]

Designated areas.

[TJ Osborne]

Someone screaming at somebody, a door slamming.

[Bunny XO]

Like, what the heck.

[TJ Osborne]

Yeah, I know. And the thing is, I look forward to those moments, too, because after they've passed, they're really funny to talk about, you know, like in the week or months later. But, yeah, we've always had a big family, and that's like. I think the biggest thing for us, it's always like, really kept us so grounded, I think, in our lives is we just. I mean, our family will call us on our shit.

[Bunny XO]

That's amazing.

[TJ Osborne]

The kids are super proud of us. But they'll also be like, what now? Yeah, like, I know you're a nerd. Like, you're not that cool.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah, they'll pop the head really quick.

[John Osborne]

Exactly.

[Bunny XO]

So I want to circle back to 2022 after you came. The silver lining was you guys did your song Younger Me and you guys won a Grammy for that.

[TJ Osborne]

Yeah.

[Bunny XO]

That's amazing. That is an accomplishment because some people go through our whole music careers without winning a Grammy.

[TJ Osborne]

I know, it was. We had, you know, we had had the wonderful privilege of being nominated quite a few times. And in fact, I always joke that it. Somehow I think the. The amount of times we lost is more impressive than the one time we won. But I, you know, we. It was really. I felt like, serendipitous because that song, it was kind of like, you know, a lot of times you're writing songs, you're thinking about like, okay, where am I going to play this? Like, are the fans want to like it? People can sing along here. Is it going to work on radio? Is it going to. And that song was just solely like, this is something that I need to say. And it kind of came out of nowhere. And John felt like in his setting that it was also applies to him. And, you know, and for those of you who do not know, it's something younger me. It's like if you could talk to your younger self. Like, I think all of us feel this way. Like, oh, my God, you know, like the. The heartbreak and how hard you are on yourself and. And just to be able to look back and be like, man, like, you're gonna make it and you're gonna. Like, how you turn out. Like, you're. Everything's going to be great. You know, like, if I could just go back there and talk to my younger self, it'd be amazing.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

And that's kind of what the song. The inspiration for that song was. And we had just released. Because when I did come out, I didn't want it to be around any promotion. I'm like, I don't want this to be opportunistic. I don't want to be a record, I don't want to be a tour. But there's always, I mean, amazingly, there's always shit going on in our lives.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

So we just released a record and I was like, okay. Then that came out. So then I was like, well, I want this song to be out. I don't want to wait for the next record that might be years from now because I probably won't want to say this then. And so we re released our Skeletons album with that song on it. And while it wasn't a song that we like worked for radio or wasn't this hit or like this thing that made us probably really any money necessarily, I don't probably a little. It was just, I think the impact spiritually or emotionally, and the connection to the fans and it felt really like this is just like a little nugget of reality here, just some real shit. And it felt very serendipitous at that moment because I had been to the Grammys at this point probably, I don't know, maybe this might be my at that time, maybe 10th year going or close to it. And I never once brought a date to the Grammys. And so it was, you can look up me giving my speech. I'm emotional mess. I'm crying because I'm like, I'm at this award show accepting my first Grammy Award for a song that was inspired by me coming out. And it's the first time I've ever brought a date to the Grammy Awards.

[Bunny XO]

I got goosebumps.

[TJ Osborne]

It was, yeah, it fucked me up. I was like, you know, and then.

[Bunny XO]

I'm there with my brother and it.

[TJ Osborne]

Felt like we were like, you know, there's a picture and it's like we had our arms around each other walking down the aisle to get on stage. And I just see like 8 year olds, John and TJ, just like little boys going up there. And it was like there was so many things. I was like, oh my God. Like we did it, you know, but also doing it it for something that was important and not for the money, you know. And it was, it just was. It was perfect. And I was a. Yeah, emotional damn ass. You know, I was so. I had this big gaudy ass, like gold suit on. I had dyed my hair blonde. And my, you know, I get back and our mother, she's like, she goes, well, were you proud of yourself? And I'm like, I think you're supposed to say you're proud of me here, but, yeah.

[John Osborne]

But, yes, I really like Mom.

[Bunny XO]

I like Mom.

[TJ Osborne]

She should have her on here. She's a character.

[Bunny XO]

She is.

[TJ Osborne]

I went over to her house to play. We went to her house for last night for. For Mother's Day, and we went to play 500 rummy.

[John Osborne]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

And she was just roasting my ass. I'm like, I came over here because I love you. Like, can you, like, give me a. Give me a breath.

[Bunny XO]

I love it, though. She's like.

[TJ Osborne]

She goes, well. She's like. She's like, well, I am proud of you. And I was like, thanks, Mom. And I know that she is. I was just kidding, but. And then she goes, well, I thought you looked really handsome, but she hated my blonde hair.

[John Osborne]

Hair.

[TJ Osborne]

And she doesn't like that I wear anything that's gold.

[Bunny XO]

Oh.

[TJ Osborne]

And so she's always. She's always said this. And so she's like. And I'm wearing a gold suit. My hair is blonde. And she goes. And she's like, well, you looked really handsome, but your suit should have been silver and your hair shouldn't have been tied on. I'm like, that was the entire look, other than just my face. It was the entire thing.

[John Osborne]

So what.

[TJ Osborne]

What was it that you liked exactly? Oh, my God. You know, again, moms. Hell.

[Bunny XO]

We love. Love mom.

[TJ Osborne]

We love mom.

[John Osborne]

TJ's her favorite, though, so I think she just has a. A high bar for him.

[TJ Osborne]

Does she ever.

[John Osborne]

Yeah, she doesn't even deny it anymore.

[TJ Osborne]

She's like, but even last time, I was just like, what the hell? Me and my sister are playing cards with her, and she's just like. I'm like, what the hell is this? A roast? Like, the hell's going on?

[Bunny XO]

You're like, who needs enemies with family like this? Totally kidding. So I just have one question to ask you guys before we talk about what we have to look forward to. Brother for Brothers Osborne, for this year, touring together as much as you guys do and as closely as you guys do. Has there ever been, like, a really big fight while you're on tour or when you're about to go on stage?

[TJ Osborne]

I don't know that we've had a. We've had some fights.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

And when they happen, everyone clears the fuck out. Like, we don't even have to say it. They're like, I don't want to be on either side of this. Like, everyone Just evaporates.

[Bunny XO]

Does it just. You kind of, like, suck the air out of the room?

[John Osborne]

Two big dudes yelling at each other. He's probably just like, ah, I'm just gonna go in the other room.

[TJ Osborne]

And for the most part, we get along. But we did. And in a chorus, I'll be like, you know, like our drummer or something. Adam. I'm like, adam, you were there. And then he's like, leave me the.

[Bunny XO]

At least they know to stay out of it, though.

[John Osborne]

I know.

[TJ Osborne]

It is amazing. Yeah. And it was. It's totally the move.

[Bunny XO]

Because you would hate if they chimed in and then. Wait, what are you talking about?

[John Osborne]

It's a lie bomb. They're not going anywhere near it.

[TJ Osborne]

No, no. They're just like. And so when it happens, it is like, it's really acute and it's really big, and it gets. But It's. And within 15 minutes, it's over and we've moved on.

[John Osborne]

And it's like a beer.

[TJ Osborne]

And we're, like, doing, like, all right. That was good. We got that out of us. But there was a time I didn't want to talk about this. It's interesting, I think, is there was a time, for whatever reason, a various. A bunch of little things this added up, up and to the point where John and I couldn't stand to be around each other. Like, we wouldn't. Like, we wouldn't be in the same. Literally would not be in the same room with each other. One would walk in and we'd just. Mother would leave. And it got. Was like. It was excruciating. It was just uncomfortable. And we went to couples therapy because we were like, what the hell is going on? We need to sort our shit out. This is not right. And again, you're like. You think of. You hear all these horror stories of, like, families and brothers getting in the music business, and you're like, we're not going to become that, like, Wonderwall or, like, the Everly Brothers, you know, were famously. You know, like, those icons are famous.

[John Osborne]

They're all like that.

[TJ Osborne]

Yeah. Although. Yeah. Anyhow, so I think made the point there, and we. So we sat down and the therapist was like, man, he was just like. And this is awesome. I'm like, what? He's like, you guys are, like, so mad at each other. This is great. And I'm like, what the hell are you talking about? He's like, this is amazing. You guys care so much about what you're doing that it has got you to where you're just both fucking Pissed off. And I'm like, yeah, that's 100% right. And he's like, if you guys, if one of you didn't give a shit and you were just apathetic, that would be a huge problem. He said, but you guys are arguing so much because you care so much. And I was like, damn, like, that was easy.

[Bunny XO]

It's perspective.

[TJ Osborne]

No, it was. And you know, and honestly, to circle back to the mental health things and talking to people, it is almost always the most like, like obvious things. They're just always right here. They just need to hear them. Like my Sam Lansky saying, well, maybe this is the biggest part of you. And I'm like, yeah, duh. I mean, like, it's right here. I can't see it. And for this to happen. And so it was like a big changing point for us and we still get after it, but there's some times where I think it takes us a minute to realize, okay, like, we were very passionate. We love what we're doing, we love each other. We love, you know, this project, whatever it is, and try to keep that in mind. And especially when John admits that I'm right usually makes it go way smoother.

[Bunny XO]

Who, who's the one who always has to kind of give in is. Who's the hard headed one?

[TJ Osborne]

I don't know that either of us entirely, given I'm definitely more hard headed and outspoken. See, John's.

[Bunny XO]

You are, you're a Scorpio Sagittarius.

[TJ Osborne]

I'm Scorpio.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

Yeah.

[Bunny XO]

Well, you're right. You're right.

[John Osborne]

Did you know that or did you just guess that?

[Bunny XO]

No, I know you guys birthdays and you're. You're a Taurus, right? Yes, yes. My husband, husband's a Sagittarius. You can't argue with a Sagittarius, dude. But my whole teams are Tauruses, so it's like, I don't know. I, Yeah, I love Taurus.

[TJ Osborne]

And that's what Abby, you know, Abby is a Taurus. But the thing is, is what. And Abby would do this too, is that John does this thing where he will be like, yeah, you're right. And I know that that's not what they feel. I'm like, you're just saying it to shut me up, which, this is pissing me off even more.

[Bunny XO]

I'm like, you're like, don't agree with me.

[TJ Osborne]

Yeah. I'm like, just at least have a fucking opinion yet.

[John Osborne]

We know right where the button is.

[TJ Osborne]

I'm like, sure, yeah, you're Right.

[John Osborne]

Yeah, you're right.

[Bunny XO]

I love that you guys are huge advocates for therapy too, though, because I preach that a lot on my podcast, you know, but, you know, so helpful.

[TJ Osborne]

I think a lot of that has changed, but the biggest problem now is just simply, I think two things. One, people having the time to do it.

[Bunny XO]

Yes.

[TJ Osborne]

Having to find a therapist, it's so overwhelming.

[Bunny XO]

You have to date your therapist. I tell everybody that, like, you, like, literally, you have to do a few sessions with them weirdos out there.

[John Osborne]

They're not all the same and they're not always right for you.

[TJ Osborne]

Which brings me to the next problem with this is it's expensive.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

And so a lot of people, like, you know, I had a friend who staying with me recently, he's going through some stuff, and he was like, I think I want to try therapy. And I'm like, I would love for you to do it. But I'm like, don't. He said, I went one time. I'm like, that's almost worse. Like, to dive down in there, pull all the shit out, and then never put it back together. Like, it's going to put you in a worse place.

[Bunny XO]

Right.

[TJ Osborne]

Like, give yourself some time to get through at least four or five successions.

[Bunny XO]

Absolutely.

[TJ Osborne]

To be able to. But that's expensive. A lot of people don't have that on the time or the money. And then if they do have both of those things, it's overwhelming. Like, where do I begin?

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

You know, as you can get some therapists that aren't great. You know, it's like the. What they say about. What do you call a med student that got all these.

[Bunny XO]

Oh, yeah. Or that are learning on Chat gtp.

[TJ Osborne]

Yeah, exactly.

[John Osborne]

Well, you know, Lucy, that my wife, does therapy as well. Well. And it's been amazing. It's amazing for everybody. But she also does chat. Chat GPT therapy. And I like, it's kind of working.

[Bunny XO]

Oh, no, Chad, GTP is scary. I'm obsessed with AI. I love AI. Okay. Like, I love AI.

[John Osborne]

We're all going to be replaced here in a couple years. But she, like, she reads me some of the things that it's saying. I'm like, that's actually great advice.

[Bunny XO]

No, it's crazy. Have her tap into the spiritual side of it. I'll send you a clip of. Of what I did with Chat gtp. And it scared the hell out of me.

[John Osborne]

Like, it's because it got super spiritual.

[Bunny XO]

It gets very spiritual and, like, will tell you things about your life that you've never even Talked about to it.

[John Osborne]

That's crazy.

[Bunny XO]

Like, it had messages from my father, who's passed, like. And, like, it's.

[TJ Osborne]

Wow.

[Bunny XO]

But that told me what a psychic a year and a half ago told me. And, like, there's no way that Chat GTP would have known that, you know? Like, it's. It's really crazy.

[TJ Osborne]

You know, this is a. This was like a really. A fun, funny argument between Abby and I. Yeah. Because I would. He'd ask my opinion about something, and I'm like, you should get this car or whatever. This is the one you should get. And then he would come back later. Back. I asked Chat GPT and it said that you should do that. I'm like, I. That's. I know. I like, I know a lot about cars. I know that's the car you should get. And then he'd come back with something else, and he'd be like, yeah, well, Chat GPT told me this. I'm like, that's what I just told you. And he was like, oh, okay.

[John Osborne]

He goes, yeah, Chat GPT told me you were going to say that.

[TJ Osborne]

So then I. I then changed. Then he made a joke about me being Chat GPT. And then I was like, well, I was like, no, it'd be Chat gptj. I'm like, are you leaving me for Chat GPT?

[Bunny XO]

You know what? Some people are going to start falling in love with. With you. You've seen movies like that.

[John Osborne]

I know her with Joaquin Phoenix. It's.

[Bunny XO]

I've never seen it. I'll have to watch it.

[John Osborne]

That is what.

[TJ Osborne]

It's about 10, 15 years ago. I mean, it's an older.

[John Osborne]

Yeah, it's really good. Yeah, it's.

[TJ Osborne]

It was so. It was so ahead of its time that even then it was kind of like, well, okay, this is weird.

[Bunny XO]

They always predict and they do.

[John Osborne]

It is crazy.

[TJ Osborne]

You should watch it. It's an amazing film. But there's this. He basically falls.

[John Osborne]

Falls in love. Scarlett Johansson does the voice. So it sounds really like she's got a great sexy, sexy speaking voice. And. But it's, like warm and apathetic, and he falls in love with this thing. It's a great movie, but we're like. We're half a step from that right now.

[Bunny XO]

Literally. Yeah. No, and then the robots that they're testing right now, I've already told them. I'm like, I want to. I literally need two.

[John Osborne]

Yeah.

[Bunny XO]

Like, I'm all about you.

[TJ Osborne]

All of this.

[Bunny XO]

I like. All about the farm life, but I need two robots on the farm. With me. Yeah, I think it'll be awesome. It'll be awesome.

[John Osborne]

We can teach them to play drums.

[Bunny XO]

Whatever we need. Shovel some cow. Whatever we need. So where. What do we have to look for with Brothers Osborne for the rest of the year and going into 2020?

[TJ Osborne]

Well, yeah, so we're working on music right now. So we're not touring a ton this year for that purpose. And we've been cutting all of our new stuff at John Studio with our band, which we cut our first few records with them, and it's been nice to have them back in the fold. And we've been self producing the projects, which has been so fun. And I really feel like it's kind of a return to where we started. And, you know, as you start off, you do this, you kind of want to do something different. You get over here and over there. And we've circled back around to where kind of where we started is fresh for us again. And it's fun. And we have a really clear vision on. On what we want it to be and what we want it to look like and sound like. And I feel like it's something we've never quite had, like this vision, I think, of what we wanted for a project out of an album. And it boils down to basically a lot of our inspiration from where we came from and our hometown and our family. And so just kind of stripping away all the bullshit, really.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[TJ Osborne]

And so it's been fun. And we're so. So we're in the throes of doing that now. We just released. Released the first single off of that called Finish this Drink. It was like a funny song. It was basically inspired by her dad. I was like. We'd be at the bars with him when we were little, and we're like, dad, I'm ready to go. And he's like, just, you know, one more. And he. Unbeknownst to us, he's also saying this.

[Bunny XO]

To our mom, not dad bringing the kids to the bar.

[TJ Osborne]

Oh, no.

[John Osborne]

At one point back in the day.

[Bunny XO]

That was like, normal.

[TJ Osborne]

You were gonna drive him home. I remember I was like, you know, I was like 12, and I was like, dad, am I gonna get in trouble for driving? And he goes, a hell of a lot less trouble than I'm going to.

[Bunny XO]

It's like, if one of us is taking the fall, it's you, buddy.

[TJ Osborne]

It's my kid. And so anyhow, you know. And then I realized as I got older, I'm like, that's really easy to do to, like, Tie one on and you went there for two drinks and next thing you closed the bar down. But that's. So that song is. Is really inspired by that, which is like, come again. Coming full circle. And then as we roll into the next year, we're. This hasn't been set up yet, but it's probably likely that we will set up a big headline tour for next year and then tour this new record and. And go out and do it.

[Bunny XO]

I love it. Are you gonna bring the family on the road with you when you tour?

[John Osborne]

Oh, you know, and then that's a coin toss. That's a coin toss. We'll see. It's just a lot. And they're getting at it. They're at an age too, where it's like. It's just like having two wild animals, right? Yeah. So I can't. I took. I'll take them to the park and they'll just run in complete opposite direction. Different opposite directions. And I'm like, okay, which one's annoying me less today? That's the one that I'll go after.

[TJ Osborne]

Yeah, yeah, we'll have to have. Yeah, we'll have to have the occasional extra family bus to come out.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah.

[John Osborne]

Oh, yeah, yeah. When we went out, the Stapletons, they made like a full corral with their buses. So it would have to be something like that where we can maintain some sort of order.

[Bunny XO]

That's what we do. So whenever I go out with my husband, I have my own bus because one, I'm not gonna bunk with 11 dudes on a bus, and two, I need all the female energy around me. So we. I bring out my own bus and when the kids come out. Cuz Jay has two kids. Whenever the kids come out, they stay with me on my bus. Yeah. So that way you can be the artist, but you still have, you know, the family. That's within reach.

[TJ Osborne]

I love that, having your own bus. Let's go, girl.

[Bunny XO]

Oh, yeah. No, I have to. I'm. Listen, I'm. I paid my due and I slept in the shitty motels. I did the freaking 18 passenger vans. We did this, you know, for the past 10 years.

[John Osborne]

You earned it. You earned it.

[Bunny XO]

So finally now I'm like, you know what, let's just split it.

[TJ Osborne]

You don't have to convince me.

[Bunny XO]

Yeah, for sure. Thank you guys so much for coming on the podcast.

[TJ Osborne]

I love your podcast. Thanks for having us.

[Bunny XO]

I appreciate you guys. And you guys have to come back and see me.

[John Osborne]

We'll do. Maybe we'll bring Lucy.

[Bunny XO]

Yes, please. I feel so bad about that whole.

[John Osborne]

Situation, even your fault.

[Bunny XO]

I know, but still, I felt terrible that she was like excited to do it. And then Nigerian guys on the other end.

[John Osborne]

You know, this Nigerian prince just conning everybody.

[Bunny XO]

Thank you guys so much. Thank you guys for tuning in to another episode of Dumb Blonde. I will see you guys next week. Bye. No offense, but your brain is a terrible place to keep your big idea. It belongs in the world. But you know that already. You have a calling, a voice that says, this is what I'm meant to do. Create the website your big idea deserves. With wix, make it your own with top to bottom customization, AI to help realize your vision and built in business tools to turn your daydream into your dream job. WIX supports every stage of the business journey except one. Your decision to begin. Ready? Go to wix.com.