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- [00:00]
Ramona Rizzo
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- [00:32]
Bonnie
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- [00:38]
Ramona Rizzo
Like Project Hail Mary by Andy Weir.
- [00:40]
Bonnie
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- [01:11]
Ramona Rizzo
Discover what lies beyond the edge of your seat.
- [01:13]
Bonnie
Start your free 30 day trial at audible.com wondery us that's audible.com wondery us what's up guys?
- [01:21]
Ramona Rizzo
Don't forget to sub to Patreon so that you can see the visuals because not only do we have episodes of the podcast, we have exclusive content that nobody else sees on any other apps. Behind the scenes, we're photo shoots and we're dropping a whole bunch of surprising stuff this year. So if you guys don't want to miss out and you want to be the first to know, go over to our patreon www.dumbblondeunrated.com Love ya. Is this thing on? Bonnie, who used to be a former sex worker and now hosts the podcast Dumb Blonde. Most little girls grow up wanting to be doctors and lawyers and shit. And I was like, I want to be super hot, make a lot of fucking money and be a rock star's wife. That was my goal as a child. And here we are. What's up you sexy motherfuckers? Welcome to another episode of Dumb Blonde. Today I have a true I guess we could call you a mafia princess some degree. Ms. Ramona Rizzo. How you doing baby?
- [02:17]
Bonnie
I'm doing great. Honestly. I'm so happy to be here. I kind of manifest this in my own brain to be here with you because everything that you've done, like I'm gonna give you your flowers. You know, I'm not like, a little groupie, like, a fan groupie, but the things that I've said about Bunny is, like, she says it how it is, what she's been through, but also, you're very, very intelligent, which more people need to know. Like, take away all the esthetic of the makeup, the clothes. Like, you say some deep shit. I'm like, this bitch. Like, you would really think that you had, like, the best education. You're very educated. I give it to you. Girl.
- [02:49]
Ramona Rizzo
Girl, you want to make out? I need you to just come and do my intros all the time. That was amazing. I appreciate you. And, you know, it's. I always tell everybody, street smarts trumps book smarts, and I learned everything that I've learned through life lessons and living on the street, so I appreciate that. So there's so much to dive into with you. I just had, you know, one of the other mob wives who you are very close with, that is your cousin, right?
- [03:17]
Bonnie
Well, we're not blood, but we knew each other before we were actually born. Our parents were pregnant together, so we grew up the minute we came out, like, with each other.
- [03:25]
Ramona Rizzo
Okay. And that's Karen Gravano. So I just had her on the podcast, and I. I told her the same thing. Like, you know, when this whole mob wife aesthetic thing came online, I was like, this is the perfect opportunity to show people that this is not just an aesthetic, that this is a real lifestyle that has hurt people, that has affected people, that has given you amazing memories also. In the same token, and your story is pretty crazy. I felt so bad for you watching some things, and we're going to get into it, but who was your grandfather?
- [03:59]
Bonnie
My grandfather was Lefty Guns Rogerio, and the movie Donnie Brasco was based on him, basically.
- [04:05]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah. So let's go back to that. So where did you grow up?
- [04:08]
Bonnie
I was born in the Lower east side, in Manhattan. And that's where the show, like, act like the show the movie was featured there.
- [04:15]
Ramona Rizzo
Right. And he. So Lefty Guns was part of the Bonanno.
- [04:21]
Bonnie
Look at you. You're Italian.
- [04:22]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah, Listen, I did some research, okay? Properly, I'm telling you. So he was part of the Bonanno crime family, and you were the first granddaughter?
- [04:32]
Bonnie
Yes.
- [04:33]
Ramona Rizzo
Did growing up, what was your relationship with your grandfather like?
- [04:36]
Bonnie
We were so, so close. Like, I was. You know, when you see, like, somebody's. Your grandfather's princess, that's who I was. And we had a very, very close relationship. I had another grandfather who, who was in the lifestyle, but I don't know, maybe a lot of times people say you're always closer to your mom's parents, opposed to your dad's. So I was much closer to him. He was a very warm person. So I don't know what he was doing behind closed doors. And when he left, to me, he was so affectionate. He was warm. He made a big fuss. Total gentleman. And if he was like, you know, I wish he was here today, he. He would fuss over you. Like, he would dote on you. Like, he was very, very big on manners.
- [05:12]
Ramona Rizzo
I love that. Anytime I hear you talk about your grandfather, it's always like, the sweetest memories.
- [05:17]
Bonnie
That's what I knew.
- [05:18]
Ramona Rizzo
Like, what an. What an honor, though, to him to have a granddaughter who just, like, pat him on a pedestal.
- [05:23]
Bonnie
Well, according to the few, you know, if I ever get bored a couple times, and I'll just, like, read some of the comments, like, say, if I do an interview like this, or just in general, like, he was a murderer. How do you sit there and justify your grandfather? I'm like, dude, this who he was. To me, we're not talking about Charles Manson. We're talking about somebody that was in an organization that everybody told me chose to be in.
- [05:43]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [05:43]
Bonnie
It wasn't like how, say, Charles Manson got innocent people or, you know, the serial killers. Like, people want to just sit there and say, murder, murderer. He was alleged. He never got convicted of that. You know, they said, whatever they said, the number, it's quite high. But was it true? Don't know. Not my business to know. Right. And I'll never have proof if it was right.
- [06:04]
Ramona Rizzo
And I think that's actually a profound point is because, you know, it's so easy for people on the outside to be like, oh, he was a murderer. How are you advocating for this man? And really that side you never got to see. Your grandfather loved you and, like, doted on you. And anytime we talk about him, I always hear about, like, the great memories that you guys had growing up. When did you start realizing that there was something different about your family? Because I heard you state in an interview that you. It was a very secretive family till this day.
- [06:36]
Bonnie
My family, they just can't help themselves, are very secretive. That's why with my four children, like, just come ask me everything. Just get it out of, you know, off your chest. What do you want to know? Yeah, it had to be about 9 years old when all this started, and it never, it went into that family to my actual family that I was living with. Because I also had a father.
- [06:54]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [06:55]
Bonnie
He wasn't a straight shooter either, even though he's legit on paper. He had a past that if you Google it comes up. So, you know, if I was born in this time, they would never have a chance to keep up any secrets.
- [07:06]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [07:07]
Bonnie
But then they were very secretive about everything. So it's about nine. And how I always remember that, because that's another thing. How do you remember your childhood trauma?
- [07:14]
Ramona Rizzo
I. I remember it was when I.
- [07:15]
Bonnie
Was five, but I had to do with the holy time of communion. My grandfather's body language changed differently so much that day. It was. It was always about me and fussing and fussing. But he became, like, talking in the corner, like, not himself. Like, I could read his body language. He was like. He knew something was going down to me. You know, he took whatever happened to him like a man. He never ratted, he never cooperated. But he was still nervous because a lot of stuff was happening, and I guess that was in the timeframe, like, words were being shared and, you know, things were different.
- [07:45]
Ramona Rizzo
Let's kind of paint a picture for the. The people at home about, you know, what happened with your grandfather. So there was an undercover agent named Joe Pistone.
- [07:57]
Bonnie
You got it again.
- [07:58]
Ramona Rizzo
Who entered, infiltrated the mob as Donnie Brasco.
- [08:02]
Bonnie
Yes.
- [08:03]
Ramona Rizzo
Can you tell us that story and take us on that journey?
- [08:05]
Bonnie
Well, everybody thinks that my grandfather was the one who introduced him to everyone. He wasn't. My grandfather got introduced to Pistone from another man. That was part of the book. And because the book tells the real side opposed to the movie. Joe Pistone wrote a book. He sold the book to the, you know, to the movie company. I don't know who produced it at the time. And they had the right to change it because once you. They buy the rights to the book, it's lights, camera, action. So from that where they got to change the ending, that my grandfather was murdered. He died of cancer in Sloan Kettering Hospital. So it was totally different.
- [08:40]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [08:40]
Bonnie
So again, a lot of people don't know when you work for the FBI, you're not supposed to profit off your work. So Postone wrote the book, they fired him because he was just, like, rewarded. Like, here's your plaque and a check for $200. But this man was so engulfed in this lifestyle that I think he never would have quit. Like, they pulled him off because supposedly there was going to be a hit on my grandfather.
- [09:04]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [09:04]
Bonnie
So they. They closed down the whole operation, let's let's.
- [09:07]
Ramona Rizzo
Let's rewind it back and start from the beginning. So your grandfather allegedly had a gambling problem, correct?
- [09:13]
Bonnie
Or gambling and women. He would have loved you. Blondie.
- [09:17]
Ramona Rizzo
My kind of guy. I'm from Vegas. So he, you know, had a gambling problem. And he was kind. This is me just, you know, all the research that I didn't. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I want you to tell the story also. So he kind of had a gambling problem. And enter Joe Pistone, AKA Donnie Brasco, presents himself as this jewel thief, this, you know, hustler, whatever, and he starts working with your grandfather to initially start paying back his debts. Right.
- [09:47]
Bonnie
Well, this, again. This is what happened. So he met my grandfather through somebody that was in their. Their crew, already cooperating. So if you're already with somebody's cooperating, what are they going to tell you? So now we need to move on to the next one. So the guy introduced Pistone. Then my grandfather and him became extremely close. And my grandfather, regardless, they were making money. Whatever he did with that money. Yes, it was definitely to pay debt, probably to go pay some more, probably to go buy us gifts. Whatever it was, it was for his lifestyle and to pay off debt, but also to keep gambling and to live.
- [10:19]
Ramona Rizzo
Right. So moving on from that, he also. Hold on, let me get my bifocals on. Let me not even be able. Let me not even pretend to be able to read this without my glasses. He came. He became a made man, though, after working with Pistone and then after, you know, him and Pistone had a pretty. Because I'm just trying to paint this picture at home for people so they can see all that you've been through. And, you know, the story of your grandfather, he. And he became best friends with Joe.
- [10:50]
Bonnie
He was the best man at the wedding because he got remarried. Him, My grandmother were divorced, and he married this girl that I thought for many years was the maid. See, I'm going back to the family secrets. Like, nothing was off limits here. I'm like, who's calling? I'm like, I'm calling the house. And they're like, it's the maid. I'm like, the maid.
- [11:07]
Ramona Rizzo
So in reality, they were. They were shading her, though. Yeah, they were being petty and shady.
- [11:14]
Bonnie
They would never say anything. Like, you know, through whatever took place, so many secrets came out, like, through this movie, through the book, through him going to jail. Like, they waited till after he died. So it was like, damn, like, it all hit you.
- [11:29]
Ramona Rizzo
So before he passed away from Cancer. I. There was a part where it said that you were, you know, nine years old at your first communion. All this stuff was going down, you know, him and Pistone became best friends. And then one of the head bosses was murdered. And it caused, like, a split in the families.
- [11:51]
Bonnie
To. That whatever went on with them, with that, I'm not 100 sure. All I know was that something had taken place and that they said that they were going to put. There was a contract out of my grandfather. Not from. Not about. For like, the mob was going to kill him for something before they even knew. I guess maybe that's when they found out Brasco was an informant.
- [12:10]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [12:10]
Bonnie
Something happened with the book.
- [12:12]
Ramona Rizzo
Yes.
- [12:12]
Bonnie
I mean, with a boat.
- [12:13]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [12:13]
Bonnie
And they said they put two and two together.
- [12:16]
Ramona Rizzo
They have said that there was, like, a yacht party and it made the news. And that's how they start. Your grandfather started questioning Pistone.
- [12:24]
Bonnie
And this will get better, because, see, like, if he was maybe here today. Once I found out about the book and I had a breakdown, and I'm starting. I'm a teenager. I'm like, maybe, like in my. No, a little bit older, maybe, like, 20s. And I'm like, what is this? And then I said to myself, he goes, do you have anything you want to ask me? You could ask me whatever. I took a deep breath and I said, no, you're my grandfather. I don't want to. But before I got the book. The day before I got the book, I was hysterical, crying for two days straight. So the book hit me first before the movie.
- [12:52]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [12:53]
Bonnie
So I had the chance to, like, see how you're asking me all these questions. Some of them I do and don't. Don't know. Because I could have asked him anything. He would have told me whatever. I didn't care.
- [13:01]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [13:01]
Bonnie
It didn't care anymore because it's like, you can't tell me about a person that I know. It's truly not my business what a man does when he leaves the house.
- [13:09]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [13:09]
Bonnie
If we're married, perhaps.
- [13:11]
Ramona Rizzo
Right. But it was your grandfather.
- [13:13]
Bonnie
Yeah. It's like a level of respect, and I didn't need to know it. So as far as that, I think what took place was there. They found out Donnie Roscoe was an agent, then they were going to put a hit out on my grandfather. They took him right off the street, arrested him. That was it. And he had no record. My grandfather never had any priors or anything like that. He went to jail for the RICO Act.
- [13:33]
Ramona Rizzo
And during this entire time, your family is still lying to you and not telling you anything that's going on. How, as a little girl, is that making you feel like, does that give you anxiety? Does that give you depression? Like, I think one of the most awesome things that I gathered from doing the research on you was you said that you used to sit down and write your grandfather letters, but then you would also write back his response to you. And even as a child, that's a form of manifestation.
- [14:02]
Bonnie
Well, yes, but let's talk about the word anxiety. I don't think that word was used back then. This is. This is a word of now. This is a word in the past couple of years. It wasn't big growing up. No, it wasn't big. If a parent had a problem, maybe they should be on bipolar medicine.
- [14:16]
Ramona Rizzo
Right?
- [14:16]
Bonnie
There wasn't a problem. Like, let's be honest, with our kids, everything was very hush. So for me, that had to be an anxiety. I couldn't come and tell my parents. This is what I knew. I was. I had the knot in my feeling, you know, my stomach.
- [14:29]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [14:29]
Bonnie
I had, like. I was sad, I was crying. That's anxiety. I was nervous. But you didn't know what that. Nobody explained it to you. There was no Internet. There was nobody talking about it at school. There was nobody to help you with your problems. So I had to deal by myself. I was writing because I'm watching things on the news. I'm grasping it, but I'm not. It was still a lot, but I knew. I knew how to know his. Hear his name. I knew how to see him on the tv, but nobody would tell me. So I had to figure it out myself to a degree. I had to write letters, and I had actually write it to my grandfather telling him how I felt. That was my therapy.
- [15:06]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [15:06]
Bonnie
And then after that.
- [15:07]
Ramona Rizzo
But at such a young age to.
- [15:09]
Bonnie
Do that had no outlet.
- [15:10]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [15:11]
Bonnie
You know, Karen would tell you, she'd be like, you know, this all makes sense. Because after she watched the special that I did and I discussed that, she goes, this makes sense why you were always all the time in the room by yourself. Like, they would go outside and play a lot, and I would just be like, no, I'm in my room. Because I got so used to it. I became used to being Drew, my own therapist, in a way, and also, like my best friend. Like, you know, when somebody has, like, not even, like, an alter ego, when somebody talks to yourself, but it's really you and you say it out loud. That's what I was doing. I was doing a Duel, like being my own psychiatrist.
- [15:41]
Ramona Rizzo
That is crazy that you did that at such a young age. And then when was the pivotal moment that you actually, your parents were actually honest with you? I think some letters got intercepted.
- [15:54]
Bonnie
My mother and I, we have the same name, same first name. They call her Mona instead of Ramona. But the letters, he would never call him on. He would always write to her. Ramona. She gave me her letter. I said, ho, ho, ho. This is it. This is like the jackpot. I'm gonna finally get, you know, time to express what's going on. I read her letter. I said, this is. I'm gonna read it out loud. So I would never make my mother read, you know, listen to my grandfather's letter. They were sacred, they were private. Nobody could read them, nobody could touch them. He wasn't telling me like the code to the, you know, that' safe at all the millions. It was just between us. So now I'm like, I read the letter out loud and it's to my mother and he's like, Mona, you know, days a little bit not that great. You know, jail is what it is. Something pertaining to that. He said the word jail. All of a sudden, the floodgates. She just started hailing and crying, you know, did we talk about how I set her up? To this day, we never even had that conversation. But even then, as a little kid, I was basically setting up my mother because that was my outlet to get.
- [16:52]
Ramona Rizzo
You know, to get answers.
- [16:54]
Bonnie
But let the cat out of the bag.
- [16:55]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [16:57]
Bonnie
And you know, I could have been again. Why? What happened? Just want to see him. We don't have to talk about all that because I didn't want to hear it because I was so tired at that point, being lied to. And I didn't know if I could trust what was going to come out of your mouth. And really did it even matter? He is where he was. It was a lot for a nine year old. But it was like, just give me to the prize already. I don't care about, you know, I'm packing it. Just give me to the prize. And he was the prize. Going to jail. Go visit.
- [17:23]
Ramona Rizzo
They had taken him after your communion.
- [17:25]
Bonnie
A little bit after.
- [17:26]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah. Is that when we had circled away from that? But so at your communion you could tell that your grandfather's body language was off.
- [17:34]
Bonnie
And shortly after, shortly after, maybe like maybe a month or two, he was gone. And we're in Florida. That's what he's telling me. Parents like, he's in Florida.
- [17:45]
Ramona Rizzo
And so between that time and the time that you got that letter, your parents were lying to you the entire time.
- [17:51]
Bonnie
Not even the parents, the whole family. It wasn't just my mother and father. Everybody was in on it. Aunts, friends, everybody. It was like, you know, shh. Don't tell the kids lies really could destroy a family.
- [18:04]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah. That's gotta be so painful and traumatizing as a child to know that you. They pretty much initially gaslit you your whole childhood. And that's traumatic as fuck.
- [18:16]
Bonnie
More than traumatic, because it's like something that, you know, when I. It really depends. Like, I don't remember what I ate yesterday for dinner. I don't remember a lot of stuff. Especially, you know, this age creeping up in you. I don't remember. Girl, I tell you. And I try to do whatever I could do to, like, I play little crosswords and try to, like, always jog the brain. But I could always go back to the first day I visited him in jail. I remember what I wore. I remember the corduroys. Like, if you had to feel like if you had to put them in front of me, I could remember the type of quarters they were. I can remember the watch. I can remember how my hair was. And I can remember, like, you know, when you go in a hospital room and you just feel, like, that eeriness and the coldness and there's a certain type of sterile smell. Yeah, that's what jail reminds me of all that. And back then, I did have to see him in cuffs because it was different back then.
- [19:03]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [19:04]
Bonnie
And a lot of people don't know is like, he was in mdc, which is the lower part of Manhattan. So now I could officially say where he is. So we went from not seeing, you know, not knowing where he was to to, like, he's at the window. Look, he's at the window. He's waving at you. So now it was like, my family's like, look, he's waving. And I'm like, last week you told me he was enjoying the sun. Now it's like, look, he's waving. So it went. It just. It's a lot. It was a lot to take in, you know, Even though I got to see him, it was still a lot.
- [19:33]
Ramona Rizzo
What was that like, that first meeting, seeing your grandfather? What kind of emotions was that?
- [19:38]
Bonnie
Different because there was many people around where I'm not used to, where he can't get up, he can't pick me up and throw me, you know? But then once I initially got into the visit, it was like nobody else was around anymore. But initially it was like, this is horrible because it's like now we're like supervised on rules, but in the rules that he had to tell me where, you know, this is going to be different. But he was still. He had charisma. He still did it with such grace where, you know, fast forward, not fast forward. You go back in time and everyone say, how do you remember things? I went to go visit my father when I was jail and I was younger and he really didn't have much grace. I spilled the soda, the Coca Cola, and it was like, clean it up. Like, that was traumatic. Where anything that took place with my grandfather there, it was still done in grace. Where again, how did I remember when I went to go visit my father in jail many years when I was young, was like four. How do you remember that? Because something took place there. That soda spilling sent a trigger to my brain. And I'm like, every time sometimes with Coke, that's what I remember. Coca Cola being spilled.
- [20:43]
Ramona Rizzo
That is so wild that your parent, that your family would let you go visit your father in jail.
- [20:49]
Bonnie
I wasn't going to remember. Who thought I would remember? Bunny?
- [20:51]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [20:52]
Bonnie
I was little and then he was. Oh, we were in college. I went to go visit my father in college. So at that age, do you really know that you're in jail? I was little. I had to be maybe like about four or something like that. I don't remember the exact age, but I was tiny. Where enough they could lie to you.
- [21:06]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [21:07]
Bonnie
But I still remember, right? Still, like, you know, you see the pictures, they.
- [21:11]
Ramona Rizzo
They took you to jail, but they said he was in college.
- [21:13]
Bonnie
Yes.
- [21:13]
Ramona Rizzo
Oh, my gosh.
- [21:14]
Bonnie
And that's a big mob thing. That's a big Italian thing. I don't know if it goes into other, you know, nationalities. They'll be like, where's. Where's her father? Oh, he's in college.
- [21:23]
Ramona Rizzo
Wow.
- [21:24]
Bonnie
He's away. He's in school. Nobody.
- [21:26]
Ramona Rizzo
Like, was your dad in the lifestyle also? Gotcha. Yeah, I can tell it's hard for you to talk about it, you know.
- [21:33]
Bonnie
And, you know, I don't really. I don't speak to my dad, but that's a whole. The can of worms. But, yeah, that was like a whole other thing. Whatever. I went to go visit him in jail that time when I was younger. Dude, it's 20, 23. I could search you on the Internet.
- [21:46]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [21:47]
Bonnie
So you don't need to blame me for Mob wives for coming up. Everybody's skeletons are coming up. You don't need A show.
- [21:52]
Ramona Rizzo
Is he still in prison or is he out?
- [21:54]
Bonnie
Oh, no, no. My father's 100% legit. He's.
- [21:58]
Ramona Rizzo
Why don't you guys talk anymore?
- [21:59]
Bonnie
Oh, because I married someone out of my nationality that wasn't FBI, which. And I said, what's FBI? I'm like, we don't like FBI. He goes, no, full blooded Italian. I said, jesus Christ. Can't catch a break around here. So I married somebody that he didn't approve of. And at the end of the day it's like, okay, don't approve of him. I have four kids now, but we just don't speak.
- [22:24]
Ramona Rizzo
But still. But still love your daughter, even if you don't approve of who I marry.
- [22:28]
Bonnie
But after all that came to place, it goes deeper and I'm like, maybe it just wasn't meant for me to have a relationship with him. I see who he is now. Maybe it's better off I'm not with him.
- [22:38]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [22:39]
Bonnie
You know, I just had. I just had a family member pass my aunt who was like my second mom. I had to do four days with this man. And you know, the first funeral parlor, I was like a soldier. Just let it roll right off my. My kids are like, that's him. This is. Everybody's intimidated from. I go, not me. I go, you daughter goes, no. I said, so let's just keep rocking. It is what it is some, because he's like a stone face, my dad. But I think sometimes in life things happen for a reason. And with him, you know, maybe was because of my husband. But maybe if I didn't have my husband, it may have been for another reason. Some people shouldn't be parents. My mom's a great woman and she deals with a lot of stuff and. But for him, I just don't. I think he's just been a guy that should have dogs because he's just very good to animals. Because animals can't talk back to you.
- [23:27]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [23:27]
Bonnie
Animals are going to do what you tell them to do. There's no compromise. There's no. Well, you told me this and I believed you. No, no, I can't do it like that. We never said that. I'm. Kids are very big on that.
- [23:38]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [23:38]
Bonnie
You know, working on something and getting the goal. Here, look, I got all this stuff. You said I can move now. I never said that. You have to stay here until you get married. Oh, hell motherfucking no. I don't care about your Italian traditions. I'm moving out beforehand.
- [23:52]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [23:52]
Bonnie
If I get married or not. Like, I Was very good. But in some degrees I was a rebel, you know what I mean?
- [23:58]
Ramona Rizzo
Did that happen after your grandfather passed away? Let's talk about really quick. So your grand. We left off where your grandfather got. I'm just. We'll tie this all in together. But we left off where your grandpa. You had just found out that he was in prison. You went to go visit him. How long did he stay in prison after that? And did you stay in communication with him?
- [24:17]
Bonnie
Well, it was always with my grandfather. You never knew that he wasn't around because he got to, you know, I guess in jail it's the type of thing where you could use the phone. He was always on the goddamn phone. But that's the point. Like what are we gonna talk about now? Like during holiday, everyone's like past the phone because he was always, you know, speaking to us. So there was nothing new in the past 10 minutes.
- [24:33]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [24:34]
Bonnie
So we always got to talk. But from that time, from that time when I went to go see him again, I was like maybe like 10. The next time I got to go see him was in Nashville.
- [24:45]
Ramona Rizzo
Wow.
- [24:46]
Bonnie
So it was kind of a double banger. I got to see the two men that I loved. Elvis Presley and my grandfather.
- [24:52]
Ramona Rizzo
Wow.
- [24:52]
Bonnie
Cuz Elvis and my grandfather, the only two men I always put in my heart, I've Elvis fan since the day he died. So I'm not going to just say my age, but I was five. Do the math. So I became in love with Elvis. So I was like, this is a cool trip.
- [25:05]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [25:06]
Bonnie
But the only reason why I got to go and the whole family got to go because he was diagnosed with cancer. But between then I never got to go on a visit. And I'll tell you why.
- [25:14]
Ramona Rizzo
Was he incarcerated in Nashville?
- [25:16]
Bonnie
Yeah.
- [25:17]
Ramona Rizzo
Oh, wow.
- [25:18]
Bonnie
So I never got to go, bunny. Because when I came home from that visit, my father didn't approve of it. He went nuts on my mother. My mother didn't tell him I was going. Now mind you, we never discussed when I was little and went to go visit him. So when I went to that visit, so certain things set off in your brain. I was a little chunky monkey. I like to eat. I was a little cookie kid which used to feed me, like, you know, mock my weight, but still give me cookies. He was making cookies and he'd be like, where were you today? The minute I got into, I was like, what? Where are you? I said, I went to go visit papa and jail. And they put the cookies up in the air. So this became even more Traumatic. So it was like I said, when certain people should maybe have kids.
- [26:01]
Ramona Rizzo
Did he not have a good relationship with your grandfather?
- [26:04]
Bonnie
No, he kissed his ass. They were fine. They were cool. But why should I? Again, this is still a man that I love. He's still part of the scenario of the family. Someone that you just took away without any reasoning of why. And this is what took place. My mother didn't tell him, I guess because maybe she knew he was gonna say no. Work that amount yourselves. Not my problem. It shouldn't have been my problem, but it became my problem. And it was horrible. So I remember that. So up until that time, the next time I saw him again, send major presents. Always calling us, getting, you know, people doing sketches of you from. From jail. Like, you know, we always had stuff from him, but I never got to see him until I was in high school. And when I knew. When they said he was gonna pass.
- [26:49]
Ramona Rizzo
So they released him from jail. And did they release him because he was so sick? I'm sorry. I have like a little frog in my throat.
- [26:56]
Bonnie
It's the. I like drinking the glass bottles. That's the way.
- [26:59]
Ramona Rizzo
Yes, Always.
- [27:00]
Bonnie
It's hard to know.
- [27:01]
Ramona Rizzo
Do you guys. Do you want something to drink? We have one of these for you if you want.
- [27:04]
Bonnie
I'll take one later because I don't want her bother with my lips. But I didn't get to see him till then. And my father really put. Made me feel worse than what it was. So I was dealing with leaving my grandfather behind in a very cold hospital. Like the closest thing I could, you know, at that time. It's like. It wasn't like the visits you go today. Like you go. And like, sometimes you could be, you know, against somebody. Sometimes you could have the glass. It was just. To me, it just reminds me a very sterile visit. Like. Like that hospital, cold feel. It was because maybe it was my first time I, you know, popped my cherry going to visit people in jail. Like, you know, that was it. So I didn't get to see him till I was in a teen. So he did the 13 years in jail, came home.
- [27:51]
Ramona Rizzo
Did they let him go because he was sick or the freak?
- [27:53]
Bonnie
No, he still. He did his whole time. He did his whole bid. Okay. But it was so funny because I think he did like the two years before everything before he got sentenced. And I think he did 13 years since the whole time, but. 13, right?
- [28:06]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [28:07]
Bonnie
He dies, gets out. He dies 13 months later. Should have played lotto. 13 and 13. Like crazy shit. And then he died. I was like, look at him. Died on my favorite holidays. Like, there was no way I was ever gonna forget him. But he made sure it was on Thanksgiving. Yeah. So it's like kind of like maybe was like, you know, to remember I will never, ever forget him. But that was like. Like stamping it more. I was like, wow, this is even crazier. But, yeah.
- [28:35]
Ramona Rizzo
So take me on that journey of your grandfather, the pretty much the light of your life, the one man that you really look up to because you don't have a great relations with your father. So he essentially was that father figure in your life. Losing him, dealing with the anxiety of pretty much bearing the weight of your parents issues on your shoulders. How old were you when your grandfather passed away?
- [28:59]
Bonnie
I was about 22.
- [29:01]
Ramona Rizzo
About 22. Take me on this journey. Like, what does Ramona do without her grandfather in her life?
- [29:08]
Bonnie
Well, you have to remember too, all that time while he was in jail, I had another grandfather. And again, when I did Mob Wives, I was. I always said that I'm never gonna. Never gonna say something that people didn't know.
- [29:19]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [29:20]
Bonnie
So people would have done their home. Like a lot of people do their research. So one of the things was when I originally said I was gonna go do Mob Wives and I had to go meet an uncle about it because he had to give me something, my grandmother, who was my father's mother, passed, and he's like, I hope you're not gonna say anything about my father. So who do I go to? I go to the Mafia, you know, the 41 1, the. The information book. I said, karen, who the fuck was my grandfather? Well, your grandfather, meaning my father's dad, was the one who got my father into the mob or he was in his crew. I'm like, really? So now we start going through names. And I was like, what about this guy?
- [29:55]
Ramona Rizzo
I love how disconnected from it you are, though. Like, Karen is so immersed in it.
- [29:59]
Bonnie
And we grew up totally different.
- [30:00]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [30:01]
Bonnie
Her father told her everything.
- [30:02]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah, everything.
- [30:04]
Bonnie
This girl knew everything. So. So. And I was like, well, what about. What's his name? When he would come to my grandfather's house, she goes, he was a sharpshooter. This guy was. I was like, holy shit. So all these people that I thought were like, regular people that never would think anything that they are about, they were really about it. But you would never think that.
- [30:26]
Ramona Rizzo
Wow.
- [30:27]
Bonnie
So again, Karen was the one who told me if I had any questions. So here I am on a show, but I said to myself, I'm only going to talk about. I don't speak to my dad, so I'm not going to shine light on that.
- [30:39]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [30:40]
Bonnie
I can't help what's going to come out, if there's anything going to come out, because he did it to himself. He was a grown man. He put himself in that lifestyle.
- [30:46]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [30:47]
Bonnie
So my whole situation before my grandfather actually died, I still had another grandfather that was alive, but I wasn't close with, but my family was still. Anything that came into our home, if it was about anyone, it was a secret.
- [31:00]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [31:00]
Bonnie
Like, even one time, it was so crazy. The height of Karen's father situation and before he got arrested. And they were every. It's like, listen, dude, at the end of the day, you guys are going to the same spot every week. But John Gotti didn't care. They were filming it. So one time, I'm watching the news inside and I see my father, because it's like. It's like they had a appointment every week. So there's my father in the news. I go in the bedroom to rip into my mother. She was just up two minutes ago. She's under the covers like this. I'm like, making. Like she's snoring like she's going to town store. I go, get up, please. The gig is up. Just stop. You know, I mean, so everything bunny. So it didn't end there. And even if it was a question, it was kind of like when people watch the Sopranos and she goes, what's the mafia? Are we in the Mafia? I couldn't accept at home because I was gonna get lied to.
- [31:50]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [31:50]
Bonnie
You know, because people still have legit jobs and, you know, they're still, you know, part of something that you can't get out of. You know, I don't know how you. How maybe you die. Maybe you rat, you know, guess like, however you join a gang, that's their whole, you know, oath. But I could never ask that. So the lies continued. They were just covered up in different ways.
- [32:10]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [32:11]
Bonnie
So like, with Karen's father's situation, you know, then it became like.
- [32:15]
Ramona Rizzo
Well, I said, karen's father is Sammy the Bull.
- [32:17]
Bonnie
Yeah. So with him, it was like, I'm not going to turn my back on her, you know, whatever men do, you know? But a lot of people did. A lot of people.
- [32:27]
Ramona Rizzo
Which is terrible because a child should never have to pay for the sins of the father. I've never believed that, you know, and.
- [32:33]
Bonnie
She paid her own sins. And she'll talk about. It's no secret she rebelled like a Motherfucker. She rebelled hardcore. And it was something rightfully so, though.
- [32:41]
Ramona Rizzo
You guys all, you know, were kind of born into a lifestyle that you didn't choose. And it's like when you finally get that first taste of freedom and you're able to just say you to everybody. I mean, that's. I would. I would have done.
- [32:55]
Bonnie
I don't know if she told you, like, when we went out and we didn't know, like, every place you went, everybody winds it up knowing somebody in our family. So we would make up names.
- [33:03]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah, she told me hers was Gina.
- [33:05]
Bonnie
Yeah, I would make up a name because I didn't want to be caught up in that. And I didn't want to be in trouble because, again, she had a different lifestyle. She was allowed to go out. We had a stage. Sneak out of my house. But even when we would sneak out of her house, we had. They. They admitted to her later on that the FBI agents were watching us come off. To come off the roof. We could have been dead. You're watching kids chimney off the roof. They didn't give two shits. They didn't. They didn't report it. They didn't call the police. Said there was. Let them fall. Who gives a. I mean, I'm talking about a steep roof here. They didn't care. So we grew up differently. My family was more of a secret. So it always. I. You know, the closest thing, like this whole mob wife aesthetic, the closest thing I've ever lived to the Sopranos, because, again, it roots from the sopranos. It's the 25th anniversary. That's how, like, all these women came up. And, you know, Soprano, Carmela, she is the number one TV mob wife, you know, because everybody on our show was not a mob wife. It was just with the focus group, right? It was, you know, going on the tales of all the housewives shows that were, you know, very prominent.
- [34:07]
Ramona Rizzo
Who was an actual mob wife on the show? Anybody was. Renee.
- [34:11]
Bonnie
Well, Hector really wasn't a made guy because he was Puerto Rican.
- [34:16]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [34:18]
Bonnie
You know, that was very bad situation. That was all real tv. You know what I mean? Yeah.
- [34:23]
Ramona Rizzo
That's a whole.
- [34:24]
Bonnie
That, you know, something like that. So what.
- [34:26]
Ramona Rizzo
You know, there wasn't really a mob wife on.
- [34:29]
Bonnie
It was just. It was just a word. I was the closest one becoming one because I was engaged to somebody at the time, but he got arrested while I was on the show.
- [34:37]
Ramona Rizzo
While you were on the show. I remember that. So let's. Let's circle back. So you move on. You know, you're dealing with all this stuff personally. When does mob wives come knocking on your door? How old were you?
- [34:48]
Bonnie
Well, mob wise didn't come knocking on my door. Mob wives. I was out of the country. I had.
- [34:53]
Ramona Rizzo
Oh, is this when. Okay, so you've met your husband. Yes, but. Okay, so let's talk about the husband, the ex husband.
- [34:58]
Bonnie
The deceased husband just recently just passed. So that was a whole other thing I had to deal with. Wow. Yeah.
- [35:04]
Ramona Rizzo
Can we talk about that?
- [35:05]
Bonnie
Yeah, no, it's fine. So I met my ex husband through one of these people's jobs that my parents placed me in. So you didn't want me around this, but meanwhile I'm working for people of such demeanor. So it was a mob affiliated job.
- [35:20]
Ramona Rizzo
Gotcha. So I wasn't Italian.
- [35:22]
Bonnie
Correct, he wasn't Italian, but his partners were. His partners was a big guy. So here I am, I get this job guy totally wasn't my type of had kids prior. I had the perfect boyfriend before I had the one that looked like he was going to law school. He looked like the Ken. We were like I always remember like that Brendan and Dylan from 921. That was us. We did the Europe trip. We did the whole nine. But it was a psycho.
- [35:45]
Ramona Rizzo
Right? It's always the cute ones.
- [35:47]
Bonnie
Really. Like, like honestly like the preppy murderer. Like he could have those tendencies.
- [35:52]
Ramona Rizzo
American Psycho.
- [35:53]
Bonnie
Yes. That I got rid of. But now my. My husband was who was actually my boss at the time. It's like the regular story. Like the boss and the secretary fall in love with each other. They put me in charge of this office to basically like kind of watch him in a degree. And plus a lot of people couldn't understand his dialect because even though he was Arab, he was spent like 20 years in Italy. He was an exchange student, so his accent was very different. But we ran one of the largest telecommunications company and that became a freaking show with the mob and this and that and all the stuff that was being exploited at the time. But he could sell ice to the Eskimos. Max husband. So basically it wasn't based on his looks because I had the best looking. It was how he treated me. But this is where it comes into play. It was the height of when this movie was coming into. So I was still didn't have a good relationship with my dad, was never close with him. This man working with him one on one, you know, everything I said like hey, you should do this for your diet. Like it was a mutual respect and it gave me a. I worked for my position. I Wasn't sleeping with him, anything like that. We didn't hook up. It's much later on. He did it in a way where he just disappeared. He started working from home. He did like reverse psychology where I grew to miss him. And then one day I was in the midst of buying. I had made a lot of money. I was buying my first apartment in Battery park and I needed him for help because I told my parents originally, I'm going to save this money. I want to move out. When I came with the down payment, I never said that. So here I am, a deer in the headlights, nobody helping me. So he helped me. I didn't know anything about mortgages. I didn't know anything about co ops. Nothing about that.
- [37:32]
Ramona Rizzo
Your family wouldn't help you?
- [37:34]
Bonnie
No, because he didn't want me to move out because he never thought I would save the money. Because I said, look, if I'm not married, this is your dad, right? I'm bouncing.
- [37:40]
Ramona Rizzo
This is your dad.
- [37:41]
Bonnie
Yeah. And he's like, your mother doesn't want you to move either. And he tried to do some like reverse psychology. Like, well, I'll move if I'm the problem. I go, you're not the problem. I'm not living by the fact that I. Because we're Italian. And then you could only leave if you're getting married. I'm. I'm not into that. Like, I was kind, I wasn't a wild child. But there's certain things that I believe.
- [38:01]
Ramona Rizzo
That if I was a traditional, like old school way of thinking when my.
- [38:05]
Bonnie
Father was different, because it's like when my uncle had passed in the movie, remember the guy that they made out to be the drug addict?
- [38:12]
Ramona Rizzo
The movie that we keep referring to is Donnie Brasco. In case you guys, they made like.
- [38:16]
Bonnie
My uncle, you know, he had a problem who really didn't have, you know, have it coming up. A lot of people were on coke. It was the thing to do back then, you know, was the drug of.
- [38:26]
Ramona Rizzo
The 80s and 90s.
- [38:28]
Bonnie
So long story short, my uncle was murdered from affiliation of the life. He was with one of his friends. They told him, don't stay with him. They killed him. But getting back to my father and his strictness, we never really had, you know, at that age, I was still young. I was like maybe about 12. My grandfather was still alive. You know, he's in jail, so he couldn't handle it. He couldn't do all the preparation. My father's like, you can't watch tv. I'm like, what? Old school Italians, they believe when somebody dies, you can't even watch tv. Can a music. I'm like, jesus Christ. Like, it became really weird.
- [39:04]
Ramona Rizzo
Why is that? Is that like a respect factor?
- [39:06]
Bonnie
I guess maybe. My father's. My father. My father is not. He's born here, but he lived with his grandparents. They lived in the house growing up. So he speaks Italian. Had a lot of their traits. He's Sicilian. Like, it's the hardest Italian. It's like rocks. They got brains like rocks. It's really bad. So then after that, I got shipped to his mother's house, and while my mother was mourning and we could have watched tv. But in my home where I lived with my mom, we couldn't watch tv.
- [39:33]
Ramona Rizzo
Wow.
- [39:34]
Bonnie
So everything was different with my dad. He was very, very hard. So, you know, I was not close with him. And then again, his father was part of the lifestyle. He was. It was never discussed. So it was all these different things that took place. So now, again, coming back to how I met my husband. It was the height of this movie being shot. Before I worked for my husband, I worked for one of the top law firms. My family got a copy of the script. I'm like, I'm not dealing with this. They put my. I should have let them lead my grandmother into it. I had my ex the place I work for the law firm. I made them write them a letter. They took my grandmother out of it because they made her like she was the annoying ex wife. They didn't talk. Listen. They still had kids together, you know, he was married to a new person. But they had little, you know, little talk here and there. But it wasn't like, I'm gonna kill him. All this bullshit, Right? She caught him many times cheating. It was the end of it. Yeah, he remarried.
- [40:29]
Ramona Rizzo
I love how Hollywood tries to paint jaded women as, like, the villain or the bad people. When really everybody knows if you get fucking cheated on, you're gonna dislike the human who has fucking hurt you that bad.
- [40:41]
Bonnie
Gave him so many different. Different chances. My grandmother. And that was another thing too. As I grew older and they started telling me the story, you know, now you'd be like, if your friend has their husband cheats on them, you'd be like, that mother effort. I still couldn't bring myself to see it because I was like, you know what? It's between them. I knew how to separate it. So I got a copy of the script. While I'm working for at my husband's from the communications company, I made my old bosses take them Out. Take the. My grandmother out. Like, they like, listen, if you don't remove this lady, we're going to sue you. She's still alive. They remove her. So now I'm like, this is still not sitting right with me. I got to do something. I got to speak up for my grandfather because they waited for him to die. And at the time, it was very rare where you got paid for interviews. Barbara Walters, before my grandfather passed, offered him $2 million. Trust me, we could have used the money because everybody thought that our family made money off of this. And my grandfather had no money like that. He could have left. He's like, no, I'm not talking. He went out like a man's man. So they waited for him to die to put this movie out. So once I got this copy, I'm like, this is some. This is not real. I knew that they were filming it in my old neighborhood, which I grew up in. So even though I hadn't been there since I was young, my cousin's mother still lived there. So I still knew in and out of the place. I went there, I sculpted. I brought my sister, who. My sister was funny. She was like, when Karen, everybody went out. She was the brawler. Like, they were fighting people, beating them up. I bring her there to meet.
- [42:05]
Ramona Rizzo
You're a brawler, too. I've seen it on.
- [42:07]
Bonnie
She's a mob wise. Hysterical crying. She breaks down because now I get to go meet Pacino. I, like, basically stalk him. I'm like, on stalker mode. I'm like. They're like, he'll be here soon. I know where his trailer is. I'm asking everybody in the neighborhood. So I'm having breakfast in the local diner, the whole area. So then finally, I wait for him to come outside, like, to go into his trailer. I'm like, Mr. Pacino. He, like, looks at me. Who's this girl who get, like, another fan? I was like, I want to talk to you about my grandfather. Lefty guns Egirio. His mouth dropped. The guy goes, one minute. He comes, he goes, he's gonna take you inside. So my sister goes inside again, tough as nail. She starts hysterical crying and go, what the frig you crying about? Shut up. Get it together. I want to talk to this man. I brought all my proof. I brought my letters. I brought, you know, our pictures. Because a lot of people, Bunny even, like, now I get weird dms. I'm your grandfather's other daughter, dude, you'd be really old. And I don't think that's true. Like, Karen has, like, you know, someone saying that they're Karina's father. People, which, you know, are freaky.
- [43:05]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [43:05]
Bonnie
So I came prepared with the truth, just in case, because I could have been a stalker. Liar.
- [43:09]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah, for sure. I love that he was willing to take that meeting with you. Like that.
- [43:12]
Bonnie
Amazing man. So graceful. Because what I found out about Pacino is when he goes into character, he supposedly doesn't. So while he's on set, I was.
- [43:21]
Ramona Rizzo
Always, like, a method actor.
- [43:22]
Bonnie
He still continues it going so honestly to meeting me probably would have been, like, a plus for him. So. And he. He was so graceful, so nice. He did. He said something to me that made this whole horrible situation so much easier. He said, ramona, I'm gonna take not only your grandfather, what I know about him from the book, but everybody else around him, and I'm gonna make my own character based on that. Yes, it's based on your grandfather. Because I said my grandfather. My grandmother's. His wife's mother came from Ellis Island. She was from Spain. So from that moment she set foot in America, her. That. My great grandmother. My mother. My grandmother always worked in fashion. My mother went to fit. I was like, you have him looking like a schlep. Like, that movie made him look like he. You know, he was a hobo. Where my grandfather was at the T. See the hat. Never even owned a hat like that. So they, you know, jijed it up to make it more like maybe Hollywood make. Make it look a certain way. My point of this meeting with Pacino was to make sure that he knew that he just had it when it came to the family, if there was going to be a part about that. Play that with love. Cuz regardless, whatever went on with this family, this Costa Nostra family, he did love us. And I wanted them if they were. Because, again, scripts change. It could go into certain things. I just want to make sure that I said my piece and paid my respect. Like, it was like my last homage to him. Like, I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna make sure that my. Because I got a mouth when I want to use it is gonna get known, because this is crazy.
- [44:52]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [44:53]
Bonnie
And he said to me, everybody around him, this was what's gonna be. Hollywood has to do things differently. And he explained to me, once they bought the book, the movie company bought the book, they're allowed to change it. So that's how they got to change it. Made that so much smoother for me. And I basically, at the end of it, it's like, When I met another celebrity, I had to let them go, because after I was. I. I came, I got what I needed, and I was like, thank you. Like, there was no reason for me to keep it going. Like, I. You know, he was.
- [45:24]
Ramona Rizzo
Closure.
- [45:24]
Bonnie
Yes. To give me his time.
- [45:26]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [45:26]
Bonnie
I felt like he probably would have talked to me. He was so nice and he was so gracious. He probably would have given me another hour. But I didn't need it. I got everything that I wanted right then and there. I said my piece. I said, when it comes to the family, that's all it really was about. Anything else I couldn't control after that. What a fucking clusterfuck. Oh, your family must have made so much money. First of all, dude, nobody needed the money.
- [45:48]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [45:48]
Bonnie
And we didn't make any money. That was Donnie Brasco's thing. That was with the. You know, if you were educated, you knew it came from the book. We had nothing to do with it. But that's all I got. So meeting my husband, it's crazy that.
- [46:00]
Ramona Rizzo
Joe was able to make. Joe Pistone was able to make money off of it, but not your grandfather.
- [46:06]
Bonnie
My grandfather didn't want to because it was against his oath he would never make. My grandfather was very old school.
- [46:11]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [46:11]
Bonnie
So, like I said, he wasn't like my father. Like, hey, you couldn't watch TV if somebody died. He wasn't like that. But old school and his values with this. With this whole mob thing and how I did learn that, because I did get to listen to some of the tapes, you know, that they have on YouTube and that. Is that normal Bunny? No, it's like, in a. In a way, it. Like, it gives me peace that I could get to hear my grandfather's voice. But it's weird that what I'm listening to.
- [46:37]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [46:38]
Bonnie
You know what I mean? But then I'm like, hey, now I know why I get some anger issues or how I know maybe I get some backbone. And the best. It'll be like, you know, I'll be such a curse. So my mother be like, don't curse. I'm like, listen, it's in the family jeans. Or I've been. Maybe I should have just been a dude. Like, I don't know. You know, it's crazy. But again, that's how my whole. My husband kind of like. I don't want to say weasel, but nestled his way because I was very vulnerable at that time, and he presented all the key factors that I needed. I needed someone to basically be there for me. And when all when the actual movie came out, you know where I was? I was in Jordan. I left the country.
- [47:19]
Ramona Rizzo
So you met your husband Last we left off, your husband was helping you get this apartment. Did he help you get that apartment?
- [47:25]
Bonnie
I did get the apartment and I acquired it before I started dating him. I still had the crazy ex boyfriend at the time who I was like distancing and distancing. And then he's coming to my door with three carrot rings, fighting with security to try to get up, you know, come see me. And I was just totally done with him. But now he knew where I lived because I moved out of my parents home. So with all this happening, you know, my ex husband, who was very cunning, knew how to set it up. But we weren't together then. He was just helping. But I never. And I said to my girlfriend, said to me, one of my best, oh, I think he likes you. I go, shut the fuck up. Like, no, he doesn't. She saw it. I couldn't because I just thought it was like a boss, like a relationship, like someone that was, you know, being there for me. And I think it was the best thing that I did leave and go out of the country because I don't know if I could have handled, especially if it was this day.
- [48:18]
Ramona Rizzo
And how did he talk you into leaving the country? Because that's huge. To be able to be like, hey, I'm gonna take this Italian princess and move her to Jordan.
- [48:26]
Bonnie
At that time we were together.
- [48:28]
Ramona Rizzo
Okay.
- [48:29]
Bonnie
And I had left to go get married and I left the country and I got married there.
- [48:33]
Ramona Rizzo
Without your father. And you aren't talking at this point, right? Because he knew you guys were dating.
- [48:38]
Bonnie
But. But I got married there. Stood there for like a month or two. Came home, I got married. A Muslim marriage. So it wasn't, it wasn't official. I didn't record it. So when I came home, certain things we separated and I said, you know what, I don't know, like, let me just see, you know, like a lot of the dust settled and my head was still a little bit. My mom wasn't talked. My mom was destroyed. I was gone. It was like all these things. And who was upset? It was a lot. I was still, it was still a lot. I was still like maybe like 24, 25. Still young. Yeah. And yeah, that's a baby. Still tried to, like, we still try to set. Keep away from each other. We hooked back up and that was the end of it. So we had four kids.
- [49:21]
Ramona Rizzo
Well, but take me on this journey. It Wasn't such an easy journey for you. Like, you ended up having to fight for your kids. Can you tell me all about.
- [49:28]
Bonnie
Well, you could read in between the lines. We had a very good marriage. Everything was fine. My story, I will fully tell. It's not like, oh, my God, like, I'm trying to, like, hold it. I can't tell it. Because if I was to tell it right now, a lot of that world still exists. And why my marriage crumbled and why I winded up truly in the Middle East, I can't really fully say to, you know, the fullest degree, because I have a son and I have kids. I don't want to talk about it now. Because everybody ain't gonna live forever. So once certain people are where they belong, possibly in hell, then I'll put my book out.
- [50:06]
Ramona Rizzo
Gotcha.
- [50:07]
Bonnie
And. But what I could say is that I winded up going to Jordan. I had. I had to become a mother before a wife. Like, I had to put the kids first. Even though we created these kids together. And while we were marrying America, he was a wonderful father and things were really good. When I went over there, I knew in my head that I was only bringing them to see the kids, see your dad. See where? Because I didn't want to be what happened to me. And my grandfather just disappeared. Like, hey, now your father. Because up until a certain. Up until I. My husband told me that I'm going to Mexico, like, things were getting weird in the house, weird in a sense, where he. He was acting different. So I already knew the 411. I knew what was coming. Now, remember, if you sit back and I told you how I got the job, I got the job through people, right? So now certain things were just crumbling down.
- [51:01]
Ramona Rizzo
And you already have that, like, abandonment issue. I don't know if it's okay to call it an abandonment issue, but even though your grandfather mean to abandon you, that wound is still there.
- [51:11]
Bonnie
Now I'm dealing with this again, right. But now I'm responsible for lives, for kids.
- [51:16]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [51:17]
Bonnie
So I'm like. But I still don't want these kids not to be around their dad. So I'm thinking that he went to. Told me he was going to, I think, Mexico or something. So I call, like, the first two days, everything we're calling. And again, the marriage was becoming very strained because of certain components of people coming around.
- [51:36]
Ramona Rizzo
And.
- [51:36]
Bonnie
And, you know, and he was the type of guy, like, he didn't have a vicious bone in him. And I would have handled a different way, but he Wasn't built like that. And he had. He had the right connects from the Middle east to handle it. That's all I'm going to say, right? And he wasn't about that and calling every day, calling every day. Then eventually we're good. We're speaking the fourth day now. The phone crosses over. Fucking crosses over. It's in Arabic. I'm like, holy shit, he's in the fucking Middle East. I'm like, damn, this is really some shit now. I'm like, oh, my God. So I had to like, how many.
- [52:11]
Ramona Rizzo
Kids did you have at this?
- [52:12]
Bonnie
Four.
- [52:12]
Ramona Rizzo
Oh, so you. You had.
- [52:13]
Bonnie
You bought the one.
- [52:15]
Ramona Rizzo
Oh, my God.
- [52:16]
Bonnie
My age is kids with kids. Right now I have a 25, a 24, 23, and a 19.
- [52:21]
Ramona Rizzo
Oh, my goodness. Yeah, I was busy girl.
- [52:24]
Bonnie
You guys was tv.
- [52:25]
Ramona Rizzo
You guys were making babies.
- [52:26]
Bonnie
There was tv. But I wanted to create my own family. I'm not like one of those women were like, oh, my God, we're going to have two kids. Because I had a great marriage, I had a great home. Everything was fine. Whatever God was going to bless us with, was going to bless us with. I'm not going to lie after the fourth one, because I had a miscarriage after that. After that, I was like, buddy, we need to do some type of protection. Because I didn't want to handle that miscarriage. But I think, again, everything in life happens for a reason. Because I had one miscarriage after my son was born. But the last one was like, I don't think God would have been like, you could do this with five kids. He, listen, it's already predicted what's going to happen to you. So imagine even doing this with another kid. It was hard enough traveling over there. So I said, you know what? I'm not going to let the abandonment my kids have, the separation. I'm going to take them over there. I'm still going to get a divorce because I have to end this, because I have to become a mother first, right? And that was really hard. And nobody understood it. And I wanted them to see where the father was from. I went there before. Love the country, love the people, love the culture. Jordan is very. At the time, they had the princess, she was American. So a lot of things were changed and it was different. And I got stuck there for almost four years, three and a half years.
- [53:45]
Ramona Rizzo
And I had. I think I had read somewhere that you got stuck there because your husband was holding on to one of the last baby's passport, you know, the tattoo.
- [53:54]
Bonnie
A lot of people have or the saying, there's a thin line between love and hate. Oh, sister, that one came full effect. Do I blame him? Sometimes. But then do I understand that he was also trying to save his family? So certain things took place that, you know, did I add a little spark to the fire? Hell, yeah. Because I just. I couldn't take him. I was so angry. There were certain things. My kids, till this day, they were babies. That's why I said, when people are like, oh, you don't remember? My daughter was telling me other day, she broke down, and she's like, you don't remember that? I remember when we went to that place and your nose was bleeding. And I'm like, I don't remember my nose being bleeding. But she remembers when her and her dad and myself had a pretty big altercation that we went to, like, kind of like a shelter. Like, they compare their flight, battered women. And they gave him three choices. Either leave her alone. You could sign this piece of paper, or you, if you bother. Again, like, three things. What he did, he went to another. It went to another country. That was the last time that out of my four kids, all three of them ever seen him. Because I went to where he was in another country. I tracked him down there to try to go get a divorce.
- [55:06]
Ramona Rizzo
But what was it? An abusive marriage.
- [55:09]
Bonnie
Only again, it was a thin line between love and hate. There were certain things there. He couldn't. He couldn't take that. I. Nobody ever thought that women with four kids were going to get up and get the. Out of there in general or just leave.
- [55:20]
Ramona Rizzo
You strike me as that person.
- [55:22]
Bonnie
And I think back, and I'm like. Because a lot of people, you hear, even in America, they stay because it's economically right. They stay because they don't want to have that responsibility by themselves. I was like this. I got to just do it because I had to be a parent first. Did I love the life that he provided? Hell, yeah. Did we. Did he, like, become, like, the person that was like, oh, if you. You know, you could have this. It was like, you know, Rabbit, you know, putting the little carrot in front of the bunny's face, like that type of scenario? And I'm like, I had to pull back from that because I had to be responsible for these kids. Did they fully understand it? Do they may have some resentment, I don't know. But so many things became so displaced. And I also said, I don't want to raise my kids, like, to be army brats, in a sense. And the best way that he could Ever punish me was I got to go back to my family. That was the biggest punishment. Because there were certain things that I didn't want my kids to be around. Like if I was married to him, you know, he wasn't around. The people that got him involved in that business, they were no longer around. So I knew the minute that I was very grateful for my family taking me in because I had nothing coming back home.
- [56:31]
Ramona Rizzo
So you ended up going back home.
- [56:33]
Bonnie
With the four days, the biggest punishment. But before that, he tried everything to keep me there. I would have made it where. If we could make it where I could have stood still, still stood in the Middle east because my kids had the best education. They had an amazing education. If you lived there middle class, you were very rich. The homes were beautiful, the food was to die for. If he would have made it where I could come home, I probably would have been down for it. But he's like, no. I'm like, no, everybody come visit you here. I'm like, but when you see this on the news, they're like, they think the bombs are going off. Jordan's nothing like that. They think that because, you know, it was a time after 9, 11, right? So everybody thinks it's this whole big thing and it's not like that. But to convince people you love, you know, at the ends, I had to send three children without my fourth because she didn't have a passport. Nobody would come get them. And my family loved my kids, but they were scared. So I had to get like an airline stewardess to pay for them to watch my kids on the plane. Everybody thought like, no, the minute they got off the plane, they were going to be beheaded. Like, that was going to be the end of them. So also then I had a lot of issues over there. Like, he was strong arming me where like, well, this could happen to you. Or one time we had, you know, when I was there, I said, I'm gonna be with you. Like, I tried it, but then, like, you know, Bunny, I was like, I can't felt. I felt like I was in that harm's way. Like with my grandfather, I felt like the bottom was gonna. I couldn't trust anymore.
- [57:55]
Ramona Rizzo
You didn't feel safe.
- [57:56]
Bonnie
Because what I told him was, you know, through the marriage, if I find out one thing, you're back even talking to these people, I get it now because I'm much mature and I'm older. But then he couldn't tell me because he failed me as a husband. But then I also knew that he had no choice but to talk to these people because I said to them, I said, if you bother with these people against the end of our marriage, swear on the kids. He told me, I won't do it. He had no choice to. Did I make a lot of rash decisions? Probably was a very hot headed. But that was my way of protecting my children.
- [58:25]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah. And I didn't want them to go through what you had to go through. And in a degree you're trying to break generational trauma.
- [58:31]
Bonnie
And in a way, maybe they went through something worse because they don't have a dad. You know what I mean? So I don't know. There was no. I don't think there's any even side of this coin. They do know that I did everything to keep us together. Like, listen, he offered me a million dollars of money for the kids. Kids. Like, you know, he had tons of money. But I was like, did he just.
- [58:52]
Ramona Rizzo
Step away from the kids after you?
- [58:53]
Bonnie
No, he wanted. But he was here. I mean, I was here. He was there. Because that was a whole other issue. It wasn't like now anybody could come back over the border. There was a lot of. Yeah, because he came from a country that he lived in Jordan, but he was originally from another country that it's not recognized.
- [59:07]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [59:08]
Bonnie
So his passport. So to come back into America, he had to go through all the process and getting all the paperwork because he was never fully a citizen. I was in the process of making him one.
- [59:17]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [59:17]
Bonnie
Paid millions of dollars in taxes, was never a citizen. It was like some up.
- [59:21]
Ramona Rizzo
No, that sounds like the government.
- [59:23]
Bonnie
You know, it is what it is. It wasn't like now like you could, you know, walk over and nobody's gonna bother you. It was different then. Like, you know, one time with the, the immigration, they came to my house. He's like, I was doing my hair. I was like, you have to come home now. Immigration. I go, if these can't see all the toys at my house look like Toys R Us, that this is a real marriage.
- [59:43]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [59:43]
Bonnie
Then they really need to go get a better job. And I took my time and I went there for the interview. And he was on. He was on the cusp of getting his. His nationality, but all the. The bottom fell out. So here I am trying to make everything nice, go to the country. And he just didn't want to let me leave. And then I found out throughout that I had legal issues back home because of him. Because when he left, he left so many business things. Wow. Up in the air. He had no Choice. Who's left holding the bag? The trophy wife. So who if they can't get him? When they're coming for me.
- [60:16]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah, absolutely.
- [60:17]
Bonnie
So it was. It was basically. It's. It's a Lifetime movie. It's like the mob meets. Not without my daughter. Meet some corporate, like, white collar shit. And at the end of it, everybody.
- [60:29]
Ramona Rizzo
And you tried your hardest to get away from it.
- [60:31]
Bonnie
And, you know, and then, like. And when I did the show, I wanted it to kind of be a meaning for women to be like, listen, I get it. You know, so many people go through divorce. Mob Wives. And they did Mob Wives.
- [60:42]
Ramona Rizzo
And they. They came knocking on your door when you were in Jordan.
- [60:45]
Bonnie
No. Okay, so again, one. Karen was on the show. She was going. They were talking about doing the show again. It was never called Mob Wives. It was about all these girls. So I knew what they were getting into. So when I came back, it was their first season. So here I am now. I'm just thrown back to some old friends. Karen had just moved back to Arizona, which was nice. So she was kind of like. Like, when I got there, she was like, in a sense, a newbie of being back. Officially moved back.
- [61:10]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [61:12]
Bonnie
Some of the girls, like I said, you know, Renee's family did holidays with them whatnot. So they were like, the first season, like, you know, do you want to be on it? I had to turn it down because I had all these legal issues. He left me with a bag of. I couldn't even get a Toys R Us credit card. Like, everything was up from top to bottom. You know, I was left with like. Because we left the house. It was like we left like thieves in the night. I only packed for two weeks because my kids were enrolled to go to school. And here I am. Got stuck there all these years. So when I came back, I was like, no, I can't do it now. I don't know what my fate is going to be with the law. I don't know. I had to check in with, like, some. The D A or some. No, that. I don't know, some high guy up in. In the. The government to make sure I wasn't. Like, when he saw the case, I'm like, listen, I had nothing to do.
- [61:57]
Ramona Rizzo
There was charges brought up on you because.
- [61:59]
Bonnie
Never brought up on me. They were trying to come up with something because of my husband. So when I finally got one of the prosecutors on the. He goes, I've been following this case. I go, what case? I said, did anybody. Did my husband hold a gun to anybody's head. You only know about this case because it originally started organized crime. The people that he's involved with now, because he had up and leave because he owed people money, they don't understand that the guy had to go. So right now you're going on something that had. This is not about the mob. So if you. So he's like, yeah, you're right. So they couldn't do anything to me. So they were trying to, like, make me, like a martyr. Like, maybe he'll come back if we'll take the wife down. But there was nothing to take me down for.
- [62:37]
Ramona Rizzo
They'll go to any length.
- [62:38]
Bonnie
Any length.
- [62:39]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [62:40]
Bonnie
So after a while, I thought women.
- [62:41]
Ramona Rizzo
And children were off limits not to.
- [62:43]
Bonnie
Not to the feds.
- [62:44]
Ramona Rizzo
Okay.
- [62:44]
Bonnie
I mean, I got. Please. I got hit with so many different things that were just so. Please. It's just like when I tell you it's a book, it's a story, It's a whole fucking lifetime. And it just became so insane with everything that was happening. So when the show took place, I said, listen, guys, I don't know what's going to happen now. My family took me back in, you know, I had to go live, which was very humbling. Had to live with my aunt. Used to having my own house. I built a 30,000 square foot in Atlanta. Never got to live in.
- [63:11]
Ramona Rizzo
Wow.
- [63:12]
Bonnie
You know, my dream home to go to live in to a house where we're sharing bedrooms. But I had no place to go. But still. I appreciate it. But it's still. Now it's somebody else.
- [63:20]
Ramona Rizzo
It's humbling. Yeah.
- [63:21]
Bonnie
Somebody else's rules.
- [63:23]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [63:24]
Bonnie
Somebody else's way of, you know, authority in the home. So that was the biggest punishment I felt from my divorce. If you had to say, like, hey, Ramona, this is what was worse? Losing money or that. That. Because it also brought me back to a place where I didn't wanna. My parents and my family are good people. Like, you know, they. They just have a way of secretive or maybe the way that they believe. And, you know, for me, I'm like, Whatever my kids decide to do in their life, even if they wanted it to be, you know, in a relationship where somebody's not the same color, somebody's not the same nationality, I'm gonna be like, listen, it's not gonna be easy, but if that's what you want to do, I'm here for you.
- [64:05]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [64:05]
Bonnie
And my family. Oh, hell, no. You'll be disowned. You won't be. You know what I Mean, if save you were.
- [64:10]
Ramona Rizzo
How far has that gotten them? You know, like, being secretive.
- [64:13]
Bonnie
Old school.
- [64:13]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [64:14]
Bonnie
Like, just. It's the law of their way.
- [64:17]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [64:17]
Bonnie
You know, Karen has an interracial baby that would have never flew in my home. Never.
- [64:23]
Ramona Rizzo
Do they consider your kids interracial?
- [64:25]
Bonnie
Because that was, like, the weirdest thing. It's, like, so weird because even when I came back home and I'll talk to all my Latin friends, they're like, you're white. I'm like, but what the are you like, I never saw my friends that are Latin, not white.
- [64:35]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [64:36]
Bonnie
So when to see this. The only way that I found out that people judge differently is when I moved to good old Atlanta, Georgia. So we lived there for many years.
- [64:43]
Ramona Rizzo
The good old South.
- [64:44]
Bonnie
Love the South. I really did. I loved it. If I could have been lived there for forever and not have any of this happen. Ramona, you want to be on tv or you want to live happily in Atlanta? Oh, honey, I'll take that any day.
- [64:53]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [64:54]
Bonnie
How I saw the racism was that I was like, listen, there was nobody gonna outshine me. Like, when it came to, like, selling stuff, you know, like the pta. Mom, my daughter came, my son came home. He had to sell all this. I rocked it. I killed it. I sold everything to everybody we knew. They were so nice on the recording. Back in the day, you had the recordings on the home phone. Hi, Ramon. I'm so happy you won. You this, you that. You're great. The minute I call back and she heard that Yankee accent, oh, it was downhill. They didn't like me. So I got a little bit taste of the South. Even though Atlanta is the melting pot, that town is ran by old money.
- [65:32]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [65:33]
Bonnie
And once they got, you know, my New York accent, and they're like. So that's where I first discovered that the second thing, when my son came home, he said, what's this little. He goes, what's? I said, what did you say? Because his last name was Arabic, and they considered them. I had to explain to them.
- [65:52]
Ramona Rizzo
So I called him at school.
- [65:54]
Bonnie
They said, so where'd it come from? It had to come from somebody's parents, because, again, he was carrying the Arabic last name. And that's where, you know, this whole. I was like, oh, Giovanni. And I. You know, the kid, he's got an Italian name with an Arabic last. So it was. It was a lesson. But that's where I knew that people would be like, different colors. You know what I mean? I never. Unless you were like, black. Be like, which I have many black friends. I don't. You know, I always thought, like, somebody if they were Spanish or they were white. You know what I mean? It's so different how people are like, no, because you're white. I'm like. To my friend. No, I'm Latin. So it's like how everybody looks at it different. Where. I never looked at anybody as a true color unless it was, like, actually said out loud. I never really. So in the south, that's what it was about. But I guess because my husband was light, you know, they can never really say anything, like, as far as, like, you know.
- [66:49]
Ramona Rizzo
You know.
- [66:50]
Bonnie
Yeah.
- [66:50]
Ramona Rizzo
Shamed you.
- [66:51]
Bonnie
Where like, they're having, like, an interracial child.
- [66:54]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [66:54]
Bonnie
Like, you know, a mixed baby. Like, you know, you can never come home and date a black guy. I'm like, can I just date whoever the I want to date?
- [67:02]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [67:02]
Bonnie
It wasn't like my father would find out if I was doing something on a. Like, say, on the weekend by Tuesday as as much. Hush, hush. We thought we would, you know, keep it. He would find out. I've had friends, you know, tell me that your father chases. Never came home and told me some guy that I thought it was cool to, like, have him. My sweet 16, he was. You know, we were together, like, dating, you know, wasn't even having sex. Then nothing. My father chased the guy down in the mall with the hammer, but I didn't know about it. You know what I'm saying? So it's like, again with the double lives. Then I'm like, seeing this other guy. He's like. When I'm older, he's, like, so hot. I had to break it off with him because somebody lived on the block that knew my father. So it was like. Because I could never say where I truly was.
- [67:44]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [67:45]
Bonnie
So I was just like. I wasn't. I never. I was the type of girl that I never wanted to do drugs because I saw, you know, my family, there were alcoholism in it. My uncle would drink, My aunt would drink. Once in a while, my uncle went through the other situation on the other side of the family with the. The drug. So I knew to always stay away from that.
- [68:03]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [68:04]
Bonnie
So when I went out, I wasn't like that type of partier. I just wanted to go out and be free.
- [68:09]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [68:10]
Bonnie
You know what I mean? And just have a good time and not be somebody's daughter, somebody's granddaughter, somebody's niece. I just wanted to be like everybody else. But it was very hard for us because New York was ran by A lot of mlb.
- [68:25]
Ramona Rizzo
So speaking of mlb, let's talk about how you got integrated into the whole Mob Wives thing. And like, take me on that journey with you. You. Because you're just coming home.
- [68:34]
Bonnie
Just coming home. I was asked to do it the first year I had her. I had a client. Then came when these other girls got wind of it. Holy. You could have think like, oh my God, that, you know, the devil was coming to be on the show. They didn't want it because it all came down to Bunny. Nobody wanted to share with another girl. Like, you know how on Atlanta Housewives you get a peach?
- [68:55]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [68:56]
Bonnie
They don't want nobody else on the show. Karen was down for it. So they had a meeting among the minds and with, you know, with some of the producers.
- [69:03]
Ramona Rizzo
They didn't want you the show?
- [69:04]
Bonnie
No.
- [69:04]
Ramona Rizzo
Okay.
- [69:04]
Bonnie
Some of the girls didn't. And mind you, one of these girls in particular, when I did come home, I was partying with her. There was no qualms then. But when it was like, we're going to put Ramona on the show.
- [69:14]
Ramona Rizzo
Which one? Who is it?
- [69:15]
Bonnie
Her name starts with a D. Okay. Yeah, starts with a D. She didn't want me on the show. And how I knew about it was because Carla, who was very close with her because she like they had a relationship because Carla's father in law delivered Drita's baby. So call it after her and Drita had a falling out, came and told us what was taking place and she said she didn't want you. There she goes. I didn't know any better because I was just, you know, following the code. She was my friend. So long story short, I became on the show and oh my God, like we were just cool last week. Now, but again, you're not going to abuse Karen in front of me.
- [69:50]
Ramona Rizzo
Right? That was, that was a crazy, iconic episode though. Your mouth bleeding and you just literally scream. Like I. You would put the fear of God in anybody trying to get to her.
- [70:04]
Bonnie
Because it was just, it was just like, you know what? Scared of who?
- [70:08]
Ramona Rizzo
Who.
- [70:08]
Bonnie
Who are we supposed to be scared of?
- [70:10]
Ramona Rizzo
Right?
- [70:11]
Bonnie
Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, you know, I had. My sister's ex boyfriend, wasn't really a tough kid. You know, he went. She went to jail for murder. You know why? He punched somebody, had a fight, punched somebody. The kid went down and he died because he hit his head. Anybody's tough in their own sense, right? Just. You know what I mean? The quietest person in the room could be the toughest. Right? You know What I'm saying, I'm not into all that rah rah. But if that you're selling yourself as a character, cool. Nobody's saying you didn't have your. Your brawls back in the day, fine. But a lot of that stuff, it was a real show.
- [70:43]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah, I feel like there's a lot of anime. It's sad because, you know, you guys were so iconic and just that was a moment in time that was just like. That was really amazing tv. It was unscripted. It was real raw emotions. Like, you could tell you guys really had had history. And like, I don't want to say beef, but just like unresolved that you guys all brought to the table. And it just played out on tv. And that's what made for such great tv. And I think it's so sad now because there's such a rift between you guys.
- [71:13]
Bonnie
You know, as far as the riff is concerned, if you really think about it, if it wasn't for that show, none of these people would be hanging out. And they didn't. They hung out when they were younger. They had a pet. Like, for example, Drita was like my siblings. Sister's friend and Karen's friend. I really didn't associate so much with them, but that time it was my boyfriend mode. But the whole thing is like, you know, when you sign up for this, they put you in these scenarios. That's why, like I said, when I watch your stuff, it's real because nobody's scripting it. They're not putting you. They're not putting you bunny. With the neighbor that you never would talk to.
- [71:41]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [71:42]
Bonnie
Because they've signed on for the show.
- [71:43]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [71:44]
Bonnie
You know, I could handle anything that's thrown to me, but sometimes it's like they had you to a degree, faking. It's a, you know, just funk it to fake it. However the you say it. It was just like I was dumbfounded. I was like, wait, what? Like one time when I was on the show, and they're like, where's Ramona? I just signed up for the show. They're like, where's Ramona? Karen's like, oh, I don't know. She'll be back later. Karen didn't want to say or was. I was getting arrested with my boyfriend at the time, my fiance. And so now we have to reenact this because obviously when this takes place, because nobody does. Everybody doesn't know. It's not like Big Brother that they can. Cameras are in your house.
- [72:18]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [72:18]
Bonnie
So they're like. And I love him, and I get it. And Adam, he's so great. He didn't. Now he understands us, but when he was first working with us, he's like, who's Adam?
- [72:26]
Ramona Rizzo
Is he the producer? Adam.
- [72:27]
Bonnie
Adam. Love you, Adam. He is the producer of the show. And he's like, come on. Boo. Boo. You know, you were crying. I was like, I wasn't crying then. I'm thinking to myself, like, I. After. I went home after doing the scene because we had to reenact it. I'm like, is there something wrong with me? Because I didn't cry because they wanted me to call Karen. She's like, no, you were crying. Oh, no, I wasn't. And Karen's like, well, how would you do it? She'd be like, call me. You know, come here now. I want to see you. We would never talk on the phone.
- [72:53]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [72:53]
Bonnie
I would never, never give it. Like, I was arrested. I would never say anything in general. That's how we were brought up. So when that happened. So a lot of things on the show, like, they put you in scenarios that you wouldn't be a part of.
- [73:05]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [73:06]
Bonnie
Like, the whole thing with Karen and Lee, it was dead, but it made good tv. So now you're bringing these two. You're pitting. Bringing up old balloons, and it's getting worse. Yeah. And then, you know, he has a disgusting mouth, her husband. And he said a lot of bad things about Karen that. Yo, dude, when you broke up with her, you just wanted to go your own way. It was what it was. Everybody went in peace. Now you're calling her all these things. You're calling her. You're calling her daughter. Like, we don't do that.
- [73:33]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [73:33]
Bonnie
And it was sad. It was sad. It was a lot of sad things. You know, on the show, made up with Rita. We were cool. Then one time, her and call. I had it, like. And then we were all, like, coming together to see if we could have certain things that when we want to renegotiate the contract and all the. And I thought we were cool. And I just retweeted something that Carla said, and she blocked me from then. So I'm just like, did I forget to send you a Ramadan card? Because she, you know, she's Muslim. Did I forget to, like, who's Muslim? Greeda.
- [74:05]
Ramona Rizzo
Oh, wow.
- [74:05]
Bonnie
Did I forget to, like, you know, say something to you that I. You know what I mean? Like, what did I do to you?
- [74:10]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [74:10]
Bonnie
But it was because of that, so. And again, she was just looking for a way to, like, separate, you know what I mean? And again, nobody was ever trying to flex, you know who they were on the show. Because when they did have this meeting, they said, so if we're gonna have the show and this is going to be the name of it, this girl deserves to be here more than any of you. Because like I told you, my grandfather, who was with Karen's father, that's on my father's side. Then you have my real grandfather from the Donnie Brasco movie.
- [74:39]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [74:39]
Bonnie
I'm dating somebody that obviously just made the news, and we were going to get him marri on tv, but, you know, he was in the life and, you know, everything that took place, my uncle died. Like, there were real issues that took place, but I was never like that. Like, not that. Like, I. If we could all do something together, make money, what the. Why the hell not? It came a lot of jealousy. And I see that. What other. Maybe housewife shows, but other housewives shows had amazing management. Amazing that these women's are making banks. Like, nobody walked off the show rich.
- [75:12]
Ramona Rizzo
Nobody helped you guys. It was just kind of like they just. I don't want to, you know, I'll use the term loosely, but it was almost like they just used you guys for views.
- [75:21]
Bonnie
Well, I mean, you're in the industry now. There's no way that you could be a manager and be a producer of the show.
- [75:25]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [75:25]
Bonnie
Double dipping. That's what we were up against. So even though your manager, doesn't your manager get you deals? And she's entitled to it. So whatever I brought in, it was like being an escort. I had to give it to you no matter what.
- [75:36]
Ramona Rizzo
Yep.
- [75:37]
Bonnie
Then at the end of it, what? We found out, me and Karen, that Drita and Carla had fired the management team, which was producer Jennifer Graziano. And we're supposed to be childhood friends. So they're not paying you, but us struggling moms are paying you. So Dreed is even making more money. Carla's even making more money because they're not giving to. When I was supposed to do the third season, I was supposed to get a raise. And you're supposed to negotiate for me being, like, in the opening. But you couldn't because it costs too much money because that'll come out of your pocket. And then later on, lots of shady business. A lot of shady business.
- [76:14]
Ramona Rizzo
Wow.
- [76:14]
Bonnie
A lot of shady business. And when it got a little ugly for a minute when it, like, certain things took place when, you know, we quit or in my terms, I made sure that I got fired. Because there was a different clause in it. Because. But it winds up in a sense, like, if I would have. Have. If I would have gotten fired, if I would have quit, then there were certain things I couldn't do. But they still blocked me on VH1, because that's where I was supposed to do something with the girl Tony from bmf.
- [76:40]
Ramona Rizzo
Wow.
- [76:41]
Bonnie
And she told me. She goes, you're black. Bolt. And on VH1, she goes, in MTV, because I sold. I signed. I don't know what I was signing. Signs over my likelihood.
- [76:50]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [76:51]
Bonnie
So I couldn't. I couldn't be on any other show, even though I was still part of dating somebody, incarcerated. Because that's what the new BMF show was about. It was about all these women coming together, dating men. And I made a relationship with these girls. So I said, forget it. You know, whatever took place with the show, and it was bad blood, but nobody walked away rich. Not like it was. It was. I made more money with my family staying home, my family giving me. Opposed to what I did on the show. So as much as I had issues with my family being strict, they really came through with everything else. So it's like, you know what I mean? So I was kind of very grateful. Yeah. You know, do I. Did I raise my children differently? Yes. They need to know the truth. I never want them to be blindsided. I always told them, if there's anything you want to ask me, ask me whatever you're into, God forbid you get in trouble, let me know. I'm always gonna be. I'm gonna yell.
- [77:41]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [77:41]
Bonnie
Because that's just what I do. But I'm always gonna have your back.
- [77:44]
Ramona Rizzo
That's how I am with our. Our daughter. I'm just like, tell me before I find out from somebody else. Because if I find out from somebody else, you're in trouble. If I find out from you, you have a chance, you know, and, you.
- [77:53]
Bonnie
Know, you could save them because they're, you know, you're young. I don't. I want somebody to have my back because I was always very sneaky. I had to grow up to be that way because it was either that or have a boring childhood.
- [78:03]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [78:03]
Bonnie
I wasn't. You know what I mean? Like, I don't. I wanted. I want. And I'm glad that I got to experience, like, going out and going to. Doing all these different things. And there were some situations. We could have got pretty hurt.
- [78:13]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [78:14]
Bonnie
You know, God watched.
- [78:15]
Ramona Rizzo
I think that's part of growing up, though.
- [78:16]
Bonnie
Yeah. You know, God Made sure that we were okay. But the show, in so many different outlets, it puts you in scenarios that you never, ever would have had yourself into. Like, everything was a party.
- [78:27]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [78:28]
Bonnie
Like, you know what I mean?
- [78:29]
Ramona Rizzo
I'm like, alcohol heightens things.
- [78:30]
Bonnie
And I'm sure, you know, ego was the biggest thing.
- [78:33]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah, ego, ego, alcohol, all of it.
- [78:37]
Bonnie
I remember I was like, I wasn't being a key, I was being a keyboard warrior answering back. Because let me tell you again, when I came on the show, it was the first season, all the girls. So the way that they pitched me the second season was like the Italian Omarosa. Remember Omarosa how she was on one of the reality shows? Oh, yeah, yeah. So they made me out to be like her. So I'm like, now I'm going up against the fans favorite. Okay. Because this Drita is picking on my cousin. So I'm not gonna stand by. First of all, there's no reason to fight.
- [79:06]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [79:07]
Bonnie
You could talk it out. Like, this could be. But now we got. Our egos are, you know, really exploding and this is what the people want. And boop, bop. And I'm like, oh, God, please just let me just control this. You gotta see how people work. This was the height of Twitter.
- [79:22]
Ramona Rizzo
Twitter is rough. That is a rough crowd.
- [79:25]
Bonnie
But to remember this was just the height of it. So my boyfriend's like, come on, we have dinner. I'm like, no, because people like. And I'm like, people saying, I go. And I go. This is the reason what I tell them in person. This is the reason why people swallow their kids. Like, in other words, they should have swallowed you or given a blow job. Your mother should have never had you. Yeah, the friggin. What do you call? Hits me up. They're like, FH1, you can't talk like that. Why not? Do you see what they're saying me? So now you're even censoring what the hell? I'm answering back in real life. Friggin Twitter.
- [79:55]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [79:55]
Bonnie
You know, I'm saying so now like they're watching you.
- [79:57]
Ramona Rizzo
That's why I won't sell our shows that I do that. My. My production company does the Bunny XO show and the Meet the D forwards. Because I. You're just.
- [80:04]
Bonnie
You give up so much control.
- [80:05]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah, you're not going to control anything. The narra editing is a. Oh, for sure. They can make a whole situation that isn't even there just from sound bites of things that you guys say. It's crazy.
- [80:18]
Bonnie
Well, that's what they did. Then later on we stepped into some other, you know, into the light of say this word. You got to do it because they're your boss. You're getting paid.
- [80:26]
Ramona Rizzo
Wow.
- [80:26]
Bonnie
And then they would place it someplace else.
- [80:29]
Ramona Rizzo
Wow.
- [80:29]
Bonnie
And then, you know, there were a lot of people.
- [80:30]
Ramona Rizzo
It's like entrapment.
- [80:31]
Bonnie
Yeah. Like, Adam was on our team, and he was great, and he understood what was going on. But again, it was just. Just. It started taking a better turn going into my second season. But then after that, that. That year, when we found out some stuff, I was like, I'm out. Like, it was either gonna be this way or that way.
- [80:47]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [80:48]
Bonnie
And I just got a bad taste because money is a lot of time. The root of all evil.
- [80:51]
Ramona Rizzo
It is.
- [80:52]
Bonnie
And that's what truly had happened. And people could say whatever they want to say. They could go around town saying whatever they want to say. I could give two shits because my. Listen, I was very grateful because I got to support my children. But what people don't understand, with or without mob wives, I still made it. Like, I. The point of making it is I got to raise my children.
- [81:11]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [81:11]
Bonnie
I got to.
- [81:12]
Ramona Rizzo
You got to be.
- [81:12]
Bonnie
I live better than I lived before. So what? You know, it got to be. Where one time, I remember Renee. She's like. With the Twitter. Again with the Twitter.
- [81:21]
Ramona Rizzo
She's like, renee is hilarious.
- [81:24]
Bonnie
And like, she. She apologized. We work things out. Listen, you know, when you speak to her, like, she has always have a soft spot. Soft spot in my heart, because when mob wife started, nobody had money like that. Ask her who gave him money to go to Vegas to. When you went to California to go to show. I handed her money. The poor girl that just came back had nothing. Who was taking the nail polish off your toes because you had to go and get yourself clean. I wanted her to get better. So with or without the show, she'll always hold us, you know, a. A soft spot in my heart. We didn't speak to for each other for a while because she didn't know certain things. And when she got. Got privy to it, things got better. But one time she tweeted, she's like, yeah, my sister's fed you. I said, well, we'll back up the bus, baby. The only people that ever fed me was my mother's tit and maybe a boyfriend. Other than that, I've always fed myself. I've been working since I'm 14 years old. That was another thing, you know, everybody thinks, like, oh, my God, the mob. My parents made us work. Karen worked. I Worked. We weren't like, you know, like, spoiled. We weren't like, trust me, Soprano. Yeah, some people are. Renee never worked. So throughout this lifestyle, there's different ways that you handle in your house? My house was very strict. My house, we never discussed the word mob. I had to get a job. Karen's house wasn't as strict, but she had to get a job. Like, you know, they wanted those foundation. And I. You know, much as my father, I thank him for that because if I didn't, maybe I'd be lost. Poor Renee, she really never had a steady job. She even tells me, she's like. Like, you know, you girls, you have a business. I'm so happy for you. She doesn't have any hate in her heart.
- [82:55]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [82:56]
Bonnie
But it just. It just created a snowball of monsters. But I was very appreciative because it helped feed my children at that time. And I was fresh coming home to the second year. But if people said to me, what would you rather do? Have a business knowing you're successful or being in, you know, an everyday job that, you know, you could really, like, have a business, I would pick that because this comes in a lot of.
- [83:19]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [83:20]
Bonnie
And I'm not even. I'm not even like, famous famous. So imagine the people that are truly famous. You know, I've had some stalkers here and there that, you know, Karen and I owned a pizzeria. And I'm like, we thought this guy was really coming because the stuff that he was saying, it was scary. You know, because we're out there now. We can't. Like. Because when I go places, I usually say where I am after.
- [83:38]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [83:38]
Bonnie
Not because I'm no big deal, because there's weirdos.
- [83:41]
Ramona Rizzo
Well, you have to. Yeah.
- [83:41]
Bonnie
People. But in the pizzeria, we were sitting duck. Sucks. Yeah. You know, so it was different. But I always said, like, listen, these people, that there's just out of the way to be mean.
- [83:53]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah. Oh, the people online reading comments like.
- [83:56]
Bonnie
How does she remember she was a baby? Another liar. Oh, my God, her voice is so nasal. No shit, Sherlock. I'm supposed to get my nose done because I have my nose inside his old cave.
- [84:06]
Ramona Rizzo
Like, I think it gives you character, though.
- [84:08]
Bonnie
No, but I. I love my nose. That's the whole thing. I want to find a person that is not going to change my nose. But inside, I literally. I was there the other day. He's like, how do you breathe? I go, this is what I'm here for. He's like, oh, no. It's like, Literally caved. He's like, you have the smallest canal. But my point is, like, you're. She's a nasal. She talks like the Net. No. Like, what is your point? Like, why. Why are you going out of your day to say that? I don't remember something when I was nine. I totally do.
- [84:35]
Ramona Rizzo
People.
- [84:35]
Bonnie
I remember when I was five, when I went to jail, like.
- [84:38]
Ramona Rizzo
Like, people on the Internet are a different beast. It's bullying. Yeah.
- [84:42]
Bonnie
Like, and this is why a lot.
- [84:43]
Ramona Rizzo
That's why I stand up against it, because I just don't think it's right, dude.
- [84:46]
Bonnie
It's not right.
- [84:47]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah. And especially now that mental health is such a huge topic of conversation. I really think that these platforms need to start cracking down on bullies. It's not okay. It's not okay to just spew whatever the you think out of your mouth that is harmful and hurtful to somebody. Especially. Especially with children on the Internet. Are children supposed to be on the Internet? No. The parents should definitely govern that a lot more. But you can't literally, you know, be over your kid's shoulder.
- [85:15]
Bonnie
Every friend, they're going to have somebody, they're going to get to it.
- [85:18]
Ramona Rizzo
Yes, exactly. So it's like, I just. These platforms, I've been working with this foundation, and I'm hoping to do a lot more with them, but they, you know, do a bunch of stuff for cyberbullying and because it personally affected the man who runs the organization. So I just feel so strongly about it. It's not okay what people say.
- [85:36]
Bonnie
And it's also about images. Like, I. The only thing I commends Facebook about when they took away the likes, because a lot of, you know, little girls, like, I'm not getting that many likes or people like, feeling bad for themselves. And it's very easy. For example, like your husband's song, Save Me to Me. I don't do drugs, I don't drink. But I relate into other ways. Because you could fall into depression.
- [85:56]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [85:57]
Bonnie
And, like, I have fibromyalgia, so I had to step back from a lot of stuff. And here I am, not the girl going with all my friends to the dinners or seeing all my other friends. And because I was that person, my friends range from Queens to the city to all over. And I was always there for everybody. Going out, they're like, where's Ramona? They didn't understand. But with that came a sense of, like, depression in a way, because I wasn't that same girl anymore that used to laugh and what happened to her so it's like people don't get it how easily you could feel depressed on so many different levels. It doesn't have to be from actually a substance abuse. It could be from your inner. It could be from autoimmune trauma. Trauma? Well, that's what they're saying, that autoimmune is caused by trauma. You know, how the hell did. Nobody in my family that I know of has fibromyalgia or neuropathy. I winded up with all the stress. I want to go to her, but I know if you be so much pain, you ever see the woman, she's like, she takes all the stress out of you and she like basically like, yeah, one of those. And I'm like, you scream, people cry.
- [86:58]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [86:59]
Bonnie
And she's in Cali and I'm like, am I ready for that? But that's built up cuz that's opening.
- [87:04]
Ramona Rizzo
A Pandora's box too. Once you open that up, you have to deal with everything that you start feeling too. So.
- [87:09]
Bonnie
And it's like a lot of different things that I know that I have in within me, but it has to be up to me when I'm ready.
- [87:15]
Ramona Rizzo
You also battled an eating disorder, correct?
- [87:18]
Bonnie
No, I was just always chubby.
- [87:19]
Ramona Rizzo
Oh no. I could have swore that we had talked about an eating disorder, but maybe.
- [87:23]
Bonnie
No, like that. You know, when I was younger, I was, you know, a little bit overweight and I had that and. But nothing like no.
- [87:31]
Ramona Rizzo
Do you still battle with depression and anxiety? I have my moments older. Do you do therapy? Because I asked Karen the same question and she said she's never done therapy. And I was, was blown away by that because I was like, how out of all the you guys have been through, like I would think now in your lives, like therapy would be just essential.
- [87:50]
Bonnie
Well, put it to you this way. When I was away in Jordan, my therapy was whatever I was allowed to listen to on YouTube because the music was some degree was restricted. So it was music. Music was my therapy. That was my outlet. When I was younger, it was writing. When I came home, I didn't know if I was going to be in trouble to go to jail. So I'm like talking to this guy and I'm like, like, he's a therapist. I'm like, this is some. Because unless I'm really ready, I can tell you whatever, right, to make this, you know what I mean? To make this kind of like work in my favor. But I'm like, I think the therapy that I would need, it goes back to the Issues of abandonment and stuff like that. And I think I have to be fully ready.
- [88:29]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [88:29]
Bonnie
To open those because it go. You know, it. It goes into, like, a lot of other things. It's like. Like, there's no reason why I should remember what that jail sounds like. There's no reason why I should remember, like, how cold it was. Again, I don't remember what I ate two days ago. You know, I do need therapy, but I also think it's really important about finding the right person. I don't know if I trust anybody. Like, kind of like, here we go back to the Sopranos.
- [88:53]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [88:53]
Bonnie
You know, he found her. A lot of people, and I just feel this day and age with therapy. They're like, here's a pill, like, with fibromyalgia. Heals the pillow. Oh, so you want me to take Lyrica? Do you know Lyrica is for people that have seizures? It's a band aid. I don't need a band Aid, dude. I need, like, if you could help me, fine. I'm not into band Aids.
- [89:12]
Ramona Rizzo
I like doing holistic. That's why I always do holistic. Eastern medicine, not western medicine. Because Western medicine, all they want to do is throw pills.
- [89:20]
Bonnie
Big farm.
- [89:20]
Ramona Rizzo
They tried to put me on blood pressure pills last year, and it came down to the fact that I was allergic to rice.
- [89:26]
Bonnie
Wow.
- [89:27]
Ramona Rizzo
And if I had not advocated for myself and done blood work and studied and did all this on my own, I would have been on blood pressure.
- [89:33]
Bonnie
That's why I said, you're smart as well.
- [89:35]
Ramona Rizzo
I appreciate you, but I just knew that it was. It wasn't my blood pressure. I knew something was triggering it, you know, and you have to be your own advocate when it comes to.
- [89:42]
Bonnie
Well, this is what it is, because I'll relate to you. Like, I'll go into, like, a meeting with the doctor, and he'll tell me something. Like, I'll get the gist of it, but I'll forget.
- [89:48]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [89:48]
Bonnie
So, like, I get all the things you're saying, and I can relate to it. But, like, this is point about everything. She knows how to say all the words. She'll be like, she does. She knows her research. But, like, for me, I'm all about being holistic. And it was so funny because Karen, like, she. You know, she tries to bust my ball. She'd be like, they had pizza last week. She's like, you want pizza? I was like, nah. She goes, why? Because you want to be skinny? Because you're going on bunny? I'm like, no, jerk off. I can't eat cheese for another three or the gluten cheese. And I can't do steak right now because my cholesterol is through the roof. And I'm trying to take my blood because. Testing it again. Because I don't want to go on goddamn medicine. I had an issue with my heart. This guy's putting me on everything.
- [90:29]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [90:29]
Bonnie
Like.
- [90:30]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [90:31]
Bonnie
For the rest of my life.
- [90:32]
Ramona Rizzo
Yes, they will. And they have no problem.
- [90:34]
Bonnie
They get paid off of it.
- [90:35]
Ramona Rizzo
Well, they get. They get paid to keep you sick. No. Big pharma doesn't make money off healing people. So it's like they want to keep you sick. But you have to be your own advocate. It's if the best thing. And this is my. Everybody, all my listeners know this. I advocate for getting your own blood work done.
- [90:51]
Bonnie
Yes.
- [90:51]
Ramona Rizzo
You can go to any anytime labs. They'll give you your.
- [90:54]
Bonnie
But there's an extensive blood. You have to get done. I forgot what it's called. It's a different. It's a different test. Like there's. When I had gone to this one doctor, he did more than what the regular doctor would do. I forgot what it's called again. I'm not good with all the names.
- [91:07]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [91:07]
Bonnie
And all the.
- [91:08]
Ramona Rizzo
All the panels you have to do hormones, you have to do the heart, you have to do like the. All separate panels. And it's expensive, but it's like you have to do that unless. Or you're going to be stuck taking pills. Like, you have to advocate for yourself.
- [91:20]
Bonnie
Truly healthy in America. You need to have money. Vitamins cost a shitload of money. They're a couple hundred a month.
- [91:26]
Ramona Rizzo
It's so sad.
- [91:27]
Bonnie
You have to make sure that. You know, when I had. I was scared shitless about two years ago. I thought like I was going to have a heart attack. They were going to put a stint, the whole nine. He put me on cholesterol medicine. And then with this new doctor I saw, he goes, did he ever bother to check you again? He goes, your cholesterol's too low. Get off of it. And I said, holy fuck. And then they're like, they make money off of this. Yeah. So I was like, you know what? Never again. So I try to do things where I could heal myself because I'm responsible. Nobody else. Really.
- [91:55]
Ramona Rizzo
The best thing that you can do for yourself. And it was very hard for me, but I had to do an elimination diet. And I haven't had sugar in over a year. And it is the best thing I've ever done for My life, I'll eat gluten here and there, but I changed my entire diet last year, and it was the most healing thing I've ever done.
- [92:12]
Bonnie
Do you know that I put a post about this? Sugar is harder to get off of than cocaine.
- [92:17]
Ramona Rizzo
Oh, yeah.
- [92:18]
Bonnie
So for me, that's my issue.
- [92:20]
Ramona Rizzo
Coconut sugar.
- [92:21]
Bonnie
Coconut sugar. But again, this is my problem about growing up when we. Maybe this is what you're talking about. But the eating disorder. I knew to stay away from alcohol. I knew to stay away from drugs. Here, everybody's like, if I would have known the sugar could lead to. Which in my family, there's diabetes and there's, you know, all these other issues, high blood pressure. I would have stood away from it because I was so scared. But no, here's a cookie, here's an M M. All this other stuff, we didn't know that. So now it's like, I'm too late in the game.
- [92:47]
Ramona Rizzo
And I'm like, no, but you're not.
- [92:49]
Bonnie
No, no, but you've known it. So now do I like something you said about your husband? Like somebody had said to our bed, which I was commending you. You're like, does it bother you that he drinks and he smokes? And you said, whenever he's ready. Yeah, if he wants to go clean, he will. The same thing I. I'm eliminating. I'm doing better choices. But I know when I'm fully ready. Yeah, it's gonna come. Because I know at the end, if I don't, I could lose a toe or go on dialysis.
- [93:16]
Ramona Rizzo
Like, you don't be losing toes. Crazy.
- [93:19]
Bonnie
And I'm like, I don't want to be this, you know, that person. Like. Like, here I come with, you know, here's grandma, but she's got no toe.
- [93:26]
Ramona Rizzo
And listen, that ass with a walking.
- [93:28]
Bonnie
Chair will be hot. Okay.
- [93:30]
Ramona Rizzo
Wear those little body suits. You'll be good. Bling the walker out. No, but you just. You have to be your own advocate. And it's all about what you put in your body.
- [93:41]
Bonnie
Years ago, everything was glass.
- [93:42]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [93:42]
Bonnie
But now plastic. Plastic.
- [93:45]
Ramona Rizzo
Yep.
- [93:45]
Bonnie
You go in the freezer, it takes. Puts into the water. All of a sudden, the. In the water. But now. Oh, we can't, because it's dangerous. Snapple was always with glass. All of a sudden, the one plastic.
- [93:55]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [93:56]
Bonnie
It's just because it's easier.
- [93:58]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [93:58]
Bonnie
But they have to make us sick because they make the money off of it. If you know, you know.
- [94:02]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah, absolutely. I pre. I could preach this all day long. We could talk about this all day long because it's like one of my favorite topics is health. Because you become obsessed with it as you get older. You realize you're not immortal. Immortal. You know, you, you, you have to do things to. To make sure that I. I think what really struck a chord was inheriting custody of both of my parents as they're dying. And I got to see what they're dying, what, what my mom died from, and now I get to see what my dad is dying from. And that's a wake up call.
- [94:31]
Bonnie
Yes.
- [94:31]
Ramona Rizzo
You know, and your own health suffers from it too. And you just get to a point in life where you're like, you know what? I don't want to be like this. I want, when I'm old, I don't want to have to worry about my, you know, kid taking care of me. I want to be able to, you know, still have a good mind and some. Somewhat of, like a little bit of health. So I was like, if I start now, maybe I'll be on the road to, you know, redemption by the time I'm 70.
- [94:53]
Bonnie
A couple of things that need to be restoring and just kind of get like a little bit of a clean path.
- [94:58]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah, yeah.
- [94:59]
Bonnie
It is what it is. And that was like one of the things that I find, like, maybe in a sense that, yes, I got fibromyalgia, got neuropathy, but. But I got that like after the show. And again, it was built up trauma and the show. It made me. It led me into like after that to start meditating and start making intention candles and just like doing certain things to find my peace where meditating is amazing that if I would have stood on that show, it never would have been because that was. A lot of times people don't get. It's like, wasn't. Didn't end when you would just say, okay, everybody go home. See you tomorrow. Yeah, we all lived in the same area, Bunny, so. But then it also makes you think, gee, if you're really about it, why don't you come ring my fucking doorbell?
- [95:37]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [95:37]
Bonnie
You know what I'm saying? So it was kind of like if you were really smart, like, if they really, we could have done that. Like, we could have continued if this is what you want to do, but you're only going to make it so escalated when the cameras are rolling. But it was like, I. My biggest thing going on camera is like, okay, how am I going to look and what's my outfit? Other than that I could be myself more than 24 7. I don't have a problem. But with that, I think after leaving it and everything else, I don't think if I would have had all these issues going on, I could have remained. And I think I found peace after because with the meditation, like making candles, like I have a whole company. It led me into a different direction where I'm at peace. If anybody asked me, like, hey, like, this was super cool. I. I like, I'm a big fan of yours. It was awesome to do some things. I'm very selective. I have to have like, kind of like some type of feel like, okay, I could connect to it. Because other than that, it's like, like, you know, things that you saw and everybody's like, bring mob wise back. Do you really want to see girls either in the late 40s or early 50s fighting?
- [96:39]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [96:39]
Bonnie
Come on. It's like grandma's cop. Stop. Just slow it down. Like, what could we really fight about? Yeah, hey, we're not getting Social Security in a couple years. Like, it's ridiculous. But these will fight. But it's ugly. It's not realistic. It's like, when do you stop? And everybody on the place, like, you know, on the, on this whole thing, if they want to talk about it. Not everybody has an ailment. Well, one of these have something going on.
- [97:02]
Ramona Rizzo
Right.
- [97:03]
Bonnie
So is it really normal to really. So everyone's like, I think sometimes things they're done, like, just let them to rest.
- [97:10]
Ramona Rizzo
Let sleeping dogs lie.
- [97:12]
Bonnie
Like, you know, every time they do have to do a remake of this movie, just sometimes it's best keep it original.
- [97:17]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [97:17]
Bonnie
So, you know, I. We appreciate the fans, like, hey, get a comeback. If certain things would go, people probably would want to make it back. But. But what are you making it back for? You loved it because of the fighting, right? Gotta ask yourself, America, you really want to see old people fighting? Like, I. I don't know. You know what I mean?
- [97:35]
Ramona Rizzo
Clip that, Jason. So what, what can we expect from you? Like, you spoke about a book or.
- [97:44]
Bonnie
A book will definitely be coming in. Like I said, it's all about timing.
- [97:47]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [97:47]
Bonnie
I can't control what God has, you know? Yeah. People living or dying.
- [97:50]
Ramona Rizzo
Well, shout out your company and stuff like that.
- [97:52]
Bonnie
I do have a spiritual line. Spiritual slinger. I make intention candles. I have fun just like, you know, going on social media, people. So I do have a lot of nice fans and they're so appreciative of, you know, me just even like sometimes I'll do a charity and stuff like that. And that really like touches Me like, you want me to be a part of it? Of course I will. Because every. If we don't help each other, who's going to help you? Yeah, like, we are all we got people. This universe is one time around the ship and you don't want to be in, you know, the water sinking. You want to be on the boat where we all could survive. And people are very, very slow and mean to help. Like, if you want someone to help, it's like slow motion. If I feel something is a real good cause I'm on it. You give me a real good gofund. I'm down for it. You know what I'm saying? So I'm always still active on my pages. I'm more in love with just watching Tick Tock because you people are incredible.
- [98:43]
Ramona Rizzo
Like you.
- [98:44]
Bonnie
Like you. But other people, like, oh, yeah, no, they're great. Like, there's people that you don't even know, I don't even know about. And they have like, like 200 mil in my doors. Like, you don't know this guy. Or how about the lady? She's eating the foods and she's the sounds of the emoji. Like, wild.
- [98:59]
Ramona Rizzo
No, it's crazy. There are so many nooks and crannies of Tick Tock that I can't even fathom them.
- [99:05]
Bonnie
And that was one of the reasons why they wanted to take it down because it goes in every area.
- [99:09]
Ramona Rizzo
It goes in house universal.
- [99:11]
Bonnie
It goes in ever. And then you're like, they're learning this in China.
- [99:15]
Ramona Rizzo
I'll be scrolling and there'll be people in like the Middle east somewhere sleeping in sleeping bags. And another thing is like a bunch of like, Indians with face paint and like, tribal stuff and like doing a freaking.
- [99:28]
Bonnie
And you're like, wow, is this real? Like, you only read about this in your history. It's wild.
- [99:32]
Ramona Rizzo
No, it's crazy.
- [99:33]
Bonnie
So I'm like, I like some. I'm like, base. My friends. Like, you have to do more and people love you. I'm like, I'm like, so amazed. I'm like, no, I'm like scrolling through this. Like, I can't compete with this. This is wild.
- [99:44]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah, but you just being you. I told Karen that too. I was like, you guys have to get on TikTok because you guys, I am.
- [99:48]
Bonnie
But not to like. Like, like I said, I do do it right. But I know you, like, you, like, you have it like it's a.
- [99:55]
Ramona Rizzo
It's a business.
- [99:56]
Bonnie
It's a business. And that's what I'm like, because there's a lot people don't realize. You have to be a talent. You have to have perfect editing, and you have to have content. And that's why, like, my hats, I totally tip them for everyone. Because I'm like, this one girl, like, she could cook. And I'm like. But then you have to get with the right person to edit. And, like, it's wild. Yeah, it's a fascinating world. Like, I like it more than. Than Instagram because it's, like, not censored.
- [100:19]
Ramona Rizzo
Like, right.
- [100:19]
Bonnie
Give you so much more.
- [100:20]
Ramona Rizzo
Instagram is my lowest platform. I don't even. I only deal with Instagram because I've had it for so long. But, like, tick tock is my jam. Facebook is my jam. Instagram, I just feel like we're so under the thumb there.
- [100:32]
Bonnie
You can Twitter zone. I literally got a report yesterday, Facebook. But see, they don't censor you on Facebook because Instagram and Facebook are the same people.
- [100:40]
Ramona Rizzo
So they. Ish. They do, but not as bad as Instagram. Like, yesterday, I reposted somebody's story about how they, like, put cayenne pepper in their. In their husband's lube because they caught him cheating. They flagged that and took it for hate speech. And I'm like, how is that hate speech when she's just speaking about. You know, like, it's just.
- [100:56]
Bonnie
And then you're at their mercy because if you get a certain amount of flags, they'll take your account, and then you can't. Like.
- [101:01]
Ramona Rizzo
And my account's been taken twice before.
- [101:04]
Bonnie
Imagine it's not by a hacker. It's by the actual company.
- [101:06]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah. No.
- [101:07]
Bonnie
Crazy. It's crazy.
- [101:09]
Ramona Rizzo
Ramona, it's been so nice just sitting here. I feel like I could talk to you forever.
- [101:13]
Bonnie
Well, I probably could tell you more about your life than, you know. You know, because I'm a bunny stalker. Like, I just love the shit out of her. I love you. It's amazing. Like, the whole. The whole thing and how you sat there and you just, like, make the whole family work and. No, that was another thing, too. Like, I have a stepdaughter that I took her when she was 13, and that was really hard. Wow. And, you know, she became very successful. She became a lawyer. Her mom. Her mom told her. She said, if you. I wanted her to go to Disney World. The girl. Her mom was very religious and she wanted to join basketball. She wasn't allowed to wear shorts. She wanted to do this. I said, can I take her now? Mind you, fresh with a little baby. I'm 26 years old. Have a little baby. She's 13. So there's only 13 years apart from my stepdaughter. She's like, can I take her to Disney? Ramona? If you take her, you keep her. If I take her to Disney, I gotta keep her. So I kept her. So I started my marriage with a little baby and a 13 year old. That was a show.
- [102:10]
Ramona Rizzo
Oh.
- [102:10]
Bonnie
Because it was like kind of breaking her out of the curses that, you know, she stepped into with her mom. And one of the things was bringing that trauma to the house. And then, you know what? She would get away with her mom, you know, being sick all the time and not going to school. Then we had a cutting episode. It was a lot. It was a lot that went on. But again, I knock on wood because I always tell her, and not like, trying to gloat, but I'll be like. Like, I'm one of the reasons why you became a lawyer. Not only did you become a lawyer, she worked.
- [102:38]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [102:39]
Bonnie
For acs, which is for children's. Advocating for children's. Had Then had a top position with the courts. Right under the judge. Now went back to ACS to help kids again. So to me, like, I was put there to help her. You were her. Because she had no outlet.
- [102:55]
Ramona Rizzo
Now she's advocating.
- [102:56]
Bonnie
Yes, she. The kid had no outlet. Her mother was one way or the highway. And like. Like, you know, and at the end, it's like, now she's going through her own type of trauma. And again, she was a kid that went through therapy, and I knew she was working it, but again, she had to do what she needed to do. Now does she need therapy because she's going through her own divorce. I don't push her. I make her do what she needs to do because I feel like if you push it. That's why I said you have to be ready for therapy and you have to be very selective.
- [103:21]
Ramona Rizzo
Therapy is not for everybody.
- [103:23]
Bonnie
Because also, too. He could be half a kook.
- [103:25]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah.
- [103:25]
Bonnie
You got to make sure that you get the right people. Like, it's sad to say. You have to do your homework. No.
- [103:29]
Ramona Rizzo
Some of the crazy, craziest humans become psychiatrists.
- [103:32]
Bonnie
And then also, too, it's like, what makes you better to tell me about me? Like, not even being defensive. Like, no. People don't really realize if they were in your shoes, what they would do.
- [103:41]
Ramona Rizzo
Yeah. No, it's accurate.
- [103:43]
Bonnie
You know what I mean? Like, for me, they're like, well, you really were gonna get married to man in jail. At that time, I was. And we were gonna have it like, kind of televised in a way, because at that moment I was in true love and it was meant to be. Like, we did the whole thing on the show. Like, we went to go see the catering hall and all the. But certain things, real life took place between him and I. And I didn't do the show the next season, so it never happened. But, like, people always want to look like you. Like, you got 10 heads, but you wouldn't even know to operate these heads if you're in this body.
- [104:10]
Ramona Rizzo
Couldn't walk a mile. And shoes. Yeah. Ramona, why don't you tell people where they can find you online?
- [104:16]
Bonnie
Ramona Rizzo on Instagram. The real Ramona on Rizzo on Tick Tock. And that's about it.
- [104:24]
Ramona Rizzo
Thank you so much for coming on today. Your story is amazing, and I just hope that everybody in this series, that everybody can see that you guys are like real women behind the drama and that, you know, everybody loved Mob Wives and I thought that was cool. But I'm. I'm really hoping that everybody takes away little bits and pieces of you guys stories and just falls in love with you even more.
- [104:43]
Bonnie
Yeah. Just follow the. You know, if you want to be fashionable, think of as aesthetic. But trust me, nobody wants the mob wife life. It's nothing but a box of tissues and a lot of prison visits and heartache. Nobody wants it. And a lot of wasted money. Because the money that you made, you got to give it back to lawyers and you lose. Nothing is more precious than time, you know, Nothing. So people like, I want to be with a gangster. No, you don't. It's a waste. It's a waste of a life.
- [105:08]
Ramona Rizzo
Absolutely.
- [105:09]
Bonnie
Yeah.
- [105:09]
Ramona Rizzo
I couldn't agree. Thank you so much.
- [105:12]
Bonnie
I appreciate you love coming.
- [105:14]
Ramona Rizzo
You're gonna have to come back and visit me when you write that book.
- [105:17]
Bonnie
Sure, I will.
- [105:18]
Ramona Rizzo
All right.
- [105:18]
Bonnie
I'll get it to you, girlfriend.
- [105:19]
Ramona Rizzo
All right. Thank you guys for tuning in to another episode of Dumb Blonde. I will see you guys next week. Bye.