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- [00:00]
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- [00:55]
Lauren Garoni
Geico's motorcycle expertise gives me the coverage I need. Like 24. Seven claims, I'm on cloud.
- [01:02]
Chelsea Fairless
Clouds are wholly unable to support the weight of an adult human.
- [01:04]
Lauren Garoni
What's happening?
- [01:05]
Chelsea Fairless
Furthermore, clouds are not numbered. Even if you procured a jetpack and searched, you'd find no cloud numbered nine. However, at that altitude, you'd likely befriend a flock of migrating snow geese. Geese who'd encourage you to leave your 24.7geico motorcycle claims insurance behind as they would take you in and even share their dinner of crickets and clovers with you. GEICO assumes no liability for any indigestion that may occur from a clover cricket dinner. GEICO expertise for your motorcycle.
- [01:28]
Miranda
I spent $40,000 on shoes.
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Charlotte
What's the matter, Mor? Break down beautiful gowns?
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Lauren Garoni
Fashion has changed.
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Charlotte
No, it hasn't.
- [01:48]
Lauren Garoni
Hi, I'm Lauren Garoni. And I'm Chelsea Fairless. Welcome back to another episode of the Every Outfit podcast. Today is our monthly Sex and the City rewatch episode. We are doing attack of the 5 foot 10 woman. As a short person, myself, my greatest fear? A tall lady. Yeah. As a short person who's also in denial about their actual height. As previously established, an actually tall person being confronted by that, my worst fear, I actually was looking at the photos of us from your pregnancy reveal. I was like, the fact that she thought she was taller than me is really hilarious. Well, I love that you're doing that after the photo shoot. Because during the photo shoot you were.
- [02:33]
Charlotte
Like, you still think that you're taller.
- [02:35]
Lauren Garoni
Than me or we're the same height? I was like, okay, okay. So this is kind of, I feel like an important Sex and the City episode. It's the introduction of Magda. It is Carrie at her lowest and maybe her most relatable this episode is written by Cindy Shupek, who's written some of our favorite episodes. She wrote the chicken dance that we've done. She also wrote the iconic Splat boy Interrupted many great episodes. I also think that this episode is notable because it features a female director of this episode that will become rarer and rarer as the seasons go on. Her name is Pam Thomas. She directed only a few Sex and the City episodes. But I did want to note that she, according to IMDb, in 1996, directed a VH1 Fashion Awards segment called Jane Black that I don't quite remember. Well, yeah, I don't remember anything from the VH1 Fashion Awards. I should, but it's just been too long. There's a singular person who's uploaded from their VHS in its entirety, the 1998 VH1 Fashion Awards. Before we get into the episode, can we talk about fashion for a second? Of course. I feel like Carrie Season 3 style really encapsulates so many of the tropes that we associate with her. The bias cut dress, the nameplate necklace, the flower brooch. Of course. Can I be vulnerable for a second and admit that I've been thinking of incorporating a massive flower brooch into my life? Lauren, I support you. And you know where you should get one? Etsy. Etsy is the best place to find vintage clothing, custom jewelry, and handmade accessories. And that is why I am thrilled that today's episode is sponsored by Etsy. Lauren, do you know how many talented sellers are making flower brooches? I don't. Chell. How many? A lot. So many. And truly, whatever your flower brooch needs are, Etsy has it. There are flowers of many sizes, many price points, many materials. This is so great for an audio medium. Guys. Chelsea is showing me all of the flower brochures she found on Etsy right now. Wait, is that one denim? Yes. This is an especially Y2K looking flower brooch. And the flower brooch is actually something that Sarah Jessica Parker herself brought to the costuming of her character. And it's something that also carries through, no pun intended, to her personal style. That makes a lot of sense because when I think about Sarah Jessica Parker and therefore Carrie style, it's very whimsical, very romantic. And I feel like the other romantic style element of this episode is the bias cut dress. Yeah, Carrie wears a really good one in the last scene of the episode. That's right. When her and Samantha attend the Women in the Arts luncheon. Yeah, she looks hot. And bias cut dress is a really solid Etsy search. You can also add Y2K to that if you want to find dresses that look very sex in the city adjacent. And Chell, you're not the only one who's been shopping on Etsy. The thing that I love about using Etsy is the convenience of being able to refine by size and and time period. Chelsea is someone that looks incredible in a 1960s and 70s silhouette. Personally, that's not for me. I'm someone that looks better in a 1940s and 50s silhouette. And through Etsy, I'm able to search for vintage that gives me exactly that. See, I don't want to see anything from the 50s when I'm vintage shopping. And now, thanks to Etsy, I don't have to see that stuff. I also love the size filters, of course. That's a huge game changer. And another thing that Etsy really excels at is custom jewelry. Yeah, there are a lot of great sellers that make nameplate necklaces. Carrie's other iconic signature. This was a Pat Field thing that she brought to the character, which makes sense. And ironically, you nor I have ever owned a nameplate necklace. Well, I feel like it would be a bit on the nose for us now. Although, I don't know, maybe we should lean into that. I have always wanted one. Same. And with Etsy, we're able to customize our jewelry so much that I really actually think we could make the nameplate necklace our own. Yeah, there are a lot of options in terms of typefaces. There are also a lot of nameplate necklaces that have different cute little visual elements like little stars and little hearts and little butterflies and whatnot. Wow, Chell, it really seems like you've gone down an Etsy rabbit hole since I last saw you. You know, I have. And another thing I want to say is I highly recommend using the app. Use the app, utilize the favorites. Because what I do is I search for something I favorite a lot of stuff and then I go back and edit through my favorites so I don't get overwhelmed by the sheer amount of options. That's smart. I'm going to start doing that. It's really good because I feel like being able to compare things to each other. You get the best price, you get the best version of whatever you're looking for. And you know what, guys? Chelsea has made it even easier to shop for the Carrie esque pieces that we've been discussing. If you click the link in the show notes of this episode, you can prove some of the Best bias cut dresses, flower brooches, and personalized jewelry at a variety of price points that Chelsea has found on the site. Now you guys can give your wardrobe a refresh and discover new ways to express yourself with original finds on Etsy. Shop the Etsy app or go to Etsy.com okay, let's get into the episode. This episode starts out on a strong note just because it's beginning at brunch. Yeah, this restaurant looks nice. It looks better than the diner that they usually go to. This episode that we're doing is actually bookended with two previous Sex and the City rewatches. The episode that comes before is politically erect. So Carrie is coming off of sort of naming the politician who wanted to pee on her. The episode after this we did all the way back in 2022 is boy girl, Boy Girl. The bisexual episode. Also known as the bisexual episode. We're like only a few episodes before she meets Aiden. Yeah, Carrie's just in her single girl era. For some reason they are going on location for brunch. This is a breath of fresh that they're going to real restaurants, for sure. I also feel like the Carrie in this episode is a bit closer to Candace. Oh, for sure. I mean, this is definitely a Candace coded Carrie episode. Yeah. So the episode begins with a Carrie voiceover. There are a few things I love as much as Sunday brunch. You can sleep till noon and still get eggs anywhere in the city. Alcohol is often included. And it's the one day you get the single woman sports pages, the New York Times wedding section. Okay, but who actually reads that religiously? And I say that as someone that always goes to the style section first in the Sunday Times. I think because of things like Vogue weddings and Instagram. You know, if you're stalking someone you care about in their wedding, you probably have seen it on their social media before. It hits the New York Times for sure. This was old school. There are a couple of things that feel very of its time, one of which is Charlotte lamenting that the oldest woman included is 27 years old. Like, I think that that is something that has changed from this episode to now is I feel like it would be weird if someone got married at 27.
- [09:53]
Charlotte
Do you know what I mean?
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Lauren Garoni
I feel like it's more about older brides these days. I don't know if it's weird, but it's no longer scary if you're not married after the age of 30. I think we have sex in the city to thank for that in part. Honestly, we do. And this scene also feels very Candacey or from Candace's mind, because they are lamenting about the phenomenon of young women getting married and then quitting their jobs. You're right, because Charlotte is reading one such wedding profile, and it says, until recently, the bride, 24, worked as a supervisor at Ogilvie and Mather. I love how they say until recently, meaning she quit her job once she found her soulmate investment banker. I know there's a lot of talk of trad wives now, but I feel like this traffics in the New York equivalent of a trad wife, which is a woman who has some semblance of a career until she marries some finance bro and then quits. That's a common trope, especially for women like Natasha in the fashion industry. As they know, these women marry the Roman numeral guy. That's funny. And as Charlotte reads, she married Charles Duffy Anderson the Fourth. To which Samantha says, the higher the number, the worse the sex. I dated a third. He couldn't get it up. Miranda shoots back, how bad must Henry VIII have been? Carrie punctuates it with a you give him head, he cuts yours off. I love how you're just doing a dramatic reading of the entire conversation. This is some of the best Sex and the City dialogue.
- [11:31]
Charlotte
Or at least I think it encapsulates.
- [11:33]
Lauren Garoni
What made the dialogue of the show so good. Right. It's pithy. It reveals a hard truth of dating, or at least heteronormative dynamics, while also throwing in a maxim about sex that if you watch it at an impressionable age, I did. You just take as truth, like dating someone with a Roman numeral leads to subpar sex, which is, I think, why I've never even slept with a junior, even. I'm just not in close proximity to any of the Roman numeral guys. Are there even Roman numeral guys at this point? Not in la. That's an east coast thing. I feel like the Roman numeral son or the Roman numeral progeny died with, like, stretch limos. Just not in Vogue anymore. No. So Charlotte stumbles across the piece about Big and Natasha's wedding. This is all very funny, but you know, Charlotte doesn't have a great poker face, right? She. She sort of gasps and then pretends like nothing happened. Do you think it would have been better if she was like, okay, Carrie, there's something in here that may shock you. She did her best. So I guess my question to you is, what is the etiquette? Should Big have given Carrie a heads up that he was getting married. Well, he did. He invited her to their engagement party. This is true. I was gonna say they did attempt being friends at the end of season two. And Carrie lost her shit when Big said that he and Natasha were getting married. So probably not. Yeah. Rude to Natasha for sure. So Charlotte and Carrie go back to Carrie's apartment. Charlotte's like, look, girl, like, I know you're just gonna read this newspaper alone and cry, so let's just read it together and get it over with. Which I think is a very nice gesture. Oh, my God. Absolutely. And this is where, to your point, it's a very Candace coded Carrie episode because Charlotte just. She keeps giving activities they could do together to occupy Carrie's time. And she just straight up is like, don't worry, I'm not going to slip my wrist. Yeah. This is one of those moments where Carrie is the character that was originally envisioned for Sex and the City, which was the mind of Dorothy Parker in the body of Heather Locklear. Right. Yes, this is that. And I love when Carrie gets into a bit of gallows humor. It's very Candace. So they read the article. I thought that they cleverly tell their love story through Natasha's point of view as a way to not have to say or reveal Big's full name, which we won't learn until three more seasons. Big, not a Roman numeral guy. No. So we learned that while in Paris, Natasha was at, I'm sure some chic brasserie. A man sent her a bottle of Pinot Noir. That man happened to be Big. They shared the bottle. And by the end of that bottle, she knew that she would marry this man. To which Carrie says, you were drunk and he was rich. This is just bad journalism. And then we get a part of the article that is a real gut punch, Mary.
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Samantha
They did yesterday in Southampton at the bride's parents estate. There are only 50 guests. We wanted to keep it intimate. She said, just family and close friends.
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Miranda
Yeah, in the New York Times.
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Lauren Garoni
Really?
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Samantha
How intimate is that?
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Miranda
You know what? I don't hear Big anywhere in this article. Natasha's calling the shots and he's just along for the ride.
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Samantha
The bride carried Calla Lily tied with a red ribbon.
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Miranda
Well, that's nice.
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Samantha
And as she walked down the aisle, a saxophone played When a Man Loves a Woman. Well, that's tacky.
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Miranda
No, that's Big. Jesus.
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Lauren Garoni
What?
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Miranda
I wouldn't give her a working fireplace.
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Samantha
He wasn't the right man for you.
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Miranda
I know that. I know it's not him. It's the Whole wedding. And it's her, it's her, her. You know, she's just, you know, she's shiny hair, style section, Vera Wang. And I'm, you know, the sex column they run next to ads for penile implants.
- [15:59]
Lauren Garoni
I do find it interesting in this exchange that Carrie says, I don't hear Big anywhere in this article because Cari will essentially do the same thing to Big in the first Sex of the City film. If you remember, when she comes across her Vogue wedding article, she's lamenting to Miranda, I believe, during their Valentine's Day dinner. She's like, it's all I, I, I. Big is nowhere in this article. Sarah Jessica Parker's acting is just incredible. I love this sort of line about the shiny hairstyle section, Vera Wang thing. And it is a rare moment where we see Carrie be kind of ashamed of her job. I guess it's touched upon in the previous episode with the politician because he thinks that what she does is kind of low class. Clearly you're right. Between the last episode and this episode, I wouldn't exactly say that it's dealing with class differences, but it kind of is. The. The details were given about Natasha, you know, that she works for Ralph Lauren, that her parents have a Hamptons house that she could possibly get married in, and Carrie, despite her incredible wardrobe, we've has always been presented as growing up working class, for sure. And in this episode, it's established that she can't afford her wardrobe. I think what also makes season three so good and the whole storyline with Natasha and Natasha being Carrie's foil is it's presenting this idea of the complicated woman versus the uncomplicated girl. And that men, even though they will be infatuated with the complicated woman and maybe even love that woman, they will always choose the uncomplicated girl. As delulu and maddening as Carrie's behavior is throughout the series, I think her pain is very relatable because we've all been there when an ex has moved on, at least moved on with someone in a way you wish they had moved on with you. Also, he's moved on with, like, the chicest woman in New York. The casting of Bridget Moynihan is impeccable. So much of the subtext of what's going on between Carrie and Natasha doesn't need to be text because of the visual juxtaposition between these two women. Meanwhile, over at Miranda's, she's hired a Ukrainian housekeeper named Magda. Frankly, thank God one of them is shown to have A housekeeper. Because I have a hard time believing any of these women are cleaning their apartments. Carrie's just not cleaning it. In general, if anyone has a housekeeper, it's definitely Samantha. And that housekeeper has found a lot of dildos and nipple clamps. So from the get go, Magda is kind of a psychopath. She's very controlling. She's very religious. It feels like this could be the beginning of one of those A24 horror movies like the one that came out with Brandy kind of recently that I didn't see. Right. I didn't see Heretic. But wasn't that kind of as well about religious fanaticism? Yeah, I actually did see Heretic. I hated it. It's like imagine you're at a party and there's some coked up guy that's like a religious studies major that is just monologuing at you for hours. Imagine a serial killer like that. It's like, just kill me. Magda's trying to get Miranda to get off coffee and drink herbal tea. And she has brought her a rolling pin as, I guess, a welcome gift to make pies. Pies a dessert category. Frankly, that. Cookies. Sure, I'll make some cookies. But a pie, I'll always buy a pie over making one. I also want to note the cut in this scene, which I think is so cool, which is. It's a close shot of Miranda reacting to Magda. And then there's this almost seamless cut where then it's Miranda at the clothing store, but it looks like one continuous scene. And then Miranda asks Carrie if she has a rolling pin. And she's like, are you kidding me? I use my oven for storage. Which is an important bit of Carrie lore that we learn from this episode and that says everything that we need to know about her. And it's such a legit it girl thing because in your average one bedroom apartment, there is not adequate storage space for a large wardrobe. So if you visit any IT girl's apartment, there are clothes and accessories in inappropriate places. Like, I just went to my friend Queenie's house this week, and in her living room she had a rack of, like, Dior saddlebags, like a garment rack in her living room. I was also going to say, see Julia Fox's iconic apartment tour video from a couple years ago. Yeah, exactly. Also, can we talk about how good Miranda's hair is here? Like, this is when they really figured it out. I wish we could stay here forever. That deep red, almost burgundy color she's in her. What would we say? Thin White Duke era. Yes, that's definitely what the cut of her hair is giving. Yeah, it's perfect. But as we learn from Cynthia Nixon, this experimentation to get Miranda's hair color right nearly made all her hair fall out. And we really appreciate her sacrifice. It has not gone unnoticed. So Carrie is in the dressing room and, oh, no. So is Natasha. And she's trying on a very un Natasha dress. In my opinion, like, this is giving Christian girl spring. It's like a white, romantic little wrap dress. It's the kind of thing that, like, Britney Spears would wear. Do we think that Natasha and or Carrie would be shopping at the same store? Of course. All right. This embarrassing scene that we're about to get into could have been avoided if there was a saleswoman there because Carrie was simply asking for a larger size and just happened to come out in her bra and underwear, run smack dab into Natasha. So they get into a conversation. Forced pleasantries.
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Charlotte
Because it begins with Carrie being like.
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Lauren Garoni
That dress looks nice on you. Which, as you've established, is not that.
- [22:20]
Charlotte
Nice of a dress.
- [22:21]
Lauren Garoni
No, that was a backhanded compliment. Well, she didn't know what else to do, to be fair. And then Natasha's like, I'm shopping for this Women in what it is Women in the Arts luncheon because she's, like, on the committee or something. And Carrie notes that she is also a member because she is a woman in the arts. And, Chelsea, I did not realize that recently on the podcast, I referred to myself as a woman in film. And you didn't understand your own reference. That's how deep Sex and the City is in my brain. That obviously, that's what I was referencing, but that was not a conscious decision I made. So Carrie's like, I will be at that luncheon because she has to run into Natasha in a better situation. Right. Which she talks about with Samantha in the very next scene.
- [23:11]
Miranda
And now I can't find the invitation.
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Lauren Garoni
Well, why did you tell her you'd go?
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Miranda
Because I have a deficit now. I've talked to her twice. Once I was in a cowboy hat and once I was in my bra. I'm like, freaking Annie. Get your clothes on. I would just. I would like her to see me looking normal.
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Lauren Garoni
Just normal.
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Miranda
Okay. Yes. I would prefer to look amazing, but not like I'm trying amazing. Just effortlessly striking.
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Lauren Garoni
Yeah, fair enough. I get it. Yes. This is maybe one of my favorite Carrie isms of saying, I'm like, fricking Annie. Get your clothes on over here. At this point, the writers so understand the characters so well. And this idea that Samantha's like, I don't understand why you're going through all this trouble. Right. Because she asked. She goes, oh, is Big going to be there? It's Carrie's like, no, we're focusing on Natasha here. And she's like, seems like a lot of trouble for a woman, but no matter. Samantha's going to go support her friend. This also getting back to Carrie being like Candace Bushnell, we should say she is calling Samantha because even though she is a member, received that invitation. She, of course, threw it away and now cannot find it. So she is asking her publicist best friend to get the information so that they can go. And then we get the. I couldn't help but wonder, that night.
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Miranda
I modeled my entire wardrobe in my head and vetoed everything. Why did I care so much? What was it about Natasha that always made me feel like the charity case? Was it just that she had big, or was this bigger than big? I started to wonder, are there women in New York who were just there to make us feel bad about ourselves?
- [24:50]
Lauren Garoni
I think the realest part of this is when she says that she modeled her entire wardrobe in her head and vetoed everything. I do this at least once a week. Oh, yeah, of course. Why is it that, like, no matter how many clothes you buy, you always end up back there feeling like you don't have the thing you need? It's like a sickness. Because this is an unquenchable quest for us. There will never be enough clothing. That's. That's the mistake I keep making, is I think that there will be one purchase that will act as if, like, that is the purchase of all purchases. I don't need to get anything anymore. Yeah, I think that you can make better choices. So you're buying, like, more versatile clothing so you're less likely to fall into a trap like this. But still, when there's a special occasion in life, like, I don't know what the fuck I'm going to wear to your baby shower, I don't think I have anything that's appropriate for that. I somehow doubt that. But I think this also gets at the heart of having a style like Carrie, which we have idolized and I think has made us, as a reaction, become more minimalistic and develop a uniform, is when you have this eclectic of a style, this is going to happen to you, which is you're not going to have something to wear for a ladies who lunch luncheon. Well, to be fair, I think it's sort of Easier to dress like this. If this is how you authentically dress. Like this comes from your soul in the way that Carrie's style is this kind of innate thing. It's when Orando tries to emulate that style that it becomes hard to put things together. Also, it depends on how hot you are. Obviously, like, a hot person can wear literally the ugliest outfit and look amazing. Again. What makes this episode so relatable is up until this point point, we've come to idolize Carrie, idolize her wardrobe. That is her superpower. And so for her to feel less than it, really, as an audience, you can't help but sympathize with her, even though as the audience, you're like. But Carrie has everything. Of course. But even we recognize the sort of hierarchy between the Natashas and the Carries. Very true. We should get into the central question of this. I couldn't help but wonder, which is, are there women in New York just there to make us feel bad about ourselves? Absolutely. Of course, it goes without saying that we're projecting our own shit onto them. Well, in New York, there are some of the most glamorous women in the world just walking among us. And there's nothing worse. When you're having a sort of like, ugly day or an ugly week or an ugly year, and you're like, hungover at brunch, and then like, some girl walks in, like, in a vintage slip dress in, like, a current season Chanel bag, and you're like, I should just kill myself. Why did I ever leave the house? I'm never leaving the house again. Just me. I hope that one thing that comes with age. I guess what has been freeing for me is the realization of, like, even that perfect person, they have their own shit going on that they're insecure about. Which is basically the back half of this episode gets into, certainly with Charlotte's storyline. See, that's not comforting to me to know that I'm not relieved that these women have insecurities as well. And honestly, I feel like one nice thing about living in LA is that it's very rare that you see anyone hot or stylish in the way that you do in New York. Like, you'd have to go out of your way to go to, like, A Current Affair. Yeah. Or like, the sceniest restaurant in Echo Park. Or, like, you'd have to go to a store where, like, the employees look amazing, like, at the Row or Chrome Hearts or something, to find someone to be jealous of in that way. Okay, can I tell you the other.
- [28:39]
Charlotte
Thing that I do, if I really.
- [28:40]
Lauren Garoni
Need a pick me up, I remind myself that that person also probably has.
- [28:46]
Charlotte
Taken a violent shit at some point in their life.
- [28:49]
Lauren Garoni
That's good. That makes you feel better. It's nice to think about, I guess. Sometimes I'll look at Kaia Gerber and.
- [28:57]
Charlotte
I'm like, she's had bad takeout before.
- [28:59]
Lauren Garoni
And, like, been gripping the walls. You know what? She probably hasn't, Lauren. That's probably just us. She doesn't even know what like, IBS stands for, you know? She's like, is that a new kind of facial laser? Okay, so with the I couldn't help but wonder. It becomes clear what the theme is for the episode, and it is women comparing themselves to other women. I love that for Miranda, her female enemy is her elderly housekeeper. Did you see that video where someone asked, like, what Sex and the City character they most relate to and they said, magda, that checks out. Who would you say? Margaret Cho? Okay, well, I like to think I'm not that high strung. I wish I was that funny. No, Miranda, obviously. So Magda finds everyone who has a housekeeper's their worst fear, which is your housekeeper finding your goody drawer, AKA where you keep all of your sex related stuff. Well, I think it's just a given that your housekeeper finds that drawer sooner or later. This is very true. She's going to thoroughly clean everything. Can we talk about the fact that Miranda's goody drawer is completely monochromatic? It's all purple. Purple towel, purple astroglide, purple vibrator. Also, do they even still make those anymore? Oh, those kind of vibrators. Yeah, like the hard plastic ones. I'm shocked that Miranda has that vibrator considering that we're two seasons out from the very influential rabbit episode. I guess they couldn't find a purple rabbit. Yeah, and pink doesn't make sense for Miranda. Miranda is back with Steve, although Steve does not make an appearance in this epis. But Miranda feels it is very important to explain to Magda that she does have a boyfriend, which is what the condoms are about. And before the boyfriend, she knows there was a long time of no one, which is what that other thing was for. Way too much detail to give to your housekeeper. I mean, I'm sure Magda is very shocked, so that's why she doesn't comment on that. But the thing that she really seizes onto is the idea that Miranda has a boyfriend and asks if she wants to marry this man and how good being married is, which made me Think. Because the episode we did last month was one. Which is when Miranda and Steve get together in season six and Magda busts in on them and has this little Cheshire grin of like, yes. Watching these two things back to back made me wonder, Chelsea, did Magda give Miranda a complex and that's why she married Steve? Perhaps. So cut to the spa. The ladies are having a spa day. I love this for them. I know. And they're talking about the whole goody drawer debacle. Samantha divulges that she has a goody closet. Charlotte, of course, has no goodie drawer, which makes Miranda question, if she did, what would be in your goody drawer? Robert's Rules of Order. Which is something that every time I've watched the episode, I've just let roll over and been like, I'm sure that's some clever thing, but I decided to Google what is Robert's rul of Order. Robert's Rule of Order is a set of procedures that govern how meetings are run. It was created by Henry Martin Robert, an American military officer in 1876. Okay, Cindy Shupek, go off. That speaks to someone who probably had a father that was obsessed with military novels or something, because how else would you just have that at the ready as a reference? I don't know. Maybe it was like the Chicken Soup for the Soul of its day. All the Gen Z listeners are like, chicken Soup for the what? You know what? I'm going to buy an old copy of Chicken Soup for the Soul. I'm going to cut it up and make them tiktoks and it'll go viral. I've never sounded older than saying that statement. All right, back to this episode. All the ladies get into the sauna. Which made me realize, should we have a spa day? Should we have an every outfit, team building experience in the sauna? I'm not opposed. I haven't been to a spa in ages. But Charlotte is very uncomfortable because everyone is naked. Aside from her, she refuses to get naked. I don't know. I personally wouldn't care about being naked in that particular context. But I also do think it, like, makes sense to not want to be naked in public. Like, that's not something that everyone should just automatically be comfortable with. Okay. I mean, I now feel like we're role playing the Charlotte Carrey conversation because it's being naked in a very specific, yes, a public context, but a pretty private context within the public sphere, which is a women's locker room. Charlotte doesn't have a ton to do in this episode, as we've remarked in re watching these episodes, you realize that you can only really serve three of the characters a full storyline. And so someone is always getting the short straw. In this case, it is Charlotte. This is like half a storyline. I know that they like to play with the idea that Charlotte is the most stuck up or repressed, but that's the fun of Charlotte. Is she, as we've spoken about behind Samantha, kind of has the most diverse sex life. Because clearly, if there was anyone that was going to have a problem being nude publicly amongst her friends, it's Carrie. She is a sex columnist. She will not divulge her own sexual exploits to even her friends. True. But at the same time, I think Carrie is the kind of woman that would strip publicly at the Barney's warehouse sale. She would be like, that doesn't count. Which used to be a thing. When that sale still existed. Charlotte leaves the sauna. Carrie runs after her. They have a very funny conversation. Charlotte is like, I can't be nude because I didn't grow up in a nude household. To which Carrie's like, I didn't grow up in a nude household either. And then they oddly shame this woman who's simply just changing in the locker room. Oh, yeah. They're like, I bet she grew up in a naked house. She doesn't even seem like a hippie or anything where that would make sense. Kind of. No. Again, they're in a woman's locker room.
- [35:12]
Charlotte
Like, her locker door is open.
- [35:14]
Lauren Garoni
She's just getting her clothes. I guess they expect women in women's locker rooms to do that towel trick that I've seen surfers do in in movies like Point Break, where it's like you put the towel on, then you put your clothing underneath. In my experience, usually surfers just flash you. There is nothing that makes me more indignantly upset than being in a gym setting or a locker room and putting on clothing too soon. Like putting on clothing on your wet skin that's not fully dry.
- [35:45]
Charlotte
Ugh.
- [35:45]
Lauren Garoni
Nothing makes me madder.
- [35:46]
Charlotte
Jell.
- [35:47]
Lauren Garoni
So Samantha runs into a woman in the spa. This is insane. If anyone deserved to have the short straw of a plot this week, it was not Charlotte. It was Samantha. This is crazy how much time we dedicate to this. I'm into it, though. Samantha basically finds out that there's a masseuse in the spa that will go down on you. His name is Kevin. She learns this from a singular source. I would not think that this was a masseuse that offers happy endings but instead be like, I don't know. He's probably into this woman, right? So obviously Samantha is intrigued and books an appointment. At first she's like, fuck it, I don't need to pay for sex. And then sees this man and is like, all right, I'll. I'll make an appointment. What? Also, like, fair enough. I would 1000% go to like a Happy Endings massage parlor if that was like a thing for women. There is this one like, beach shack in Mykonos that is kind of giving that where all the guys are really buff. And it is kind of like the Magic Mike version of a massage. My understanding of, like, masseuse, Happy Endings for Women is exclusively as a pornography genre, Right. Every time I watch this episode and I see the masseuse whose name is Kevin, all I can think about is how that man played the father to Mary Kate and Ashley Olsen in a short lived TGIF show called Two of a Kind that I used to watch. I can't believe you remember that because I've definitely watched that show. But I would never in a million years be like, that's the dad. And the other bizarre thing is that this actor, these are his first two credits. Chelsea, it's the Sex and the City episode. And then Two of a Kind. And his name is Kevin in both of these. Love that. I went down a rabbit hole trying to find a connection. Did Sydney Shupek know this man? Like, it just. It's too oddly coincidental. Well, what else has he done? I mean, not much. Chell, his most recent credits from 2024, where he was in a podcast series called Discovering dad where he plays Dan. If he played a man named Kevin, I would have lost it. Okay, so the next scene is what looks like a little lunch date or something between Carrie and Charlotte. Carrie has been shopping at Manolo Blahnik. When I imagine Carrie, this is the scene that I imagine. That long suede patchwork coat that debuts in this episode. She will wear it again when she meets Aiden. I tried to look for an outfit credit for it. It feels like Todd Oldham. It's definitely Todd Oldham vibes. This silhouette of a long coat, short, what looks to be a vintage dress, those aviators, the Manolo Blahnik bag. The hair, the hair. The season three Carrie hair. This is perfection. And I love how she sits down with this bag and is like, char, I need your honest opinion. And she's just immediately like, you can't afford those Again, only a handful of times in this series do they discuss Carrie's sort of precarious financial state. And this is one of the episodes. Yeah. They stopped doing it at a certain point, despite the fact that in the first scene of this episode, Carrie is wearing a Chanel jacket. Chanel is a brand that has never been attainable to anyone who isn't rich, even on the secondhand market. I would say, like, sure, you could find, like, a Gaultier dress or something, but, like, a Chanel, like, suit? Hell, no. Oh, tell.
- [39:32]
Charlotte
You're sounding like Daddy.
- [39:34]
Lauren Garoni
Mpk. I'm sure he had this exact same conversation with Patricia Field.
- [39:38]
Charlotte
And I'm sure Patricia Field was like, she found it in a charity shop.
- [39:42]
Lauren Garoni
On the Upper east side. So Charlotte's basically like, you're obsessed with this Natasha thing. You've gone crazy. Yes. Because Carrie is like, these shoes will be perfect because it will put me almost at the same exact height as Natasha at this event if Natasha wears flats. And then she realizes, like, why would Natasha be wearing flats? Yeah. And she also discloses that she plans to wear it with a dress she saw at Bergdorf's that will cost a month's rent if she's able to achieve this superior look. It's not that she has a complex. It is more an obsession that will be conquered when she looks incredible at this luncheon and all her problems will go away. Chelsea. And you know what?
- [40:26]
Charlotte
Completely relatable.
- [40:27]
Lauren Garoni
Totally get it. I support Carrie in this endeavor. We should also discuss that this is a beautiful. It feels very grounded because you have Charlotte confronting and comforting her friend about her complex with Natasha. But Carrie is doing the same thing because they are at this pastry cafe where Charlotte only wants to get a fruit bowl because she hates her thighs. And, you know, she doesn't want to indulge in any. Any kind of dessert or anything. And Carrie tells her, the problem is not your thighs, it's your head. So Charlotte then attempts to go back to the spa. She is facing her fears alone this time, which, honestly, scarier. Yeah. There's actually a lot of scenes on Sex and the City where the characters have to face their fears, whether it's Carrie and the trapeze or Samantha's AIDS test. Of course. Yeah. And no one backed up these women at all. They were like, love you. You gotta face that on your own. Charlotte going to Brady's birthday. Like, a lot of these scenes on this show. So she goes into the spa, drops her towel, and immediately gets a compliment on her breast from a hot woman who says, I'd kill for your breasts. Chelsea, this is my point before you have to imagine women you envy having explosive diarrhea. You have to realize that each of these women have complexes of their own. We also, of course, have to address the fact that the role of the beautiful woman, that is how she is credited on IMDb is played by Athena Calderoni, who to my knowledge, did not act in a lot of things, but she is now a hugely influential interior designer and lifestyle influencer who gained a really, really massive Instagram following because of the way that she decorated her Cobble Hill brownstone. Her Instagram handle is called I Swoon. What a wonderfully modern day Natasha. Totally. She's very Natasha, very beige oriented. Her style of decorating is pretty similar to the goop aesthetic, I would say. It's a lot of marble, it's a lot of white boucle, it's neutrals, it's abstract expressionist art, that sort of thing. I love that when you are a interior design influencer on the level that she is, you have to move. Like, you either have to constantly redecorate your own house or you have to just leave it behind. And that's basically what she has done. She has left the Cobble Hill townhouse and is now renovating an insane apartment in Tribeca that I think is her house and also her design studio. I don't know, but I'm sure it's going to be fabulous. I'm sure whatever upcoming Architectural Digest tour will tell us exactly what this spaces, but yeah, very Natasha coated fashion wise. Also, it's like she either wears like all white or all black. I mean, imagine having that up your sleeve as an icebreaker. Like I tried acting once. I was that hot topless girl on that episode of Sex and the City. I bet when she plays two truths in a line, no one figures it out. Well, it is cool because she does own it. Like she did post a still of this on her Instagram a while back, which I appreciated, of course. Very cool. We were talking about how Charlotte was facing her fear alone. But I guess given how this episode is going, Samantha is getting a massage at the very same time, right. And seems to be annoyed as the massage is ending that she hasn't gotten her happy ending yet. So she takes matters into her own hands, which I would love to know what Samantha thought or how Samantha thought this was going to go down. Because I guess she's assuming, you know, at the end of a massage where they're like, we have like 10 minutes left. Would you like me to focus on your feet or maybe massage your head? She Just thought that's the opportunity of when he goes down on you. Well, yeah, of course, the happy ending. But there was no happy ending, and Samantha basically just grabbed his dick. Which he was not into thinking about the theme of this episode and believing that another woman is better than you. I guess for Samantha, the idea that he would go down on that woman but not Samantha is too much for her to bear. It's confusing to me also, frankly, but that it basically just cuts to her being lectured by, like, the woman that runs the spa about the fact that she's a sex offender, which is true. So many of the storylines in Sex.
- [45:26]
Charlotte
And the City could just be the.
- [45:27]
Lauren Garoni
Cold open of an SVU episode. Although I really love Samantha's line where she's talking to them and she says, I'm telling you, it was entrapment, false advertising, and blatant discrimination. You can't just randomly go down on one and not the other. I paid good money expecting to be eaten out. We stan Samantha despite her problematic behavior, but we also are against narc behavior. And she immediately narcs out Kevin because she's like, I am not a molester, okay? I know for a fact he went down on another customer. That's the whole reason I booked this appointment. Not cool, Samantha. Just be happy that you're not being arrested by stapler, okay? Yeah, I agree. I hate that she narcked on him like that. So cut to the women in what Women in the Arts luncheon. Samantha and Carrie are officially women who lunch in now. And although Carrie does not see Natasha, she does see Gloria Steinem and Wendy Wasserstein, may she rest in peace. I believe we answered this on a recent hotline episode when a caller was a little confused about the upcoming line where the woman behind the desk is telling everyone that they should wear their name tags because they had an incident. They had an embarrassing incident with Joyce Carol Oates last year. It's so funny. Why is it so funny? Yeah. And in the moment, I think when we were answering that hotline call, we were like, there's no deeper story. Like, because I remember I went in search for around this time if there was some literary incident with Joyce Carol Oates. I just think there's something about her name and getting names wrong that was just extremely funny. Yeah. I love when Sex in the City does good name dropping. And they really delivered in this scene. So they learned that Natasha isn't coming because she is sick and didn't want.
- [47:28]
Charlotte
To get everyone else sick.
- [47:30]
Lauren Garoni
Do we think that's true? Do we think she herself has a complex about Carrie and didn't want to show up? I highly doubt she gives that much of a shit. But Carrie, of course, is like, I'm the one that's sick. I put myself into debt buying this outfit. This bitch isn't even here. I mean, the fact that she's like, I might have just bounced a check to a charity. Love her. I do love Samantha, who will commit to a bit. She's like, I paid $85. I'm going to use these drink tickets. Instead of being like, all right, let's Irish goodbye out of here. What would you have done? Of course I would have stayed. You dragged me all the way here to this thing. Like, we're at least having a drink now that we're here. I do love the choice that Samantha makes, or I assume the hair and makeup team made to give Samantha a very Upper east side bouffant. Yeah, well, Samantha has that within her. So Samantha's trying to make Carrie feel better, and she finds some random girl that went to college with Natasha. And, you know, Samantha's like, tell Carrie what you told me. And it's basically just that Natasha once showered with a guy in the community bathroom and gained 10 pounds her sophomore year. Yeah, and I'm with Carrie on this one. That's supposed to make me feel better. Six years ago, she had a weight problem. And look, when people say sex in the city is problematic, this exchange is not one of the biggest offenders, but it's definitely a the type of conversation that would not happen today. Well, this reminds me, there's this kind of post that I keep seeing on Twitter and Instagram that's basically like, nothing was ever worse than the body shaming in the early 2000s, which I completely disagree with. I think it was worse before then. Way worse. Well, it was definitely more out in the open. What's that infamous Vogue diet from the 70s where it's like, I have a hard boiled egg and a glass of Chablis and a pack of cigarettes. I mean, every women's magazine was basically like eating disorder tips. At least they had mostly phased that out by the early 2000s. It was just about celebrities being too fat or too thin, which has been a theme in tabloid journalism since the beginning of time. They sort of redeem themselves at the end of this scene where Samantha says, when you get home, you'll smile because she was a porker in college. And Carrie goes, ten pounds does not a porker make. And it's like, true. Yeah, especially £10 on Natasha. We've also glossed over the beginning of this scene where Carrie is drunk and miserable at this table and this woman is trying to chat her up, and she's like, I work on the the board, and it would be so great to get you involved to work with children and help them write. And Carrie just goes, I write about sex. Is that something that they'd like to learn?
- [50:23]
Charlotte
Writing about blow jobs?
- [50:25]
Lauren Garoni
Which I'm not sure if Sarah Jessica Parker was a executive producer at this point, but something tells me that Sarah Jessica worker probably had an issue saying blow jobs. Yeah, that was probably the last time we heard her say blowjob. So Samantha then happens upon the woman from the spa, the woman that told her that Kevin went down on her. I love this reveal. Well, I love this reveal, but I also love that Samantha, a woman we've come to know, very clever, very with it, very street wise, doesn't think that narcing out the happy ending masseuse might have consequences. And so it is the woman who did get eaten out by Kevin turns to her friends and she's like, look, this is Samantha Jones, the woman who got Kevin fired. I love the one chick that says, who's gonna fuck me now? Yeah. And now they're mad because they're like, oh, we didn't know that he fucks people. Also, can we talk about. About the fact that the who's going to me now? Woman is wearing one of the most iconic Prada jackets ever from the spring 97, like, ugly collection modeled by Kate Moss on the Runway. And that's why we love Sex and the City, because even the actors in the minor roles are completely dripped out. Do you think that was a Patricia Field choice where she was like, I can't get this jacket on any of.
- [51:50]
Charlotte
The main four girls, but I'm getting.
- [51:52]
Lauren Garoni
This jacket on the show. I think it would have looked great on Carrie or Miranda personally. But also, it feels like Kevin really should be going out on his own.
- [52:02]
Charlotte
It seems like he has enough of.
- [52:03]
Lauren Garoni
A client base for his masseuse sex worker business. So after this exchange, Samantha and Carrie just kind of run out again.
- [52:12]
Charlotte
We recently did the Four Weddings and.
- [52:15]
Lauren Garoni
A Funeral episode where Samantha is ostracized from Upper east side society, which felt slightly unwarranted. This feels more warranted. It's like, how many times has Samantha been canceled within New York society, I wonder? No, it's true. It's like people are constantly chasing her with pitchforks, like her neighbors also. So we have neglected Miranda up until this point just because she is siloed basically the entirety of this episode post the dressing room scene. But she is living in her own hell with Magda. She goes to masturbate one night because Steve is, I guess, working at the bar. Okay, not like you need an excuse.
- [52:58]
Charlotte
They go on to explain like, well.
- [53:01]
Lauren Garoni
Steve's not here, so she gets to have some alone time. With her disturbing vibrator. Yeah, with her 1992 vibrator. But her 1992 vibrator isn't there because Magda has replaced it with a Virgin Mary statue. Again, horror movie fireable offense. Oh, for sure. It's a miracle we ever saw her face again. Miranda is a braver person than I think, either you or I, because she straight up confronts Magda and delivers this amazing rant.
- [53:31]
Samantha
I need a housekeeper who will clean my apartment and stop judging me because I'm a 34 year old single woman living in New York. I drink coffee and have sex and buy pies and enjoy battery operated devices. If you can't deal with that, I will find another housekeeper who can.
- [53:48]
Lauren Garoni
Okay, you would definitely confront someone if they did this to you. Yeah, but I don't think I would be clever enough to say I drink coffee, have sex, buy pies and enjoy battery operated devices. If you can't deal with that, I will find a housekeeper who can go off. Queen Magda takes in Miranda's words and rectifies the situation in her own way. A mea culpa of sorts. Miranda doesn't get an apology, but instead, the next night, when she opens up her drawer, there is a plate of artfully arranged condoms and chell. I've always remembered that there was the Virgin Mary statue in the middle of the plate. And I was like, oh, I guess I Mandela affected that. But when I read Kiss and Tell, they explained that that was the original concept, that it was going to be that plate of condoms and the Virgin Mary statue in the center. But HBO and the producer stepped in and were like, we think that goes too far. Huh, that's so bizarre. So you just remember reading about that in the Kiss and Tell book? I guess. But they never actually shot that. Seemingly not. I think it's too early to have had that digitally removed. Yeah, for sure. So back at Carrie's, she is in an all white outfit. She gets a thank you card from Natasha thanking her for attending the luncheon. And then Carrie gets the greatest gift of all.
- [55:13]
Miranda
Game over. I had to accept the fact that in life some women are simply better. And no amount of Shoes or lack of pastry or making of pies will change that. I will never be the woman with a perfect hair who can wear white and not spill on it and chair committees and write thank you notes. And I can't feel bad about that. Sorry I couldn't be there. T H E I R But I could feel good about this.
- [55:49]
Charlotte
Hello, Miranda.
- [55:50]
Miranda
It's a good thing she got married. The woman's an idiot.
- [55:55]
Lauren Garoni
Do we think this voiceover made it into Carrie's column? We haven't even gotten into. What exactly is Carrie's column this week? Because, per the voiceover that I couldn't help but wonder, it seems specifically about Natasha. Yes. This wouldn't make me feel better. It would make me feel worse that the woman that the love of my life chose over me was so stupid. All right, this gets into one of my exit survey answers, so I'm gonna bite my tongue for a second. Okay. How many Manolos? I'm gonna give it eight and a half. It's a strong episode. See, I'm giving it six and a half. And I know that seems like a low rating, but I think it speaks to the fact that the. The other episodes of this show are so outrageously good. I also am knocking it down a point because somehow both Charlotte and Samantha don't have, like, real full plot lines. And Samantha should be in jail, given her plot line. Yeah, like, I only expect three of them to have plot lines, but it only really feels like Carrie and Miranda do. Average of a 7. Although I love Carrie's perspective in this episode, her jealousy of Natasha speaks to a feeling that a lot of us can understand for sure, and is the kind of thing that is not often addressed in this way on a television show. Of course, we've had shows like Dynasty that address it in a different way. And the Real Housewives franchise. Yeah. Well, I think this is a perfect segue into the exit survey. Chelsea, who's the MVP of the episode for you? Carrie. And really, Sarah Jessica Parker for doing such great acting. See, I was gonna say Charlotte, because I feel like she was an incredibly good friend to Carrie. Not only gently, but strongly pointing to her financially irresponsible consumer habits and also her unhealthy obsession with Natasha. And on top of that, she conquered her own body image issues. Although Charlotte does ultimately become the woman that they made fun of, who quits her job the second she gets married. Like any friend group, when your friend.
- [58:11]
Charlotte
Does it, it's different.
- [58:13]
Lauren Garoni
True. Best dressed Carrie. Yeah, Carrie at the cafe in the long Suede jacket and Carrie in the red dress at the end. Also don't know who designed that dress. Can't figure it out, but it's great. Who are you voting off the island of Manhattan? Magda, you can't force your religion and your trad wife tendencies on Miranda. See? I was going to say the Virgin Mary statue. Similar vibe. Best line. Last year, we had an unfortunate experience with Joyce Carol Oates. I think for me, it's one of my. Annie, get your clothes on. Who are you? Now? The who are you? And the biggest trigger. They're sort of one in the same.
- [58:52]
Charlotte
For me, because, Chelsea, you might be.
- [58:54]
Lauren Garoni
Shocked to hear this. I'm Natasha in this episode. As someone that is grammatically challenged myself and who probably in thank you notes has confused their t H E r e and T H e I r. You know, I just. I relate to this woman deeply. Okay, but you're not that bad. I'm not great. You're definitely better than that, though. I'm just saying. And I know you are correct, if I was sending a thank you to my current husband's ex girlfriend, I would definitely read that three or four times. Maybe have a friend read it, spell check it for me. You're correct. Yeah. I'm Carrie. I get what it's like to be obsessed with wanting to look good for a specific occasion or a specific person. And like Carrie, you're always the best looking person in the room.
- [59:50]
Charlotte
Chell.
- [59:51]
Lauren Garoni
Ah, that's very sweet of you to say. Biggest trigger. What is my biggest trigger? I guess my trigger is like Charlotte being like, I hate my thighs. I'm like, we've seen your thighs. Okay. Hottest take. Samantha belongs in jail. That was gonna be mine too, but we've discussed it so much. Is that a hot take? Let me think. Maybe this is not a hot take. But I think the older I get, the more I realize the best revenge is just living a good life and being unbothered. And I know that's very difficult to do. Yeah. Who can do that? That's why it's a. It's a hot take. Well, that sounds beautiful. Best of luck with that. Thank you. Also, I like to think that Detective Benson and Stabler paid Samantha a visit after this episode. I'm actually surprised there hasn't been an SVU about a happy ending masseuse that caters to women. And if you don't think they've ever done that episode, then they've definitely not done that episode. You are an encyclopedia with SVU. SVU at this point since it's in its 26th season now. Now they're at the point where they're just straight up doing, like, different versions of the same episode. Again, like, the episode for last week was Girl in coma is Pregnant. This is the second episode that they've done with that premise. So they're running out of ideas. We might need an episode about the all female happy ending. Spa. We have to go, because I think, Chell, you and I have a spec script to write for svu, and our goop kitchen is here. All right, guys, we'll see you next week. Bye. Bye. Every.