Midlife Style Shift

Summary

Podcast Summary: Everything is Fine – Episode: Midlife Style Shift

Release Date: April 7, 2025
Hosts: Jennifer Romolini and Kim France
Title: Midlife Style Shift

Everything is Fine, hosted by Jennifer Romolini and Kim France, is a poignant exploration of the evolving identity of women over 40. In the episode titled "Midlife Style Shift," the hosts delve into personal anecdotes, societal expectations, and the intricate relationship between aging and personal style. This summary captures the essence of their candid conversation, enriched with notable quotes and key insights.

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1. Navigating Personal Identity and Relationships

The episode opens with Jen Romolini recounting a recent experience involving her friend, a middle-aged woman dating a significantly younger man. This situation serves as a springboard for discussing the complexities of midlife relationships and the shifting dynamics that come with age differences.

Notable Quote:

Jen Romolini (03:27): “If your life is a movie, you're no longer the main character. You're just like the middle-aged sidekick.”

Jen shares her discomfort and the feeling of being a peripheral figure in her friend's new relationship, highlighting the emotional toll of such dynamics.

Key Points:

• Age Differences: Jen emphasizes the challenges and feelings of disparity when middle-aged individuals date much younger partners.
• Self-Identity: The discussion underscores the struggle to maintain one's sense of self amidst changing relationship landscapes.
• Generational Gaps: Differences in slang and worldviews between generations can exacerbate feelings of alienation.

Supporting Dialogue:

Jen Romolini (05:19): "I am so old."

Kim France (06:02): "That's exactly right."

2. The Evolution of Personal Style in Midlife

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to the hosts' introspection on personal style changes that accompany aging. They discuss the pressures of adhering to societal beauty standards and the desire to find a style that resonates with their current selves.

Notable Quote:

Kim France (18:12): "Everybody says you should wear less makeup as you get older, right? I don't find that is the case with me. I want to put on more makeup as I get older."

This statement challenges conventional wisdom and opens up a broader conversation about self-expression through fashion and beauty.

Key Points:

• Style Crises: Both Jen and Kim grapple with outdated styles and seek new ways to express their evolving identities.
• Uniform Approach: They consider adopting a "uniform" look to simplify decision-making and maintain consistency.
• Fashion Accessibility: The difficulty of finding quality clothing in extended sizes is a recurring theme, highlighting gaps in the fashion industry.

Supporting Dialogue:

Jen Romolini (26:17): "Mine's totally changed. I'm just not liking it."

Kim France (26:30): "I know. It's so hard to find things that fit well and look good."

3. Parenting and Social Etiquette in Modern Times

The hosts shift focus to parenting, particularly the importance of instilling respect and social etiquette in children. Jen emphasizes setting clear boundaries to prevent children from developing disrespectful behaviors.

Notable Quote:

Jen Romolini (17:45): "Remember that you're a guest. Remember, like, the basics of being a guest. Clear your plate, ask if you can do anything."

Key Points:

• Parental Responsibility: The necessity of teaching children fundamental social skills.
• Generational Shifts: Balancing modern, child-centered parenting approaches with traditional values.
• Long-term Impact: How early lessons in etiquette shape children's interactions and societal contributions.

Supporting Dialogue:

Kim France (17:28): "Kids appreciate knowing where they stand."

Jen Romolini (18:03): "Don't treat me like that. Don't talk like that."

4. Embracing Solitude and Personal Growth

Jen discusses her recent efforts to maintain household order and personal well-being during her partner's absence. She highlights strategies to manage overwhelm and cultivate a sense of accomplishment.

Notable Quote:

Jen Romolini (42:24): "It's the key to living. And honestly, now I know I have ADHD. That's been really helpful for me."

Key Points:

• Mental Health Awareness: Recognizing and addressing ADHD to improve daily functioning.
• Productivity Strategies: Tackling tasks promptly to reduce procrastination and self-loathing.
• Self-Care: The importance of maintaining personal space and mental clarity.

Supporting Dialogue:

Jen Romolini (43:09): "The dread is so much bigger."

Kim France (43:16): "Yeah, it's like. I just have to do it."

5. Shifting Beauty Standards and Self-Perception

A conversation about beauty standards reveals the hosts' frustration with superficial expectations and their commitment to defining beauty on their own terms.

Notable Quote:

Jen Romolini (22:35): "I've been sold that there's this one conventional aesthetic... I just don't feel flouncy like that anymore."

Key Points:

• Authentic Beauty: Rejecting rigid beauty norms in favor of personal authenticity.
• Changing Aesthetics: Adapting beauty routines to align with aging gracefully.
• Self-Acceptance: Embracing one's natural appearance and resisting societal pressures.

Supporting Dialogue:

Kim France (22:35): "Women are just trying to draw themselves back in, because beauty doesn't die."

Jen Romolini (22:45): "It's the face that goes along with that, you know?"

6. The Role of Humor and Personal Growth

The hosts reflect on how their sense of humor has evolved with age, linking it to personal growth and increased generosity.

Notable Quote:

Jen Romolini (56:24): "I may be more generous with a laugh than I used to be."

Key Points:

• Humor as Coping Mechanism: Utilizing humor to navigate life's challenges.
• Personal Development: Evolving humor styles as a reflection of maturity and empathy.
• Relational Dynamics: How humor strengthens relationships and fosters understanding.

Supporting Dialogue:

Kim France (56:00): "Comedians are some of the most, you know, traumatized people."

Jen Romolini (56:39): "I don't feel that same way about middle-aged men."

7. Listener Questions and Community Engagement

Towards the end of the episode, Jen and Kim address listener-submitted questions ranging from fashion advice to personal experiences. This segment underscores the show's commitment to community involvement and personalized support.

Notable Quotes:

Kim France (55:05): "Do you want to do style episodes? We could bring in a stylist."

Jen Romolini (55:37): "How do you create that balance where you're really enjoying your own company and you're not feeling that disconnection?"

Key Points:

• Practical Advice: Offering solutions to everyday challenges faced by midlife women.
• Interactive Format: Encouraging listeners to contribute and engage with the hosts.
• Shared Experiences: Building a supportive community through shared narratives and advice.

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Conclusion: Embracing the Midlife Journey

"Midlife Style Shift" offers a heartfelt exploration of the challenges and triumphs that come with aging, particularly in the realms of personal identity, relationships, and style. Through honest dialogue and relatable anecdotes, Jennifer Romolini and Kim France provide valuable insights and foster a sense of camaraderie among their listeners. The episode serves as a reminder that midlife is not just a period of transition, but also an opportunity for self-discovery and authentic self-expression.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Jen Romolini (02:07): “I'm Jen Romolini.”
• Kim France (02:05): “And I'm Jen Romolini.”
• Jen Romolini (03:27): “If your life is a movie, you're no longer the main character.”
• Kim France (18:12): “Everybody says you should wear less makeup as you get older...”
• Jen Romolini (26:17): "Mine's totally changed. I'm just not liking it."
• Kim France (56:00): "Comedians are some of the most, you know, traumatized people."
• Jen Romolini (56:24): "I may be more generous with a laugh than I used to be."

These quotes encapsulate the episode's themes of self-identity, shifting beauty standards, and personal growth.

Transcript

[Jen Romolini]

Josie.

[Kim France]

I'm Josie Santee, health coach, wellness editor and host of the Every Girl podcast where we cut through the noise with realistic, expert backed advice to help you thrive in every category of life while still loving the person that you already are. And part of loving yourself is being really authentic to you, including the clothes you wear. In partnership with Nordstrom, we are helping you update your spring wardrobe so your style is fit for your best self. Nordstrom brings you the season's most wanted brands like Skims, Mango Free People and Princess polly, all under $100. From trending Sneakers to beauty must haves, we've curated the styles that you'll wear on repeat this spring. Free shipping, free returns and in store pickup. Make it easier than ever. Shop now in stores [e-mail] Race the Rudders.

[Jen Romolini]

Race the sails. Race the sails.

[Josie Santee]

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[Jen Romolini]

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[Kim France]

Hi and welcome to Everything is Fine a podcast for women over 40. We are your hosts. I'm Kim France.

[Jen Romolini]

And I'm Jen Romolini.

[Kim France]

And from what I understand, Jen, from what you told me, you have a new tattoo.

[Jen Romolini]

Oh, fuck off. Yes, well, you know that I have a new tattoo because you texted me and said that is the worst tattoo I've ever seen.

[Kim France]

Okay, okay. But in fairness to me, you had already expressed some disdain over the tattoo.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay, so we're just gonna have to tell the story of the tattoo which I'm like I'm okay with. So a friend of mine is middle aged and is dating a 22 year old and is in a blush of new love with this 22 year old and asked me if I would go get tattoos with them and I was like okay, but because like A certain point, like, if your life is a movie, you're no longer the main character. You're just like the middle aged sidekick. The two of them in their new sex energy got the cutest tattoos ever. And I wound up with something because they were barely paying attention to me. Because they don't care. Because they're just, they're in that fuck bubble that nothing else matters.

[Kim France]

They're like sucking each other's fingers in public and things like that.

[Jen Romolini]

Exactly. Right? So it's just like, oh, I said to my friend, like, what do you think? And my friend was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, that looks great, that looks great.

[Kim France]

But like, nobody go for it.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah, nobody cared. And so I walked out and I sent it to my sister and my sister was like, did you get a Darwin fish? And I was like, no, it's a lemon.

[Kim France]

It looks, in fairness, up close, it looks like both. Yes, it looks like both. Like, it actually looks like a very cute lemon when you see that that's what the tattoo artist was aiming for. But from a very slight distance. It looks like a fish.

[Jen Romolini]

It looks like a fucking fish. And it looks very specifically like a Jesus or a Darwin fish. Like those bumper stickers from the 90s. It's very. It's. Anyway, I wound up getting it and I just kind of walked out of the situation. And then they were like, well, we're gonna get another drink. And also they're in that new blush of love where they're just drinking and like, it doesn't matter. Like, calories don't matter. Alcohol, nothing matters because it's just, you're in this bubble, right? So I had already had like an afternoon drink with them and I'd already had like an edible. So I was just like walking home, like, slightly buzzed alone through the streets of Silver Lake. Like, just like, just a middle aged lady with a bad tattoo. So it was so wah bwa. But it is weird to. And especially because I was with this 22 year old and like, no judgment, I guess. Like, people have to do what they want to do. But, like, my friend's girlfriend's really young. And I was like, I don't even feel like the same species as this person.

[Kim France]

I know.

[Jen Romolini]

I am so old. And at one point she goes, oh, wait, how old are you? And I said, 52. And she said, oh, same as my mom.

[Kim France]

Amazing, amazing.

[Jen Romolini]

Like, I don't understand the slang that she was using. I didn't understand, like, there was just, it was, it was like being with a zygote, like it was just like. Like, I see that you are a fully formed human and you are legally an adult, but, like, you are so new to the world. This is insane to me.

[Kim France]

Well, her newness to the world is part of what's making her so appealing to your friends.

[Jen Romolini]

That's right. Exactly. That's exactly right. That's exactly right. Of course it is. It's like, that's like the fresh. Like, I get it. I can't be tricked that easily. This is why this trick wouldn't work for me. Like, if I somehow was out of this marriage and, like, I couldn't be in a relationship with someone that young, because I can't suspend my. You know, my disbelief about the world. Like, I. Or my belief about. I just can't. I understand the world, and I. I can't pretend to be in something else. Like, my friend was like, so, wait, where's cool to go dancing around here? And I was like, no. Like, really?

[Kim France]

Unbelievable.

[Jen Romolini]

Anyway, yeah, I'm really feeling. I'm really feeling my years, I will say that.

[Kim France]

But maybe not in a bad way, though, because. Would you be that young again? No.

[Jen Romolini]

Never. Never. No. And the things they're, like, bickering about, like, I was like, oh, my God, the petty jealousies, like, that you can see, even though the girl's trying to hold back, but, like, you know, you could just. You're just like, absolutely not. Like, I've moved on from that channel. Like, that is no longer a frequency I can vibrate on at all.

[Kim France]

Yeah, I get it. I get it. I totally get it.

[Jen Romolini]

But also, you're like, this is somebody else's life that I'm sort of a side character in, because they are living. They're going to live such a long life that this is just a blip in it. You know, they have so much more to live, which is also interesting.

[Kim France]

Yeah. Like, this Guy's in his 40s. Like, in 10, 15 years, she's going to be like, oh, the guys I dated when I was in my 20s. But she's decades from getting that.

[Jen Romolini]

Oh, 100%. But at some point, she's gonna be like, yeah. And my. The person I was seeing's friend came along and got this ugly lemon tattoo.

[Kim France]

That's what's gonna stick with her.

[Jen Romolini]

I mean, maybe I would remember that or maybe I wouldn't, because I just don't even care about what other. Like, my surroundings don't matter because I'm just in a different thing.

[Kim France]

Yeah.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah. So anyway, that was my weird week. And also, I went out, like, three nights in a row. Like, didn't get drunk or anything, but I was like, I'm fucking tired. This is not. This is not what I can do.

[Kim France]

Yep. No, I get it. I get it.

[Jen Romolini]

How's your week? What are you up to?

[Kim France]

Well, I had a realization.

[Jen Romolini]

Bring it.

[Kim France]

This wasn't always true about me, but I can keep a secret.

[Jen Romolini]

Wow. Wow. That is. That is some. That is new.

[Kim France]

That is new. I have in the past had a really big fucking mouth.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Kim France]

I just did. And you told me a really juicy secret a couple weeks ago. There have been circumstances when I have been very tempted to reveal it, and I have not. And this makes me feel good about myself because I was always the person who was like, blah, blah, blah, you know, talking out of school about shit.

[Jen Romolini]

That exact secret that I told you, I held for so long. Like. So when I finally did tell just you, I was like, okay. Like, I feel like I'm allowed to.

[Kim France]

As a reward for keeping it.

[Jen Romolini]

I'd been holding it for months. Yes, exactly.

[Kim France]

Yes, of course you were. Yes.

[Jen Romolini]

Yes. But I did feel guilty that it's so funny that we're having a similar. That we're having both having a relationship with the secret. Because I have felt guilty that I told you, because I had similarly been like, look at what a great secret keeper I am. And then I told you. I know.

[Kim France]

And you told me. Who has a history of being a big mouth.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah.

[Kim France]

So no wonder you felt guilty. But your secret is safe with me.

[Jen Romolini]

Wow.

[Kim France]

I am very, very proud to say.

[Jen Romolini]

I'm proud of us. How's Philly?

[Kim France]

Philly's all right. Philly's all right. You know, I have mixed feelings about.

[Jen Romolini]

This city, as most people do. That's why we'd be so aggressive.

[Kim France]

Oh, my God. There is. There is an aggression on the streets that is different than the aggression on the streets in New York.

[Jen Romolini]

Oh, 100%. It's just. It's a. It's a dial. More feral.

[Kim France]

A little more feral. Exactly. I will say, however, excellent restaurants in Philadelphia.

[Jen Romolini]

Amazing. Amazing food in Philly.

[Kim France]

Absolutely amazing food. And we ordered. We went to parc, which is like a, you know, a Philly institution. And we ordered dinner. And we both. You know, we ordered dinner. We had. Both had one drink each. And appetizers and dinner. It was as much as takeout costs us to get delivered in New York.

[Jen Romolini]

No, Philly's also affordable.

[Kim France]

Yeah.

[Jen Romolini]

You know, I mean, it's just. No, it's great. The food in Philly is great. And the aggression's a lot. Like. The aggression is. It's a lot. And it's especially a lot if you grow up in it and then you're planted somewhere else and people are like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

[Kim France]

I bet, like, that's.

[Jen Romolini]

Why are you coming at me like that? And I never thought of it as coming at a person. Like, I had no idea that that wasn't how everybody was. But that. That's a big thing. And that's kind of why I like Baltimore. Because Baltimore's like Philly, except if it was stoned.

[Kim France]

Right.

[Jen Romolini]

It's like just more. It's just got. It's just closer to the south enough that it's a little more mellow.

[Kim France]

Yep, I get that. That makes sense.

[Jen Romolini]

It's a lot to be. Especially, like, driving in Philly. I don't know if you've had, like, confrontations. I don't know if you've had people screaming at you or just people screaming.

[Kim France]

I have witnessed a lot more screaming. And definitely traffic screaming. Definitely road rage on the streets of Center City, Philadelphia. Definitely.

[Jen Romolini]

Yes, yes, yes. Like, what the fuck is wrong with you? What are you doing? You know? And it's just like, yeah, what are you, a fucking idiot? What do you fucking do? Like, just non. Nonstop. My Philly accent continues to come back. I don't know what's happening. I'm like, is this early dementia? I was talking the other day, I was like. I was like, yeah, I gotta order that. And I was like, oh, my God, order. What is wrong with me?

[Kim France]

I know. Well, sometimes my Texas accent still comes out a little. Very rarely just comes out. It's in you.

[Jen Romolini]

He does. It's true. So you have mixed feelings about Philly. How much longer are you there?

[Kim France]

I am here today is Wednesday. I am here till Sunday morning.

[Jen Romolini]

Oh, it's long trip.

[Kim France]

It's a long trip. Well, Paul's students have a couple big shows this weekend.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay.

[Kim France]

So we're here for the, you know, for the lead up to the shows.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah, that sounds good. That sounds fun. Well, the shows. The shows will be fun.

[Kim France]

The shows will be fun. They're doing Talking Heads.

[Jen Romolini]

Oh, that'll be amazing.

[Kim France]

And it is. The songs they're doing, I'm pretty sure are the versions that are on. Stop making sense. The live film.

[Jen Romolini]

Oh, wow. Wow. You know, Gen Z really likes Talking Heads is what I've been noticing lately. Like, I mean, from my, My. My very small focus group, but Gen Z, it's funny. The music that Gen Z will accept will embrace Accept. Exactly, exactly. Like, they were my friend and their. My kid and were listening to the Cardigans the other day and I was like, oh. Like, that's like. I didn't.

[Kim France]

That's so funny.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah. I was like, that's interesting. And Charlotte was like, yeah, I love this. And I was like, okay. Or like, the Breeders is a big one.

[Kim France]

Yeah. I knew that because Olivia Rodrigo had them open for her on her tour. And when they got the call about it, they were like, is she sure?

[Jen Romolini]

Right, Right. The Cranberries. Like that. There's a certain lane that I feel like is very, like, Gen Z coded, that they're just really into it. I don't know why, but.

[Kim France]

Steely dad.

[Jen Romolini]

Because then other things. Yes. The other thing. Charlotte would be like, what are you playing? Like, this is horrible.

[Kim France]

What does she say that about?

[Jen Romolini]

There was. I don't remember what. There was. I was like, playing just like. I don't know, just like some normal music from, like a playlist, you know, just like anything that's not from anything that's sort of modern and not from our era. Anything that we would like in print present day, my kid hates. You know, basically, that's the. That's how. That's how it usually goes down. Like, even like I was playing Bob Dylan, actually, and Charlotte was like, what? I don't want to listen to this. Or like, Nick Drake is not. Is not approved of. I don't know. There were like, things that were just, like, absolutely denied. Charlotte called me an old lady today, and I was like, you know what? I don't like that.

[Kim France]

Yeah.

[Jen Romolini]

And Charlotte said, well, I didn't like when you called me an asshole last weekend. And I was like, okay, it's a push. Let's stop calling names.

[Kim France]

I love these moments where that.

[Jen Romolini]

That.

[Kim France]

That parents have with their children that are so adolescent. Like when their kids call them on something, you know?

[Jen Romolini]

Exactly, exactly. I don't think most parents call their kids assholes. And I was like, you were acting.

[Kim France]

Well, see, you didn't call her an asshole. You said she was being assholic. It's very different.

[Jen Romolini]

I mean, I did. I did say. I did say stop being an asshole.

[Kim France]

Okay. So, you know, she understands. I'm just not going to feel bad about. I mean, I'm not going to let you feel bad about that because I just think she understands in the context of your relationship that you do not think she is an asshole.

[Jen Romolini]

I think that. I think that it is a parental responsibility to help your children, among many, many other things. But to really help them not be assholes. Like, I think that it is so, so important and underrated in this time. The trends of parenting and, you know, child centered and everything else to point out. Hey, you're being an asshole right now. Yeah. Don't be an asshole. Don't, don't, don't treat me like that. Don't talk like that. Yes, you have to share a bathroom sometimes, you know, like just like shit that you just can't let get out of control.

[Kim France]

Yeah, no, I think that's really true. I think that's really true. And kids, when they're in your home, you know, when they're growing up, it's like they're in training to be citizens, you know, and it's your job to help them be better citizens.

[Jen Romolini]

My kid had people over, over the weekend and I saw them clear a whole table like of pizza box and like pizza, like plates and cups. And I was like, okay, like none of the other kids, none of the other kids like, stepped up to clear their plate. My kid cleared the whole table and I was like, that's right, there you go. That's an important part of being. And every time they go to somebody's house, I'm like, remember that you're a guest. Remember, like the basics of being a guest. Clear your plate, ask if you can do anything. You know, just that shit. I feel like that stuff is. I don't mean to be again, like Andy Rooney, but I feel like that stuff is really being neglected.

[Kim France]

Yeah. In the name of not upsetting your child's delicate equilibrium.

[Jen Romolini]

Exactly. And I'm hardcore. I have like a very absolutely not list. Like absolutely not. No, you can't do that. Nope, I don't care. Can't do that.

[Kim France]

I think kids, I don't think they may be in the moment, but I do think kids appreciate that. They appreciate knowing where they stand. I think.

[Jen Romolini]

Well, I think later on they appreciate not having somebody else have to tell them that they're an asshole. You know, like not having the humiliation of not having like basic respect for people and having a hard time in the world because they don't have basic respect for people and they don't know that they're supposed to.

[Kim France]

Right, right.

[Jen Romolini]

I think that does them a pretty massive disservice. Anyway, those are the things that are on my mind ish this week.

[Kim France]

Well, here's another thing that's on my mind.

[Jen Romolini]

Go.

[Kim France]

I've been thinking about. And this is good. Since you're a beauty expert. Everybody says you are, though. Everybody says that you should wear less makeup as you get older, right? I don't find that is the case with me. I want to put on more makeup as I get older.

[Jen Romolini]

I mean, that's interesting. Like more makeup in what kind of makeup? Like more like skin concealers. More like what? More blemish? Concealer? Like that kind of a thing or what?

[Kim France]

No, like not just mascara, but eyeshadow and eyeliner, you know, I mean, I think that's great.

[Jen Romolini]

Like, I think that these rules are not. I think that none of it is universal. I think you can't make a universal skincare recommendation.

[Kim France]

Right.

[Jen Romolini]

I think you can't make a makeup recommendation. You know, like you don't have really hooded eyelids. I think that as your eyelids get more hooded, sometimes makeup can make exacerbate that look, you know. But at the same time, I was staring at Kim Gordon. I was watching her and John Mulaney last week and I was staring at her face. Oh, so good. I was just like staring at her and I was like, God, she looks good. Like she just looks like. I know she's had. We all know she's had work. Anybody who like studies faces and is a freak about that shit is like, oh, she probably had a facelift. But she looks good for an older woman. Like she just looks herself and she looks cool, right?

[Kim France]

She has, she has some of the greatest legs I've ever seen.

[Jen Romolini]

I mean, well, that for sure. But she specifically is still wearing like really heavy black eyeliner. And like most people will tell you not to do that, but I was like, this fucking looks cool. Like it's just, you know, it doesn't matter that it maybe makes her eyes look more squinty. She's not looking to look like a doe eyed like Instagram filter. She's looking to look like a cool chick that she's always been.

[Kim France]

Exactly, exactly.

[Jen Romolini]

So I think that that's interesting, but I also think it just doesn't matter. I think whatever is working for you and you feel like you feel good in. I do. I'm in like a whole. I'm still back in a whole crisis. I had a whole conversation with a really close friend on Friday. She came over during the day and I kind of played like half day hooky and we just, we went out to lunch, whatever. And she was like talking about like how the clown look, which I adopted early in middle age, is now like a mark ass mark of like just being older. It's kind of like the little red glasses, the like the bright colors the, you know, the patterns, the loud jewelry, the whole fucking thing.

[Kim France]

I mean, I find it all really poignant, you know, all the bright colors, the red glasses, everything else. Because there are all kind of things that are saying, you know, I'm still here.

[Jen Romolini]

The pink hair. Yeah, you're right. You're right, you're right. You wrote about this. The thing is, I'm still processing things you've already gone through. You wrote about this so. Well, years ago with the. When you wrote about the blue eyeshadow in New York magazine. Do you remember that piece you wrote? I remember.

[Kim France]

I wrote about. I wrote about aging and vanity. Yes. I wrote about how I saw, like, old ladies on the street. And you see them and their makeup is so poorly applied. They've got, like, a couple slashes of. Yeah, you're right. The blue mascara and the blush.

[Jen Romolini]

The blue eyeshadow.

[Kim France]

Yeah, blue eyeshadow and the, you know, blush applied too heavily in. In a circle. And I thought, like, to me, that looked like women just trying to draw themselves back in, because beauty doesn't die. Beauty fades, you know, which is in many ways much harder to deal with.

[Jen Romolini]

Or it changes. Right? Like, that's the thing. We've been. We've been sold that there's this one conventional esthetic or, like, you know, five conventional esthetics that we can. We can subscribe to and, like. But they're all you. All. You have to be young to pull any of them off. You know, it's like, I feel like it's just a different kind of beauty. Like, I do find older women really beautiful. And, like, honestly, I don't want to be around this. I have so little interest in being around that, like, dewy, fresh face that, like. Like, just everything that goes along with it.

[Kim France]

Yeah.

[Jen Romolini]

Because it's just so new. It means so it's so light. It's like. It's. It's. It's frivolous and not even an interesting way to me. And the face goes along with that, you know?

[Kim France]

Well, and the face still. You know how babies and baby animals are made, are cued on purpose so that their parents won't abandon them.

[Jen Romolini]

Yes.

[Kim France]

Like, when I meet somebody that age, they still. They're still babies, you know?

[Jen Romolini]

Yes, yes.

[Kim France]

They still have baby in their face and baby in their behavior.

[Jen Romolini]

Yes, exactly. So my friend and I were trying to figure out what the look was. Right. Like what? Okay, so what the hell are we gonna do here? Because this clown clothes gotta go. The lady playsuits. The lady play clothes. Like, I'M done, I'm out, I'm done. Like, I did it for the early stages of middle age and like, I'm now like, I need something new. I need something like, slick, whatever. So we're having this whole, like, crisis and, like having this whole conversation and we start texting each other, we start sending each other over Instagram, possible looks. And at one point she sends me a picture and it's like, it's the cast of Severance, but they're all the. The women are in menswear. And she goes, maybe the look is baby bisexual femme David Byrne. Right? And I was like, oh, that's, that's interesting. And then the next day she goes, so I sent this DM to you with this image late last night with the caption, maybe the look is baby bisexual femme David Byrne. But I accidentally sent it to a guy.

[Kim France]

Oh, I've been there.

[Jen Romolini]

It was like, she was like, it's like that we're having to like work this out. But also with middle aged brain. Oh my God, it's so funny. Yeah, man. I don't know. I don't know what the look is. I really, I can't. I'm in like a little bit of crisis. I don't know what it is. Is it. Am I trying to be like a Kim Gordon? Am I gonna start wearing like a tie? Where am I, in space?

[Kim France]

Yeah. I think you've been actually shifting the way you dressed for, for a while. I don't think you've dressed in clown wear.

[Jen Romolini]

You know, it's been like two years.

[Kim France]

Yeah, you're not, you're not doing that the way you used to do that. And you actually used to do that and make it look really cool. Not actually. I mean, you did.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah. You can up until a certain age, then it becomes something else.

[Kim France]

Then it becomes something you don't want it to be.

[Jen Romolini]

Yes, it does. Then it becomes a cookie. Like, oh, look, I'm the cookie old lady.

[Kim France]

I know.

[Jen Romolini]

It's the same thing as orthopedic shoes that were once like, oh, it's granny chic. Ha ha ha. Like, this is ironic. And then suddenly it's no longer ironic, it's just granny.

[Kim France]

No, I mean, that's why I haven't ordered another pair of Warshofer shoes. Because I'm over 60, I'm now the target market.

[Jen Romolini]

I know, I know. An old foot looks different in that shoe than my 30 year old foot did. Yeah, it's really these little, these subtle, like style shifts are. I'm like fascinated by them. I mean, obviously, everybody should do whatever the hell they want to do. I don't care what anybody else does. This is just for me. And I can feel that I've hit, like, some kind of inflection point, and I'm like, in a new period of adjustment of, like, what do I look like in my mid-50s? Because that's really where I'm at.

[Kim France]

Yep.

[Jen Romolini]

It's different than my. It's different than my 40s.

[Kim France]

Sure. It's absolutely different. I mean, I even feel like my 60s are different than my 50s, and I'm just barely into my 60s.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah. I'm like, okay, maybe it's just, like, the one. Same color palette and everything. I think it's going to uniform. I think it's fucking going to uniform.

[Kim France]

Well, that's been my solution.

[Jen Romolini]

I think it's the only way.

[Kim France]

I was looking on Instagram today, on my page, my profile page, looking for something I'd posted years ago. And so I start scrolling back, scrolling back, scrolling back on Instagram. I get to, like, 20, 18, 2019. I'm like, oh, the skinny years, you know?

[Jen Romolini]

Right.

[Kim France]

And I saw how much fun I had with. How much more fun I had with clothes then than I have now, because clothes now are about, you know, some of it's about looking cool, but it's about providing a solution, you know?

[Jen Romolini]

Right. Right. I mean, I, I. There's. There's limitations in, you know, when clothes are all made for people who are a size 2. There's limitations if you're not that size or if you're not in those sizes. And then there's limitations as you get older because things just don't. Look, there are, like, all kinds of limitations in terms of, like, I don't. I don't know how much I'm loving my upper arms. And that shirt really requires a lot of upper arm, you know, like. And so. And then there's like. And then there wind up being other things. Like, that just doesn't feel right to me. That's not how I want to present to the world. I just don't. I don't feel flouncy like that anymore.

[Kim France]

I get that. You know, I get that.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah. So that's why the uniform works. Because once you nail down a couple of things, you're like, this is. I'm sticking here. I'm just. This is where I'm staying. Because this feels good. I know it works. And I don't have to, like, think about it too much. Yeah.

[Kim France]

And I know I look good Right.

[Jen Romolini]

And that is, that feels increasingly like, I'll buy. I bought 10 things from Mango. They had a big sale recently and two worked.

[Kim France]

Yeah.

[Jen Romolini]

You know, so it's like increasingly it's fewer things that things I thought always worked and just like. No, no, because it's even like I'm not even loving showing a ton of like, chest skin.

[Kim France]

I get it. Chest skin changes.

[Jen Romolini]

I'm just not liking it. Yeah, it's. Mine's totally changed.

[Kim France]

Yeah, I get that.

[Jen Romolini]

So now it's like, how do you dress? I don't know. It's very confusing. And again, like, I don't. I really, I don't feel any certain way about how anybody makes their decisions. It's just I'm grappling with how I'm feeling. You know, this is not like a blank. These are not blanket rules for anybody else's body at any age. I just am like, what's going to make me feel good style wise? And I feel a little bit lost in that forest right now.

[Kim France]

I get that. I find so many of the designers I like. I am the biggest size they make. It's totally changed how I shop. And I can't shop at some designers I used to like because they are brands. Because their size 12s are a small. Size 12 or their larges are a small. Large.

[Jen Romolini]

Right. It's like. And they don't have extended sizes because few brands do. Few smaller brands do.

[Kim France]

Yeah, a few smaller brands, I mean, some, like madewell have gotten much better, but even people say that they're getting worse again, that, you know, that people were making an effort for a while and now they're making less of one. But I did a swimsuit post a while ago and I always make sure that at least some of the things that are in any post, I do have our extended sizes. But this one post, out of 10 swimsuits, eight were available in extended sizes. So that's pretty good.

[Jen Romolini]

That is pretty good. I mean, look, this is a larger conversation about what Ozempic is doing to us as a society and how thin is back in. I mean, we are, we are. From what I'm looking at, we are back to like Kate Moss, 90s like that. That's what it looks like to me.

[Kim France]

And I think Vanessa Friedman just wrote a piece in the Times saying the exact same thing based on the fashion shows that just happened.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah, it's. And just from the feedback, just from talking to teenagers, like, I can hear the way they're talking about it and I. It's alarming. To me. It's alarming to me how it seems like we are going backwards and we're going backwards in every fucking way.

[Kim France]

In every way.

[Jen Romolini]

Let's take a quick break from some ads. Support for Everything Is Fine comes from Ritual so listen, I literally test skin care products for a living. I am constantly trying new things. Lotions and potions all over my face and most of them are junk. Let's be honest with each other. Which is one of the reasons I love Rituals Hyacara, which is a multi step skin care in one daily. It's a multi step skincare routine basically in one daily supplement and it also features two of the best clinically studied ingredients shown to help minimize wrinkles and hydrate skin. I love Ritual. I've been using Ritual products for years. I've been taking their supplements. I love the Melatonin. I love the daily multi. The products are clean. The the tablets themselves go down easily. I really just think this is a great supplement product that has taken a lot of the guesswork out of supplements for me. And Haasera is a once daily skin supplement like I said, that's clinically proven to reduce fine lines and increase skin smoothness in 90 days. So you can support your skin from the inside out with one daily capsule essence with soothing vanilla. Which is kind of delicious, right? Rituals products are also rigorously tested and validated by a third party party for allergens, microbes and heavy metals so you can start Hyacinth to support your glow without compromising on clean science. Get 25% off your first month for a limited time at ritual.com fine. Start ritual or add Hyah to your subscription today. That's ritual.com fine for 25% off.

[Kim France]

Josie.

I'm Josie Santee, health coach, wellness editor and host of the Every Girl podcast where we cut through the noise with realistic, expert backed advice to help you thrive in every category of life while still loving the person that you already are. And part of loving yourself is being really authentic to you, including the clothes you wear. In partnership with Nordstrom, we are helping you update your spring wardrobe so your style is fit for your best self. Nordstrom brings you the season's most wanted brands like Skims, Mango Free People and Princess polly, all under $100. From trending Sneakers to beauty must haves, we've curated the styles that you'll wear on repeat this spring. Free shipping, free returns and in store pickup make it easier than ever. Shop now in stores [e-mail] does it.

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[Jen Romolini]

And we're back. I see whatever the spokeslady is for trump, the like 22 year old, she's probably 27. Let's, let's be generous. The 22, 27 year old, like Barbie looking, whatever. She, the person who gives like the press briefings and she, somebody asked her about DEI and you know, she was like, you know, disparaging dei and then I saw somebody point out, like, you wouldn't be here. Like, diversity just means that like you, that women get to have jobs and people of color get to have, like, there's so, so many of the people, like supporting this administration are going so against their best interests and have no idea that that's what they're doing.

[Kim France]

I know, I know. I mean, I, you know, I was talking last week, the week before about the couple I know who I found out voted that way, and I can't believe it. Of the woman. I can believe it. Of the man. I can't believe it. Of the woman. I can't believe it. Of most any woman.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah, no, of course you can't. Of course you can't. Speaking of women, you know, who's looking amazing right now and looking amazing meaning, like in all ways is aoc.

[Kim France]

Yep.

[Jen Romolini]

I've been like watching her out there. She went on that, she's on that tour with Bernie and just watching her just like, you know, she's been around for a little while now. She's still kind of young, but she's starting to really like, come into her own in a really interesting way. You know, just like, even the way she's walking, you can just see there's like a centeredness to her and like a determination. And she's honestly like one of the only things that's giving me any sense of hope right now.

[Kim France]

Yeah, it's gonna be the kids. It's gotta be the kids. It's not gonna be fucking Chuck Schumer, that's for sure.

[Jen Romolini]

It's not gonna be Nancy Pelosi. It's just, I mean, you know, God love them and God love you. Thank you for your service. But no, it's not gonna be. It's not gonna be them. That's not what's gonna happen. I think we have. Oh, wait, we have to do our thing. Things that don't suck. Yay. All right. Things that don't suck this week. Okay. Yes, Go.

[Kim France]

Okay, so this is the thing that I think is not going to suck.

[Jen Romolini]

Yes.

[Kim France]

And it's Michelle Williams new series on FX called Dying for Sex.

[Jen Romolini]

Oh, my God. I can't wait to see it. I can't wait to see it. With Jenny Slate.

[Kim France]

Right, With Jenny Slate. And she plays a woman who finds out she's got stage four breast cancer and metastatic breast cancer. And she realizes, like, she's never had an orgasm with another person in her life. She has no idea what turns her on. So she goes on a kind of vision quest to figure out what turns her on.

[Jen Romolini]

I can't. I really. I can't wait to see it. Like, I cannot wait to see it. I think it looks so good. And she's always good.

[Kim France]

Yeah, she is.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay, so I have things that don't suck, which is going out to dinner by yourself along with a second things that don't suck. Irish goodbyes.

[Kim France]

Irish goodbyes are the best. Totally the way to do it. Just get out. And the opposite of a Jewish goodbye, a Jewish goodbye is when you never leave.

[Jen Romolini]

Oh, well, Italian. I don't even know what Italian Americans do. Yes. You never get out of there. You're hugging. Oh, yeah. Like, you're, like, almost re. Entering the party on upon exit. You know, it's like. It's awful. I went to a birthday party on Saturday night, and I was like, I'm not up for that. I was by myself. Alex was out of town. I was like, I'm not up for this. I'm not up for this. Walked in, talked to the host. Like, you know, met a couple of people. And then there was, like, a lull. I was there for like a half hour. There's a lull. And I was like, that's it. I'm gonna go.

[Kim France]

Perfect. Perfect.

[Jen Romolini]

Just backed out. And then I took myself out to dinner and I just went to this little Cuban restaurant in Atwater. Cause I was nearby there and just walked in, had, like, had hot tea with my dinner. Like, had a delightful, delightful dinner. Didn't even look at my phone. Cause my phone was dying, and I needed it to get an Uber home. So, like, kind of just like, eavesdropped on other people's conversation and just kind of spaced out and, like, ate a lot of food by myself. Felt like a part of something, but also, like a lot of solitude, because solitude is delightful and just had the best time, paid the check and, like, walked out into the night.

[Kim France]

So great.

[Jen Romolini]

So good.

[Kim France]

That's totally great. I love that.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah, yeah. More people. We should do more of it.

[Kim France]

Yeah. I think dining alone is good and important. And just having.

[Jen Romolini]

Your.

[Kim France]

Having solitary not equal lonely.

[Jen Romolini]

Exactly, exactly. That is the thing. How do you create that balance? Because especially if you work from home, it's like, how do you create that balance where you're really enjoying your own company and you're not feeling, like, that disconnection, you know?

[Kim France]

Yep, yep. Exactly. Precisely.

[Jen Romolini]

It's a hard balance. It's a hard balance to hit. Okay, your turn.

[Kim France]

Okay, so I hate read Graydon Carter's memoir excerpt in New York Magazine last week.

[Jen Romolini]

Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

[Kim France]

And I am totally not going to buy that book. I hate Graydon Carter. I think he's a pig. That's a little excessive. I didn't like him. I didn't care for him. But it reminded me of Tina Brown's Vanity Fair diaries, which are totally a fun read. Okay, so that's the thing that doesn't suck. Tina Brown's Vanity Fair diaries.

[Jen Romolini]

One time I was in Paris, years after I was working for Conde Nast, and we were sitting at the bar in a restaurant in Paris with Charlotte, like, in the front room of this restaurant, and we were just like, oh, that looks good. Why don't we go there? And Graydon Carter walked in with, like, five people, and I was like, oh, we must be in a really good restaurant, you know, like, but, you know. Yeah, I mean, I guess I have a little bit of, like, nostalgia for what he did, you know, and what Vanity Fair was. Because I think Vanity Fair, like, I enjoyed it even though it wasn't that good. It was like, it was like a reliable thing that you. You knew what it was. It knew what it was.

[Kim France]

Absolutely.

[Jen Romolini]

And it was. And it was reliable. Like, the way magazines were just reliably enjoyable. Like, Esquire was reliably enjoyable every month, you know? Like, it just was. It's again, how much I miss magazines.

[Kim France]

I get it. I get it. I liked. I liked. I mean, I always looked at Vanity Fair, that's for sure. I just, you know, I just. I found him yucky. I found him yucky. Yeah. I miss magazines, too, obviously. Even though I don't think I could sit with a magazine the way I used to because of the way our.

[Jen Romolini]

Brain questions have changed.

[Kim France]

I can sit with books. I can sit with books. So that's encouraging. But, yeah, anyway, what's your next thing?

[Jen Romolini]

So my next thing is. And then I have one product, Rick. But my next thing is just doing shit. Like, I've just, I've. I've been challenging myself. Alex was away and when Alex goes away often the house just like goes to crap. Like, it's just like whatever his jobs are that he normally does. I don't do. Like, say, like, if there's boxes come in, I don't break them down. You know, I just let them pile up. Or I just. I let things pile up, right? And so I just. Last week he was out of town for five nights and I just. Every day and every night when I saw something, I did it. I just did it. I was like, okay, that needs to be dealt with. I'm just gonna deal with it. I've been trying more and more to just deal with things like, okay, instead of letting all these dishes pile up in the sink and then doing them at the end of the day, why don't I just make this easier for myself and just clean up a little bit in the, in the middle of the day, like whatever the hell it is. The thing that annoys me that I don't feel like doing, I've just been immediately doing. So it doesn't become a larger issue that I then dread and then go through the cycle of like procrastination, self loathing, don't wanna do it. And then it's like this long task that is, you know, arduous.

[Kim France]

I think that's great. I think that's great. I am trying to do that in my own small way.

[Jen Romolini]

I think it's the key to living. And honestly, now I know I have adhd. That's been really helpful for me in the last couple of years. Saturday, when I had all these chores to do when he wasn't here, I was so overwhelmed and I was starting to be a bitch because I was so overwhelmed. And I was like, oh, I'm just overwhelmed. I just need to just take a breath. I know that I'm just going to get this all done. The laundry's gonna get done. I'm gonna, you know, you can just do things instead of the doing of things becoming bigger than you.

[Kim France]

I know. And the dread of anything that you have to do is never as bad. I mean, it's never as bad when you actually do it. You just do it and it's fine. But the Dread is so much bigger.

[Jen Romolini]

The dread is so much bigger. And the avoidance makes the dread even bigger. It's like. It just, like, fans the flame.

[Kim France]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Jen Romolini]

It's like. So anyway, so that's. That's just doing shit is my. Is my new thing.

[Kim France]

Okay. Okay. My next thing is a book. It's not. It's been out for a few months. How to Be an Artist by Jerry Saltz, who's the New York magazine art critic and seems like a really cool guy. And it's just a really, like. As I try to get more into my actual, you know, creative writing, it's really helpful to read somebody who's, like, giving you permission to be an artist, to call yourself an artist, to make mistakes. You know, it's just. It's a really, like, kind of fun and unintimidating book about, you know, how to turn yourself into an artist, how to take yourself seriously as one.

[Jen Romolini]

I'm gonna pick that up because I love those kinds of books. And similarly, I will plug Beth Pickens book Make youe Art no Matter what, which is similarly, like, very approachable, very, you know, pragmatic and gentle and. Yeah. Because I do think having some kind of creative practice for most of us, even if you don't identify as a creative person, is a really useful, nourishing, balancing thing to do in your life.

[Kim France]

Absolutely. I think. Absolutely.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay. My last one is. I've been obsessed with a new sunscreen, the Tula T U L A. They sent me their new line of face sunscreens. They're all amazing. Like, the one that's like a. They're like skincare, you know, skincare sunscreen hybrids, but potent sunscreen. The cream is just, like, pillowy and amazing. There's like, one that's more of, like, a serum that has, like, a pearliness to it that makes your face look glowy.

[Kim France]

Wow.

[Jen Romolini]

It's just really, really good face sunscreen. If anybody's looking in the market, I'm going to. I'm right now testing for the best sunscreens of the year. I'm going to name it the best face sunscreen of the year.

[Kim France]

It's.

[Jen Romolini]

I can't imagine anything coming close. It's not chalky, it's no white cast, but it's really skin conditioning. I'm obsessed. It's a little expensive, but I'm like, oh, this feels so good that I want to keep this feeling up. So I'm gonna pay $40 for it.

[Kim France]

I get it. I get it. That sounds amazing. I wanna try it.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah, I want you to try it. Okay, what else?

[Kim France]

That's it. That's my list.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay, great. Guess what we do now. We're gonna get you some listener questions.

[Kim France]

All right, let's go for it.

[Jen Romolini]

All right. We have some from our Patreon.

[Kim France]

Oh, good.

[Jen Romolini]

Yes. Okay, number one. Do either of you have a Hunza G swimsuit? The one that fits all crinkle suit. Have you ever tried that?

[Kim France]

I know what they're talking about, and I have never tried it. I don't think it would be a.

[Jen Romolini]

Successful experiment or the Erez, The Ares suit. E R E S. I bought an.

[Kim France]

Eris suit once when I was staying at the Four Seasons in Beverly Hills when I was at Lucky, and it was worn and I wanted to go in the pool, and I didn't bring a swimsuit. And this gift shop had ERAS swimsuits, which were idiotically expensive. And I bought one then, and it was a nice swimsuit, but I would never spend that kind of money on a swimsuit again.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah, me neither. I just don't care. I have looked at the crinkle suits, and I got a knockoff crinkle suit. And it. The problem for me with it is unless you're feeling like, man, I love my ass. My ass is the best looking thing in the world. They really kind of cut up high on the cheeks, and I just didn't want to show that much butt. Honestly.

[Kim France]

I get it.

[Jen Romolini]

I mean, that might be somebody's thing, but it was not for me. Okay, how are Kim's R I K a Rika studio purchases holding up?

[Kim France]

Oh, I bought a jacket in the fall when we went to Amsterdam. Rika's studio is a store there. I love that jacket I bought. It's holding up great.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay, great. So someone was, like, saying they want to buy a couple of her pieces, and they're exploring and they wanted to know what you thought of the quality. Okay. Thoughts on necktight versus Ultherapy versus Kybella. Have you tried any? I need to tighten my jowls. I have tried Ultherapy and I had an amazing result from it, but it was like I was only 45, so I don't know what the result's gonna be now. I am about to go in and try Softwave next week. I think Kybella, I never tried because first off, I was a little grossed out by it because you have to inject that weird fat. But also you get the goiter. You have to accept that for a day you're gonna have toed neck. And I thought that Was weird and honestly, necktight I haven't even looked into. But I Probably something I should.

[Kim France]

Yeah, Kybell is very tempting, I gotta say.

[Jen Romolini]

I mean, it works. I know it works.

[Kim France]

Yeah.

[Jen Romolini]

And what it does when it gets rid of your double chin, when it melts all that fat, it tightens your whole neck.

[Kim France]

Ugh. I want that so much.

[Jen Romolini]

That's what they told me. I just. I just was grossed out by it. I was like, that's weird. But maybe it's good. I mean, it's better. Probably better than fucking everything else. Botox and everything else.

[Kim France]

Yeah.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay. All right. And finally, this is our final one here, and then we'll move over to Facebook. Any more credence to the Barack and Jennifer Aniston rumor?

[Kim France]

I have no credence whatsoever. I have no evidence that is true. It brings me pleasure to believe it, so I choose to believe it.

[Jen Romolini]

I believe in my heart that it is not true. I think that it is absolutely not true. And I do think maybe she's dating Pedro Pascal, which. Which I'm like, good for you. Jennifer Aniston, if that is the truth.

[Kim France]

Yeah, she's batted. Her batting average is quite high when it comes to, like, hot guys.

[Jen Romolini]

Oh, yeah. She's obviously one of those women that like, just like, loves a pretty man. I've never really been that, but that is obviously her thing. Yeah. Okay, let's see what else we got for questions. I'm sorry I didn't collect these into a whole thing. I should have, but I didn't. Okay. I went down a rabbit hole on. Oh, speaking of Jennifer Aniston, I went down that rabbit hole on Justin Throw's wedding to a woman almost half the age of his ex, Jennifer Aniston, the other day. I'm just feeling very resentful, jealous maybe of middle aged men in general lately that they get to have these second lives and families in their 50s. I don't have kids, but maybe I'd want some at 55 if my young partner did all the work. I guess the question is how not to be so resentful that many men don't date women their own age or get to enjoy certain aspects of youth longer. Or am I just a hater?

[Kim France]

That's a really good question. And I think that the thing is, it just. It's an unfair thing. It's 100% true. It's one of the ways in which life is unfair. And I think you just have to have a little radical acceptance around it. Like, this is the situation. And would I want to be with a man who would prefer to be with a woman twice half his age. Like, maybe not.

[Jen Romolini]

No, I wouldn't want to be with that man. And so, yes, it does make the men that I would potentially, if I wasn't married want to be with much fewer. But at the same time, there is a flip side to this, which is isn't that just not accepting the reality of your life? Like, I don't want that kind of arrested development. Like, I've grown.

[Kim France]

Yep.

[Jen Romolini]

That's a. That would be a regression for me. And also not really accepting my life on life on its terms, you know? And let's be fucking honest, like, you have a kid of 55, the kid's 10. You're trying to. You can't run after them. It's really hard to be a parent. It's physically laborious like that. You can. Doesn't mean you should. Like, how much. How checked out are those dads? And then what is your responsibility as a parent? You know? Like, is it okay to just provide sperm and be like, yep, I'm slapped. My name on that one. I don't know.

[Kim France]

Yep, I get it. I agree with you.

[Jen Romolini]

I don't. Yeah. I don't even know what I'm saying, but there's something about it. There's something in it. Like, I love middle aged women so much. I love middle aged women more than I've loved women at any age. I think we are the best. And I am. I don't think that. I don't. I know. I don't feel that same way about middle aged men. So whatever that's worth. Yeah, here's another question about men. Men, exclamation point. Can anyone stay married to them?

[Kim France]

Very funny. I don't even know how to answer that.

[Jen Romolini]

It beats the fuck out of me. I mean, I am. So I guess you can.

[Kim France]

Yeah.

[Jen Romolini]

Yes, my relationship is older than the woman I was with earlier this week.

[Kim France]

Amazing.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah. My relationship is a whole more than a drinking adult's life old. So yes, you can.

[Kim France]

You absolutely can.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay. Returning to the office soon and need some alternatives to Nikes. My days of wearing cute pointy flats or kitten heels are done. My feet can't take it anymore. I need something that is comfortable to walk a few thousand steps in and looks cute with pants or barrel jeans.

[Kim France]

I think it's gotta be loafers.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah, I think you're right.

[Kim France]

I don't know. You know, I honestly don't know. I wear sneakers all the time now because I don't know the Answer to.

[Jen Romolini]

That question, but is there a dressy sneaker? I guess that's what we're talking about, a dressy sneaker. Or is she not talking? I mean, I don't know if she's talking about, like, is there a dressy sneaker that would be office appropriate? Probably, yeah.

[Kim France]

Like Cole Hahn or someone like that feels like they would make something like that. It has to exist, especially post Covid.

[Jen Romolini]

You know what? I'm going to make a wild wreck. What about an Oxford?

[Kim France]

I like an Oxford.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah, maybe it's an Oxford. Like sometimes there's like, Rachel Comey has had some good ones. Who wants to spend that money? But. But something like that, that's like kind of chic. That's a chic oxford. You just need a wide, like, foot pad, like it's. And some comfort. You know, I have to say, Aerosols has had some really cute shoes for like, you know, a geriatric brand. They've had some really cute styles recently.

[Kim France]

Totally agree.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay, what do you suggest is a good price point for quality clothing items like shirts, blazers, trousers? This is. This question I already know is fucked. That won't contribute to fast fashion environmental devastation, but not break the bank. So many labels have higher prices that suggest quality. Think Alex Mille. But are they good bets? Are some. I mean, Alex Mill is mass produced, right? Or are some of the pricier labels just competing to give the impression of quality without really lasting? And how can you tell? What do you look for?

[Kim France]

This is a very. This is a big question. This is an episode, really.

[Jen Romolini]

It is. It is. It is. Actually, actually, I think you're right. This is an episode.

[Kim France]

Yep.

[Jen Romolini]

This is an episode. Because this is such a hard question.

[Kim France]

Yep, it is. I think it's both an episode, and I'm happy to use that as an excuse to not answer the question.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay, fine. Okay. You may have addressed this before, but I'd love a recommendation for an affordable good under eye moisturizer. Roc R O C makes a good retinol under eye eye cream. It's not the most moisturizing. You might want to put moisture over that, like a higher hyaluronic acid. But it's a good eye cream in that it is targeting fine lines and wrinkles and conditioning your skin under your eyes.

[Kim France]

Perfect.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay, how are you both so funny? Is it as effortless as it comes across or do you put work into it? And lastly, has your sense of humor changed as you've gotten older?

[Kim France]

Okay, how'd we get so funny? I can only speak for myself. But I would say shitty childhood. Shitty childhood often equals, like, funny later.

[Jen Romolini]

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, exactly. Trauma is funny.

[Kim France]

No, it's true. I mean, like, you know, comedians are some of the most, you know, traumatized people.

[Jen Romolini]

Totally. I think that my sense of humor. And the only way that it's. That it's changed is that I may be more generous. I may be more generous with a laugh than I used to be.

[Kim France]

That's interesting. That's interesting. I think I'm still pretty stingy with a laugh, though. Certainly not when we're talking.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I think I try. Well, maybe I still am. Who knows? I'm more of a. Than ever. Who the fuck knows?

[Kim France]

You're not more of a. Than ever. And, and, and. And that makes it sound like you were a raving bitch ever, which you weren't.

[Jen Romolini]

That's true. And I'm not more of a. I'm actually much less of a bitch that I. That's the way I've changed the most. So maybe if that creates more generosity in my humor, that might be the case.

[Kim France]

Yeah. I was going to say my humor is a little nicer now than it used to be.

[Jen Romolini]

Yes, that's it. I really try not to make it other people's expense.

[Kim France]

Yeah.

[Jen Romolini]

Okay. What trend will you never wear?

[Kim France]

Tiny sunglasses. Oh, I really hate that trend. Crop tops.

[Jen Romolini]

Crop tops was going to be my number one. I tried recently. No fucking way. Ever again.

[Kim France]

Yeah, no, that's not for me. I don't know what else. What about you?

[Jen Romolini]

I'm just going to say barrel pants. I've tried, like, five pairs, and I'm like, why am I doing this? Are these even cute? Like, is this. Is this just one of those things that we've all decided, like, we're going to buy into, but, like, nobody actually likes, you know? Like, I'm like, what are these?

[Kim France]

I agree. I think they look funny, and I think they probably look nice on people. But I don't get it. I don't get how it caught on. I don't get how so many brands decided to do it too. You know, with a shape that is difficult at best.

[Jen Romolini]

Yes. Yes. Okay. This is a skirts question. I don't know if, you know, we need to have a style episode soon. I really think that that's where we're really headed. Maybe even with, like, a stylist who we can just really talk to about stuff. Okay. What the fuck do you wear with skirts that doesn't look frumpy, but also doesn't emphasize a pooch. Oh, God, this one's so hard. Why are skirts so fucking hard?

[Kim France]

Skirts are fucking hard. And for the most part, I don't want any of them. Like, they're not shaped in a way that makes me want them. I think skirts are really tough. And I have no advice. No advice.

[Jen Romolini]

Skirts are tough. Skirts are tough with a pooch. I mean, I can't wear. There's so many skirts I can't wear. I can't wear. I can never wear a denim skirt. Never in my life can I wear a straight skirt. Denim skirt. That never worked. I think if you go with a slightly, this is going to sound counterintuitive, but if you go with a slightly higher waist skirt that has like an A line, has a little roominess in the stomach and an elastic waist, you can kind of get away with a stomach and like, not you get away with the stomach no matter what. You could do any fucking thing you want, but it'll you. The line, the skirt will kind of go with your body. You know, it cuts out where you want it to cut out.

[Kim France]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jen Romolini]

And that depends. That depends on your waist and your proportions. A lot of these are just like trial and error, which is the most annoying thing because it's impossible to trial and error right now.

[Kim France]

It is. It's impossible to. And who wants to do it? Who wants to go into a dressing room with 50 different things? It just.

[Jen Romolini]

Yeah, yeah, I, I don't, I don't want to do that. Okay, well, listen, we've answered all the questions that are appropriate to answer on the show. Not that anything was not appropriate, but just I don't think we have answers for. And that's. That's a show right there.

[Kim France]

I think it is.

[Jen Romolini]

So thank you for listening to Everything is Fine. Once again, we are your hosts. My name is Jen Romolini and mine is Kim France. If you like the show, please rate and review it across platforms. If you feel like it, Apple podcasts, just drop us five stars. Share the show, tell people about the show. Let us expand this audience and preach to middle aged women everywhere. If you want to support the production of this show and help us keep it going, you can join our [e-mail] everythingisfine. It is $3 a month. We do show notes there. We do skincare and style recs there and we also are taking listener questions from there. If you want to find Kim and Kim's excellent style recommendations, it's kimfrance substack.com you can find me at jenramalini.substack.com the show is mixed. Oh, we're both on a private and robust Facebook group. And then Natalie Rivera, thank you for being a hero once again this week. Two two episodes and Kim's in a hotel. Jesus Christ. We love you and we'll be back next week.

[Kim France]

I'm Josie Santee, health coach, wellness editor and host of the Every Girl podcast where we cut through the noise with realistic, expert backed advice to help you thrive in every category of life while still loving the person that you already are. And part of loving yourself is being really authentic to you, including the clothes you wear. In partnership with Nordstrom, we're helping you update your spring wardrobe so your style is fit for your best self. Nordstrom brings you the season's most wanted brands like like Skims, Mango Free People and Princess polly, all under $100. From trending Sneakers to beauty must haves, we've curated the styles that you'll wear on repeat this spring. Free shipping, free returns and in store pickup. Make it easier than ever. Shop now in stores [e-mail] everyone has.

[Josie Santee]

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