Everything’s Perfect…Except The Double Standard

Summary

Podcast Summary: Everything's Perfect – “Everything's Perfect…Except The Double Standard”

Air Date: January 20, 2026
Hosts: Autumn Calabrese & Donald “Dom” Stamper
Episode Theme: Examining cultural double standards around gender, body image, and fashion—with real talk about societal expectations, personal agency, and female empowerment.

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Episode Overview

In this lively and unfiltered episode, Autumn and Dom dig into the double standards society imposes on women’s bodies, clothing choices, and self-expression—contrasting these with how men are treated in similar circumstances. Through humorous anecdotes, personal frustrations, and thoughtful reflection, they peel back the layers of judgment and shame often directed at women. The conversation ranges from harmless delivery mishaps to the serious cultural baggage that accompanies “what women wear.” The hosts tackle both current controversies (like the pastor's wife dress scandal) and their own experiences with judgment, always pushing for more compassion, autonomy, and respect.

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Key Discussion Points

1. Opening Catch-Ups and Delivery Drama

Timestamps: [01:00–10:45]

• Autumn vents about aggravating delivery issues with her Pilates equipment order, highlighting poor customer service and a threatened $700 fee for not accepting a botched delivery.
  • “It feels like extortion, right? It feels like, well, if you want your reformer, you have to pay this.” – Autumn [07:01]
• They comment on the principle of being blamed or up-charged in unfair situations.
• Notable Moment: Autumn fantasizes about taking the issue to Judge Judy. [06:38]

2. Fire Alarms and Daily Interruptions

Timestamps: [10:45–12:30]

• Autumn shares the comical chaos of having her apartment’s fire alarm tested repeatedly during client calls.
• Dom interjects to laugh at the absurdity of the situation.
  • “Testing it. Like setting it off.” – Dom [11:09]
  • “It’s like, oh my God... I was probably trying, totally normal, but while I’m listening and engaged the whole time… it was like a test.” – Autumn [11:28]

3. Fitness & High Rocks Training

Timestamps: [12:30–15:13]

• The hosts banter about their fitness journeys, recent training in Las Vegas, and relatable struggles of trying new workouts.
  • Lots of playful teasing about competitiveness and workout gear.
  • “I’m the fitness expert, I just can’t look like a total loser… I gotta train!” – Dom [13:03]

4. Vegas Recap & JLo Appreciation

Timestamps: [15:38–17:13]

• They rave about Jennifer Lopez’s impressive performance and her unapologetic embrace of her body at 54.
  • “With training… she was very good. And danced her ass off. And I’m sorry, but I’m here for all her costumes.” – Dom [16:50]
  • “If you got a booty like this, you’d be naked too!” – JLo quote recounted by Dom [17:13]

5. Honest Discussion: Double Standards & Body Shaming

Timestamps: [17:13–46:30]

The Double Standard for Women

• Autumn reflects on backlash women face for embracing their bodies or dressing “young/sexy”—from both conservative and secular communities.
  • “That’s what I mean. Like, guys do not get… how guys can just show their nipples.” – Autumn [19:06]
• Dom details the hypocrisy of women criticizing other women, even while celebrating shirtless men online.
  • “The same women that are tearing down other women… are just like the horniest, dirtiest, fucking drooling over the guys that are topless…” – Dom [20:20]
• The group discusses cultural attitudes—how female sexuality is policed while men go unchallenged for similar behavior.
• Autumn ties in her strict religious upbringing and how ballroom dance shifted her mindset about performance and body freedom.
  • “As a dancer, you can see how much work is put into it. It’s not just about showing your body, it’s about showing your ability.” – Autumn [18:52]

Clothing, Judgment, and Empowerment

• The hosts decry the syndrome of blaming women for others’ inappropriate behavior (“What were you wearing?”).
  • “Women carry the responsibility of what everyone else thinks. If a woman gets cat-called or grabbed, they’re always asked, ‘What were you wearing?’” – Autumn [21:51]
• Autumn urges women to feel empowered in their choices, and for others (including men) to respect that.
  • “More and more women should be empowered to be able to dress and present and feel confident how they want.” – Autumn [21:55]
• Dom recounts instances where viewers objected to his workout outfits (sports bras, shorts) for being “too sexy” or tempting to others’ spouses, and explains the functional reasons for such clothing.
  • “I’m not working out in a T-shirt… if my whole body is covered… the viewer at home can’t see exactly what shape [my form is in].” – Dom [22:33]

Cultural and Global Context

• They bring up cultural differences—nude beaches in France, tribal societies, and how standards of decency vary globally, illustrating how relative and constructed these taboos are.
  • “In tribal cultures, the women probably don’t have anything covering their tops… and it’s not a thought.” – Dom [39:25]
• Share humorous stories about accidentally stumbling onto nude beaches and how “nudity” is far less provocative in other places.
  • “I was just caught so off guard… we don’t have that in our culture.” – Dom [44:29]

The Pastor’s Wife Dress Controversy

Timestamps: [30:10–33:45]

• Discussion of a viral scandal: a pastor’s wife criticized by other churches for wearing a (fully lined) black lace gown.
  • “The dress was a gown… it was thick… nothing was showing. Everybody’s like, ‘Oh my God, what it implies!’” – Dom [31:04]
  • “You don’t get to stand behind religion and be an asshole.” – Dom [31:43]
• They lambast the misogyny and public shaming, call for autonomy, and underscore the importance of minding one’s business.

Impact of Purity Culture & Sexuality

• Autumn and Dom swap stories about how purity culture has skewed perceptions of normal attraction/desire, especially for women and young men.
  • “What we called purity culture in church really damages a lot of people who become adults and have a messed up view of attraction and sexuality…” – Autumn [37:28]
• Dom gives a personal account of his son struggling with religious guilt around noticing women at the gym.
  • “He stopped going to the gym… after watching all these things, he was worried that if he saw a girl in fitness clothing and thought she was hot, that was lust, and he was sinning…” – Dom [35:53]

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• “If you got a booty like this, you’d be naked too.” – JLo, as recounted by Dom [17:13]
• “It is so wild. It feels like extortion, right? Well, if you want your reformer, you have to pay this—even though they didn’t come.” – Autumn [07:01]
• “Guys can wear Speedos and no one bats an eye… You could wear your mesh shirt with nothing under it—nobody cares.” – Dom [29:33]
• “You don’t get to stand behind religion and be an asshole.” – Dom [31:43]
• “I want women to be able to feel confident and sexy and powerful and celebrate their bodies any way they want. And I want men to have responsibility to respect women, that’s it.” – Autumn [33:44]
• “I also just want people, more than anything: mind your business. Like, are you her husband? No? Okay. Then it’s none of your damn business what she wore.” – Dom [33:48]

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Listener Q&A: Friendship After a Breakup

Timestamps: [46:43–54:09]

• Question: Can/should you remain friends with both members of a couple after they break up (particularly if you were friends with one first and developed a real friendship with the other too)?
• Hosts’ Thoughts:
  • Dom draws a distinction for male/female friendships: in some cases (esp. with exes and opposite sex) it's “girl code” to remain loyal to the original friend.
  • Both agree: Be true to yourself, don’t share information between ex-partners, but also—open communication is vital.
    • “You need to be the friend you would want someone to be to you… and it’s okay if one of them needs to take some space.” – Autumn [51:21]
    • “Not only are they going through a breakup, but if they feel like their friend… is now supporting the ex, it’s almost like two breakups.” – Dom [54:54]

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Conclusion & Tone

• The hosts encourage listeners to embrace self-confidence, mind their own business about other people’s choices, and have compassion for the social struggles women face.
• They close by inviting more listener questions for future “Phone a Friend” advice segments.

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Timestamps Index

| Topic | Timestamps | |------------------------------------------|-----------------| | Delivery Disaster & Judge Judy | 01:00–10:45 | | Fire Alarms & Disruption | 10:45–12:30 | | Fitness & Training Banter | 12:30–15:13 | | JLo in Vegas & Body Confidence | 15:38–17:13 | | Double Standards & Cultural Context | 17:13–46:30 | | Pastor’s Wife Dress Scandal | 30:10–33:45 | | Cultural Views on Nudity | 39:06–45:00 | | Listener Q&A – Breakup Friendships | 46:43–54:09 |

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Tone: Unfiltered, frank, supportive, and witty—balancing humor with serious cultural critique. Autumn and Dom’s camaraderie makes big themes feel intimate and practical.

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Recommended for: Anyone frustrated by society’s double standards, those seeking validation for living life authentically, and listeners who crave honest takes on complicated cultural issues—served with a side of laughs.

Transcript

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[Autumn]

And I didn't know the extent that my building that I live in would be testing the fire alarm system over and over and over again. It's not like the fire alarm is.

[Dom]

Like pe, pe pe.

[Autumn]

It's like, it's like, oh my God.

[Dom]

Me and my girlfriend Kat, we went to the south of France, not Paris. We were at like a beach club. We're like, oh, let's walk on the beach. You know, that's a normal thing. You take a walk on the beach. So we're walking down the beach. We don't realize that we transitioned from the beach club beach to just the public beach. And we didn't know it was a fully nude beach. I look up and this guy is on his hands and knees digging through his bag, but he's naked. And I am like, oh my God. Happy hump day this day.

[Autumn]

So do you want to go first with your how your day is going or should I?

[Dom]

We have a saying. I don't know if this is a saying that everybody uses. I feel like everybody uses it, but Dom uses it all the time. He's like, I'm about to crash out anytime things are going wrong. Well, I already done crashed. I crashed out hard this morning. So real quick, I ordered a new piece of Pilates equipment. I ordered a Cadillac. I have a reformer that is a combination reformer Cadillac. And I wanted just a Cadillac because I never convert the thing. It takes too long. Anyways, I ordered it three months ago. I've been waiting for this Thing ordered it white glove. Because I'm not carrying a Cadillac from my front door to the back thousand upstairs. Yeah, I'm putting it together just like all my other Pilates equipment. I ordered it from the same company I always order from. I am throwing them under the bus. They're called Recover athletes.

[Autumn]

If I order a lawn chair, I order a white glove. I'm like, I don't want to square screw those legs on.

[Dom]

Like, seriously, like, deliberate, please. Like, I'm not. I'm clearly not a handyman. Anyway. Anyways, they call on Monday. The guy calls on Monday. Finally, like, the delivery company. And they're gonna deliver it. I'm like, great. And he's like, we'll be there between three and four. I'm like, great. 4:15. They're still not here. And Kent's getting ready to leave for the day. I don't like people delivering stuff when I'm home by myself. But also, it's supposed to be delivered and put together. So it's like 4:15. I'm like, where is this guy? And my phone rings. It's the driver. And he's like, I just got to the warehouse, so I'll be at to you about 6:30. And I was like, well, no, that's way too late. That's two and a half hours outside the delivery window. And I was like, and you're gonna put it together? Like, it's gonna take at least an hour, like. And he's like, put it together. I said, yeah, I ordered white glove. And he goes, no, it's just me by myself. And I was like, well, that's a problem. So I was like, well, you're outside the delivery window, so you can't deliver it today. He's like, okay. I was. He said, just call the guy tomorrow. Come to me tomorrow. Great. They call me Tuesday, yesterday to try to reschedule the delivery. But at this point, I've been on the phone with recover athletes. Like, hey, it's supposed to be white glove. They're like, no, it's not. I'm like, yeah, it is. Like, I know what I ordered. I would never order this. Not white glove. Like, I don't know what happened in your records anyways. They're like, okay, well, don't have them deliver it. We'll figure it out. We'll fix it. But the girl was not being very helpful. She kind of kept trying to argue with me. And I was like, she's like, you didn't pay for white glove. And I was like, I selected White glove. So if it didn't charge me, can you just charge me? She's like, would have went to a different warehouse. I'm like, I don't know what you want me to do here. I can't. Like, I don't even have a curb in my neighborhood. I can't get it from the front yard all the way upstairs by myself.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

So what do I need to do to get it delivered properly? Like, we can problem solve this. Let's problem solve it. In the meantime, the delivery company calls again and they ask if they can deliver it yesterday. And I said, well, no, don't deliver it today because I'm trying to figure it out. With recover athlete athletes, it's supposed to be white glove. Thirty minutes later, the delivery truck just shows up and it's a mom and her teenage son.

[Autumn]

Oh, my God.

[Dom]

And I'm like, what are you doing here? I specifically told them, like, I didn't schedule this. Like, what if I wasn't even home? Like, I'm not taking this delivery right now because you're not going to be able to get it upstairs. So they call today. Recover athlete calls today and basically says, we're not doing anything to get you white glove and the movie. Or in the delivery company is going to charge you $700 for turning away the delivery twice. And I said, bitch, I didn't turn the delivery away twice. I didn't ever schedule either. The first day, it was two and a half hours outside the delivery window. Not my fault. So the guy never came. That's not a turn away. That's the guy didn't come the second day. The guy just randomly. Or the girl just randomly showed up. That's not on me.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

So now I'm stuck with one of two options. Either pay $700 in delivery charges that are not my fault. That principle is very hard for me to swallow.

[Autumn]

Yeah, I bet.

[Dom]

Or call my credit card company, dispute the charge, tell recover athletes to go f themselves, keep their Cadillac, and then reorder from somebody else and have to wait three more months to get one.

[Autumn]

Does the other equipment you bought from that company?

[Dom]

Yes, I've spent that so much money with them.

[Autumn]

That's so annoying.

[Dom]

I mean, studio, like, this is not cheap equipment.

[Autumn]

And the others were white glove.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

Like, they're just like, why would you suddenly not.

[Dom]

She tried to tell me that the other one wasn't. I was like, so how did I get a Cadillac reformer upstairs and together.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

I'm like, if there's elves, Santa's Helpers. I'm not really sure.

[Autumn]

She said it. Was it.

[Dom]

Yes.

[Autumn]

Wow.

[Dom]

And I was like, I don't know what's wrong with your records, but I.

[Autumn]

Like, is there someone else you can talk to?

[Dom]

No. I asked and she was like, I'm the only one. I was like, okay. So anyways, that was my crash out of the morning.

[Autumn]

How are you so mad? I want this to go on Judge Judy. And I'll be the witness just sitting there and I'll, like, probably say something. She'll, like, stop talking. But I'm obsessed with her. Justice would happen. Well. But to be fair, though, it is. It's wild. It's wild. It feels like extortion, right? It feels like, well, if you want your reformer.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

You have to pay this. Even though they didn't come in the.

[Dom]

The first day.

[Autumn]

They didn't even come.

[Dom]

They didn't come.

[Autumn]

You didn't turn it away.

[Dom]

You just said, you missed your window. I'm not going to be home.

[Autumn]

And then that you told them not to come. When they showed up with the mom and teenager.

[Dom]

It would be like me and Dom showing up to deliver a cat. By the way, this is a large piece of Pilates equipment. Like, large. This is not small.

[Autumn]

Yeah, right.

[Dom]

And I did tell her today. I was like, at this point, I don't even care about the white glove. Like, fine. Like, don't worry about figuring that out. You need to get it delivered to me without this 700 charge. And she's like, well, I can't do anything about that. I was like, that's the movie. The company you picked.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

To deliver it. Call them and tell them, absolutely not. You guys missed your delivery window, and you showed up without a delivery time. That's not on the customer. That's on them. I said, or I'm gonna cancel this.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

And she basically just said there was nothing she could do.

[Autumn]

Did she? What did she say when you said you would cancel?

[Dom]

She started going round and round trying to recap the last two days with me, and I was like, no, no. That part of the discussion is over. We already know what happened the last two days. I'm asking you if you're going to get it delivered today or not without me paying this 700. And she just kept going around. And I finally handed the phone off to Kent because I know that I turn into a psycho. Like, where I'm just like, oh, like, you're not listening. Why is it so hard? So I handed the phone to Kent, and when Kent gets mad, you know somebody has done messed up because he can keep his composure for a very long time. And I handed it to him, I walked away. And a few minutes later he walked in the room and I heard him say to her, claire, we're done with this conversation. Call me back by 3pm and tell me if you're delivering the Cadillac or we'll be canceling it through the credit card. I'm done with this conversation now.

[Autumn]

Bye.

[Dom]

Thank you. And he hung up. And I was like, oh, yes.

[Autumn]

Oh, he's pissed.

[Dom]

Well, because he's been handling a lot of it too. Like, he's been a lot of the communication. So anyways, that is just so frustrating.

[Autumn]

When you spend that amount of money and it's not just the amount of money on this piece of equipment, but you've earned so much from them. It is. It's just saying that they can't.

[Dom]

That you would just be okay letting it go.

[Autumn]

Right? I mean, if that delivery company is one of their people that they use, couldn't they call them and say, yes, we're not going to continue to use these use you guys if you don't help us with our customer. She's ordered a lot of equipment. We're not sure where the miscommunication happened. Also, why did you deliver when she said not to? Why were you outside of your window? That kind of stuff pisses me off. Right.

[Dom]

Oh, the injustice of it all. And it's literally held captive and there's nothing I can do except either pay 700 or wait three more months. And I'm annoyed. First world problems.

[Autumn]

Yeah, but they're still annoying.

[Dom]

It's just annoying because I've been so excited to get it and like really start using the Cadillac more. Because the Cadillac Reformer I have, like I said, it really does take like a good five to 10 minutes to convert it. Yeah, it's just not quick. And sometimes I want to do a little bit on the Reformer and then I want to do a little work on the Cadillac. So, like, again, first world problems.

[Autumn]

I don't even know what the difference is between the two, but I can't.

[Dom]

Wait to take you on it. Also. I'm so sore, girl.

[Autumn]

I'm sore. I was like, oh, I feel it.

[Dom]

And heels for three days in Vegas.

[Autumn]

I told you, bring some damn combat boots.

[Dom]

I am too old.

[Autumn]

Beauty is pain. Well, we'll talk more about that, but. Yeah, but how are you? My day was just very difficult, you know.

[Dom]

We'Re doing great, guys. Welcome to the fest.

[Autumn]

Well, I had a couple Client sessions before I was coming over. And I didn't know that today. Well, actually, to be totally fair, I did know, but I just totally forgot. And I didn't know the extent that my building that I live in would be testing the fire alarm system, but it's literally going.

[Dom]

Testing it. Like setting it off.

[Autumn]

Yes. Over and over and over again. And they also went to everyone's door and, like, opened it to make sure the door is. And listen to make sure the alarm is going on in your apartment and the apartment. It's not like the fire alarm is.

[Dom]

Like, pee, pee, pee.

[Autumn]

It's like. It's like, oh, my God. And the thing is, because of noise canceling, it happened in the middle of my call, but my client couldn't hear. Oh, I was probably trying totally normal, but while I'm listening and engaged the whole time and talking and I. It is serious and something that I really love doing. It's. It was like a test because this was going on the whole time. Like, literally. I walked to the post office to drop some stuff. I'm going to get these. I'm going to get my teeth straightened. And my ears were just ringing the whole walk. I was like, this can't be healthy. Like, when that happens as a fire, you hear it and you leave this. We're sitting around for hours while this blast in our ears. It was.

[Dom]

It was. That's crazy. Why does it take him so long? Turn the thing on.

[Autumn]

I'm like, hello. It works.

[Dom]

Yeah, clearly.

[Autumn]

I've walked around this whole place. It's. It's alarming everywhere. Okay, we're good.

[Dom]

We're good.

[Autumn]

We are at surrounding buildings. Would know there was a fire. Like when my.

[Dom]

Went off for no reason.

[Autumn]

Yes.

[Dom]

Well, we're doing great.

[Autumn]

Well, Vegas, let's go back. Which is so funny when you get. That's right. Oh. Oh, yeah.

[Dom]

Hot rocks. I have to tell you the funniest text thing about that. So I texted my team because we're doing a relay. And so I'm on a team with three other girls, Emily and Heather. And so I'm texting with them and I was like, because we. We haven't picked events yet. I'm like, okay, ladies, come on, Come on. I need to train for something. We train the whole damn thing. But I was like, okay, I'm going to do sled push and rowing. And so they all start chiming in. And they're like, okay. And they're like. I was like, you know, because, like, I got to train. And Emily responds She's like, we're doing this for funsies, right? And I was like, yeah, fun. I was like, look, I'm the fitness expert. I just can't look like a total loser. Like, I'm completely out of shape, you know? And. And then they're like, don't worry, we'll do. We'll make you look great.

[Autumn]

I want to. That's funny.

[Dom]

It was so funny.

[Autumn]

We're just going round and round. You're lucky I'm doing it with. No, listen. He's like the most intense.

[Dom]

Yeah. Come on.

[Autumn]

Yeah. But like, you got to find a new teammate.

[Dom]

You know me though.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

Competitive af. So I'm like, it's just. I don't care what they do with theirs.

[Autumn]

I want good time, solid online. I know I need to start. I'm going to look for some classes because I know there's classes like.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

That are for training for high rocks. Because I tell you what, my body's really feeling these 30 minute workouts that we're doing.

[Dom]

And first of all, I made those things hard.

[Autumn]

You did.

[Dom]

That's why it's called hustle hard, girl.

[Autumn]

I'm hustling hard.

[Dom]

Also in Vegas, we did a full H rocks training session. That was so fun.

[Autumn]

It was. It made me feel better about it because I'd never done a sled push. The. The only thing we technically didn't do.

[Dom]

Is the sled pool and the skier. Because they didn't have one.

[Autumn]

Right. I gotta get. Gotta try that.

[Dom]

Yeah. Well, I don't have to do those yet.

[Autumn]

Yeah. I'm just like, okay. If I can practice as if doing the whole event.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

And feel like I'm dying. Then when I actually do it and Nell and I are splitting the events, it'll. We'll be good to go.

[Dom]

You'll be solid.

[Autumn]

Get running down. But it's coming faster than my training is going, so that's a little bit of a concern.

[Dom]

Great.

[Grainger Announcer]

Egg lands best.

[Dom]

So other than that, JLo was phenomenal.

[Autumn]

Oh my God, I'm so impressed. She was awesome. Like it. And I have to say, because it wasn't a small theater, but it's like a Broadway style theater. I felt like I could experience her personally. We also had really good scenes.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

I felt like she was just so. Her energy was so up. She was so in it. She was really communicating with the stage. I mean the audience. She was so much fun.

[Dom]

I really liked it because I've seen her in a stadium arena, which was also phenomenal. I saw her for her 50th. But it was such a different way that she did it. I was so impressed. Like, I love when an artist of any kind really just expands their range and tries new things. And she did it like old school Vegas show and really, like, talked to the audience, like, a lot and threw in some songs that weren't hers. Her voice, like, you could tell she's been working on it.

[Autumn]

Totally. Because I've been saying that for a couple. A couple years. Like, she is one of the only performers that has gotten. Continues to get better with age. Yes. And I think she's really just putting the work in.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

With training. And she was very good.

[Dom]

And danced her ass off.

[Autumn]

Danced her ass off.

[Dom]

And I'm sorry, but I'm here for all her costumes. I'm. Well, yes, girl, at 54.

[Autumn]

Almost spill all of our drinks. That's exactly what we need today.

[Dom]

Perfect. But yeah, at 54, I'm like, you better wear the. Basically like a. It wasn't a G string, but it wasn't a G string at all. But it definitely.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

But yeah, she said, if you got a booty like this, you'd be naked too. I said, damn right.

[Autumn]

I love that she addressed that. Is that something I. That actually I care a lot about is how women are made to feel about how they show their bodies or how they dress or are shamed for certain ways. And it comes from a lot of things. One is like, you know, you're either, you know, if you're young, you're dressing a certain way because you, like, you're a.

[Dom]

Right. You're trying to get attention.

[Autumn]

You're not. If you're with old in air quotes like JLo, you're not dressing your age.

[Dom]

Or your New Year's. I had no. I'm saying, oh. Because on New Year's, I did a cute little reel of like, getting ready to go out with you guys.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

And some commented and she's like, oh, yeah, too old. I was like, too old.

[Autumn]

And it makes me.

[Dom]

And it was like some young girl. I was like, oh, yeah.

[Autumn]

Oh, this little. She doesn't know girls like you paved the way for girls like her.

[Dom]

I was like, don't you dare.

[Autumn]

Yeah, well, I think I care a lot about it because I come from, like, as we've talked about, a very religiously conservative background. And when I now that I have lived outside of that West Hollywood that time. Yeah. Los Angeles. No, really, actually, ballroom dancing is what changed it for me. And I started to see, like, how the. In the Costumes that women would wear and stuff, how it's really athletic, even though it's sexy and pretty and all the things, they're showing their athleticism and their ability to dance.

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

And it's so, like, as a dancer, you can see how much work is put into it. It's not just about showing your body, it's about showing your ability. And that started me opening my mind a lot about, like, how fucked up.

[Dom]

It is that the double standard is insane.

[Autumn]

That's what I mean. Like, guys do not get. First of all, we forget if we talked about this, how guys can just show their nipples.

[Dom]

Oh, all the time. Like, no big deal. Like, okay, great, boobs are made of fat.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

Or they're silicone or saline. Mine or saline. But still, like, we all have the same thing. And it's like, oh, my God, you showed cleavage. But it's so funny because it's typically. It's women tearing women down, right? Because obviously guys are like, oh, you know, they're not. I mean, yeah, I'm sure you'll get some ultra conservative guys, like, oh, that's bad. But it's usually women tearing women down. But here's the craziest part. Go on something like Instagram. And the same women that are tearing down other women for too sexy or even just like, workout clothes, sports bras, shorts, whatever, are just like the horniest, dirtiest, fucking drooling over the guys that are topless, shirtless, dancing, all the things, and there's nothing. Right? Like, nobody judges a guy for being shirtless. Nobody judges a guy for dancing in all the ways. Have you seen these food videos of these different guys that, like, bake?

[Autumn]

Yes. Now that I freaking love them.

[Dom]

They're so good because they're essentially simulating every version of sex that you can imagine. They're smacking bread.

[Autumn]

They're sure.

[Dom]

They'Re doing things. Their fingers, they're drizzling things to look like they. And the comments, these women are like.

[Autumn]

Wow, I love those videos. Like, oh, my God, I do too.

[Dom]

But I also don't care if a girl's in a sports bra, a bikini, or. Or. Or whatever makes her feel good. I think so often people, both men and women, will think that a way a woman dresses is for other people. And I'm like, what you don't realize is we're not dressing for you, we're dressing for us. I'm dressing for what makes me feel good, what makes me feel confident. I don't care if I have your attention or not. Yeah, I put on something because I like the way it looked.

[Autumn]

Yeah. I think it's interesting. Like, it really. It shows a lot of insecurity, and it also. Women in the world that I come from carry the responsibility of what everyone else thinks. Like, if someone says something, if a woman gets, like, cat called while she's walking, or if someone grabs her inappropriately. So they're always asked, well, what were you wearing?

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

How are you dressed?

[Dom]

What did you do that made them think they could do?

[Autumn]

Yeah. And it makes me so angry because I think more and more women should, like, be empowered to be able to dress and present and feel confident how they want.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

And also, if you're worried about what your man's gonna think get you a man that you're not worried about, all of a sudden, some woman he doesn't know walking by, and he doesn't have eyes for you anymore.

[Dom]

I have literally had people say, oh, I really like your workouts, but I don't like to do them at home because I don't want my husband looking at you like that. And I'm like, I'm on a tv.

[Autumn]

Well.

[Dom]

And I, I. I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but, like, I'm in workout shorts and a sports bra or workout pants and a sports bra. Like, yeah, I don't know what you want me to work out in. Like, I'm not working out in a T shirt. Like, the whole point is one that you can. It's not like I'm trying to show my boobs. Right. Like, it's. It's partially if. If my whole body is covered up in baggy clothing, the viewer at home can't see exactly what shape. And when I say shape, I'm not talking about, like, am I in good shape? I'm saying, like, the lines of my body. Like, is my back flat? Is it rounded? Where's my shoulder position? Where's my elbow? Like, you need them to be able to see it so they can mimic at home and have proper form.

[Autumn]

Yeah. But I mean, plus, at the. The fitness industry, like, that's the way that sports bras and fitness clothes are made.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

Now, I just. The thing is, I would say, because I am sensitive to fact, that people have insecurities and are given very little resources to actually address their insecurities and instead go through life like. Well, especially in the religious world I come from, that's. They're acting like a Jezebel. They're making. Your husband's not responsible for Or. Or your. These boys aren't responsible for where their minds go when women dress a certain way. And I fully disagree with that. I think that. That someone. Including men. People talk about guys like, we are nothing but a bunch of Neanderthals. Like, we have no control. Like, but it's. It is a. There is a line between noticing someone, like, with. No. If he is looking at something on Instagram and there's a really ripped, hot, like, guy banking a bread roll, making a bread roll. I'm like, what are we watching?

[Dom]

Yeah, exactly. Like, let me in on the fl.

[Autumn]

No. But I don't feel insecure because I know what we have.

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

And I know that he's not with me because I have that body. And I. And I'm also not with him strictly because of how his body is. And so I think that it shows maybe there's insecurity in how you feel about yourself and how you feel about your relationship. Maybe at times. I know it's a very broad subject.

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

If you're so worried about guarding your partner's eyes from someone's never gonna happen.

[Dom]

Like, the world is the world. Right. Like, there's tv, there's social media, there's just walking around outside and seeing people. So, like, if that is always the worry, then that is something that probably needs to be talked about, worked through.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

No matter what. And by the way, it doesn't. Like, I have had times in my life, plenty of them, where I have been insecure because I've been cheated on, dumped, all the things and I had to mentally work through. Like, okay, Autumn, you don't need to go change. You don't need to go get filler. You don't need to go get da, da, da. You don't need to dress a different way. You don't need to work out more. That just wasn't meant to be.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

That it wasn't going to work out because it didn't work out.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

That's the bottom line. Like, that's really a mental state I'm trying to get in. Like, not to go philosophical for a minute, but I really am trying to be in this mindset more of everything is the way it's supposed to be because it's this way. And if it wasn't supposed to be this way, it would be different.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

Now, that doesn't mean it has to stay this way. Like, right. You can work to improve things. But I'm just saying, like, if a relationship doesn't work out, if a friendship doesn't Work out, if a job doesn't work out, if. If a. If something changes, that's just the way it's supposed to be. Because it is. You can sit there and think and wish and wonder, and, how could I have done different? But the past is the past. You can't change it. This is the moment. This is what is. So we got to move forward.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

And in relationships, I. Like, I went off on a tangent. I know, but I'm just saying, like, in relationships, when it comes to, like, if you're worried about somebody else, or if you're worried about your partner or somebody looking away, looking at somebody else, there might be deeper things that need to be discussed. I think it's a broad topic, and it's hard to, like, isolate it down because it could be so many different things.

[Autumn]

Right. And that's just one aspect of it. I think that in general, for a lot of reasons, women are just judged the way they present. And people talk about women the way they would never talk about men. And I want us to do better about noticing that, because for a long time, it's just like, I can think of a lot of moments in my life where women were just talked about, like, oh, look how short they're wearing their skirt. Look at how low look. And it's just like, that is so toxic. But it was. I didn't even clock it because it was just how society talked. I used to have this female barber. She moved away, but she told me a funny story. She went to Vegas one time, okay. And you're gonna see all the way with this guy. And anyways, he. She was in the bathroom, and she was ready, and he was like, okay. And he was like, I'm ready to go when you are. So she walked out of the bathroom, and he looked over and he was like, oh, my God, I'm sorry. I thought you were dressed. She was like, I am.

[Dom]

First of all.

[Autumn]

I was like, what are you wearing? She had like. Like, you know, those lacy, like, bralette.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

Top. That's just what she was wearing with, like, a pencil skirt or something.

[Dom]

Oh, yeah. That was the style. For a minute.

[Autumn]

That was the style. But I was like, that is so funny.

[Dom]

First of all, why would he cover his eyes? He's there, right? Who cares if she's not dressed? Haven't you seen that?

[Autumn]

It was a new, like. Like, they might have just. I don't remember the details.

[Dom]

Okay, that's. But still. That's funny.

[Autumn]

Yeah. Oh, my God. I thought you were dressed. She's like, this is what I'm wearing.

[Dom]

That's awkward. Because now you got to decide, am I making him uncomfortable? Which you shouldn't have to decide.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

If he's uncomfortable, that's on him. That's not on her. If she's comfortable in what she's wearing. But again, I think the bigger issue is it goes back to mostly women judging women. Why is she wearing that? She looks like a. Oh, my gosh, that's so inappropriate.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

And, yeah. You just don't see it. Like, guys can wear Speedos and. No. But like, you might have a chuckle about it. Like, oh, haha. But nobody's like, oh, my God, I can't believe he's in a banana hammock. Oh, my God, I can't believe. Like that. Short shorts. Oh, my God, I can't believe he's showing his abs. Who does he think he is? Like, I mean, maybe. I'm sure there are some that get it, but, like, in general, it's just not the same. And it's nowhere near as intense. Like, you could wear a belly shirt shirt. Nobody's gonna judge you. You can wear your mesh shirt with nothing under it. So, yes, we would be able to see your nipples. Nobody cares.

[Autumn]

Right?

[Dom]

Guys are allowed to walk around without shirts on in public, and girls are not. Not that I want to walk around without my shirt on. That feels awkward, but I'm just like, I always wonder about that. I'm like, God, that doesn't feel awkward to a guy. Like, it's hot out and they just take their shirt off. Women in menopause would like that ability. I'm just saying, lift up their titties.

[Autumn]

Get some air under there.

[Dom]

You're like, why do they get. Stick their shirt off.

[Autumn]

I want flash. He's putting ice cubes from your drink.

[Dom]

Seriously. So I say, I love it when JLo do it, girl.

[Autumn]

Me too.

[Dom]

Well, you brought it up before we started the controversy that just happened with the pastor's wife.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

Over her dress. It's just so stupid. The dress was a gown.

[Autumn]

I agree 100%. People. And the way people have felt and the way. I think it's sad the way that other churches have felt such freedom to talk about how she was dressed inappropriately. And it's like, I think, like, she doesn't belong to you. She's her own person.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

If her. If she's cool with it, and especially if her and her husband are. Love the dress. Let her wear what she wants to wear. And the dress. So you guys, we Will, if we can, we'll put a picture up if you're watching on YouTube. But it was essentially like the, the from the above, the knee up was like a black lace with sort of a flesh colored.

[Dom]

But it was a thick fabric.

[Autumn]

It was thick.

[Dom]

It was thick. I have seen dresses that have just like mesh. So you can actually see like a little bit of skin or like a very thin lining under it. No, it was like a thick lining. Like, yes, it was skin toned.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

But nothing was showing. And everybody's like, oh my God, I can't believe what it implies. And the fact that it's other churches, like you said that just makes me so mad. I'm like, these people that stand behind God and Jesus and are the most judgmental, mean, cruel, will say the worst things. I'm like, you don't get to stand behind religion.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

And be an asshole.

[Autumn]

I saw a video of another pastor talking about it and he said that. And he was like, I'm not talking about her. I'm talking about the. Her husband. How would he let his wife go out looking like. Look like. Looking like a two dollar.

[Dom]

The pastor, a different pastor, called her.

[Autumn]

A two dollar from the pulpit, said a two dollar, and then moved his mouth away from the, from the mic, like implying what he was going to say. And, and this is, by the way, they were going to a black tie.

[Dom]

Yeah, she's in a gal.

[Autumn]

She's in a gown. It looked beautiful. It was like, I thought it was very nice on her. She's also an educated woman. She's a professor. She has her PhD and it's just.

[Dom]

People talking about her that way, it's infuriating. And that the fact that a pastor from a pulpit stood there and said that her husband would let her. Ho. Okay, Go back to the stone Age, you douche.

[Autumn]

Yeah. I saw a clip of her talking about the experience, like what people were saying and the dress and all the controversy. And she was like, people think women can only be one thing. And in that culture of church, they call the pastor's wife the first lady. And she was like, she said, she was like, I'm a professor. I'm going down all the different hats she wears. And she says, and I fell in love with a man who is a reverend. And so I'm also a first lady. But like, the idea that everyone can just attack a woman for wearing a gown that they don't approve of, like, we need to check ourselves a little bit more a lot. And it's definitely in, in the Church and in. In those type of circles, but I think it's everywhere. Like. And I just. I want us to do better. I want women to be able to feel confident and sexy and powerful and celebrate their bodies and wherever they want. And I want. Want men to have a responsibility to respect women. Yeah, that's it. Respect women. You have the ability.

[Dom]

I also just want people more than anything. Mind your business.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

Like, are you her husband?

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

No. Okay. Are you her. No. So guess what? It's none of your damn business what she wore. You keep your opinion to yourself.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

Because it's not. It's not even yours to have. You want somebody to have an opinion about the way you dress?

[Autumn]

Like, exactly.

[Dom]

You want us to put you on the public forum to be judged for the way you dress or how you behave? Like, no. So what gives you the right? Like. Oh, it gets me fired up because I'm like, too many people. Mike Tyson said it best. Too many people hide behind the keyboard. They should be punched in the face. It's not exactly how he said it, but basically that's how it. He said it. He said.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

All these, like, keyboard warriors that want to just get back there and talk. But, like, you're gonna go say that to her and to her face. No, you wouldn't, right? Absolutely. Like, it just makes me so mad.

[Autumn]

Me, too.

[Dom]

I. A few weeks ago, I was in my hot tub. Like, just. I had my bikini on. Posted it in my stories, like, relaxing, whatever. Mind you. I was home by myself. Dom wasn't here, and I was in just a bikini, and the shot was like this. So you couldn't even really see my back. Like, you could see, like, the side. And somebody commented and was like, I can't believe you would wear a thong around your son. What's wrong with you? And I'm like, first of all, it's not a thong. Second of all, do you see my son in the picture?

[Autumn]

Exactly.

[Dom]

So he's not here also.

[Autumn]

None of you.

[Dom]

Well, it's none of your damn business at all. But it wasn't a thong. I'm very aware of how I dress around my son to not make him.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

Uncomfortable. And he doesn't care. Like, a bikini is just a bikini. Again, it wasn't up my.

[Autumn]

I mean, he's been. He's been your son his whole life. He's seen his mom in the workout clothes and.

[Dom]

But also, Dom, you know, I told you we've talked about this before, like, over the last two years. He's sort of. He has he's found his Christian faith. And in that he has struggled a little bit because of all the judgment he has seen other people have on YouTube and tick tock and Instagram towards women. And, like, he kind of went down a rabbit hole for a while where he was watching some pretty, I guess I would say, extreme religious stuff. Like, that's like, what we really had to work on for a while. And he had such an issue. He stopped going to the gym because after watching all these things, he was worried that if he saw, like, if he looked at a girl in fitness clothing and thought like, oh, she's hot, that that was lust and he was sinning and he was gonna go to hell. And he's like, well, I don't want to go to the gym, mom. Because, like, you know, there's a girl. If a girl's working out, and why does she have to dress like that? And I was like, no, no, no. You don't get to have that opinion. Why does she dress like that? She's in workout clothes and she's at a gym and it's hot and she's sweating, and she's allowed to wear what she wants to wear. You're allowed to wear what you want to wear. She's allowed to wear what she wants to wear. And also, there's nothing wrong with thinking that a woman looks attractive.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

Like, there's nothing wrong if. As long as you don't go up to her and be like, oh, you got a nice ass. Or like, hey, exactly. I was like. And he's like, yeah, but like, if I have a thought like, oh, she's hot, then that's bad. And I was like, no, it's not. I was like, that's called hormones. God gave them those so we could reproduce.

[Autumn]

So. And maybe have a little fun. I mean, who's to say? I mean, I. I believe. And this is something that I like in. I would like to find a way to talk about more and focus on more that what we called purity culture in church really damages a lot of people who become adults and they have messed up view of attraction and sexuality and all of that for a long time. And I'm. I fully believe I was born gay. But the idea that sexual feel. I think a lot of people are confusing their sexuality in the church because all sexuality is painted to be bad in a way.

[Dom]

And I'm like, so weird because eventually you're supposed to get married and have kids, but you've spent so much time telling somebody, like, suppress those feelings.

[Autumn]

Right. And then it's like those feelings are natural and. Right. People need to be taught how to handle those feelings in a healthy way.

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

Not to just shove them down. And then it's like, okay, well, that leads to some bad things that we see, you know?

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

So someone should feel like it is okay to see a person and find them attractive and be attracted to their body and the way that they look and. And know that, like, when you think that you. You don't lose all control of how you act, of what you do, of how you speak. Yeah.

[Dom]

You don't have to turn into it.

[Autumn]

It's not just a product. That's not all they are.

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

You're just acknowledging that you're feeling a normal thing that people are supposed to feel.

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

Like.

[Dom]

Well, it's so interesting if you start to think about, like. Like indigenous cultures, tribal cultures. Right. Which there are still tribal cultures. If you were to go to one, the women probably don't have anything covering their tops, and they might have something covering the bottom, but a lot of them.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

Are mostly naked. And it's not a thought.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

Because they don't live in a world. They don't live in our world. Right. They don't have technology. They don't have all these things. They don't. That's just how you walk around.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

It's like. Or you go, okay, you go to France, there's nude beaches. I accidentally ended up on one. I was not new. It was.

[Autumn]

Was it your last trip?

[Dom]

No, no, no, no. It wasn't with dom. It was 35th birthday. Me and my girlfriend Kat, the one that moved to Miami, we had gone to the Maldives. Then we went to Paris, or we went to the south of France, not Paris. And we were at, like, a beach club, and we were. We went out on the beach. The beach club we were at was not top. Was not a nude beach club club. But we're like, oh, let's walk on the beach. You know, that's a normal thing. You take a walk on the beach. So we're walking down the beach, and we don't realize that we transition from the beach club beach to just the public beach. And we didn't know it was a fully nude beach. And so all of a sudden.

[Autumn]

First of all, I bet you loved everything you saw.

[Dom]

No.

[Autumn]

Yeah, I know.

[Dom]

Because it is not a bunch of young, fit people.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

They were significantly older than us. Significantly. Maybe not in the best shape. I look up and this guy is on his hands and knees, digging through his Bag. But he's naked.

[Autumn]

So I'm talking like all the things.

[Dom]

Ass, taint, balls, all of it. And I was like, oh my God.

[Autumn]

Why is it winking at me?

[Dom]

So the way we were walking, I was the one next to the water and Cat was next to me on the other side. So I'm. I have the angle up towards the beach and she has sort of the angle looking down so she doesn't see it at first. I'm like, oh my God. She's like, what? And she turns her head and she's like, oh, my God.

[Autumn]

Especially if you aren't expecting it.

[Dom]

No, we were not expecting it at all. And so I whipped my head the other way, and as I whip my head the other way, there is a woman coming out of the ocean, totally nude. Totally nude.

[Autumn]

God, I'd be too afraid.

[Dom]

Again, much older. And I was just like, I. I don't know what's going on. I don't know where to look.

[Autumn]

Oh my God.

[Dom]

But then there was like a group of like two couples standing there, all new, talking. Guy and girl, guy and girl standing there talking. And I was like, I mean, talk about, like, you'd have the best eye contact in the world because you don't want to look down.

[Autumn]

Seriously.

[Dom]

We turned around so fast.

[Autumn]

But it's so weird. The be, but they don't care. The point is cultural. And I say that all the time because we act like there is some universal standard, but it's really just about the culture. We're in the culture. It's different every place. And I think that that's so important. There was a church I used to go to. There was this woman who was from Brazil. And a man in our church married her, like, and, and brought her to the States. And she was very. She was just different. The way she celebrated her body, the way she was like, the thong I'm gonna wear on the beach. And she always like, she'd wear these two piece, like a little top and skirt to church and things that, where. How I grew up and even my family were like, wow, we've never seen someone dress like this to church.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

But in her mind she was just dressing nice.

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

To church. And I thought that that was a. I'm actually really. That's one of the moments I'm thankful for, realizing culture plays such a big part. And I think that we need to work more on changing the way people treat women and how they dress like in our culture, like pushing that pressure on them and making it more respectful and Acceptable for people to do how they want. But oh, my God, a nude beach. It is. It's like, I can't imagine. I can't imagine going to a nude beach and just pretending like everything's normal.

[Dom]

I was like, hi, wave.

[Autumn]

No, you know, my mom, you know Nell, he says hi to everybody.

[Dom]

Nelson's hi to everybody.

[Autumn]

I'd be like, oh, my God, can you bury me in the sand?

[Dom]

I'm not face down.

[Autumn]

No. Because then it's ass up like the songs anyway.

[Dom]

Yeah, no, it was. It was intense because it was all of a sudden and it was everywhere and there were a lot of things swinging and I was like, I gotta. I gotta get. Get me back to that beach club again. I don't care. But I was just caught so off guard.

[Autumn]

Oh, right.

[Dom]

And since it's not normal for us, you're like, where do you look? Without making it feel like you're staring.

[Autumn]

Were there people, like, hanging out on the beach also? Like, were you the only people in suits or clothes? Oh, that's funny.

[Dom]

Everybody was nude.

[Autumn]

Because I feel like some nude beaches are like, they're nude, but there people on there who aren't nude.

[Dom]

But maybe later there was gonna be. But right at that moment, they were all, wow, naked.

[Autumn]

See, on a sandy beach.

[Dom]

That sounds like that things in a lot of change.

[Autumn]

Uncomfortable.

[Dom]

Yeah, that sounds like things are going to get in places that you don't want.

[Autumn]

I didn't need to exfoliate there.

[Dom]

Ow. But again, I don't care. Like, it wasn't like I was offended by it. I just was more caught off guard because we didn't go to a nude beach. And like I said, we don't have that in our culture. So you kind of like, where do you look?

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

Without it feeling like. Because you kind of almost want to stare because you're. It's like a train wreck. You're like, oh, naked.

[Autumn]

I'd be so worried about getting an erection the whole time. Not because I wasn't gonna happen on.

[Dom]

This.

[Autumn]

Turns into an innie real fast. Oh, my God. I swear this never happens. No, like, sometimes just when you're nervous and maybe it's because you're a kid. You like. Like, women don't know how hard it is to be a boy going through puberty. Like, the fear of being called to the front of your class or something, and you just happen to have one of your involuntary erections. It's the most terrifying thing. Or like being on a road trip. Or like, I remember my mom driving me to school. Yeah.

[Dom]

What does the road trip have to do with it?

[Autumn]

You know, the vibrations from the car. Oh my God, my bone up by accident. It's like, swear I'm not turned on. This is so awkward. Either that or I have a problem no one else experienced. No other guys experienced it. Anyway, that's what I'd be worried about.

[Dom]

Female audience. That you're okay. Yeah.

[Autumn]

The whole time I'd be like, oh my God. Like, I wouldn't. I would probably get an erection from thinking, don't get it. Don't get it. Right. Because the universe doesn't hear the word don't. The universe just hears. Anyway.

[Dom]

Yeah, that's. I guess that's one thing we don't have to worry about as women. Can't tell if we are or aren't.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

But yeah, if you're on a nude beach, that's. Oh, that's okay. Well, I don't think we're gonna make any progress at this point. Our culture is just suppressing women left and right, so.

[Autumn]

I know, well, I'm gonna fight it to the death, do what I can.

[Dom]

Same right up until it's Handmaid's tail up in here.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

Like, guys, guys.

[Autumn]

Anyone else see what's happening?

[Dom]

Yeah, you put me on a plane quickly. Anywho. Because we had a phone. A friend.

[Autumn]

Yep.

[Dom]

Should we just summarize what. What the question was? Like, it was a little bit of a long email.

[Autumn]

Sure.

[Dom]

Do you want to summarize it or you want me to?

[Autumn]

Yeah. So basically we have someone who I would like to remain anonymous, who's friends with a couple and they were friends. Like she's friends with one of them first and then this, her friend started seeing someone and she became friends with both of them. And the friend she was first friends with was like, will you do some one on one things with my boyfriend? Because I want to make sure it's a gay couple, by the way. I want to make sure that he feels like not alone while I'm working and whatever and that he has his own community. I don't always have to be there. So she really developed a strong friendship with the new guy as well as she had one with the guy who was her original friend. And anyways, they broke up and they say we totally expect you to be remain friends with both sides. But in doing that, that it's like there's always kind of a problem. She always feels a little bit in the middle.

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

And her original friend is feeling like she is choosing the now X.

[Dom]

The Now, X.

[Autumn]

Exactly that. Who was the new boyfriend?

[Dom]

And she was asking what she should do. Should she not stay friends with the new guy, the new guy, the. The person that the other guy broke up with, or if she's. If she's in the right to say, well, hey, you. You introduced us and said, be friends with them. And so now I am friends with them. So I'm not gonna stop being friends just because you broke up.

[Autumn]

Right. So what do you. What's your advice?

[Dom]

So, okay, it's. Well, here's the thing. I. I would give different advice. So because it's a gay couple, it's two guys, and this is a woman asking, can she stay friends with both. If this was a female male and the woman was friends with the wife, but then also became friends with the husband, I would say, you can't stay friends with the husband.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

That would feel inappropriate. Even though that's ridiculous to say, because guys and girls can be friends. Like, I get that.

[Autumn]

Like girl code.

[Dom]

Yeah, like girl code. Like, because I have friends, like friendships that have unfortunately fallen apart. And I was also friends with the husbands, but in no way would I ever be like, we can still be. We could still be friends.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

And it was just friendships. But I would never. Like, that's just right. But. And so, I don't know, like, I guess I should still keep that mentality, like, because who cares if it's a guy guy or a guy girl? But I would sort of weigh in and say as long as you don't have discussions with each of them about the other one, that you should be allowed to stay friends with both.

[Autumn]

Yeah. I'm really torn on my advice on this one because initially I do feel like you. You. Well, you need to be careful when you become friends with your friends. People, they're dating another.

[Dom]

Yes.

[Autumn]

Because it's always a chance. No one. No one together. Most people, when they get together, aren't planning on breaking up.

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

They're, like, hoping for the best. They're gonna be madly in love forever and ever and ever.

[Dom]

And we also know most people don't have.

[Autumn]

Yeah. Split. So it's like I am kind of like, I'm very friendly with my friends. Partners, but I still try to keep it a little bit more clear. Like, I'm like, if you guys break up, I don't wish. Have any ill will, and I'll be bummed. But I'm still. Still friends with the first person.

[Dom]

Right. Their little loyalty there.

[Autumn]

But I do think it's a little different too. When you're asked to and you spend a lot of one on one time, it's like you can't turn off your authentic self. And when you have a connection with someone of total friend connection, there's no risk of it being. It's not like it's another gay guy. There's no risk of anything.

[Dom]

That's what I was saying.

[Autumn]

Exactly. So I think in this person's scenario it is her responsibility to be true to herself and be the friend that she would want someone to treat her as to both of them and then how. Where they fall needs to be okay.

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

And it's okay if one of them are like, you know, I love you, but this doesn't feel comfortable for me now that we're broken up and needs to take some space. It's painful for everyone, but that's okay.

[Dom]

Right.

[Autumn]

But I think that that's what, what she should do. But in the future, like for me, just be mindful when you're really close with a couple that that relationship could end and you'll have some decisions to make.

[Dom]

Yeah. It is always hard because you don't want to have to pick sides. Like that's a theme you actually see a lot in life. Like, oh, the couple's breaking up and we gotta pick sides. And like somebody feels like they lost all their friends because the friend group sides with one person and so the other one's out. And so that does suck.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

I guess there, there's other, deeper questions like why did the couple break up? Did one do something sort of mean and hurtful to the other one or did they just realize it wasn't going to work out as being a couple? Because if somebody did something mean or hurtful, then I'd be like, yeah, hey, that's messed up.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

But if I looked at it like if it was you and Nell. I love Nell to death and I would never not be friendly with now, but if you guys broke up and you said to me it's uncomfortable.

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

You were first.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

Your French. Like, you know what I'm saying. And I hate saying that because I love Nell to death. But if it came down to that.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

It wouldn't be a mean thing to him. But I'm just sort of trying to put myself in that position to, to give the advice.

[Autumn]

Yeah, right.

[Dom]

It.

[Autumn]

I would say, yeah, you would choose me there.

[Dom]

Yeah.

[Autumn]

Which I will say.

[Dom]

Listen to this one.

[Autumn]

Well, no, that's not the plan. And also I think Nell and I are different and I'm my track record with people I have dated, which Nell's the longest boyfriend I've ever had. We're. We're more serious than any of my exes, but anyone I dated before, I'm still friendly with. Like, my family would, like, would. They were like, should we unfollow them? And I was like, no, you guys can be totally cool. It just didn't work out. But it's. It's not like that. So I think the problem would be, though, if. If that happened and I felt like you were, like, always busy with him.

[Dom]

Oh, yeah.

[Autumn]

And not calling me.

[Dom]

Oh, that would be.

[Autumn]

Then I. Right. Whether that was true or not. But I think. Think that then I would be like, okay, you can be friends with both of us, but how am I getting the boot in this scenario? You know?

[Dom]

Right. Like, yeah. What happened here?

[Autumn]

Yeah.

[Dom]

So, yeah.

[Autumn]

That's a tough situation. If it's unfortunate, I just want to say I wish you the best going through that. The. To the listener who wrote in.

[Dom]

Yes.

[Autumn]

And I. Honestly, everyone in that situation, the best. And, you know, the. The fact is, relationships of every kind, friendships, and they change, they serve purpose. It's okay for them to come to be stronger or a lot more present in terms of how much time you spend together. It's okay for some space to be had if it needs to. And just remember that it's hard.

[Dom]

Yeah. And just. Yeah. Just be aware. That's what I would say. Open communication. And be aware of how somebody might be feeling, because not only are they going through a breakup, but if they feel like their friend, they don't have that friend to lean on, because now the ex is getting that friend that might like. It's almost like two breakups.

[Autumn]

Right.

[Dom]

So it's like, oh, I'm already emotionally down and you're sort of kicking me when I'm down there. That kind of sucks.

[Autumn]

Right?

[Dom]

So you just have to be aware of all of it.

[Autumn]

Yeah. And communicate your feelings.

[Dom]

Communicate your feelings. So you guys phone a friend.

[Autumn]

Yeah, I was gonna say we want. Want the juicy, the dirty, the nasty. Or maybe I'm speaking for myself. I don't know. I want all the juice in the phone A friend request.

[Dom]

Yes.

[Autumn]

That you send to us if you'd like us to give some advice or some thoughts on your situation, something that you're dealing with or someone. You know, what they're going through. You can email us the [e-mail] and let us know if you want to be anonymous or if you'd like us if we can use your name.

[Dom]

We did get quite a few and we got some DMS too. So we have have some to work with, but we always want more. And if you want to DM us, you can do that @everythingsperfect official on Instagram. Make sure you're following us as well. As always, thank you guys for joining us and we're gonna see you next week.