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- [00:01]
Paige Desorva
This season, let your shoes do the talking. Designer Shoe Warehouse is packed with fresh styles that speak to your whole vibe without saying a word. From cool sneakers that look good with everything to easy sandals you'll want to wear on repeat, DSW has you covered.
- [00:16]
Lexi
Find a shoe for every heel from the brands you love like Birkenstock, Nike.
- [00:21]
Paige Desorva
Adidas, New Balance and more. Head to your DSW store or visit dsw.com today. This is Paige Desorva from Giggly Squad. Opill is a game changer for sexual reproductive health. They're the first over the counter daily birth control pill available in the U.S. finally, the days of needing a prescription to get birth control are over. Opill is FDA approved, no prescription needed, full prescription strength, estrogen free and available online and at most major retailers. So so when there's no prescription, no appointment, there's no hassle, no more waiting at the doctor's office to get a prescription. Opill will be easily accessed over the counter, in store or online and will be ready for when you need it. Opill is available online and at most major retailers. Use code giggly for 25% off your first month of opill@opill.com welcome, welcome welcome to the Fantasy Fangirls podcast where two sisters dive deep into beloved fantasy lore, character themed series and more.
- [01:38]
Lexi
I'm Lexi, older sister and Fantasy Lore nerd.
- [01:41]
Paige Desorva
And I'm Nicole, younger sister and romantic at heart.
- [01:44]
Lexi
And today is our episode three Deep Dive of Spark of the Everflame by Pen Cole, where we're covering chapters 15 through 21. But before we begin this episode Deep Dive, please listen closely to our spoiler warning because all of these episodes include spoilers for all three released books in the Kindred's Curse saga, which means all of Spark, Glow and Heat of the Everflame.
- [02:04]
Paige Desorva
So if you don't know why Ron Ghislaine had it come in cell block tango style, then please go finish the series. We will be here when you're done.
- [02:13]
Lexi
Next, we at Fantasy Fangirls are adults who say adult things about adult books. In other words, friends, this podcast is.
- [02:19]
Paige Desorva
Rated R. We meet Vance this episode and right now is probably the only time you'll ever hear us talk about him without throwing down explicitives. But but still, please do be mindful of those little listening ears.
- [02:32]
Lexi
Additionally, we are so excited to see you at upcoming live events.
- [02:35]
Paige Desorva
I will be interviewing Rachel Gillig, author of One Dark Window and the upcoming the Night and the moth in Denver, Colorado this weekend. On May 25th, we will be featured.
- [02:44]
Lexi
Guests at Enchanticon in St. Louis, Missouri August 15th through 17th.
- [02:49]
Paige Desorva
Then we will be at the Everflame Ball along with Pen Cole for the first ever Kindred's Cursed Soccer Ball on August 30th in Castle Rock, Colorado. We will also be back at the Dragon Gauntlet in Boyne City, Michigan September 12th through 13th.
- [03:01]
Lexi
Then Romantasy Bookcon in Orlando, Florida October 23rd through 25th where we are interviewing Rebecca Yaris again at Disney World.
- [03:09]
Paige Desorva
Check out our website or the links below for more information to all of these events.
- [03:13]
Lexi
Last thing before we jump into the Spark of The Everflame Episode 3 if you love Fantasy Fangirls and want more events, more content, more community and just so much more all around, please check out Fantasy Fan Club.
- [03:24]
Paige Desorva
We have three membership tiers that you join can number one the Descended which includes access to our Boppin Discord live Q&As from Lexi and I, a book club, exclusive author interviews, community events like trivia, promo codes for live events, plus exclusive designs and 20% off all merch. That is for $6 a month. Or you can join the Royal Family which includes everything from the Descended level plus early access to ad free episodes. Our full episode outlines special voting privileges that is for $10 a month. And last but not least, we have the Crown's Council we have which includes everything from the previous two tiers plus more behind the scenes content. A welcome gift from Lexi and I giveaways a private Discord channel named Kheel and it is so fun. I love that channel so much and your name is shouted out on the podcast that is for $25 a month.
- [04:15]
Lexi
Join the party at fantasy fangirls.com fan club. The link is also in the show Notes and Freely and truly friends, thank you from the bottom of our hearts for supporting us as we've turned this podcast into a dream come true.
- [04:26]
Paige Desorva
It's all because of you and now it is time to join the Guardians of the Everflame.
- [04:32]
Lexi
To start off every episode, Nicole does us the honor of summarizing this stretch of chapters. So gather round as we consult with our royal advisors to discuss what happens in chapters 15 through 21 of Spark of the Everflame.
- [04:45]
Paige Desorva
Chapter 15 after arriving in Paradise Row for a healer call Bat Signal Style, DM is met by a blood covered madam. But the blood is none of your concern. DMD DM heals the not bloody patient using the good old distraction method and is told that with her eyes she'd make a damn fine sex worker. Which DM politely declines. But then a blood curdling shriek pierces the air. Pulling out her dagger, DM sprints towards the commotion. Off the main road a descended man is towering over a woman and her child. Or should I say their child. This douche canoe of a man is attempting to murder his own half mortal child and DM ain't havin it. Calling upon her father's lessons, DM rushes to the aid of the woman and child, throwing her dagger with a accuracy only for it to bounce off the descendant like a pebble against the tree. Shit. Wrong blade. Well, looks like he's got time to get a shot in a shot of magic. Chapter 16 A tingling feeling explodes through DM's body and no, it's not thanks to Luther Courbois setting her skin ablaze with 100% definitely not magic. The not magic flashes before Diem opens her eyes. He missed. With one final burst of not magic, DM evades another attack from the descended man. He missed again. Knowing she's absolutely fucked if she doesn't get help, DM does the only thing she can do and yell fire. Then slashes his ankles open. Having successfully scared off the big bad wolf, DM rushes back to the child, but it's too late. Both the mother and boy did not make it. After burying the mother and son, DM and her rage filled heart stop towards Henry's door. She is ready to join the guardians of The Everflame. Chapter 17 it's testing day. Walking up to Evrenbennet's front door in Lumnose City, DM is greeted by a very angry child who, after a verbal lashing from his father, leads DM to a very young girl's room. With some coaxing and a little candy, DM leaves Ebony's room and heads back to the parlor, but not before taking a quick pit stop into Evrenbinet's personal office. With a swish and flick, DM starts copying down anything and everything she can see that is on his desk.
- [06:50]
Lexi
What's that?
- [06:50]
Paige Desorva
Footsteps are approaching and it's time to bounce like a bat out of hell. DM finds herself in the kitchen, ready to play dumb and by the flames.
- [06:57]
Lexi
It works.
- [06:58]
Paige Desorva
Clutching her contraband, DM collects her payment and gets the fuck out of there. Chapter 18 DM meets Henry outside and boy, he's in trouble. But Henry has his sights set on one thing and one thing only. What information was DM able to find in Evram Binette's personal office? I don't think Henry could fangirl any harder if he tried. After getting the rundown on how the hell DM got in and out alive, Henry lets it slip that she didn't actually have to get anything to pass this little test. But that's not all he let slip. Oh nay nay. These documents are enough to blow the lid off of Bonette's business. Literally. Heading back to the meeting location, DM is denied Guardian entry with a no card game for you from the Mafia man at the entrance. But after showing her stolen wares to the father, DM has successfully proven herself. Welcome DM Bellator to the Guardians of the Everflame. Chapter 19 it's Mickey Mouse Clubhouse. Come inside. It's fun inside. Entering the Not a Cult Rebel meeting room for the first time, DM comes face to face with a teeny tiny little problem. Her fellow healer Lana is here and she knows everything DM just did. But she's not the only familiar face. Breq is back. However, it's not the time for catch up. Assignments are being passed out and DM's name is thrown out by none other than her boothang. Her new task? Obtain access to the royal palace and move freely to find the place that the Guardians are looking for. Easy peasy lemon squeezy. Chapter 20 thanks to Prince Prince Luthor's strict rules about decorum, Moira brings DM up to speed with the 411 on how to greet the very unconscious King. Walking up to the gates of the palace, Prince Luther is here and he's ready to search Diem's body personally. For weapons, that is. And search he does. Trusting DM with the blade he found, Luther leads the two healers into the King's chambers. King Ulther lays motionless while Moira gets to work. Seeing as this is her only chance, DM remembers that she forgot her bag out front and being as subtle as a rooster during the 5am Wake up call, DM takes off in a dead sprint down the hallway. Using her DIY map of the palace, DM attempts to find her way out, but she doesn't get far before footsteps sound behind her. Mission failed. At least Luther stabbed one of his guards instead of her, right? Chapter 21 Moira gives DM the silent treatment for almost the entire walk back to Mortal City until she cracks, giving DM the knife twist Luther gave his guard Diem wasn't ready for the job. DM is never going back to the palace. And dang, it's a good thing Aurelie isn't here to see what DM did today. Ouch. DM heads to the Guardians clubhouse to report to the Mouseketeers about her mission. Suffice to say, they are not too pleased with DM's lack of performance, though she is still breathing, so that adds a few more brownie points to her scorecard. Realizing she needs something to give them, DM turns over the only other piece of information she has. Remember that secret entrance? Yeah, it's back. Outside of the meeting, Henry confesses juuust how much DM's involvement is getting him hot and just how much he wants to marry her. Just how much he wants a bun in the oven. Just how much he wants to start a family full of babies of their own. Could have started with let's go get dinner. But sure, DM being the master of avoidance, she is. She takes Henry's confession and raises him a I just need some more time. Time is a weird way to say Luther, but okay.
- [10:05]
Lexi
Well friends, it is now time to reach for the foraging magic and unravel key insights, character analysis, lore, foreshadowing theories, and oh so much more. I do want to say that as we get ready to cover chapters 15 and 16, I think it's important to give a trigger warning for death of a child. I know for me this part was hard to read, so we really want to be sensitive about how we discuss it on the episode. And we're going to keep the focus on DM in the scene, but if you prefer to skip this part of the deep dive, we completely understand. We only ever want you to listen to your comfort level. After treating a patient on Paradise Row, DM rushes toward the sound of a woman's cries of pain and fear. She comes across a woman and her four year old child cowering beneath a descended man wielding shadows with an expression filled with hate. As it turns out, this is the boy's father and he is here to kill his half mortal son.
- [10:51]
Paige Desorva
As a reminder, in this world the union between mortal and descended is forbidden and if a child is born from any mortal descended pairing, that child is immediately condemned to death. However, the person who is in charge of upholding these laws, AKA Luther Courbois, has put in place certain incentives like a monetary award so that the children who are discovered to be half mortal are turned in rather than killed outright, which has saved many, many lives. But in some instances the descended parent doesn't want their house knowing about the child. Like Ron here, who is of House Ghislaine, who after many years of trying this house has finally been allowed entrance to one of the 20 prestigious houses of Lumnos, and doesn't want anything or anyone to jeopardize it. But this does bring up a question. Why are half mortal, half descended children forbidden? And where there's a question, there's a theory. I sincerely believe that half mortals are more powerful. I mean, like, look at Luther or Zellerik as two great examples. I also wonder if it's that way because of how the Kindred wanted it. It's almost like after they bound them to a mortal lifespan, because they found their mortal mates through their love, they had half kindred, half mortal children. So the Kindred want the melding of these two races together to be more powerful than the former.
- [12:07]
Lexi
I have an idea here. I wonder if DM will end up being more powerful than her father. Let's say that is Omnos. And Omnos had a child with a mortal, which created dm, who is essentially like the first descendant of this Kindred bloodline. Which could maybe make her more powerful than her father. I don't know how that would be.
- [12:29]
Paige Desorva
But yeah, I think you're 100% onto something. I see the Kindred based off of what their goals were for the melding of the descended and the mortals in Amarian. I see them wanting every single generation to be more powerful than the previous one. So I think you're 100% onto something. But then I think it was discovered about how when a child of Immortal and a descendant is more powerful, the descendant didn't want the mortals getting too much power, or at least to power in their bloodline. So they outlawed half mortal, half descended children so that they didn't overpower, you know, the great descendants themselves.
- [13:03]
Lexi
I definitely believe that the half mortals are also more powerful, like you're saying here. There was also that luminous girl at the Umbros Inn who is very powerful too, despite being so young. The Arboros crown as well. She's half mortal too. There's just so many half mortals who are more powerful than most ascended. And I love that theory about how that's really what the Kindred wanted to embody and what they stood for. We also do know that no matter what, the Kindred blood will always overpower. So I assume even someone who is like 1/16 descended still has colored eyes and magic, because their descended blood always triumphs. We will learn in GLOW that these progeny laws was actually King Arthur's compromise to not banning the mortals outright. So I'm leaning toward these laws are maybe not put in place because the half mortals are more Powerful, but because the descended are just really scared of having people with that power who are, I'll say, outside of their control, you know.
- [13:56]
Paige Desorva
Yes, yes, that's exactly it.
- [13:58]
Lexi
Seeing this gut wrenching situation with the mortal mother and child and the descended father about to play out, DM chooses to fight this battle. She has been on the verge of boiling over, I will say, I feel like we say that every episode, but now is when she really plants her feet in the sand and joins the fight, in this case literally, because she can't possibly turn away from this poor mother and child whose only crime is being mortal. This child's only crime is literally being alive. And this mother, she was a sex worker and. And her best clients were the descendants. So she was literally, I'll say, just doing her job. DM and the rest of her people cannot afford to turn a blind eye to these injustices anymore. We've talked endlessly about the sheltered life DM led up until the start of the story. And now she is seeing and experiencing firsthand the horrors that these entitled, privileged, cruel, descended inflict upon the mortals. She and the voice within her are demanding to fight back. I love how it is, Ron, that she ends up choosing to battle in the Challenging at the end of Glowing. That plot twist was just so delicious, so fantastic for DMs arc, because here she is working together with her godhood to fight back against this descendant who deserves to be served justice. And then during the Challenging, she will know that is an instance where she and her godhood do like each other and can work together against him.
- [15:13]
Paige Desorva
On any given day, DM would always choose to save an innocent. But then add on top of it, the eye opening reality of what she's been seeing from the descended and their actions towards putting mortals in their place. And like she says, quote, smart and rational were privileges of the lucky, the fortunate few who could afford to close their eyes to injustice and walk away. Oh my God, that writing.
- [15:35]
Lexi
What's more, DM recognizes this mortal woman here from the day of her mother's disappearance. No, we did not catch that in our foreshadowing segment. She was the one on Paradise Row who accepted the weapons DM took off the asshats and she helped DM evade their pursuit, very possibly saving DMs life that day, as these men were out for blood with her. We can also gather that this woman is a lady of the night, like I mentioned just a few moments ago. And like the Garden women explained at the start of chapter 15, descended men have no Problem coming into Mortal City for a little action. In fact, descended are some of these women's best customers. Considering how much of sleazeballs a lot of these descended are, I'm looking at you, House Hanover, especially toward mortals. I can imagine how this is the case. So putting two and two together, Ron was a patron of this mortal woman. She ended up pregnant and has been hiding this child now for four years. And it's so sad. She is just begging DM to save her child.
- [16:26]
Paige Desorva
It is not a surprise that DM frustrated beyond belief that Ron isn't giving her a second glance when he's so focused on the mother, DM takes one of her blades and launches it at him. What is a surprise is that she launches it towards his neck. She was going for a kill shot, however, it was a mortal blade, so it just bounces off of him.
- [16:46]
Lexi
When she's still thinking this is a death blow, DM feels a cold, heavy numbness at the prospect of this person's death on her hands. I believe it would have been the first light that she has taken. And instead of feeling sadness or regret because Ron wholeheartedly a million percent deserves it, DM does feel a dark acceptance that makes all of her quote, ideals seem distant and foreign.
- [17:07]
Paige Desorva
I think Ron is the first life she takes though, right? At the challenging. Yes. So it's so poetic that she tries to take his life here and has this moment of like, oh my God, like this is. And later she will do it and not really feel a whole lot of guilt about it. At the challenging.
- [17:27]
Lexi
Well yeah, because she tried to save his life and he's like yeah, that sucks.
- [17:34]
Paige Desorva
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- [17:49]
Lexi
I always feel like I can tackle the day when I take my ritual stress relief in the morning because I really do need all the stress relief help I can get with so many balls always in the air. Plus, these supplements taste great and Ritual has a variety of other products to support your body's needs.
- [18:03]
Paige Desorva
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- [18:36]
Lexi
Summer is around the corner, friends, and I am so excited for the return of patio Weather. It's my absolute favorite and there's no better place to go for outdoor furniture than Wayfair. Wayfair's huge selection of outdoor essentials will help you make your outdoor space more comfortable, functional, and most importantly, more you.
- [18:51]
Paige Desorva
Our patio is all thanks to Wayfair. We have a table. We have a little couch out there. You all have been commenting a lot of my bookshelves actually behind me. Yes, they are also from Wayfair. I was in a meeting yesterday with Hayden and Lexi. I was in a chair that was built from Wayfair. I basically redesigned my office and my patio thanks to Wayfair.
- [19:06]
Lexi
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- [19:26]
Paige Desorva
Shop the huge selection of outdoor furniture online this summer. Get outside with wayfair. Head to wayfair.com right now. That's W A Y-F-A-I R.com Wayfair Every style, every Home this season, let your shoes do the talking. Designer Shoe Warehouse is packed with fresh styles that speak to your whole vibe without saying a word. From cool sneakers that look good with everything. The easy sandals you'll want to wear on repeat. DSW has you covered.
- [19:57]
Lexi
Find a shoe for every heel from the brands you love like Birkenstock, Nike.
- [20:01]
Paige Desorva
Adidas, New Balance and more. Head to your DSW store or visit dsw.com today. Race the Rudders.
- [20:13]
Lexi
Race the sails. Race the sails.
- [20:15]
Paige Desorva
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- [21:06]
Lexi
This dark acceptance that DM feels right now is very interesting to consider as we continue reading the rest of the series. And she keeps her ideals at the forefront where right now they feel distant and foreign. But later on she's really going to grow and keep these ideals very strongly centered. You know, even when another person like Vance who deserves to die is at her mercy. But I wonder if in Burn she's gonna have to choose this dark acceptance for the greater good and deal with the emotional turmoil it will still leave her in.
- [21:35]
Paige Desorva
I really do wonder if there was part of her also in this moment with Ron that felt brave enough to take that kill shot because she subconsciously knew her mortal blades wouldn't pierce his descended skin because her mortal blades wouldn't pierce his descended skin. And Ron didn't even turn his head to acknowledge this knife. Instead, he uses his magic to end the mother's life, which causes Diem and the voice inside her head to roar and agree in their motivation. Fight but not fight the descended necessarily. It's more fight for the child's life. So DM gives the descendant a second option rather than his. I have no choice. Bullshit. Due to the progeny laws, she will take the child and claim him as her own as they find a new life in Umbra. She won't tell anyone who the child is or who his father was. She doesn't even know Ron's name as of right now. Here is the choice that she gets to give a descendant. She's praying that this man has a sliver of humanity in him that would allow for him to take her up on this offer. An offer that would completely turn her own life around. She would have to leave her family, her job, her life, but it would save an innocent child and that she is willing to make the sacrifice. So she begs this descended man to take the choice, but he does not. Next book after Ron is completely drained of his magic and begging for mercy for his life, Diem does what he does not have the courage or selflessness to do here. She lets him go, only for him to literally stab her in the back two seconds later. The literary parallels are pretty stark here. DM is begging for the child's life in this scene. Later, at the end of Glow, Ron will be begging for his own life at the challenging DM allows for him to keep his own life. But Ron chooses to end the life of both Childe and dm. But DM doesn't go down without a fight. Flinging Brex for Tosian steel blade again, it lands directly in his neck.
- [23:28]
Lexi
Okay, aim.
- [23:30]
Paige Desorva
Good job, dm. Except it still struck too far away from any veins that would bring him down. And damn the descendant and their healing abilities because he grabs the knife and yanks it out of his neck. And the wound instantly stitches itself together as if it was no more than a minor cut. And it officially dawns on dm. The descended are truly gods. Evil, horrible, murderous gods. And the mortals don't stand a chance in this battle of strength. This feeling of helplessness here is a very important moment in Diem's character arc and her decision to go to the Guardians. She does feel helpless in the presence of this mighty descended alone. But DM knows a united group of mortals might stand a chance against the strength of these godlike people in they work together.
- [24:15]
Lexi
Shoot. I mean, that's when she forms her plan to yell fire. In order to get others attention and draw a crowd over here. Not necessarily to fight against this descendant. She knows better than to assume that they'll do that, but to have witnesses to what he is doing. Ron turns his shadowy spikes on dm where they hover in a lethal halo around her chest. Despite the voice within her demanding to fight and be unleashed, DM recognizes that this is her end and she begins accepting death. She has nothing but her own skin to protect this boy and the hope of leaving this world with a little peace as she recites the forbidden mortal religions rite of endings. Yet when Ron strikes her with those shadowy spikes, it only sends her skin ablaze and tingling explodes within her. His power doesn't do anything to her. She's still keeping the boy huddled in her arms. She's untouched and still keeping the boy huddled in her arms. So what Ron, did you miss here? Even he can't believe this. He's stunned. He's like, but I hit you. But no, he must have missed. So he shoots shadow arrows at her. And while the darkness surrounds her, DM feels that same icy tingling. There's another blinding glow. And DM's fine. Dang, dude, you missed again. What are you, like a stormtrooper here?
- [25:26]
Paige Desorva
Jeez, I will never forget reading this for the first time and being like. And naively I was like, he must have missed.
- [25:35]
Lexi
Yeah, and the wolf got spooked, huh? Yeah, but this is a reread. And we know better. DM very uniquely can absorb Descendants magic. Their powers don't do any damage to her. And in fact, magic directed at her only strengthens. Damn. So, in fact, if she was, I'll say, just a descended, and Ron used his powers here, they should have worked no matter what. Whether she's mortal or ascended, this should have worked, which is like a. What the fuck is going on here? Which brings us to our favorite game, how delulu is dm. Oh, dear girl, you admit that there was no chance those arrows wouldn't hit you. And even for his first attempt, let's go with, like, sharp her. DM's not familiar with descended magic, so maybe there's like the tiniest possibility he missed. But that tingling she feels and the blinding light and the fact that it happens again when he is convinced that he hit her. DM, you get a 4.5 for this Dulu rating.
- [26:31]
Paige Desorva
Okay. I was originally gonna dish out my first five.
- [26:35]
Lexi
Me too.
- [26:36]
Paige Desorva
But I actually decided on going with a four. It would be way lower if this only happened once, but the fact that it happened twice and seeing the arrows heading towards her, that's. That's a hard thing to mistake. But in her defense, this. The reason that I docked it a point is because even among the descended, this is fucking impossible. So she doesn't even know this type of power exists. She barely knows the descendants power exists. That is true. So I'm gonna give her. I'm trying not to talk myself into a 3.5, because I want to give one answer and actually stick with what I say. So I'm gonna give it a 4. All right.
- [27:16]
Lexi
I am sticking to my 4.5 with half a point subtracted because again, it is something that even the descendant haven't seen. And dm, you are really running out of excuses.
- [27:27]
Paige Desorva
She is. There's. There's a moment later that. That will definitely not be a four. Let me say that honestly, Ron is just as stunned as DM is in this instance. He can't fight her because she just absorbed his magic was a sponge, and it was nothing. And neither of them understand this weird new magic thing. He does understand that with the new growing crowd following her call of fire, his time to act is over. So this asshat flees, but not without committing Diem's face to memory, and not without DM getting a nice cut in around the ankles. But sadly, there were no Victors today in this fight. As DM turns towards a child, she realizes that he is dead. And DM hits her Last straw. Hearing about the injustices in the world is a regularity in Mortal City. But it wasn't until the last month or so that DM had fully began to experience these injustices firsthand. She's been talked down to, groped, and treated no better than a bug on a shoe. But those pale in comparison to watching two innocent deaths occur right in front of her eyes from one descended man. And she feels useless in the light of what happened to them.
- [28:38]
Lexi
Them.
- [28:39]
Paige Desorva
She's done feeling useless in this fight for the mortal survival. Prior to this Paradise Row visit, DM was starting to itch to do something. But watching this fight play out changed something fundamentally from want to do something to need to do something. She has to fight back to make them pay for what they've done, and not just for their murder. They took over mortal land, they changed their school systems, they oppressed them. And now innocents are paying the price. Price. She is done waiting.
- [29:08]
Lexi
DM has always prided herself in being a skilled healer, and so much of her identity is tied to it. Yet now that she is driven to fight, fight, fight, she feels like healing is reactionary. It's passive. She can't wait for someone to get hurt before she's useful. She needs to be proactive and protect the innocent before they need healing. Because in this fight against Ron, she just felt like another weak, useless mortal. At the end of the day, her swagger and her confidence evidence don't matter because the descended will just do whatever they want. Yes, there is the voice inside her, her godhood that insists on fighting. But also at her core, this is who DM is. There is a reason that her godhood says fight when others. Like Luther's is protect. She didn't choose to be a healer. Her mother set her on that path by the time she could walk. Now that she's off the flame route and her mother is gone, DMs figuring out in real time what path she does want for herself, what path she needs to take for herself herself. And she's ready to make a difference. She's ready to join the collective voice rising up against the descended and channel her anger and agony into something productive.
- [30:10]
Paige Desorva
After burying the boy and his mother, then going up and down Paradise Row in the freezing rain trying to find anyone who knew who they were, DMs molten hot rage from the fight earlier has cooled to quote something sharp and unforgiving. She isn't just mad from the murderer descended from earlier. No. With this cooling of her wrath, she came to the widening of her anger, including including all descended, the cursed king, the progeny laws that brought this evil to them. So before she loses her nerve, before the sharpened edge of that grit and determination leaves her, she knocks on Henry's door. It's time to join the Guardians.
- [30:46]
Lexi
But you can't just say you want to be a Guardian. You have to prove it. Which brings us to Henry and DM in Lumnose City several days later, where a healer has been requested at a descended hotshot's house. Henry assures DM that this test and gathering of intel can help save a lot of innocent lives. And listen, I don't believe Henry has malicious intentions here. I know that's becoming a common phrase here for us on the podcast.
- [31:07]
Paige Desorva
Don't you say us. That is a you statement.
- [31:09]
Lexi
I have said that too many times.
- [31:13]
Paige Desorva
I don't agree. In this instance, I don't think he has malicious intentions. It's just a little. A little manipulative.
- [31:20]
Lexi
Oh, absolutely, yes. So he is guiding her through this initiation. He also insists that this test of obtaining info from this powerful house is for her to prove herself to the others that she is not going to betray the Guardians. And yes, Henry does follow up with reminding DM that getting out alive is more important than getting info safely. But DM's takeaway is there is a test of loyalty and courage to see how far she's willing to go to get necessary intel for the Guardians and their mission to dm. That's a challenge of needing to succeed. Her identity is rooted in being the best at what she does and going all in with what she sets her sights on. What Henry fails to mention is that no one actually completes their first mission. And the real purpose of this test isn't about what information they get, but whether they're willing in the first place to take the jump and try.
- [32:09]
Paige Desorva
I'm going to give Henry the first of multiple Ls. I'm going to give him this episode for not helping her with expectations. More like you're saying Dan is an overachiever. Of course she's going in thinking she has to go above and beyond. And I think he could have stressed a little harder that you don't need to do that. Please just survive. Because she's even thinking as she goes in, like, if I'm going down, I'm not taking Henry. Like, I'm like, dude, like, maybe stress it a little harder. Which brings me to my own personal headcanon for this trial. I think that Vance set up an incredibly difficult trial For DM on purpose, there is no way the other guardians would have had to interact with one of the most powerful descended houses. Later we will see in the. In the guardian meeting, there will be elderly, there's sex workers from the garden, there's old classmates and teachers. I cannot even imagine what kind of tests they had to do to prove their loyalty to the guardians. But I guarantee you it was not interact with House Banette. Yes, there was a healer call. I understand the circumstances, but they set up those circumstances. It also makes me wonder what Henry's test was. Was. Or was it just him waiting to kill Aemon and then the guardian saw him?
- [33:24]
Lexi
Yeah, I think that these more difficult tests are reserved for the wannabe guardians who have the most access to the descended. Henry recruited DM in part because she has such direct access to the descended as an esteemed healer who is now the palace healer. Plus, with the doubts that some of the guardians have toward DM because of her father, I think that Vance purposefully made sure her test was jumping into the deep end to really see if she's able to be trusted as a spy, to see if she has the grit that he. He thinks that she might have to help his efforts.
- [33:55]
Paige Desorva
I see that as one of the reasons. Yes, I do see a whole other side of this, where it is that kind of malicious side of Vance. We know that Vance and Arleigh did not always see eye to eye. So I see this as partly a test to see how far Aries daughter would go to really put her through the wringer. Whether that's consciously or unconsciously a way to assert his dominance over a Bellator, Especially after being under Arlie's leadership for so many years. And he's like, I'm a man, I need to assert my dominance. I just. I. That. That seems very Vance.
- [34:28]
Lexi
That's very Vance.
- [34:30]
Paige Desorva
DM isn't going to any old descendants house though. She is taken to House Banette, one of the most powerful and influential of the elite. 20 houses that basically control all of Lumnos. While these 20 houses control the realm, there's only five that hold the most power. Corbois, Banette, Hanover, Tenares and Amrau. If these five houses are in agreement, the rest are most likely to. House Banette is the second most powerful house. They provide weapons for all of Lumnos. And the head of House Banette, Evren Banette is a very powerful, very murderous weapon dealer who despises mortals. Besides providing the weapons to Lumnos, he's had a hand in almost all weapon dealings in Omarion, and he will not remember this interaction with DM at all next book when he meets her as queen. Instead, he'll be all puffed up and say how honored he was to have welcomed her in his home. Bro.
- [35:25]
Lexi
So the hope here is for DM to get intel that can help the Guardians intercept a weapon shipment and put the weapons in mortal hands instead of the descended hands. Yes, we are going to overlook the fact that DM knows any information she retrieves will purposefully put weapons in the mortal's hands to use against the Descendant. She really does believe in the Guardian's mission, even if DM is naive in how she thinks they can accomplish these goals. I'll hold off on talking about all that now because we did so much last episode, and we'll crank it up a few million notches when we dive into it next episode. When DM is greeted at the door, she is reminded just how meaningless she is among the descended. The Bennett family sent for a healer. And the son who opens the door sneers at DM for why would they send you this preteen Loris is disgusted by DM's attire. She looks like a glob of mud splashed on a wedding gown in the midst of their residence. And he has grown up being told his family is more important than the Lesser Houses. He's been taught societable judgments and prejudices in this wealthy city that loves to play the population politics games. So even though this boy, Loras, will assume DM is a Descended, he still looks down on her. She's a healer, first of all, and that's a position beneath the descendant of Lumnos, because that should only be for mortals. The descended go to Fortos for healing if they need it. And then he's also later on like, well, you can't be that powerful because you're just a healer. And so again, power in most instances automatically equates to status, right? If you are not powerful, then you are automatically seen as less than among the decent.
- [36:51]
Paige Desorva
Well, then let's not forget that when Lily expresses like, she she would love to be a healer, and DM is like, oh, well, like let's train you. Lily's like, no, no, no, I can't work. And I would assume with Bennett being a very powerful house alongside Courbois, it would be very similar, especially for the child of Evram Banette, who's the leader of the house.
- [37:10]
Lexi
Well, and then also going back to DM's attire, she is dressed very poorly for the descended standards like far beneath the elaborate and colorful attire of these descended of Lumnos. All I can picture when she's des fashion and just like the whole culture here is the capital of Panem.
- [37:25]
Paige Desorva
Yes, that's exactly what I thought. Slightly agitated by this child talking down to her in such a manner. DM has no problem fibbing that she is a descendant, or at least not correcting him entirely when he makes that assumption. This whole section is just rich on a reread because it's so clear a just how little DM knows about their culture and the hierarchy of the descendants. It's not her fault. Cough Cough Looking at you Arlie Cough Loris asks which house DM is from. We know from Glow that there are those 20 houses. They each have their own hierarchy in the house and the house is having status over other houses, yada yada yada. So Loras asking her absolutely makes sense. He wants to know how far above you am I. He would probably treat her differently if she was a Hanover or a Courbois versus a Ghislaine. But DM knows nothing, Jon Snow. The only house she could name is Courbois, which quote even I would never be fool enough to claim. Give it a month Diem Bellator. Or should I say Diem Corbois, Queen of Lumnos? I keep going back to something Pen said during our book club interview. This was almost a year ago. One thing that interested her in this story is what would happen if the absolute worst person for the job of the crown was selected and that person is Diem, with her intense lack of knowledge on how the other half of Lumnos works that she will be ruling over. Luckily, DM uses her wit to her advantage when her knowledge of the descendant just utterly fails her. Evading the what house are you question by using the clear fear the boy has for his father's anger, telling him that she's being paid by the minute and would Loras like to waste any more of his father's gold? I love that her tactic is to go for the fear of the asshole father losing money because DM right now sees the descendant as these extremely wealthy and wanting to hoard their power and the power that wealth gives them. So it makes sense that she uses that as leverage since it's the only thing she really sees from the descended right now. But of course this is DM and she doesn't just see the snide ego this boy has, she sees the family he grew up in and thinks that of Course this kid ended up this way. When his father is like that. A twinge of sympathy goes out to these children. They weren't born with this I'm so very important head on their shoulders. It was taught to them from the actions of their elders, who were probably taught from their elders.
- [39:41]
Lexi
Generational ideologies will be a big theme in especially GLOW and of course the rest of the season series. And I just can't wait to explore that. How this younger generation's hope for a better future motivates them to fight for change. And DM is really a spearheader of that as she recognizes this nature versus nurture, right? So I can't wait until she really finds her people in GLOW and they band together to find a better way for this world.
- [40:05]
Paige Desorva
She doesn't see people act a certain way and then immediately decide to hate them because that's who they are. She always subconsciously asks, why are they the way that they are? And she reflects how she is fortunate to have had a family who loves her, who taught her what a happy marriage is, who taught her what unconditional love feels like. These children clearly do not have that and it's not their fault. Therefore why should she hate them when it's the system and the environment that they're molded in to make them act this way? As we see Loras hold his little sister's hand later when he's wanting her to be brave, there is that loving, caring heart within him and at his core. And it's only when he feels safe enough to tap into it. Oh, Loris.
- [40:45]
Lexi
Once again, my mama heart grows three sizes when DM interacts with Loris's young sister who is the Benette child needing a healer today. As DM gets to the bottom of what caused this rash, she learns that a woman gave this little girl flowers while they were out in town. According to Henry, emphasis on according to the timing of this house call at a very important powerful descended family's house is just a blessing from the old gods. After all, the Guardians figured out the young daughter was ill because they eyes on all the key descendant just in case something like, you know, this happens. But when DM presses and finds out from this young girl that it was a mortal woman who gave her a poisonous plant in Lumnose city, that's when DM's nagging suspicion levels up to fury as she puts two and two together. Guardians set this up for her test. They purposefully poisoned this little girl so she would require a healer, AKA dm for the ration, other side side effects. And yeah, DM would never believe it now, but we will find out. Henry knows all about this when he sends her in. I will be talking about that more soon. This flower called Death Shade is lethal if ingested, but if touched it gives you a rash and other minor side effects like a stiffly nose, a little bit of fever and watery eyes. So yes, it is a very good thing that this little girl did not ingest the flower. You all I have young children. Do you know how easy it is that that would happen happen? But even Henry will brush this possible risk off in chapter 30 when he argues that the descended have killed thousands of mortal children. As he says, quote if one spoiled descended child has to have a mild rash for a day so thousands of mortals could live. How can you say that's not a price worth pain?
- [42:23]
Paige Desorva
Henry, he's fully lying to diem when he tells her the timing is a blessing from the old gods. No it's not. He knows that this was the guardians doing this to get the little girl the Death Shade flower. And I think he believes he's not lying because he's like, well the guardians are working from the old God's intentions. Henry.
- [42:45]
Lexi
L L L L big ol L He also knows that DM would not say yes to this. Like she even is like I would never have agreed to this otherwise. And he's like yeah I know, I know I lied.
- [42:59]
Paige Desorva
DM even thinks about how she knows how Henry's heart and he would never condone such a thing. We've talked so much about how Henry loves the old DM and we'll talk about it more this episode. Well, dm you know Henry. But you know the old Henry, he has changed. He's angrier, he's harder, not in the fun way. And he's been molded by his own environment and those he spends time most around to be more aggressive in these types of acts. He doesn't view them as hard, as heartless. Instead he sees them as the descendant are finally getting a taste of their own medicine. You do not know his heart right now. He would do something like this. But she believes so wholeheartedly that he hasn't changed. Just like he believes so wholeheartedly that she hasn't changed.
- [43:42]
Lexi
With cream to treat little Evony. So she's feeling better by this evening. DM knows that now is the time to spy on and stop the head of this family who does terrible things. So after her patient falls asleep and no one else is around, DM sneaks Into his office.
- [43:55]
Paige Desorva
Office.
- [43:55]
Lexi
Pause for a quick moment. Because the fact that DM is unattended in a descended home and even able to sneak into this office is unheard of for a mortal, for a descendant outside of the family, for a healer, for anybody. And she uses it to her advantage. She switched from her healer mode to spy mode to polarizing identities in a tug of war as she'll continue figuring out her morales later on. But for now, let's find some intel.
- [44:17]
Paige Desorva
While creeping around the desk, DM sees stacks of documents, ledgers with unfamiliar words or confusing notes, numbers. But after rifling through some stacks, she notices a map of a large armory. Yes, we will come to learn that this is the armory in the palace. So large and in charge. Indeed. She will also find a ledger of all recent buyers and copy several pages of their names. I mean from a Guardian's point of view of fighting this war, I understand completely. While they're like why? They're like holy shit, you got the jack pot. They now have a highly detailed map of the descendants largest weapon storage. Later the Guardians will blow up this very structure, killing both through the blast and through straight up murder, many Descended guards unwatched and destroy many of Evrym's weapons that will set him back months.
- [45:07]
Lexi
The Guardians will also take quite a few of his weapons as well. And that's going to be really beneficial for the Guardians. Unfortunately it is Vance who will have these weapons.
- [45:16]
Paige Desorva
And then Ophio and little Feokai.
- [45:19]
Lexi
Yes, exactly.
- [45:20]
Paige Desorva
Then she also gets this list of people who have bought Descended weapons. AKA she now has a list of people that the Guardians can target. Again, from the Guardians perspective, this is a slam dunk.
- [45:32]
Lexi
Oh no denying this is a slam dunk for the Guardians. It's how they'll use this intel that DM will have a problem with. Vance will lead a group that blows up an armory and kill descended who are literally just there doing their jobs. But intercepting shipments like Henry originally led with. For this mission is in the safe zone for dm because to her she's thinking about what the descended lose, which is like property and you know, things like weapons versus what the mortals gain and the action that they take in order to do so.
- [46:00]
Paige Desorva
DM getting this intel is why House Banette is so very very very high on my list of suspects for Andre's murderer. Which brings me to a theory we're probably going to revisit multiple times, especially through glow. What if Evren Burnett suspected that DM is the one who stole these blueprints we will see in Glow just how furious he is with the mortals. And when Andre speaks up during their meeting, Evram is even more livid and ends the meeting with him threatening to challenge her. Taking DM's father out is a damn good way to ensure that she's absent as a ruler while she's mourning. And House Corbois would look weak.
- [46:35]
Lexi
I definitely see where you're coming from. And I do believe that House Banette is a top contender for Andre's killer. I don't know how they would put that. DM stole the blueprints though.
- [46:45]
Paige Desorva
Yeah.
- [46:45]
Lexi
And I'm leaning toward they just hate mortals.
- [46:48]
Paige Desorva
I hate that. I think you're right. But I don't know. I loved last episode. We brought up Breck as more of a higher possibility and I'm. Yeah, I'm interested to see as we deep dive, especially Glow, going back to other things that DM learns from this office. Earlier, when DM was walking with Loras to Ebony's room, she overheard quite the conversation from Evram, learning that the last three shipments of weapons have been missing half of what they ordered. Most likely because the rebels are intercepting these shipments and stealing half of the shipments. Sophos is researching an explosive that can match the explosives the rebels are producing. And both Meros and Fortos have put in orders for these upcoming bombs. But if Sophos can't hurry it up with their research, then Evren will have to turn to Umbros to get this specific type of weapon. So much here. Yes. Mortals explosives that the Guardians will use both for the armory attack next episode. But also these rebel explosives will be used on Kirill. Arlee has some of these rebel explosives right now. Now, I looked in books two and three for any explosives specifically mentioned around Sophos, and it couldn't find anything. So I wonder if this is something either we haven't seen yet or if Sophos is going to try to use DM's explosive power that we saw after her father died and hone that into something that is more precise and that will cover this explosive weapon that they're researching. Researching. Maybe that's also the. What we assume is an explosion in the vision that causes all the bodies around her to be dead and strewn about in such a manner, successfully getting.
- [48:15]
Lexi
The map of the armory, a few other documents, and copying the info on recent customers. DM barely escapes without any suspicion. Zanal, the God of Luck, is on her side, that's for sure. Or whatever the Kindred equivalent is. And Understandably, very shaken. DM takes her anger out on Awaiting Henry outside of the Banette family home, because, no, she is not all right right now. She almost got caught in Evram's office, and she has some serious questions about how that little girl got sick. But Henry's main takeaway is.
- [48:43]
Paige Desorva
Whoa, whoa, whoa.
- [48:44]
Lexi
You got into his office unattended. What'd you find? Like I mentioned, this kind of infiltration is unheard of. And Henry is so proud of his girl and this groundbreaking information, she's retreated.
- [48:55]
Paige Desorva
It's time for a plant watch. Henry is loud, lounging outside, half hidden by a tree with blooming ivory camillas. The camilla is a symbol for love, adoration, and longing. But fun fact. Back in Brazil during the Imperial age, camillas were a symbol of abolitionism, and it was a common practice for abolitionists to plant camillas in solidarity of the movement to outlaw slavery. With joy and pride in his eyes for his girl's successful venture, Henry looks at diem in a way, way he hasn't really ever before. He looks at her with, quote, a reverent kind of pride. It's a look that DM realizes is true respect. If you've been listening to the podcast for a while, you know, one of my favorite things on the planet is when an mmc, or any love interest for that matter, allows for the protagonist to fight their own battles. Not as a test, but because the MMC, or the person, has full trust in the FMC's ability to fight a battle without them. But they are here if needed. So typically, they'll stand off to the side or they'll stand off to the back. But in those cases, that trust and belief and respect in their partner is not earned. It is naturally given because it just is here, Henry. L doesn't seem right. I want smite. I want to smite you for this. I am giving you a smiting. L, capitalized, underlined, and italicized.
- [50:25]
Lexi
Wow. This is the first time in FFG history there is a smite.
- [50:30]
Paige Desorva
This does go back to Henry's belief of men versus women. She's a healer. She didn't earn that respect from being a damn good healer, because inherently, Henry does view that as a weaker role. She's a fighter, but that's thanks to Andre, who Henry has lost respect for due to Andre's rank in the army. But it isn't until she does something for for the Guardians, an organization that he is passionate about that he feels is making a true difference in the world. That is when he finally looks at her with respect. Well DM, this whole time has been making a difference in ways that he views as smaller, but she's been making them every single day. I know that he believes this showing of respect is a huge step in their relationship. It's a big moment for them, but it implies that her worth in his eyes hinges on performance and alignment in his own cause. You know how life goes where we think there's no way it can get busier, but then, surprise, it always does. Say goodbye to sticky notes and calendar confusion with Skylight the Skylight Calendar is here to help keep your family organized. This beautifully designed digital display syncs with your existing calendars, making it effortless to track events, appointments and reminders in one easy to see place.
- [51:39]
Lexi
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- [52:04]
Paige Desorva
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Lexi
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Lexi
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- [54:37]
Lexi
Henry is implying that DMs worth her earning of respect hinges on her performance and alliance with his cause. Yes, yes, Nicole, this sounds like the perfect time for a Henry hat. Let's put ourselves in Henry's POV and see why he believes she has now earned that respectful gaze from him and why he, you know, misled DM about the motives of this guardian test. Henry, my boy, you get a jester hat today. And also I have little jingles on this thing and it is going to drive Hayden absolutely crazy. I am so sorry. Ahead of time. Henry, unlike dm, has had his eyes open to the world of the descended and the fight to survive against them for a long time. He's been taught through loss, through hierarchy, through brutality, that action is the only currency that counts when it comes to winning this fight, it comes back to this idea of for the greater good. Henry is willing to mislead dm. In other words, lie to DM about how this little girl got ill because he knows DM well enough that she would have refused to do this if she knew the truth. So what's a little white lie for the Greater good for the possibility of getting valuable intel to weaken the descended and protect the mortals. As well as a big test for his girl to be deemed worthy by his brother in arms. Then when DM steps fully into Henry's world and shows her grit and determination through this huge success, it clicks for him that she's earned the same hierarchy as other members of the Guard Guardians, in fact, more than most members. He was in full Guardian mode when he sent her into that house. Yes, first priority is getting out with your life, but also you gotta pass this test. He, on a personal level, needs her to pass this test. Not for her worthiness as a mortal rebel, but for her to be worthy of being on the same level as him. And his fellows can die, hang with the boys, so to speak. Even if we readers know it shouldn't have been necessary to be earned in the first place, like Nicole was saying. Or rather that he should have already felt this deep sense of respect and admiration and connection with the woman he loves for just being the person that she is now. She has crossed the threshold from the passive role as healer to comrade in arms, ready to fight. It's not that Henry's realizing she's only capable now, it's that he's finally recognizing her in the language he understands best and what he's most passionate about, what he has dedicated his life to. At the end of the day, we already know that Henry is going to choose the Guardians over dm. He has already chosen the Guardians over her with the disappearance of her mother and how he does know something about that and he has been lying to her. And this is a really big instance of when he is willing to lie to his girl for the Guardians. Right? And yes, well, it's because he believes.
- [57:21]
Paige Desorva
They'Re on the same side. He believes they're. They're working towards the same things. And I keep going back to what Andre was saying about with. He always felt like he didn't need to know everything that R. Le was saying because. Because, you know, that's just unconditional love. And that's kind of Henry's standpoint. He feels like DM shouldn't need to know everything in his life because he believes they do have that unconditional love.
- [57:42]
Lexi
Yes, exactly. So anyway, I'm going to take the Henry hat off. I know we also like, weave this all in, like, throughout. And then this is kind of like the little cherry on top here. But anyway, I'm going to take my little Henry hat off. Bye bye, Jester hat.
- [57:53]
Paige Desorva
The more we Deep dive into Henry and DM's relationship. It really goes to this idea that he believes, believes he loves her. But I do want to rephrase this statement ever so slightly because he believes he loves the idea of Diem and who she is. If they fight alongside each other in this battle. After all, that's what they've been talking about, albeit passively, for basically all their lives. They've spent countless nights talking about the horrors of the Descended and their reign and how, you know, and how the mortals deserve better. So when the opportunity to have DM alongside him no longer is in a passive manner with their hatred of the Descended, but it's instead in an active way, his mind almost convinces itself that this is where their match made in heaven lies. Naively, he's ignoring the signs that are right in front of him that A, her version of fighting back is very different than his, and B, she was worthy of your goddamn respect long before she joined the Guardians. She is worthy of respect because she is your best friend. She is her own person with her own skills. She is worthy of your respect because she's a fucking human being.
- [58:58]
Lexi
So I do want to point out it's not like he hasn't respected her previously, but it is now in a totally different way.
- [59:05]
Paige Desorva
She did say he looks at me with a newfound look that she realizes respect that she's never seen on his face before.
- [59:12]
Lexi
Yes. And because I do think that it might be doing him a little bit of a disservice by just saying, saying like he hasn't found her worthy before this and all that because he has loved her, but now he is seeing her on equal footing with him and what he's doing with this fight with the Guardians.
- [59:28]
Paige Desorva
And yeah, he's loved her in a way of believing that of the two of them, he is the one who is doing something actively where she's passive. And now you're right, he is seeing her on that equal footing.
- [59:42]
Lexi
Yes. Later on, DM and Henry come up to the back of a seedy rundown tavern in Mortal City. Outside the door, a burly man sits on guard.
- [59:51]
Paige Desorva
I'm not gonna lie, I kind of love how truly Mafia man this guy is. All the way down to his hat. That's like a little tipped off to the side. Which by the way, Henry does slip and starts to say this man's name. It's D A R Dar. So is it Dariel? Dario? Darwin? Daris? Darth Vader? I don't know. But I'm going to keep an eye out in this deep dive because I'm pretty sure we never see him again in Clay Glow in Heat. And while we might never see Darth Al Mew again, a man emerges from this card game who we will absolutely be getting to know throughout this deep dive. And that man is Vance, who seems rather familiar to DM when she first sees him. Yes, we will learn later on the road to the exploded armory that she saw him once waiting outside of the Healer center whispering to Arlie A spontaneous meeting of Guardian leaders perhaps while we will be analyzing and cursing out wanting to flambe his stupid head. Vance in detail as we get into Glow and especially in Heat here as we first meet him, he seems completely normal, like a different person, at least on the surface. He's curious about what DM acquired at House Banette. He's defending her in some ways and most importantly, he lets her in even with quite the pushback from his right hand men. Francis and Brant, which pause men surrounding Diem is male after male after male, determining her worthiness to allow her in. And she hates it fairly. She hates feeling inadequate and that is the vibe she is being given at this very moment. Given how Henry mentioned the Guardians were run by a woman. Yeah, it would be extremely disheartening to be surrounded by these guys who hold her approval or denial into the club. It does make me wonder when Otto Marley was in charge, were there people who were being called into these types of situations? Were they a mix of genders? This is Vance is doing because he very much believes in that brute force and that men are the ones who provide it. We will see this throughout the series with almost all of Vance's group interactions that he chooses for missions or fights. They are all male. Regardless, there is pushback about DM being off limits to the Guardians. Ah, Arlie's rules are straight, staying straight strong with some people. But Vance smiles and says that she's an adult who's capable of making her own choices and more importantly deciding where her loyalties lie. Ah, this is so coded because on the surface it seems like the loyalties of choosing to fight the cause versus stay oppressed, but in hindsight he's saying that she can choose that her loyalties are not with orally or not with her father the Commander, and instead her loyalty is with with the Guardians.
- [62:28]
Lexi
We have to remember that Orly made it very clear that DM is off limits. She cannot join the Guardians, she cannot know about the Guardians. She is very very sheltered from the descendant and the Guardians. And so here These guys are like, vance, she's not supposed to be here. What are we doing here? And he is like, no, she wants to join. He's pretty much saying, her mother's not here and she's an adult and she can make her own choices.
- [62:50]
Paige Desorva
Well, and I think another reason he is letting her in is to also say a little bit of a you to orally. Apparently. I just believe Vance is the devil incarnate. It would. It wouldn't be a stretch to say that Vance did not enjoy being Arlie's number two for so long. Especially given that he believes she's not as strong, as worthy of leading as that she's not as aggressive. So letting DM in is a way for him to say, ha, take that orally. I'm in charge. I'm making decisions now. Like, fuck your orders.
- [63:22]
Lexi
Yes, And I also think maybe that's just a bonus. He recognizes how useful and eager DM is, how much of a fighter and go getter she is, and he wants to use that to the Guardian's advantage. He's not about to turn down a great candidate who has a. I'll call it innocent career. A very trustworthy career as a healer with direct access to descended homes.
- [63:44]
Paige Desorva
There's also this moment during the meeting where Vance reminds everyone that under no circumstances are you to share the names or identities of your fellow Guardians audience. I think he's reminding everyone that because DM is here and he's like, no one fucking says anything about orally. Got it? No one. You're not allowed.
- [64:04]
Lexi
The fact that it takes her so long to learn about her mom being the leader of a group that she has joined is impressive. It's honestly impressive. Really, really made that very clear to everybody.
- [64:15]
Paige Desorva
I could just imagine her at the podium at the end of every meeting and. And remember the number one rule. Don't share any Guardians identities. And the number two rule, DM is never allowed. I just don't see that perfectly.
- [64:26]
Lexi
It makes me realize too, Lana probably knew about her mother being a guard. Unless maybe she did join afterward. I bet Henry recruited her.
- [64:35]
Paige Desorva
Oh, I bet you anything Henry recruited her. Pause, though, because there is someone else here in this alley. Before going into the card game, something tingles against DM's skin and she feels a presence in the shadows in a nearby alley. Luther, my guy, you're here because he very much knows that the Guardians are here. And he knows that it's Guardians meeting night. Not as subtle as they think they are, guys.
- [65:01]
Lexi
Holy moly. You're right. I never picked up on that. But yes, he's like at some point says to dm, the Guardians are not nearly as sneaky as I think they are.
- [65:10]
Paige Desorva
I know. I love that line. Oh, it's so good.
- [65:12]
Lexi
Now that she's allowed entry into the meeting, DM is surprised that the Guardians are made up of more than just burly men. Like the impression she got back in Fortos. And even this interaction she just had with Vance. There's plenty of women here, including people DM recognizes. Like a seamstress her mother knows. Ah, there's someone connected to her mother. A few sex workers, the trainee healer Lana who came with DM and Moira to help with the accident at the palace. Even a former classmate and her old teacher. Not only that, but there's children present too, as well as the elderly. All of this to say the Guardians aren't just a bunch of tough men. It's a diverse community of people in all walks of life who hope for and are working toward a better future. Knowing that the Guardians have continued on in secret for generations after the Blood War. I bet it is deeply ingrained in some families to simply be a Guardian. I feel like it. Also. I also love how this humanizes the Guardians mission. They're not all like Vance who believe violence is the only way. These people have been led by all Aurelie, who might be willing to sacrifice a lot and could be cold and calculated when she needs to be. But she does not believe in brute force and aggression. First, like Vance, from both the outside.
- [66:17]
Paige Desorva
Interaction and inside this meeting, DM is starting to notice a pattern. Everyone is called brother or sister. With Vance being known as the Father and the female leaders as mother. Oh, the irony that Aurelie is mother here and mother for dm. And while Henry is insistent on this group definitely not being a cult, there is quite a history of this type of language being used in cults and also in religious movements. This is used to strip away identities which we see outside the meeting where they're only referred to as brother or father versus inside the meeting they're called Sister. Name like Sister Diem. But this type of hierarchy language around the leader is another way to signify them as the ultimate. Or specifically with the Father, the divine figure. Outside of the cult references, there are other reasons this language might be be in place. For instance, calling someone brother or sister. It gives us immediate sense of family ties which helps those who may have feel like they've drifted apart from their family due to their involvement in the rebel cause or they lost a family member due to the descended. But it also fosters that loyalty, making it almost harder for someone to turn them in.
- [67:20]
Lexi
It goes back to the collective voice of the many that we talked so much about last episode. Together, they are a force to be reckoned with. Together, they have a driving purpose. Purpose. Together, they can make a difference.
- [67:30]
Paige Desorva
It's also that slight symbolic rebirth. This is a new family of yours in a new identity, a new life for you to be filled with purpose. We absolutely see that with one Mr. Henry Albanon. Then there's this Mother Father title, which, yes, it symbolizes that they're in charge. But as Mother Gothel said, mother knows best. It implies that the Mother Father has the highest level of wisdom. They are the care caretakers. They are the protectors of this group, and others will obey them like one would follow a parent's orders. As the meeting continues, we learn about a previous successful mission. Quote Sister Samira completed a high risk delivery in Lumnos City. What kind of delivery? That was very cryptic. Was this delivery the flowers to Evony? Or was it something to do with the reason Breck is here in Lumnos rather than in Fortos, since he did have a weapon shipment. But that's really all we know since DM stopped listening to the meeting.
- [68:24]
Lexi
I love those possibilities, especially the flowers one. I hadn't thought about that, and that's what I'm going with. I think that the Sister Samira was one who gave the flowers to little Evony.
- [68:35]
Paige Desorva
Father Vance, of course, shares about DM's successful mission as well, which is met with mostly a round of applause, with the exception of one Ms. Lana, who is staring at DM with judgment. After all, she knew that like all the other healers did about the house call to house Banette. So here goes Diem using her vow as healer for evil. Which is rich given the fact that Lana most likely blabbed about what happened in the palace and healing Lily. So my headcanon is that Lana isn't judging her for the healer vow. She's glaring daggers at her instead. Because Henry got DM here, which means Lana is going to have a harder time wiggling her way into his heart.
- [69:15]
Lexi
Yes, that's my impression too. It's like 70% being jealousy and the other 30% being that, yes, DM is one of the top healers at the center and as a role model to others, who has always held her healer's vow in the highest regard. And here's Lana being like, oh, dm. Wow.
- [69:31]
Paige Desorva
Okay, I Bet DM also has. Maybe as she's teaching or as she's mentoring, she might have like, really cracked the whip on. The healer's vow is most important. The healer's vow is most important. So Lana's over here being like, bitch.
- [69:46]
Lexi
Yeah, a little bit. Like, that's rich coming from you. Yeah, well, because, yeah, Dima's already struggling with how she is using her healer access for the Guardians now. And it seems like Lana is not quite there yet. Especially when we find out later that she did not give up the location of the secret entrance to the palace. Now, Lana is also a trainee, so she does not have the same degree of access that DM does, but there is is that vow that Lana has upheld better than dm, and that is a big deal for DM to realize. Speaking of leveraging healer status for the Guardians, DM is torn between two emotions. Number one, she needed this sense of purpose for herself. And she appreciates feeling like she's good at this, being part of the Guardians, like she might belong here. Henry has a whole new sense of respect for her. He's proud of her, and the Guardians are impressed by her. Mission accomplished.
- [70:36]
Paige Desorva
And.
- [70:37]
Lexi
And she has this nagging guilt. She has sacrificed her integrity as a healer, which was the line she was unwilling to cross just days ago, before the incident with the mortal mother and child and the murderous descended man. Choosing to push past it and be part of the Guardians anyway doesn't make that feeling of shame, guilt and trepidation go away. This is only the beginning of DM's internal tug of war with wanting to make a difference and being morally against the inevitable consequences of that difference that she wants to to make. Henry, on the other hand, is nothing short of giddy that his girlfriend is kicking ass and taking names as a Guardian spy. So when Vance declares that they need a Guardian who can obtain access to the royal palace and find a way to move around the ground floor unseen, Henry's like, that's you, Boo. Ah, yes. The mother of the Arboro cell who will meet in Heat of the Everflame, sent word that they have a big mission coming soon and they need help. In hindsight, this is Orly's mission on Cross Kuril. And now they need to start figuring out how to sneak the Guardians onto the boats to the Sacred island so they can see their mission through of taking control of the island. I don't think Henry knows that request to find the boats at the palace is for Aurelie. Though later he'll say Vance told him about the mission. So my guess is Vance will fill Henry in on the details of the Creel mission off page pretty soon. But while Henry might be enthusiastic to volunteer DM for being a Palace spy, DM is like, that's a big step up from what I told just did. And she was very shaken at how she almost got caught in Banette's office. It was sheer luck of Zen all that she got out of there without any suspicion. The palace is a whole other ball game, especially with Prince Luther already keeping a close eye on her. Yeah, he is. But if she wants a life worthy of a legacy, if she wants to make a change among the mortals, then she has to gather her courage and be ready when she might not feel ready yet. So yes, she will take this mission to live up to being the person she wants to to be, to make a difference in these efforts against the descended and to burn her mark into the world.
- [72:29]
Paige Desorva
Without a moment to stress over this dangerous situation, it is time to prepare to head into the palace for this Guardian mission. Because yes, DM did say yes to it. The timing could not have worked out better for these Guardians. For months since Arleigh's departure, Moira, who is definitely not part of the Guardians, has been in charge of King Ulther's care until today. Where did Diem takes over as palace healer? Remember, in DM's eyes, she feels like if she doesn't take over as the Bellator serving the palace, Teller will lose his position at school and thus the opportunity to study at Sophos, which is his dream. Not to mention feeling like this mission will help her uncover truths about her own mother. But today her eyes are set on the mission from the Guardians. So with her sketched out map tucked in her boobies and Brecht's knight knife strapped to her boot, she prepares to enter the lion's den.
- [73:19]
Lexi
I really do appreciate the contrast we get in Moira from the Guardian Sin Diem. We're very familiar with the angry mortals who hate the descended on principle. And then there is Moira, who knows how to play the game in this descended ruled world and considers the descended to be people too. And she doesn't instinctually poo poo on the kindred stories and histories. Moira understands that the descended are not so different from the mortals, and she offers empathy and an open mind without automatically blanking them all as evil over overlords. In a world where everything feels so black and white, Moira is the first to really think in the gray. I actually I put Andre in That category as well too. From here on out, as DM gets more acquainted with the descended and has to deal with the fallout of her involvement with the Guardians, she'll also begin to see this gray and choose not to live in the black and white like she does right now.
- [74:05]
Paige Desorva
The more DM gets involved with the Guardians and is surrounded by the egos of the descended, she's getting more lax with how she talks negatively about these descended overlords. So much so to the point that she joked with Moira about Luther's scar and how it must mean his soul is deeply corrupted. Damn dm. Especially given what she what the scar means to her later in the series, I'm like L. That's a lowercase L for you, madam. For someone who is so known for her judgment free attitude, with patience of all walks of life, I could totally see how Moira would be like what the fuck girl? But it just shows shows how deep DM is in her prejudice. She's putting almost all descended into this box of bad, not unlike Vance and Henry do.
- [74:50]
Lexi
Exactly. She doesn't see them as people like she sees the children as people. And yet then once they grow up, they're the evil descended like Luther.
- [74:59]
Paige Desorva
Yes, now this is very unlike DM and is not how she will stay for long, but it does highlight just how mad she is right now and how the confidence is and anger of the Guardians is rubbing off on her that this type of judgment flows freely out of her mouth as a random joke. But Moira is not here for this, Wondering with these comments if DM is ready to be able to leave her opinions of patients at the door just like she does with all of her flipping patients. DM has a rare talent as a healer, but also for her ability to have unrelenting compassion to any patient in any walk of life. We saw this on both her first and second trips to the palace. Both times when interacting with patients, she treated them with immense kindness. But since that day in the alley watching the descendant kill the mother and child, something has snapped that feels forever changed. And now she's going to treat a man who put the laws into place against the half mortal children and that compassion has left the building for dm. But when Moira threatens to go turn around and how this was a mistake for her to bring DM Diem along, DM assures her she can handle this situation. After all, she is a professional.
- [76:08]
Lexi
The way I see it is that DM wants to be able to handle this situation for all reasons except knowing she has to treat the Descended like fellow people. She needs to keep Teller in school. She needs access to the palace for the Guardians. She needs to learn more about her mother's disappearance. But DM has her own deep rooted prejudice that Moira is rightly calling out here. So yeah, deep. DM might want to be able to handle the situation, but she's not able to point blank. Let's see if getting frisked at the entrance to the palace is less of a disaster than last time. Well, for starters, Prince Luthor is here along with Sarai to greet DM and Moira. So I guess it's off to a good start. And DM did not bring her twin daggers like last time as she hopes to avoid attention during this visit. So she can do her stealth mission for the Guardians. But still gotta have Brex Blade, the one weapon she has that can actually help her against the Descended and keep it hidden. Unfortunately, it's the same guards as last time. And they're definitely not going to let DM's attitude from her last visit slide. Guys, you did not learn your lessons. And Luther is right there. No way will they let a mortal woman get the upper hand on them. Though as far as they're concerned, there is no lesson to be learned. Even after the show of power that Luther said last time. So the guard still squeezes DM ass aggressively. Rifles through their bags and such.
- [77:24]
Paige Desorva
Seeing the guard's hand squeezed tighter with DMs flinch. This fuck. Luther steps in to handle the search from here. Good job, my boy. What's even better is as his hands drop to hover over her hips, he asks, may I? We love a man who asks for consent. Gold star, Luther Corbois.
- [77:45]
Lexi
10 out of 10.
- [77:46]
Paige Desorva
No, no. With her consent, his hands start at her wrist, kneading up her arms like he's giving her a little massage. So he can feel anything and everything hidden under her tunic for one reason. Then he goes down. Her spine splaying wide at the hollow of her back, thumbs moving in slow circles up and around her ribcage. Then he gets onto his knees, fingers caging her leather pants around her inner thighs. His mo, his hate hands move down her legs to her calves. I'm not breathing. But then his fingers brush along the top edge of her boot. Shit. He felt Breck's knife. She made sure this man knew she left all her other blades at home. So this looks bad, bad, bad that she's trying to sneak one into the palace. So Luther totally arrests her right now, right? Nope. He Raises to his feet and tells her to follow him on a first read. This can feel very much like a what the fuck moment. Does he find her that attractive that he's letting you know her loose with weapons to go see the king? And the answer is no. Like we've discussed, he does put a lot of trust in DM because of the vision that was sent to him by Mother Lumnos about the gray eyed queen he would protect and serve. But there's a new angle I also want to pull in here because in the burn of the Everflame sneak peek chapters which yes, there are three chapters out right now. The link to access them is in the show notes we get from Luther's pov. What's going on in his head during these trips to the palace. His godhood during these visits was chanting quote, protect her, protect her, protect her. And he's convinced that this is blessed Mother Lumnos sending him this message. If he were to say hey, no weapons, he would literally be putting a target on her back. He wouldn't be able to usher her in, she would be in a cell probably this way he's able to watch her and protect her best.
- [79:36]
Lexi
Now she's ensured she'll have an excuse when she leaves the king's quarters because oh, I forgot my bag. Gotta go get it. I love this little exchange between DM and Luther. As they head to the king's chambers, she's physically drawn to his magic again because her godhead likes him. This leads her to ask questions about his magic. She genuinely doesn't know much about it or how it works. And she's an innately curious person. Also, being lured toward the magic probably makes her want to understand it more on a subconscious level. She might even know that this is what she's personally experienced. Like her hallucinations from all those years ago. While mortals are not allowed to learn about the descendants magic, Luther enlightens DM and explains how the concentrated light and shadows work to create the tangible magic Luno's descended wield. By the way, he should not be sharing this forbidding information with Diem. But guess what? He knows she is not just immortal and he's helping her get a little insight into the powers he knows that she possesses. I also love how he explains magic so much. DM might be naive about some things, but she is a healer and a very practical person when it comes to facts like this. And it's like Luther understands that about her and gives her as practical an answer as is possible to describe how magic works. Also for me, being the lore nerd that I am, I love when magic, magic can be explained like this.
- [80:50]
Paige Desorva
I love that you love that. I love the moment where he's like, quote that Ms. Bellator is why we call it magic. And it makes DM grin from ear to ear like, what a smooth talker.
- [81:03]
Lexi
Meanwhile, I love that line because it's like, oh, like it's such a great balance between tangible, logical reasons and then just magic. Like you always need that nice balance in these stories.
- [81:14]
Paige Desorva
I just need Luther Corporal I know. Walking up to the King's colossal chambers, which will be soon Diem's chambers, she sees her predecessor, King Ulther, someone she's never seen before due to her mother keeping Diem home on days where he would come into mortal City. But despite being prepared for the state of the king, Diem is quite taken aback by just how surprisingly he young he is, considering he's dying of the descended version of natural causes. After all, he seems to be around her father's age, so I'm assuming like late 40s, 50s? Ish. We know that the descended live a long time, and even yr Cell appears young and gorgeous when we know she's reigned for centuries since the Blood War. But as we got a small teaser for in chapter two from Teller, recalling information from his Law of the Crown professor, which that sounds like a cool class. Sometimes the Forging Magic itself will decide it's time for the crown to change hands. Even if they're young. Even if they're young and healthy, this very well might be what's happening to Ulther. The magic or the Kindred themselves are ready for Diem to take up the Limnos Crown. Unconscious or no, there are some very strict rules that you must abide by in order to be in the King's presence. One, you must kneel when you first greet him and wait to be told to rise. Number two, you don't do not speak until you're spoken to. Oops. Number three, you do not look directly into the eyes of royalty. Oops. Double oops. It doesn't take long for DM to get angered by the fact that she and more specifically Moira, are forced to bow for these two men, who in her opinion, have done nothing to deserve their obedience. So staring Luther directly in the eyes, that's rule number three. She stands, and her and Moira get to work on making the King more comfortable. Comfortable by coating his bed sores and salve and massaging his swollen joints. Their work here is not to heal him, but instead to make him as comfortable as possible, since the sickness has weakened any healing abilities he had, slowing his healing rate down to that of immortals.
- [83:12]
Lexi
But hey, you remember that bag DM accidentally left behind? Gotta go fetch it.
- [83:17]
Paige Desorva
Byee.
- [83:19]
Lexi
And without giving anyone the chance to stop her or let one of the guards go and grab the bag, she bolts out of the king's chambers. I'm sorry, I can't say this without laughing. DM needs the park and wreck. Don't be suspicious. Don't be suspicious meme. But instead they're running like Jack Sparrow.
- [83:33]
Paige Desorva
Because girl.
- [83:36]
Lexi
Cuz Girl, your 20 year oldness is showing. And yet it works sort of somehow kind of way. As she retraces her steps to get back to her bag that she threw in the dark alcove, DM ducks into an unused office while a single guard goes straight past the door. This is exactly what DM hoped and assumed would happen. Luther did not chase after her because she didn't think that he would leave Moira alone with the king. And there are only two guards at the door and one has to stay there. So Luther sends the other guard to go get dm, who she easily just evaded. Step two complete. DM may be completely out of her element in this palace on a very dangerous mission, but she's got the swagger of a young, cocky individual.
- [84:15]
Paige Desorva
She.
- [84:15]
Lexi
She's used to succeeding as a skilled healer and fighter. And yeah, our girl has a bit of an ego. A big, big ego. So at this point she's like hell yeah. I am so good at this. I can get into the palace, I can evade the guards. I can be a kick ass spy. DM orients herself with the map that she kept tucked away in her boobies. And let's just say it's not up to my standards as far as maps go, the only way the Guardians have this map in the first place is from decades of being in the palace as servants or traffic tradesmen and reporting back. It only has a primitive floor plan for the palace's many wings and floors, but at least in the lower corner of the map there is a door marked with a red circle that is supposed to lead to the underground canal. And that is what DM's mission is today. Sneak into this underground canal and search for the boat for where a stowaway can potentially hide. Vance won't tell her why he needs this information. Big red flag there. Just that it's for Arboros rebel cells mission. In other words, her mother's mission that the Arbo Cell is helping plan for the new Luminos crown coronation coming some point soon. Her mother is currently on Kuriel after Luther took her there on foraging day. She's planting bombs on the island and waiting for coronation. Then when the Crowns return for King Ulther's replacement's coronation, Vance and crew will be able to sneak into the palace boat and get to Kuriel, where Aurelie is awaiting so that they can take over the island after the bomb distraction. And yes, the Guardians in our Burros are also in on this plan, since their crown is sympathetic to their cause and helping them. I don't know if the Arboros Queen knows about this whole mission, but she's at least sympathetic enough where the Guardians are very, very active in our.
- [85:49]
Paige Desorva
That's a good question. I can't remember. Maybe that's a phone. A pen question we have for when we get to heat. Speaking of questions, do you think that Aurelie is the one who put most of this map together?
- [85:58]
Lexi
I would think so, but that's also very interesting because she could fill it out completely, like very detailed, and yet it's still rudimentary, so that must mean that she has held back on the details.
- [86:10]
Paige Desorva
Ooh, intrigue. That also. That might also be a question for pen.
- [86:16]
Lexi
Yeah, yeah.
- [86:17]
Paige Desorva
But then footsteps sound down the hall, headed straight for her. And for some unexplainable reason, she knows it's Luther. More like DM is bringing that Gen Z energy and she's noticing that aura. DM rushes behind a stone wall column, and while a little narrow, she still manages to hide herself from this. Now pause. I was wondering if here she's using like light magic to hide herself unknowingly. Kind of how Alix uses light magic to basically render herself or others invisible.
- [86:48]
Lexi
I don't think so, because her magic is not activated right now. DMs not in sync with her godhood like she has been when she uses her. Her magic. So I am going to say she's not.
- [86:58]
Paige Desorva
That is a good point. I think that's very logical. I reached out to Pen, had a phone and requested a phone append moment to see if this was a moment where DM was using her magic.
- [87:11]
Lexi
And for the record, everybody, Penn texted Nicole this because she went to go do the group chat and she saw that I had a green bubble and if you see send a video over to from like an iPhone to an Android, it's not as good a quality. And she and Nicole made fun of me for having. And Nicole's like, see, even Penn says you need an iPhone. So I have literally not listened to this video clip yet.
- [87:35]
Paige Desorva
Listen listeners, if you can help me by getting Lexi peer pressure to get an iPhone, that would be great for the business. Thank you.
- [87:41]
Lexi
Google Pixel forever.
- [87:45]
Paige Desorva
Regardless, here's what Pen had to say in regards to Is DM using magic?
- [87:51]
Lexi
Hi ladies, it's Pin.
- [87:52]
Paige Desorva
I hear you have some very interesting.
- [87:55]
Lexi
Theories on my books.
- [87:56]
Paige Desorva
I also hear you have a question for me.
- [87:59]
Lexi
When DM is in the palace on the Guardians mission, she runs away and hides behind a pillar. Does she use illusion, light magic to hide herself from view? The answer is no.
- [88:10]
Paige Desorva
I think that she, in my head.
- [88:12]
Lexi
I imagine her sort of crouching behind.
- [88:14]
Paige Desorva
This pillar with like one tiny little.
- [88:16]
Lexi
Sliver of her sticking out where Luther can definitely see her. Even if he can't see her.
- [88:22]
Paige Desorva
I think he can definitely sense her with her magic.
- [88:26]
Lexi
But I think he chooses in that.
- [88:28]
Paige Desorva
Moment to let her go. I think he's kind of just as.
- [88:32]
Lexi
Curious as we are what she's gonna do next because he just can't figure this woman out. What is she up to?
- [88:38]
Paige Desorva
But I think in this moment, as.
- [88:40]
Lexi
At least she is not using her magic. Hope that helps.
- [88:44]
Paige Desorva
Happy reading. Regardless on how she's hiding herself, Luther can absolutely feel her magic and apparently also just directly see her. I love that. And he knows where she is. While we as readers with context around the whole series know his intentions are here to protect. Like we brought up earlier in regards to his chapters at the beginning of Burn, DM here does not know that at at all. She believes this man had something to do with her mother's disappearance, specifically around, you know, aurally blackmailing him. And then he did something to her. He is very mysterious. And while they've had this pull towards each other, he did still hurt one of his guards on her last visit. And in her eyes, he's a little unhinged. Just wait till he stabs a guard in a few minutes. She knows from Teller that he is the number one pick for the crown. And he's extremely powerful. Powerful. And at the end of the day, he is a descended. And DM is livid and feeling so prejudiced against them all at this time. So anything that Luther would say to her would be colored in that light. With all of that said, it makes total sense that when Luther is like, it's in your best interest to reveal yourself or there's only so much he can do to protect her that she's like, oh hell no, I'm not Trusting you. Then he says, more urgent, urgently, quote, don't end up like your mother. She betrayed me and lost my trust. You should learn from her mistakes. Again, I'm gonna be team DM here for a second.
- [90:08]
Lexi
Me too.
- [90:09]
Paige Desorva
Because Luther doesn't know what she knows, he will ask her early next book and be quite shocked at her lack of knowledge around Aurelie and her schemings. So in DM's mind, the don't end up like your mother is, don't end up missing. Don't make me have to punish you like I did to her. So I would do the same thing DM does here. I would continue trying to make myself as small as possible, because if she trusts him and leaves her spot, he could have her arrested and have her quote, unquote, missing, like, aurally.
- [90:40]
Lexi
Yeah, I am fully in DMs camp of mistrust here. Like, I love Luther and I know that there's supposed to be an air of mystery, but she has got a good point.
- [90:48]
Paige Desorva
Yes, well, and then when Luther is talking to his guards, he. He says very ominously, bring her directly to me. We know that this is so that he can best protect her, but DM thinks it's so that he can punish her personally. That's terrifying.
- [91:03]
Lexi
Meanwhile, from Luther's pov, this is a repeat of what he experienced with Orly when she was a palace healer. He caught her spine and knew she was part of the guardians. So here Luther is wondering if DM is also spying. It should sure seems like it with the way she is sneaking around like her mom had. But Orly was probably much smarter about it. Dm, where she didn't get caught on day one. DM is absolutely playing a dangerous game, just like her mother was. And her mother lost Luther's trust. So here he is asking DM not to put him in the same position as he was in with her mother. He has given her a lot of trust. She literally has a Vertosian steel blade in the palace right now seeing the king, and he knows it about it. And he's here being like, can you not make yourself seem so bad right now? He's just saying it all in a very ominous way because he doesn't know how clueless DM is to what her mother was actually doing. He has no idea that she doesn't know what he knows about her mother.
- [92:01]
Paige Desorva
Walking back to King Alter's chambers with her tail between her legs. This is a unique instance for dm. She is used to being the best in her Field and the master of her craft. She is very high off her successful mission for the Guardians at House Banette. And while hesitant to do this one, it wasn't from a place of feeling incapable. She feels very capable. This is one of the first of many moments we are going to see DM have to deal with failure.
- [92:28]
Lexi
And she does not handle it well. As she begins choosing to step out of her comfort zone and go down her own path, she's going to stumble, she's going to make make mistakes. She's someone who is used to being an expert and damn good at what she does. And now she's a novice who at least up until this failure, had the confidence of that expert that she was in a different profession. And now it's like, oh, the guards are all coming and Luther is on to me and he knows where I am and yeah, this is not going to work out. There is no way I can make it to the boat, so I might as well go back to the chambers before I actually get killed.
- [93:00]
Paige Desorva
And while on the outside she seems calm, cool and collected, you know, admitting that she just took a wrong turn. Oh, DM inside, the fight in DM has extinguished both figuratively and literally, as that ever present voice doesn't even whisper to her. And she allows the guards to easily capture her and put a knife to her neck. More on that in a moment.
- [93:21]
Lexi
So yeah, these guards are jumping into action upon her arrival back to the King's Chambers. DMs like, I just got lost coming back from grabbing my bag. But they are having absolutely none of this. They surround her. 1 Rams DM up against the wall. All the while Moira is wailing in distress, doing her best to de escalate the situation to no avail. Moira knows that this could end up with both of them killed and their families even killed too. A guard slashes the bottom of DM's bag, sending all the healers things shattering to the ground. What a waste as they accuse her of having poisons. There's even a knife like Nicole was just saying to DM's throat. And she can feel the blood slide down her chest as it slices her skin. And she feels the pain that is very important there because yes, she just got cut the descended half for Tosian steel that can slice anyone's skin like a fellow descended. And listen, I am not condoning these guards jumping to violence here with DM coming back. But I also have to point out that she is an outsider who just bolted out of the king's chambers. And went missing. And none of the guards, or Luther, technically, could find her. You don't do that in the palace. Yeah. They are going to be wary of what she is up to and not fall for her perceived innocence. Like, she's like, why are they not believing me? It's like, because, girl, you are not innocent.
- [94:37]
Paige Desorva
Luther steps in, and homeboy is pissed. And boy, oh, boy, I get it. Luther doesn't trust many people, or really any people, for that matter, outside of, like, Taran and. And Alixe and Mother Lumnos, who he's been kind of blindly trusting the vision she sent him as guidance with Diem. Now he feels like Lumnos has steered him wrong and that he's misinterpreting the vision and that he might be letting a bull in a china shop loose in a palace. So he's at a crossroads. Continue putting his trust in the faith that he believes in or cut his losses with this girl who seems to have a death wish. And at the end of the day, that protect her chant wins out. Luther asks two guards, Rhygorn and Yannick, to step forward. One who pushed her into the wall with her capture, and the other who still holds a bloody knife in his fist from Dien's neck. Blood. Taking that very dagger, just using his shadow magic, Luther's shadows plunge the knife into one of these two guards stomachs. Whoa. Okay. Yes. The protector chant really hung out here. He is furious that this woman was hurt, who he believes is basically their salvation. And he, let's be real, is also hella attracted to her. He's pissed, don't get me wrong. So he's taking that anger out in a way that at least involves stabbing the guard in the palace that, you know, in a place that is at least no vital organs or at least a few veins with an.
- [96:05]
Lexi
So he's taking it out in a healthy way.
- [96:08]
Paige Desorva
He's playing voodoo doll, but with a descended man. But you know, the descended man. He'll be fine. He might just be in pain for a few days. But then he does take his anger out on DM by telling her to leave and that she should be, quote, grateful is with your life.
- [96:23]
Lexi
Luther is not someone to be undermined. And yet here DM is undermining him at literally every chance she can get. His guards are reacting to Diem and therefore undermining Luther in the process. Luther is kind of stuck between a rock and a hard place here, as his loyalty to Lumnos and his loyalty to protecting the palace from this gray Eyed woman Lumnos seems to have sent are pulling in opposite directions. He's probably like, Mother Lumnos. Who the fuck is this person? Like, I have to protect him.
- [96:50]
Paige Desorva
He's like, I thought I did my trial with you, but apparently you're testing me, woman.
- [96:54]
Lexi
Yeah. After leaving the palace, miraculously with her life, DM deservedly gets the silent treatment from Moira on the way back to Mortal City. Moira follows the rules at the palace. She has listened to what DM wants and given her the chance to be the palace healer against Aurelie's wishes. She has tried on several occasions to help DM understand what it means to be the palace healer and what is expected of them, what the protocol is. And yet DM has taken everything Moira said and done the opposite. DM has too much hate for the descendant. She's too rebellious and reckless to be trusted in the palace. And today's visit was the last straw. Moira is so disappointed in DM's disobedience that almost got the two of them killed twice. Now, when from Moira's perspective, there is no reason for DM to act out the way that she has been. I am absolutely on Team Moira this whole conversation. She handles her emotions and delivers her scolding to DM really well. Maybe that's the mother in me like praising how she scolds her, but it's true. Her words might come cut deep, but dm, you need to hear it, honey. Oh my gosh. And get a verbal smack upside the head.
- [97:58]
Paige Desorva
Moira goes on to really twist the knife. I should have trusted your mother. Aurelie knew you best. And if she didn't believe you could handle it, I should have respected that. DM deserves this, but fucking ouch. DM is never someone who thinks she can't handle anything. Like we were talking about earlier. She's a I'll figure it out or die trying kind of of a girl. So Moira pointing out that her own mother thought her incapable of this. Which isn't true, but damn, it still stings. And now Moira is chastising herself for not listening to the wisdom of Aurelie. Yeah, that twists the knife. Remember in episode one where I mentioned Diem's strategic thinking? Yes, she is a very strategic thinker when she is thinking straight. Which she hasn't really done since going off the flame route. And especially she hasn't really done since she's opened her mind up to the ways of the descended and how they oppress the mortals and this time is no different. DM's strategy was frantic. It was narrow minded on the singular goal of getting to the place the Guardians wanted her to go. So when dm, still with that frantic quality, tells Moira that she'll apologize to the prince because it's so important for DM to be in this role as Pallas Healer. It's for her brother after all. Moira cuts her off with a big dose of reality pie. If DM was truly thinking of Teller and her family's safety, she never would have done what she did today. She put Moira at risk. She put the work of the other healers at risk. She put Teller at risk. The truth is, DM was so zeroed in on the Guardian's mission that she didn't think of all of the consequences. She's thinking about the Guardian's mission more than she's thinking of her own family and what this reckless behavior could mean for them. And she's not the only Bellator female who does this.
- [99:43]
Lexi
That's exactly what I was thinking. Because oof. The way that Moira turns DM's concern for Teller around on her is so fair. So, so fair. DM has chosen obligations that are in direct conflict with each other. And it's like she kind of realizes it, but can't face that reality yet because it means she'll have to choose which is more, more important. And she can't choose. It reminds me of In Heat when Auralee will say family always comes first and it triggers DM into an outburst because her mother actually always puts the Guardians first. This is Moira giving the same kind of smackdown to dm. This is pre self aware dm. She's telling herself what she has to to make herself feel better, but her actions say something else. It's exactly like Aurelie. It doesn't mean that she doesn't care about her brother getting his education. But let's be real. She wants to be the palace Healer, to fight back against the descendant, to be a legendary Guardian and to make a difference. And that is taking priority, especially in her thought process and her energy and her actions than being a good obedient palace healer so that her brother can continue his descended education. Then Moira calls out an observation that DM can't face herself. DM's heart is not in healing. This path was chosen for her, as DM has reflected many times. But even though DM did not choose this path, her herself being a skilled healer is DM's identity. It's all she knows it's a big source of her confidence and her ego. It's her connection to her mother. It's what she's good at. But Moira knows that just because DM is good at being a healer, just because she doesn't want to complain about being a healer, doesn't mean that it's her destiny and what she personally truly wants for herself. Ultimately, Moira only wants her dear DM to be happy and to feel fulfillment. But the problem is not even even DM knows what would make her happy right now. As she tries and fails to convince herself it is this life set out for her.
- [101:28]
Paige Desorva
I think it really brings to attention the comfortability versus happiness. She has a job, she has her family. She has a man who on paper seems like a perfect match. But comfortable doesn't always mean true happiness. DM searches for purpose. She knows that she's capable of more, which is one of the reasons she joined the Guardians, believing that they would help her find that sense of purpose just like they did for Henry. But she doesn't feel like she's doing what she's made to do yet. And that's a really hard pill for DM to swallow. When it rains, it pours though. And DMs misfortunes for the day are not over yet because it's time to go talk to Father Vance and tell him about her mission. After again some trouble at the door from Darth Alamu. Vance, Brant and Francis who are his two right hand men, escort her inside to a table and ask how the mission went. Well, she managed to get away from the guards, she ran through the palace and still came home in one piece because they let her go. Brant specifically is super duper suspicious of this because there's no way in hell someone could run through the palace and have no consequence. Him and Francis are absolutely like there's more to the story here versus Vance who leans back in his chair hair and smiles looking at this mission as quite the success. Yes, she made it out of the palace alive probably because she's a healer and they tend to be more trusting of them. But my Vance radar is up and running. I think he also sees a girl who's so unlike Arlie who Arleigh is more strategic and careful. DM is reckless, she's an act first, think later kind of girl. He sees this reckless potential in her and he thinks of wanting to explore it more given that it's so much more his style. In fact, I love the moment where he shuts down Brant and Francis's questions with a quote. We are grateful for the risk Sister Bellator took today, are we not? Yep, you guessed it. Bellator is in italics. It's like he's reminding them. Remember who this fucking girl is.
- [103:25]
Lexi
Oh yeah, DM might be reckless and not ready for another mission, but she's a spitball of fire who he thinks can be very useful. I absolutely agree with you that he sees the potential in this this Bellator, but I also think he's excited to exploit her naivete. DM is reckless, eager to please, and has access that no one else does. That's not someone you dismiss willy nilly. He's playing the manipulation game with DM here and she is falling right into the trap. And that is not the last time I will say that on this podcast.
- [103:52]
Paige Desorva
But pause because remember that knife cut from earlier? When she returned to Ultra's chambers, a guard put her a dagger to her neck so force that quote, I felt a sharp sting and a trickle of warm droplets sliding down my chest. How interesting that now that same very cut is completely healed when Brant and Frances wonder how the hell she got out without a scratch. And DMs like I did get scratched. However, nothing is on her neck, but all she did was clean the wound after getting back to the healer center. But that slice was so deep that it gushed blood down her tunic. Now, was it the guard who nicked himself and that's where all the blood clot came from? No, no, because she specifically remembers that slice so painfully and so clearly. In hindsight, we know that this is because her strong skin got sliced. And then the descended asterisk next to descended quick healing abilities took into came into place. There's even this moment where Luther is staring at her neck, seemingly to be raging in fury at the cut. And while I'm sure that's part of it, yes, he cares for her, I absolutely believe that he. He's also seeing the wound stitch itself back together fast. Even later, when Luther points out to her the cut, she feels for it and she's like, it's a scratch, it's just. But a scratch. Hardly worth stabbing anyone over. And his eyes widen in shock. First, he saw earlier just how deep that scratch went, and second, he's again seeing proof of her being a descendant. And he's like, hello, do you feel that? Which brings us to our favorite game. On a scale of 1 to 5, how how DeLulu is DM? Oh, this is. This is gonna be a high rating. In the moment, are things chaotic? Yes, but she has now had time to simmer down from the adrenaline. She even went to the center and cleaned the wound, meaning she saw that there was something there to clean. But now in this meeting, she's gaslighting herself again, saying maybe she wasn't the one hurt, even though she felt the pain. AKA I can't trust my own own memories in this instance. I want to give this a 4.75, but someone won't let me do that. So I'm gonna go with a 4.5 on the Dulu scale. The only you have.
- [106:07]
Lexi
No. I'm laughing because there's a few lines here. I know, I see. Quote, I really want to give a 4.75, but I said no to those in episode one. So I'm divided between a 4.5 and my first five rating. Okay. Okay. We can have this be a 4.75.
- [106:29]
Paige Desorva
Thank you. Okay. Thank you. The only reason this isn't 0.25 points higher and the first five out of five I'm giving is because she is gaslighting herself due to the all consuming fear of being descended. She is extra prejudice around them right now and she's having having this internal freak out as she's talking to the Guardians who are very, very anti descended. But that fear is starting to run out of excuses.
- [106:56]
Lexi
Just starting, just starting.
- [106:59]
Paige Desorva
So 4.75. Thank you.
- [107:01]
Lexi
Yeah. I am trying really hard to save my five for next episode. But even in this moment, there are long buried suspicions that are coming to the surface for dm. And she has to consciously tell herself, no, this was a hallucination. It can't be more. It couldn't possibly be more more. At this point, she does know it is more, but she can't bring herself to acknowledge the truth. 4.75. Yes, yes, yes. So close to a 5. This is so close to like, I.
- [107:27]
Paige Desorva
Would do a 4.9 if I could here, but then I'm just really pushing my luck.
- [107:32]
Lexi
Yeah, me too. The only reason it's not a five is because I have to think about in the future things too. And at that point there would be things like an 8. So I'm saving my fives for when they really, really need, need to be five.
- [107:44]
Paige Desorva
Oh, I might do some six out of fives. Sure, that sounds good.
- [107:49]
Lexi
Like we've been saying, DM does not do well with failure. And while, yes, she is a fiery, independent person, she is also someone who wants to belong like so many of us do, right? To contribute to a bigger purpose and have her life mean Something. So having to admit her failure with the mission that was practically impossible in and of itself, like holy shit, that was hard. Is already bad enough. But when she is belittled about whether she got anything useful or accused with suspicion, with the way that she's able to move around the descended palace, D feels a strong sense of needing to prove herself. She doesn't want to be perceived or feel useless. So without thinking twice, she insists she can try again in hopes of having better success. Failure is not an option for her. And in her attempt to prove her worth to the Guardians, to give any promise that she's not a complete failure, DM reveals that there is a secret entrance in a hole in the wall of the palace gardens. Quote the second I said it, regret sank in my chest like a stone. Oh dm. Oh dm. Dm. Dm. That was a rash and reckless choice. How many times have I said the word reckless? This episode, man, this is not a good episode for dm that happens to the main characters. This was a bad choice to share that information with the Guardians because DM no knows. She knows it will be used to go on the offensive and that is not what she is about. Sneaking intel about the weapons dealer or I'll even stretch it to searching for boats in the palace is not at the same level as giving Guardians secret access to everyone in the palace. As she realizes there are children in that palace, there are innocent people and she just condemned them to be able to prove herself and make herself feel better.
- [109:27]
Paige Desorva
When it comes to the Guardians, DM feels feels quite less than and like she needs their approval. And the only way she knows how to do that right now is by offering them something valuable. That's when it dawns on dm. The fact that the Guardians didn't know about the secret entrance means that Lana, the third healer who was there that day, did not tell them she upheld that vow of secrecy again. I don't think she kept the level of secrecy when it came to sharing what happened in the palace though. But like Lexi was saying, those are two different levels and oh woof. That fills DM with a seemingly never ending wave of guilt. So much so that she has to remind herself of all the horrible things that Descend do on a daily basis to feel justified and that they deserve this betrayal. After all, DM is someone who holds patient healer trust so sacred and as one of the very things that define her. So realizing that Lana did uphold that sacred vow is just one more way that DM wasn't good enough or Like Moira said, her heart isn't in it.
- [110:28]
Lexi
She's in a constant pull between her morals as a healer and wanting to take down the descendant and serve a greater purpose that she chooses in this life.
- [110:36]
Paige Desorva
The truth is, DM's guilt isn't just about what she shared. Yes, it's definitely part of it. There's children in that palace. Blood and cheese situation could happen at any moment. But it's also about what that act reveals about her. That in her desperation to be seen as am enough from the Guardians, she crossed that line and cost her a piece of herself.
- [110:55]
Lexi
And there's no take backs, no matter how much she wishes there was. After DM's eyes betray her and she spots the hidden entrance on the maps that the Guardians hurriedly provide her. Naturally, Vance is very, very intrigued to try and gain a little control over the situation that she already gave away. DM attempts to convince these men that she can sneak back into the palace and find the boats. But more than anything, at this point, she wants to be the one to use this hidden, hidden entrance so she can ensure the information she just shared does not lead to innocent lives lost. And she is the only one to bear responsibility for the consequences of revealing this location. Yes, the Descended are bad, but DM is remembering that not all of them are terrible like Lily and the children for instance, they're not monsters that these mortals believe all descended to be. But DM's done enough for the Guardians. According to Vance and his minions, DM was lucky to get out of the palace today with her life. That is definitely true. And she put herself in that dangerous position because she pulled a rookie mistake and acted like a reckless amateur. The intel she just shared with them is way too valuable to risk on her and her alone to execute. As DM reflects the fact that what she just revealed will make more of a difference than she realizes. And knowing what these men are capable of, it's like she knew better. But her emotions in the moment and this drive to need to succeed and prove herself led to the situation. One of the reasons DM feels like a realistic character and a unique FMC is because she makes these kind of mistakes. She has these big ideals and stumbles along the way of trying to make them happen. Because to achieve one goal is to forsake her values on another. And that's a tough position for anyone to be in. And her character illustrates the human imperfections of trying to please everyone and ultimately making yourself miserable and leaving a trail of major consequences and damage.
- [112:35]
Paige Desorva
But this day Cannot get any worse, right? Right. Wrong. Because as DM leaves the Guardians meeting spot, Henry is waiting outside for her. Before we get into the official proposal itself, I do want to take a moment and give Henry a few small gold stars. Number one, he knew it was going to be a big day for his girl, so he wanted to show support by being there after she talked to the Guardians about her mission. And number two, after DM tells him all that went wrong, he tells her that he is still proud of her and that Vance and the others are wrong for telling her she's not ready to continue missions. I want to do my best. Especially as I ripped him the L of the century earlier. I want to do my best to highlight moments where Henry is choosing Diem and their friendship over the Guardians and their movement. But about that friendship though. What if that friendship was taken to a deeper level? Like marriage? After DM has had this shitty day, why not make her feel better? Jokes aside, Henry does feel like this is the perfect moment to pop the all important question. In Henry's eyes, Diem is going all in on Guardian life. She's spying on the royal family. She stabbed a descendant and he's horny for it. This is also just more evidence of him feeling like they are truly in sync. They're fighting for something together and something that they both believe in. He sees their future clear. Clear as day. Oh, but Diem does not.
- [114:09]
Lexi
Last episode we discussed their different visions for the future. Henry is more traditional and believes that after they fight and win this war, DM can be a wife and a mother. A supporting role to her husband. Like what's expected for most women in Mortal City. But we all know DM is not like most women. She is independent and can't imagine being tied down as a dutiful wife. Her own identity is everything to her. Part of the reason she's been a mess lately is because what she knew about her identity has been crumbling since her mother's disappearance. And she is lost without this confidence and self assuredness. But one thing is for certain. She knows her identity is not wrapped up in the traditional kind of marriage. Surely her lifelong best friend, the person who knows her better than anyone else, who is her comfort and familiarity, understands this about her, right? Right. Oh, dm.
- [114:59]
Paige Desorva
Henry's thumb. There's this moment where his thumb is chasing a path beneath her ear over and over and quote, My mind couldn't focus on anything but that movement. Imagining my skin eroding slowly until it was bleeding and raw. That's how you want to feel about a fiance.
- [115:18]
Lexi
Oh, my God. Yeah, that's the right feeling. After someone poses to you.
- [115:22]
Paige Desorva
Yeah. Oh, my God.
- [115:23]
Lexi
This is the moment where you're supposed to say, hell, yes, and you want to jump their bones. But truly, yet again, we readers realize how much distance really has grown between DM and Henry. Each of them sees the version of the other they want to see that fits the mold they personally need from the other. DM immediately stumbles over excuses about why.
- [115:45]
Paige Desorva
They should not get married.
- [115:46]
Lexi
They're not courting. This intimate relationship as lovers is still new.
- [115:50]
Paige Desorva
Wendy does say that. They're still so new, she's trying to figure things out. They're not even courting yet. Henry. I gave him what was in a supreme. A smiting L. I don't know if this is quite smiting, but it's not far off because this dude says, quote, dm, I shouldn't have to court you for you to know how I feel about you. We've been together for damn near two decades. Breathe, Nicole. Never stop courting your partner. You know that. That moment in Incredibles where Edna, like, goes, go pull yourself together. That is this moment for me with Henry right now. I'm trying to be nice to this guy, but I swear.
- [116:37]
Lexi
Okay, he maneuvered, albeit weekly, around that excuse DM gives. I don't think Nicole agrees with that, but we're gonna keep going. He almost got excited.
- [116:45]
Paige Desorva
Smiting L. That is a I am.
- [116:50]
Lexi
On an L train, but I'm not on the smiting train. Anyway, so what about the other excuse? That the fact marriage is a really, really big step. This isn't a light decision to make after all. She needs time to think about it. Ultimately, we all know the truth. DM is stalling from the inevitable. She loves Henry, but not like this. She feels like she has to convince herself that all she needs is time. Because she recognizes this is supposed to be the right decision. It's what's expected of her. It's what she wants to want. It's the safe and fortunate option. But then he's really letting her down about how well he knows her. Immediately after he says he knows her better than anyone and that they're meant to be. With this comment about how she'll be able to quit her job as a healer and focus on starting a family. She'll be an incredible mother after all. Oh, Henry, honey, you are so blind to what DM actually wants in this life. This goes back to each of them seeing the version of the other that they want. To see he knows how independent DM is, how much being a healer is tied to her identity, and I'm willing to bet her fear of commitment. I bet he knows all of that, but he thinks their relationship changes her opinions on that because all he can envision is the future he wants for them. All right, we're gonna wrap that part up before Nicole has a mental breakdown. Down in this magic fueled segment of the episode. Let's tap into our Umbros magic and turn our full attention to important foreshadowing moments for the rest of this book and series. I love, love, love all the foreshadowing that the madam says to dm, quote, don't choose a mediocre life for a mediocre man. Go be exceptional. If he's worth it, he won't judge you. And if he's really the one, he'll come along for the ride.
- [118:27]
Paige Desorva
That line, like, makes me cry. I love that so, so, so much. Because, yeah, Luther not only is along for the ride, he's like, let's get a goat and name it Tara Jr. Multiple goats. They need friends. Ron saying to DM, quote, I'll sleep easier knowing you earned your death. This is the exact reason she'll choose Ron as her challenging partner. Because she feels like with his actions, it will allow her to sleep easier if when he's killed. When walking through Lumnose City dmc, all these flawless dressed, descended and thinks how she sees these flawless descended and their flawless, glowing skin. And she thinks how she likes how Henry looks because his scars and imperfections. Scars, scars. You say girls got a thing for imperfections because that's one of the many, many, many reasons she's so drawn to Luther. And it's one of the many, many, many reasons diem is so unique for him. She loves his scars when so many, many others wanted them healed away before he became king. I just reread the scene at the dinner at the Corbois family where Ileana is like, oh, he's gonna have them healed away before he becomes king. And I want to just like.
- [119:38]
Lexi
And really, there's so much foreshadowing around all of these thoughts around scars. DM believes that scars are a map of one soul that only those who truly know you can read in Glow. She's gonna tell Luther about her scars and he'll remember them. The way they share how they got their scars is so intimate, especially for Luther, because it is a little peek into their souls.
- [119:57]
Paige Desorva
I cannot wait to cover that scene. I'm so excited when talking to Loras and telling him that she has the Shadow kind of magic, he tells her that the light always wants to please its wielder, but shadows only want to fight. Fight DM Alarm bells should be ringing and going off in your head. That fight voice in her head has been the shadows primarily wanting to escape her. The woman who is in charge of the kitchens at House Banette throws DM a scowl that looks almost as if she's related to the main family. Because yes, she is. Main houses in Lumnos often have the most powerful family be waited on by the less powerful members of their house, as we will see next book with the Courbois.
- [120:38]
Lexi
When Diem is walking through Lumnose City, she forces herself to hold her head high, but beneath her armor of feigned confidence, she feels like an imposter. Oh dear dm. That's going to be the baseline feeling of yours and Glow.
- [120:50]
Paige Desorva
I present the storyline of Glow at the Guardian meeting. Vance begins talking about the new aggressive course of action and then DM is distracted listening to his speech by Breck coming in to talk to her. They were literally about to start talking about the attack on the armory and the DM didn't hear it.
- [121:10]
Lexi
That's so out of and at one.
- [121:13]
Paige Desorva
Point Henry's even like this is enough to blow it up entirely. And DM smiles like.
- [121:20]
Lexi
Like dm, they've.
- [121:21]
Paige Desorva
Told you twice what's happening, but she just doesn't.
- [121:25]
Lexi
It doesn't want to listen.
- [121:26]
Paige Desorva
She doesn't want to listen to it.
- [121:27]
Lexi
Yeah, exactly. DM thinks about how with our father, sometimes you have to do things you hate in order to stop worse things from happening. Welcome to Leading Leadership.
- [121:36]
Paige Desorva
I give you the plot of Heat of the Ever Flame. Sarai looking at DM as if she's reading her and sensing her. Because Sarai knows this is the future queen and she's sizing her up. Basically along these same lines, Moira mentions how Sarai makes her as nervous as a one legged mouse in a field of cats. But Moira is going to be one of the few mortals who rides Sarai in Heat of the Everflame. Also, fun fact, Sarai is sister in Latin. That's adorable.
- [122:05]
Lexi
I love that. I love that.
- [122:07]
Paige Desorva
DM thinks about how if Andre knew she was taking over as palace healer, quote, his wrath would put even the Princess to shame. She's not wrong, because when Andre does find out, it leads to one of the biggest fights her and the Commander have. Aww. Now it is time to enter the sophos Library where each episode Lexi walks us through a world building topic to help us deepen our understanding of this realm, the people within it and its magic.
- [122:32]
Lexi
Today's Sofas library topic is the Guardians of the Everflame. So first things first. Who are the Guardians? The Guardians of the Everflame, more commonly referred to as the Guardians, is a group of mortal rebels that oppose the Descended rule and fight for mortal rights. Some of these Guardians, like Vance, are more extreme and they would love nothing more than to see the fall of the Descended rule and and exterminate all of the Descended. Other Guardians, like Aurelie, absolutely stand strong against the Descended oppressive system, but are more strategic in their efforts and are not as aggressive and bloodthirsty as Guardians. Like Vance. It was thought that during the Blood War the Guardians were wiped out completely, but some of the rebel cells survived and they've continued building their resistance group, operating as a decentralized network of rebel cells in secret ever since. During this time, they've been collecting Godstone weapons, because those are absolutely very precious for the mortals to use against the Descended. I assume that they've been gathering flame root as well. They've been gathering other weapons and resources. All of this to help them for when it is time, which is in the very near future, to rise up against the Descended. While a huge majority of the Guardians are mortal, humans, descended have been known to help them out on occasion, like DM and Luther, that we know of course, and even the Queen of Arboros. Like I was saying, the Guardians main objective is to resist the rule of the Descendant and reclaim Amarian form. The Mortals, while they've been doing this in many ways, and secretly building their strength and resources over literally centuries since the Blood War, nowadays they're starting to lean towards large flashy sabotage missions to ensure the descendants see them as a real threat. They are ready to make themselves known. Especially with Orly being gone on her mission and Vance taking over the Lumnose cell. Then the rebel violence will really crank up with Ophiuchai when he joins the violent Guardians and they attack Realms in this pursuit to dismantle the Descended. The Guardians are willing to do and sacrifice anything for their mission, including forfeiting their own lives and the lives of their fellow Guardians. Guardians like Vance don't care if they are killing or harming innocents or children in the pursuit of their goal. It's all or nothing in their eyes. While other Guardians, again like Aurelie, take a more strategic approach where their mission is not to literally Kill all descended. But it's more focused on the oppressive structure that the descended have created around them as a whole. The Guardians are the resistance group group against the descendants oppressive systems. And some of the things that they want to do include reclaiming sacred mortal sites like the Everflame Tree, Sacred mortal sites like Kuril, where their Everflame Tree used to be before the Kindred cut it down. And for their voices to not only be heard, but to matter in this world that was once originally theirs. Let's move into Guardians practices and ideals. The Guardians believe that recent events like the Blood sun on Forging Day signal the old gods call to action. Many men members choose to get a tattoo of the Everflame. This tattoo is not required, but many specifically the men get it anyway as a mark of allegiance and a reminder of what they are fighting for. After a potential member is found, they are given a test before they can be brought to their local cell headquarters or the current meeting location. This test could really be anything, but for DM it was getting information from House Banette while treating their sick daughter. The new recruits aren't actually expected to complete their test mission. Most don't, but the test is there to make sure the recruit is willing to try even if they don't succeed. If they pass the test, they are welcomed into the cell and given missions as needed. In more recent times, this recruitment has been focused on people that they can use to get into or as close to the descendant as possible, like Diem, who is the palace healer. In an effort to find out their weaknesses, get around their healing abilities, maybe even test out different poisons by telling them it's medicinal. The Guardians maintain a high level of secrecy. They strive together in intelligence, weapons and resources while avoiding detection as their survival depends on secrecy and strategic operations. This includes their oldest and most important rule. The names of fellow Guardians are to be protected at all costs. This means never reveal the identity of a fellow rebel member. Speaking of members within the rebel organization, members refer to each other as brother and sister, while leaders are referred to as mother and father. To further heighten and protect their secrecy before being able to enter a meeting location, the correct phrase must must be said. In the Lumnose cell, the member tells the doorman, we're here for the card game. The doorman replies with quiet night tonight. And the member answers, but the tree burns on if their entry is not given. The doorman replies with no card to game tonight, but is also at the discretion of the doorman if entry will be allowed. Sometimes the doorman, as we see here, is just being an ass and won't let people DM in. Also in the Lumno cell meetings start with the leader announcing blessed the ever flame and is answered with Amarian soil we shall reclaim. We don't have a whole lot of information on the Guardian cells throughout the realms, but here's what we do know. In Lumnos, the leader is Mother Orly Bellator. She's been the leader of the Guardians for nearly a decade. And the temporary leadership is Father Vance, with Brandt and Francis as his second and third in command. Vance is taking over leadership until Orly gets back from her mission. Again, she did not think she would be gone for this long or she would not have put Crazy Vance in charge. In Fortos, the only member we know of is Bre, who is the Blacksmith arms dealer. Then in Arboros, as we will get to know her in heat, the leader, Mother Cordelia, AKA Del, who is friends with her mother. And there you have it. That's what we know about the Guardians.
- [127:35]
Paige Desorva
Let us close out this episode with skipping around the apple orchard and talking about our favorite moments. I know we didn't really talk about this scene, but the scene where Diem is treated Peony in the garden on Paradise Row.
- [127:47]
Lexi
I just.
- [127:48]
Paige Desorva
I love seeing how loyal these women are. I know DM mentioned it in chapter one, but even the Madam shuts down Peony's worries about not being able to work or losing out on income, saying that she will take care of her because they take care of their own. This line more made me giggle than like something I love. It's the descendants extraordinary clothing being like, quote, strolling through the finest textile market after nibbling on the wrong kind of.
- [128:13]
Lexi
Mushroom like that is so panem in the capital. I also love how in this series the casual use of magic for fashion. Like how cool is that? Like, I love when magic is used so casually.
- [128:27]
Paige Desorva
I am not one for pranks, but Henry telling DM that part of the Guardian initiation is the blood rite where she must go on stage, quote unquote, confess the worst thing she's ever done, and then everyone drinks each other's blood. It is kind of funny.
- [128:42]
Lexi
I wish he believes him.
- [128:46]
Paige Desorva
I would have because she's so on edge. He I think he took it a step too far because he saw how panicked she was and he let it go on a little long, but it was still funny. I love lines like this. Quote, I wanted to burn my mark into the world. Here was my chance to start. I love all of these little mentions of Burn, especially with the last book being burned as part of the title. Like I'm my antenna is going off.
- [129:14]
Lexi
Something else I love is when DM thinks about how Luther looks annoyed pretty much every time she is around. It's so funny. I love them so much.
- [129:23]
Paige Desorva
DM is so witty and I just really love it. Like when she jokes around about how to please Prince Luther. What? One must stay down on their knees until the future majesty is fully and completely satisfied. Like I love that. That's so funny. And as Moira, DM and Luther are walking into the King's chambers, Luther uses ebony Vines of Magic to pull the doors open. I'm 1000% convinced he's showing off for Magic wise.
- [129:51]
Lexi
All right, well, there we have it friends. Thank you so much for listening to this Episode three of our Sparky the Everflame Deep Dive.
- [129:58]
Paige Desorva
We will see you again next Monday for our second to last episode of Spark of the Everflame where we are covering chapters 22 through 29. It will also include insights from Luther's bonus POV chapter from the Hardcover edition.
- [130:12]
Lexi
Friendly reminder that we did update our Spark coverage from four episodes to five episodes. We needed that extra episode so badly and we're just so excited to move straight into Gloria. After we finish these five episodes, we would love to give the biggest warm welcome, welcome, welcome to our newest Crowns Council members. Take it away Nicole. I'm so excited.
- [130:31]
Paige Desorva
Welcome, welcome, welcome to Kiara Kim, Mary Kate, Stephanie, Nikki, Kat O, Malik C, Susie K, Shauna F, Audrey T and Rachel J. Welcome, welcome, welcome. Thank you so, so so much for being here and supporting the show.
- [130:46]
Lexi
Yes, thank you, thank you, thank you. We appreciate your joining generosity so much. Your support means everything. Thank you for being part of this community and if you're like, hey, I want my name shouted out on the podcast and to be showered with love and attention to join our fan club@fantasy fangirls.com fan club. The link is also in the show notes.
- [131:03]
Paige Desorva
Thank you as always to our favorite Sophos scholar, AKA our Content researcher Brooke and our Executive Producer AKA our sanity manager Hayden. We love, love, love love love you both.
- [131:15]
Lexi
We are very active on social media with weekly Spark of the Everflame trivia plus Kendrick's Curse guides and much, much more. So please be sure to follow us on Instagram and slash or TikTok at fantasy fangirlspod. And if you're watching this on YouTube or you want to watch us on YouTube because you need to see the latest Henry Hat Hit that subscribe button to keep following along.
- [131:33]
Paige Desorva
And while you're hitting buttons, do not forget to rate and review the podcast. It is two seconds of your life and it's one of the most helpful things that you can do. Not only for this show show, but for any shows you listen to. And last but not least, do not forget to share this episode with your fellow Ever Flame friends. If you're friends and you had the group chat popping off when you were reading this book for the first time, saying, hey, the Guardians sound like fun, this is a great episode to send to them.
- [131:59]
Lexi
All right, thank you so much everybody. We will talk to you next week. Bye bye.
- [132:04]
Paige Desorva
Oh Lexi, you are muted.
- [132:07]
Lexi
Sorry.
- [132:09]
Paige Desorva
Oh my God, there's this gigantic mother fucking truck outside that is just like.
- [132:17]
Lexi
No. How many hours do you think there is of us just laughing?
- [132:26]
Paige Desorva
Ever? Oh yeah.
- [132:27]
Lexi
Ever.
- [132:28]
Paige Desorva
Oh God, probably three straight hours.
- [132:32]
Lexi
Oh, at least, yes.
- [132:34]
Paige Desorva
Oh Lexi, you are muted.
- [132:36]
Lexi
Sorry.
- [132:39]
Paige Desorva
Oh my God, there's this gigantic motherfucking truck outside that is just like eh.
- [132:47]
Lexi
No. How many hours do you think there is of us just laughing Recording of Ever? Oh yeah, Ever.
- [132:57]
Paige Desorva
Oh God, probably three straight hours.
- [133:02]
Lexi
Oh, at least, yes.
- [133:06]
Paige Desorva
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- [134:04]
Lexi
Here's a show that we recommend.
- [134:08]
Paige Desorva
Hello American podcast listeners.
- [134:10]
Lexi
Max Rushton here from the Guardian Football.
- [134:11]
Paige Desorva
Weekly, which I think you should give a listen.
- [134:13]
Lexi
It is good.
- [134:13]
Paige Desorva
It comes out three times a week.
- [134:15]
Lexi
And the podcast delivers you analysis news, both the good and the bad from the Beautiful Game and maybe even the occasional laugh.
- [134:21]
Paige Desorva
He's angry about everything.
- [134:22]
Lexi
He doesn't have a great poker face, does he? I would like to play cards with Bruno. Fernando, you can listen to the Guardian Football Weekly wherever you get your podcasts. Hopefully see you soon. ACAST helps creators launch, grow and monetize their podcasts everywhere.
- [134:45]
Paige Desorva
Acast.com.