Fashion Neurosis with Christian Louboutin

Summary

Fashion Neurosis with Bella Freud: An Intimate Conversation with Christian Louboutin

Episode Release Date: March 26, 2025

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Introduction

In this captivating episode of Fashion Neurosis with Bella Freud, Bella Freud engages in a deep and revealing conversation with the iconic fashion designer Christian Louboutin. Known for his signature red-soled shoes, Louboutin delves into his personal journey, design philosophy, and the intricate relationship between fashion and identity. Throughout the episode, Christian shares poignant anecdotes, insightful reflections, and his unique perspective on creativity and life.

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Clothing Choices and Design Philosophy

The episode begins with Bella inquiring about Christian's attire for the podcast. Christian humorously describes the complexity of choosing his outfit, highlighting his usual minimalist style influenced by practicality over meaning.

Christian Louboutin [02:21]: "I came as I was, and I arrived from Manchester, so I took the trade in that outfit."

Christian emphasizes his preference for colors over black, associating black with hiding imperfections and opting instead for vibrant hues that reflect his optimistic nature.

Christian Louboutin [05:59]: "I never wear black, apart from if it's a black tie or funerals... I can't imagine myself surrounded by black or draped in black."

Bella recalls Christian's early reluctance to wear black, an aspect that significantly influenced his design aesthetic.

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Personal History and Family

Christian opens up about his childhood, particularly his relationship with his mother and the discovery of his biological father. Raised primarily by his mother, Christian credits her unwavering trust and support for shaping his confident and independent character.

Christian Louboutin [11:45]: "My mother has been very instrumental in my behavior, but also in my character and in my confidence."

He recounts a memorable childhood argument with his mother over his unconventional attire, illustrating his early assertion of personal style and autonomy.

Christian Louboutin [10:12]: "When I had to change my socks for school, it was the first time I remember discussing a look. And it was a big argument."

The revelation of his Egyptian biological father adds a layer of complexity to his identity, though Christian maintains a strong bond with his upbringing and does not feel the need to seek out his biological roots.

Christian Louboutin [15:34]: "I have never met him and I never felt the need to. I'm quite happy and busy."

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Design Process and Creativity

Christian provides an in-depth look into his design process, emphasizing the importance of color and the absence of black in his creations. He narrates the serendipitous story behind his trademark red soles, highlighting how a simple act of adding red nail polish transformed his sketches into the iconic feature now synonymous with his brand.

Christian Louboutin [34:59]: "I painted the sole red because red is an element that exists even when you don't wear colors."

This anecdote underscores Christian's keen eye for detail and his ability to recognize and implement what works aesthetically.

He also discusses his collaborative approach, working closely with his right hand, Hugo, to ensure every design aligns with his vision while maintaining a streamlined creative process.

Christian Louboutin [57:03]: "I always start with a white page... I sketch, and then we review the drawings every three days."

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Collaboration with David Lynch

One of the episode's highlights is Christian's collaboration with filmmaker David Lynch. Christian recounts their project to photograph fetish shoes, a venture that melded his design with Lynch's unique artistic vision. He describes the meticulous planning and the immersive atmosphere Lynch created during the photoshoot, resulting in ethereal and evocative images.

Christian Louboutin [63:15]: "Working with David was fantastic. He created a distinct universe that perfectly complemented the fetishistic aspect of the shoes."

The collaboration not only enhanced Christian's designs but also provided him with a profound appreciation for Lynch's mastery of light and atmosphere.

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Personal Insights and Philosophy

Christian shares his philosophical outlook on life, emphasizing optimism and the conscious cultivation of happiness. He believes in the power of positive energy and its impact on one's environment and experiences.

Christian Louboutin [38:36]: "I always see the glass as half full. Out of dark times, I always see a tunnel's end."

He reflects on his aversion to leadership roles, valuing personal responsibility and the freedom to create without the burdens that come with guiding others.

Christian Louboutin [76:32]: "I have no desire to become a leader. It's not in my blood. I'm kind of shy."

This humility contrasts with his towering presence in the fashion world, revealing a complex persona driven by passion rather than authority.

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Closing Thoughts

As the conversation winds down, Bella and Christian exchange heartfelt sentiments, celebrating their long-standing friendship and mutual respect. Christian's final remarks encapsulate his journey—a blend of artistic integrity, personal resilience, and an unwavering commitment to infusing color and life into his creations.

Christian Louboutin [78:36]: "Thank you for being on Fashion Neurosis. You're one of my dearest friends, and I love chatting to you."

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Notable Quotes

• Christian Louboutin [05:59]: "I never wear black... I can't imagine myself surrounded by black or draped in black."
• Christian Louboutin [11:45]: "My mother has been very instrumental in my behavior, but also in my character and in my confidence."
• Christian Louboutin [34:59]: "I painted the sole red because red is an element that exists even when you don't wear colors."
• Christian Louboutin [38:36]: "I always see the glass as half full. Out of dark times, I always see a tunnel's end."
• Christian Louboutin [76:32]: "I have no desire to become a leader. It's not in my blood. I'm kind of shy."

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Conclusion

This episode of Fashion Neurosis with Bella Freud offers an intimate glimpse into the life and mind of Christian Louboutin. From his early influences and personal philosophies to his innovative design processes and memorable collaborations, Christian illuminates the intricate tapestry of fashion, identity, and personal growth. Listeners are left with a profound appreciation for the man behind the iconic red soles and the enduring impact of his work on the fashion landscape.

Transcript

[Bella]

Yeah, sure thing.

[Christian Louboutin]

Hey, you sold that car yet? Yeah, sold it to Carvana.

[Bella]

Oh.

[Christian Louboutin]

I thought you were selling to that guy.

[Bella]

The guy who wanted to pay me.

[Christian Louboutin]

In foreign currency, no interest over 36 months. Yeah. No.

[Bella]

Carvana gave me an offer in minutes.

[Christian Louboutin]

Picked it up, and paid me on the spot. It was so convenient.

[Bella]

Just like that? Yeah.

[Christian Louboutin]

No hassle?

[Bella]

None.

[Christian Louboutin]

That is super convenient. Sell your car to Carvana and swap. Hassle for convenience. Pickup fees may apply.

[Bella]

Wow. What's up?

[Christian Louboutin]

I just bought and financed a car through Carvana in minutes. You? The person who agonized four weeks over whether to paint your walls eggshell or off white, bought and financed a car in minutes. They made it easy. Transparent terms, customizable, down and monthly. Didn't even have to do any paperwork.

[Bella]

Wow.

[Christian Louboutin]

Mm.

[Bella]

Hey, have you checked out that spreadsheet.

[Christian Louboutin]

I sent you for our dinner? Options finance your car with Carvana and experience, total control. Financing subject to credit approval.

[Bella]

Hi. Come in. Welcome to Fashion Neurosis. Christian Louboutin.

[Christian Louboutin]

Thank you.

[Bella]

Can you tell me what you're wearing today and why you chose these particular clothes?

[Christian Louboutin]

I can try, but I have to say it's been a very complicated decision because I knew that I was going to see you lie down on the coach. So it was a lot of factors that I had to take into consideration, which I never do in general. I've never been lying on a coach, and. And I never saw you with that conscience. So it's been really one of the most difficult decisions that I ever had to do in my life, I have a feeling. But anyway, I thought, does it have to have a meaning? Probably it should. Should I be natural? Thinking of not thinking and going the way I was gave me a headache just thinking in that direction. So it was really, really difficult. So, bottom line, I came as I was, and I arrived from Manchester, so I took the trade in that outfit. The only thing that I did is that I changed my T shirt in case I had to speak of something. So I put a T shirt with a meaning, and it's.

[Bella]

What does it say?

[Christian Louboutin]

It's. I don't remember what it said, but it says something. It says, life has a purpose. I don't remember. It's a quote by Dolly Parton. That's the one thing I do remember. And it's a quote which I liked. And as I loved Dolly Parton, I thought a good quote of Dolly Parton would make it on a T shirt. So I have this T shirt out there, which is my protective T shirt. Otherwise, again, I thought, probably, let's try to have a meaning. And again, I never fixed that. Where would I dress up in general? I go to a pair of shoes, and I think, what could go with that pair of shoes? That's kind of about it. But this time I thought, okay, I have these pairs of jeans, which were given to be. Then the shirt. I have no idea where it's coming from, but it was. It looked like the jacket. And it's very warm, coming from France. But just before that, I was in Brazil. I was really concerned by being cold and that catching a flu or something, which I started to do, as you can hear, maybe with my nose taken. And so I actually really looked at my shoes and I thought, a shoe is really a shape before anything else. So I have this shoe that I did, which has a bit of a clowny shape. So I thought, I hate clouds, but I like cloud shapes. So I thought, okay, I'm going to have my cloudy shape mochasa. And it's all the same color.

[Bella]

I've never seen you in a shape of shoe like that. Are they new, these shoes, or not really new.

[Christian Louboutin]

I mean, I have them for a few years, but they're still new to me because I barely wear them. I love them, but I barely wear them. And so they're two or three or four years ago.

[Bella]

They're almost quite minimalist in your style. Like, the line is. It's like you've drawn it on. I really like that one.

[Christian Louboutin]

It's like a sketch. It's like an unfinished sketch. And. Yes. So it's really a concentration just on the last. And the rest is almost. If you take a pen or pencil, I don't know what it's gra. When you have the eraser with it. Pencil. So if you take a pencil and you take a 4B, which is already a greasy one, that you, you know, you almost sharpen with it.

[Bella]

Yeah.

[Christian Louboutin]

So yes, it's just lined. The line is reinforced. But an outline of a different color.

[Bella]

Yeah, it's really nice. And I always associate you with color a lot. And today your color is in your socks. So it's quite a kind of muted color palette for you. And from my position, your socks match perfectly the soles of your shoes. You have, like this red herringbone. Red and white herringbone.

[Christian Louboutin]

So you have a good point of view.

[Bella]

Yes.

[Christian Louboutin]

Anger of you.

[Bella]

If you angle a very good vantage.

[Christian Louboutin]

I always need to have something with colors. I never wear black, apart from if it's a black tie or funerals, which often Looks like the same, but I never wear black. I wear colors in general. But if I don't wear colors, I always have something in colors. For instance, everything which is dark that I had made, such as suits or things like that, the lining would be colored. I can't imagine myself surrounded by black or draped in black.

[Bella]

I remember that creeps because when I first started my brand or a certain point, I used to give you jumpers and they were always black. And you very politely showed enthusiasm. At a certain point you said, I don't really wear black. And then I sort of had an epiphany.

[Christian Louboutin]

But do you remember black with something works black all over black also when I'm in black in general is because I gain weight. So being in black for me is being in the worst shape that I've been in general. So I associate black with hiding or I don't hide or I don't like hiding.

[Bella]

And do you remember the first time in your life you found a piece of clothing that made you feel different?

[Christian Louboutin]

I would not remember that moment because it probably happened very, very at a very, very early age. I do remember always liking to dress up. But when I look at pictures of me as a child, I see things that I'm thinking how could I be dressed like that? How, how come I didn't scream or something so weird that when you like so much to dress up, you see clothes of you on you, or the child which is you. And you're thinking what was I thinking to let myself to be dressed in such a way? And I guess it's a very nice thing of I like the idea that I was not conscious. I couldn't care less of clothes as a child, as an early child, because that I see having daughters, age 10, they've been conserved by what is a dress for years. I have no clue what I was wearing. And I really don't remember being conscious of I like this or I don't like this age 7, 8, 9 or 10. I immediately became conscious of, let's say, appearing with clothes around 11, I remember dressing up, that's for sure. All I remember, for instance, I was checked the only mirror that we had in the apartment in Paris at my parents apartment was in the bedroom of my parents. So there was a big mirror next to the bed of my parents. So I would look at myself just before going to school. And I do remember looking at myself thinking that I looked good. But it's not the first thing, but the first look. But let's say it's the first time that I do remember something connected to how I was dressed. And I said, okay, now go to school. And my mother says, you're not doing at school like that. I said, what do you mean? She said, no, you're not dress properly to go to school. You have to change. And I said, no, why? So we had an argument. So I had the shorts, a pair of shorts. I had Jeze Jae Zhen is those very pointy shoes, laced up shoes that you had from the 50s, you know.

[Bella]

They'Re like winkle pickers.

[Christian Louboutin]

I don't know in English. Jaeger did French rock and roll shoes in suede. You know, red shoes. They were maroon. I had a tank top of pad of velvet.

[Bella]

Wow.

[Christian Louboutin]

I had round kind of inflammatory flu yellow glasses with a necklace of that I made of gridfather. Two colors, light green, lime green on darker grid. So Barbara said, you're not going dressed like that. I said, what do you mean? She says, you need socks with these shoes, you need socks. You will not go without socks. It doesn't go in my look. I don't want to wear socks. She obliged me to wear socks. So I said, okay. She was going dramatic. If I was that wear those socks. I put the socks, left it apart. But five minutes after I removed the socks, I was at school like that. So that's probably the first time I do remember discussing a look. And it was a big argument. Socks or no socks.

[Bella]

Your mother sounded like a remarkable person. She allowed you to leave home and live with a much older man when you were a teenager. Do you think her trust in your decision making was part of what's made you such a good decision maker?

[Christian Louboutin]

I think that, yeah, my mother has been very instrumental in my behavior, but also in my character and in my confidence. So I think that trusting people is very important. Trust with love is a very good mix, is a very, very good combo. And she loved me, so she trusted me. And she trusted me, so she loved me and she let me be the way I was. And so having no boundaries somehow is exposing yourself to your own boundaries instead of the boundaries which are not belonging to you, but which are belonging to your parents, to society, to your family, to your siblings, whatever. So I had to create my own boundaries. I think it's been very good for me and it's been very good for her, let's say, for the family, because she didn't have to be afraid. She didn't have to take any decision, which was probably boring. And again, I refer to her because I think that I'm a little bit like that with my kids. So, yes, I think it's good to be trustful towards your children. Then I guess it's, you know, it. First of all, of course it is personal, but also it depends so much of the child's character still. But I guess that it's. It's really a combo. You do understand, naturally, that according to your child character, if you can, or if you decide to trust your child and let it go. And. Which means that I never had a downfall with my family. Yeah, I never had this age which is like teenager, which is called in French la j? Bette, the stupid age where you hate everything. You hate your parents, you hate everything, which is, say you rise, you roll up your eyes and you hate the world. The adult everyone is so stupid. I never had that. I mean, I had that with many people, but not with my parents at least. And definitely that with my mother.

[Bella]

That's so unusual. I mean, the description, her reaction to your outfit is such a good example that she must have been concerned about your feet getting cold or something. Instead of, you know, I thought you were going to say, she said, you can't wear those clothes out. And instead she's wanting you to put some socks on.

[Christian Louboutin]

Yes. No, no, no. She was really concerned by the lock of socks. It would have looked really bad.

[Bella]

And then after her death, you discovered that she'd had a love affair with an Egyptian, a young Egyptian man, and that you're the result of that love affair. And I always remember, we've been friends for 30 years, and I remember asking you once, do you have Arabic blood? Because I lived in Morocco when I was a child and I've always had a strong affinity to that country. And you just said, are you crazy? And then told me the story that your sister told you that this young man was your father. And I wondered if you'd ever met him and whether your artistic brilliance comes through him.

[Christian Louboutin]

You know, it's interesting that the few people I have been discussing the discovery of my biological father being Egyptian woman, would ask if I wanted or if I had met that person. Never. Men, men have never asked me. My male friends have never asked me about if I wanted or if I had met that person. The reality is that, no, I have never met a guy and neither felt the need of meeting. It's really the story of my mother and. And I am the result of that story. So I'm very happy of the existence of that man. My father has been my father, who educated me, who was next to me. So it's really the story of my bowser. And I think that it's nice if I feel. If I. One day I feel that I should meet or try to be that person, I will do it. I have no problem with that. But it needs to come from a feeling, not from. From just curiosity. And the only thing that I think that it's way too vain. The only thing which kind of makes me want to maybe meet that person is that many times, if I have to have my photography taken so by a photographer. Photographer always tell me, you have a beautiful smile. Yeah, my sister told me that was the first time she met that guy in our apartment in Paris. He said hello to her with a beautiful smile. He left by the window, wow. The day after, same scenario, beautiful smile. And he flew by the window, sixth floor, but above on the roof of the scenario went on and on and on. And so I guess that I have the spine of that band. But again, it's the only reason where I would like to maybe see that band is just to see if we have exactly the same spine, which I think we have. But it's not enough of a reason to actually, you know, drag thing and whatever to beat somewhat. But I think that I have the smile of that man. That's a thing which we have it common.

[Bella]

It's a nice thought, really, to have this. This thing that it's.

[Christian Louboutin]

I'm conscious that it's a very vain thought. But again, it's funny because really, photographer always tell me that. So I've always been thinking, what is that smile they're talking about? And then when my sister told me that, yeah, I immediately thought, okay, so now I know where is my smile coming from?

[Bella]

Well, a smile is such an uplifting. It's such a connecting thing. So it doesn't seem like vanity. It seems like some sort of alliance that it's a lovely description. And you do have this wonderful smile that makes everyone start falling around laughing immediately, which is one of your many qualities.

[Christian Louboutin]

Well, I'm happy about this. But again, I am conscious that entering a field where I would want to meet that man who happened to be my father, but that I've never met, would probably make me enter into a different zone. And if I had time, if I had also if I was kind of empty, or if I was looking for myself somewhere, somehow, or if I wanted to have a mission in my labs that I don't have or whatever, maybe it would be a nice thing to do. But I'm quite busy and I'M quite happy. So it wouldn't be. I mean, I don't look for more happiness that I have on a. Definitely don't look for more time consuming anything that my life at the time, at that moment now. But again, I was very happy for my mother because she met that bench. She was in her late 30s. And I thought that it's a beautiful story. And I know as a fact in my family, I know that when you're the product of love, it can go both ways. You may be adored or you may be hated. You may be the person, you may as a child, maybe that person who broke that love story between two people. One person left because of that child or the opposite. That child represents this huge love between two people. And then you're becoming the nest of that Le Crozet of that story. In my case, I am the positive side. I received all the love that she could not give anymore to that parent who literally fled when I was born. But it could happen different way. Someone disappeared because you were born. But thank God it's been very much the opposite for me. So I own to that man to be born, but I own to my father who raised me to be alive. That's to be alive after being born, let's say.

[Bella]

Yeah, what an amazing family you have. I know your parents are both dead now, but it's kind of an amazing story of really good values and really good feeling towards each other. Your parents sound like they had to be.

[Christian Louboutin]

I was always surprised when I was a kid, when I was bringing back people in my. In the apartment of my family. Could be boyfriend, it could be girlfriend, it could be anyone who was going to sleep. And they were often surprised. And I was like, why would they be surprised? It's a. It's a very random apartment. It's nothing special there. And I realized that they were surprised by the warmth. The carabel said, the la bieve du. The welcoming, the easy welcoming. I would come at 4 o'clock in the morning. I didn't have the key and I had to whistle. We were living on the sixth floor without the elevators. So floor number four. I started to. And then before the sixth floor, the door was open and my mother would have opened the thing, but she never, never accepted that I would have the key. She wanted to be woken up anytime. So people were always surprised to see someone say, oh, I saw you free. Okay, so take the bigger bed. And she would go in my bed and give her bed, which was bigger. And so people were surprised. It was natural to Me, you know, you free people, it's easier to sleep at three people in a bigger bed than having your mother sleeping in a big bed and you free the small bed. So for her it was simple. So for me it was simple too. But I saw that the simplicity was seeming very complex to most people. But for a long time I did not understand why. And then after I started to understand why, I still feel she was right. If you're free, take the bigger bread.

[Bella]

It sounds like me and Jimmy, my son, who's your godson. I'm always. I'm just so happy to see him. Even if it is at 3 in the morning, I'd rather, you know, open the door and I'd rather he woke me up than end up in any kind of difficult situation.

[Christian Louboutin]

Yeah, you're a good mother.

[Bella]

You're a great godfather.

[Christian Louboutin]

I would be happy, you as a. And my mom.

[Bella]

Okay, that means a lot. And I read somewhere that you'd said it depends on whether you want to feel dressed or undressed on which shoe you choose to start the day. Can you describe what that means?

[Christian Louboutin]

First of all, it's more having to see with women shoes, I would say there is this thing on women's shoes, not so much on men's shoes. It's a very, very different topic. Men shoes that women choose. But for women, yes, shoes can undress you, or shoes can definitely dress you. And it's a different. It's a different pair of shoes. It's different kind of shoes. But when I have to dress up, when I wake up, the first thing I'm thinking is the shoes. So I guess it's an extension of how you're going to want to feel during the day. And so that's why, for instance, when I am designing shoes, I really am conscious at one point to do something which is dressy or something which is undressy. I would say undressy is to kind of be able to exhibit yourself, and dressy is to basically wear a mask. So some shoes are like a mask, and some shoes are like the opposite of a mask. And I think it's more daring, of course, to be undressed and saying that. I don't say that you want to be undressed all the time, but you want to be undressed for everyone, or you want to be undressed in front of everyone, or you want to be undressed in the morning. I mean, you know, that's a brilliant description. Moods are changing all the time. But yes, it's a different. It's different pairs of Shoes. So when I am designing, I have this in my mind. Sometimes I look at my work. When I'm designing, I'm thinking, ah, okay, this is Cristo, the macho side of me. This is the stylist. This is another shoe. This is the friend of women. And this is sometimes even the woman who speak there. And it's different characters, and I know that it doesn't shatter in my brain, but they're almost literally a different part of my brain. You have different characters. So sometimes I look at Floyd Said, I look at what design that I did, and I think, okay, you know, it's. If I am a guy and the girl who is wearing that is going out with me, I may say, darling, do you mind to change the shoes? Something doesn't work for me. I understand that kind of macho point of view. And the stylist would say, no, own it. It's you. It's your decision, or whatever. I understand also the designer fight, but sometimes it's not the same character. I respect every character. I'm trying to respect every character in myself as I try always very consciously to respect people in general.

[Bella]

God, that's so interesting. Like having different characters. It is like a play, you know, who gets the upper hand and why? Why do they decide when does the macho win and when does the vulnerable person win? And so interesting. Is there something that you remember wearing to be consciously attractive to somebody?

[Christian Louboutin]

For the longest time, the idea of sexy was very alien to me. And I never was interested into the word, the world of sexy. And it looks strange because suddenly a big part of my word is considered sexy. If that, ultra sexy, if not over sexy, if that, exaggeratedly sexy, if that's violently sexy, if not vulgarly sexy, if not anything but still sexy. A big part of my life I was very alien to sexy. I had no clue. And if I was dressing up, I was always to try to look pleasant. Sexy. Was that a word that I was using? And actually, as a teenager in my twenties too, I had a kind of aberration of sexy. I was scared by sexy. I never had any sexual problem. I had sex all my life with different people. So it's not about having problem with sex, but the idea of sexy or being obsessed by sexy or wanting to look sexy never occurred to me ever, ever, ever.

[Bella]

And before you established your brand, you worked for Roger Vivier. And I always remember you telling me this story about how you asked him a question. It was something to do with someone's age. And he'd replied, oh, you know, our age. Our age, yeah, but you were a teenager and he was 80. What did you learn from him?

[Christian Louboutin]

I was 24. He was 80 years old. I said, you know, our age. I was like, but, Roger, we have a little bit of a difference in age. And he looked very shocked that I would say that we had a little bit of a different. And he was right, because we were pretty similar. And I guess, you know, 24 plus 80, it's 104. So we were in our 50s, both of us. We were meeting in our kind of early 50s. That's how we felt at least. But I learned that, you know, really, it's funny how much I remember because I have been having friends, multiple friends, older than me for a big part of my life. So it's interesting to see that when you are still a kid and you see older people, what is the most shocking is that as a child, you really see a border, a very fat border between teenagers, let's say young people and old people. And old people starts at 35, when you are like 14, 15, 16, or whatever. So it's interesting to see that. To me, it was fascinating to see old people, meaning someone who was 35, jumping on bed and screaming and farting, was like, this is for kids. I'm not going to be exact, but I'm going to be that old. And. And then, of course, you realize that there is not so much change. So at one point, you realize that you don't know when the change is arriving. You know, you end up being a child trapped in a kind of slightly older skin. But as long as a child is there, it's great. And the child, in some people has a hard time to disappear, which is a good thing. There's nothing wrong of keeping the child, your inner child, yourself. But as a child, I was very conscious that I was looking at adults, thinking, adults don't act like adults. So what is it to be an adult? Because one day I will become an adult. But I cannot be like that. Jumping on a bed and saying silly things, being very happy about all of it and breaking the bed and like, whatever. And of course, you know, I could jump on that coach very easily if I was lying on the coach.

[Bella]

I always remember coming to stay with you in Portugal when you had a very small, tiny little house. And when Jimmy was about 6 or 7, I was trying to find him, and then I opened the door and there was. It was pitch black in this tiny room, and you and Jimmy were dancing like maniacs to m. Turned up top volume. And it just felt like, oh, he's fine, he's safe. That's the best thing that could be going on. It was.

[Christian Louboutin]

I think that doors is such an important thing. And I'm so happy to see that now people, children have really less problem, if that to say no problem to dance.

[Bella]

Yes, I totally agree. I know you've told this story before and to me many times, but can you tell me about the Red Soul.

[Christian Louboutin]

And how it happened, how it started? Yeah, well, it started very simply. It's because I draw and I draw and I put colors on my drawings most of the time. Now I start to be a little bit lazy. Sometimes I don't put colors, but most of the time I was putting colors. I still put colors anyway. And what is important for me is to have the first drawing. The primary drawings to be the reflection of the real shoe needs to be as close as the first drawing. And when there is a small border between the reality and your fantasy as a sketch, it's a great satisfaction. Because of course, a sketch is only a sketch. So you have to adapt it to a real life as a three dimensional. But if you remain quite very close and faithful to your primary drawing, it gives you such an excitement and such satisfaction. So anyway, I was sketching and then the shoes that I was sketching were inspired by the kind of serigraphy of Andy Warhol. So pop colors, etc. With block of colors. And then. So one shoe was a reflection of one of the painting of Andy Warhol, which is called Flowers.

[Bella]

Yeah.

[Christian Louboutin]

And. But I never look at things. I have them in my mind and then. And thinking of them and then do it my way. So I had this painting in mind and it was flowers. So I did the Mary Jade with a high heel pointy last, and it had a big buckle and the buckle was a flower. And everything was full of colors and different colors. So when the shoe became a shoe, I looked at it, but I always have the sketch next to it. And for some reason the sketch was better than the real shoe. The shoe fitted was good, the flower looked good. But when I was turning it somehow from the back, there was a lot of black. There was no black in my designs. No black, no white, no beige, no brown, no taupe, no gray, no kind of dull colors, etc. So anyway, and so the person who had tried the shoe, it was in Italy, had finished to try all the shoes during the day. So she was painting her nails with a nail polish. So I thought, okay, what about if that shoe had no black. Had a color instead of black which eats the rest. So I grabbed her nail polish after a little bit of a fight, because she had two dangles. She was, ah. I grabbed the nail polish and I painted the soul red. So it was not to add a color. It was a bit to add the color, but also to have that black disappearing. And then suddenly I could find my drawing again. You know, the drawing became alive. But I thought, okay, that works. So it needs to be full of colors, as I am a little bit basic. And it was around Christmas, I thought, okay, I should do the soul green because it's around Christmas. And then I put the first soul green. And I looked at it and I said, doesn't work the way red was working. No, no, no, no, no. I have to start by red. And that I ended up sticking to red because even if you don't like colors, red is an element which exists on someone who is dressed in black. The lips are going to be red, the nails may be red. So even if you don't supposedly wear colors, you'll have a diligent of red very often. So I stuck to red, and now I'm stuck with red. Happiness. Stuck with it.

[Bella]

It's such a good story. I get goosebumps every time I hear it because it's just. It's so kind of. It could have so easily not happened. And it's a. It's such an example of your genius. I. The way you decide on what you choose. And you know, from your earliest decisions, what you talked about, your mother and making these. You just have this incredibly, this unerring instinct and you, you notice what works. And I love that story and how it transpired. It's just. And you always see what's, you know, like grabbing the nail varnish in life, you're very much that person that you see there's something missing and oh, there it is. This is what's needed. And it's very. It's very simple, but so, so inspired.

[Christian Louboutin]

You know, I. I do sometimes think that I have. Without being conscious of it, I have personal ingrained mantras. Like, for instance, you have the glass which is half empty or half full to be. I always see the half full and I always see the good side of it, of things in general. And. But again, I think, okay, it's probably at the beginning a nature, but then after it becomes a decision, you at one point decide of things. And so naturally, I think I'm a very optimistic person. But then I learned to understand that it was somehow A quality. And when you understand that, kind of stick to it. And yes, out of dark figs I can always see an end of a tunnel. Out of dark fig I will always see the bright, the brightness somewhere. And it probably helped me many, many times.

[Bella]

Yeah, I suppose it's practice. I remember you telling me I always wake up happy. And as I always wake up in a bit of a gloom, I thought this is really something. And I thought about that quite a lot. And I do things to shift my mood purposefully because it's a real blessing to be able to have that, you know, be inclined towards that. It saves all this kind of climbing up from the. The abyss where you see where someone like me often starts off and, and, and then I suppose it's a bit like exercise. The more you are happy and know how to make yourself happy, the more you are happy.

[Christian Louboutin]

Yeah, I think energies are important. As much as I don't believe in God, I really believe in energy and how much you are driving your energies, you are attracting energies. So if you are negative energy, everything is becoming negative or you receive the negativeness from all over. If you are really more positive with positive energy, it works the same way. And I really think that it's. Again, it's. I'm kind of serious about that. I've understood that it's a serious matter to decide to be happy. You are probably naturally happy, but then it's something that you have to cultivate because it's such a nice thing to feel happy. And also for that. I do remember being with Louise that you know very well, my ex boyfriend. And we were in a car on the way to the airport and he was screaming because we were missing the flight. At one point he looks at me and he said, but you're so calm. Why? I said, first you don't leave me any room to be screaming. You scream for five people. But also it doesn't make any difference if we miss the plate. We'd be surprised. It's not by screaming and be hysterical that every. That suddenly like, you know, the Red Sea is going to open and the car is going to go all the way to the airport. So there's nothing we can do about it. So why being so miserable? And I thought, and he looked at me if I was crazy. I said, well, we have no power over that, so why do you give yourself a headache? It's not good to change anything. But I think that once you realize that you have no power on things which are kind of negative, forget about it. To feel Bad or to be hysterical about that doesn't make a difference as long as you have empathy, which is a very different thing. I think that otherwise to be fully forced, enraged about things doesn't help.

[Bella]

Yeah, that's a waste. A shoe is where you can show something secret about yourself, especially if you're a bit introverted. And it's almost like underwear. It's it, you know, which is invisible. But with shoes you can, you can kind of indicate something. And I wondered how you connect so successfully to this thing that women really want.

[Christian Louboutin]

Well, I think I do know a bit about women because I was raised by women. But also I was a little boy when my sister were older. And funny enough, so when my father was not there, I was the only boy in the village, as they say in Little Britain. I was the only boy in the apartment. But I was a small one, so I was not a male figure. So I could see women in the world of women when you are that considered as a man, as a male figure, but like as a little puppet, as a pet or whatever, you know, women together are acting the way they're acting between women. Suddenly my father would appear on or like a grown up man would appear. They were different. But for the most time I was by myself with, you know, with the Arab of women in the apartment. So I could see it all. And I had every story, you know, the period, the boyfriend, how you get fat and that fat and whatever. The underwear, the face. I had it all. And I never was neither shocked. I was always amused. But always I had the feeling to be at looking at a play, you know, being like, you know, cucur movie like, you know, with all those stories.

[Bella]

You draw the most beautiful feet with a high end step. And I wondered if is there a foot shape that you find completely impossible?

[Christian Louboutin]

A foot shape or a shoe shape?

[Bella]

Well, a foot shape really something you.

[Christian Louboutin]

Find hard to dress foot shape difficult is really what I call the pizza foot, which is where the foot is really flat, flat, flat, flat, with little of an ankle, so slightly straight behind. If you do the profile, like an L, no curves, like a 90 degrees, a care kind of style. And then the foot really large by the front, which happens often when people have this position since they are kids, like sitting on their feet, you know, like almost like let's say a Japanese seat, you know, where you just sitting and you rise a thing because it engage the muscles and the bones to be to stabilize your entire body weight on the front of the foot. So it develops a larger foot in the front.

[Bella]

God, that's so interesting.

[Christian Louboutin]

And it's complicated. Z after it's not that pretty. But thereafter also it's very difficult to. To do a shoe which is not a flat shoe, where when you put it on the heel with an arch that it doesn't open to shoe. It's not a good look for foot.

[Bella]

Yeah.

[Christian Louboutin]

Once a foot is dressed, or even a bit undressed, but elevated.

[Bella]

And what do you think of the ankle boot? Nick Cave said he hates them.

[Christian Louboutin]

Yes, I know that Dick say that. Cave say that. I understand, I understand. Because I don't have a problem with ankle boots, but I have a problem with napa unlined ankle boot. I do remember speaking often to this guy who was a great journalist musician called Yva Derrier in the 70s in Paris. He was the journalist for music. Great guy, very 70s look. And he has those boots that line so like gloves. I could see his feet touching all the leather. So you could see the feet molded on the boot. And I was really disgusted. I could barely find anything. He was very interesting, but I could find anything he would say. I would, I would be reserved because it looked, I don't know, something looked weird because of his feet on his boots. Something always fake. I mean, I could not take him seriously because I looked at his boots and I was like, ah. How can you be seriously interesting having those animated fingers inside those nappa boots? I was horrified by that. And so I have a problem with boots. Where you do see the body of the shoe, where you do see the bone. I don't see. I don't like to see bones in shoes. So when it's on a boot, you do see a big part of the foot and I find it really disgusting. So yes, I do not like ankle boots where they are lined. When you do see the foot inside, you know, we have this thing in French called. It's a terrible expression called bull beat. So mold dick. So it's when people have those underwears, you know, swim underwear, and you see everything.

[Bella]

Oh yeah.

[Christian Louboutin]

Where the dick is mouldered, you do see the dick, you do see the bold, etc.

[Bella]

Here we call it budgie smugglers.

[Christian Louboutin]

Budgie smugglers, yes.

[Bella]

As though you've got a budgie down your trousers and you see all this outline of the strange shapes.

[Christian Louboutin]

Voila. So I have a problem with budgie's manglers on the foot. On, around, around the ankle, it's fine. But on the foot budget sparklers looks really bad.

[Bella]

Yeah.

[Christian Louboutin]

So everything which is budgie spaggler on the Foot side, I don't like. So that's why I don't like nappa ankle boot.

[Bella]

So this might answer my next question, which is, if you fancy someone and you don't like what they're wearing, does it kill your attraction?

[Christian Louboutin]

No, it doesn't kill my attraction to find someone very badly dressed. On the opposite, I think that if you're attracted by someone, everything which is kind of around is interesting because if you don't like it, it means that you like something else. That's what they wear. So it makes you think, what do I like about that person? As I don't like the appearance. So it's just not about the appearance. It needs to be about something else. So I find it way more interesting to be attracted by someone that you don't like. Really, you don't like the looks and everything? Because it means that it's not the look that you're attracted to, but it's something else. And as much as appearance means something, I like that I'm not attracted by the appearance, but maybe attracted by something else. Which reminds me of one thing. Long time ago. So I used to dress up a lot, especially when I was going in clubs. And I remember, I don't remember the age. I was probably 14 or 15 years old. And then I was in that club called the palace in Paris. And this guy tells me to come over him. And you know, when you're 15, anybody who wants to speak to you, you're happy because when they are by the bar, you know that you're going to have a free drink. So I was like, okay. So I go to him and he says, okay, so I saw you because I was really like a parrot, you know, I was very visible. He said, okay, so I notice you, so what do you have to tell me? And I looked at the guy, I said, what? He said, you want to be noticed? I notice you, so what do you want to say? And I was very offended. I was like, that's the worst way to be flirtatious to someone. Who does he think he is? And I left. But then it stayed in my mind. And I realized that it stayed really in my mind for years. Not every day, of course, but it stayed in my mind. And one day I actually understood. I thought, okay, when you're very young, you like to be floated or to be noticeable. Of course it means something. Of course it means that you want to be detached from the rest of people. So you probably. Which probably means that you want to say something at that age. I had no clue what I wanted to say. I still don't know, actually. But basically it's a way to say, hey, you know, I'm slightly different than other people around, and this is a way to engage a conversation. Or this is a way to. That maybe people are interested by you. So the guy was just telling me, I'm interested by you, so why tell me what you have, which is so special that I should be interested by you? But I took it really badly. I thought, what a prick to. To be like that, maybe. And actually, after I understood that very well, I thought that was very smart. He probably was a very smart person. I should have found something to say instead of saying, who do you think you are?

[Bella]

There's something a bit shaming about how he said it to you. Like, challenging in a way that, I mean, I can't.

[Christian Louboutin]

Well, it was a very mature way to be with, like a teenager trying to pick up a teenager in a smart way to not to be, like, too cheesy. I guess it was definitely not cheesy, but I probably would have preferred to have it more cheesy, definitely.

[Bella]

I always remember that time we went for breakfast. This was probably in the 90s, and on Sunday. And we found this big cafe off the Rue de Rivoli. And there was no one in there. And we sat down and ordered a Pacino. And then this waitress. Anyway, they never arrived. And we were chatting like crazy. And then when she came back and we asked her where it was, the coffin, she said, you have to leave.

[Christian Louboutin]

Yeah, I remember. I was furious.

[Bella]

Yeah. And then we were so angry. And then we got up, very calm, and then suddenly she was passing with a tray of drinks, and you just slapped the tray of drinks from underneath. And we ran down, out and running, screaming and laugh. And I've never seen you ever angry or lose your temper. And I wondered how you do stay so even, because you often have a thousand problems and frustrating things to deal with, as the fashion business is not, you know, famously, everything goes wrong all the time. But how do you manage to not.

[Christian Louboutin]

Freak out in general? I don't know. I find a solution that it's that important what happened. But I remember what you're talking about. We waited for hours, and then she said, you have to go. And I was like, she could have said it a minute, you know, 30 minutes ago. So I was furious. I just didn't know what to do, what to say. I thought that there was nothing to say. The only thing is that I restrained myself to that. To throw her Entire table to her face. So I got quieter. I just throw the table. But just got careful that it wouldn't affect her face or anything. But I was furious. She deserved it totally. She said, I never came back to that restaurant ever.

[Bella]

I always remember asking.

[Christian Louboutin]

I know exactly what it is in the corner of my street.

[Bella]

I never came back on that bridge. And when I remember saying what. How. Why did you suddenly get so angry? And you said, I don't want her to think just because I'm wearing pink trousers she can push me around.

[Christian Louboutin]

Yeah.

[Bella]

And it was such a sort of true abstract reason that you.

[Christian Louboutin]

She had a bit of a condescendant like oh gosh. She was in this little sneering, this little. This little couple thinking they're on the top of the game because they wear colors. I'm going to smash them. That doesn't work that way.

[Bella]

Yeah.

[Christian Louboutin]

Viva la color. No, no, no. It. She had an attitude. She had an attitude. Very rude. You never do that. You never do that. You know, sometimes it happens at fix that. But you just arrive at you, You. You apologize when you do something nasty. At least please apologize. Especially when you know that you're nasty and you do something nasty. Just be smarter or do apologize.

[Bella]

She definitely got.

[Christian Louboutin]

It was a pure block of aggression. So she received a little part of it. But it's rare. It's rare. It's rare what I get when I lose my temper.

[Bella]

You work with a team, but you design everything with Hugo, who's your right hand. And it's quite unusual these days that a designer does design everything themselves. And you draw a lot. And how do you sit down and start?

[Christian Louboutin]

Well, I always. It's the same thing, you know, to work. My main work is designing so drawing. So the first thing is to be an environment slightly isolated, but that I know which is very comfortable in the sense of I don't have to look for restaurant, I don't have to look for plate. Papa pas. I know where is. You know, where are the markers, where is the pencils whereby razor. I know the food I'm good to have, etc. So there is no distraction around. So it's basically places where I used to go. So I go either to Rio where I have this apartment, or I go to Portugal or I go to Egypt for the summer collection. I go to Brittany where I have a house for the winter collection. Kind of like this because I'm quite affected with light and climate when I'm sketching. And then I guess it's for the pleasure of Drawing you don't necessarily need at the first, second inspiration about what you're going to design. Fact, to draw and to correct my lines is a big pleasure. So out of that, I start to sketch. But I always start with a white page. If I have things in mind, I put music according to those moods. Otherwise, no, music is my favorite thing. And then I start sketching. And then I guess the friend that I have, who are writers, I call it, is the anguish of the white page. So there is this thing. But I know, because it has become a routine for 34 years now. I know that I'm kind of mushy, mushy for the first maybe half day. And then puff, it floats. And then really, I sketch, I sketch, I sketch. And then I re. You go. We review the drawings that we've been doing the last three. The first three days and then start speaking about it and then continue again. So every three days we kind of do a little review and amass a certain amount of sketches. And then after two weeks, we go back to France. But it's the same routine. I haven't changed. The one thing that I don't have is that I can be inspired by zillions of things, but I don't work with documents I do not bring. For instance, when I drew the shoes, it's by the. By the Warhol's flowers. I looked at the painting of Andy Warhol after the shoe was finished. So I was kind of accomplished.

[Bella]

Yeah.

[Christian Louboutin]

And the flower of Andy Warhol has no outlines. It's that three petals. It's four petals. It's one color. The heart is the same color. When for me, I designed a three petals outlined different colors. The heart of the flower is another color. So it's completely different. So when you're designing, you can be inspired by things. But I think that it's better to have it without the documents or things which have been inspiring to you, because then it goes through the filter of your memory and your visual memory, which is really a radio machine, which has done a lot of work from you to you. And then when it comes out, it's no longer a document. This document has been chipped in here with so many other things that it comes out not as a Xerox, as a copy, but as your own thing, your own view on something, your own vision view on something. So that's the thing that I do, that's my routine, is working with no documents and everything stored in my head. Sometimes a little bit of an object could be. So I start Almost like a graph. And start sketching and it's becoming bigger, whatever, but really small details. I could have very small face, small details that I like to really try to do the curves of those details of an element. But that's it. That's it. And I've never worked differently. Never? No, never. It's always been like that. And there is no fear. There is no fear. And if my sketches. The only thing is that I don't take. I mean, first of all, I don't take drugs in general, but I mean, I would not take drugs every time I've been smoking pot. Andrew was a disaster. I'm like, for four hours on a sketch and then, God, this is the most beautiful sketch of the morning after. Like, okay, I lost one entire day doing that pretty sketch with nothing on. And. But, you know, you correct and you correct and then there is a little beep and then you. You have to scratch a beep, etc. So I think, for instance, I have the feeling for musicians, part can be a kind of good isolation moment or whatever. You know, it kind of puts you in a kind of bubble, which can be a creative bubble. But for me to draw is a disaster. I have to be very clear. Yeah, I mean, not alcohol, nothing. I need to be clear.

[Bella]

And you collaborated with David lynch and he. He made photographs of the fetish shoes that you designed for your. You had an exhibition and you asked two girls from the Folies Berger to model. And there was something very pure about the photographs. I was looking at them again before you came, and they're so cool and sort of, their bodies are so contained. And then the shoes are so erotic and extraordinary. And what was it like to work with him?

[Christian Louboutin]

It was fantastic to work with David and it came that way. I wanted to design shoes which were not done to walk anyway. And they were really objects of desire, an object of fetishism. Fetishism is a big word. You can embrace a lot of different fetishism. So I thought, okay, I'm going to design these shoes not to be worn, but really to be objects on the side of different aspect, fetishist aspect. So I thought there should be a light somehow, a very distinct world universe. And I thought, it's definitely not a fashion photographer. It should be someone a la Lynch. I have this weird thing that I never really think that people would be interested to do something with me. So I would barely never ask anyone to do something with me. That's why I do very little collaboration on fiq, because I always think probably maybe the fear of being rejected. So I never ask anything to anyone. So like this, I've never rejected. I am totally conscious that I want to do something lynch style. I know David, so I still have to ask him first. He's going to refuse, but I cannot take the risk that he's thinking. These guys that I know, we were friends and he's been copying my works. That's pretty offensive or whatever. So I was conscious that I wanted something very lynch way. The coloration, the patida of Lynch. Incredible visions in photography, in light, in colors. So I thought out of politeness, I have to ask him that he will say no. And then I will try to find someone that I'm thinking would be a good thing. So I went, we had a drink with David, he was in Paris. And then I said, well, I have a little bit of a project I wanted to speak to you about. And I totally understand that you will say no. You can say no, but I still need to speak to you about it because I've been thinking about you say, what is it about Christian? And I said, well, it's. I have shoes that I wanted to be photographed. Shoes not to be worn, but really shoes around fetishism, the ideas, multiple ideas on fetishism. And he said, okay, let's do it. So I said, what do you mean? He said, let's do it. Where are the shoes? I said, was I in my head why? I said, because I wanted to ask you first and if the project was making sense, that I would do the shoes. He said, let's do was as simple as that. And then he says, you have to develop, you have to show me the sketches. And I'm sad because I lost them. He lost them. I'm even more sad, but at least I'm not responsible. He lost them. And so I did every shoe. And then I explained the kind of category of fetishism. It was big, it was belonging to. So I show him and say, okay, do the shoes needs to be worn on girls? You choose the girls. But one thing. No bones.

[Bella]

No what?

[Christian Louboutin]

No bones.

[Bella]

What did you mean by bones?

[Christian Louboutin]

I say, what do you mean by bones? He says, the shoes are beautiful, but they're extreme. Me photographing these shoes, if it's on skinny girls, model style, it's going to look that they come out of like a torture chamber or something horrible. So it should not be. It should not be with skinny girls. I don't want to see a bone in those girls. That's the only thing. No bones. I said, okay, and then I proposed him two girls from the Crazy Horse. So great dancers from the Crazy Horse in ballets. And he immediately said yes. And the best to photograph. To photograph girls where the body is going to be important. The best people are always dancers because they know how to express with their body model, try to express with a face. It's way more complicated. They need to be very, very good to come out with something which I'm interested by. But dancers express one tire body and it gives way better pictures. And also it's someone who loves Belle Mere, who knew the work of Boninier. So there is this thing about twisted, curvy bodies and still sketches, sketched bodies that I understood where he goes, what he's liking and where he's coming from. And on that we have some carbon points. So we did those pictures for two days in the studio in Barais. Very little crew. One person with a light, another person called in camera him and another person doing. I don't remember what. And then the makeup artist who had to go when he started to do picture in another place. And that's it. And someone with a camera kind of documenting more or less. And it was very. No one that he knew actually. And it was very interesting because without asking anything to anyone, everyone was acting. I don't know how you say in English, why'd you speak like this?

[Bella]

Oh, in a hushed way.

[Christian Louboutin]

Everyone was hushing. And you. I think that everyone had the feelings that we were living a very special moment with a very special. With an incredible human being, with an incredible character, with an incredible artist. And he did that silence around him and everyone was aware. You were almost like in a church. And he didn't ask anything. He never did shut up or anything, never. But the respect comes with him immediately. He was always surrounded. People had. First of all, he was such an iconic person that people are recognizable physically, that people in his presence were very, very kind of almost scared and almost. If they were seeing a kind of God or idol. And so it means that the surrounding was always very smooth. And he was a painter, you know, he was as many artists actually doing something other than painting. Painting is a ultimate. It's a ultimate form of art. So he never paint. He did paint, but his art, his biggest developer, of course, had been in movies and also in music, but definitely that in painting, even if his paintings are beautiful. So it was really interesting because, for instance, the way he was working with the light. So it was still pictures, but it was almost like a slow movie. So he was having the Camera. And he talked to the assistant to take the light, almost like a brush. So he would have this big light. The assistant, it was heavy, and he had to brush the girl, meaning the light has. What if you were like painting someone in a second, in a nasosecond like that. And then the moment the brush was on, he would take the picture. So that very, very, very weird light from David Lynch's movies is coming from the way he's brushing very, very, very quickly and very strongly his characters, which gives that really important, impactful light just to the people. And it was really impressive because it was a lot of movement. Sometimes he was taking the picture. Most of the time he was brushing with the light. So he was asking to the assistant just to click. But the most important thing was how he was brushing the person. And it gives that weird light where there is no light, but the light seems to come from inside the character, the skin of the person. So it was really very impressive. That's why also, I think that people were into kind of almost a coma. You know, no one was speaking.

[Bella]

This looks almost like those figures of those girls are like an apparition. All like how you've described this luminosity comes from within them. And then there are these incredible shoes. And their naked bodies seem like so pure and. God, I mean, they're so beautiful. Have you. Have you got those photographs?

[Christian Louboutin]

I have the photographs, yes. And, you know, again, it's. It's interesting how much, you know, I've been traveling to many countries, which I'm very happy of having traveled to, and most of the time I want to go there. Once I'm there, you can be the most beautiful landscape. It's the most beautiful front of the most beautiful Padoraba. You still are starving. You have, like, you know, you still have. You want to have a glass of water, you want to. Whatever, you know, you have on your basic needs, basically. And you're not necessarily thinking, wow, where am I? What am I doing there? How beautiful is that? How memorable is the moment that I'm living now? It really comes after. It's almost like if I was doing things for memories, not for the moment, not for the real moment, but for the memory of that moment. I do remember those two days with David. It was great. It was intense, but it was just like, okay, you know, he's asking that, Christian, what do you think? David, you decide. No, no, no, we do it together. What do you think? I said, okay, you know, but everything was kind of smooth and easy and simple or whatever. And then it's after looking at the pictures, remembering it that I thought, my God, I've been living in fantastic problem with one of the most interesting person I got to meet ever in my entire life. So. But the moment I was living, it seemed like a very, very normal moment. I mean, I don't remember so many moments where I was at the moment impressed by the moment I was living. It's really after that thinking, wow, that must have been impressive to leave that little Christian, don't you think? I'm thinking, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's true. We will say, well, it was impressive, but I'm never impressed at the moment. In the moment, I kind of leave the moment. It's really after I'm thinking, oh, my God. And it's terrible to say, but since David died, I know I will never see him again. And it makes me very sad. Just think, you have many moments with him.

[Bella]

God, what an amazing experience. And to have those pictures and to have the evidence of those, you know, that time with him just.

[Christian Louboutin]

But also, you know, sometimes it is. You would like to do something with someone and then when, you know, if you work with somebody else, it's not totally in your hands, which is normal. So sometimes the result is not the fantasies that you were having of working with someone and achieving something very specific that you have in your head, but which doesn't belong to you completely. Just the way the photograph we did with David is that belonging to me fully. It's his work. It's my work on his work, it is work. Photographing my work, it's different. But I have to say it has been a very pure moment because it's literally what I had in my head. Not the construction, but the quality and the emotion coming out of those pictures.

[Bella]

Yeah, well, you just recently described something where you said you weren't a leader yet. We all love to be in your orbit and we love to follow you. You're such a great person to lead or for. For people to follow and listen.

[Christian Louboutin]

I think that we are living in a moment where you can perfectly understand why you do not want to be a leader. There is no nothing in me which wants to make me look like a leader. I have very little respect for the leaders that we're having now and the role models which is proposed to us as leaders. Now is pretty scary. So I think that I could give you this answer. I have no desire to become a leader. None. And it's not in my blood. I'm kind of shy. I don't want to Outshine. I don't want to be so responsible for other people. And I think it's a lot of responsibility. When I was a child, I wanted to be an architect for a little while. And then I heard that a building collapsed and there were hundreds of people who died. I don't even remember where. And it stopped me the second I heard that. I said, I will never be an architect. The idea of being responsible for the death of one person is killing any type of desire on me. So imagine what means to be a leader. Or imagine now what it means to be a leader. That's the worst thing I would like. That's my worst nightmares. I would not want to be a leader.

[Bella]

Well, instead, you're responsible for a huge amount of pleasure in the world.

[Christian Louboutin]

But I still try to be as irresponsible as what is permitted to me.

[Bella]

Well, thank you so much, Christian, for being on Fashion Neurosis. You're one of my dearest friends, and I love chatting to you. I could talk to you for days.

[Christian Louboutin]

And I have a question for you, Bella. What means new roses?

[Bella]

I think.

[Christian Louboutin]

Is that neurotic? Neurotic?

[Bella]

Yeah. It's. I think. I mean, to be honest, I don't entirely understand, but it means a neurotic obsession with something that doesn't necessarily make any sense. Anyway, that's my interpretation.

[Christian Louboutin]

I love the word.

[Bella]

There's plenty of that in the fashion business. Well, thank you, Christian.

[Christian Louboutin]

Thank you.

[Bella]

Sa.