Podcast Summary: Fashion Neurosis with Susie Cave

Episode: Fashion Neurosis with Susie Cave
Release Date: April 8, 2025
Host: Bella Freud
Guest: Susie Cave, former Supermodel and Founder of Vampire's Wife

1. Introduction and Today's Outfit (00:38 – 02:09)

Bella Freud welcomes Susie Cave to the podcast, diving straight into the conversation by inquiring about Susie's outfit for the day. Susie describes her attire as an emerald green Moroccan caftan, complemented by Gucci Alessandro Michele gold mules, Sophie-Billy bra diamond ring, and Balenciaga earrings. She emphasizes her love for comfort infused with elegance, choosing outfits that honor her Moroccan heritage and her personal sense of style.

Susie Cave (00:56): "I'm wearing this emerald green Moroccan dress... because I love it, first of all. It's just so comfortable."

Bella relates the caftan to her own childhood memories in Morocco, highlighting the deep emotional connections clothing can evoke.

Bella Freud (02:09): "I love that emerald green caftan because when I was a child living in Morocco, my mother had an emerald green caftan and she looked so beautiful in it."

2. Childhood and Early Fashion Influences (02:09 – 05:10)

Bella transitions the conversation to Susie's childhood, prompting her to recall the first piece of clothing she became obsessed with. Susie reminisces about a party dress with an orange and white long skirt and a ruched top she wore frequently during her family's return from Africa to Cheshire. Despite its extravagant nature, she clung to it out of sheer affection.

Susie Cave (03:17): "There is one outfit that I had, a party dress... I kind of never felt like I really fitted in."

Bella touches upon Susie's challenging childhood, including running away from school at age 14 and moving to Japan. Susie admits she had low expectations for herself and felt like a disaster, yet life unfolded in unexpected and delightful ways.

Susie Cave (04:32): "I was pretty terrified of the future and I just felt like a bit of a disaster... All the good things that happened to me were things that were just in no way ever."

3. Early Modeling Career and Experiences in Japan (05:10 – 08:23)

Susie's serendipitous entry into the modeling world begins with an encounter with Bethann Hardison, a renowned model agent, during a school holiday trip to New York. At 14, Susie is scouted and introduced to Steven Meisel, an 18-year-old photographer who advises her to return to school due to her youth.

Susie Cave (06:00): "He was incredibly sweet and sort of said, look, I really think you need to go back to school."

Five years later, at 19, Steven Meisel books her for a job in New York, marking the start of her modeling career. However, instead of transitioning immediately, Susie relocates to Japan after a brief and unremarkable return to school. There, she unexpectedly gets scouted by a Japanese agent, leading her to spend nearly two years modeling in Japan despite having only 20 pence when she boarded the plane.

Susie Cave (08:23): "I sort of went back to school briefly for about a day... and on one of those days I was spotted by a Japanese agent who asked me to go to Japan."

4. Working with Tien and Christian Dior Campaign (08:23 – 14:37)

In Japan, Susie grapples with camera shyness and self-doubt, often freezing during photoshoots. Her turning point arrives when she collaborates with Tien, the creative makeup director for Christian Dior. Tien transforms her appearance, enhancing her features and instilling newfound confidence. This collaboration leads to Susie becoming the face of Christian Dior makeup for four to five years.

Susie Cave (10:54): "He transformed me into these sort of flower kind of vibe, ballet... each campaign was so different, and I wasn't really recognizable at all."

Bella admires Susie's transformation under Tien's artistry, noting how it accentuated Susie's unique features.

Bella Freud (12:19): "When you looked in the mirror, what had he done?... Oh, this is me, and I can be more of this."

Susie shares anecdotes about working closely with Tien in a minimalistic studio setting, which fostered creativity and a deeper bond between them.

Susie Cave (12:35): "It was just him and me in the studio. We were kind of on our own, and it was amazing."

5. Friendship and Collaborations with Bella Freud (14:37 – 20:58)

Bella reminisces about memorable moments in their modeling careers, including a Vivienne Westwood shoot for Elle magazine where Susie's dress blew up, and her graceful response impressed Bella.

Bella Freud (15:32): "I remember you were standing in the doorway of a Winnebago in Hyde park... and you'd smooth it down so slowly."

Susie attributes her newfound elegance to her time in Japan, where she observed and emulated the graceful movements of Japanese models.

Susie Cave (16:18): "I kind of learned to try and do things elegantly... They were so graceful."

The conversation shifts to Susie's relationship with her then-boyfriend, Ralph, and Bella’s introduction of Susie to her future husband, Nick. Their friendship deepens through mutual respect and shared experiences in the fashion world.

Bella Freud (24:43): "We reconnected in the 90s when I started my own brand..."

6. Vampire's Wife Brand and Its Origins (25:08 – 43:12)

Susie recounts the tragic loss of her son Arthur, which plunged her into profound grief. During this time, Daisy Lowe contacts her to design a dress for the GQ Awards. This gesture becomes a pivotal moment, reigniting Susie's passion and leading to the creation of the Vampire's Wife brand.

Susie Cave (48:49): "Daisy Lowe asked me to make her a dress for an event, and it somehow saved me to keep getting up for work."

Susie discusses how designing helped her navigate her grief, turning her pain into creative energy. The Vampire's Wife brand gains recognition, symbolizing transformation and resilience.

Bella and Susie also delve into their collaborative efforts in designing, highlighting Susie's exacting standards and Bella's adaptability.

Bella Freud (41:15): "You were so specific... It's like a whole other side of my personality I didn't know I had."

7. Personal Growth and Handling Grief (43:03 – 55:38)

The conversation touches upon Susie's transformation from a chronic lateness to punctuality, influenced by her responsibilities and family life.

Susie Cave (47:18): "Living with someone like Nick, who's extremely organized and punctual, I think I must have picked it up by osmosis."

Susie opens up about the devastating loss of her son Arthur and how creativity became her lifeline. Designing for Vampire's Wife provided purpose and a means to honor her grief.

Susie Cave (49:31): "Creativity has this ability to make life bearable and to be able to have joy within so much pain."

Bella commends Susie's resilience and courage, emphasizing how fashion served as a therapeutic tool.

Bella Freud (54:11): "Fashion has been such a tool, a survival tool."

8. Personal Philosophy: Lashon Hara and Positivity (55:38 – 59:44)

In the closing segment, Susie shares her recent adoption of Lashon Hara, a Jewish tradition that prohibits speaking negatively about others. This practice has fostered a more peaceful and positive mindset for her.

Susie Cave (56:24): "I just thought that was so wonderful and I thought, I'm going to try and do that... I just feel very peaceful."

Bella reflects on her own experiences with negativity and how Susie's approach has influenced her.

Bella Freud (55:38): "I thought I would practice it myself... It makes space for other ideas."

Susie acknowledges the challenges but remains committed to maintaining positivity, noting the profound impact it has had on her interactions and self-perception.

Susie Cave (59:12): "I just find space for other ideas... I just can't get me to gossip about anything."

Conclusion

The episode offers an intimate glimpse into Susie Cave's journey through the fashion industry, personal tragedies, and the healing power of creativity. Through candid conversations and shared memories, Bella Freud and Susie Cave explore the intricate relationship between fashion, identity, and personal growth. Notable for its depth and emotional resonance, this episode underscores how fashion can be both a personal solace and a means of connecting with others.

Notable Quotes:

• Susie Cave (00:56): "I'm wearing this emerald green Moroccan dress... because I love it, first of all. It's just so comfortable."
• Bella Freud (02:09): "I love that emerald green caftan because when I was a child living in Morocco, my mother had an emerald green caftan and she looked so beautiful in it."
• Susie Cave (06:00): "He was incredibly sweet and sort of said, look, I really think you need to go back to school."
• Susie Cave (10:54): "He transformed me into these sort of flower kind of vibe, ballet... each campaign was so different, and I wasn't really recognizable at all."
• Susie Cave (48:49): "Daisy Lowe asked me to make her a dress for an event, and it somehow saved me to keep getting up for work."
• Susie Cave (56:24): "I just thought that was so wonderful and I thought, I'm going to try and do that... I just feel very peaceful."

This comprehensive summary encapsulates the essence of the conversation between Bella Freud and Susie Cave, highlighting their personal journeys, professional collaborations, and the profound ways in which fashion intertwines with identity and healing.