Cou Cou Cachet

Summary

Fashion People Podcast: "Cou Cou Cachet" (July 17, 2026) Host: Lauren Sherman (Puck) | Guest: Rose Colcord (Founder, Cuckoo Intimates)

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Episode Overview

This episode explores the evolving market for women's intimates through the lens of Cuckoo Intimates, a fast-growing, culturally attuned brand founded by Rose Colcord. Host Lauren Sherman and Colcord discuss the origin and philosophy of Cuckoo, the challenges of designing everyday underwear, how cultural shifts post-Victoria's Secret have changed what women want, and the business realities of launching in the pandemic. The tone is conversational, insightful, and full of industry “inside baseball,” making it perfect for fashion insiders and curious listeners.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Personal Backgrounds & Routines (02:48-07:50)

• Rose grew up in London, with family roots in Liverpool and the U.S.
• Lauren and Rose bond over morning workouts (SoulCycle, running, Pilates) as ways to manage energy and anxiety.
• Discussion of how motherhood altered fitness habits and body image.

Notable Quote:
"I think of my energy like a pressure cooker in a way, and I have to let out steam."
— Rose Colcord (03:57)

2. The Evolution of Underwear & Cultural Context (07:07-16:40)

• The decline of overtly “sexy” lingerie, shift to function and comfort.
• Experiences with the generational divide: past focus on “performative lingerie” vs. a desire for beautiful everyday options.
• Roots of Cuckoo: inspired by the lack of options between “sexy” and “granny panties.”
• Literary/feminist influences on Cuckoo’s aesthetic: Virginia Woolf, Joan Didion, Jane Birkin, bell hooks.
• Nostalgia and the use of pointelle fabric as a motif for comfort and modernity.

Notable Quote:
"As women, we feel our most peaceful when we're our most comfortable."
— Rose Colcord (13:16)

3. Launching Cuckoo Intimates (16:40-22:38)

• Entering the intimates market as an outsider—with a degree in philosophy, no fashion background.

• Underwear as a reflection of larger questions of femininity, confidence, and daily self-perceptions.

• Influential philosophy professor's advice:
  "Brands tell stories and brands have the power to shift cultural narratives." (20:34)

• The intention to reclaim femininity from voyeuristic, male-driven narratives toward “real, undone, unpolished.”

• Cuckoo avoids Photoshop, uses only female photographers, and is driven by intentional choices around representation.

4. Product Development & Sourcing (24:21-27:32)

• Colcord’s market research: purchased and analyzed every relevant bra and underwear available, noting what worked and what didn’t.
• The importance of lingerie expertise even for daily basics—partnered with a technical developer from Agent Provocateur/La Perla, bringing high craftsmanship to “daily” underwear.
• Application of premium detailing and care to everyday essentials.

Notable Quote:
"It's not done—applying lingerie principles to daily underwear. I was like, well, let's do it then."
— Rose Colcord (26:08)

5. Timing, Market Shifts, and Cultural Forces (27:32-34:10)

• Launched in late 2021/early 2022: pandemic-era consumers shifted to comfort, but were ready to reclaim attractiveness.
• Victoria's Secret’s decline created a void—women who previously defaulted to VS or M&S had nowhere "aspirational" to go.
• Discussion of the pendulum swing from “not trying” to wanting just the right amount of effort and beauty.

Notable Quote:
"If Victoria's Secret is Mac, Cuckoo is maybe, like, Saie Beauty or what Glossier was in that turn of the beauty industry."
— Rose Colcord (34:10)

6. Branding, Community, and Retail Approach (38:18-42:00)

• Cuckoo’s visual and philosophical sensibility was established on Instagram as a “mood board” before product launch.
• Emotional connection to the brand’s world is seen as a differentiator.
• Direct-to-consumer with some select wholesale; pop-ups at places like Le Bon Marché in Paris.
• Retail as a critical component for direct engagement, especially for touch-and-feel and fit.

7. Changing Landscape of Underwear Brands (42:00-47:10)

• Discussion of the limited options for good everyday underwear—even at the higher end.
• The "Playboy moment": Cuckoo connects to contemporary cultural shifts around underwear as self-expression and art as much as function.

Notable Quote:
"I’m not actually passionate about underwear. But what I am passionate about is almost seeing it like a microcosm and expression for the female embodied experience and how it fits into culture."
— Rose Colcord (47:10)

8. Curation, Product Expansion, and Staying Disciplined (48:44-56:57)

• Cuckoo’s success attributed to “discipline": avoiding distraction by trends or competitors, staying offline and true to the brand’s core.
• Product development driven by the founder’s own needs, her team (who mirror the customer), and in-person feedback via wear trials.
• Expansion into new styles (slips, sets, other essentials) is careful and customer-led—trend forecasting tools and AI are avoided.

9. What’s Next for Cuckoo? (57:05-60:44)

• Ambition: “the go-to premium everyday essentials and organic cotton intimates brand for the new generation of women.”
• Vision for permanent stores in New York, LA, and Paris—more than retail spaces, they would be cultural hubs (book curation, memories, experiences).
• Offline engagement and real-world touchpoints seen as critical, as customers want authenticity and to physically experience product quality.

Notable Quote:
“Cuckoo is a world, and it’s a philosophy… our pop up has a Cuckoo library of books—essential readings curated by me that shaped how I saw the brand.”
— Rose Colcord (59:00)

10. Underwire Bra Launch & Sizing Realities (60:44-end)

• The “teacup” underwire is a top seller, but sizing is complicated (few women know their actual bra size).
• Cuckoo’s solution: intuitive “S+, M+, etc.” sizing, more reflective of customer feedback and real bodies.
• Discussion of how bras, like jeans, are both universal and intensely individual.

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• "I think of my energy like a pressure cooker in a way and I have to let out steam."
  — Rose Colcord (03:57)

• "Am I going to feel sexy and not comfortable or am I going to feel comfortable and not beautiful? That was so backwards."
  — Rose Colcord (13:16)

• "Brands tell stories and brands have the power to shift cultural narratives."
  — Lauren Sherman paraphrasing Colcord’s philosophy professor (20:34)

• "It’s not done—applying lingerie principles to daily underwear. I was like, well, let's do it then."
  — Rose Colcord (26:08)

• "If Victoria's Secret is Mac, Cuckoo is maybe, like, Saie Beauty or what Glossier was in that turn of the beauty industry."
  — Rose Colcord (34:10)

• "What I am passionate about is almost seeing [underwear] like a microcosm and expression for the female embodied experience and how it fits into culture."
  — Rose Colcord (47:10)

• "You don’t need to do a mood board on [Instagram] for sure. It’s highly unnecessary at this point."
  — Lauren Sherman (55:51)

• "Cuckoo is a world, and it’s a philosophy… I want [stores] to be more than a place to shop, to be somewhere that makes memories."
  — Rose Colcord (59:00-60:12)

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Structured Timestamps for Key Sections

• 02:48-07:50: Workout routines, personal background.
• 07:50-16:40: Origins of Cuckoo, aesthetic influences, feminist thought.
• 16:40-22:38: Moving from academic philosophy to brand-building, values of comfort, confidence, and authenticity.
• 24:21-27:32: Product development & technical challenges.
• 27:32-34:10: Market timing, cultural shifts post-Covid and post-Victoria’s Secret, the pendulum swing in femininity.
• 38:18-42:00: Building community and retail philosophies.
• 48:44-56:57: Product expansion, creative discipline, avoiding trend-chasing.
• 57:05-60:44: What’s next—retail dreams, store-as-cultural-hub, Cuckoo’s offline world.
• 60:44-end: Underwire bra launch, sizing discussion.

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Conclusion

This episode offers an insider critique and celebration of how the intimates market is rewriting old narratives of femininity and comfort. Rose Colcord’s journey with Cuckoo Intimates exemplifies a new, disciplined approach to branding: intentional, values-driven, tactile, and authentic—eschewing trend-chasing in favor of building a real and lasting world for its distinct customer. For listeners, it’s a window into not just the business of underwear, but the shifting tides of what “fashion people” are really talking about.

Transcript

[Rose Colcord]

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[Lauren Sherman]

Queen Carvania stood haloed by the morning sun. An army hung on her every word. My champions, I have sold my chariot on Carvana. Twas a lovely suv, an inexplicably queenly offer. They're even coming to the castle to collect it. Tonight we feast. An offer you can feast on. Sell your car today on Carvana. Pickup fees may apply. Hello and welcome to Fashion People. I'm Lauren Sherman, writer of Puck's fashion and beauty memo line sheet, and today with me on the show is Rose Kolkerd, founder of Cuckoo Intimates. We discuss aesthetics, bras, starting a business during the pandemic, and a whole lot more. Before we get going. I wanted to remind you that if you like this podcast, you'll definitely love Puck, where I send an email called Line Sheet. If you're a fashion person, you get that reference. It's an original look at what's really going on inside the fashion and beauty industries. Line Sheet is scoopy, analytical and above all, fun. Along with me, a subscription to Puck gains you access to an unmatched roster of experts reporting on powerful people and companies in entertainment, media, sports, politics, finance, the art world, and much more. If you're interested listeners of Fashion People get a discount. Just go to Puck News Fashion People to join Puck or start a free trial. Happy Friday everyone. I am pre recording this because I'm on vacation. So I'm in a forest. Something major happened. I'll jump on. Obviously I wouldn't go somewhere without Internet. Do you think I'm insane? But really, I'll be back next Tuesday with everything that's fit to discuss. If you have any requests, ping me. Taking a break is important. I'm reading multiple books at a time and enjoy this conversation with Rose. We talked a lot about working out and running a small business, so I hope you enjoy it. Rose Colcord welcome to Fashion People. Hi.

[Rose Colcord]

I'm so excited to be here.

[Lauren Sherman]

I'm so happy to have you. What did you have for breakfast this morning?

[Rose Colcord]

I don't usually have breakfast, but I dragged myself out of bed to go to a workout this morning. So I was like I need something. So I had A bagel with almond butter and an apple chopped. I thought I'd go the extra mile rather than just chomp into it. I chopped it up.

[Lauren Sherman]

What workout did you do? That sounds delicious.

[Rose Colcord]

It was not. It was like a nice, well rounded meal. I did SoulCycle, which is kind of basic, but I don't really drink and I have a 2 year old, so it's kind of my version of like a night out.

[Lauren Sherman]

I feel you. I understand. I'm not a bike, I'm not a cyclist. I used to do it. I don't like, like the vibe of it anyway. But also. But I used to do it because I like. I'm a big runner. Like, I like sweating and getting really overworked, which it does. And it's fun.

[Rose Colcord]

And I feel like there's been a lot of narrative around. I don't know, everyone seems to be really into like Pilates right now and I love yoga, but I. I think of my energy like a pressure cooker in a way and I have to let out steam. So. I've recently got into running since I have my daughter too, because just. It's so easy to just put on your trainers, get out the door, go on a run and yeah, come. How long have you been running for? Am I allowed to ask you questions back?

[Lauren Sherman]

Sure, sure. I feel like I talk about myself too much, but I started in like 14, 2014. I was. And it became. I'm not as much as now. I'm very into Pilates post baby. And like, honestly running, I went real hard, I guess, with everything. Like suddenly I had never run more than like a mile and a half in my life. And suddenly I was like, I'm doing marathons, but. And now my hips are in. Like, I became a really intense runner. Then I had a baby and like my hips and joints and stuff are just so. So like I do a lot of Pilates now and I run once a week. But I just find. And I really like the Pilates. Like my. I'm happier with my body than I've ever been because of the Pilates. And I do a lot of little strength training too. But like the Pilates is just. It's just changed. Like I have a little bit of a butt, which I've never, you know, that kind of stuff. But there's nothing like running and it. And also post baby agreed. Like you don't have time to go to a class. And I went to my doctor, six weeks, they were like, yeah, you can start. I went that day and went for a Run. Yeah, I'm real hardcore. Like my body's fucked my. It's totally wrecked.

[Rose Colcord]

Well, it sounds. Not so much. It's so much since you've been doing Pilates, but like, it's funny you say that. I did. I know this isn't a Pilates podcast, but I did like Pilates. Porcia, how old's your daughter?

[Lauren Sherman]

He's son. Five. Five.

[Rose Colcord]

My daughter's two. And I, funnily enough, signed up to Pilates class yesterday because although running, I'm like naturally very like cerebral and quite anxious and so I need exercise that like, gets out some of that energy, which running does Pilates. But then I'm like, I really need to get stronger because although I'm like kind of like I've shrunk, that's not what I like care about. I'm like, I really need to feel like stronger. Like I could not do a single sit up. I need to do this. But like, I also noticed. Damn. Like my hips feel so different. Like, but yeah, anyway, it's mild, it's wild.

[Lauren Sherman]

Well, I mean the body and, and it, it is connected to what we're going to talk about today, which is Cuckoo Intimates, which I. I don't know if you know I wrote a book about Victoria's Secret.

[Rose Colcord]

I do and I have it on my shelf and I. I have been intending to read it for the last year and just.

[Lauren Sherman]

You know what, because if I were you, you know what I would do? Put it in ChatGPT and be like, what are the big takeaways here? I'll send you the PDF of it. I don't mind you bought the book.

[Rose Colcord]

I'm excited to. I really am excited to read it. But yes, I'm a. Wah.

[Lauren Sherman]

Well, so I'm very interested in this market and have been following what you've been doing since pretty early. But first off, I wanted to talk a little bit more about you other than your exercise routine, which we could literally spend 45 minutes on. Where are you from? How did you get into this business? What are you doing on Fashion people?

[Rose Colcord]

So where am I from? I'm born and raised here in London. My family is. My mum's side is from up north, Liverpool, which I think actually contributes a lot to my kind of work ethic. I joke around that where my like Nana and my mom are from in Liverpool. That image of the outskirts of suburban Liverpool is part of what drives me forward. Like I am not going back there, but my. And my dad's from. From the U.S. but yeah, I.

[Lauren Sherman]

Where is your dad from in the us?

[Rose Colcord]

He, he, they, he.

[Nicola Hopkins]

His.

[Rose Colcord]

His dad was from Kentucky, but he grew up in Italy and then New York and then came to. To London. So he's a bit of a mashup. Got it.

[Lauren Sherman]

Okay, cool.

[Rose Colcord]

But how did I end up here? On Fashion People? I. But how far back do I go? I mean, I. I was always obsessed with, like, what the New York and the LA girls were wearing. Even in high school, I didn't want what, like, the London girls in my class were wearing. I was like, oh, you know, what's going on out there? Of course. You guys were the coolest. So I would send my friends in New York and LA things I wanted and they'd bring them back for me when they came, which a lot of people are like, oh, surprise, that cuckoo's majority are us market for us. But I think I inherently have a US consumer mind. I went to Gallatin, nyu, lived in New York for a couple years. Then I was really homesick. And for me, me, I think New York was just like, a bit overstimulating. Like, it's. I've realized it's really important for me to have nature around me and kind of easily accessible to touch grass, as they say. And so the. I moved to LA and I went to. I transferred to USC to finish my degree in philosophy, where I was focusing on ethics and ethics and really, like, literature and philosophy in literature rather than, like. I felt that I'd always been passionate about philosophy. My dad studied philosophy at Stanford. But not, you know, not like, logic, not in your. In the high tower of philosophy. I was really about, like, how do we, you know, what is it to, like, be human and like, what makes our lives, like, meaningful and what is the right thing to do and how to spend our time here? And I felt like philosophy felt so inaccessible, but when you just narrow it down to, like, storytelling, you can. You can really connect with so much of that. So I was applying to do my master's in philosophy, and then, as you've referred to him, my knucklehead boyfriend, one day when I was innocently getting changed, asked me why I didn't have any nice underwear. And I was like, you cheeky sod. I've got a whole drawer of Agent Fateur La Perla. Like, what are you talking about? Bear in mind, I'd been with him for, I think it was like four years by that point. So, like, those weren't coming out the drawer as much, but he was like, no, I'm in your Daily underwear. It's like granny panties. And then that kind of just was the moment that kind of changed everything. And yeah, it all tumbled from that.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah, it's interesting because we kind of came up in, I mean, you're younger than me, but I'd say like these generations around us came up in this era where Alexa Chung made it, put it really well. It's like we like purposefully made ourselves look less sexy or something. Like it was not okay to sexualize things like everyday underwear. Like, like, and there just weren't any options. Like it was like Victoria's Secret or, or lacy underwear or I used to wear Amazon cotton underwear. There wasn't a lot on the market that the. And the, the underwear. Can we talk a bit about? So, like, I want to hear about when. Why I. You. He said this to you? I assume you weren't immediately like, well, I'm going to start this very cute brand. Let's. I don't want to go too all over the place, but one thing I wanted to ask you, when you're looking at the imagery from the US and like, I'm into that. Who, what were, what would be on your mood board? Like, what movies and, and art and fashion and stuff were you into in that time?

[Rose Colcord]

Okay, so firstly what you said about that, you know, oh, I either had my lingerie on my granny panties was that. It wasn't like, oh, he said that. And then I was like, okay, I'm gonna start cuckoo. It was that same realization I, when I was like, oh, you know, what are you talking about? I've got a whole drawer of Agent La Perla.

[Nicola Hopkins]

Like, what?

[Rose Colcord]

What do you mean? And he said, no, I'm in your daily underwear. It's like granny panties. There was this realization of like, wait, he's so right, but where do I go? What else is there? And then I realized he had one drawer of like premium Calvin Klein's, which I was like, that's a cool brand. And then I had these two drawers of performative lingerie that I only wore to look sexy. Like, yes, sometimes there's a power in like wearing, you know, push up lacy lingerie, like for yourself. I'm like, also all into that. Like, I still have some Asian folk tour pieces, but I came to feel that, that the dichotomy between those two drawers really represented a choice that as women we have to make every day between am I going to feel sexy and not comfortable or am I going to feel comfortable and not beautiful? And I feel, I felt like that was so backwards. Because I really believe that as women, we feel our most comfortable, we feel our most peaceful when we're our most comfortable. And I who's on the mood board is people who inspire me. And when I was thinking at the time, okay, Virginia Woolf, Joan Didion, there's no way Virginia Woolf wrote A Room of One's Own in sequined push up hot pink bra and like synthetic scratchy, like lingerie. She, she must to do, you know, your work, you need to feel comfortable and feel confident. So that experience is what I recognized. And I was like, okay, how can I make a product that really bridges that gap between not just those two drawers, but everything that represents? And I also felt at the time that I wasn't wearing bras anymore. Now that gravity has taken its hold after having a baby, I do. But I was like, bras aren't as much what they were like. Women of that generation, my generation at the time, I felt like it wasn't really about lingerie. It was more comfort driven, so tank tops and all of that. And so when I started Cuckoo, it was who was on the mood board. Going roundabout was. I mean, people who have really kind of come more into culture recently. I'd say Jane Barkin just represented this sense of like effortless femininity that I wanted Cuckoo to represent the work of John Cassette bell hooks and then a lot of baby clothing, like a lot of nostalgic baby clothes were. And that's where the pointelle came about was it had this element of nostalgia to it, but that I felt could be redefined for the modern woman. And so we launched with pointelle and that was our first fabric base.

[Lauren Sherman]

So I want to hear about how you decided to like, get into business. And maybe the thing that I'm interested in from writing about Victoria's Secret, I know that the lingerie market and the way you produce bras, first of all, it's really hard to construct a bra, especially an underwire bra, which you just started doing. But there's like a million different parts. And there are also the market used to be like, I believe in like Germany and Switzerland, a lot of production. And then they moved a lot of it to Sri Lanka with Victoria's Secret, did a lot of that. And now there are a lot of factories there. But the A, it's not like super. It's not like a T shirt where you can just get that made anywhere. And then B, it's a very interesting market because there aren't that many players compared to fashion. But once Someone buys a bra, they stick with the company forever. You could same wear the same brand for 20 years. So again, this is too many questions, but I'm very excited about this topic. Well, let's start with why did you finally decide to do it? Like what, what was the turning point?

[Rose Colcord]

The turning point for me was, and I'm mutually as excited by the way, because not many, I'm like, not many people are so, you know, familiar with the market as you. I've listened to. Although I haven't yet read the book. Although it.

[Lauren Sherman]

I really have to. You really don't have to. I swear to God I will have.

[Rose Colcord]

I am going to and I'm gonna email you when I have and be so over enthused.

[Lauren Sherman]

I've read like three books since a kid. That was five years ago.

[Rose Colcord]

The only way I've got through reading books is to stop watching tv. Like I don't.

[Lauren Sherman]

I do a lot of audio.

[Rose Colcord]

Yeah.

[Lauren Sherman]

Because it's just, it's tough. It's tough to get through a chapter

[Rose Colcord]

before knocking out and falling asleep. I probably get through like two pages a night anyway. So what made me finally decide to do it? So I noticed that as I basically noticed that I wanted it. I was like, I want firstly a product that makes me feel comfortable. I want organic cotton essentials and everyday intimates that make me feel comfortable without feeling like I'm wearing like granny panties or, you know, M and S vests. Like, I want to feel put together and comfortable and confident in my everyday pieces because that's always been my style. Like, I love like vintage. But I will, I'll take a whole suitcase. I just took a whole suitcase to New York for a pop up of like cute stuff. I've got vintage and Levi's and a bunch of Cuckoo. And I literally just wore my Levi's and my Cuckoo and like, like ballet flats. Like that is all I wear. That's my uniform. But I realized that I want, I needed that product as a consumer. But also that I felt like at the time, honestly, the definition of femininity, the image of what it meant to look like and be a woman had really impacted me and my confidence growing up. And I was still carrying that into my 20s. How I related to my body, how I never felt enough, never felt pretty enough, cool enough, charismatic enough, skinny enough, confident enough xyz. And that is a universal like women, you know, I know I'm not alone in that. And I felt that there was this gap for a brand that reclaimed that narrative away from being so being voyeuristic and defining what it looks like to be a woman from companies that are run by men. And I was like, there's this other version of femininity that I felt women wanted to embody more, that was more real and undone and unpolished. We don't use Photoshop. We used only female photographers. Like, these are all extremely intentional choices at Cuckoo. And yeah, I was like, okay, there's a cultural need and a brand world that I want to live in that I don't yet see. So I kind of want to try create it. A brand that represented these values of quality over quantity and like this idea that every day is worth wearing your favorites, not just special occasions. That's really the, like a core philosophy of Cuckoo is, is how you live today is how you live your life. That first choice you make every day can set the tone for it. And, and then the product piece. And I was like, I want both of these. And then I spoke to my professor. I was in the middle of applying for my masters in philosophy and I was like to him and I told him about the brand idea we had. We, we got like very like close. And he was like, you're not going to make an impact in the classroom. Brands tell stories and brands have the power to shift cultural narratives. And there's a narrative you want to shift from your experience. So give it a go. And if it all goes tits up, excuse the pun, you can always come back and do this later. So I've always got a backup plan.

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[Lauren Sherman]

And so when you started to look into, like, how to make a pair of underwear, what did you find?

[Rose Colcord]

Yeah, so I had no experience. I didn't even know where to start. But where I did know what to do first was to. I started with just buying a bunch of every single underwear, every single soft bralette and, like, camisoles I bought. And I made notes of what I liked about it. If anything digged even a touch, it would be like, in the no pile. Women are so loyal with their bras and bralettes. Like, if they love one, they'll come back forever. But same with underwear. Like, if someone puts on an underwear and it digs, like, they are never going back.

[Lauren Sherman]

It's so true. I thought for a long time I just thought it was me. I was like, I guess other people don't mind when their underwear digs and it's just me.

[Rose Colcord]

No, no, no, no, no. What's been so interesting about the product development with Cuckoo is we almost like, develop through a lens of being so attuned with our, like, attuned with our. How we perceive our bodies and how we feel in our bodies and, like, what, you know, how we feel when something digs in. So, yeah, but where did I start was through market research, saying what I liked, what I didn't like, what I liked about this, what I liked about that. I started making notes on notes on notes. And then when I was finally ready and clear on the pieces that I wanted, the silhouettes, the shapes, I reached out to, I googled sustainable underwear developer in London and found this woman who came from Agent Vocateur and the parlour Shout Out Nicola Hopkins, who wanted. Who I wanted to develop these pieces with me. And I literally had to pitch her because she was like, no, no, I just do lingerie. You don't need me and my expertise. Like, if you're doing daily underwear and tank tops and camisoles here, like, I can help you find a couple factories and use. You can use their blocks. You don't need my expertise or anyone's to develop daily underwear. Like, that's just not. And I literally had to pitch her over a month. I was trying to get this woman. Cause I was like, this is. I think people have, like, done it since, but it was really the first time. Well, I can't say that. But she was like, it's not done. Applying lingerie principles to daily underwear. I was like, well, let's do it then. And I had to kind of share with her this idea of cuckoo. That it was giving the same value to our daily underwear that has only historically been applied to lingerie. That's just for, you know, a Friday night and performative. And so that's where I started was with finding the expert. And I worked with her on our first three pieces, which are still three of our bestsellers today.

[Lauren Sherman]

It's amazing. And so what year did you. Did you launch?

[Rose Colcord]

We launched at the extreme end of 2021, early 2022.

[Lauren Sherman]

Wow. So just primed for, like, still people buying stuff, but not totally still at home. So they're thinking about. And I do feel like, I don't know. This was also the time that I was researching and writing the book. So, like, I had a baby. I started writing a book about underwear. I started shopping for underwear constantly because I was like, my body's changing because I had a baby. And then also the thing you mentioned about women not wearing bras, I think it was also, like, just wearing wireless bras. And I post this is not even have anything to do with changes in my body, to be honest. I don't want to, like, go into this too much. No one wants to hear about it, but I started wearing underwire bras again for, like, the first time in years. And it was. It was more about. I just, like, suddenly was like, I. I think I want to wear underwire bras again. I thought I would never wear one again. But there was something happening in the culture when you launch, like, the underwire bras. The were sort of coming back. People were. And people were sort of starting to pay attention again to their underwear. What do you think it was? Do you think it was like a post Covid thing or. I mean, that was the middle of COVID Do you think it was a pandemic thing where people are at home more so they're just, like, paying attention to what they wear to, like, on their body, closer to their bodies? Like, what do you think that was happening? That made it a prime time for you to launch, or was it the fact that Victoria's Secret was sort of really dipping at that moment?

[Rose Colcord]

I think with the dip of, like, vs, there was almost a bit of, like, an existential crisis. Like, women were like, okay, well, now where do I go, you know, if that's not resonating with me anymore, if I don't go to Victoria's Secret, where does one go? And when I asked all my friends, where do you buy your underwear and bras? It was always Amazon or Marks and Spencer's. And I think what was interesting was that there were these one. You know, as consumers, we build our identities through the brands we associate ourselves with and the things that we buy. So with the decline of these, you know, who dominated the market previously, customers were like, okay, well, now where do I land? Where do I go? And they were going, you know, to Amazon, Marks and Spencer's target, these bigger, fast, you know, fast fashion giants that had no sense of identity for them. And I think that intimates are so. Are political. It's bodies, it's identity. And I think that that's part of it was, okay, you know, where do I go now that that's kind of declined. And I don't resonate with that ideal of femininity anymore. Yeah, I think that is it. And I think there was also, after the pandemic, more of a desire for comfort. It was just that became the priority was comfortable. And that's. Everything cuckoo represents is like, okay, we're comfort led. So. Yeah, yeah.

[Lauren Sherman]

And it's so interesting. It's like, I'm trying to figure out how to synthesize this, but it reminds me also of, like, this was the time that Alaia became popular. Like, there was this sort of. We had gone through a decade of really conservative clothing, and conservative ism is. Was like, just like surging in the culture, you know, during COVID It still is, obviously, and. But then there was this part of, I think you're right about, like, the reclaiming of it's okay to want to, like, look attractive. Whereas I think there was an era that it was almost like you weren't supposed to make any effort to look pretty. Like, you were supposed to, like, you were pretty or you weren't, or you were like, really hoey or you were, you know, really conservative. And something flipped where suddenly, like, looking a little sexy was actually acceptable and encouraged and like this, like, almost like a reclaiming of that stuff. And then at the same time, all the Victoria's Secret stuff was happening, and they were and it's interesting now. I'm curious what you think if, like, because they have sort of really shifted their. Changed their narrative in a way that I think is really convincing. But at the time, they were trying really hard to be woke or whatever. And, like, I remember they did some podcast advertising, not with me, obviously, but with other people, where they actually use the word woke. And I was just like, this is so bad. And also that stuff was so ugly. I feel like I. For many years, and I still think there's a lot of room in this market. Like, there are not that many. I buy a lot of stuff from you. I buy Yasmin Aslami, which I love, and I buy, like, a little bit of Eris, but I think Eris could be a million times better than it is. But I think, like, there was just not many options. It felt very dated. Like, there was just nothing to make yourself look good and feel cute, especially for every day. When you launched, like, what was the initial reaction? And did you start selling out of stuff really quickly? I know you mentioned the US Market is big for you. I remember buying some stuff very early on and being surprised of, like, how it, like, all the fabric so natural and everything. Like, it's. It's. It's not like it didn't feel overdone. It felt, like, very special. All the things you were. You were making, what was when you first hit, like, what took off, and were you surprised? I'm sure that it started selling really fast, really, really quickly. Yeah.

[Rose Colcord]

So I think the pendulum swung the other way. Like, I was part of that where it was like, okay, I don't want to be all polished and, like, have to be perfect all the time like that. And then, you know, was like, okay, I'm just not gonna like that. Like, I'm not gonna, you know, try. And it was cool not to try and. And all of that. But then I realized, which I think is from my experience and then I think is also reflected in the wider, you know, maybe other women will relate to is I was like, wait, I don't feel good on this side either. Like, and it's like, you know, now I don't wear a full face makeup. I don't remember the last time I wore foundation or bronzer. But, like, I like a bit of lip liner and a little eyelash curl. Like, that's the equivalent of cuckoo. You know, it's. If Victoria's Secret is Mac, like, cuckoo is maybe, like, say, beauty or what glossier was in that turn of the beauty industry. And yeah, like what you were saying with the materials was always really intentional from the beginning because fundamentally I wanted this brand and this product to be for women and to make women feel a bit more comfortable and cute and bettering themselves in their everyday lives. Not on the dates and the special occasions, but every day. And just like even with our content and with our creative, it's like I just want to make, you know, I just want to make women feel a bit more inspired or to recognize something in themselves in our creative and our imagery. But when it came to picking on materials, I did so much research and organic cotton is just the best. You know, it's like number one gynecologist recommended. And also I'm a big advocate for like climate change. I feel like since I had my daughter, that's even more, you know, in my consciousness. And with organic cotton, that also takes accountability for the life cycle of our intimates and daily underwear, which is the one thing, you know, not going to resell on depop or buy invest layer collective. Like I, I never, I, I personally never would have gone into like, I, I never would have made a fashion brand. Like we don't need more blazers and more dresses, we can buy those vintage. But I was like, okay, these are the one, one thing that does need to be reproduced and reproduced. So how can we make it have as little impact as possible? And organic cotton ticked both those boxes of like best for women, best for our skin, non toxic, no synthetics, no microplastics which have become so much more people have become so much aware of. But it also reduce the environmental impact of these garments that no one's really like thought about before. But yeah, I think when we launched what I'd done was as I was developing the brand, I started posting all my mood images on Instagram, like a mood account. I would share photos of like book quotes that I felt resonated with the values of the brand. I was building mood images of like the pointale being developed, Jane Buck and John Cassatt or literally all of those images onto Instagram. So I built this following up to probably 5,000 followers that people thought it was a mood account. So by the time that I launched the brand and the product, I think people had this emotional attachment to it as more than a product. It was like, oh, this is a way of being and a philosophy in a way. And so I think that sensibility attached to it is what kind of created the foundations that we've had the growth from.

[Lauren Sherman]

How did you approach retail? Did you have any Wholesale in the beginning or did you do. Did you start with direct? I've shopped you at Le Bon Marche, which was helpful. There's a small selection there, but it was helpful because then I just ordered a bunch of stuff.

[Rose Colcord]

We have more coming. We have a big pop up at Le Bon Marche this holiday exclusive.

[Lauren Sherman]

I can't wait.

[Rose Colcord]

You had it here fast.

[Lauren Sherman]

I can't wait. Well, exclusif. Exclusif is if we were saying it in French exclusive. If we work to page six, but we don't.

[Rose Colcord]

I was so curious why. Why you're in, like, what. What takes you to Paris? And I'm. I'm also so curious. I wanted to ask, like, what made you so curious about Victoria's Secret?

[Lauren Sherman]

These are two great questions that I will indulge. Even though people are gonna be like, she talked too much about herself and her stupid underwear collection in this. This episode. The first answer is, my husband and kid both have EU passports, so we have the ability to live abroad. And I have been going to Paris on and off for my whole career at least twice a year. In 2019, we spent four months in Paris and really loved it, my husband and I. But I was trying to get pregnant and was like, I can't be. I went to a doctor there, and she's like, you just need to calm down. Which has ended up being true. No person who's trying to get pregnant wants to hear that. But, like, I went home, Covid happened, and I got pregnant and we moved to la. When I started this shop, I started coming to Europe even more. And my husband and I were like, let's do second grade in Paris. Because he speaks French. We just thought it would be fun. And then before my kid started kindergarten, we were like, well, maybe we should just do a few months to try it. And then we got here and we're like, oh, we're just gonna stay. So we're gonna stay for now. And because we can, like, it's totally legal, and we're gonna. We'll probably spend the summers in LA and. And Paris and be in Paris the rest of the time also. It's, like, extremely affordable. It's way more affordable than New York. And to be honest, like, I cover the luxury industry every single business. It used to be when I lived in New York there, I was just with someone who. Who is really involved in the industry here. And I said, look, like, when I started 20 years ago, there were still tons of people, big businesses in America, and they're still Tapestry and Coach but like, they're not really fashion companies. That's like a different kind of business. And the industry has consolidated in Paris and, and Milan. And so it just feels like we want to be in a city. It's way more affordable here than. Than New York. I think with Brexit, it's brought a lot of interesting people here. And I don't know. We were just. My husband and I, this is one of the reasons we only have one kid.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Because.

[Lauren Sherman]

Because we wanted to, like, do these kinds of things. I have no idea how long we'll stay, but we're. We're in it. And then on Victoria's Secret, I have to be honest with you. I don't have a deep interest in Victoria's Secret.

[Rose Colcord]

I don't have a deep interest in underwear. People are like, oh, you must be so passionate about underwear. I'm like, I'm not actually passionate about underwear. No.

[Lauren Sherman]

But, like, honestly, what it did do was it made me more interested in the business of. Basically I had covered it on and off. The thing I really don't care about at all is models and Victoria's Secret. Like, a lot of the coverage was always about models. Like, I don't. They're cute. I don't care. I mean, I am obsessed with the Giselle Brian Malloy style Giselle covers of W magazine. This is why Sarah Moonves is. Is fashion's true editor in chief. But it's so good. But. But like, I. I had covered it on and off and I had been early to. Because of the Epstein connection to Les Wexner. And then also just like early on, I used to do when I worked at business of Fashion, some pretty deep investigative reporting and had started to do some stuff looking into Victoria's Secret pre. Everything that went down pre. I'd Razik and Chantal Fernandez, who is my colleague there, who now works at New York magazine. At one point she. I, like, had shared we were reporting partners on a lot of stuff. And I had shared that I. I had shared a source with her. And she called me after she talked to this person and said, you should really write a book about this. And I thought. I said to her, I was like, you can't write a book, a big corporate book like this anymore by yourself. Do you want to just do it together? And so. And it was Covid. And we were bored. And then of course, I got pregnant, like the minute we started writing the proposal. But. But yeah, honestly, it was a thing of. I don't write about it every single day. And I felt like it was a thing I could go into, really learn the whole thing and then get out. Whereas, like, LVMH or Caring or Chanel or Hermes, like, I probably will write a book about one of those companies someday, but, like, I'm in that every single day. And it's. When you're a beat reporter, it's just a different game. But I think the good thing about writing this book about Victoria's Secret is, like, I have a really good sense now of what they're doing and have been able to judge what Hillary super is doing pretty, I think, fairly and. And I am impressed. Like, every time I'm like, she's not going to get it right. She's not going to get it right. She has done a good job running that business. But. But, yeah, it wasn't. I would say that, like, my interest, personal interest in underwear is never been this much. But a big reason for that is there wasn't anything cute that I liked. Like, I got. I think for my wedding, I had La Perla. A lot of these. These brands, they. They don't, like, really exist anymore in the same way either. And Eris, Erez or whatever, like, always felt too expensive. I don't want to, like, say rude things about your competitors, but, like, there's one that is very cool that might have been in Lost in Translation, that I love the brand, but they don't fit. Like, it just. The bras don't fit, the underwear don't fit. Like, it's so. Or not me. At least. So, like, there wasn't a lot. And now it feels like there's more options. And Cuckoo is. Is at the top of that list, I think. Do you sell. I don't know if you sell to this shop in. In Echo park in La Boudoir? Yes. Do you sell there?

[Rose Colcord]

We're in conversations with them.

[Lauren Sherman]

I. She's amazing. When that store first opened, I didn't even think about going in because I was like, it's gonna all be, like, stuff that doesn't fit right. And that is like. And now I shop there all the time because there are these brands, and I think there's opportunities for more. Like, I look at the really high end of the market, and I had this conversation with Gabriella Hirsch. She was like, do you think people would buy it if I made underwear? I said yes. At the really high end of the market, the only super fancy thing that doesn't feel tacky is Eris. And it's, like, not that good. So there's like they, they could do way better. So I, yeah, it just, I think like that's sort of the evolution of, of why I particularly wanted to have you on. And then also Phil Picardi's relaunch of Playboy. I thought like I, I thought it was interesting that you were involved. Like you, you had an ad in there and then also it spoke to this moment that I think you were sort of the pioneer on. Like we are all talking about paintings with underwear where you can see the butt crack like all the time and photographs that look like that. But you were sort of at the like front of that cultural movement that it required quite a bit of sensitivity to kind of key into that at the time that you did.

[Rose Colcord]

I mean, yeah, like, well, firstly that. Thank you for saying that and recognize. I mean like I'll take the compliment. Phil and Marie. I think what they've done with Playboy is really cool and it was so cool to have, you know, an ad page in there and to just naturally have been included in multiple of the shoots and stories. And I think, yeah, like you said the, I think it's that culture piece and cuckoo. It's you know, so hand in hand with that. But yeah, I mean I think, I think what they've done is, is really cool and hearing about that. You're not particularly passionate about Victoria's Secret, for example.

[Lauren Sherman]

No, like I didn't like it at all growing up. I was a gab body girl.

[Rose Colcord]

Me neither. Like with underwear. I'm not particularly passionate about underwear. But what I am passionate about is almost seeing it like a microcosm and expression for the female embodied experience and how, yeah how it, how it fits into culture.

[Nicola Hopkins]

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[Rose Colcord]

you say Cuckoo's at the top of that list. Like what, what is it for you, particularly with Cuckoo? That why it makes it up there?

[Lauren Sherman]

Well, I think it's a mix of like feminine and cool. It doesn't feel precious or like you use a lot of traditional materials and, and like pointelle or whatever or, or techniques. But it doesn't feel trad, like it feels, it feels specific to the person. And I think also you just, you know, with, with the art direction and all of that, like what you're doing and, and there's no. It has a real identity which is, is super hard to pull off with a brand new anytime. But especially in this market where there's just so much noise. I just really like the identity and it, I'm not like a girly girl, but it felt, it feels like there's a lot there that I like. I bought a lot of different pieces and different. And it feels like every time you introduce something more, I'm like, oh, I understand that. Like I'm not going to buy the print, but I have like every color underwear, that type of thing. And I think, yeah, I love it. I'm curious to know from your perspective as you get into more different types of like how much of what you're producing is driven by what you see is missing in the market at this point. Like slips, for instance. Like forever I was looking for slips and couldn't find them. Now they're starting to emerge and I just went to Vera Persiani and in Milan to buy a bunch of stuff but like you couldn't find a silk slip to save your life and you're, you do a lot in cotton but like how much of like the short sets and things like that have been driven by. Oh, I, there, there isn't anything like this on the market or customers asking for you. Like, how are you deciding how to build out the range?

[Rose Colcord]

Oh, this is such a loaded question. Because there's so many factors to it. Like there is so much noise. And I think what has contributed to Cuckoo and our success and being so clear on who we are is being so disciplined. Like it is so easy to look and be like, oh, they're doing that and that's working, that's cool. Why don't we do that? Oh, they're doing that. And when you get distracted by what other people are doing, and you leave your home base, someone else will take that home base. And I think from the beginning, I was so crystal clear on, like, Cuckoo is organic cotton essentials and everyday intimates. Like, if you aren't likely to find it in, you know, a vintage kind of old brocante. That's the extent to which we do intimate ready to wear. Like, anything that you see, you know, outside in Cuckoo. Like, all the girls in New York wearing Cuckoo out and about right now, it's either Arvina long sleeve or, you know, these pieces that have this versatility between, like, oh, is that intimate wear or is that outerwear? And it's like this fluidity that's really beautiful. So how do we decide? Number one is through being really disciplined on what makes a Cuckoo piece a cuckoo piece. Like, being so clear on that and, like, our design principles that we literally have written out and in the studio, it's everything from, you know, versatility to comfort to, you know, not requiring, like, dry cleaning and all these things. These things. But really, I'm so offline. Like, sometimes I worry about how I'm not on Instagram and not online. Like, I'm like, maybe I need to get. Maybe I need to get an Instagram or something to just stay attuned because I'm known by my friends and close ones, and even it's, like, embarrassing. Sometimes I'll meet people from the industry and they'll be like, oh, do you know this? Or know that person? And I'm like, no, no, no.

[Lauren Sherman]

But I think it's good.

[Rose Colcord]

Honestly, I went back and forth for a while, like, oh, do I need to stay in tune with what's going on? But I really trust that the people I'm around, what's important will filter through in conversation. And so how we're building out the range is literally by staying in touch with what I want. But also, the majority of my team were the Cuckoo customer. So I ask my team. I'm always going into even our finance women. I'm like, what do you think of this, Cami? You try it on. What do you think? And we do wear a trials with friends and friends of friends. But really, it's driven by what I feel like the only experience we ever really can know as our own. So I try stay attuned to that and hope that it resonates with others and trust that it does. And it has so far. So, yeah, we don't use any. I'm like, so again, when we were looking to, oh, like, what can AI do? It's like, oh, trend forecasting. And like, that is like the last thing I would ever, ever use is trend forecasting.

[Lauren Sherman]

So, yeah, look, I think from a creative perspective, look, researching on Instagram is only helps people who get off on that. If you don't, if it doesn't fuel you, it's not worth it. I think the only reason to be on there is for. I was actually talking about this with a really big designer who's not on there, and he's like, should I be on there? And I was like, no. Like, if. If you feel an urge, great. I think it's helpful. Like, your team needs to be on there to see what, like, how to like market your stuff. But they, they can do that. You don't have to. I think you're. Because, like, look, even the silhouette of the underwear that you're making is like exactly the right thing. Like, right now I'm seeing a lot more of this, like, not a thong, but not a brief where it's like a really high cut in the back, which I think is great. And you do a great version of that.

[Rose Colcord]

The Brazilian.

[Lauren Sherman]

The Brazilian. And I think, like, that I'm seeing in at a lot of different brands, but you're doing it in the way that's only you. And I think, like, you don't need to be like, doing a mood board on there for sure. It's highly, highly unnecessary at this point.

[Rose Colcord]

I think, like, to be. I do, I do. Still, I'm very involved with what we post. Like, I am like, I, you know, with my girl. Like, we, you know, I'm very in the Instagram, but I don't look at it like I post. I see it like, you know, it's our primary channel for sure. But I have my best, like, ideas through meeting other women, being curious about how they're feeling, what they're going through. Like, oh, you're wearing that.

[Nicola Hopkins]

What.

[Rose Colcord]

You know, I'm interested in what women are wearing in real life, like, in front of me. And I feel like I have my best ideas when I'm on a run. I have like a thing I can like verbalize and into my notes all through reading. But just being engaged with the world, like, I find I find screens really energy sucking. So as. Yeah, I'm happy to say to feel confident that Instagram doesn't do it for me.

[Nicola Hopkins]

It really.

[Rose Colcord]

It brings a lot of inspiration to a lot of other people, though. I know. But for me, I. It doesn't work that way.

[Lauren Sherman]

Rose, what do you want to do? I have to run soon. But what do you want to do next? Or, or what is what's next for. For Cuckoo? Do you want to open? I know you've done some pop ups. Do you think you'll do like a permanent store? And what would that look like if it were up to you?

[Rose Colcord]

Yeah. What's next for Cuckoo? I feel like this is genuinely just the beginning. Like to me, I'm so proud with where we've come, but to me this literally feels like the beginning. I want Cuckoo to become the go to premium everyday essentials and organic cotton intimates brand for the new generation of women. And I want it to be the. I want stores. I dream of stores. I dream of one in New York first, probably. I dream of one in la, I dream of one in Paris so that, you know, let's say one of your peers was coming to Fashion Week in Paris and God forbid their suitcase got lost and it was gonna come in like a couple days, delivered to that hotel or whatever. They'll be like, okay, thank God I'm wearing my 501 jeans, I can just hop to Cuckoo, grab a three pack thong, a two pack baby tee, and I'm like, sat for like the next couple days. I want Cuckoo to be accessible in that way. I want it to be. I think retail's really important. I'm offline, so I feel like our customer is craving being offline more and more. I'm noticing my friends are like deleting their Instagram, so I'm like, let's meet her where she is, number one. I think like you, you were like, I'm going to go to La Bonne Marche to try on files and then you got a bunch of stuff on the site. I think people want to feel the fabric. You know, sometimes I think customers won't really get why we're premium priced over, you know, other competitors right now. But really it's down to like the fabric quality and people want to, you know, know what size they are and know that the underwear is not going to dig in and the length of the tanks and all that kind of thing. But more so Cuckoo is a world like, and it's a philosophy. And you know, our pop up that we have right now, for example, yeah, there's, you know, our product, but there's also a Cuckoo library of, of books like essential Readings curated by me that have really shaped how I've thought and saw the brand. And so I want to create a world that represents, you know, everything. Cuckoo is beyond just a place to Come in and shop. Like, I want somewhere that makes memories. I always used to go to Rigby and Pella here in London with my mum and just remember sitting in those changing rooms for hours. And I have so many memories with my mum in those changing rooms and I'm like, I just want to make those memories. And I was speaking with someone about, about my vision for the store. Even though we don't have a store, I'm like, I call it the store.

[Lauren Sherman]

You will soon, I'm sure, soon.

[Rose Colcord]

And they were like, oh yeah. And the changing room is like where you go with your lover. I'm like, it's not so much your lover, it was a guy. And I was like, less so your lover is more like your daughter, your sister, your best friend. So yeah, that's what I hope for, for Cuckoo is that this is just the beginning and we continue to make good product, great product, perfect product that women can consistently come back to reliably to feel comfortable in their everyday.

[Lauren Sherman]

You know, the. The first Victoria's Secret was open so that guys would be comfortable going in to buy stuff for their wives. So things have like really evolved since. And Rose, this was so fun. I can't wait to meet you in person and congratulations on everything. I love it. It's so great. Final question. How's the underwire bra been? Because you just launched that, like, what has the feedback been? I was really excited about it.

[Rose Colcord]

So our teacup bra is one of our like top. Let's become in our top five bestsellers.

[Lauren Sherman]

Amazing. It.

[Rose Colcord]

It has been hard because we weren't able to by proper bra sizing and also then this weird like thing of. Do women even know their bra size?

[Lauren Sherman]

They don't. So I was gonna say, like, honestly, I think it's okay.

[Rose Colcord]

Yeah, it's.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah.

[Rose Colcord]

So what we've settled on now is we're going in. We wanted to see if like the Cuckoo girl woman would even buy an underwired bra, which she does. Like that shift you said has happened. So now we're expanding it to for examp, extra small plus small plus medium plus. Because when we did some like research, like with friends and friends, we do like kind of like group research sessions. It was like no one knew their actual bra size. Like am I 34D, blah blah blah. It was like, oh, I'm a small waist but like a bigger bust. And so the translation of that is small plus. So to answer your question, it's going really well and I'm excited to refine the sizing for you. Know. Know the women who are not just like, a cookie cutter, small or medium

[Lauren Sherman]

or large or extra large, which no one is like. And that's the interesting thing about bras. They're like jeans. Like, it's hard to get it exactly right. And. And I. Which is why I think, like, the small, medium, extra large, and. And then if you add, like, a little in between, it's. It's just as well because, like, I'm a different bra size than many brands. Like, that's the thing about. And no one really knows. I worked at Victoria's Secret for, like, three weeks in college, and I remember that I was like, bra fitting. I was like, I don't know what I'm doing. They're like, yeah, just do that. Anyway, we talked too long, but it was such a pleasure. I can't wait to meet you in person. Congratulations on everything. It looks really great, and I love it. I love wearing them, and it's fun to just to see you rise. So congratulations.

[Rose Colcord]

Thanks, Lauren. I'm actually going to be in Paris in a month, so I'll hit you up when I'm coming. And thanks for just making this so easy and being so warm and making me feel so comfortable.

[Lauren Sherman]

Of course. Maybe we can go to a pilates class.

[Jill Schlesinger]

Yeah.

[Lauren Sherman]

Okay. We'll do it.

[Nicola Hopkins]

Okay.

[Lauren Sherman]

Okay. Rose, this was awesome. We'll talk soon. Congrats on you.

[Rose Colcord]

Thank you, Lauren.

[Lauren Sherman]

Fashion People is a presentation of Odyssey in partnership with Puck. The show is produced and edited by Molly Nugent. Special thanks to Puck co founder John Kelly, executive editor Ben Landy, producer Maya Tribbit, and director of editorial operations, Gabby Grossman. An additional thanks to the team at Odyssey, Kelly Turner and Bob Tabador.