Suit Up

Summary

Fashion People — Daniela Kallmeyer’s Lesbian Chic

Host: Lauren Sherman
Guest: Daniela Kallmeyer (founder & designer, Kallmeyer)
Date: March 6, 2026

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Overview

This episode offers a deep dive into Daniela Kallmeyer’s journey as an independent New York-based designer, her South African roots, the philosophy behind her namesake brand, and the dynamic of "lesbian chic" in luxury fashion. Host Lauren Sherman explores how Kallmeyer's razor-sharp tailoring, distinct pricing, and queer perspective have carved out a new, inclusive space in the American fashion landscape. The conversation spans from her early immersion in arts and costume to strategic retail growth, creative philosophy, the realities of launching with minimal funding, and the impact of increased queer visibility in fashion.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Roots, Family, and Early Influences

• South African background and upbringing in D.C.:
  • Kallmeyer’s family immigrated from South Africa; she grew up in the D.C. suburbs but spent summers in New York with her grandmother, who taught her to sew.
  • “My grandparents, when they immigrated to America, moved to Riverdale in the Bronx...my grandmother would teach me how to sew in the summers.” (06:10)
• Interest in fashion and costume:
  • Early blend of theater, figure skating, and costume design—her creative roots aren’t purely fashion.
  • “Probably until I graduated high school and had my first internship in the city and realized that fashion and costume are different. I sort of blended them together and learned to sew for all the same reasons.” (09:20)

2. The London Years: Education and Competitiveness

• Studying at London College of Fashion—versus Central Saint Martins:
  • Learned tailoring mastery, fabric, and draping.
  • Highly competitive environment; focus not just on shows but long-term career.
  • “There was, like, competition within competition within competition...but my sights were set beyond just the show being, like, the end goal.” (12:37)
• Internship at Alexander McQueen (McQ Launch):
  • Somber but formative atmosphere, instilled a respect for craft and precision.
  • “There was sort of like a silence that made space for [Alexander] to think about what you were presenting...very valuable for me as a young person.” (14:53)

3. Return to New York: Personal Motivations and the Business Reality

• Family ties and coming home after her grandmother’s passing.
• First jobs:
  • Worked wherever she could find work: Alice + Olivia, QVC/HSN, design for National Geographic, and more—gained an understanding of different consumer bodies and needs.
• Launching Kallmeyer in 2012:
  • Did it all on her own with $7,000 saved from waitressing.
  • “I made the patterns myself. In many cases, I sewed the samples myself. I was working in my Upper West Side apartment...I really put my ego behind the vision for the brand.” (24:02)
  • Leveraged personal relationships—her first boss at the Food Hall later found her retail space.

4. Bootstrapping, Trunk Shows & Brand Building

• Finding first customers:
  • Walked into boutiques and cold-called, started with one skirt, two dresses, then three suits—“it really was like that for many years.”
  • Trunk shows on the Upper East Side led to breakthrough sales—customers overlooked by traditional wholesale came directly.
  • “I sold more in like a four or five day trunk show than I did in like three seasons of...wholesaling.” (25:17)

5. Brand Vision, Pricing, and Philosophy

• "For All": An inclusive luxury brand:
  • Sought to create beautiful, lasting, designer-caliber clothes accessible in style and price—filling a gap between “contemporary,” mass market, and intimidating luxury.
  • “I have a tailoring background. I approach the brand as a designer with a luxury mindset. But...I’m able to make decisions about a target price point.” (27:07)
  • Clothes designed for elegance, quality, not trend or status—deep focus on fit, feel, and confidence.
  • “Just make a beautiful designer brand. That’s not about trend, it’s not about prints...I just wanted, like, a perfectly cut trouser and a beautiful shirt.” (28:07)

6. Retail Expansion and World-Building

• Opening her first store (Orchard St, NYC):
  • Poured all she had into it—built fixtures herself, created an immersive brand experience.
  • “World building allowed people to see what the clothes meant in situ and, like, how it felt like wardrobing.” (31:12)
• On the "feeling" of her clothes:
  • The design’s success lies not just in the look but in wearer experience—movement, gesture, subtle confidence.
  • “I really do put so much into how do these clothes feel? How do they fall off of a real body?...it’s about, like, how they live and, like, come to life on a person.” (32:40)

7. Wholesale, Sellouts, and Selectivity

• Strategic launches on Net-a-Porter, Goop, Moda Operandi, and select boutiques:
  • Small, curated buys led to frequent sell-outs, creating buzz and demand.
  • A self-funded, non-wasteful approach to sustainability—focus on longevity and avoiding surplus.
  • “We’re a self-funded brand so...we also approach sustainability differently. I think about sustainability as like non-wastefulness, clothes that can exist in every situation in your life...things sell out and it creates like a really good momentum.” (35:03)

8. Queer Visibility, “Lesbian Chic,” and Representation

• Navigating “lesbian chic” and queer media coverage:
  • Recently won the Human Rights Campaign Visibility Award; reflected on the New York Times profile “Lesbian Chic for All”.
  • Emphasizes inclusivity: “I’m more honored that there is representation and unity that is implied in the words for all...it’s not just queer women...everybody wants to be seen.” (39:26)
  • Describes dressing a diverse clientele—queer couples, powerhouse moms, anyone seeking to feel seen and strong.
  • “I’m not a queer brand. I’m a queer designer.” (41:12)

9. On Showing at New York Fashion Week and Brand Partnerships

• Fashion Week presentations:
  • Initially took a break from Runway, then returned—now centers hospitality and brand experience.
  • Recent, organic partnership with Starbucks as part of supporting creative labor and community.
  • “My team is literally fueled by Starbucks right now on our third day of Style Out...it makes a lot of sense.” (43:13)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

“I just, I wanted to work. So I got to New York. It was hard to find a job, so I would work anywhere...I just kept doing it. I didn’t let anybody tell me that it was not good enough...one person wanting one skirt was enough for me.”
—Daniela Kallmeyer, (19:34, 24:02)

“Everybody wants to be seen. And I do think that that ends up translating in our clothes...I’m not a queer brand. I’m a queer designer.”
—Daniela Kallmeyer, (39:26, 41:12)

“World building allowed people to see what the clothes meant in situ...when you put it in a wardrobe that really makes sense for women or for people who can identify with it, then you start putting the puzzle pieces together.”
—Daniela Kallmeyer, (31:12)

“It’s not about trend, it’s not about prints...I just wanted, like, a perfectly cut trouser and a beautiful shirt without feeling like you were going to work.”
—Daniela Kallmeyer, (28:07)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 06:10 — Learning to sew from her grandmother; NYC roots
• 09:20 — Blending costume and fashion; theater & skating background
• 12:37 — London College of Fashion: culture and competitiveness
• 14:53 — McQueen internship: lessons on creativity & tailoring
• 17:45 — Coming home to New York after her grandmother’s passing
• 19:34-24:02 — Founding Kallmeyer with $7,000; doing everything herself
• 25:17 — Trunk shows and direct customer feedback
• 27:07-28:07 — Defining the brand’s vision, mission, and price strategy
• 31:12, 32:40 — Opening her first store and the immersive approach
• 35:03 — Wholesale, sellouts & sustainability philosophy
• 39:26-41:12 — Queer visibility and "lesbian chic for all"
• 43:13 — Starbucks partnership and New York Fashion Week

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Conclusion

This episode is an honest, detail-rich narrative of perseverance, precision, and perspective. Daniela Kallmeyer’s story is layered: one part technical mastery, one part fierce independence, all filtered through the lens of being a queer woman in luxury American fashion. The conversation, peppered with wit and candor, provides not only industry insight but a refreshing look at how queerness can be both a foundational influence and a universal invitation for all to feel seen.

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For listeners seeking the behind-the-scenes reality of building a brand, inclusivity beyond buzzwords, and what “next-gen” American luxury sounds like, this is essential listening.

Transcript

[Lauren Sherman]

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[Daniella Kalmeier]

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[Lauren Sherman]

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[Daniella Kalmeier]

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[Lauren Sherman]

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[Daniella Kalmeier]

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[Lauren Sherman]

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[Daniella Kalmeier]

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[Lauren Sherman]

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[Daniella Kalmeier]

Hello and welcome to Fashion People. I'm Lauren Sherman, writer of Cluck's Fashion and Beauty Memo Line Sheet and today with me on the show is Daniella Kalmeier, founder and designer of Kalmier. We're talking starting a brand from scratch. The European system versus the American system, Lesbian chic for all and so much more. Before we get going, I wanted to remind you that if you like this podcast, you'll definitely love Puck where I send an email called Line Sheet. If you're a fashion person, you get that Reference it's an original look at what's really going on inside the fashion and beauty industries. Line sheet is scoopy, analytical and above all, fun. Along with me, a subscription to Puck gains you access to an unmatched roster of experts reporting on powerful people and companies in entertainment, media, sports, politics, finance, the art world and much more. If you're interested listeners of Fashion People get a discount. Just go to Puck News FashionPeople to join Puck or start a free trial. Happy Friday everyone.

[Lauren Sherman]

Hope you are having a great week. It's been a pretty nice one in Paris.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

The weather is truly amazing.

[Lauren Sherman]

The shows have been good and also bad.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

But I will say that I feel

[Lauren Sherman]

less dire than I typically do at

[Daniella Kalmeier]

this moment in the Fashion Week cycle. There haven't been as many ups and downs. I felt like physically not well in Milan and then here felt pretty good.

[Lauren Sherman]

I don't know, maybe I'm at a

[Daniella Kalmeier]

different moment in my life where I don't get as upset about this stuff, but it's been fun. Anyway, I have two very special guests on Monday's episode to discuss Paris.

[Lauren Sherman]

But let's just say that Tom Ford was a fabulous show to me, the best of the season.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

But Dior and A Liar were also very good.

[Lauren Sherman]

Especially Dior. I also love Dries Van Noten and Marie. Adam Leonard and I had a really great time at Isabel Marant on Thursday night. So more to come on all that stuff this week.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

In Line Sheet I look at products

[Lauren Sherman]

plan for Versace and Malik Morris, our Line Sheet correspondent is back with a scoop on Net a Porter layoffs. Net a Porte, Net a Porter. You decide.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

Today is Loewe and Sunday is Celine,

[Lauren Sherman]

Hermes and much more. I'm excited to meet Plum Sykes in real life on Sunday. More to come and have a great weekend. Let's get going with Daniela. And big thanks again to Starbucks for not only sponsoring Daniela's show but sponsoring this podcast that we did.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

It was super fun.

[Lauren Sherman]

I look forward to working with them more and I think you'll enjoy this conversation.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

Daniella Kallmeier welcome to Fashion People.

Thank you for having me.

What'd you have for breakfast this morning?

Oh, actually I had a Starbucks egg and spinach wrap.

That is the best wrap.

It's the best wrap.

I've been eating it for I think 15 years. I hope they never take it off the menu. The tortilla is so good.

So good, so healthy. Perfect amount of protein.

It's really, really good.

That wasn't even a plug. That's genuinely what I had this morning, it's so good.

I also like the egg bites, but the feta wrap, I've honestly 20 years. I've been eating it since I used to go to the 14th street when I would come down from Washington Heights on the A and go to the 14th Street Starbucks on the way to Forbes on Fifth Avenue.

That's like when you're looking into the case at Starbucks and you're like, there's a cake bite and there's an egg wrap, and the egg wrap is going to satisfy me.

It's true. I mean, eggs are the perfect protein. As we've said on fashion, people many times go, eggs. So where did. Did you. You didn't grow up in New York, did you?

No, I grew up out. My family's from South Africa and we immigrated here when I was a baby. And I grew up in the D.C. area in the suburbs. But my grandparents, when they immigrated to America, moved to Riverdale in the Bronx. Oh, cool. So I really felt connected to New York for a very long time. I used to spend my summers here since I was 10, 12 years old. My grandmother would teach me how to sew in the summers. I would take dance intensive courses in the city. So when I went away to school in London, I used to say, I'm going home to New York.

That's funny. What was it like growing up in the D.C. metro and being interested in fashion? Because you went to Central Saint Martin's right?

I went to the London College of Fashion.

I'm sorry, okay, you went to the London College of Fashion, Right.

It's like the business system, so.

But you were interested in fashion growing

up from the youngest possible age? I think I have sketchbooks from, like 6 years old where I drew like a boot, but there were legs coming out of it, and like, that was the dress. And then like a dog and the tongue was a. Was like a skirt.

Was it something. I think about D.C. a lot in terms of the context of people have to really dress up there, but it doesn't feel like. And Robin Gavon, the great fashion critic, was based there for many years and is still there. She worked at the Washington Post and all that stuff. But it's a very interesting city for fashion. Like, it was the top market for rent the Runway for a long time, but it's not like fashion fashion. Did you feel like your interest in it was unique or were there? Did you share that with your friends?

Well, first of all, it's funny that you say that, because I was recently looking at, like, our shipping Geography. And after, like, New York and LA, D.C. is next.

So that's interesting.

Thanks to my homies. But, no, I didn't feel like. Well, so first of all, I grew up going to the high school that the book that Mean Girls was written about was about. So you can imagine what, like, some of my classmates dressed like. But I would not say they were my muses, necessarily.

Was it, like, Abercrombie era?

Totally Abercrombie. Juicy Couture.

[Lauren Sherman]

Yeah.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

Guess jeans. Limited to.

[Lauren Sherman]

Wow.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

But I grew up as a theater girly. I was a thespian, famously.

We're gonna talk about that later.

So I think more than, like, oh, D.C. as a fashion place, it was like D.C. as, like, an arts and culture community. I went. I did, like, community theater growing up. So there were, like, adult performers in my life and cost, like, professional costume was part of my life. I was a competitive figure skater, so costume was part of my life.

[Lauren Sherman]

Sk.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

So I think for a long time, probably until I graduated high school and had my first internship in the city and realized that fashion and costume are different. I sort of blended them together and learned to sew for all the same reasons.

I wonder if you competed against my friend Hannah Fiedel in professional figure skating. That name doesn't ring a bell, does it?

I competed with myself.

She will be. She sent me. She's from Maryland, and she sent me the Vera Wang. I mean, not Vera Wang, the Oscar de la Renta. Sorry, Alex Bolin. The Oscar de la Renta, the Canadian skate figure skater has been wearing them. And she was like, I can't believe it, but I wonder if you two competed. So what was your first internship?

So when I was, like, 16 or 17, I was staying with my grandmother, and she had a very glamorous friend who was a shopaholic, and she had a daughter my age who was into sports, so she used to take me shopping with her. And we wandered into Luka Luca, which was an Upper east side staple. I think there were, like, somewhere between three and six boutiques, like, just in Manhattan. And Luca came down from the atelier to greet her and thank her for shopping. And I, like an arrogant teenager that I was, pulled out my sketchbook and handed it to him and said, I want to work for you. And he said, we don't have job openings. And I said, no, I'll work for free. I'll be your intern. And he said, we don't have interns. And I said, well, great. Then it sounds like you need one. And he gave me the job. And I worked for him for two or three summers, and I think that was really where I fell in love with making clothes. And I specifically remember spending one whole summer just, like, perfecting cashmere cardigans and, like, the exact placement of embroidery on dresses. And Adriana Lima was one of his muses, and I remember fitting with her, but really his focus was, like, dressing the women of the Upper east side. And while he had these beautiful, exquisite Runway moments, it was also about, like, a perfect trouser, a beautiful suit, a gorgeous dress, and it was like my aha moment that, like, fashion and costume are not always the same thing.

What did you learn at London College of Fashion?

I really learned how to, like, cut good clothes, fit good clothes, learn about good fabric. I learned how to research was the

culture there, because especially from the juicy couture reference, I think I know how old you are. I'm not going to ask because I don't know. I. I don't really care the exact age, but it was a time when those schools in London in particular, were hyper competitive. Did you feel that being there and was there because it was like, post Christopher Kane and all those and obviously, yeah. So did you feel that when you were at lcf or was it a little separate? Because it wasn't Saint Martin's and there wasn't like, the Louise Wilson and all that?

No, no, it was definitely very competitive. There was, like, competition within competition within competition. So you were at lcf and then, you know, when we got to our graduate year, you were working on your graduate collection. Then within the class of however many students we were, only like 12 of us or 20 of us made it into the graduate show. And then from that, only five of us made it into the Royal Academy show. So you had, like, our teachers were the judges and then also outside industries. So you were sort of like competing for their affection while you were learning from them. So there was. And they were working in the industry, so there was certainly a competitiveness in that. But I have to admit, my sights were set beyond just the show being, like, the end goal. It was like, what happens after the goal? What happens after the show? What happens after the Royal Academy show? What happens in my career?

Did you know you wanted to do your own brand even back then?

I want to say yes and no. I really wanted to work for, like, I really wanted to work. When I was in school, I had gone to the London College of Fashion and I had American friends who were in, you know, their overseas year, their year abroad, and they traveled every Weekend. And it just didn't occur to me to treat being in London like that. I, like, was in the studio every weekend. I took it very, very seriously. And so I just wanted to work. Like, as long as I was working, I was happy. I did an apprenticeship for Alexander McQueen while I was there, and I was obsessive with it. And so I was part of the team from the atelier that got pulled into launching McHugh.

That must have been. And that was. Sarah Burton was the.

No, Lee was alive then.

Okay, so now I really know how old you are.

I use good face cream.

Wow, that's amazing. What was that like? And being around all those people who are all so legendary now and so famous because they've been in all these books and they're gonna be on. There's, like, 15 TV shows being made about him all the time.

It was. I guess the best word I could use is somber. It was. You know, there was a severity and respect that happened during the creative process. There was sort of like a silence that made space for him to think about what you were presenting. And I think that that was really valuable for me to observe, especially as, like, such a young person who was in such a small team presenting concepts to him.

What did you learn about tailoring there? Because obviously, that was what everything came from with him. Was there something specific that you learned that you took that you're still carrying on today?

Well, I learned a lot about tailoring from my professors at lcf. I had one particular professor who was like a tailoring master. I had these tailoring shears that actually I had kept from my grandmother, and they said England on them. And that's a whole other story. We think that maybe they were like. My great, great uncle might have owned a factory in England after he left Austria when the Nazis invaded. So these were like family heirloom scissors. And they were, you know, no less than 12 inches long, and they were heavy, and they were really good tailoring shears. And Peter Cox used to walk into the room and he'd pick up my shears and he'd wipe them on the back of his head to grease them. And then he'd cut. He'd cut into the fabric like freehand. And I was obsessed with him. Like, obsessed. He'd walk into the room smelling of booze. It was like 9 o' clock in the morning. And he was just like a mad genius. And we probably shouldn't, like, celebrate that kind of thing of behavior, but it was just brilliant. And it was so meticulous and so intuitive. And that's all I cared about, was impressing him and cutting. Perfect suit.

Why did you move back to the States? Why didn't you get into the Euro ecosystem?

I did for a little bit, but my grandmother was like my world. And she was my muse and my best friend, and she. I thought I'd be in London for longer, and she got sick and passed very quickly. I think I assumed that after I came back to be with her that I'd go back. I, like, left half my things in London. But then I got back and it was the market crash and it was hard to find a job, and I wasn't sure if going back there was a better idea than staying here to find work. And then all of a sudden, I found myself in her apartment in Riverdale. And just like being here and being in New York and that felt right.

And you? I feel an Andrew Rosen adjacency with you. You worked at Alice and Olivia. Did you work at Theory also?

No, I never worked at Theory, but

I worked at Alice and Olivia.

I worked briefly at Alice and Olivia. Yeah.

I just feel like he'd like your stuff.

Andrew and I love each other.

He's the best. So you worked at Alison Olivia.

It owes me a round of golf.

You've gone golfing with Andrew?

No, no. But I will.

I would do that, too.

Andrew. I will golf with you.

I'm gonna. He won't listen to this, but I'll be like, we talked about you, and we talked about the fact that we wanna go golfing with you. I don't think I should. I've never been golfing with you.

I think I should get into golf clothes. Like, that's really.

You 100% should, which is. We do not have time to go on all these tangents.

[Lauren Sherman]

But.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

But I go running around the Rose bowl and I see these ladies. I really want to be one of them. And I need clothes. So I got you. You can do, like, custom stuff for the Masters. We'll talk about it afterwards. But so you. What did you do when you got here and you launched your brand in 2012? So what leading up, what were you working on and what made you decide to do it and in the way that you did it, which was very under the radar and very small to start, I think you launched with 7,000. You spent $7,000. I remember meeting you and my friend Emmy Parsons Trunk show, and she was renting a place across from your studio. That was probably like six or seven years ago. But talk about the lead up to 2012 and what made you want to do it and how you were actually able to do it. Because most people launch with their parents, take a second mortgage out, and they spend at least 200 grand, if not a million bucks or whatever.

Yeah, like I said, I just. I wanted to work. So I got to New York. It was hard to find a job, so I would work anywhere. So I worked for Alice and Olivia for a little bit. I designed for qvc, hsn.

That sounds awesome. And awesome. Good learning experience.

Awesome. You know, I remember Isaac Mizrachi talking about how valuable traveling the United States was when he was designing for Target and, like, meeting real people and real bodies and. And. And learning how to design for them. And I felt the same way. It's like that. That's how you learn to make, like, really, really good clothes that fit is when they fit everybody and when they're made for everybody. And when, like, you know, they. They don't return them.

[Lauren Sherman]

Right.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

They order them online. They order them from how it fits and how it's made and a description of the fabric, and then they. They buy it. I did a graphic, like, merch line for Nat Geo, which I collected National Geographic since, like, we moved to America. So I had, like, shelves and shelves that were yellow. Growing up, I worked for a brand that's no longer around, a Korean designer named Jenkao. And. And we were making, like 7,000 do dresses, like silk jersey with fox fur trim. I mean, I just took any work that I could get, and I worked as hard as I could. And then I started winding that down and just freelancing. And I was working at the Todd English Food hall at the Plaza as a waitress.

I know it.

I lied that I had experience. I didn't know how to open a wine bottle. And I just. I loved working there. I loved meeting people. I loved talking to them and charming them and telling them about what the oysters of the day were, even though I don't eat shellfish. And I saved up my money, and one day, Emily Kripitz, who was my manager at the Food hall as a waitress, said I had some press online from the Royal Academy and some work that I had done. And one day I came into work, and she said, come into my. And she said, I looked you up. I googled you. You're on the Internet. You're a really talented designer, and I don't know why you're doing this. And so Todd English actually sponsored my first show at the Empty space down in this in the Food hall before they expanded. And fun fact, fast forward all of these years. Emily is no longer in hospitality. She now works as a real estate broker and she found me my Madison Avenue store.

[Lauren Sherman]

Wow.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

Full circle.

Full circle.

That deserves a round of applause. I don't smoke and I never have, but I feel like everyone else I know is suddenly smoking again. Of course, it's a free country, so if you like smoking, do what you will.

[Lauren Sherman]

But if your New Year's resolution is to quit or even to use nicotine in a healthier way, check out the Quit with Jones. Visit quitwithjones.comfashion to take the free quiz and use code fashion to get 15%

[Daniella Kalmeier]

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[Lauren Sherman]

That's quitwithjones.com fashion taking back control starts now. Thanks to Quit with Jones for supporting this episode. And just a heads up, the mints

[Daniella Kalmeier]

contain nicotine, which is an addictive chemical.

[Lauren Sherman]

Jones is FDA approved and available for those that are 18 and older.

[Brian]

For years, Gone south has been a podcast about crime in the American South. But for our new season, we're widening the lens. Through deeply reported narrative driven stories. We're digging into the myths, scandals, and power structures that still shape the south and in a lot of ways, the country itself. Follow and listen to gone South Season 5 An Odyssey podcast, available now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your shows.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

So Todd throws you this fashion show.

[Lauren Sherman]

What?

[Daniella Kalmeier]

How did you even do the first collection with seven grand? Like, can you walk us really quickly through how you were able to get samples together?

It's not dissimilar from how I did it for, like, the next several years, which is I made the patterns myself. In many cases, I sewed the samples myself. You know, I was working in my Upper west side apartment. I turned the living room into my studio until. Until I could rent my first studio, which is a closet in another designer's showroom. I mean, I just, I think the, the gist of the whole story is that I really put my ego behind the vision for the brand. And I worked by myself for a really long time until I could hire someone freelance, until I could find an intern. And, you know, I just kept doing it. I didn't let anybody tell me that it was, like, not good enough, that I wasn't in that many stores yet. I think my first season, or maybe my second, I got into like three boutiques. I don't even think it paid for the samples, but just knowing that, how

did you find them?

I walked into stores in the city. I Looked up stores that other brands sold to. I cold called people and it was like one, like one person wanting one skirt was enough for me. And if that skirt sold, I made two dresses. And if two dresses sold, I made three suits. And like, it really, it really was like that for many years. And until I. My bosses from Luca Luca, when they closed the business, started a trunk show business on the Upper east side and called me up and said, we know you've been doing your own line. Do you want to participate in this, like group trunk show? And I sold more in like a four or five day trunk show than I did in like three seasons of, you know, air quotes, wholesaling. And these are, these were customers who were shopping in the stores that were telling me no. They were shopping in like Saks and Barneys and Bergdorfs. And they were coming in and saying, oh my God, this is exactly what I need in my wardrobe. Like, this is exactly like, where has this been all my life? And so it was like, that was enough encouragement for me to be like naive and cocky or whatever you want to call it to say, okay, I'm going to do one more collection or I'm going to make like five more shirts.

So when you think about what the original vision for the brand, it feels like you were very clear because it's what it is today. What were you trying to accomplish? And then the second part of that question is on pricing. Your pricing is unique because it's not cheap and it's not contemporary, quote, unquote. It's like very specific. It feels like designer, but it's not crazy expensive stuff that you would typically get on the designer floor. A question is like, what was your big idea from the beginning? And then B, how did you figure out pricing to get it so specific?

Well, first of all, exactly that. I appreciate the distinction because I think that that really is what makes the brand unique. I am a designer. I have luxury designer experience. I have a tailoring background. I approach the brand as a designer with a luxury mindset. But it's through clever sourcing, clever, very strong relationships with my factories, like knowledge of how things get cut or how things get worn, that I'm able to make decisions about a target price point. And as I said, I moved to New York. I didn't have a lot of money. I didn't see myself in these stores. Like, I personally, through my own personal journey of self discovery and, you know, closeted queerness and, you know, a young designer who didn't grow up, you know, grew up around exquisite fashion but couldn't afford it. All of these things, I think were made up who I was when I walked into, like, Barney's Co Op and said, these clothes are too contemporary for my taste. And then walked into Bergdorf's and said, well, I'm scared to even touch this because it's too expensive. And I knew that there were women out there who appreciated beautiful clothes that lasted a really long time. I mean, I looked at my own mother, my grandmother, who were incredibly elegant. They never wore designer clothes. They were always, like, beautifully dressed or beautifully tailored. There wasn't a designer brand in their closet. And so it didn't matter. And I think that. And I had to believe that there were people out there like that who could appreciate just, like, beautiful clothes rather than the brand name. And so I really, I went out and I launched this brand with that vision in mind, like, just make a beautiful designer brand. That's not about trend, it's not about prints. I mean, this was like the era of fit and flare dresses and mismatching prints. And every trench coat had, like a leather, like, collar, you know, and every button down had, like a diamante button. And I just wanted, like a perfectly cut trouser and a beautiful shirt without feeling like you were going to work.

Well, the interesting thing about your clothes, and I've looked, I've done. I used to do show [e-mail], like, I've looked at a lot of clothes. I still can't. I'm not like one of those writers that knows exactly why. I just know when I see something that it's good, like, it's good, well done. And your stuff, it can be just a simple black blazer or a pair of pants, but you can just tell that it's good quality. And that might be the stitching. And it's something that, like, some people could really can shoppers and whoever can really kind of pinpoint. But for me, it's just a visceral reaction of, oh, that thing is worth the. The money. It is. And someone could make the exact same run of things that you make, and I would know that yours is better. And that is extremely hard to impart in the stuff that you do, which is very, I don't want to say simple but clean. And so that's a hard thing to impart that you're able to do. But when did you realize that, like, when was there the switch where you realized that everyone was catching on? Like, was there a season or was there a moment when you thought that your sales, like, quadrupled or something?

Well, I think I attribute a lot of the recent sort of, like, aha. Growth that we've had where people are, you know, catching on to opening our first store. And that came shortly after this sort of, like, run of trunk shows where I was like, there are customers out there. I just have to find them. And so I put every last cent, penny, dollar, like, whatever I found under the couch into opening that store on Orchard Street. I got the keys on, like, May 26th, and on June 4th, I opened this store with, like, furniture and fixtures that I made with a circular saw in the basement and, like, wood that I found on the street. And so. And then I, like, collected furniture. I emptied my apartment. I just wanted a space that felt like the home of my brand. And I do think that that made a really big difference, like, build, like, world building allowed people to see what the clothes meant in situ and, like, how it felt like wardrobing. Because I do think I understand how, like, as a young designer going into, like, a department store, saying, hey, this is the most perfect pair of black pants. They could say to me, well, we've got that covered. But when you put it in a wardrobe that, like, really makes sense for women or for people who can identify with it, then, like, then you start putting the puzzle pieces together. And, you know, you. You mentioned, like, there's just, like, something different. I talk a lot about, like, the feeling of my clothes, and I know that that sounds, like, a little bit esoteric and maybe even, like, obnoxious, but.

No, it's fine.

Not with this crew, but, like, I really do put so much into how do these clothes feel? How do they fall off of a real body? How do, like, how do you stand differently or gesture differently or how deep are your pockets? And if they're. If they're deep, you know, how do you. How do you position your body in them? And so how do you enter a room in these clothes? Like, I put so much thought into what clothes feel like on real people that I don't think it's just about the clothes. It's about, like, how they live and, like, come to life on a person in the world.

Yeah. I wonder if it's. That's how you approach merchandising, because I think when I really started paying very close attention, I remember the fact that you had a lot of formal stuff too, like, gowns helped me understand who the customer was outside of the suiting and what you were thinking. And the first thing I ever bought from you was a mini skirt. Because I wanted a mini skirt but was like, I don't know, I didn't want something super trendy and I didn't want it to be inappropriate and I just trusted and I bought it online. I couldn't go to your store, it was like during the summer or something. And I trusted that your miniskirt would be right.

[Lauren Sherman]

And it was true.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

It was the only miniskirt I ever bought but.

Well, I thought it would be the only miniskirt I ever made.

But it became a big hit, right?

Yeah, huge. The mini skirt, the Shiloh miniskirt and the Eloise mini dress. I mean I was like, I will never make a mini anything. No, I am modest. And now look at us. Legs.

So you also launched at some point on Net A Porter. Net A Porter. I don't know. But what was going after all of your experiences like doing those things, types of like strategic, wholesale. Was that helpful in terms of marketing? Was it good for the top line? Like what, what value did that bring to you? Ended up opening a second store uptown. You don't have a store in LA yet, right?

Not yet.

Not yet, Someday. But what did the sort of wholesale stuff do for you?

As you said, we've been very strategic about who we sell to and how. Elise Walker is another great example. Net A Porte.

Amazing store.

Amazing store. Goop. Net A Porter Moda. They've been amazing partners to us because they really buy the brand as it's meant to be seen and they buy it for their specific customers. The Moda buy is different than the NAP buy but I think launching on Nap, as you said it like it was a combination of like really the correct merchandise for their audience. The right buy, the right amount of buy and great marketing and we sold out right away. So I think having a couple of seasons in a row where we're just like really selling out and it's a really good strategic partnership between our two brands. Has, has like it's created like tension and buzz and excitement and I think the same thing like we're, we're self funded brands so I'm not interested. And I think we also approach sustainability differently. I think about sustainability as like non wastefulness, you know, clothes that can exist in every situation in your life and every, every you know, moment of your life and also that, that last and have longevity. And so we also don't buy into tons of surplus for our, for our own inventory. So things sell out and it creates like a really good momentum into the Next season.

[Brian]

I'm Brian. I work at UnitedHealthcare.

[Lauren Sherman]

So Brian, why do you care?

[Brian]

I care because I don't want to leave anybody behind. I oversee one of the biggest resource center in UnitedHealthcare. I see people walking in my office every day just like my parents. They have no idea about the health care. I feel like they are my uncles, aunties. I treated people like family. I'm Brian and I'm committed to care.

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[Daniella Kalmeier]

I have a question and you've mentioned a couple times that you're a lesb.

Me

and my great friend and Fashion People guest, frequent Fashion People guest Marissa Meltzer profiled you for the New York Times and the headline was basically like this. Lesbian Lesbians are cool. And it's interesting because through the years there will always be occasionally like lesbians are fashion. Obviously we know that. How do you feel about that? Because obviously all of fashion is gay men. So like, are you. Because it's fetishizing it a little bit. But is it in a good way? Like as a person who's become a leader in that community, like shout out Pam Jucker Mann. You did in la. You did that big thing with her and her new venture. Are you cool with the fact that Marissa, who I think self identifies as a straight woman, wrote this story that like that it's a part of your brand?

So this is very timely because I actually just received the visibility award from the Human Rights Campaign this past weekend.

That's awesome. Congrats.

[Lauren Sherman]

Thank you.

[Daniella Kalmeier]

And I actually mentioned that article, the New York Times article in my speech and I said, you know, the New York Times famously wrote about us lesbian chic for all. And while I'm very flattered to take credit for lesbian chicness, I'm more Honored that there is representation and unity that is implied in the words for all. And I think that people forget the second half of the sentence. Yes, it's lesbian chic. Yes, I have a perspective that comes from my own personal, you know, path, my own personal journey, my personal desire to be seen and perceived as I am, and the same wish that I have for my own community. But I think the for all is very important because it's not just queer women or, you know, genderqueer people who want to be seen. Everybody wants to be seen. And I do think that that ends up translating in our clothes. You know, I talk as much about the queer couple who comes in, and they've never walked into a luxury store before, and they're afraid to go into the dressing room, and they come out in their wedding suits as I do about the, like, tired working mom who's actually a badass, and she's like a CMO or a CEO and wish she experimented more in college, but that she also, like, just doesn't see herself for who she is anymore. And she walks into rooms where she has a lot to say and probably men are too loud, and she just wants to feel strong and proud. And I'm dressing her, too. And so I think that there is an experience that I have that is, like, ingrained in what I'm doing that isn't just about queerness. And I think that that's something important to remember, is that I'm not a queer brand. I'm a queer designer.

Yeah, no, that's very true. And it's interesting to see how you've navigated it, because it isn't. It's a part of your identity, but it's not the whole thing. And that's why, like you said, for all that's when something's very specific, it does a lot of people connect with it. So Fashion Week, why did you start showing at Fashion Week? You now do Runway shows. And, like, what value obviously, Starbucks is here. They. I don't know if you all read in Feed Me Today and Women's Wear Daily, they're sponsoring a lot of or partnering with a lot of young brands, including yours at Cause Lada brands that we all care about, like the good brands at New York Fashion Week and which the way New York Fashion Week works has changed so much. But what value does it still bring to you? And what does like partnering with a store, a brand like Starbucks. How does it help? And I'm not just saying this because Starbucks is helping us with this chat. It's I'm truly interested in why this is all working together.

Well, as you know, we're. You know, before we started showing on the Runway again, we actually did. We did, like, one or two Runway shows, like, way back in the beginning. But before we started showing Runway again during Fashion Week, we put ourselves back on the calendar with presentations, and we put hospitality at the forefront of that. So right away, Starbucks made sense for us to, you know, connect with. But I really appreciate how, like, organically they're placing the brand and how much respect they're having for what makes sense for the brands that they're partnering with. You know, we work long hours. We're working in groups.

You walked in with a Starbucks today.

I walked in with a Starbucks. I ate my egg wrap this morning. My team is literally fueled by Starbucks right now on our third day of Style Out. So it's very organic, and it makes a lot of sense. And there's a reason that there's a Starbucks on every corner. And maybe there'll be a Kalmier on every corner corner, too.

There will be someday. Daniella, thank you so much.

Thank you.

This was so fun. And thanks to Starbucks.

Thank you, Starbucks.

And thanks to the Puck team and everyone at the Chelsea Hotel. And thank you all for being here. This was so fun. Fashion People is a presentation of Odyssey in partnership with Puck. This show was produced and edited by Molly Nugent. Special thanks to our executive producers, Puck co founder John Kelly, executive editor Ben Landy, and director of editorial operations, Gabby Grossman.

[Brian]

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