Artists’ Salon: Hairstylists Mara Roszak and Barb Thompson

Summary

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Fat Mascara – Artists’ Salon: Hairstylists Mara Roszak and Barb Thompson

Host: Jessica Matlin
Guests: Mara Roszak & Barb Thompson
Release Date: May 13, 2026

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Episode Overview

This special "Artist Salon" edition of Fat Mascara brings together two of the industry's most respected and beloved hairstylists, Mara Roszak and Barb Thompson, for an engaging and candid conversation about their creative journeys, behind-the-scenes camaraderie, and their unique mentor-mentee bond turned genuine friendship. Host Jessica Matlin guides the discussion as Mara and Barb share their artistic philosophies, personal anecdotes, career-defining moments, and practical advice for both hair professionals and enthusiasts. The episode also delivers heartfelt insights into building each other up, evolving in the beauty industry, and the importance of emotional intuition in creative environments.

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Key Topics & Insights

1. Introducing Mara Roszak & Barb Thompson (02:07–04:24)

• Jessica highlights Mara’s work with top-tier celebrities (Emma Stone, Olivia Wilde, Zoe Saldana), founding Mare Salon, and creating the acclaimed Rose Hair line.
• Barb is praised for her rising profile in the LA hairstyling scene, her close professional (and personal) bond with Mara, and her work with stars like Hilary Duff and Justine Lupe.

Notable Quote:

"They’re a perfect example of what kind of lifting each other up can be." – Jessica Matlin (03:22)

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2. How Barb Met Hilary Duff: The Role of Chance Networks (05:17–07:06)

• Barb recounts meeting Hilary Duff through client/friend Mandy Moore at a birthday party, calling out the serendipity and relational circles of LA life.
• The conversation includes playful banter about both guests' musician husbands and life outside of work.

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3. The Origins of Their Partnership (07:40–10:19)

• Mara and Barb recall their first meeting on-set in 2021, orchestrated through a mutual friend and stylist, Kylie Heath.
• Barb describes her starstruck excitement at meeting Mara amidst the buzz about Rose Hair's launch.

Notable Moment:

“I was just so excited to be around Mara… Who cares about the client? Mara’s here.” – Barb Thompson (09:06)

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4. The Mentor/Mentee Dynamic & Reinventing Careers (10:20–14:03)

• Barb openly discusses leaving her established Northern California salon (and 20-year-long clients) to start fresh in LA and assist Mara.
• Mara celebrates Barb’s lack of ego and willingness to learn:

  “It’s such a testament to Barb … her lack of ego, talent, curiosity—all qualities we could only all dream of having.” – Mara Roszak (11:07)

• They describe the dynamic as a friendship built on mutual support rather than hierarchy.

Notable Quote:

“It was just without a doubt the hardest thing and the obvious best thing that I could have ever done.” – Barb Thompson (13:05)

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5. The Realities of Salon vs. Celebrity Work (14:10–16:36)

• Both stylist share contrasts between the demands of running a busy salon and the flexible, often intense life of styling celebrities.
• Mara on the physical and emotional toll of salon work:

  “At the end of a salon day, I would just drive home itchy because I have other people’s strands of hair all over my body… I would sit in silence on my way home…” (16:06)

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6. Building a Brand—The Power of Community (19:36–24:31)

• Jessica asks Mara about how professional relationships impacted her launch of Rose Hair.
• Mara reflects on the vulnerability of creating a brand, expressing deep gratitude for Barb and others who championed her product.

  “There is nothing—I mean, hairdressers are so discerning… The fact that they love and use Rose… is beyond my wildest dreams.” – Mara Roszak (20:38)

• Barb candidly reveals witnessing the ‘un-glamorous’ reality behind building a beauty brand:

  "It’s kind of like watching my friends with a literal baby… I see how hard it is. And… it wouldn’t be worth it if you didn’t put your entire self…” – Barb Thompson (23:55)

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7. Product Philosophy: Clean, High-Performance Haircare (24:31–26:58)

• Mara gives an in-depth ‘elevator pitch’ for Rose Hair—born out of her inability to find clean, sustainable, performant products for her clients and herself.
• The products are designed for hairstylists, informed by decades of hands-on experience, and built around clients’ wellness concerns.

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8. Pro Hair Advice: Cuts, Tools, & Techniques (27:02–36:25)

• On Achieving ‘Cool Girl’ Hair:
  • Work with your natural texture, not against it.
  • Bring in reference photos of similar hair texture, not just celebrities with great stylists.
  • Ignore the traditional “face shape” rules—it's all about hair type.

    "I am not a believer in face shape… it’s really about your hair texture and hair type." – Mara Roszak (28:56)

• Practical Tips:
  • To determine if you really like a haircut, “put your thumb over the face” in the inspo photo to avoid being swayed by the overall look/personality. (30:49)
  • Beware of Pinterest/AI images—they set unrealistic expectations.
  • For effortless waves: “Less is more”—especially for hair with natural movement. Tools: large-barrel curling iron (T3, 1.75in) and T3 hot round brush for at-home styling and shine boost. (33:09–34:23)
• Accessories:
  • Favor vintage combs and brooches for elegant looks.
  • Ribbons are fun but context-dependent—stock up on different colors for versatility.

Notable Quotes:

“Some of those tools for at-home use…I actually just bought a curling iron that Barb recommended…it’s a really, really big, chunky 1.75 [inch].” – Mara Roszak (33:09)
“I do love a bow. Right, but it’s the time and place, isn’t it?” – Mara Roszak (35:24)

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9. Emotional Intelligence: Working with Celebrities & Building Trust (36:25–40:13)

• Both stylists discuss the emotional demands of prepping celebrities for red carpets, shoots, etc.—and how trust, energy, and sensitivity are essential.
• Mara: “The energy we bring into the room, I believe, is everything. So for me, I’ve always been very mindful, even if I’m having a crazy morning…how am I entering in the room?” (37:06)
• Barb: “The one thing I have learned from all of these top, top, top people, is reading that room—not making it about yourself.” (39:00)
• Both agree: Emotional intuition is critical and transcends hairdressing, applying to all career interactions.

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10. The Fat Mascara 5: Rapid Fire Round (42:35–47:40)

Fun quick-answer segment—highlights include:

• Most LA Thing: Barb’s pampered dog, Bags, gets picked up, groomed, and listens to meditation music. Mara’s “Rose Smoothie” at Erewhon is a pinnacle LA moment.
• First Beauty Product Loved: Barb: “Smackers soda-flavored Chapstick.” Mara: “Horrible cotton candy 90s body spray.” (45:14)
• Hair Trends to Skip: Mara: Bobs with short layers (“looks like a newscaster on everyone except models”). Barb: Hair tinsel (“It’s really hard…Don’t come back!”).
• Desert Island Must-Have (non-hair): Mara swears by Homeoplasmine French pharmacy chapstick.

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Partnership:

  “I never saw Barb as an assistant…she was a very well-established hairstylist…but she really just wanted to…get your foot in the door and really get to kind of meet people in LA. And I was like, well, I just want to be your friend…” – Mara Roszak (11:07–11:58)

• On Success:

  “Nothing you do, even if it’s your own project, happens in a vacuum…You have to lean on people.” – Jessica Matlin (19:53)

• On Emotional Labor:

  “Even if they are our friends, we’re at work in that moment.” – Barb Thompson (40:03)

• On Trends:

  “I can’t get behind a bob with fringe—unless you look like Hailey Bieber…anybody else looks like a newscaster.” – Mara Roszak (45:48)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 03:22 – The importance of lifting each other up in creative industries
• 07:47 – how Mara and Barb met and first impressions
• 10:36 – Barb’s transition from established salon owner to Mara’s assistant in LA
• 13:05 – The emotional cost (and gain) of career leaps
• 16:06 – Behind the scenes: physical realities of salon life
• 20:38 – The rookie year of Rose Hair and peer support
• 27:02 – Defining and debunking ‘cool girl hair’
• 30:49 – The “thumb test” for haircut inspo photos
• 33:09 – Favorite styling tools and tips for waves
• 35:24 – Accessorizing with intention
• 37:06 – Entering celebrity spaces with the right energy
• 39:00 – Reading the room; “less is more” in both style and presence
• 42:50 – Fat Mascara 5: “Most LA thing”
• 45:14 – Childhood beauty product obsessions
• 46:22 – Hair trends they’d banish

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Conclusion

This episode combines career wisdom, hilarious candor, and heartfelt advice from two industry leaders who have forged a path rooted in camaraderie, humility, and passion for their craft. With tips relevant for both stylists and everyday listeners, Mara and Barb exemplify the power of vulnerability, mentorship, and supportive professional relationships in shaping not just hair—but entire careers. The conversation is authentic, warm, and full of practical gems for anyone interested in beauty, creativity, or simply being a better collaborator.

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Transcript

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[Jessica Matlin]

Hey everyone. Welcome to Fat Mascara. We have a double whammy today. We've got an Artist Salon episode. If you're just jumping in, you've not been here for the relaunch. Artist Salon is a new sort of episode. This is where we bring two creatives together in conversation to share and compare their experiences. Now, of course, we're not going to stick two randos together. That'd be really awkward. We are bringing in two friends. I would say more than friends. This is a mentor, mentee, relationship. But now they're just amazing friends. I have Mar Rosak in the virtual studio. She's the co owner of Mare Salon, but she's also the founder and CEO of Rosehair, one of the, I would say best scented hair brands to come along in a long time. But of course I think Mara would say, hey, it's also high performance too, and it's clean and all those good things that everyone wants in their hair care now. And it's also totally beloved. It's only been around for, like, a handful of years, and I would say major, major success story. So she's the founder and CEO of Rose Hair, but we've also seen her work on basically every celebrity. I'm just going to name a few of them. Emma Stone, Olivia Wilde, Zoe Saldana. She does all of the Hollywood. I'm saying this with air quotes, but it girls. But honestly, she does all of the Hollywood it girls. Now, Barb Thompson. Listen to the episode. You'll understand more about their relationship. But Barb Thompson say shadowed her. But I mean, Barb's not in anybody's shadow. Once you meet Barb, you'll understand. Barb really learned from Mara, and then the two of them became sort of like a dynamic duo. Barb, one of her biggest clients. You've seen her hair everywhere. Hilary Duff. I mean, Barb's having a banger year. Justine Loop. I just learned how to say her name. Justine Loop of Succession fame. Marissa Bode of Wicked fame. They're hysterical together. I love them. I feel like I chatted a little too much just because I was just totally in the moment with them. But I hope you enjoy it. They're great and a perfect example of what kind of lifting each other up can be. So take it away. Mara and Barb. We gotta talk about both of you. I don't mean to go heavy on the Barb for a second, but I gotta go heavy on Barb for a second.

[Barb Thompson]

Mara, I see what you're doing already.

[Jessica Matlin]

I don't know what I'm doing, so I'm glad you see it.

[Barb Thompson]

I'm onto her.

[Jessica Matlin]

We have to have a moment for Barb does hair. If you don't follow, Barb does hair. This is Barb's first time on Fat Mascara in person, but we have had Barb on the show. And do we have an audio of you? You've been on, like, the fat mascara Instagram. And we called back to many a conversation with Barb because you are a hair hero, hair savant. But this is your first time on

[Barb Thompson]

Jessica Matlin saying that. Or as our friends refer to her as Matlin.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah, I know. Barb's like a real friend from outside of the.

[Mara Rosak]

The Kevin Bacon of hair of like, you know what I mean? Everybody's like, yes, you know Barb does hair.

[Jessica Matlin]

Everyone knows Barb. But wait, tell us about. Because people. People don't care about, like, you and I hanging out outside of work. What I care about is how the hell do you know Hilary Duff.

[Barb Thompson]

How do I know Hilary Duff? I met Hilary Duff through my friend and client, Mandy Moore.

[Jessica Matlin]

Oh, my God. Oh, people. Little feet are kicking. The people want to know, but we can't go. Go on, go on.

[Barb Thompson]

Yeah, so we, my husband and I, were invited to Mandy's birthday, and we went. And as you guys know, when you only know the birthday person, you're like, oh, God, who are we gonna talk to? And then my other client, Gabhi, she's this amazing chef, and she was the only other face that I ever recognized.

[Jessica Matlin]

She's in the group, right?

[Barb Thompson]

Yes.

[Jessica Matlin]

Okay. Yeah, okay. She's. Okay. I'm not, like, deep into this stuff, but I. Yeah, okay. Go on, go on.

[Barb Thompson]

Yes. And I just saw Gabi, so I ran over and.

[Jessica Matlin]

And you mean you ran over and, like, clutched her and was like, don't leave me.

[Barb Thompson]

Like, Avi, I don't know anyone. So went over and then just like, oh, you're with Hilary Duff. And so we just started talking with Hillary, and then.

[Mara Rosak]

Wait, wait, wait.

[Jessica Matlin]

So you go to this party, you don't know anybody, but you know Gavi the chef, right?

[Barb Thompson]

Yes.

[Jessica Matlin]

And she just happens to be like, oh, meet my friend Hills.

[Barb Thompson]

Yeah. And we met her husband Matt, and I knew Gabby's husband, Thomas. So my husband and I just were hanging out, and the next day, Hillary

[Jessica Matlin]

calling me Hilary's husband. Is he a musician?

[Barb Thompson]

Yes. And he's the producer.

[Jessica Matlin]

And your husband's a musician.

[Mara Rosak]

Exactly.

[Barb Thompson]

So it was like a perfect little hangout. And Mara's husband is a musician, and that's where we'll get into it.

[Jessica Matlin]

I didn't know that.

[Barb Thompson]

I know.

[Jessica Matlin]

Okay. Barb's husband is such a sick musician.

[Barb Thompson]

And so is Taylor, Mara's husband.

[Jessica Matlin]

What can we. Next time we're gonna do a full Brady Bunch, like, episode where we have the guys too, and we'll just talk about their music.

[Mara Rosak]

They could use that. They can really use that, you know, their own support group.

[Jessica Matlin]

That's awesome. So that's how you met Hiller. I'm calling her Hills. I don't know why.

[Barb Thompson]

Yeah, it's Hill.

[Mara Rosak]

That seems appropriate.

[Jessica Matlin]

I love it. I love it. But the more pertinent question to this episode, to this artist salon, is how did you guys meet?

[Mara Rosak]

We met on set. You were working with our other dear friend and very talented hairdresser, Kylie Heath. This is the first day, isn't it?

[Barb Thompson]

Day one. I think it was May 13, 2021. Not that I remember the exact day where I met Mara Rosak. Wow.

[Mara Rosak]

Yeah, wow. Pulling that out. Yeah, she's with us.

[Jessica Matlin]

Oh, yeah.

[Mara Rosak]

So, yeah, she was. Barb was with Kylie Heath on set. And I was like, who's that cool person over there? And Kylie was like, you don't know Barb. I was like, I've never met Barb, but I've heard of Barb.

[Jessica Matlin]

One syllable, that's all you need to know. Barb.

[Barb Thompson]

She.

[Mara Rosak]

Exactly, Barb. Actually, I've wanted to for a long time. And, Jess, we should just, like, do this. But I've wanted to make a, like, who's Barb? T shirt. Just because that's amazing. It's like, who's Barb? Oh, Barb, of course. It's just such a good.

[Barb Thompson]

It's so good.

[Jessica Matlin]

It's a great name. Barb.

[Barb Thompson]

Oh, my God.

[Mara Rosak]

And I was like, I don't know Barb, but I do know Barb and I need to know Barb. And then she introduced us, and I was like, well, I would just love to work with you in any capacity. And so we exchanged numbers and I probably called you later that day.

[Jessica Matlin]

Is that how you remember it, Bar?

[Barb Thompson]

And how I remember it is Rose. Her company was just being launched that Sunday before, and it just was everywhere. And I was like. And everyone was talking about the smell. And I was like, I just wanna smell it. I wanna know what it is. And we happened to be on set and Mara was with a client. And everyone was losing it over the client who had come on set. I'm not gonna say the client, but I was like, who cares about the client? Mara's here. I was just so excited to be around Mara. Cause I'll get into it in a little bit. Cause there's other questions we have that this is the answer to.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah, no, I know. I've gotta be really thoughtful about my questions. Because there's so much I wanna ask you about. You know, it's funny that you mentioned the product, Barb. You were a super fan of the product. Cause we went away together with our. And I remember I was gonna take a shower, and you were like, try this. And you had little samples and you were like a street team.

[Barb Thompson]

Oh, yeah. I was boots on the ground.

[Jessica Matlin]

What steak does she have? And I was like, all right, okay. But you were really. I know you were. You were actually a true fan of Mara and her work.

[Barb Thompson]

Yes.

[Jessica Matlin]

So when did you actually start working together? And I think people would like to know, people who are super into beauty. What does it mean to work together in that relationship as two hairstylists? Because Barb you were working with Mara, right?

[Barb Thompson]

I was assisting. I was lucky enough to assist Mara.

[Jessica Matlin]

What does that relationship look like as an assistant?

[Barb Thompson]

There's many different variations.

[Mara Rosak]

Yes. I've never had one like this before. I never saw Barb as an assistant. I mean, Barb was an incredibly well established. And this is such a testament to Barb because I again, I don't know many people or anyone ever that has done this before. And I think it's so cool and so admirable and just such a testament to her lack of ego, talent, curiosity, all qualities like we could only all dream of having. And I met Barb and she was a very well established hairstylist, but was new to Los Angeles. She owned a hair salon in Northern California and everybody knows her there. And then very shortly after everybody knew her in Los Angeles.

[Barb Thompson]

So again, you're so sweet.

[Mara Rosak]

I was like, yeah, of course I would love for you to work with me, but why would you want to come work with me? You don't need to be doing this. But she really just wanted to seemingly like, and you could answer this really bad erbar, but get your foot in the door and really get to kind of meet people in la. And I was like, well, I just like want to be your friend and if you get to like tag along on jobs with me, what this is like the greatest gift to me.

[Barb Thompson]

What a dream.

[Jessica Matlin]

Barb, I'm curious. That is a big ego check here. You're somebody who's started a salon, you're running P and L, you're managing people, you're doing all of this and now you're saying, yeah, I'm going to assist, I'm going to assist someone. I'm going to. Mara making this up. I don't know if you had her. Hold your hairbrush, hold my rat tail comb, spritz this, you know, go get me a coffee call this person. Forgot this. Like, that's a huge mental step back. How did people in your life react to this decision that you decided to make?

[Barb Thompson]

Yeah, I think also with that even just the move of like a region and it was just like a complete flip. And my family is really tight, as you know, but everyone just, I think got it from the very beginning. Like my third month in beauty school, I said I wanted to own a salon, I wanted to work New York Fashion Week and I wanted to work with celebrities. So it was always in things I would say. And I think sometimes the more you talk about something manifesting whatever it is, I do think it helps make it happen. So you're not just talking out of your ass? Sorry, don't know if I can say that. But yeah. So it, I think it was hard to leave my family and not even just the people I worked with, but the people I worked for in the salon. I had some of my clients for 20 years, so I was not only leaving their friendships and that, but we become family. So I think some of them are still mad at me with love. But yeah, it was just without a doubt the hardest thing and the obvious best thing that I could have ever done. And I moved here in June of 2021 and I met Mara May of 2021 and it was just like we're going. So it was just no brainer.

[Jessica Matlin]

And then Mara, you also owned a salon, right? Or you're the founder of, of Mayor Salon. Are you still active with it at all?

[Mara Rosak]

I am a bit. I have a co owner and he's really more of the day to day.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah. It would be impossible for you to be involved day to day. Absolutely.

[Mara Rosak]

Something, something had to give between brand, freelance, career and all the things.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah, for sure.

[Barb Thompson]

Being a mother, a mom.

[Jessica Matlin]

And was it, was it hard for you to walk away or was it like, okay, I've done that, that and now I'm onto a new dream. These are. You guys both have this similarity of having done all of these three things together. The only thing Barb, you haven't done yet is start your own line yet.

[Mara Rosak]

Yeah, I think the hardest thing being a founder is sort of like a completely other thing altogether being the founder of a brand. But I think in terms of hairdressers in the salon are like the hardest working people. They're on their feet all day long, they are talking all day long. They're giving everything to those people who have been waiting. It's very different than what we do, I think with actors and actresses who, you know, it's part of their job to get glammed up and you develop obviously like a intimate relationship and they become your friends as Barb mentioned. For sure, I would say, but it's very different than people who are coming to the salon who, it's not their job. They are like saving up for that time with you. So you're, you are giving, I mean, you're giving so much in general. I think that is hairdressers are just like the hardest working, most giving, supportive people I think I have ever met. But definitely in the salon it's very, very hard. And they don't take breaks. They're just going for like 10 hours straight.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah. It's like a performance.

[Mara Rosak]

Yeah, it is.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah.

[Mara Rosak]

No, at the end of a salon day, I would just drive home itchy because I have other people's strands of hairs all over my body inside my bra and underwear. Truly disgusting. I would sit in silence on my way home of just like, I can't speak or see or anything. So it's very, very different. It's very different and a real commitment.

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[Jessica Matlin]

Now. When you are building something like Rose, which is clearly like a real labor of love, I know you're working on that for a long time and it's named after you, it has your imprint on it. How do your relationships, your working relationships with people like Barb, the people that you've pulled into your orbit, how does that come into something that is so personal? Because you do need people when you're launching something that's your own. I mean, I know this just from having a podcast. Nothing you do, even if it's your own project, nothing happens in a vacuum. Like, I called you and Barb to be like, hey, I'm doing this. Please, will you come on the show? I promise it'll be fun. You know, like, you have. You have to. You have to lean on people to make your project work. Everything about it, from the infrastructure to the talent to everything. So tell me about the creative people in your life.

[Mara Rosak]

It's completely changed my life, I would say. Being a founder and launching something is so vulnerable, and I think it's only worth doing probably if it is. But I. I mean, I could cry right now just thinking about it. The people who have showed up, I mean, Barbara, number one, top of this list, one hairdresser saying, I want your product. I've heard good things about it, I've used it, and I want more of it. There is nothing. I mean, hairdressers are so discerning, obviously, when it comes to hair products and the fact that they love and use Rose. And it's beyond my wildest dreams, Bar, being top of that list and being the most supportive. I mean, as you said, Jess, she was like, go use this in the shower.

[Jessica Matlin]

I was in the shower. I was in the bathroom and she was coming in with the samples, and I was like, exactly.

[Mara Rosak]

She's opening your naked in the shower. And she's like, you gotta use so it's unbelievable. It's unbelievable. I am, like, forever grateful and truly, it's been beyond my wildest dreams. And Barb's been the greatest supporter of Rose and of myself. I am forever grateful to her for that. It's been truly the greatest gift.

[Jessica Matlin]

So you got the hairdressing community, and then are there any surprise people when you can name names or you cannot? It's funny who shows up when you're putting something together?

[Mara Rosak]

Unbelievable. I mean, there are these hair icons that I won't name names, but I remember when I was a budding hairstylist. This is, like, going back probably 20 years. And I was on set very, very early on with Emma Stone, who was also kind of a budding actress. I think maybe it was press for Superbad. This is, like, her first movie ever. And we were doing it, like, inside Nylon photo. And I was on set, and we just happened to be. The set was at this hairdresser, an iconic hairdresser in his back house and in his pool we were shooting at. And I didn't know that. I just showed up to the address they gave me, and I'm like, oh, this is so and so's house. Okay, no big deal. And he's there because of course he's there. And I just see him, like, out of the corner, my eye. I had some, like, hair extensions on the table, whatever. And I just see him walk up to the table of extensions and sort of zhuzh the extensions just to, like, feel the quality, you know?

[Jessica Matlin]

Oh, my God.

[Mara Rosak]

And I had a heart attack. And, yeah, he comes to every Rose event. This is 20 something years later. I mean, he shows up to every event, is so complimentary. Tags, earth products, DMs. Me, I'm like, are you kidding me? Full circle. Yeah.

[Jessica Matlin]

That's awesome. That's great. Barb, Would you ever start your own line?

[Barb Thompson]

Okay, well, that is so loaded because I am so close to Mara. However, it seems on the outside, I know how much this woman has put into this. It's kind of like watching my friends with a literal baby. I think this is why I don't have a baby yet, because it's not glamorized for me.

[Mara Rosak]

Yeah.

[Barb Thompson]

And I see how hard it is. And, like, Mara's saying, it wouldn't be worth it if you didn't put your entire self. So with that, I would love to partner with a brand. I have some ideas and. But I just.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah, that's okay. That makes sense.

[Mara Rosak]

And that can change too. I think I probably. I wasn't ready to do it until I was ready to do it. And I'm glad I waited also, because it is everything and more in terms of time.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah, it's full on. It's amazing that you have time to still do all the styling that you do. And I probably buried the lead a little bit with Rose. I mean, it's. I'll let you give me the elevator pitch. For those of. For those who don't know about your line, it started out so simple. It was just this one beautiful oil.

[Mara Rosak]

You're right. Yes. And, Jess, I mean, you are also. Because obviously Barb turned you onto it. One of, like, the first calls and early, early supporters of Rose and that one product. Yeah. So I had this idea for one product, obviously had idea for all the products. I would say hairdressers in general really are like their own mini chemists. We are always mixing and matching and concocting, and hair is what we know better than anything in our lives. And so you know exactly what products need to do and how they need to perform. And really, that obviously, like, 20 plus years in doing hair has really informed the products and what products need to exist and how they need to perform. But what I was never able to find in any hair salon I ever worked in owned any products that I tried and put in my kit, none of them were clean and none of them were really in sustainable packaging. So for me, that's what really changed my clients. You know, we're also in Los Angeles, which is like the mecca of health and wellness. You know, air wands popping up left and right. And my clients were really starting to ask, what do you have in the clean space so that I can feel safe using these products on my whole family or my kids or on myself. And I had nothing to recommend them at my own salon. So I knew I wanted to do a brand, like, deep in my bones, had clearly been talking about it for a long time, because I have clients who, like Barb said, women that I've seen for 20 years, they're like, 10 years ago, you told me about that brand you wanted to start. Now look, you did it. I'm like, I was talking. What was I even talking about 10 years ago? But I clearly really wanted to do it. But what my clients were really looking for and what I knew I needed as a professional hairstylist, like, really informed Rose today. And every product is this high, high performance and clean ingredients in sustainable packaging. Yeah.

[Jessica Matlin]

And it is. Yeah, it's in, like a metal. Either metal or glass.

[Mara Rosak]

Exactly. With Refills.

[Barb Thompson]

And the scent, you guys.

[Mara Rosak]

Exactly. Oh, yeah. The scent is really. The scent really gets people going.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah, the scent's beautiful. And you don't have a lot of superfluous products. It's a really lean and mean line. Okay, so let's talk. Let's get tactical and practical. Barb, you know, you've been very generous to me with advice over the years, because I tap you for advice sometimes. Hair advice. I'm like the shoemaker with no shoes. I write about hair. I write about hair, I talk about hair, I sell hair products. I do all the things in my career. My own hair brush and go. A little oil, a little cream. I cannot use a hot tool to save my life. But Barb has taught me some things. I think that hair is hard. And raise your hand at home if you think that hair is hard. I think I see you guys.

[Barb Thompson]

Hair is hard.

[Jessica Matlin]

It's really hard. You can't see in back of you. We're righties or we're lefties. It's hard. That's why blowout bars did so well for so long. Okay. It's hard. So you guys are both so good at this. Go look at their Instagrams if you haven't already. Everyone has just got that perfect. I hate this phrase, but it just works here. The cool girl hair. Kind of like what Hilary Duff has going today.

[Mara Rosak]

Yes, that Justine loop.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yes, yes. It's just like. It's just easy. And you work with all different textures of hair, but every tech, every time, every head of hair you work with is always just cool. It's not fussy, it's gorgeous. So I'm going to ask you, give us a few holy commandments. What can we do? Or what do we stop doing? Is it like, remember, Barb, you gave me a hot iron once and you were like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Put that down.

[Barb Thompson]

Whoa, whoa, whoa.

[Jessica Matlin]

Because I was using it like crazy. I was holding it the wrong way.

[Barb Thompson]

Start with a cold one. Yeah. Let's get the motions going.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah.

[Mara Rosak]

Yeah.

[Jessica Matlin]

What are some. Some tips for getting just gorgeous, easy hair? Let's start with a cut. What are some things we could tell our hairstylist?

[Mara Rosak]

I mean, one thing I would say is it's definitely about working with your texture, I think, rather than against it. And so the cut is that, too. I was just saying the best way to get the haircut you want is to actually look for, you know, people. Clients bring in photos, and those can be really, really helpful. But oftentimes it's just Like, I want to be this person. Okay, well, let's talk about what we're looking at here, and let's talk about you. And it's not that it's limiting at all, because I am not a believer in face shape or. And you can only have bangs if you have a square, like, whatever. No, it's really about your hair texture and hair type, and we want a haircut that works with that. Right. Otherwise, I'm going to give you a bob, and you're never going to know how to make it look as good as I made it look in the salon. So for me, I think it's about bringing in a photo and try to identify your texture and does this person look like they have similar hair to me?

[Jessica Matlin]

So face shape never worked for you, that women's magazine? Heart oval?

[Mara Rosak]

No.

[Jessica Matlin]

Okay.

[Mara Rosak]

It never did. Did it for you, Barbara?

[Barb Thompson]

No. I always would think that's kind of limiting and not truthful as well.

[Mara Rosak]

Yeah.

[Barb Thompson]

I don't know if you guys know this TikTok filter. Sorry to bring up social media already, but there's this TikTok filter that said you couldn't get a bob if the length of your neck to your shoulder to the chin was a certain length that.

[Mara Rosak]

Oh, my God.

[Barb Thompson]

10 out of 10. I agree, because I always look insane, and I failed on the filter on that. But other than that, I think you're good. But, yeah, I think the photo thing that Mara is talking about, I always would tell a client to put the thumb over the face.

[Jessica Matlin]

Put your thumb over your face over

[Barb Thompson]

the face in the photo that they bring in. And do you like the hair or do you like the outfit in the face that you're seeing?

[Mara Rosak]

Yes. Yes.

[Jessica Matlin]

Oh, that's clever. Yeah. It's like you get seduced by the look and the styling or that it's Emma Stone or that it's like Zoe Saldana or Anne Hathaway. It's the vibe. It's not so much the hair.

[Mara Rosak]

Exactly. And you really got to isolate those things because we're here to talk about hair.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah.

[Barb Thompson]

And Pinterest being AI now, I've had other hairdressers that I cut bring in AI photos, and I'm like, that's not real hair. So I think Pinterest is getting a little out of control. Jess. I'll send you some references. It's wild.

[Mara Rosak]

You could put them over the screen.

[Jessica Matlin]

That's interesting. I didn't even really think about that. Yeah, it's like. It's completely unrealistic expectations. What about that wavy texture. It sounds like I'm really hung up on Hilary Duff right now, but, like she's just really at the forefront of my mind. But that wavy texture. Justine Lupe or Loop. How do I pronounce her last name?

[Barb Thompson]

Justine Loop.

[Jessica Matlin]

Justine Loop. Okay. Yes. Justine Loop. She always has that great texture. Olivia Wilde, that kind of texture. How are we getting that? Because whenever I try that, it looks like a hot mess express. It just looks like I didn't. I don't know my way around a curling iron.

[Barb Thompson]

Justine Loop in particular is a unicorn. Like Mara. They just have this like dreamy thick mane of hair that to Rose's testament, I truly just will put in products to her hair and just tweak it a little bit. And sometimes we do like a full thing. But Justine's hair in particular, it has such memory that the more time I have with her, we get lost in the sauce. So truly, like, I'm like, less is more. Less is way more.

[Mara Rosak]

Yeah, you don't want to overthink those things too much. I do feel like some of those tools for at home use, I mean, I actually just bought a curling iron that Barb recommended.

[Jessica Matlin]

What is it?

[Mara Rosak]

It's like a really, really big, chunky 1.75, like almost a 2 inch barrel iron, which will give you that very loose iron bend.

[Jessica Matlin]

Which brand is it?

[Mara Rosak]

It's a T3.

[Jessica Matlin]

Okay. T3. 1.75. Is it round or is it square? Oh, it's round.

[Barb Thompson]

Round, yeah.

[Mara Rosak]

Yeah, exactly. It's a really big daddy. So, yeah, I think they called it

[Barb Thompson]

like the big handle or something. It's good. So I use that on Justine a lot.

[Jessica Matlin]

Okay, nice. And is there any product, obviously we know with the Rose products, but is there any kind of like other weird product or a spray or something unexpected that you would use or like a special brush to get that shine?

[Barb Thompson]

I really do also think for at home tools is a roller styler brush, like a hot round brush and blow dryer in one.

[Jessica Matlin]

Is there one that you like?

[Barb Thompson]

Not going to say the one you could get at a store, but T3, again, they have a beautiful one.

[Mara Rosak]

Yeah, I got that T3 one. It was good.

[Barb Thompson]

It's so good.

[Jessica Matlin]

What's good about it that is different than just your using a round brush and a blow dryer?

[Mara Rosak]

I think that's where people get stuck. They don't know how to do the brush and dryer together. Right. It's a little too much.

[Jessica Matlin]

This is. It's too much coordination. It's too much to Think about.

[Mara Rosak]

No, that's the word.

[Jessica Matlin]

It's a horrible brush.

[Mara Rosak]

Yes.

[Barb Thompson]

I'm really replaying Jess in the morning of our trip. Just like, what?

[Jessica Matlin]

I was like. I was like, who's there? Whose hand is that?

[Barb Thompson]

It's you, Jess. It's you.

[Jessica Matlin]

Oh, my God. It was. It was horrendous. It was horrendous.

[Barb Thompson]

I'm gonna definitely send photos from that for this.

[Jessica Matlin]

Oh, my God. It was so funny. It was so funny. So it kind of. It's like a shortcut, and it gives you the volume and it gives you the smoothness.

[Barb Thompson]

Exactly. The shine can really come out.

[Jessica Matlin]

Are there any hair accessories you would endorse? Because those can get a little funny sometimes. It could be a Baby Jane, like when I start putting, like, a bow in my hair. But, like, when I look at both of your work, I'm like, oh, that is tres elegant.

[Mara Rosak]

I know I'd love a vintage comb or, like, a vintage brooch of sorts, but I do. I think it's a fine line. Well, Barb and I, I think, will, like, occasionally frequent the trimming shop that has great ribbons and you can get every color. And I do love a bow. Right. But it's the time and the place, isn't it?

[Barb Thompson]

Totally. I feel like two holidays ago, if you didn't have a Jennifer Behr velvet ribbon with you, you're out. Yeah. And they're. I do love their headbands. Like, Jennifer Behr's products are gorgeous. But I think also just having a box full of ribbon and any kind of fabric that you could possibly need

[Jessica Matlin]

with you at all times, that's really fun. That's like a case for going to Michael's or the trimming shop in the city. Yeah. Amazing. Okay. And then you guys both spend your days with some of the most talented. I mean, I would have killed for an invite to that Mandy Moore birthday party.

[Mara Rosak]

Same.

[Jessica Matlin]

I mean, you are with some of the most talked about, buzzed about, talented, powerful women, entertainment. So you get access to see a side of them that nobody else does. And honestly, it does sound like fun. What have you learned from this very specific experience in both of your positions? And it could be something silly, like a recipe, a decorating tip, a fashion tip, or it could be something a little bit more profound. I'm going to give you an out with the easy one, but it's really a very particular perch from which you guys sit, spending all your time with these ladies.

[Mara Rosak]

I think the greatest gift has been really observing. I think energy plays such a huge role in our jobs. And you are entering a very intimate space with people. Right? And yes, these are our friends and people we really, really love. Both Barb and I, I would say, are very unique in that we have very close relationships with our clients. And that is such a gift because you get to really understand someone the way they like to show up in these quite vulnerable situations that we launch them out into the world to do. Right. Like before a big premiere or photo shoot, which these settings are not always the most comfortable for any human being, even them who do this all the time and they're pros at it. Right. But there's a lot of expectations and things. So anyway, I would say we get to show up and the energy we bring into the room, I believe is everything. And so for me, I've always been very mindful. Even if I'm having a crazy morning and I'm leaving my two cuckoo kids. When I'm getting in the car and I'm driving to go see a client, I check myself and just go, yeah, how am I entering in the room? And I think this is good for any relationship. You're going to your friend's house and do you want to walk in and unload all the things? I mean, sometimes yes, sometimes yes. And maybe we will eventually all have a crying moment because we've been traveling together for two weeks and you just gotta let it out and that happens. But I do mostly think having that emotional intuition and listening is really important for me.

[Barb Thompson]

Getting to assist Mara, I got to learn Mara's way of doing it. And when I assisted Kylie Heath, I got to see her energy. And when I assisted Clayton Hawkins, I got to see his energy. And when I assisted Jenny Cho, I got to see her energy. And the one thing I have learned from all of these, the top, top, top people, is reading that room, not making it about yourself. And truly just. I'm going to say it again, less is more, especially in the beginning. And now with some of the relationships I have with Justine Loop, I'm obsessed with her dog and I go there and it's like a reunion with her dog. And when I'm with Hilary Duff, we'll talk about skincare. It all kind of is shifting with each client. So I think and different days, sometimes it is more nerve wracking event. Or it could be just a quick do and go. So I think there's never get too comfortable because it is a job. And even if they are our friends, we're at work in that moment. Yeah.

[Mara Rosak]

Emotional intuition being key Critical and not everyone has it.

[Jessica Matlin]

That is really good feedback I think for anyone in any, any job and, you know, professional situation. That's great. Thank you. Let's take a quick pause and we're going to do the fat mascara.

[Barb Thompson]

5.

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[Jessica Matlin]

All right, it's time for the fat mascara 5. Our quick and dirty lightning round. Barb, I know you're from Northern California, but you. I'm sorry, you're very la. You got. You're very LA right now. What is the most LA thing both of you do? I'll let Barb go first.

[Mara Rosak]

Wait, should we answer for each other? Everything about me is la. I try to pretend like I was born my. I was born in New York. Yeah, right. I was like six months old when I moved to la.

[Barb Thompson]

Oh my gosh. Yeah. Answer that one for me because I don't even know what I do.

[Jessica Matlin]

Okay, Mara, what's the most LA thing about Barb?

[Mara Rosak]

I think maybe. I think Bags, her dog, is like a child. I don't know how people in NorCal do it, but I know how people in LA do it and they only go to the best whatever, groomer. And so I think maybe that.

[Barb Thompson]

I love that. Yeah, Bags makes me feel very la. Because in a small town, you can leave your dog in the backyard. He's primo. He gets picked up, dropped off, lights on, a soft music on the tv. Yeah, Bags is very elegant.

[Jessica Matlin]

This makes perfect. I know I'm not a dog owner, but that feels like nothing you're saying is over the top. This feels very reasonable. This feels baseline for a dog.

[Mara Rosak]

Yes. Meditation music.

[Jessica Matlin]

This is not my FM5.

[Barb Thompson]

Mara will call me. One time we were on, I think it was like an award show day, and we just did a phone call at the end and 25 minutes into our conversation, she's like, what is that music in the background? And I was kind of in my hairstylist. I don't need anything. But it was like calming meditation dog music. So now I just send her photos of Bags listening to it.

[Jessica Matlin]

Standard. Standard.

[Barb Thompson]

Oh, I totally have Mara's LA thing. And this is going to be really sad because I don't think this is going to come out in time, but Mara has a rose smoothie at Erewhon right now. That, like, that is la.

[Jessica Matlin]

I mean, that's like getting a sandwich named after you at Carnegie Deli or something.

[Barb Thompson]

It is the pinnacle. I mean, and it tastes so good. They need to keep it if they're smart. Erewhon.

[Mara Rosak]

Keep it.

[Barb Thompson]

The crowd's going wild.

[Jessica Matlin]

The crowd's going wild. Well, I'd love. I'd love to try it. That's awesome.

[Mara Rosak]

I know. We gotta get it to New York. I wish I could ship it to you.

[Jessica Matlin]

That's incredible. Okay, what is the first beauty product you both fell in love with? You'll have to answer one for yourselves.

[Barb Thompson]

Mine's so gross.

[Jessica Matlin]

What is it?

[Barb Thompson]

The Smackers soda flavored Chapstick.

[Jessica Matlin]

Isn't that gross? That's cool.

[Mara Rosak]

Yes. But that's bringing me back to a time 100. Like myself and all my girlfriends had this horrible cotton candy, like very 90s cotton candy body spray. I don't even know. It was like in a pink Juicy tube type bottle. I don't even know, but it was. It was all the rage.

[Jessica Matlin]

Is there a hair trend moment that you were just like, nah.

[Mara Rosak]

Yeah, I don't understand these bobs with short layers. I'm sorry. I can't get behind it. It's all over everywhere. Unless you are the most. Like, it doesn't matter. You're a model. You look like Hailey Bieber. You can do anything, but anybody else looks like a newscaster. There is no. I do not understand a bob with the fringe. I can't get behind it. And I'm seeing it all over. And I'm seeing it mostly like, I asked for this haircut and I got this haircut.

[Jessica Matlin]

But, yeah, hair trend or like a hair moment.

[Barb Thompson]

My kryptonite is hair tinsel. Not only do I not like it, but it's so hard. A couple years ago during the holidays, I couldn't. I was like Jess with a curling iron.

[Mara Rosak]

Like, somebody had it. Somebody had it in their hair and you had to work with it.

[Barb Thompson]

I was trying to do it for the holiday look and I had a camera going and I couldn't figure it out. It's really hard. So no for me. No for me. Don't come back.

[Mara Rosak]

Yeah, no for me, too.

[Barb Thompson]

Yeah.

[Jessica Matlin]

Okay. What is your must have desert island beauty product always in your bag? Forget we're not doing hair products right now. What is your must have makeup product that's always in your bag?

[Mara Rosak]

I have one. I have this drugs, French pharmacy Chapstick called Homeoplasmine. You know when you get that, like, dry lip that just. Nothing. It's almost like something burned your lips.

[Jessica Matlin]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Mara Rosak]

This stuff is the only stuff that will fix it. And I use it every day, multiple times a day. I love it.

[Jessica Matlin]

All right. Barb and Mara together. I mean, one plus one equals three sometimes. So I think that the two of them are just. They really inspire me. And a couple of good takeaways. Not only some great product recommendations, but I really. They left. They left me some good things to think about. So tell me if you enjoyed the episode. Who else do you want to hear on the show? What dynamic duos do you want to hear from? Would love to hear your suggestions. Loving putting these pairings together. Let me know what you think. Jessatmascara.com or infoatmascara.com Send me a note. All right, hope you guys have a good week and I'll see you Wednesday. Thank you for listening to Fat Mascara. If you like the show, consider giving us a rating and review on itunes, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts. This helps other people find the show. All of us on social atmosphere Mascara. And email me at infoatmascara. I would love to hear from you and to shop the products heard on the episode. Check out Fat Mascara on Shop My Shell. This show is produced by Red Rock Music. I'll see you next time. Premiere hosts on VRBO deliver quality vacation rental stays with fast responses and clear instructions. Oh, I had a question, our host replied. Super quick Premier move.

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