Introducing... Final Thoughts: Jerry Springer

Summary

Summary of "Fiasco" Episode: Introducing... Final Thoughts: Jerry Springer

Final Thoughts: Jerry Springer, an episode from Pushkin Industries' Fiasco series hosted by Leon Neyfakh, delves into the complex transformation of Jerry Springer from a progressive Midwestern politician to the host of one of America's most controversial daytime talk shows. This detailed exploration uncovers the pivotal moments, personal choices, and societal influences that shaped Springer's divergent career paths.

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1. Introduction to the Series and Episode

Leon Neyfakh sets the stage by introducing Final Thoughts: Jerry Springer, an Audible original series produced in collaboration with Prologue Projects. The episode aims to unravel the story of Jerry Springer, highlighting his unexpected transition from a respected politician to a symbol of sensationalist television.

Leon Neyfakh [00:00]: "Hey, fiasco listeners, it's Leon Neyfakh. I'm here to tell you about a brand new series from me and prologue projects."

2. The Controversial Jerry Springer Show

The episode begins by contextualizing the infamous Jerry Springer Show, notorious for its outrageous guests and shocking on-air confrontations. Springer, often perceived as merely a referee to the chaos, is portrayed as having a deeper, more complex professional background.

Leon Neyfakh [03:14]: "The Jerry Springer show wasn't just a television show. It was an international phenomenon that to many represented nothing less than the decline of Western civilization."

Notable moments from the show are highlighted, such as Evelyn Springer Strout professing to be pregnant by her brother and guests revealing hidden truths about their lives. Springer’s closing remarks often offered moral lessons, showcasing a side of him aiming for depth amidst the spectacle.

Jerry Springer [04:50]: "Yes, you want the person you love to love you back. But they're not loving you back if they don't know the real you."

3. The 1999 Chicago City Council Hearing

A significant portion of the episode focuses on Jerry Springer’s 1999 appearance before the Chicago City Council. This hearing scrutinized the authenticity and ethical implications of the violence portrayed on his show. Alderman Ed Burke spearheaded the resolution challenging the legitimacy of the show's confrontations.

Ed Burke [06:08]: "If it's a crime to slap your wife on Soldier Field, then it's a crime to slap your wife on the stage at the Springer show."

Springer's demeanor during the hearing contrasted sharply with Burke's confrontational approach. Despite facing intense questioning, Springer remained composed, leveraging his political acumen to navigate the tribunal.

Jerry Springer [10:10]: "We have to be very careful here. You're the government and this is America... I was polite enough."

The hearing concluded without significant repercussions for Springer, ultimately enhancing his public image and solidifying his position in the entertainment industry.

4. Jerry Springer’s Political Roots

To understand Springer's transformation, the episode delves into his early political career in Cincinnati, Ohio. Before his television fame, Springer was a city councilman known for his progressive policies and charismatic leadership.

Justin Richmond [15:29]: "The answers to the problems which currently plague our cities... are to be found in the hearts, minds and resources of our own people here at home."

Springer’s tenure on the city council was marked by initiatives aimed at improving public transportation and reforming the city's jail system. His hands-on approach, such as spending a night in the dilapidated city jail to highlight its deficiencies, demonstrated his commitment to civic improvement.

Jerry Springer [36:19]: "They recognize the need for rehabilitation programs, that you can't just build walls and have a prison, and they need our help."

5. The Turning Point: From Politician to TV Host

The podcast explores the factors that led Springer to pivot from politics to television. Despite his success and rising popularity in Cincinnati politics, Springer’s ambition drove him towards a larger platform.

Leon Neyfakh [17:07]: "He was a moralist, but also a nihilist, a comedian, but also a foreign policy wonky, the host of the so-called worst TV show of all time."

His ability to engage and entertain, honed during his political campaigns, seamlessly translated to his television persona. The audacious nature of his show, combined with his political finesse, positioned Springer uniquely in the media landscape.

6. Public Perception and Cultural Impact

Final Thoughts: Jerry Springer assesses the lasting impact of the Jerry Springer Show on American culture and politics. The show's blend of sensationalism and underlying social messages influenced public discourse and media standards.

Leon Neyfakh [16:17]: "Whether or not you find yourself compelled by the righteous aldermen of the Chicago City Council, it doesn't seem crazy to think that this globally iconic show had a real impact on how people treat each other and talk to each other."

The episode suggests that Springer's show normalized public confrontations and personal revelations, potentially paving the way for more abrasive political rhetoric in the subsequent decades.

Leon Neyfakh [16:51]: "It also doesn't seem crazy to suggest that Springer softened the ground for... Donald Trump's strategy, which is scorched earth."

7. Legacy and Final Reflections

Concluding the episode, Neyfakh reflects on Jerry Springer's multifaceted legacy. Springer is remembered not just for his television persona but also for his earlier contributions to politics and social issues.

Leon Neyfakh [17:51]: "Behind the joke was a life guided by conflicting ambitions and values that even some of Springer's closest friends didn't know how to reconcile."

The narrative underscores the complexity of Springer's character—a man torn between his political ideals and the allure of mass media, ultimately leaving an indelible mark on both arenas.

8. Conclusion

Final Thoughts: Jerry Springer offers a comprehensive examination of Jerry Springer's unlikely journey from a progressive city councilman to a symbol of sensationalist television. Through detailed storytelling and insightful analysis, the episode paints a nuanced portrait of a man whose choices significantly influenced American media and political culture.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Leon Neyfakh [03:14]: "The Jerry Springer show wasn't just a television show. It was an international phenomenon that to many represented nothing less than the decline of Western civilization."

• Jerry Springer [04:50]: "Yes, you want the person you love to love you back. But they're not loving you back if they don't know the real you."

• Ed Burke [06:08]: "If it's a crime to slap your wife on Soldier Field, then it's a crime to slap your wife on the stage at the Springer show."

• Jerry Springer [10:10]: "We have to be very careful here. You're the government and this is America... I was polite enough."

• Justin Richmond [15:29]: "The answers to the problems which currently plague our cities... are to be found in the hearts, minds and resources of our own people here at home."

• Leon Neyfakh [17:07]: "He was a moralist, but also a nihilist, a comedian, but also a foreign policy wonky, the host of the so-called worst TV show of all time."

• Leon Neyfakh [16:51]: "It also doesn't seem crazy to suggest that Springer softened the ground for... Donald Trump's strategy, which is scorched earth."

• Leon Neyfakh [17:51]: "Behind the joke was a life guided by conflicting ambitions and values that even some of Springer's closest friends didn't know how to reconcile."

This episode serves as a compelling case study of how individual ambition, public perception, and societal trends intertwine to shape a public figure's legacy.

Transcript

[Leon Nayfak]

Foreign.

[Justin Richmond]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Leon Nayfak]

This is Justin Richmond from Broken Record. The three things I love about summer are pool days, blaring, all the new summer songs that come out, and endless refreshing iced drinks from Starbucks. Even better, my favorite summer drink has returned to Starbucks. The Summer Berry Refresher is available now. A mix of berry flavors shaken with ice and poured over raspberry flavored pearls. It's light, vibrant, and just as refreshing as the summer fun you'll be having. So queue up your playlist and head over to Starbucks to check out their summer menu. There's something for everyone, from creamy cold brews to ice cold refreshers. Your summer Berry Refresher is ready at Starbucks. Hey, fiasco listeners, it's Leon Nayfak. I'm here to tell you about a brand new series from me and prologue projects. An Audible original series called Final Jerry Springer, the story of a television show that changed the world and the man who gave it his name. You may think you know Jerry Springer, the TV host who presided over America's most controversial daytime Talk show for 27 years. In that time, Springer became synonymous with outrageous guests, taboo confessions, and vicious onstage fighting. But did you know that before the Jerry Springer show made him notorious all over the world, Springer was something else entirely. A respected Midwestern politician, the progressive mayor of a major Rust Belt city, a man many saw as a future leader in democratic politics. How did this idealistic rising star with his lofty political ambitions take a turn in such a radically different direction? If you're curious, keep listening to get a sneak peek at the first two episodes of Final Thoughts, Jerry Springer. To listen to the full series, just search for Final Thoughts Jerry Springer on the Audible app or go to audible.com Springer if you don't have an Audible subscription, you can sign up for a free 30 day trial and start listening today. Now onto the show. Will you state your name for the record, please?

[Jerry Springer]

My name is Jerry Springer.

[Leon Nayfak]

Will you spell your last name? But according to.

[Jerry Springer]

Oh, I understand. S P, R I, N G, E.

[Leon Nayfak]

R. Okay, and the first. On June 4, 1999, the Chicago City Council chambers turned into a stage. It was a full house. Even the balcony seats were taken, and multiple cable networks were broadcasting the proceedings live. At the center of it all was a man in surprisingly good spirits for someone who had been dragged in front of a government tribunal to answer for his sins.

[Ed Burke]

And Mr. Springer, what is your business or occupation?

[Jerry Springer]

I host a television show. It's called the Jerry Springer Show.

[Leon Nayfak]

As everyone in the room knew, the Jerry Springer show wasn't just a television show. It was an international phenomenon that to many represented nothing less than the decline of Western civilization. It was the first talk show in over a decade to beat Oprah in the ratings. And its reputation as one of the trashiest, ugliest, most depraved shows in the history of TV was uncontested.

[Jerry Springer]

Tell us about this bizarre relationship you have.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

Well, I'm pregnant by my brother.

[Leon Nayfak]

On any given day you could tune in to see a mother, daughter, dominatrix duo. A man finding out his girlfriend is a prostitute and that she's sleeping with his brother. Or someone confessing to their fiance that they've been lying about their gender.

[Jerry Springer]

What is it that you've been keeping from him?

[Justin Richmond]

That I'm a transsexual.

[Leon Nayfak]

The week of the hearing in Chicago, viewers were introduced to a man who wore diapers on dates.

[Jerry Springer]

You wear diapers every day.

[Leon Nayfak]

Every day gets a chance without getting in trouble. Most days the show followed a predictable format with a big reveal setting things in motion. I slept with your sister. Followed by a confrontation that often turned obscene, not to mention physical. Conducting this circus day after day was Jerry Springer, who had crafted an image of a mild mannered, sometimes self deprecating host whose job was merely to referee the on screen chaos. He ended each show with a final thought, a brief friendly commentary offering up the moral of the story.

[Jerry Springer]

Yes, you want the person you love to love you back. But they're not loving you back if they don't know the real you. They are simply loving who you're pretending to be. That's pretty empty. Till next time, take care of yourself and each other.

[Leon Nayfak]

Springer was a ripe target. In 1999, less than a month before he was invited to appear in front of the Chicago City Council, two teenagers had carried out a mass shooting at Columbine High School in Colorado. In the aftermath, as people tried to understand how such a terrible thing could have happened, Springer's name came up when filing a lawsuit against the parents of the shooters. A lawyer representing a victim's family lamented that our children were being raised by Jerry Springer. And the Internet news programs quoted teachers venting about Springer's influence in their classrooms.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

So many of my students love Jerry Springer and what does he encourage? You have a problem with somebody you throw your fist around, you slam a chair over their head or you curse them out.

[Leon Nayfak]

Springer's appearance before the city council was technically part of a hearing of the police and fire committee. Springer, whose show was taped in Chicago, was on the agenda because he had attracted the ire of a former cop turned alderman named Ed Burke.

[Ed Burke]

If it's a crime to slap your wife at Sox park or Soldier Field, then it's a crime to slap your wife on the stage at the Springer show.

[Leon Nayfak]

In a formal resolution, Burke argued that if the fights happening on the set of Springer's show were real, then guests should be getting arrested for assault. And if the fights weren't real, that is. If the Jerry Springer show was fake, then Springer should admit it and file for an entertainment license to film in Chicago. The day of the council hearing, a diverse crowd of mostly young people gathered outside City hall and chanted Springer's name.

[Jerry Springer]

Jerry.

[Leon Nayfak]

Jerry. Some of the more vocal Jerry fans on the scene told reporters they were part of a group called PETS People for the Ethical Treatment of Springer. They carried signs saying Support Springer and fight for free speech, while a single counter protester dressed in a clergy robe shouted, Jesus is coming and Jerry must go. Earlier that morning, a 55 year old Jerry Springer had approached City hall sporting a slick suit and tie and a big grin. There were camera crews from all over the world clamoring for a shot of Springer on his way into the hearing. He looked almost bashful at all the attention, but it was obvious he was eating it up.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

Do you feel your reputation's on the line?

[Jerry Springer]

My reputation? You know, just don't worry about my reputation. That's gone.

[Leon Nayfak]

How do you feel about the City.

[Jerry Springer]

Council calling you here? Do you think there was a necessity to do this? That's there to say I'm honored, You know, they want to invite me. That's great. It's not my life.

[Leon Nayfak]

It's television. When he finally entered the chambers, he was met with thunderous applause from spectators. And as he made his way to his seat, he shook the hands of each and every alderman like a politician maneuvering a rope line. It quickly became clear that Alderman Burke didn't have much support from the rest of the City Council. Only one of his colleagues had endorsed his resolution. And the chair of the council, William Beavers, seemed to question the point of the hearing. It's a waste of time. Yes, it is. But because the resolution was introduced and sent to my committee for a hearing, I have to give them a hearing. So Burke would be Springer's chief antagonist. As he kicked off his line of questioning, the tension began to simmer immediately.

[Ed Burke]

You are a resident of the City of Chicago, I believe?

[Leon Nayfak]

Yes.

[Ed Burke]

And where is your residence?

[Jerry Springer]

I live in the Hancock Building.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

Okay.

[Ed Burke]

What's the address, sir?

[Jerry Springer]

175. Well, I don't want to tell everyone.

[Leon Nayfak]

Despite Springer's objections, Burke went ahead and read his home address into the record.

[Jerry Springer]

You know where I live?

[Ed Burke]

I believe you did say, Mr. Witness. You live at the Hancock.

[Jerry Springer]

You can call me Mr. Springer or Jerry. Yes, I live in the Hancock building.

[Ed Burke]

And the address of the Hancock Building is 175East Delaware, isn't it?

[Guy Guckenberger]

Yeah.

[Jerry Springer]

Thank you very much.

[Leon Nayfak]

This interaction set the tone for the sarcastic back and forth that would continue for several more hours.

[Ed Burke]

And are you also a licensed attorney?

[Jerry Springer]

I don't practice now, but yes, I. In fact, I graduated law school here at Northwestern University.

[Ed Burke]

Northwestern University. Very prestigious Chicago Law School.

[Jerry Springer]

At this point, I suspect they're trying to destroy all my records.

[Leon Nayfak]

But even though Alderman Burke had called the hearing, he soon found himself on the defensive when he pushed Springer to reveal how long his contract was for and how much it was worth. Chairman Beavers came to Springer's defense. Alderman Burke, what does this have to do with the resolution?

[Jerry Springer]

Yeah.

[Leon Nayfak]

Can you show me what you're trying to do?

[Ed Burke]

I think the relevancy, Mr. Chairman, would go to who actually has control over the product and who controls what happens on the soundstage over at NBC Tower.

[Leon Nayfak]

Well, why don't you ask him that? When Burke kept pushing, Springer got serious.

[Jerry Springer]

We have to be very careful here. You're the government and this is America. And I don't mind coming here talking to you about my show. You can ask me questions. Do you think the fights are real? Are they fake? You can all that's fair discussion, but be careful. I don't work for you, sir. I really don't. And that isn't. I'm being. I'm trying to be very respectful. But you're not the boss. You know, I was polite enough.

[Leon Nayfak]

While Burke sputtered, Springer came off as comfortable and confident, self deprecating about both himself and his show, but also fiery and sharp.

[Ed Burke]

So you don't know who it is that owns the entity that employs you?

[Jerry Springer]

I get up in the morning, I go to work, I do my warm up jokes, just give you a couple of them later on. Then we do the show, we have a good time, and we go home. And I know where I get my paycheck.

[Ed Burke]

So long as your paycheck comes in, that's all you are concerned with.

[Jerry Springer]

My concern in life is to be a good human being, is to be a loyal employee, is to work hard for the paycheck that I get in this particular job, is to provide an entertaining show, is to please my fans. And be a good human being. Those are my concerns. Do I like getting paid? Yeah, I enjoy getting paid. I didn't think that was un American. I enjoy it.

[Leon Nayfak]

After an hour and 42 minutes, the hearing finally got to the heart of Burke's complaint. The fighting. Everyone wanted to know, were Springer's guests actually trying to hurt each other or were they just putting on a show?

[Tim Burke]

Mr. Springer, is the violence on your.

[Jerry Springer]

Show staged or real? It looks real to me.

[Tim Burke]

Is the violence, and I mean the.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Punching, the kicking, the swearing, the pulling.

[Jerry Springer]

Of clothes, the pulling people down and.

[Tim Burke]

Wrestling them to the ground, is that.

[Leon Nayfak]

Encouraged by your producers?

[Jerry Springer]

I certainly hope not, no.

[Leon Nayfak]

The council members seemed frustrated by Springer's hedging on this point. An alderman named Burt Nateris tried to pin Springer down on what he thought his show was achieving.

[Ed Burke]

What is the purpose really of your program? What are you trying to do? Are you trying to change society? Are you trying to be humorous? Are you trying to change, show people how life really is? Are you trying to give employment to would be actors? I mean, what. What is the purpose of your show?

[Jerry Springer]

The purpose? I have said this so many times publicly. I think it's a silly, crazy, outrageous show. I think it's chewing gum. I think the world will be fine with it. The world will be fine without it. Just talk to your friends, because every single one of you here has someone you deeply respect in your life that if under oath, would have to admit that once in a while they'd watch the show. Not a person that you think is sick, not a person that you think is going to go to hell. Just a regular person. It could be.

[Leon Nayfak]

Then Neteris acknowledged the obvious, that a huge driver of Springer's success was the show's transgressive nature. The more hand wringing and moralizing there was about it, the better its ratings would likely be.

[Ed Burke]

Don't you think that the city council really has done you a big favor today? Well, yeah, but you know what? You know what's going to happen as a result of these hearings, and I think they're being televised all over the world. By the number of cameras we have here, I think your ratings are going to go up, you know, up my. I think that's why you came here. I think that's why you came here today. I don't think you came here out of any respect for this body or the people asking the questions. And I personally think you probably think we're a bunch of sanctimonious buffoons, which.

[Leon Nayfak]

Were not, after nearly three hours. The hearing came to an end and the throngs of press followed Springer out into the hallway to get his reaction.

[Jerry Springer]

I make no excuses for the show. I'm not running away from it. It's my show. It's got my name on it. That's why I showed up. I'm not going to say, oh, it's not my business. It's my business. I enjoy doing. I love doing it. I love doing it.

[Leon Nayfak]

Do you have any way to change anything? That evening, Springer hosted his first ever pay per view event. For $699, viewers could watch uncensored clips and outtakes from the show. It was an extension of Springer's lucrative collection of Too Hot for TV VHS tapes.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

Hi, I'm from the Big Apple and.

[Leon Nayfak]

I'd like to be Miss Topless America because there's more than just big apples in these things. In the end, the Jerry spra wasn't forced to get an entertainment license or to arrest its guests. The council resolution was tabled and taken under advisement. By most accounts, Springer had come out of the hearing on top.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Who won here?

[Ed Burke]

City council or Jerry Springer?

[Leon Nayfak]

Oh, clearly Jerry Springer. Springer had come off in the hearing not as an air headed talk show host or a Hollywood lightweight, but as a seasoned politician. And that's because he was back in the 70s. Long before the Jerry Springer show debuted. He was a city councilman himself in Cincinnati, Ohio, where he was widely regarded as a rising star in the Democratic Party.

[Justin Richmond]

The answers to the problems which currently plague our cities, our towns and our homes are to be found in the hearts, minds and resources of our own people here at home.

[Leon Nayfak]

Springer also knew how to deliver a perfect sound bite for the cameras. Having spent nearly a decade as a local news anchor and an Emmy Award winning TV journalist.

[Justin Richmond]

Good evening. The message tonight from the folks who.

[Jerry Springer]

Live and work in the east end of Cincinnati was loud and clear. No more benzene, period.

[Leon Nayfak]

And yet, the job Springer held longer than any other, the job he chose to devote his life to, was hosting the Jerry Springer Show. The show ran for 27 years and banked nearly 4,000 episodes before it finally stopped taping in 2018.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Since then, a lot of people have.

[Leon Nayfak]

Wondered what mark the show left on us, on our culture and on our politics. Whether or not you find yourself compelled by the righteous aldermen of the Chicago City Council, it doesn't seem crazy to think that this globally iconic show had a real impact on how people treat each other and talk to each other and what sorts of things we're willing to share in public about our private lives. It also doesn't seem crazy to suggest that Springer softened the ground for, well, you know, Donald Trump's strategy, which is scorched earth.

[Jerry Springer]

You think the Jerry Springer show is tasteless?

[Leon Nayfak]

I mean, this is the Jerry Springer show of politics. The year before the Chicago city council hearing, Springer published an autobiography called Ringmaster.

[Guy Guckenberger]

At the beginning of the book, Springer.

[Leon Nayfak]

Envisions himself at the pearly gates, face to face with God. The premise is that Springer will tell God his life story and God will decide whether he belongs in heaven or hell. In the end, God let Springer go back down to earth, proclaiming him an unfinished work and urging him to keep fighting the good fight against elitists who would suppress freedom. When Jerry Springer died In April of 2023, the first line of his New York Times obituary credited him with setting a new standard for tawdriness on American television.

[Guy Guckenberger]

It closed with a quote from Springer.

[Leon Nayfak]

If I get to heaven, we're all going. Behind the joke was a life guided by conflicting ambitions and values that even some of Springer's closest friends didn't know how to reconcile. He was a moralist, but also a nihilist, a comedian, but also a foreign policy wonky, the host of the so called worst TV show of all time, and a would be leader of men who dreamed of making a positive impact on the world.

[Guy Guckenberger]

So what impact did Jerry Springer make on the world? What did his show do to the people who watched it, not to mention the people who were on it and the people who helped make it. The Jerry Springer show is television without its makeup on. It is no different than anything else on TV other than we are not trying to make ourselves pretty.

[Leon Nayfak]

A lot of people wanted to come.

[Jerry Springer]

On the Jerry Springer show and a.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Lot of people wanted to watch it.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

So what do I have to be ashamed of?

[Guy Guckenberger]

Whether you like it or not, this show stuck with us. It hit a nerve and lodged itself into our collective memory.

[Leon Nayfak]

Even if you never watched it, you.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Remember it and recognize it as a step along the way to wherever we are.

[Leon Nayfak]

Now how did that happen?

[Guy Guckenberger]

And how did Jerry Springer of all people turn out to be the guy who led us down that road?

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

He is certainly one of the many co conspirators of the world I think.

[Guy Guckenberger]

We live in now.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

I don't blame him for it, but was he a participant in it and a co conspirator in it?

[Leon Nayfak]

Absolutely.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

From the Jerry Springer that I heard about, that was mayor and other things he was about to the Jerry Springer that I saw on the show, it was like two different people.

[Leon Nayfak]

Our goal in this series is not to render judgment on whether Jerry Springer deserved to go to hell for his TV show or even to try to resolve his apparent contradictions. Rather, it's to tell a story about choices. How we make them, how we justify them to ourselves, and how we transcend them or don't.

[Tim Burke]

Foreign.

[Leon Nayfak]

I'm Leon Nayfak. From audible originals and prologue projects, this is Final Thoughts. Jerry Springer.

[Justin Richmond]

I run because it has become increasingly evident that unless some new alternative, some new initiative, some new approach is injected into the political life of our community, we are destined to lose here at home the very prize we seek to defend abroad. The politics of participation.

[Leon Nayfak]

This is Jerry Springer at the age of 25. At the time of this recording, he had just made the surprising, some might say arrogant, decision to run for Congress in Ohio. Springer had only recently moved to Cincinnati to work at a local law firm. He looked like a classic carpetbagger. And this alone made the Congressional run an uphill climb. But it got even worse. Springer was also a liberal, a progressive even, and he had decided to run in a very conservative district where he would be competing against a five term Republican incumbent.

[Justin Richmond]

My campaign is based upon the proposition that the answers to the problems which currently plague our cities, our towns and our homes are not to be found in the decisions in Washington. They are instead to be found in the hearts, minds and resources of our own people here at home.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

The intonation was exactly Robert F. Kennedy.

[Guy Guckenberger]

It was a slight queen's accent.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

It was a slight Queen's accent, right?

[Guy Guckenberger]

Evelyn Springer Strout wasn't surprised to see that her little brother was in a hurry to run for office. Gerald, as she still calls him, had worked for RFK's presidential campaign before moving to Cincinnati. And long before that, he had absorbed his family's passion for liberal politics. At the dinner table.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

We always discussed politics at the table. I mean, because we wanted to assimilate. We always discussed how life was in Europe versus it is in America and how grateful we were to be here. The one thing my father always asked was, what did you learn of America today?

[Guy Guckenberger]

For young Evelyn and Gerald, this question what did you learn of America today? Was a matter of survival. Their parents had escaped Nazi Germany in 1939, just weeks before the start of World War II. The family then spent a decade living in London, where both kids were born, before taking the Queen Mary across the Atlantic to New York. They first moved into a hotel in Manhattan, which had been converted into housing for refugees and concentration camp survivors. Eventually they settled in the working class community of Kew Gardens, Queens. Evelyn and Gerald's parents rarely talked directly about the Holocaust or the grandparents, uncles, aunts and cousins who had been killed in the camps. But it was clear that their experience under the ultra right wing Nazi regime had shaped their politics.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

My parents were very big advocates for Jack Kennedy. I mean, they were always liberal, no question.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Evelyn says her brother had plenty of opinions of his own, political and otherwise.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

He would stand on a table in the hallway and start pontificating and start giving speeches. I mean, he was maybe 7 years old, 8 years old, and every time we would pass by we would have to stop and listen and if we didn't, we would get so. I mean, that was already the beginning of his love of talking, of telling people things. And he was funny.

[Leon Nayfak]

It was nearly two decades later that Springer decided to seek out a bigger table to stand on by running for Congress in Ohio. The same week he announced his run, he was called up to the Army Reserves as part of the Vietnam War effort.

[Justin Richmond]

My name's Jerry Springer and I'm currently serving in the United States Army Reserve at Fort Knox, Kentucky.

[Leon Nayfak]

At the time, the voting age in most states was 21, which meant that 18, 19 and 20 year olds could be drafted but didn't have the right to vote. Springer had gotten involved in an effort to lower the voting age in Ohio. After moving to Cincinnati in the middle of his congressional campaign, he was invited to Washington D.C. to testify on the issue before the Senate.

[Justin Richmond]

Imagine that. I could take a few minutes here and discuss the merits of 18 year old. As a voter.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Sitting in front of a panel of lawmakers, Springer sported a military crew cut and a dark suit. He had several sheets of paper laid out in front of him, but he barely glanced down at them as he spoke. Unlike the politicians he was addressing, Springer had lived with the possibility that his draft number would be pulled and the impossibility of doing anything about it at the ballot box.

[Justin Richmond]

18 year olds pay taxes. 18 year olds are considered adults before courts of criminal law, and 18 year olds can fight and die for their country. Yet despite all these responsibilities which our young people have, it is only the 1 or 2% who protest and riot. It is only they who have any political voice because we respond to violence.

[Guy Guckenberger]

The 26th Amendment was the fastest amendment to ever work its way through government. It passed in just over three months. It also helped Jerry Springer fast track his political career. After leaving boot camp and returning to his congressional campaign, Springer sailed Through the democratic primary. And even though he ended up losing in the general election, a few months later, he put up an impressive challenge to the incumbent Republican, getting 44% of the vote, far more than anyone expected.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

We thought it was great. We thought, my gosh, you know, get into the politics of this country would be terrific.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Springer's family watched his forays into Ohio politics from the east coast. They were supportive and excited. It felt right that their Gerald was making a career out of talking to strangers.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

He's an entertainer. I mean, he knows how to entertain and he knows how to carry a crowd. He knows those things.

[Leon Nayfak]

Where'd he learn that that was innate?

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

From the table. Where he started pontificating. That's where he learned it.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Evelyn knew that her brother's congressional run was just the beginning. It was clear to her that he would continue to seek out more tables to stand on.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

Every entertainer and everyone in public life, Politicians particularly, like, you know, the attention that they get. Otherwise, they wouldn't do it. I mean, that's human nature. Some take it too far and then sacrifice what they believe in for the people, and some can, you know, tame it.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Jerry Springer would spend much of his life fighting for and winning the attention of strangers around the world. For now, he would be satisfied with just getting the people of Cincinnati to like him.

[Leon Nayfak]

What would it take for this outsider, this jewish liberal from Queens, to win over a struggling rust belt city?

[Guy Guckenberger]

People in Cincinnati talked about him, his political talents and his charisma, like equivalent of Bill Clinton.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

They said, well, maybe, but he was better than Bill Clinton. He was my brother.

[Guy Guckenberger]

I'm Leon nayfak. From audible originals and prologue projects, this is final thoughts. Jerry Springer.

[Leon Nayfak]

Chapter 2 the Idealist John Snow was 24 years old and working in construction when he first met Jerry Springer at a bar near the university of Cincinnati.

[Tim Burke]

He kind of looked unkempt a little bit. And God, his hair, it was too long, and it didn't, you know, and it kind of went one way and then the other.

[Leon Nayfak]

It was 1971. On the heels of his failed congressional bid, Springer was running for a seat on Cincinnati city council.

[Tim Burke]

The boss of my union said, hey, we're supporting this guy for city council. You need to meet him.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Snow found Springer charismatic, and he liked what he had to say. So when Springer's campaign manager offered him a job, Snow took it.

[Tim Burke]

So I went to work for Jerry Springer. I was his body man.

[Leon Nayfak]

A body man is kind of like a personal aid. Part assistant, part driver. Snow, who looks like Santa, crossed with a pro Wrestler was also a kind of de facto bodyguard. But his most important job on the campaign was to shepherd Springer from event to event and try to keep him on schedule.

[Tim Burke]

When you're in a conversation and it's time to go to the next event, I'm the guy that says, we gotta go, Jerry. And, you know, he feigns like, oh, God, no, we can stay. No, come on, come on.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Snow's role was especially important because of Springer's relentless campaign schedule. His congressional run had earned him the attention of local Democratic party officials, but a lot of voters in Cincinnati still hadn't heard of him. So Springer threw himself into the work of introducing himself and showing up at every venue in the city that would have him.

[Tim Burke]

God, it was a schedule that would kill you. I'd pick him up at 6 in the morning, first thing. We'd grab a coffee, we'd get a, you know, get it rolling. We're gone all day. I mean, 6:30, Western Hills Bowl. All the women are up there bowling and Jerry's, you know, they're, hi, I'm Jerry Springer. I'm up at the bar drinking more coffee. And I know this day is not going to end till midnight.

[Leon Nayfak]

We actually found a stack of Springer's old daily agendas from his city council campaigns. On one Saturday alone, he attended a local civics meeting, a neighborhood festival, two parades and a college football game. He then went to a wedding and a high school fair and closed out the day with a tow, a thon, a church dinner banquet, a cocktail party and a visit to a local democratic club.

[Tim Burke]

And it was. We'd be done about 11, 12 o' clock at night. And the next morning it started again.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Springer was running for one of nine spots on the Cincinnati city Council. There were a total of 19 candidates. And because it was an at large race, Springer was running against all of them. If he could break into the top nine on election day, he would get a seat. Most of Springer's rivals in the 1971 race were people who had run multiple times before. To have any chance at all at getting enough votes, Springer had to work twice as hard as them. It helped that voters seemed to love him. They didn't even see him as an outsider.

[Tim Burke]

I could hear women talking to each other. Oh, God, Myrtle. He went to school with Jerry at Elder High School. Oh, he went to school with him at Oak. He's from Kew Gardens, New York. I mean, and I didn't correct him. They said, well, you know, oh, he did. Oh, God, when did he graduate? All the same years. Marvin, you know, they all thought he was from Cincinnati. That was Jerry. He was my nemesis, I thought because he was so articulate and so convincing and you would argue a poem and he would counterpoint and you'd say, oh my God, I wish he'd stop.

[Leon Nayfak]

Guy Guckenberger was another young candidate in the city council race. Though he was a Republican, the fact that he and Springer were Both in their 20s meant they had a lot in common.

[Tim Burke]

I mean, that was the person I felt I was competing against. If he can do it, I can do it. We were the only two people that were that age. All the other people were at least 10 years, maybe 20 or 30 years older than we were.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Springer may have entered the race a relative unknown, but he quickly began to stand out in the crowded field.

[Tim Burke]

Oh, he was a star. He was just a superstar. He was way ahead of everybody else.

[Leon Nayfak]

At the time, Cincinnati politics were dominated by entrenched elite families like the Tafts, as in William Howard Taft, the 27th president. City leaders were predominantly wealthy, white, Protestant and Republican. Young Jerry Springer had decades of establishment inertia to overcome.

[Tim Burke]

I didn't think we had a shot. I really didn't. I mean, he's a first time runner. We, we busted our hump.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Snow figured that Springer could get elected eventually, but he would have to put in his time first and run a second and perhaps a third time before breaking through. But then Springer eked it out, coming in eighth out of 19 and securing one of the nine city council seats that were up for grabs.

[Tim Burke]

It was, it was, that was one of the greatest political victories I was ever involved with. It was great. It was terrific.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Springer's election to city council in 1971 represented a changing tide in Cincinnati. For the first time in 14 years, city council had a Democratic majority. It was the beginning of a new era. Springer's family, of course, was thrilled.

[Evelyn Springer Strout]

We were all very, very proud of him. But my father would say, only in America can something like this happen.

[Guy Guckenberger]

It seemed like the fulfillment of the American dream, that a refugee who moved to the U.S. seeking asylum could be elected as a leader in a major US City. Springer's political staff wasted no time planning out his future. They had learned a few important things during his run, namely that he had a high antipathy quotient. People either loved him or hated him. Springer's campaign manager, Mike Ford, drew up a memo stating, he is controversial. There's nothing we can do to change that. But Ford was confident. In his memo, he outlined a 10 year plan that imagined Springer leveling up from city council to Congress by 1976 and then in 1980 moving on to the ultimate goal, the U.S. senate.

[Tim Burke]

The only thing we knew from the very beginning is he could never be president.

[Leon Nayfak]

Tim Burke, now a long haired Democratic party veteran, was a legislative aide in Springer's office at City hall, which was staffed with a tight knit crew of young liberals. The reason Burke knew that Springer couldn't be president, of course, was that he wasn't born in the United States. But Burke was sure that Springer's political talents would take him far. She also just really believed in his ideas.

[Tim Burke]

He was a great liberal and what he did on city council in those early years documented that at one point he wanted to introduce an ordinance making it illegal for Cincinnatians to be drafted to go to Vietnam.

[Justin Richmond]

The insanity of this war must be stopped immediately and I think we have to go to the courts. We have to do everything we can to stop it.

[Tim Burke]

That wasn't going to go anywhere, but he started talking about that.

[Leon Nayfak]

Springer's office quickly became a hub for young progressives in Cincinnati. Carol Sanger, a reporter for the Cincinnati Post, told us it was kind of a scene.

[Carol Sanger]

There was a whole group of young people who were council aides who were just involved in city government in some way or another. And so the whole atmosphere changed at that time. It really did. And it became a very exciting, fun place to cover.

[Guy Guckenberger]

From her perch at the Cincinnati Post, Sanger reported on Springer and his cohort of civic minded idealists. And soon she became friends with them. Sometimes they'd all go away together on weekend trips, renting a cabin in a state park.

[Carol Sanger]

It would be lots of serious conversations and lots of fun conversations and also just sort of a chance to engage, envisioning, you know, what you imagined could happen could be done. You know, it was the Camelot of politics that was really very Kennedy esque.

[Guy Guckenberger]

In keeping with that Kennedy esque spirit, Springer pushed popular newsworthy causes while on council that reflected his faith in government. For instance, he helped lead a campaign to take the local bus system, which was being operated badly by a private company, and make it public. The campaign succeeded, leading to better busing and lower fares. At one point, Springer got interested in the city jail, a dilapidated facility that was colloquially known as the workhouse. To capture its poor conditions, Springer secretly arranged to spend the night there.

[Justin Richmond]

And they have a bucket there, they have to go to the bathroom. Straw mattresses. The worst part is the idleness. I guess they sit there all day.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Springer actually ended up spending the night in the jail's medical wing after the staff moved him there out of fear for his safety. But he stayed about 24 hours, long enough to speak vividly about what it was like.

[Justin Richmond]

The staff are working under horrible conditions, and they're doing the very best they can, and they're pretty progressive in their thinking. They recognize the need for more training. They recognize the need for rehabilitation programs, that you can't just build walls and have a prison, and they need our help.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Tim Burke, Springer's legislative aide, said the visit really made a difference.

[Tim Burke]

It didn't happen immediately, but it got more attention paid to that issue than anything had in years.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Springer had a knack for getting attention for the causes he cared about, something none of his more buttoned up colleagues in the council had a feel for. When the city threatened to tear down the historic art deco train hall in Cincinnati, Springer wrote a folk song to drum up support and saved it from demolition.

[Justin Richmond]

And they say they're gonna tear her down with a big old wrecker's ball.

[Leon Nayfak]

San Diego st. Save yourself a friend sell the mind.

[Tim Burke]

Oh, it's grandstanding.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Guy gukenberger, Springer's republican counterpart on city council, wasn't always impressed with Springer's approach to governing and making change.

[Tim Burke]

It's just grandstanding, pure and simple. It's a way to get your name in the paper.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Would you consider them stunts?

[Tim Burke]

Oh, sure, they were stunts. Very clever stunts.

[Leon Nayfak]

Clever enough to win over a lot of Cincinnatians. They had never seen a politician who was so dynamic and informal and unrestrained, and they were into it.

[Carol Sanger]

He was refreshing, I think is the word I would use. He was just refreshing. He was able to fill a void in what had been local politics. I think that was something new in concept to city hall.

[Guy Guckenberger]

It didn't hurt. Springer was also rather handsome.

[Leon Nayfak]

Women liked him.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Oh, yeah.

[Carol Sanger]

Yeah. He was very attractive. Sense of humor, his intelligence, his position of authority, of power, whatever. You know, that whole sexual appeal was there.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Whatever it was, it worked. Just two years after Springer won his seat on city council in a squeaker, the 1973 election saw him come away with the second highest number of votes.

[Leon Nayfak]

Having surged in popularity between 71 and 73, Springer looked poised to become the city's next mayor.

[Guy Guckenberger]

But as he built his profile locally, the allure of national politics was never far from Springer's mind.

[Justin Richmond]

No one can stand here and say that, you know, they haven't thought about Watergate. They haven't thought about the effect that it has on our governmental processes.

[Guy Guckenberger]

In 1973, after the Watergate scandal broke, Springer introduced an ethics ordinance in Cincinnati that would require city council members to disclose their financial investments.

[Justin Richmond]

And I think now more than ever before, anyone in political life has to work at trying to restore public confidence in their elected officials. And this is a way for us to say, look, we aren't doing anything wrong and, you know, we're opening up ourselves so the public can see what kind of people we really are.

[Leon Nayfak]

That same year, Springer married Mickey Velton, a graduate student whom he met on a blind date. A newspaper profile in March of 74 portrayed them as a modern, supportive couple, respectful of each other's interests and careers. Velten told the reporter, I want him to go as far as he can. It's amazing how happy it makes him to be successful. Springer was no longer just a scrappy young upstart, but a beloved and now experienced young politician. But then, let's talk about what happened in 74.

[Carol Sanger]

Nixon resigned.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Nope, not that.

[Leon Nayfak]

On April 29, 1974, the lead story on the Cincinnati Enquirer's front page was about Watergate. Below the fold, there was an article about a different, more local bit of intrigue. The article noted that an unnamed but well known political figure in Cincinnati was the subject of a criminal investigation into a local prostitution ring.

[Carol Sanger]

And it basically posed the question of which local politician was caught in a compromising situation with a prostitute in Northern Kentucky. It just raised the. The question. It was a tease.

[Leon Nayfak]

Sanger's reporter instincts went off when she read the story. A source at City hall told her that the investigation revolved around a Kentucky brothel operating as a health club just a few minutes over the border from Cincinnati. Sanger's source told her that a city councilman had visited the health club and had paid a sex worker for her services using a personal check. Sanger also learned whose signature appeared on the check.

[Carol Sanger]

It was. It was Jerry Springer.

[Guy Guckenberger]

Cincinnati was about to have its own little Watergate.

[Carol Sanger]

I knew one side of Jerry, I didn't know the other.

[Guy Guckenberger]

That's next on Final Thoughts.

[Justin Richmond]

This is an I Heart podcast.