Fire Escape Cast #133

Summary

Fire Escape Cast #133

Date: May 25, 2026
Panel: Dan Ryckert (Host), Mary Kish, Jake Decker (filling in for Mike Mahardy)

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Episode Overview

This episode brings together Dan, Mary, and guest host Jake for a vibrant, wide-ranging discussion on gaming and pop culture. With Mike out at “wine camp,” the trio covers a bevy of games—most notably Mina the Hollower—with deep dives into game mechanics, difficulty, and player experience, as well as detours into movies, nostalgia, and media recommendations. As ever, the cast balances insightful game talk with humor, personal anecdotes, and raucous tangents.

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Highlights & Key Topics

1. Bar Banter & Where’s Mike? (00:00–03:15)

• Mike is humorously absent because he’s at “wine camp,” complete with wine luggage and a wine buddy system.
• The group laughs about what wine camp might entail—think “adult summer camp, but with booze instead of hidden snacks.”
  • “Man, that guy likes wine, doesn't he?” – Dan [03:07]

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2. Sick Day Drinks & Cult Memories (03:16–05:29)

• Dan’s been sick for a month, drinking hot toddies for his throat.

• Mary and Dan recall a special trip to Multnomah Falls, joking about joining a cult where phones (and memories) were locked away.

  • “We joined a cult. That was a no photos cult.” – Dan [04:38]

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3. Alcohol Health Chat: Science & Myths (05:30–13:52)

• Spirited debate about whether any alcohol is actually good for you, science myths, and societal shifts in medical advice.
  • Mary explains the myth and science behind wine/alcohol being "healthy."
  • The group swaps hangover prevention tips—hydration, food choice, and the importance of protein before drinking.
  • Notable hangover fix: “Pedialyte. There’s those like, noon electrolyte tablets…” – Dan [11:58]
• Dan tells the story of a wild fan incentive: flying to a Giant Bomb listener’s home for an epic weekend of barbecue and booze.

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4. Hornytown, NC: Merch, Memories, and Fire Chiefs (13:53–18:58)

• Mary shares her adventures in North Carolina’s Hornytown, famous for its cheeky merch and signs.
  • “Can we check right now before looking? I want to Google who the mayor of Hornytown is.” – Dan [16:57]
• Hornytown doesn’t have a mayor, but it does have Chief Kelly Baker at its Fire Department.

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5. Movie Segment – ‘The Dirties’ & Matt Johnson (19:13–28:44)

• Dan reviews “The Dirties,” a found-footage-style dark comedy about a school shooting, made by Matt Johnson (of “Nirvana the Band” and “BlackBerry” fame).
  • “Tonally, that seems like such a crazy needle to thread… I think they do it really, really well.” – Dan [20:58]
  • Jake and Dan discuss Matt Johnson’s range, upcoming Anthony Bourdain biopic, and a Magic the Gathering project.
• The trio waxes nostalgic about making student movies—recording foley, stealing sound effects from Goldeneye, and editing “violent” shorts in school.

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6. Deep Dive: Mina the Hollower

(Main Segment: 34:39–62:33)

• The cast gives their impressions—some with spoiler-free depth—of the much-anticipated, tough-as-nails action adventure from Yacht Club Games.
  • General consensus: It’s great but very challenging; new players beware!
  • The game is often compared to Zelda: Link’s Awakening visually, but is structurally “a 2D Dark Souls.”
  • Difficulty: The game doesn't hold your hand; figuring out progression, tools, or even the map requires patience and curiosity.
    • Notable quote: “This is a gamer-ass video game… It will not tell you what to do. It will give you some hints and guidelines. You need to use your noodle, and if you don’t, you will be punished.” – Mary [45:51]
  • Navigation and discovery—how you can miss crucial tools/mechanics for hours.
  • Frustrations over cryptic design and “aha!” moments, likened to Tunic and older Zelda games.
  • Highs and lows: The agony of losing thousands of “bones” (in-game currency), the joy of finally breaking through a difficult section.
    • “I have lost tens of thousands of bones. Anytime when you play this game, you will be like, oh, no, I have 500 bones. I’m so scared to lose them. It doesn't even faze me anymore.” – Mary [39:27]
  • Different approaches: Dan followed the game’s path with less death; Mary blazed her own trail, running into tough areas and “suffering.”
  • In-game tips: Protein is important (in both drinking and gameplay)!
  • Closing thoughts: The panel agrees this is a special, bold game—difficult, occasionally infuriating, but rewarding if you “lock in.”
    • “It’d be hard to argue that this is not a good video game. I think you’re gonna get a lot of people that say ‘it’s not for me’ and that’s fine. But undeniably, they had a vision with this game and they pulled it off.” – Dan [57:52]

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7. Quick Game Spotlights

Yoshi in the Mysterious Book (62:33–71:06)

• Dan reviews it as a “very interesting” new direction for Yoshi platformers—more a physics/gimmick puzzle adventure than traditional platforming.
  • “I’ve never played a platformer like this before… It just keeps me interested.” – Jake [65:34]
  • Jake praises its variety, mystery, and novel mechanics.

Forbidden Solitaire (71:13–78:22)

• Mary tries Vinnie’s recommendation: a 90s FMV-style solitaire game with dark, meta-inscription-like twists.
  • You win or lose by playing solitaire to advance in a sinister, VHS-inspired narrative.
  • “There are upgrades you can buy with points, and the gems get embedded into your hand. Like, they go into your skin and into your nails and stuff. It’s kind of fucked up.” – Mary [75:05]

Creature Kitchen Lovefest (98:19–99:03)

• Jake circles back to rave about Creature Kitchen, a quirky horror-puzzle game.

Pokemon Champions (99:04–101:02)

• Jake gives a quick peek into Pokémon Champions, a competitive battle sim—good core battling, poor live-service model.

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8. Mixtape Discourse – Narrative, Nostalgia, and Disdain (78:43–93:52)

• The cast discusses the polarizing narrative game Mixtape.
  • Mary: Likes the vibe but finds the minigames too passive; soundtrack is a standout.
  • Dan: Hates it; finds the writing and characters pretentious and cannot relate at all.
    • “This is a tone piece and a narrative thing and a really character-based thing and I just don’t like any of the tone or the characters.” – Dan [86:51]
  • Jake: Bounced off it hard; couldn’t finish due to grating character dialogue.
  • Extensive conversation about nostalgia, how personal experiences and tastes shape response, and the value of personality-driven recommendations.
    • “I was not ever an angsty kid or anything, so all this coming-of-age angst stories and stuff do nothing for me.” – Dan [84:10]

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9. Forza Horizon 5: Japan Impressions (94:11–96:25)

• Dan gives brief impressions: It feels like “Peak Horizon”—more focused, less DJ “festival” fluff, pure fun to explore, and visually stunning.

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10. Gecko Gods (Revisited) (96:26–98:14)

• Mary finished the charming puzzle-adventure: “A cathartic, brain-scratching puzzler… Great for planes or half-watching TV.”

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11. Q&A: Dream Game Jobs & Movie Needle Drops (102:07–111:34)

• Listeners ask about dream studios to work for—Neversoft, SingleTrac, EGM, and Bungie get shout-outs.
• Favorite movie needle drops discussed (“Bad to the Bone” in T2, “Stuck in the Middle with You” in Reservoir Dogs, “This Is the End” in Apocalypse Now, “Don’t Stop Me Now” in Shaun of the Dead).

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12. Media Recommendations, FOMO & Personality-Based Taste (112:06–144:12)

• Advice on handling the endless flow of recommendations: trust your vibe, keep loose lists, don’t force yourself.
• Dan laments never connecting with Pixar or teen-focused narratives, leading to a revelatory discussion about childhood preferences, nostalgia, and how these inform present-day media taste.
  • “I never wanted to be a kid or a teenager. I always was like, man, I like hanging out with adults and talking to adults, you know.” – Dan [122:02]
• The panel muses on which movies are “litmus test” friendships—e.g., if someone doesn’t like The Thing or MacGruber, “we just won’t get along.”
• Differences in taste—especially over comedies and horror films—are explored with candor and humor.
• A detour into contemporary movies: Hokum comes recommended (don’t watch the trailer!), recent horror, and action movie favorites.

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Memorable Quotes

On Mixtape:

• “You thought it was, like, pretentious?” – Mary [85:49]
• “I wanted to peel my skin off as I was listening to the characters talk… It did not do anything at all for me.” – Jake [89:42]

On Mina the Hollower:

• “The lows are low and the highs are high… I think the frustrations of truly not knowing where to go and getting stuck is a little mean.” – Mary [51:43]
• “It’s a unique video game experience that I’m really enjoying poking at.” – Dan [57:52]

On media recommendations:

• “You just have to make peace with the fact you’ll never play, read, watch everything people recommend.” – Jake [138:04]

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Timestamps of Important Segments

• 00:00–03:15: Mike’s “wine camp” absence
• 05:30–13:52: Alcohol science chat, hangover cures, Giant Bomb barbecue tale
• 19:13–28:44: “The Dirties” review & foley talk
• 34:39–62:33: Mina the Hollower discussion (mechanics, challenge, discovery)
• 78:43–93:52: Mixtape – in-depth debate on narrative, nostalgia, and character
• 94:11–96:25: Forza Horizon 5: Japan impressions
• 102:07–111:34: Listener Q&A: dream companies, needle drop movie moments
• 112:06–144:12: Recommendations, nostalgia, taste differences, movie litmus tests

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Tone and Style

• Conversational, candid, irreverent, and peppered with personal stories.
• No topic too silly to riff on, yet honest and articulate when dissecting games or media that don't click.
• Genuine affection among hosts, who tease, challenge, and support each other equally.

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Final Thoughts

This episode showcases Fire Escape Cast’s unique appeal: a blend of astute game criticism, pop culture analysis, and the easy camaraderie of friends who have seen it all—topped with infectious, often hilarious tangents. Whether you’re hungry for challenging new indies or just want to hear why Dan can’t stand Teenage Angst Games, #133 delivers a hearty helping of both.

Transcript

[Dan Reichert]

Foreign.

[Mary Kish]

What's happening, Charlie? Clappanen. That's my.

[Dan Reichert]

Wow. Wait, no, that's it. We got it in. Hey, hey, what's new, Lucy Lou? There we go. That's a podcast. Yeah. Come on, Jake, get in there.

[Jake Decker]

Oh, I can't, I can't, I can't, I can't. I can't think as quick as Mike.

[Mary Kish]

You know, just hold your nose and pray.

[Dan Reichert]

Think of a celebrity here. We'll work backwards. Jake, think of a celebrity.

[Jake Decker]

Okay, okay. I saw this one. Sandra Bullock.

[Dan Reichert]

Okay, now Bullock. Oh, that's a. Yeah, Bullock. What's he.

[Jake Decker]

They don't even make sense when he does it. He's like, what, scooting Sandra Blue or something?

[Dan Reichert]

I don't know. I'm Dan Reichert. I'm here.

[Mary Kish]

That's why I don't do the intros. I'd be introing Putin.

[Dan Reichert]

That's Mary Kish. And we got Jake Decker here filling in for Mike Maharti. Hey, crew, how's it going?

[Jake Decker]

Oh, it's good to be here. Thanks for having me. I. I got. Yeah, I'm. I'm excited. There. There are. There are some cool games to talk about and some other exciting stuff to

[Dan Reichert]

talk about, and it's. It's fun when someone devolves so much into self parody that it's gonna sound like a joke when we say what Mike's doing. So those at home go ahead and imagine what you think Mike is doing right now. And it's maybe more ridiculous sounding than that.

[Mary Kish]

This was a show. If there was a gun to your head and we said, where is Mike Maharti right now? What would. What would you, the listener, say to save your life?

[Dan Reichert]

They're probably going to say like a vineyard or like a tasting. It's more silly than that. Jake, do you want to tell the fine folks why Mike is not here today?

[Jake Decker]

Well, Mike packed a bag and he went up the coast, I assume. I don't know, to a wine camp.

[Dan Reichert]

I. Yeah, his little knapsack, which I know for a fact. He has luggage that has special little holders in it for wine bottles. He has special wine luggage that he took to his wine camp. What are these doing right now?

[Jake Decker]

I think he's paired with, like, a wine partner too, or something. So they have like a little wine buddy system. Yeah, like a camp buddy system where they.

[Mary Kish]

Adorable.

[Jake Decker]

I don't know, maybe wear the same colored shirts, hold hands in case they get lost. So they don't get lost.

[Dan Reichert]

Make sure they don't get, like, sick or like, what is wine Camp.

[Mary Kish]

I know. I like to imagine it's like heavyweights, and they have wine hidden in all the areas of their bunk beds. So when you, like, knock on the wood, it's hollow. And when you open up the top, there's wine in there.

[Dan Reichert]

No, no, no, no, no. Because I think it's like wine is the purpose there. So they wouldn't be hiding wine. They would have to hide like, bud lights or something. Yeah, yeah. It's like they're not drinking wine, so they're go get in trouble.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, yeah. The camp counselors are like, you can't drink any bad light.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah. Lights out.

[Mary Kish]

I assume they sound like Sven. Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Reichert]

Man, that guy likes wine, doesn't he? Yeah, we've heard. Yeah. It's fine. It's. It's fine. I got nothing against it.

[Mary Kish]

Well, I think we should have an anti wine episode, so we're not allowed to use the word wine for the rest of the episode.

[Dan Reichert]

Okay. I'm drinking a hot toddy because I've been sick for a month and Mary

[Mary Kish]

did just hotty weird.

[Dan Reichert]

Well. Cause I'm sick. Mary did inform me that this will not actually cure my sickness. It'll just maybe make my throat less scratchy.

[Mary Kish]

Is that right? I think so, yeah. Dan said, I'm not, you know, I'm a little sick. He's like, but good news. I have a hot toddy, so I'm good to go. And I was like, well, hot toddies won't help you in any other capacity besides the. All of it. The whiskey, the hot water, the honey and the lemon will coat your throat and it should help your voice.

[Dan Reichert]

Okay.

[Mary Kish]

I drink hot toddies all the time in the winter.

[Dan Reichert]

And Mary, you came in clutch here because I read that I was like, oh, because I'm stupid about glass and dishes and stuff. And I was like, can you just pour boiling water into like a normal whiskey glass? And I looked it up and I'm like, they're like, if it's thin, it can crack. And so they were like, oh, get like a thick ceramic mug or something and marry this from Multanoma Falls. Did I say that right?

[Mary Kish]

Yeah.

[Dan Reichert]

So, yeah, I got a nice thick little nug here with it thanks to that.

[Mary Kish]

Did you get that on your journey?

[Dan Reichert]

Yes. With you? Yeah. Yes.

[Mary Kish]

That's adorable. I love. Makes me happy. That was a good memory, Jake. You were there too. We had a good time at the falls. We really didn't capture a lot of those memories publicly. There's like, no. It's like, no Videos, because it was like, more of like a personal trip, but I have really, really good memories.

[Dan Reichert]

We joined a cult. Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Yes.

[Dan Reichert]

That was a no photos cult. Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

You know, trip. And I didn't really want to share that with anyone else unless they were in the cult.

[Jake Decker]

You made us lock up our phones and then you threw them at the bottom of a lake. Yeah, that was an accident, though. You didn't mean to throw them in the bottom.

[Dan Reichert]

You were wasted.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, that was an accidental, everyone give me your phones, I'm throwing them overboard situation.

[Dan Reichert]

I mean, if that was a cult situation, it could have been a lot worse in terms of cold. So we just, like, went to the woods by a river and drank, and that was a really good time. I enjoyed that quite a bit.

[Mary Kish]

It was a good experience. Well, I'm glad that you have a hot toddy to help with your throat. Yeah, I had a. And okay. Double fisting. Drinking for two.

[Jake Decker]

I see the beer is counteracting whatever good the hot toddy is probably doing.

[Dan Reichert]

Sure.

[Jake Decker]

If any.

[Mary Kish]

There's like, this mental state of, like, some people who are like. No, I mean, like, one alcohol is good for you because they probably read it in a magazine somewhere in the 90s and then just never decided to undo it. Which have you.

[Jake Decker]

Which alcohol.

[Dan Reichert]

All alcohol is not one unit.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, but. Yeah. Well, there's a specific one which we just agreed to not mention.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, right. That's the one you always see on, like, cnn. It's like, doctors say one glass of blank, you know, can make your heart better.

[Mary Kish]

It's. It's been. I mean, I. It's been debunked in the sense that, like, there's no provable amount of any alcohol that's good for you, period.

[Jake Decker]

I don't believe that.

[Mary Kish]

Some benefits in the sense. I think, like, some types of blank can make your blood a little thinner, which could be good if you have, like, high blood pressure. But ultimately, drinking is just not good for you from a health perspective. Like, doctors will never be like, yeah, drink every day. It's totally fine. So here's. You're not supposed to.

[Dan Reichert]

I definitely consider myself someone who, like, I trust medicine, I trust science. You show me a guy in a lab coat telling me something, I'm just gonna listen to him. As long as he's not, like, a whack job or something. You know, go to a hospital, they gotti.

[Mary Kish]

Wears a lab coat all the time. And that guy doesn't know shit.

[Dan Reichert]

I would trust his dad because his dad's on the up and up son Minati. I don't trust him one bit about the health stuff, but I tend to trust yeah, scientists, doctors and things like that. But then it is tough when you remember too that it's just like, oh man, like we've always been fucking stupid. Like, you know, as soon like our parents were probably alive, when the doctors were saying, like, cigarettes are good for your T zone and it's like, that's not that long ago. And it's like, oh, just drink as much like, you know, high fat milk as possible and makes your bones stronger. Now they're like, oh, no, milk's bad for you. So is it everything that we know and except now, like, the best we can do is just follow the instructions. But in 50 years is going to be like, wow, I can't believe people thought apples weren't cancerous. You know, I mean, we used to

[Jake Decker]

put lead in the walls, you know, we stopped doing that. Yeah. Here's what I would say though.

[Mary Kish]

Science, you grow like as they learn, they'll be like, oh, actually that old science, that's, that's a load of hoo ha. Now, now we're all up on this science. So like, it's not that you were taught lies, it's just at the time that was as advanced as medical science had and now we have more science and we're like that last, you know, don't do that other stuff anymore.

[Dan Reichert]

I, I don't think anyone's actively lying, you know. Well, I don't know. Now, now I don't know nowadays maybe. But you know, like, I think most doctors and science programs have had like, good intentions until maybe recently.

[Mary Kish]

Jake, what were you.

[Jake Decker]

Well, okay, I was going to say it's been proven that stress is really bad for your heart. It's just.

[Dan Reichert]

Yes.

[Jake Decker]

Being stressed constantly is not good for you. What if a little bit of alcohol de stresses you? You know, like could like. I'm not saying it's good for you.

[Dan Reichert]

Right.

[Jake Decker]

Like, probably the healthy thing to do would be to figure out how to de stress in a healthy way from your life.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

But maybe you can't. And you know, a beer is better than being at a constant state of stress, in my opinion.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah. You think, Dr. Dan.

[Dan Reichert]

Well, Dr. Dan says, look, I have an apple watch. So I'm somewhat of an expert on this because I wake up and I. Look, Jake, I know we've read the same book about sleep and stuff like that. Like, sleep is fascinating. And if I drink and I wake up, I look at my watch and it's like, oh, God, I was just fucking, like, the lightest sleep. No deep sleep. Just waking up several times throughout the night without even realizing it versus, like, actually for like, the whole month of April, I didn't have a drop. And it was like, that was so easy to fucking. Like, I'm getting up early, I'm running. I'm, you know, like, I'm just feeling rested and better. I'm not feeling like I need a nap at, you know, 6pm or anything like that. So, yeah, like, on top of all the shitty stuff it's doing to your body, it's also hurting your sleep, which is super important. Yeah. Yeah. But it is fun.

[Mary Kish]

That seems good advice. The thing, too, I wonder is, like, I love this, like, three uninformed.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Adults discuss the impacts of alcohol on the body.

[Dan Reichert]

I think there's a lot of those podcasts now.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

You increase your tolerance, and so then that beer probably isn't de stressing you. Then you need two beers, and then you need three beers, and then you get yourself a stew going. And so my worry is that you're kind of using alcohol as a crutch. Right. Instead of addressing whatever it is that's really stressing you out. Ultimately, I drink every day, and it's been great, but I find that I am sleeping the most and I feel the most rested when I get up and exercise instead of drinking. But I like to exercise and drink. Not at the same time. I think that would be tough, but

[Dan Reichert]

I've done the both thing. I thought that would be smart. It doesn't. It's not smart at all. You shouldn't do it.

[Mary Kish]

It seems hard. Because you're thirsty.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. And dehydrated. Yeah. I just thought, like, my logic in college was that, like, I would run home from the bars sometimes because I'd be like, God, it takes so long to get home. I'll just run. And I'd be drunk. So the next morning I'd be like, wow, I don't even really remember running. It's like, I just flew by. So my thought was, ooh, maybe if I went to the gym drunk and then ran on the treadmill, it would seem really like, it went by really fast. So I would, like, get tanked. I think it was 24. It might have been 24. 7 rec center. So I'd be, like, tanked in college and then go to the rec center, and I just got on the treadmill and like, 10 minutes in, I was, like, dizzy and almost fallen over. Like, this is probably not surprisingly, let you in.

[Jake Decker]

Just this drunk college kid showing up,

[Dan Reichert]

stumbling in

[Mary Kish]

to spot me.

[Dan Reichert]

God, lifting. Yeah, Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

I couldn't imagine. I've been trying to get smarter because as I've gotten older, my hangovers have gotten worse. And so it's very important for me to not get hungover. And so my new system is before I go out, if I know I'm going to be drinking, I drink one of those like Gatorade or like hyper. What are those called? Like, liquid IVs.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, like electrolyte tablet.

[Mary Kish]

And yeah, before I go out drinking. And that helps ease it ultimately, like, one of my favorites has been Pedialyte.

[Dan Reichert]

No, that's a long time. Like, I've done that a lot. Pedialyte. There's those like, noon electrolyte tablets that are like little Alka seltzers you throw in. There's the liquid IVs. There's the emergencies. You know, stuff like that. Like, I travel with those. Yeah, it's great on, like, planes and stuff too. If you're just worried about being dehydrated, like, I love those.

[Mary Kish]

And you just pre. Prepare yourself for alcohol. I like, prep my body and my skin accordingly because I'm like, you're drinking tonight, body, so I want you to be really hydrated because I'm about to fuck you up. My body, like, knows to tense up and be like, okay, she's going to a pool house. Like, we need to get ready.

[Jake Decker]

All your blood cells get ready.

[Dan Reichert]

It's coming.

[Mary Kish]

They're telling each other and like, running around, they're battening the hatches in there, I assume. But in the morning, I find that I'm just so much better because I've prepared myself for that alcohol.

[Dan Reichert]

Food's super important, I find, like the days where I get the most fucked up the next day, or like, if I started drinking, like, this is all, you know, 101 drinking stuff.

[Mary Kish]

It's 101. But a lot of people don't know that it ain't bread. You want protein because protein breaks down alcohol molecules better and faster. Bread is more like a soaker. So a lot of times people will be like, get a piece of bread in you.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Because that will slow the alcohol intake, which is true because now you have to digest it. But the same amount of alcohol is getting in your bloodstream, so you're not preventing anything. You're just delaying the inevitable of how drunk you're going to be. Eating chicken, eating, like steak, eating meat. Protein breaks down the. It helps your body, like Break down the alcohol faster so you won't get as drunk as quickly with protein. So there's a fact that maybe not everybody knows.

[Jake Decker]

So bring some protein powder with me to the bar is what you're saying. Maybe I'll mix it in my beer.

[Mary Kish]

When you get drunk at the gym is the biggest secret that I know.

[Jake Decker]

That's a double whammy. You know, you're so drunk you don't remember going to the gym. Plus, you have protein already. You know, you're good to go.

[Dan Reichert]

You're jacked.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah. Yeah. Next thing you know, you don't remember how you became jacked.

[Mary Kish]

I also, I learned that fact about the protein from a, like a workout instructor lady, like a trainer. So I feel like she knows.

[Dan Reichert]

I. I think I accidentally followed that advice without knowing it last weekend because Jan and I went to North Carolina last weekend because.

[Mary Kish]

Lovely place, you know, I like North Carolina.

[Dan Reichert]

It's barbecue part of the country and I love trying different barbecues and stuff. What area?

[Mary Kish]

You know, my sister lives there. I have a lot of family in North Carolina.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, really? Around with, like, Durham and stuff is kind of around. Flew into Raleigh, went to Durham. But it was a thing. We did the Bombathon thing last year and we had a million just like silly incentives and stuff where it's like, oh, fans, you know, if we give this much or give this many subscriptions or if we hit this goal, we do this and this and this, and we're still like all year. We're kind of like, you know, making sure we're making good on all those incentives. And one of them was just one of those, like, we throw out the occasional crazy idea and it's like, I wonder if this is actually going to happen. But here we go. We listed a large number and we said, if any one person gives this much, contributes this much to Giant Bomb, me and Jan will fly to your house and hang out with you for a weekend and make a video about it.

[Mary Kish]

Cool. Did you have fun?

[Dan Reichert]

I had a great time. His name is Andrew. He's also a big fire escape fan, so he's probably listening right now.

[Mary Kish]

Hi, Andrew.

[Dan Reichert]

We flew out to Andrew's place in North Carolina and this is the protein part. Me and Jan show up at his house. He has made the craziest fucking spread of just a rack of ribs. He's made a giant tin of wings. He's got just like a salad. He's got. He has this smoker on his deck and he smoked Cheez Its. He poured a whole box of cheez its into a thing and put a bunch of, like, ranch seasoning and oil and stuff on it and left it in a smoker. And it was just like, oh, my God, like, all this shit was incredible. And then he also has a bar in his house, and he's like this, like, master cocktail maker. So, yeah, we show up immediately. It's just like, here's a million pounds of meat. And then we're going to go down in my bar and start taking tequila shots and stuff. So I did get a good amount of protein in before. We just drank for 48 hours straight, basically. But, yeah, that was a great time. Andrew showed us around and we had

[Mary Kish]

what a good host. Their barbecue is prolific. So my sister lives in Greensboro, which he'll know is pretty close. And when I visited her a couple years ago, she took me to Hornetown, which is.

[Dan Reichert]

No, excuse me.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, it's west of Greensboro, and I wish I had known because I would have been like, tell them to take you to Hornetown.

[Dan Reichert]

You can't just be saying that to fans. You can't.

[Mary Kish]

You can take me to Hornytown. And it's crazy because it's, like, on their gas station. It's on their shirts and stuff. So you can, like, buy like, I've been to Hornytown.

[Dan Reichert]

I'd want to get a magnet.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, I know.

[Jake Decker]

So they're in on the joke then.

[Mary Kish]

I didn't know. I think that at some point they realized their merch sales were high and they decided to capitalize on the fact that they are Hornytown.

[Dan Reichert]

All right, can we check right now before looking? I want to Google who the mayor of Hornytown is. And what do you think? Just describe what you imagine the mayor of Hornytown looking like or being.

[Mary Kish]

Do you think he. They have a mayor? How small does your city have to do be before it, like, doesn't have one?

[Dan Reichert]

You're right. It doesn't have a mayor. It's an unincorporated community in Forsyth county, does not have a formal municipal government or elected officials. There is the Hornytown Fire Department, which is led by Chief Kelly Baker, the. The fire chief of Hornytown.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, I'm the fire. I put out the fires in Hornytown.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, that's good. Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Wow, that's funny. Yeah. I feel like I could judge that person. I feel like they. I hope that they have a. What do they call it? A fire dog.

[Dan Reichert]

They have an Instagram account, the Horny Town fire department.

[Mary Kish]

Oh, good for them.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. Yeah, it's the Location here. Okay. Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Merch is crazy. They ha. You have to get merch from this. I have a photo of me in Hornytown, like, at their gas station. And we, like, all bought Hornytown shirts because we thought it was so funny. Like, my sisters were like, this is like such a classic, like, my family thing. But it's like, you're not gonna be 40 minutes from Hornytown and not go. And I'll take selfies in front of the Hornytown sign. And so that's what we did on our vacation.

[Dan Reichert]

That seems to be popular thing here is a lot of people taking pictures in front of the Hornytown sign. Also seeing ads for the. The Horny Town run for hospice, 5K.

[Mary Kish]

Oh, they're givers. They are. They are so thoughtful.

[Dan Reichert]

Horny town and hospice are not two words I would put next to each other. Really?

[Mary Kish]

Horny for hospice, they say.

[Dan Reichert]

No, they don't. No, they don't.

[Jake Decker]

Horny in hospice.

[Dan Reichert]

So that was. That was our weekend. Was. Was that. And then I was gone overseas for nine days prior to that. So I've been. I've been out and about quite a bit. That's why I missed the last episode. But thanks to Vinny for filling in. That sounds great.

[Mary Kish]

He's so great. He's so easy to talk to. And we had a really good conversation. I think we'll probably get to it because we did talk about some games, but you weren't here here, so we just assumed what your opinion would be on said games. And so it'll be really nice to.

[Dan Reichert]

You know, I think I might have seen a clip or something or some references to one. And I can kind of expound upon that a little bit here. Once we get to the games. Yes, we will get to that game and others soon. I did watch, you know, Bonk and I do our movie nights, and I heard of one recently that I just watched. Was it last night? Might have been last night, yeah. The dirtiest. Have you guys heard of this?

[Mary Kish]

No, I've never heard of that.

[Dan Reichert]

So it's fascinating. It is Matt Johnson from Nirvana the band, who. He's the guy who directed and wrote BlackBerry. He's like the kind of the main guy in Nirvana the band. And he's in it. He. He directed it and wrote it and everything. I think it actually was made after the first run of Nirvana the Band the show, but before, like, it was like 2013. It came out, basically. And it is like, imagine a lot of the, like, Nirvana the Man, the show stuff where it's like they're using. It's kind of found footagey. It's sometimes you can't quite tell who's an actor or what's really filmed here. What's like scripted or whatever. But it's about school shootings.

[Mary Kish]

Jesus. It's a crazy subject line to be like messing around with as like a found footage situation.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. And it's like it is him acting like he's playing himself. His name is Matt Johnson in it, just like it is in real life and in Nirvana the band. So it's. And it's a crazy thing because he, he is like the subject of the movie and he's basically just like a not super self aware video production nerd that is trying to put together a movie about like a school shooting and like these bullies in a school and stuff like that. And in the midst of it, he actually starts planning a school shooting.

[Mary Kish]

Oh my God. Is this a serious drama or like.

[Dan Reichert]

Well, that's the thing. It is like, like tonally, that seems like such a crazy needle to thread.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah.

[Dan Reichert]

I think they do it really, really well because it is like the first like 30, 40, whatever minutes. It is like, it feels like Nirvana the band. It's like him. And it's not actually Jay is in it and Jay is the composer, but he's only briefly like a cameo in it. But it's like him and a friend and they're playing high schoolers and stuff and they are just kind of joking around. It is like they're hanging out in a place. Movie posters all over the walls. There's GameCubes and 64s everywhere. They're talking about the same type of stuff. They talk about Nirvana, the man of the show, but. And it's not dealt with like, it's not dealing with the subject flippantly or anything. It is just the way this character is talking about it is just like, okay, this kid's obviously really disturbed here. And you see his friend that he's talking with kind of like get a little more just like, whoa, Okay. I don't, you know, I'm not super comfortable with this. And it's just so, so crazy to see that same Nirvana the van style and even humor that delves into a very serious topic, but doesn't ever feel like gross or exploitative or anything like that. It's kind of a fascinating, like, I don't know how he pulled it off, basically.

[Mary Kish]

Can I ask one, like, question that I don't think is spoilery?

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Are we supposed to believe that Matthew Johnson is a student. Yeah, that guy doesn't look student aged.

[Dan Reichert]

It kind of works. I mean, there's supposed to be like high schoolers in this. It's set in like 2007 2. Because they reference dark Knight in it. So it's like probably 08 09, like early iPhones and stuff. He. It's not. It's not. It was. It was in 2013, so he was much younger. You know, this is 13 years old. What do they do?

[Mary Kish]

Just put him in some cutoffs and say, you know, ham it up for the camera. And he does. He can't wear his hat.

[Dan Reichert]

No, he doesn't have his trademark hat or anything like that. But I will say out of a high schooler, it was not super distracting. And I thought it was really, really interesting. And it was so. It's so weird too, because, like, you know how, like. Okay, we alluded to before and we're gonna talk about it later. Like, mixtape being like, you know, some people saw it as like, oh, this is a nostalgic. This is what I remember high school being like and stuff like that. Now it is very important to give this distinction. If you subtract every part of the school shooting thing of the movie, which is a big part of the movie, this is probably the closest to like a mixtape type thing of my high school experience of just like, the way they depict bullying, the way they depict, like, just. These guys are obvious, like video production nerds. And like, every movie they reference, every poster they've gotten, it's the same fight club posters and Clockwork Orange references and all this stuff. It's very much like. And you see them like, in the editing bay and stuff, like making their, like. And they're making these like, kind of violent short films and stuff like that. And like, I. In my editing bay, you know, I worked at the movie theater. I brought in all the AMC posters to put all of our editing bay in video production class. I was super inspired by, like, Tarantino stuff and everything. So I was making these dumbass violent, you know, short films and stuff. Yeah, we all were, you know, you know, we were 17 and getting our friends to make these like, kind of like mob Tarantino inspired movies or whatever. I got banned from the video production class and lab in my school because, like, it was a very conservative, you know, teacher. And he was like, oh, you know, no guns in this, no cussing or whatever. There's literally like a scene in this where like their video production teachers like, hey, you can't don't do the guns, don't do the swearing and stuff. So it's like, holy shit again. Remove all of the school shooting elements to it. And it's like. This was like. I turned to bonk at one point. I was like, this is like my mixtape. Like, these are like Nintendo nerds. This is like Nintendo nerds. Because I saw people. Again, we're going to talk about mixtape the game in a bit here, but I've said my thoughts on Giant Bomb and people were like, oh, I bet if they made it about, you know, 90s kids, you know, wearing wrestling shirts and going to a wrestling show, Dan would love it. I was like, no, that sounds stupid. I wouldn't like that. But watching this, it was like, oh, wow. This is kind of like what hanging out with my, like, video production nerd friends was like back then again, until the school shooting stuff. Like a million times. I have not shot up any schools, but I would. It's on YouTube. The whole movie was on YouTube. It's like an hour 23. It's just if. If you like his stuff, like, if you saw BlackBerry and liked it or Nirvana the band, it's obviously a very, very different subject matter, but I just continue to be fascinated by everything Matt Johnson makes, including this.

[Jake Decker]

Do you know what he's doing next? Have you seen the trailer for Isn't

[Dan Reichert]

that Magic the Gathering or something?

[Jake Decker]

No, he's directing the Anthony Bourdain biography. Yeah, they released the trailer not that long ago. I'm pretty sure it was Matt Johnson.

[Dan Reichert]

I think I remember hearing that. And then he signed on to do a magic thing recently. But yeah, he's doing like, he did

[Jake Decker]

sign on to do a magic thing because I think. I think he's been quoted to saying, like, if he wasn't into film and directing, he would be a professional. Or he would have tried to be a professional, like Magic the Gathering player. But no, I think his next thing

[Dan Reichert]

magic comes up in this movie.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, yeah, that does not surprise me at all. But like, yeah, I think his next thing is supposed to be this Anthony Bourdain biopic, which, like, I think the range is super impressive. Not that because I kind of followed the Nirvana, the band, the show stuff back in the day. Maybe not back in the day, but I caught up with it later. But then I remember seeing BlackBerry and the whole thing with BlackBerry, at least from my perspective, was like, yeah, it's the Nirvana the band the show guy. And you directed a movie. And I was like, I. I don't think this will be good, but I think I will enjoy it. And it turned out I really enjoyed it, and I thought it was good.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

Mostly because it was making fun of, like, that whole genre. But I'm really curious to see what he'd do with Anthony Bourdain, because even you talking about, like, the Dirties, it really seems like he has, like, untapped range and potential. Yes. So I'm super curious to see, like, where his career goes. Because, man, watching Nirvana, the band, the show, the movie, all together in New Orleans is so much fun.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, my God, that was a blast. That was my second time, and it held up so well. It's just like, yeah, he's one of those guys now. Like, Zach Krager is one of those now, too, where it's like, okay, you just say a name of, like, this young kind of visionary filmmaker. It's like, I will see anything they attach their names to. And, like, there are funny parts, too, where it's like they're recording Foley audio and stuff. And, like, Jake, you've probably been in these situations where it's, like, you and your friend, you're just like. He's, like, stomping around on, like, leaves and stuff, trying to do Foley stuff, and he's trying to get, like, background chatter. And he starts, like, bringing up, like, specific NPC lines from Baldur's Gate. And he's like, oh, yeah. You know, like, when he passed the end. And there's that guy that says this every time, and it's just like, wow, this is a really earnest depiction of, like, making funny videos with your friends, you know? And then there's the school shooting stuff. Yes.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah. And then that, too. Yes.

[Mary Kish]

I think there's something about recording Bali that's. I don't think it's universal for everyone, but it was a part of my high school experience of, like, we gotta get this footage. So we're, like, you know, punching heads of lettuce or, like, stomping around. That, I think is really fun. And even to this day, I have, like, a friend that's, like, chased my dog Simone, around the apartment to get his little snorts. Because it'd be, like, really fun to have in the background of. It doesn't matter. Some video. But it's, like, Folly is just, like, so fun to record. It's such a joy to see if you can capture magic in a bottle by, I don't know, slamming a. You know, slamming an orange against the pavement and finding out what kind of, like, weird sploosh. It makes.

[Dan Reichert]

Well, and then we've probably all been to game studios and development places before. Like, I don't know if anyone's been to like a high end, like, Foley room where it's like, I love it. Where it's like, here's the section of the floor that's like a tic tac toe board, like a three by three grid of like, here's sand, here's glass, here's dirt. And they've got different shoes and stuff in there. Like clunk, clunk, clunk, or bags of stuff. They're rustling around. Then you're hearing the stories about like, oh, yeah, we wanted to get this specific train sound. So, yeah, this guy stood basically on the caboose and pointed like a shotgun mic at the wheels for like two hours. Like, that type of stuff is so specific and cool.

[Mary Kish]

I think that is like my miss of a career. If I could have done something else than what I did, I think it would have been so much fun to record folly for a job. How fucking cool is that? To throw stuff and to like walk on stuff and be like, how do I capture this idea that there's like a whistle in the wind? I love it.

[Jake Decker]

A few years ago, Jan and I went to the Capcom studio in Osaka for Monster Hunter, right? And they gave us like a tour of like, we saw the. Oh, God, the motion capture room or whatever where they did that. But we also saw where they make the sounds for Monster Hunter. And it was kind of like what you described, except not high end. It was like in a tiny little room in the basement. But one of the cooler things was that for all of the monsters for the last Monster Hunter game, they invented instruments to be the sounds of these monsters. So they'd have the weirdest things you've ever seen in your life. You wouldn't understand that they're an instrument or they could be played and they'll like blow into them or like scrape them and it'll make these terrible sounds. But like, man, seeing those sound designers light up as they were, like showing like these weird creations they made that are designed to create these ridiculous sounds for these monsters is so cool. Like, yeah.

[Dan Reichert]

Could they be so much fun utilized to, like make actual music if they wanted to, or is it just like, oh, it makes this one fucked up sound?

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, they'd make like screeching, like, sort of noises, but it would do it very well and it would have some range so they could like, like, this is when it gets hurt. This is when it. This is when it breathes fire. Whatever it was, it was. It was pretty cool.

[Dan Reichert]

I think it was that trip I saw. It might have been. You posted a video of like, the guys doing the, like, mocap for the. The different creatures and stuff and just the wild, like, motion that they're making. Like, that seems like a. Probably a fun one to work on.

[Jake Decker]

Oh, yeah, I bet. I mean, like, that. Yeah. Seeing all the stuff that happens in that Capcom studio is like kind of.

[Dan Reichert]

Kind of magic.

[Jake Decker]

It was crazy to see how just all these different areas work together to create a game.

[Dan Reichert]

They're. They're doing a good job lately, it turns out.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah. And Capcom's killing it. And you want to be able to own all that stuff too. Like, there's a lot of places where you can get free folly. And I do. Anyone, Anyone who's like, budding into this world, you can. You can download free folly on like, a lot of different websites. And it's fun to be like, what. What kind of fake sounds. Footsteps can I make? But there's nothing like recording it yourself because it's yours, it's uniquely yours, and so you own it. And so it feels really good when you're. Whatever video ends up coming out because every piece of that you constructed. So I can absolutely see why in a game they don't want to buy somebody else's sound effects. They want to own every original sound effect that they use. And that makes a lot of sense. But that's a part of that behind the curtain view where you don't think about the fact that every sound that you heard was constructed in this tiny little room. Not, maybe not tiny, but like some kind of fake room where they've orchestrated everything that you're hearing was all constructed in one space.

[Dan Reichert]

It's crazy. A fun thing about, like. Yeah. Being like, making videos in high school and stuff like that is I remember, like, I'd make my stupid movies and, oh, a mob guy would have a silenced gun and take someone out for something and it's like, okay, well, I'm just gonna like, put a VHS tape in and record Goldeneye and just shoot the silence PP7 a bunch and then like, get all the other guns for other ones and then like, feed it into, you know, Final cut or whatever. And yeah, that stuff was fun as hell.

[Mary Kish]

So that's not creating sound effects. That was stealing.

[Dan Reichert]

That is stealing from Nintendo as a

[Jake Decker]

child, but went through the process, you

[Mary Kish]

know, you definitely stole those sound effects from a video game.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

The men to your.

[Dan Reichert]

Well, they're doing Things like Nintendo sues you. Oh yeah, I made a lot of money off those shitty Tarantino rip offs when I was 17 year old.

[Mary Kish]

Shitty trailers for Tarantino and they find them in copyright strike your ass.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, well, there's funny parts in, in the Dirties where it's like they want like this girl to be in it because like at one point Matt Johnson dresses up like a woman to be like a woman character in this thing's like, ah, everyone's gonna give me for this. We need to like, we need to like talk to an actual girl and get her in this.

[Mary Kish]

We need to talk to girl.

[Dan Reichert]

There's this girl in their class in their video production class that they want to be in and she just has to say this one line where it's like, help, you know, help, please call the cops or something like that. And so when that girl in class is showing her movie and they open it up to questions afterwards, Matt Johnson's like, hey, what's the part where you said, you know, help, please call the cops. And she was like, what? He's like, yeah, that part where you said, help, please call the cops. And she. I didn't say that. He's like, well, didn't say what? And she's like, you're saying I said, help, please call the cops. And they're filming that and then they take that part and put it into the movie.

[Mary Kish]

But she's not saying it's stressed out. She's right. She's saying, please call the cops.

[Dan Reichert]

It doesn't fit at all. Yay.

[Mary Kish]

That's pretty funny.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. All right, well, we, we alluded to some games here. We alluded to mixtape. I know, Mary, you talked about that last. Me and Jake can kind of talk about our thoughts a little bit here, but we've got other games. We've got newer games that we can kick off with soon. So stick around and we will be right back. Video games. They're here, we're playing them, including Mina the Hollower. Now this is an interesting one because we're kind of in this purgatory zone between embargoes here. So we. This is not a spoiler warning here because we actually have to keep things pretty vague and we can't talk about later game stuff. We're not gonna be talking about specific boss fights. We're gonna be talking general thoughts on maybe kind of the early parts and format and things like that. I mean, the Hollow. It sounds like we've all played quite a bit of it.

[Mary Kish]

It sounds like we have a Range of times it sounds like, Jake, you might have rolled credits. So you've played a good chunk, which is cool though.

[Jake Decker]

I have finished it. Yeah, I have finished it and that's all I'll say in that regard.

[Dan Reichert]

Okay. I'm like 10 hours in. Mary, how about you?

[Mary Kish]

I'm like 26 hours in and I know that I've. I think it's fair you can say that generally what you're doing is you're like getting these towers and I have, I have gotten four. So that's like a good like at least gauge of how far I'm in because I think there's about six.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, imagine like, you know, Zelda dungeons basically. You know, there's a handful of.

[Mary Kish]

I've actually heard a lot of people comparing this to Zelda Force Awakening.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, the kind of the top down. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Go ahead, Jake.

[Jake Decker]

I was going to say, I think one of the interesting things about this embargo with this specific game is that there are specific dungeons we can talk about. But the thing is, is you can do them in any order. So in theory, the first two dungeons, like I didn't do the Bayou, which is one we can talk about until like my third.

[Dan Reichert]

Third one that was my second.

[Jake Decker]

And apparently like, yeah, that's crazy that it was your fourth too because one of them is like a pain to get to otherwise. Right. So it's like, it's very interesting. Like this game doesn't fit that kind of embargo. I was expecting stricter restrictions.

[Mary Kish]

It's very confusing to me to find out that Bayou was one of the ones that it encourages you to talk about because it's probably early on, probably because it's easier to get to and maybe it's easier to get through than the later ones. I've really been crawling my way through this game. This is a difficult game is how I'm going to start. This is a challenging game that is not for the faint hearted. I think it is difficult to go the wrong direction. I found it really challenging with the towers that I picked first. Took me. It took me like 10 hours to get my first tower because it was so fucking hard. I could not get through this game. You guys. I have out loud said multiple times, this game isn't for me. This game is not for me. It's too hard now that I'm like 20, 25 hours in. I'm like, oh no, I get it now. But holy shit, if you go the wrong way, it's total Dark Souls where you're Just like you're in an area you should not be in. And I didn't know that.

[Jake Decker]

Couple questions for you both. I take it no one looked at the newspapers.

[Dan Reichert]

No, I did. And so, okay, because the newspapers do,

[Jake Decker]

in theory, they guide you to the dungeons you should be doing in order from easiest to hardest. I didn't know this either, though. So I just kind of blundered around until I went to. I finally made progress in the crypt, which is the.

[Dan Reichert]

Supposed to be the first one I went to.

[Mary Kish]

The other tower we're allowed to talk about as well. So we talk about the crypt and the bayou.

[Dan Reichert]

Yep.

[Mary Kish]

I did not know this. I did read that. I thought they were just giving me hints. And also, if you talk to the people in the town, which we're also allowed to talk about this, we're allowed to talk about the. What's it called?

[Dan Reichert]

Generally talking to NPCs and stuff in the Loner's Landing.

[Mary Kish]

I think that's the town, right?

[Dan Reichert]

No, it's like the ossex or something, Right. Isn't Essex the six is the town? Yeah. Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Okay. There's a town. An. And every person you talk to is like, I heard there's something going on in the bayou. Like, my. My friend says there's a lot of bones in the swamp. And I'm like, okay, so I suppose I should go there. But at no point did I feel like I was supposed to go to the bayou first. So I just walked around, and when I got into an area. And this is exactly what happens in this game, similarly to Souls. If I can just, like, back up for a second and kind of explain a fundamental component of this game. Souls Esque. But the bones are their dollars. You have to kill things to get their bones. And if you die, your bones are put into a soul, and you need to go to that same spot. Sure. And you need to get it. And if the soul goes into a monster, you need to kill that monster in order to get your bones back. And if you die a second time, you lose your bones, they're gone. And it even. It mocks you. It tells you you lost this many bones and it's in the newspaper, it'll tell you. It tallies all your lost bones and it fucking throws them in your face. And I have lost. I have lost tens of thousands of bones. Anytime when you play this game, you will be like, oh, no, I have 500 bones. I'm so scared to lose them. It doesn't even faze me anymore. I've lost 5,000 bones in a. In a single life, all the time. It's brutal, dude. Like, losing that many bones will make you hate yourself. But I've lost so many bones that my soul is hardened into like a concrete lump. I just don't care anymore anyway. These other areas, you'll face probably more difficult challenges and so it's harder to get your bones back. What I'm saying is, is the reason I, like didn't go to the bayou is because once I found myself in an area I had all these bones and I was like, I'm afraid to lose these bones. And if I did die, I had to go get my bones. So at no point did I feel like I could just abandon ship because I needed to go get those bones.

[Jake Decker]

And then when you get your bones,

[Dan Reichert]

you're not gonna turn around.

[Jake Decker]

You're like, well, I've already made it this far. I'm gonna keep going forward.

[Mary Kish]

You know, I think as far as I'm aware, there's not like a lot of fast travel situations here. Like, you need to. You need to figure it the fuck out. And this area is dangerous. There's the underground passages. If you go to the underground, which is like how you save, I guess it's like where you would the Burrows died.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah,

[Mary Kish]

you. You feel like you need to like stick it out in those spaces because once you trap, once you go down there, the monsters come back to life again.

[Dan Reichert]

It's the bonfire. Yeah, yeah.

[Mary Kish]

If you save, everything is back to life. And so now you're in danger again. To be sure you can get through it. But I think this game, you kind of start quite weak and over time you build a lot of your skill set. You grow more weapons, you grow more, your health bar can expand. And I think that really helps with getting through it in the later stages.

[Dan Reichert]

Now, I have found it very difficult, but I feel like in a very different way than you have, Mary, because I have not died much. I've died, but I've recovered. I haven't lost a lot of bones basically, but. But my problem is especially early on, actually, the whole time it's like the amount of times I'm just running around in like, okay, I'm going to talk to every NPC a million times. But then I'm just kind of going around the same area and just kind of this circuit and it's like, oh, I've been here a million times. I don't see anywhere I can go forward. I'm just fiddle farting around forever. And then it's like, it wasn't until I started checking the newspapers where it was like, oh, go this way, Go to the east, go to the swamp, go to the whatever. And then I. So I think I went in specifically the order the game was recommending. So I think that's why I haven't died much is because. Because it's like, kind of ramping it up appropriately. But it's crazy to me. I didn't know until an hour ago when we, you know, first hopped on this call that you could go in any order, because I swear I had done a full lap around this map. And there's not a map. There's not a quest marker or quest log or anything like that unless that opens up later. So I'm. I'm. Well, I.

[Jake Decker]

What do you not have the map?

[Dan Reichert]

They're not a specific one.

[Jake Decker]

Okay.

[Dan Reichert]

There's one that I can just see where generally, like, yes, here's where the swamp is, but not like, here's where I am in relation. Not a Zelda style. Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

Not like the tile by tile, but there is a map that I didn't find until, like, halfway through the game. So I was really just kind of poking and prodding every direction. And then I think someone at GameSpot was like, yeah, in the map, there's this area. And I was like, there's a map. Where do I get the map?

[Dan Reichert]

It's definitely not. I've never seen one where you can

[Mary Kish]

just pause conversation with another person who had a copy. And we had this conversation and I said, well, it gets. It gets better when you find the map. And they said, oh, fucking what? And they were mad at the idea that there's been a map to me. Jake and I were talking about this. It's kind of like tunic, where there are things that you can get right away. There are things that are pretty easy for you to acquire, but you don't know they exist. So you're not looking for them. You don't know. And thus, when you find out it exists, you might have two different reactions. One might be, oh, my God, thank God, I'm so glad I found this. The other might be, this was here the whole time. The whole time. The whole time. Like, you might get mad when you realize that this thing that was really difficult for you to traverse is actually quite easy once you realize that you needed to do a very specific thing in order to alter it. And that will happen in this game. There are. There are things that the game you could have done the whole time and you didn't know, because the game didn't teach that to you yet. I think it's cool. But similarly to tunic, I get a little pissed off when I find out that I have been suffering for three hours, when it's because I didn't know that there was this skill. The game will teach you, but you have to have a lot of patience with yourself, I think.

[Dan Reichert]

So, Mary, when you first started describing that, I assumed you were gonna say, oh, it's a trinket. You can equip or something, and then you can hop over this thing or what. But the more you said it, like, if you're bringing up tunic and stuff, it makes me think, like, oh, God, are there, like, control things I haven't even considered?

[Jake Decker]

So I would say one example that we can talk about, because you can't actually progress through the bayou unless you know it, but you can. You know how you can burrow? You can burrow in the ground, but you can also burrow in water, and that's how you, like, cover extra gas. And I was stuck there for, like, 30 minutes. I was like, what am I supposed to do? Am I missing some item? Is there? And then I think I accidentally just, out of frustration, was just jumping, and then, like, swam, and I was like, oh. So I've been able to do this the whole time, and I had no idea.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, it's a mix of, like, I like that stuff. I like those, like, aha. Moments that I. It's cool when a game doesn't hold your hand too much, and because it gives you those moments and you feel like a genius, and, like, that's great. But it also can lead to very frustrating moments where it's like, for instance, I was in the bayou, and there's, like, a group of characters that are like, hey, we're looking for our buddy. And then I found a guy who was clearly their buddy, and he was like, oh, do you want to lead me back to my friends or whatever? I was like, oh, great. Sure. Let's go. And I remember I was trying to do some, like, platforming or whatever to bring back to his friends. And again, there's no map, there's no arrow, there's no anything. So it's just like, I think they were this way. But then if he falls in a hole or you fall in a hole or whatever, I think it resets at a certain point. I just had to save the game, went to bed or whatever, load it back up. And I remember, like, oh, right. I was trying to bring that guy back to his friends. And I was, where was that guy at? And so I spent like probably over half hour just like going around these same swamp screens over and over and over being like, oh man, I just, I don't need a big glowing arrow at all times telling me what to do. But like, I wish it was a little bit easier to like look back at a log of some sort and be like, oh, you found him here.

[Mary Kish]

Does not hold your hand. This is a gamer ass video game.

[Dan Reichert]

It is.

[Mary Kish]

And especially with a lot of the commentary right now and what's considered a video game, this is a video game for gamers. This game will not tell you what to do. It will give you some hints and some guidelines. You need to use your noodle and if you don't, you will be punished very harshly for it. I think it asks a lot of the player visually. And another area that we're allowed to talk about is the crypt. And there is a lot of hidden areas, there's hidden walls, there's areas that will give you a very small visual indicator that you can actually burrow under it. And if you do not pay attention, you will miss a vital key or button that you need to progress. And if you don't find it, you will spend 45 boobless minutes looking around waiting for something to happen. Which happened to me multiple times. And when I finally realized that there was a crack in a wall and I needed to hit the wall in order to find something, I was actually a little pissed. I, I got over it. And I actually, if I can just say I feel like I've been complaining a lot. I really like this game. I have a very good experience at this game. But I haven't had a game in so long that has made me verbally say fuck this game in a long time. And I did say that several times playing this game. And then I, over time I realized the game is teaching me, the game is pushing me. The game is applying pressure. It thinks that you're smart enough that you will just figure out that there is a hidden door and you need to find it. That the game thinks you are smart, it thinks you're capable and it thinks you are good. And it, it asks a lot of the player.

[Dan Reichert]

It does. But it also like unnecessarily kind of holds you back sometimes where it's like, you know, in like Breath of Wild, you run into a thing in the world and you're like, okay, well I don't think I have what it takes to get here now, but let me I'll leave the stamp on the map or whatever. Like that was a very, very helpful cool thing in that game. And many games have done it since this game. Everywhere you go in dungeons, the Overworld, everything, there's just like, oh, here's this character that says like, hey, if you give me a thousand bones, I'll do a thing. Oh shit, I have 400. I need to remember to come back to this guy later. Or you see a gap you don't know how to cross. You see a wall. Like I. I walked up to this place where there's like two like lightning bolts going and near like kind of this river thing. I was like, what the is this? I gotta remember to like, I don't think I can do anything with this now. But there is no way like it. Unless you're just taking notes, which again, like I know tunic. And games like Fez and things like that like Incurred the Witness encourage you to like take notes and stuff.

[Mary Kish]

You need a gamer notebook for this game. In my.

[Dan Reichert]

Even then it's like, I don't know, like I don't think there's like a, oh, I need to go to a 7 on the map. I think it's just there is. Yeah, River Lightning. Find that again. Find the frog in the bayou. He needs help or whatever. It's like, like even if I took those notes, I don't think I would know how to get back to that. So that can be very frustrating.

[Jake Decker]

I had a great time with this game. I enjoyed it a lot. I think probably the main thing that will throw people off is that this looks like Link's Awakening. I think they've said Link's Awakening is a big inspiration, these Game Boy color Zelda games. The thing is, this is not like a Zelda game at all. Other than how it looks. It is a Dark Souls game. Specifically. It reminds me a lot of Dark Souls one in that there are a lot of routes that you can follow. You're going to have to do most of them, not all of them eventually. But if you know your way around the world, you can find other ways through it. So this to me feels like more of a top down 2D Dark Souls game. And like we can be vague, I would say all the way up to the very end. Like those comparisons make even more sense by the time you get to the end. And I, I think that is, is probably why I've enjoyed it so much. Because I love those Dark Souls games and that sort of world design. And this follows that format. I would say Somewhat strictly in a good way. But yeah, I, I, I had a great time. I definitely had frustrations though. But it sounds like my frustrations might be a little different. I would say. I'm with you though, Mary. I think like the, the beginning is so brutal. Like every direction I was going, I didn't have a map. I was dying no matter what I tried to do. But once you sort of get a handle once. I just started investing in strength and defense and ignored everything else. Like your sidearm upgrades, because I don't like how sidearms are utilized. Like, you lose us, like they're not permanent. So if you die, you lose the sidearm and then you don't have a sidearm. And some of those sidearms you need in order to solve certain puzzles. So then you're like, where the heck was that sidearm? And then you're having to go back

[Dan Reichert]

and find the bike somewhere.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, yeah. Yes. So I wish some of those tools were permanent and I wish there was more of a Zelda like side there maybe where like, you know, you get the bike and you've got the bike from now on, you know, but, and then I had some like depth issues with like your jumps and going under and I think that's just the nature of the top down perspective. But yeah, I really enjoyed this game, but I definitely shared some of those frustrations.

[Dan Reichert]

I feel like, yeah, I am getting very frustrated with it. But I do think it's telling that I have had numerous times now where I've been like, you know what? I respect what they're doing. I don't think it's for me. And I've put it down and I've kind of just been like finding myself being like picking the steam deck back up and being like, okay. And then like having a breakthrough and being like, ooh, that felt good. Okay. And so like that's happened a few times with me and I think that's pretty telling that, like, it's not one that I'm just putting away. It's. It's still rattling around in my craw a bit. And every time I come back, I'm rewarded.

[Mary Kish]

You know, the lows are low and the highs are high. As a result of that, I think, I think the frustrations of truly not knowing where to go and getting stuck in a space is a little mean. I think there are some things about this game that I wish they, I understand that they wanted to make a difficult game. They succeeded in that. I think the heal animation is too long and yeah, it's, it's. It's almost brutally long where when you are in a boss fight you should just not count on the ability to heal.

[Dan Reichert]

It takes, I mean, or it's so long. It's the Dark Souls thing. It's just like, well, okay, this particular attack, he has such a wind up for it or such a recovery from it. It's like this is the time I can like get away from him real quick and get a heel in.

[Mary Kish]

You haven't done the boss fights I've done because you can't heal in some of these boss fights. Dan, I am telling you, there are boss fights where you cannot heal. And like I had to, I. I was suffering. Go ahead, Jake.

[Jake Decker]

So, so this too is like kind of interesting as well though because like Hollow Knight, I would say this is probably the best sort of. But they have trinkets and there are ways that sort of change those situations of frustration based on the trinkets you are holding. But the thing is, some of those trinkets, there's one really good one at the end of the crypt that I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of people just straight up don't get and then they are playing the rest of the game without I think the best trinket that helped me through so many very difficult fights probably.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, wait, okay, wait, no, I think I might have got it. Does it involve. It protects you and also hurts other things?

[Jake Decker]

Nope.

[Dan Reichert]

Shit, did I miss it? Oh God. Oh, give me a hint. What does it do?

[Jake Decker]

It's vague. You have to help a guy. You have to help a guy at the end of the crypt.

[Mary Kish]

Oh, he's looking for his lover.

[Dan Reichert]

What the fuck is this?

[Jake Decker]

It sounds like Mary did this, but I did it.

[Dan Reichert]

Point me towards it. I gotta go back to the crypt.

[Jake Decker]

Go back. Go back to the crypt. Maybe check another room or two right before the boss and you might.

[Dan Reichert]

You might end the actual thing. Oh my God. I wonder if I. Oh, that sucks.

[Mary Kish]

Wait, is it a thing that helps

[Dan Reichert]

you recover if you die?

[Jake Decker]

Yes.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, okay. I think I might have got that actually.

[Jake Decker]

Okay. Yeah.

[Dan Reichert]

Seems like a pretty important thing, especially

[Jake Decker]

in the later areas or the later bosses. I don't know how I would have beaten it without that.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, that is how I would have equipped through without. Okay, yeah, I think I got that then. All right. Is it a vial of sorts?

[Jake Decker]

Yes.

[Dan Reichert]

Okay. Okay, I think I got it.

[Mary Kish]

Okay, Dan, you're not vague at all.

[Dan Reichert]

It didn't say anything about the trinkets.

[Mary Kish]

Let's just say it's a vial that helps you heal.

[Dan Reichert]

I read the preview barter three times before we can talk.

[Jake Decker]

Talk about it.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, we're good. We're good.

[Mary Kish]

It's just you dancing around literally describing it.

[Dan Reichert]

I think. I think we could if we wanted to, but we're just not spoiling it. But it is a really cool game. I wonder. This is a thing where I could either fall off two hours from now and just be like, I respect it but it's. I can't do it. Or it could be a thing that I push through and beat and I. It's one of my favorites of the year. Like, either way, it's a fun one to talk about.

[Mary Kish]

This game. I. I have put a lot of time into this. I have sunk so many hours into it and I've. There's just a bit of a. What do you like? A sunk cost fallacy at this point where it's just like you're so far. You gotta. You gotta see it to the end now. Feeling it. I am excited. I do enjoy playing it. I look forward to playing it. I've had. I've had this opportunity where I'm like, well, you should really play more Sorrows and you should really play, you know, Forza. Like there's all these things I keep picking this game up and I think it's an excellent game probably for being in a plane just because it will lend itself to the Steam deck. So I will have more to say about it. I think it's great and I think people are going to really like this game. My general consensus is I think the audiences are going to like this game. But I am warning you that this is a tough game.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, you really just have to push through those first three, four, five hours and just. Just get your bearings, level up a bit and just slap yourself.

[Mary Kish]

Realize, look yourself in the mirror and lock in. Fucking go for it.

[Jake Decker]

You're going to throw some bones down the drain and you just have to accept it and move on.

[Mary Kish]

Don't read that part of the newspaper. It's almost laughing at you. It's so mean. It's like, here's this really latest update. Do you want how many bones you lost, you stupid bitch? You don't know how to play this game at all. It breaks my heart, but apparently also I did the most difficult spaces first just to. Just because I hate myself. And I really did. I really hated myself. I said out loud, I'm not a good gamer. I'm not good enough. I can't do this.

[Jake Decker]

I honestly don't know how you managed to do one of those dungeons before the Nox Bayou or whatever. If that was your fourth one, that is crazy.

[Mary Kish]

I did the bayou fourth. And if I could do it again. And it's funny too because I was burning through the bio, you guys. I was like, I bet I was zip zapping people. I was just like, you're dead. You're dead. I felt like a God in the bayou because I had, I had become so emboldened from these other places. I don't know. So I don't know, maybe. Maybe the rest of the game, you know, will get more difficult and I'll. I'll feel it again. But it's. It's been fun going from a sack of nothing that is so worthless and can't do anything in this game to a pretty formidable warrior. Not just in the game. Right. Not just your character building, but me, the player. I have learned the mechanics of this game, that I am a better player and I am smarter and I understand it and I think that is a well designed video game. Right. Like I am better for what this game has done to me. But I am scarred from this game.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. I think it'd be hard to argue that this is not a good video game. I think you're gonna get a lot of people that say it's not for me and that's fine. But undeniably they had a vision with this game and they pulled it off in a. Like this. This is a unique video game experience that I'm really enjoying poking at.

[Mary Kish]

I think young people will gravitate towards this because this kind of reminds me of the games that we had when we were young.

[Dan Reichert]

Sure.

[Mary Kish]

It's kind of like remind. It's like hearkening back not just to like Link's Awakening, but like the Lion Kings of the World where it was like, you're not supposed to finish this. You're not good enough. Timmy, this isn't. For a 7 year old to get through this game is gonna destroy your self esteem. But that's okay because like this game isn't really trying to make sure everybody finishes it. It's very obvious as you said, that they knew what they were making with this. They're making a difficult game that progresses you over time and there's going to be a lot of quitters.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah. Also just like tonally much darker than I expected for the main character being a cute little mouse. Some of those characters, some of the things you come across, some of the things you do or I mean not do, but like things, you know, like I'm like, oh, this is. This is. I don't know if it's heavy because it's not darker video games, but like.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Kind of fucked up visuals. Some like boss fights and stuff like that. Oh, can I say something cute? That happened. I. I always love little touches that let you know that they put a lot of TLC into this game. Like something you'd see once and then it just. You never see it again. It's like. Well, they made a custom animation just for this one thing. Well, there's this area where if you drop from the sky, if you drop on some leaves, you kind of crush the leaves and that helps with mobility and moving around. But the first time I did it in this one space, I crushed a leaf and the leaf animated and went, no. And I broke his leg and he started crawling on the ground to try to get away from me. And then he stretched his arm out and he died. And then two other leaves come up to him and they go, no. Oh, wow, you monster. And I. And I'm just sitting there like, what? And. And they mourn him and they won't talk to you because you killed their friend.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, that's great. I like that.

[Mary Kish]

And they, they animate this little leaf like trying to survive. It's. It's like cheeky. It's dark. It's funny. There was so much energy into it and I don't even know why they did. Serves no purpose personality as a character. There's no reason for it.

[Jake Decker]

It's all that shovel knight money. They take the time they want, you know, Add that they took their sweet

[Dan Reichert]

time with this game. Yeah, I know.

[Mary Kish]

They rely the opposite of lazy devs. There's so much TLC in this. You can feel it. You can feel the love in this game. You can see the background animations. Oh, the folly. They did a good job with the animations and the visual style of this game. It's. It's dark and brooding and it nails the aesthetic that they were going for and I respect that. They put so much energy. This is a well made game.

[Jake Decker]

What weapon did you guys choose?

[Dan Reichert]

The flail.

[Jake Decker]

Oh yeah, the Flail. I did two.

[Dan Reichert]

I like it a lot.

[Jake Decker]

I did the flail and then I flail.

[Mary Kish]

Sorry, I don't know.

[Dan Reichert]

The chain, like the whip thing with

[Mary Kish]

the ball on the end. Yeah, yeah, that's what I have too.

[Jake Decker]

Okay.

[Mary Kish]

It's not my favorite.

[Dan Reichert]

I unlocked the hammer and I haven't really used it much. I think I like the range of the flail.

[Jake Decker]

The range of the flail is nice. I've been using the daggers, though, and I've enjoyed because that is more classic Zelba. It feels where it even just like sticks out the swords, you know, like Link does.

[Mary Kish]

You guys, I'm all shield all day.

[Jake Decker]

The shield is really good. Yeah, I enjoyed using the shield a lot.

[Mary Kish]

Game changer. I love my shield. Oh, I. I will agree that the flail gives you range. The shield is a short range, but my God, it is such a game changer for boss or anything that you're intimidated by and you're scared. It just protects you from one hit and what a magical thing. And you can upgrade. Oh, my God. We probably can't talk about it too much, but that's my goat. I love that shield. I would probably hate this game if it wasn't for that. When I got that, I was like, okay, I understand. I think I can do this now.

[Dan Reichert]

Out. Okay, well, I got a lot more to play. We'll see how I feel about it. We'll see if. If Mike is. If they let him play games at camp. Yeah, definitely not the last. You will hear about that game here. But for now, Jake, you and I played some Yoshi in the Mysterious book. Well, I. I reviewed it. I. I beat it. I reviewed it on Giant Bomb. Gave it four out of five stars. Jake, how much did you play of it?

[Jake Decker]

I made it through chapter six. So I rolled credit the first credits and I unlocked the. The modular UI thing.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. Which is weird. There's some weird post credits. Yeah. That you can unlock. Just odd stuff for a Nintendo game. But I. I liked it. I gave it four out of five. At first I thought I was going to like, be like, this is too kind of kitty. The same reasons I didn't love Yoshi's story back in the day is like, all right, well, Yoshi's island on Super Nintendo was this like, challenging, great platformer. And then they just really dumbed everything down for Yoshi's story. I was expecting that with this based on the art style and everything, the very storybook aesthetic and everything. But it's just a totally different type of game. It is a puzzle game. It's an adventure game. It's like you're basically filling out like a bestiary of these creatures inside this book. So it's like you're going in and every level you go into a page of the storybook and it's like, here's a new creature and you'll Try to lick it. And then you'll see what that does. And then you'll try to pick it up, see what that does, throw it, you'll stomp it. You'll do. And you kind of learn what it can do and how it can interact with the level. And it's just kind of like an undefined end to every level. Sometimes you got to climb a tree to. To the highest point. Sometimes you need to, like, introduce this character to this thing. Sometimes you need to eat all of these things or whatever. But it's. It's just a game about exploration and discovery, basically. And I did definitely grow to respect it and enjoy it by the end, especially Jake. There's some stuff past that, chapter six, that, like, just does some. That's when they kind of get experimental with some of this stuff. Like, there's just some weird, weird levels going on there. But have you enjoyed it, Jake?

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, I'm eager to play more. I made it to, like, I made it to the credits yesterday, so I have not touched anything beyond that because I was too into Mina the Hollower, to be honest. But I really liked it. I mean, I think my. This is going to sound hyperbolic, but I don't mean it to be hyperbolic at all. But I've never played a platformer like this before. You were talking about how a lot of the objectives are undefined. Depending on the level you go to, it's different, but it also doesn't tell you what those objectives are. When you load in, it's just like, yeah, there's a little guy here, and you need to interact with the little guy and see what the little guy tastes like. And then you show up and you're eating the little guy, you're throwing the little guy, you're like bouncing on the little guy, whatever it might be. And you just kind of like, naturally come up with some like, yeah, this seems like what I should be doing. And then you keep doing it, and all of a sudden it's like, congrats, you figured out the puzzle of this area. So I found it really compelling to just keep checking out different levels and seeing what that gimmick would be. And yeah, I really enjoyed it. I don't think I loved it. Like, I would prefer a Mario platformer or something of that nature, but I think. I think that's a more interesting direction for Yoshi platformers to go than just making it easy. Because it's easy.

[Dan Reichert]

You know, it's like Mario's got just the straight up platforming thing down you're not going to beat Mario at a platforming game. Kirby is also a platformer, but kind of has its own whole weird thing of like an inhabiting the enemies and things in the environment and floating around. It's got a different feel than Mario Yoshi. Like, like the moveset is the same. You got the flutter jump, you got the stomp, you're eating things, you're throwing eggs. It's just the way you are using those is not just avoiding or attacking enemies or not falling down holes. It is like poking around at a level and seeing what happens. And like some of those are kind of like more low key and then some of them are like, I kind of compared them in my review to like the Donkey Kong country minecart levels where it's like this one is like a weird skateboard looking creature that you can kind of surf on and you're on the waves and you're going around finding all these like little baby skateboards on the oce stuff and it's much more kinetic or like, you know, this creature is like a hang glider, this one. Like so there's just every level you go into, you have no idea what to expect in terms of like what these things do or what you will be doing with them. So I just think variety is probably the game's strongest suit.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah. And I would say it not only is it the strongest thing, but like it also, like I was saying, it just, it just keeps me interested. Like I wanted to keep going just to see what I was going to see. And I would say some of them were definitely duds. I'm trying to think of some off, off the top of my head, but there was certainly some where I was like, I don't really like this gimmick. Thankfully once you're done, you kind of move on. Like sometimes those creatures will appear again, but a lot of times they just don't. My favorite though, the boomerang was a lot of fun and how you like figured out ways to upgrade the boomerang and by the end you're like really just knocking things down. I, I, that one was really cool.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. There's the ones that like one where

[Jake Decker]

you have to hide from that.

[Dan Reichert]

That one was crazy because I was

[Jake Decker]

like, what is this? What cute thing is this? And it's like, oh, I, it just killed me. Okay.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. Because I kept thinking like, you know, this would be a great game for kids and I still think that. But like that one particular level, it's like, it's almost like a Mr. X type thing where it's like you have to kind of stealth your way around and he is going to like just pursue you and kill you basically in one hit. Yeah, yeah. And then you talked about like some of them, like the boomerang evolving. There's one. You can name all these. And I named this one a flammer because it was like a flower hammer type thing. And it was like, it had this mouth on the hammer. It was like a King dedede hammer. And he's like, the more you hit bugs and butterflies and stuff with it, it eats it and it starts growing more and more. And then at a certain point it grows big enough to where you can bring it down on a big boulder and it'll crack the boulder and open up new parts of the level and things like that. So it is just, it is just non stop, just discovery of like, oh, it does this. Oh, it does this. Oh, that's fun. Oh, I didn't know I could do that. Or like, like just fun little. Like I, I, if I was a kid, like, hell, I'm 42 and I, and I thought it was a ton of fun. I imagine like a kid having a blast with it. And also it's low stakes. There's no health bar. You're not dying when you fall down a hole. Even when that like scary bush thing kills you, you just kind of get spawned right back, you know.

[Jake Decker]

Well, you say there's no health bar, but I think that is probably one of the weirder things about it is I don't know how because once you roll credits, you, you unlock the ability to unlock different aspects of the UI that weren't present there before.

[Dan Reichert]

The waveform of Yoshi's heart rate.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, it's super bizarre. Or like the temperature of this or. But, but one of them is a health bar. Like you can unlock a health bar. So you can play with a health bar. But even if the health bar is empty, from what I understand, you're still like, nothing really happens. I think Yoshi's animation just changes.

[Dan Reichert]

It's just so weird. There's a pedometer that you unlock.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah. And part of it, I see it and I'm like, this is kind of cool because it, it shows an extra level of detail to all these little creatures. Right. Like, okay, these creatures for some reason have like an internal temperature or whatever or a weight. And like, you know, you can tell how much they weigh by like it's like a fulcrum. Yeah, yeah, it's, it's super bizarre in a way. I almost wish. I think our reviewer at Gamespot talked about this, Steve Watts. But I almost wish I could unlock some of that stuff sooner just to kind of get a better grasp at, like, what these creatures meant in the world. Like, one thing I love about. There's many things I love about Breath of the Wild, but one of the things I really love about it is like, each item kind of has its own identity and its own use within

[Dan Reichert]

that world in interactions with other items.

[Jake Decker]

Interactions. And Yoshi has this too, but it feels like a light version of that. But then you start seeing all these extra details that have gone into these items and it's like, man, I kind of wanted to know that sooner, I guess. Maybe not. Maybe if I had it up front I'd be like, what the hell is this? Why do I need to know the way. It's a very interesting, like, post game mechanic, I guess. Yeah, it's.

[Dan Reichert]

I mean, interesting is a word I come up with with this game a lot because, like, I think a lot of previous Yoshi games post Yoshi's island have not even been interesting. Like there's Woolly World and Crafted World and stuff like that, which are not bad games. These are still Nintendo first party platformers. They're like, they're beautiful. They're. They're solid platformers, but there's not anything particularly interesting about them. This is a game where it's like pretty much every level there's something where I was like, oh, that's interesting. Oh, okay, that's cool. I didn't expect that. Like, I think this is a really cool new approach to Yoshi.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, I agree. I hope that's what Yoshi games are going forward because I, I like Yoshi. I like the character. It's one of my best characters in Smash Bros. So, you know, I've got respects for the little green dinosaur, but I've like, you know, like you're saying the modern Yoshi games I've not been able to get through. And this is the first one where, you know, since way back when, where I was like compelled to keep playing and I do want to go back and play those extra chapters and see what's there.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, cool stuff. Mary, what is Forbidden Solitaire?

[Mary Kish]

Forbidden Solitaire was recommended to me last episode by Vinnie and he. Right, it's pretty fun. Forbidden Solitaire is a solitaire bass, but it also has FMV videos.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, I see why Vinnie was playing it. Okay.

[Mary Kish]

Give you like a 1995 CD Rom vibe.

[Dan Reichert]

All right. This Is all sounding vinny. Okay.

[Mary Kish]

That also has dark, scary elements where the way the game opens is on a desktop and so you click on the game to play it. But you also have instant messenger with some family members and they're like, I can't believe you're playing forbidden solitaire. I'm looking up all the cool stuff about that game. Can you believe they don't sell it anymore because of what happened as they're sending you, like, videos and images of, like, behind the scenes. Ultimately, like, as you progress through the game, there's something very sinister going on with the developers who constructed this game. There might be something like, evil or like, messed up about the actual foundation of the game. You watch a review, which I think would be funny if you watched because it's one of those classic pretend to be a 1995 video game review.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, the dream.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, yeah. And he's like. He's like, I couldn't even finish the game because of these late game bugs. It's actually pretty problematic. But it's very funny to watch how they reconstructed what they thought game reviewers were like in the 90s. It's fun. It's a bit repetitive. You are just straight up playing saw Every time. You know you'll be in this dungeon, it'll be like, you don't know where to go, or there's a grate without a key and you gotta find the key or there's a monster that's attacking. It's like, well, better play solitaire than you play solitaire. And if you win, you get through the situation and if you lose, you die. So I'm playing a lot of solitaire, but they try and mix it up with, like, cards that are. Maybe they have vines on them, or maybe you have to click on them three times or there's cards that hurt you. I like that. In a boss fight, it's actually not about winning solitaire. It's about getting enough cards each turn because cards are your weapon against the boss. So you actually at some point want to be like, I want a new solitaire game. It's not about you completing this solitaire game. It's about you getting a lot of cards in one turn to do damage.

[Dan Reichert]

The look of this, I'm looking up some images. Like, they nailed that. Did they make, like, fake ads and stuff for this? Like, this looks incredible. Like, the box art and all that. Like, they are nailing that.

[Mary Kish]

They did and they do a lot. Remember I told you that your family member messages you and is like, you gotta Check this video. They have spoofs of TV shows back in the day where like a television show host would be like, you've heard that maybe some video games can make you violent, but have you ever heard of a video game that kills you? Tonight we're gonna discover Forbidden Solid. And so it's like going. It's like that old vibe of, like a TV show that's investigative reporting games. It's obviously all actors, but it's. It's silly and cheeky enough that I kind of bought it. And I just. I don't know. I. I think this game sets out what it wants to do in a fun way. It has really fun gimmicks. There are these upgrades that you can buy with points that you get in the game, and they're gems, and the gems get embedded into your hand. Like they go into your skin and into your nails and stuff. It's kind of fucked up. Like, it's. It's been a fun ride. I haven't finished it. I. I feel like I'm probably pretty close. I. I likely. I have a big plane ride coming up, and I think it's going to be one for the plane ride for me to just mess with. It's been a joy. Vinnie was right.

[Dan Reichert]

I'm gonna make this sound. This seems like a good one to have installed for a play. Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

What if you don't like solitaire? I like solitaire. I'm just like, do not buy this game. It's just very solitaire focused.

[Mary Kish]

Otherwise, solitaire, it does some. Again, you know, like, there's some changes to it, like on the regular ones, you're trying to win a regular game of solitaire. I think that. That this game takes liberties. It's obvious to me that in certain areas, they have designed it so that you're going to get through it. Right. They're gonna give you a card that's plus one or minus one of what you need, which I appreciate. But there's these upgrades that allow you to destroy. There's like, this one card that allows you. They're like bonuses. They're kind of like jokers in Balatron. And so you could pick it and it'll just be like, I'm gonna lightning strike three random cards to get rid of them for you so you can win faster. Or there's ones that are like, I'm gonna turn over six cards that you know what they are and you can plan accordingly. And I've enjoyed the little additions that they've made that spice up solitaire. So I don't just feel like I'm playing solitaire. There's also, like, mini games too. There's this creature that is stalking you and you're hiding from it. And so when you play solitaire to hide from this creature, there's a cone of vision. And you can't play cards in the cone of vision because it'll see you.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, that's cool. Okay.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah. So it's like, it messes with it. Ultimately, you're playing a shit ton of solitaire. So you don't like solitaire. Don't play this like you're miserable. Good. Then you're gonna like it. This. That's. That's probably how I would sell it then. If you like solitaire, I think you're gonna like forbidden solitaire. If you don't like solitaire. No, this isn't for you. I don't know how long it is, but I, I'm. I'm suspicious that it's not super long, but I actually think it's gonna overstay. It's welcome if it's much longer. To me, I. I am totally getting what it's trying to do. And there's already been, like, some spoopy voiceovers in the game that I think were not, you know, they weren't meant to be in the final version of. This is a game that they're saying, we. We planned for you to play this game. This is a game within a game, if that makes sense.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

And so it's clear that they're starting to say something's wrong with the game that you're playing.

[Dan Reichert]

Sure, sure. Like an inscription type thing where it's like.

[Jake Decker]

Sounds a lot like inscription, just based on the way you're describing the story side of it.

[Mary Kish]

I suppose it's inspired by. For sure. I think it's gonna start breaking the fourth wall soon, and I'm excited about it. So anyway, I think it's good. It's. I'm still. Yeah, I haven't completed it yet, but I do think it's a great solitaire. Scary, esque, you know, fun 90s adventure that I. That I've. I'm glad that I bought it. It wasn't that expensive either. I think it was like, my last sell to you is I think there was a. There was a bundle, and if you already own the other game in the bundle on Steam, you just get 10% off, and so you just get it for cheaper. So I love when you can do that on Steam. Can we talk about that for a Second, if you already own a game and it's in a bundle, it just gives you 10% off the game. Such a sick deal.

[Dan Reichert]

Nice.

[Mary Kish]

You wouldn't know because you have that cool fucking account.

[Dan Reichert]

I haven't paid for games since 2005. I don't know these things.

[Mary Kish]

I have to find bargoons in this world. And you can get a good deal on this game and even when they're

[Dan Reichert]

free, you'll pay for them. So you know, that's your thing.

[Jake Decker]

That's true.

[Mary Kish]

Better not be on game pass.

[Dan Reichert]

I don't think anything is anymore. All right. That's forbidden solitaire. That sounds awesome. I do want to check that out. Let's pull the mixtape ripcord here. This seems to be the one that's dominated exhausting stupid Internet discourse for a while now. Mary, you mentioned that you did go into it last episode. Your thoughts. Do you want to give me the. I know you don't want to rehash, but like your general feelings on it.

[Mary Kish]

I mean my tldr, I think and I played it. I thought about it a little bit more since the last time I talked about it. I praised. The soundtrack is great and I think it's like a fun little romp of a day in the life of kids, you know, young coming of age film that you get to like mess around with. I liked it. I think it's not everything pulled at me the way I was hoping it would. And I think it's because some of the mini games or whatever it is that you're doing, they're so passive. I didn't get to have a very deep connect connection because I didn't feel like I was doing very much gameplay. It'd be stuff like painting a door. That's not super. That's not going to push me to be like, wow, I feel like I was there. Some of the mini games I just didn't think were that engaging yet I did like it.

[Dan Reichert]

Like things like the, you know, the headbanging and hitting buttons to Headbang. Does that do anything for you?

[Mary Kish]

I think that sometimes when it came to the connection with music, I was more likely to be interested in the game because I really liked the track. I've been listening to the to the mix on Spotify. It's fun to listen to the Devo song.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, all the hits of the night of 1999. Devo and Joy Division. It's what everybody was listening to. TRL was nothing but Devo in 1999.

[Mary Kish]

I think you have to like expand your Worldview to the fact that when you're a kid you probably listened to all sorts of different.

[Dan Reichert]

Everything I listened to is from the 60s. Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah. So it's a fun little escapism. No, I didn't think that was. And you know what? I had a friend who was like so obsessed with the drunk tape picking out minigame where you're like drunk and you're like, I gotta find a tape. I also thought that one was like a little too passive where I was like, well, I'm not doing anything. I'm just drunk and stumbling around in a store. I think that sometimes I want a task to complete. I wanna be good at something. My favorite one was when the kids were talking and I was skipping rocks on a. A stream and I was able to like skip it through the tire.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, there's things, yeah, the rock. Things that you can knock over and stuff like that.

[Mary Kish]

There were things to accomplish and I think that's when I felt the most invested in the game. So anyway. But I did actually. I do like this game and I recommend it heavily for people who are looking for a story based adventure game with a rock and soundtrack. So that's kind of how I walked away from it. It's just not usually my forte to play something like this. I believe I'm just going to assume here you don't love it, Dan.

[Dan Reichert]

So my experience with it was I did not expect to love it. You know, I just. Narrative games in general, I don't like or it's not really what I move towards. But as I was playing it, I was doing. I was on a plane and I was playing it and I found myself going into that Dan mode I've gone into before where I'm just like, like dump this, this isn't even. And there was a world in which I just kind of like quit the game there and then went on and ah man, this sucker, you know, like just ranted and raved about it and everything. And I made the decision not to do that. I was like, listen, I can. I. I remember, I still remember red Dead Redemption 2 when I hated it so much and I went on the game of the year thing and I was sitting next to Gerstman and I was just saying like, oh, it sucks shit, it's fucking, it's blah, blah, blah. And Gerstman said something along the lines of like, like Dan, you've done this for over 10 years, use your words. And he's right. I should have been able to do that then. Now I've Been doing this over 20 years. I should definitely know how to fucking describe the things I don't like about this game. Yeah, tonally, I did not like it. I know it's pulling at the nostalgia thing quite a bit. I was kind of annoyed at some of the stuff, like, insisting that this was everyone's teenage 90s experience. And I was like, no, this is not the type of people saying that

[Mary Kish]

external reviews impacted you. Because in the game is saying, okay,

[Dan Reichert]

no, no, no, no. I'm talking about. No, no, no. I'm talking about when the character turns in the first minute of the game and the character turns to the camera and looks at the player and says, soon you won't be listening to music. You're going to be listening to who you were. And then a bunch of stuff happened that is nothing like, has ever happened in my life ever before. And I was like, shut the fuck up. So it's like, it was just like one thing like that after another where I was like, what the fuck? Get out of your ass. Like, I just fucking. Like, I was getting really annoyed. I hated these characters.

[Mary Kish]

Like, glad that Jeff Gerstman has had you grow as a game reviewer. You have progressed.

[Dan Reichert]

Instead of it's get out of your ass.

[Mary Kish]

Get out of your ass.

[Dan Reichert]

No, I'm describing my first exp. I've experienced. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jake Decker]

You're telling me you never ran from the cops while on a shopping cart?

[Dan Reichert]

No, I talked myself out of trouble with the cops. Yeah. I used speech.

[Mary Kish]

You were the narc.

[Dan Reichert]

No, no, no, no. I just.

[Jake Decker]

Dan was like, they went that way.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Mary Kish]

We hate that guy.

[Dan Reichert]

I would have hated all these characters. I. This was not my experience at all. I was not ever an angsty kid or anything. So all this, like, coming of age angst stories and stuff do nothing for me. I can't relate to them whatsoever. I did like the soundtrack. Like, I mean, like. Like, as much as they say, like, oh, these aren't the actual songs that were, like, popular in there. Like, that's a good devo track. That's like, you know, there's some good choices there. I like Joy Division totally. But it reminded me of, like. Like, it's the reason I don't like Baby Driver, that movie where it's like, I like Edgar Wright, but that movie. I just felt like it was like,

[Jake Decker]

there's a better reason not to like it, but sure is.

[Dan Reichert]

There just. I just think it's like the playlist thing. Like, it feels like he's trying to like, show off his eclectic playlist, you know, like, what's your reason?

[Jake Decker]

Kevin Spacey.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, I forgot he was in. Yeah, that's not good. Yeah, he's no good. Yeah, I just, it just felt, Felt very, like, I'm gonna show off my eclectic, you know, my taste. Like, like, it felt like people making the game weren't that far off from the main character in that they always have to insist. Like, you know, here's why this next track fits. Like, like the character explaining why this next track will fit the mood of the scene. It's like, show, don't tell. I just like. And I know people are gonna say, like, well, this character is supposed to be pretentious. She's supposed to be kind of this, know it all, you know, music snob and stuff like that. She's not supposed to be like. But it still doesn't make me enjoy the game. I. And, and none of my complaints are any of the, like, I hear that a lot of the, the, you know, discourse is that, like, this isn't even a game. This isn't. I, I've never been that guy. Yeah. Like, I liked Gone Home a lot when it came out. Like, I'm not a. Like, a game doesn't have to be this or that or anything like that. I just found, like, this is a tone piece.

[Mary Kish]

You thought it was, like, pretentious.

[Dan Reichert]

I thought it was pretentious. I didn't like the characters. I didn't like the story. Yeah, I thought it was pandering. I thought it was also, like, a pandering nostalgia thing where it's like, that's why it's like, Like, Stranger Things annoys me where it's like, hey, remember the 80s? Like, I just think, yeah, okay, we don't. Like, I, I just find that really annoying. And also, like, this. Some of the stuff I, I, I disliked about Red Dead 2, where it's like, okay, I like game. The thing I like in games is agency and discovery. I always bring this up, and I'm talking about, you know, Breath of the Wild or when we're talking about with Mina, I like to be able to explore as a player. And it's like, you know, I'd be, like, walking slowly around her house or whatever, and I'd go to go down the stairs, and she'd be like, like, can't bail yet. And then it's like, oh, great, I got to go look at six Polaroids or whatever and hear this witty dialogue before I can move forward.

[Mary Kish]

It's like, I just you're trying to game, you're trying to game. You're like, what do I need to accomplish to get you to shut the fuck up? Which is like the kryptonite of a game like this, which is all about being like, we want you to enjoy what it's like to be in the room of a teen. Which I think is like something you just have no desire to do and

[Dan Reichert]

not, not these characters. Like, no, I wouldn't hung out with any of these fucking dorks. No, I just. I. Yeah, it's hard when it is a tone piece and a narrative thing and a really character based thing and I just don't like any of the tone or the characters. That's just kind of be a. It's going to be a non starter

[Mary Kish]

for me, you know, So I respect this opinion. I do. I think it's like, it's not your cup of tea. I can see why you are not gravitating towards it. And I also, like, I think we're, we are vibing in one way of. There's a. There's an era for this game that people can enjoy because it's nostalgic and it makes you feel connected. If you don't feel that connection, this game is dead in the water. I think it would completely. Would not connect with a per. It did connect with me. I absolutely tried to score booze when I was a teen. This is the plot of many of my weekends.

[Dan Reichert]

Hang on. I'm calling the cops right now. I don't know what the statute of limitations is on that. One second. Hang on.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, this is like 100% what I was doing. I was like trying to score drugs. Like, I was like, all in. I was like, where do we get like the craziest things we're allowed to get as children? And I. And I was bad. I agree with you. I think the main character was a little rough around. There were edges. I think there was this time when she was explaining that she doesn't respect motorcycles because they're loud. And she was like, you have to earn your loud.

[Dan Reichert]

And I was like, oh yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Do you know how engines work? It's very difficult to construct them. They've earned that loud girl. Like, you don't get to decide that a rock album is allowed to be louder than a motorcycle anyway. It's like, I, I can feel that tension. But I actually had a girlfriend in high school that was like really obnoxious about her music choices. So I also was like, I get it. This just reminds me of My really fucking annoying music friend.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, but even if it's accurate, you know, even if that is what people were like, like, that doesn't make it enjoyable necessarily. At least not like maybe you enjoyed being reminded of that friend. I just get annoyed by it. And like, also, I am someone who is very nostalgic, like for that era. Everything on this fucking floor of this house is from the 80s or 90s. You know, I've got. There's numerous CRTs and like a alien back here, a Tekken poster. Like, I live basically in like 1998. I'm watching old ass wrestling all the time. But that's how I like to engage with my nostalgia, is I like to revisit the actual thing. Like, if I were to watch like a. Like I don't think I ever saw that was that Adam Sandler Pixels movie. Like, I don't just want to be like, hey, remember Bleep bloop. You know, like, this is like, I. I want to just do the actual thing. I don't want to be reminded that it exists or that things used to be, oh, like I don't see a Polaroid. And like, fuck, yeah, you know, it's. I. This is not how I like to engage with nostalgia and certainly not with characters like this. But I am curious. Well, before I started it, Jake, I'll let you use the same phrasing you use with me if you would like to but out its ass.

[Jake Decker]

I. I wanted to peel my skin off as I was listening to the characters talk. Yeah, it. It did not do anything at all for me. I think, Dan, you just very succinctly and well explained why you didn't like it. And I agree with a lot of what you said. It just didn't. It didn't click with me. I like some of the music and I like the visuals.

[Dan Reichert]

It's got a style to it.

[Jake Decker]

Some of the segments I thought were really well done and well choreographed and. And as we've been saying, I think the whole like, well, is it a game or is it not a game? Doesn't matter. That's irrelevant. Who cares if you think it's a game and you like it? Cool. If you like it. That is like the least interesting thing to talk about with this game, in my opinion. But yeah, I didn't finish it. I got about, I think halfway through, but I just couldn't listen to those characters anymore.

[Dan Reichert]

That's where I was about halfway through. Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

I wonder if it's. Cause like my high school experience wasn't in the 90s. But, like, I still. I. When I was in high school, all I listened to was 90s music, so I enjoyed some of the soundtrack there. But, like, it just. It just didn't connect with me at all. And on any level, I would say. On any level. Yeah. But I get why people really like it, I suppose. Yeah, that's sort of been my thing, you know, like, our reviewer really liked it. I know. Like, it's reviewed really well and it's really connected with some people and there's some people in the GameSpot office who really enjoyed it, and I get it. But, like, oh, man, those characters just.

[Dan Reichert]

They're just awful.

[Jake Decker]

I couldn't get through it.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. Like, teenagers in general are just awful. These seem like just terrible teenagers, I would say.

[Jake Decker]

I don't think this comparison probably means anything because I don't think you guys played it, but I played Dispatch last year, which is sort of similar, I would say that's more episodic. That's more like telltale games where you're making decisions that eventually funnel into it. So, like, I definitely have an appetite for these kinds of games. I like these narrative style games. But also, like you, I played one episode of Life Is Strange, and I felt the same way where I was like, I cannot stand any of these characters. I do not want to hear any of them talk for a long time or ever. And. But, like, I think that's kind of what it is, though, is just like, my high school experience wasn't like this. Therefore I was not able to connect to this. And I think what's even weirder, too, is, like, these are supposedly high school kids in California. Right. Like, they're talking about, like, one of the friends. Right, Is going to, like, ucla. It's not called ucla, but it's basically ucla. So it's like, all this stuff is, like, in my realm. I went to high school in California. I had friends who went to ucla. I tried to get, you know, like. Like, I think it should be more up my alley than it is. It just didn't do it for me.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. All right. I think these are all reasonable takes on this game.

[Mary Kish]

I agree. I think they're all reasonable takes. I think it's interesting that the gradingness of a kid character can break us into whether or not the game is acceptable. And I wonder if that game would have been better received by this crew if they had picked different character archetypes, perhaps.

[Jake Decker]

I also just think it's so hard to write convincing teens. And I think whichever archetype you pick. It needs to be well written. And when you're trying to do that with teens, it's just like, I don't know, like, some of the slang they were saying, I was like, yeah. Did people say this? I don't think so. Like, there were some things that I. I'm sure they did, but other things, it was just like, oh, yeah, I don't know. I know it was. I think it was written and developed by an Australian team. Right. So, like, I wonder if maybe some of that slang is just slang that I didn't experience because I didn't grow up in Australia. You know, I missed. I didn't. Didn't have that, you know?

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. I don't know. I would rather hang out with any of these characters than with anyone who wants to yell on Twitter about what a game has to be, though. So.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, I'll agree to that.

[Dan Reichert]

Absolutely.

[Jake Decker]

At least they probably, you know, party.

[Dan Reichert]

Yep. So. All right.

[Mary Kish]

All right.

[Dan Reichert]

That's. Did Mike talk about it last time?

[Jake Decker]

He loved it.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. Oh, Mike loved it. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, cool. All right. That is mixtape couple we can kind of touch on here. I'll just mention real quick Forza. I've played maybe six or seven hours of it right now, and it's very, very good. It's good enough to where I assembled the whole wheel situation again, and that's a lot of fun. It's. It's Horizon. It's. It's better than ever in that it's toned down the music festival, dj, social media, and it is just driving cool cars through Japan and everything looks incredible and feels incredible. It's just got a lot of fun types of different race types and things like that. Just so fun to look at the map and point out a thing and be like, all right, I'm gonna do that event. I'm gonna do this event. I'm just gonna drive around the country and break these mascot things and signs and stuff like that. It's just. It's impossible to be bored playing this game. It's just so expertly made. It's exactly what I would want out of a racing game. There's, like, three tiers of racing games to me. There's, like, kart racers, which are their own thing, and I love that. There's sim things. There's the Gran Turismos and the Forza motorsports of the world, which are not for me because I don't really give a shit about cars. And then there's Horizon, where it's like, yeah, it's Real cars, it's all realistic and everything, but it's arcadey enough. And like, I don't need to actually give a shit about the cars or go in and tune the drivetrain or anything like that. I can just drive around and have a good time. And it doesn't get better than Horizon. And this is about the best I've played in a long time at least. So very much enjoying that.

[Mary Kish]

That's great. I heard that there's really good hidden stuff. Like if you go off road or you find like a little, I don't know, like you see a shed or something or you see an off trail and you go down it, you're usually rewarded. Have you had any of those experiences?

[Dan Reichert]

I mean, most of what I found so far has just been like, yeah, here's the hidden signs, here's the XP things. There's like different like mascots and stuff. Like here's like a little moki mascot or something or here's this little ramen bowl and these are kind of scattered across. And then there's the occasional like barn finds and stuff. It's like, oh, I found this old classic car in a barn on a hill or something. So. So yeah, it's like on those times that you're not specifically doing, oh, this rally race or this delivery mission, like you can drive around and you don't feel like you're wasting time because you'll, you'll find that stuff and level up and stuff like that. So it's. Yeah, just, just a tremendous game.

[Mary Kish]

So cool.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. Mary, you finished Gecko Gods?

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, I talked about this when I first started it several weeks ago and it's just been in my steam deck.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, this one? Yes, that's right. Okay. I remember seeing this. Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

People also compared this to Wind Waker because it's like visual based puzzles that you do as a gecko and then you get a fun little boat and you travel to different islands to do all their visual puzzles. Well, I finished it. I completed every puzzle on every island. It's just such a cathartic, brain scratching puzzler. I did a couple times get pretty stuck cause I just didn't know what the game wanted me to do next. And when that happens, you spend like 40 minutes, it's just, you know, pitter pattering around on this island hoping that somebody will tell you what the fuck to do. And that can be a little draining. But other than that, I loved the puzzles and they got pretty fun towards the end. There's like balls that you need to get into a socket, and then you have to roll them with your little gecko body to get into the space, and so they put them into puzzles. The final puzzle is a good head scratcher with an elevator and power. And so you have to, like, turn the power on and off to like, make sure that you can use the elevator and ride it at very specific times to get where you need to go. I rolled credits on it, and I said that was a really nice experience, and I'm glad that I finished it. So, really, just a final reminder that this game is a simple yet fun puzzle game. I think it's great for airplanes or something where you just want to do a little visual puzzle or. What I love to do is play a game while you're also half watching TV per for that, because you don't have to really pay attention and get it done. So, yeah, I really enjoyed Gekko Gods.

[Dan Reichert]

Nice. And finally, Jake, you're playing Pokemon Champions.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah. Actually, though, before I get to that, I do want to say I played Creature Kitchen, as per Mary's recommendation a couple weeks ago, and I loved it.

[Dan Reichert]

I thought it was very fun. So good.

[Jake Decker]

Very clever. Didn't outstays welcome. I thought the aesthetic was great. The creatures are cool. I enjoyed it a lot. So just wanted to, you know, shout that game out because I thought it was great.

[Dan Reichert]

I think it was a universal. I think all four of us like that one a lot.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, it seems like a fun one.

[Mary Kish]

It's silly, isn't it? I love a creative game like that where you're. It's not. It's not scary, but it's kind of eerie. Like, I actually screamed once playing it because I didn't expect that thing to be in the tree. I think it had a good aesthetic to it. I'm glad you played it and liked it.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

But, yeah, Pokemon Champions. I. I have been playing a lot of this. I probably won't say a whole lot about it, but this is basically just a battle simulation from the Pokemon games. Although it is on a competitive level, they do dailies, so I kind of clock in every day, do some battles, and put it down. They just had a new season, and the new season's pretty bad. It's a. A terrible battle.

[Dan Reichert]

Pass.

[Jake Decker]

That doesn't get you anything. They didn't add any new items. Pokemon. This is probably kind of, like, you know, deep in the weeds here, but that's kind of been my game. I've been returning to quite a bit. But, like, there's. This is something that people have wanted for so long, like a competitive Pokemon online battler that is official, that can be played at tournaments that you can return to. You don't need to wait four or five years for the next Pokemon game to come out before you can try different metas, try different teams, and it streamlines it all. So it's so much easier to train Pokemon. It's so much easier to put together a team. So it gets a lot of things right. But the live service model they have not nailed at all. And I really hope they're able to kind of step things up, especially if this is supposed to be the. Be the official platform for competitive Pokemon going forward, which I know is like over everyone's head. I know you guys don't care too much about that sort of thing, but it has been my main investment and it is. I've been.

[Dan Reichert]

It's my private hobby. Yeah, I don't like this advertising.

[Jake Decker]

Incredible high.

[Mary Kish]

And I trade cards like crazy.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, I got a level six gold tour Apollo. That's. Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

Hey, Klefke is a pretty good poll, you know.

[Dan Reichert]

Okay. Yeah, yeah. Don't you.

[Jake Decker]

Don't tell me Klefke. You know, like, you didn't say Pikachu.

[Dan Reichert]

No, no, that's a scrub.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Who's that?

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, who knows? Anyway, not a lot to say on that other than live service woes.

[Dan Reichert]

Sure.

[Mary Kish]

Live service woes.

[Dan Reichert]

All right, well, I believe that will be it for our games this week. You guys want to move on to emails?

[Jake Decker]

Sure.

[Dan Reichert]

Excellent. All right, we've got emails here. I'll put out a call for some more emails here. I went through and grabbed a handful, but we could. We could use a replenish. People want to send in their questions, too. Oh, no, Mike usually knows this. I think it's firescapecastmail.com. does that sound right to you too? Fire Escapecast. Gmail.com. yes, I just saw it. Okay, there you go. That is the one. Send in your questions.

[Mary Kish]

All of it. It.

[Dan Reichert]

Yes.

[Mary Kish]

With the. With the cast.

[Dan Reichert]

We have a handful here. First one. What's up, Billy? Crudup. Mike, what kind of wines have you been drinking lately? That's Carter from Virginia. Oh, no. Why do we read that on this? He's not going to be able to talk about it.

[Mary Kish]

That's a shame. Well, jeez.

[Dan Reichert]

Okay, throw it away.

[Jake Decker]

Delete.

[Dan Reichert]

Okay, that's it. Okay, that's gone. We'll move on.

[Jake Decker]

Okay.

[Dan Reichert]

How's it going, Julie Bowen. Sorry, Mike. I'll leave the impeccable intros to you. I Just want to know if any of y' all have had a video game company you dreamt of working for. As a kid in the 2000s, I fantasized about getting a job at Neversoft. Rest in peace. The behind the scenes videos and the Tony Hawk games made it look like such a fun place full of cool people. Love you guys. Charles from Philadelphia. That is a great answer, Charles, because yeah, they. The Tony Hawk games, those early ones always had those cool. They had the Bales videos and the behind the scenes stuff and what's his name? Josh Jewett or Joel Jewett. A guy that retired and Polygon did a great story about him recently. He just like lives in the mountains in Nevada or something and just seemed like the coolest team of guys that just like, you know, skater culture, really laid back. But also these geniuses making like one of the best game series of all time. Like they are way, way up there. I think back then I probably would have said single track. That was where David Jaffe and Scott Campbell made something that basically twist metal. Twist metal one and two specifically because it just seemed like such, you know, 13 year old kids dream idea of like what if an ice cream truck shot missiles and you could run over kids at the swimming. Like it was just like dumbest ever. I wonder now looking back, that would actually be like a really obnoxious working environment. The ones I really loved and always wanted, egm, I mean these are, these aren't game developers but Electronic Gaming Monthly and Game Informer. Like the ones where like you would read about the editors and the shit they did in the office and stuff like that and you'd have silly photoshops of the editors at the beginning of the issues and it's like, like that was always the culture I wanted to work in and yeah, yeah. And turned out Game Informer was a really good one. Not Rockstar or Nintendo. They both seemed fucking weird and bad always to work for and don't want to do that at all. So that's. That was a no go. So how about you guys?

[Jake Decker]

I was going to say. So I would say Game Informer as well. I remember getting that magazine as a kid and you know, flipping through those pages and seeing everyone on staff and being like, that's where I want to work. I would say game studios not as much. However, I remember seeing the Halo 2 behind the scenes documentary that came with like the collector's edition and I thought it would be pretty cool to work with people who also love and play Halo. I think I haven't seen that doc in a while. But I remember or I vaguely remember it showing like people like sleeping under their desk during like the build up to like launch that game. And that stuff was, you know, you're a kid, you're naive. I didn't even think about it, but I was like, yeah, I, I want to work at Bungie.

[Dan Reichert]

I mean that was always like presented as like this like romantic like almost like look how passionate they are. They sleep under their desk and like

[Jake Decker]

they want to make the best game ever.

[Dan Reichert]

Perfect job themselves would put that out like behind the scenes things like, look how much we love this. We sleep here. And it's like, wow, it's crazy how much that's changed.

[Mary Kish]

12 year old US were like, dream job.

[Dan Reichert]

I never want to leave the office.

[Mary Kish]

I don't know if I ever as a child was like, I gots to work for this game.

[Dan Reichert]

Eminem kart racing.

[Mary Kish]

Oh my God. I can't. How dare you bring up my worst game. My name's on that.

[Dan Reichert]

Hell yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Working for a publisher is hard and it's, it really does rip all the joy out from you. It's funny when you do work in games how much you're like, man, there's a lot of bad in this place. There's a lot of people being like, how do we extrapolate more money from people? The games in that publisher house zoo were designed to always be on sale. So we had a price point when we were constructing them to say, okay, if we sell them for $5, we're making a profit. So we'll list them for 10 and have them be endlessly 50% off. Because that scratches an itch in mostly parents brains. It's like it's 50% off. Let's get it.

[Dan Reichert]

Wow.

[Mary Kish]

We designed the game to be profitable at 50% off so that that made money. And so you're just buying a really shitty game with intention. That's probably a more egregious answer. That was such a bad experience. But when I was a child and like I was like playing like or like just really old games on my game gear, I remember like feeling like the Sega logo and that company was so iconic and how cool it would be to work for a company like Sega. But I never like looked it up or even like went to their website. I just don't know if I was that in when I was a kid.

[Dan Reichert]

So they were super sleeping under their desks.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, I think they were employees. Yeah. Well, it's a shame. I never really got into it and applied.

[Dan Reichert]

Well, thank you for the email, Charles. We got one from Austin in Missouri here. Hey, pals, what are some of your favorite needle drops in movies? And why no spoilers? But I watched 28 years later the Bone Temple yesterday, and it prompted this thought.

[Mary Kish]

So good.

[Dan Reichert]

I've been, We've been. Me and Hanson have been trying to find a night to watch it for months now.

[Mary Kish]

And I'm curious what you think of it, because I.

[Dan Reichert]

Before.

[Mary Kish]

Okay. And you liked the one before.

[Dan Reichert]

I liked it. I mean, zombie movies have never been, like, my thing, but I remember, like, seeing 20 years later that was, that was a good movie. Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

I like Bone Temple more, for what it's worth.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah. It had been so crazy.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah. It had more of an X factor, I guess, that I was into.

[Dan Reichert]

Okay.

[Mary Kish]

They took the script of what zombie movies are supposed to be, and they were like, throw that away. We're going on this crazy tangent with this guy with his dong out. It's going to be 90% dong. I hope you're cool with that. And it's like, it does have a good needle drop, though.

[Jake Decker]

It does.

[Dan Reichert]

Okay.

[Jake Decker]

But I think, like, my favorite.

[Mary Kish]

We should explain what a needle drop is.

[Dan Reichert]

Right. My understanding is, I think we had to Google it. It's. I'm assuming it's non Diegetic. Right? It's stuff that, like, oh, it's the baby driver thing. Right. Or it's just like. Yeah, we're just playing these big songs during all these scenes and into this big. Like, I bet Marvel movies do this a lot, right?

[Jake Decker]

I, I, I think it could be both. Like, I think you could probably make a case for either. But in my head, yes. It's usually like, moments where like, like the cool guy kicks in the door.

[Dan Reichert]

Right.

[Jake Decker]

And then the music plays and then

[Dan Reichert]

it's, you know, the first thing I thought of was, well, I guess this was diegetic. So I guess, yeah, diegetic probably counts. But bad to the bone in Terminator 2. It's just like, that is the most. Just like that is so tied to that scene and it's so fitting for that scene.

[Mary Kish]

Like, that's a good one.

[Jake Decker]

This one's classic. But I always think of it whenever I hear the song, so I imagine that's probably good, but Apocalypse now, now, this is the end.

[Mary Kish]

The end.

[Jake Decker]

Only friend, you know, like, that's got a lot like. But, like, that scene that is, like,

[Dan Reichert]

imprinted into my brain, just flames the napalm on the. Oh, my God, what a way to. That's. That Sets the tone of a movie better than any opening I've ever seen before. It's like, oh, this is gonna be a thing, isn't it?

[Mary Kish]

Like, these aren't brain busting examples. Like, these are, like, the perfect examples to make it. Make us hammer home to you what these are. And when you hear this song, you might be, like, skyrocketed into this movie, like Reservoir Dog stuck in the middle with you.

[Dan Reichert]

Yes.

[Mary Kish]

Is the iconic. I can't hear that song on a radio without thinking about that scene.

[Dan Reichert]

Ear's getting cut off.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, yeah, it's up. And it's like such a. Such a. Like, happy go lucky.

[Dan Reichert]

And he's having. Michael Matson's having a lot of fun there, you know? Oh, he's a fun loving guy. Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

When he takes the ear and he goes, hello.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

He's such a little freak in it. He's joking the whole time while he's, you know, hurting someone. I think that's a classic probably example of it.

[Dan Reichert]

Tarantino is pretty egregious with it, but, like, I don't know.

[Mary Kish]

He does it in every one of his films.

[Jake Decker]

He does. But I give some work really well. Some are just like, all right, you're just doing your thing, you know, Like. But some are really good.

[Dan Reichert]

That's the difference where it's like, yeah, like Edgar Wright. It was just one thing after another. And it didn't really feel like. With, like, Tarantino's. It feels like he can just. Just do, like, Kill Bill has a lot of these. The Don't Let Me Be Misunderstood is incredible. Was a fight without honor or whatever. Like, Kill Bill has a ton of these that are tremendous. The. The. The motorcycle one. The. Like, that one. Although I guess that wasn't like a pop song, which I guess that's probably more what a needle drop is, but. Oh, Big Lebowski. When. What condition my condition was in.

[Mary Kish]

That's a great one.

[Dan Reichert]

I love that one. Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah. I think. I mean, maybe this is not.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, he doesn't. Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

But I think Scorsese does this well. But the one I always think of is the Departed that opens up to the Stones. Gimme Shelter.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

And it's, like, showing, like, Boston at the time. And then in that same movie, I think. When was it DiCaprio, one of them goes to prison and they start playing the Dropkick Murphy's show and that. I remember I hadn't heard that song before until I saw that movie and it started playing, and I was like, whoa, this is. I Gotta get on this. And I started listening to Drop Kick Murphy's because of it.

[Dan Reichert]

I do love Scorsese's. Yeah, Scorsese's are awesome. Because, like, yeah, it's got Give Me Shelter like, once or Twice in the Departed. And then there's a part in the bar where they're playing Let It Loose by the Stones. And I was like, man, this guy loves the Stones. I get it. And then I watch, like, Mean Streets, which is from the 70s, and it's like, it's got Rolling Stone stuff all over it. It's all right. Dude loves the Stones. Can't. Can't fault him for that. That. All right, thank you, Austin. Finally.

[Mary Kish]

Wait, I have one more.

[Dan Reichert]

Yes.

[Mary Kish]

Shaun of the Dead. Don't Stop Me now is, like, one of the best because not only is it a good tune and they're killing zombies to it, but they actually, like, beat zombies to the beat of it, where they'll be like, yeah, don't stop me. They're, like, actually beating people with pool sticks. And I think that is very iconic for me because it's funny. It's a zombie movie, it's action, it's slapstick, and it's a damn good song.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. And that's Edgar Wright as well. And so, like, I think he maybe just, like, saw how good that was. And it worked so well in Shaun of the Dead, and then maybe just got a little overkill with it. But Shaun of the Dead, it works fantastic. All right, final email. Hello. How do you all deal with the constant onslaught of recommendations for games, books, movies, movies, and TV shows from peers, friends, or family? I feel like it's become more and more common for people to drop the whole you should really play, read, watch, etc this because I liked it lie in a conversation. For some reason. It's extremely exhausting to me. There's so many apps like letterboxd, websites like Backlogged, and I'm tired of keeping tabs on what I should and shouldn't spend my time on. How do you pick what you actually follow through on checking out in your free time? I love the show. You're a wonderful, funny group of friends, Freddie. I like that question, Freddie. Thanks you. That's the thing. Yeah. Anyone who spends any time on the Internet, well, first rule of thumb is if anyone starts trying to yell at you about what anime to watch, don't listen to them, because holy shit, anime fans. Oh, my God, like, all of us have an onslaught of this stuff all the time. The time I had an anime podcast the fucking novel length emails you'd get from like, okay, you gotta do this, but then only do this arc and this. It's like, oh my God, don't listen to anime fans ever.

[Mary Kish]

They'll just be like, listen to more anime. Watch all anime. What do you mean you haven't watched one Piece and it's like, get out of here.

[Dan Reichert]

It's only 7,000 episodes.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah. And just pretend that this character is not 14 and actually, you know.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, exactly. Yes, ignore them.

[Mary Kish]

I think like the most boring answer is that I go with my gut of what I'm actually interested in at the given time. I really try not to watch something just because it was recommended. I do try and keep a notes document, but that doesn't mean it's gonna be the next thing I watch. That's a mistake. That's a mistake. And that's not what you should do. You should be trusting your gut for the genre that you're interested in. And then when you're interested in that genre, you should go into your backlog and be like, oh my gosh, I've been waiting to watch a drama.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

And so I'm going to watch this. But like, just because everyone and their brother is telling you to watch the this like very, very dark and depressing based on a true story movie does not mean that's what you should be watching. After a long Tuesday, you know, in your precious two hours, give yourself the room to say to yourself, what vibe am I in for? And then pick that thing that you've been recommended for so that you're not ruining your fucking night. I've had, I am very horror. I'm into like any recommendations of horror. And I feel like it all the time. And so I have this big backlog of horror. I can't always watch it, but if I'm interested, I go into my backlog and I start watching horror. But there are days where I'm like, I need a comedy, I need a comedy. And I, and I don't want to worry about it too much. So it's got to be a sitcom. I'll go into the backlog and I'll find a sitcom comedy. That that's what I recommend doing.

[Dan Reichert]

Or sometimes you want a short movie, sometimes you want a long one, sometimes you want to turn your brain off thing. Bonk and I have a shared doc where it's like, okay, the biggest column is just Dan Bonk movie night. And that's just all these movies we want to watch together. And like, when it's movie night. That is the, like, you know, we never look at our phones. That's the lights down. We're watched on the big, big screen downstairs. You know, like, that's. That's a dedicated night. And then there's like, okay, here's the high column. These would be good to watch when you're high. Here's a Dan solo column where it's like, okay, she doesn't. She's not gonna watch this or whatever. Here's background. So if we just want to, like, be on our steam decks and just have something on in the background, it's like, okay, we could rewatch Arrested Development or something like that. You know, I. The thing with recommendations with me is like, yeah, we do get so many being on podcasts and stuff like that that I just have, like, kind of like a short list of like, there are certain people in my life that have just had a good track record of introducing me to things I would like. Like, I. I count everyone on this podcast. Mary, Jake, Mike. Mike. Mike has a great sense, too, of, like, he likes a lot of stuff passionately, that he just knows that I'm not gonna like. And so, like, he's not gonna give me the hard sell on something, but, like, something like, outer, wild.

[Mary Kish]

Careful. Yeah, I have to be careful with Mike because he'll. He'll have art. Art pics. And I'll be like, I watched it. I have no idea what I watched, but it was beautiful. And he'll be like, can't you believe how incredible that was? And I'll be like, like, oh, yes. But, like, I have to. I have to be really focused. When Mike gives me a recommendation, it's usually very thoughtful.

[Jake Decker]

I definitely. I think to Dan's point, I definitely have, like, certain people that I look to or, like, hear out their recommendations. And some people I don't. Maybe not people just. But like, if I don't have. If someone whose recommendations I trust doesn't recommend something to me, then I'll probably not see it or watch or play it. I will say with Mike books, whenever Mike recommends a book, usually he did

[Dan Reichert]

that, I'll pick it up, I'll read it.

[Jake Decker]

Even the ones that he's recommended that I haven't liked, I've still, like, enjoy. Like, I feel like I've gotten something out of it. So I would say, like, him for books especially is someone I look toward. But I think another key thing is like. Like, do a little research, I guess. Like, I don't know. I feel like, you know, like, Dan's saying we're getting recommendations constantly being on podcasts or just like people saying, you got to play this, you got to check this out. And sometimes I'll be like, okay. And then I'll just Google it and I'll be like, nope, this is not for me. This is a bunch of teenagers. I'm good.

[Mary Kish]

You know, I wonder if, based on this listening of this podcast, if people's takeaway is to play or not play mixtape. Right. Would be based on our individual personalities and whether or not you identify with us. People who identify as like a Dan style gamer should not play that game. Right. And people who identify more with like, my vibe might want to give it a try. And they're both fine and accurate, but I find that really funny is like, it. It doesn't change whether or not mixtape is a good game, which is so subjective. It changes whether or not it's for you. So we can both kind of recommend it or not. But it's really based on, like, who do you identify the most with when you're listening?

[Dan Reichert]

Well, I think that's one of the huge benefits of like, personality based media because, like, that's why I always loved in magazines. We were talking earlier about, like, Game Informer. I could look at like, you know, it would have the byline where it's like, okay, Reiner wrote this review. I typically like the same type of action games that Reiner likes, so I'll trust him here. Miller gave this a really high score, but he's a big, kind of like deep RPG guy, so I don't know if I'm gonna necessarily go out and buy it just because Miller loved it, you know, Like, I think that really helps. But yeah, my shortlist, it's. It's everyone on this podcast. I think you guys have a great track record with recommending stuff to me. Bon, if Bonk ever sells me on something, I'm always, She's got fantastic taste and stuff. And then there's people where you gotta like, it's. It's categorical. Ben Hansen for one. He is. He's recommended so many great things to me. Mostly great things like, especially, like weird things too, like little documentaries and stuff that like, other people, like, I remember the Jinx or like, oh, you should watch this Larry Sanders doc, even though you don't really, you know, don't know Larry Sanders or Gary Shanbling, whatever. Where I got to stop with Hanson is like, he has given me super hard, passionate, like, tears welling in his eyes. Recommendations for like, Toy Story. 3 or the Incredibles or something. And I'll be like, ben, Ben. I don't. It's not my type of thing. And he'll spend like a year trying to get me to watch Toy Story 3. And I finally will, and I'll be like, ben, I should have trusted my instincts. This is not for me.

[Mary Kish]

That's a bummer. Wait, so you didn't like Incredibles?

[Dan Reichert]

I just. It just seemed like it was just. I don't know, it's kids movie three

[Mary Kish]

or the first one?

[Dan Reichert]

One. I didn't know they made three. It was the first one. He was talking about the first one forever, and I watched the first one. I was like, okay, well, that was a zero out of. Not zero out of ten, quality wise.

[Mary Kish]

I mean, it did.

[Dan Reichert]

It did zero to me. No, no, no, no. I'm not saying it. I wouldn't score it a zero. It's obviously very well made. I'm saying in terms of affecting me, zero, like, did not register on my brain in any way, shape or form other than I was just waiting for it to end.

[Mary Kish]

Everyone email fire escapecastgmail.com with your best recommendations for Dan specifically.

[Dan Reichert]

I will.

[Mary Kish]

No one else.

[Dan Reichert]

All of them.

[Mary Kish]

I want to know what you guys think. Dan would like the idea the Incredibles is like, just doesn't register. It's funny, it's charming, it's interesting. Like, it has, like, really witty humor. It has a great ending of, like, why the bad guy does what he does and, like, what happens to him. It's a good conclusion.

[Dan Reichert]

It's ended. I couldn't tell you a single thing that happened. It's like, it's not. It's obviously very well made. Like Pixar. They're incredible at what they do. I just. I don't think I've ever seen a Pixar movie where I'm like, wow, that affected me none.

[Mary Kish]

What's your favorite Pixar?

[Dan Reichert]

Sounds like none of them seen. I guess when I was a child and saw Toy Story, I thought the CG was impressive.

[Mary Kish]

Oh, my God. CG's dog. Compared to now in 1995.

[Dan Reichert]

It was cool. 10 years old.

[Mary Kish]

You weren't like, wow, these army men are part like, you weren't like, excited about, like, the. The. The story.

[Dan Reichert]

Ernest did a voice. I like Jim Vernie. And I was like, it's cool. The Jim Vernie's voices in this. And John, you know what? Honestly, I was 10 years old. The thing I probably like the most about Toy Story was that Don Rickles did a voice. I was the oldest 10 year old ever. I was like, hell yeah. Don Rickles, the funny guy from Letterman, he's the pig or whatever in this.

[Mary Kish]

Are you 45 years old when you were 10?

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, hell yeah. I. I'm just telling you, kids movies there, the first movies that affected me were fucking Terminators and stuff like that. I never ever like, I saw Aladdin, I was like, all right, that was fine. And then I was just like, I just show me Arnold stuff. Like, I just never cared about kids movies, even as a kid.

[Mary Kish]

That's so odd. And like, no wonder you didn't like mixtape. There's like something about this thing where you're like, I don't want to pretend to be a youth in any capacity.

[Dan Reichert]

I never felt like a youth. I never liked my peers. I never liked my generation. I listen to old guy music from the time I listen to music. I watch R rated movies from the time I watch movies. Like, I never wanted to be a kid or a teenager. I always was like, man, I like hanging out with adults and talking to adults, you know.

[Mary Kish]

You didn't like Finding Nemo?

[Dan Reichert]

Never saw it. Oh man. Don't see it. Yeah, I won't.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, I, I mean, I guess, yeah, it's not going to hit you. I'm just like, you've never seen Ratatouille?

[Dan Reichert]

I saw it like when I stopped watching kids, I saw Aladdin, Little Mermaid and Lion King.

[Mary Kish]

Those are good.

[Dan Reichert]

And then I think, I remember by the time, I think Pocahontas was the first big one. Like Pocahontas and like Hunchback. Those were the ones that came out. And I was like, I can't be watching Disney movies. Like, and I was like, I'm an adult.

[Mary Kish]

You're like 11, nine and having a cigarette.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, I'm still getting the Happy Meal toys, but I'm not watching the movies.

[Mary Kish]

You have the diet of a nine year old, but the cinematic viewpoints of a 60 year old angry man.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. And no part of this is maybe like, oh, I'm too cool for this, or I'm too adult or grown up. It's like I just, they never did anything for me.

[Mary Kish]

I'm not getting that from you. I just feel like there's like a part of me that's like, it's a bummer that you wouldn't watch like some of these that I think are pretty interesting.

[Dan Reichert]

I thought it was boring as fuck.

[Mary Kish]

Wally could be boring. I think that's fine. Finding Nemo is pretty universally Loved, though.

[Dan Reichert]

Let me guess, Monsters Family? Or they've. No. Never saw it. No.

[Jake Decker]

Monsters Inc's pretty good. I. I feel like it's just. Maybe not just the case, but. But I was gonna say, like, maybe, you know, you're just born too soon to, like, really get it because. Because when I was growing up, I thought Toy Story was incredible. Like, I watched Toy Story every day. I thought it was amazing. But I. I could see myself not giving a shit if I hadn't seen Toy Story until I was like, I don't know.

[Dan Reichert]

I saw in the theaters 15. No, I was like, 11. Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

I don't know.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

And that movie rocked my world. When Toy Story came out, everyone was like, this is a game changer. This is like, what movies were built for. And it's. It still slaps, I think. Although I haven't seen it. I just got it on vhs, you guys. I'm really excited to watch it, but I. Instead, my. My friends are all learning that I'm getting vhs. It's another giving them to me as gifts, which I think is really sweet. And the other day, my girlfriend gave me Running Man. The Running Man.

[Dan Reichert]

That movie. What a VHS movie. That is so fucking good.

[Mary Kish]

And it holds up so good. And I was like, I can't believe I was gonna watch Bambi. This is so much better than Bambi.

[Dan Reichert]

That's the most inspiring. Maybe you're right. The casting for that movie with Richard Dawson from the Match Game and Family Feud as the evil game show host. I love that movie so much.

[Mary Kish]

So much action. Like, from the beginning to the end, like, there's always something going on. I was very impressed by this. And I also realized. I didn't know. I don't. This will probably upset you. You. Because we've discussed it on the show before. I don't think I've actually really ever watched the Rock before. And so I finally watched the Rock. Like, I actually paid attention from beginning to end and watched the Rock.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, my God, you guys.

[Mary Kish]

It's pretty good.

[Dan Reichert]

It's incredible.

[Mary Kish]

I had no idea. I had no idea that it was like, you have to sit down and watch this film. Like, the. The balls.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

That are nerve gas. What a great design for a. For a thing that you need to, like, contain and use. But don't touch it. And if it drops, you better run like hell.

[Dan Reichert]

And, like, detonate this in the atmosphere.

[Mary Kish]

And if you put it in your mouth, you gotta stab yourself in the heart.

[Dan Reichert]

What a fucking.

[Mary Kish]

Cool.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

There's, like, all these little things Going on. It's great.

[Dan Reichert]

Alcatraz is a setting and Ed Harris as this, like, conflicted villain. It's just so fun. But he's got these like jackass cronies around him and he, he's, he thinks he's doing the right thing and Connery's doing Connery. Shit. Oh my God, it's so fucking good. Every time.

[Mary Kish]

I, I did not realize, but that was a good recommendation that I just didn't really process. And so I, I think I would, I would listen to you for action movie recommendations day in and day out and probably comedies. I, I, I believe in you. I'm really not over the musical recommendation. I just don't think I can do it.

[Dan Reichert]

That's an anomaly. I, I want to be clear. I don't like musical. And this is a like, and that is just a thing that is just so weird and unlike anything. Like, I'm not even necessarily saying it's good or you're going to like it. I'm just saying it is something so out there it's worth seeing. That's what I'm saying. I like it now just because of how fucking nuts and bold it is and it does some unbelievably weird shit by the end and the fact that I got a budget and like major stars and stuff involved. I can't help but just kind of respect how, how fucking off the wall that movie goes. But no, I don't like when I talk about my favorite movies and stuff like that.

[Mary Kish]

I'm not gonna like, throw them though. Yeah. I just say it's like such a ridiculous thing that you're like, it's absurd that it was constructed. Doesn't mean that I have to endure it.

[Dan Reichert]

Sure. That's it. That's fair. That's fair.

[Jake Decker]

I will say talking about like Pixar and stuff and knowing you, Dan, I can understand why that is just not your interest. However, the one thing that confuses me is that you've said before that you don't like horror movies. Or at least you don't think you like, like horror movies.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, I, that doesn't make sense to

[Jake Decker]

me because, like, you can go ahead, but it just like those movies are so like, not all of them, but there are some like, incredibly stupid horror movies that are amazing because of how stupid they are. And like, like,

[Dan Reichert]

I think maybe here's part of it, and I've never thought of it this way before, but this is where my brain went. I like things to have at least some grounding in reality. In terms of like. And it can be wild. Like I throw a Metal Gear Solid into that and Command and conquer games that are, hey, it's set on Earth. It's dudes with guns, with countries that exist. That is the type of thing where I can kind of like be like, okay, this is within the realm of reality here. You know, I've never been the biggest sci fi guy. I've definitely become more of a sci fi guy over the years of just like, you know, like annihilation and like really good, like hard sci fi and stuff. Never been a fantasy guy at all. Just because it's just like I. Why magic and elves and stuff? Like, I just don't. This, this isn't real. This is very. Paul Reichard is very. My brain still having vestages of his. But I need to see a real world scenario and like dudes with guns and not monsters and like. So like, like a frame a question.

[Mary Kish]

Have you seen Seven?

[Dan Reichert]

I love Seven. Okay, so that's the thing. There are horror movies I love. I think it's generally the more like psychological horror type. Like, I mean, 7 is kind of a thriller murder, you know, it's a.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, it's like a procedural detective. Yeah.

[Dan Reichert]

The Shining. The Shining is probably my favorite ever. The Shining. That's psychological horror. You know, like none of that. Well, I mean, you could argue some of that stuff is, you know, the Burial Ground.

[Mary Kish]

What about Donnie Darko?

[Dan Reichert]

Didn't like it.

[Mary Kish]

Children.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, yeah, yeah. But also it was. That was a movie that was hyped up to me for like 10 years by the most obnoxious people in college. And by the time I saw it,

[Mary Kish]

I was like, like, okay, you're such a true soul. You're like such an anti pedo. Like the second there's a kid, you're just like, I am. Ew.

[Dan Reichert]

I don't want to watch it run over by a truck or something.

[Mary Kish]

I hate this. I'm not watching it. And it's just like the hero that we need in 2026.

[Jake Decker]

So. So is it like creatures and like when a creature in a horror movie, that's just unbelievable to you, but I,

[Dan Reichert]

I don't think I have that anymore because it's like, like barbarian. I'm not going to spoil anything. But like barbarians. Not a realistic movie. I loved it. Weapons. Weapons is not remote. Like, that's not realistic. I thought weapons kicked ass. Sinners, you know, so it's like, I think I'm kind of over that now. I still can't struggle with like Fantasy and stuff like that, sure. But sci fi, psychological horror, I like. Induston's a lot of fun. Like I'm.

[Mary Kish]

I'm picking up some vibes based on what you've said yes to.

[Dan Reichert]

I feel like it's just like slightly slasher stuff. Never really like. I like Halloween. I finally temporary. Finally got. But Jake, I might have watched that with you for the first time. Tim had us over to that house and watched Halloween 1 and 2. And I normally am not into like slasher type stuff, but the John Carpenter of it all, like, I just love his style so much that I don't know, I. And I super don't like the like kind of gore porn saw hostel type stuff like that. Does like just like violence and gore for. For the sake of violence and core doesn't do anything for me me. But yeah, like horror is. It's. It depends. It depends with horror, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But like the Rock, like Mary, I saw that on my 12th birthday and it was like, this is the coolest shit I've ever seen in my life. Why would I ever go back to kids movies?

[Mary Kish]

I can't believe I went so long without really giving it a good, solid watch.

[Jake Decker]

Especially living in San Francisco for as long as you did. Like, how do you miss out? I feel like every. I mean, okay, to be fair, I'd go to many bars and it would be playing. But you're not actually watching it in a bar you like, look at. Like, that's how you know.

[Mary Kish]

Have seen the rock probably 10 times. But I haven't watched the Rock. This was the first time that I said, we're sitting and we're watching this start to finish, from start to finish. I actually, half the time I was like, oh, I didn't realize this was like at the beginning of the movie. Like, I never had really, really understood it. So yeah, it was very worth it for me to watch it. I think. I think it'll be nice maybe the next time we get together for you to have like three where you're like, these are quintessential 10 out of 10 banger actions. You can get more nuanced if you want, but it's like you have to watch these and I recommend them fully with my full chest. Like, they're brilliant.

[Dan Reichert]

We never get all Face off, did we? I mean, I think Jake and Mike fell asleep and we stopped.

[Mary Kish]

They fell asleep Face Off. But we've seen it.

[Jake Decker]

I've seen it. Yeah, I'd seen it before.

[Mary Kish]

We watched it together before.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, Face Off Fantastic. I don't.

[Mary Kish]

It's not quite very good.

[Dan Reichert]

I think the Rock to me is the best like traditional action movie as far as there's nothing sci fi. There's nothing like. Because, you know, I think the Terminators and stuff like that are kind of action sci fi, horror. I would put T2 over like the Rock. But like as far as just a straight up in the realm of reality action movie, I don't think it really gets better than the Rock. And then there's the other category that's like the Running man. Granted that sci fi also. So that's kind of like quippy Arnold. That's kind of like one liner. Like that's kind of different to me.

[Mary Kish]

Did you know he says I'll be back in it. I couldn't. Numerous different movies.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, he says in a lot of different movies.

[Mary Kish]

I can't believe it's not trademarked by his other. I'm amazed they were like you're allowed to use your coveted line.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, that's Arnold's. Yeah. But yeah, there's like the prestige action movies like the Rock. I put their Predator again, Predator is like. Predator is also major horror elements there. But like Predator is that. That's kind of a genre bending thing where it starts out like it's going to be this like super testosterone action movie and then it turns into this

[Mary Kish]

sci fi horror kind of a horror. Yeah. I would consider Predator in the, in the realm of horror.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. Yeah. Man. I just get excited to think about these. You've. You've both seen Predator, right? Okay.

[Mary Kish]

If you find it on vhs, I want it just so you know.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, that's a good vhs.

[Mary Kish]

Keep your eye out.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, okay, I'll be watching.

[Mary Kish]

And we've talked about, you know, like my favorite horror is the thing. Like that would be like in my. Like you have to watch it.

[Dan Reichert]

Yes. Then that's. Yes, that is of that caliber. Totally.

[Mary Kish]

It's the type of recommendation I give where I'm like, well if you don't like this, you wouldn't. Like we wouldn't probably get along.

[Dan Reichert]

Exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that, that's a fun category. Like what are the movies, if you had to name a few, that like, if someone doesn't like them, I, I

[Mary Kish]

think think we can't be friends no more.

[Dan Reichert]

I mean. Yeah, I kind of think the one where it's like, if you see this movie and don't understand why this is so funny, that is just speaking to someone's sense of humor in a way where it's like, okay, we might get along politely, but, like, we're not gonna get each other.

[Jake Decker]

You know, I. I think comedy is probably the best way to tell because it's just like, I don't know, you can tell what, what someone's sense of humor is based on watching a movie. And if they don't find it's funny, it's just like, all right, I guess we're just different.

[Dan Reichert]

Talking about.

[Jake Decker]

Or if they think it's funny and you're, like, cringing at it, then that also, you know, has the opposite effect.

[Dan Reichert]

Or it's just sort of like, yeah, totally.

[Mary Kish]

I've actually, you know, I met someone at. At a party. It was like a mutual friend's birthday party who said that they could not get through. I think you should leave because it was so cringy and awkward.

[Jake Decker]

Throw my drink in my face and walk away.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah. And I was, like, really polite about it and I was like, okay, like, you're totally allowed to have that opinion. I'm gonna go over here now. And to this day I'm like, when I see them, I'm like, I don't really want to talk to that guy. Like, he didn't like a show that has fundamentally altered how I talk to people because I think it's so funny. He's allowed to have that opinion. I'm not saying he's like a bad person or he's like a loser. I'm just saying we're not going to probably get along.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. There's a level you can't connect on, you know?

[Mary Kish]

And what am I supposed to do? Invest time into this person?

[Dan Reichert]

No, Laska.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, I. I was at a show last night at a concert, and there was a guy in line next to me, and he was wearing an incredibly. A shirt with an incredibly complicated pattern. And the amount of self restraint it took for me to be like, not be like, how much that shirt cost? It looks pretty expensive. With a pattern that complicated, it could cost you thousands of dollars. And I just, like, held it in.

[Dan Reichert]

I was like, don't say anything.

[Jake Decker]

Don't say anything. Don't say anything.

[Mary Kish]

Don't ruin this social experience.

[Jake Decker]

Speaking of a show that's changed the way I talk and think that one probably pretty high up there. For better or worse. I mean, even playing Minna, you know, I'm. The entire time I'm singing the bones are their doll and so are the

[Mary Kish]

worms all the time. As soon as I found out. Did you know that? Yeah. Leveling up in Mina. It's Bone up. And I was like, outrageous that you're calling it that. Like, I like that this is a. I don't have such an aggressive opinion about Mina. Like, I think if you guys were like, we don't like it, I would be like, okay, well, this is a bad idea. And Dan, you're not a big fan of mixtape and I think it's pretty good. And like, that's okay that I. That actually checks out. I can like see the differences in our personalities and I still like, really like you. I think there is like, yeah, I'm a very good person and I think that there is like, there are things though in my life that if you didn't like them, I'd be like, who is this person? Who is this man? Like, it's so weird that you wouldn't like this. And I'd like to cross those off on the next podcast. I'll write like a list of things where I'm like, you like these, right?

[Dan Reichert]

I think this was productive though. I think we're all still friends here. I think we haven't crossed any lines.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah, no, I don't think so. I think I'm pretty open minded about this stuff. There's like a rare few pieces of media where I'm like, like, it's. You're supposed to like these.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

Strange.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, you're just wrong if you don't like these. Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

I mean, it's funny. I bet you there are people out there that like, don't think MacGruber is funny.

[Dan Reichert]

Oh, they're out there. I mean, it's the least. Honestly, it was a huge flop. It was a critically panned. It was like the amount of people like, oh, Gimlie. Dan likes this stupid movie. It's like, no, you just. Yeah, you don't get it. Growing up, like, I was such a little film nerd and stuff. And the amount of times I would try to get like, you know, my mom is great. Love my mom. She is not a film connoisseur by any means. And I would like be like, mom, you got to see this, you got to see this. And like very quickly learn the opening, honestly. Yeah, it was stuff like I was trying to get her to watch like Clockwork Orange and you know, like I was a teenager. Fight club at the time to me was like high art or whatever. And it's like she would just watch this stuff and you know, it's like, well, like, can we watch that thing you do for the 7,000th time instead? Oh, man.

[Jake Decker]

To bring it back to the question kind of. I will say one thing that helped a lot is, I mean, it kind of goes on this, but it's just like, I don't know, I've just accepted that I'm just not gonna play everything, read everything, see everything that people recommend. And, like, you kind of just have to make peace with that. I, I do often think about, though, like, it's probably just because I wasn't, I wasn't getting as many recommendations. I didn't know a lot of people who had the same interests as me. But I do wonder how, like, when I was a kid, I felt like I played everything I saw.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

All the movies.

[Dan Reichert]

There was less.

[Jake Decker]

I was able to keep up with every. Yeah, I mean, that's part of it too. And now it's just very much like, I don't know, like, I loved Disco Elysium. I thought that game was fantastic. And the new, their new game, Zero Parades is out. And I'm just like, oh, I can't. I don't know what I'm gonna have the time to play this. And I just have to be okay with that and move on. People are like, well, you'll probably like it because you like Disco Lesy. When it's like, I believe you, you are right. That recommendation makes sense, but I just don't have the time, so I'm just gonna have to skip it. Maybe I'll get to it, maybe I won't.

[Dan Reichert]

One recommendation I learned to disregard very quickly was the amount of times a Marvel movie would come out during the height of the Marvel stuff. And all these people like, Dan, I know you don't normally like the Marvel stuff, but this is the one. Even if you don't like Marvel. Thor Ragnarok's gonna be the one. I watch like, no, no, this sucks too. Like, these all suck. I heard that so many times. And I eventually just like, I'm just, I'm just, I don't need to try with these anymore.

[Mary Kish]

I think I'd like to try the new Spider Mans. I was thinking about giving it the old college try those.

[Dan Reichert]

You talking about the, like the spider verse ones? Not the ones with that cool. Oh, no, the live action one suck. Those were also the ones people told me, like, even if you don't like it. No, the live action one sucks. Still no way home or Long way from home or whatever. I, I, I never stop a movie halfway through. The one with Michael Keaton, and I love Michael Keaton. I got halfway through and I was like, I hate this movie. And I stopped it. The, the spider verse movies, the animated ones. Those are actually good. I actually like those, dude. The. And is it Andrew Garfield or Tom Holland, whoever the current one is. Oh, just suck.

[Mary Kish]

Really. Oh, no, I was, that's what I was talking about. I was like, maybe those are.

[Dan Reichert]

No, don't waste your life. You have so much time. This mortal plane. Don't waste a half hour of it even trying one of these. Like, I, I, I mourn the loss of a half hour I spent watching that.

[Jake Decker]

You need Toby Maguire's Spider man on vhs. I think I, I think that's the Spider man scratch.

[Dan Reichert]

These are fine. Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

I remember liking the first Toby Maguire a lot.

[Jake Decker]

I thought the first two are pretty good.

[Mary Kish]

First I saw those in theaters and I remember being like, yes, this is the Spider man that I wanted. And then I don't think I watched any after that.

[Dan Reichert]

Top three.

[Jake Decker]

It was not Tobey Maguire. One is bad, but it's kind of fun because it is so bad.

[Mary Kish]

It's so bad.

[Dan Reichert]

It's still Sam Raimi and, like, weird bad, you know?

[Jake Decker]

But I think, to your point, Dan, about, like, all the Marvel, the new Spider man ones, there's just like, no. I don't know. I feel like all the edges have been sanded off. It's just Marvel. It's like, okay, it's just.

[Dan Reichert]

Here's a quick word now, but slop is how I gotta do all that stuff. Just the same type of fucking. Same shitty snarky humor and all these. And. Yeah, it's.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, Watch Hokum instead.

[Mary Kish]

Oh, yeah. You were saying? So you're. I don't want any spoilies because I think I'm gonna watch this. But you said you watched Hokum and it's worth seeing.

[Jake Decker]

I think so.

[Dan Reichert]

H O K U m. Yep.

[Mary Kish]

Don't look it up. I think it's one of those ones. I don't know if you should look it up. Up. Although I think you could look up like a photo. But I wouldn't watch the trailer because

[Dan Reichert]

I saw a weird bunny thing and I closed the tab.

[Mary Kish]

It's kind of like one of those things where I think, I think part of what's supposed to be so good about it is how weird and mysterious it is. So the more you learn about it, I think the less you'll be. Jake, you should probably say this. You're the one who watched it. But, like, I saw half a trailer and I was like, I'm not watching the rest of this. This is going to spoil the out of this film for me.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, it's definitely one of those movies that I think the less you know going in, the better. I wouldn't say it's to the level of love, Zach Kreger's stuff, where it's like you don't want to know anything. You don't explain anything. I think, like, if you know the general conceit, you'll probably still enjoy Hokum. But, yeah, I would. I would. I would recommend it for you specifically. Mary Dan. I'm not sure about you.

[Mary Kish]

Is it in theaters? It's in theaters, right?

[Jake Decker]

It's still in theaters, but I bet it'll come to streaming pretty soon.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah.

[Dan Reichert]

Would you put it in, like, is it like a modern horror? Like a Hereditary or Midsommar or something like that?

[Jake Decker]

It's not that it's. It's not that. Up its own ass, I would say.

[Dan Reichert]

Okay. Well, actually, I like those.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah, I mean, I do, too. I like them a lot. But I feel like those horrors were, like, really trying to, like, elevate.

[Dan Reichert]

Sure.

[Jake Decker]

The genre in a way. And this feels. It's very thoughtful in the horror that it is, but it doesn't feel like it's trying to say more than what it's trying to sing, I guess. But there's just some very well constructed, well directed scenes. There's a dumb waiter that is used in a incredible way that ratches up tension. It's very good.

[Mary Kish]

I'm excited.

[Jake Decker]

I had a great time. I had to go to the bathroom at one point in it, and I was pissed because I didn't want to miss a second, but I also didn't want to want to piss my pants in the pants.

[Mary Kish]

Yeah.

[Jake Decker]

You know, you kind of have to just.

[Mary Kish]

That's what I get for drinking sometimes. That's why I do like it when it's home, because I like being able to, like, go to the bathroom or get another drink without missing anything. But I. I also think, like, the theater experience is, like, one for the books.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah. There's huge benefits to both, for sure.

[Mary Kish]

I know. It's the peeing that's the problem.

[Jake Decker]

Yeah. I mean, I could just not drink four or five beers before, and then I'd be fine.

[Dan Reichert]

But. Yeah, but that's part of the movie theater experience.

[Mary Kish]

I know they keep investing in these popcorn buckets, but I need a piss bucket so that I can stay. They're like, customized.

[Dan Reichert]

It's like a hidden little thing.

[Mary Kish]

Dune 3 piss bucket. Yeah, I think.

[Dan Reichert]

I think it's a Nathan for you. When he had the, like, chili suit with the hoses that would, like, spray the chili out. I just do an invert thing that just sucks pee out of my wiener and suck the pee out.

[Mary Kish]

I don't want to leave.

[Dan Reichert]

All right, well, that's our movie podcast.

[Mary Kish]

Thank you for your.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah.

[Mary Kish]

For your question, Freddy.

[Dan Reichert]

Yeah, they just got a movie related question. It actually wasn't even specific about movies. And we just went on a tangent. Turns out they're good. All right, well, that is it for Fire Escape this week. We've got [e-mail] deepdishpussy.com that might go to the Patreon. You can figure it out. You know how to Google, but yeah, follow us on our socials, on Instagram, Blue Sky. Anything in particular you guys want to plug before we get out of here? Nope.

[Mary Kish]

Next, when this goes live, I'll be at TwitchCon in Rotterdam. So this is probably not for most of you, but if you're in Europe next week, I'll be at TwitchCon. Please feel free to stop by and say hi. That would be so cool. Other than that, I'll be back on our regularly scheduled posts. That's it. I'll also be. I won't be able to stream this week because I'm. I'm in Europe, so. But I'm excited to see anybody who I run into there.

[Dan Reichert]

And for me, it's giantbomb.com we got summer Games Fest coming up. We are doing Giant Bomb at night. Make sure you tune in Friday and Saturday night. We'll be doing some late night shows. We got a couch full of guests. Tune in. Always a great time. I'll try not to get assassinated via confetti cannon this time.

[Mary Kish]

Oh, that was funny. That was like one of those things where you could have been seriously injured.

[Dan Reichert]

Yes, I could have.

[Mary Kish]

But you weren't, so it's funny.

[Dan Reichert]

It felt like I might have been. All right, see us. Tune in.

[Mary Kish]

I think I'm going. I'll see you.

[Dan Reichert]

I'll see you there. Come by the studio. We got a new, new place and everything. Yeah, yeah, I want to see both of you there. It'd be great. And until then, we will be back in a couple weeks for the Fire Escape cast. See y'. All.

[Mary Kish]

Bye.

[Jake Decker]

See ya,

[Dan Reichert]

Sam.