How One Couple Overcame Infidelity and Broke Generational Cycles (Part 1 of 2)

Summary

Podcast Summary: Focus on the Family with Jim Daly

Episode: How One Couple Overcame Infidelity and Broke Generational Cycles (Part 1 of 2)
Date: January 28, 2026
Guests: Tim and Kathy Bush
Hosts: Jim Daly and John Fuller

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Overview

This episode features the deeply moving testimony of Tim and Kathy Bush, a couple whose marriage not only survived infidelity, addiction, and years of broken patterns but was also radically transformed through faith. Their story covers a journey from a rushed, troubled beginning and generational wounds to the breaking point and eventual renewal in Christ. The conversation is frank, honest, and offers hope to listeners struggling in their own marriages.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Early Years: A Marriage Built on Shaky Ground

• Pregnancy and a Quick Marriage
  • Kathy shares that she and Tim married because she became pregnant soon after they started dating ("Didn’t get pregnant on the first date," [02:41]), moved quickly, and lacked pre-marital preparation.
  • For Kathy, marriage was an escape from school and home, seeking someone to provide for her ([02:44]–[03:44]).

    “The marriage was pretty much based off of how I thought Tim was going to make me feel. I was marrying him because I knew he could provide for me and I felt like he was going to take care of me.”
    – Kathy Bush, [03:34]

2. The Breaking Point: Loss, Depression, and Secret Sin

• Tim’s Grief and Downward Spiral
  • Tim recounts a multi-year period of trauma (the loss of his grandfather, brother, and nephew, business collapse) that pushed him into severe depression, substance abuse, and crippling anxiety ([03:57]–[07:04]).
  • He describes a life without God, attempting to carry burdens alone:

    “…I was building at that point what I would call my own kingdom here on Earth. My goal was 100 buildings in 10 years. And I was going to do this no matter what and carry it all on my shoulders without even talking to God about it. I didn't know God.”
    – Tim Bush, [04:23]

• Revelation of Infidelity
  • In counseling, Tim admits years of secret affairs ([07:08]):

    “I told him about my serial infidelity over the years and the things I had not told Kath. And he said, well, you're going to need to tell her. And I said, well, if I tell her, I'm going to lose her. He goes, well, if you don't tell her, you're going to lose yourself.”
    – Tim Bush, [07:39]

3. Why Did They Stay? Cycles, Divorce, and the Search for Identity

• Neither Gave Up on the Same Day

  • Kathy highlights that divorce was always on the table for one of them, but never both at the same time:

    “There wasn't one day in those 27 years that we both wanted a divorce.”
    – Kathy Bush, [08:54]

• Impact of Generational Divorce

  • The weight of family history:

    “My mom married nine times, my dad five … my grandparents too, at age 18, they got a divorce after 37 years of marriage. So I didn't really see any what I would call stable marriages.”
    – Tim Bush, [09:33]

• Attempts to ‘Find Themselves’ Outside Christ

  • Kathy describes seeking fulfillment through self-help, schooling, and other avenues before finding Christ:

    “We filled that hole with drugs and alcohol and infidelity, but also I was filling it...I would go to college and take college classes. I would go to self help seminars. You know, it was just that constant search.”
    – Kathy Bush, [10:43]

4. The Road to Faith: Small Steps, Big Change

• God’s Pursuit in the Midst of Rock Bottom

  • Encouraged by a friend in Mexico (oddly, his “drug dealer” friend), Tim begins reading the Bible, even if skeptically:

    “I went and bought one. I'm reading 70 pages a night, whiskey in one hand, Bible in the other. I'm not getting a thing from this thing.”
    – Tim Bush, [00:31] & [13:02]

  • He’s challenged to read Proverbs daily. Eventually, post-trip, Tim asks Kathy to join him:

    “When he asked me to read the Bible with him ...that was like, the sexiest thing Tim had ever done...he was doing something that was right, leading me in the right way...I was craving for my husband to do something godly with me.”
    – Kathy Bush, [15:09]

  • They both express shock and delight at how practical and relevant Proverbs is, having never encountered the Bible as a living document ([16:20]–[16:26]).

• Sober for the First Time, Sensing Hope

  • A 30-day cleanse and daily Scripture reading begin to lift the fog for Tim ([16:28]–[16:32]).

• Mentorship and Calling

  • Pastor Bill Voros, who walked with Tim’s brother during terminal illness, pushes Tim toward a deeper calling:

    "The Lord's got a calling on your life and it's a big calling and it's not here. You need to go find yourself at Jesus Loving Bible Teaching Church and figure out what that calling is."
    – Pastor Bill, paraphrased by Tim Bush, [18:25]

• New Church and a Holy Spirit Encounter

  • At a Christmas concert in a church that met in a former casino, the couple feels a profound shift:

    “They played this song called the Lighthouse...and I literally feel something happen inside me. Like something came inside me and I know now it was the Holy Spirit. And I reached down to Kath with tears in my eyes. I said, babe, our lives are going to change forever...this is on December 21st of 2009. Still makes me emotional to talk about it.”
    – Tim Bush, [20:03]

5. Stakes in the Ground: Building a Transformed Marriage

• Establishing Non-Negotiables

  • After coming to faith, Tim and Kathy intentionally set firm boundaries (“stakes”) in their marriage to guard against old patterns ([22:34]–[23:24]):

    “We realized we needed to do some radically transformed things in our marriage, not just for us, but for next generation...so we had to make some what I would call non negotiables in our marriage ...We made eight stakes in the ground...”
    – Tim Bush, [22:40]

• Healthy Boundaries

  • One key stake: no private meetings with the opposite sex, total openness with phones and computers ([23:37]):

    “Boundaries are so important. And I think even if you haven't dealt with infidelity in your marriage, boundaries are important. God puts boundaries for us. You have to have healthy boundaries in your marriage...the person I trust the most is Tim. And that's only because of what Christ did in our marriage.”
    – Kathy Bush, [23:37]

6. Overcoming Infidelity and Deepening Trust

• The hosts and guests discuss the paradox: couples who survive infidelity and do the hard work of healing often experience deeper intimacy and transparency ([24:25]–[25:20]).

  “...we've seen with Hope Restored...the number one issue that couples come into Hope Restored with is infidelity...if a couple can actually survive that and get to the root sources...they seem to have a beautifully transparent marriage. And trust that is built...either ruined by that or it's incredibly deeper...”
  – Jim Daly, [24:25]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “There wasn’t one day in those 27 years that we both wanted a divorce.”
  – Kathy Bush, [08:54]

• “He said, well, if I tell her, I’m going to lose her. He goes, well, if you don’t tell her, you’re going to lose yourself.”
  – Tim Bush, [07:39]

• “I went and bought one. I’m reading 70 pages a night, whiskey in one hand, Bible in the other.”
  – Tim Bush, [00:31]

• “When he asked me to read the Bible with him...that was like, the sexiest thing Tim had ever done. For the first time in our marriage, he was doing something that was right, leading me.”
  – Kathy Bush, [15:09]

• “I literally feel something happen inside me. Like something came inside me and I know now it was the Holy Spirit...I said, babe, our lives are going to change forever.”
  – Tim Bush, [20:03]

• “Boundaries are so important...the things that we went through and that we did to each other...the person I trust the most is Tim is my husband. And that’s only because of what Christ did in our marriage.”
  – Kathy Bush, [23:37]

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Key Timestamps

• 02:01 — Kathy shares the rushed, precarious beginnings of their marriage
• 03:57–07:04 — Tim’s downfall: grief, addiction, admission of infidelity
• 08:30 — Kathy explains why neither ever filed for divorce on the same day
• 10:43 — Efforts to “find themselves,” search for identity pre-faith
• 13:02 — Tim’s friend challenges him to read a Proverb daily; Tim invites Kathy to join him
• 15:09–16:26 — Together, the couple begins discovering the Bible and seeing life change
• 18:25 — Pastor Bill encourages Tim to find his spiritual calling
• 20:03 — Tim’s encounter with the Holy Spirit during the church concert
• 22:34–23:24 — Establishment of “stakes in the ground”: marital non-negotiables, boundaries
• 24:25 — Reflections on how couples can move past infidelity and build deeper trust

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Conclusion & Next Steps

Jim Daly and John Fuller close the episode by encouraging struggling couples not to give up hope, highlighting the success stories from Focus on the Family’s “Hope Restored” marriage intensives. They preview a continuation of Tim and Kathy’s inspiring journey in the next episode and invite listeners to find more support and resources through Focus on the Family.

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Resources/Book Mentioned:
Sex on the First Date: A Story of a Broken Beginning to a Radically Transformed Marriage by Tim and Kathy Bush

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To be continued in Part 2...

Transcript

[Dave Stone]

Your church comes to you each week to fill their cup. But when the crowd leaves, who's filling yours? That's exactly what I'm here to do with my new podcast from Focus on the Family. It's called Pastor to Pastor with Dave Stone. I'm so excited to help you navigate the unique challenges that pastors face in their ministry journey, both personally and professionally. So I invite you to listen and subscribe to Pastor to Pastor wherever you get your podcasts.

[Tim Bush]

But I want you to consider something. Would you consider reading the Bible? I said, Bob, I went and bought one. I'm reading 70 pages a night, whiskey in one hand, Bible in the other. I'm not getting a thing from this thing. I'm not getting anything.

[John Fuller]

That's Tim Bush, and he and his wife Kathy are with us today on FOCUS on the Family, with Jim Daly, sharing their incredible marriage story. I'm John Fuller.

[Jim Daly]

John Occasionally we hear some marriage stories that are amazing, I'd say miraculous. And today we're going to hear that from this couple that will share a lot of the trench warfare spiritually that they were in, the generational curses that plagued them. And I am, my jaws open. I'm just kind of shocked they made it. And so this is the kind of show you want to kick back, get that cup of coffee or a hot cup of tea and just listen to this story. I think you're going to be amazed that God actually was able to work through their hearts and create a miracle in their relationship.

[John Fuller]

Yeah. And Tim and Kathy have been married for over 40 years. They have three grown children and eight grandchildren. And they're speakers and serve with the Family Life team. They've got a powerful book, as you said, Jim. It's an incredible story. The book is called Sex on the First, A Story of a Broken Beginning to a Radically Transformed Marriage. And we've got details about our guests and the terrific resource this book online. And the link is in the show notes.

[Jim Daly]

Tim and Kathy, welcome to FOCUS on the family. Nothing like being headlined with this is a crazy marriage story that God reached down and found a way in his sovereignty to save Kathy. Let's start with you going back. I mean, you do have this powerful story. What were some of the unhealthy habits that were going on early in your marriage?

[Kathy Bush]

Well, yes, it was a crazy marriage. So going back, the unhealthy. Well, starting at the very beginning, you know, Tim and I got married because I was pregnant, thus the title of.

[Jim Daly]

The book, Sex on the First Date.

[Kathy Bush]

Didn't get pregnant on the first date.

[Jim Daly]

Okay.

[Kathy Bush]

Got pregnant shortly after that. And Tim and I had actually talked about getting married. But once I got pregnant, my parents were like, it looks like we're going to move the date up. And we're, you know, I was actually a senior in high school, but I really felt like, for me, I was. I was looking for a husband. At this point, I wasn't. My. My future was going to be. I was going to get married. So when I got pregnant and I could drop out of school, it gave me a good excuse because I did not like school at all. So we moved into the marriage really fast, and we didn't know each other. We didn't do any kind of pre marriage. The marriage was pretty much based off of how I thought Tim was going to make me feel. I was marrying him because I knew he could provide for me and I felt like he was going to take care of me. So I basically just went from being in my home with my parents to moving to being with Tim into another situation of a man taking care of me.

[Jim Daly]

Tim, let me turn your direction. One of the major turning points in your marriage was when you came to a breaking point. Describe the breaking point. What was happening at what year of marriage did this breaking point occur?

[Tim Bush]

Well, the breaking point in our marriage was there's a. Between. Between 25 and 27 years. It was a long breaking point. But in 2005, my pop passed away. And I never really grieved over it. I was a tough guy, and he told me to be tough. He, you know, don't grieve. People need to depend on you, and you need to be a rock for everybody.

[Jim Daly]

And your pop was your grandfather? Grandpa?

[Kathy Bush]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jim Daly]

He's the one who raised you.

[Tim Bush]

He's the one that gave me his last name. They adopted me and raised me as their own from the time I was 12 and really even before that, but mostly in those teen years, taught me how to work and taught me that's what women were attracted to for success. And so I worked towards that. But I can tell you the breaking point for me when pop died. And then a couple years later, my brother got brain cancer. Cancer. Stage 4 glioblastoma. In 2008 was when he was diagnosed. And then that fall, our nephew passed away. And it was really hard in our family. He was only 22. And also that fall, business was getting bad because the economy changed and I was building at that point what I would call my own kingdom here on Earth. My goal was 100 buildings in 10 years. And I was going to do this no matter what and carry it all on my shoulders without even talking to God about it. I didn't know God. And things started to crash down that fall. So I was depressed. I was filled with anxiety, couldn't sleep, couldn't think right. And ultimately then my brother passed away in February of 2009 at 43 years old. And everything I could do to try to save him, but I couldn't do it. And I tried, though, but I started to fall apart and even talked about suicide. I was to the point where I was at the end of myself and didn't know what to do. And at this point, I'm drinking a fifth of alcohol a day just to cope, just to cope with it. And taking Xanax and other drugs, too. Just everything, just to get through the day. I couldn't work at this point. I'm not working at all. And we have lots of employees, lots of things going on. And I literally thought that I was going to die. But the breaking point didn't quite happen just then, but it was pretty close. And I was going to a counselor then, too. Jake was really trying to help me through all this. And he thought it was from abuse from my brother's dad that he abused me when I was younger and beat me, put me in the hospital a couple times. And he thought it was that. So he told me that I should go to Costco and get one of those big boxes for toilet paper that he used to make, not the plastic, and tape it all up with duct tape and then write his name on it, get a baseball bat and beat that box until I felt better. And I did. I did that. And it did make me feel better about my brother's dad. And ultimately I did end up forgiving him the day my brother died, right in front of my brother.

[Jim Daly]

Wow.

[Tim Bush]

But I wasn't a Christian yet. Yeah.

[Jim Daly]

I was going to ask where is the Lord and all that.

[Tim Bush]

I just felt like I needed to do it while my brother was still alive. And he died about an hour later. My brother did, and his dad was on the other side of me when this happened. But I can tell you, my counselor said, you're not telling me everything. And I said, well, what do you mean? He says, well, if you're still having anxiety, all these things are going on. There's things that you're not telling me. And then I told him about my serial infidelity over the years and the things I had not told Kath. And he said, well, you're going to need to tell her. And I said, well, if I tell her, I'm going to lose her. He goes, well, if you don't tell her, you're going to lose yourself. That's where you're at right now. God's having his way with you. He's brought you to your knees. And he told me a scripture and I basically said, if you don't let this out, you're going to die.

[Jim Daly]

And you're in that spot. I mean, this is painting a really amazing picture. Kathy, I want to come back to you. You described the desire to find yourself in the midst of all this and you've got all this difficulty going on with your marriage. I guess it's a two part question. First, what kept you in at this point? I mean, maybe then you can describe when Tim shared that infidelity with you and your response to that. But what kept you, your head in the game? I mean, you're not committed to the Lord in a deeper way. It sounded like kind of a superficial understanding of scripture and stuff, right?

[Kathy Bush]

Yeah, I definitely didn't really have any understanding of scripture. I was not in God's word and only heard it from what I heard in church. But really what kept me in it was kind of an on and off thing. And we tell people, when they ask us that question, why did you not get a divorce? And my answer to that is, there wasn't one day in those 27 years that we both wanted a divorce.

[Jim Daly]

You said that very carefully. So people need to understand. It wasn't that you never said what about divorce? You just never said it on the same day.

[Kathy Bush]

We never said it on the same day. And so there was always one of us that was willing to fight for the marriage. And I look back at that and I hear people say, well, if you're not both going to commit, you're not going to both fight. It's not going to work. And I don't believe that. I believe if there's one of you, I believe eventually, yes, you can't make it work if you're never both going to commit. And God did that for us. But I believe that Tim wanted marriage so bad because he had experienced divorce so many times.

[Tim Bush]

My mom married nine times, my dad five.

[John Fuller]

So that is, that was an incredible thing.

[Tim Bush]

Well, then my grandparents too, at age 18, they got a divorce after 37 years of marriage. So I didn't really see any what I would call stable marriages.

[Kathy Bush]

So he continually said to me, I'm not going to do that to our Kids, I'm not going to drag them through a divorce. I don't, you know, he knew what that felt like. I had no idea. My parents were longtime married. My thought was, this isn't a good situation for our kids to be seen. That's. I was kind of looking at it at that way and I didn't know what divorce was. So I was, I was the one that was throwing divorce out there a lot more. And I was told from people, you need to find yourself. And what does that even mean? Because we're really supposed to lose ourself and find Christ. It's not about.

[Tim Bush]

We so searched. We searched.

[Kathy Bush]

The search was on.

[Jim Daly]

Well, and that's real. I mean, and I appreciate that. And there's people listening that don't have a deep commitment with the Lord and they're trying to find themselves because friends of theirs have said, try to find yourself, find yourself. So this is part of your testimony. And how long did that journey of finding finding yourself last? And in the end, you went to a cul de sac called Jesus Christ Lane. There was no way out. So what happened there?

[Kathy Bush]

Well, that lasted the 27 years before we found Christ. And it wasn't only, you know, we filled that hole with drugs and alcohol and infidelity, but also I was filling it. I would go to college and take college classes. I would go to self help seminars. You know, it was just that constant search. And then after Christ took us to our knees, which he basically did, Tim, which brought me. It's like the search was over. We found our purpose.

[Jim Daly]

Yeah, that's good. And I'm going to come out of the break and we'll get more about that finding of Christ.

[John Fuller]

Yeah. This is Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. And our guests are Tim and Kathy Bush sharing a little bit of their story, which is captured in more detail in the book Sex on the First Date, a story of a broken beginning to a radically transformed marriage. Incredible read. Get a copy from us here at the ministry. We've got the link in the show notes.

[Jim Daly]

You know, the thing that's fascinating is the way the Lord's working in both your hearts prior to your commitment to Him. There's obviously a stirring going on. The Lord is like reeling you in, which is what he does. You know, the best thing you can do if you don't have a relationship with Christ is say, lord, just show me yourself, and God will do that. It sounds like you guys are in that spot. Just to kind of give it some framework again. I mean, you're drinking heavily, Your business is crumbling. You're concerned about the kids in the marriage, which is super broken, but you're willing to stick with it and find answers. Where does God show up more prominently for both of you and how did that happen and when did it happen?

[Tim Bush]

Well, that was a process. When we were in Mexico, I was served on a board, and there's a bunch of people on that board and a friend of mine who I was trying to get more drugs because my doctor wasn't gonna give me any more Xanax. I said, I need Xanax. And he even talks about this. There's videos in our book, and he even talks about this. When I came to him and he said, you know, Tim, he said, I'll get you the drugs, no problem. But I want you to consider something. Would you consider reading the Bible? I said, bob, I went and bought one. I'm reading 70 pages a night, whiskey in one hand, Bible in the other. I'm not getting a thing from this thing. I'm not getting anything.

[Jim Daly]

Well, he was your drug dealer, so this is all kind of odd.

[Tim Bush]

Well, and. Well, he was doing that as a friend because you could get it in Mexico over the. You could literally get it over the counter in Mexico. So. So he said, you know, when I got really down and out, I started reading the Proverbs. I read one every day, and I didn't know if the Proverbs was in the Bible, what he was even talking about. And he said, just, you know, there's 31 of them. And I would consider reading, doing that and seeing if that would work. And so you know what? I'll think about it because no one's going to tell me what to do. And so we leave Mexico, which I was a mess in Mexico.

[Jim Daly]

And what year is this now?

[Tim Bush]

This was early 2009, right after my brother died, because I thought things would be better once he died. And they, they didn't. I mean, the President kept spiraling down. It was just bad. We got on the airplane, for example, and I want to kind of seize this moment. We had a first class seat, and as soon as they closed the door, I started sweating, shaking, completely freaking out to where I was so claustrophobic, where even my socks on my feet made me feel claustrophobic. Think about that. I couldn't tie shoes. I couldn't have my shoes tied because I would itch or whatever. It just really messed me up. And so I'd start drinking right away and they would. The flight attendants would give it to Me, because I was a mess.

[Jim Daly]

Yeah.

[Tim Bush]

But we got off that plane, and then when we went to Bob, and our kids were with us, too. And, I mean, I was so OCD or whatever you want to call it, where I needed some lip stuff for my lips. We went to five stores to find lip stuff.

[Jim Daly]

Lip balm.

[Tim Bush]

Yeah, lip balm. Just because my lips were chapped. And I wasn't gonna stop until I found the kind I wanted. And so I just. That's how bad I was. And so when we left. Yeah, exactly. So when we left Mexico, got home, and I said to Kath, I said, you know, Bob mentioned that, you know, maybe I should read the Bible and read a proverb a day. Would you read it with me? And it was a moment there. Kath, I don't want to take this away from Kathy. Yeah.

[Kathy Bush]

Let me say it.

[Tim Bush]

Okay, you say it.

[Jim Daly]

This is good.

[Kathy Bush]

Because I remember this moment when he asked me to read the Bible with him. And there was just something in me that was like. When I think back to it, that was like, the sexiest thing Tim had ever done. Like, I felt like for the first time in our marriage, he was doing something that was right, leading me in the right way. And I think I was just craving that because, you know, I think because of my upbringing, there would be times when I would. I would get a Bible and I would say, I'm going to start reading the Bible. And I would start. I usually do this in January. I'd start reading the Bible in Genesis and got about halfway through and never went any further. And I even have a Bible that my mom gave me. And I opened it years later, and she wrote in there to my spiritual daughter, and she saw something in me. But when he asked me, it was just. I was craving that. I was craving for my husband to do something godly with me. And I didn't even know that. So it was an amazing time for us. And we started that day. We started with chapter one of Proverbs.

[Tim Bush]

And we found out who wrote them and all that stuff.

[Kathy Bush]

We were blown away by Proverbs, and it made so much sense. We would look at each other like, wow, that.

[Tim Bush]

Like, that's in the Bible.

[Kathy Bush]

That makes sense. Like, we've never read this before.

[Tim Bush]

And when I was a kid growing up, I remember my gram, she had this family Bible. It was a big one. It's 1936. We still have it now. It was called the family Bible. And I went to grab it one time. She goes, oh, no, we don't touch That I only opened it up to write marriages and deaths and stuff like that. So I never. Bibles were just something you didn't touch is what I thought. And so we're actually reading God's Word. And I went through a thing where I was trying to lose weight. And the thing I was doing was called Advocare. And it was a 30 day cleanse. So no drinking during those 30 days. So all of a sudden I'm not drinking at all for 30 days. We're reading the Bible and I'm starting to get better. And then things started to spin a little different. I had a good friend, which I think that's where we're going to go anyway. I think I remember his name is Bill Voros. He was a pastor that walked my brother through his death in hospice. He was there every day. And so I really liked this guy. And he reminded me of my pop. Same. He was 140 pounds, five foot seven. They looked alike. There were a lot of similarities there. Only this guy had a relationship with the Lord and my pop didn't. And so Bill asked me, he said, hey, Tim, I want you to go to grief counseling. You need to do this. And I said, well, tell me about that. And he said, well, I have a group starting. You lost me at group. I'm not going to do any group thing. And he said, well, what if we did it one on one? So I said, sure, I'll do that. And so we started. And after a few times, Bill said to me, I'm going to close the door this time. Your claustrophobia and anxiety seems better. I need you to really hear me. And so he closes the door and he said, tim, I could lose my job. I've been a pastor for 40 years. I've never had this conversation with another man. And it's really important. I want you to hear it. He said, tim, the Lord's got a calling on your life and it's a big calling and it's not here. You need to go find yourself at Jesus Loving Bible Teaching Church and figure out what that calling is. Wow.

[Jim Daly]

And he was working at the church.

[Tim Bush]

You guys were going to. He was the associate pastor on.

[Jim Daly]

And you say you got to get to a different church.

[Kathy Bush]

Yeah, he was at this Lutheran church.

[Tim Bush]

He was an interim pastor at this church. And then I had too much pride to say I didn't know what a calling was. So I went home to the girl that was raised in the church. I went home to Kath. I said, hey. Bill said this and what do you think? What's a calling, by the way? She goes, well, I don't know either. We'll find out, right?

[Kathy Bush]

No, I mean, I said, it sounds.

[Jim Daly]

Good, the freshness of it.

[Kathy Bush]

And I even said I thought every church was a Jesus loving, Bible teaching church. I just thought that. I assumed when we went to church and we sat down in that church, everybody was gonna be in heaven with us. When we all died, we were all going to heaven. I didn't. We just didn't understand. We didn't understand, so. But it was exciting. It was like, let's go find a calling. Let's go find our calling.

[Jim Daly]

Well, we need to tie that in a bow. I'm assuming you found a good church then.

[Tim Bush]

Well, we started searching and then ultimately we did find a church. And it was kind of funny how we found it. Our niece had been going there and she said, why don't you go? So we decided to go there and it was actually in a casino. Casino. Well, it used to be a casino and. But that's where the church was. So it didn't matter that it wasn't in a big building. We go in this deal and so we're going there, start talking about this Christmas concert they're going to have. And you guys, this is just phenomenal how God works in this because I look back at that, the Christmas concert, they wanted people to set up and tear down and serve. And I said, well, I'm not going to do that, but we'll pay extra money for the tickets. We'll help that way.

[Jim Daly]

We'll pay for the service.

[Tim Bush]

We'll go, yeah. And so we go. So on December 21st of 2009, we go through this whole concert and I'm listening to the music and they're playing and it's just a really cool concert. Well, then all of a sudden at the very end, they play this song called the Lighthouse that I've never heard before. And I literally feel something happen inside me. Like something came inside me and I know now it was the Holy Spirit. And I reached down to Kath with tears in my eyes. I said, babe, our lives are going to change forever. And we're going to go to this church and we're going to serve here and things are going to change. I want you to know that this is on December 21st of 2009. Still makes me emotional to talk about it.

[Jim Daly]

No, I can see that. And the power of that. That is a changed life. You know, so many people wonder, am I a Christian? I made A commitment. I got baptized, and somebody once gave me great insight. It was a pastor in San Diego. I used to go to their church before I was married. He said, evidence of the Holy Spirit is a changed life, is a changed heart. If you're wondering, am I a believer, are you moving in a positive direction toward the Lord and his character? That's a changed heart, where you're not lost in the fog and you're making steps toward Him. And that's a beautiful expression of that.

[Tim Bush]

Well, a cool backstory to that. And this is probably pretty cool because we didn't know this when we were writing the book, but when we did the videos for the book, Mel is in one of the videos, one of the QR code videos, and Mel was doing the video, and he said, tim, I want you to know that song was not even one of the charts we were going to do that night. And he said, in fact, we had people chanting, lighthouse, lighthouse, lighthouse. And he went back to the music director, Mark Levain, and said, hey, can you do this song, the Lighthouse? He goes, sure, because it was not planned. So that's the last song they did, and I'd never heard it before. So it's kind of interesting how God can work that way, too.

[Jim Daly]

Absolutely, he does. He's creating a tapestry in everybody's life. We don't know how that works and how he manages all that, but this is what he does. And a person who may not be perfect, nobody's perfect. We're all sinners, saved by grace. But somehow he steers us toward him, and it's a beautiful thing.

[Tim Bush]

I was never even attracted to worship music at all of any kind. I mean, my kind of music was definitely not worship music, Earthling of Fire, you know, big band music. And so I actually thought worship music was kind of weak. I love it now. But that's why that song. How could that song even be something that would grab me like it did? But the Lord just reached right in me, used it.

[Jim Daly]

You talk about stakes in the ground in your marriage. Describe stakes in the ground. What does it mean?

[Tim Bush]

Well, we did that later in the book after we had come to the Lord and started to do things different. We realized we needed to do some radically transformed things in our marriage, not just for us, but for next generation and people to see that there was a change. And so we had to make some what I would call non negotiables in our marriage. And we had to agree on it, too. And so we made eight stakes in the Ground. There's a Ninth one. Now, that's not in the book regarding the Sabbath. But we did these things realizing that we have to frame it up to where it's easy and people can make their own stakes or they can use ours, but no stakes in the ground for your marriage and your life. I don't know who you're modeling to, but that's not good. You got to have some kind of something going on.

[Jim Daly]

Kathy, let me ask you, because one of those stakes, I think, was about the boundaries you need to put in your life. We talked a bit about Tim's infidelity, but you were also in that same space and that became one of the stakes for you, correct?

[Kathy Bush]

Right, right. Boundaries are so important. And I think even if you haven't dealt with infidelity in your marriage, boundaries are important. God puts boundaries for us. You have to have healthy boundaries in your marriage. And for Tim and I, we don't meet with the opposite sex. We don't do coffee or lunches with the opposite sex alone. You know, our computers, our phones are completely open. We have, you know, the things that we did to each other. It's amazing to think about the power of God because the things that we went through and that we did to each other. When I think about the person I trust the most is Tim is my husband. And that's only because I agree with that.

[Tim Bush]

Me too.

[Kathy Bush]

Yeah. And that's only because of what Christ did in our marriage.

[Jim Daly]

Well, and there's more to the story. I mean, we haven't delved in. We're kind of giving it in pieces. And I want to continue next time, but that right there, I want to punch that a little bit because what we've seen with Hope Restored, which is a four day intensive that we do, probably the number one is issue that couples come into Hope Restored with is infidelity. It's certainly near the top. And in that context, if a couple can actually survive that and get to the root sources of all of that, they seem to have a beautifully transparent marriage. And trust that is built. It's almost as if it goes either way, it's either ruined by that or. Or it's incredibly deeper because you know one another kind of to the core and you still trust and love each other. That's what's so good for our listeners who feel stuck and alone in your marriage. Please let us be there for you. Don't be embarrassed. It happens and it happens often. So it's not going to be a surprise to us. Our Hope Restored program is built to help people in that circumstance, just like you may be in right now. Couples who participate in that intensive, that marriage intensive, have an 80% success rate of remaining married. Two years later, when we go back and assess everybody and how they're doing, we had one couple tell us this. We're forever changed and tremendously grateful for the tools given to us to change our stormy relationship and into a peaceful calm. What a gift God gave us here in a safe environment with counselors and staff that are totally walking in a close relationship with Christ. Miracles happen and what a testimony. If you have a desire to see your marriage transformed, I want to encourage you to check out our Hope Restored Marriage Intensive.

[John Fuller]

You'll find all about Hope Restored when you call us at 800, the letter A in the word family. That's 800-232-6459 or look for details in the show notes.

[Jim Daly]

And if you were inspired by the conversation today, you can read more about Tim and Kathy's radical marriage journey in their book Sex on the First Date. When you make a gift of any amount to the ministry, a Focus on the Family, we'll send you a copy as our way of saying thank you for supporting us. We are a nonprofit ministry, so your donations are what fund our programs like Hope Restored and so much more. So if you want to help more couples find healing and have a generational impact, just like Tim and Kathy, become a ministry partner today. Every dollar you give will go right back into saving marriages, protecting preborn children, helping parents navigate, raising Christ like children in the chaos of this culture.

[John Fuller]

Yeah, Donate today and get your copy of Tim and Kathy's book Sex on the First Date, a story of a broken beginning to a radically transformed, transformed marriage. When you call 800, the letter A in the word family again, 800-232-6459 or look for the link in the show notes. Thanks for joining us today. For Focus on the Family with Jim Daly, I'm John Fuller inviting you back as we continue the conversation with Tim and Kathy Bush and once again help you and your family thrive in Christ.

[Dave Stone]

Your church comes to you each week to fill their cup, but when the crowd leaves, who's filling yours? That's exactly what I'm here to do with my new podcast from Focus on the Family. It's called Pastor to Pastor with Dave Stone. I'm so excited to help you navigate the unique challenges that pastors face in their ministry journey, both personally and professionally. So I invite you to listen and subscribe to Pastor to Pastor wherever you get your podcasts.