Deuteronomy Part 1 • Dr. Camey Andersen • May 11-17 • Come, Follow Me

Summary

Podcast Summary

Podcast: followHIM
Episode: Deuteronomy Part 1 • Dr. Camey Andersen • May 11-17 • Come, Follow Me
Host(s): Hank Smith & John Bytheway
Guest: Dr. Camey (Cammie) Anderson, education expert and seminary/institute leader
Date: May 6, 2026

---

Overview

This episode explores the Book of Deuteronomy, focusing on the final sermons of Moses to the Israelites. The discussion centers on the principles of remembrance, teaching the next generation, the importance of scripture, and the relevance of Deuteronomy’s messages in today's world, especially as they relate to education, family, and humanitarian work. Dr. Cammie Anderson brings personal insights from her international education work, linking scriptural mandates to practical application in modern contexts.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Relevance and Power of Deuteronomy

• Jesus Quoted Deuteronomy: The hosts note that when Christ answered temptation, he quoted Deuteronomy—showing its core role in His scriptural canon.
  • “There are some real refrigerator magnet type great verses out of Deuteronomy. When Jesus was told to read the scriptures, where did he read?... He read Deuteronomy.” — John (02:00)
• Moses’ Final Mission: Deuteronomy contains Moses' preparation of Israel to enter the promised land—emphasizing not survival tactics or conquest, but loving and obeying God.
• Theme of Remembrance: Moses’ sermons urge the Israelites not to forget the Lord or His miracles—a spiritual principle (Hebrew “zakar,” to remember) appearing over 160 times in the Old Testament, most often in Deuteronomy.
  • “This book is about remembrance. The Hebrew word, zakar, appears more than 160 times... and most in Deuteronomy.” — Dr. Anderson (13:53)

2. The Shema and Loving God Wholeheartedly

• Recitation in Jewish Practice: The Shema (Deuteronomy 6:4-9) is highlighted as Israel’s daily prayer, reminding them to love God fully and teach His words and laws to their children—formulating a foundation for enduring faith.
  • “Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord: and thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.” — Deuteronomy 6, read by Hank (11:37)

3. Scripture as a Tool for Memory, Protection, and Teaching

• Repetition and Memorization: The discussion underscores how repeated exposure and internalization of scripture helps individuals withstand temptation and strengthens faith.
  • “Repetition is the law of learning. If you want to learn something, it must be repeated over and over... until it becomes part of you.” — Hank Smith (18:55)
• Scriptures as a Lifelong Anchor: They recount stories about well-loved, marked scriptures in their families, explaining how these texts surpass even professional textbooks in enduring value and impact.

4. Remembering God’s Hand and Recording His Miracles

• Personal and Family Journaling: The importance of documenting spiritual experiences is emphasized, referencing teachings from President Eyring and Elder Holland about keeping journals to recall God’s interventions and blessings.
  • “The reason for a journal is to document the hand of the Lord in your life... and hold fast to that.” — John (27:24)
• Examples from the Book of Mormon: Nephi’s remembrance of God’s blessings after Lehi’s death and Oliver Cowdery’s testimonies are cited as scriptural evidence of how remembering sustains faith even through darkness or loss.
  • “As [Nephi] writes about it, something sinks him… Nevertheless, I know in whom I have trusted... remembering turns it around.” — Hank (28:24)
• Practical Family Applications: Cammie shares how making gratitude lists or writing down miracles as a family builds spiritual memory and resilience.
  • “I still have this piece of paper... I love to go back and see it because they were very simple things... It’s not always the parting of the Red Sea. It’s not the miracle that maybe we would like to have happen, but it is a miracle nonetheless.” — Dr. Anderson (40:00)

5. Warnings About Forgetting—Prosperity & Pride

• The Prosperity Test: Moses warns Israelites against letting prosperity dull their need for God—a warning echoed by Brigham Young regarding wealth and spiritual forgetfulness.
  • “My greatest fear for them is that they cannot stand wealth. And yet they have to be tried with riches.” — Brigham Young, quoted by Hank (44:20)
  • “This people will stand mobbing, robbing, poverty and all manner of persecution and be true. But... they cannot stand wealth.” — Hank (44:20)

6. Teaching the Next Generation Diligently

• Normal and Natural Teaching: Rather than only formal instruction, parents are encouraged to teach gospel principles in daily, organic situations—exemplified through personal stories from President Monson’s family, golf outings, or fishing trips.
  • “Talk of [God’s laws] when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.” — Deuteronomy 6:7, discussed throughout (47:03)
  • “It wasn’t a formal ‘let’s have family home evening.’ It was a fishing trip... That’s what I get out of verse seven.” — Hank (50:37)
• Being a Repenting Example: Honest parenting—admitting mistakes, repenting, and demonstrating resilience—is often more impactful than being a perfect role model.
  • “I’ll never be a perfect example, but I can be a repenting example.” — John (51:10)

7. Moses' Non-Traditional Family as a Model

• Reassurance to Non-Traditional Families: Moses’ non-traditional upbringing is pointed out as encouragement to those who may not have ideal family backgrounds, with President Oaks’ vulnerable story cited for modern context.
  • “Many of us must do this [teach the gospel] when not all of our families are traditional... My father died when I was seven years old. So my... siblings and I were raised by a widowed mother in the most difficult of situations. She pressed on.” — President Oaks, quoted by Dr. Anderson (53:15)

8. Modern Relevance: Global Education and Service

• Education as a Religious Mandate: Dr. Anderson connects Moses’ charge to “teach them diligently” to modern education initiatives, especially those run by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (e.g., Succeed in School program).
  • “Education is a religious responsibility.” — President Nelson, quoted by Dr. Anderson (59:25)
• Church’s Humanitarian Efforts: Over $1.5 billion spent worldwide (2025), including more than a million meals served in West Africa as part of education programs—tying service, education, and faith together in fulfillment of Deuteronomy’s call to care for the stranger and the less fortunate.
  • “Truly incredible to think that we are part of a church that... generously contributes to the health, happiness, and education of others.” — Dr. Anderson (00:02, 59:25)
• Real-life Success Stories: Dr. Anderson shares experiences of African youth gaining education, spiritual growth, and hope for the future—supported by thousands of volunteer teachers and the broader generosity of the Church community.
  • “It is truly a miracle... helping these amazing youth to succeed in their lives and be who our Heavenly Father wants them to be.” — Dr. Anderson (64:22)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Enduring Power of Scripture:

  • “You can put your quad on the shelf. Some of those books are already thousands of years old and they're still true... We are reading Deuteronomy, getting inspiration and help and comfort from it. I don't get that from my marketing textbook.” — John (21:46)

• On Remembrance:

  • “Remember means you forgot. You can't remember unless you forgot. So that you will always forget and remember, forget and remember, forget and remember. Remembering has a lot to do with repent, being converted to daily repentance.” — Hank (26:18)

• On the Subtlety of Miracles:

  • “It's not always the parting of the Red Sea. It's not the miracle that maybe we would like to have happen, but it is a miracle nonetheless.” — Dr. Anderson (42:34)

• On Teaching in Normal & Natural Ways:

  • “He asked him to kneel right there in the boat and pray for his brother taking the bar exam. To me, that's what I get out of verse seven. When you sit in your house, when you walk, by the way, when you lie down, when you rise up, talk of them.” — Hank (50:37)

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

• [02:00] – Importance of Deuteronomy: Verses Jesus quoted; Deuteronomy as foundational scripture.
• [10:59] – Introduction to the Shema; Loving God and daily recommitment.
• [13:53] – The centrality of remembrance (“zakar”) in Deuteronomy.
• [18:55] – The necessity of repetition in learning and living gospel principles.
• [21:46] – The enduring and unique value of scripture vs. secular textbooks.
• [27:11] – Discussion on journaling and documenting personal spiritual miracles.
• [28:24] – Nephi’s example of remembering to overcome spiritual darkness.
• [40:00] – Dr. Anderson’s family gratitude/miracle lists as a tool for remembrance.
• [44:20] – The “prosperity test” and warnings against forgetting God in comfort.
• [47:03] – The Shema’s commandment to teach children “diligently.”
• [50:37] – President Monson’s “normal and natural” gospel teaching by example.
• [53:15] – President Oaks’ family story—a message for non-traditional family situations.
• [59:25] – Modern relevance: Church education programs and humanitarian efforts.
• [64:22] – Success stories from global education and volunteer efforts.

---

Conclusion

This episode offers a rich, personal, and practical exploration of Deuteronomy’s most important themes: remembrance, the power of scripture, teaching future generations, and care for those in need. Anchored in both scriptural context and modern application, listeners receive encouragement to record and remember spiritual experiences, to teach and serve with love and resilience, and to find new, deeper significance in the principles Moses gave to Israel—and that remain relevant for disciples today.

Transcript

[Hank Smith]

Coming up in this episode on Follow

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Hip, the church just released its caring report for 2025. More than $1.5 billion spent in humanitarian efforts around the world. Truly incredible to think that we are part of a church that not only does amazing things on Sunday, that helps us grow in our testimonies, but that so generously contributes to the health, happiness and education of others.

[Hank Smith]

Hello my friends. Welcome to another episode of Follow Him. My name is Hank Smith. I'm your host. I'm here with my co host, John, by the way, who teaches diligently. John, I know you're a teacher, but honestly, you teach diligently. How long have you been doing that?

[John]

I started teaching at BYU in 1996, taught in BYU Provo until 2005. I've been at the Salt Lake center since 2005. Up until now, a wonderful career.

[Hank Smith]

You teach diligently. John. That's From Deuteronomy, chapter 6, verse 7. Thou shalt teach them, your children diligently. John we are honored today to have someone we've never had on the show before. Her name is Dr. Kami Anderson. Cammie, if we can call you Cammie. Thank you for being here on Follow Him.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Thank you, Hank and John, I am so thrilled to be here. I have been a long time listener.

[Hank Smith]

We love Cami Anderson. We're excited to share with all of our listeners. John, Now Deuteronomy isn't something that I would think the average person just thinks about when I say Deuteronomy and you've studied the scriptures a long time, what do you think of, like what lesson comes to mind?

[John]

One of the first things I think of, Hank, is something you taught me which has always been right there. But it's that when Satan tried to tempt the Savior, he always gave a scripture for an answer. And they're all out of Deuteronomy. There are some real refrigerator magnet type great verses out of Deuteronomy. When Jesus was told read your scriptures, where did he read? Well, he read the Old Testament, right? He read Deuteronomy.

[Hank Smith]

These are the scriptures Jesus read. Cammy, what do you want to do today as you've been preparing, what do you hope we walk away with?

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

I have so excited to talk about some of these great principles that are in Deuteronomy. It may not be the first book of the Old Testament or of the scriptures that comes to mind when we think what scripture could I go to for guidance, for help, for instruction? Yet there's such great counsel to us, support to us. We're of course coming to the end of the life of the great prophet Moses. How can we finish his journey? He is coming after an incredible life that he's had to share his thoughts with the Israelites as they move into their next phase of life. We know that Moses will not be going with them. He's there. You can imagine him up on the top of the mountain, looking down, thinking, I am finishing my time as a prophet. What will I say to them? Talking about the Ten Commandments again, But not just the commandments, but how they would remember them and the importance of remembering in their lives that they don't forget the Lord and the things that he's taught them and the miracles that he's done in their lives. Also he talks about watching out for the stranger, being able to be aware of those who are maybe not exactly like us, but who need our love and concern. We see that in Deuteronomy 15. Very important, very relevant to today. In the end, I think a strong encouragement for all of us. Be strong and have a good courage. We remember that was the youth theme just a few years ago. To have that strong conviction, that strong testimony that no matter what, that we can keep that commitment to our Savior, to his gospel, and to helping our family, friends, those around us move forward on the covenant path. Deuteronomy 30, verse 19. It says, Therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live, no matter what happens around you, no matter what difficulties you face. And Israelites had faced a lot of difficulties and they have difficulties to come, but they choose life through our Savior, Jesus Christ. That I hope will be the focus of our discussion today.

[Hank Smith]

Kami, I am already excited to walk through this with you. John, when someone is excited about a topic that is contagious, right, it gets exciting. All of a sudden I'm thinking, I can do this. Oftentimes when we think of Moses, we probably think of the stories of Moses, not necessarily the teachings of Moses. This is where we get his sermons, his words. Now, before we go any further, John, there may be a couple of people out there who don't know Cammy as well as we do. I'm guessing there's some. What do we know about Cammie? What do we know about her background? Tell me who this is.

[John]

When I read Kami's bio, I thought of that verse in 3rd Nephi, 3rd Nephi 6, where it says the people began to be divided by ranks according to their riches and their chances for learning. She is all about giving people chances for learning, which is a wonderful Mission. She works for education for youth in countries around the world as a senior manager for strategy and research in Africa west and Utah in the Succeed in School program in seminaries and institutes. We had been talking before we started a lot about Africa, which she was very excited about. She is an adjunct professor at Brigham Young University in both the Marriott School of Business and in Religious Education. And she teaches at the BYU Salt Lake center where I teach. She's a single mother of four children. She returned to school, earned her Ph.D. in instructional psychology and technology. Cami, I have to tell you, long time ago, when I was in my 20s, I went to a youth conference in Florida. After the youth conference, they took us over to meet your parents who were so kind to us that day. This was long before the church got to know Elder Neil Anderson. I don't remember even if he was the stake president or an area authority or something, but they were so kind and so nice. I'll never forget their hospitality to us in Florida back in the 90s, or maybe it was the 80s.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

I will make sure and pass that on to them. I'm sure it was just a highlight to get John by the Way to Florida, where not very many people ventured back in the days. I have to say this is a full circle moment for me as I was a younger mother walking through the halls of my house with younger children at night, I would hear the voices of Hank Smith and John, by the way, coming from their CD players at night where they, especially if someone came to town and brought them a new one, they would rush to bed early, which was always a blessing. As a mother, I'm very grateful too for your great influence on my children who you've never even met. Although some have now had the chance to be in Dr. Hanksmith's religion classes and have been very positively influenced that way. It's really a testimony to the fact of the power of words and to influence because your testimonies even back then influenced my young sons to help live the gospel in a place where there were not a lot of members. That's part of the message of Deuteronomy I'm remembering with Moses and the Israelites today.

[Hank Smith]

That was incredibly touching.

[John]

Thank you. Yeah, I knew Moses. Hank didn't know Moses, but I knew Moses.

[Hank Smith]

That means a lot to me. It really does. To hear that you would trust us with helping your children. Let's jump in, let's discover Deuteronomy. Speaking of remembering, the lesson this week is called Beware lest thou forget the Lord. The manual starts this way, Moses earthly ministry began on a mountain where God spoke to him from a burning bush. It also ended on a mountain more than 40 years later when God gave him a glimpse of the promised Land from the top of Mount Nebo. Moses had spent his life preparing the children of Israel to enter that promised land. And the book of Deuteronomy records his final instructions, reminders, exhortations, and pleadings with the Israelites. Reading his words makes it clear that the real object of Moses ministry, the preparation the people needed, wasn't about wilderness survival, conquering enemies, or building a nation. It was about learning to love God, obey him, and remain loyal to him. That's the preparation we all need to enter the promised land of eternal life. So although Moses never set foot in the land flowing with milk and honey, because of his faith and faithfulness, he did enter the promised land that God has prepared for all those who follow him. What a beautiful way to start this lesson with that. Cammie, we are ready to learn from you. Walk us through what you want us to see in.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

In Deuteronomy, there's so much that we could talk about. One is that there's an important prayer in Judaism. It's called the Shema, and it's the declaration of faith. If you went to Jerusalem today, it would be recited at least twice, once in the morning and once in the evening. It helps the Jewish people recommit to God and to their faith. Hank, would you mind to read a continuation of this prayer?

[Hank Smith]

You got it. This is Deuteronomy 6, 4, 9. Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God is one Lord, and thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart and with all thy soul and with all thy might. And these words which I command thee this day shall be in the thine heart. And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up, thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes, and thou shalt write them upon the posts of thy house and on thy gates.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Beautiful. Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, with all thy soul, and with all thy might. Even when I hear you read that, I just think about my own testimony of the Savior and how critical that is to me that I keep the Savior forefront in my life. I love that they're reciting that every day. What are some of your thoughts as you read this very important first commandment

[Hank Smith]

just last week with Dr. Dave Thompson, he said the exact same thing. Israel struggled when they weren't looking at the Lord, when they looked at what they didn't have or what they left in Egypt. And he said that's when they struggled. Yes, difficult things happen, but. But my focus keeps those things in my periphery. They don't become the center of my world.

[John]

Well put. You mentioned a youth theme before. We've had the theme of look unto me in every thought. Doubt not, fear not. We did that one from the Doctrine and Covenants. We did. Section 19. Learn of me, listen to my words, Walk in the meekness of my spirit. Hank, we've said this multiple times. President Nelson's famous statement that the joy we feel has less to do with the circumstances of our lives and everything to do with the focus of our lives. That's just another reminder, different way of saying it. But here's Moses teaching the same thing

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

and not always easy to remember. This book is about remembrance. This Hebrew word, zakar, which it appears more than 160 times in the Old Testament and the most in Deuteronomy that's remembered. Our first example is, of course, the Savior himself. When he was on the earth, what did he quote?

[Hank Smith]

Deuteronomy.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

People may not necessarily connect the New Testament to Deuteronomy, but I think that that should give us something to think about.

[John]

Way back when we began the Old Testament, Joshua Sears, I think, is the one who just made me think. Tell Me the Stories of Jesus is the song we used to sing, but now it's telling me the stories of Jehovah and Jesus because they're the same being. When Jesus was quoting Deuteronomy, sometimes he was quoting words he gave to Moses himself, who. Which is kind of, whoa, that's a very reliable person to quote.

[Hank Smith]

Cammie, you mentioned those. I call them those silly talks I used to do. But one that became very important to me was one called Five Temptation Killers. Kind of an odd title. I noticed that the Savior basically wiped out temptation by quoting scripture. I wanted my children and those listening to that funny little talk to pick out temptation killing scriptures, things that they can have ready to go. It could be short, but I don't think Jesus said, hold on, Satan, let me look this up. I think he had it right in his mind. Ready to go. John, I love what you said earlier, which was, this is the scriptures Jesus read. But sometimes we think, oh, Deuteronomy Come on. I can skip this. Jesus would say, I memorized it.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

I love that, Hank. That is such a great insight. He's quoting these scriptures. John, could you read Matthew 22:36 through 38? We don't want to hold people in suspense saying, what scripture is it?

[John]

Okay, here's Matthew 22, starting in verse 36, Master, which is the great commandment in the law. Jesus said unto him, thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart and with all thy soul and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

It would benefit all of us if we haven't to have a few scriptures, hopefully. Maybe for this week, you have one from Deuteronomy that you find that's special to you, but that you have those scriptures that when you face moments of temptation, when you face moments of challenge, that those scriptures will come to your mind, especially if they have to do with our savior, Jesus Christ. They are so powerful to help reframe your thinking, reframe your perspective, and help you focus on what is truly most important to you. Have you found that to be the case for you?

[Hank Smith]

Absolutely. And they become. What did Elder Scott say once they become a friend who can help you in time of need, give you some advice.

[John]

And in Lehi's dream, it's something to hold onto. It's the word of God. Things are shaky. What do I hold on to? Boom. Hold on to that iron rod so powerful.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

I hope that everyone will be thinking of one. Maybe they'll pick one up. From our discussion today, we see that Moses get re reshares with the Israelites the ten commandments, and then he talks about how they can use them in their lives to continue to be faithful, happy, successful, even when he is no longer with them. He's having the Israelites remember. That's is a key theme in Deuteronomy. The name Deuteronomy is from the Greek name, which means second law. We're getting that reinforcement. Any of us who have ever taught anything, which is most of us in the church, we're all teachers. It's not enough to just teach one time. Have you found that in your classes? Like, is one time enough to teach one of those hard principles?

[Hank Smith]

Oh, goodness. I frequently ask my students, hey, how many of you played sports? No, raise their hand. How many of you ran the same play in practice? Oh, hundreds of times. Oh, who's who here was a dancer. How many times did you do that dance before performing it? Repetition is the law of learning. It is a law of learning. If you want to learn something, it must be repeated over and over and over until it becomes basically part of you.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

I was an English major my first time at byu. Love being an English major and love my English books, love my novels. And there are a lot of them that sit beautifully on the shelf as opposed to my scriptures which are used so often. I love this social media media post. I think elder Matthew Holland showed it in his talk at BYU recently after his father, President Jeffrey R. Holland's passing showed a picture of the many different copies of the Scriptures that had been shared between his parents. You're shaking your head like you know what I'm talking about, John.

[John]

Oh, I just remember he had so many different sets of scriptures that probably had been marked differently for different times. That just shows you what a part of his life it was.

[Hank Smith]

Yeah, I think the kids were saying, hey, I want one of these. How many are there? And they put them on the bed. Yeah, you can have 10 each.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

It was beautiful to see. It was a beautiful testament of President and Sister Holland's love for the Scriptures.

[Hank Smith]

John, you feel that way about your dad's scriptures. I know that.

[John]

Yeah, I used them and it made me laugh because when we looked at Deuteronomy 6, 7, when thou takas by the way, guess what he had underlined. He underlined, by the way. My undergraduate degree was marketing and it was like pre Internet. But I kept some of the textbooks because I thought, hey, I might need this someday. Yeah, I remember buying a biology textbook for about a hundred dollars and then trying to sell it back. And they said, oh, we're not using that one anymore. It's obsolete. And I thought about how the answers aren't true anymore or the science has evolved or changed. You can put your quad on the shelf. Some of those books are already thousands of years old and they're still true. Here we are reading Deuteronomy, getting inspiration and help and comfort from it. I don't get that from my marketing textbook. I mean, it's pretty amazing.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

We may all be at different places in our testimony, but we can use these wonderful words that have stood the test of time to help us gain that solid foundation of a testimony that will keep us moving through this life, moving through the wilderness, like the people of Moses. If we look in Deuteronomy 5, we see Moses sharing the commandments again. He's reviewing the Commandments, the covenant with his people that the Lord has made. You remember, the original 10 Commandments are back in Exodus. That was maybe new news for them at that time, but now they've had the commandments. Moses is reminding them of the importance of staying true to these covenants that they have made. We can think about also different covenants that we make, not only just the basic commandments, but also our temple covenants that help us really stay close to our heavenly Father and our Savior. Now it's also interesting that there's slightly different words in these. We won't read all of them just for time, but John, would you mind to read this for us? Deuteronomy 5, verses 12 through 14.

[John]

Deuteronomy 5, starting in verse 12. Keep the Sabbath day to sanctify it, as the Lord thy God hath commanded thee. Six days, thou shalt labor and do all thy work. But the seventh day is the Sabbath day of the Lord thy God. In it thou shalt not do any work thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, nor thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thine ox, nor thine ass, nor any of thy cattle, nor nor thy stranger that is within thy gates. That thy manservant and thy maidservant may rest as well as thou. And remember that thou wast a servant in the land of Egypt, and that the Lord thy God brought thee out thence through a mighty hand and by a stretched out arm. Therefore the Lord thy God commanded thee to keep the Sabbath day.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Thank you. He's asking them to remember not just the commandment, but but also remember the blessings. Remember the miracles. Remember what the Lord has done for you in connection with these commandments that you've been keeping.

[John]

I was thinking about how interesting that in the middle of a commandment is. Hey, I want you to remember an event. Remember this event and how I'm thinking Nephi did. Nephi talked about Moses all the time in the Book of Mormon. And hey, let's be like Moses.

[Hank Smith]

He says, you're going to not have your servants or your employees work. Do you remember being a servant in the land of Egypt? Do you remember no one giving you rest? You're not going to do that to others. Please remember what it was like to be in that position. I like that idea.

[John]

And Hank, that reminds me of a previous chapter where they were told to some hospitality rules about strangers. And then he says, remember you are a stranger in the land of Egypt.

[Hank Smith]

Right? You know how that feels.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

What is it about remembering that is such a powerful spiritual Principle for us that Moses, as he's thinking about the end of his life, as he's thinking about what can he do to strengthen his people, not just give them the commandments, but help them remember how the Lord had blessed them and how he had brought miracles into their lives. Why is that so important for us in our own day? As we're thinking about commandments, we're asked to keep covenants that make a difference in our lives.

[Hank Smith]

Absolutely. This is the crucial question. John has taught me this over the years. The sacrament that they will always remember him. Which is interesting because remember means you forgot. You can't remember unless you forgot. So that you will always forget and remember, forget and remember, forget and remember. Remembering has a lot to do with repent, being converted to daily repentance. So as I remember, I repent. I think they are tied together. Does faith have a short shelf life? I have found that experiences. I think I'll never forget that unless I write them down. I would forget them. I try to write them down to make them not so I never forget, but so that I can remember.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

So important writing it down and then going back to review it over time, especially when we face challenges that we remember what the Lord has done for us.

[John]

I was really blessed by President Henry B. Eyring's thought that a journal isn't just for our trips and our trophies, because I thought that's what it was for. I did this and I won this and I went here, and here's a picture of me here. He said the. I'm paraphrasing, of course, but the reason for a journal is to document the hand of the Lord in your life so that you'll remember, oh, he has been involved in my life. He does care about me and will continue to care about me. Elder Holland gave a talk called Lord, I Believe where he said, hold fast to what you already know when you're having doubts or problems. I thought you got to write it down to be able to hold fast. Make a list of President Eyring's journal. Make a list of how God has been involved in your life and hold fast to that. Don't forget it. And that's what a journal can do.

[Hank Smith]

Many people love 2nd Nephi 4. Nephi is writing about his father's death. It's been decades since this happened. As he writes about it, something sinks him. He's O wretched man that I am. I am encompassed about by temptation and sin. My heart groans because of my sins. Nevertheless, this is the low point right in verse 19. Nevertheless, I know in whom I have trusted. And the rest of this psalm is him remembering what God has done for him. By the end, he has completely changed. He is no longer in this dark place. He's come out of it. He's giving himself a pep talk. By the end, oh Lord, I have trusted in Thee. I will trust in Thee forever. So remembering for Nephi pulled him out of darkness, pulled him out of almost a depression, sadness. John, what would you call it? He's in a dark places. He's writing. And remembering turns it around.

[John]

I would love to be as wretched as Nephi.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

It's hard to say that word tied to him.

[John]

Yeah, but Hank, you mentioned my dad's scriptures. I'm looking right at it where Nephi remembers the hand of the Lord in his life and says, he hath preserved me upon the waters of the great deep. And my dad's written me exclamation point because he survived World War II on an aircraft carrier.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Oh, wow. Amazing. It's one of the reasons also that we want to record at least some of these stories that we can share with our family. I know now it's so easily accessible on FamilySearch that anyone, members of the church, friends of the church, you can write your different stories, put a photo if you want, and just put it on Family Church. And it's there forever and it's free. What a blessing to have that not just here and now, but when we may not always be here in person, that our families can still look back and have those, especially those really meaningful experiences. Maybe we start with five key spiritual experiences or miracles that have been meaningful in our lives. Even if we are a new member of the church, even if we're not a member of the church. I think everyone could think of five ways that they have seen God's hand in their life and write those down, then put them on Family Search. Even better. I had a friend who very suddenly passed away and he didn't have children, he wasn't married. He was a wonderful person and he had a great testimony. It had been recorded on some videos and other media. It was there. And I wanted to make sure that that testimony was kept for other members of his extended family or his friends to be able to see, not have to go searching through the Internet to try to find it. I was so glad to be able to go to FamilySearch, put that on his family search site so that when his family members in the future or friends of his come to think of him, they can remember his wonderful testimony of our Savior Jesus Christ. Another thing that I might add about remembering that I think we really learn from Moses again. He has seen so much. You think of all the experiences that he's had. Wouldn't it be great to have Moses's journal? That'd be an amazing bestseller, I think. Moses's journal. I was thinking about a story and we just finished reading the Doctrine Covenants not too long ago. If you look in your paper copy of the Doctrine Covenants Pearl Greg Prize Triple Combination Scriptures. It's only under like a footnote in Joseph Smith history. But it's the testimony of Oliver Cowdery about receiving the Aaronic priesthood. His experience. I just want to read this in context of remembering and then we'll go back to Moses. He says, I shall not attempt to paint to you the feelings of this heart, nor the majestic beauty and glory which surrounded us on this occasion. Nor has this earth power to give the joy, to bestow the peace or comprehend the wisdom which was contained in each sentence as they were delivered by the power of the Holy Spirit. Man may deceive his fellow man. Deception may follow deception. And the children of the wicked one may have power to seduce the foolish and untaught. But one touch with the finger of his love, yea, one ray of glory from the upper world or one word from the mouth of the Savior from the bosom of eternity strikes it all into insignificance and blots it forever from the mind. That's Joseph Smith History 171. Note such a powerful testimony. We know what happened in the life of Oliver Cowdery. Even though he had had incredible spiritual experiences, some of the most amazing recorded, he never denied the truth of the Book Mormon, but he found himself out of the Church until later in his life. And then when he came back in soon afterwards, he died. I think often of this amazing testimony and of the many other incredible experiences he had. What did he say? It was never to be forgotten. Days never to be forgotten. But he did forget. While it would be wonderful to have those heavenly manifestations that Oliver Cowdery had in the early days of the Church, we don't need those to have a testimony. But it wasn't enough for him to keep his testimony strong during his lifetime. What's important to remember about that is when we think about Moses and the Israelites and helping them and seeing them looking to what he could leave them as a prophet with his last testimony, he's thinking, I want them to remember what matters most. I want them to Remember the miracles of the parting of the Red Sea. Many of them wouldn't have been there. They certainly would have known that that happened. They wouldn't have known the challenges that were faced yet if they didn't remember it. It might be hard to keep that focus on the Savior. What does Moses do in his final words to his people? He asked them to remember. It's just a really powerful lesson to us, even looking at others throughout the Scriptures, that we make sure in our own lives we do not forget. Heavenly Father has given us those experiences, all of us. We don't forget the power of God's love to show us that he loves us and that his gospel is the true gospel and that we can have the strength, the courage to follow it.

[John]

To me, that was just another way to say, keep your eyes on the Savior.

[Hank Smith]

We have this false notion that really big, wonderful experiences are going to stick around forever. I remember thinking when I was younger, my young men's leaders would say, feeling the Holy Ghost is better than seeing an angel. And in my young head, I thought, no way. No way. If I saw an angel, I promise you, that would definitely have more impact than feeling the Holy Ghost. I'm going to channel a thought from Joseph F. Smith. The Holy Ghost weaves the truth through the fibers and sinews of the body where it cannot be forgotten. I think that comes from writing it down.

[John]

And thank you for the reminder, Cammie, because I've had times where my wife will elbow me and say, hey, tell that story. And I'm like, what story? The story you told in this. Talk about this. And I'm like, I totally forgot that

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

you think of how could you have two more focused, righteous people than Hank and John? And if they're having a hard time remembering, I think to write things down, I think that should give everyone, myself, encouragement that I can write it as well.

[Hank Smith]

It's kind of intimidating to think I'm going to write this whole story down. That's not what I do. That's not what I do. I have a note on my phone in which I just need a couple of sentences. Maybe one day I need to write them all the way down. But if you're thinking, I don't have time to sit down and write out every detail. I don't think that's the expectation.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Some people love to write in their journal, their physical journal. As a teenager, I loved it. I love to write in my journal. Every day of our mission in France, I went with my parents as I served as mission leaders in France and I made it a point to write every single day. I sometimes would make up on our car trips across brands. But I have an entry for every day of our mission. It's interesting to go back and read. I really miss some of the important things. Why didn't I write more about now President Oaks coming to our mission or then Elder Packer coming to our mission? They came. I wrote some things, I had notes. But I was 15. What do you write when you're 15? I still had some important things that I think might be of interest to my six grandchildren in the future. They might be interested to know when they hit 15, how I had the chance to have that very unexpected interaction with those amazing apostles of Jesus Christ and their wonderful wives at that time. That was wonderful. Even if I just got a few sentences. And maybe we are attending general conference and we have the chance to sustain present Oaks as our new prophet. We take a minute to write down the what that experience means for us. I remember last time with President Nelson, President Ballard asked us all to do that. To take a few minutes and write about that. When President Nelson was sustained as the prophet, we'll have that opportunity. When I read Deuteronomy, you think of Moses reminding his people of the miracles. Deuteronomy 5:15. Remember that thou was a servant in the land of Egypt. We think of him saying over and over asking his people to remember. I remember one family home evening that we had in my family, the family I grew up in, growing up where my mother had us sit around and ask us, okay, we're going to make a list of all the miracles we've seen in our family. I'm thinking now that maybe we children were not showing as much gratitude or for our lives or maybe we needed to be more grateful or think more about what mattered most. I still have this piece of paper. I'll just hand wrote it back then. I love to go back and see it because they were very simple things. It was someone doing well on an exam at school or someone for me at that time, if we were in France, we had some amazing miracles as our family started reading the Book of Mormon every day. There were some miracles of safety where someone was protected. Maybe looking back, we'd forgotten about what happened. As I remembered, oh, I got some help in this big thing that I was doing at school and okay, now a couple years down the road it's not a big deal to me but at the time it was. Even looking back, I don't think I even remembered most of those Things that were on that list at this point. All these years later, if I went and did the same thing with my own children, what a powerful legacy to remember one line. It's not always the parting of the Red Sea. It's not the miracle that maybe we would like to have happen, but it is a miracle nonetheless. I know I've seen that in my life, that there were a lot of miracles that I prayed for that I did not receive that miracle that I wanted. But looking back, the blessings from Heavenly Father have been amazing and. And I'm so grateful for them. Remember that experience where I heard the prophet and I knew that what he was saying was true. I really had a testimony of that. But maybe you're struggling now and you're not feeling it and you need to go back to that time and think, I did have that testimony and what do I need to do to get back there? Or I did make a difference as a missionary. If we think back to those times, we remember the great message of Moses that he wanted his people not to forget. It's the same for us all these centuries later.

[Hank Smith]

That's beautiful. I noticed in the next chapter, he's also worried about them getting wealthy and forgetting after the Shema, he says, verse 10. When the Lord brings you into this land of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob to give thee great and goodly cities, houses full of good things, well digged wells, vineyards and olive trees, beware lest thou forget the Lord which brought thee forth out of the land of Egypt from the house of bondage. This reminds me of this great Brigham Young quote. The worst fear that I have about members of this church is that they will get rich in this country, forget God and his people, wax fat and kick themselves out of the church and go to hell. This people will stand mobbing, robbing poverty and all manner of persecution and be true. But my greatest fear for them is that they cannot stand wealth. And yet they have to be tried with riches. Tried with riches.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Probably a lot of people want to be tried with riches. I mean, they feel like if they're getting a trial, like, try me with riches.

[Hank Smith]

Yeah, give me this. Give me this trial. I mean, Moses was concerned too. You're going to get into the promised Land. Things are going to go really well, and you'll forget the Lord which brought you out of the land of Egypt.

[John]

Tevye in Fiddler on the Roof, his son in law says, riches are God's curse. And Tevye looks up and says, may God smite me with it and may I Never recover and then sings if I were a rich man or something. But isn't that the story of the Nephites? They prosper, and then they set their hearts on their riches instead of keeping their hearts on Christ. And then they have to be reminded through a war or a famine or whatever until they get humbled and build their foundation on Christ again.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Yeah, really good counsel to us as we're thinking about these commandments, keeping us focused on the Savior. I would love to have your thoughts about what he says about teaching children. In Deuteronomy 4. He says, I must die in this land. I must not go over Jordan. But ye shall go over and possess that good land. And again, take heed unto yourselves, lest ye forget the covenant of the Lord your God, which he made with you. John, can you read for us? Deuteronomy, verse 6 and 7.

[John]

This is part of the Shema. Deuteronomy 6, 6. And these words which I command thee this day shall be in thine heart. And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children. And thou shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Thank you, Hank. Do you want to read verses 8, 9, and let's go ahead and read 10 as well.

[Hank Smith]

Okay. And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes. And thou shalt write them upon the posts of thy house and on thy gates. And it shall be when the Lord thy God shall have brought them into the land which he swear unto the fathers, to Abraham, to Isaac, to Jacob, to give thee great and goodly cities which thou buildest not.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Then he goes on to talk about remembering the good things that they've had. Then he says again in verse 12, then beware, lest thou forget the Lord which brought thee out of the land of Egypt. How do you teach your children the gospel when maybe like Moses, that may not be the perspective that you grew up in? Moses was put into the basket, went taken by Pharaoh's daughter, raised in the palace. What does that tell us about teaching our own families, especially if we're facing challenges and maybe we don't know where to start.

[Hank Smith]

John brought this up just a little bit earlier, which was he said, when you talk of them, when you sit in thine house and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down and when you rise up, John, what did you call it? Normal and natural ways. I think that's an Elder Bednar phrase, President Uchtdorf. Yeah, yeah. I really like hearing of those type of stories from children. I actually brought this today. This is Clark Monson, President Monson's son. Now, you might think, oh, I bet President Monson had family home evening and family scripture study. I bet that they had some formal gospel teaching, which they probably did. This is what Clark remembers. This is when someone interviewed Clark and asked him what it was like to grow up with President Monson. Clark was deeply touched on a typically marvelous Monson fishing experience. His father asked him to reel in his line for a moment. When the lines were in and the rods were set aside in the boat, brother Monson said, clark, in about five minutes, your brother Tom will be sitting down to take the bar exam admitting him to the practice of law. He has worked hard for three years of law school for this, and he will be very nervous. Let's just kneel here in the boat. I'll offer a prayer for him, and then you offer one. It wasn't a formal let's have family home evening. It was a fishing trip. To me, that's what I get out of verse seven. When you sit in your house, when you walk, by the way, when you lie down, when you rise up, talk of them.

[John]

I would love to be a perfect example, but I'm not. I'm an imperfect example. And that means that I need to show my children I have to repent. Sometimes I need to apologize to them, to let them know I'm trying to stay on that path and help them see that they'll probably make mistakes, too. But you try to stay on that path. I'll never be a perfect example, but I can be a repenting example.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

I guess I love that when they go and have their own families like President Monson, they. They remember that maybe more than the big events, vacations, and other times that we think as parents are so important. But it's those small times that are often so meaningful.

[Hank Smith]

I have another fishing example. I was up at Aspen Grove fishing with my son Mason. We were really trying to catch fish. You could even see them. It was the easiest fishing you could do. And we're trying to catch fish. These fish are like, no way. We know what you're trying to do. We would disguise the hook, and we would try different bait, and then we would throw the bait in without a hook. They'd come, eat it. Then we'd try it again, and nothing. And we were sitting there talking. I said, mason, we're kind of like the adversary. We're kind of like Satan. Here we are trying to disguise this hook. They can see right through it. And he said, yeah, I. And I said, how are ways that Satan tries to disguise the hooks? So we talked about that for a little while and we had a really good moment. And then I thought, wow, I'm a pretty good parent. And then Mason went right over and hit his brother. All right, Good feeling gone.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Well, I think you should still congratulate yourself. I think it's a great. Probably in the end, that's what they remember. The fish aid.

[John]

Yeah.

[Hank Smith]

My dad was a golfer. He would talk about why people who design golf courses where they put sand traps, they put them right where they think you're going to try to cut a corner. He'd say, don't you think Satan's like that a little bit? I'm going to put a trap right here where they're going to try to take advantage of the situation. That's what I think of Cammie. When the Lord says, teach them diligently, Teach them diligently and talk of them when you sit in thine house.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Those are such great examples, both of those. I think it's so easy to be as a parent, discouraged. And I think we've talked about maybe some of the temptations that the adversary gives us. One of those is discouragement. It gets very easy to get discouraged as a parent. I'm not doing enough. I'm not a good enough gospel teacher. I don't have the background that others have. I'm a new member. I didn't grow up with parents that taught me, how can I teach my own children to have that faith in Jesus Christ that I want them to have? How can I teach them to love the teachings of the prophets and be faithful in the Gospel to want to love the temple and be in the temple as much as they can? How can I teach them that when I don't have that experience in my own life? I was so touched by the vulnerability, by the honesty of President Oaks in October General Conference when he talked about some of the personal difficulties he had faced as a young man and his family. And it just reminded me of some of the similar feelings that Moses may have felt in his own difficulties as a youth, not having the family situation that his peers would have had. President Oaks said to us, start off with exactly. We'd expect from the soon to be ordained prophet. This is a family church. Aren't we so grateful for prophet that in today's world reminds us this is a family church. This is in his talk, the family centered Gospel of Jesus Christ. He says, as parental influences diminish, Latter Day Saints will still have a God given responsibility to teach their children to prepare for our family destiny in eternity. Many of us must do this when not all of our families are traditional. Divorce, death and separation realities. I experienced that in the family in which I was raised. Again, this is President Oak speaking. My father died when I was seven years old. So my younger brother and sister and I were raised by a widowed mother in the most difficult of situations. She pressed on. She was alone and broken, but with the Lord's help. Her powerful teaching of the doctrine of the restored Church guided us how she prayed for heavenly assistance in raising her children. And she was blessed. I know many other families are not so happy, but every single mother or I would say father can teach of the love of a heavenly father and the eventual blessings of a temple marriage. You too can do this. Heavenly Father's plan assures this possibility responsibility for everyone. And then he tells such a personally tender story. He said our doctrine and our belief in eternal families strengthen and bond us. I will never forget the promise of my maternal grandfather Harris. When we children were living on his farm near Payson, Utah, he gave me the tragic news that my father had died in faraway Denver, Colorado. I ran into the bedroom and knelt beside the bed crying my heart out. Grandpa followed me and went to his knees beside me and said, I will be your father. That tender promise is a powerful example of what grandparents can do to fill in the gaps when families lose or missing a member. Then he talks about the blessings that we have as families, even if, as he explained, it may not be exactly the traditional family. This is what we see from Moses sharing his insights with the Israelites that he didn't come from a traditional family anything but. And yet he, through his faithfulness, through his commitment to the Lord, even in difficult times, he was willing to see that God helped a plan for him. He somehow saw his identity even in that time in the palace, with other things going on around him, he was able to see his identity and move ahead. And as time went on, he became who our Savior wanted him to be. What an example we have today. Because he did, he's willing to then encourage others who also may not face completely ideal family situations in their own teaching of their children. That I see him saying. He doesn't exactly say it this way in the scriptures, but I see him saying, when he says that you can do it, remember the miracles you can do it. Heavenly Father and the Savior will help you.

[Hank Smith]

Cammie, you have an expertise here that I would like to tap into. Right here we're talking about teaching diligently. There are people all across the world who don't have the opportunity to get an education like this is talking about. I think Moses is saying teach them diligently, like not just about God, but about everything. God encompasses everything. You know all about teaching across the world. Could you share with our listeners some of your experiences? I know you're excited about what's happening on some other continents in the world, so could you tell us a little bit about that?

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

Well, I'm excited about what's happening across the world, especially through some of the amazing humanitarian efforts of the Church. We'll tie this all into our great verses here in Deuteronomy, especially Deuteronomy 15 will remember the great quote by our prophet, President Nelson. Education is religious responsibility. Now we have President Oaks who talks about education is a gift from God to then go and be able to serve other people. And our prophets have encouraged us to find the blessings of education that allow us not only to contribute here, but contribute in the future and use those talents that our Heavenly Father has given us. I have the opportunity to work for the succeeding school program for the Church. It's a program for youth ages 11 to 18 that helps them improve their reading, writing, math, studying life skills and other skills that help them not only in academics, but also build their faith with seminary and self reliance so that they can go on to higher education, including byu, Pathway Worldwide and other higher education opportunities to really stay committed to the covenant path and attend the temple, serve missions as they choose, and then come back and serve in the church in remarkable ways. This is what we're seeing around the world as many parents who want to teach their children the value of education that our Savior, our Heavenly Father want us to have those opportunities to learn and become more like them through learning. Not just spiritual learning also, but learning that we can have here on earth and different subjects that especially reading. We want to read the Scriptures through this amazing program. Succeed in school. Many youth who have not had the opportunity to have education are able to come after school after their regular classes and improve their opportunities for success in passing tests and moving forward in seminary and faith and in life. And it is truly a miracle. Maybe we turn for a minute to Deuteronomy 15 which talks about this issue of looking at those who are, quote, strangers. No one is a stranger to God. God knows all of us. But who might be a stranger. I point out the Church just released its current report for 2025, more than $1.5 billion spent in humanitarian efforts around the world. Truly incredible to think that we are part of a church that not only does amazing things on Sunday, that helps us grow in our testimonies, but that so generously contributes to the health, happiness and education of others. I was so touched by this quote from the First Presidency that is in the front page of the report. It says, members of the Church Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, we seek to follow him by ministering to the sick, feeding the hungry and comforting the afflicted. Ours is a ministry of great joy to all of God's children. Truly, that is what I see. I returned last week from an amazing trip with my wonderful succeeding school Seminary Institute colleagues and students and amazing young single adults and youth in West Africa. That is what I see. They are given more opportunities than they have ever had to embrace education, the ability to become what they see our Heavenly Father wants them to become. They are finding amazing joy and happiness and seeing potential in themselves, confidence that they never thought they had. All of a sudden they see for themselves. They see a future where they're able to be who Heavenly Father wants them to be. And it is inspiring.

[Hank Smith]

Where have you met some of these students?

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

In my specific area that I work in is various countries in the West Africa area of the Church. Our program succeed in school is in about 30 countries around the world, more than 40,000 students growing. But we also have students here in the United States, Utah in the Southwest in Native American reservation. They're all possibilities for students who are looking to improve their education in West Africa. They're able to have two healthy meals twice a week as they come and attend Raiden writing and math classes. It's been such a blessing to see more than a million meals served last year in 2025 to our more than 25,000 students there in West Africa when you're hungry it's hard to learn. But they still come because I have seen them. I've seen them come in the dark when there is no power and and when there hasn't been a healthy meal, they come, they sit, they listen attentively as our faith based lessons are taught. They teach reading, writing, math with the Scriptures, words of the prophets and help them learn. We have almost 30% or more friends at the church who attend with us. We welcome them. They're grateful for that opportunity to learn. It is truly a miracle. I think of this time to see the Blessings of education, being able to be more widely shared in these areas and helping these amazing youth to succeed in their lives and be who our Heavenly Father wants them to be. We've seen many of our original students now go on missions. To see them as missionaries is so touching. I hear from quite a few of them. To hear the blessings that they see as some have learned another language, English for some, Portuguese for others. As they've learned another language and are now taking the Gospel to people in countries far from where they live and helping them read the Scriptures where maybe they weren't able to even read well before. It is truly a miracle of our Heavenly Father that we see that the Church has helped bring and that through the great dedication and diligence of these wonderful students, through the support of their leaders and others who are there with them. Teachers. More than 4,000 volunteer teachers in West Africa alone, similar to a volunteer seminary teacher or other church calling you might have, they come and they help support these students and mentor them in the most amazing ways. I'm overwhelmed every time I see them. To see the faith and, and dedication not just to learning, but to God wanting to truly do what he wants them to do in their lives, it's amazing to see and everyone should feel as they are able to contribute to the church's humanitarian program, that they are also part of this amazing effort to care for those in need. I hope you'll take the time to look at that and think about what a blessing it is that in the Gospel of Jesus Christ we can provide that kind of help for others. It's remarkable.

[Hank Smith]

Coming up in part two.

[Dr. Kami Anderson]

In the meantime, my grandmother joined the church as she was marrying my grandfather. So in her 20s they moved around with the military for a few years. They eventually came back to Tampa, were active in the church, and after several years decided they wanted to go be sealed in the temple in Salt Lake City. That was the closest temple to Florida back then. As they went to Salt Lake City to be sealed in the temple,