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- [00:02]
John
Welcome Back to part two with Dr. Cammie Anderson. Deuteronomy 6:34.
- [00:07]
Hank
Cammie, what you just talked about there, that was one of the main reasons I wanted to bring you on for this portion, was because so much of Deuteronomy seems to say, we're here to help, we're here to serve. Did you see that in Deuteronomy?
- [00:23]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
Absolutely. When we think about these great efforts the church has made, it might also inspire us, and I'm sure many of us have been part of those. But maybe it inspires us in our efforts going forward to look for other ways that we can contribute to humanitarian efforts and make a difference. And we don't have to go to other countries to make a difference. We can do it in our own backyard. There's so much need. Let's go to chapter 1010 in Deuteronomy, and we'll first read two verses there, which again, goes back to what we were saying about remembering John. If you don't mind, could you read for us Deuteronomy 10, verses 17 through 19.
- [01:17]
John
Deuteronomy 10:17. For the Lord your God is God of gods and Lord of lords. A great God, a mighty and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward. He doth execute the judgment of the fatherless and widow, and loveth the stranger in giving him food and raiment. Love ye, therefore the stranger, for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt.
- [01:43]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
Powerful verses again.
- [01:45]
John
Here's the theme of remembering. I'm taking you to this promised land, but don't forget how you treat strangers, because there was a time when you were a stranger. Whatever circumstance you're in, if it's great, remember when your circumstances were not so great.
- [02:04]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
Really beautiful.
- [02:06]
Hank
Cammie, this is with what you just said about what the church and what you yourself are doing to educate those who wouldn't have opportunities for education. This warms my heart. The Lord is watching out for the strangers, the poor, the widow, and the expectation is that we will as well. Because you were there once. That was you at one time. It hurts my heart when I hear a Latter Day Saint saying, say something like, well, if you don't like what we believe, then you can move. And I'm like, oh, man, that was us once. If you don't like what we believe, you can move. I think we heard that quite a bit in our history.
- [02:47]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
I'm glad you brought that up, Hank, because think about it. It hasn't been that long since early members of the church were the strangers in the communities. They Were the ones being forced out. They were the ones whose homes were burned or who were ridiculed or all kinds of other terrible things that they had done. All in the name of faith. When I see stories in the news about those who are persecuted for their faith, I think we all have to think back to our own history. Not that many years ago when members of our church, not called members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints as we are now, were also persecuted because of their faith. When we think about what it says here that the Lord loveth the stranger, that is great counsel for us as we're thinking about our own behavior. That we can all do more to quote, love the stranger. Because in our own communities, not going halfway around the world, but where we are. Because that's what the Savior would do. That's what he said in the New Testament. Specifically, he references that that his disciples would do, would they would take care of the stranger. They would take them in. I know I've seen that in my own life. And certainly I wouldn't put myself in the category of many who find themselves in very desperate circumstances. But I have been in circumstances where I saw my life change in one day, Change drastically in one day. Many people, I'm sure, could relate with that. That all of a sudden you think you're here and then you're here. It's not necessarily anything that you did. It's just life. It's part of our mortality that sometimes those things, choices of others, life events, other circumstances come into play and we find ourselves in a different situation than we thought we would be. If we're not in that, we're grateful. I hope that I can say I think I've learned from my own experiences, from many people who stepped in to help me As a suddenly single mother with four children at home, not knowing what I would do in the future. Certainly I wasn't left to fend for myself. I had many people that helped me. But my life circumstances changed so drastically I had to go back to school. I had to think about what would I do in the future for a job. I was having people, my mom and sister, help me take my kids to school all of a sudden, where I had never done that before. It was such a dramatic life change that I never would have imagined. Yet many of us can find ourselves in those situations due to illness, accident. I found for me that while I hoped I was compassionate before, it's made me much more compassionate to the stranger that the Lord talks about here. Because we can all Be that person. Hopefully we're looking for ways to lift them up because that's what the Lord would do. We may find that we need it as well at different times in our lives.
- [06:39]
Hank
I wanted to read something from Elder Holland. This talk was called are we Not All Beggars? He says, cherish that sacred privilege at least monthly. And be as generous as circumstances permit in your fast offering and other humanitarian, educational and missionary contributions. I promise that God will be generous to you. And those who find relief at your hand will call your name. Blessed forever. He's very honest here. He says, brothers and sisters, this sermon that he's giving demands that I openly acknowledge the unearned, undeserved, unending blessings in my life, both temporal and spiritual. Like you, I have had to worry about finances on occasion. But I have never been poor, nor do I even know how the poor feel. Furthermore, I do not know all the reasons why the circumstances of birth, health, education and economic opportunities vary so widely here in mortality. But when I see the want among so many, I do know that. And he quotes this famous saying, there but for the grace of God go I. I also know that although I am not my brother's keeper, I am my brother's brother. And because I have been given much, I too must give. Cammie, I'm so inspired by you and the work you do. You just got home from West Africa and you were gushing over the people that you met. And the humility. Maybe even more than anything you say today. The way you live is Deuteronomy personified.
- [08:28]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
You're kind. I am so uplifted every time I am in any of those incredible West African countries where I have the opportunity to work, to see the faith and commitment, covenant keeping like we talk about in Deuteronomy. Covenant keeping of these members of the church. They're many thousands of miles from church headquarters. They're the first to honor their covenants. They're the first to sustain President Oaks and the other prophets. As prophetseers and revelators. They are the first to pay their tithing to. They are completely committed to being lifelong disciples of Jesus Christ. It's my great opportunity to know them and be able to be strengthened by their testimonies. That's the blessing of the worldwide church that we have. That we can come together as brothers and sisters. That the things that divide us and a society, that society tells us, want to divide us, don't matter as much in the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Because we remember that we're united by our faith in Jesus Christ, our covenants that we're one with our Heavenly Father. We try to be and we're working towards becoming that Zion people that's ready to welcome him at the time of his second coming. It's a great worldwide effort to do whatever we can, wherever we are, whatever country of the world city, to strengthen faith and testimony, share our testimony of what we know. Like Moses encouraged his people in his time, we can do that in our time as well. Finishing this topic of such great encouragement to us to look for those in need, whatever kind of need they might have. Deuteronomy 15. For the poor shall never cease out of the land. Therefore I command thee, saying thou shalt open thy hand wide unto thy brother, to thy poor and to thy needy in the land. It's my testimony that whenever we do that, and not just with money, but with time, with talents, with any effort we can give to the Lord to strengthen our brothers and sisters. He gives so much back to us because we know that we're helping them become stronger. Women and men, young men and young women, children, disciples of Jesus Christ, all walking along that path together, wherever we are.
- [11:33]
John
I have personal friends who have benefited from the Perpetual Education Fund in the Philippines. I just thought that is the most Zion idea. And if anyone's wondering, I don't know how to build Zion. Well, the church is actively doing things to try to build Zion. As I introduced you today, I mentioned that verse because of their riches and their chances for learning. There's people, their capacity is just as great as anybody, but they don't have chances or opportunities for learning. I love that our church is trying to give people opportunities to learn. I love hearing those stories and I love that there's people like you that are out there doing that.
- [12:18]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
I'm so glad you said that because it's one of the great blessings of the church, Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. I think another way that in a hundred ways that we know it's true, people can know it's the true church of Jesus Christ because he is giving every son and daughter the opportunity to have education. Now my program succeed in school for youth 11 to 18. It's not in every country yet, but BYU Pathway Worldwide and it is available, I believe almost everywhere in the world at the lowest of costs enables you to move through higher education and obtain a college degree or certificates which allow you to have a skill. It's incredible the opportunity that is given to members of the church throughout the world and friends of the church as well, job opportunities as well. After that online. I hope that if anyone is listening to this podcast and hasn't had the opportunity, I wish they could all come be in a Hank Smith or John, by the way class at byu. That would be amazing. But they can still attend a class at BYU Pathway Worldwide no matter where they live. Everywhere almost. They can do that. And then they can attend a institute class with that to also strengthen their faith along with their academic skills and work towards having a better job no matter where they are. I also speak to women or men who may have not finished their education and want to go back to school. It's a great opportunity for them as well. It's not just for single adults, young adults, it's for all people. The church is bringing education to all people because our heavenly Father, our Savior want all of us to enjoy the blessings of education. Like you said, not just a select few that may live by a university, but everyone. The church is making this happen through, specifically through BYU Pathway and the Institute program that's with us. It is a miracle, and I hope that when we think of parting the Red Sea, we know that's a miracle. We can all imagine it happening. This is a miracle, too, and it's happening every day around the world.
- [15:03]
Hank
Tammy so well said. For anyone listening who thinks, oh, it's hard for me to give, it is a sacrifice. I want to read to you something from one of my heroes. I've read it on here before. John. Bishop Edward Partridge, first bishop of the church, gave and gave and gave. He said, this is a letter. I have torn my affections from this world's goods, from the vanities and toys of time and sense, and been willing to love and serve God with all my heart and be led by his Holy Spirit. My mind has been, as it were, continually expanding, receiving the things of God until glory's indescribable prayer present themselves before me. I am willing to spend and be spent in the cause of my blessed master.
- [15:55]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
I need that quote, Hank.
- [15:57]
John
Okay, if I remember my church history right, he was a hatter. He had a hat business, and he had done very well, gave it all up. He had the Midas touch, didn't he? He seemed like whatever he tried, he was really good at. And he gave it all up.
- [16:14]
Hank
Cammie, can I throw one thing out at you to have some fun with that verse you showed us? Cammie, Going back to chapter 10, I think it was, he says, love ye, therefore the strangers, for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt. Now, what Cammie taught us is crucially Important. Can we maybe liken this to some other things? Love ye, therefore, your children, for you were children.
- [16:41]
John
You were children once.
- [16:44]
Hank
Love ye, therefore, your students or your teenagers, for you were teenagers once. Sometimes we forget as a parent, at least I do. I get frustrated with my boys sometimes for doing something that I definitely did worse. I think it's good. Even as a teacher, both of you, do you remember you were a student once? Do you remember the stress? Do you remember the difficulty?
- [17:17]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
Absolutely. I think that we need to be reminded of that patience that we need to have and is easily forgotten as we gain experience and time in this world. It maybe has been longer, depending on who we are. But those lessons, if we take time to actually sit and reflect and think back, we might remember that maybe there was a day that I didn't turn something in for some reason, or maybe I could have been nicer to my parents. I can't imagine that I was always just so perfect at all. I think that we need to take that time to reflect on that. That's a great point, John.
- [18:15]
Hank
Do you ever do that? Like, oh, you were little once?
- [18:19]
John
Yeah, I think I got in an accident with one of my dad's cars once. So when my kids had a fender bender, what am I going to do?
- [18:28]
Hank
Right?
- [18:29]
John
How could you? I never. Oh, wait a minute. Yes, I did.
- [18:31]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
I did do that.
- [18:33]
Hank
I think I've told this story before. One other time, there's a story about Larry Dahl, who is a professor of religion at byu. When he was a kid, he burned down a barn. It's a pretty big deal. His father paid for it. Well, as a father, one of his boys broke a window, and he's very upset and he's going to go get after him. And his wife says, larry, windows are not nearly as expensive as barns. You were there once, Cammie. We've had a great experience. Let's keep going. What do we want to look at next?
- [19:13]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
I thought it might be great if we went back and revisited the importance of covenants to the prophet Moses as he is thinking about the end of his life. Hank, could you read Deuteronomy 10, verse 12?
- [19:32]
Hank
Deuteronomy 10:12. And now Israel. What doth the Lord thy God require of thee, but to fear the Lord thy God, to walk in all his ways, and to love him, and to serve the Lord thy God with all thy heart and with all thy soul?
- [19:48]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
If we look even later in the chapter, it talks about how the Lord delights in those who love him. That is also an important thing to Remember as we think about covenants and that it's not just an obligation we have to progress in the gospel, but it's something that we hopefully love and truly value as a key part of who we are as person. As a disciple, Jesus Christ, I'd love to hear more about maybe some of your experiences with covenants and the temple. I know ever since COVID I've had such a greater appreciation for the temples. For most of my life, I live far away from a temple and it was only when I moved to the Utah area that I lived close by to a temple. And, and I've had such a great appreciation to attend the temple. And now not just for us, but for most members of the church with the temples that are announced will be within 200 US miles of a temple wherever they live in the world. It's incredible to think of that blessing. I don't know where all the places that you all have lived, but for me, when I think about it, I know there's now a temple being built in my hometown of Tampa, Florida. I can tell you never in a million years growing up did I ever think there would be a temple in Tampa. We see across the church. I was just in Abidjan, Cote d' Ivoire and It took almost 10 years after the groundbreaking for the temple to be built. I went back multiple times during that time and would see it, take a picture by it, but it hadn't been dedicated. Finally, the House of the Lord is dedicated there in Abidjan, Cote d', Ivoire, and the members are so grateful to not have to travel to Accra, Ghana to attend the temple. What a great blessing they have. I just wanted to share this short experience about what I see as the blessings of covenants, not just for us, but in the generations. I'm gonna hold up a little keychain for those who can see it. Can you see what's on this keychain?
- [22:23]
Hank
It looks like a temple, but I can't tell from here.
- [22:27]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
It is. It's a Salt Lake temple. This keychain is more than 50 years old. It belonged to my great grandmother. Her name was Mildred Ker Aman. She had what might be considered a challenging life. She was not a member of the church. She wasn't born in the church. Around the time that she was maybe a little younger than me, her husband left and she was divorced in a time when there wasn't divorce was not that common. And she had one of her children passed away in a tragic accident as a child. So she had One remaining child. My grandmother shouldn't really have an educational background. She was left to take care of herself and move ahead in the world. And she did have an amazing daughter who was my grandmother and then later her family. From the world's perspective, her life might not have seemed to be the ideal. In the meantime, my grandmother joined the church as she was marrying my grandfather. So in her 20s, they moved around with the military for a few years. They eventually came back to Tampa, were active in the church, and after several years decided they wanted to go be sealed in the temple in Salt Lake City. That was the closest temple to Florida back then. As they went to Salt Lake City to be sealed in the temple, my grandmother's mother, Mildred, my great grandmother, took the missionary discussions. She had not previously. Even though her daughter, my grandmother Martha, had encouraged her so much as their only daughter and had wanted her so much to be part of the church, she had really resisted. But while they were away going to the temple, her mother took the missionary discussions, I assume again, because I think she'd seen the missionaries maybe through the years. When my grandparents and my mom and her brothers came back from being sealed in the temple, long car drive back and forth, my great grandmother was ready to be baptized in a short period of time. She made another drive to Salt Lake City with my grandmother to receive her endowment in the Salt Lake Temple. And when she did, she got this little keychain that she kept on her keys for the rest of her life. And the interesting part of the story is that that was the only time she was ever able to attend temple because she was an older woman, she lived thousands of miles away from the temple. She ended up having an illness that resulted in her being in an accident and in a care center for the final years of her life. And she was never able to tend the temple again. One time, being able to go to the temple, she never had the opportunity to remarry while she had this wonderful daughter and grandchildren. And she had the chance to serve in a Relief Society presidency with my grandmother as the president, and she is a counselor, which was such a special thing she might have thought, I don't know about my covenants. Is it working for me? You remember that great talk, mortality Works, that was given a few years ago, where it talked about. Sometimes it seems like maybe it's not all working the perfect way we might want it to work. But the great thing was, even though she might not have had all the blessings that she wanted in this life, she was always faithful to her covenants. And she kept the temple as the focus of her life on her keychain until she was not needing keys anymore in her life. I love that about her. It gives me so much strength now. Well, I'm her great granddaughter and I have grandchildren and so do many other people in her posterity and who are faithful in the church and active in the church. While she only had the one daughter that she had at the time, she was divorced and somewhat of a difficult life. Her posterity has had amazing blessings. We look at her and think, what a great example of faithfulness to your covenants, even in very challenging times. That's the power of covenants that you see beyond what happens now. Do you look to the future and say, my life may not be perfect, I may not have all the blessings that I want right now, but I contribute as I can? She contributed in her ward. She blessed the life of her family while she lived. Then we have the blessings of the Gospel in our lives and she is a great part of that. We're so thankful for her example these many years later. I'm so grateful for the power of covenants that. That keeps us anchored no matter what. And I'd love to hear any thoughts you all have on how covenants make a difference for us as we're thinking of Moses ready to leave this life. How those covenants help us stay anchored to what matters, even if it's hard to see sometimes.
- [28:11]
John
Recently we've heard some great insights from leaders about not thinking of a covenant as a contract, but as a relationship. The power of a relationship. Sometimes I'm not strong against temptation. Maybe the answer is, yeah, you're not, but Jesus is, and you've made a covenant with him. He can be with you. I also think when I have a hard decision to make, I think, well, who have I made covenants with? That always clarifies things for me.
- [28:42]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
We have a family. Even if we don't think we have a family, we do. We have family past that loves us and cares about what choices we make that lead us to live with them again.
- [28:58]
John
You just demonstrated that by showing something from your great grandmother. This is a. A covenant connection you have.
- [29:06]
Hank
Yeah. John knows that. When I think of covenants and the Abrahamic covenant, I think the Lord said to a certain family, I need you to bless all the families of the earth. I'm going to choose you, Abraham, and your posterity, which all three of us are a part of. You're going to bless all the families of the earth. I'm going to give you commandments, you keep those commandments. I will pour out blessings upon you, and you're going to use those blessings to bless everybody else. I think of my obligation to do that. I do like the keeping the commandments part and the getting the blessings part. I like both of those parts. I'm just learning how to like the bless everybody else part. Like sending a boy across the country and saying, I like that kid. I didn't want to send him away, but I can see that that is part of my covenant or that is part of what the Lord has asked of me. I also like the idea of my wife. She knows everything about me that there is to know, and she still loves me. That to me, is very similar to how the Lord feels about us. This isn't a covenant of perfection. This is a relationship. The Lord would say, I know every single thing about you and I still love you.
- [30:28]
John
I like you anyway.
- [30:29]
Hank
Yeah. Don't reject me. Stay in the relationship. Don't leave. I love you. Yes, believe me, I see you very clearly. Stay in the relationship with me. We'll make this work. Really, the only way out of my covenant with the Lord is for me to reject him because he will never reject me.
- [30:48]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
Remember, President Nelson talked to us so strongly about that, has said principle that no matter what we are doing and once we make that covenant with him, he will do whatever it takes to bring us back. We are worth it to Him. We know he loves all of us. But it's that covenant relationship that is so special to him. That should give us a lot of comfort if we're ever feeling discouraged. One of my young adult friends said to me recently, you don't realize how much competition there is online with young adults. It's not the same as when you were my age. I thought, interesting. We maybe don't feel that the same way that young adults do, that sense of competitiveness and I have to be better than the next person because I see it all on social media and whether it's real or not, it's there. Being in the temple as much as we can that truly anchors us to our Savior and reminds us of Him. I found, at least in my life, in the worst of times, when I felt like I had peace nowhere else, I could always go to the temple and find that peace. I'd come back out, have to take on the world again. You both talked about your amazing, wonderful wives. I think if you're single, you may have more complicated feelings about that. That can be challenging. And the church has reported at different Times that more than 50% of members are single at different periods. That can be hard to not have that person that is in that covenant relationship with you, with Savior. But you can always know that you have the Savior there and that as you're doing your part that things will work out. As President Nelson used to say in a quote I really like, faith always propels us forward. This is a quote from a talk I really have read many times by President Oaks called Trust in the Lord. He says trust in the Lord is a familiar and true teaching in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. That was Joseph Smith's teaching. When the early saints experience severe persecutions and seemingly insurmountable obstacles, that is still the best principle we can use. When our efforts to learn or our attempts to find comfort encounter obstacles in matters not yet revealed or not adopted is the official doctrine of the Church. The same principle applies to unanswered questions about sailings in the next life, desired readjustments because of events or transgressions and mortality. There is so much we do not know that our only sure reliance is to trust in the Lord and His love for his children. I would just give my very strong testimony that the more time I spend in the temple, or if I haven't been able to be there to think about my temple covenants, the more trust in the Lord I'm able to have about situations I may not understand or difficulties I have that I never anticipated. But that if we will trust in our Savior, we can have the confidence that in his time, in his way, things will work out and we don't need to worry. Without my covenants, I don't believe I would have that peace and happiness in my life that I have every day. Because of that.
- [35:07]
Hank
Cammie. Another reason I really wanted you for this section was something I noticed. I sometimes will see a word come up a couple of times and think, man, I've seen that a bunch. I'll grab my phone and I'll say, how many times do I see that? If you read Deuteronomy, you're going to see the word fatherless in chapter 10, chapter 14, chapter 16, chapter 24, four times, chapter 16, two times chapter 26 and chapter 27. It keeps coming up. The Lord is very concerned with how they treat the fatherless. I know you have done quite a bit of research on mentoring. I see how that would totally fit this. The Lord is take care of the fatherless. I don't have to remind either of you of this, but the United States has the highest rate of children who do not have a father in the home. And we're talking in the millions of children who do not have a father in the home. Cammie, can you tell me more about mentoring? Even Moses is a mentor.
- [36:10]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
I love mentoring. I had not necessarily thought about Moses as a mentor. I have looked at others in the scriptures as mentors. But when you look at Deuteronomy and I would encourage all of our wonderful, dedicated listeners to do this. As you look at Moses as a mentor, as Moses as a leader, let me give you a quote from President Dieter Echt Utdorf on mentoring and how it fits into a gospel context. Because someone might think, well, we've got mentoring. We've got our religious leaders. How do those work together? Here is what President Uchtdorf said. The most powerful and capable being in the universe has is his greatest purpose. To mentor you, his children, and provide a way for them to one day live with him. Think of the people Jesus ministered to during his mortal life. His teachings centered on assuring ordinary people that God was among them. He would answer their prayers, place them on his shoulders, and carry them home. When you think about Moses and his role as the prophet coming to the end of his life here after serving for so many dedicated, faithful years, can we think of someone who better fits that description? What comes to your mind when you hear that and think about the things that he was doing?
- [37:55]
John
I was thinking first of how Jethro was a mentor to Moses when Moses was so exhausted because of all the problems he had to solve. And Jethro's like, you're doing this wrong. You should delegate and taught him this wonderful system. I'm thinking in a larger way how struck I am of how many of these chapters are over and over and over again taking care of the poor and the fatherless. And I'm thinking anytime we can chip away at that idea that the God of the Old Testament is mean and the God of the New Testament is nice, I think it's good here. What we are seeing is a God who really wants us to be compassionate with each other and the widows and the fatherless and the poor.
- [38:42]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
Great thoughts. I think, too, that when you think about what impact does a mentor have, you might just think in your mind of someone who's been a great mentor to you. Hank. John, I'm sure you have mentored countless young adults. One of the great pieces of research is that you don't have to spend a long time mentoring for it to have an impact. Quality mentoring can Be as effective in the life of a mentee, a youth, young adult, as employee at a company, as the quantity mentoring that we sometimes might think of when we think of mentoring. I love to go to speak at mentoring seminars and ask people who's mentored you? And so many times it's just one or two brief incidents. Maybe it was a church leader that they had a brief interaction with and made a difference for them. Maybe it was someone who worked with them for a longer period of time, a teacher that showed a lot of interest in them, a relative that cared about them when they felt like they didn't get that attention at home or they had a difficult family situation. Mentoring can be truly life changing, helping people see a vision for who they can become.
- [40:22]
Hank
There's so many people that come to mind, it's hard to say, oh, that one was the one that really made the difference, but one that comes to mind. And if someone out there is listening say, hey, I was your best mentor, then I'm sorry if I missed you
- [40:35]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
here, but everyone is going to be fighting to Hank and John, what great mentors they've been to them. I think that'd be fantastic.
- [40:46]
Hank
I had a couple in my time. Think of bishops, of course, when I was younger, bishops who took time with me. A mission president that really blessed my life. And then I was a student teacher when a man named Russ Bullock, he decided that there was a good teacher somewhere in me, he was going to bring that teacher out. He did, in a way. He loved me. He loved my wife. We had no children at the time. I credit him for a lot of my career. What can I say about Russ Bullock, other than I love that man still to this day, and we don't get to talk anymore. He's retired from church education, but if I think of him, Cami, even though it's been a while since we've talked, it still floods my heart.
- [41:37]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
Brings a great feeling, doesn't it? Because you know that when we think about what President Dorf said, that effort to mentor in the Savior's wait, it's not assigned. That's the pure love of Christ that is coming out to serve someone in a way that only you can, using your unique talents to bless someone's life. The wonderful thing is that there is no one that can't be a mentor, no matter how many talents you feel like you have. Everyone can be a mentor to someone and make that difference for them. That maybe in a different way than your mentor did for you, but everyone can do that for someone. Even in peer mentoring, where I've seen wonderful examples of peer mentoring where students mentor each other. I'll see them where an older student is helping a younger student to learn a concept or do something that they didn't know how to do. And what a blessing.
- [42:47]
John
I feel like, Hank, I might miss somebody. Priest quorum advisor named John Pei was amazing. I could name so many bishops, and I can't tell you as a teenager every year who won the super bowl or the World Series or Academy Awards. But I can remember all my bishops. I can remember my young men's leaders. They're the ones that had the biggest impact. Robert Millett helped me tremendously. David Christiansen in teaching. Sister Kathy Schlendorf helped me a lot in teaching. Menlo Smith, my mission leader that I still keep in touch with, who's in his late 90s. I mean, sometimes, Hank, all I have to do is what would president do? They're still helping me. And of course, my own father. We don't generally think of fathers as mentors, but I do. There's so many. I hate to miss anybody.
- [43:40]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
That's another list. We've gone through a couple lists we can make today. Scriptures, miracles now, mentor list.
- [43:48]
John
Kim, you mentioned Paul and Timothy. That's a really good one. One that's one of my favorites is Ammon and Mormon who comes along. I perceive that thou art a sober child and are quick to observe. Mormon says, when I was 10 years of age, he came unto me. Most 10 year olds aren't out going, hey, could you mentor me somehow? Amaron was watching and said, let me tell you something about you that you might not even see in yourself. You are a sober child. You are quick to observe. Let me give you an assignment. When you're 24 years old, go to the Hill, Shem, and dig up the record. It's kind of a nice little story in there. In Mormon chapter one, I thought of
- [44:37]
Hank
my father in law, John, when you started talking about your dad, my own father, and then my father in law, Rod Savage in St. George, man, when I walked in his house, he must have thought, are you kidding? That is who my daughter brought home. But he took on this project, man. He spent hours and hours with me.
- [44:58]
John
And I better mention my father in law, Michael Loveridge, who has been a mentor for all of my children that are trying to be the pianist that he already is.
- [45:09]
Hank
Cami, thank you for that.
- [45:11]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
I love this. We could go another three hours and we could talk about all the amazing lessons we've learned from different Mentors in our lives. Actually, it's one of the reasons I love the academic field of mentoring, because I feel like in the gospel of Jesus Christ it is so relevant to everything we're doing, if we choose to to in our service that we're already doing and call INS and so many other things. Mentor in the Savior's way. When you think about the Savior reaching out to people one on one, we do that in our mentoring efforts. Whether it's a long period of time or short, we can have a huge difference in someone's life. Hank, to go back to what you said about the fatherless so many times, I hadn't realized that, that those scriptures about the Fathers were mentioned so many times in Deuteronomy. Now I'm going to have to go back and look all those up. Especially for those who, as we spoke of earlier, may find themselves in challenging situations. And not just youth or young adults, but even older people. For me, going back to do a PhD was really hard. So many people were great mentors to me. I'm not going to mention all of them on here today, but many at byu. Then in my other employment, volunteering with a refugee organization or later in my job was succeed in school. Truly gave me opportunities, looked beyond maybe some of what was just there on the resume to give me opportunities to become who I could be that maybe I couldn't even see for myself. I'm so grateful for the opportunities I have now because people were willing to mentor me, especially in the church, in our callings. We have so many opportunities. We don't have to sit and have an organized mentoring meeting. But I think of a wonderful primary teacher in Baltimore, Maryland, where we lived for many years. She was such a great mentor to my children as they were going through primary. Now they're all married now and she still keeps in touch with them, sends them thoughtful cards, things with them. It's been more than 20 years and she is still reaching out to them, just like she did as their primary teacher there in Baltimore. She is still looking out for them, still wanting to know that they're strong in their faith and moving ahead on the covenant path and knowing that they had a teacher that loved them and cared about them and and still does. I think mentors help us see our Heavenly Father's love for us, whether it's even in professional ways, that we're just supported in a way when we feel like we couldn't do it on our own, we have someone step in to say, I can give you some help and Help you as Moses. Think of all the experiences Moses has had. What is he doing? He's thinking back to the fatherless, the widow. Maybe they didn't have divorced people back then, but I'm sure he would have put that in there. That would have been included other single people or those facing health challenges or others who really needed extra help. And he's looking out for them with the experiences that he had. I think it's really amazing and a great example for us in our own lives to say, I can be a mentor like the Savior and like the prophets.
- [49:25]
Hank
I'd never thought about that. John and Cammie, where you just said Moses had a mentor, someone who stepped. Jethro stepped in and said, I'm going to help you.
- [49:35]
John
You're doing it wrong.
- [49:38]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
And hopefully that's a call to us.
- [49:40]
Hank
Yeah. Cammie, you exemplify that in so many
- [49:44]
John
ways to your life's work. Yeah.
- [49:48]
Hank
To take care of the other members of this church. And not only that, to bless the whole earth.
- [49:53]
John
Very Zion.
- [49:55]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
A lot of amazing help. And I am, like I said, so blessed to have any small part in working with others to bring more education.
- [50:11]
Hank
Cami, hang on. Now, you've asked John about his mentors, and you've asked me about mine. What about you? Who comes to mind for you? And you can't name everybody either. I know.
- [50:22]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
I'm so grateful for my parents. They've been my greatest mentors in life. Examples and of course, the practical things like education or my family and trying to do things that I wanted to accomplish that way, and supporting me and those efforts, but especially in the gospel. I'm so grateful for all they did to encourage my testimony. And if I had questions, they never gave me a pause about that. They just answered them and helped me become the young woman and later woman that I am now when I face very unexpected challenges. They were my greatest supporters. I couldn't have imagined how much I would need my parents as an adult. I'm so grateful for them and how I have been able to look up to them. And I hope I can be that kind of mentor for my own children in their lives. I love them so much. I'm just so grateful for them.
- [51:39]
Hank
Kami, I have to tell you a quick story. I was listening to your mother actually speak at byu. She came to present for the religion department. She told a story that changed my teaching. It was just a brief story. She said that she was in Africa and had gone on a little safari to watch the animals. And she said they saw this group of baboons. And they were silent. These baboons were silent. And this lion, this big lion was walking in front of them with a baby baboon in its mouth. She said the baboons were just watching, all in silence, except for two. There's two in the back who were wailing, like yelling and wailing. She commissioned us as teachers. She said, each child has some people who care about them deeply, deeply. So do your job well. It honestly changed my teaching. Instead of looking at one or two going, oh, you're so hard, I thought about that story.
- [52:52]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
Wow, what a message about looking out for the one.
- [52:56]
Hank
Cammie, this has been superb.
- [52:59]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
I'm so grateful for you both giving me the opportunity to come talk with you. I've been so enlightened by your insights. I'm sure listeners have as well. What an opportunity for me to be here. So thank you so much. I am very grateful to both of you. As we think about these great principles that we've learned from prophet Moses, and we think about him, all that he had learned and taught as a prophet through the years, then coming to his final time, his final message, this is something we see throughout the Scriptures. What is the final message that a prophet gives to his people? Why would he give that message? One of the favorite verses that our family has is doctrine covenants, section 1 38. By my noble voice or by the voice of my servants, it is the same. We know that prophets speak for our Savior, Jesus Christ. As we go back to our beginning message of looking for our Savior in the Old Testament, we think about the message of our new First Presidency, President Oaks, and First Presidency Jesus Christ is the way. And we think back in time to Moses and we think of this inspiring verse to me in Deuteronomy 30, I want to read and just end with my testimony says, therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live. That thou mayest love the Lord thy God, and that thou mayest obey his voice, and that thou mayest cleave unto him, for he is thy life and the length of thy days, that thou mayest dwell in the land which the Lord swear unto thy fathers, to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob to give them. I feel so strongly from whether it's the Israelites in the time of Moses or whether it's us today with our new prophet, President Oaks, and other living prophets that we have, that we are blessed to have prophets to help us get through the wilderness, get to the promised land, however long it takes. Whatever the challenges, if we will look to them. They will walk beside us and point us to the Savior. We can face very difficult trials, even trials we never could have imagined. With the Savior as our focus, with the prophets to lead us and guide us, with the scriptures to be our anchor, we can make it. We can know that happiness and joy, as President Oak said in the first presidency said in the message of the caring report, happiness, joy are ahead because of Jesus Christ. As I try to do that, that's what I find. Joy in covenants, joy in following the prophets, joy in reading the scriptures, joy in trying to keep my focus on the Savior and hoping that my family will be part of that with me.
- [56:51]
Hank
Dr. Cami Anderson. What a superb day. When I thought of Deuteronomy before, I got to admit, my heart didn't swell in me. Now when I think of the obligation to help. This has been inspiring to me. I've got to go help.
- [57:08]
John
It's throughout. Isn't it nice? I like that you said these, like, sermons of Moses. So we have what happened to Moses. Now we've got Moses's sermons before he sends them off into the promised land where he doesn't get to go. This is how he wants him to live.
- [57:25]
Hank
Cammie, thank you so much for your time.
- [57:27]
Dr. Cammie Anderson
Thank you. It's been my privilege to be here.
- [57:31]
Hank
Oh, it's been so fun. I've been looking forward to this for a long time. Now I know why.
- [57:36]
John
It was great.
- [57:37]
Hank
With that, we want to thank Dr. Cammie Anderson for being with us today. We want to thank our executive producer, Shannon Sorenson, our sponsors, and David and Verla Sorensen. In every episode, we remember our founder. He was a mentor to me, Steve Sorensen. We hope you'll join us next week. We're going to jump back in to the Old Testament on Follow Him. As a thank you to our wonderful listeners, we'd love to gift you the digital version of our book, Finding Jesus Christ in the Old Testament. It offers short, meaningful insights drawn from our past Old Testament episodes. Visit followhim.co. that's followhim.co. to download your free copy today and you'll also find the link to purchase the print edition. Thank you for being part of our Follow him family. Of course, none of this could happen without our incredible production crew. David Perry, Lisa Spice, Will Stoughton, Crystal Roberts, Ariel Cuadra, Heather Barlow, Amelia Kabwica, Sydney Smith, and Annabelle Soreness. Whatever questions or problems you have, the answer is always found in the life and teachings of Jesus Christ. Turn to him. Follow him.