Andrew Scott/Remembering author Marjane Satrapi

Summary

Fresh Air Podcast Summary

Episode: Andrew Scott / Remembering author Marjane Satrapi
Date: June 12, 2026
Host: Terry Gross (with Dave Davies), NPR

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Overview

This episode of Fresh Air is divided into three distinct sections, each offering deep conversations and thoughtful reflections:

1. An insightful and reflective interview with Irish actor Andrew Scott: The discussion explores Scott’s diverse and acclaimed acting career, focusing on his roles in "Fleabag," "Sherlock," and "Hamlet," as well as his approach to complicated characters and his reflections on faith, sexuality, and personal growth.
2. A heartfelt remembrance of Marjane Satrapi: The late Iranian-French author and creator of "Persepolis" is remembered through an archival interview, highlighting her rebellious spirit, her views on growing up in revolutionary Iran, and the cultural power of her work.
3. A review of Steven Spielberg’s new film, "Disclosure Day": Critic Justin Chang analyzes the sci-fi thriller, drawing connections to Spielberg's broader filmography and the film's timely themes of conspiracy and hope.

The episode weaves personal narrative, cultural critique, and celebratory remembrance, creating a rich tapestry of art, resistance, and storytelling.

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Section 1: Interview with Andrew Scott

Host: Terry Gross
Timestamps: 00:17–20:37

Main Discussion Points

• Role in "Pressure"

  • Scott stars in the WWII film as meteorologist Captain James Stagg, tasked with predicting the weather for D-Day.
  • Conflict depicted: Stagg’s grim forecast vs. the optimism of Eisenhower’s meteorologist.
    [00:17–01:58]
    • Quote (as Stagg):
      “...if you invade tomorrow, they're going to be washed away because the storms that I'm talking about are real and the jet stream ... is real and the wrath of nature is real.” (01:05, Andrew Scott as Captain Stagg)

• Signature Roles & Faith in "Fleabag"

  • Discussion of Scott’s acclaimed turn as the “Hot Priest” and the deep philosophical themes it raised.
    [02:43–10:46]
    • Quote (Scott, about the church in Ireland):
      “The culture is based on the Catholic Church … I’m not a practicing Catholic anymore, but certainly the culture around Catholicism is one that is very hard to dispel. And parts of it are wonderful... but … a whole litany of abuse cases … just coming out every morning.” (05:36, Andrew Scott)
    • Scott discusses the tension between doctrine and human desire, and how Fleabag offered a nuanced, human portrayal of faith and doubt.
    • Quote:
      “So it's not the abstinence that I have the problem with. It's the silence around the abstinence … That's why I found that character so cathartic.” (08:03, Andrew Scott)
    • On positive feedback from priests:
      “I had really, really positive feedback from priests, I think, because they liked, like all of us, like to see themselves represented in a sort of fair way...” (10:21, Andrew Scott)

• Becoming Moriarty in "Sherlock"

  • The audition process and discovery of the “scary” within himself. [10:46–14:47]
    • Quote (Scott):
      “I was aware that I didn’t look like a villain... so I took great pleasure in frightening them. And I knew in the audition that they were amused, but also that they were scared.” (13:01, Andrew Scott)

• Approach to "Hamlet"

  • Making Shakespeare modern, relatable, and actable for everyone.
    [14:47–19:59]
    • Quote:
      “I have this real passion about Shakespeare. It shouldn’t be kidnapped by academics. It's something that's very actable … You may not understand every single word, but in the same way you may not get every word in a rap song, you understand there’s a musicality to it.” (16:38, Andrew Scott)
    • He describes the play as a living contemplation of grief, humor, and human contradiction.
    • Quote:
      “We laugh on the saddest day of our life and cry in the middle of a brunch when we don't think we're going to. It's always within us all the time, the potential to go in either direction.” (18:39, Andrew Scott)

• On Fame & Recognition
  [19:59–20:37]

  • Scott can still sometimes walk unrecognized in public, expressing gratitude for this anonymity.

---

Section 2: Remembering Marjane Satrapi

Host: Terry Gross (archival)
Timestamps: 21:56–40:52

Main Discussion Points

• The Impact of Persepolis

  • Satrapi’s autobiographical graphic novel broke ground by illuminating life under the Islamic Revolution and the Iran-Iraq War, becoming an international phenomenon. [21:56–23:35]
    • Quote (Satrapi, about the veil):
      “...if you didn’t wear that on your head, you couldn't go to school. ...So of course we didn't believe in it. And as soon as we could take it off or play with it or making it look ridiculous, we did it.” (24:12–24:48, Marjane Satrapi)

• Growing Up amid War & Authoritarianism
  [24:48–28:28]

  • On Fearlessness:
    “After that, I think I accepted that I was already dead. So from the moment ... your death doesn't matter anymore to you, then you're not scared.” (25:08–26:15, Marjane Satrapi)
  • She describes speaking out, refusing to conform, and physically rebelling against school authorities.
  • Quote:
    “I just pushed her away and ... she fell down and that was a crisis ... I don't regret it one second. If I had to do it again, I would have pushed her even harder.” (27:17–27:41, Marjane Satrapi)

• Cultural Contradictions and Rebellion
  [28:28–33:21]

  • Recounting her mother’s strict regime of education as liberation, not oppression.
  • Quote:
    “If tomorrow she has to leave the country, she has to know everything ... The more languages she knows ... that's a new chance.” (30:00–31:26, Marjane Satrapi)
  • Smuggling Western pop culture into Iran (Iron Maiden poster, denim jacket), and how it forged a sense of global belonging.
  • “...the culture in general belongs to everyone. There is no frontier. Your Edgar Allan Poe belongs as much to. It belongs to me as much as my poet Hafiz in Iran belongs to you.” (32:06–33:21, Marjane Satrapi)

• Exile, Assimilation, and Return
  [35:26–38:38]

  • Satrapi details being sent alone to Austria, feeling misjudged and isolated, and eventually returning to Iran to re-root her identity in her home culture.
  • Quote:
    “At this time, I understood [why I was sent away] very well ... But in these years ... I was escaping something and people, they were judging me by the thing that I escaped, myself. ... To assimilate another culture, first of all, I have to assume my own culture ... That made me go back.” (37:08–38:38, Marjane Satrapi)

• Secret Parties and Personal Freedom
  [38:38–40:52]

  • Satrapi describes clandestine parties as an act of survival and reclaiming joy in an oppressive state.
  • Quote:
    “We were just together almost every night making a party every night because first of all, it was forbidden ... We were risking to be arrested and we have been arrested 1 billion times ... But we did it. Life continues.” (39:36–40:48, Marjane Satrapi)

---

Section 3: Film Review — "Disclosure Day" by Steven Spielberg

Critic: Justin Chang
Timestamps: 42:10–48:27

Main Discussion Points

• Film Overview

  • "Disclosure Day" is positioned as a return to classic Spielberg “alien cinema” with a modern conspiracy twist, starring Emily Blunt and Josh O’Connor.
  • The film’s premise revolves around government secrecy, whistleblowing, and alien encounters.

• Characters and Performances
  [44:48–45:10]

  • Emily Blunt’s meteorologist character suddenly gains unusual, possibly alien powers.
  • Colin Firth plays the menacing chief of a shadowy agency, while Colman Domingo and Elizabeth Marvel provide notable supporting roles, with Marvel exploring the theological ramifications of extraterrestrial life.

• Themes and Style
  [45:10–48:27]

  • The film is praised for its clever sequences and strong performances, but Chang finds it ultimately swayed by Spielberg’s trademark sentimentality.

  • Quote (Chang):
    “Whatever aliens might be capable of doing to us, the movie suggests we have far more to fear from some of our fellow humans.”

  • The film’s finale strains for catharsis and hope, echoing both Spielberg’s optimism and a caution about easy redemption.

  • Memorable moment:
    A nun’s reflection that “the existence of aliens doesn’t threaten her belief in God ... it affirms that God, like the universe, is far bigger and more complex than humans like to acknowledge.”

  • Quote (Chang):
    “Like the existence of alien life, our essential goodness is easy enough to believe in, but a lot harder to prove.” (48:18, Justin Chang)

---

Notable Memorable Moments & Quotes by Timestamp

• 01:05 — Andrew Scott (as Stagg):
  “You can assemble the greatest armada ... but if you invade tomorrow, they're going to be washed away ... the wrath of nature is real.”
• 05:36 — Andrew Scott:
  “The culture is based on the Catholic Church ... I'm not a practicing Catholic anymore, but ... the culture around Catholicism is one that is very hard to dispel.”
• 08:03 — Andrew Scott:
  “It's not the abstinence that I have the problem with. It's the silence around the abstinence ... That's why I found that character so cathartic.”
• 13:01 — Andrew Scott (on Moriarty audition):
  “I took great pleasure in frightening them ... I knew in the audition that they were amused, but also ... scared.”
• 16:38 — Andrew Scott (on Hamlet):
  “I have this real passion about Shakespeare. It shouldn’t be kidnapped by academics. It's something that's very actable …”
• 24:12–24:48 — Marjane Satrapi:
  “...as soon as we could take [the veil] off or play with it ... we did it. ... That was really an obligation. In no way was that the choice of Iranian people.”
• 25:08 — Marjane Satrapi:
  “When you see your friend who is 13 years old ... can die, then you say, I can die also ... after that, I think I accepted that I was already dead.”
• 32:06–33:21 — Marjane Satrapi:
  “The culture ... belongs to everyone. There is no frontier. ... Edgar Allan Poe belongs as much to me as my poet Hafiz ... belongs to you.”
• 39:36–40:48 — Marjane Satrapi:
  “We were just together almost every night making a party ... we were risking to be arrested ... But we did it. Life continues.”
• 48:18 — Justin Chang:
  “Like the existence of alien life, our essential goodness is easy enough to believe in, but a lot harder to prove.”

---

Conclusion

This episode captures the intimate connection between artistic process and personal history:

• Andrew Scott reflects on inhabiting iconic roles and channeling his identity and heritage into art.
• Marjane Satrapi’s stories celebrate the irrepressible spirit of youth, resistance, and the universality of culture, even under repression.
• Justin Chang’s review situates contemporary cinema within the context of global fears and hope, reinforcing art’s ability to hold a mirror to both our darkest and most optimistic instincts.

This edition of Fresh Air serves as both a celebration and an elegy for voices that challenge, inform, and inspire.

---

Transcript

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[Dave Davies]

This is FRESH air. I'm Dave Davies. The new film Pressure takes place in the days leading up to D Day during World War II, when the exact date of the invasion was as yet uncertain because it would depend on the weather. Today we feature our interview with Irish actor Andrew Scott. He co stars in Pressure as Captain James Stagg, the chief Royal Air Force meteorologist. Allied commanders are gathered in England and Stagg is urging them to hold off on the invasion as he sees a storm brewing. But he's at odds with the meteorologist for Dwight Eisenhower, the supreme commander of Allied forces who thinks the weather will be fine. His name is Irving Kirk. Here's a clip from the film in which Andrew Scott, as Captain Stagg responds to the forecast. Kirk has just presented to the commanders

[Andrew Scott]

that what Colonel Crick just said, that it's going to be safe to land in Normandy tomorrow. And so that's what you believe. But everything that he's just said is pure, unadulterated horse. You can muster all the tanks and soldiers and ships that you like. You can assemble the greatest armada that ever there was, but if you invade tomorrow, they're going to be washed away because the storms that I'm talking about are real and the jet stream that's propelling them towards the Normandy coast is real and the wrath of nature. Is real.

[Dave Davies]

Andrew Scott most recently played Tom Ripley, a con man with no conscience in the Netflix series Ripley, adapted from the famous Patricia Highsmith novel. He was the famous hot priest in the award winning comedy series Fleabag, torn between his vow of celibacy and his love for a woman. And he was Sherlock Holmes nemesis Moriarty in the British series Sherlock, opposite Benedict Cumberbatch. Scott was also a soldier in Steven Spielberg's series Band of Brothers, a wise cracking lieutenant in the World War I film 1917, and a gay man who shut down his emotions in the film all of Us Strangers. Terry spoke to Andrew Scott in 2024. She asked him about his part in Fleabag.

[Terry Gross]

So you may be tired of talking about your role in Fleabag as a priest?

[Andrew Scott]

No, not at all.

[Terry Gross]

As a priest torn between your commitment to the priesthood and your love for for the main character, the woman nicknamed Fleabag, torn between your commitment to celibacy and your own sexual desire and you know, it stars Phoebe Waller Bridge, who also created and wrote it. She plays a single woman who really loves sex and has had a lot of partners but isn't really in love until she meets you. And you're a priest who performs the ceremony for Fleabag's father's second marriage. She falls in love with you. You're drawn to her, but you're a priest. You become good friends and she started to hope that you'll leave the priesthood and be with her. And I want to play a scene in which she's visiting you at the parish in the evening. And the scene starts inside and then moves outside. So we just did a bit of editing to edit together those two parts of the scene. So let's hear that Phoebe Waller Bridge as Fleabag, speaks first.

[Andrew Scott]

So I read your book. Okay, great.

[Marjan Satrapi]

Well, it's got some great twists.

[Terry Gross]

True.

[Andrew Scott]

But I couldn't help but notice just

[Marjan Satrapi]

one or two little inconsistencies.

[Andrew Scott]

Okay, sure.

[Marjan Satrapi]

So the world was made in seven days. And on the first day, light came. And then a few days later, the sun came.

[Andrew Scott]

Yeah. That's ridiculous. You believe that? It's not fact. It's poetry. It's moral code. It's for interpretation, to help us work out God's plan for us.

[Marjan Satrapi]

What's God's plan for you?

[Andrew Scott]

I believe God meant for me to love people in a different way. I believe I'm supposed to love people as a father.

[Marjan Satrapi]

We can arrange that.

[Andrew Scott]

A father of many.

[Marjan Satrapi]

I'll go up to three.

[Andrew Scott]

It's not gonna happen.

[Marjan Satrapi]

Two, then.

[Andrew Scott]

Okay, two.

[Marjan Satrapi]

Do you think I should become a Catholic?

[Andrew Scott]

No, don't do that. I like that you believe in a meaningless existence. And you're good for me. You make me question my faith and I've never felt closer to God.

[Terry Gross]

That's Phoebe Waller Bridge and my guest, Andrew Scott. That's such a great role and such a great performance. Did you ever know a young priest as attractive as you were?

[Andrew Scott]

That's very kind and also impossible to answer. Yeah, no, I completely adore Phoebe. And.

[Terry Gross]

Well, wait, let's not avoid the question here. We'll take out the comparison to you so you don't have to worry about being humble here. But did you ever know a young, very attractive priest?

[Andrew Scott]

No.

[Dave Davies]

No.

[Andrew Scott]

The priests that I knew were not young or attractive.

[Terry Gross]

Right. You were raised Catholic in Dublin. What was the role of the Church in your life?

[Andrew Scott]

Well, I think it was a huge role in my life growing up. The culture is based on the Catholic Church. Ireland is a small country. I was at a Jesuit school. I'm not a practicing Catholic anymore, but certainly the culture around Catholicism is one that is very hard to dispel. And parts of it are wonderful. I think the sort of focus on community within the Catholic Church is really wonderful. And there's also, of course, the, you know, the huge amount of corruption and abuse that happened when I was growing up in the 90s. I remember, you know, driving to school. My father would drive me to school in the mornings, and we would listen to the news in the morning. And, you know, my very strong memory is of just a whole litany of abuse cases within the Catholic Church just coming out every morning.

[Terry Gross]

Sexual abuse.

[Andrew Scott]

Sexual abuse. And not just sexual abuse, but infidelity within marriages and marriages where people would be, you know, having affairs with priests and, you know, but mainly sexual abuse.

[Terry Gross]

Were you really angry with the church for having so many hypocrites in positions of religious power? You know, you talk about the priests who were accused of sexual abuse and infidelity, entering other people's marriages. And you're gay. I don't know how old you were when you realize that. Maybe all your life. But like I said in the Republic of Ireland, being gay was against the law until, I think, 1993. I think that's when it was repealed and the church condemned it. And yet you have these priests, you know, abusing boys and having affairs with women and men, probably. So how did you fit all these complicated feelings into your character of the priest in Fleabag? And it's a comedic role, too, as we could hear from the scene, the scene that we played. And he's wrestling with the natural sexual desire that people have and love physical expressions of love, too.

[Andrew Scott]

So it's not the abstinence that I have the problem with. It's the silence around the abstinence and the way that people in position of power silence people who want to be able to talk about that. And so the reason that I found that character so cathartic is that, you know, when I first had the conversation with Phoebe, I don't want to play a sort of a stereotype of somebody who is extreme in that way. This is a human being. I think that's why we like that character, because he does have a faith. I think it's a wonderful thing to be able to have romantic feelings and to also have faith and to be able to talk about the human struggle. And so I love the fact that this quite radical, sexual, kind of risque series has at its center a real addressing for young people of what faith is, because I think there's a real gap in the. For people of my generation who have been let down by the church and feel like it's not for them, to have a still space is something that would be wonderful for them if they were made feel welcome. And I think that's perhaps why Fleabag appealed to so many people, because it wasn't cynical. I think we tried to talk about religion in, of course, a humorous way, but also in a way that isn't just too judgmental of the Catholic Church. Actually. This is a person who really is struggling and is human being.

[Terry Gross]

And I love the fact that he questions his faith but constantly stays with it, that it's okay to question it. Like, if your belief is deep enough, it's okay to challenge it and question it. And remain committed.

[Andrew Scott]

Yes, exactly. Remain committed, exactly. To see that struggle, like in any relationship, in a marriage, you think this is tough. This relationship is hard. How do I keep it going? How do I talk about it? It's not just blind devot the whole time. In any relationship, you question it. And it's how you approach those crises that makes us honourable and courageous. And that's a wonderful thing to be able to convey and also, of course, just to just address.

[Terry Gross]

Did any priests give you feedback on your role in Fleabag?

[Andrew Scott]

Yeah, they did, actually. I had really, really positive feedback from priests, I think, because they liked, like all of us, like to see themselves represented in a sort of fair way and that they're not just these pious, flawless people. I think most of the feedback I got was really, really wonderful.

[Terry Gross]

I think you first became known in the U.S. in Sherlock, the BBC series that played in the U.S. as well, with Benedict Cumberbatch as Sherlock Holmes and you as his nemesis, Moriarty. So I want to play a scene from. And this is the first scene where Sherlock Holmes and Moriarty meet face to face. And Moriarty has lured Sherlock to rescue his friend Watson, who's been outfitted with an explosive vest. So Sherlock is pointing a gun at you during this entire exchange, and your character Moriarty speaks first.

[Andrew Scott]

Do you know what happens if you don't leave me alone? Sherlock to you. Oh, let me guess. I get killed. Kill you. No, don't be obvious. I mean, I'm gonna kill you anyway someday. I don't want to rush it, though. I'm saving it up for something special. No, no, no, no, no. If you don't stop prying, I'll burn you. I will burn the heart out of you. I have been reliably informed that I don't have one. But we both know that's not quite true. Well, I better be off. Well, so nice to have had a proper chat. What if I was to shoot you now, Right now? Then you could cherish the look of surprise on my face. Cuz I'd be surprised, Sherlock. Really, I would. Just a teensy bit disappointed. And of course, you wouldn't be able to cherish it for very long. Channel Sherlock Holmes. Catch you later.

[Terry Gross]

No, you won't.

[Marjan Satrapi]

So

[Terry Gross]

you play Moriarty. Big and smirky, sinister and funny. What was your audition like?

[Andrew Scott]

Like, my audition was incredibly fun. Just the day before, I knew that they were auditioning people to play Morty. And their original idea was that this character would appear almost like a. Just an image, and it would say something like, hello, Sherlock, and that would be the end of the series. But then when they realized that, lots of actors coming into audition, just saying hello, Sherlock doesn't give them much of an idea of, of. Of the actors range, you know, for future series, if they cast this actor. So they quickly wrote. Steven Moffat, the writer, quickly wrote that scene, which eventually appeared as the scene we've just listened to as an audition scene for actors to read in the audition. And they sent it maybe, I don't know, like the night before the audition. And I thought, wow, this is really fun. And I was aware that I didn't look like a villain at the time. I had quite a sort of, you know, boyish face and stuff, and so I took great pleasure in frightening them. And I knew in the audition that they were amused, but also that they were scared.

[Terry Gross]

Were you able to tap into a place in yourself that you thought could scare people?

[Andrew Scott]

Yeah, yeah, I was. I feel like one of the things that I feel quite fortunate about is that I feel quite near my emotions, you know, I feel that's stood me in good stead as an actor. I feel like it's an enormously. I don't know, it feels healthy to me to be able to access that part of you, but not really do any harm, you know? Yeah. It's a funny thing, isn't it, to be an actor?

[Terry Gross]

Yeah, yeah. I want to move on to Hamlet. You got an Olivier Award, I think, right, for your portrayal?

[Andrew Scott]

No, I might have, yeah.

[Terry Gross]

You might have. Okay.

[Andrew Scott]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Terry Gross]

How am I supposed to know if you don't know?

[Andrew Scott]

Yeah, well, I don't know. How am I supposed to know if you don't know?

[Terry Gross]

Well, anyways, you were acclaimed.

[Andrew Scott]

Yeah, okay. Yeah, you were acclaimed. People liked It. People liked it.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

Yeah.

[Terry Gross]

So you've spoken about how you wanted to make the language understandable so often, especially for Americans who sometimes have to work hard just to grasp a British accent when spoken quickly or spoken with a regional British accent. And, of course, so much of the language in Shakespeare is language that we no longer use. It's archaic, but you really wanted to make every word understandable. So I went on YouTube to see if I could find anything, and I found you doing part of the two be or not to be soliloquy, which is, of course, the most famous part. And it was so interesting because Hamlet is really thinking through, like, should I live or should I end my life? I don't know. And what's the worst that can happen if I die? What would that be like? And, of course, he's using very elevated, poetic language to say all of that. But you say it, like, really slowly. There are so many long pauses in between. For instance, to be long pause or not to be. And on the one hand, I felt like, wow, that's a lot of pauses. And on the other hand, I felt like, well, every word is ringing out, and I'm kind of hearing things I hadn't heard before. So can you describe your thoughts about those pauses and why you took them and where you took them?

[Andrew Scott]

I suppose the thing about the pauses is that he's thinking, am I going to live or am I going to die? And we're seeing that live. And, you know, your job is to not play the famous speech. Your job is to just. That speech wasn't written to be famous. It was just written to be authentic. And this is somebody who's thinking, am I going to do this or am I not going to do this? And nobody's watching him, so why wouldn't he take his time? You know, a lot of the language is archaic, but a lot of words that we still use today were invented by Shakespeare. So I have this real passion about Shakespeare. It shouldn't be kidnapped by academics. It's something that's very actable. And for young actors, if you really examine it and you're not intimidated and you're not told this isn't for you, then actually it should be really, really accessible. You may not understand every single word, but in the same way you may not understand or get every word in a rap song, you understand that there's a musicality to it, and there's a feeling that you have to get. And that could be witty, or it could be contemplative, or it could Be whatever it. And it's incredibly actable. And also Hamlet is incredibly funny. And so it was just like with all things, it's just to be able to ignore the famousness of the play. In fact, we had a thing in rehearsal called the Famous Play Buzzer where you're like, are we just doing this just because everybody knows this is what you would do. Like Hamlet's father appears to him as a ghost at the beginning of the story. And we don't know we should unlearn the fact that we don't know that that character could be in that character who only appears fleetingly, but we know that probably because we know the play so well that actually that's. He just appears to him and then he sort of, he goes for the majority of the play, but for a 16 year old who's watching it, they don't know that this character isn't going to be by his side for the rest of the rest of the rest of the show. So you have to unlearn what you already know about the famousness of the play in the same way you have to unlearn all the stuff that you know about Tom Ripley or James Moriarty or anything that you know when you're reinterpreting a famous story. So I found all that really interesting and all the stuff about Hamlet to me is fascinating because people say, oh, he's the dark prince and he's wearing, you know, the inky black cloak and blah, blah, blah. But actually this is just a guy which I, you know, I very much understand at the moment, which is a guy who's in mourning. His father has died very, very recently. So the question is that you don't drown that character in just, oh, he's just a dark, depressing guy. Where was his lightness? And so I feel like you always have to go towards the lightness when you're dealing with tragedy and a little bit like fleabag. Then you, when you're dealing with comedy, you to look for the soul. And that's what I think the great art or certainly the art that I am interested in, you know, has a bit of both. Because that's the way we are as human beings. You know, we like a bit of both. We laugh on the saddest day of our life and we cry in the middle of a brunch when we don't think we're going to. It's always within us all the time, the potential to go in either direction.

[Terry Gross]

Andrew Scott, I want to thank you so much for talking with us and your face changes from role to role. Can you pass unrecognized on the street?

[Andrew Scott]

I can, yeah. Yeah. I can sometimes, right?

[Terry Gross]

Sometimes, yeah. Do you use some kind of disguise or.

[Andrew Scott]

It depends. I'm very lucky. I can walk the streets pretty, pretty, pretty easily, you know.

[Terry Gross]

Yeah. We'll see how long that lasts.

[Andrew Scott]

I think I've been saying that for a while, so hopefully I'll be able to duck and dive into the future.

[Terry Gross]

Thank you so much for being with us.

[Andrew Scott]

Thank you so much for having me.

[Dave Davies]

Andrew Scott, speaking with Terry GROSS. Recorded in 2024, he stars in the new film Pressure. After a break, we'll remember artist and writer Marjan Satrapi, who died last week. And Justin Chang will review Steven Spielberg's new film, Disclosure Day. I'm Dave Davies, and this is FRESH air.

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[Terry Gross]

The super bowl, you might say, averages

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[Dave Davies]

Marjan Satrapi, the Iranian French author and artist of the groundbreaking graphic novel series Persepolis, died last week at the age of 56. No official cause was given, but the Guardian reported that relatives said she died of a broken heart after the death of her husband last year. Satrapi's semi autobiographical Persepolis novel, drawn in flat black and white, introduced readers to life inside Iran around the Islamic Revolution and the Iran Iraq War. It was a world unknown to many readers outside the country. Published first in French, it became an international phenomenon. The novel was adapted into a 2007 film, which was nominated for an Academy Award for best animated feature. Satrapi was born in 1969, 10 years before the Islamic Revolution. Her family was prosperous, educated and Westernized. Her parents protested against the Shah and later the Islamic regime. An uncle was jailed and executed. As we'll hear, Satrapi had a rebellious spirit, and when she was 14, her parents sent her to Austria to attend school because they were afraid she would get into trouble with the Revolutionary Guard. Four years later, depressed and missing her home country, Satrapi returned to Iran, where she earned a degree in graphic arts. She eventually returned to Austria and then moved to Paris. She became a French Citizen in 2006. Marjan Satrapi spoke to Terry Gross in 2003 when Persepolis was published in English. Marjan was 10 years old when the Islamic government made it mandatory for women and girls to wear the veil.

[Terry Gross]

One of the images that you've drawn for your new book describes what it was like after all the girls and women had to wear the veil. And in the illustration, one of the kids is strangling another girl with her chador and is saying, execution in the name of freedom. Another girl is putting the chador over her head and saying, ooh, I'm the monster of darkness. And another girl is saying, it's too hot out. So did you play with the chowder like that and, you know, strangle friends with it and pretend it was a costume and act like kids do? Well, yes.

[Marjan Satrapi]

You know, it's not because, you know, they push you to do something or you have to do it, because the situation in Iran is that if you didn't wear that on your head, you couldn't go to school. And if you were a grown up and you didn't have that on your head, you would have gone to jail. It's not. But it was not the choice of people that was like that. So of course we didn't believe in it. And as soon as we could take it off or play with it or making it look ridiculous, we did it. And this thing was really an obligation. And in no way that was the choice of Iranian people.

[Terry Gross]

During the Iran Iraq War, Iran was bombed by Iraq. Your neighborhood was bombed. In fact, a house on your block was. Was hit and one of your good friends was killed. You say in your book that you were really changed by that and it made you fearless. Why did it make you fearless?

[Marjan Satrapi]

When you see that your friend who is 13 years old, she can die, then you say, I can die also. I mean, of course, you know, when you come back to where you are and you see that, you know, people that you have known, they are gone, of course you have a very bad conscience also. To say why you should have survived and why should she die, you know, if at this moment, you know, when the bomb explodes is a question of A, I don't know, the 10th of a second or the 10th of inch is nothing really. So it could be my house. I could have died. So after that, you know, I think I accepted that I was already dead. So from the moment that, you know, your death doesn't matter anymore to you, then you're not scared. You know, all these people that they died in my country, to defending the country, to defending freedom, justice in the war, whatever, I don't know in what sense. My blood would be a little bit more red than theirs. You know, my life doesn't worth more than theirs, so I'm not scared.

[Terry Gross]

So when you stop being scared, what are some of the things you started doing that you were too afraid to do before?

[Marjan Satrapi]

Well, you know, I just came out and I always say what I think after. After that, I never swallowed my words. I never hide myself. I always thought what I think. And, you know, it doesn't matter anymore. You know, it doesn't matter. So if, you know people, they don't agree. If they agree, you know, all this hypocrisy of hiding the thing to please everyone and, you know, just want to save my skin and everything I did. Another way to save my skin was that I left my country in 94, definitely. But until the time I was there, until the time that I could speak and it had an effect, I spoke. And I still do that. That was the effect of that.

[Terry Gross]

When you stopped being afraid, were there rules you started breaking at school? Did you talk back to teachers? Did you refuse to pray when they asked you to?

[Marjan Satrapi]

Oh, yes. I even hit the director of the school, you know, because she wanted to take my. I had a little bracelet, gold, my mother gave me, and she wanted to take it. And, you know, they were just rubbing things from us. That was stealing. And I say, I don't give it. And she wanted to take it by force. And I beat her.

[Terry Gross]

Beated her with what, your fist?

[Marjan Satrapi]

Oh, no, no, no. I just, you know, I just pushed her away and well, she was like this wimp style, so she fall down and, you know, I didn't push this hard neither, but she fall down and that was a crisis. And they threw me out of the school. And it was a whole story to find another school and everything. But, you know, I don't regret it one second. If I had to do it again, I would have pushed her even harder. You know, I should just add something. All these directors of the school, during these years that I was in the school, they gave the student to the guardian of the revolution. And many kids between the age of 14 and 18 they had been killed in the prisons because of these directors that gave the children. So, you know, probably I would have beat her much harder than what I did.

[Terry Gross]

Who were the guardians of the revolution?

[Marjan Satrapi]

Well, you know, you had the army, you had the police, and then you had another style that was this guy who were dressed like rangers and they had big beard and you know, they were here to make order and you know, they were the law themselves. You know, they could stop you because they feel like stopping you, telling you that your scarf was not right or you spoke too loud or why is it for people gathered together in the street? That was a time in my country, in 81, in 82, that, you know, people, they have been shoot down in the street because they have making. They made a little demonstration, you know, the thing they had very, very, very much changed. I'm not talking about of Iran of today, that it. I hope that there won't be any confusion, but at the very beginning of the revolution, it was like that.

[Terry Gross]

Now, at the same time that you were rebelling against the authority figures in your life, like your teachers who represented the Iranian revolution, you were also rebelling against your parents.

[Marjan Satrapi]

Oh, well, that was the age, you know, that was the age I was like 12 years, 13, 14 years old. And you know, I had to confirm myself because I was getting tall and you know, I was realizing that I was a human being myself and I was not anymore just the child of my parents.

[Terry Gross]

So yes, yes, you're right, you were rebelling against your mother's dictatorship. What was she strict about?

[Marjan Satrapi]

Well, you know, because my mother, she was a real dictator and she still is, you know, from the second that the school, for example, they closed, she was convinced, and I thank her so much today she was convinced that the only way for me to get out of this whole mess was to be very well educated. So, you know, the school finished every day at 2 o'. Clock. Every day she came to pick me up at 2 o'. Clock. Three days per week I had French courses between 2 and 8, so that was three days. Then one day per week I had some German courses because I was going to go to Austria. Then I had one day of karate courses, even two days. And then the only day of weekend, which was the Friday, I had painting courses. And the rest of the time, when I came home after 8 o', clock, when we arrived, it was almost 9. I had to sit and do my homework until 11, so. And my whole family was saying to my mother, but you are mad. You're going to kill this child. And my mother said, nobody die from reading or learning. So this guy, this child is not going to die. And we are in a hectic situation. And if tomorrow she has to leave the country, she has to know everything. The more languages she knows, the more she knows how even to defend herself bodily self defense. If she knows how to draw whatever I give her, that's a new chance for her to, to be able to do something outside of this country. And she was right. Because, you know, I learned, you know, not to be lazy, probably, and to work hard after that.

[Terry Gross]

When it became easier, a few years after the revolution, for people to leave the country for visits, your parents took a short trip to Turkey and they went by themselves. It was just like the parents went and you stayed behind and they brought you back gifts. And the gifts they brought you were the kinds of western things, pop culture things, that you couldn't possibly have gotten in Iran. They got you a denim jacket, they got you an Iron Maiden poster.

[Marjan Satrapi]

Yes.

[Terry Gross]

And they had to smuggle it in. They had to figure out creative ways of smuggling this stuff into Iran. What did it mean to you to have that?

[Marjan Satrapi]

Oh, I was the coolest person in the whole school. Imagine, I had the big poster of Iron Maiden and a large poster of Kimwell. Nobody had such a. Such a thing. I was the only one. And of course, you know, I was inviting my friends coming home, watching my poster and being jealous at me. I was very, very happy to have those, though. You know, afterwards, everybody had a friend who was in Germany or somewhere else, and they were folding the posters into a letter and sending it to their, to their friend. But I had big posters, another one, they had smaller posters, so it was something. But again, you know, but my book is also to show that, you know, that's not because you're Iranian, that you're listening to revolutionary song against the west the whole day that, you know, the pop culture belongs to everyone. It's not because you're Iranian that you don't know who is Iron Maiden or who is Kim Wall or, you know, I mean, the culture in general belongs to everyone. There is no frontier. You know, your Edgar Allan Poe belongs as much to. It belongs to me as much as my poet Hafiz in Iran belongs to you. That is the heritage of all the human beings.

[Terry Gross]

Now that you're older yourself, looking back, do you think that your parents were wonderful or crazy to have almost risked their lives to smuggle in the Iron Maiden poster in the denim jacket. I mean, if they were discovered, discovered, not only would have this stuff been confiscated, they probably would have been seriously punished.

[Marjan Satrapi]

Well, I think that my parents, they were wonderfully crazy, that is both of them, they were wonderful and they were crazy, but they wanted so much to make me happy and, well, they didn't really risk their life. I mean, probably they would have, you know, they would have, they would have, you know, I don't know, take my father passport for a month and, you know, just finish with the poster and these things, you know, it was not really life risking, but it was a risk anyway. But yeah, but then I was happy for one year and I think that it's worth that for them, of course.

[Dave Davies]

Iranian French artist and writer Marjan Satrapi speaking with Terry Gross in 2003. Her graphic novel Persepolis, about growing up in Iran, became an international phenomenon. We'll hear more after after a break.

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[Terry Gross]

This week on the NPR Politics podcast, Republicans In Congress passed $70 billion in funding for immigration enforcement, 38 billion DOL to ICE alone. That represents a massive increase with little oversight attached to how the money is spent. We unpack how the move limits the power of Congress and what it could mean for the midterms. This week on the NPR Politics podcast, When you were 14, your parents sent you to a school in Austria. Why did they want you to leave the country and why did they choose Austria as the place for you to go?

[Marjan Satrapi]

Well, you know, I was too much outspoken. I was just, you know, talking all the time. And you should know that in these years, they really stopped, no matter who. I mean, in the Iranian prison, you had kids of 15 years old, 16 years old, 14 years old. You had all the ages. And this kid, they could be executed. So and then it was Bomb every day. And, you know, my parents, they had just one child and, you know, they were always so. I don't know, I mean, my mother always said, you know, I would love you so much that you should go. And she always thought that, you know, the parents, that they keep their kids close to them, they're just egoistic. And the real love is also always to give enough possibility to your kid to go. And that was the reasons they sent me abroad. And why Austria? Because Austrian, they give very easily the visa. And my mother's best friend was in Austria, and, you know, their life was not so expensive. And that was a very good French school in Austria. That's why I went to Austria.

[Terry Gross]

Did you feel like your parents were rejecting you by sending you away? Did you understand why they wanted to send you away?

[Marjan Satrapi]

Oh, yes, at this time, I understood it very well. But then when I went in Austria and I was so misjudged because, you know, now, now I am the axis of evil. But in these years, in the very early 80s, you know, I was Khomeini myself, you know, all the Iranian, they were so much misjudged, you know, by this, you know, I was escaping something and people, they were judging me, but by the thing that I escaped, myself. And it was so hard. And, you know, when you are 14, 15, 16, you don't have any friends and, you know, you don't have your parents and everybody judge you and everything. So I just cut completely with my country. I just wanted so badly, you know, to assimilate the Western culture that, you know, I just forgot who I was myself. And I went back to Iran because of this reason, because I was just too finished, too tired for that. And that is just much afterwards that I understood, understood that to assimilate another culture, first of all, I have to assume my own culture and to assume who I am myself, and then I can open myself to the other ones. And that made me go back. And at this time, I was kind of angry to my parents, you know, because I thought that it was a rejection. But it didn't last very long, you know.

[Terry Gross]

You returned to Iran when you were 18, intending to go to college there. Did you stay that long?

[Marjan Satrapi]

Oh, yes. I stayed for six years in Iran, five and a half years like that. I made the master in communication in visual communication. You know, I got married, I divorced, I worked, I did all sorts of things. And that is only after that that I came back in 94 to France. But this year that I had in Iran, first of all, I was so happy to be in Iran. And I can tell you I never partied as much as I did there because since there, you know, party was forbidden and everything was forbidden with the students, we were just, you know, we were just together almost every night making a party every night because first of all, it was forbidden. And then we lived in such a repressive society that the only way to have a balance in our personal life was to have a big freedom in our personal life.

[Terry Gross]

Where did you hold the secret parties and what were the parties like?

[Marjan Satrapi]

Oh, like the parties that you have here with more sophisticated people because, you know, again, you know, whatever is forbidden, you make it even more, for example, you know, now United States, for example, is forbidden to smoke. I smoke three times as much as I do in France, where I have the right to smoke. So that's the nature of the human being. So it was hold in the apartments, for example, in, in my apartment and everybody came and you had this Rolling Stone music and you had Deep Purple and you had, I don't know, whatever you can imagine, you know, from I don't know, whatever. And, well, we were drinking alcohol and dancing and shouting and all of that. But at the same time, we were risking to be arrested. And we have been arrested 1 billion times. I mean, how many times haven't I been arrested because, because of the fact that I was in a mixed party with my friends and then they came and, you know, they stopped us and we were one night in the jail and the day after, the parents, they had to come, they had to pay. We had to sign a paper saying that we will never start to make party again. But we did it. Life continues.

[Terry Gross]

Well, I want to thank you so much for talking with us.

[Marjan Satrapi]

Thank you very much.

[Dave Davies]

Marjan Satrapi speaking with Terry GROSS, recorded in 2003. Satrapi died last week. She was 56. Coming up, Justin Chang reviews Steven Spielberg's new science fiction thriller Disclosure Day.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

This is FRESH air support for NPR. And the following message come from GoodRx. Summer's here and with busier days and changing routines, staying healthy and on budget is top of mind. With Goodrx, you can find big savings at the pharmacy for the whole family. Pets too. Compare prescription prices at over 70,000 pharmacies and instantly find free coupons. GoodRx is not insurance, but it may beat your copay price. If you do have insurance save at the pharmacy this summer, go to goodrx.com fresh this message comes from Mint Mobile. If you're tired of spending hundreds on big wireless bills, bogus fees and free perks. Mint Mobile might be right for you with plans starting from 15 bucks a month. Shop plans [e-mail] Switch upfront payment of $45 for 3 month 5GB plan required. New customer offer for first 3 months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See Mint Mobile for details.

[Dave Davies]

Nearly 50 years after making Close Encounters of the Third Kind, Steven Spielberg returns to alien territory in his new sci fi thriller, Disclosure Day. The film, which opens everywhere in theaters today, stars Emily Blunt and Josh o' Connor as two strangers trying to expose a US Conspiracy to cover up the existence of extraterrestrial life. Disclosure Day also features Colin Firth and Colman Domingo. Our film critic Justin Chang has this review.

[Justin Chang]

Earlier this year, former President Obama made waves in an interview when he said that he believed aliens were real, though he hadn't seen any evidence of them during his time in office. President Trump accused Obama of revealing classified information, but then said that he would direct government agencies to release a number of images showing alien and extraterrestrial activity. The Pentagon rolled out those photos last month, but they were largely deemed fuzzy and inconclusive. All this might sound like free publicity for Steven Spielberg's new thriller, Disclosure Day, which is about a massive US Conspiracy to hide the fact that aliens have been visiting Earth for decades. If anything, though, the movie's pleasures feel more retro than timely. It harks back to Spielberg's greatest alien themed hits like Close Encounters of the Third Kind, E.T. and War of the Worlds, but it also feels like a throwback to the 90s and early 2000s, the era of conspiracy minded sci fi series like the X Files and M. Night Shyamalan's eerie crop circle thriller signs. Disclosure Day stars Josh o' Connor as Daniel Kellner, a cybersecurity expert who decides to blow the whistle on his employer, Wardex. That's a powerful agency operating outside the boundaries of the government that for decades has suppressed evidence of alien visits to Earth. Daniel has stolen video footage of these creatures and he feels duty bound to disclose it to the public and to expose the sinister Wardex for having captured, detained, and even tortured its share of aliens. Meanwhile, in Kansas City, Missouri, something strange happens when a TV meteorologist named Margaret Fairchild, played by Emily Blunt, tries to deliver her morning weather report. She freezes up on the air and begins making strange, guttural clicking noises, speaking what appears to be a kind of alien language.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

Good morning, Kansas City.

[Marjan Satrapi]

Let's take a look at today. Let's let's Today is today.

[Justin Chang]

Around this time, Margaret also finds that she can read the minds of the people around her, a gift that comes in handy once she too goes on the run with Wardex agents in pursuit. Although Margaret and Daniel don't know each other, they share a mysterious connection. Noah Scanlon, the head of Wardex, played by an unusually terrifying Colin Firth, is determined to stop them before they can make contact. One of Scanlan's deadliest weapons is a form of mind control technology that he uses to try to get Daniel's girlfriend Jane, played by a very good Eve Hewson, to betray him. Whatever aliens might be capable of doing to us, the movie suggests we have far more to fear from some of our fellow humans. The mind control bit is one of the movie's cleverest sequences. A scene in which Margaret stages an almost Houdini level escape is another. At 79, Spielberg is still the nimble filmmaker who delights in treating cinema as a magic trick. He's also as skilled with actors as ever. Firth injects a palpable sense of anguish into the role of the movie's big villain, and Josh o' Connor brings an Everyman like ability to his truth telling tech whiz. But the most dazzlingly inventive work comes from Emily Blunt, often a tough, sardonic screen presence, as in the devil wears Prada 2, she gets to flex her proven action and comedy muscles in a more earnest emotional register. Like Richard Dreyfuss obsessed alien seeker in Close Encounters, Margaret is the kind of madly eccentric character Spielberg instinctively gravitates toward, someone who has little idea where she's headed, but is convinced, rightly, that the truth really is out there. There are other memorable characters too. Colman Domingo gives a warm turn as a fellow whistleblower who steers the operation from afar. And Elizabeth Marvel delivers a fine performance as a Catholic nun who, in one of the film's more thoughtful asides, claims that the existence of aliens doesn't threaten her belief in God. If anything, she says, it affirms that God, like the universe he created, is far bigger and more complex than humans like to acknowledge. That's a profoundly beautiful idea, though I wish Disclosure Day itself were a more complex movie. Spielberg's storytelling is often described as overly sentimental, which isn't always fair. His previous work, the semi autobiographical the Fabelmans, was one of the most genuinely moving films of his career. But sentimentality does ultimately overwhelm Disclosure Day, especially in the big finale when the movie strains to bring its characters, and indeed all of humanity together. Having shown us some of the terrible things powerful people are capable of. Spielberg makes a third act lurch toward catharsis, as though desperate to suggest we aren't beyond redemption as a species. Like the existence of alien life, our sensual goodness is easy enough to believe in, but a lot harder to prove.

[Dave Davies]

Justin Chang is a film critic for the New Yorker. He reviewed Steven Spielberg's new film Disclosure Day on Monday's show. Author Eddie Glaud on America at 250. We talk about his new book, America USA. In the story, he says, this country keeps telling itself, from Frederick Douglass in 1876 to this 250th year and what we choose to forget. I hope you can join us to keep up with what's on the show and get highlights of our interviews. Follow us on Instagram P R Fresh Air and you can subscribe to our YouTube [e-mail] thisisfreshair. We're rolling out new videos with in studio guests, behind the scenes shorts and iconic interviews from the archives. Fresh Air's executive producer is Sam Brigger. Our technical director and engineer is Audrey Bentham, with additional engineering support from Joyce Lieberman, Julian Hertzfeld and Diana Martinez. Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Phyllis Myers, Annmarie Baldonado, Lauren Krenzel, Teresa Madden, Monique Nazareth, Thea Chaloner, Susan Yakundi, Anna Bauman and Nico Gonzalez Whistler. Our digital media producer is Molly CV Nesper. For Terry Gross and Tonya Moseley, I'm Dave Davies.

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