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- [00:01]
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- [00:16]
Tonya Moseley
This is FRESH AIR. I'm Tonya Moseley. If you've watched TV, gone to the movies or even glanced at a bus stop ad in the past year, you've probably seen Pedro Pascal staring back at you this summer alone. His face has been splashed across posters and billboards for the Fantastic Four, First Steps, Eddington and Celine Song's Materialists. He's also gearing up for Doomsday, and that's on top of an Emmy nomination for his role as Joel in HBO's the Last of Us. In the past decade, Pascal has become one of Hollywood's most magnetic leading men, often playing reluctant protectors like in the Mandalorian and the Last of Us who who find family in the unlikeliest of places. That connection between found family on screen and his own life came into sharp focus during his Saturday Night live monologue in 2023 when he credited his parents for making sacrifices to bring him to the United States from South America, a journey that began with political exile and helped shape a career defined in part by portraying outsiders finding their way in. That combination of personal history and on screen vulnerability has made him something rare in Hollywood, a star that people feel like they know. A recent New Yorker cartoon captured it perfectly. A therapist tells a client it's not strange at all. Lately, a lot of people are reporting that their faith in humanity is riding entirely on whether or not Pedro Pascal is as nice as he seems. To Pedro Pascal, welcome to FRESH air.
- [01:53]
Pedro Pascal
You will have to assess and share with everybody whether this is true, I suppose.
- [01:57]
Tonya Moseley
Well, I think we're getting off to a great start. Congratulations on your Emmy nomination. It's a really big deal for you.
- [02:04]
Pedro Pascal
Oh, gosh, thanks very much. Thank you.
- [02:07]
Tonya Moseley
Well, let's talk about the Last of Us. So I want to get folks up to speed if they don't know it. The Last of Us is based on this hit video game set in this post apocalyptic America overrun by this fungal outbreak that turns people into the deadly infected. So basically like zombies on steroids. And at its core, it's about your character, Joel, who is really contending with the loss of his daughter and trying to survive in spite of all of this. And Ellie, a teenage girl. You all connect and she might be humanity's last hope. We've watched you guys survive these Impossible circumstances.
- [02:46]
Pedro Pascal
And.
- [02:47]
Tonya Moseley
And then season two happens and I'm gonna spoil it. You die very early on in a very brutal way. And I was completely blindsided. I know you have heard this before, but I actually had to take a break for a moment.
- [03:01]
Pedro Pascal
Sure.
- [03:02]
Tonya Moseley
Because it was so much, even for you, it was a lot to see your character die.
- [03:07]
Pedro Pascal
I understand. I mean, it's happened to me on other shows I've watched. I've had to take breaks whenever they throw these kinds of blindsides.
- [03:15]
Tonya Moseley
Yeah.
- [03:16]
Pedro Pascal
It's very sadistic to be attached to something. They know it and they play with us and we stick around.
- [03:24]
Tonya Moseley
Right. You know it. In taking on the role I did.
- [03:26]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah. So that's kind of how. And of course, the whole world of gaming really opened up to me when I took on this part. So it was just such a monumentally successful video game. And the medium of storytelling within this, within gaming is also very sophisticated and more and more so over the last, you know, decade.
- [03:51]
Tonya Moseley
It's a cinematic experience in itself, playing.
- [03:53]
Pedro Pascal
The video game, and also a very literary one as well because of how complex the stories can be and so all kinds of genres. And this one obviously really being unique in how kind of grounded it was in its human characters. Right. And the more skill you have at playing the game, the more you can unlock the story as it unfolds. Right. Because my nephews lost their minds when they found out that I had gotten this job and I hadn't heard of it. I hadn't heard of the game.
- [04:26]
Tonya Moseley
You tell this funny story where they weren't just excited, they were like.
- [04:29]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah, they were like screaming. I called my older sister and they were in the car and I was on speaker and I didn't even get the four words out. I just got the last. And they were like, the last of us. You gotta do it. You know? And so that being said, because of the nature of what the character story arc is and how structured it is, on the adaptation, it was always a one season deal. And then the second season would be very committed to the second part of the game. And that it was all pretty mapped.
- [05:07]
Tonya Moseley
Out in terms of, like your character was for a finite amount of time, you're gonna die.
- [05:12]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah. And that he was gonna go early like he does in the experience of the game.
- [05:18]
Tonya Moseley
So in season two, you have now connected deeply with Ellie, who is a young girl, 16 years old, who might hold the key to curing this fungus that has taken over the world. She's immune to it. And you all are on this journey together. You meet up and you're connected. And so you're moving through this world together, and you make this choice that changes the ability for her to actually maybe be the person that could provide the cure. And so in this scene, which is a spoiler, you explain to her why you've made the choices that you've made to keep her in the relationship with you instead of possibly being the person that could provide the cure. Let's listen.
- [06:07]
Pedro Pascal
Making a cure would have killed you. Then I was supposed to die.
- [06:16]
Tonya Moseley
That was my purpose.
- [06:18]
Pedro Pascal
My life would have mattered. But you took that from me. You took it from everyone. Yes, and I'll pay the price, because you're gonna turn away from me. But if somehow I had a second chance, at that moment, I would do it all over.
- [06:52]
Tonya Moseley
Because you're selfish.
- [06:55]
Pedro Pascal
Because I love you in a way you can't understand. Maybe you never will. But if that day should come, if you should ever have one of your own, well, then I hope you do a little better than me.
- [07:41]
Tonya Moseley
Man, look at us. We about to start crying in the studio. That was my guest today, Pedro Pascal, in season two of the Last of Us. Ellie goes on to say to you, I don't think I can forgive you, but I'm going to try. When you think back to that choice, Joel choosing to keep her alive, to love her, and for his own comfort over those other, bigger things, the greater good for society because she might hold a cure for this fungal thing that's spreading across the world, how do you see him now? Like, do you see his decision as selfish or something more complicated?
- [08:21]
Pedro Pascal
You know, it's interesting. I think, that the primary way that I was able to understand it is that it isn't a choice. He is incapable of losing her and incapable of processing in a rational way what would be a profound sacrifice for him for the greater good. It is not something he is able to understand because of all of his unprocessed grief and loss over his original daughter that he was unable to save, that he's lived with. That is literally the kind of defining factor of his adult identity. Post Apocalypse. He is. He is the man that didn't save his daughter's life. And he, before that, he was the man that lived for his daughter's life. And so once he's stepped into, reluctantly, but inevitably, into that kind of a relationship again, he's incapable of giving her up. And I can imagine. So I can't objectively say that that's the right thing to do. And given any kind of, like, you know, God forbid any of us find ourselves in circumstances like these.
- [09:56]
Tonya Moseley
Right, Right.
- [09:57]
Pedro Pascal
You would just hope that you would do, you know, the right thing. But who knows what any of us would be capable of when it is related to love and grief and loss and trauma and. And all those things. And so I was always like, well, he didn't have a choice, you know, even though he very clearly did, but not one that he was in relationship to. It's almost like his own, like, body could only see one way. I just don't know what my initial instinct would be, but I would sort of like one of nurture a mind that knows that violence is never the answer. But it's not hard to again, because it's all imagination and sort of, like emotional play and make believe. As dark as it may be, it is make believe in the end. So it is easy, very easy for me to imagine taking somebody out if they're coming for my own.
- [11:05]
Tonya Moseley
I know. So could you survive Pedro, for real? Like, in a real life, if this.
- [11:11]
Pedro Pascal
Was like, I don't think so. I don't know. I think if the people that I love were sticking around and being like, you know, no, we gotta deal with this. And I'd be like, oh, shoot, okay. All right, let's face this. Because I'd be too scared of leaving anybody behind or leaving anybody on their own. But I don't know. I'm definitely not down for stress.
- [11:37]
Tonya Moseley
Right. I mean, because there's the constant fear of the people you love, keeping them safe constantly.
- [11:42]
Pedro Pascal
Exactly. And that's what keeps you going. That's kind of what keeps you alive. With Joel, I think it's different because he feels he's lost all the people that he loves, and then he doesn't really let himself love anymore. He's looking for his brother at the beginning of the first season, his brother, whom he loves very much. But outside of that, he's not allowing himself to love. So it really is simply survival. And I don't know if I would have that.
- [12:09]
Tonya Moseley
Will you hosted SNL in 2023, but we're still talking about it like it was just yesterday. It comes up often, you know, it's like, a high point for many actors. What did it mean for you?
- [12:22]
Pedro Pascal
Oh, everything I have to say, I'm trying to lean away from being too hyperbolic about it, but it was definitely, like, the most romantic experience I've ever had.
- [12:36]
Tonya Moseley
Romantic?
- [12:37]
Pedro Pascal
Professionally, yeah.
- [12:38]
Tonya Moseley
What do you mean by that?
- [12:39]
Pedro Pascal
Its legacy, you know, number one, what it has authored in terms of culture, for better or worse. You know, since it started. And so it's just something I grew up with. Some of its original stars are my biggest imprints. I mean, Eddie Murphy came from snl.
- [13:04]
Tonya Moseley
I know, right? Do you. I'm thinking about.
- [13:06]
Pedro Pascal
SNL gave us Eddie Murphy, right?
- [13:08]
Tonya Moseley
Were you thinking about that during your time on there?
- [13:11]
Pedro Pascal
I was thinking about all of that. And then I think that what I was expecting was all of that to really kind of make it a miserable experience because I would be so afraid and so in my head about bombing on live TV and really like marking a point in my life with public humiliation.
- [13:33]
Tonya Moseley
I have so much to hold.
- [13:36]
Pedro Pascal
I know, I know. But let's just say, you know, you hold it, but you start to let it go.
- [13:42]
Tonya Moseley
Was there a moment you gradually let it go where you were like, oh, I'm doing fine?
- [13:45]
Pedro Pascal
There is a process that is so. It's so ritual. And we have such an incredible community of actors, you know, that have gone through the experience and so many of which that were so willing to kind of talk to me before I went into it because, you know, it's something you feel you can't say no to. But also with the offer is terror before excitement, which is the case for many people that I've spoken to.
- [14:13]
Tonya Moseley
Did you call up or did people call you up when they found out you're going to be on there?
- [14:18]
Pedro Pascal
For the first couple of weeks, I didn't talk to anybody because I wasn't willing to think about it beyond my capacity of facing the reality that it was going to happen. And then once there was an announcement and it was out there, then I started to. I talked to friends that had been on it. But right before I got into like my first sort of like Monday night meeting with the cast and the writers and Lorne Michaels, I was talking to Aubrey Plaza, who had just hosted and had slayed. And she took me through this process and she was just like, just go with it. Monday's, this, Tuesday's. That Wednesday starts to ramp up and it starts to turn into this. And then Thursday, like, you know, like, save yourself. You're gonna. The Wednesday night dinner. Don't get too drunk. Because on Thursday is when it really.
- [15:08]
Tonya Moseley
Is, you know, because at dinner is when it's the whole cast.
- [15:12]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah, yeah. And you have a dinner and it's like it's all a ritual that has been fine tuned or very much in place from its very beginning. But it definitely feels like you are in this, like decades long experience that holds you very, very well. And on Monday, the First thing was going in and having a one on one with Lorne in his office and sitting across from this legendary person in the intimacy of just the two of you having. I don't know what we were going to talk about. Well, you know, I just did. Not just. I didn't care. I was just. I'm just going to sit there and I'm going to listen or you know, I hope he doesn't. I hope I'm not meant to contribute anything because all I have right now is fear. And to my left is this fish tank with these big eyed, blinking, smiling, kind of bulbous lipped fish that are, you know, kind of like curiously swimming up to the glass to check out the new face, the stranger in the office. And it's just giving you this sweet dumb smile and blinking at you. And it was so disarming. I have no idea if it is intentional on his part. But it worked for you. Oh my God, did it work? And then he is somebody that really wants to set you up for success. And I felt very seen. And then comes the community of actors and writers that are all fully enthusiastic and passionate about what they do and get really excited if you're down to do whatever.
- [16:58]
Tonya Moseley
And you were down whatever they want. Oh, heck yeah, you were down. So my producers and I had a debate, really about what clip to play because they were all so funny. But I want to play a clip from a skit you did called Fancam Assembly. So you play Mr. Ben. He's a popular high school teacher. He's leading this assembly with all these students in an auditorium about the tech rules of the school. Specifically begging kids to stop making fan cams of you, Mr. Ben. And just to let the audience know since they can't see it. Like these fancam videos, you're like, I mean, you know, they're edits. They're like you're hot. Like you're looking at the camera, smoldering, you know, like you're all of this. And the students push back when you say, like, don't do this anymore. They push back. They withstand slang and they keep cutting together new fancams of you in real time. Let's listen.
- [17:55]
Pedro Pascal
No, Skinny legend. Why are you doing this? Because you have made thousands of fancams of me and I'm not sure what they mean, but I know it has to stop.
- [18:07]
Tonya Moseley
But we make them because you're our.
- [18:09]
Pedro Pascal
Beloved and you have us in a chokehold. Okay, don't say that. I just don't understand. Why do you make sparkly Fast romantic montages of me every single day like this. I mean, we don't make them every day.
- [18:36]
Tonya Moseley
Yeah, just on the days you send.
- [18:38]
Pedro Pascal
Us or give us life. What does that mean?
- [18:42]
Tonya Moseley
Don't worry. It just means your foot is always on our necks. See?
- [18:51]
Pedro Pascal
Is that. Is that me right now? How did you make that so fast? And how did you take over access to the monitor? Mr. Ben, why are you so mad? You're in your assembly era. I'm not mad. I'm confused. Is the way I ate this up a compliment because it was nom nom delish and had you gagged? Exactly.
- [19:15]
Tonya Moseley
We love you down, Mr. Ben. You're so father, period. That was my guest today, Pedro Pascal, on SNL from 2023. Have you ever had a surreal moment where you're like, oh, my gosh, Wow. I am a meme. I am a certified meme. And people are making edits of me every day, hundreds of them on TikTok and Instagram.
- [19:40]
Pedro Pascal
I love the young generation so much just listening to that and all of the phrasing. I just die for it. I really do. And I came to it kind of late. You know, I've just. Like, everybody. I don't know what year we're talking about, but at some point, you know, I had Facebook and then came Instagram. TikTok I didn't have. I think, yes, at one point, it found its way, like, into my algorithm. But I think that, like.
- [20:14]
Tonya Moseley
You found your way into your algorithm?
- [20:16]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm gonna call it. It. I'm gonna call that it found its way into my algorithm because, you know, which are also kind of, you know, brilliant, hilarious edits to songs. And I definitely am flattered, totally perplexed by a lot of it, because, I don't know. I mean, how would you feel? You know what I mean? Like, you just have to kind of just sort of go, all right, right, right.
- [20:49]
Tonya Moseley
Just let it be.
- [20:50]
Pedro Pascal
Just kind of like. Because it authors itself on its own, really. And so there's a strange relationship. You feel you don't have to a thing that's kind of happening.
- [21:02]
Tonya Moseley
Our guest today is actor Pedro Pascal. We'll be right back after a short break. I'm Tanya Mosley, and this is Fresh Air.
- [21:10]
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- [21:26]
Tonya Moseley
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- [21:29]
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- [21:31]
Tonya Moseley
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- [21:50]
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- [22:23]
Tonya Moseley
You moved to New York for college and you got deep into the theater. You had these small roles on television, Law and Order, some other little bits.
- [22:33]
Pedro Pascal
All of them.
- [22:35]
Tonya Moseley
All of them. Right. But your breakthrough role did not happen until 2014 with Game of Thrones. And I want to go back to that time period because I think you talked about, like it was 15 years of entry level for you, which a lot of those years were in the theater. That's 15 years of climbing, of near success. Because what had been success for you up until that moment.
- [23:01]
Pedro Pascal
Success up to that moment, which was huge because I tell you, when you get a call and they say you booked apart, whether it's like, you know, two scenes in an episode of Law and Order, you know, you jump up and down. And it always felt that way. And as I got older, I think that there was incredible success in just supporting myself through acting and.
- [23:28]
Tonya Moseley
And you were doing this through theater.
- [23:30]
Pedro Pascal
Through theater and episodic television.
- [23:32]
Tonya Moseley
Yep, yep.
- [23:32]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah. And the medical insurance through Equity, which was our stage actors union, was really good. I don't know how good it is now.
- [23:43]
Tonya Moseley
Yeah.
- [23:43]
Pedro Pascal
But it was these kinds of things really, really help you survive. And even though you're, you know, barely, like, what you're actually putting into the bank is barely enough to. Well, it's not nearly enough to pay your rent, but there are a lot of elements in place with consistent work that just kind of help you get by.
- [24:02]
Tonya Moseley
What were some of the things you were doing in those in between times? Between roles, between theater roles and this episodic television appearances?
- [24:10]
Pedro Pascal
I was working in restaurants, and I was never good at it because that's a real skill. You know, service is highly. Highly demanding work and highly laborious. And I mean, a lot of it can be. Anyway, some busy restaurants. I mean, that is some higher octane.
- [24:30]
Tonya Moseley
Is it true that you got fired, like, 10 times?
- [24:32]
Pedro Pascal
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [24:34]
Tonya Moseley
From different restaurants?
- [24:35]
Pedro Pascal
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Different cafes that were opening up from, like, I got fired from being a barista to being a.
- [24:41]
Tonya Moseley
What was like, the number one reason. That's a lot of firings, Pedro.
- [24:46]
Pedro Pascal
I know, I know. You know, there would be a lot of different reasons. I'd be lying if I didn't say that. Sometimes it was attitude. Yeah. I'm not perfect. And. Yeah, some one. One manager didn't like my attitude, or one customer didn't like my attitude, or I just wasn't very. Honestly, I wasn't very good at it. I didn't get good at it until. It took years to get good at it and to be sort of consistently in one place, there was a. I can't believe I'm talking about this, but there was a restaurant manager named Alyssa. And it's funny. We can turn this into kind of the theme of. Of feeling and being seen and kind of believed in.
- [25:34]
Tonya Moseley
Yeah.
- [25:34]
Pedro Pascal
You know what I mean? I had that at a restaurant, and she kind of, you know, she sort of stuck it out with me, and she. She really, really kind of helped me learn instead of through kind of pressure and antagonism, but support. How to wait tables. Well, and she was just kind of like on your side as a restaurant manager. And I felt that to be kind of like a rare and very refreshing kind of energy.
- [26:06]
Tonya Moseley
What was it about acting? Because you started talking about wanting to be an actor at, like, 4 years old.
- [26:12]
Pedro Pascal
Well, I was born in 75. And just think about seeing E.T. in the movie theater. You know, think about seeing Poltergeist and the Goonies and, you know, Gremlins and, you know, so I was very, very easy source of building a fantasy of, you know, wishing you were either living these adventures, experiencing these adventures, or part of the adventure of telling those stories.
- [26:44]
Tonya Moseley
Yeah. You know, I keep coming across these little details, like you being obsessed with the Color Purple.
- [26:49]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah.
- [26:50]
Tonya Moseley
James Baldwin for Colored Girls, To Kill a Mockingbird. So you were really into literature as well. And I'm trying to piece together who is this kid. How would you describe yourself back then? You were a deeply feeling child. But what did these worlds provide for you? Because, you know, they're entertaining for everyone else. But it sounds like there was another step further for you where you felt immersed in them.
- [27:13]
Pedro Pascal
Well, I think being moved, you feel very alive. You feel very inspired, you know, and in school, in a way, by incredible storytelling, incredible performances, incredible literature, you know. So the process around the Color Purple is very interesting because we had cable tv and Whoopi Goldberg had a televised show that had been transferred to Broadway and then shot for television for hbo. It was just called Whoopi.
- [27:48]
Tonya Moseley
Yes.
- [27:49]
Pedro Pascal
And she was playing a bunch of different characters, and I was just floored. It was magic. And with that show, Whoopi, I mean, I saw that so many times. I could do some of her monologues.
- [28:06]
Tonya Moseley
The hair and the towel.
- [28:07]
Pedro Pascal
Oh, my gosh. And he said, okay. I said, okay. We said, okay. Okay. And I mean, I literally haven't. I haven't seen that since, I think, the 80s, you know, and it's imprinted, right. And then I'm walking out of a movie, and I see a poster of this, like, silhouette of Whoopi Goldberg in a rocking chair with purple and Steven Spielberg's name on it and her name, Whoopi Goldberg in the Color Purple. And I'm just like, here I am, completely moved by the marketing of it. And I think the movie is a masterpiece. And I think it's one of the greatest screen performances in the history of cinema that she did in her purely freshman experience, her first time on camera, on film, her first movie role.
- [29:02]
Tonya Moseley
Right.
- [29:03]
Pedro Pascal
And I just was, frankly, overwhelmed, you know, by it in the best way. And I couldn't let it go. So I had to get the book, and I read the book.
- [29:11]
Tonya Moseley
You'd walk around with the book.
- [29:12]
Pedro Pascal
I would hold it. Yeah. I would hold it like a. Like a. Like a treasure.
- [29:18]
Tonya Moseley
Your mom saw this in you. She saw this and wanted to connect with you because of it. You guys would have these family movie nights.
- [29:27]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah, yeah. My dad. My dad was. My dad was the. Was the. Was the moviegoer. My mom was selective. She would fall for. She would notice much more if I was, like, really into a book or if Prince was in it.
- [29:49]
Tonya Moseley
So you were a big Prince. Prince fan. But that also.
- [29:51]
Pedro Pascal
But she was. No, she was the Prince fan.
- [29:53]
Tonya Moseley
Okay.
- [29:53]
Pedro Pascal
She was the huge Prince fan, which by proxy, made me a big Prince fan.
- [29:58]
Tonya Moseley
And that's around Purple Rain time.
- [30:00]
Pedro Pascal
Oh, yeah.
- [30:02]
Tonya Moseley
Let's take a short break. If you're just joining us, my guest is Pedro Pascal. We'll continue our conversation after a short break. This is FRESH AIR.
- [30:11]
Pedro Pascal
On the next through line from NPR.
- [30:13]
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- [30:20]
Pedro Pascal
If something happened to a president who was still alive, the consequences for the country would have been enormous.
- [30:28]
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The 25th Amendment. Listen in the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [30:35]
Pedro Pascal
There's a lot of news happening. You want to understand it better, but let's be honest, you don't want it to be your entire life either. Well, that's sort of like our show Here and Now Anytime. Every weekday on our podcast, we talk to people all over the country about everything from political analysis to climate resilience, video games. We even talk about dumpster diving on this show. Check out here and Now Anytime. A daily podcast from NPR and wbur.
- [30:58]
Tonya Moseley
What were these movie nights like, these family movie nights?
- [31:01]
Pedro Pascal
Well, Purple Rain is a perfect example of where we all went together. Like, my dad would try to, you know, take us on a school night whenever he got a chance to whatever he wanted to see. But Purple Rain was like, we're all going, you know, and I guess they're sort of, you know, my most special memories. We're a very sort of like movie going family. My older sister has a love of dance and did ballet, so we would go to the. As a child, she studied ballet and so we would go to the ballet a lot. I hated it at first until I saw, I think a really hilarious production of A Midsummer Night's Dream and then started to kind of really appreciate the kind of storytelling that happened through dance.
- [31:54]
Tonya Moseley
Did you ever dance?
- [31:55]
Pedro Pascal
I didn't, I didn't dance. I mean, I danced, you know, like at any chance I got.
- [32:01]
Tonya Moseley
Yeah. To Prince and stuff.
- [32:02]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I danced around the house, I danced around my parents, parties, Christmas, New Year's, all that. All that stuff. I never took class, but then in a performing arts program that my mother found that I went to, from my freshman year in high school to graduation, you had to study dance, you know, did west side Story. And I love dance and actually got sort of really seriously into I guess what you would call sort of post modern style of improvisational dance in college. And that was the only work I could get when I graduated actually were through movement professors and doing a lot of downtown stuff.
- [32:43]
Tonya Moseley
When you say downtown, what do you mean?
- [32:44]
Pedro Pascal
South of 14th Street, St. Mark's Church, Lower east side, East Village, site specific performances. This piece called Demeter's Daughter that was conceived by a choreographer named Tamar Rogoff, who is a lifelong family friend and mentor to Claire Danes.
- [33:03]
Tonya Moseley
And what kinds of stuff would you do for them?
- [33:05]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah, like postmodern dance. Like, you know, sort of create movement and dance. And then it wasn't the kind of thing like, this is the choreography. Learn it. It was like, let's move and let's write this together.
- [33:23]
Tonya Moseley
Kind of like improvisation, but for the.
- [33:25]
Pedro Pascal
Body, for body movement.
- [33:27]
Tonya Moseley
I'm so fascinated about that physicality because there is a holding of the body in all the characters that you play. I'm thinking about in the Last of Us. Like, how would you describe what Joel is holding in his body?
- [33:44]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah, holding A lot of Trauma one. And then in a more simple way, this is a man who works with his hands. He's a contractor, and he builds things. He, I think, expresses himself through his physical relationship to work and to maintenance and that kind of thing. So it's sort of like understanding a person who works very roughly with his hands and is in sort of a very consistent relationship to physical labor, you know, in a way that he probably loves, because it's way easier than having a conversation.
- [34:39]
Tonya Moseley
Right, right. But it's so fascinating about you and your history with dancing because, I mean, so much of. Well, so much of your acting is so physical. Like, I'm just thinking about a lot of films that you're in. There's so much silent power in what you're doing, but it's through your. That you're telling the story.
- [34:56]
Pedro Pascal
Well, Game of Thrones being a perfect example of, like, experiencing, you know, that level of exposure for a part. And one would argue that what the role is most known for is the fight.
- [35:13]
Tonya Moseley
Yes.
- [35:14]
Pedro Pascal
And that is more dance than you can possibly believe if you don't want to get killed anyway, you know, that is. That is. That is physicality in its purest form, and that is choreography in its purest form. So it's just ironic because I was already pushing 40 when that job happened, and so the doors that opened were, frankly, leaning in the world of action and a lot of highly, highly, highly physical choreography in the experiences. More so than I could have ever imagined, having had a lot of, like, fight choreography on stage, you know, in Shakespeare and all that. But this was like, another level.
- [36:05]
Tonya Moseley
Your family history is fascinating because your parents fled Chile when you were a baby growing up. What was the story that you heard?
- [36:15]
Pedro Pascal
You know, I didn't hear any stories about it, actually. And I hear stories now because I ask. And I also am met with the sort of desire to share and desire to tell what it meant for, you know, my father's sisters to say goodbye to their brother in in that way, for my mother's family to live in the terror of the experience of her going into hiding.
- [36:45]
Tonya Moseley
Because what's the story? Because the story that you came to learn, your parents were very young, you were a baby, and they fled from South America to the United States to Texas.
- [36:56]
Pedro Pascal
Yes. We had asylum in Denmark first and were likely to, you know, stay there, were it not for somebody that helped hire my father into his lab in San Antonio, Texas.
- [37:08]
Tonya Moseley
Why were your parents exiled?
- [37:10]
Pedro Pascal
Oh, well, they were involved in the opposition movement against the military regime under Pinochet. They were Allende supporters and, frankly, just very young and liberal. And my mother's side of the family, there's a cousin of my mother's, Andres Pascal, who was a leader of the opposition movement. And so that I think, just by association, sort of could put the name and family in peril. But there was someone who brought an injured man to my mother's and father's home, knowing that my father was doing his residency at a hospital and asked for help. And he'd been shot in the leg. And the. It was a. It was a priest who brought him over to. To our house. And. And, you know, at this point, I'm an infant, so obviously I have no memory, but the priest was taken into custody, and he was tortured, and he gave names. And. And then they went looking, looking for my parents. And. And, you know, and so they. They had to, you know, go into hiding and find a way to survive. There are a lot of details that kind of go into it that create, like, such a fascinating story. The odd circumstance of my father finding out that someone was in the lobby asking for his name and a patient that kind of, like, interrupted the moment where the officer wanted to. Was about to ask my father who he was or his name, if he was doctor, in fact, Dr. Balmaceda. And a patient that was like, you know, I'm in pain, and no one is attending to me. And I almost wonder. I mean, you know, you got to be careful because, you know, how much story do you build around it and what's really real? But this was this chance circumstance that gave my father the opportunity to sneak out the back to go and get my mother and go into hiding. And they were right because they came to the house, they tore everything apart, and it was about six months before they found a plan to sneak into the Venezuelan Embassy and claim asylum and be reunited with my sister and I.
- [39:43]
Tonya Moseley
What a story to learn in a adulthood. It's not a lore. It's not a story. You grew up knowing and having pride in.
- [39:51]
Pedro Pascal
Right. I had a sense of it. I remember one very, very vivid experience of seeing the movie Missing. See, this is the funny thing is that like here we are, this nuclear family in the suburbs of San Antonio, Texas, with this not distant legacy of escape. I mean, the dictatorship was continuing on and I'm seeing a movie about it in my house. And Sissy Spacek is the size of my mother.
- [40:20]
Tonya Moseley
Right.
- [40:21]
Pedro Pascal
Because the age of my mother and the movie Missing. Right. By Costa Gravas.
- [40:24]
Tonya Moseley
Yes.
- [40:25]
Pedro Pascal
And her, you know, being out in the streets past curfew by accident and her life being in peril and me somehow putting all of that together and understanding that sort of placing my mother in that circumstance as a child and just like absolutely falling apart. How old were you when the movie came out in? I must have been like, I don't know, maybe seven.
- [40:51]
Tonya Moseley
Wow.
- [40:53]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah. It was a different time. Parents were letting us parents. Parents were letting us watch whatever was on tv.
- [40:59]
Tonya Moseley
But I'm saying, wow, about you piecing that together and somehow understanding Sissy Zbasek is, is my mom.
- [41:06]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah. Feeling that way, feeling that way, feeling that way in that moment. And I, it had to stop. I fell apart.
- [41:12]
Tonya Moseley
You literally started crying.
- [41:14]
Pedro Pascal
Oh, I started. I mean, it was like, you know, I think something, you know, bordering on howling. I was so. Did you ever traumatized by the idea? I don't know. I never got a chance to talk to my mom about it the way I'm talking to you about it, you know, unfortunately, I wonder if she understood. But yeah, I guess just to answer it simply, no, not really.
- [41:48]
Tonya Moseley
When you say you wonder if she understood, what do you mean if she.
- [41:50]
Pedro Pascal
Understood that I was kind of a son who was scared for her, you know, and kind of absorbing the context but not really knowing how to process the context.
- [42:04]
Tonya Moseley
If you're just joining us, my guest is Pedro Pascal. We'll continue our conversation after a short break. This is FRESH air. Do you ever look at political headlines and go, huh? Well, that's exactly why the NPR Politics Podcast exists. We're experts not just on politics, but in making politics make sense. Every episode, we decode everything that happened in Washington and help you figure out what it owns means. Give politics a chance with the NPR Politics Podcast, available wherever you get your podcasts. Pop culture Happy Hour NPR's Easy Breezy, laid back pop culture podcast has brought you the best in culture for the past 15 years.
- [42:44]
Pedro Pascal
That means we spent the last 15 years talking about what exactly?
- [42:47]
Tonya Moseley
Bad reality TV actually good Marvel movies, actually awful. Marvel Movies, reboots, pop music, prestige dramas, Netflix slob. That's 15 years of buzzy pop culture chit chat. And here's to many more. With you along for the ride, listen to Pop Culture Happy hour on the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts. Movies have been so important to you in your life.
- [43:11]
Pedro Pascal
Everything.
- [43:12]
Tonya Moseley
Yeah. They allow you to understand the world.
- [43:15]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [43:17]
Tonya Moseley
And now you're doing that for other people. Do you ever think about it like that?
- [43:21]
Pedro Pascal
I feel profound gratitude to be doing something that I love to do and, and the people that I get to do it with and being sort of always a part of an experience, you know, whether it's well received or not, but always like everyone involved is putting their entire selves and bodies into, you know, and. And cares so much about. About making it. And it's very bonding, it's very fun, and I don't know anything else.
- [43:53]
Tonya Moseley
That SNL appearance, it also happened on the anniversary of your mother's death. Mm, yeah. Did you clock that for yourself?
- [44:03]
Pedro Pascal
I really did. It was obviously a sad anniversary for most of my adult life and for my, you know, my family's life, my siblings, you know, their whole lives. And I don't think I realized it until there was kind of like a post it note announcement in the way that SNL does, where they have the date, the host and the musical guest. And I realized that I hadn't. I hadn't seen that I hadn't seen those numbers together outside of my mother's gravestone. I was like, oh, my gosh. Wow. And of course, there was so much opportunity there to sort of add fear to the experience in a profound way. This is going to be a double negative anniversary. And it was the opposite. And my family was there and it was a day of like, achievement and joy, incredible joy and community. Because the other magical part of SNL is that it really actually felt like old days in the theater, like showing up and doing a reading of somebody's play or like mounting something on the fly, you know. And were it not for all of those years, I think in New York, I think I cognitively could have easily had a total meltdown because of how you are needing to read cue cards and be in the moment so that it would be, you know, on February 4th was a gift that I'm holding onto.
- [45:55]
Tonya Moseley
What a gift.
- [45:56]
Pedro Pascal
Yeah.
- [45:57]
Tonya Moseley
Oh, Pedro, this has been great.
- [45:59]
Pedro Pascal
Thank you, Tanya. Thank you so much for having me. I can't tell you this is part of my little pinch me moment. I told you before, we started. I've been listening to NPR through my parents since I was a teenager and my entire adult life. I've been listening to FRESH AIR forever. And getting to sit here with you is very special.
- [46:20]
Tonya Moseley
Pedro Pascal. He's nominated for an Emmy Award for his performance in season two of the Last of Us. His film Fantastic Four, First Steps, is still in theaters, and Eddington and the Materialists are now streaming. Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Phyllis Myers, Roberta Shorrock, Ann Marie Baldonado, Lauren Krenzel, Teresa Madden, Monique Nazareth, Susan Yakundi, Anna Bauman and John Sheehan. Our digital media producer is Molly CV Nesper. Our consulting visual producer is Hope Wilson. Thea Chaloner directed Today's show with Terry Gross. I'm Tanya Mosley.
- [46:58]
Capital One Ad
On the Throughline podcast, you have the.
- [47:01]
Pedro Pascal
Right to remain silent.
- [47:02]
Capital One Ad
It's a staple of cop shows.
- [47:04]
Tonya Moseley
When I think of Miranda today, I.
- [47:06]
Capital One Ad
Think it's so misshapen now that it's.
- [47:09]
Tonya Moseley
Really lost its ability to do much good. The Fifth Amendment and the right to remain silent.
- [47:17]
Capital One Ad
Listen to Throughline in the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [47:23]
Tonya Moseley
Stars, they're just like us. John Legend goes to cbs. Well, that's because he has his own skincare line.
- [47:29]
Pedro Pascal
It was so exciting to actually go into one of those stores. We had the end caps.
- [47:34]
Tonya Moseley
Were you like, I don't want this locked up. John Legend is one of many stars riding the celebrity branding wave. He tells us about it on the indicator from Planet Money. Listen in the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.