The News Quiz Ep5. Starmer psychodrama

Summary

Friday Night Comedy from BBC Radio 4

The News Quiz Ep5: "Starmer Psychodrama"

Date: May 22, 2026
Host: Andy Zaltzman
Guests: Mary Black, Ian Smith, Nish Kumar, Katie Balls

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Overview

In this episode, The News Quiz dissects another tumultuous week in British politics, centering on Keir Starmer’s leadership woes, Labour infighting, and swirling scandals. The show’s trademark satirical wit skewers recent events, including Wes Streeting’s resignation, Andy Burnham’s attempted return, peculiar Scottish elections, and farcical headlines involving potholes, Royal Navy uniforms, and political financial scandals. The panel of comedians and journalists offers sharp comedic relief from current affairs, wrapped in typically irreverent BBC Radio 4 humor.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Keir Starmer’s “Psychodrama” and Labour Party Turmoil

[01:44–04:33]

• Leadership whispers: Nish Kumar suggests Starmer is precariously positioned, citing Wes Streeting’s resignation and lack of an open leadership challenge (“he does not have the requisite 81 MPs to mount a challenge directly”).
• Controversy: Kumar humorously labels Peter Mandelson as “paedophile adjacent,” alluding to his proximity to Jeffrey Epstein (03:30).

  “We have to believe that we deserve more than a Prime Minister who is paedophile adjacent adjacent.” – Nish Kumar (04:27)

• Reluctance and plotting: Katie Balls describes the Labour crisis as a “very slow, almost coup,” with MPs playing a political version of the TV show “Traitors”—none want to fire the starter’s pistol or be left carrying the blame (04:45).
• Fundamental conclusion:

  “Whoever ends up Prime Minister, fundamentally, they're still a shite bag.” – Mary Black (05:28)

2. The Return of Andy Burnham & Labour’s Talent Pool

[05:47–07:31]

• Burnham’s possible comeback: Ian Smith jokes about Andy Burnham’s attempt to re-enter Westminster via the by-election in Makerfield (not actually a place, he notes).

  “Ashton in Makerfield is known as the centre for the manufacture of locks and hinges. So it would be ironic if Andy Burnham comes back and still can't get in.” – Ian Smith (05:59)

• Rising absurdity: The panel agrees UK politics more closely resembles a reality show (“Love is Blind”/“Hate is Blind”), with public drama outstripping any actual policy initiatives.

  “It's a great reality show at the minute. That's what it feels like.” – Mary Black (07:13)

3. Leadership, Direction, and “Vision Vacuums”

[07:31–09:12]

• Wes Streeting’s resignation letter: Quoted (“Where we need vision, we have a vacuum. Where we need direction, we have drift.”).
• Comparisons: Starmer’s leadership troubles paralleled with Boris Johnson’s and Liz Truss’s scandals. Balls notes that Labour’s efforts to present themselves as “bringing the adults back into the room” have unraveled spectacularly.
• Running tally of PMs: If Starmer goes, it's “how many prime ministers in about seven years?”

  “Perhaps we'll just keep going in full circle, because it probably shouldn’t be lost on us if Keir Starmer does go… it might also be some problems of the country.” – Katie Balls (09:05)

4. Who Do We Actually Want as PM? (And Why Not Alan Carr or Mr. Blobby?)

[09:12–10:53]

• Gallows humor: The panel suggests unlikely leaders: Claudia Winkelman (“she’s used to working with traitors”), Miriam Margolyes (“just for the chaos”), or even Mr. Blobby for “stability.”
• Nish Kumar volunteers:

  “Like Starmer, I'm profoundly unpopular with the British public. And like Rishi Sunak, I'm an under talented, over promoted brown man.” – Nish Kumar (10:36)

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Memorable Moments & Notable Quotes

• Wes Streeting meeting Starmer:

  “A crunch meeting you might have alone in a deserted river with a crocodile... Starmer came out fighting like a supermarket trolley in a canal.” – Andy Zaltzman (10:53)

• On the Scottish elections:

  “It's all fun and games till the mask comes off and it's Wes Streaton.” – Mary Black (12:50) “The thing that's really the cherry on top for me is that J.K. Rowling is now represented by a trans MSP.” – Mary Black (13:18)

• On Wales:

  “It's an astonishing phrase because it suggests Keir Starmer has somehow managed to leave a whole country down the back of a fridge.” – Nish Kumar (14:36)

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Segment Timestamps

• [01:44] – Show proper starts, panel introductions, set-up of the week’s big question
• [02:40–04:33] – Nish Kumar’s take on Starmer’s looming crisis and the Mandelson joking controversy
• [04:45–07:31] – Katie Balls & panel riff on Labour’s plotting, Andy Burnham’s return, party infighting as reality TV
• [07:31–09:12] – Reflections on leadership “vision/vacuum,” Labour v. Tories, serial PM turnover
• [09:12–10:53] – Panel jokes: preferred PMs, from TV personalities to Mr. Blobby
• [11:49–14:27] – Scottish election results, figures in fancy dress, independence movement analyzed
• [14:36–16:12] – Labour losing Wales; multi-party UK politics leading to dysfunction
• [16:12–19:48] – Green leader’s council tax scandal, Farage’s £5m gift, satirical escalation
• [21:54–23:22] – Bonus round: Somerset pothole lorry, symbolism for Britain
• [23:45–26:56] – US/China: Trump state visit, Chinese pageantry re: Trump, Thucydides Trap explained
• [27:17–29:56] – Royal Navy redesigns uniforms to tackle “robot nips” (nipple-like buttons)
• [29:56] – Final scores & sign-off

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Round Highlights

Bonus Rounds

1. Potholes

[22:11–23:22]

• Somerset lorry sent to fix potholes gets stuck in one. “Encapsulates Britain in 2026.”

2. China & Trump

[23:45–26:56]

• Trump’s ostentatious state visit: “The Chinese, a big state banquet, but also military to welcome him.”

3. Royal Navy Uniforms

[27:18–29:56]

• “Big metal robot nips” on uniforms spark redesign, costing £200k.

  “First time that phrase has appeared on Radio 4 for a while.” – Andy Zaltzman (28:22)

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The Panel’s Tone

• Cynically amused at the farcical state of British politics
• Irreverent toward party leaders and sacred cows (especially Labour, Starmer, and Mandelson)
• Wickedly quick-witted banter and rapid-fire one-liners
• Relentless with puns and metaphor: equating political crises with sitcoms, reality TV, and slapstick

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Final Scores

• Winners: Ian Smith & Mary Black (15 points)
• Runners-up: Nish Kumar & Katie Balls (12 points)
• Prize: “Free membership of the Keir Starmer Fan Club… Ian and Mary have to decide between you who’s president and who’s vice president until next week.” (29:56)

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Summary

This episode perfectly encapsulates Friday Night Comedy’s satirical lens on British politics: scandal, scheming, and the sense that the nation’s serious issues have become both soap opera and sitcom. The panel’s sharp observations and fearless jokes, on everything from Labour’s dysfunction to nipples on Navy uniforms, ensure no news item is too absurd to escape their wit.

Transcript

[Andy Zaltzman]

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[Sponsor/Advertiser]

Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc. SEC Registered Advisor. Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures available at public.com disclosures.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Hello, welcome to the News Quiz. Sorry, you know how it is when a word's been on your mind. I'm Andy Zoltzman. Let's get cracking. We've got a plot to get a lot to get through this week. We have Team there's still time to turn this ship around against Team Captain, this ship is already a submarine. On Team Ship we have Mary Black and Ian Smith and on Team Submarine, Nish Kumar. And back on the correct side of the Atlantic for one week only, the Times Washington correspondent Katie Balls. Any one of whom could be Prime Minister by the time you hear this show. In fact, Katie, your visit back to these shores is suspiciously timed. All that fun. For our first question in this week's at the Time of Recording special, go to Anish and Katie. Who could soon be going? Who has left and who could be back?

[Nish Kumar]

I guess who could be going is Keir Starmer I mean, could be. Is a huge, huge thing to say at the moment. As we record on Thursday night, the person who is definitely going is Wes treating. So Wes treating as Health secretary. But he said that he's not mounting a direct challenge. So the Guardian is reporting that the fact that he's not challenging Stalmer immediately suggests he does not have the requisite 81 MPs to mount a challenge directly. And listen, I rarely speak for this country, but I think I can when I say thank God. The issue I have with Wes treating is one of the key problems that Keir Starmer has had in the last few months is that there's this idea of his association with Peter Mandelson and his decision to employ Peter Mandelson as the ambassador to America. Now, that was obviously contentious because Peter Mandelson, and this is a term I've had legally cleared, was paedophile adjacent. That's technically a legally clearable term because he was photographed on several occasions next to Jeffrey Epstein. Therefore, he was literally adjacent to a paedophile. Right. And so that's obviously been a huge problem for Keir Starmer. So it makes no sense to then replace Keir Starmer with the only person closer to Peter Mandelson in the government, a man who's so close to Peter Mandelson that he had to release his own WhatsApp messages, which never happens because something good is going on. Like, the only time someone releases their WhatsApp messages is when her husband's being accused of adultery and goes, fine, read my phone and see there's nothing going on. You're paranoid, you crazy cow. And what I have to believe. What I have to believe for this country is as much as we've been through a lot and we have low expectations for ourselves, is we have to believe that we deserve more than a Prime minister who is paedophile adjacent adjacent.

[Andy Zaltzman]

So, Katie, you went to America, where we tend to look upon things as being quite chaotic, and you've come back here and now this. Are you claiming responsibility for the mayhem unfolding before us?

[Katie Balls]

Yeah, I was looking for the chaos when I went to America, and then I started to. To get a slight concern that I was in the wrong place. So I was here the past week. But, no, I think what we've had is a very slow, almost coup this week where everyone seems to know they want to go after Keir Starmer or they're not happy with him, but no one has quite been willing to do the firing starter shot because they're all worried And I think Wes reaching is one of them, that if they do, they're going to be blamed, that they will not get to wear the crown. And therefore every day has been a slight kind of everyone staring and saying, well, you resign, then I'll resign. But I. I don't trust you to resign. So I think we have almost, you know, the Downing street version of traitors playing out.

[Mary Black]

So whoever ends up Prime Minister, fundamentally, they're still a shite bag.

[Katie Balls]

Unless they're a faithful vote.

[Nish Kumar]

Alan Carr.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Well, I mean, yeah, I mean, you just can't rule anything out these days. Could well happen. And who is going to be coming back, it seems.

[Ian Smith]

Oh, well, at the time of recording, Josh Simons is standing aside from the constituency that we've all heard of, Makerfield. I only found out that Makerfield isn't a place, it's a suffix. So it's for Ashton, Makerfield and Ince in Makerfield. I've done the research on Wikipedia. Ashton in Makerfield is known as the centre for the manufacture of locks and hinges. So it would be ironic if Andy Burnham comes back and still can't get in. But yeah, Andy Burnham is planning on coming back if he can win a by election, if he gets allowed in by the neck, if he loses a by election. It's funny. I'm not saying that's what I want to happen, but it's objectively funny. That's the best we can really aim for at the minute. Just to be objectively funny.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Is that his sort of, you know, his strength as a candidate, Mary, is the fact that he's not been in Westminster? Is this where we are now? That actually that's a strength rather than a weakness?

[Mary Black]

I mean, well, it should be a strength, but it seems a bit bizarre to be spending your entire career going, I don't want to be. In fact, that sounds like me. I don't want to be in Westminster, but let me come back and join the whole sphere. So, no, I'm not convinced that it will happen anytime soon. It's just. It's a great reality show at the minute. That's what it feels like. You know, we're just watching this love is blind play out, except it's like, not love,

[Andy Zaltzman]

hate is blind. This is a much better show. Well, I mean, Wes Freetig in his resignation letter said, where we need vision, we have a vacuum. Where we need direction, we have drift. I mean, just something to pick up on that, you know, vision and direction. Do you necessarily want? I mean, Liz Truss had both vision and direction. The problems were what she was seeing and where she was going. When Starmer sort of came in, we'd have the sort of, you know, the chaos of trust. And Boris Johnson before that, well, lots

[Katie Balls]

of people, when they came in were saying, you know, the adults are back in the room and we're gonna have a very stable period of government. I'm gonna go back to debating policy. And when I left about a year ago to go to America, it wasn't looking great for Keir Starmer, but it hadn't unraveled in the way it has since. But it's his own version of psychodrama, so, I mean, it is. In some ways. It has all these parallels with the Boris Johnson story. Now, Boris Johnson, it was party gay Keir Starmer, it's Peter Mendelssohn. And then I think just the sense that everyone is just war now. And now no one wants to get behind him. And this is obviously the Labour government, which made so much of. We're going to clear up the sleaze. And I think now, every kind of five minutes, you can see people digging up these tweets of what Wes Streeting, Keir Starmer, Angela Rayner were saying as they were pushing out Boris Johnson over Party Gate. And of course, the Tories are enjoying it back, too. But perhaps we'll just keep going in full circle, because it probably shouldn't be lost on us if Keir Starmer does go. I mean, how many prime ministers in about seven years? It might also be some problems of the country.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Well, look, we can't start blaming ourselves, sure. Out of the sort of current frontrunners that we've talked a bit about. Who would you personally like to see take over as Prime Minister?

[Mary Black]

Well, I want it to be a woman, right. Because I need to have at least one female Prime Minister that I can root for. Because, I mean, you had Theresa May with her hostile environment. You had Liz Truss being Liz Truss. And I'm sure that Margaret Thatcher was looking up at both of them and thinking, you know, you go, girls. No, I'm ready for somebody like Claudia Winkelman. You know, she's used to working with traitors.

[Nish Kumar]

She.

[Mary Black]

Under the right circumstances, she's okay with murder. You know, I'm like, she's got a good CV for it. Her or Miriam Margulies, just for the chaos.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Ian, who would you like to see take over?

[Ian Smith]

If I could have anyone? Well, I guess Mr. Blobby, for stability, just to sort of get things going a bit, or if you really want to Double down on your choices. Let's give it to Peter Mandelson. Let's refuse to let people, you know, get us down and go, no, you know what? He's all right,

[Nish Kumar]

Nish, I'll do it. I am in many ways a combination of our last two Prime Ministers. Like Starmer, I'm profoundly unpopular with the British public. And like Rishi Sunak, I'm an under talented, over promoted Brown man.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Yes, well, let's summarise that. The Prime Minister is clinging to power after a showdown meeting with Wes Streeting on Wednesday morning was described as a crunch meeting. The kind of crunch meeting you might have alone in a deserted river with a crocodile. Streeting left Downing street after just 17 minutes, which suggests there were four three minute rounds under the Queensberry rules. After Streeting resigned, Starmer came out fighting like a supermarket trolley in a canal. He was still just about visible above the water, but you wouldn't necessarily expect it still to be so by Monday. So this is all in the context of the election results from last week, which it's fair to say did not go particularly well for Labour in terms of the Scottish election result. The SNP leader, John Swinney said after the SNP's victory that Scotland needs to make sure its Parliament is protected. From what?

[Mary Black]

The English? It was Farage, wasn't it? Yes, Nigel Farage.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Yeah.

[Mary Black]

Yes, the Scottish elections. I'm just hung up on the fact that it was a daytime count because not only was it daytime, but they also cut out the channel halfway through, so you had to scour about on the Internet. But like, there was one of my old colleagues, Angus Robertson, he lost his seat and when he was standing on the stage beside him, there was a person dressed as a gannet, like the bird. And this is what I mean, that hits different at four in the afternoon, whereas at four in the morning you're like, this is the best thing ever. WrestleMania's taking a turn, you know.

[Ian Smith]

Would be funny to see someone dressed as a gannet, like, as a jerk candidate win and just take their head off and go, no, no, no, no, no. I've got no policies. All my policies are give me all your chips. How the hell have I done this?

[Mary Black]

It's all fun and games till the mask comes off and it's Wes Streaton.

[Nish Kumar]

I quite like the idea of combining our general election coverage with the Masked Singer at the end of every count. Off, off, off, off.

[Mary Black]

But of course, in SC two trans MSPs have now been elected. And I mean, of course that's great. It's progressive. It's such a horrible time for a minority. But the thing that's really the cherry on top for me is that J.K. rowling is now represented by a trans MSP.

[Andy Zaltzman]

In terms of the state of Scotland. So the SNP won, but with a sort of lower vote share. How do you see the sort of independence movement at the moment?

[Mary Black]

Well, it's still got a pro independence majority. The Greens did better than they've ever done because they're actually on the same number of seats as reform at the minute. Because the other thing that people don't realize is that the Scottish Parliament is actually designed to prevent a majority. Like it's got a mixed system where half of it's proportional, so it's more democratic. But it's also insufferable when you want to stop idiots getting into Parliament. But no, I think it's definitely still on the agenda. Absolutely.

[Andy Zaltzman]

So it's designed to sort of foster collaboration and cooperation.

[Mary Black]

It's supposed to.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Weird, isn't it? How's that supposed to work in politics?

[Mary Black]

It's kind of like if you tried to force siblings who hate each other to actually sort out a funeral. That's the sort of atmosphere that's in the Scottish Parliament.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Sounds like you're pitching for a new reality show there. Well, Labour managed to lose Wales, which, I mean, that's.

[Nish Kumar]

Yeah, it's an astonishing phrase because it suggests Keir Starver has somehow managed to leave a whole country down the back of a fridge. Welsh Labour was. It's one of the most successful political parties in the world. Right. Because it's been the single largest party in the Senate since devolution. And now that streak is over and I think Starmer's got to flip the narrative here and call himself a history maker. You know, not all history makers are positive Hitler.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Do you think, Katie, as politics in the UK just completely fractured, we saw the results from those. If we have that in a general election with the biggest party getting about 25%, we've got a system that's barely functioned when there were two parties that commanded almost the whole vote. How will it cope with five or including the SNP and Plaid Cymru, seven parties splitting everything.

[Katie Balls]

Well, it starts to get potentially very messy, particularly if it's quite slight when you're in a first past the post system. We have had that refrain of the two party system is broken. I think the question now being asked in Westminster is, is it actually broken this time because how people vote in Locals doesn't always represent what they're going to do in a general election when you might want to say you want to stop Farage, you want to stop the Greens, and that kind of sense. But certainly, I think all the signs are there for a pretty dysfunctional Parliament the next time around if there's no majority. But then again, we've had a majority that was pretty big and it was still quite dysfunctional.

[Andy Zaltzman]

The Greens leader, Zach Polanski, faced criticism this week for failing to do what on his boat.

[Nish Kumar]

Anyone raise the flag of the Jolly Roger? It was pay council tax.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Yes, correct.

[Nish Kumar]

Listen, obviously this is serious. Anytime a political leader is not paying tax, that's always serious. But let's just all take a quick second to say this is the funniest possible scandal to happen to the leader of the Green Party. Not paying your council tax on a narrow boat is like a heartbeat away from Zach Polanski getting rumbled for putting cardboard recycling in his compost bin.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Slightly larger sum of money involved. With Nigel Farage facing a parliamentary inquiry for the 5 million pound gift. I mean, Nish, what do you see as. Which do you think technically is a bigger sum? 5 million pounds or Zach Polanski's unpaid counter?

[Nish Kumar]

Well, I'll tell you what I see with this. It's more nonsense from the biased Bolshevik corporation. How dare you? How dare you judge Nigel Farage based on the things that he's done? I am furious with this tide of woke nonsense. Just because Nigel Farage got £5 million. That's from his friend. That's what friends do. How do you think I got this gig on the news quiz? I sculpted a statue of Andy Zaltzman out of Manchego, because I know Zaltzman loves two things, statues of himself and cheese. A man loves cheese so much, if he sends you a text listing the things he's eaten in that day, you can get gout in your eyes.

[Andy Zaltzman]

I do have both of those things in my house at the moment. Cheese and a statue of myself. The context of that. My dad was a sculptor and he sculpted me when I was seven.

[Katie Balls]

The thing with this Nigel Farage stories, he does seem to be changing his tune slightly. So when it first came out, he hasn't seemed as though he wants to particularly talk about number one, but it was the idea that this was all for his security. So 5 million on security. He obviously didn't declare it because he wasn't an MP at the time, is now being looked into by Parliament, but he's since given an interview where he Said it was for security, but it was also, you know, a well done gift for delivering Brexit.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Right. So I mean that's. Those two are quite different things, aren't they? Technically, in terms of the meaning of words, they seem to be, yeah.

[Katie Balls]

Your gift is security.

[Mary Black]

Yeah. I mean you could argue that the milkshake was also a gift. Thanking you for venture.

[Andy Zaltzman]

He definitely declared that. I guess Ian, you know, let he, who has never been given £5 million by a Thai based crypto billionaire and immediately bought a new house, cast the first stone. So he needs cutting some sleep, do you think?

[Ian Smith]

Yeah, well, I've been in a similar situation really. I guess the reason why it's very clear, it's suspicious is that the Conservatives have also lodged a complaint about it. And when you're getting a gift that the Conservatives are like, this doesn't feel right. There was a quote from a Conservative party spokesperson, said 5 million is an enormous amount. More than most people will earn in a lifetime, I imagine, before adding not in our party, most of you lot.

[Andy Zaltzman]

He also said I can't be bought by anybody, which didn't used to be true. When he still had his cameo for about 80 quid, he would say whatever he wanted. At least he's getting good money for it. Now he's realised that he could get more than 80 quid and he's got five million.

[Nish Kumar]

Five million quid per cameo. I've got to get on that thing, man.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Well, at the end of that round the scores are six points all.

[Sponsor/Advertiser]

Aprobecha los ahoros de Memorial Day in Los y compra los vasicos pare logar pormenos ahoro centadolares en la parria gas de cuatro que madores Char broil Performance Series. Los nosotros hayudamos 2 ahoras. Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index. With AI it all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor supply suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year. You can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc. SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete Disclosures available at public.comdisclosures

[Ian Smith]

we have

[Andy Zaltzman]

special bonus questions this week in which our teams can double their points for each round. Nish and Katie, I'll give you the first choice of category. The categories you can have are Immortality, potholes or Nipples.

[Katie Balls]

Potholes.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Potholes. Okay. How this week did a Somerset based lorry guarantee itself in nomination in the 2026 metaphor for the State of the Nation of the Year award?

[Nish Kumar]

So this is a truck that had been called out with stuff in it that they needed to fix potholes.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Yep.

[Nish Kumar]

It got stuck in a pothole.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Yeah. I mean it does seem to say quite a lot about where we are. Isn't that. I mean, could anything Encapsulate Britain in 2026 more than a lorry sent to fix a pothole at a 45 degree angle in a pothole?

[Nish Kumar]

Also, the name of the company is Stabilized Pavements. So the photo is just a truck that says stabilised pavements at an angle that a truck should not be at.

[Ian Smith]

They sent a breakdown lorry to get broke down.

[Mary Black]

To be fair, they did say stabilise pavements, not the road. If we're going to go true British, let's be pedantic about it.

[Ian Smith]

I think they should monetize it and rebrand it as the Leaning Lorry of Walton.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Yes. If the current cross and crumbly state of the UK needed a new poster vehicle, it got one this week when a lorry sent to repair potholes in Somerset got stuck in a pothole. Thus I suppose filling it. Let's move on now to our American round. Who got out their fanciest China this week?

[Katie Balls]

The Chinese.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Yes. Correct. Yes.

[Katie Balls]

To welcome Donald Trump his first trip of his second term to China. He also went in his first term or China.

[Andy Zaltzman]

And I mean they, they really went. I mean he loves a pageant, he loves over the top ostentation and they really played that card hard, didn't they?

[Katie Balls]

They went for it. Yeah. The Chinese, a big state banquet, but also military to welcome him. We know that Donald Trump likes the military. He did try last year to have a military parade around the time of his birthday which was inspired by the military parade you get in China in Russia. But the Americans didn't quite get it right because all the soldiers were smiling, which is not what you're meant to do.

[Nish Kumar]

These are obviously like massively important talks. There's a lot going on. The states of Taiwan, America's trading relationship with China, various issues around AI development. And it's good in that situation to not over prepare. So the night before he went, he posted on social media 50 times in three hours. And the posts were not, I am revising very hard. The posts range from sort of more conspiracy theories about the 2020 election, sort of accusing Barack Obama of treason, A photoshopped image of Donald Trump on the hundred dollar bill. Somebody's got to turn the White House Wifi off after 10pm

[Andy Zaltzman]

yeah. So the meeting between President Xi and Trump. If you were a fly on the wall at that meeting, whose sandwich would you vomit on first? It's quite a tough call, isn't it?

[Ian Smith]

It's one of your more surreal questions. The Chinese president questioned whether the US and China can transcend the Fucycides Trap. And I just thought, that's what I've been thinking for a long time. Can they transcend the Thucycides Trap? It's one of those things where I've been interested in the Thucycides trap for a long time. And you might be thinking to yourself, ian, have you had to write that phonetically on your notes? But yeah, just kind of. Can they transcend it, though?

[Mary Black]

I think you've fallen into the trap.

[Ian Smith]

Am I a Thucydides trap?

[Nish Kumar]

Is it thu or thou Thew.

[Andy Zaltzman]

The Thucydides Trap.

[Ian Smith]

Yes.

[Nish Kumar]

Right. Now imagine if I was someone that didn't know what that was. I do obviously know what that thing is.

[Ian Smith]

Well, I certainly do. And I wouldn't want to patronize anyone by saying what it is.

[Andy Zaltzman]

The Thucydides Trap is a political theory stating that when a rising power threatens to displace an established ruling power, the resulting structural stress makes violent conflict the rule rather than the exception. There we go.

[Nish Kumar]

Another thing I've understood.

[Andy Zaltzman]

So the scores are now 12 to Nishin, Katie, nine to Ian and Mary. But you have a chance to double your points with your bonus question. So the two topics left are immortality or nipples. The big two. Which one are you going to go for?

[Mary Black]

Got your nipples?

[Ian Smith]

Yeah. Nipples, please.

[Andy Zaltzman]

The Royal Navy is set to redesign some of its uniforms because what look too like nipples.

[Ian Smith]

The button placement.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Yes, buttons.

[Ian Smith]

The buttons are like directly over where the nipples would be.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Yes.

[Ian Smith]

And I believe the exact phrasing of the complaint is, looks like we got robot nips. Big metal robot nips.

[Andy Zaltzman]

That was the exact terminology used, yes.

[Ian Smith]

And it's going to cost us money, apparently.

[Andy Zaltzman]

Yeah. 200,000. Let's talk it up. £200 million, the Royal Navy to redesign these female officers uniforms. I mean, when people talk about us Brits being buttoned up about sex, I think this story proves it quite literally.

[Nish Kumar]

Couldn't they try and style it out and say that those are protectors for the nipples against bullets?

[Andy Zaltzman]

You'd think so, wouldn't you?

[Nish Kumar]

You've got to protect the teats, guys. We've got to get the teats and taints covered.

[Andy Zaltzman]

First time that phrase has appeared on Radio 4 for a while.

[Ian Smith]

Is it right that it was. So I read that it was like Princess Anne. Was Princess Anne complaining or have they just used Princess Anne as a sort of focal point for like, I guess, basically to men reading the story. But you know, nipples, you know, women. Here's one. He is a famous person that we can't imagine a story about buttons being in an inappropriate place unless we have a sort of famous. So we've just been looking at pictures of Princess Anne in a uniform and going, alright, that's where her nipples are, I guess. And as you get older, the buttons get lower.

[Andy Zaltzman]

The Navy said it was a positive step for women and the majority of the cost of the new jackets would be offset by reducing the number of uniforms issued in future. Isn't that worse? Are all our Royal Navy servicemen and women going to have. You have to prance around jacketless nipples akimbo. What is this country coming to?

[Ian Smith]

I think instead of uniforms or camouflage, they should make their uniforms out of the stuff you do Magic Eye puzzles with. So then the enemy would get so distracted because they'd be like, ah, if you just squint, what are you seeing? They're all discussing that we've shot them all in a classic Thucycides tr.

[Andy Zaltzman]

The Royal Navy is reportedly set to spend £200,000 redesigning some uniforms because the buttons look like nipples, kind of. If your nipples are made of brass and you've got eight of them. So our final scores, it's 15 to Ian and Mary and 12 to Nish and Katie. Our winners this week get free membership of the Keir Starmer Fan Club. Ian and Mario have to decide between you who's president and who's vice president until next week. Thank you for listening. Goodbye. Taking part in the news quiz were Mary Black, Ian Smith, Katie Balls and Nish Kumar. In the chair was me, Andy Zaltzman, and additional material was written by Ruth Hosko, Alex Keeley and Claire Ramelkamp. The producer was Georgia Keating and It was a BBC Studios production for Radio 4. Could you talk about being invisible or double denim?

[Ian Smith]

Who knows what's next on the new

[Katie Balls]

series of Just a Minute?

[Mary Black]

Belting out a rendition of

[Ian Smith]

Whatever the

[Andy Zaltzman]

topic, our panel has just a minute

[Katie Balls]

to speak without hesitation, deviation or repetition.

[Nish Kumar]

Join Zoe Lyons, Desiree Burch, Paul Merton

[Andy Zaltzman]

and many more for the new series of Just a Minute with Me, Sue Perkins.

[Nish Kumar]

It's funny cuz it's True. Listen on Radio 4 and the full

[Andy Zaltzman]

box set is available now on BBC.

[Nish Kumar]

Sounds.

[Katie Balls]

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[Katie Balls]

Hey, everyone, check out this guy and his bird. What is this, your first date?

[Sponsor/Advertiser]

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[Nish Kumar]

Me to a human, him to a bird.

[Katie Balls]

Yeah, the bird looks out of your league.

[Sponsor/Advertiser]

Anyways, get a [e-mail] or with your local agent.

[Mary Black]

Liberty. Liberty.

[Katie Balls]

Liberty.

[Mary Black]

Liberty.