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Episode 3 Recap (Feat. EJ Tackett): The Unofficial Born To Bowl Podcast
00:57:21
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- [00:00]
A
A quick side note, before we get into this week's episode, I'm going to finish the unofficial Born to Bowl podcast and continue to post the season here on the Fro nosephoto Podcast channel. But if the series does continue, I will start a new channel which is actually already out there and it's linked down below in the description so that you can get the unofficial Born to Bowl podcast on its very own channel. I didn't want to leave you guys hanging who enjoyed the first couple of episodes, so that is why I'm putting this note here. But now let's get to the episode with E.J. tackett. Welcome to the unofficial Born to Bowl podcast. I'm your host, Jared Poland. As you can tell, my voice is a little bit, well, lacking today as I'm slightly under the weather and it's all in my throat, which is making it a little harder to talk. But that's all right. We're going to push through here just like the bowlers push through in Born to Bowl. In this episode, we're going to recap the Born to Bowl episode number three on HBO that is currently out. If you haven't checked out all of the episodes, you can check them out on HBO and HBO Max. For streaming in US and Canada. It goes live at 9pm Eastern Standard Time on HBO as well as HBO Max. So I'm going to recap episode number three here, but we're also going to sit down for an interview with E.J. tackett, who talks about Born to Bowl as well as if you're paying attention to the 2026 PBA season, E.J. tackett stepped up to the line with a chance to win the Masters. He needed to strike and he didn't. So I got him to sit down this week and we talk about that as well as Born to Bowl. So what we're going to do is we're going to run the interview with EJ and then after that, I'll go into the recap of episode number three. All right, ej, welcome to the unofficial Born to Poll podcast.
- [01:58]
B
Glad to be here.
- [01:59]
A
It looks like people can't see this at home, but are you sitting in the RV right now?
- [02:03]
B
I am sitting in the RV right now.
- [02:05]
A
You just finished a block?
- [02:06]
B
Yeah, we finished about an hour ago and we go back on the lanes in about two and a half hours.
- [02:13]
A
And where are you sitting right now in terms of standings?
- [02:16]
B
Sitting in second. Scores are really, really high this week. Actually bowled a pretty good block, but Ryan Barnes decided to enter like God mode and Beat me.
- [02:27]
A
Look like he has is averaging or 2:52 right now and you're 2:51.
- [02:32]
B
Yeah, something like that.
- [02:33]
A
I mean those numbers for, you know, anybody. That's kind of insane to think about. We rarely touch two fifties as a as. And when I say we, I mean me as a amateur bowler. I wouldn't even call it amateur. As a guy that bowls three games a week right now, you know, averaging 250 is just bonkers.
- [02:54]
B
Yeah, yeah. I mean it's, it's pretty ridiculous. Even out here on tour, like I said, lanes are playing pretty, pretty easy and you got the best players in the world bowling on an easy pattern. You get really high scores.
- [03:06]
A
That, that is true. So I, I do have a question really to lead into. Has the doctor called yet?
- [03:12]
B
The doctor has not called yet. Not that I'm aware of.
- [03:15]
A
Not after, not after episode three of Born to Bowl. The doctor hasn't reached out.
- [03:20]
B
Yeah, well, you know, the doctors, a multi billion dollar corporation. So it might take a couple days to get to the right people.
- [03:29]
A
Well, I think, I honestly do think it will. I think they will come calling because. Why not?
- [03:35]
B
Yeah, that's what I think too. But you know, in. My ultimate goal is obviously I want to, I want to have a partnership, but you know, the ultimate goal is to get a company like that, like Dr. Pepper involved in bowling and really, you know, shake things up and get more money for, for everyone, not just myself.
- [03:53]
A
Is that one of the hopes that you have for Born to Bowl in general?
- [03:56]
B
Oh, absolutely. You know, I hope when this is all said and done, you know, the coming months and years, that it really opens bowling up to the masses and also to, you know, bigger corporations that want to get involved with the professional side of bowling. So that way we can see, you know, some prize funds increase. And if that happens, I think the talent pool is just going to keep. Continue to get better and better because as the, as the prize increases, people are going to say, oh well, if I go win one tournament, like that's three or four years of my job that I'm doing right now and that, that really can change your life.
- [04:39]
A
What would you like to see the prize fund look like?
- [04:43]
B
Ideally, ideally golf. But realistically, I think if we could get to, you know, in the next couple of years, if we could get major championships paying a quarter million dollars and every event paying $100,000, that changes everything. And I think those are realistic numbers that are actually attainable. Obviously we want to see a tournament, especially a major championship, paying 1, 2 3, $4 million like golf does. But you have to look at it long term stuff isn't going to happen overnight. But if we take step by step by step, you know, anything is possible. But you know, if we can get in the next, you know, within the next five years, if we could get, you know, those major championships paying a quarter million dollars, I think it, I think it changes everything.
- [05:33]
A
What's it going to take? Like really what, what are the steps that you see in order to get the PBA to do a, have a quarter million dollar tournament?
- [05:43]
B
Doing this series with hbo, I think brings a lot of things to bowling. I think it brings a lot of credibility to the sport. It opens people up to things that they really didn't understand or even know about, you know, lane patterns and bowling balls and what we do as athletes and bowlers to be able to perform every single week at such a level. And the more engagement that we get, the more eyes we get on us. You know, typically that normally creates more, more dollars. So I'm so thankful for, for you and everybody that worked so hard to make this series happen. I could see some really, really good things coming out of it.
- [06:31]
A
Have you noticed any changes yet? I mean, it's only been out for three weeks, but have you, have you seen a pop on social? Have there been new people coming up to you that, that never knew you existed and don't care about bowling but are watching?
- [06:45]
B
Yeah, I don't think physically in the bowling center we've seen it yet, but definitely on social I've noticed a lot more, I'm getting a lot more followers. There's a lot more people that are liking posts and watching our posts. Yeah, I'll go through and look at notifications and I see a lot more likes and follows from people that have blue check marks, which I think is huge because a lot of times Those people are 50, 1000-002005-00000 followers. Well, those are, I mean that's, that's some, that's some influence. So I've definitely noticed a huge difference there on the social side. Not physically in the bowling center yet. I think that's, that's a trickle down effect because, you know, social media is so readily available. I could see, you know, people coming into the bowling center, more and more people watching us during qualifying. And this year our shows have been sold out every single week. So that's, that's a good sign as well.
- [07:53]
A
Definitely on, on the, the money front, you're talking about bigger paychecks and all of this. I still find it to be utterly insane that there's a $500 entry fee for all of these tournaments in on the PBA tour.
- [08:07]
B
Yeah, I mean that's, that's, that's kind of how it's always been. I know I, I would believe that if we got to a place of, of that substantial amount of money that those would probably go away. They actually did it. I think it was last year, the year before with guys that were exempt on the PBA tour. We didn't pay entry fees the whole season, so they've already kind of dabbled in doing that. And I think if we get more sponsorship dollars and more money coming in, they, they would probably, you know, look at doing away or at least bringing that entry fee down.
- [08:46]
A
It's going to be interesting because, you know, with having an HBO show and it's in, it was as high as number seven in the top 10 yesterday, you know, the day after and it was still at 8 today. Which is pretty impressive when sometimes it's ahead of John Oliver or Bill Maher. All these other shows that you look at and you're like, well, we're ahead of that, we're ahead of Neighbors sometimes. And it's, I don't know what the numbers are right. We can't quantify that right now. I can't at least. But you could absolutely see that there is a huge opportunity for sponsors to show up in the bat. I mean like John's Crazy Socks is probably showing up on HBO and dude Wipes shows up on hbo. Those are long lasting effects for advertisers that some advertisers, and I know this from what I do with my website, is they don't understand the long burn effect. They just want everything right now. But if a show lives on, on HBO for years down the road, people are still discovering and finding it.
- [09:43]
B
Yeah, it's a, it's a, it's a long term play for a one time fee kind of thing.
- [09:48]
A
And I definitely think it's going, going to happen. You know, I can't wait to see what the numbers are. But so far the feedback has been great from bowlers and non bowlers alike, which is exactly what we were going for. Raise the, elevate it.
- [10:02]
B
Yeah, absolutely. And the only, the only complaint that I've seen is it's not long enough. Which is a great complaint to have because that means everybody wants more. And I know every episode I've watched it gets to the end, I'm like, it's over already. Like this needs to be more Like, I want. I want more. So, I mean, it's a great problem to have. And if that's the worst thing that we have, then I think everyone did an unbelievable job at putting this thing together.
- [10:28]
A
I agree. That's been one of the take. Takeaways has been, you know, it's not long enough. I mean, it's 20. It's 28 minutes. And it definitely goes by fast.
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B
Oh, it goes fast?
- [10:38]
A
You want more? Well, I mean, how do you think you were portrayed last week?
- [10:44]
B
Exactly who I am. That's how I thought I was portrayed.
- [10:47]
A
It's interesting because we have you miked up for a lot of stuff. I mean, there's a lot of stuff that we get to hear. And I say this when I. When I do these interviews each week is that when we have, like, four people mic'd up, I can hear all four people's conversations at the same time.
- [11:00]
B
Right.
- [11:01]
A
And I hear you. And it's interesting that I'm listening when I hear you, it's like you could start off with a four bagger, and then all of a sudden you ten pin and you go, you fucking suck, ej.
- [11:10]
B
Yeah.
- [11:11]
A
And what is that all about?
- [11:13]
B
Well, a lot of times it's because I threw it bad and I left the ten pin or I missed because I missed. And I'm my worst critic. But my expectation of myself is. Is perfection. I know it's not realistic or actually attainable, but if I strive to be perfect, if I get close to it, I'm going to be really, really good.
- [11:40]
A
I know. I definitely heard you. I think that's. I think you said that on the show this week, but it. It's crazy to hear you beat yourself up, because it's like I. I could be at some other lane videoing somebody else, and I hear you going off, and then I come to find out that you're leading and you're leading by more than anything. And you broke some record. Yet it sounded like. I thought you were flaming out.
- [12:05]
B
Yeah, I guess I have a tendency to do that. But I grew up watching Tiger, and Tiger always said that he gave himself like 15 to 30 seconds after a bad shot to be as mad as he wanted to be. And after that time, it was complete focus on the next one. So I guess I kind of have developed that where, when. When I do something wrong or something happens, I flame out for 30 seconds or a minute, you know, in between. But when I step up on the next one, I'm ready to go because I. I got rid of all that negative stuff, I let it out so I can focus on the, on the next one.
- [12:47]
A
I gotta, I gotta ask then. Cause that, that begs the question, what happens after the last shot of the majors? Do you have to wait? Do you. How long does that last?
- [12:57]
B
Yeah, when I tenpin to lose a major championship. Yeah, that one lasted quite a bit longer than most have lasted in the past five or six years. You know, it was huge to be in that moment. Winning the Masters would have completed the Grand Slam for me. It would have got me one major away from the career Grand Slam, or the Super Slam they call it. And now I've. The two majors that I haven't won, I've lost by a pin on both of them. So I'm two pins away from the Super Slam now. Yeah, I was pretty distraught after that. The drive home sucked at two and a half hours. Felt like it took three days. I couldn't sleep. And then the drive over here to Columbus on Monday also felt like it took forever. And I'm not gonna lie, I was pretty depressed Sunday night. I didn't want to do anything. I had no motivation. I ended up going to the bowling center and drilling some bowling balls that, coincidentally enough, I've thrown the entire time I've been here, averaging 250. But I was texting Natalie while I was there and I was like, I have no motivation. Like, I'm moving so slow. Like, I just don't want to. I just want to sit in a corner and cry because I was so devastated from, from losing that, that major championship. But as the days go on and you're able to reflect, like, I threw a really good shot and after the first couple of frames in that match, I threw really good shots. The rest of the game I had an opportunity to win and they just didn't fall down. But, you know, it was still really devastating to lose by a pen. But I can say that, you know, I made a post saying that I left it all in the lanes and that's all I could do. And you know, there is some positivity to that and gotta take that and carry it forward because we don't have time to sit around and just be sad. You know, it was get done on Sunday night, drive home, do laundry, drill bowling balls, get up Monday morning, drive here for practice. There's no time to sit around and dwell. All the negative stuff, you have to just. You have to get over it and, and move on to the next.
- [15:24]
A
So what's going through your mind? You step up. I Mean, you step up, you need two strikes to win. Somebody yells something stupid, someone else yells something stupid. You take your time. You step off. Can you block that from your mind? Because you did. You stepped off the lane. You regrouped.
- [15:39]
B
Yeah, I mean, you know, we watch. We watch sports all the time. Obviously, bowling and golf's a little bit different because, you know, everybody's kind of quiet, you know, when you're throwing the ball or hitting the golf ball. But we. We see stuff in other sports all the time with people yelling and trying to throw people off. It's. It's part of sports. And when. When stuff like that does happen, you just have to say, you know, it is what it is. Step off, regroup. Go. Go through your routine again and get up and throw a shot.
- [16:15]
A
Yeah, and the shot you threw there was perfect. And it looked like the second shot was a little more inside.
- [16:23]
B
Yeah, I mean, half an inch. I mean, I missed by a half an inch at 40ft, so I threw it really good. It wasn't a hundred percent perfect, but it was 98%. You know, I liked everything about it. They just didn't fall. It could have. It could have struck as easily as it didn't. So, you know, it is what it is. It sucks, but you move on to the next championship.
- [16:53]
A
Yeah. I mean, the thing about the Masters is it's a long road to hoe. It's. It's a tough one.
- [16:59]
B
It really is. And especially if you lose early, it is a super long road to get to that TV show.
- [17:06]
A
Is there any sort of disadvantage to being number one in a. In a major? I mean, this year, Simo lost, and you've, unfortunately for you, have lost twice in. In. In majors, being the number one seed.
- [17:23]
B
I mean, the. I think the only disadvantage is, you know, when you get up there and you throw your first few shots, you kind of have some sea legs, just, you know, the nerves start going, and you're trying to just kind of feel everything out and get your body working together in a rhythm. And I didn't do a very good job of that beginning of that show. There's been plenty of shows I've been on where I've able to just hit the ground running. There's some where I struggle, you know, the first couple of frames, trying to just get my legs underneath me. So I think that would be the only disadvantage that I feel like some people will say, too, oh, the other guy has a lot of, you know, he's bowled a bunch of games on the. On the pair he knows how they've, they've broken down as we've gone through, which is. It could be true, but we're all professionals. Like, I get eight or 10 shots on the pair before I start the game, so I should have a pretty good idea of what the pair is doing because that's almost a whole game that I get a ball on the, on the pair before we start. So, yeah, I would much rather be in that, in the number one position because then I know I'm guaranteed an opportunity to win a championship. So I always want to be in that position. And I'm never, I am not superstitious of it. I'm not scared of it. You know, that's, that's the place that I always want to be in to have a chance to win a championship.
- [18:48]
A
You know, I'd say unfortunately for you this year, last year the. Gary had a. He had to lose twice.
- [18:55]
B
Yeah.
- [18:55]
A
Or just win once and he could afford to lose a game. What's your thoughts on double elimination when it comes to the Masters?
- [19:03]
B
Yeah, I've, I've, I've never been a fan of how the TV show goes, and I haven't been a fan of it for the entirety of my career because I did the same thing back in 2014 where I was the number one seed and only had to lose once. And, you know, it's just, in my opinion, it's not the true format of the tournament. If it's double elimination, it has to be double elimination all the way through, in my opinion. But I don't know. I don't know what the answer is for that to make it work because of the way our TV schedule works. I don't know. I don't know what the answer is. It's. It's above my pay grade. But all I know is I'm not a fan of it being where the number one seed doesn't have to be beaten twice. I'm not a fan of it. And even, even if I would have lost to Eric, I would still feel the same exact way about the number one seed needing to be beaten twice.
- [20:11]
A
Now he brings up Eric because the, the way that the Masters works is that the two people that are left in the winners bracket face off against each other to get one and two. And so that way, you know, EJ went undefeated through the entire bracket, which got him the one seed. Eric lost that one game, but that keeps him in the number two seed, and that's how that works. I should also bring up, when I mentioned the RV earlier that EJ does travel around most times in a fifth wheel. That's very nice. There's lots of Dr. Pepper, there's a couple of beers. There's. Yeah, I mean, there's a, There's. Is it a king size bed in there?
- [20:47]
B
I got a king size bed and a bathroom that's bigger than most ones in hotels.
- [20:51]
A
And it's a nice, it's a nice way to travel.
- [20:54]
B
It is. It's a lot of fun. I enjoy it. So when we were in Fort Wayne, it's close to home, only 30 minutes from my house, so I stayed at home. And that 30 minute drive, I was like, I want to go back and walk across the parking lot.
- [21:08]
A
That is in what other sport is there a world where the best bowler in the world is parking outside of the venue and waking up and walking into the venue?
- [21:20]
B
Yeah, I know some golfers have done it over the course of time where they've actually parked their RV at the golf course. And yeah, Mark Kalkabecki is a really good friend of mine, played on the PGA Tour for a long time, still plays on the Senior Tour right now. But he's a major champion and he's always, you know, parked at the, at the golf course. I've talked to his wife about it. They'd have, you know, big generators there the guys could plug into. They'd have someone on call for like water and septic, where someone would come dump your septic tank for you, like, hey, you know, Uncle Eddie, shitter's full, you know, and they come, they come dump it for you. Or if you run out of fresh water, you know, they would, they would bring some fresh water and fill you up. And, you know, maybe we can at some point get enough of us out here where we can all, you know, band together and, and get some of those amenities.
- [22:19]
A
I mean, they barely get you water in the back, so I don't know. They barely get you bottled water.
- [22:25]
B
Yeah, well, that's. Sometimes it depends on the venue. There's a lot of venues that do really well of taking care of the players. Some could, could use a little bit of little reworking and do a little bit better job. But, you know, there's. I would say more. There are more venues that, that take care of us really well than there are that, that don't.
- [22:50]
A
I will say the time that I've been out on the PGA Tour events, one at the, the Arnold Palmer Classic and then, then the one in Philly, the Arnold Palmer Classic, was insane when I showed up there. And I see that they've got like two 18 wheelers that are just dedicated for massages. And then there's a practice truck, and then there's the family services. So if the family of golfers want to go to Disney, they just go into here and they make that happen.
- [23:19]
B
And there's.
- [23:19]
A
There are so many different amenities, but there's a big difference when you're winning $4 million for a tournament. Ver thousand at this point.
- [23:29]
B
Yeah. And, you know, one of the things I would love to see that the PGA Tour does is creating, you know, retirements for. For players and just having that where I don't know exactly like how it works on the PGA Tour, whether just by being part of the tour they have a retirement account or like, some of their winnings, like a percentage of their winnings goes into a retirement retirement account. I would love to see something like that for. For the players where, you know, they can. They can definitely opt in and say, hey, there's this big pool of funds that everybody's paying into that opens up, you know, these big, you know, markets where they can. They can invest and make those big returns with people that. A bunch of money do, you know, you know, how do we. How do we do that and create a retirement fund for players? That would. I think that would be a great step if, you know, if we can get more money coming in. That would be one of the. One of the. You know, early steps to help the players and create retirement funds for them.
- [24:44]
A
I mean, that would be great. It would be great to get more money into bowling. And I think people are finally now, because of the show, seeing what you guys go through and that. And that was the goal when I set out at the very beginning with the idea was we have to show people who you guys are. You are real people who just so happen to be professional bowlers. And there's not a lot of money out here. I mean, you look at. You look at the lists of what people made last season, and you're like, well, you know, I'll just use Cam as an. As an example. In his rookie season, he took home $18,000 in prize money, and that's not going to go very far. After four months out on the road.
- [25:23]
B
No, it's pretty much all gone. Yeah. Without even paying, you know, without even taxes taken out. Because everything that we make, like we're 1099, so we have to file our own taxes. So it gets. It gets tough.
- [25:36]
A
He's probably like nine grand in entry fees.
- [25:40]
B
Yeah, it's normally between 6, 7,000, 8,000, something like that, for the season, for every event.
- [25:47]
A
I still find it to be insane that you have to enter the damn events, but hopefully some big sponsors come along like the Doctor or some, some car manufacturer, some airline, some, some airbnb, because a lot.
- [26:01]
B
United. Let's get them all, all of those guys.
- [26:05]
A
So, so shifting gears just a little bit, is there, is there someone you truly enjoy beating on tour? You don't have to say a name unless you really want to, but is there, is there someone you truly enjoy going head to head and just demolishing?
- [26:19]
B
Well, I mean, I like beating everyone, but to be perfectly honest, you know, and I don't want this to sound bad, but when you're able to go against someone like Jason Belmonte and you go head to head and you're able to win, pretty freaking cool. You know, Jason's arguably the greatest has ever played the game. He's definitely in that conversation because of the amount of major championships that he's won. So, I mean, when you beat Jason, it is fun to beat him because he's so great and you know, you, you did something special. If, if you're even in that match with him and are able to beat him, it's, it's always, I can't even really like describe it. To bowl against someone like that, that's literally a living legend of our game.
- [27:19]
A
Yeah. And I know you faced him last year in the other World Championships and that was a back and forth match where he had a chance to really put the pedal to the metal after you opened in, I believe, the fourth frame, and then he did the exact same thing.
- [27:32]
B
Yeah, yeah. And I, we've had a lot of matches over the years and a lot of them have been back and forth like that. There's been, there's been, I, I think maybe once that I've bowled him that I kind of, you know, ran away from him a little bit. And there's been a couple times where, you know, he's really beat the crap out of me, but most of the time we, we, we normally have pretty good matches that, that come. Come down right to the end.
- [28:00]
A
Is there something that a today, ej, you would tell rookie pba ej, is there something you would tell yourself?
- [28:08]
B
I think the only thing I would tell myself, and it was probably first few years on tour, I wasn't very good at this. And that's just preparing for anything and everything that could possibly happen. I felt like maybe my first few years I wasn't prepared Enough for those TV shows or those match plays or the season itself. I felt like I maybe lost out on a little bit because I just wasn't prepared enough. And that's probably the one thing I would tell myself, is to work harder.
- [28:49]
A
Well, what's the preparation you do now that you weren't doing then?
- [28:52]
B
Just being, it's just being more disciplined and being a little bit older and not so young and dumb. You know, I, I used to, I've always practiced, but I didn't really prepare. Like, there's a difference between just going and practicing and actually being prepared. And I used to just practice. Now I feel like I'm actually prepared from the practice that I do. And I'm a little bit more patient now, even though you don't think so, because I'm always screaming, yell at myself, but I am.
- [29:35]
A
You also step right up and go. You rarely take a lot of time at the line. You, you're, you're get up and go.
- [29:43]
B
Yeah, I've, I've always been that way. I'm a, I'm a make a decision before you step on the approach. And when you step up there, I've already made the decision. All I have to do is get set and go. So I've, I've always been that way. That's nothing new.
- [29:57]
A
Do you see yourself, I mean, how long do you see yourself out on the PBA tour? I mean, you've got guys like Chris Barnes still bowling on the, on the main tour. I mean, is this something you see yourself doing for the next 20 years?
- [30:08]
B
I mean, I would love to do it for as long as I possibly can. As long as my body holds up and I'm, and I'm physically still able to feel like I can compete with, you know, these, the, the kids that are out here now, like Brandon Bonta and Ryan Barnes, you know, those guys are in their early 20s. So 10 years from now, I'm going to be in my early 40s and they're going to be my age. So can I still compete with them? Do I feel like I'm still good enough to win and I'll bowl? As long as I feel that way. If I don't feel like I can win, then that's probably when I won't, I won't bowl anymore. But hopefully that's for a long time. And like I said, I think a lot of it depends on, you know, how long my body holds up and we just have to wait and see.
- [30:55]
A
Now, you just mentioned some of the new bowlers do you do you feel that they are far more advanced than they were 10 to 20 years ago?
- [31:03]
B
Yeah, I think. I think the kids that are, you know, in their early 20s that are coming out on tour now, they. They have so much more information available to them. You know, YouTube came out, what, 2007,
- [31:18]
A
A6, original YouTube, 2005.
- [31:21]
B
But that's so, like, I was 13, and we didn't really know what it was. There was nothing on it yet. I mean, it was 10 years before there was, like, real information, and it really started to get utilized for what it is now. So. And if you. If you look at that, when. When YouTube really started become huge and all this information on there and people are doing videos and how tos and all this stuff, you know, those guys are in 10, 12, 15 years old. They have all this information just exposed to them. They got to not just watch guys play on TV on Sunday. They got to watch all the qualifying with. With the live streaming. They get to go rewatch it on YouTube whenever they want, you know, bowl TV. Now everything that we bowl is stored. They can. You can go watch it at any time. So they can go learn on themselves. You know, what did I do wrong? They can go watch it from a different perspective and maybe learn something just by watching themselves, you know, that. That kind of stuff didn't exist 20 years ago. So I think, you know, as humans evolve, you know, athletes continue to get better and better and better, but they also have way more information exposed to them that. That they're. They can receive and learn from than, you know, the generations of 20 years ago and prior just didn't have.
- [33:02]
A
Was there someone that you looked up to? I mean, there's a lot of bowlers that come up today. They obviously look up to you right now. Who did. Who did you look up to when you were younger?
- [33:12]
B
Norm was probably top of the list. Norm Duke. Over the last, you know, five or six years, I've. I've actually become pretty good friends with Norm, and we've had a lot of really great and deep conversations, and it's kind of crazy. And I still talk to Natalie about it. That, like, I can't believe, like, Norm Duke is, like, one of my really good friends. Like, I never would have imagined in my entire life that I would be this close with. With someone that is so incredibly talented at the game that I play. It's. It's. It's cool, it's surreal, it's special. But Norm is. Is, you know, at the top of that list. And then Tommy Jones is one that I, I really watched a lot too, because he was one of the, you know, one of the early guys that came out that, you know, had a higher rev rate, you know, threw it hard, and I was like, dang, I want to, I want to hook it like that. And I think when Tommy came out on tour, I was about 8 or 9 or 10 years old, something like that. I think he came out around 2001 or something. So, you know, I, I learned a lot watching him of, of the power game. And then I learned a lot from Norm of knowing how to finesse the bowling ball and, and do things that not everyone else is doing and see the lanes a little bit differently. So, you know, I'm, I guess I'm kind of a culmination of, of a traditional old school player like Norm and a new power player like Tommy Jones.
- [34:53]
A
Yeah, I mean, it's two great hall of Famers. And what's, what's crazy about Norm is, I mean, he started at 18 out there on tour.
- [35:00]
B
17.
- [35:01]
A
He was 17.
- [35:02]
B
Yeah.
- [35:03]
A
That's crazy. I mean, he bowled forever. I mean, because when I started this project, he was. His last tournament was the Masters and he ended up the second seed.
- [35:13]
B
Yeah, yeah. He bowled on tour for 41 years and he has.
- [35:17]
A
Well, so he has 40, 40 titles, seven majors, which I guess puts you even with him at this point.
- [35:22]
B
Yeah.
- [35:23]
A
And I mean, and that's in an era where they bowled 35 tournaments, 34 tournaments a week a year, which is the pretty insane how there was money then they had more money in the 90s and the 80s coming into bowling, which is pretty crazy. But. Yeah. Anything else you want to add to the people sitting at home? Anything you want to share about bowling, share about yourself before we wrap it up?
- [35:49]
B
Well, I always say bowling is really hard. I don't think people truly understand how hard this sport is. And there's so much information that you need to know and understand. You know, we have all these different bowling balls now in the different oil patterns, different oils that they're putting on the lane, different lane surfaces. Bowling is extremely, extremely difficult. And I think sometimes people kind of underestimate the level of difficulty it takes or there is to, to be competitive on the PBA tour.
- [36:34]
A
With that being said, has anybody challenged you to set to any action matches?
- [36:39]
B
No, I haven't bowled. I haven't bowled for action. It's been at least 10 years since I've done that.
- [36:47]
A
What the numbers look like. Can you share what numbers look like in action bowling?
- [36:51]
B
Most of the time when I bowled it was a couple hundred bucks. It wasn't anything of substantial value. I think one time I bowled for a thousand dollars a game, and that's the most I've ever bowled for. And I lost. And I lost. I lost that time. I lost like two or three grand.
- [37:07]
A
And you still have your hand.
- [37:09]
B
I still have my hand. Well, I paid, so I didn't lose any body parts.
- [37:13]
A
Yeah. For those out there, action bowling. And pot bowling is underground bowling. Basically. If you watch Kingpin, you get an understanding for what happened early on. And it's just backroom games. It's kind of like pool sharks, right?
- [37:26]
B
Yeah.
- [37:27]
A
You know, you go and you play pool for money. This is people challenge. I mean, there's people all the time. I talk to, you know, Stu Williams about people that will go to the bar and sit there at the end of a tournament and be like, I could have done that. And they're like, okay, let's go do it.
- [37:42]
B
Yeah, go.
- [37:42]
A
Let's go do it. I challenge you right now. And it's. It's not easy to do what you guys do.
- [37:47]
B
No, it's. It's really not. And, you know, and the more we can, you know, spread out some education just so people understand that there is different oil patterns and there's different oils and get people to. Or get bowling centers to create more leagues that have these sport patterns on them so people can go bowl them and get a even better understanding of how hard this game is.
- [38:14]
A
I did a summer sport shot league in last summer. I mean, that was. That was tough. And for you guys out there, sports shot is basically rolling on different patterns that the pros and everybody else gets to bowl on. And not just a house shot, which, as I've said before, is designed to help you strike. The other ones are designed where they flood the outside of the lane, the outside of the lanes, and you have to find a different angle. And. And sometimes there's a long pattern, you know, 50ft, or then there's a short 34 foot. And you're trying to. As an amateur, you have to roll the perfect shot. And if you're off by a board, you're screwed.
- [38:55]
B
Or if you're off by half a board, you lose a major championship.
- [39:00]
A
That. That. Yeah, I mean, I don't want to be like, you know, if you had that shot to throw again, I mean, you just would try to throw it a little. A little better.
- [39:09]
B
Yeah, like 1% better.
- [39:12]
A
Since you brought it up. I mean, you're do. You did. Do you potentially have a celebration in mind at all, or is that nowhere
- [39:22]
B
near, like, when I win?
- [39:25]
A
Yeah, because a few years ago, it was like, three, you know, three times. Are you kidding me? Right?
- [39:31]
B
Yeah.
- [39:31]
A
No, that had to be planned.
- [39:34]
B
No, it's all reactionary. I don't plan celebrations.
- [39:38]
A
No. Who do you. Who do you think you are? I am right.
- [39:40]
B
If that was. If that was planned out exactly how it was supposed to happen, no one would know that. No, it's all reactionary.
- [39:48]
A
Who do you think you are messing with someone like me?
- [39:52]
B
Yeah.
- [39:53]
A
What. What were you getting at, Pete? What was that?
- [39:56]
B
I don't think anybody knows.
- [39:59]
A
That's. You know, all I could think of, though, during the playback of watching you was a strike. To claim it was. Was all I could think of. And unfortunately, it. Unfortunately, the pin did not fall.
- [40:12]
B
Correct. And even when Pete. When Pete did that U.S. open, he threw the same shot, the shot before, and left the ten pin. And then he had to make the ten pin and then strike to win by a pin. It could have. It could have 10 pinned again, you know, if he was just this much off.
- [40:29]
A
Yeah.
- [40:29]
B
So. But, you know, he was P. Weber and was perfect. Wow.
- [40:34]
A
Well, I know you've got to rest up before your last block of the day, so we'll wish you adieu and thank you very much for coming on to the podcast.
- [40:45]
B
Glad to be here. Glad to do it, and thanks for
- [40:47]
A
having me on, and I hope to see you out. Maybe I'll be at the TOC or something. Maybe I'll come say hi again.
- [40:52]
B
Well, I'll be there for sure, so.
- [40:56]
A
All right, man. Good luck at the rest of the go. Let's see if you can follow it up with taking this one down.
- [41:04]
B
That's the plan.
- [41:04]
A
All right, EJ Have a good one, man.
- [41:06]
B
Thank you.
- [41:07]
A
I want to give a big thank you to EJ for taking time in between bowling blocks to sit down on his RV and have a discussion with us about Born to Bowl, as well as what happened at the Masters. I thought it was interesting to hear him talk about how depressed he was for the next few days. I mean, we all know what it's like to lose at something, but when you are stepping up for a chance to win a major bowling tournament and you have a chance to do it with a strike, and he started off with the first strike, and he came back and he 10 pinned on the second ball, meaning he came up a pin short, which is crazy. Now, he does still win $50,000, but there's a big difference between $100,000 and $50,000. Because that difference is everybody. $50,000. That is. That's crazy. On the flip side, Boog went from potentially only making 50,000 to winning $100,000 in the tournament. So there's a lot that goes into it. EJ shared a lot of information. It's. It's always interesting to hear the pros perspective. EJ is currently the best bowler in the world, and that is back to now. He may not win every tournament, but the fact that he is there time and time again on TV in the top fives, in the top twos, time and time again proves that he is currently the best bowler in the world. So let's dive into the recap of episode number three of Bourne to Bowl. Now, episode two ended with Simo winning his match to put him onto the Sunday show to try and climb the ladder to win the US Open. Now, we start off by seeing Simo cruising in the first match, strike after strike after strike, until there was a monkey wrench thrown at him. Now, normally, and you. And you hear him talk about this in the episode, and after five and a half frames, there's a commercial. So what that means is five and a half frames, you can take a breather, you can sit down, you can let your brain relax for just a second, because you know you're going to have three, four, or five minutes to prepare for the next shot. Well, in this case, you can see the producer on the side giving him the rolling finger, like, let's go, let's go. It's go, Bowl. And Simo was caught off guard. Now, I want to give props to our videographer for being in the right spot to actually catch that. That's pretty cool that they caught it because it is a pivotal moment in the episode and in the tournament because Simo now has to rush to make a shot. He talks about, I have 20 or 25 seconds to now make the shot. What you don't know is there's a shot clock. We don't really mention there's a shot clock. Well, he says it, but I'm going to tell you there is a shot clock. And I'm not sure if you get a warning the first time and then the second time is a zero on the frame. I mean, that would be kind of ballsy to give someone a zero on a frame for that. There used to be a fine. I don't know if there's still a fine. I think it was like 100 bucks. And then it went up to 250 bucks if you went over, because these are televised. And when it was on Fox and there was another event coming up after, they didn't want to have to cut away from the bowling to go to the next event. I mean, that would suck for the viewers at home to, to if something went overtime to not be able to see what was happening. And so there's a shot clock and Simon knew that he had the bowl and so he went, he rolled what looked to be a good ball, but I believe it came in a little high and it left the 7:10. And that is unmakeable. I mean, it's been made twice on tv, I believe. And it's just Mark Roth did it. And then the flying tomato, I guess they call it. No, no, not flying tomato. That's Sean White. It was the left hander who made the 7:10 on TV the, the last time. That's kind of Anthony Nair. He's the one who made that. Anyway, so Anthony throws a 710 split. He doesn't clean it up and then the next frame he opens again. And it basically was all over from there, which was kind of disappointing. It should have never happened. Something like should have never happened. There should have been a commercial break or there should have been better communication. And I believe that the production screwed up. I don't know if that was Fox. I don't know who screwed it up, but there could have been a bunch of things leading up to it. And I don't recall, I don't recall if maybe the show started late because Fox was late getting the broadcast because maybe a different event, a different sporting event they were covering started late, so they then took out a commercial break or there might have been an issue where they took an earlier commercial break instead. Because sometimes if there's technical issues, you'll take a commercial break and you'll run the commercial, but that means you don't have that commercial at that other time. And so I think Anthony handled it pretty good in the way that you would expect. I mean, I think Anthony would have probably flipped out a little bit more. I don't know why he didn't. I mean, that's a, that's a time where you're kind of justified in flipping out. Like, absolutely not. Like, I'm going to take my time. You guys screwed up. Give me a timeout to regroup and throw the next ball. So that is something that should have never happened at all. So anyway, Anthony's done at that point. His tournament's over. We follow him into the Paddock. We get his feedback, his, his, his thoughts on everything. And I'm sure he wasn't very happy at all. And so that's unfortunate because I would have liked to have seen him climb that ladder. Now the episode progresses. We shift away from Anthony now and we take a different tone, at least from episode two, which was a very raucous. Lots of curses. I mean, I've heard people be like, I love that episode. And I've heard people say there were too many curses. And I think this was a real episode. It reflects exactly what Anthony does on the lanes and a lot of other bowlers do on the lanes as well, but they're usually not mic'd up. So you're seeing what is actually. You're hearing things that you normally wouldn't hear. These are things that are actually going on and you wouldn't get that if we didn't have the access that we had to do that. So this episode number three starts to take a different tone. As we follow EJ back to his hometown where he and his wife own a bowling center. We find that he bought the bowling. They bought the bowling center from his parents, who I believe opened it in 1998. And it's really cool that we see old footage of little ej. Yeah, Lil EJ bowling on the lanes. Just pushing it down the lanes because the ball's too heavy. But his high game was like 174 at the time. And he's like a four year old. He's just like, yep, I just want to throw really, really fast. But you just learn, right? However you get the ball down the lanes is all that matters. We talked about that in the past. So seeing EJ as a kid bowl is pretty fascinating. That is, that is something that we're lucky to have footage of nowadays. I mean, we see it with some old athletes. You see it with like Wayne Gretzky back in the day, skating as a kid, going past tons and tons of players on the ice and seeing him score. Now we have more footage. We had Kyle, we have ej. I know that we have some Belmo footage coming up. We had Simo footage of him being a kid. We have younger footage of Cam. So, yeah, it's all there. I mean, it's cool to be able to cut back to that stuff. But we see E.J. in his home bowling center when he's not on tour. They're at the bowling center. They're painting, they're cooking, they're running, running the ship. You hear they're not making they're not taking any money for themselves right now, but they keep it running, which is great. It's. It's a personal thing, and obviously I hope it can be a success because, you know, there's not a lot of independent bowling centers around. So we get to go to EJ's house, we see his trophy room, we see his son knock the foot off the US Open trophy. It just seems to be something that. That tends to happen quite a lot as the trophy is extremely heavy. And it's not the first time that a trophy has broken. I believe Pete Weber broke a trophy on TV once. Not on purpose, but by accident. Now, in episode two, we saw a lot of on the lane stuff with Simo, and I know a lot of bowlers loved seeing that. I like sharing that. But we only have 28 minutes in an episode, and so it's hard to balance both. So you can have the personal stuff, which I think is extremely important off the lanes and having the on the lane stuff worked out really well last week with, with. With Simo's episode. And there will be more on the lane stuff coming up. A lot more. It's just a dance. With 28 minutes. You have to do a dance. So I found it interesting that, you know, EJ has this obsession with Dr. Pepper and he's like Dr. Ppper 2, 10 and 6 or whatever it was. 10, 2, and 6. I don't know. He said there's some commercial and that's what it was. It would be interesting to see if he does get a sponsorship. I think something like that could be small. A small sponsorship would be not a big ask for a large company. I don't know who owns Dr. Pepper right now, but it would definitely be a small ask compared to if you had to sponsor football, basketball, baseball, or hockey. You know, EJ could be a Dr. Pepper sponsorship for. I'm going to go higher. Let's just call it $50,000. We'll. We'll just go higher because I know it could be probably a lot less. But if Dr. Pepper Pepper is listening, give EJ a sponsorship right there. That would be. That would be good. So after seeing the personal life of EJ and his family, we go back to the US Open now because EJ's the number one seed and he's taking on Andrew Anderson for the Green Jacket and the US Open Championship. We don't go through a ton of the game and honestly wasn't that close of a match. It ended up being 2:38 to 1:84, which is not close at all. And it was kind of like EJ had it early. He mentioned it that, that Andrew made a mistake early on which left the door open for EJ to step right through and take a commanding lead and just, and just bowl. I mean, I guess he was born to bowl. Not just, just bowl and execute. And it was a foregone conclusion at that point. But there is a lot of celebration that happens at the end because it is a tough road to hoe. These majors are hard. The US opens, like, he's got to go through like almost 60 games of bowling in the week to get to that moment to hoist that trophy, to put on that green jacket and to take home that $10,000. We finally put the US Open to rest. And the episode then shifts gears to the Pete Weber Missouri Classic. We get some background on Pete. Now. I know some people wanted to hear more. They know that there's a lot more about Pete to go into. But again, in a 28 minute episode, it's not very easy to go into an entire thing that would take two hours in a documentary to do on Pete. There is so much to dive into. Pete, we just, we just scratched the surface. You know, you hit the, who do you think you are? I am the bad boy. The drugs, the alcohol, I mean, It's a quick 4, 4 minute, 3 minute, I don't know, vignette of Pete. But then we see modern day Pete talking about the height, you know, you've reached the high, the height of bowling when you have a tournament named after you. A little side note, these tournaments aren't as lucrative as the majors. And there used to be 35 or 37, I think it was 37 tournaments in a season or 34 somewhere in the 30s. And most of them weren't majors, but they were chances to bank and take home some money. A lot more opportunity than there are today. The Pete Weber Missouri classic is a $30,000 tournament to the winner. And I believe it goes 15 to the second place, maybe 10 to third, 7,500 to fourth and 5,000 to fifth, if I had to guess. So it's not a lot of money. But leading into this tournament, we, we see that Cam didn't make the cut, Simo didn't make the cut. I would have loved to have seen, you know, $0 go up on the screen for that. But yeah, they didn't place, they didn't make any money for that tournament and they were out. Now we do encounter Kyle again, who we see needing a mark to make the show, the TV show. And all he needs to do is Mark. And I say all he needs to do is Mark. I mean, it's easier said than done. Of course, we're not in that situation. But you know, you know, you, you roll your first ball. That means you have two balls to clean up. You know, the first ball, you get a nine. All right? You leave one pin. You then go pick up the pin. You're on the show. So he rolls the ball and he five tens. That means the pin behind the head pin. The one pin is the head pin. The five pin is behind the head pin. And he left that and the ten pin. It is a very, very difficult split to make for a right hander. I'm a left hander. I've made it as a left hander because you can hook it heavy and knock that five pin into the ten pin. But as a right hander, you honestly need to throw a backup ball. A backup ball is where you throw it over to the left hand side and have it roll and hook back into the five pin, kind of like you're a lefty. He was trying to cut it on the left hand side, the very edge of the pin, and he hit it too flush. And we see that Kyle missed the show by a pin. He needed that pin to make the show. And unfortunately for him, he left a split and wasn't able to clean it up. And so his season of dejection continued on. EJ continued to cruise this week in this tournament and he wins again. Again. I mean, again. Again. I mean, that sounds right. So he wins the Pete Weber Classic. It's the second, second year they've done that. And he took it home. I believe Simo won it last year, the first year they had it. But yeah, EJ takes that 30 grand home. 130 grand. In the two weeks right after winning the major, the last week, there was actually another tournament before the Missouri Classic, the Pete Weber Missouri Classic. It was a doubles tournament. And I think this might have led to Belmo going home because he was partnered with Bill o' Neill and they won the tournament. I believe it was slightly better than the 30,000, was 50,000. So they split 25,000. And I think because Belmo won that tournament with Bill o', Neill, that gave him more of a, a reason to fly home and take a quick break and visit the family. So as we alluded to in episode one of Born to Bowl, you know, Liev goes, now if you think that's all you're going to see of Kyle. Don't worry, he'll be back. Right? Same thing with Belmo. They will be back. There is more bowling to be had as we lead into the last two episodes of Born to Bowl. We've got more Kyle, we've got more Belmo. We still need to do the Belmo vignette, which we will, and we go to Australia to see that. But there's a lot more bowling to come because the World Series of Bowling is, I believe, what comes up next in episode four. So that brings us to the end of the unofficial Born to Bowl podcast, where we've recapped episode number three. Don't forget to tune in to Born to Bowl on Mondays at 9pm Eastern Standard Time on HBO and HBO. Max, couple more episodes before we wrap up the season. Thank you very much for listening. I'm Jared Poland, your host of the unofficial Born to Bowl podcast. Remember, always throw strikes. I mean, try to throw strikes. That's all I have to say. See ya.