Loading summary
Transcript44 lines
- [00:00]
Ro Khanna
People are going to see that it costs more to get a car, that it costs more to get groceries. They're going to see that the country is slowing down, meaning it's harder to get a job if you're graduating from school or in your 20s. It's just going to be harder to get, get a good paying job. So all of these things are going to hit. They haven't hit fully now but over the next few months they're going to hit. And I think we just have to keep talking about the, that it was Trump's choice self destructive policies that got us in this mess.
- [00:36]
Cameron
Hey everybody. Today me and my buddy Jack are talking to Congressman Ro Khanna and it's really fun, it's a blast. It was recorded like five days ago and therefore we are talking about the Bernie and AOC rally in Los Angeles before it happens. And that might be a little confusing but keep that in mind and it's going to be great. We laugh, we chat, we talk politics. You're going to love it. Stay tuned. Hey everybody, welcome back to FYpod. Today we are talking to one of my heroes, Congressman Ro Khanna who I just looked up your age. I thought that you were like Gen Z than I was like the way that you've been doing social media lately, the way your TikToks have been going like you are on social media. Everything that I lie to my employers and say that I am.
- [01:25]
Ro Khanna
Oh please, you've got a huge social media presence. You do. Jack does. I, I just surround myself with a lot of talented Gen Z folks. You know the key, key to anything is having a good team.
- [01:36]
Cameron
No, but seriously like in terms of messaging and the stuff you're talking about, I'm just like, oh, someone is speaking to the topics that are interesting and engaging to my generation. What a concept. That's so strange. Right now you're in California, right for the rally?
- [01:52]
Ro Khanna
I am. I'm headed down to L. A to speak at Bernie rally tomorrow morning and then head to Cleveland on Monday to give a big speech on the economy, economic patriotism instead of the Vance Trump gilded age. And then I go to Yale where Vance and I both went to stand up for universities, free speech, make sure people are speaking out about kids getting snatched off of universities without due process. So it's a busy, busy few days.
- [02:25]
Cameron
Yeah, I tried to visit Jack at his Columbia dorm and I didn't have my ID on me and they just wouldn't let.
- [02:31]
Jack
First of all, why do you not have your wallet with your id all.
- [02:35]
Cameron
The time Cam, I, I, I, your Honor, I'd like to be tried separately. Point is, they didn't let me up and it's like I used to go here, go through your student record, whatever. So Ro, I guess right now I'm having a hard time. I mean, Jack knows this stuff because he's, you know, a politics robot. But I personally, it seems like every time I catch up on the tariff drama, every time I finally start to understand it, it just flips and there's something new. Like right when I had an understanding of what was going on, now it's like, oh, there's insider trading and Marjorie Taylor Greene is kind of tweeting about it. Just for the people in the audience who are more like me, is there any chance you could just talk to Jack ideally about what's going on?
- [03:19]
Ro Khanna
Cameron, it doesn't make sense. Because it doesn't make sense, you know that. It's just Trump basically said it doesn't make sense. They said, how are you doing? Policy says I'm doing it on instinct. So it's basically whatever his whim is. That's why it's hard to keep track of one day the tariffs are on. One day the tariffs are off. One day he's tweeting out the people buy stocks knowing that he's going to be removing the tariffs a few hours later for some countries. But here's, here's the what everyone should know. I mean, look, there's still 10% tariffs on every country around the world. I mean, that's a lot. That means your prices on a lot of things are going to go up by up to 10%. That your car prices, your grocery prices, your prices to build any, any homes, any factories. The second thing is that he's got 145% tariffs on China. That basically means we're, we're in a trade war with China. We're not going to buy anything from China. China is not going to buy anything from us the way he's got this going. And what's crazy is a lot of factories need stuff from China. Like you want to bring manufacturing here, you need things from China. And there's no plan on how we're going to get the substitutes. So it's not like he had said, okay, let's build some of the substitutes here. So we're right now in a, in a, in a trade war with China. You had the markets obviously be very volatile, correct? Almost 20%. And then, but the most concerning thing is the bond markets and that's what freaked them out? You know, bond markets basically are a indication of how much people want to invest in the US and all these countries said, well, we don't trust the US Anymore, so we're going to start to sell us Treasuries. And the bond yield started going up. And why is that a problem? The bond yield goes up to 4.55%. Then credit card interest payments go up, mortgage payments go up. If you're borrowing any money, your interest go up. The amount of debt we have to pay that off, that goes up. It's really terrible for an economy. It basically means you're losing confidence in the US Currency. And so Trump paused the some of the worst tariffs things he had put on in addition to what I've talked about, because he was spooked by the bond markets.
- [05:32]
Jack
Yeah. And we wanted to talk about the bond markets and what it means for the actual our alliances entrusted America and the stability of the dollar and our economy going forward and how that's impacting the future. But I also wanted to talk about the right now of it all. Cam touched on this and I brought it up to you when we spoke a couple weeks ago when Marjorie Taylor Greene became the chairwoman of the Doge Subcommittee, she also thought now's a great time to buy some Tesla stock. Right. But since then, Tesla stock has dropped pretty dramatically, which was funny to see that Marjorie Taylor Greene is too stupid to do insider trading correctly. But when Donald Trump is directly telling you, it seems, how to insider trade, she had a little bit more success. Can you speak to what we saw from Marjorie Taylor Greene purchasing what it seems like was hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of individual stocks during a dip that have now bumped up quite a bit because Donald Trump has decided we're not doing tariffs anymore. Can you talk more about. We saw Leader Jefferies say that there's to be an investigation into this. We want answers. But what's going to be happening with insider trading that you've talked so much about and has now become so apparent to so many?
- [06:40]
Ro Khanna
Well, we need to ban members of Congress from trading stock. I mean, it's pretty simple. And we should ban any elected official for giving stock tips. You shouldn't be allowed to, as a congressman or as a president, sit there and say, I want you to buy stock and then get to decide actions that are going to have massive impact on the stock market, like whether we tariff things or not. So what happened is Donald Trump tweeted out at 9:30. This may be a good time. This is a Good time to buy. And then, conveniently three, four hours later, he says, okay, I'm taking away the reciprocal tariffs and the stock market booms. So the question that really is, is who knew that he was going to do that, that four hours after he tweeted out that he was going to reverse tariff policy? Because if you knew that and you went and bought stock, you were going to make a ton of money. And it's that kind of corruption that really drives people crazy as a time where we've got record income inequality. But there are two very. This is not a complicated thing. Like, there's a bill, I've been on the bill for years called the Trust act, that basically says, ban members of Congress and their families from trading stock. If you have come into Congress with stock or have assets like my wife did it from prior to marriage, put them in a diversified trust that you don't control, and that eliminates conflicts. And if you're a member of Congress or if you're a senator or if you're a president, make sure you don't say anything about whether you should buy or sell stocks. I don't know. It's not a very hard thing.
- [08:13]
Jack
It just doesn't seem that difficult, especially with the type of access. And it's funny, you know, we think back, it's like, this is not the only person from Georgia who, you know, bought a dip. We saw this with David Perdue, right, during COVID These people have access to this information, but Trump is also being so blatant with it. I feel like that's part of their corruption right now, is that if they think that they're doing it out in public, it's totally fine. Like Elon Musk snatching up FAA contracts for Starlink, taking more from the Defense Department. Like, they think if they're just doing it in public, it's okay, and it's different, but it's just such a highlight. I know we saw the clip of Trump with, you know, some executives in the Oval Office talking about how many billions they had made in that day. Like, this is the type of stuff that we need to be highlighting as much as we can.
- [08:58]
Cameron
I mean, it harkens back to the famous if I shot somebody on Fifth Avenue comment. Like, they'll just do it in front of us. And it was really complicated to me, because I said, okay, there's no way I truly understand this corruption. If it makes sense to me right away, you know, there must be something I'm missing. And then I look into it and I'M like, no, actually this is that exact kind of corruption. I think one of the things I'm interested in talking about is a lot of young people my age who play a little friendly with maga. You know, they might not necessarily say that they're Trump supporters friendly.
- [09:29]
Ro Khanna
That's interesting. Yeah, that's a good.
- [09:31]
Cameron
Yeah, they're MAGA enablers more than they're necessarily like Viking hat wearing Capitol rioters. Like, because Trump is success with Gen Z is so much more cultural than it is an actual policy matter. A lot of people I know who might have voted for Trump and just don't want to admit it, or if not, did not vote for Harris and are sort of like that, he's funny, whatever. A lot of them like to say that they aren't political. You know, ooh, this woke thing's gone too far. Ooh, are you sure you want trans athletes to play sports? Whatever. But then the second you press them on any actual policy, they pull back and they're like, but I'm not a politics guy. Because they want to engage in the fun, indulgent, decadent stuff that comes with maga, but they don't want to be pressed on it because they didn't do the reading. So what I'm seeing from those people in terms of all of this is they can't get behind the tariffs, they don't support the tariffs, they don't want the economy to tank. You know, guys like Dave Portnoy are tweeting about how their portfolios are blowing up, but all of them go back to the same thing, which is, oh, there must be some plan. Like, you know, I'm not smarter than Trump. Trump is playing 5D chess. And the interesting thing for me is the MAGA world and Trump's messengers, they can't keep up with him either. So you'll see the same MAGA influencers saying, actually, it's okay to lose money. It's not a big deal to lose money. You're fine. And then six hours later they'll be tweeting, see, he's been doing this all along. And I'm trying to figure out how to message to people this plan you're expecting to see from Trump is not there.
- [11:07]
Ro Khanna
Two things that I think this whole episode taught us, which is, unfortunately, there's only one check on Donald Trump right now. It's not the courts, it's not Congress, it's not Democrats, it's the bond market. It's like the only thing he listed, though. I mean, basically the economy was going to crash. People told him it's not going to be a recession, it's going to be a great depression if the bond market continues. And Trump basically came out and said the bond markets were going crazy queasy. That's why I stopped. So the other lesson is there are a lot of things you can get away with in American politics, as Trump has shown. You can get away with, you know, having criminal indictments, you can get away with affairs, you can get away with starting an insurrection on January 6, but you can't get away with destroying people's wealth. It's like this, this country, you know, they're not going to tolerate people who are going to destroy the economy, destroy people's wealth. So I think this is breaking through in a way that other stuff with Trump has it because you and I and Jack care about democracy and the rule of law and fairness and making sure that we're treating people with respect and that these are high end, you know, these are sort of principled values. But everyone, America cares about making money and making sure the economy doesn't, doesn't crash. Now, to your point about this 3D chess, I mean, they're, they're trying to find some rationale. Oh, he's going to make sure that we're actually living in a zero tariff world and all these other countries are going to come cut a deal with them. First of all, it's contradictory because he's saying we're going to have manufacturing come back to the United States. Well, if you're going to have manufacturing come back to the United States, that means you got to keep the tariffs. And then he's saying, no, no, no, we're going to have zero tariffs. Now, if you're a Mary Bar and you're saying, should I put more factories in the United States? You don't know what to do because on the one hand you're saying, okay, maybe I should, because there are these tariffs that are going to stay. On the other hand, you get all these Trump people saying, no, no, he doesn't mean it. They're all going to go away. So he's created the worst of all worlds. Prices are going up, but economic uncertainty, business investment is frozen, consumer confidence is at the lowest level, and manufacturing is declining. The second thing is they keep saying the art of the deal. What deal? Like, where are the deals? Where are the other countries saying, okay, we're eliminating all tariffs on American goods and we're forgetting that he's put a 10% tax on every country. There's a universal tax on every.
- [13:28]
Cameron
I think those penguins from that uninhabited island actually caved to Trump.
- [13:32]
Jack
Yeah, I saw them on a plane. They, I saw that on Instagram, so it must have been real. Well, like, this is my, this is the thing that I like, am most shocked by, which is weird that I'm not most shocked by the tariffs. I guess we all should have predicted that when Trump wouldn't stop talking about it, he'd, you know, stick to his word for the first time. I'm shocked that MAGA doesn't have some, like, coherent and cogent message. Right. They're all saying different things. We've heard art of the deal. We've heard your money doesn't matter from Benny Johnson. It's all ones and zeros, we've heard. But the market is doing well, so now it's good. I don't know what the, the end is for them. Like, what is their goal? What do they want to accomplish? It's clearly not bringing manufacturing back or they wouldn't have cut out so many appropriations from the Biden agenda. What is the way that we nail them down on a failure? Right. Is it just talking about. Is it just talking about the market? Is talking about how Donald Trump thought that, oh, if I create a recession, that means interest rates will be low. Well, now interest rates are going up because I've destroyed America's standing in the world. What is the, what is the one way that we particularly nail them down? Because they're just kind of reshaping how they want to argue this. Of course, we'll never change the minds of, like, the real MAGA diehards, but when there's so much mis mixed messaging, which is pretty shocking from them, where do we want to be talking about, like, what is the main specific impact or is it many different things?
- [14:55]
Ro Khanna
Well, Jack, Donald Trump is much better and more dangerous out of power in certain ways in messaging than in power. And the difference is that when you're in power, there are actually consequences to what you do, and there's only so much you can spin. And he's great at telling stories, but ultimately people are going to see that it costs more to get a car, that it costs more to get groceries, that it costs more to buy a house. They're going to see that there are 401k plans, their retirement plans have less money in it. When they get that statement, they're going to see that the country is slowing down, meaning it's harder to get a job if you're graduating from school or in your 20s, it's just going to be harder to get, get a good paying job. So all of these things are going to hit. They haven't hit fully now, but over the next few months they're going to hit. And I think we just have to keep talking about the, that it was Trump's choice self destructive policies that got us in this mess. But the Democrats have a great opportunity which is we can become the party now that understands and leaves on the economy, that has sound, rational economic policies, that if you are young, you want to build economic independence, you want to build wealth, you want to build a company, you want to have some security, the Democrats have actual ways of helping you do that. And for the longest time we couldn't penetrate Donald Trump because he was seen as this rich billionaire guy and people said, oh cool, he's got Elon, the richest guy in the world. They know what they're doing and building wealth, it turns out they don't.
- [16:26]
Cameron
Well, I got, I guess one more question on this because I want to mostly do fun stuff with the time we have. Because you do. You do enough interviews talking about this. You're going to go talk with the giant audiences supporting Bernie and Ioce's rally. You're going to get into this today. We're going to do some goofy things. But first, you know, right now, I think one of the biggest losses we're facing right now is any chance at suggesting to other countries in the future that we are a reliable trade partner. Right. Even if Trump was immediately removed, even if his entire regime was removed from office and we replaced it with the greatest, most constructive liberal people in the world, I can't see the world looking at us and saying, well, how are we not four years away from another disaster? So if you were the United States of America trying to communicate to other countries, hey, we are better than this Trump disaster, please excuse us and please trade with us again and rely on us for anything. What is the strategy?
- [17:30]
Ro Khanna
You know, it's a really good point. They have to like you to buy stuff from you. And I think we just haven't realized the damage we're doing, which is where people aren't liking us. I mean, you think it's a problem with Tesla that people aren't buying Tesla? Think about if there are people around the world thinking that about American products for the first time. People are saying, maybe we don't want to buy American. 95% of the world's consumers live outside the United States. And this is going to be one of our Biggest challenges that Trump is basically making us disliked in so many other parts of the world. It's a problem for our foreign policy, it's a problem for our alliances. It's a problem for our moral leadership, but it's also a problem for our business because people are going to say, maybe we'll just buy the European thing, maybe we'll buy the Chinese thing. I mean, he's gotten Japan and South Korea talking to China that, like I joked around that give him the Nobel Prize for that. I don't think that was possible. You know, I mean, he is fundamentally pushing away people from the United States. Now, how do we change that? I think it's going to mean that the next speaker of the House, the next president, is going to have to inspire the world again to say America wants to partner with the world and lead in a way that, that recognizes that we can have a win. Win that we, we want other countries to. To succeed while we succeed. And it's going to be a huge challenge.
- [18:52]
Cameron
Yeah. Jack, do you have anything else before I start talking about Marco Rubio?
- [18:56]
Jack
Well, that was going to be. My question is like, what is the step? You know, you ro. You haven't been shy about being someone who wants to lead the future of the Democratic Party, someone who wants to be a leader of this country. What, what does that look like showing the rest of the world that we are not what we have looked like over the past? You know, it's not just like, you know, a couple of weeks, but the entirety of this Trump destabilization of what America has been viewed as on the global stage. What are the steps to do that?
- [19:25]
Ro Khanna
I think some of it is who we have representing us, right? I mean, if we had Kamala Harris, for example, standing up there, the daughter of immigrants, an African American, Indian, American woman, saying, I represent America. I think the, the world looks at that very differently than if you have Donald Trump or, or J.D. vance, who's talking about, you know, Afghan, Afghani Americans blowing up malls in, in Ohio. And so it's partly who in their values represents the United States. And whether that's for speaker of the House or in the Senate or in the presidency or the Cabinet. And then it is how they talk about America's role in the world. I believe in America that is leading in innovation and science and industry, but inspiring the world to, to. To. To make advances in human knowledge and civilization, cooperating the world to do that. The type of America we were, what that John F. Kennedy called us to. And I think it's still possible. I think it's. In fact, I think there's going to be such a breath of fresh air after this ugly Donald Trump period. In much the same way, there was a breath of fresh air after George W. Bush when Obama came though. George W. Bush looks like a saint compared to Donald Trump, although he's been.
- [20:50]
Cameron
Really quiet, hasn't he? You'd think that George W. Bush would maybe be like, hey, you know, this isn't the Republican Party that I fought for. I feel like a lot of people have been quiet. And I know there's this decorum from former presidents where they're not supposed to speak up about certain things, but it's like, hey, guys, the American experiment is failing right now. Maybe say a couple things about it. Regardless, speaking of the American experiment failing, I just want to ask you what you think is going on in Marco Rubio's head when he's making this type of face. Because, you know, he's gotten a lot.
- [21:25]
Ro Khanna
Easier lately right now. I mean, he was, like, always smiling. America is the American century. When he ran for president, the, you know, we were American optimism. And now it's like all the pictures are just like him, scowling and angry, you know, so why, why does he want this job?
- [21:42]
Jack
This leads into a great, a great topic of another person you've been going back and forth with. So Marco Rubio. People have said that Marco Rubio and J.D. vance is that picture of them in the Oval Office with President Zelensky. Right? And it's Marco Rubio looking depressed and J.D. vance is smiling. It's like both of them are going to hell. Only Marco Rubio knows it. Do you think J.D. vance, someone has completely abandoned all of his values, has any residual soul left in him that's kind of being, like, eaten away by being a part of this administration? Or do you think he's fully embraced that? He fully embraces it when he's, like, trying to attack you and he fails at it on Twitter. Do you think there's any part of JD Vance that's really sad and, like, getting crushed during this, or is he just, like, left everything behind, shed his skin, become a whole new, you know, like, autocratic, awful version of him?
- [22:28]
Ro Khanna
You know, sadness and introspection are signs of weakness in the, in the JD Van sort of MAGA world. It's sort of like you got to own the libs. You can't. You can't think and be vulnerable and show that you may have regret. That's just not how people show strength. So I don't think he stops to think about things. I think he's on a autopilot. Like I got to own the libs. I got to show him who's in charge and hasn't had the time for reflection. And that's one way that that's what he's become. But you know, I often say sort of Trump without any of the charm Trump. You know, Trump has kind of an entertainment like sense of comedic timing. I mean I think it's awful his policies, but he's got a understanding of how to, to, to connect. And I think Vance doesn't have that.
- [23:21]
Cameron
I think people, you know, I understand why folks think Vance selling his soul. His sort of Faustian deal was when he went over with Trump who he had recently called America's Hitler. But I mean you gotta know he sold his soul to Peter Thiel. Peter Thiel was the first real demon that he was working with. And the second Peter Thiel gets his claws in you. I mean he's the 21st century Roy Cohn, which for those of you who don't know what that means is not a compliment. And one of the things that I've been so curious about right now is the different ways we can watch Teals influence manifests in this administration. Because I feel as though Thiel is a shadow operator right now who has so much power over Maga world and Elon is kind of sucking up all the attention. But I feel like Thiel and his whole cadre are really making a lot of moves here.
- [24:18]
Ro Khanna
Well, I'm speaking going to be speaking about exactly Peter Thiel in my Cleveland speech on Monday and would love for folks to check it out. But Peter Thiel basically says that democracy and technology advancing are not compatible, that democracy moves too slow, that democracy is too inconvenient and we need a so called aristocracy of talent to govern people like him and others because they understand what's needed to move civilization forward. It's a blatantly anti democratic agenda. And he says the time he most idolizes in the 1920s where we had cars and automobiles and optimism, of course it led to the stock market crash and the Great Depression. But his agenda, which, which is not secret is really to make the country governed by more business elites to slash government. And he thinks that that's the way that we're going to unleash technology. And, and I agree with you that he was the reason Vance got where he was. He's the reason Vance is on the ticket. And it's a very dangerous ideology it's something we've seen before, like in the 1920s. It's something we've seen in the robber baron era. And the only way to defeat it is to have a progressive movement on the other side, which is what Bernie's doing, which is what FDR did.
- [25:37]
Cameron
I've seen it called techno feudalism. And from my didn't even graduate high school understanding, it's the idea that if you can dismantle democracy aggressively enough, billionaires can come in and seize even more power over everybody. And it really seems like this is a full blown attack on democracy. And the problem is we've been saying this for a while now and people on the right are saying, okay, well, there have still been elections. You know, you were saying Trump was attacking democracy back in 2016, but then you look at Peter Thiel, who's so influential now, and his Manifesto makes Project 2025 look like a children's book. This guy is coming out here and straight up saying, like, yeah, no more United States, no more America. We're just going to divvy it up, give it to tech billionaires. And it's scary. And I personally don't really know how to be a messenger to people around me about how alarming this is, especially since these guys have so much control over what's going on.
- [26:36]
Ro Khanna
Yeah, I mean, look, the move to have techno feudalism, techno libertarianism, isn't just to cancel elections. I mean, that would be the most extreme. But if you're dismantling the state, if you're basically taking away people's funding for education, public schools, Medicaid, Social Security, if you're privatizing the state, if you're taking away any of the regulatory checks, then for all intents and purposes, we have power in the hands of the most wealthy. And they get to make the decisions about what they want to spend on and how they want to live. And the only check on that is right now, our elections. Because they haven't been able to take away the elections and to prevent the four, four more years of JD Vance, eight more years of JD Vance, where they would entrench a total dismantling of the state and power in the hands of the very wealthy. But it's infuriating because Elon Musk got taxpayer money to build Tesla, got government contracts to bring, build SpaceX, and he's taking the money he earned based on public investment to go fund the election of Donald Trump. And that's, that's why people are so jaded about, about the political system.
- [27:50]
Cameron
Well, you saw Elon's brother, who is a Tesla board member, tweeting negative public things about the tariffs. And it's hard to believe Elon wasn't aware of that and didn't clear it, seeing as he's another Tesla board member. Do you think the sort of like, diva Real Housewivesian fallout between Trump and Elon is something that can happen anytime soon, or do you. It feels as though two personalities like that, especially with how much of a diva Trump is, how much ketamine Elon Musk is doing. Is there a way that that fallout can happen and aggressively and soon, perhaps?
- [28:27]
Ro Khanna
Well, I think Elon's already leaving by May. He said that. And he certainly thinks these policies are irrational of tariffs that they're, they're pursuing. I just think who, who wouldn't be enamored if the president United States made you, you know, invited you to everything, made, gave you power to cut things, acted like they were your best friend. And I think Elon got caught up in all of that. But, you know, he's, he's leaving, he's been pushed out, and we'll see how loyal he stays to, to the Trump, the Trump base. But I think it's a first sign of a crack and it's what should give people hope about the importance of organizing and being out there. I mean, Elon's numbers, he started out at 60% approval because who doesn't like someone who can put up rockets in space? And he's down to like 35% now. It was the most dramatic turnaround because people said, no, we don't want a billionaire cutting our health care or our education funding. You know, in this country, we're pretty smart voters. I mean, it's like, okay, we want LeBron James to play basketball. Elon can do, you know, this, the stuff on space. We want, you know, Beyonce doing concerts, but we don't want them ruling over us. We believe in self government and we believe people have to go through the process. And it's deeply offensive to people, even Republicans, even MAGA folks like, why is this guy getting to call the shots? No, I'm a citizen. I get to call the shots. I don't care about some celebrity business leader, athlete actually calling the shots.
- [29:57]
Jack
Well, we talked about maybe the, the deep seated hatred of self that might be left in J.D. vance, and we can hold out hope that it is. Looking back at how far Tesla stock has fallen since, I think it was early December when it was at its peak, how much Elon has lost of his Market share for electric vehicles, how much people despise him, which is the thing he loves most is to be liked. Which is funny because it's thing happening least to him recently. Do you think Elon Musk would do it all over again or do you think he looks back with regret and he knows that now everyone who touches Donald Trump is eventually screwed over by him, as we've kind of seen played out here. Well, Elon kind of did it to himself. But do you think Elon regrets it all?
- [30:38]
Ro Khanna
Yeah, I don't know. I don't know if he's at that stage yet. I mean, I think he was intoxicated by the crowds that were coming out to see him in Pennsylvania. I think he loved ketamine, you know. Yeah, I think he loved, he loved being seen as the second most important person in the country. He convinced himself he was going to get us to fiscal responsibility. Of course the Trump budgets explode, the deficits even more. But I think when he leaves, he may, he may start to wonder like, well, what did he do? He didn't, he didn't end up cutting the federal deficit in any way. He's left with his companies in worse shape. He's left with people actively disliking him and thinking he's hurting people. So, you know, I'm sure when he reflects, if he does, he's going to have mixed thoughts about the whole thing.
- [31:35]
Cameron
Well, Congressman, with the time we have left, I have a question that's a little bit more abstract, but it's the one I'm the most curious to hear. So you've been in Congress, you know, Biden was the president. You would prepare for events, speak with people. You know, you had something of a schedule and a life. Now Donald Trump is like two and a half months into his crazy regime. Do you watch stuff on TV anymore? Like, do you have time to do anything? Like I'm a, I'm a, I'm a podcast host and I feel like I'm too busy.
- [32:03]
Ro Khanna
You know, I don't watch much TV other than some sports, even when Biden was, was president. But I, you know, it's been crazy, these two and a months. It feels like so much longer. It's kind of cliched, but it really does. And I've just felt that the most important thing I can be doing is not being in Washington, being out there, out there doing town halls and red districts, out there calling out J.D. vance's attack on universities, going to Yale and doing that standing up. You know, I hate the anti intellectualism in this country. Like, yes, we need to make sure that we do a much better job for the 60% of people who didn't have a college degree because we messed up by offshoring so much industry. We didn't invest when jobs went offshore in communities that were hollowed out. But that doesn't mean that we start attacking people who study or who pursue the truth or that we start attacking institutions that are producing massive research. And Nobel laureates like, we should not be ashamed of intellectual contributions to society. And that's partly where, you know what Kennedy's America was. It was a celebration of excellence and excellence in all aspects. And Trump is really, ironically, he talks about merit, but he's hurting the institutions of merit in government at universities across the nation. And so I feel compelled to speak out, to be out there, to be out there on as many podcasts. And yes, so the days have gotten longer and busier, but it's not really a sacrifice. I mean, the sacrifices are people like John Lewis who were beaten on an Edmund Pest bridge, or my grandfather who spent years in jail as part of Gandhi's independence movement. I mean, but all of us have to stretch ourselves, I think, to exert citizenship in this moment.
- [33:48]
Jack
And I'm glad you brought up the anti intellectualism and that attack from the right and also the podcasting tour you've been on. I always say about, like your media strategy, not only do you go to the places where Democrats don't like to show up, but I would say probably 98% of Democrats in Congress don't know some of the places you go. They are unaware of these other podcasts. And we talked about this in the episode of the FY pod that I did with Tim and Cam about these MAGA influencers who pushed the anti intellectualism because they want young men to think that they have to like escape the matrix to live a better life. And to do that, you have to buy their course. And being a drop shipper, right, you shouldn't go to college and pursue an education in a career that you're passionate about. Like, you should sell things from China for a higher price in the United States. Like, that is economic liberation. And certainly that has worked. The right wing space has taken over what would just kind of be the lifestyle space for young men or what they aspire to. What have you learned from those hosts? And I know maybe learned isn't the right way. What have you taken away from the host of these kind of more right wing or apolitical seeming, but right influencing podcasts that you've been on that you think we need to apply in our messaging. As Democrats, I think we certainly should.
- [35:05]
Ro Khanna
Engage them, go on and chat with them. But I think that what we have to do is separate sort of convenient truths from. From more serious thinking. I mean, Matrix was a fine movie, but it, it's not philosophy. I mean, you know, I mean, and people need to wake up to. To realize that they should think for themselves and not be brainwashed with what I'm saying, but also not be brainwashed by what some podcaster is saying. And I think that the only way that you can get that is if you're on these programs and on these podcasts and challenging people, explaining it, jousting with folks. And I. And Democrats need to do that. They need to be more willing to just have conversations and we make say conversations. You say things that are sometimes silly or dumb or can be misinterpreted, but we have to be willing to take that risk. And so I, I think what you have, unfortunately, is for a lot of people, they're getting this kind of superficial New age philosophy and they bought into it. But what we have to do is say, look, we can ask. Ask a little more questions and see if this is really what you want to believe in. It's kind of like the initial charm of reading an Ayn Rand novel. Like, okay, it seems like she has the whole world figured out. And then you realize, yeah, you know, maybe it's a little more complex than that.
- [36:35]
Cameron
I'll do you one better. I actually think they're boring. Congressman, thank you so much for joining us today. Really appreciate it. Best of luck in all of your travels, all your big events. We can't wait to watch and uplift and elevate everybody. Please keep your eyes on everything that the Congressman and co are up to, because it's very good stuff and it's exactly what a lot of people are asking for. So thank you again.
- [36:56]
Ro Khanna
Well, thank you, Cameron. Thank you for your voice and Jack, both of you are incredible and you're doing an incredible service to the country and appreciate it. Gives me hope for the next generation.
- [37:07]
Cameron
Likewise. Take care, man. Thanks a lot.
- [37:08]
Ro Khanna
Thank you. Thank you.