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- [00:00]
Jon Favreau
Foreign Congressman Robert Garcia from Long Beach. There's a lot for us to talk about this week. I know we both just want to talk about Superman, so we're going to get through the other stuff really quickly. But I have to ask, Robert, I. I see you on TV all the time. I see you out doing stuff all the time. Have you been all right? Like, are you chilling at all?
- [00:24]
Robert Garcia
I mean, look, I. I try to take some. Some time for myself. I mean, everybody should. Everything's so, like, up right now and a really tough time, but I think we got to be in the fight right now. Really tough. And I think that. I think that if you're not willing to go, you know, 110% every day as a member of Congress, I think we got to get people in Congress that are willing to do that right now. And so I've told all my Democratic colleagues, like, this is. We're in a moment where our democracy and our country's on the line, so we've got to be out there really tough all the time. I love that. It feels like more and more people are stepping up and doing things. So, no, I mean, I'm tired all the time, to be honest, but it's good. We gotta. We gotta keep fighting.
- [01:02]
Jon Favreau
Do you see Democrats in Congress right now who actually don't know what to do and are sort of just trying to sit this out and hope that once all the craziness ends, they can stay there? Like, you know, I see people locking in really hard. You. And we just spoke to Ro Khanna. You guys are going at it heavy. You guys are really locking in. But there's some congressmen who I feel like are less active than they've ever been. Not more.
- [01:29]
Robert Garcia
Yeah, I mean, I think. Look, I think, first of all, it depends on every person. I think for some members, and I think this is very true, people may not see them maybe, like, in the national press or doing podcasts or other things, but they're very active in their community and so don't want to discount folks that they're organizing, they're doing rallies or out in their community. They're. They're helping their constituents get through horrific immigration cases. So a lot of people are doing things every single day. I also think that, look, the Trump era is just different. Like, we. Look, let's be honest. I mean, when Trump gets elected, Democrats did not have a plan and how to react. In fact, I mean, like you, I. A lot of us were just so disappointed in kind of the slow burn to actually getting up and fighting as a party. Right. That, that, that happened. And so I think a lot of people are still trying to figure out how horrific Donald Trump has been and didn't expect it. I think people expect, yeah, he'll be bad. We were there the first time. But no, this is like immensely worse. And so I think people are realizing that now. And I think you have seen a shift in the last couple weeks.
- [02:34]
Jon Favreau
You know, I think this would have sounded like an inflammatory and kind of unnecessarily aggressive thing to say a couple years ago. But right now, part of what I'm wondering is how many people in Congress are inhibited by the fear of political violence. Right. And the reason that I bring this up specifically today is we just saw Governor Josh Shapiro's house get set ablaze and the pictures out of it are very scary. And I'm thinking, are there people in Congress who are trying to quiet down a little bit and sit on, sit in the wings because they are afraid that the ever aggressive and more intense than they've ever been MAGA base might actually do serious personal harm to them.
- [03:20]
Robert Garcia
So, look, I think that's actually a real reality because it is for everyone and anyone's job. Look, I remember when I was calling out Elon Musk and, you know, called Elon Musk a dick, and we're using metaphors. Not, not a big deal. And Donald Trump sent his Justice Department after me and basically his U.S. attorney saying he was going to prosecute me. That was, I remember thinking, sitting there going, okay, I'm not a wealthy person. I work hard and I'm here in Congress and I'm going to get maybe the world's richest man involved, the U.S. attorney's office involved. Congress isn't there to protect you or pay your legal bills. It's not the way it works. And so those are real concerns that people could have. And I don't blame people for those, especially working class folks, younger folks are coming to Congress. I understand that. You know, I think at the same time, this is like a moment where you have to be willing to kind of put it all at risk. I've kind of made like, peace with, like, look, you got to put yourself, your whole self at risk at this moment and whatever that means as it relates to Donald Trump's actions, you know, empowering his Department of Justice to go after you. I think it's a real thing, but I think it's also something we gotta be like, prepared for. And that's how serious the moment is. And I think that that's the way we got to think about it.
- [04:43]
Jon Favreau
One of the things I think it speaks to is a larger moral decline. I think I've been a little trepidatious to say moral decline before, because conservatives kind of hijacked the idea of a moral decline, and they talked about moral decline being like Dungeons and Dragons games and, you know, queer people reading books to your kids at the library. But there has been a severe moral decline. People in this country are really of the belief that being a bad person is the easier path to success than otherwise. And that's part of why we're going to talk about Superman, because I don't want to talk about Superman just for some fanboy shit. I want to talk about Superman because the values he represents and the values on which you swore into Congress, which we'll get into. But for now, I'm just like, it seems like this isn't even the Democrats who should be afraid. I'm fully of the belief that there are moderate conservatives who are facing threats of violence from maga, because if that wasn't the case, I don't see why moderate conservatives would be voting alongside Trump for policies that these conservatives ran on not supporting. You know, conservatives are not voting with. Forget their values. They're not voting with their own agenda. And I'm just thinking, like, is there going to be a point at which people in Congress can come out and start having these conversations about, listen, this doesn't feel like America anymore. This doesn't feel free. At any point, any of us could be the target of violent people who literally fucking ran through the Capitol.
- [06:11]
Robert Garcia
Yeah, I mean, I think that's right. So first, I'll just take my own experience once I got to Congress, and particularly this last four or five months, or I've been a little bit more aggressive on particularly Elon Musk and Donald Trump's reelection. I mean, the death threats. The threats are real. Like, they're real. It's not just social media kind of bullying or social media attacks. It's like real people calling the office, people doing strange things that we've got to pass along to, like, law enforcement. That's happening to a lot of members, not just on our side, but also on the Republican side as well. And they're getting it mostly from the extreme right that they're not being, you know, conservative enough. And so that is a real concern for folks. People need to protect themselves and their families. You mentioned what happened to Governor Shapiro. That is horrific and dangerous and scary. And so those are all things that we all got to think about, and I certainly think about it when I go out and go to events and it's scary, especially for folks that are out there. A lot. I think about these big rallies and you see Bernie out there and Alex, Alexandria and so many others. Like we, we, we don't worry about everyone and, and kind of some of these crazy people that are out there.
- [07:23]
Jon Favreau
I guess to the Bernie and AOC thing, this brings up the other thing I really wanted to talk about, which was, okay, so we're seeing right now these giant crowds of people showing up for economic populism. They are showing up for left wing policies and leadership that they aren't finding elsewhere in the party. And I am wondering what the Democratic Party is going to learn from the leaders that we're seeing emerging in this moment. And if we get elections again, hopefully, knock on wood, are the Democrats going to say, gee, this economic populism thing seems really popular, might be a way to engage people who didn't show up to vote, or are the moderates going to come in and do what they're so good at, which is ruin everybody's fun and say we need to be spending millions of dollars to win over Liz Cheney Republicans. I guess my question to simplify it is like, do you think the Democratic Party is going to learn a lesson from the success of this left wing messaging or are we just going to try to turn it all the way back to more? Joe?
- [08:24]
Robert Garcia
I think yes, the answer is yes, and I obviously hope so. Right. I mean, I think both those things are true. Look, I think first, I've been so excited to see these rallies. I think that the message that Alexandria and Bernie and others are giving and the energy that you're seeing is real and the message is and should be the Democratic message of the moment, which is it's all of us versus the billionaires who are trying to essentially privatize the federal government, support the richest man on the planet and his friends and take away earned benefits and earned programs that the American people and workingclass people depend on. I mean, that they're, they're going after exactly what Democrats, all Democrats should be talking about right now, which is that we're a work, working class party. We always should be, we should center working class people and we be very clear that billionaires are trying to destroy the government. And so that is really exciting, I think, to me, but also should be to people across this country, not just Democrats, but everyone. So I think Bernie and Alexandria are have the exact same right message and that should be the message. Now, are, are some uncomfortable with that? Do some want to push back against that? Sure, maybe. But I think there is more excitement around this message now than I, than I have ever seen. And I've mentioned this actually to a few other folks. I was talking a little bit to Alexandria, to afc and she had been mentioning that a lot of people that are coming to these rallies aren't folks that are just like, you know, left wing folks, progressive folks. You're getting like pink hat like Hillary Clinton, like Kamala Harris, ladies coming to these rallies.
- [10:04]
Jon Favreau
Centrist moms are like a big part of this big coalition that's building because moms have always been on their shit. And I know this from my background being in the gun control world. Like when you're organizing against gun violence, it doesn't take you long to learn that it's the goddamn middle aged moms who are showing up the hardest. And I think that's very important.
- [10:23]
Robert Garcia
And that's exactly what's showing up right now at the Bernie and AFC rallies. It is, it is a wide, wide, wide collection of people. That's just really exciting.
- [10:30]
Jon Favreau
And that's sort of what I'm saying is like, you know, I think I'm, I'm nervous the Democratic Party is going to see this and go, oh, see, we still have, you know, the moms behind us. That means that if we run some regular centrist who's going to go in and advocate for a system that was just exploited by Donald Trump and Elon Musk to ruin everybody's lives. You know, if we, if we run another candidate on the norm, those same moms will show up. And I'm like, no, these moms are showing up because they're seeing leadership right now. They're seeing people defy the administration. And I think, you know, we've got Democrats at this moment who are standing up and defying the administration. We've got Democrats who are saying, if I play nice and if I'm buddy buddy with Trump this time, maybe he'll be a little bit less aggressive. And of course threats play into that too. Right? Trump going to governors and saying, I'm going to withhold federal funding to your state if you don't do xyz, it's very alarming. And I'm sort of just like, I don't see how, I guess I'm talking in circles. I don't see how the party can run another status quo candidate now that there isn't a status quo anymore.
- [11:35]
Robert Garcia
Yeah, I think, I think that's right. I mean, I think first, obviously, like, we're gonna, you know, it's a long time filter until Democratic primary for president, but I think you're gonna see a lot of congressional candidates, I think this cycle with a populist message, you know, with, with, with a message that speaks to working class people, that's taking on the billionaire class, that's going to push back against tax cuts for the rich. I think that is a popular message. It's the right message, and it's one that Democrats have been slow to expand to the entire party. And it does feel, honestly, a lot because of Elon Musk and Trump's billionaire cabinet, a cabinet of billionaires. You know, I think that this is. People are seeing this, and hopefully that's where that's where the message goes. So that part is really exciting, I think.
- [12:15]
Jon Favreau
Yeah, I think that that also speaks to why we lose the culture wars. Because I find this contradiction when I'm talking about why Gen Z is voted for Trump and stuff like that, where I'm talking about how the Democratic Party wasn't populist and progressive enough on the economy. But then I'll find myself on another talk show saying, we lost the culture war. And, you know, that sort of brings to mind like, okay, which is it. Is it about the economy and. And is it about, you know, Senate Democrats tweeting about egg prices, or is it the fact that young people have decided that they don't want to use pronouns anymore? And I think the conclusion that I came to was that we lose the culture wars because we bother to engage with them in the first place. We spend the time that we could be spending talking about healthcare, debating fringe weirdos about trans athletes, when maybe the thing that we should do is go, why do you care? This doesn't matter. You know, look at these tariffs. But in terms of broad messaging, if you were laying out an agenda for how the Democratic Party can come and regain power, what would you say to the folks who are saying, like, oh, we went too woke and stuff like that? You know, is it beneficial for us to double down? Or, you know, do we actually say we're going to throw everyone under the bus and get kind of conservative with it?
- [13:33]
Robert Garcia
Yeah, I mean, I think, look, I think one is we should never retreat on our values. So on that. That is, we got to stand strong and always push the rights of people forward. So whether it's the rights of women, uplifting migrants, the rights of lgbtq, trans people. Trans what? All of those things that we Believe in, in diversity, in a better country. That difference makes us stronger and better. We should never retreat on those issues. At the same time, we have to understand that we don't talk about the broader issues that impact everyone. And so we don't. We, we have likely invested so much of our energy in that space and then using, allowing Republicans to attack us in that space that we take our eye off the ball and we take our eye off the big game, which is talking about issues that impact all working people in this country. The economy, the price of housing, why people can't afford to buy a home or pay the rent, why people are struggling to go to college, why, you know, young men are disconnecting from, from, from, from going to school, from, you know, socializing in ways that make us, makes us all more productive. So I think that we've got to focus on the big issues, never forget our values, but we need to put the energy, the focus on that continue, that will continue to move forward. If we keep electing folks that are forward thinking Democrats, rights are going to continue to advance. And so we've got to think about it that way.
- [14:55]
Jon Favreau
I think, well, look, I can go on about this all day. I know you have to hop soon. So let's get to the real money here. Right now we are seeing a giant cultural shift towards the return of Superman. For those of you who don't know, Superman is a Kryptonian alien who Donald Trump would try to deport, who was created by two Jewish men, Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster back in the 1930s to represent positive values and as kind of like a huge left wing dude. Like if you read OG Superman, including his first appearance, Action Comics number one, on which Congressman Garcia swore into Congress, he was like, he was further left than I am. And I feel like a lot of conservatives take like the Reagan era Superman posing with the American flag and talk about how he represents conservative values. It's like, no, this dude is like, this dude is like really, really far left. What connected you with Superman in the first place?
- [15:52]
Robert Garcia
Yeah, I mean, absolutely. I mean, Superman is a fighter of people that need help. Right? He is always going to always look out for the little guy, for those that are oppressed, standing up to bullies, taking on the world's richest man. Not Elon Musk, but Lex Luthor. Right? I mean, this is exactly who he is. You know, when Superman first came into the scene, I mean his, the way he was written was he was taking on kind of corporate CEOs and fighting against injustice. I Mean, he became a journalist for cr. Out Loud. His. His alter ego is literally a journalist trying to expose corruption in the country and the world. I mean, that Superman was created, written, and still is to this day, written as a progressive left character, and yet all American, yet from Kansas, yet all these other things that. That we know and yet. And patriotic. And he's a. He's a patriotic person. He loves. He loves his country, but he understands, at the end of the day, it's people that are. That are oppressed. And that's why I love the character. I know. That's why you love the character. And it's going to be a very good year for our favorite superhero.
- [16:54]
Jon Favreau
Yeah. And I think this brings to mind. I don't want you to upset any crazy fans who are. Who are part of any online cult, so I'm not going to ask you to speak on this too much. But that brings to mind what didn't work for me about Zack Snyder. Superman in the Henry Cavill version. I think Henry Cavill is a great actor. I think he was a great Superman, and I think there was really a great version of that character with him. And I think in many ways, Snyder's a great director. But what was missing there was Superman liking his fucking job. Because the thing about Superman that is so progressive to me is the fact that this is a guy who has the power to do anything he fucking wants. And he makes the choice to do the right thing, not because he has to, but because he gets to. He enjoys helping people. Making the world a better place makes him happy. And he just reinforces this idea that doing the right thing, even if it's the harder thing to do, can make your life better. And then he gets to date Rachel Brosnahan and he gets to be happy and colorful and stuff. And I think my problem with the Snyder Superman was he was so burdened by the fact that he was helping people. He never looked like he was really having a good time. And I guess as a congressman who. Who has to be a bit of a Superman of his very own. Do you ever have moments where you're like, okay, this is very heavy right now. Let me take a moment to think about the positive impact of what I'm doing. And that will kind of push me.
- [18:19]
Robert Garcia
Forward all the time. And people think it's funny. Like, I actually get a lot of. I get a lot of inspiration from comics and from. I mean, I was just reading a few comics just yesterday, and then I picked up at the store. I don't ever Always get to go to the store. When I do, I, you know, I. It gives me a little bit of hope back. It's good fiction. It's. It's good stories. I do. You have to reflect on, continue to do the most good that you can. And. Yeah, and so funny. It just really quickly said things interesting as far as, like, the Snyder, you know, the movies and what James Gunn is going to do next. I view each of these iterations as just a different type of Superman. Right. Like, people just lose their minds of this. It's like, it's okay. These people, all these versions can exist at the end of the day, I think, like you, my version is a hopeful one and one that's actually colorful and bright and embraces and wants to help people. I think that's what we're going to see also in James Gunn's film this summer.
- [19:15]
Jon Favreau
Well, I think one thing we can all agree on, regardless of any political divides, is that, James, I know you're watching this. The movie comes out in two months, and we've yet to see a clip or a trailer with really any dialogue. And I want to know what David Corenswet Superman sounds like. I want to know what Rachel Brosnahan, Lois sounds like. I want to hear these characters talk to each other. I understand that sometimes less is more, but release a fucking trailer where they talk. I want to hear them talk. Congressman, thank you so much for joining us today. You are the real Superman. I hope we get to talk to you soon.
- [19:49]
Robert Garcia
All right, man. Thanks.