Is It Okay to Have Crushes in a Relationship?

Summary

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Girls Gotta Eat – Episode Summary

Podcast: Girls Gotta Eat (Dear Media)
Episode: Is It Okay to Have Crushes in a Relationship?
Date: May 11, 2026
Hosts: Ashley Hesseltine & Raina Greenberg

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Episode Overview

This week, Ashley and Raina tackle a listener email and recent article from The Cut exploring the question: Is it normal or healthy to have crushes on other people while in a committed relationship? Using their trademark blend of humor, candid storytelling, and audience input, they explore boundaries, motivations, harmless crushes vs. emotional affairs, gender differences, and personal experience. They also share (and debate) data from a massive poll of over 20,000 listeners on the topic.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Personal Updates and Banter

• Ashley and Raina discuss upcoming travel (Ashley to Boston, Raina extending her comedy tour, [03:37]), share thoughts on live sports vs. couch relaxation [02:40], and give shoutouts to favorite local LA guides and restaurants [09:09].
• They poke fun at LA's attempts to recreate New York food culture (Bagel Fest in LA, "dairy-free, seed oil-free" bagels, [11:48]) and riff on food snobbery.

2. Money, Food Delivery, and Relationship Dynamics

• The hosts break down a Cut article examining couples' spending on food delivery and associated relationship tensions [15:18].
• Three scenarios discussed:
  • Couple 1: Joint debt, one partner over-ordering DoorDash against agreed budget—"You are not being a nag. You have every right in the world to communicate with your partner about this." (Raina, [18:27])
  • Couple 2: Emotional eating and takeout routine in relationship—deeper issues than just food delivery, possibly lifestyle incompatibility [23:53].
  • Couple 3: One frugal home cook, one high-earning takeout enthusiast—Are they financially, culturally, and lifestyle aligned? [28:46].
• Discussion on boundaries, fairness, and whether "money differences" are relationship dealbreakers [30:18].

3. Main Topic: Crushes in Committed Relationships

• Sparked by The Cut article "The Secret to a Great Marriage: Crushes on Other People" and a listener email:
  "Happily married but still fantasize about others. Is that fucked up?" [41:53].
• Defining harmless crushes:
  • "The line is, are we moving this relationship forward? Are we talking? Are you doing something you can't admit to your partner?" (Raina, [47:24])
  • Shared laughter about harmless farmer’s market/flirty barista crushes—but hard line at private messaging or emotional intimacy [50:42].
• The hosts clarify they're discussing traditional monogamy, but recognize not all relationships are monogamous.
• Key insight: Having a crush is "actually harmless" if there's no personal connection or secrecy. Examples: celebrities, people you barely interact with ("40 words or less" rule, [69:12]).

4. Audience Polls & Community Insights

• Over 20,000 responses on relationship crushes:
  • 73% have had a crush while in a committed relationship [57:55].
  • 56% say it's "sometimes normal, it depends;" 24% "totally normal;" 21% "it means something is wrong" [58:09].
  • 45% only want to know if their partner has a crush "depending on situation" [58:30].
  • 52% believe crushes are "just human nature;" 22% say they indicate something missing in the relationship [60:34].
  • Overwhelming agreement that "harmless" = nothing hidden/concealed from a partner [66:24].
• Discuss "actor-observer bias": We justify our own crushes as natural, but may judge a partner's more harshly [62:08].

5. Gender Differences & Cultural Context

• Citing research and personal anecdotes, Ashley and Raina note differences between how men and women experience, interpret, or act on crushes and infidelity [53:04]:
  • Men: More often pursue for physical novelty, ego, or because they can.
  • Women: More likely rooted in emotional dissatisfaction or relationship neglect.
  • Some female listeners say male "crushes" (especially at work) feel predatory or unsafe, while harmless female crushes rarely bother men [54:48].
• "Typically, women cheat because they are missing something in their relationship and men cheat because they can." (Ashley, [53:29])

6. Listener Letter: Fantasy and Boundaries

• A listener writes that she's happily married but fantasizes and occasionally masturbates about a co-worker. She's worried her crush might not be so "innocent" if the other person pursued her [69:17].
  • "Are you missing something in your relationship, or is this fun, or are you missing something in your life?" (Raina, [71:04])
  • Advice: Fantasies are normal; the issue is whether it manifests as action or damages the relationship. Ashley suggests dialing back on romanticizing/sexualizing the crush to avoid crossing a line [73:02].
  • If frequency of thoughts/fantasies feels out of control, therapy may help [73:44].

7. Where’s the Line? Harmless vs. Hurtful

• Listeners and hosts agree:
  • The line is crossed when there’s secrecy; DM’ing, texting, confiding emotionally, or hiding interactions [66:24].
  • "Anything you wouldn’t do in front of your partner" is suspect [66:03].
  • Harmless = “pure fantasy” or fleeting, not persistent, not acted on [69:10].
• Ashley: “Crushes should be at a distance. I love that.” [68:25]
• "As soon as you start interacting privately...that’s how you know. That’s the line." (Ashley, [68:04])

8. Closing Thoughts: Novelty, Routine, and Relationship Health

• The hosts note that long-term relationships naturally lack the novelty of new crushes, but that’s normal.
• "If you’re craving novelty...can you create novelty within your relationship?" (Raina, [75:43])
• Small “from-afar” crushes can add a little spark, but shouldn’t be a substitute for what’s missing in the relationship or cross into emotional/physical affairs [73:44].
• Dreaming about someone else is not, by itself, meaningful or worth anxiety [76:28].

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Ashley, on harmless crushes:
  "If that farmer's market guy slid into the DMs...get out of here. You know I'm married. And now I can't have a crush on you anymore." [68:35]

• Raina, on confronting partners about money:
  "You are not being a ‘nag.’ You have every right in the world to communicate with your partner about this." [18:27]

• Ashley, on men and harmlessness:
  "I was my husband's celeb crush and he did marry me. So you should be scared of celebrities too." [47:26]

• Raina, on what crosses the line:
  "Any communication you can’t share in front of my face, I don’t like it." [65:54]

• Ashley, clarifying the crush “rules”:
  "Crushes are just supposed to live in your head. Exactly. Imaginary and then engaging in any way, I mean, again, this is...the line." [68:44]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:30-07:14 – Personal updates, Raina’s tour, Ashley’s comedy special
• 09:09-14:15 – LA food scene tangents, Camber/restaurant recs
• 15:18-36:02 – Money and food delivery in relationships; deep-dive of “The Cut” article’s examples
• 41:37-57:08 – Main topic: The meaning and role of crushes in relationships, polls, “work wife” boundaries
• 57:55-64:59 – Audience poll results & analysis, actor-observer bias
• 69:17-75:43 – Listener email: When fantasy about a co-worker starts to feel risky
• 76:28-end – Final insights, importance of transparency, wrap-up banter

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Summary

Ashley and Raina dissect the nuance between healthy, passing crushes and problem signs in a relationship. Their bottom line: "Harmless" means it lives in your head, doesn’t involve secrecy, and can be joked about openly. Anything hidden, persistent, or emotionally deep is a warning sign. Couples should talk about their boundaries, acknowledge attraction as human, and focus on creating novelty and connection at home. As always, the hosts combine humor and empathy, giving listeners solid self-reflection tools—and plenty of laughs along the way.

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Transcript

[Ashley Hess]

Crushes should be at a distance. I love that. Yes. If that farmer's market guy slid into the DMs. Oh, glad you like the pasta. Get out of here. You know I'm married. And now I can't have a crush on you anymore. This podcast is a Dear Media production.

[Raina Greenberg]

Hi, guys. Hi, guys.

[Ashley Hess]

Welcome.

[Raina Greenberg]

Welcome back to another episode of Girls Gotta eat.

[Ashley Hess]

Welcome back. Mid May, that is what it is.

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm gearing up to be in New York for a whole month.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. So I will be getting to New York today and then we have some fun things this week. Raina's show in New York. I will be there.

[Raina Greenberg]

Oh, that's my special guest. Yes, Gramercy Theater, Thursday night. Please come. Ashley will be at both shows.

[Ashley Hess]

And then, yeah, I'm going to be on the east coast for two weeks.

[Raina Greenberg]

That's crazy.

[Ashley Hess]

And then going to see my family and then going to Boston for Memorial Day weekend. Exotic. And I'm so excited. Just haven't been to Boston and so I guess I was in Boston for the Thanksgiving holiday, but just summertime, springtime, you know, I used to spend so much time there when I was in a long distance relationship. So, so excited to be there.

[Raina Greenberg]

You surprised me with that. I didn't know you were going to Boston. So exotic.

[Ashley Hess]

I know people like. What are you doing for the holiday? Going to my first Red Sox game. Oh, you've never been? I've never been. So that'll be next weekend.

[Raina Greenberg]

Do you care about baseball?

[Ashley Hess]

No.

[Raina Greenberg]

Do you like going to baseball?

[Ashley Hess]

I just have always wanted to go to Fenway. I don't know why.

[Raina Greenberg]

That's like a classic. Yeah, that movie.

[Ashley Hess]

This was so many years ago. Fever Pitch, it had Jimmy Fallon in it.

[Raina Greenberg]

I actually own the COVID art of that. Cartoon ball.

[Ashley Hess]

Yes.

[Raina Greenberg]

Cartoon ball.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, I think so. Jimmy Fallon and Drew Barrymore. I love this movie. It's such a deep cut.

[Raina Greenberg]

Jimmy Fallon.

[Ashley Hess]

Jimmy Fallon in this rom com. And ever since, I've just always wanted to go to a Red Sox game.

[Raina Greenberg]

I feel like the only thing men do as a group as they get older is they go on like baseball stadium tours. Totally. That's men's only group activity with each other as they get older.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, we went to two baseball games last summer and that was two too many. But it's fine. Like, Shashank just loves baseball. And so I will go to two a year.

[Raina Greenberg]

I have like PTSD because my dad used to drag us to every fucking Pirates game and talk the. He wanted to tell me about every umpire, every Stat. I have truly never cared less about anything than baseball in my life. It's a night, hypothetically. It's a nice thing. It's just. But I don't want to do it slow.

[Ashley Hess]

I just.

[Raina Greenberg]

I want hockey where they start to make out.

[Ashley Hess]

I just.

[Raina Greenberg]

I love a basketball game.

[Ashley Hess]

I mean, when we went to that Celtics playoff game, obviously. Love a football game.

[Raina Greenberg]

People are like, you could go relax. It's like, I could go relax on my couch and not pay 50 to park and 20 for a hot dog. I could go relax.

[Ashley Hess]

Right, Exactly. I just. I've been at baseball games, and I have been sitting there for one hour, and I haven't looked at the score. That's how little I care, because there isn't.

[Raina Greenberg]

It's, like, the scores, too.

[Ashley Hess]

I couldn't tell you who's ever won a baseball game. I've attended.

[Raina Greenberg]

Fuck no.

[Ashley Hess]

But anyway, it's a nice experience, and my husband loves baseball, so we'll be at that game. But that's next weekend, so we'll see you.

[Raina Greenberg]

We'll see you this week in New York City.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, we'll see you guys there. I'm so excited. And Raina has another fun, special announcement, but we'll thank our partners.

[Raina Greenberg]

All right, well, we'll thank our partners. Thank you to Rocket Money. Reach your financial goals [e-mail] GGE and Zbiotics. Get 15% [e-mail] GGE with code GGE.

[Ashley Hess]

And thank you to Helix. Go to helixsleep.com GGE for 27% off site wide. Okay, announcement time, you guys.

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm very excited to announce this because I was. I started to get really sad, like, am I gonna be done with this tour in May? And, like, what am I gonna do in the fall? And what I'm doing in the fall is extending the tour, so. I knew you would. You guys knew she would. You knew I would. I didn't even know I would.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, it's just, like, what else are you doing?

[Raina Greenberg]

Truly, what else are you doing?

[Ashley Hess]

And why not go tour the material as long as you can? Yes.

[Raina Greenberg]

I mean, outside of you and I touring together, this is the greatest joy of my life. I love it. The tour has just been so much fun to be with you guys. And I am adding 11 new cities. I'm going back to a couple cities, and I'm doing my first international tour stop in London. So I'm very excited. I'm trying as this airs today. So I'm announcing the Tour today on May 11th. And I'll post it on my Instagram. All the tour stops and the dates. It will go on sale May 14th at 10am local time. So rainagriberg.com and I'll list the cities really quickly. But I don't know, as we're recording right now with a London date is.

[Ashley Hess]

I don't know. I was just thinking, I don't know any of these guys. I've noticed this. You're hearing this as the first time with me. I don't know what she's doing. I know she's been working on him. She's talking about London. I'm supposed to go, but I don't know what's happening.

[Raina Greenberg]

I think I'm moving it so you can be with me. So my initial date. It might still be the date. Who's to say? Okay. My initial date was July 4th, which I thought was, like, hilarious to do Independence Day.

[Ashley Hess]

Hate to be in this country.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yes, yes. And America, who, if you will. I started thinking I wanted you to be with me. So I might move this October, so I don't know when the show is. By the time this airs, it will be on my website and be on the tour.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, so, guys, check that space.

[Raina Greenberg]

Watch the space.

[Ashley Hess]

Watch the space.

[Raina Greenberg]

I've rescheduled Nashville and Salt Lake, so I'll be going back there in July. But I'm kicking it off in Columbus, Ohio.

[Ashley Hess]

Love it.

[Raina Greenberg]

Cincinnati, St. Louis. Indianapolis. New Brunswick, New Jersey. Stanford, Connecticut. Buffalo. Buffalo. Buffalo, baby. I feel like it's just a hop skin.

[Ashley Hess]

This is where I live. I have adrenaline right now.

[Raina Greenberg]

Oh, wait till you get one of these. I didn't know any of these the last three weeks at Vancouver, Detroit, and then I'm ending it all in Vegas. November 12th. Vegas. It's a Thursday night. Come Thursday and Friday, I'm gonna invite every person we're friends with. I wanna do, like, Thursday night show. Friday night, like Chainsmokers Club. Another club bus. Like, I just wanna go so hard. This is insane. And I'm adding. I'm revisiting two stops that I just couldn't add more shows in. So Seattle and Toronto. I am coming back to those cities.

[Ashley Hess]

Oh, shit.

[Raina Greenberg]

Because I wanted to add more stops and I couldn't because I am about to. I will probably. I probably came back in a body bag from the last time I did.

[Ashley Hess]

Definitely another cold this fall. So I'm curious which one you're going to cancel. It's going to be Ohio. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. We ride for Ohio harder than any other performers I know when people are

[Raina Greenberg]

like, what's your favorite cities to perform in? We're like all of the Ohio cities.

[Ashley Hess]

All the Ohio's. Okay, when is Vancouver?

[Raina Greenberg]

Thank you for asking. It's the day before Seattle. So October 28th is Vancouver. October 29th, Seattle.

[Ashley Hess]

When is Detroit?

[Raina Greenberg]

Detroit is 11:11. November 11th.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, I like that.

[Raina Greenberg]

And then 11:12. Vegas. I wanted to actually end this several weeks before Thanksgiving because I think people start to, like, travel and I want you guys to like, come party in Vegas. Obviously Ashley will be there.

[Ashley Hess]

What's on November 1st? My anniversary.

[Raina Greenberg]

I took that time off to celebrate,

[Ashley Hess]

actually to celebrate it that we may or may not be married. Well, congrats.

[Raina Greenberg]

Thank you. Buffalo came out of nowhere.

[Ashley Hess]

Came out of nowhere because we've never gone there. Not because we don't want to. And we have always heard that it's a great comedy scene and just the people are really fun. And so that's so great. I'm so glad.

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm really excited. So I just. I feel like I wasn't done. I felt like there was more to do. So this goes on sale this Thursday, May 14th, 10am local time. Everything will be on my website. Raina greenberg.com.

[Ashley Hess]

okay, that's it.

[Raina Greenberg]

That's all I got. I can't wait.

[Ashley Hess]

I love that. Okay, congrats. So fun. And of course, my comedic update is you guys can watch my special. It is been out worldwide. Yes. If there's any confusion, it's been out for 10 days now. 10, 11 days at this point. So you guys can watch it on

[Raina Greenberg]

YouTube anywhere in the world except North

[Ashley Hess]

Korea, except for a few countries. Eritrea, for one, which sounds vaginal.

[Raina Greenberg]

I thought that that was an airline.

[Ashley Hess]

Eritrea.

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm thinking of Emirates.

[Ashley Hess]

It's. I don't know, it sounds just kind of. It sounds cute.

[Raina Greenberg]

It does. Sounds like.

[Ashley Hess]

But also sounds like something's going on with your. Your urethra or your clit. And you can watch it if you're here in the US On Prime Video, if you have a Prime Video subscription. So two ways to watch but anywhere in the world, with the exception of like three countries, you can watch on YouTube. And I hope that you guys have been loving it if you have watched it. So I know you guys love it. It's amazing. And we will have just done the Netflix as a joke festival last week, so. So thank you guys for coming out for that. We're recording this before the show, but we're sure it was amazing. We're sure you guys had a Fun, hilarious, horny time with us and the Chippendales and Bobby Westside, our mc. So thank you to everyone that made that possible and we love being a part of this festival and so thank you guys for, for coming out. And if you're looking for other fun stuff to do in la now that the biggest comedy festival in the world is over, we have a go to. And we've mentioned them before on this podcast, which is Camber. Used to be Camber app. Now it's Camber Places, which is Camber Places.com and Camber Places on Instagram. And this is just an LA guide, Things to do restaurants. It is my go to. I post this a couple weeks ago that I send Shashank reels or posts of restaurants and he makes the res. Like, these are all of our dates. Like, all the things we do. I mean, you introduced me to it.

[Raina Greenberg]

Tessa, when she worked for us when we first, when we first moved to la, I was like, I need to get like. Cause you know, we lived in New York. I follow TimeOut in New York and Infatuation and like, how do I find stuff to do in LA now? And I was like, what are the accounts I follow? And Tessa suggested, she was like, I love Zap Camber. And I subscribe to their newsletter and I just, I get so much, like, good stuff to do every week in LA from them. Even the founder, Maddie, she posts great reels too of just like tips of like travel, where to stay. Oh my gosh. So there's some cute reels. There's a cute reel of Ashley and I talking about girls night out. If you subscribe to their substack, we're also on there just talking about LA in general, but I'm always looking for like a trusted voice and in every city, like I'm visiting town, what do I do? That's the one I go to is Camber in la.

[Ashley Hess]

I mean, I wish they had it in every city. It's that good. And of course there's plenty of platforms, there's timeout in every city. But this just. I love what she does. I love what they do for. When I went to Laguna Beach, I took the exact itinerary from Camber and then exact just started their Instagram, which is Camber Places. And then you can go to their link tree and then you can find the substack. They have a podcast called Is There Parking? Which is so appropriate for la. Obviously you always got to know if there's parking newsletter like we said. And just the reels and that the website is really great. They redid it recently. And you can look by, like, what you're looking for your neighborhood. I mean, there's just obviously so many neighborhoods in la. A lot of times you're like, I need. I can't just look at all of la. I need to filter by this specific neighborhood. And we just love it so much. I mean, I got to a point where I was like, I can't bookmark anymore. Like, I just bookmark everything. They take every.

[Raina Greenberg]

They did an Ojai one. I took the whole trip in Ohio. Not one skip, no skip.

[Ashley Hess]

I love the way they create the content, like, every time. And I'm never disappointed, you know, Like, I feel like sometimes you might see, like, a reel of a place of, like, I don't know, coffee shop, and you're like, oh, my God, looks so beautiful, so exotic or something. And you go there, like, what is this? Like, you really. Catfish. They don't do that. It's. It feels really true to what you. What you get.

[Raina Greenberg]

So check them out. Speaking of something to do in New York, I just want to tell you this because it made me laugh. Okay? So I'm like, obviously, like a bagel purist. Bagels are really important to me. You know, you and I go back and forth about what's a good bagel, what you're willing to eat and what I'm willing to eat. And I'm just. I don't want to eat bagels outside of New York City. It's what I want. It's just. I. It's all I care about it. Other cities, bagels, like, you just keep it to yourself. I don't want it. You can't do it. Good. But there's this thing, there's a festival called New York Bagel Fest. And it's gotten so big. I mean, I think it's like five, six years where they've been doing it. It's at Citi Field now. It's so big. And it's every bagel place in New York. And they've asked me to, like, be.

[Ashley Hess]

I think I asked both of us

[Raina Greenberg]

to be a judge. Right?

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, we'll do it a different.

[Raina Greenberg]

We'll do it another year. But they did their first LA Bagel Fest, and I got served real about it. And I was like, what is this?

[Ashley Hess]

I feel like That's Rage Bait, L.A. bagel Fest. And I like the bagels here. I'm just saying it feel like maybe who greenlit this?

[Raina Greenberg]

I was looking at, like, all that this real. Listen, I don't want to shit. These are all great. It's just not my style. Bagel. All the bagels. You got like little quarters of a bagel. And people got very creative with the toppings. There was like kimchi and salad. You know, I think they get too creative here. There's olive oil and there's just like honey and. Stop this. Yeah, stop this right now. And they all. And I was like, are they gonna tell us the name of any of these places? And the only owner that they interviewed in this reel, she was like, our bagels are gluten free, dairy free and seed oil free. And I was like, ah, fuck this festival in la. No, fuck this audacity. I want them to be. It's full fat. It is full dairy.

[Ashley Hess]

What dairy?

[Raina Greenberg]

Am I crazy? What dairy is in a bagel? Eggs. I think it's flour, water and alkaline. You put alkaline in the water and you boil it. That's what makes the crust dairy free. Dairy free. Seed oil free. Shut the fuck up. Listen, I know people want to eat like this and good for you, but I don't want it. Tell me about a salad.

[Ashley Hess]

I really feel for people who have to eat gluten free. I mean, we have a close friend who. I mean, she's gluten free and I sometimes when we go places like, she will get the gluten free version of whatever and I always take a little taste and I always regret it.

[Raina Greenberg]

I just.

[Ashley Hess]

Bread is tough. I think for whatever reason, I ordered

[Raina Greenberg]

breakfast this morning, which is very unlike me. And I did think. I almost. I thought about ordering gluten free bread and I was like, nah, enjoy your day.

[Ashley Hess]

It doesn't hit the same. But I mean, I feel for them. They know it doesn't.

[Raina Greenberg]

It's a terrible life decision to make.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, I don't think we needed La Bagel Fest, La Taco Fest, la. La Pasta Fest, La Salad Fest.

[Raina Greenberg]

Literally sandwiches.

[Ashley Hess]

I would fuck with the salad festival sandwiches.

[Raina Greenberg]

I mean, I could give you a. I've done every single sandwich in la. I'm like a connoisseur. Like, crazy. Pizza here is fantastic bagels. I don't want it. You didn't need to do it here.

[Ashley Hess]

You know what? I will accept that from you because you said you will give us pizza. I think there's great. There's great pizza.

[Raina Greenberg]

There's some of the best in the country here.

[Ashley Hess]

We went to a great Indian place recently that I saw again. Camber sent it to Shashank Queen Made a res. It's called Bad Mash. It's in Venice. Such a vibe. Just give me a restaurant with good food and rap music. You know, I get so pissed if a restaurant is not playing rap music. And I know that's not for everybody, but I'm like, why not?

[Raina Greenberg]

But why not give me a vibe?

[Ashley Hess]

I know there is a restaurant. I'm not gonna call them out by name. In New York. And it was a place we spent a lot of time, and I know them. And I was like. Got to a point. I was like, the music is just. It's always different. I never know what we're getting. And I asked the manager, and she was like, it's just whatever the hostess wants to put on. I was like, what?

[Raina Greenberg]

You just leave it up to?

[Ashley Hess]

I can tell you guys are never trying to set a vibe.

[Raina Greenberg]

Like, that's crazy.

[Ashley Hess]

Consistency is key. I feel like you should know what you're getting at an establishment, you're saying

[Raina Greenberg]

to me, that's insane.

[Ashley Hess]

So the hostess is having, like, an emo bad day, Right? Sometimes I would walk in there and I'd be like, this has to be a joke. What's playing?

[Raina Greenberg]

Like, what if you broken up with today?

[Ashley Hess]

Right? Or, like, it could be heavy metal. I'm leaving.

[Raina Greenberg]

I just want to listen to Bad Bunny all day, every day. But, like, also, like, what if that doesn't match the vibe?

[Ashley Hess]

I know. So anyway. But great experience at Bad Mash. Okay, well, so speaking of food, we have this article we wanted to discuss. Discuss with you guys.

[Raina Greenberg]

So there's this article on the cut. It's called I'm Over Here Meal Prepping while he spends $100 on sushi. It unpacks three different scenarios with three different couples and their spending habits around food, which, I mean, we can break each one down and we will. I just. I find it really interesting. And a lot of these questions are like, what am I allowed to say something about what's reasonable, what crosses the line? And I think that this is, like, highly debatable what you're allowed to ask of your partner in terms of how they spend money. I mean, you just. You gotta get aligned about how do I see money and how do I see the rest of my life, and what. How do I value spending? Right.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. It says the number of households that use food Delivery services like DoorDash, Grubhub, Uber Eats has roughly doubled in recent years. Obviously, that's not a bad thing. Pivoting to take takeout kept many restaurants afloat during the Pandemic, yada, yada. But it's just gotten more expensive. Like I can't, I mean, with the fees and everything and as it should be. I mean, sometimes I, I can't believe what some of these delivery drivers are running around and not making. You know, like I always want to tip and it's not about that, but it's gotten more expensive to get food delivered.

[Raina Greenberg]

And a lot of, a lot of these services, almost all of them doordash, grabhub, Uber eats, they charge the restaurant a percentage. It's usually like 15 to 25% of the total bill. And so restaurants pass those fees onto the customers. And those menu items are more money when you order them on these things than when if you'd go to a restaurant. So there's that feel. So, so it's 20% more, it's a delivery fee. It's like just things that just say like fee, yeah, and a tip. So yeah, it's expensive.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. So there's three scenarios here. So the first one, a 27 year old physician's assistant lives in New York. He says he doesn't have time to cook and that ordering food is his only vice. She says, my husband and I are about $20,000 in credit card debt from their wedding. It was worth it, but they basically agreed to put $1,000 each month, so $2,000 total towards the $20,000 debt. They get it paid off in under a year. And she says, I've put in about $5,000 and he's probably contributed about $2,000. So he's not holding up his end of the bargain. And she says he's probably spending between $200 and $400 a week on doordash, which was not part of the plan. To be fair. It's not hard to spend that much. 100%. We live in New York, we're ordering one meal, winds up close to 40 or $50 with delivery fees and tips and everything. Doing that once or twice a day. Whoa. Really adds up.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay.

[Ashley Hess]

So anyway, she just says every month he comes up short on the debt payment, says he's doing the best he can. She says, I pointed this out to him. He gets defensive, he's busy, he's a paralegal to law firm and he works hard. He says he doesn't have time to cook and that ordering food is his only vice, which is true. He doesn't even drink. I brown bag my lunch at work every day. When I've suggested that he try that, he's done it once or twice and then stopped for dinner. I'm pretty happy making rice in our rice cooker with mixed vegetables and an egg or something. But I often wind up eating his leftovers too, so that all this food he' ordering doesn't go to waste. He does most of his ordering at work and he often works until 8pm or so. So he'll order dinner and bring the rest home. I've told him that I'll wait until he gets home to cook dinner, but he says his schedule is too unpredictable. I'm not really sure what to do. I know that he feels guilty. I don't want to be a nag. I love him. I'm optimistic it'll work out. Yada yada. There is so much happening here and the comments were lit up about this. Multiple parts about it. It's her rice cooker for one. Because he doesn't want to eat that.

[Raina Greenberg]

Let's reframe this nag thing for you just right away. When you are married to somebody and you have both made a financial decision to spend money and every financial decision that your partner makes now affects you, you are not being a quote unquote nag. You have every right in the world to communicate with your partner about this.

[Ashley Hess]

So let's.

[Raina Greenberg]

I don't care if he calls you a nag every day. You have every right to question your partner's spending habits. That's crazy.

[Ashley Hess]

Yes. Like if you guys have agreed to pay off your shared debt and he is spending two to $400 a week on doordash, that's infuriating. Like there's a couple things. Someone was like, if he works till 8, his company should be paying for his dinner. But let's just say that doesn't. He can also walk down the street. I mean, you live in New York. You actually live in New York, don't have to pay the delivery fees. There's just other options. Like I also get the like. This comes up a few times, the article, it being like a vice. And vice doesn't always have to be the word. It can just be something that brings you joy. You know, you work all day, you're like, I don't want to eat rice with an egg. And I understand that. You know, I want to order. I want a hit of something. Like, I'm unhappy at work and I'm stressed. This is how I want to bring some joy into my life. But you've got to navigate that within your relationship because the underlying theme here is the debt and him playing in her face. Ordering a hundred dollars a week for food.

[Raina Greenberg]

I validate that. That like we all deserve joy in life. And if you're like, I'm working till 8pm every day, I need some. I'm not spending this on drugs or alcohol or gambling or T shirts. I mean, there's plenty of people that spend $400 a week on new clothing. So if she was also doing that, like, why is his habit not as valid as her habit? But it sounds like number one, she's paying her debt and he's not.

[Ashley Hess]

Yes.

[Raina Greenberg]

And there are alternatives to this. You actually don't need to spend $50 per meal. And I'm not saying you need to have a dollar slice for every single thing, but like you could spend half of that at least to feed yourself every day and still eat really well. It's just if you're not paying off your debt, then you don't have the money for this.

[Ashley Hess]

Figure this out. Until the debt is paid off, it's like, I'm sorry. You guys had an agreement to pay

[Raina Greenberg]

off your wedding together. This makes me feel.

[Ashley Hess]

I know.

[Raina Greenberg]

And I want my partner to feel that they have autonomy to spend whatever money that they want and whatever things that they deem that their hard earned money should go to. But not when we have decided together to take a day.

[Ashley Hess]

I know, I know.

[Raina Greenberg]

So I dated somebody. I lent him, we were younger, he really needed money. I lent him $5,000. That was an insurmountable amount of money to me back. Yeah, that was like 26, 27.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

That was the most money I could ever imagine giving to somebody. But he was my partner. We lived together. I was like, fine, I know where he lives, I'll get it back. And he was a bartender and he'd get off work late and he would take cabs home. And I was like, okay. In any other scenario makes sense, like if you work really hard, you work really late, one o' clock in the morning, you should be allowed to take a cab. Except when you owe me money. And there's alternatives.

[Ashley Hess]

Right.

[Raina Greenberg]

Like this was also like a 6 foot 2 man. It's different if you're a woman. You're scared to take a subway home in the middle of the night. But you're not scared. You're a big man.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. I mean, when you owe your partner money, you have agreed to pay this thing off together. You have to be responsible. This isn't just that, like she doesn't like this habit of his is that he's on the hook for something. They agreed to.

[Raina Greenberg]

I wonder what defense he has. These are not substantial defenses to me. Like, I work really hard, I need to eat, I don't have time to cook. Like, that's still not a substantial defense for. Like, I need to overspend on this and I can't pay back this.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, and I really don't understand the logistics. Something is like a little shady here. Like, you ordered it at work and you still got it delivered. You couldn't pick it up on the way home. Again, like, it's what, 10, 20 bucks? You might save by picking it up, but it shows your partner that you're not spending frivolously.

[Raina Greenberg]

20 bucks is a lot. I mean, if that's like $50ameal versus

[Ashley Hess]

100 a week or something, I mean, what's he spending on the delivery fees?

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay, so what would you always. The advice that you give her, okay, he's like, you're being annoying. I don't go out and drink. This is what I choose to spend money on.

[Ashley Hess]

I just think she needs to say we might not be aligned on this. You know, I understand you want to treat yourself and I want to make rice with an egg on it. But I really want us to commit to paying off this debt together. And it just feels like you aren't taking it as seriously. And I have to be completely honest. When I see the hundreds of dollars a week on the food delivery, I feel a little disrespected because we have committed to paying this debt off together.

[Raina Greenberg]

That's a perfect answer. I love it.

[Ashley Hess]

Thank you. Cosign from Reina. Okay, so the next one, this, I think this is. This sounds like two women in a relationship. The woman writing in, she says her employer pays for her dinner if she works past 7pm, which she does almost every night. She's a management consultant. They live in Virginia. My partner, on the other hand, orders dinner pretty much every night. I come home, find her sitting on the couch, half empty Thai food containers on the coffee table, watching tv. It's so depressing. And so basically she just gets into like she's got some body issues, but so do I. What woman doesn't? But ordering out every meal is not healthy. It's expensive. She's unhappy at work, so I think it becomes a sort of comfort thing for her, like a treat at the end of the day. I'm empathetic, but I also wish she'd help herself. I'm not sure how much she's spending on delivery every week, but it's gotta be a couple hundred Dollars, at least. We moved in together a year ago. Okay. So they're not married, they're not locked in. So maybe she's always done this, but now she's just more comfortable. I've brought up meal kit solutions, but then she says, you're never home for dinner, so they're not gonna cook. Cook together. And it just. The whole thing's frustrating. I hope it's a funk that's temporary, but it seems indicative of something bigger. I don't want to say she's lazy, but sometimes it feels like she's giving up. I mean, some of these are relationship problems and not food delivery problems.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah. I mean, none of these are food. Are food delivery problems. Like, the first one is like, we just have mismatched ideals about, like, what we want to spend money on and what we value, like, how we look at money. This is just like. It's hard to watch your partner kind of give up on life. Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

I mean, I don't know what's going on here. I think everyone goes through hard times, and sometimes you're like, I'm in a slump and I'm unhappy at work, and this is just how I'm living right now. And that's okay, and that's human. But at some point, if you are unhappy, you have to figure out how to dig yourself out. If you are happy doing that, you are with the wrong person. Like, some people want to get home and order takeout and watch TV every night. They are happy doing that. They have to find a person that's happy doing that too. Because you're. Your partner is going to be turned off by it the same way that you'd be turned off by someone getting up at 5am and eating a chicken breast and going to the gym and riding a marathon. Like, you're not aligned in your lifestyle.

[Raina Greenberg]

Like, that might be their best life.

[Ashley Hess]

Yes.

[Raina Greenberg]

Like, my dream is I make so much money that I don't ever have to cook or get takeout or prep anything in my life. I will get delivery every single day. That's some people's best life.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. Sorry. They also said they can afford it. So this actually isn't about the money. I think it's more about the lifestyle. And she's like, just. Just looking at her differently when she comes home and she's on the couch. These couples, all of them are not aligned in how they have dinner. And I think that's huge. And that is just personal to me. It's important to me. I. I know when Shashanka and I are both home for dinner. Someone doesn't have plans with their friends or something. I know what we're doing. I also had dinner with my family every single night. My mom, my dad, my brother and I. My mom or my dad cooked dinner every night. We had dinner as a family.

[Raina Greenberg]

Same.

[Ashley Hess]

It's important to me, and it's important to my relationship, so. So these wouldn't work for me. I mean, I think there's times in your life where someone's got to work late, this and that. But, like, I don't understand all these relationships have worked up till now. Like, Shashank and I do have dinner together.

[Raina Greenberg]

I love that you're like, the issue is dinner.

[Ashley Hess]

But, like, he works all day. Like, I would. Then we have dinner together. I don't.

[Raina Greenberg]

It wasn't an option, so it doesn't sound like it's an option.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, this is a problem. Like, she's like, you're never home for dinner. Can you get home a little earlier? Can we make Sunday brunch our thing? Like, what are they doing to combat this whole, like, we never eat dinner together thing? I don't know.

[Raina Greenberg]

But the first couple, I'm like, okay, so what's the alternative? We're just going to accrue all this interest and debt and, like, that's how you want to live? Like, don't you want to set us up for some success in the future by, like, not accruing all this debt? Yeah, like, that's how you want to live. You want to live, like, under a mountain of stress.

[Ashley Hess]

I mean, that could also be a bigger problem, how that guy manages money. But I want them to work on it because they're married. But the second couple, they're not. And this may not be the. The right match.

[Raina Greenberg]

Like she says, it's like. Like, it's depressing to come home, and she's just. That wouldn't depress everybody. You know what I mean? Like, I don't think.

[Ashley Hess]

I don't.

[Raina Greenberg]

Some people would walk in the door and just be like, okay, my partner worked hard. I'm not saying she's wrong, but I wouldn't love it. I wouldn't love to know that I was outside of the house all day long, working hard. I came home. You did not order me dinner. You're just sitting here eating something bad for you. You're already depressed. Food that's bad for you only makes you. How do I want to phrase this? It seems like you're eating things that make you feel bad.

[Ashley Hess]

Feel bad. You Already feel bad. Yeah. And she's unhappy at work, which ruins your whole life. Yeah. I mean, if you are unhappy at work, truly hate your job, it's really can take over your life. I've watched. Watched a friend recently who just was in a job like that for years, and it really, I feel like, changed who she was. And she recently left her job. She's a different person, and she's got other going on, and she still feels so much lighter and happier because she's out of that job. I was like, it was the job.

[Raina Greenberg]

Right. And that's why I think you. You frame this conversation. The second one is just like, you don't see me as happy as I'd like to see you. And like, let's talk. I mean, she might get the world's best job and be super happy. You're still gonna come home every day. She's eating Thai food on the couch.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

And that might. That might depress you and that much person for you.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Raina Greenberg]

So you know when I was like, so sick a couple weeks ago, at the amount of takeout I ordered and stuff, that was bad. I levain cookies every single day. I ate the Celica every day. I was like, I have nothing left. Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

Oh, people wrote on the comments. You did it, right? It said, starve a. Starve a cold. No, feed a cold.

[Raina Greenberg]

I fed it.

[Ashley Hess]

Feed a cold, starve a flu or something. They just said, feed a cult. People said, you were right to binge while you were at that cold.

[Raina Greenberg]

What else? I had nothing else to live for.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay. This last one. Okay. She's 27, works in marketing in San Francisco. Before my boyfriend and I met, he says he ordered in every single meal. He has literally never cooked a thing. At first, this was endearing. He's a very capable person. Overall, it was fun to order food together or go out. But now that we moved in together, as of three months ago, it seems unsustainable. I've always cooked my own food. Part of it is cultural, but it's also financial. My parents are frugal, they're from India, and I was raised to take care of myself. It seems so helpless to not be able to make your own dinner. So she likes to meal plan and go shopping on Sundays. She said it's not my money, so I try not to care too much. But it's ridiculous when I'm over here meal prepping while he spends $100 on sushi.

[Raina Greenberg]

Is this every day? Did I miss that?

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. He does not cook for himself. She says I'm pretty sure what I spend on a week's worth of groceries is less than what he spends on a food in a single day. It's okay for now, but what happens if we get married or have kids? I don't mind being the cook of the household because I do like it. But it's a little weird that he rarely wants to eat what I'm making. I've asked him if he doesn't like my cooking or if there's something else he'd prefer. He just says he likes to order what he's in the mood for when he's in the mood for it. I don't think his family ate meals together a lot growing up, so maybe that's part of it too. I wonder how it affects his finances. He makes considerably more money than I do, so I'm not in a position to tell him he can't afford anything. But if he's spending $500 a week on for years, I mean, you do the math. I'm not sure what he has in savings. He's getting a little bit better. I've convinced him to eat what I'm making two days a week, which is a start. But I hate being the dinner police. It seems like other couples don't have this type of conflict. Why does this have to be complicated? Shouldn't he want to eat delicious, home cooked, affordable food instead of expensive crap?

[Raina Greenberg]

I mean, I'd have to know more about his finances. I'd have to know about the relationship. To me, like, I mean, you know, you and me, like, food is just the most important thing. Food, adventures, having dinner together, like, cooking together, like, it's how I show love. It's the most important thing to me. Like, is everything else in the relationship great? Does he make you feel valued and heard and understood and uplift you? And, like, is the only thing that, like, you guys want to have different types of dinners? Like, maybe that's fine. Is he so rich? They're like $500 out of somebody's pocket a week. Might not be that much money for them. Everybody's different. It would be a lifestyle thing for me. It would just be disappointing.

[Ashley Hess]

I want to.

[Raina Greenberg]

You do too, like, sit around, cook together, talk about we're going to eat. I want to start talking in the morning about we're going to have for dinner. I want to plan like a special night. Like, what are we doing that's fun.

[Ashley Hess]

There's so many different things here. Like, yeah, he makes more money, but is he really wasteful? Like, Is he always going to make that much money? Is he going to be spending two grand on delivery if he gets takes a pay cut? Like, how does he look at money and spend money? Totally different conversation. Then they made me sad and I don't know, like, she's Indian, she wants to cook. Her family ate together. Like, it's just, he doesn't want to do it. I mean, it sounds like she's convinced him to do it two days a week, but she feels like she's forced him into it. Like, like maybe you guys are making progress and maybe it's just been some shifts that he wasn't brought up this certain type of way and he's gonna come around and in which case, like, I root for them. But if not, this might not be your person. Like, if it means a lot to you to cook and have your partner enjoy it, you wanna find a partner that enjoys it.

[Raina Greenberg]

Is he offering to order food for her? Is it like, babe, I got this, I'm so rich. Like, I will, I'll take care of the sushi tonight. Like, it's not how I wanna live. My body doesn't feel good when I go to take out every day. But like, like, right? Also people who can't cook, I just, how did it happen?

[Ashley Hess]

So I made that note too. I mean, they're in their 20s. Okay, but okay, if someone says something like that, I can't cook, I've never cooked a meal for myself in my life. I, I would want to know what else they're incapable of doing. Like, can they clean their room? Like, can they, can they manage a checkbook? How old am I? Do they understand how to, how to handle their. I can't even manage a checkbook. I'm saying, like, are they self sufficient in other areas? Because cooking is not for everybody. I mean, we know men that don't cook, we know women that don't cook. It's not even gender specific. But I've never cooked a meal for myself in my life. You've never made eggs or made a sandwich and okay, but are you doing other things? Are you admitting that your mom still picks up after you and buys you underwear? I have more questions. And I understand that you're young and you can think that's endearing. You're like, okay, well I'm gonna come along and do this, but just make sure when someone admits that to you, they've never made themselves food, what else can't they do for themselves?

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm trying to understand, like the full picture of this. Person, like, outside of, like, this is a trust fund kid that had staff in the home and does not know how to cook or clean. Like, truly, how did this happen? I don't understand, like the. And yes, if you can't cook a meal for yourself, I'm pretty sure you can't do other stuff.

[Ashley Hess]

I couldn't, could never. It's such an ick to me. Like, I only want a guy that can cook or is excited trying to learn. Like, it's hot. I mean, just the men in my life cook. I mean, my dad, my brother Rob, obviously my husband, my exes were excited about it. I'd love a man in the kitchen, a man on the grill, a man in an apron, and nothing else. I'm just kidding. That's what you guys do. Dick hanging out the bottom.

[Raina Greenberg]

I just, I'm so curious like, like what this person's like. Because I think about people that are so rich they don't have to cook. But like, I don't know, they're so successful, they've like got it in every other area. They'll just take care of it. I mean, how did this happen?

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, it's fascinating and I'd love to see what happens with this couple. They're in their 20s and they're not married. They can break up. It's no biggie.

[Raina Greenberg]

You know what? I love that our advice always is like, if you don't have dinner together, then you should break up. There was another, right. We had like another email about this kind of recently.

[Ashley Hess]

People die on this hill. What are they doing?

[Raina Greenberg]

She said he didn't want to like explore new kinds of food and we were like, break up?

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, she touched base.

[Raina Greenberg]

She said all other things were great. He just wanted like chicken fingers for every meal. He wasn't like, adventurous.

[Ashley Hess]

Yes, she touched base. It's me, the woman with the anti foodie, terrible cook boyfriend. Yeah, he wouldn't cook and he didn't want to go to dinner either. Oh, it was like all the things. Remember, he just like wasn't into it. Yeah, he eats. Okay, well while we're here. So she said he is a wonderful partner in so many ways. He makes me laugh. He supports my career. He does most of the non food chores. He makes me feel like a queen in bed. Since I first wrote in, I did try to be mature and talked about unhappy I was with our food situation, but we didn't really land on a solution. We've kind of settled into doing our own thing at dinner. I ordered a meal kit subscription but he was skeptical about the cost. We'll see how it pans out. Honestly, I'm in a weird in between phase of life, so it's not exactly the moment for big relationship moves. But I appreciate your. How your advice is always both hilarious and nuanced. Thank you again. And Ashley, I can't wait to watch your special. Okay, girl.

[Raina Greenberg]

No.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, so yeah, they're gonna break up too.

[Raina Greenberg]

I mean, we're just like, if you don't want to do the same stuff, food wise, we think you should break up. That's our advice.

[Ashley Hess]

I mean, again, like, it's just one of those things of like, if whatever works for you, do it. If you like it, I love it. I want to be in a relationship where we have dinner. It's like, we talk about our day, we cook together, we order something. Also, if you were ordering takeout for every meal, like, how do you feel?

[Raina Greenberg]

I feel so shiny. It's just.

[Ashley Hess]

This has nothing to do with like shaming or weight or anything. It's just how you feel. It's just what it is. I mean, I guess if you do order sweet green or group kitchen every night, that's a different thing. But real restaurant food, it's just heavier. More salt, more butter, more oils. All the things like with the way I feel when we order food versus make it, I mean, it's a world of difference. This is the coldest take. But we do cook. Always two nights. Usually three nights a week we cook and sometimes more. If we're in town all seven nights, I would say we cook three to four nights, go out always at least once a week. We went out two nights this past week, Friday and Saturday night, and order take out once or twice. Like, that's the breakdown. If we're home, we cook three at least.

[Raina Greenberg]

I mean, Ash, I just, I need to be aligned with how you feel about food. And if you don't care about food, I need you to at least be excited for me to show you about food. It's what I do with all my free time and all my money. I wanna travel to food, I wanna drive to food destinations, I wanna cook. I just. People that are just like, not for me. I'm like, well, you're not for me.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. And I just think with all these things, I mean, there's lifestyle which a lot of these things are again, indicative of the way they wanna live their life and finances and how they think about money and spend money and save money. And that is all stuff you have to figure out before you Marry someone. And that's what they're in the middle of doing. That's why they're writing into the cut with like, here's what I got going on. Clip it. Yeah. So all right, good luck to them. Well, just gonna talk about our partners and then we will get into the topic.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay. So summer is coming up and if you're thinking like I wanna to plan a trip, I don't know what my budget is and I want like a good tool for that. The one thing that I could totally suggest that you do is Rocket Money. So Rocket Money is truly like a one stop shop that'll help you budget. It'll also help you track your subscriptions. And they have the ability to cancel unwanted ones within the app. So they've saved people over 880 million in canceled subscriptions. So that's just free money. You guys like the amount of stuff that I subscribe to, I don't even know I'm subscribing to. I downloaded this app. The interface was really easy to use and it just identified all these things I'm paying for. Right off the bat was like, you trying to cancel this? And I was like, I am trying to cancel this.

[Ashley Hess]

The budgeting is great too.

[Raina Greenberg]

The budgeting is great. So you just build out like everything you pay for. So anything that you're, the car payments, insurance, rent, things like that, what do I make? And then it'll help you understand like what can I spend? And then you can set goals. There's personalized insights, there's reports you can get like real time alerts for large transactions, if there's upcoming bills, if you get refunds, you have low balances. I mean if you're like, I want to get my money in order, I want to take this trip, I want to figure out what can I afford this? This is the one stop shop to do all those things. There's automated savings as well. So if you want to like adjust the amounts, you want to set up frequency, kind of set it and forget it. And that is always like one of the number one tips from financial advisors on our show is just automate it and forget about it. Rocket Money is a personal finance app that helps you find and cancel unwanted subscriptions, monitors your spending and helps lower your bills so you can grow your savings. Let Rocket Money help you reach your financial goals faster. [e-mail] GGE that's RocketMoney.com GGE RocketMoney.com GG

[Ashley Hess]

okay, and I am telling you guys about Helix. I Think my Helix mattress is one of the things I love most in this world. I can't even believe how comfortable it is. Like we sleep on so many beds, nice five star hotel beds. Like it just, it doesn't matter. Coming home to my Helix, I'm just like, I feel so lucky. Like I just feel like I am blessed and anyone can have this. Like, I really just think this is the thing you need to treat yourself with.

[Raina Greenberg]

Every person that stays in my house is like, what is that?

[Ashley Hess]

People have told me what's going on at Raina's house.

[Raina Greenberg]

Oh, because you don't let people stay at your house because you get a get out of jail free card.

[Ashley Hess]

Husband.

[Raina Greenberg]

But we love the mattress toppers and the pillows. I mean get everything.

[Ashley Hess]

Yes. Like people have asked me like, Reyna doesn't know what she's got going on. Do you know what mattress she has? Someone brought me up to your guest room to identify the Helix mattress because you like didn't know what it was, whatever. No. But I've had guests and I sleep on the midnight luxe, which is the absolute best in my opinion. Best mattress for sex. It was awarded. They won some award a couple years ago. And then I have the moonlight luxe in my guest bedroom. Rayna has I think both of those as well. The dusk luxe is really great too. But you're just going to get online and take the quiz. So you know which mattress model is going to be the best mattress for you. They have over 20 mattress models standard. They have Luxe and Elite. Elite. I again, I have the midnight luxe and we all sleep differently. I mean we sleep on our back, our sides, we roll around, some of us run hot. I personally do. They just have something that's going to help you address all of those concerns. They have plus size mattresses. My brother and my sister in law have that and they're just incredible. They're award winning, most awarded mattress brand tested and reviewed by experts like Forbes and Wired 129 Night Sleep Trial, Ltd. Lifetime warranty. The happy with Helix guarantee and a study they ran found that 82% of those involved saw an increase in their deep sleep cycle while sleeping on a Helix mattress. We really can confirm it's truly the best. So check it out you guys and see the mattress. It's going to be the best for you. Get the best sleep of your life and just feel really, honestly just feel really blessed and really lucky when you're sleeping on those mattresses. So you can go to helixsleep.com GGE for 27% off site wide. That's helixsleep.com GGE For 27% off site wide helixsleep.com GGE 27 easy to remember. That's our ages. Oh, yeah. I was like, wait, what?

[Raina Greenberg]

It's May. The temperature is finally above 40 degrees. You guys. Congratulations, we made it. But it is patio season, which means heavy drinking season, which means you got to find a way to manage your alcohol intake. So may I recommend Zbiotics to you guys? So ZBiotics pre alcohol probiotic drink is the world's first genetically engineered probiotic. It was invented by PhD scientists to tackle rough mornings after drinking. Here's how it works. When you drink, alcohol gets converted into a toxic byproduct in the gut. It's a buildup of this byproduct, not dehydration, that's to blame for the rough days after drinking. Pre alcohol produces an enzyme to break this byproduct down. Just remember to take pre alcohol before your first drink of the night. Drink responsibly and you'll feel your best tomorrow. I mean, I can't recommend it enough. I refuse to have a bad day, and I want to enjoy my time, go out, have a drink or two with friends. But I want to be like, clear as day the next day. Let's be real. Usually a Friday night out means a Saturday morning spent canceling my workout plans or, you know, whatever plans I have. But since I started incorporating pre alcohol, my glass of wine doesn't disrupt my morning flow. Remember to head to zbiotics.com GGE to use the code GGE at checkout for 15% off. Off.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, so this topic comes to you today from an email we got that really coincided with an article that dropped around the same time in Surprise, surprise, the Cut. Everything we do is like, based on an article.

[Raina Greenberg]

So I said to like, our publicist, I was like, all I want is a mention of my show in the cut. Like, that's my North Star. I just, you know, at the back of the magazine, it says, like, things to do and there's hundreds of things there. I was like, please do Raina Greenberg.

[Ashley Hess]

Honestly, I'd take it 100%.

[Raina Greenberg]

I just, I love the cut so much.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, this is your vlog for the cut. Your weekly plug for the cut. So we received an email that was subject line, happily married but still fantasize about others. Is that fucked up? And we'll get to that. But the cuts article was titled the secret to a great Marriage Crushes on other people. And this isn't like they're the first media outlet to talk about this. I think this is like a, a discussion a lot of people have. And like what constitutes a crush and

[Raina Greenberg]

what constitutes harmless and not harmless.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. And like we don't get into a relationship or get married and stop looking at other people. I mean, some people might, but we just wanted to discuss this and we put up polls for you guys on instagram and over 20,000 people participated in this. So great data here.

[Raina Greenberg]

And I think that everybody really has feelings about this, about their own behavior and their partner's behavior and has this has happened. I mean, and I think we get in a relationship, as you say, and you don't lose your eyes and your ears.

[Ashley Hess]

Yes, I still have a pussy.

[Raina Greenberg]

And you don't lose your desire to still feel desirable to other people. And I think that your partner can be everything in the world to you. And you can be super in love and happy and you still want some people to take notice some of the time. And you're like, I trust myself to not let this go any further, but it's nice to feel desired by other people.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, there's feeling desired by other people and there's like you desiring other people. I mean, what's, what do you define as a crush? And as we go into this, we understand people don't have monogamous relationships. Let's just get ahead of it. People are like, wow, you can, you know, like, this is for people, monogamous relationships. I mean, people have crushes and they act on them within an open or a non monogamous relationship. So I think obviously that goes without saying.

[Raina Greenberg]

I think this is most people. I mean, I was saying to you, I, I used to do these things. I wish I did them more of like, confess your sins to me, confess your secrets to me. And I mean 50% of them were like, I had a dream about somebody at my work. I can't stop thinking about somebody at my work or my boss. It's always somebody at work. But like, it's so common. I mean, what the differential. Your desires and your actions are different things and we're not animals and you should be able to stop yourself.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, what, what are your desires and where are they coming from and how deep do they run? And you know, fantasizing about someone in what way? And we'll break down all of this. I mean, I don't know if it's, if I would say it's like a sensitive topic to me. Like I don't. I mean, Shashank and I are obsessed with each other. I would die if I thought he had actual feelings for someone else, and vice versa. Like, it. Like, my heart hurts even thinking about it. Like, if I actually thought he was flirting and having a connection with just someone at work, I would lose my mind. I mean, of course I'll say that. And I will also say I'm not, certainly not fantasizing about anyone else or there's nothing missing in my relationship. I love him. I only have eyes for him. We have been together three years. We've been married under one year. So there is that. You know, someone might hear me talk like this and be like, wait 10 years, you know, And I hope we still feel like this, obviously, in 10 years and 20 years. So I just want to say that

[Raina Greenberg]

I do think that there's a lot of people that, like, have kids and they stop seeing each other romantically. There's a lot of couples that just become roommates. And, I mean, how often do you hear somebody say, like, I wandered outside of my relationship because, like, no one's. My partner doesn't see me. They don't desire me. They treat me like their mate or their therapist or their mom, their friend, but, like, certainly not their romantic partner. And I think that's. The dream is forever. You always feel like that. But I think for so many people, that is the story of, like, I don't know, I get home and we watch TV and we go to sleep, and I don't feel desired by this person.

[Ashley Hess]

Right. And have you talked about that with them? Like, have you communicated that with them? I mean, today's not really a cheating episode, but you can't talk about this without it coming up. But if you have expressed these things to your partner and over and over and you've tried and you've worked on it, and nothing changes. It makes sense why you're looking for it somewhere else.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah. I mean, and we're only human. And I think we all want to feel good about ourselves and, like, somebody else is proud of us and finds us attractive and feels that we're exciting. And I think so many people, especially when they have kids, like, your partner just sees you as a mom, and you're like, hey, I'm still a person here. I still want to feel like you see me as, like, a fuck doll, too.

[Ashley Hess]

100% the fuck doll. Yeah. And we. You mentioned, like, the people at work, and I just want to get ahead of this. We did a whole episode on the Work wife. I. I looked this up to cite it. It was in April 14, 2024, titled should you worry about the work wife and other platonic friends. And this shit is so real. And so we're not really even talking about that today. Like, someone that you really have that, like, connection or relationship with. Like, which we, we don't. We don't like it. And we've made that clear on that episode. And you guys can listen back.

[Raina Greenberg]

So we will get into the polls and everything that you guys said, but, you know, one of the biggest questions was, where's the line? And overwhelmingly, people said it's somebody you don't have a connection with. It's somebody that is a huge celebrity. It's maybe a waitress at a restaurant you go once to, or barista, you kind of floor with somebody at the grocery store. Like, the line is like, are we moving this relationship forward? Are we talking? Are you doing something you can't admit to your partner? Are you taking this offline? Are you texting?

[Ashley Hess]

Are you like, Raina, you're getting ahead of it.

[Raina Greenberg]

Just.

[Ashley Hess]

I want to reference one, something, the article really quick. I will also say that I was my husband's celeb crush and he did marry.

[Raina Greenberg]

I knew this was going to come up. So you should be scared of celebrities, too. Matt Damon, didn't he marry his waitress? He didn't cheat on his wife with his waitress or anything like that. But yeah, I mean, a lot of people were like, I mean, I think to your point, work wife, that is when it's not harmless and it doesn't feel harmless, it feels that it's crossed a line.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, so I. That's why I want to kind of start the article. I'm not going to read all word for word, but. But the. The author, E.J. dixon, so she says at my last job, I had a crush on a co worker named Phil. His name has been changed, yada, yada. She talks about Phil. I did not and do not know Phil well. By the time we stopped working together, we'd maybe exchanged 40 words in total, the vast majority which were about Steely Dan. But my husband, to whom I have been married to almost 10 years, heard about him every once in a while. Occasionally when I got home from work, he'd ask if my office crush was in that day. Once I was putting some lip tint on a mascara before a Zoom meeting, and he asked if it was because Phil was on the call. So she says, my husband are happily monogamous. We have children. He harbors his own little crushes too. And she says the whole point of having a crush is that it causes a little Frisian of nervous energy, one that tends to dissipate when you're in a long term relationship. A crush while you're married is like a sweet little snack that gets you through the 4pm song. My friend Kara, 35, told me her friend's been married four years. She, she has a crush on a New York Times critic whom she's met at a few times through friends. It's harmless and invigorating. Reminds you you're alive and kicking and yearning and thinking her husband doesn't mind. As is the case in my relationship, it serves as fodder for a couple inside jokes. So the article then goes on to talk about extramarital crushes that also can rejuvenate your sex life and maybe a little deeper where you're talking about it during sex. And some people are super into that and that's fine too. But she's mainly just talking about this crush on this work guy that I, I, I really hung on to. They've exchanged 40 words like, they are not, they don't have a relationship. They are not messaging. They're not texting. They don't have each other's phone numbers. They're not messaging on Instagram. I feel like, and that is actually harmless. And I was thinking about myself, like, if I have a crush and I. Your barista.

[Raina Greenberg]

Oh, you do.

[Ashley Hess]

No, the barista from like a couple a year or so ago.

[Raina Greenberg]

He has a crush on you.

[Ashley Hess]

He had a crush on me and do we ever talk about this?

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah, we did on the show.

[Ashley Hess]

He was flirting with me and my, my, I was. Shunk was on the phone. Yeah. No, I didn't have a crush on him. My crush is the farmer's market guy, the pasta guy.

[Raina Greenberg]

He's hot.

[Ashley Hess]

He's so hot.

[Raina Greenberg]

That guy is too hot to be the farmers market.

[Ashley Hess]

So, like, it's funny because I don't even know his name. And Shashank will joke about it. He's like, oh, you're not wearing your ring today because you're going to. The pasta guy is going to be there. Like, we see him. Shashank rolls his eyes. He, Shashank goes and gets our coffee. We, we get to the farmer's market every Saturday. He overhears me giggling like it's funny. I don't get excited to see him. I don't even think about him until he's right in front of me. I don't dress differently. I don't need to defend this, but I'm just. That's the harmless. Like I can be a little flirty and smiley with this beautiful man selling pasta and he's not messaging me, asking me how like the pasta then we've crossed a line and Shashank can laugh about it.

[Raina Greenberg]

It I was thinking about like you and I've toured for a decade and we've worked with hundreds of vendors between like dancers and cryo people and videographers, photographers, venue managers, the security who I did fuck but and date for years. But like that's the kind of person I think like you meet at work that's like harmless. And there's so many people we meet. They're like good looking men. And I might like he but like I'm never going to talk to them again. I know that I can be trusted in a relationship to not like, like move that forward. And I had this like experience. This guy at a years ago, I met him at a comedy club. He was also a comedian and we had like a fun night together. We flirted and I went home and he mentioned while we were talking that you had a girlfriend. And I was like, that's the end of that. There will be no. And he DM'd me at midnight. Something that we had like been talking about. And I was like, he crossed the line. You crossed. If that was my man, I wouldn't like this shit.

[Ashley Hess]

Wait. Yeah, there was a venue guy that messaged me, remember that I was single.

[Raina Greenberg]

He wasn't multiple people that did this.

[Ashley Hess]

No, the guy New Orleans. The guy in New Orleans. We were both single.

[Raina Greenberg]

You want to date with him?

[Ashley Hess]

We went out, but he was showing me those pictures of him in drag and like, I don't know, it wasn't hitting because you know I'm attracted to drag queens but didn't work for him. I just was like, I don't know, you're wearing like spanx and like high heels and that's fine. It just didn't hit the same. He couldn't pull it off. But no, there was another guy that like was messaging me and it was flirty and he had a wife and I just was like felt uncomfortable.

[Raina Greenberg]

I think that like if you're doing something that you wouldn't tell your wife about, which is dming me off lot like out of office hours.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. And I mean, I don't know if I'd call myself a flirt. I think I'm friendly. I laugh a lot. My mom is a natural flirt. We've talked about this. I mean, just at dinner, flirting. Like, my dad just used to sit there.

[Raina Greenberg]

What? Ashley, she used to sit there and roll his eyes.

[Ashley Hess]

We'd be at dinner, and my mom, I would. She'd stick her chest out, she points to something on the menu. She's so flirty. Like, I remember. I. I remember she had a guy friend like, that was a teacher at her school, and just. It was flirty with him. Like, she's just flirty. And my dad is not flirty. And I love that about my husband as well. Shashank's not a flirty guy.

[Raina Greenberg]

Your dad flirts with me.

[Ashley Hess]

Like, he only flirts. He only has eyes for Reina. Like, Shashank is straight face, black cat energy.

[Raina Greenberg]

Well, we always say about Shashank, he would be insulted if someone thought it

[Ashley Hess]

was an opportunity, knew that we were married, and they had the audacity to flirt with him. He would probably insult them. He would be so deeply offended on behalf of our marriage. Like, guys can be flirty and it's harmless. But, like, there's. There's a difference here. And we'll talk about the difference today between men and women.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah, I trust me. I don't trust you.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, I think that in the intention matters for sure. Like, typically, women cheat because they are missing something in their relationship, and men cheat because they can. And I even looked this up. I just did a little overview of the research that indicates that while both men and women often cheat due to underlying relationship dissatisfaction, their primary motivations frequently differ. Men tend to report cheating for physical gratification, sexual novelty, or. Or opportunity literally just because they can. Whereas women are more likely to cite emotional dissatisfaction, neglect, or a desire to fill an emotional void as the reason for cheating. And, you know, even men with a crush can hit different. Like, there's a few comments under the article that stuck out to me. And this one woman said, as I read this, I kept thinking, ah, yes, this is the kind of harmless crushes my married female friends have. That's not the kind of crushes my married male friends have. The article lays out the conditions under which a crush can be harmless and even positive for a relationship. I'm just not so sure that both parties are equally capable of having crushes under those conditions. And there was a response to that comment that said, having unfortunately been the target of several married men's harmless crushes over the years, I can confirm that you're right. It feels like leering and ogling and just a gross vibe. And it's incredibly creepy and uncomfortable. It also happened to me at work, which had a huge negative impact on my mental health and affected my job because he was an older man in a more senior role. I mean, this is not all men. Of course men can have a harmless crush. But it does hit different. Like, I don't think men who have women at work who have a little crush on them ever feel threatened.

[Raina Greenberg]

It's creepy. And like, I don't think men, like, keep it in the box. I think that women are like, he's cutie.

[Ashley Hess]

Like men do.

[Raina Greenberg]

Like not all men. But it just hits different. It just does. I'm sorry.

[Ashley Hess]

I know. So, yeah, I'm trying to think of situations in my own marriage that like, I think it would be some. Somebody who's so unattainable in some way or another that like, of course I don't mind if Shashank thinks she's pretty or if it's like someone he deals with. A lot of people at work, like some older lady who comes in and flirts with him. He tells me about that obviously, and I'm not bothered by it. And I think he gets hit on a lot.

[Raina Greenberg]

Also, the thing about him that's interesting, I saw this TikTok randomly come across my desk and it said like, beware of men that don't like themselves. Because like, any way to fill that void. To feel. Yes, to feel validated. Like, I guess that's all people. But I. I think that traditionally men and women have different responses to self hatred and I don't know, a lot of girlfriends. It's just personal experience. I don't have girlfriends that experience self hatred and insecurity that fuck their way out of it with other people outside of their relationship. Totally. But I do see that with a lot of men in my life that I know and have known and don't even know.

[Ashley Hess]

It's so true.

[Raina Greenberg]

Like, it doesn't feel like a female characteristic.

[Ashley Hess]

I mean, yeah, and there's exceptions to every rule, but you're totally right. I mean a lot of men truly cheat because of out of insecurity.

[Raina Greenberg]

My ex that like I lived with my first boyfriend, I was so young, but he just cheated on me with everybody just for fun. He hated himself.

[Ashley Hess]

Opportunities. Yeah, they were around, they were there.

[Raina Greenberg]

He was a restaurant manager. He just. Just to staff your friends, the guests. So I think like one of the primary themes of this article is like, could this help your relationship? And I think most people's primary feeling is like, how far is too far? Where's the line, when is it stop being harmless?

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, I mean, I was interested in the comments. There's not too, too many. But some people don't, don't like this, of course. And some people feel like a crush. There's always something deeper. And then some people are like, this sounds like a very healthy marriage and there's no lines being crossed and she's just getting a little excited every once in a while in this long term relationship about someone else.

[Raina Greenberg]

And it doesn't sound like it bothers her husband like it sounds. I mean, I haven't interviewed him as well, but it sounds like this is pretty normal. Fine. They're both in on it. They're like they're respecting each other's boundaries. Not everybody would like this. Some people would be like, why are you telling me about this? I don't need to hear this.

[Ashley Hess]

I know. It's interesting though because like we do still find people attractive, most of us in relationships. I guess some people get married and turn it off. But I don't think that's what the average person does. And it's sometimes funny because I know I have a good relationship and a friendship with Shashan because sometimes I almost tell him, like that guy hot. Like I'll, I'll start to say something. I'm like, oh my God, he's my husband, just my girly. He's not my like friend. You know, you almost want to tell him, like, look at that guy. And you're like, he's like, like, could you not look at me?

[Raina Greenberg]

So funny. It's so true. So Based on again, 20,000 responses, have you ever had a crush while in a committed relationship? 73% of people said yes. So this seems like this is healthy and normal. It happens to a lot of people.

[Ashley Hess]

But.

[Raina Greenberg]

And then we said, do you think that having a crush on someone else is normal in a long term relationship? So totally normal. 24% of people sometimes it depends. 56%. So the majority of people and no, it means something is wrong is 21% of people. I guess it could mean a number of things. It could mean something is wrong. It could just mean that you're a person with eyes and ears and I find other people attractive sometimes.

[Ashley Hess]

Those percentages are interesting because we have this like 20ish percent of people who said they have never had a crush while in a committed relationship and that it is not normal. And then the other people are 73% who have had a crush while in a committed relationship. 56% of them say sometimes it Depends if it's normal. And some people said, totally normal. So, I mean, that kind of fit. Like, people are like, yeah, I have. And yeah, this is normal. So if your partner had a crush, would you Want to know? 19% of respondents said, yes, full transparency. 45%, the majority said, it depends on the situation, and 36% said, no, I'd rather not know. And again, this is not your partner coming home and telling you they have a crush on someone at work. Again, like, I just think the farmer's market example is what I picture of. Like, Shashank notices this. Hawkeye is at the farmer's market every other week, and I talk to him and it's so obvious that any woman would be like, oh, you know, like, I think of some men that are just so attractive, so big, whatever it is. A Harry Jowsey, a Tyler Cameron. Like, I was in a relationship both times we interviewed them, and I was like, I. Am I flirting? I don't know. Like, when Harry.

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm so flirty.

[Ashley Hess]

Like, when Harry, like, touched my leg, I'm like, like, is this allowed? Like, sometimes it's just you can't help yourself. Like, I think there's. I can't help myself with Kendall Jenner, like, walked in the room, Shashank would. Like, his jaw would drop.

[Raina Greenberg]

I think it's like, is this a person you engage with every day or not? Like, that's the line for me. That's the line for most people. Like, is this somebody you see the farmer's market, the coffee shop, or the person checks you out at Erewhon Fine. Also, like, if this is somebody that you see every day, why are you telling me about this?

[Ashley Hess]

Well, that's the thing. Like, once your partner tells you about something, somebody that's no more harmless crush,

[Raina Greenberg]

like, you're leaving your job.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, for me, you're dropping a hit.

[Raina Greenberg]

I just have to wonder what the motivation is. If this is somebody you. You have access to, that you engage with on a daily basis that you are having interactions that, like, maybe on the surface look normal, but, like, I wouldn't be comfortable with. Like, why. Why are you telling me about this?

[Ashley Hess]

So then we asked, what do you think a crush usually signals? And 22% of people said, missing something in your relationship. 52% said, just human nature. 18% said, boredom or routine, and 8% said, nothing. It's random. And I like this. I mean, all of this research really lines up. Like, 20% of people don't align with any of this. And the rest are like, it's normal and fine.

[Raina Greenberg]

I don't know that it always signals. There's something. I've had crushes on people. When I was in good relationships and bad relationships, they were for different reasons. So I've sought out the attention of other men when I was. Was flailing in my relationship for a reason. And there's been other times where nothing was wrong in my relationship. Something just caught my eye. It was sparkly.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, right. The boredom and the routine. Would you be okay with your partner having a work crush? 6% say yes, 58 say no way, and 36% say as long as it's light. And that's. I don't know. It depends on how people interpreted that. Because again, when we get into this like co worker, work wife, you have a relationship with this, this person and you have a crush on them, that's deeper and it's not harmless anymore.

[Raina Greenberg]

What's going on with the 6%? A work crush, you're good with it.

[Ashley Hess]

But again, people are just in different types of relationships. I mean, there's people who are in non monogamous relationships and in open relationships. And so people just view monogamy differently. Does outside attention crush energy help keep a relationship feeling alive? 15 say yes, it's a confidence boost. 69 said no. That's a slippery slope. This is interesting. This took a turn. I'm talking to you about this. And then 16% say no. It actually hurts relationships.

[Raina Greenberg]

The disparity is interesting to me because you. 73% of people saying, yeah, I've had a crush all time at relationship. And a lot of people being like, it doesn't really matter, it's no big deal. It's just human nature. But 69% of people being like, I wouldn't like it if it was them. So we talked about this with Esther Perel in our show, and I was trying to remember what it was called. And it's called the actor observer bias. And so this is the way that you view the things that you do and the things that other people do. And it's typically applied to insidious behavior like cheating. And basically when you do a thing, you observe it based on circumstances and context. When you see somebody else do a thing, you observe it based on their character. So when somebody else cheats, they're a bad person. It is black and white. When you cheat or you do something, you look at it as like, well, I wasn't getting the type of love I want in my relationship. I'm not being validated. You don't you look at it as a character flaw in somebody else. You look at very contextually through what you do. So you have, like, a real bias in a situation. I was unhappy, it was complicated. There were reasons, and somebody else does it. They're selfish, they have no impulse control, and it's a fundamental attribution error, meaning the more general the version our tendency to overemphasize personality and under emphasize circumstances. So for me, it was circumstances. For you, it was your personality. And I think that so many people are like, yeah, when I did it, it was fine. When you do it, it's not fine. But it goes back to the conversation to me of like, well, I know that I can control myself, and I don't know necessarily if you can control yourself.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, totally. And again, it's not fair to act like that in your relationship. You should give your partner the benefit of the doubt. Liz Moody talks about best intentions. Like, think your partner is the best. Yeah, I think your partner has the best intentions as opposed to the worst. If you. I'm getting this all wrong. Sorry, Liz. But healthy relationships, you want to think your partner is the best intentions, essentially.

[Raina Greenberg]

And.

[Ashley Hess]

And I do think part of being a good partner, friend, family member, is always putting yourself in someone else's shoes. So you should think, well, I can have a little crush, and so my partner can too. And that's, like, quite the opposite of what you said that a lot of people do. Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

And I think that that's normal. I think it's normal to give yourself more grace than anybody else. You know, I think it's normal to be like, oh, I'm in my head and I understand why I did this, but, like, when you do it bad.

[Ashley Hess]

Right.

[Raina Greenberg]

And I do think we're all human and this happens, and if it happens for me, why wouldn't it happen for other people? I mean, to the initial article's point, like, it does just kind of make it a little more fun to go to work. You just, like, get a little more dressed up than you would. But, like, I'm saying that as somebody not in a relationship currently and somebody who's felt like that, but, like, I have fucked my coworkers a lot.

[Ashley Hess]

See?

[Raina Greenberg]

And no one should give you the

[Ashley Hess]

bed for the doll.

[Raina Greenberg]

I know. How tall were they? I guess it just depends on, like, where you're at in your own relationship. I do think it can, like, add to the thrill of going to work and doing your job, going to a coffee shop, or like, when I go to everyone and that guy's there checking me out. I'm so excited.

[Ashley Hess]

I don't like the. The work.

[Raina Greenberg]

Work just feels different.

[Ashley Hess]

It does feel different. Are you working with them side by side or. I don't know. Like, I. I keep thinking of fill. 40 words exchanged between the two of them. Maybe he was a different department. Like, whatever they had going on, like that, that's the goal. Or literally the barista. Like, that's the type of energy I want. Or someone you'll never meet in real life.

[Raina Greenberg]

Barista came up so much when we asked people to find a harmless barista. Came up over and over. Celebrities. But Shashank did marry his celebrity crush. Liking somebody's stuff on social media, somebody really from afar. I mean, you just have people feel like you can't have proximity to the person.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, so this is. Did you say this is what we asked? How do you define a harmless crush? Yeah. Okay.

[Raina Greenberg]

I think. Think. Who knows what happens?

[Ashley Hess]

She's all over the place. It's a little late in the day for Reina. Raina's sundowning the wall. She's climbing the walls. Yeah. So how do you define harmless garage? Like, no action taken whatsoever.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yes. Yeah, I don't. You don't need to be engaging with that person on social media. Liking their Instagram stories. Any communication you can't share in front of my face, I don't like it.

[Ashley Hess]

So Raina got ahead of herself. But anyway, the next question is, when does a harmless crush cross the line? We love these answers, as always. We just love when you guys weigh in on this stuff. And the top answer came up a lot was, as soon as you're doing something, you need to hide or you can't share where. And someone also wrote anything you wouldn't do in front of your partner.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah, that's my line.

[Ashley Hess]

When I talk to the farmer's market guys, Shashank is 10ft away. He can hear me giggling. He can hear me Cha ching. Spending more money when that guy's there. I always get two passes and two sauces when he's running the table.

[Raina Greenberg]

They don't send that guy to the Brentwood Farmers Market. He is at the Venice one.

[Ashley Hess]

He's at ours. Like, I mean, I said every other week, but honestly, it's like once a month. Best week of the month. Okay, more on the when does a harmless crush cross the line? You have private interactions you enjoy a little too much when you're communicating every day, opening up emotionally. Someone you see on a daily basis. I mean, I don't know you might go to the coffee shop every day confiding in someone, yet you have a

[Raina Greenberg]

relationship now you utter one word about our relationship to somebody else.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, this is that. Now we're getting into an emotional cheating territory, potentially.

[Raina Greenberg]

I had a very casual sexual relationship with somebody recently. He told me he told one of his girlfriends about something that went on between us. I was like, come again? You're talking about like you're confiding it somebody else. I don't like this. Don't talk to her. Talk to me. You're having sex with me. You only talk to other women. You talk to me. Is she your therapist? No.

[Ashley Hess]

I feel like I don't know what happened. You were so eloquent, like 5 minutes ago doing that whole Esther Prowl thing. I was like, wow, this is why

[Raina Greenberg]

I wrote that down.

[Ashley Hess]

Beautiful. And now you're making no sense. You're like, I was casually someone. And the audacity of him to talk to other women about me about a

[Raina Greenberg]

fight that we had.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Raina Greenberg]

He was like, I asked a female friend of mine about this situation. I was like, don't talk to other girls. Yeah, Ashley, that's it.

[Ashley Hess]

That's so true. Ashley, about me. The second you start interacting privately, text, social, one on one, this is the answer. I'm just so glad. I mean, our audience is brilliant. Obviously. Like, they nailed this. That's what it is. That's how you know. That's the line.

[Raina Greenberg]

Every time I talk to a guy and I get a DM from him later, I'm like, gotcha. We will let this go. As far as I will let this go.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. Liking stories, exchanging contact information, texting at odd hours. Someone is trying to get to know you better. Crushes should be to distance. I love that.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yes.

[Ashley Hess]

If that farmer's market guy slid into the dms. Oh, glad you like the pasta. Get out of here. You know I'm married and now I can't have a crush on you anymore.

[Raina Greenberg]

He probably has your shop pay information. If you use your. If you.

[Ashley Hess]

He's gonna show up at the house. He's like, I heard the podcast. And obviously we're meant to be together. Anything outside of something that just lives in your head. So funny. Crushes are just supposed to live in your head. Exactly. Imaginary and then engaging in any way. I mean, again, this is the the line. Harmless crushes are just pure fantasy.

[Raina Greenberg]

40 words or less.

[Ashley Hess]

40 words or less. Okay, so let's read this email. This is a little different.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay.

[Ashley Hess]

And I'm curious what you think about this. So again, the subject line was happily married, but I still fantasize about others. Is that up? She says, hi, I'm happily married and have been for five plus years. Together for ten. Okay. Long term relationship. My husband is an incredible man who I feel lucky to be married to. We have a beautiful, supportive relationship and I'm still very attracted to him. We have a decent sex life. Working on having sex more frequently, but love it every time. This is great. Great. No kids yet. However, I've had a few. All good stuff, no notes so far. However, I've had a few crushes on various people over the years. I've never cheated as I want to stay married to my husband and love him too much to hurt him in that way. And all of my crushes have been innocent while the other person probably not even knowing. But occasionally I'll end up fantasizing about them to get off. And my most recent crush has me wanting to pick up extra shifts at work and plan group gatherings just to see him more. We get all on Greatest friends and are both respectful of boundaries and have never crossed the line. But I think in another life I would date him, which makes makes being friends feel possibly inappropriate. Also, should he start to cross boundaries, I'm not sure I'd be strong enough in the moment not to at least kiss him. Though I don't think I'd let it go any further than that. Sis, is this type of thing normal or am I fucked up? And should I see a therapist about it? Thanks for the help. Curious to hear your thoughts. Love you ladies. Signed, anonymous. People are triggered. I can feel. Can feel the collective energy two weeks from now.

[Raina Greenberg]

I mean, listen, you've been together with somebody for 10 years. You know, like, it sounds like you guys have a great relationship, but to our point, very early on the time doesn't mean you no longer have, like, eyes and ears and. I don't know, everybody can have their own boundary. Like, do I think it's so crazy to masturbate about somebody? No. I mean, people watch porn and masturbate and you can fantasize about whatever you want. It's up to you how far you're gonna take this. You're saying, like, I don't know that I would stop him if he made a move. I don't know that you're fucked up, but, like, are you missing something in your relationship? Is this just fun? Are you just. Are you missing something in your life? Are you just looking like, I cheated one time on a partner.

[Ashley Hess]

That.

[Raina Greenberg]

That's the only time I've ever cheated on anybody and something. It actually, I just, I was looking for some like, novelty in my life. It's not fair. It's just not. And I would never do it again. I was really young. But it didn't put the bandaid over what I was really looking for, which is I was sort of unfulfilled in my own life. I was a little unfulfilled in the relationship, but I was still very attracted to him and I wanted to be with him for a long time. It felt like it almost had nothing to do with him. But like, doing that didn't solve the problems that I was experiencing in my life.

[Ashley Hess]

But.

[Raina Greenberg]

But I was sort of in this area where I was like, if he made a move, I wouldn't stop him. And I wouldn't call myself totally fucked up, but it was maybe just a symptom of feeling unfulfilled either in my own life or in my relationship.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, this is just so tricky because, like, what do you. What's she supposed to do? She's supposed to not cheat on her husband. I've read this about my spouse, so crush me, by the way, you know, but like, what's the answer here? Like, I don't know. She's telling us she has a great marriage. The one thing that I did flag was working on having some sex more frequently. So maybe she's a little dissatisfied even just to say working on something that I'm clearly not. It's not 10 out of 10. Would that change it? Like she's doing a little much with this crush. With the masturbating. He's on your mind a lot. You want to see him more. Like, how far are you going to take this, sis? I mean, that's for you to decide. I don't know that a therapist could help. Sure. Like maybe figure out what's going on here. I need much more information to diagnose it, but I don't know, I can only, I only have the information she's telling us. Like, after 10 years, I have not been in a 10 year relationship. I can't speak on it. So this is probably super normal. But when you are admitting to us and you're putting in writing like, I might kiss this guy, then that's gonna snowball.

[Raina Greenberg]

If you really feel like you might cross the line, I might suggest. It sounds like, so crass. But like, I might suggest stop masturbating to him because psychologically your, your mind actually doesn't know the difference between fan, fantasy, reality, and you're actually like spending more time with this person in your mind.

[Ashley Hess]

You're spending more time and you're creating

[Raina Greenberg]

these scenarios in your brain that like, your brain says, like, this person made me come a lot. And yeah, it's hard to be like, stop masturbating to this person. I mean, you're alone with your thoughts, you could do what you want. But like, I do think that would help a little bit.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. And, and this is not to say that masturbating to someone other than your partner is wrong either. It's the frequency thing. Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

And also you're around this like, I understand you being like, I might kiss him. Yeah, you're having orgasm to the thought of him.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. She's like romanticizing him more in her mind, probably even idolizing someone he may not even really be in her own mind. Like literally has made him a fantasy.

[Raina Greenberg]

I don't know. It's hard. Again, you and I have never been in a ten year long relationship. Like, is this just like a healthy way to keep yourself feeling a little bit alive?

[Ashley Hess]

Maybe if you really don't want to cheat on your partner and you really want to, to keep this marriage healthy and, and work on it, cut back on the stuff with this guy and tell yourself that that's not who you're supposed to be with or you'd be with him or explore issues you might have in your marriage. I mean, it could be part of a bigger problem. And again, like, I even like that she brought up seeing a therapist for sure. I think a therapist would, would help figure out what's going on.

[Raina Greenberg]

I think in a really, in a long term relationship, we see somebody outside of the relationship and it's very easy to project magical qualities onto somebody that don't really exist. So like that guy, you don't feel monotony with him. You feel the thrill and the energy that we all want, that we all crave at the beginning of a relationship. You're never going to get that again with your husband. You've been with him for 10 years. So like, you might be projecting a lot of qualities onto this person that don't even exist. You're just like, you want him so bad for the thrill of it. But like, that might not even exist in this person. It would be different if she was like, I have feelings for this person.

[Ashley Hess]

I think in another life I would date him.

[Raina Greenberg]

Sure. In another life, I think a lot of married people would date a lot of other married people. But like, in another life would you be in Love with him. Would this be a good partner? Is this. Are you willing to blow up your marriage for this?

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. And focus on your marriage? I mean, is there things in your 10 year long relationship, which is a long relationship, that you can do to make it more exciting? I don't know what their sex life is like, aside from her wanting to have it more frequently, but she says she loves it every time they do. You know, is there stuff you can do in the bedroom? Is there some quality that this guy at work has that your husband doesn't like? What is it like, are you feeling kind of stagnant? I mean, like we talked about up top. You know, is this kind of like you've gotten really comfortable and you're having takeout every night on the couch together, watching tv? Like, has your relationship gotten too routine and quote unquote boring where you can do something there? I just don't know what's going on. Like, they might be like traveling and doing adventures every weekend and that's not the case at all. But if it is kind of of something that's not exciting, can you make it more exciting?

[Raina Greenberg]

So, like, if you're craving novelty.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

Can you create novelty within your relationship?

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

Buy some costumes, buy some sex toys.

[Ashley Hess]

I mean, yeah. So we appreciate her writing in. We always appreciate, appreciate you guys sharing with me. And this is like a judgment free space. But we're gonna be honest with like our initial, our thoughts on it and just in general, like fantasizing about people. I don't know. You said that someone asked like, I had a dream about somebody. Does this mean something's wrong with my relationship? I was like, grow up. Like, I. I had a dream I was dating someone a couple weeks ago. I also had a dream I fell off a cliff in a car. I have dreams, my teeth are falling out. I don't want these things to happen. I guess, sure it could. But to me, that has no correlation to your relationship that you had a dream about someone else.

[Raina Greenberg]

People, I think, add a lot of weight to dreams. I just don't like, what does your subconscious really want? Well, I don't know. What does your conscious want? Like, you could have a dream about your ex, you can have a dream about your boss. You have dreams about stuff to your point, all the time. That can't happen, wouldn't happen. And also, like, I have free will and I'm not an animal. So if I have a dream about somebody who's to sleep with and that turns me on, that's okay too. I Don't have to text them when I wake up, right? It's fine.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, exactly. It'll go away. You'll stop thinking about it. When you'll wake up, it'll feel fresh and then it just won't.

[Raina Greenberg]

By the end of the day, you

[Ashley Hess]

won't even remember that happened. But yeah, I mean, masturbating to the thought of somebody else, like, like it's this interesting thing because it's like we can tell you, okay, you are masturbating to your crush once a week. I mean, I don't think I would recommend it because again, it's like you're having an orgasm. You're thinking about them. It's like you're spending time with them and someone could be like, what? You're gonna tell me what I can think about? That's up for you to decide.

[Raina Greenberg]

I mean, yes, you wrote the email. Do I think it's so easy to stop masturbating to something fun and novelty?

[Ashley Hess]

No. You're like, I keep thinking about the barista when I'm masturbating and it's like, it feels weird for me to tell you to stop. But what is it doing psychologically? Like, our thoughts do manifest into actions.

[Raina Greenberg]

It creates more like limerence and just like hanging on to this thing. But like, you're creating more meaning to it, you're adding more meaning to it and your brain doesn't realize the difference between those things. And so you're just like, like it. Now this person's just giving you orgasms.

[Ashley Hess]

And I wonder about the length of a crush because to me, when we really talk about harmless, it feels like it should be short lived. Like, you don't think about it. Well, I don't know. I'm just like, do you have a crush on the barista for three years? Like, should you go to another coffee shop? Like I'm saying, like, if it truly just stays in that harmless from afar, the relationship never progresses in three years, that's one thing. But having a crush for a long time, like, just maybe go to a different farmer's market, get your pasta somewhere else.

[Raina Greenberg]

It's crazy to have a crush on somebody for three years. Like, just move on.

[Ashley Hess]

There would be a point where I'm like, I don't have a crush on the farmer's market guy anymore. I have a crush on another guy at the farmer's market. Yeah, obviously. Like, I don't. The pasta guy is people cycling through pasta guys. So 2008, like, it's the taco guy now.

[Raina Greenberg]

The fishmongers are usually pretty cute.

[Ashley Hess]

Oh, our fish guy's so weird. They're all weird. He's an asshole.

[Raina Greenberg]

They're all weird and high as fuck.

[Ashley Hess]

But there's one guy there, like, sells tees, never wearing shoes, and now he doesn't have a table anymore. He's sitting on the ground. It's really evolved over time because he's never worn shoes, and he's always like, come try the tea. I'm like, I'm okay. I'm a coffee girl. And then now there's. He doesn't have a table anymore. And I feel like. I feel like that's a choice. I feel like that's a choice.

[Raina Greenberg]

I.

[Ashley Hess]

Because. Do you think it costs extra? He has the space.

[Raina Greenberg]

He probably just doesn't watch. He rents the area.

[Ashley Hess]

He's sitting on the ground.

[Raina Greenberg]

What do you say? Sitting on the ground barefoot. He's like, energetically. I just don't believe in table.

[Ashley Hess]

Sitting on the ground barefoot, barking at people as they go by. The fish guy. So he had these sand barking. Well, like, barking. Like, in the comedy club. Free show tonight. Free show tonight. Free tea. Free tea. The fish guy, he had these salmon patties for, like, three or four weeks in a row. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. His salmon has two bones in it. Like, I said to stop getting his actual salmon fillets. These patties were the best thing I've ever tasted. So then he stopped selling them. And I would go every week and be like, do you have the patties? And he was like, no. Oh, I'm like, you're so sorry.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yes.

[Ashley Hess]

Like, I'm so stupid for asking. Hey, do the patties this week? No. Oh, my bad. I bought them the last three, so I just assumed I could ask if you were selling a product, like, not Raina. He could say, oh, my God, I'm so sorry. Those were like, don't have a limited time.

[Raina Greenberg]

Ran out. Totally.

[Ashley Hess]

And so finally one time, I was like, shashawn, can you go ask if he has the salmon patties?

[Raina Greenberg]

You thought because you're a woman he was talking to?

[Ashley Hess]

Well, I just was like, I can't have him be mean to me again because he's not giving me any more information.

[Raina Greenberg]

Salmon patty girl again.

[Ashley Hess]

It's just. Well, I think he's like, buy a filet, you cheap.

[Raina Greenberg]

I know. So minced up trash.

[Ashley Hess]

Sean goes over there and he comes back, and I was like, what? I was like, did he dunk on you too? He was like, absolutely.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay, good. I was worried. He gave.

[Ashley Hess]

Oh, no, no, no, no. So we just finally stopped even going over there. But what if they're in there? I can't ask every. I can't just ask every week.

[Raina Greenberg]

I. No, you can't. I can't wait in the line of the Bratwood Farmers Market because he takes three hours with every customer and he's just talking and I'm white knuckle in it, and he's so high. And I just. I can't wait this long for my scallops. My overpriced scallops.

[Ashley Hess]

It's so we go every Saturday. It's one of my favorite parts of the week. It's so crazy. Like, the stories Shashanka and I make up about these people. They are characters in our life. Like, and the bands and the singer. Like, there's live music every week. Like, I just feel like this is such a fun part of our relationship is, like, these characters in our life every week. And, like, what are they up to?

[Raina Greenberg]

You didn't talk about the T guy. That's hilarious. No more table. What happened to the table? How much does the table cost?

[Ashley Hess]

He's sitting on like a pillow.

[Raina Greenberg]

He's not right.

[Ashley Hess]

Like, bohemian people, they don't have furniture. They live in a loft with, like pillows on the floor.

[Raina Greenberg]

They don't live in a parking lot. Like, they go sell something dusty. So if you want. If you want tea, you have to reach to the ground.

[Ashley Hess]

Isn't that crazy?

[Raina Greenberg]

Do you have to get on the ground?

[Ashley Hess]

He probably wants you to get on the ground.

[Raina Greenberg]

Hand it up to you. I don't know. Right?

[Ashley Hess]

Like, is he going to stand when you approach?

[Raina Greenberg]

Is he playing music?

[Ashley Hess]

No, you can't really. It would be weird if people played music. Cuz there's live music.

[Raina Greenberg]

Weirder than not having a table.

[Ashley Hess]

I got to get more information. I'm just take a picture of him, guys. Watch YouTube. All right. Well, I hope you guys enjoyed this topic again. Thank you as always, for weighing in and sharing with us and being open and vulnerable. And I think we. I think we covered it. You know, what constitutes us harmless and what doesn't. And.

[Raina Greenberg]

And as always, we have the most people responding to our polls than any other podcast because we're the best in the whole world, so we have the best audience in the world. So thank you, guys.

[Ashley Hess]

Yes. So thank you, guys. Girls, gotta eat dot com. But not much going on over there, so you can skip that one hit. Raina Greenberg.com starting on the 14th for the tickets today, you can look what the. You can peruse. Yeah, you can see where you want to go. You can shop.

[Raina Greenberg]

You can load up the cart window,

[Ashley Hess]

shop a little bit and then get your tickets on the 14th. You can watch my special worldwide and on Prime Video just in the U.S. and if you want to get all those links, if you can't seem to find them, I am Ash Hess on Instagram and check out my link tree. Raina is Raina Greenberg on Instagram and you guys can watch full video on Spotify and YouTube. Leave a comment, weigh in, let us know what you're thinking and subscribe. Share this episode with a friend and we will see you Thursday.

[Raina Greenberg]

Have a good week, guys.

[Ashley Hess]

Bye. Spring just slid into your DMs.

[Raina Greenberg]

Grab that boho.

[Ashley Hess]

Look for that rooftop dinner, those sandals that can keep up with you. And hang some string lights to give your patio a glow up. Spring's calling. Ross, work your magic.