Losing Your Partner (and Loving Again) with Kelly Rizzo

Summary

Podcast Summary: Girls Gotta Eat

Episode: Losing Your Partner (and Loving Again) with Kelly Rizzo
Release Date: May 18, 2026
Host: Dear Media; Co-hosts: Ashley Hesseltine & Rayna Greenberg
Guest: Kelly Rizzo

---

Episode Overview

This deeply insightful and candid episode of Girls Gotta Eat tackles the complex experience of losing a life partner and navigating the journey of grief, healing, and potentially loving again. Special guest Kelly Rizzo—creator of Eat Travel Rock and widow of comedian Bob Saget—joins hosts Ashley and Rayna to discuss sudden loss, societal expectations of widows, the messiness of mourning, ways to support grieving friends, and her lived experience of finding companionship after loss. The conversation blends humor, empathy, and wisdom, helping listeners understand both the personal and communal aspects of bereavement.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Kelly and Bob Saget: Love Story and Legacy

• Meeting and Dating (39:00–45:00):
  • Kelly shares how she met Bob Saget via Instagram DM after a friend’s heads-up, describing their first exchanges and the surreal aspect of dating a celebrity she’d grown up seeing on TV.
  • Their relationship progression is recounted with humor, including group dates and the challenges of age and fame differences.
  • Quote [40:57] Kelly: “He was so unbelievably awesome and just chill and fun and quirky and neurotic and just all the things that you’d want him to be. And I was like, I can’t not give it a chance.”
• Bob’s Fame and Personality (31:45–36:50):
  • Discussion of Bob’s legacy as “America’s Dad” and the emotional stories fans have shared with Kelly since his passing.
  • Bob’s dual persona: wholesome Full House dad versus blue, edgy stand-up comedian.
  • Quote [33:50] Kelly: “His real life Persona was somewhere between Entourage and Danny Tanner … He wore, you know, the black robes with the cigar by the pool … but at the same time, he was sweet and wanted to hug everybody and was a neat freak.”

---

2. The Sudden Loss and Early Grief Experience

• Immediate Aftermath of Losing Bob (48:47–51:55):
  • Kelly recalls the shock, disorientation, and the sense that “nothing computes” after Bob’s sudden passing from an accidental injury.
  • The disconnect between being a “young widow” and societal expectations of widowhood.
  • Quote [50:31] Kelly: “I remember, even that day… saying to [Candace Cameron], ‘I don't have a husband anymore. Like, so I’m like, a widow. Like, what? … I’m young. Like, it just didn’t make sense.’”
• Timeline and Milestones of Grief (51:55–53:55):
  • Grief is initially measured in hours, then days, weeks, and months; seeing improvement is almost impossible at first, but time and support slowly bring healing.
  • Quote [51:55] Kelly: “All of a sudden you look back and, like, three months in, you’re like, ‘Oh, I’m doing a little better now than I was then.’”

---

3. Support, Community, and What Actually Helps

• What Helped Most (54:05–56:40):
  • Kelly credits her close-knit support system—her sisters, Bob’s daughters, and best friends—for helping her survive grief, noting she never felt the need for outside therapy due to this.
  • Quote [55:15] Kelly: “The recipe for making sure that you can get through it is just to feel like you’re around people who just get you and support you.”
• Advice for Supporting Grieving Friends (56:36–59:47):
  • It's meaningful to have a “home base” where people can gather in the aftermath.
  • Checking in matters, but the most comforting connections come from people who also loved the person lost.
  • Continuing to mention the loved one, even long after the loss, shows their memory is alive—don’t be afraid to bring them up.
  • Quote [59:28] Kelly: “Mention the person, even if it’s a year later … They don’t want you to forget about their person.”

---

4. Communication: What Helps and What Hurts

From Kelly’s “Grief Journal” (64:34–68:45):

• Phrases that felt unhelpful or triggering:
  • “I’m so sorry.”
  • “My heart breaks for you.”
  • “How are you?” (over text, felt like “homework.”)
• Why? She disliked feeling pitied, didn’t want “homework” of summarizing her feelings in a text, and found some sympathy language hollow or burdensome.
• Preferred communication:
  • Ask specific questions (e.g., “Was today better or worse?” rather than, “How are you?”).
  • Offer an open line: “Do you want to talk?”
  • Say, “Don’t respond to this” to avoid giving the grieving person another obligation.
• Quote [65:16] Kelly: “I didn’t like feeling pitied. … I kind of wanted people to be sad with me, but not for me.”

---

5. Grief and Moving Forward

• Pressure and Timeline (76:23–77:08):
  • Kelly placed a one-year moratorium on considering dating—she felt this was a “cultural minimum,” though acknowledges everyone’s timeline is different.
• Feelings of Guilt and ‘Moving On’ (78:12–81:16):
  • Detailed the emotional complexity, including guilt, in wanting to love or be loved again.
  • Her experience gaining “blessing” from Bob's daughters was critical for healing and dating again.
  • Quote [80:13] Kelly: “Of course [his daughters] want you to be happy, but, like, there’s probably a lot of guilt that comes with it.”
• Finding Love After Loss (81:16–84:50):
  • Kelly met her current partner Brecken 18 months after Bob’s passing; their relationship developed slowly, with support and understanding from both sides.
  • Importance of a new partner accepting and respecting the place of a lost spouse—“both loves can coexist.”
  • Quote [85:12] Kelly: “Both loves can coexist indefinitely, forever, because they’re not going anywhere. But one doesn’t take away from the other.”

---

6. Grief Etiquette and Real Talk

• Check in, but don't expect a reply ([75:28–75:53])
• Don't compare grief, don't try to fix, just listen ([71:38–72:55])
• Don’t try to rush someone through their grief, and don’t judge their path ([46:11–47:53])

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• [31:07] Kelly: “Even soon after, I tried to talk about [grief] in a lighter way … I was married to a comedian … he taught me that it’s okay to laugh at everything.”
• [41:01] Kelly: “I posted this on my Instagram … it was the 10-year anniversary of this post … ‘If that’s not too forward, best, Bob Saget.’”
• [53:30] Kelly: “I want to feel everything, like, because I don’t want to be the person who pushes it away, and then years later … I should have dealt with that.”
• [85:12] Kelly: “My love for Brecken doesn’t negate my love for Bob. They just exist at the same time and in the same space.”

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

| Timestamp | Segment/Topic | |-----------|-----------------------------------------------------| | 29:40 | Introduction: Kelly Rizzo and how she met Bob Saget | | 31:45 | Bob Saget’s legacy and character | | 39:00 | Kelly’s dating story with Bob; age, fame | | 48:47 | Immediate aftermath and timeline of grief | | 54:05 | The role of community and support | | 64:34 | The “grief journal”—what helps and what doesn't | | 76:23 | Pressure, timeline, and guilt in dating again | | 81:16 | Meeting and dating her new partner, after loss | | 85:12 | Both loves can coexist |

---

Takeaways & Advice

• Supporting Friends:
  • “Just be there,” and ask what they want (do they want to talk, do they want space?).
  • Specific questions are better than, “How are you?” which can feel overwhelming.
  • “Don’t respond” messages are a kindness.
  • Continue to mention and honor the loved one lost well beyond the initial aftermath.
  • Don’t try to offer perspective with platitudes like “everything happens for a reason,” unless you know how the person feels about such phrases.
• For Grievers:
  • Grief does not keep a schedule; only you know what feels right for you.
  • Let yourself feel your feelings, and don’t judge the process or compare yourself to others.
  • Allow both past love and new love to exist without guilt.

---

Resources & Where to Find More

Kelly Rizzo:

• Podcast: Comfort Food
• IG: @kellyrizzo

Girls Gotta Eat:

• Website: girlsgottaeat.com
• Podcast: Available on all platforms
• IG: @girlsgottaeatpodcast

---

This episode is recommended for anyone coping with the loss of a partner, or anyone wanting to be a better support to grieving loved ones. The candidness, humor, and practical wisdom will resonate long after you listen.

Transcript

[Kelly Rizzo]

I'm supposed to move on. Or when everyone else says, you're supposed to do this or not supposed to do this, and you really just learn that there are no rules.

[Ashley Hess]

This podcast is a Dear Media production.

[Raina Greenberg]

Hi, guys.

[Ashley Hess]

We're an adult. Don't start.

[Raina Greenberg]

Die.

[Ashley Hess]

Just leave it.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Hi, guys.

[Ashley Hess]

Hi, guys.

[Raina Greenberg]

Welcome back to another episode of Girls Got so Hung over, I don't know how to function.

[Ashley Hess]

What if that was our energy, though?

[Raina Greenberg]

You walked in this room, and I was just sitting in the dark.

[Ashley Hess]

I know when someone's just sitting in the dark, you're like, oh, it. It's dark in more ways than one. Something's wrong.

[Raina Greenberg]

You were like, do you need a ride today? I was like, I think I need to just be on my own journey. Our friend Bobby's staying with me, and, like, I've just been upstairs in my room just being quiet. And he was like, I'll walk you to the. To the studio. And I was like, no, no, I'm going to go.

[Ashley Hess]

Two drinks of duty in your 40s, everybody.

[Raina Greenberg]

I really did not have a lot to drink last night.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, like, we both have not been drinking a lot. I mean, you know, I'm usually not drinking a lot. And you can't. You're on tour. You're working nights now.

[Raina Greenberg]

And so day worker and a night worker.

[Ashley Hess]

And week to week, it varies in terms of if I have a glass of wine with dinner. And this whole week, until the exception of last night, I just didn't. I had, like, a seltzer. I might have a little treat. I like to treat myself with something after dinner, whether it's a sweet treat, like a brownie or ice cream, but, like. Or just something with bubbles. And the other night, I was like, do I want a glass of wine, or do I just want, like, a grapefruit spin drift? And I did a spin drift, and I just woke up. I felt so satiated.

[Raina Greenberg]

Like, looked so good from one spinny.

[Ashley Hess]

No, Rayna. And I'm saying not doing alcohol.

[Raina Greenberg]

Not doing alcohol. Never do.

[Ashley Hess]

Alcohol is going to be sundowning this whole episode. I can already feel it. I was editing an episode recently, and

[Raina Greenberg]

you just were not. You.

[Ashley Hess]

You were grasping, like, half a concept, and it was because it was too late in the day.

[Raina Greenberg]

Ashley, you made me record on a Friday.

[Ashley Hess]

I made her. Oh, you guys.

[Raina Greenberg]

You've made me. And I don't know how this happened.

[Ashley Hess]

Ross podcast here.

[Raina Greenberg]

We did a show yesterday. We did Netflix as a joke, and it was so n to just have you be in charge.

[Ashley Hess]

I Loved it. I just love to be in charge.

[Raina Greenberg]

I felt so taken care of.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, let's thank our partners.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay.

[Ashley Hess]

Thank you.

[Raina Greenberg]

To Quint. Refresh your wardrobe. Get free shipping and 365 day returns on your next order at quint.com GGE

[Ashley Hess]

and thank you to AG1, get an AG1 flavor sampler plus a bottle of vitamin D3 plus K2 free with your first AG1 subscription at drink ag1.com GGE and Bilici wake up with clear skin and smoother hair. Gets 60 nights risk free plus 30% [e-mail] GGE with code GGE also, yesterday

[Raina Greenberg]

we were like, planning the show. I was like, I asked you a question. I was like, how will we decide? And you were like, I'll decide. Okay.

[Ashley Hess]

But it's so.

[Raina Greenberg]

The.

[Ashley Hess]

The timing of our live shows is something that I have on lock.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

I've never been wrong.

[Raina Greenberg]

Well, you plan that well.

[Ashley Hess]

I just. And I, you know, I've been doing stand up for 10 years. I have a concept of time too, and just I know how long things are going to. There's was one incident that the show ran too long and we had to get off stage, and that was because they didn't let us know there was a curfew. So sorry, Chicago 2023 that we had to rush the end of that show. But I always know where we're at. And I still am impressed with myself where I'm like, it's gonna be a 90 minute show. And then alas, 90 minutes. And so Raina will be like, I just don't know if we have enough time. I don't know if it's gonna be too long. It's gonna be too short. You still are doing this 250 shows later. I don't know.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I think it's gonna be too short. I think it's gonna be too long. I'm like, why?

[Ashley Hess]

Just leave it to me.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I've leaned in.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay. I've had to be in charge of my whole self, this whole tour. I had to make, like, a really hard professional decision the other day, and I was just like, I have to just do this alone.

[Ashley Hess]

Just all by yourself and wait, what? Could I help or no. Did you ask for my opinion? What was it? Is this private? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, that one. I said, you do you. I said, I will support you either way. I did not want to.

[Raina Greenberg]

You were 51% in the camp of do it.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. But I was like, I'm not gonna push you on this, so. But you did, you know, you did the thing.

[Raina Greenberg]

You know, you and I. I joke around. You and I work really hard at this business. Obviously, it's not like, Yeah, I know.

[Ashley Hess]

People are just like, it's the wrong idea. We also have different responsibilities.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah. So. And also, we've just been in business long enough that I do just trust you. I like when I'm like, you just do it. It's like, I just, I know it will be done. Well, I don. Have to worry about it.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, thank you guys.

[Raina Greenberg]

But yeah, I've just been out here being in charge of me and it's exhausting. But you weigh in on stuff. I feel, you know, you have been on tour longer than me, so, like, in terms of like, what's fair to pay people, what's expected in terms of like, cover this, don't cover that. Like, I do turn to you more because it's my first tour.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, happy to help. I need you to just love those conversations.

[Raina Greenberg]

Manage me, Be in charge of me.

[Ashley Hess]

We're wearing our matching flip flops today.

[Raina Greenberg]

Didn't I get you those?

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. So I still, you know, I will say I never really thought I would be back into flip flops. Like thong sandals, obviously. We all wore them for so many years. Haviana Rainbow. I feel like that was more of a south thing. But then that was like all we wore. And then I retired them and they kind of went out of style. And I was like, I do need more support. And now they are back and I love the look and I don't like the way they feel. And so I'm not comfortable and I don't feel stable.

[Raina Greenberg]

You have been saying that for a long time and yet you're always in.

[Ashley Hess]

I'm doing it. I know. And they're so light and small to pack. But even Shashanka and I went to dinner, would just walk to a place in our neighborhood and I was like, I shouldn't have worn these. I don't feel secure. You don't have a fear of slipping?

[Raina Greenberg]

You scared about slipping?

[Ashley Hess]

And I just don't have the support like we used just to roll around willy nilly. Flip flopping. I'd rather wear a slide. This is just not.

[Raina Greenberg]

I mean, it looks.

[Ashley Hess]

I love the look.

[Raina Greenberg]

It looks like that might snap. And then you have no shoe.

[Ashley Hess]

Exactly. And then you have a Chanel heel cover.

[Raina Greenberg]

I walked here in my teaks.

[Ashley Hess]

Crazy.

[Raina Greenberg]

And I just, I'm comfy.

[Ashley Hess]

Do you feel comfortable?

[Raina Greenberg]

I feel ugly, but I feel like my, my feet are just out there to the world. And I haven't had a pedicure in, like, three weeks. And they are long.

[Ashley Hess]

Do you feel supported?

[Raina Greenberg]

Nothing could support me today Already.

[Ashley Hess]

I'm actually surprised you're hungover in flip flops. Like, I would feel so unsecure. I would feel really just not.

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm already so uncomfy. I was just like, yeah, who. Who cares? I do look at them and they look like they're going to snap, but I just.

[Ashley Hess]

I didn't think I would love the way they look with so many different outfits. And so here we are. And so just know if you guys see me out in these streets in these teaks, I look good, but I don't feel good.

[Raina Greenberg]

I've been trying to figure out something that's in between teaks and snakes.

[Ashley Hess]

Guess what? I will not be doing loafers. No. I like ballet.

[Raina Greenberg]

Oh, ballet flats.

[Ashley Hess]

Whatever you guys want to do. And they are in style. But there's the ballet flat. I will never. And then there's this ballet flat sneaker hybrid.

[Raina Greenberg]

No.

[Ashley Hess]

That I refuse. No, but these are what's in. And I. I ref. I hate it. I personally look so stupid with the ballet flat. You wore those clear ones recently.

[Raina Greenberg]

I don't like those.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, I haven't seen them.

[Raina Greenberg]

I sold them.

[Ashley Hess]

Obviously. You did Raina's other job. That's why I have to run this company. Because Rain is busy on my other work.

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm busy selling everything I own. My shopping addiction. Well, I'm trying to condense three bedrooms of clothing into one bedroom apartment at some point. But yeah, ballet flats I still like. Cause I feel like I'm tiny and I could do ballet flats.

[Ashley Hess]

You look cute.

[Raina Greenberg]

But, like, I went. I did this podcast with this guy the other day, and I was randomly trying to look cute.

[Ashley Hess]

I don't know why you were.

[Raina Greenberg]

I was trying to look kind of cute and I didn't know what shoes to wear.

[Ashley Hess]

You don't know why. Cause you're single and he's fun and good looking.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah, but I'm not gonna date that guy.

[Ashley Hess]

So what?

[Raina Greenberg]

You're right. That's true. I'm not. I can't take what you were doing. I can't take him seriously. It's like a prospect. But he is cute, so I wanted to, like, look cute.

[Ashley Hess]

As opposed to the last guy you slept with that you took so seriously.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I hate him.

[Ashley Hess]

One thing about Raina Greenberg is she does not take someone seriously.

[Raina Greenberg]

I don't have to take them seriously to sleep with them. He fucked pretty well. I Took that seriously. Took that really serious. I took that dead serious, actually.

[Ashley Hess]

Dead ass. Okay, so you wore those clear sandals.

[Raina Greenberg]

No, I wore Adidas. I wore. You saw me after we recorded. I wore this brown, like skims shapewear bodysuit. And I wore. I wore Adidas. Like sneakers.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, like sambas. Yeah, I'm a sambas girl. Yeah. But I just. The ballet flats are in and this ballet flats sneaker situation and it just couldn't be me. And this is just whatever you want to do. This is just my taste. I think they're hideous. And if you like it, then I love that for you.

[Raina Greenberg]

I like a loafer.

[Ashley Hess]

I love a loafer.

[Raina Greenberg]

I take myself serious in a loafer. I'm like, she means she's at business.

[Ashley Hess]

But then sometimes like, I bought these like lug sole loafers. I was like, I look so stupid.

[Raina Greenberg]

I look stupid in this.

[Ashley Hess]

My feet are too big for these.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah, they're too like masculine for my little.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, they were too masculine. Okay, so we have Kelly Rizzo on today. We will talk to her obviously shortly. But she was married to Bob Saget, who passed away. And we're talking about grief. And I met her at a dinner last week. Dear Media hosted this dinner with Pinterest. And we just started talking and I just liked her immediately and I felt comfortable with her. And I started talking shit about something in the room. They put on a great event, but there was like a thing that bothered me has nothing to do with them.

[Raina Greenberg]

It is the great unifier if you can just start talking shit with somebody about something.

[Ashley Hess]

So we just like kind of bonded over that. And then we got started, started talking and she will share her story. But she was obviously married to Bob Saget and she is dating someone new now. You might know who he is and we'll talk about that with her and just all the things. So I just wanted to say we did a grief episode when my dog Dewey died. Very different to lose a pet, to lose a spouse. That goes without saying or. Or a parent or to anything. You know, a pet is different than a person. So. But I still just wanted to cite it because I do get asked about it a lot. And people message me that they're pet died and they listened to it. And also people have asked they that don't know it exists and do we have any resources like that? So anyway, it was called Pet Loss, Grief Relief and showing love in February. February 8, 2021, if you guys want to check that out. And then we had Kate Nichols, a comedian and a Friend on in July of 2020 and we chatted with her about losing a parent and her mother's breast cancer and all sorts of things. So those are two grief related episodes. If you guys are looking for this. Because we asked on Instagram what you guys want to talk about and so many people respond. I mean there's a lot of people who have obviously dealt with loss and grief and so we just wanted to offer those additional episodes.

[Raina Greenberg]

It's a blind spot for me. I hate to be like I never lost anybody, but I didn't have pets growing up and my parents are healthy. My grandparents passed away when I was pretty young. You know, grandparents are supposed to pass away. You know, I haven't had a part. When I was 19, my boyfriend died. And that was a horrible, obviously terrible situation. But not my lifelong partner, you know, like that was somebody I casually was dating. And of course that was something really, really horrifying to struggle with. And more so when you're 19, just your own mortality is really, really tough to struggle with. But I've never like in my adult life lost a partner or a pet or anything like that. So it's a blind spot to me. And I think that from the outside we're all thinking like how do I support somebody? Cause you and I had a really close friend that lost her pet recently and I said to her like, I don't know how often you want me to check in with you about this. I don't know if you to bring this up every day, cuz it's on my mind every day like when I talk to you, but I don't know if you do you want to be reminded of this every single day.

[Ashley Hess]

It is tough and you just can ask your friend that if you're close enough friends like how do you want me to support you? So if obviously it's our same friend and I just want to keep checking in on her. She's really struggled with it a lot obviously, like we all do when we, we lose a pet. And so I try to feel a little vague like I'm just want to check in on you. How are you doing? I'm thinking about you as opposed to mentioning the dog even. Like not that I would, but I'd like to keep it. I'm thinking about you. I'll send her a voice note. Do you want to talk? How, how are things going? She knows what I'm asking. You know, a lot of people, when something happens, they'll check in once and then that's it. And that's also okay. It depends on your relationship. It depends on the closest to the friendship. This is a really close friend of ours. You know, when Dewey passed, I had people checking in for. For weeks, months even, and then I had people who checked in once, sent flowers, and that was absolutely enough, given the nature and closeness of our relationship.

[Raina Greenberg]

Also, this is our friend Brittany Schmidt, who's been on the show, and she's talked about this publicly on her podcast and has posted about it. But sometimes you're like, well, I don't want to bring this up in case you had, like, an hour of peace. And somebody's like, hey, how are you feeling? You're like, I was. I was feeling fine.

[Ashley Hess]

You mentioned it. I know, I know. That's crazy.

[Raina Greenberg]

So I come to this episode from the other side of things of, like, I don't really know how to support somebody when they're like that. From a lens of, like, I've been through this because I know you and her have been talking so much more because you went through the same thing. But, you know, I like to make everything about me, and I can't make this about me. I can't be like, when this happened to me, xyz, you know, truly, I'm just like, you got to tell me how I can show up for you.

[Ashley Hess]

It's so interesting because. Toeing the line of your own experience, too, because it's not about me. I went through it, and here's how I dealt with it, and here's how I felt day to day and week to week. And so I find myself, like, not.

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm not trying to bring it back

[Ashley Hess]

to me, but it's. I think that people want to hear, how did you cope or how did you feel? And so I just think with your close friends and family, just ask these questions.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

Like, for. To your point. I mean, I would straight up ask my friend, do you want me to check in on you daily? Like, I don't want to bring this up. If you're having a nice little bit of happiness.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah. She said to me, I don't want

[Ashley Hess]

you to bring it up a lot.

[Raina Greenberg]

She was like, you've checked in a lot, and I appreciate it. And, like, I'll tell you if I want to talk about it. Okay? And I was like, that, yeah, great. But, like, you know, I think we all want to say, in any situation, I've been through X, Y, Z, and this is how long it took me to get over it. This is how long, like, I think that, like, quote unquote it's healthy to dwell on it. This is when, like, breakups, anything, you know, I think, I think to your experience with Dewey makes sense because it's like, well, how long until you felt better? I think people are like, I want to know how long until I stop feeling so bad.

[Ashley Hess]

But I just think most people want to be checked in on. I think you can do it in a vague way, but again, if they don't, I think they will tell you. But, I mean, someone who loses a parent or a child or a spouse, I mean, we'll talk about this today with Kelly. You're on my mind every day. If you're a close friend of mine and I want you to know I'm thinking about you and I'm not forgetting about it. And so it is just really trying to find that. That balance. Losing somebody really close to you like that. I don't think you have many moments where you're not thinking about it. And I get served, like, content like this sometimes from women who have lost their mom. And they're like, it's my whole identity. It affects every. Every moment of every day and every decision that I make in my entire life. And again, that's not everybody's experience. But, you know, so it is interesting how much people want. You just have to, like, ask them and. And see, there's no harm in that. Everyone's different. So there is no way to know like this. There is no, like, rule book or playbook.

[Raina Greenberg]

So we'll get into it more with her.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, her story. Okay, Well, I wanted to chat with this article with you. I saw this, and it's one of these debatable topics. This was in bustle, not the cut. Surprising.

[Raina Greenberg]

I did see another article in the Cut the other day. I was like, we got to stop.

[Ashley Hess]

Gotta stop. They're gonna send us a cc. I know.

[Raina Greenberg]

They're like, guys, get your own podcast.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, so the title is your Instagram story text is too damn small. Okay? Tiny type is sweeping Instagram and violating the social contract of social media. If it's an art form, then it's an art form of being annoying. I guess that's like someone's quote, but it says she opens it up as of late. Scrolling through social media feels like I'm in an ophthalmologist appointment. Like I'm undergoing a non consensual vision exercise because the text everyone slapping on their Instagram stories seems to be getting smaller and smaller by the day.

[Raina Greenberg]

Do you agree that you find that it's getting Smaller and smaller.

[Ashley Hess]

No, not small. It's like, some people do it or some people don't.

[Raina Greenberg]

When it's too big, it feels very boomer to me. Like, sometimes I write something really big and I'm like, should I be embarrassed? I don't know how boomerish is this of me, but, like, really small. I'm just like, what am I doing here?

[Ashley Hess]

I do not want someone to have to screenshot it and zoom in, grow up. That is attention seeking, pick me behavior. It's the same as, like, people intentionally vague because they're trying to, like, you know, sympathy trap or what. I get attention, but I do it smaller sometimes just as an aesthetic, it's readable. And if it's something that maybe I am just trying to say more subtly, or I'm trying to be humble about something, or I don't know. And then sometimes I write a giant. I'm screaming. It feels like how I'm saying the thing in my head. Yeah, I size that.

[Raina Greenberg]

It depends on how much I want you to buy the tickets that we sell. I want people to buy my poshmark stuff, shop our affiliate links. Like, that stuff I make really big. I want clear. I'm not doing small stuff. It's not like an art form that I need to lean into. I think you and I are funny, and if I say something I want to say with my whole chest, I think if I'm being silly, I want to just be silly.

[Ashley Hess]

But I support people doing small texts if they want to feel a little artsy in that moment. If I can't read it, if I have to actually screenshot and zoom in, get. But otherwise, if it's readable, even if it's tiny, I support you. Shashank's a small, small type guy. Okay. Can I just.

[Raina Greenberg]

I never know what he's posting. And at least three times a week, I'm like, I want to text him and ask him what this is about. And for three years, honestly, I've just been like, let him cook. Like, I can't. I don't know what to do.

[Ashley Hess]

And I'm supposed to know.

[Raina Greenberg]

It's multiple times a week. I want to message him and be like, what is this about? Like, it'll just be like a landscape or a car or a house or, like, a thing. I'm just like, I don't. What is this about? But like, I'm just like, I got to let him cook.

[Ashley Hess]

I don't know. He's. It's.

[Raina Greenberg]

He's just.

[Ashley Hess]

It's his Niche interests. Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

Just like, do you understand it?

[Ashley Hess]

I know that it's just something he likes. Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

I just.

[Ashley Hess]

It's like, he likes architecture and cars and music and deep cuts and Mac Miller and a lot of times it's

[Raina Greenberg]

a building and I'm like,

[Ashley Hess]

you just need to start trolling it. What is this why?

[Raina Greenberg]

I want to ask him all. And then the, like, urge passes where I'm sometimes just like, I got to let people live. I gotta let people just, like, be who they are. I. Kids would be in Shashank's comments every day. Like, what does this mean?

[Ashley Hess]

Just do it. Who cares?

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay.

[Ashley Hess]

Make a man, sir. Okay, so there's just a couple quotes in the article, I think, that are interesting. So someone says, whenever I have done it, though I don't do it often, it's because I'm using my small voice. It's not something that I necessarily want people to feel that they need to read. You can be a passive consumer of the main visual image, but if you're interested in the fine print, it's there for you. Okay, I sort of get that. Like, that is sometimes how I feel like, I'm like, the copy is the least important part of this post.

[Raina Greenberg]

The only real problem I have in this world with Instagram is too much, too much text. Who's reading this? Who is this for? Well, all this information, I mean, I do that.

[Ashley Hess]

I'll fill a screen. If it's about, like, a political thing,

[Raina Greenberg]

you don't abuse it. Some people abuse it.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Raina Greenberg]

Right.

[Ashley Hess]

It's their journal.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yes. Some people, like, some food bloggers, like, go to the grocery store and they Instagram story, like seven different things at the grocery store and they explain to you why they like it. And I'm like, I didn't need this.

[Ashley Hess]

You write a cookbook? Yeah. This is. Should be in a doc somewhere. And you should print it later and

[Raina Greenberg]

make this a feed post and, like, it'll be my business if I read this later. But don't. Don't put this across my desk and

[Ashley Hess]

make me do this and make me hold it down with my thumb. I'm with you, but I'll fill a screen. I have something to say. Yeah, but you're right, like, use it sparingly.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah. Don't abuse it.

[Ashley Hess]

Do you have a signature font?

[Raina Greenberg]

I have just been going back and forth a lot. Okay. Sometimes I notice that you and I have been doing the same font for, like, a few days, and I'm like, I got to switch up the font. And I go Back. And I do deco a lot. When I'm trying to be like, classy, I do deco.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, wait, let me see their names. Okay, so we have the Instagram story, fonts, Modern, Classic, Signature, Editor, Poster, Bubble, Deco, Squeeze, Typewriter, Strong, Meme, Elegant, Directional. Who's ever used that? And literature.

[Raina Greenberg]

Wait, I think signature is the one I use the most.

[Ashley Hess]

Right.

[Raina Greenberg]

That's like the pretty one. I'll show you my instruments. This one Is this signature?

[Kelly Rizzo]

No.

[Raina Greenberg]

Which one's that?

[Ashley Hess]

That's poster.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay, so my number one is poster.

[Ashley Hess]

Yes.

[Raina Greenberg]

But sometimes I'm just like, I feel like I'm just taking it too far. Like it's just, it is too big and it's just, it's too designy for what we're doing here. And so I do deco.

[Ashley Hess]

It's a serif. It's if it's the difference between a serif and a sans serif.

[Raina Greenberg]

Uh huh. I like deco. If I'm trying to communicate information. I want you to take this seriously.

[Ashley Hess]

Our girls gotta eat Signature. We decided.

[Raina Greenberg]

Ashley decided.

[Ashley Hess]

It's classy, it's into it. Yeah, it's classy. And I like, I like a classic

[Raina Greenberg]

every once in a while. Classic just means I mean business. You know, I'm not trying to, I'm not trying to jazz it up. I just want to disseminate a little bit of information in a way that's just, you know, it feels like home.

[Ashley Hess]

Classic is me every day. If I veer from it, it's. I'm making a statement. Like if, you know, I would have used a signature or a elegant for some of my, like maybe my wedding stuff or something like that. And I love when they do a holiday font, the Halloween font.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay, but do you. If you have classic on few Instagram stories, will you switch to another one while the stories are still.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, because it's not that serious.

[Raina Greenberg]

I take it serious like that.

[Ashley Hess]

Like, I'm taking this way too seriously. Yeah, I'll switch it up. But I, you know, when all the new ones came out, I was like, am I really still gonna do classic with all these other options? And for a while I was in my poster era. I like strong. Strong is strong.

[Raina Greenberg]

Which one's strong?

[Ashley Hess]

Strong is just, it's got a little slant. It's bold.

[Raina Greenberg]

I do not like strong. You hate strong.

[Ashley Hess]

You know what I'll never do? Meme. Meme is like a Comic Sans.

[Raina Greenberg]

Let me see it. Strong is egregious. I don't like it. Who is using memes?

[Ashley Hess]

The same people that use Comic Sans.

[Raina Greenberg]

What's the one next to meme? I hate that one.

[Ashley Hess]

Too elegant.

[Raina Greenberg]

That is. That looks like Disney adults.

[Ashley Hess]

Oh my gosh. I didn't see that coming. Okay, Deco's cute. Yeah. Squeeze is fun sometimes. Taylor Frost, our friend. Squeeze Giant all the time. Always.

[Raina Greenberg]

It's not for me. It's really not for me. She's a great follower. She can do whatever she wants.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, well, let us know what your guys signature font is.

[Raina Greenberg]

I think about this a lot.

[Ashley Hess]

I do too.

[Raina Greenberg]

Can I tell you what I hate doing? Feed posts. I hate them.

[Ashley Hess]

What do you mean?

[Raina Greenberg]

I just get really nervous about captions. I'm just not that cl. I'm not a caption. I'm a clever caption person and I just get like really nervous every time I'm gonna post a feed post. I hate it.

[Ashley Hess]

Is this a hard launch of how many times I've written your captions?

[Raina Greenberg]

You write my captions a lot. You leave really good comments. Like, it's not an art form I'm good at and I think I'm really funny, but I'm not good at. You leave really good comments.

[Ashley Hess]

You leave good comments.

[Raina Greenberg]

Shashank leaves really good comments. Like, he's funny. I'm not good at it. Like, I feel like I just. Tweeting was never an art for me.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay. Yeah. So you haven't been training, but like,

[Raina Greenberg]

how does one train?

[Ashley Hess]

I don't know. I mean, I'm also like a memer. Like, I love short, quippy Internet. You do?

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm not. It's just. It's not of me.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay. Yeah, I just.

[Raina Greenberg]

I get nervous about all that stuff. I'm just like every once in a while if something strikes me and I can just be like a ridiculous person. I like that.

[Ashley Hess]

I don't write them all. It's. I'll do like one a quarter. That one time we had like a workshopping thing. We all came up with it together. I forget. In Greece, I think. Okay, well, let's thank our partners and then we will get into it with Kelly. I am telling you guys about Blissey right now. How good does my hair look today?

[Raina Greenberg]

Actually, I can't believe how it looks.

[Kelly Rizzo]

It's crazy.

[Ashley Hess]

I really. I really did it, you guys. I really figured out my hair. And this is one of the main things, I promise you, is the silk pillowcases. So I was noticing so much breakage and I could literally see it in the morning. I was waking up and my hair just looked frizzy and I was sleeping on good bedding, but not silk. And so this was a journey. I started at the earlier at the beginning of the year and switched to silk pillowcases. And it's such a difference. I wake up, my hair looks like it did when I went to sleep. It's not breaking. And it also is great for your skin too. So I mean, better hair in days, truly. It reduces frizz, breakage and preserves styles and color and also healthier skin. So it can reduce those fine lines and wrinkles and sleep creases and also helps prevent breakouts as well. Blissey pillowcases are the highest quality silk. It is that 100% pure mulberry silk. That's what you need. Satin is not going to do it. And it's naturally cooling, breathable, hydrating, hypoallergenic. Dermatologists tested and recommended. I literally bring these with me when I travel. I've forgotten a couple and I don't want to talk about it, but they zip on and off super easy. So you can bring them with you to travel. If I were you, the day that you're going to leave, set yourself a reminder in your phone to take your pillowcase and don't be like me because they're not cheap and I believe in them. So these are Incredible. Again, over 3 million sold. They're featured in Vogue, Oprah Daily, Good Morning America 13 times award winning, amazing gift. The sleep mask is incredible too. I mean, they pillow mist, but we're really focused on the pillowcases and it will change your hair and skin. You guys, like, truly, just trust me. People are asking like, what are you doing? And it's weird when this is like the top thing, I say my pillowcases, but I really stand by it and I endorse it fully. So because you guys are listeners, Blissy is offering 60 nights risk free, plus an additional 30% off when you shop at blissey.com GGE that's B L-I-S-S-Y.com GGE and use code GGE to get an additional 30% off your skin and hair. Will thank you.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay. And if you guys want to be a little more intentional about what you wear day to day and lead into pieces that feel kind of like effortless and comfortable and look put together, we're going to put you onto quints. Ashley and I love it. They've been a longtime partner of the show and we used to record this podcast in sweats every day. And I loved it. I was comfy, but you and I both made this decision to like look a little more intentional when we record. And I think in order to do that, you don't need really expensive pieces. You just need stuff that like fits nicely and looks like crisp and nice and just will stand the test of time. And so even if it's just like a white T shirt and like a solid pair of jeans, it's just something that like looks intentionally put together. And you can get those basic pieces on Quint's, I truly love what they do. They use premium materials. They have European linen and organic cotton and ultrasound soft denim.

[Ashley Hess]

This is quince, the top. It's a couple years old. It holds up amazing. This is cashmere. Does it not look perfect? How many times have I worn this? I've worn it a lot. I've washed it a ton. No pilling. No pilling at all. I mean to have cashmere that doesn't pill. And I hang dry it. You can't, you know, whatever what the tag says. But I just again, wash this in the washer on regular and hang dry it. And I mean I've worn this so many different times. It looks brand new.

[Raina Greenberg]

And I think that like for the price, you don't actually expect the quality because their prices are unbelievable and you do get what you pay for. Usually where you're like, okay, I can buy a dupe of something, it's a little less money. But that's not the case with them at all. We just absolutely love the price and the quality. And so you should check out what they have. And they not only have clothing, they have great stuff for summer travel. If you want some new luggage, if you want to update your spring wardrobe, if you want some jewelry and any kind of accessories, they have all of that you can refresh your everyday with luxury you'll actually use. Head to Quince.com GGE for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns now available in Canada too. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com GGE for free shipping and 365 day returns.

[Ashley Hess]

Quince.com GG okay, and I am telling you guys about AG1. It is so important to take care of your health and there are just little things that you can start your day and will really help you feel your best. AG1 is going to be that for you. One scoop eight ounces of water every morning. That's it. It is a daily health drink with a multivitamin pre and probiotics, superfoods and antioxidants. So the next gen formula delivers 75 plus ingredients backed by four clinical trials. It's going to support your gut health. So important fill the common nutrient gaps that we all have and improve key nutrient levels within three months. So we are getting into summer is coming up, lots of travel. I mean everyone's probably got a trip planned and these are the times that can really take a toll on your immune system and make you feel tired and sluggish and so anything like that, whatever you have going on, late nights, long weekends, spontaneous plans, AG1 can help keep this one thing consistent which is that high quality nutritional support every single day no matter where you start your morning. So we love this. We have been talking about it for years and again you're just going to do that one scoop ice cold water, shake it up or stir it and just great way to start the day. So AG1 has over 50,000 verified five star reviews and comes with a 90 day money back guarantee. Visit drinkag1.com GGE to get a free AG1 flavor sampler and a bottle of vitamin D3 plus K2 in your AG1 welcome kit when you first subscribe. That's a 72 value. That's drinkag1.com GGE drinkag1.com GGE okay, let's get into it.

[Raina Greenberg]

All right guys, we are very excited to welcome our guest today. She is best known for her award winning lifestyle and travel media brand Eat Travel Rock and she is the host of the podcast Comfort Food. Please welcome to the show, Kelly Rizzo.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Oh, thank you so much for having me. This is so exciting. I was just giddy the whole drive here.

[Ashley Hess]

We're so glad to have you. We met last week at a dinner.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Our little meet cute was that our chairs were back to back and there was a photographer that was just like flash bombing the entire group. And we were looking at each other, we're like, is that normal? Like that's not okay. Like we were blinded by this person.

[Ashley Hess]

Blinded. Like I feel like I was getting brain damage. And I was just like, who in the room can I talk with? And I just, upon meeting you, I was just like, so how about that flash, right?

[Kelly Rizzo]

But you said the thing that I had been thinking for the past hour and all I wanted to do was to commiserate with somebody because it was so egregious.

[Raina Greenberg]

Sometimes you say it to the wrong person and they tell you to just like relax or like it's not a big deal. And you're like, I'm on an island here. Like with the Hate in my heart and I need to give it to somebody.

[Ashley Hess]

Or they didn't even flag it. Like, are we not built the same? Are you not realizing what's happening in the room?

[Kelly Rizzo]

I just immediately felt a safe place with you to talk shit about this flash that was just so awful.

[Ashley Hess]

So now we're here with her anyway.

[Kelly Rizzo]

So now here we are.

[Ashley Hess]

Did you talk about grief A week later?

[Raina Greenberg]

Ashley was really excited to tell me that she met you and pitched the episode idea. And, yeah, she seemed very invigorated from this dinner.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, you know, it's gonna be a heavier topic, but. But we're gonna keep it as light as we can. No, I've always. Yeah, tell us.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Because I'm four and a half years out now from my grief experience. You know, I've Even soon after, I tried to talk about it in a lighter way because it's heavy enough. It's heavy. It's heavy enough. There's enough sad. I mean, there you can follow. If you wanna the sad stuff, follow like a grief therapist or, you know, somebody who's really in that world to get the sad stuff. But I was like, I can't. Like, I was married to a comedian who experienced enough grief in his life that he taught me that it's okay to laugh at everything.

[Ashley Hess]

I love that. So you were married to Bob Saget, America's father? Yes.

[Raina Greenberg]

I grew up with him. He, like, raised me.

[Ashley Hess]

And when he passed, I mean, you realize just how beloved he was.

[Kelly Rizzo]

What a gift. What a true blessing that still. Still to this day. I mean, he had it when he was alive. Like, anywhere we'd go, if we were walking through an airport or walking down the street, he would have people come up to him. I'm not joking. And just start crying and be like, you don't understand. You raised me. Or I didn't have a dad, and you were like, my dad. Or like, my real father abandoned me and you were there for me, like. And these people would just cry and get emotional, and he would be like, oh, thank you. And I'd be like,

[Ashley Hess]

isn't that amazing?

[Kelly Rizzo]

He's like, well, yeah, I've been getting it for 40 years, you know, And I'm like, but they're crying. And I would get emotional. And he was just so. He was always still so touched by it. But he was kind of used to it after a while. Like, it was normal to him. But when I came along, I'm like, that's so incredible. And then now that's kind of trickled down to me a little bit. Like, now I get up all these stories. You know, people come up to me and be like, you don't understand what he did for me or how wonderful he was. And, you know, I still get. People send me pictures of them with him from 30 years ago, and it's. It's so special.

[Ashley Hess]

A lot of people, they become really well known for one thing, and then they are out of it. And did he still appreciate all of the Full House?

[Kelly Rizzo]

Like, he went through a phase where he didn't. I understand he was so known for family television with, like, Full House and America's Funniest Home Videos.

[Raina Greenberg]

I never knew that he was a comedian growing up, and I remember seeing him on Entourage, and it was. The character was so, like, dirty. I mean, he was like, you're, like, sleeping with the prostitutes next door. I was like, this is so funny. Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Like, dad, he's naughty, right? And, like, his real life Persona was somewhere in between Entourage, and Danny Tanner was, like, exactly halfway in the middle because he wore, you know, the black robes with the cigar by the pool, like he did in Entourage. Like, that's really.

[Ashley Hess]

That's real. Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

But at the same time, you know, he was sweet and wanted to hug everybody and was a neat freak. And, you know, he was. He was. He was both.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

But because he had done so much family television, like he was doing.

[Ashley Hess]

I forgot about America's Funniest Videos and

[Kelly Rizzo]

Full House at the same time.

[Ashley Hess]

Totally. Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

So he was working, like, 18 hour days. He would be on set at Full House all day and then go straight to America's Funniest Home Videos and write the show, do the voices, and record the live show.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

So he was like, that was his whole life. But he was a comedian, Stan. I mean, standoff way before Full House, right? Since the 70s. Like, since he was 17 when he started. So he had been doing that, and he would, you know, he had his blue, like, irreverent kind of toilet humor type of comedy, and then he does all this family television, and in his mind, he's like, they're not letting me be funny. And I'm like, but you were so funny. Like, he was so good.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

As Danny Tanner, like, it was so funny. And that cast together, the chemistry they had. That's why the show's still around. That's why people are still watching, because it's still that good. But in his mind, he's like, it's not the funny I want to be.

[Raina Greenberg]

You know, it was a different type of funny. I just. I didn't know. Like, I. It was so wholesome. I was like, what do you mean? He's a comedian. I did not grow up knowing that.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And then when you find out what his comedy was, like, it's like, that

[Raina Greenberg]

was so cool to me that you could, like, be in both lanes, but

[Ashley Hess]

it makes so much sense that he was in between. Right. You know, and we have hung out with Larry David on a few occasions, and we're like, he is that person.

[Kelly Rizzo]

He's that.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

Our friend is married to him where it's just like, he's just an exaggerated version of himself on the curb. And a friend is a director who's working on Bridgerton. And he was like, most actors are a version of who they are in real life. So if an actor is always playing an. Chances are that is, like, who they are. Like, people don't stray too far. Yeah. So.

[Kelly Rizzo]

But then he did a full 180, and after all that family television, he's like, I want people to see me for the comedy I want to put out there. So then that's when he went, like, if you see his HBO special from, I think, like, early 2000s, I think it was called, like, that Ain't Right. I mean, the jokes were dirty. He's like, I'm showing people who I really am, you know? Then he kind of found a happy medium down the road. And then really, the last few years is when he really started to appreciate the Full House stuff. He was really shying away from it. And then I think it was in Covid, because he started. He started on TikTok, and he started doing, like, little Danny Tanner bits and Full House bits, and he was, like, vacuuming the inside of our fridge and things like that. And he was like, all right, I kind of like it. I shouldn't. I shouldn't push it away. I should embrace it.

[Raina Greenberg]

But maybe he felt like the world has already seen him in another light and it's fine to go back now. You know, he's like, people love it.

[Ashley Hess]

Like, why am I.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Why am I pushing it away? Like, why don't I embrace it? This is what people love. And I want to make. Ultimately, I just want to make people happy and entertain them. So this is what the people want. This is what I'll give them, you

[Ashley Hess]

know, and the people that appreciate his stand up and the dirtier stuff, the specials are there, and they're. That's for that audience as well. We've spanned both types of audiences.

[Kelly Rizzo]

If you're seven years old, and want to watch Full House or if you want to watch the Aristocrats, like, no matter which way you go.

[Raina Greenberg]

Wait. Can I tell you a Full House thing that happened to me, like, two years ago?

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

I was on this podcast, and I was, like, flirting with this guy. He was like, we're just flirting with each other. And he was like, you know, you remind me of. And I was like, who? And he was like, the neighbor from Full House. Gia.

[Kelly Rizzo]

No.

[Raina Greenberg]

Kimmy Gibbler.

[Ashley Hess]

Kimmy Gibler.

[Raina Greenberg]

And he was like. And I was like, it feels bad.

[Ashley Hess]

No.

[Raina Greenberg]

And I like. And then I looked it up, and I was like, I do kind of

[Ashley Hess]

see it looks wise.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Well, do kind of what it's worth. Andrea Barber, who plays Kimmy Gibbler, is a gem of a human being, and she is just such a doll, and I love her. And you know what? Kimmy Gibbler was a great character.

[Raina Greenberg]

It was a great character. I think she was supposed to be kind of annoying. She just, like, flew into the house,

[Kelly Rizzo]

and she was supposed to drive the adults nuts. But I love that she did such. She did a great job at it.

[Ashley Hess]

I said Gia initially, which. Gia was the bad friend.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Oh, but I love the bathroom.

[Ashley Hess]

I know.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

Who's actress?

[Kelly Rizzo]

I mean, Marla Sokoloff.

[Ashley Hess]

Yes. So, like, I just. She's the one that sticks out to me because I was also, like, kind of.

[Kelly Rizzo]

She was so cool.

[Ashley Hess]

She's smoking in the bathroom.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Oh, my God. She was so cool. She was.

[Raina Greenberg]

Kimmy Gibbler was not cool. I wanted to be Gia.

[Ashley Hess]

I think she was, though.

[Raina Greenberg]

Kimmy Gibbler was not supposed to be cool. I think she was Steve Urkel, but she was like.

[Ashley Hess]

She wasn't Steve Urkel. No, she wasn't full.

[Raina Greenberg]

It blew into the house. It was just kind of, like, annoying with the tone.

[Kelly Rizzo]

She was quirky and eccentric.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm gonna go watch that episode.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I want to say nerdy. Right.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay. So the short story. Bob saw you and Raya and was like, I'm too famous to. To use Raya. I'm gonna circumvent this to use it the normal way and find her.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

On Instagram. Got someone else to give you a heads up. He was sliding in.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

And that's how you guys got together?

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah, He's. He slid into the old DMs, and I got this message, like, bob Saget's gonna message you on Instagram. I was like, it's weird that you get a heads up for that, but. Okay.

[Ashley Hess]

So, like, from a Friend, you mean?

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah, from a friend.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I think she called me on the phone, like an old fashioned phone call. I was like, hey, Bob's coming, right? And so I was like, I wonder if it already happened. So I checked my DMs and I've never told anyone this story, but I was actually sitting in my ex husband's restaurant that he owned at the time. So I'm in my ex husband's restaurant and he's actually, because he's a restaurant owner, he just happened to be sitting at my booth with me and my friends, just saying, hi, we're friends.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And I remember he was sitting there and I get, I was like, guys, Bob Saget just messaged me. And I remember my ex was like, what? That's weird. He's like, I gotta go. So he like got up and left. But my girlfriend's like, what? What? And I remember I was like, oh, that's so weird. Like, I don't even know what to say to him. But it was exactly 10 years ago, like this month.

[Raina Greenberg]

And he's how much older than you?

[Kelly Rizzo]

20, 23 years.

[Raina Greenberg]

Had you dated men that were that much older than you? Okay, so that was like a huge age range for you.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I mean, I think maybe it was like a couple years older. Not.

[Ashley Hess]

Certainly not at all. And had you dated anyone famous? I mean, in the entertainment, I mean,

[Kelly Rizzo]

I wouldn't say like seriously dated, you know, like dates.

[Ashley Hess]

Yes, but not in a relationship, right?

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah, never a relationship necessarily.

[Raina Greenberg]

And did you want to get married again? After being married?

[Kelly Rizzo]

I was open to it, but I wasn't. And at the time, I wasn't completely sure if I wanted kids. I wanted the option.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

But I knew I didn't want to, but I was like, well, that's what you're supposed to do, right? I don't know, you're supposed to have kids. So I want the option. And then I was just really caught off guard because I was like, what do I do with this Bob Saggett situation?

[Ashley Hess]

Just, hey, it's Bob.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Oh, I. I literally, I post this on my Instagram a few days ago because it was the 10 year anniversary of this post and he said like, hey, Kelly, would love to invite you to a show and take you out for some burgers and lobsters. Cause he saw I was like a foodie and he's like, if that's not too forward, best Bob Saget.

[Raina Greenberg]

He signed his Instagram message, Bob Saget. Like all of our dads do.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yes, Bob Saget it.

[Raina Greenberg]

My dad's like love, Dad.

[Ashley Hess]

I just riveted by. I was hanging on every word of. What did the TM say? I love.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Would love to invite. Would love to invite you to. I think he said if it's not too forward twice. I think he said that in the same.

[Ashley Hess]

I was nervous, right?

[Kelly Rizzo]

And then I was just like, hey Bob, great to hear from you. Would love to check out a show if you're ever in Chicago and haha, love me some burgers and lobsters.

[Raina Greenberg]

Isn't it so funny to look back at those first messages and think like, married that person.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I married him.

[Ashley Hess]

Right?

[Kelly Rizzo]

And then he said like, like, wow, Kelly, thanks for responding. Quite flattered.

[Raina Greenberg]

No, we're like flattered.

[Kelly Rizzo]

You responded so quickly.

[Raina Greenberg]

Oh, he insulted you.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And then part of me was like, did I?

[Raina Greenberg]

He was like, kelly, you are so thirsty.

[Ashley Hess]

I know.

[Raina Greenberg]

Do less, Kelly. Love Bob Saget.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Do less.

[Ashley Hess]

So did it happen quickly?

[Kelly Rizzo]

Like so you know, I was living in Chicago and he was obviously in la, but a few weeks later I was going to LA for some meetings and so he, he's like, can I help set you up on some meetings? And I was like, I've heard these stories of a older Hollywood person trying to help me out. Like, no thank you, I'm not looking for that. And that sounds like I know you have a one track mind and I'm not interested in that. And he's like, no, no, no, I promise. I just, I'm not trying to cast it. You're talented, I want to help you.

[Raina Greenberg]

Right?

[Kelly Rizzo]

But I, you know, I didn't know. And I was like, I was like, I don't know what to do. And he's like, I promise I think you're talented. I just want to help you out. And I was like, okay, fine. So he set me up on a couple meetings and then he's like, can I take you out to dinner when you're here? I was like, I knew it. Like that. Like there was something. Yeah, you had an ulterior motive.

[Raina Greenberg]

He's like, well, obviously I found you on the Internet. I'm trying to sleep with you.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I was like, you can come to dinner with me and my manager and her assistant. And so he came out to dinner with the three of us. Two chaperones, four nights in a row. Yeah, four nights in a row.

[Ashley Hess]

And then Bob is like, is this fucking serious? I have two chaperones four nights in a row.

[Raina Greenberg]

I had a babysitter date four nights in a row. When did he finally get you alone?

[Kelly Rizzo]

So what happened Was by, like, date three. Group date three. I think one night we had our first kiss. I've literally never told anybody this before. We had our first kiss. I think maybe date one or two. But I was still kind of like, yeah, this. Like, this is weird. I can't have a crush on Bob Sacket.

[Ashley Hess]

That's weird.

[Kelly Rizzo]

You know?

[Ashley Hess]

Like, I mean, was the age in your mind? Like.

[Kelly Rizzo]

The age was in my mind. It was still, like.

[Raina Greenberg]

How old were you at the time? 37.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I still felt like this is too removed for me. Like, I'm a Chicago gal. Like, this is this guy who I. No, I used to watch when I was 10 years old at my grandma's house, like, on Sundays, watching America's Funniest Home Videos. It was. It was too. It was too real. Right. But he was so unbelievably awesome and just chill and fun and quirky and neurotic and just all the things that you'd want him to be. And I was like, I can't not give it a chance. Like, he's too wonderful, and he really is nice. Like, he really likes me. He's really clearly, like, pursuing this. If he's coming out to dinner with, like, totally a chaperone date three times in a row, and finally, by the last night, he's like, look. I was like, oh, are you coming out to dinner tonight with us? And it's my friend's birthday, and so want to come to my friend's birthday dinner. And he was like, you know, I'm

[Raina Greenberg]

gonna ask this, Callie.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Right. He's like, I like you, and I just don't feel like you're attracted to me or that you like me in that way.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

He laid down. So I'm just. Just, you know, if it's okay, I think I'm just gonna pass on dinner because, you know, I kind of like you in this way. It just doesn't seem like it's reciprocated.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And then it just hit me.

[Ashley Hess]

I was like, I do like him.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And I go, well, what if I am attracted to you? What. What if I do like you in that way? He goes, what time's dinner? And then he came out again.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And then after that, it was.

[Ashley Hess]

It was on.

[Kelly Rizzo]

It was just on. Yeah. And I went back to Chicago, and then we met up again a month later in Vegas for our first official date.

[Ashley Hess]

Love that.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Our first solo date without others. And then. Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

And then he moved out here.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And then. Yeah, 10 months later, moved out here, got engaged. Nine months after that, and then married a year after that.

[Ashley Hess]

Wow.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

It's crazy.

[Raina Greenberg]

I mean, obviously we're gonna talk about the. The last funny parts of the relationship and his sudden passing. And we. We've done a little bit of episodes about this with pet luxury and parent loss, but never partner loss and sudden partner loss. And you were so young. You're not supposed to lose a partner at that age. No one's supposed to lose a partner. But, you know, he wasn't elderly. And we asked our audience, and people just had so many questions about grief and how they wanted to be supported and how can I support other people? And, like, what's okay to say? What am I allowed to move on? And what about when everybody else moves on, but I haven't moved on. And so I don't know where you want to start, but.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Well, I like what you just said about, like, supposed to, and I'm supposed to move on, or when everyone else says, you're supposed to do this or not supposed to do this. And you really just learn that there are no rules.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And there's no. You're not supposed to do anything. You know, I mean, there's some basic societal, like, okay, maybe don't start dating somebody else a week later. You know, like. Like, there's some things that are kind of universal where most people who are at least in a true loving relationship, that would not even be an option for them, for sure. But for the most part, you know, widows do get so much hate or grief for, let's say, moving forward. I don't even like to say moving on. Moving forward.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah. And whereas, let's say, widowers don't.

[Ashley Hess]

Right.

[Kelly Rizzo]

It is kind of a double standard.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Unfortunately. And, you know, I didn't know any young widows before. I didn't. I was not in this world. It was not in my zeitgeist. I had nothing on my radar for it. So, like, I didn't know what was appropriate or what wasn't appropriate. All I knew about widows was, like, what my Sicilian grandmother would have been like, wearing black for 500 years. And, like, little old ladies walking the streets of Sicily. Like, that's what I pictured, you know, and especially when you're young and especially in today's world, it's just a totally different world. And to just know that however you are processing it and however you need to go about your life to feel safe and to feel okay as best as you can, because you're not going to feel okay for a while, but however you can get there and whatever makes sense for you is fine. Like if you don't want to date ever again, some people, that's fine.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

And some people have this. My spouse is dead. And that's it for me. I mean, I think of my. My best friend's mom, their dad died really young and she never dated again. And she focused on her children and she lives with them now. And you know, my brother's wife, their dad died young. And again, the mom raised all the kids. And I mean, 10, 20 years later, now she's engaged again to a widower as well. They were from the same hometown. And now it's just like a beautiful story. They found each other. And I mean, you also see people move on, move forward shortly thereafter. I mean, and there's no wrong or right. I'm curious about your just grief timeline or journey. I mean, again, this was. We don't need you to replay the aftermath. This was sudden a lot. It wasn't. It was unexpected. And so how was that next year? Even year or two?

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah. So for me, the first year was awful.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

It's such an absolute change of everything in your life. Like everything's different. I mean, and your life goes like from this to this. It's just turned upside down completely. And it. And it's just so disorienting. Especially, you know, well, in my situation where, you know, Bob was, he was such a caretaker. Like, he handled so much stuff. And I mean, he called himself Batman. Like, he's like, I, I handle my shit. I take care of everybody. I am the guy. I'm like, the buck stops here, you know, and he like to have him gone. And especially in such a way where I'm like, you know, he was this 6 foot 4, big like larger than life guy and that, that he just like falls and hits his head and then just never comes home again. Like, it was so weird and so strange that it just didn't compute. It like didn't make sense. I mean, that was a big thing for me. I was saying, like, it doesn't compute. Like, how could he. Who, like, he called himself Batman. Like, he was so strong.

[Ashley Hess]

Like, you're also dealing with that.

[Raina Greenberg]

I didn't have time to like mourn

[Ashley Hess]

this while he was alive, understand it. Right.

[Kelly Rizzo]

We just assumed it was like a heart attack or something for a while. And then we find out like he hit his head.

[Raina Greenberg]

And I want to rewind to something you said a minute ago is like, you, when you think about like this identity of being a widow now, you do think of, like, grandmas. And you're like, I'm not supposed to be in this camp of people.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

That. This isn't supposed to be. I'm supposed to be in my 30s or in your 40s.

[Kelly Rizzo]

So I was 42 when he passed.

[Raina Greenberg]

It's just. It's a lot to negotiate with and to not have as much community around you. It reminds me of, like, girlfriends we knew that got breast cancer really young. They're just like, this isn't supposed to be me.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Right. Yeah. I remember, like, even that day that I found out, people started trickling into my house, and it ended up speaking a full house. It ended up being, like, pretty much just the whole full house cast was at my house. And I remember, like, looking at Candace because she was the first person who showed up and just saying to her. Because, I mean, I was in a daze. Like, I. I didn't even know what was going on and which end was up. But I remember saying to her, I was like, I don't have a husband anymore. Like, so I'm like, a widow. Like, what? Like, I don't. Like.

[Raina Greenberg]

But that's not me.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I'm young. Like, I. Like, he was just here. Like, it just didn't make sense, you know? And it was just so strange. And it took a while to process the whole, like, wait, so all of his stuff, he's just not coming back to it anymore? Like, it was just weird. Yeah. Getting back, even to the timeline, is you count things by. At first, it's hours, literally. And then all of a sudden, it's like, days, and you're like, I can't believe it's been three days. I can't believe it's been four days. And then it's, I can't believe it's been two weeks. I can't believe it's been three weeks. And then you get to like, I can't believe it's been a month. And then I was like, okay, maybe at three months, I'll start to feel, like, a little better. And then it's six months, I'll feel a little better. And then I just. I just heard another podcast where somebody's like, you never feel better. I was like, well, looking back at the time, I was like, I didn't see how it was possible to feel better.

[Ashley Hess]

Like a light at the end of the tunnel.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Right.

[Ashley Hess]

How could that exist?

[Kelly Rizzo]

I was like, this is awful.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

But then all of a sudden, you look back and, like, three months in, you're like, oh, I'm doing a little Better now than I was then. And six months, and you're like, I'm better now than I was at three months. And then, you know, you get to a place where you can look back and see how far you've come. And strangely, my best friend just lost her husband suddenly, and she's six months in now, and she will, you know, be in a place where she's like, this is awful. Like, does it ever get better? I'm like, do you know how far you've come in the last six months? Do you remember what that was like, six months ago? And, like, it's so hard when you're in it to see the progress.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And to see the potential for the light at the end of the tunnel.

[Raina Greenberg]

I mean, I don't know how you could ever see the light. You know, you're just in it. Like, I'm. I'm curious. Like, when this first happened, were people, like, okay, go to therapy or, okay, start journaling? And were you like, I'm not ready to, like, do the healthy things. I need to marinate in this. Like, do you remember, like, what you felt like?

[Kelly Rizzo]

I will say I was kind of proud of the fact that I didn't start sinking into any. And once again, this is so. I. I am in so such a no judgment zone. Like, if somebody does do that, of course, by all means. But I did not ever sink into, like, alcohol and drugs and, you know, I need to numb myself. I was really like, I want to feel everything, like, Because I don't want to be the person who pushes it away. And then years later, like, then something happens where it, like, explodes in your face, and you're like, I should have dealt with that.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

So I, like, I was in it, and I did not want to not be in it, because me being in it made me feel closer to Bob, and me feeling closer to him made me feel better because I was sad to think of moving on to where I didn't feel connected to him. Even today, four and a half years in, like, I enjoy getting sad and crying about it because it makes me feel connected to him.

[Raina Greenberg]

It's like spending time with him. Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

What helped you the most in the darkest times? Was it the people around you? Friends, family?

[Kelly Rizzo]

And you said therapy. Like, I never went to therapy because I had. And I know once again, most people are gonna be like, come on, that's not a substitute for therapy. But I want my middle sister. Kristen is a thousand times better than any therapist could be for me. Sure knows me better and really Knew what to say and knew what to do and knew, like, she slept in my bed with me for over a month right after. Like, she was there every minute of every day. And if it was not for her, if it was not for Bob's daughters, if it was not for some of Bob's best friends, I mean, I definitely would have not gotten through it. But I felt so supported and so held. And I think the ultimate thing and the really, the recipe for making sure that you can get through it is just to feel like you're around people who just get you and support you. That's the thing I say to anyone now who loses somebody. Instead of like, oh, you know, sending. Sending hugs and, you know, sending thoughts and prayer. Like I say, I just pray that you are surrounded by people who you feel that you're surrounded by all the love and support that you need right now.

[Ashley Hess]

I just said that to a friend. So a friend of mine in Atlanta lost her husband suddenly. And like, their story is. It's. I don't need to tell it today. It's like they were each other's person. Like, I could cry. I mean, just long road for them to finally kind of get married. And I'm not that close with her any anymore. I wasn't that close. We were friends in Atlanta, but I wasn't so close to her. And I just messaged her a couple times, and she was like, I don't want to live in a world that he. Where he's not here. And that's all I could say was, I hope I know her mom. I know her sister. I do know her other friends, like, in the same group. And that's all I could say was like, I just. I know you're being, like, loved and taken care of. Just from what I know of her friends and family, that's, like, the only thing I could think of, because that is what gets you through. Yeah, it's like the only thing. Like, it almost, like, metaphorically, like, fills the wounds, like, the love, the support, you know, fills the holes.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Like, so when my best friend just lost her husband, I remembered how important it was for me in the immediate aftermath of losing Bob was like, to have all of his friends over and our family, you know, anyone who was close to him. And by the way, I felt much more comforted being around people who loved Bob and who Bob loved, even if I didn't know them very well than my best friend of 35 years.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay, just people that you had the connection, like, you're spending time with Him. Right.

[Kelly Rizzo]

They needed to be connected to him for me to feel comforted.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Anyway, I just remember having like a home base. Our house where everyone was gathering that first week was so unbelievably helpful. And so when my friend's husband just passed, I remember like, she lives in a small one bedroom apartment. She had nowhere for, like, people to go. And so I. I like gave my house. I was like, here, like, this is your home base. Because I knew how important it was for her to be able to have all those people surrounding her. And so, you know, little things like that can be really helpful to people is like, make sure they have. If you're really close with them. I mean, obviously, if it's.

[Ashley Hess]

Of course.

[Kelly Rizzo]

But don't give a stranger your house.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm curious about the moment. I think this is. The overwhelming response from people was like, what about the moment when people sort of stop checking in? You know, everybody storms you, surrounds you, you for I don't know how long it was for you. Hopefully a long time, but, you know, a month or two goes by and people stop asking and you're like, I'm still riding these waves. I'm still experiencing it.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

And like, what was like that piece?

[Kelly Rizzo]

Like, that's a really good question because that's something that people have a big problem with. You know, so many people have reached out to me online saying, you know, like, maybe they didn't have a big family, you know, their husband wasn't beloved by the entire country. You know, where they're not getting a million people DMing them every day. And maybe they didn't, you know, they had a small circle and they've. So many people have said it's sad, like the, the well wishes have stopped and people stopped checking in. And I didn't have that as much because I had such a tight circle. And if I didn't feel like people were checking in, it almost didn't matter because I had my sisters and. Right. Like, who I would just harass, like all day. Like, if I was feeling sad, it's like. Like they're gonna have to deal with me, you know?

[Ashley Hess]

Right.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah. I'm glad you had that.

[Kelly Rizzo]

So I didn't feel it as much. And plus I was constantly having people still send me messages about how much they love Bob. So that was always very comforting. But it is truly a thing. And that unfortunately is also kind of part of it is that for most people who it's didn't affect their daily life. Like, life does go on and people Move on. And that's why as long as you still have like a tight knit community of people who are always thinking about your person, it's so helpful. And you know, mention the person even if it's a year later. Like, don't feel bad bringing up their name and saying like, hey, I was thinking about so and so today, you know, your husband, like, I was thinking about him today and you know, I just checking in to seeing, you know, see how you're doing. And that goes so far because it's not necessarily that people feel like they forgot about you. They don't want you to forget about their person. You know, they want to feel like their person's not forgotten that the person lives on.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And so they feel so sad if people, if they feel like people forgot about him.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

And they're.

[Raina Greenberg]

I, I understand and validate the anger that you must feel when people are like, everybody else's life has gone on. People get to, you know, walk their dogs and enjoy their day and go on dates. And I don't get to do that with my partner. And everyone else's life has sort of moved on.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And that's probably really hard to reconcile things online. And, you know, someone got married or someone got engaged and everyone's happy with their husband. And I'm like, I don't have a husband. And you. There is a little jealousy that can creep in sometimes. And then I, I got to this really weird place maybe like six months in where I'm like, no, I still have my husband. The love didn't go anywhere. He still loves me. Like, the love is still there. So he's kind of like my ghost husband. And so like I went through maybe a one or two month period where I was like, no, I still, I still have him. You know, like, I, I would talk to him and, and you know, feel like he was still supporting me and loving me. And then it got to a point I was like, okay, it's enough with the ghost husband. Like, I don't want to sound too creepy for too long, you know, at some point that's. Yeah, I don't ever get you through the day.

[Ashley Hess]

But I think people talk to that their loved ones lost. Like for sure. I want to say, I mean, we talk about just in life, the importance of building friendships and the community around you. Not everybody has a, a sister or even a sibling or not everyone has great relationships with their, with their family. And I feel for anyone who doesn't. But you can always build those friendships and your chosen family. And, you know, don't build the community just in case you lose your spouse. But, like, then for when you go through any hard times, that is why we have these people. You know, like, Raina's not my sister, but, like, if something like this happened, I would never have her sleep in the bed, but she would do it, and she would do it for a year. Like, I have the people and in addition to my family that would be there as long as I needed.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

Them in whatever capacity. And so we will all go through these hard times, and I hope nobody listening ever loses their partner. But if you are living a life where your partner is. Is. You're every. You're one and only person in your life, it's going to be a lot harder if something were to happen because the community's not there. Like, it's like, that's what got you through.

[Kelly Rizzo]

You know what I bet is going to happen now? Because as I said, I didn't really know any widows, especially young widows, until I became one. And then you know how it's like, oh, I hadn't thought about a red car today. I thought about a red car.

[Ashley Hess]

Now you see a million red cars

[Kelly Rizzo]

when I became a widow. Now all of a sudden, they're coming out of the woodwork like they're everywhere. And, like, I know so many, and I've become such good friends with so many, and now I hear all these stories from people, and I bet you got some questions from people. But now I. Once we put this out there, you're gonna have so many people be like, actually. And it might not even be a widow. It's like, I lost my high school sweetheart when we were in high school. He was 18 and killed in a car accident. You know, like, that happens, too, and where people still have to go through the loss of their future partner. And it's so much more common than we think and so much more common than I knew until I know.

[Ashley Hess]

I mean, we have a friend, and her. Her best friend, her husband died when we were in Greece, 2022. Yeah. And we were all there together. We were all getting ready to fly out, and she got the call that he had passed. Like her best friend, the love of her life. And her husband passed. She flew to Singapore. And I just never shook that. Like, I. We didn't know her personally, the friend, but I just knowing about their relationship and, you know, our friend, it was like there was always the four of them, and they couldn't believe it either. That was like they lost their best friend. Too. And I just saw her in. In Singapore on my honeymoon a couple months ago with her new partner. And it took her a long time to obviously get there. We're talking, like, four years. And went to drinks with her. Her and the new person she's dating. He was so wonderful. And, like, I remembered, like, well, that's 2022.

[Kelly Rizzo]

That's my time.

[Ashley Hess]

We were there the moment we heard your husband died, you know, and she's gotten through it and has found on the other side. Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

I want to ask you, because, you know, people are. People asked us a lot, like, what's helpful, what's not helpful? And you said you kept a journal and you have a grief journal, and you've very kindly.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Let's preface with I am not a good journal person. And my grief journal has, like, three pages written in it. So the story here is, I apparently wrote in this a few weeks after Bob passed, and I had zero recollection of this. And the other day, I was cleaning out a drawer, and I saw this, and I was like, oh, because it says it's called the grief journal. And I was like, oh, I should write in. And then I go through. I was like, I wrote in this. I did not remember. Remember I wrote in it. And now I'm so grateful. And once again, there's, like, six pages written in it. But I'm so grateful even for every little letter that I put in here, because it is really helpful. And so I did have a page that I. I did a solo episode of my podcast today about this. I don't normally carry this around in my personal. That would be insane.

[Raina Greenberg]

You brought it for us?

[Kelly Rizzo]

Guys, here's my grief journal from four and a half years ago. So. Okay. February 5, 2022.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Not to say. Not say, I'm so sorry. I mean, that's pretty innocuous. But apparently that was triggering.

[Ashley Hess]

I didn't like that at the time.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah, these are things that were kind of triggering.

[Raina Greenberg]

Did it just feel like those words just weren't big enough to. To, like, qualify what you were going through?

[Kelly Rizzo]

A big thing for me was I hated feeling pity.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I didn't like feeling pitied. And some people want that. Some people want all the pity. It's like the same, you know, if you are going to the hospital and you post Facebook that you're at the hospital, like that type of thing.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah, the sympathy trap. Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Right. But for some reason, I. I never realized that I would be so adverse and so triggered by feeling pitied.

[Ashley Hess]

Oh, interesting.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Okay, so My next one is my heart breaks for you.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I hated that. Okay. Because it felt like, oh, you poor thing. My heart break breaks for you. Like, it just felt very pitied and I, like, I don't want people to be. I kind of wanted people to be sad with me, but not for me. If that made sense.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

How are you? Tough.

[Raina Greenberg]

Never asked.

[Kelly Rizzo]

So here's the thing.

[Ashley Hess]

Here's.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Here's why.

[Raina Greenberg]

How are you?

[Kelly Rizzo]

Here's why that was triggering. Because I felt that when people said, how are you? It gave me homework and my brain was not capable of homework. It felt like I was like, how are you? Over text. Let me say that over the phone. Fine. But over text. Because I felt like now I have

[Ashley Hess]

to write in I'm with you. I've tried to do that. Like, how in the throes of someone dealing with something.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Right. So I promise there's takeaways from this.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

So it's not like. And don't ever ask anyone, how are you? Bye.

[Raina Greenberg]

And then like, also like, when you're in it and you're like, I feel so much rage and pain. Whatever. You feel like nothing's wrong. It's like, I don't. This is not helping me right now.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I think it's because when you're in early grief, you have so much administrative work to do as well. Like, I fortunately didn't have to take care of any funeral stuff. That was handled for me, thank God, because I would not have been able. But, you know, there's so much crap you have to do. And then when somebody texts you, how are you? I can't just ignore it. I don't want to not get back to them. So I'm like, well, I have to come up with something. I don't want to just be like, fine or not good. So I was trying to give thoughtful responses to each person because I'm a people pleaser and I felt like it was homework to get that question in a text.

[Raina Greenberg]

Sometimes just when I'm really just drained. Sending the first test is exhausting to me because I'm like, this will be yet another text, text and more conversation. And it's well intentioned, but still also

[Ashley Hess]

like, I don't know. I don't know the answer. Right. I don't know. I don't know. Like, I think it's a better to be like, I'm thinking about you. I'm here if you need to talk.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And. And then thinking of you.

[Ashley Hess]

Oh, no. Oh.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And sending love and hugs. Which is funny because I I say these things to people now.

[Ashley Hess]

We all say these things. I think people are like, oh, I just said that.

[Kelly Rizzo]

No. And. And you can't be blamed for saying something nice to somebody who's great, like, because you don't know how you're going to take it, and you don't know how that person's taking it. There are so many of these that I've had people say to me. Like, oh, I liked when people asked me that. I. I liked when people said, how are you? Because people stopped asking. So I like when people say that.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, yeah, exactly.

[Kelly Rizzo]

This was my specific thing. However, you know, I have had other people be like, oh, I know.

[Ashley Hess]

I hated that.

[Kelly Rizzo]

But so do say, okay, want to talk?

[Ashley Hess]

Talk.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Like, hey, do you want to talk? Like, versus just saying, how are you? Or what did you do today? To me, that was so much more helpful. Or like, when can I come see you? Or was today better or was today worse? Like, asking something specific.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Was so helpful to me, you know, what did you do today? How was your day today?

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Because then I'm like, oh, I went to the dry cleaners and then I tried to go on a walk, you know, versus how are you feeling? Or how are you? It just felt like, right. Like I had to come up with an essay on my emotions, and every day was different. I was like, I'm too tired to go, you know, but if it's like, oh, what did you do today? And then it shows that they're thinking of you and they're asking you something

[Ashley Hess]

specific, I like that.

[Kelly Rizzo]

So to me, that was really helpful. So this is What I wrote 4 1/2 years ago.

[Raina Greenberg]

I'm glad that you have it. And who knows, like, when you're just in the throes of pain and grief and every day is a different feeling, who knows what's going to make you feel.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah. And once again, I'm. I'm guilty of doing all these things before and since going through it myself. So I never want anyone to feel bad for doing it, but just. It's more about understanding maybe why some of these things might be.

[Ashley Hess]

Totally. And the pity thing makes sense. I mean, I. You've, like, explained why they triggered you in some way. And I think this stuff weighs on me so heavily. Like, even just talking to my friend last week, like, the words, every word, I'm like, I don't want to say the wrong thing. And I always go back and forth with, I can't imagine what you're going through because I can't understand.

[Raina Greenberg]

I can't understand losing your partner.

[Ashley Hess]

I can't.

[Raina Greenberg]

Somebody's saying, like, I can't imagine you're going through. They mean to validate. Like, I know this is bigger than something I felt.

[Kelly Rizzo]

You know Rabbi Steve Leiter? Do you guys know him? He's a big, like, media rabbi, but he's wonderful. He was Bob. He was the rabbi at Bob's funeral. But he is just a genius. He's written a lot of books about grief.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And he said, tiny, little thoughtful tweak to that is to say, I can only imagine what you're going through instead of, I can't imagine because, like, you can imagine it, but, like, I can only imagine.

[Raina Greenberg]

I can only versus Yeah, I can only imagine.

[Ashley Hess]

I like that because, like, if she said to me, my friend said, I don't want to live in a world without him, like, I could say, I understand. But what I mean is, I understand how you feel that way. Because I can't imagine my life without my husband. Like, no, I don't understand what's like

[Kelly Rizzo]

before I send a text, what's worse than sending that wrong text? Wrong text is nothing. And another thing that's really helpful that I experienced and I know is happening because I'm experiencing with my best friend now, is after losing Bob, Especially in like the first several months, six months, you know, when I would have just bouts of hysterical crying, like every. Every single night. Nights were worse for me. Usually it's mornings are worse for a lot of people.

[Ashley Hess]

Oh, really?

[Kelly Rizzo]

But the nights were way worse for me. Like when I'd get in bed at night, that's when I would just uncontrollably sob. And thankfully my sister was there a lot of the time. But it got to the point when my sister wasn't living with me anymore. And I would call her because I was like, I just want somebody to hear me cry. And she would try to, like, fix it at first. And she'd be like, well, you know, maybe you should think about this. Or, you know, think about, like, yeah, but let's think about it this way. And I was like, no, no, I don't want you to say anything. I don't want you to do any. Like, you can't fix it. Just listen to me cry. And like my other sister, she didn't really get that. It took a while for her to sure to get that. And I was like, I know your instinct is to try to give advice or be helpful. I was like, but there is nothing that can help. I just Want somebody listening to crying, right? Like, like, not even listen to me talk, just listen to me cry.

[Raina Greenberg]

Were there people that were like, but at least you're young, but at least you have money or you have community. I don't know much money. But, like, was there people that were like, you know, I think the absolute wrong thing.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

I think people are sort of wanting to compare grief. Like, but at least, you know, you're so young, you could find someone else. But that's not everybody's story. Like, did you. Did people want to kind of comfort you with those things? And you were like, this isn't that helpful right now?

[Kelly Rizzo]

I think, like, I also wasn't as sensitive. So funny. I was so sensitive to the most innocuous things, like, how are you? But when somebody would say, like, everything happens for a reason, or most people hate that stuff, that's in a chill down my spine. Right.

[Raina Greenberg]

That did not bother you.

[Ashley Hess]

It didn't bother you?

[Kelly Rizzo]

Certain things like, that didn't bother me as much. Or like, you'll find somebody else. When I was like, well, I. I hope so one day. You know, Like, I wasn't like, don't even talk about that right now. Or some people. You can't even mention it. Yeah, right.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

But real quick, back to the crying thing. Just because I think this might be really helpful to some people is so now with my best friend who's going through it, she knows that if she comes over to my house or if she calls me and she just wants to cry, like, I'm not. I'm not weird about it. I'm not like, oh, let me. Let me soothe you. Or let me, like, say something helpful. I'm just like, yeah, sucks. Yeah, this sucks. Cry, cry.

[Raina Greenberg]

Cry.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Just cry. And she'll call me sometimes. She's like, I just need to cry. I'm like, okay.

[Ashley Hess]

And one question we had for you, which we wanted to ask, is, is there any time when I outreach is unwanted because you're, like, doing good and you didn't want to really want to think about it. Like, we were curious about this, like, because checking in, it's like we were talking about our friend who's going through something right now, and we were like, we don't want to bring it up if she's having a good day.

[Raina Greenberg]

Right.

[Kelly Rizzo]

You know, and that is so perfect that you brought that up. And it's so true. Because I never really had. I mean, for months and months, I never had a good day, but I would have good hours.

[Ashley Hess]

Right.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And there would Be some times and. But see God, like they meant well.

[Ashley Hess]

Of course.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Everyone means so well. And that's why no one should ever feel bad if they, oh, I said the wrong thing. I upset them in some way. Because anyone grieving is just a raw, exposed nerve nerve and they're so sensitive that you can't be expected. Like, okay, today I drank a sip of water in front of her and it freaked her out. Like you can't be expected to know everything that's going to trigger that person each day because they don't even know.

[Ashley Hess]

There's no point.

[Kelly Rizzo]

As you were saying, there were some times that I was having like a good hour and I'm focused on something else. Maybe I'm distracted and I'm not thinking about, you know, the first, let's say several months. There wasn't an hour really that went by. But maybe I'm having a good 10 minutes. I'm having 10 minutes where I'm not crying and thinking about Bob in that moment or like I'm distracted doing something and cleaning my closet, whatever it is. And then somebody texts me and goes, oh, I just, I'm, I'm just so sad for you. And are you feeling whatever it is? But it was something that would kind of bring me down and then make me. And I'm like, oh, like I, like I just, I had 10 minutes where I was doing well. But it's like they can't be blamed

[Raina Greenberg]

for their well intentioned too, you know,

[Ashley Hess]

maybe there's a language tweak there. I don't know. Just like thinking about you here. If you want to talk, it still reminds you of it.

[Kelly Rizzo]

But like I think it, it at some point and once again, like, let's not give the grieving person work. But maybe something I could have done if I'm like, hey, I'm having a good moment right now. I'm gonna put my phone on do not disturb. So that way I'm not seeing those messages in that point, you know, or during that, during that time or, you know, it's like, it's okay. As I said, the people pleaser and me wanted to get back to everyone right away and needed to respond to everybody all the time. But you don't have to.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay, totally.

[Kelly Rizzo]

You don't have to. And another thing that's really helpful that I've learned from people and now I do is I'll send somebody a message and I'll say, don't respond to this. Like it's the first thing I say all the time.

[Raina Greenberg]

I Don't want people to feel like I've given them homework. Right. You know, just know that I'm around. Don't.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Do not respond to this. I love you, I'm thinking of you, whatever the message is. And like, please don't respond to this. And then it just takes the pressure off them.

[Raina Greenberg]

They're like.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And then a lot of times they do anyway and they want to.

[Raina Greenberg]

That's appreciative. Okay. I want to ask you about the timeline because I think that, like, grief is not linear. You know, it's not like I should be here at this point. And I think a lot of people echo the sentiment that, like, there's not like a day where the grief ends. It just sort of changes shape. But in terms of moving on, was there pressure that was like. People were like, kelly, it's been three months. It's been six months. It's time to hit these milestones of feeling better. Or was that not your experience? Like, what was the experience of feeling pressure?

[Kelly Rizzo]

I think I was doing pretty well in terms of, like, I had to move out of our house after three months. And so that was a big undertaking and it was really, really hard. But I got through it and I did it. And I was, like, really proud of myself that I did it, you know, So a lot of things like that that were certain milestones that I was hitting, but I kind of put on myself that I said, okay, in terms of dating or moving forward. I'm like, I'm not even gonna think about that for one year. Like, that's societally. That's kind of a cultural. I don't want to say what's like, appropriate or not appropriate, but in a sense, anything before a year might be seen as a little too soon. And then after a year, it's a little bit more acceptable.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And I know that, as I said, there are no rules. And of course, don't feel bad if you meet somebody in month 11. You know, some people might be judgmental, but know that, like, you're not doing anything wrong. But I knew that I wouldn't think about that for a year. And then I remember it was on the one year anniversary of Bob passing on January 9, 2023. And I had. I'm sorry if this is name droppy, but at my house, I had Jeff Ross and John Mayer over and Bob's nephew Adam, and the three of them, it's me on one side of the couch and the three of them sitting on the other couch. And then Jeff Ross goes, Kel Elephant in the room. We gotta talk about it. When you gonna start dating again? And I was like, jeff, like, I mean, I'm not really ready just yet.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And John's like, you know what? Whenever you're ready, he's like, but, you know, it's like, it's. It's okay if you want to get back out there. Like, like it's okay. And. And Adam, of course, is probably, like, thinking of how Bob would think, like, if she ever moves on. How could she? How dare she? And I was like, well, I don't want to talk about this in front of Adam. Almost, I feel like, weird, but. And then Jeff goes, all right, fine. But if we get to the two year mark and you're not, then something's wrong. And, like, we're gonna have to talk again. I was like, okay, this is like

[Raina Greenberg]

the John Mulaney intervention story. It's just more famous people keep coming up.

[Ashley Hess]

Exactly.

[Kelly Rizzo]

So then Tom Hanks walks in and

[Ashley Hess]

I was like, exactly.

[Kelly Rizzo]

You know, so anyway, I was like, okay. But it was good to know that here, two of his best friends, I had their blessing.

[Raina Greenberg]

Right?

[Kelly Rizzo]

And then two months after that, so now 14 months later or so, you know, I started to feel a little lonely. And then you start to feel, you know, after over a year of, like, not having a hug or a kiss or feeling lonely, I'm like, oh, I don't want to feel like this frumpy old widow. Like, I want, you know, I. You start to feel, like, not like young and hot anymore. And I'm like, I want to feel alive again. Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

Desired, all the things.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah. Yeah. You start to feel. I'm like, oh, my God. Like, no one's looked at me. Because then. Because you're off limits. No one's certainly gonna. I mean, not that I was even putting that energy out there, but you start to feel kind of invisible.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And you start to feel like, no. Like, not only are you. Is no one looking at you in that way, but you're also, like, off limits because, well, you're the widow.

[Ashley Hess]

Right.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Certainly nobody wants to be the one who is gonna make a move and then have it be. You're not ready.

[Raina Greenberg]

Right.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

You know, but I was starting to feel, like, a little lonely and a little sad and a little like, well, it might be nice to get a coffee with somebody. Like, I'm not ready to date date yet, but maybe a hike or coffee. And I sat down with Bob's daughters and I said just that. Like, I'm starting to.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Feel a little lonely. And they're like, kelly, like, we want you to be happy. And I said, you know, I just want. I said, they're like, well, you don't need our permission. I go, I know I don't need your permission, but I want your blessing.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

You know? And they're like, of course. We're like, our dad would want you to be happy. I was like, no, he wouldn't.

[Raina Greenberg]

You're like, if you know him at all.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I was like, no, he would not that. And then that's when I had to start distinguishing. I've said this a million times, but between, like, earthly Bob and Heavenly Bob, like, earthly Bob, be like, I knew you never loved me. How could you? How dare you? You know? But then Heavenly Bob would be like, I want you to be happy.

[Raina Greenberg]

I understand the guilt, though. It's like you're still a person with needs and desires and wants to be seen and wanting that permission from his daughters. I mean, I really validate, like, wanting that. And of course they want you to be happy, but, like, there's probably a lot of guilt that comes with it.

[Kelly Rizzo]

So much guilt. So complicated still to this day. And then 18 months after is when I met Brecken, and Brecken and I. It's been three years now we've been together. He was the first person I dated.

[Raina Greenberg]

Okay.

[Ashley Hess]

Oh, my goodness. That's surprising because you think there might need to be a rebound.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I went on, like, two Simu. Dates, you know, like two kind of basic. Kind of a cocktail for about 45 minutes.

[Raina Greenberg]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And they were fine. They were nice. Nice. It was nice to feel like to get dressed up and to go out, and they were lovely experiences. Thank God that it wasn't something, like, turned me off today forever. But there was no, you know, no follow up.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

But then I met Bracken. And, like, from our first date, I mean, we didn't say this to each other because you, you know, weren't insane, but we were like, this is kind of it. I was like, I don't want to.

[Ashley Hess]

Wow.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Go out with anyone else. And he was thinking the same thing. Even though. Took us a while to process that. And we really paced it and we took it very, very slow. I was actually just listening to a dating episode. You guys did a couple episodes back, and the expert you had on was saying how it's so important to pace things.

[Ashley Hess]

Right.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And that's something that all at once. Yeah, we really did that really well. And there was no love bombing, and it was Just very, very well paced, which he knew I needed. And, you know, I. I know how lucky I got that, like, first one right out of the gate, you know, three years down the road. But I still feel that guilt. I'll say things to him like, I'm so happy. I love you so much. You make me so, like, you know, you say things in, you know, superlatives, like, it's the happiest I've ever been.

[Ashley Hess]

And then I'm like, I. I have not experienced this personally, but I can, like, feel what you're saying. Yeah. Yeah. And then how was he? Like, do you guys talk about Bob,

[Kelly Rizzo]

like, non stop all the time? He is so cool with it. Well, that was the reason why I think it's worked out is like, he kind of knew what he was getting into. Clearly. I was talking about Bob publicly all the time.

[Raina Greenberg]

Well, that must be hard to feel like I'm competing against this thing.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

You know, she doesn't want to be in this position.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Right. And he was just so confident and secure about it. He loves talking about Bob. He's always asked. He'll be like, oh, so when you used to come here with Bob, like, what was his favorite dish to order? You know, like, he was always asking about him, and he just never made it weird. And I mean, because he and Bob had a respect for each other. They. They weren't good friends, but they really liked each other.

[Ashley Hess]

Okay. They knew each other.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah. So we met through Seth Green, who is one of Bob's best friends. But Seth and Brecken were best friends since they were 17.

[Ashley Hess]

Those were such a part of our childhood too. Right.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I mean, I swear to God that me with, like, the 90s people, I did not intend for any of this. It just randomly happened. But Brecken was just so cool about it. It's not like he has expertise in dating widows. Like, I was his first.

[Ashley Hess]

Right?

[Kelly Rizzo]

Yeah. And he was just from day one so fantastic about it. Never made me feel weird about talking about Bob. Like, he's now gotten really close with Bob's daughters. He's friendly with Bob's ex wife, like, because Bob's ex wife is one of, you know, she and I are so close. And so he'll come to family events and she's there, and she'll always be like, where's Brecken? You know, it's. It is very special. And I know that it's maybe a little unique because not everyone has such a easy time, even with the late husband's family or, you Know if there's step family involved, especially. But, yeah, I've been very, very blessed to have such a nice transition into that world, because not. Not everyone does. And I think one thing that's so important, though, to look for is someone who just lets you still have, you know, your late spouse be a part of the conversation, and if they make you feel weird about it, like, that's a major red flag.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Raina Greenberg]

I mean, I'm just. I'm curious how you. How somebody would want to. And it sounds like he struck a balance between, like, just validating it and, like, I can understand that people would be intimidated by a deceased spouse that was like, a larger this is who she was gonna be with. And, you know, and this thing happened. How do I compare to this? How do I fit into this narrative? And it sounds like he just struck the right balance.

[Ashley Hess]

Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

And I think the important thing also is to know that both loves can coexist indefinitely, forever, because they're not going anywhere. But one doesn't take away the other, you know? So, like, my love for Brecken doesn't negate my love for Bob. They just exist at the same time and in the same space. And, like, my love for Bob's never diminished. But, like, that's what people think sometimes, is that, well, if you have the new one, then it kind of diminishes this one. And it's like, no, they can both coexist forever. And as long as you have somebody that kind of gives you that space, that's what's really important.

[Ashley Hess]

So I think that's a beautiful way to end it. Kelly, thank you so much. This was so wonderful. I'm so glad you came here and

[Raina Greenberg]

brought your journal and all of your truly, like, shared so much.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Happen to just be in my purse. But thank you so much. I'm so happy that we randomly met, like, a week ago. What a treat. And then that you guys had me on such a absolute honor and pleasure.

[Raina Greenberg]

Well, I think this will help a lot of people.

[Kelly Rizzo]

I'm so grateful for you. So thank you. And thanks for letting me talk about this topic that people think is not very fun. And it's hard, but if you're just open and real about it, it can make it a little easier.

[Ashley Hess]

And then when you're open about it, you also find your community. I mean, I think of, like, Heather McMahon, who has lost her father, and she just is always making jokes about the dead dad club, you know, and people are like, like, me, too, and, like, talking about it in that type of way. I feel like that's what Bob did. Yeah. Yeah.

[Kelly Rizzo]

You know, and so it's like I kind of learned from him. It's like he made light of it and it's okay to do that to, you know, you do what you got to do to get through.

[Ashley Hess]

Well, tell everybody where they can find you. Listen to your podcast, your Instagram, whatever you want to plug.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Podcast is comfort food. The, you know, comfort food with Kelly Rizzo and just Instagram at Kelly Rizzo.

[Ashley Hess]

Very easy. Okay, great. Okay.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Super easy.

[Raina Greenberg]

Well, thank you for everything and I'm sure this is really going to help a lot of people. Thank you for your candor.

[Ashley Hess]

And you guys can find us Girls Gotta Eat Dot com. Girls Gotta Eat podcast on Instagram and Tick tock. I am Ash Hess. Rain is Raina Jack Greenberg. Raina Greenberg.com for her tour tickets and you can watch full video on YouTube or Spotify. Subscribe share this episode with a friend and we will see you guys Thursday.

[Raina Greenberg]

Have a good week, guys.

[Kelly Rizzo]

Bye.