Alyson Stoner’s Memoir Semi-Well-Adjusted Despite Literally Everything

Summary

Glamorous Trash: A Celebrity Memoir Podcast - Episode Summary

Episode Title: Alyson Stoner’s Memoir Semi Well-Adjusted Despite Literally Everything

Release Date: August 12, 2025

Host: Chelsea Devantez
Guest: Tamara Yahia, Argentinian writer, comedian, former child star, and author of Cry for Me Argentina

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Introduction

In this emotionally charged episode of Glamorous Trash: A Celebrity Memoir Podcast, host Chelsea Devantez delves deep into Alyson Stoner's compelling memoir, Semi Well-Adjusted Despite Literally Everything. Joined by guest Tamara Yahia, author of her own memoir Cry for Me Argentina, the conversation navigates the turbulent waters of child stardom, trauma, and the arduous path to self-discovery and healing.

Overview of the Memoir

Chelsea introduces Alison Stoner, renowned for roles in Camp Rock, Cheaper by the Dozen, and Disney Channel shows. Stoner's memoir, published concurrently with the podcast episode, offers an unflinching look into the darker side of child stardom. Covering sensitive topics such as sexual assault, alcoholism, suicide, and eating disorders, the memoir paints a vivid picture of the relentless pressures faced by young stars in Hollywood.

Notable Quote:
"Please take care when listening and let's dive in." — Chelsea Devantez [00:50]

Child Stardom and Early Challenges

The discussion begins with the inception of Alison's career at the IMTA conference, where future child stars perform and vie for agents. Despite early successes, Alison grapples with intense self-criticism and insecurity from a tender age.

Notable Quote:
"I will continue to evolve and expand my understanding as I grow." — Alison Stoner [07:54]

Tamara relates her own experiences with child stardom, highlighting the universal challenges and the lack of effective interventions to support high-performing children in the industry.

Family Dynamics and Abuse

A significant portion of the memoir addresses Alison's turbulent family life. Following her parents' divorce, Alison's mother marries an abusive stepfather, John, whose alcoholism and violent tendencies wreak havoc on the household. The memoir underscores the absence of protective measures for child stars, exposing them to predators and neglect.

Notable Quote:
"I must get this right. I must get this right. I must get this right." — Alison Stoner [15:17]

Tamara shares her parallels with Alison's experiences, emphasizing the complexities of dealing with narcissistic parents and the long-term impact on emotional well-being.

Mental Health Struggles

As Alison navigates the demanding world of acting, she develops an eating disorder and anxiety, compounded by relentless career pressures. The memoir poignantly captures her descent into mental health struggles and the eventual realization that she needs help.

Notable Quote:
"I'm really hoping to show up as my full, genuine self today." — Alison Stoner [83:37]

Tamara discusses the debilitating nature of trauma and the challenges of healing, relating to Alison's journey of seeking therapy and self-acceptance.

Navigating Identity and Acceptance

A pivotal moment in the memoir is Alison's exploration of her sexuality amidst her deepening Christian faith. This internal conflict highlights the societal pressures and the struggle for self-acceptance within rigid belief systems.

Notable Quote:
"I felt increasingly out of place at church." — Alison Stoner [73:11]

Chelsea reflects on her own experiences with religion, drawing parallels to Alison's quest for authenticity and the barriers posed by external judgment.

Reconciliation and Healing

The memoir culminates in Alison reconnecting with her estranged father, shedding light on the complex dynamics that shaped her childhood. This reconciliation symbolizes a significant step towards healing and redefining her identity beyond the confines of Hollywood.

Notable Quote:
"I hope they listen." — Chelsea Devantez [31:02]

Tamara emphasizes the importance of setting boundaries with toxic family members, advocating for self-preservation and genuine connections.

Epilogue and Final Insights

Alison's journey concludes with reflections on neuroplasticity and the possibility of rewiring one's brain through trauma and recovery. The memoir leaves listeners with a poignant message about resilience and the ongoing process of self-healing.

Notable Quote:
"My deepest fear is my greatest opportunity to embrace life." — Alison Stoner [89:14]

Tamara encourages listeners to explore their own trauma and healing processes, highlighting the transformative power of vulnerability and self-awareness.

Conclusion

This episode of Glamorous Trash offers a profound exploration of Alison Stoner's Semi Well-Adjusted Despite Literally Everything, juxtaposed with Tamara Yahia's own experiences in Cry for Me Argentina. The conversation underscores the urgent need for better support systems for child stars and highlights the enduring strength of the human spirit in overcoming adversity.

Final Reflections:
Both memoirs serve as essential reads for anyone interested in the intersection of fame, trauma, and personal growth. Alison and Tamara's stories are not just cautionary tales but also beacons of hope for those navigating similar struggles.

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Additional Resources:

• Tamara Yahia's Book: Cry for Me Argentina: My Life as a Failed Child Star
• Follow Tamara Yahia: Instagram @Amarayahia_YAJI
• Podcast Partnership Brands:
  • Thrive Cosmetics – 20% off with code glamorous
  • EveryPlate – Special offer $1.99/meal with code glamorous199
  • Quince – Free shipping and 365-day returns

Connect with Us:
Join the conversation on Patreon's free tier to share your thoughts and participate in our ongoing book club discussions.

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Note: This summary omits non-content sections such as advertisements and introductory remarks to focus solely on the valuable discussions and insights shared during the episode.

Transcript

[Alison Stoner]

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[Chelsea Devantez]

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[Alison Stoner]

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[Chelsea Devantez]

See if you qualify for Medicare's extra help.

[Tamara Yahia]

It pays.

[Alison Stoner]

To find out, go to ssa.gov extrahelp paid for by the US Department of.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Health and Human Services.

[Alison Stoner]

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[Chelsea Devantez]

Welcome to Glamorous Trash. This is a podcast that book clubs, viral articles, celebrity memoirs, and trashy discourse to elevate your life. I'm your host, Chelsea Devantez. I'm a TV writer, comedian, filmmaker, author and sometimes I'm in stuff too. And today we are book clubbing. Semi well adjusted Despite Literally Everything. A memoir by actor, dancer and writer Alison Stoner, published the day this episode drops August 12, 2025. Hot off the presses. Now you might know Alison from their roles in the Camp Rock and Cheaper by the Dozen movies as well as countless Disney Channel shows. Or perhaps you might REM them as they are called in the book is, quote, the little white girl dancing in the Missy Elliott music videos. Work it and gossip, folks. Allison is also the host of the Dear Hollywood podcast where they opened up about their experience as a child star and wow, that is this memoir. This memoir is really, really good and really, really intense. I am still processing my thoughts about this book. You'll. You'll hear that in real time as we discuss it in the episode. I've been thinking about it every day since I finished this book and so I want to give you a trigger warning right now for sexual assault, alcoholism, suicide, eating disorders and just a lot of harrowing things that unfortunately come with growing up as a child star in Hollywood. So please take care when listening and let's dive in. I recognized this flurry of memoirs and documentaries focused on high performing children, former child performers, and now all of the kids who are posted online. And I realized no one had ever unpacked why they seem to have the same kind of downward spirals and challenges and no one focused on what we could do to intervene. My guest today is Tamara Yahia, an Argentinian writer, comedian, former child star and author of the memoir Cry for Me Argentina, which just came out last month. She has written for Clickhole, Funnier, and several TV series, including Acapulco this Fool, which shout out to that show. Just love it so much. And the upcoming Netflix animated series Strip Law. She lives in Los Angeles with her husband and her dog. Hi, Tam. Welcome to the podcast.

[Tamara Yahia]

Hello. What a treat this has been in an intense.

[Chelsea Devantez]

An intense treat and a really intense, layered treat. Okay, well, Tam, first off, you just wrote a memoir, and it ties into the story of how we first met, which I share on this podcast every time I can to talk about female meet cutes. And we knew of each other, but we first met at a little cocktail table at a wedding. And as we were sitting there having our little drinks, you said, I think I'm gonna write a memoir. And now here we are. You have. It is published, it is out, and it is also about becoming a child star. Yes.

[Tamara Yahia]

I'm like, whoa, I'm tripping. That's true. We met at this wedding. Mauley Culkin was at this wedding.

[Chelsea Devantez]

That's right. So was Adam Levine.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And many, many more.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, my God. I remember telling. I may have just started putting the proposal together. When I told you, you did, you.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Were like, I think I'm putting the proposal together. I know you love memoirs. Like, talk to me about memoirs, because I want to write one. So it's so cool to have you here and be like, you did it. You did it, bitch.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, my God, I did it. And I'm enjoying that I finished it. It was. I cannot even imagine what Alison went through because I. The subject matter of my memoir and theirs is very similar, obviously, But I was lucky enough to not to have failed at becoming a child star.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Isn't that a wild takeaway?

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And I. Your memoir is so great and so juicy. Everyone should pick it up and read it. Has. And I say this as a compliment. The craziest women you could ever read about or in this memoir, which is my favorite type of lady. And yeah, I was thinking about your memoir and your journey a lot, too, because this is going to. I'll take a quick tangent just to say that I always, and on this podcast many times have talked about how I wanted to get into this business when I was a child. And I asked my mom, I was like, how do you get in that box? Meaning the tv. And she was like, well, you would need an agent. And I was like, well, giddy up, bitch. Let's go. And truly, every day of my life I have been like, you made a mistake. You should have had me selling candy bars and grape juice. Like, I could have had money. We could have had money. And even when I read about Child Star books, I was like, we still missed out. I don't care. And finally, having read this memoir is the first time in my life where I said, okay, she made the right call.

[Tamara Yahia]

Totally.

[Chelsea Devantez]

She made the right call. Just let me get here at 18 and perish like a normal person.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, my God. Even for my story, I process things. That with Alison's book, that with mine, I hadn't processed of the trauma.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Wow. Okay.

[Tamara Yahia]

I'm really.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, I want to hear all of that when we get into it. Don't worry. Not right now. We can slowly parse our way through. But yeah, because you had a lot of this going on and you are still in the business. But the way Alison takes you through how their brain was working as a child, taking all of this in this book French braided my insides, then undid it real quickly and made it into a fishtail. Like, I am fucked up from this book.

[Tamara Yahia]

I was also reading this book while on 8 billion hormones because I was going through IVF and.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Wow.

[Tamara Yahia]

I cannot tell you. Like, there were entire days that I'm just going to show you the book. Like, please. The amount of, like, notes I have. I had to have therapy in the middle of it just to talk about the book.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Really? That is when you know it's a good book. When you take that memoir into your therapy. Yeah, this is this book. I'm still. Okay, let's just dive in because we've got to.

[Tamara Yahia]

Please.

[Chelsea Devantez]

We have to continue to unpack and do therapy on this podcast. Because I loved their author's note. I wrote I should have done this. They wrote. This book is based on true events as I experience them. The themes and insights explored reflect my perspective at the time of writing and will continue to evolve and expand as I do. I have also condensed some scenarios and recreated dialogue in good faith to tell my story. Heads up. The first three decades of life were eventful. Several potentially triggering topics will be covered, including child abuse, addiction, eating disorders, domestic violence, suicidality, mental illness, rape, gun violence, religious extremism, surgery, body modification, homophobia, death and grief, microaggressions, and general trauma. Please check in with yourself while reading. If anything feels unmanageable, pause and focus on grounding your mind and body into a place of safety.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah, that's the first page.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And it was such a great way to explain the writing of how you write a memoir in good faith and then also how the thing I really clicked with was I will continue to evolve and expand my understanding as I grow. Which you just wrote a memoir. It's like, you know, you're not done living right, and so your perspectives might shift. And yet in the moment of writing, you have to write down what you think and feel. And that's a tricky thing to navigate.

[Tamara Yahia]

Even the fact that, like, they gave a trigger warning. And I think back, I don't want to, like, make this about comparing, like, our books to this book, but I didn't give a trigger warning in my book because I didn't think there would was traumatic things about my life.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Oh. And this is why theme of the podcast. Everyone's got to write their own story because, wow, the things you see once you describe it to yourself. Yeah, wow.

[Tamara Yahia]

I thought it would just be funny, you know?

[Chelsea Devantez]

So, yeah, you were in the phase of like, isn't this hilarious? And everyone's like, are you okay? Yeah.

[Tamara Yahia]

Are you okay? Totally. And I feel like you can tell the moment. We'll get to it. I mean, I'm just so desperate to talk about it. When Allison realizes that they're not okay. And it's not till, like, way at.

[Chelsea Devantez]

The end, way at the end of the book, which is also what I love about this book, of living in it. It's really hard to explain. You're not reading it from a 10 year old. And yet the way Allison describes what was going on at 10 years old, you are really inside their brain. And actually, before we go any further, I want to clarify that Allison identifies as non binary. They use they them pronouns. However, everything written in the book uses she, her pronouns, and describes a lot about growing up as a girl. So as we go, we are going to be adjusting our pronouns, especially as we talk about the book, which is using she, her pronouns. So, okay, so the big inciting incident that starts off Alison's entire child star career is this thing called imta, which is a conference for future child stars to perform and compete and get graded and find agents. And the big thing is that Katie Holmes was discovered.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, my God.

[Chelsea Devantez]

At imta. And Alison's mom says, go stand by Katie's face. Mom snapped a quick photo before we walked over to the red carpet. Luminous flashes bounced off of golden dresses and sleek suits. For this singular moment, the contestants tasted their wildest dreams, fully realized the carpet was a radiant symbol of making it, whatever it meant to them. A path to stardom, to finding significance and belonging to Riches. What a tantalizing tease. Before floating into a gala were less than 5% of us would go home as winners.

[Tamara Yahia]

A terrifying place. Can you. I can just imagine the depression of this banquet hall.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. She's performing and she's doing well and she loves performing. But then when you go into her kid brain of like, I will be graded. I must be perfect. I am second place. I am third place. This girl is better than me. This girl is prettier than me. Was there like a swimsuit portion of this that I blacked out on? Yeah. I think she's like, model something and be like, here's my child body. Yes.

[Tamara Yahia]

And I feel like they knew at that point that that wasn't fun.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. She was like, I hate this.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

She had self conscious things about her body, by the way. So she is seven years old as this is happening. There's a little girl where she's like, that girl is prettier than me. But then she gets 11 callbacks. Like 11 agents want to meet her. So Alison's mom goes home and is like, hey, John, their horrible stepdad. We gotta go to Los Angeles for two months and make Alison a child star because Alison's got it. And so what were your thoughts on what is going to unfold to be an abusive home as they are in Los Angeles auditioning for two months to become a star at 7 years old?

[Tamara Yahia]

Well, Alison's mom's drinking problems are present from the get go in this book. And there was a moment at the beginning of the book after this conference when they go back home and Alison is like, they're at a restaurant, Alison and their mom. And Allison's counting like bubble gum under the table.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. She like lays her head on her lap as their mom drinks their life away. Yeah. And counts the gum.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes. And I wish I had written down like the little rhyme that Alison writes. It's the saddest thing. But it's like gum under the table forgotten. Like me, like something like that.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And.

[Tamara Yahia]

And I said, we are in a bad place here. I also have to tell you, I didn't know who Alison was before this book.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. Did you start looking them up and seeing all their things? Yes.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. I had the same experience where I knew of Allison, but I had to rewatch the Missy Elliott video and she provided a dozen. And then I was like, oh, my God. Yeah. We all grew up watching them.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes. And then the whole Oakwood apartments, which are these like furnished apartments where kids go during pilot season. There's an entire Movie called the Hollywood Cop Complex about that, which I really, really recommend. And you'll just get a peep into Alison's life at that beginning stage.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, that. That documentary is wild. The Oakwood Apartments are so famous for being this cauldron of. Of child stars that they're just trying to brew into making something. But also all these children who go and don't book something and have the worst three months of their life. And there's a lot of parents living in poverty just waiting for their kids to make it. It is. Yeah. I also recommend that documentary in the way that we're recommending something very sad and upsetting.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes, it's real depressing. But it's also, if you love crazy women like I think we do, the mothers in this documentary as Alison's mother are just a different type of person.

[Chelsea Devantez]

A different type of person would kill to play all of them in a movie. And Alison just starts booking and gets the child agent, Cindy. And when they are meeting Cindy in the office, they wrote this. I peeked at the framed family photos stacked proudly on the corner of her desk. There was a sentimental picture of her holding a newborn, her eyes brimming with affection. I bet she's a nice mom. When we stood to leave, I shyly asked, is that your baby? Cindy swelled with pride. That's Jeremy, my youngest client. He just wrapped General Hospital.

[Tamara Yahia]

I screamed during this part. I have 10 exclamation points next to that paragraph.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, it's unbelievable. So Alison immediately starts booking and is doing really well because they are a child who wants to get things correct. They love to study, they're parentified, they're taking care of their mom. And so when Allison is succeeding, all the adults are like, oh, they are so talented. But Alison is just a child being like, I must get this right. I must get this right. I must get this right. And hears horrible things told to them that I realized. Like this business fucks me up on a daily basis. And I'm a grown woman, right. No seven year old should ever have to hear any of the things that are hard for me to hear all the time.

[Tamara Yahia]

And on top of it, it's a tragedy to me that Alison loved to dance, love to sing. Adults will take a genuine. And this was done to me too, a genuine passion that a child has and shit all over it by putting their failed dreams on it and.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And monetizing.

[Tamara Yahia]

And monetizing and sexualizing.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And sexualizing. And you're getting a grade or money for the family as you try and do this thing that once brought you joy.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And Alison isn't like their mom does not protect them from anything. This quote so Cindy says to Allison, Ali Rae's skin is tan, which helps her pass as ethnically ambiguous. Cindy added, I'm submitting her to play Salma Hayek's daughter this week. When they ask if English is her first or second language, have her say she can learn Spanish quickly.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh my God.

[Chelsea Devantez]

But don't let her get any darker or she won't fit main roles. At the time, the majority of lead characters were given to white actors. Diversity went about as far as hair color.

[Tamara Yahia]

And then Allison started going to the beach with turtlenecks on and would turn.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Down activities because they weren't allowed to be outside and quote, get darker.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yep.

[Chelsea Devantez]

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[Tamara Yahia]

Like, at this point, they're what, like 8 years old? So another thing that got me about. So we're in the like, grooming section, right? Of like, they're training Allison also. They have gotten further than 95% of child performers at this point, right?

[Chelsea Devantez]

Like, they're doing. They booked like three pilots immediately and they were like, they're gonna make it. We're rich. And then all three of them didn't go, oh, God.

[Tamara Yahia]

Which got the devastation. There is a moment where they describe the sensation, and I can remember this, of watching the phone, waiting for that phone call from the agent to know if they got picked or not. And no child should ever have to deal with this kind of desperation.

[Chelsea Devantez]

No 30 year old Chelsea should have to deal with this.

[Tamara Yahia]

I can't imagine.

[Chelsea Devantez]

I think that's what really got me. Like, I really went. And you were sitting with Alison, eight years old, waiting to find out if they are a good person or bad person based on this phone call.

[Tamara Yahia]

Right? And then also taking classes, which this part really got me, where acting classes where Alison's taught to cry on command. And what they teach is basically, what's the saddest thing you could think of? And Allison thinks of my dad. I don't remember if it's dying or abandoning us or what.

[Chelsea Devantez]

We'll get into it in a second. But Allison's mom and dad have divorced and they stop hearing from their dad because they'll later find out that it was Allison's mom that just like made him stop coming around. But in this moment, as a child they're like, think of something sad. And Allison just thinks of the loss of my dad. Their dad. Yeah.

[Tamara Yahia]

And then manages to shed a tear and then says, it was like pain with a prize.

[Chelsea Devantez]

I underlined that too. And that that's how your child brain processes an acting exercise. Like tap into all this pain that you already have, but you, like, get treats and adults like you and you have worth and like you're doing something good for the family.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

So Alison is such a good dancer and also really tries hard because they're being groomed to try hard, which is what gets them the role in this Missy Elliott video. Because the joke of it is this very serious white kid, you know, in little pigtails doing these hardcore dance moves that Allison doesn't even know what they're dancing to. But Allison's taking it so seriously and their face is so serious that, like, that's why I think the music video works. That's. That's what they saw in casting. And Alison becomes famous off of that as, quote, the little white girl in the Missy Elliott video, which everyone shouts.

[Tamara Yahia]

At Alison and starts getting recognized at the supermarket and then asked to do the dance wherever they are the time. Yeah.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And Alison's mom says, don't be rude. Do the dance. Alison wrote this quote, be grateful, Al. We don't want you to become a stuck up diva. Mom admonished, I never wanted to be a diva. I wanted to be a good person. I had a professional and personal reputation to protect. We needed a public protocol. So mom and I ironed out a system. Whenever I left the house, I would always smile. Always. It didn't matter how I felt. Once the door opened, I was on. Managing fandom was similar to being a 247 customer service representative, where the customer's always right. I had to create a personalized and positive experience and remain unflappable no matter what outlandish requests exited anyone's mouth. So also being groomed to be manipulated and assaulted by any adult you ever meet, ever. Because Allison is being taught, whatever anyone asks of you, you need to do it or you are a rude diva.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes. And at the beginning, Allison, you can see the change, right, of wanting to do this and being excited to be recognized. And I think that's why this book is so good, because you. You travel with them in the state of mind, from wanting to please and be excited to. Well, I was in a bad mood today, and maybe I didn't wanna do the dance for a random man. Like, for a random older man.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. And I think also, you know, they're taught you are worthwhile if you book a part, if you do a good audition, if you're nice to someone. And Alison overheard, when they were younger, their dad and mom talking about how they didn't wanna have a third child. And Alison was a m. So Allison is always like, I will be the best mistake ever. I'll make sure you don't regret having me. Which also makes them find their worth in all of these, like, acting things. They wrote on top of regular hazards. Crew members didn't receive any preparatory training on how to work with kids. Not the director telling me to cry harder. Not the wardrobe assistants undressing me during quick changes. Not the audio engineers placing mic packs down my pants or pressing tape onto my chest with their bare hands. Not my adult classmates discussing their sex lives between takes. At the time, they were assured, their parents were assured by studios that Screen Actors Guild and California labor laws had ample protections in place for child welfare. But as it turned out, there were many loopholes. Unbeknownst to us, my own employers at Disney and Nickelodeon forwent or worse, disregarded background checks that permitted registered sex offenders to be my colleagues.

[Tamara Yahia]

So there's no protection at work, there's no protection at home?

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, yeah. And there's no protection on daily errands. Did you experience this as well?

[Tamara Yahia]

No, I. I was never famous, you know, so I didn't.

[Chelsea Devantez]

But still, like, on anything you did, did you feel protected when you were performing?

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, my God, no. No, no, no, no. Zero protection on top of that. I mean, and I write about a lot of, like, you know, the men looking up my skirt when I was 11 years old. And then a creep coming and burning me with a cigare my own house. My dad saying things like, ah, those guys, they wanted to fuck her. And like, I'm 10 years old and I just sang, you know, an Ace of Bass song. I didn't know that men may have wanted to fuck me until my own dad said it.

[Chelsea Devantez]

So.

[Tamara Yahia]

No.

[Chelsea Devantez]

But again, didn't know there was trauma in there, Tam.

[Tamara Yahia]

No, didn't.

[Chelsea Devantez]

You know? And this is perfect because this is exactly how trauma works, right? You really are. Trauma turns you into. I'm gonna, for lack of a better word, a superhero. Trauma turns you into an. I'm gonna say, an incredible person. You show up, you get things done. You have personality. Oh, you're so strong. You make it through so many things. And it's because for most of the trauma, it doesn't let you see what has happened. To you. And that is what has made you so strong. And then when you finally do look at it, you're like, no. How am I gonna live?

[Tamara Yahia]

No. And when it hits you, it's like a. A bucket of ice water. It's.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. And you just did that through this memoir. How are you doing right now?

[Tamara Yahia]

I'm 41. Like, you know.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, I'm doing terribly.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Thank you for coming on and being honest about it. Yeah.

[Tamara Yahia]

I mean, I'm doing terrible. And because you also. I think this is a mechanism. Right? You think, like, okay, well, I. Fine. I had trauma. I wrote about it, I processed it, and, like, now I heal. But it doesn't work like that. You don't just heal because you suddenly expressed it. So it's just having patience with yourself and grace and kindness. I'm in that phase right now.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. I think that's beautifully said of, like, writing it is part of the healing. Rereading it to yourself, part of the healing. Being able to share it, part of the healing. And then. Yeah, I've actually find. And I'm curious how Allison is doing with it. And I'm curious what you just said, how you're doing with it. I find this part of the healing process to be equally as hard as the other parts, which is fucking annoying, where you just kind of have to sit in the piece of, like, I made it through and sort of, now what? And you don't kind of have that crazy trauma engine stirring you, but it is still there.

[Tamara Yahia]

Well, and as reviews come in and people start judging your life and your trauma, and I. You know, it's. As I read Alison's book, it's like, I kept thinking, like, I hope every review is wonderful. I hope everyone tells them they're amazing for putting this down, but it's not gonna be the case.

[Chelsea Devantez]

No. But I hope. I hope. I hope for them and for you what I could not do for myself, which is that you pay attention to the voices that matter most, which are so appreciative of your books and your words. Because, I mean, anytime you share a story like that, it changes lives. I think Alison's story is going to. God, it better fucking change the world. So. So when they are a child, they come up with something called the inner publicist. Now, we've heard RuPaul talk about the inner saboteur. The inner publicist is the way Alison goes through the checks and balances of the day and prepares to not make mistakes and prepares things to say in public and private and in press. Tours because they're now doing Cheaper by the Dozen. They have to talk about the movie and they talk with 50 reporters a day. And Allison is 11 and playing a 13 year old when they're in Cheaper by the Dozen. And so the reporters will be like, you know, what advice do you have for girls who just get their first period? And Allison's like, I haven't gotten my own period and I don't know what to say. And so they always have this inner publicist running constantly of how to be a good person and how to say the right thing as a child.

[Tamara Yahia]

That question alone, wow.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Truly. How dare you. So let's get into their family life. So basically, Alison's mom divorced Allison's dad and within like six months was married to their boss, John. John had been the boss of both of them. And John had money and John has jowls. We know that. And John is really hitting the stereotype of what I call stepdad energy on this podcast where you're just the worst little captain devilman who's now in charge of a home and a family and wreaks havoc while being drunk out of his mind. So Allison's mom and John, there's just a lot of alcoholism, there's a lot of drinking. Alison talks about how there's like three bottles of wine a night going down and then used as props to throw at each other. And they wrote this. John was outnumbered by us because Alison has two sisters, but we were outpowered by him. His retaliation knew no bounds. If mom fought back, he might hurt us all. She collapsed under his control and spit out a warning with her waning coherence. Don't call anyone, girls. Every family has problems. Go to your rooms. And he had just thrown her mom against the wall. Shaken, I slowly backed away and ran upstairs. Corey, Allison's sister, came out with suitcases in hand and shushed me. Where are you going? I whispered anxiously away. Corey sneaked down the back stairs and took off with someone waiting in a car. In a year she'd get her license and leave for months, opting to live in her car over another night of John's horror. And then later wrote, john claims that my mom was his trophy wife and abandoned him for her nine year old's rising stardom, which positioned him and me at irreconcilable odds. His self esteem deteriorated into sullenness and rage. Then came delusions and paranoia, accusing mom of infidelity and as I'd learned years later, forcing her to fulfill sexual acts as repentance.

[Tamara Yahia]

This man was a narcissist.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yes.

[Tamara Yahia]

And there's double narcissism. Cause the mother was also a narcissist.

[Chelsea Devantez]

He was the aggressor.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And Allison's mom wouldn't act out. And so I think Allison didn't know that their mom was also a narcissist for a long time.

[Tamara Yahia]

Totally. And there's. I mean, John is just the worst person ever. But I really related to Alison's relationship with their mom. I. I have a mom that's very similar. Narcissist. And also kind of living vicariously through their child and also having to take care of your mother. There's a part I have highlighted here that's I tried to interpret what was happening on my mom's expressions. Is mom happy? Is mom stressed? Should I find Mom's Merlot? And she's like, 10 years old. Not even 10 years old. So there was really no one taking care of Alison. I hope Alison listens to this.

[Chelsea Devantez]

If it's good for Allison, I hope they listen. And if not, I hope they're on a beach. Oh, I want to read this. It goes along with what you're saying. So, again, Alison has two sisters who are older. Corey and Jamie experienced a wholly different mom, one they felt was absent and vindictive. While I could do no wrong, my sisters could do no right. Accomplishments were minimized, misbehavior was punished and dangled in front of me as an example of what not to become. Corey navigated the stumbling blocks of teenhood. Peer pressure with drugs and partying, a violent boyfriend, body image issues, first summer jobs without parental support. Her promising academic life was derailed by addiction, anorexia, and homelessness. Jamie, who vehemently rejected the move to California from the beginning, pleaded to return to Toledo to live with dad, where she could thrive in a community and position herself for athletic recruitment funnels. I was so busy with work, I hardly saw my sisters or spent quality time with them. I didn't know what they did, how they felt, or where they went. They had no clue about my life except for projects that aired on television. The dysfunction and lack of emotional intimacy in our house further weakened our bond and trust. With mom drunk, John unhinged, and dad mia, we girls split off like three independent islands to form our own survival strategies. Oh. Which I think is. I'm also, like, really trying not to, like, bring personal experience so hard. But I think what is so fascinating is when certain siblings are parentified and have to become the parent, and when certain siblings get a Different version of the mom or a parent. You all grew up under the same household that have different perceptions of what went on. And I loved how Allison wrote about how they split off on islands to form different survival strategies. And when you have a different survival strategy, you're gonna have a different perception of what is happening. Cause you're all surviving it differently.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And we will come back to what happens with her mom and I think answer the question of how could so many bad things happen and why was no one taking care of you? But what first happens is that things get horrifically violent. John will often, like, cut off their landline so they can't call the police and take the keys away. And other abusive behavior. And one night Allison breaks the code of don't tell anyone, we're struggling. And runs over to a neighbors and says, call the cops, we need help. And John is taken from the house. There's a restraining order put on him. He of course, just returns home the next day. Immediately.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Gathers his things. And the way they write about it is they're like, you know, after that, John is gone, but he and Allison's mom are married for like the next 10 years. And he still financially, like supports them.

[Tamara Yahia]

Maybe.

[Chelsea Devantez]

It's very. It's unclear to Allison, so it's unclear to us. What did you think was happening?

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah, no, it was classic abuse. Like setting them up in this life and then taking it away. And I mean, it's just.

[Chelsea Devantez]

I feel huge financial abuse into physical abuse.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes. And I think one thing that we should mention, which will come back later, is, is Alison's mom's obsession with buying presents for people. It'll come back to buy Alison in the ass. But their mom loved to buy like all of the Castmates gifts and the agent's gifts and anyways, using Alison's money.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. And also that's, I think what drew Alison's mom to John of, like, he has more money than their dad. Meanwhile, Allison's dad has completely disappeared and they're not gonna know why for many years, but for them it's just like, o, my dad doesn't love me, I'm not enough, and I never hear from my dad. So Allison's in tons of projects. Cheaper by the Dozen is probably like the biggest one in this moment in time. They also wrote about the intense emotional crash that comes after they end every project. Like bonding with Bonnie Hunt and being like, this is a real family. And my friends.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And how emotionally devastating it is every time a job ends when. Which I found Interesting, because Drew Barrymore also wrote about that as a child as well. That just the damage of a job going away after you got to hang out with everyone for so long. Yeah. Oh, and Mara Wilson wrote about it. That part alone is destroying you, let alone if anything abusive is going on in your life.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah, you can't differentiate. And if you're lacking a, you know, healthy family, you are being provided the perfect family.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Especially cheaper by the dozen.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah, right, right, right, right.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And you get to act out and fake all family moments that you're not having at home. And then Allison Googles themselves.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, my God.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Okay, I should have stopped scrolling, but I was itching to see what everyone else said about me. Alison Stoner wore the ugliest suspenders to the premiere. Read the next entry. My stomach twisted in knots. Why are they being mean? Why did they pick an actress with a crooked nose and crooked teeth? Debate like iron to a magnet. I clicked to see the replies. I was too busy staring at her lazy eye to notice her nose. My jaw dropped, and I rushed to the mirror to fact check their criticism. Oh, no, they're right. I never noticed that my nose was slanted and one eye was bigger than the other. What's wrong with me? I ran back to the computer and Googled my name to gather more feedback. 98,000 results. She is 10 years old. And then, just a couple pages later, this is something that was written in the book. And I screamed. And I bet you did, too. Allison wrote this. Typecasting is necessary to get your face on the map. Susan Curtis muttered over the phone in her notoriously rushed cadence. Quote. We reminded our other client, Jeanette McCurdy, the same. It's a win to be visible and employed. So Alison and Jeanette had the same child manager. Okay, this feels like a good time to take a quick break. As summer winds down, it is sweater time. I love a good, cozy, oversized sweater. And Quince makes my very favorite oversized cable knit cardigan. It's fantastic. It reminds me of being on the Gilmore Girls. Not that I've ever been on the Gilmore Girls, but when I put the sweater on, I feel like I'm in the Gilmore Girls. I've been styling it with sweatpants, with jeans. It makes every outfit elevated, which is truly what I need. They have inclusive sizes. It's so versatile. And I'm gonna link it in one of my newsletters by working directly with top artisans, Quints cuts out the middleman, which gives you luxury without the markup. And it works with factories that use safe Ethical, responsible manufacturing practices and premium fabrics and finishes. They have cashmere and cotton sweaters starting at just $40. So get into fall with me. Get your big sweaters out. Elevate your fall wardrobe essentials with quince. Go to quince.com glamorous for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com glamor to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quints.com glamorous the Disney Hulu HBO Max.

[Alison Stoner]

Bundle planned starting at just $16.99 a month. Catch Limitless live better now season one with Chris Hemsworth on Disney.

[Chelsea Devantez]

We got a lot of work to do.

[Alison Stoner]

Alien Earth on Hulu. This ship Collected Monsters and Final Destination Bloodlines on HBO Max.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Death is coming for our family.

[Alison Stoner]

The Disney Hulu HBO Max Bundle plans starting at $16.99 a month. All these and more streaming soon. Visit Disney Hulu HBOMaxBundle.com for details.

[Tamara Yahia]

I'd have been born just playing my trash.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Okay, let's dive back into the episode. So Alison and Jeanette had the same child manager. How did that hit for you?

[Tamara Yahia]

Is this person still around?

[Chelsea Devantez]

Like. Yeah. And full name? Susan Curtis.

[Tamara Yahia]

Wow.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And Cindy, what was it like? Cindy Orbank, the agent.

[Tamara Yahia]

I love when Allison shits on people.

[Chelsea Devantez]

In this book and even when they don't and they just list a full name but then tell you what happened, you're like, yes, full name. Yes, full name.

[Tamara Yahia]

Totally. And we'll get into the Demi Lovato of it all.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Oh, it is coming.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes. There was also something when Allison starts Googling themselves this paragraph, someone had taken a picture of me from the neck up and had spliced it onto a naked body with large breasts and wide open bare legs. Even though it wasn't my actual body, I felt violated and dirty. Mom would be so mad to know I clicked on this. So on top of this trauma of seeing yourself, I can't even. There's the guilt that mom would know.

[Chelsea Devantez]

You clicked on this and that that was a bad part and that the part was you looking. Also, you know, at the age when you are discovering yourself as a person in this world, the embers of sexuality, and you're seeing your child face on porn that adults have created Again, Mara Wilson had the exact same thing happened to her when she was a child. Jennette McCurdy. Like any child on the Internet, this is happening to. So what happens is basically John is finally gone, but also Alison's sisters are gone. They're working more and more. And then one friend invites Alison over, and they are Christian. And Allison wrote, my heart swelled in a split second. I gained a personal relationship with a savior. Just when I needed family the most, I gained a father and provider, not to mention a map for my life. This was tough Jesus, when you have no one.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And Allison becomes a hardcore Christian.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah. As I was approaching or reading this, I was like, no, no, no. But at the same time, it's like, at least there was something. Like they were so desperate to grasp onto anything. And I don't know how you feel about organized religion, but. But I think, like, I was just like, please, please, please.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Well, it's so fascinating because I have this section of my life when we had moved. It's in between 14 and 15. And I decide that summer I'm gonna go to a different church every Sunday so I can decide my religion. Because I was raised New Age, which meant non denominational, which meant I got to choose. And so at 14 years old, every Sunday, I walked my ass into a different church in town alone, by the way, which is not really, but, you know, come on. And I also was heavy into attending the Church of Latter Day Saints, which is Mormonism, when I was younger. And I've always had this weird thing of like, why is there so much religion in my childhood? And why did I want to do that every Sunday? And reading Allison's book, I figured out why. And I found myself thankful that everyone was so fucking rude to me because I would have fallen into. I would have taken anything that would have given me a map and given me eternal love. And the churches I happened to walk into were really gossipy and were like, look at this little broken home slut. So I didn't find Jesus. And I guess now I'm very thankful for that. But, yeah, I'm really sad for her because while I think there would have been, I think I know lots of Christians where it's a very beautiful thing in their life that's not the Christianity Alison finds. And it ends up being really horrible for them specifically.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes, absolutely. But this is a whole, like, this is the middle part of the book is when they get into this and.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Deep into the church, Alison becomes like, I am a good Christian child actor and does a bunch of, like, Christian charities and Christian promos. Meanwhile, Alison's mom is like, not, this is stupid. I hate this. But it's the only protective thing Allison has. Its rules, its structure. It's love. It's a way to forgive themselves in their head at night, thinking about, like, if I just do things right for Jesus, then I'm a good person again. And around this time, a television show is created just for Allison. Now, Allison is a dancer, an actor, and has started singing. And is the thing that brings them the most joy is music, because it's a way to emotionally express themselves. But they never win any music parts, so they're always upset at themselves for, like, not being a singer sooner. So a show is created for them. I was sick reading this. The show is about a pop star who just wants to be a normal girl during the day. And so she has a blonde wig for when she's a pop star that she takes off to be a normal kid during the day on a children's network. And I said, Hannah Montana. And it's. I didn't see this coming. I thought it was Hannah Montana. It was just the exact same concept developed for Alison Stoner while at the the same time Hannah Montana was being developed and went to Miley Cyrus. And then they said, well, that show's on air, so yours can't happen anymore.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yep. How devastating this was. I, I, oh, my God, this part is so, so sad. And all that goes into this is finally their project. This is the time that they'll be seen as. Because I feel like, Sorry, I'm. I have so much in my brain. I can't. Like, I feel like Allison also really wanted this one leading role. It's almost like if they got their one leading role, they would prove to themselves that it was all worth it or that they had worth in this world.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yes. And I think they learned this is parts of the book that really fucked me up, where Allison would untangle something horrible that had been taught to them that I still currently believed and had to be like, oh, my God, things like all of this suffering will have been worth it the moment I get my big break. And I must get my big break before a certain age. For Allison, it's 18, or I. Or child stardom will have ruined me. So you have until you're 18 years old to get a real acting role and break out of niche roles, or you'll always be a child star failure.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yep. It was also this fear or this desire to get this breakthrough role. It wasn't just to prove to themselves they were worthy, but also economic. Right. There is a lot of like, okay, well, if I just get this role, then I won't have to worry for a year or two about booking any other Auditions, because I'll.

[Chelsea Devantez]

I'll be taken care of. Yeah. And it's really, you know, there's a rubric and a ladder to climb in Hollywood, but also, there are no rules and anything could happen, which is why so many people go crazy here, because you can follow all of the math and still end up with nothing.

[Tamara Yahia]

Right.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And so Allison, as a child, has learned the math and can't get it to math. Like, when a producer comes to them and they're like, you're a singer, you're a dancer, you're an actor. I see potential for a movie about a girl who wants to become a rock star and she works at a camp and blah, blah, blah, blah. And Alison and the producer developed this idea together. It is called Camp Rock. Bring it and pitch it with Allison as the star. Then Allison never hears anything again and is like, oh, I guess. I guess that was a bad idea and it didn't happen. Then Allison gets a call to come in to audition for the project Alison pitched and came up with with this producer. They now have to audition for it. And the lead role has gone to Demi Lovato. And Alison can play the front.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes. Ooh, that part, really? And that comes after the Miley situation.

[Chelsea Devantez]

So, yeah, it came after Hannah Montana.

[Tamara Yahia]

Shitting, getting shat on over and over.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Again, over and over again. So then Demi Lovato gets the lead role in Camp Rock. This is gonna become one of, like, the number one hits of this time. And Alison was. Allison has started struggling with an eating disorder to stay thin and to stay perfect and to try and, quote, fix all these things that the Internet says is wrong about them. Allison notices that Demi is also struggling with an eating disorder. And they have this beautiful moment where they come together in the bathroom where Allison is checking on Demi and Demi is like, I'm really struggling too. And they decide they're gonna to try and be a support system for each other. And they both are young teenagers acknowledging they have eating disorders in this industry. And maybe they can be there for each other even though they're both suffering so much. There's no way they'll ever be able to help each other.

[Tamara Yahia]

No. And you know that reading it, right?

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, yeah. Just doomed. But it's such a sweet moment. And I think Demi was bulimic. And then Allison was obsessively calorie counting, Right?

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. And over exercising.

[Tamara Yahia]

And over exercising.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And meanwhile is really into. I will read this daily prayer and Bible study along with books from the self help section, like Stephen Covey's. 7 Habits of Highly Effective People helped me navigate life on set each evening. Instead of journaling scribbles, I wrote out reflections in my devotional and took accountability for where I fell short. Then I hit the gym blasting worship music in my headphones and I had this thought which is. Is being a millennial, thinking you are the weirdest person on earth with the most unique outlook, only to realize you are so fucking basic and everyone was the exact same and we just didn't know it. Because I always thought it was so weird that as a teenager I was reading business books and self help books. 7 Habits of Highly Effective People. I was just really trying to make a better life for myself, only to wake up one day and realize we all fucking work. All of us were. All of us were in our little corner reading our shitty little fake science books, thinking we were gonna fix it.

[Tamara Yahia]

But also, I mean, not all of us, but like, I think the three of us at least come from at.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Least the three of us. You're right.

[Tamara Yahia]

You're right.

[Chelsea Devantez]

I cannot speak for all women, but I think you're right.

[Tamara Yahia]

There's no privilege in our lives. Right?

[Chelsea Devantez]

And I think, I guess just the Idea that there's one other person, two other people, there's at least 10 other people out there and that. That none of us knew about it because we were all pretending to be normal and fine. Yeah. Will always make me sad.

[Tamara Yahia]

And we were. We were forced to grow up too fast.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yes. Absolutely. And Allison wrote this. This is their schedule. You've got your changes of clothes for the day. Mom called from downstairs. Coming. I lugged to carry on suitcase of rotating outfits to the car. Mom hauled us across the city through hours of traffic while I reviewed talking points for the first of six commitments for the UNICEF TAP project. I prepped out loud. I'm spreading the word about water crisis. Then at 3pm the gala for global education disparity. What am I for in between? Paley Fest television Festival at 1pm the moderated panel mom said and I need to pick up your new headshots on the way to your fitting. Unpaid work and publicity were the backbone of the creative industry, easily filling more than half of my schedule. Ironically, due to the hefty out of pocket costs of being a performer, many rising artists had actually lost money climbing the ladder in hopes that the next rung proffered higher salaries. A partial list of expenses could include a 3,000 to $12,000 monthly retainer for a publicist, a 6,000 to 10,000 monthly retainer for a fashion stylist and glam team. Unfortunately, mandatory for the quantity and high profile nature of events. 2000 in monthly voice lessons, 500 monthly dance training. 500 for updated headshots, 75 per audition for acting coaching. And I went on an average of three to four auditions a week and so on. Everyone made money off me, yet the outside world thought I was the cash cow. If I hinted otherwise, people misconstrued it as whiny or greedy. A million dollars isn't enough. Good luck in the real world. Little did they know my last residual check was 37 cents.

[Tamara Yahia]

Right.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Well, underline it, bold it, and send it out to the back.

[Tamara Yahia]

I remember reading this paragraph and being like, I'm staying in bed for the rest of the morning.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Absolutely. Would you really write down the numbers? Wow. Yeah. And Alison also is still a teenager and set. Therefore, every decision about who I became, I had to make sure that you could, quote, click purchase on whoever I.

[Tamara Yahia]

Was becoming without experiencing these things. So having their first kiss on tv, but not in real life or.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Which is also a common thing child stars write about of just being so sheltered, they have no experience, and then they have to act out the most extreme experiences a person could go through on camera. If you're in a murder show watching someone get murdered, and yet, like, you don't even go to school. Like, you don't even have a real school. You have a tutor.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, and meanwhile, this entire time Alison is going to. Because this comes back later, is going to some sort of school that isn't.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Is nothing.

[Tamara Yahia]

Right.

[Chelsea Devantez]

It's an onset tutor who will be like, how about I just, like, sign off and say, you got an A so you can, like, go to work?

[Tamara Yahia]

Exactly. So these teachers sided with the studio. And at the time, it's great. Alison's like, okay, cool. Well, I don't have to do anything, but we'll check back on that later.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah.

[Tamara Yahia]

One thing I wanted to chime in on is, during this time, Alison starts taking singing lessons with this amazing vocal coach who, like, coached Beyonce too. Right. And starts writing their own music. And I just. I have the lyrics of a couple of the songs written down. They are so depressing, but also so telling. So Allison is like, what, 11 or 12? And these are the lyrics. Am I chained or captive? You tell me. Neither. Split the difference. How dare I think anyone would listen? Got played like a pawn in their selfish ambition. Like, these are the lyrics Alison is writing. And then this producer being like, how.

[Chelsea Devantez]

About a song about a crush? But yeah, Alison is Writing cries for help and not realizing it, they think they are writing music for songs. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And at the exact same time of the all this is happening, Allison gets a stalker because they are in Camp Rock. They're in lots of things, and no one protects them.

[Tamara Yahia]

I forgot about this book.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, there's a lot. There's even more in this book we're not even getting to. But there's a stalker at one point, and Dringo Gavin de Becker is here, if you all remember, Gavin de Becker from our Dringo sheets, who wrote the Gift of Fear, which someone had a great idea for a bonus episode where we just cover the book, the Gift of Fear, which I think needs to happen because Gavin de Becker in this book is referenced in at least a dozen celebrity memoirs. And Allison reads the book to learn how to protect themselves because no one else will.

[Tamara Yahia]

Whoa. I fully blacked that entire part out.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah.

[Tamara Yahia]

But yeah. And the stock stalker comes to, like.

[Chelsea Devantez]

To their dance studio where they are a teacher, even though, again, Allison is still a teacher child and is teaching dance classes. And the stalker comes there, and everyone is like, you're making. You're, like, being annoying.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah. No, there's no support whatsoever. The first time I think Allison actually gets any support is when they start touring with the Jonas Brothers. And that's when they realize what a legit production or a team that takes care of these children, basically.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And also, the Jonas Brothers parents are always around, and they are also good Christians. And so Allison is like, oh, what would it be like to have, like, good Christian parents protecting you and caring for you? Now, listen, they also put those boys in purity rings and made them depressed about it. So. But for what Allison is going through. Yes, yes. And I think so. Allison then does Camp, Right Rock two. And then they do the tour for Camp Rock two. And so Demi Lovato is there on tour, and they're, you know, traveling around, and. I'm gonna read this. After a night of partying in Colombia, Demi and the dancers got caught. When the hotel reported a trashed room to our tour manager, the tour leaders cornered those who were involved. Someone revealed that Demi was doing illegal drugs in reaction to being called out. She coerced the managers into telling her who snitched, pitched. I was standing in the aisle of the plane that would fly us to our next tour stop when Demi charged in, irate, There was a bloodthirsty look in her eyes. She stormed in my direction. My muscles tensed in fear, preparing to be berated. What did I do? What am I forgetting? Two rows ahead of me, she squared off her stance with Alex, a well known dancer in the industry with a pristine reputation and no bad blood with anyone. Alex looked up to find Demi in her face. Demi raised her fist before anyone could intervene. She sucker punched Alex, just millimeters from taking out her eye. Time moved in slow motion and the plane went still. Then, without a word, Demi marched to the first class section and sat down to go to sleep, leaving Alex holding on to her face, wincing in pain and shock. The rest of us waited in the wake. Does Alex need medical attention? Will they contact authorities? Is Demi gonna get away with this? Because. Because Demi had been horrific to them this entire tour. And then Allison said her team and family sent her to rehab while her publicist artfully spun what could have been a career kamikaze into an empowering story of rising like a phoenix from the ashes. And they prematurely depicted an image of a sober, healthy role model, positioning her as a champion for destigmatizing mental illness before she had actually committed to sobriety and taken accountability. And then later wrote. Meanwhile, inside the industry, stories of more mistreated colleagues circulated. Relapse was confirmed years later, Demi would admit to faking drug tests and going on two month benders of using daily. But at the time, the rest of us were forced to dismiss our firsthand experiences and protect her image, or else we'd be eviscerated by the tabloids and the general public and her fans.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah, the Demi part is nuts. Like, the bloodthirsty part of me was like, give us all, like, tell us all the shit. But actually Allison is like, pretty kind in a way.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, I would say factual. Factual, yes, and factual and explaining. Like, both Allison and Demi were put into this machine. They both were ruined in different ways and they both acted out in different ways. Yes, and.

[Tamara Yahia]

And they were both children.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And they're both children. But also Demi was physically abusive to children who had to just pretend that she wasn't. And it reminded me of two things. Like, one, like, Demi has this documentary later even where another dancer takes the fall for her doing drugs. And for months, Demi doesn't tell her fans that it wasn't the dancer's fault and the dancer's life is destroyed. And then. And the other thing it made me think of is this pattern with Jeanette McCurdy and Ariana Grande and Alison Stoner and Demi Lovato, of Allyson and Jeanette having these horrific parents and who learn to do the right thing and be quiet and show up and overcompensate. And Ariana and Demi, also child stars, mistreated, but who are really big and famous, therefore get away with everything and get to treat others however they treat them. Them and these. I don't know. I just found it so interesting how many patterns there were.

[Tamara Yahia]

It's crazy. I don't know anything about these child stars. I don't know if it's because, like, either I'm older or I had, like, just moved here from the. From Argentina. I'm not sure. But I didn't know any of this. This is all news to me. I don't. I have so much I need to get into this opened up a book of, like, Demi Lovato I know nothing about.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, well, go slow, because the thing I'll say about Jennette McCurdy's book is that that's also a really, really intense read. But I think Jeanette, both of them are phenomenal books. But Jeanette tells a story where you really get to know her mom. You know, it's called I'm Glad My Mom Died and all these other characters. And so there are times when you can go on this horrific ride with her, but you're reading about. About this mom and these crazy people and these crazy things happening, whereas Allison really keeps it factual, and you stay inside her brain, which means you can never escape what she's feeling. You can never, like, get into the salacious mom character or these other things because you're staying inside her head, which I think made it a lot harder of a read for me.

[Tamara Yahia]

Wow, that is such a, like, cool observation. No, I'm really excited. Has Demi written a memoir or.

[Chelsea Devantez]

No, no, no. I think it'll come one day. She just got married, actually.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah, I saw that.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. So Allison starts to realize, thanks to no one, that they are intensely suffering from an eating disorder and working out too much. And it all comes to a head when they want an audition for the Hunger Games, but, like, haven't got on the, quote, level of other actors. And so Allison believes if they can work out to look, like, thin and strong and have a bow and arrow, then, like, they can get this audition. But really, it's all in their head. The audition's not coming because they haven't made it to, quote, the level of, like, you know, Jennifer Lawrence, who had just been Oscar nominated and was with caa. Meanwhile, Allison's like, I was still with Susie.

[Tamara Yahia]

You know, there was no world where Alison gets this, and you know that from the beginning. But you also know that Allison thinks this is their salvation.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yes, exactly. Like, if I can just get this role, I will have made it before I'm 18. Meanwhile, working out. And their eating disorder really destroys their life during this time. Till finally Allison doesn't get the role and realizes they need to go to rehab. And they reach out to a Christian mom friend who recommends a place for eating disorders. And Allison's reps say this quote, you can't take off that much time. You'll lose momentum. They answered flatly. I know, but. But quote, allison, you're not that anorexic. You'll throw away your career if you take a break. Right now, you're one roll away from everything changing. At the time, my ears interpreted their words as caregiving. They believe in me and I can't let them down. I didn't see their greed staring me right in the face. My breakthrough equaled big money in their pockets. I sat motionless, mulling over the rhetoric drilled into me since childhood. The industry waits for no one. We must conform to its beck and call or we'll be disposed of. What if the one audition I skipped was my big break? Break? Where is my next job after this one finishes and Allison's mom doesn't want them to go to rehab somehow by, I was about to say, by the power of God. And maybe like by the power of something. Allison takes their own money, convinces everyone they will learn guitar and get a new skill for their resume if they just let them go to two months of eating disorder rehab.

[Tamara Yahia]

Ah, this part. I think this is when, for me, the book starts getting really dark. Because it's been dark.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Which is crazy to say given what we've already said. But yes, I am totally.

[Tamara Yahia]

But because Allison is such an amazing writer, up until now they've been able to convey this kind of wide eyed, hopeful child's perspective, even though you know it's fucked up and they know it's fucked up. But right here, it's like the hope starts getting lost and.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, and. But this, I think it gets hardest to read at this point because this is when Allison has their breakthrough and we'll finally get just a couple of tools to help them realize how much everyone is fucking with them. And we'll get a couple of tools to get in touch with themselves.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And suddenly have a personal opinion about things. Which Allison calls a new obstacle for everyone.

[Tamara Yahia]

Right. Unbelievable.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. Previously, Allison had been just like removing everything from their lives that got in the way.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Feelings, opinions, their body mass, anything. And so I'm not. I Don't. Let's not go too much into the ED rehab, because it's pretty intense, but it takes you step by step through how bad their eating disorder was and also what had to happen to get them out of it. And when they come out of the program, Allison's mom picks them up and is like, I've been so sad and upset. I can't believe you left me like that. And gives Allison a box of chocolates.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Nightmare. Nightmare parenting.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devantez]

How dare you?

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah. I mean, if I didn't hate Alison's mom at this moment.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, exactly. And I think this is also where answering like, why did so many bad things happen to you? I think sometimes a parent is really doing their best. And Allison's mom was in a domestically violent and emotionally violent, abusive relationship. But in moments when your child has really let you know that there is a problem so much that they've taken themselves away for two months, and you do not choose to support them in that you are no longer doing the best you can.

[Tamara Yahia]

I agree.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. So Allison names their personal opinion. Fred. An inner wise compass reassured its presence again. And I recognized its distinct qualities. Faithful, rational, empathetic. And whether I liked it or not, direct. Wait, Fred. Like my old pet turtle. I did not see that coming. So now we have the inner publicist. And Fred, who is your inner voice, your gut that Allison had taught themselves not to pay attention to. And Fred shows up. Up. And now they start really slowly operating with some agency, and their whole life begins to change, including Allison realizes they only breathe out of one nostril.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

After an entire career dancing and singing and exercising.

[Tamara Yahia]

This is so not, like, shocking to me.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Right.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah. You just. You don't exist.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Exist.

[Tamara Yahia]

It's.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, you don't exist. Pain isn't real. Push through anything. Yeah. A doctor meets with them and is like, I don't even know how you've survived all. I don't know how you've done so much exertion with this deviated septum. And then in that moment, Allison realizes that they could get a nose job and fix this crooked nose, that everyone has made fun of them for their entire life while fixing their deviated septum. And Allison really struggles with, like, am I a good person if I do this? Am I bad Christian? Will God not love me? What did you think of this whole nose job thing?

[Tamara Yahia]

Okay. I have to say at first, and call me judgmental. Yes, I was being judgmental, but this whole part threw me off a little bit when.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Tell me.

[Tamara Yahia]

And then I caught Myself and was like, tam, you're being crazy. But it was like I wanted this part to be like, okay, Allison is gonna heal now. And then it just became about this, like this nose job. And I hate that I feel this way, but no, I do know.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, absolutely. You're wrestling with the exact same things Alison was wrestling with, which is like.

[Tamara Yahia]

Exactly.

[Chelsea Devantez]

But I think I ended up. Okay, let me read some of it. A year and a half after my surgery, I let myself sneak a glance while washing my hands in the bathroom mirror. I was taken aback. I'm beautiful, I uttered, stunned by my reflection. Tears filled my eyes as I turned my head in all directions to study my face. For the first time in my life, I felt attractive. Superficial or not, the surgery transformed my self image and gave me confidence to go out in public and not worry about how ugly I felt. My mental story of playing second fiddle adjusted to believing that I was a true candidate for primary roles. Then later wrote, there were roles I had been hoping to land and knew I was capable of handling, as absurd as it was. To prove my lifelong theory, as I settled into my new appearance, I booked not one, not two, but five films as main characters across one single year. I told you so. I yelled at the Hollywood sign, driving past the Oakwood apartments from my childhood. While I could still analyze my decision through a variety of lenses, was I worsening the unattainable beauty standards by giving in? Or could I contribute more to the world now that I wasn't riddled with low self esteem, I couldn't downplay the fulfillment that came from the inner freedom. In my case, my post op appearance allowed me to be much more present on set. I focused on the emotions of the scene and worried less about controlling the angle of my face. I could look people in the eyes and listen to them attentively without being self conscious. In other words, tweaking the thing that didn't matter in my actual craft vastly improves my performance.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah, it makes sense. Like, right, do you want to be like Alison? That doesn't matter. You're amazing without the no stop. But it's part of it.

[Chelsea Devantez]

But also, I think it was Gabrielle Union who wrote, you can't self esteem your way out of the way the world treats you. You can't confidence your way out of how the world is systemically punishing you. And I think given that she grew up in this industry, being told about her nose over and over and over and over and over again, yes, there was no inner love that could have outdone this Thing in this practical world where she was trying to be a.

[Tamara Yahia]

Leading lady, that insecurity seeped into her, like, deepest subconscious because they were a child when it began.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, well. And I've been struggling lately over how I think and speak about, like, excessive plastic surgery with, let's say, like, the Mormon housewives, where everyone has the same face. But then I have all this, like, when Cher is like, if I want to put my tits on my back, I will go fuck yourself. I'm like, yes, my queen. My queen. And so I've been struggling of, like, wait a minute. We would have to really break off an entire other episode to talk about the classism and things built into the new wave of plastic surgery. But I think because it was, like, this single thing that Allison was doing in a current world where people are currently changing their entire faces top to bottom to match nothing. My perspective was different on it.

[Tamara Yahia]

No, definitely. If anything, I was mad at myself, of course.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, you had to. And then I was like, she. Shut the fuck up. Tamp. This is amazing. And, well, or.

[Chelsea Devantez]

It's complicated. It's complicated. This horrible thing that Allison didn't want to do. Allison did. And then their life got better and proved a bunch of horrible things about our world to them, you know, 100%. So Allison starts dating fellow good Christians, which, by the way, I want to call out this moment in time. Allison has a really good friend who shows up in this book who is a fellow Christian, who right before they go to rehab, Allison goes to the window and realizes these little crafted flowers are being thrown at their window. And they open their window to see their really good friend who is there supporting them through all of this. And it's Debby Ryan. And Debby Ryan has also been on this podcast and is, like, so lovely and wonderful. And I have to say, it was so amazing to read about a wonderful fellow child star helping and supporting and being there for Allison throughout this whole book.

[Tamara Yahia]

Amazing. Yeah, I forgot about that. That was such a sweet moment.

[Chelsea Devantez]

That. So sweet. And also, Allison wrote, like, when flowers are being thrown at their window, that, like, Disney kids only do things with Disney moments.

[Tamara Yahia]

Right?

[Chelsea Devantez]

You know, like, totally, totally. But Allison starts dating other good Christian guys. And literally the relationships are like, I was with a guy for a year, and then they proposed, and I said, no, thank you. And it kind of goes like that until Allison ran writes this. They're on a date with Jordan, and they wrote, that's too bad. Can we do this again sometime? Jordan asked. I blushed. I didn't know what was happening. But as we leaned in to say goodbye, the magnetism left me yearning to get as close as possible. I almost kissed her.

[Tamara Yahia]

And you don't know that Jordan is female until.

[Chelsea Devantez]

That was a great reveal. It was a reveal to Allison, too, of like, why am I. I've never felt sexual towards any of these men I've ever dated. And for the first time in my life, I feel intensely sexual. And it's about a woman. You're so sad for Allison because you're like, yes, finally, be yourself. And now, because Allison's become a Christian, every. Almost every single Christian person in their life are like, you're disgusting.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And being queer is a sin. And now you're not allowed to be a Christian anymore. Which was the only thing Allison had. And Allison's mom's reaction was this. She looked at me like I had six eyes and then frowned. What did I do wrong as a parent that you turned out this way?

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah. That was another tough moment.

[Chelsea Devantez]

I mean, so many tough moments.

[Tamara Yahia]

This book is something.

[Chelsea Devantez]

This book is intense. And so what happens in this section, I wrote subtheme of the picture, sub theme of the podcast, sub theme of the podcast, which is that you read your way out. And basically, Allison is so confused at why liking women and wanting to be with a woman means that they are a bad person. That Allison begins reading everything and finds out in classic Christian texts and in other philosophies and theologies that they can be gay and they can be queer and God still loves them. And not all Christianity is like this. And this is where their own queerness helps them break free from some of the systems that were hurting them, like with their mom and with the Christians who were horrible to them and all of that.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah. I have this part where, towards the end, they start feeling like something is off with the church and they write. I felt increasingly out of place at church. Meanwhile, I met several queer people who were the most loving examples of being a disciple of Jesus I'd ever encountered. And then Allison's starts forming a kind of chosen family.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, yeah. Which is the family they've always needed.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And this is the way they get there. And this kind of brings us into the end of the book because Allison is still very young and basically pivots into digital content creation. And, I mean, this part also made me sick, where it's just, like, I learned to, like, produce and edit and do all my own things because maybe this will be a pathway. And gets booked on this, like, music digital creator tour.

[Tamara Yahia]

So sad.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, I mean, it's all sad. No, they agree. They would agree. It's sad. And Alison goes from being the headliner to them booking like more like influencers with more followers. And Alison goes to the opening act. And Alison has written their own music and has hired their own dancers. And one day one of the dancers answers is like, hey, my check bounced.

[Tamara Yahia]

Right?

[Chelsea Devantez]

And Allison's like, that's impossible. I've been working since I was 7 years old. And everyone always told me, you're doing this so that you can go to college one day. And no matter what happens, you'll have money after this. You'll be set up for life. So that's why you do all these jobs. And Alison, because they have no financial literacy and had trusted their representatives. And Alison's mom, who was a bookkeeper their entire life, they don't even know how to. To look at where the money went for. What's wrong?

[Tamara Yahia]

And Allison, what's crazy to me is enlists their sister Corey. Amazing. Who comes through and is like, I'll help you. I'll look through the accounts and see what the problem is.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And the best part about this is that cuz someone said, allison, do you know anyone who's like good at sussing out when things are wrong? And Allison's like, my sister Corey used to go through my stepdad's shit to find stuff so we could get free from him. And I said, yes.

[Tamara Yahia]

I loved this moment.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Me too, me too. And Allison, like doesn't really know Corey anymore. And it's like, I'm really sorry to ask this, but like, can you help me? And Allison's like, I know my child stardom career ruins your life, but can you still help me? And Corey has to be like, you didn't ruin my life. You were a child.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, what a beautiful moment. My God. And Cory finds.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah, tell him, Tell everyone.

[Tamara Yahia]

Okay, wait, what? I remember. Corey finds that the mother has basically just been spending a shit ton of money on these gifts, which the mom has been spending on gifts from the get go. But on top of it, it's like Alison's stylist charged like the same invoice 17 times type thing, right?

[Chelsea Devantez]

And then Alison's mom is taking fees for being, quote, their manager. Even though Allison's mom's life is still paid for by John, and Allison never knew their mom was taking money out. Also, the gifts are for other things, like, well, your sister's basketball team needs new uniforms. Let's pay for them for years. And let's let's buy them dinner and let's buy the coaches things, and let's buy, like, all of these. There's just a lot of missing money.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah. And that goes back to, like, the mother's narcissism, in a way, of just doing things to make herself look good in other people's eyes. With Alison's money.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yes. Which Alison finds out all at once when they realize instead of a million dollars they were supposed to have, they have zero. And that even the child labor protection laws, where 15% is set aside for you, was still somehow taken by their mom.

[Tamara Yahia]

Right. And in order to get out of it, has to sue their mom. Which they're not going to do. No.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And also that would drain. They don't have money anymore to sue.

[Tamara Yahia]

Right.

[Chelsea Devantez]

So Allison wrote this. They have a Christian therapist named Kate and wrote this. My image of my mother was on the rocks, but my allegiance wouldn't let up. She didn't mean to do anything wrong. It's just unresolved trauma. She needs support, not judgment. I recalled my therapist Kate, pointing out the common tendency for codependent daughters to protect their mother at all costs. Notice which parts of you run to her defense. Is it a mature part who has compassion for everyone's imperfect humanity? Or is it the wounded child trying to preserve her image because you relied on your mother's goodness to feel safe in the world? I needed her to be good. If I admitted she wasn't perfect, then it would spiral. I would have to face the guttural blow of betrayal, which would trigger deep regret for being so compliant and never paying attention to the fact that I was taken. Taken advantage of, that I didn't even like Hollywood, that I'd wasted my entire life on something I wouldn't have chosen for myself.

[Tamara Yahia]

This is the part I talked about in therapy. I think that if anybody. If anybody has any kind of mommy issues, this book is gonna fuck you up.

[Chelsea Devantez]

This book gonna grill you.

[Tamara Yahia]

But it helped me.

[Chelsea Devantez]

This book gonna throw you on the grill and flip you. Yes. No, absolutely. Tell me what kind of stuff came from it for you.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, no, I mean, just the protection, protecting of the mother and always taking care of her. I have too much to say. I. But this part, I just saw myself. Exactly. And the fact that Alison was able to, like, put it so beautifully and simply was just mind blowing.

[Chelsea Devantez]

I agree. And it's so. Again, theme of the podcast, like, where when someone else articulates the thing and you're like, oh, my God, that's me, I will offer this up, which is that, like, when you are a child and the adults around you aren't okay, and you become the child that makes sure they are okay so that life can be okay. This is a mantra my therapist gave to me, which is my okayness is no longer dependent on your okayness.

[Tamara Yahia]

Right.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Which is really hard because that's the codependent part of you that's like, let me make them better, or else I'm gonna die. And you have to realize, like, actually, if they are not okay, that doesn't mean, like, my world's ending. They need to deal with that. And I will deal with me.

[Tamara Yahia]

Totally. Totally. And we will talk about this over drinks one day, you and I. But, like, one day soon. It wasn't until I was 40 that I. I realized that all of these, you know, cleanups, I was doing for my mom, and I wasn't doing her any favors, honestly.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. Because it also keeps you and your parents separated from any closeness. If there is closeness that's gonna exist, it won't exist in that state.

[Tamara Yahia]

It's so easy to make the decision and stop parenting.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Did you say it's so easy?

[Tamara Yahia]

Once I saw it, it was so easy to make that flip, but I just refused to see it. That was the problem, you know?

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yes. Also so great about this book, which is, like, for how long she could have made that decision and knows to make that decision and still can't, I think is so authentic to the experience where it takes so long. And we even. This book is gonna end, and we know that Alison's mom is not really close in their life anymore. But Alison doesn't even go into the fallout, which I loved. Allison pivots to. Here's how I started to build my own life again. And I will say, I am not in a place to do this part of the book, so I'm gonna. Okay, so. But I'm just gonna tell everyone what we are gonna skip. And if you want this part of the book, you should absolutely read it or listen. But Alison starts getting into homeopathic New Age things, and I started to write. And again, I believe in a lot of these things, but I wrote, I'm really nervous. Nervous. Allison wrote, I mingled for a few hours with other experts, keeping a running note of terms to Google later. Psychoendo, neuroimmunology, Ayurveda, Social change, ecosystems Map, Feldenkrais and Le Bon. I'm sure I should go back and pick up some correct pronunciations. And I'm not going to. My body was Buzzing from a natural high, I felt like I could levitate. Everyone is so kind. They really care about making a difference. And basically this idea that Allison can fix themselves. And that's where I wrote. I'm really nervous. I'm really nervous. I'm really nervous. Now there's a story we're gonna skip, which is where Allison gets deeper into this community. And unfortunately, someone who's a scam artist in this community and a rapist and an assaulter sexually assaults Alison.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yep.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And Alison has just gotten free. Yeah, Alison has just gotten free. So this was really hard. Hard to walk through.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. And then because they have just gotten free and gone to some therapy and gotten some tools, they are able to go and do a rape kit and try and get justice. But as we know from many books on this podcast, the world is not built for victims to get justice often. And they do not.

[Tamara Yahia]

No. And. And you have to at least know that Alison was able to ask for help. But it's a very difficult section.

[Chelsea Devantez]

It really is. And so go listen or read that if you're in the place for that. But what happens is that Missy Elliott performs at the MTV Video Music Awards to get the Video Vanguard Award. And they call Allison and they're like, hey, do you want to do your role as little white girl in the music video? And Alison really weighs it and says, yes. And they get a bunch of press and attention and they have to tell themselves like, this is that familiar cycle. Don't get sucked in.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And they try and handle it beautifully. Like, instead of meeting with all these reporters, what if I wrote an op ed about performing with Missy again in my own words and talk about being queer and write about things that I care about? And they say, okay. And then. Then Allison goes on Ellen.

[Tamara Yahia]

Ooh, this part.

[Chelsea Devantez]

So, okay, quote twitch. I screamed excitedly. He'd become known as Ellen's DJ on the show, though he was a multi hyphenate artist and entrepreneur in his own right. We hugged and caught up briefly before I disclosed my nerves. I'm really hoping to show up as my full, genuine self today. I'm a little scared that I'll revert to my past Persona that kicks in with cameras and crowds. You know, I just want to truly represent the human and artist I'd of. Be kind. Come. Don't get me started. He sighed. Between you and me, the show has been both a blessing to provide for my family and complicated. I can't remember the last time I felt connected to my true creativity or inspiration when I approached Ellen to give her a hug. We briefly made eye contact. Unlike our first meeting, which felt grounded and playful, there was an unexpected lack of human connection. Something urgent clicked. Fred passed along the message. This isn't the time and place to be your true vulnerable self. You are going to need to recruit the other parts of you as an adult. I perceived that Ellen's performer Persona, which ironically charming and impeccably lovable comedian, had clocked in for work and there wouldn't be an opportunity for either of us to go below the surface. And basically, in the pilot for Ellen, Allison had gone on as a little girl and this was them redoing that. And they made this agreement with Ellen to talk about their other projects and things that mattered to them. And Ellen doesn't do any of it and gifts them a new tv, even though Allison has given away all of their possessions to live, like a healthier life. You don't have anything, but at least.

[Tamara Yahia]

You should watch me. So we have a 65 inch TV.

[Chelsea Devantez]

That you can put.

[Tamara Yahia]

All right, that's. You just put that in your studio apartment.

[Chelsea Devantez]

You don't need anything else. It won't even fit in my studio. Well, then put it outside and you can share it with your neighbors.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah. And Alison feels compelled or like pushed to thank Ellen for giving the.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And giving them the tv.

[Tamara Yahia]

It's so, so awful. And I really actually enjoyed that part because at this point, you know, Alison has, you know, is more whole and has more control over their life, but. And drops a big old turd on Ellen. I. I really.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And again, it's a factual turd. Like things Levy. To Ellen, this is just a factual experience. And. And it's really devastating. Alison wrote this. I found Twitch to say goodbye and he gave me a knowing look. At least you're not under contract, he said with a half grimace. Take care of yourself, friends, I said, hugging him tight. Soon you'll be free to share your true voice again. I started my car and rolled down the window to express one last thought with Tommy. I'm going to give the TV to the LGBT senior center. I hope they use it to play bingo. And Alison obviously doesn't talk about what happened with Twitch, which is that Twitch. Twitch has since died by suicide. But I think this is.

[Tamara Yahia]

I didn't know that. Oh, my God.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Oh, I'm so sorry.

[Tamara Yahia]

Please. I live under a rock. No, no, no, no, no. Whoa.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. And Twitch's wife has written a book that's highly contentious and there's a lot of, like, there's just too much for. To get into in this moment. So that was Alison, I think, paying homage to Twitch and how much they were going through and how much they both struggled in this industry and how hard it is to get out the. Of. Of suicidal ideation when you are so deeply suffering, which Allison was as well.

[Tamara Yahia]

Right.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And the book ends with Allison reuniting.

[Tamara Yahia]

With their dad, thank God, and basically finding out that their dad wanted to be in their life the whole time, but got sued and was.

[Chelsea Devantez]

By John.

[Tamara Yahia]

By John. And was threatened.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Called him a pedophile. They threatened his career. They, like, maliciously ran Allison's dad out of their life for years via the.

[Tamara Yahia]

Courts and kind of becomes, you know, close with their dad and realizes that they are so like their dad and very, like, craving knowledge and love to read and to better them play tennis. Yeah. Yeah. It's truly beautiful how it ends.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And Allison gets to say things like, what was I like as a kid? And who do you think I want. Wanted to be? And Allison's dad is like, you loved learning. And Allison's dad's like, you did not like performing. You didn't want to go to Hollywood. This wasn't your choice. And Allison didn't know that. Allison thought from their mom that, like, I chose this and I ruined my family. And the other thing, the one thing I'll say about Allison's dad, Dringo, all these goddamn dads were like, finally, you do all the emotional work to track down your father. All of them are like. Like, hold on a second. And they've got a box of shit they kept in the basement of clippings of the things you've done. And then they take you through all the newspaper clippings that he saved about their life, but also clippings of just things that Alison's dad thought they might be interested in. I said, bitch, get on the phone. This has been available to you for years before this moment.

[Tamara Yahia]

The dads in these situations are truly an enigma. When I just to finish it off, like, when my dad read my memoir, his comment after I, like, aired all of this and this trauma, which he didn't know I had suffered. Neither did I. He said, I thought your entire life, you were the happiest kid, and you laughed through all of it. I thought, like, it's kind of saying. It's hard to translate into English, but it's kind of something I thought. I thought you laughed throughout your entire life, and there was nothing wrong different from this. Right? But also, they just. It's a different I don't know. The dads are a whole thing.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Well, I'm just like, you all have a box of clippings, right? Every one of you?

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devantez]

But he is a great adult. In this book, of all of the adults available, there's two things at the end of the book that I want to read, so. And they're both in the epilogue. Clinical psychologist and mental health expert on celebrity and fame, Donna Rockwell explains that fame mirrors the symptoms and cycles of drug addiction. The celebrity often undergoes the process of, quote, first loving, then hating, fame, addiction acceptance, and then adaptation, both positive and negative, to the fame experience. She adds, becoming a celebrity alters the person's being in the world. Once fame hits with its growing sense of isolation, mistrust, trust, and lack of personal privacy, the person develops a kind of character splitting between the celebrity self and the authentic self. And these still don't even begin to dig into the other nefarious elements of the celebrity lifestyle. Public scrutiny, cyber attacks, stalking, extreme beauty standards, and more. If we know the cost of fame leads to premature death and severe mental distress, why are we voluntarily hooking children on a deadly drive? Honestly.

[Tamara Yahia]

Gorgeous book.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Gorgeous book.

[Tamara Yahia]

Everyone needs to read it, especially anyone.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Who'S in the industry or wants to put a kid in the industry. And Allison goes on to start creating wellness tools for children who are in the industry or getting out of the industry. Their podcast. And the final paragraph of the book is this. In that sense, my deepest fear is my greatest opportunity to embrace life as a has been and give myself the radical permission to change, heal, and experiment, and even. And especially if that renders me unrecognizable. Okay, we're gonna do the booktal test. Three questions. We both answer all three. First question, was the author vulnerable in the sharing of their truth?

[Tamara Yahia]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devantez]

A million bajillion, without a doubt.

[Tamara Yahia]

Out.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Second question, was it entertaining to read?

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, my God, yes. Were you googling, like, things every two seconds?

[Chelsea Devantez]

I. I tried to wait, so I think I had, like, two Google. Google searches, like, in midpoints of the book. Yeah, I will say I had to do this one in parts. It was, like, so intense that I couldn't race through it. But it was wildly entertaining.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, yeah, definitely. Well, I'm a masochist, so I. I ate this up in three days.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Yeah. Good. And not to being a masochist, but to enter reading a book we loved. Okay, final question. Did reading this book elevate your life in any way?

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, my God, so much. I actually left Alison a review on Goodreads.

[Chelsea Devantez]

I was so. Okay. That is moved. And what did you say?

[Tamara Yahia]

I just said, like, as a former child star, I want to thank you for putting it all out there. And it was just such a wonderful read. Again, like, the fact that I brought this up in therapy so many times, it really helped me in my journey.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And I think this book and your book are beautiful companion pieces.

[Tamara Yahia]

I do, too. Really.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And I think, like, if you are interested in Allison's book. Yes, I'm plugging Tam's book, but I'm plugging it for the reading experience, too, of how two children can live through this and survive and get out.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah, absolutely. And, I mean, I think mine has the whole, like, immigration factor, which is a whole other.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And a lot of cultural things. Identity things.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devantez]

That are incredible to read about. Yeah. Yes.

[Tamara Yahia]

But. But when the child star moments align, they are so similar. And you just know how many kids have gone through this, so.

[Chelsea Devantez]

And are still currently being put into the system. Yes, I will say yes. This book definitely elevated my life. I think maybe for the first time in history. I. I don't really have the articulation for exactly how yet, but I do know that it's made me think a lot about my current life and current career. I'm not a child star. I started doing this when I was 18. Right. So I was formed as fuck. But also my brain was kind of in pieces. Yeah, my brain was in pieces. I don't know, till I was 30. So, you know, in many ways, a lot of stuff got in my brain when it was. Was still trying to heal from childhood. And so I've been rethinking a lot, and in the acknowledgments. Allison, thanks. Neuroplasticity, which is a word I know thanks to my husband Yasser, who's also been reading a lot about that. And I don't even know if I'm going to get this right, but I think it's the idea that your brain can be changed through harmful traumatic experiences. Meds, not meds, all these things. Right, right. But that there's plasticity to it, which means that it can also change back and rewire and move and grow with the right tools. And that Allison is really using those tools to get their brain back, and that those tools are available. And so I've been thinking a lot about that.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh, I love that. Oh, one more thing I've been thinking a lot of from this is complex ptsd. It's something that I didn't realize, but I think it's what I suffered as well. You think that if there's not this one specific incident then nothing bad really happened to you, but this book really showed me otherwise.

[Chelsea Devantez]

So I and I think, listen, I'm making a joke. So this is not science, but I think the complex and complex PTSD is how complex it is to fucking find out you have it. I'm forgetting it's a little tangled nightmare and it really can show up as different things in your life and it often can take a specialist to show you a mirror and to give you the tools to heal that you didn't even know you needed. Tam, tell everyone where they can find your book, buy your book, follow you online and support your work.

[Tamara Yahia]

Oh yes, you can find my book everywhere. Books are purchased and Cry for me Argentina, Argentina My life as a failed child star. So bad at promoting myself. And you can find me on Instagram Amarayahia Y A J I a and I also narrate the audiobook myself so if you want to hear me and.

[Chelsea Devantez]

You'Re a performer so I bet it's amazing.

[Tamara Yahia]

Yeah, I cry so many times. It's so funny. I wrote like set out to write a comedic book and look what happened.

[Chelsea Devantez]

Theme of the podcast yeah, you were so stunning. Thank you so much for sharing so much both on this podcast and in your book. And thank you so much for coming on. I could not have imagined a better guest.

[Tamara Yahia]

You're the best.

[Chelsea Devantez]

You said so.

[Tamara Yahia]

I'm just plain white trash.

[Chelsea Devantez]

A big thank you to our senior Managing producer, Christina Lopez, our Executive producer Jordan Moncada, our sound engineer Marcus Hamm, and our amazing Associate producer, Jaron Padre. I also want to give a huge thank you to our incredible partners over at Thrive Cosmetics and every plate. We will link to those brands in the show notes. Go check them out. Everything else we discussed is also linked in the show notes. And if you have questions, thoughts, comments, go to the Patreon sign up. There's a free tier you can join, Leave a comment, chat with your fellow cookies. We will keep the book club continuing over there.

[Alison Stoner]

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[Chelsea Devantez]

5 times Membership Rewards points on flights got us to paradise with special access to unforgettable experiences and late hotel checkouts. Platinum Card membership for a trip that's next level. Learn more at americanexpress. Com Explore Platinum Terms and Points Cap Apply.