Cheryl Hines' Memoir Unscripted (with Becca Platsky) [REPLAY]

Summary

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Glamorous Trash: A Celebrity Memoir Podcast

Cheryl Hines’ Memoir "Unscripted" [REPLAY] — August 4, 2026

Host: Chelsea Devantez
Guest: Becca Platsky (Host, Corporate Gossip Podcast)

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Episode Overview

In this subscriber-released episode, Chelsea Devantez and guest Becca Platsky deep dive into "Unscripted," the memoir by Cheryl Hines, Emmy-nominated comedy actress and wife of Robert F. Kennedy Jr. The hosts dissect the perplexing intentions, shallow storytelling, and Rickety narrative of the memoir. They also analyze the intersection of Hollywood, the Kennedy family legacy, political scandal, and the strange choices underlying Hines’ public persona. Listeners are forewarned: Chelsea did not enjoy the memoir, and the episode leans sharply critical but delivers an insightful, highly entertaining takedown.

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Main Discussion Points

1. Why Does This Memoir Exist?

– [07:47]
Chelsea and Becca struggle to uncover Cheryl Hines’ motivation for releasing "Unscripted," finding no clear emotional drive or financial windfall:

• Published by Skyhorse, whose roster includes controversial figures.
• No real tie-in to the Olivia Nuzzi affair memoir, despite close timing.
• Becca speculates on financial motives: “I also think she needs the money. I think she's been blacklisted. The Kennedy spigot has turned off for both of them.” ([09:55], Becca)

2. Cheryl’s Story: Confused Intros, Skipped Details

– [10:17; 12:13; 13:01]
The book omits or glosses over key life events (like her parents’ divorce), giving readers whiplash:

• Lapses in introductions and transitions: “She also, like, introduces characters by just saying their name. … There’s, like, a lot of really basic narrative errors.” ([13:01], Becca)
• Literal copy-pasted paragraphs.

3. Florida Roots, Hollywood Dreams

– [11:05; 23:52]
Cheryl’s early years and drive to act are highlighted:

• Florida upbringing, family instability, escapes to L.A.
• Key anecdote: her sister Becky mails her an ATM card, but there’s no money. “I thought that was really sweet.” ([24:37], Chelsea)
• Early LA years defined by wanting to be around “fancy people.”

4. Groundlings, Curb, & Career Flatness

– [16:48; 27:20]
Cheryl’s time as an improv student, her break on "Curb Your Enthusiasm," all described with little emotional depth:

• Lisa Kudrow as her improv teacher—details that fail to sizzle.
• Anecdote where she gives Larry David notes, then the story abruptly stops.

5. Family, Marriage, and Step-Parenting

– [29:15; 29:53]
Major life moments are mentioned but not explored:

• Divorce from first husband Paul, amicable co-parenting.
• Cheryl’s daughter Cat becomes the focus, with RFK Jr.’s children remaining peripheral.

6. The Kennedy Maelstrom: Drugs, Affairs, Legacy

– [43:22; 47:51; 50:06; 51:28]
The memoir pivots abruptly into a selective Bobby Kennedy Jr. biography, omitting challenging truths:

• Hines avoids discussion of her husband’s late ex-wife Mary Richardson Kennedy, who died by suicide.
• Kennedy family dysfunction: affairs, “lust demons,” secret diaries, generation-spanning scandals.
• Becca recites a hot-list of family tragedies, comparing the Kennedys’ troubles to the Murdochs.

“People talk about the family being haunted or the Kennedy curse, but ... is it like, oh, this haunted family or is it like extreme wealth meets patriarchal privilege?” ([52:53], Chelsea)

7. Cheryl & Bobby: The “Meet Cute,” and the Power of Attention

– [43:22; 45:32; 46:36]

• Bobby’s environmental activism originally stemmed from court-mandated community service.
• “He likes being a savior … that gets him high.” ([45:32], Becca)
• Evidence that RFK Jr.’s main driver is attention, not ideology.

8. Rich People Weirdness: Animal Antics & Cultural Tone-Deafness

– [34:33; 67:00]

• Anecdotes about dead animals: bear, whale, emu – “He loves the live ones and also finds the dead ones interesting.” ([70:26], Cheryl in book)
• Cuba trip fiasco: getting her hair unwillingly braided, refusing to pay, ending up in court—a tone-deaf example of privilege.

9. Memoir Naïveté vs. Calculated Denial

– [35:11; 37:44; 73:27]

• Cheryl’s persistent “I’m just a nice white lady!” posture is challenged.
• Chelsea draws a line between genuine naiveté and willful ignorance/politesse, especially regarding the cultural, political, and #MeToo landmines the Hines/Kennedy world navigates.

“She does a real Meghan Markle. ‘I’d never Googled a man before.’ … You should Google everyone.” ([37:44], Chelsea)

10. The Anti-Vax/Political Spiral

– [73:27; 74:14; 76:06; 76:45; 78:14]

• Cheryl’s downplaying of RFK Jr.’s anti-vaccine rhetoric and politics is called out.
• She both-sides basic public health (“masks on planes make no sense”), ignores that his campaign is built on vaccine skepticism.
• Becca ties RFK Jr.’s turn to MAGA and anti-vax circles directly to financial and social desperation (“his salary went up to $510,000 in 2022 from $40,000 in 2016”).

11. Hollywood’s “Icing Out” and Secrets

– [75:38; 77:59]

• Hines claims loss of work and friends is a mystery, ignoring the clear industry boycott due to her husband.
• Evades any sense of public accountability or real reflection.

12. The Olivia Nuzzi Digital Affair

– [84:23; 90:57]

• Cheryl devotes more pages to not receiving Secret Service protection than to her husband’s much-publicized affair.
• The “affair” is dismissed with generic narrative: “We locked ourselves in our room and laid it all on the table … We tightened our ties that bind. The end.” ([90:57], Chelsea)

13. Bookending the Memoir: Shelter in Privilege

– [82:26; 83:53]

• As her life and marriage crumble, Cheryl’s response is self-protective tunnel vision: “I had to disconnect from politics. Not that I had been extremely involved in the first place … I can’t imagine what those experiences would have been like if I had started and ended every day angered by politics.” ([83:53], Chelsea quoting Cheryl)
• “Rich lady go bye bye.” ([82:26], Chelsea)

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Notable Quotes

• “I could not glean her point of view or intention for why she wrote it.” — Chelsea ([07:47])
• “If the essence of romance is uncertainty, and that's how you're telling yourself your life is romantic, because you live in a fucking chaos machine—we gotta burn all quote books.” — Chelsea ([65:06])
• “It's unbelievable that you would put this piece of writing out and that this is what you would choose to include in your memoir.” — Chelsea ([62:59])
• “Let people be weird. ... Let’s talk about the heroin.” — Becca ([56:07])
• “Bobby became fast friends with Paul before Paul was remarried in 2022. Paul accompanied us on most of our vacations, skiing with us in the winters and summering with us at Cape Cod.” — Cheryl via Chelsea ([29:15])
• “This was so fun. ... It was hilarious.” — Becca ([93:46])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [07:38]: Becca introduced; “Problematic Girl Boss correspondent”
• [10:17]: Book flaws, introductory confusion, and copying errors
• [16:48 & 27:20]: Cheryl’s path into improv, “Curb,” and career doldrums
• [29:15]: Paul, the ex-husband, family dynamics
• [34:33]: The fake cowboy director and Hollywood absurdities
• [35:11]: Handling #MeToo, naivete vs. compliance
• [43:22]: The shift to Bobby Kennedy Jr.’s life, public controversies
• [47:51]: Omission of Mary Richardson Kennedy’s suicide
• [50:06; 51:28]: Kennedy family scandal “hot-list”
• [65:06]: “Essence of romance” and marriage to Bobby
• [67:00]: Animal stories, bear and whale escapades
• [73:27; 74:14]: Pandemic/vaccine section and podcast with Tig Notaro
• [75:38]: TV/film career fallout, Hollywood “icing her out”
• [80:23]: Anger at loss of Secret Service protection
• [90:57]: Reaction to the Olivia Nuzzi affair
• [92:56]: Book “final thoughts” & Booktool Test

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Final Verdict: Booktool Test

Was the author vulnerable in sharing her truth?

“No. ... Really great bluffing at poker, really bad bluffing in the book.” ([93:06], Chelsea)

Was it entertaining to read?

“I would put it at like a 6, but the post read deep dive was an 11 for me.” ([93:34], Becca)

Did it elevate your life?

“I think your research elevated your life, but I don’t know that the book elevated your life.” ([94:14], Chelsea)

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Closing Thoughts

Cheryl Hines’ “Unscripted” leaves more unsaid than revealed—marked by defensive silences, bad-faith naiveté, and rich-lady obliviousness. The book reveals little of Cheryl herself, offers no satisfying account of the Kennedy family or her unusual marriage, and misses almost every chance for real insight. Still, Chelsea and Becca’s acidic reading, contextual research, and insight into privilege, scandal, and bad memoir-writing make this a wild, gleeful ride for pop-culture book club fanatics.

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For more hot goss and deep dives, catch Becca on Corporate Gossip, and stay tuned for the upcoming Olivia Nuzzi memoir episode — a dueling memoir special.

Transcript

[Chelsea Devonte]

You may remember that last year my producing partner Jordan and I started a program called behind the Bangs where we wanted to take everything we had Learned from our 15 plus years in the industry and put it back into the hands of creators. And so we ran a whole year long program and this year I wasn't able to do that because I've been on set too much. However, I am teaching a six week screenplay writing intensive called called how to Write youe Screenplay the behind the Bangs Way and the behind the Bangs Way means many things, but one of the things I'll be teaching you is just how to get to the writing part as quickly as possible. A lot goes into writing a screenplay and I will break it down over these six weeks. All experience levels are welcome. However, you do need a clear idea that you can express in one to two sentences before you take the workshop. I think the most special thing about this program is that it's gonna put you into collaboration with community. You need a creative community for you to pour into and for it to pour back into you. You will be put into many writers rooms, you will develop your unique voice and I will teach you my tried and true writing methods as you work with participants to get feedback and push your idea forward. You'll leave with a winning logline, a standout first page, and so much more. For more details on the course and how to join the community, pricing and frequently asked questions, go to patreon.com BehindTheBangs the link is also in the show notes. It's patreon.com BehindTheBangs and this year we are capping the amount of people who can be involved so spots are limited,

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[Chelsea Devonte]

Hi, it's me, your host, Chelsea Devonte, and we are taking a bit of a. A little bit of a break and I'll tell you why in a second. But first, I to let you know that today's episode and some upcoming episodes in the next few weeks are all releases from behind the paywall stuff that was previously only available for the cookies for the subscribers. So if you love today's episode, that is your sign to go sign up on our Patreon or subscribe on Apple Podcasts. I saw a comment the other day of someone saying that all the good stuff was behind the paywall. And to that I say you. Yeah, yeah, $5 a month is a big deal in these times. And if you are going to support us, we are going to work our ass off for you and always give good content to people who are subscribing and our Patreon members because you quite literally keep this podcast going financially. And so we always want to make that worth your time, worth your money. And you know, we put tons of amazing stuff on the free feed as well. We always keep that feed going. So we're taking a little break because, you know, we, we need to refocus the podcast for what you love the most. And also, as you know, I went and shot my film this year. It's going to come out in theaters. I have some other TV and film stuff happening. And I've just been really struggling with how to keep up with the pace of this podcast and the content and the quality and also do my other jobs. And so we're going to refocus things over the next few weeks. We have gotten some incredible feedback on Instagram. There's a post up on the glamorous trash podcast Instagram, where people left incredible comments about what they want the most. And in Patreon, there's a long thread of incredible feedback. And we're going to put all those changes in and basically make this a more sustainable podcast for me while also making more of the episodes you love and less of the episodes you do not. And with that said, sign up on that Patreon, sign up on Apple subscriptions. That's how we are going to grow the podcast, grow the staff and keep making this happen. And if you sign up, you are getting two brand new episodes this month. That's right, two episodes for the subscribers for the cookies, including a monster memoir episode. We appreciate your support so much. I love y', all, this community and this podcast so much, which is why we are putting so much time into making it as great as we can. So so we will see you in the comments and thank you for listening. Welcome to Glamorous Trash. This is a podcast that book clubs, viral articles, celebrity memoirs and trashy discourse to elevate your life. I'm your host, Chelsea Devantes. I'm your TV writer, comedian, filmmaker, author and sometimes I'm in stuff too. And this is a subscriber only episode, A cute little gift for y'.

[Becca Platsky]

All.

[Chelsea Devonte]

We are book Clubbing Unscripted, the absolutely mind boggling memoir by actor Cheryl Hines which was just released on November 11, 2025. Now this book was a little difficult to read and so I did not end up being a fan of it. And if you are not a fan of the episodes where I don't like the book, then maybe tap out. Now this one might not be for you. I just want to give you a fair warning. Normally I really try and love the book and this one was just a little hard for me. So there's your warning. Now you know Cheryl from her role on Curb youb Enthusiasm, but she's recently gained headlines and a memoir apparently for her marriage to Robert F. Kennedy Jr. Bobby Boy, who ran for president in 2024, first as a Democrat, then as an independent and is now the US Secretary of Health and Human Services under Trump. What a ride. Bobby himself has made many a headline for lots of different reasons. Bears, whales, brain worms. But most recently he made headlines for his affair with journalist Olivia Nutzy, who is also coming out with a memoir on December 2nd. And yes, we will be back to cover that memoir in its relationship to this memoir. Those two memoirs are going to have an affair on this podcast and that will also be for subscribers only. So thank you again for supporting the podcast and here is your trigger warning for substance use and talk of suicide. Now let's dive in. My guest today is Becca Platsky. Becca is the host of the amazing podcast that I love so much, Corporate Gossip, the business podcast that covers all the juicy Wall street scandals from Enron to Peloton. You also might recall hearing Becca on our Kimberly Gargoyle episode or on our episode covering another problematic Cheryl, but it was a Cheryl with an S. Former meta, Facebook CEO and Lean in star Sheryl Sandberg. Becca was also on deck with our viral article All Star Tracy Thomas for the memoir slash Facebook expose Careless People by Sarah Wynn Williams. Becca, would you say you are our problematic Girl Boss correspondent given the books you've covered on here?

[Becca Platsky]

Oh man, the messier the better for me. I mean, it's. It's only a problematic if you. If you don't enjoy it. So for me, I love it.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Thank you so much for joining me for this. We've been texting each other nonstop and I, I had to stop texting you so that I could save it for this podcast because what a ride. This memoir is mind boggling, strictly because I could not glean her point of view or intention for why she wrote it. And I was looking for it. I'm here for it. I want to hear her story. And it was really confusing as to why she would put this book out. And I don't even think it's money because this memoir was published by Skyhorse, Independent American Publishing company or whatever, who, I don't know if you know. Their upcoming book is called the Maha Cookbook.

[Becca Platsky]

Alan Dershowitz published his book through Skyhorse too.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yes, yes, yes. All the great. So do you think this was a money play? Why did she do this?

[Becca Platsky]

You know what's funny? Because when you were texting me, somebody said that Olivia pushed her book out so it wouldn't be that. She said. She said, oh, yeah, yeah, yes. And I'm like, well, she. Cheryl didn't say anything, so I don't think that's a real big issue.

[Chelsea Devonte]

No, she definitely didn't write it because of the Olivia Nutzy stuff. Olivia Nutzy? Her book was supposed to come out within days of this one. I said, terrible marketing move. You should have kept it. You should. Yeah, you both should have just ping ponged off each other at this point. You're already doing it. She moved it back three weeks, which isn't going to stop us from comparing the two. And yeah, Cheryl had one glorious paragraph about this affair we're going to get into.

[Becca Platsky]

And I'll say I listened to a couple of podcasts where she's all promoting it. I listened to the Tucker Carlson podcast that she was on, and it's still not clear. She struggles to speak, which I don't think is surprising because she also struggled

[Chelsea Devonte]

to write and as did her ghostwriter. I don't know where the hell they were. I mean, whoever helps her with this book should get an F. They should be. They should leave publishing.

[Becca Platsky]

Tucker Carlson asks her, was it difficult when you left Curb at the high point of the controversy around your husband's presidential run? And she starts crying and direct quote, she goes, it was bad because it made me sad.

[Chelsea Devonte]

That's. Which I think would have been a better title for this memoir. It was bad because it made Me sad.

[Becca Platsky]

I also think she needs the money. I think she's been blacklisted. The Kennedy spigot has turned off for both of them. I think one of the reasons he took the job as HHS secretary, I mean, we'll get into all of that, but I think he needed the money. He spent a lot of money on his campaign. Fascinating.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Fascinating.

[Becca Platsky]

I do think she. I don't know how lucrative this book is going to be for her, but that's kind of.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I'm like, I really don't feel like this was the payday, but maybe. Okay, let's begin. And I'm really going to get us to the good parts as fast as I can because it's only 257 pages, but blah, blah, blah. She's born in Florida, which I didn't know that. And I was like, this is such a sad sorry to Florida, but Cheryl's out here representing. And on page nine, she wrote this. And it kind of sums up her entire childhood chapters. She said the only things that were important to me when I was growing up were family and becoming an actress. I was 12 years old when Jimmy Carter became president. He had a thick Southern accent and I initially thought it was great because he sounded like my parents. My mom, sorry, I'm laughing because I'm just like, she's clocking one of our best Jimmy Carter on page nine and it's.

[Becca Platsky]

I know, it's mind boggling. She endeared me right away.

[Chelsea Devonte]

My mom and dad were born and raised in Florida and had never ventured out of state except for one long year when they moved us to Albany, Georgia. My dad had landed a good job as a regional manager for Burger King. My mom was from Jacksonville and my dad was from the tiny town of Frostproof. While politics was never discussed in my house, I once asked my mom who she voted for and she replied, that's nobody's business. My note there was, lol Bitch, she said. I couldn't help but notice how President Carter was taunted on TV for his Southern drawl. It was the first time I realized some people equate the provincial accent with slow wittedness. I decided that wasn't going to be me. I wasn't going to be a hillbilly. I was going to do whatever it would take to be a successful actress, including losing my vernacular. This is such a. You're just like, why are you bringing up Jimmy Carter? But then it's going to be about something political. Then she's like, we don't talk about politics. This. Then she's like, I'll do whatever the fuck it takes to be an actress. And I said, well, I think that that's foreshadowing. That's kind of it. I'll do whatever it takes to be an actress. And also, like, my mom wouldn't tell me who she voted for. Which I think tracks with who she's become.

[Becca Platsky]

She grows up poor, her parents get divorced. At some point, she's talking about how she grew up. She was living in a trailer. I mean, I think there was certainly some instability. And she talks about how her and her three siblings, like, they were going to be tight and like, they were gonna lean on each other.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah. Because she. I don't know if you noticed this entirely skipped the divorce between her mom and her dad. Like, she was like, my dad liked to shoot avocados out of a tree. And you're kind of like, okay, sounds great. And then a couple pages later, she was like, my choir teacher wouldn't let the choir perform at my mom's wedding. And I said, wedding to who? And that's the entire story of my dad is gone, my mom's remarried, and then her stepdad gets a paragraph when he's dying. I mean, she skipped dad, wedding and stepdad. Yes.

[Becca Platsky]

And she also, like, introduces characters by just saying their name. And then I called Becky and who's Becky? I look, I was like, you never introduced her before. There's, like a lot of really basic narrative errors.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Oh, yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

I'm just like, this would have been an easy fix.

[Chelsea Devonte]

There's also two entirely copy pasted paragraphs in the book. They're verbatim copy pasted. And at the end of the copied paragraph, it goes, as you may remember, and it's like, yeah, because this is the second time you've written it.

[Becca Platsky]

I missed that.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Well, I'll read it to you again, Becca.

[Becca Platsky]

For the third time. I read the first half of the book while I took a gummy. And I was like, oh, so it just must have been. I was just like, yeah, I just repeated that in my head.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I did love when you were like, I took a gummy and started reading the Cheryl Hines memoir. I said, that's my kind of girl. Fucking write or die. Read on a gummy. Okay, so, you know, she gets out of Florida after being a brother and sister DJ duo with her brother Chris, who is the conservative of the family. And distinctly in the book, she's like, I'm a Democrat, he's a Republican. He was the only person I ever discussed Politics with as we DJed for our fellow teens. She gets to California and after going to hair school and things like that, and she enrolls in the Groundlings, which is a famous improv theater. And Lisa Kudrow is her improv teacher. Okay, this feels like a good time to take a quick break. One Skin is nothing like your typical skin care brand. First off, it was founded by four Ph.D. longevity scientists and they studied skin at the cellular level. So they engineered OS1, their proprietary peptide, to work with the skin's biology, targeting those dysfunctional cells instead of just sitting on the skin's surface. And it is the foundation of every product they make. And what you see over time with their products is firmer, smoother skin, even more tone and radiance, and visibly fewer lines. My favorite product from them is their OS1 body SP SPF broad spectrum and it's SPF 30. I'm always hitting that SPF and I love a full body skincare that is using that peptide into the lotion and it has an spf. And this isn't just my experience. Oneskin's results are backed by four peer reviewed clinical studies, over 10,000 five star reviews. And they've been recognized by Bloomberg and Fast Company as a leader in skin longevity. Born from over 10 years of longevity research, One Skin is helping you unlock your healthiest skin. Now as you age, for a limited time, try one skin with 15% off using code glamorous at OneSkin CO. Glamorous, that's 15% off. OneSkin CO with code Glamorous. After you purchase they'll ask you where you heard about them. Please support our show. Tell em that Glamorous trash sent ya. So I saw the Billie Eilish James Cameron co directed 3D movie of her tour and in it there's scenes where she's talking to Cameron, she's doing her makeup and there were so many other things going on that are great in that film. But I did say what's that makeup routine? So I looked up Billie Eilish's makeup routine. She has a three minute video online and y' all cannot recommend it more. I just used like the closest thing I had to whatever she was doing for her eye makeup. And of course I use Thrive Cosmetics and this makeup looked great. So highly recommend looking up a little Billie Eilish makeup routine and use Thrive Cosmetics. Every product is 100% vegan and cruelty free. They have clean, slight, skin loving ingredients that work with your skin. And every single purchase of a Thrive Cosmetics product gives back so all your purchases directly fuel real impact. And it's beauty with purpose and cruelty free. And vegan is just so important to

[Becca Platsky]

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[Chelsea Devonte]

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[Chelsea Devonte]

And normally I do. Normally I go back to the magical time when I was an improv student. And instead I just felt like, how dare you? How dare you soak up all of this, like, magical artistry and people who don't fit in only to fight against them years later once you're successful.

[Becca Platsky]

So I guess that's the question, too. And we don't get any insight into this, but, like, we've talked on, you know, when we did both the Kimberly Guilfoyle episode and the Sheryl Sandberg episode is like, who are these people now that we know who they are now, were they, like, we'd have to go, I guess, talk to Will Forte or Lisa Kudrow. And in my five hours of research, I didn't hear anybody say, oh, she was different back then. But that's not to say that she wasn't. So it's a question that I. Open question that I still have.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I feel like if I could guess she's that girl who, who I mean, her. We'll get to it. But two of her best friends in the entire world are gay men. A couple, and second to Bobby, they are the biggest story in the book. This couple was incredible. Who she'd known all her life, who were pretty much her platonic, you know, threesome of a family. And she strikes me as the person whom you would have always assumed. And she says, like, it's a democrat and, you know, is. Is a girl in theater who accepts and loves everyone. And then when push comes to shove is like, oh, no, I choose white lady Rich. Like, oh, oops. Like, if I was ever gonna choose, I Guess I choose this. And she'd just never been forced to choose until her husband ran for president. And she had to acknowledge to everyone that she will always choose, like herself and her own privilege over fighting for all of the people she actually loves in her life. Which is so sad. So her grandma tells this to her. She puts it in the book and I'm floored. I said foreshadowing. Her grandma told her this quote that she printed. A good man is hard to find, but a bad one is even harder to get rid of. Do you think she knows that she's talking to herself when she printed this in the book?

[Becca Platsky]

I don't think that she thinks that RFK Jr is a bad man.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Then why is that included in the book?

[Becca Platsky]

I don't know. And the other thing is her first husband, they divorce, but they have a really amicable divorce. He comes over later and he's helping her with turkeys. So it's strange to me. Yeah, it's really weird to me.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

It almost like I would know a bad man if I saw one. And I don't think RFK Jr. Is a bad man. Like, I know. I. I don't know. It's confusing.

[Chelsea Devonte]

You just gave me chills remembering someone in my life who said that to me about a boyfriend who was what? A very bad man.

[Becca Platsky]

Wow.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Oh, that just gave me the shutters. I don't think I'll ever. I don't think ever, ever, ever in my life I will ever trust anyone who starts with I know a bad man when I see one. And Blankety Blank is not. I think that's just like a telltale sign of, like, that person's a murderer. And whatever lady is saying this to you also needs help. Okay, so there are two Paul's in Cheryl's life. One is the husband you just spoke of. The other, Paul is one of her gay best friends. This is where the writing is so coy and so like, rich lady Republican. She said, I only knew a few people in la, and one was Becky's high school boyfriend, Paul. She talks about how hot he is. Then she said, after high school, Becky was still close to Paul and they talked regularly as he made his way from Tallahassee to la, stopping a few years in New York City where he found himself. I hadn't seen Paul in a few years when I set up for Hollywood, and I couldn't wait to see his beautiful face. Promising Becky he'd take good care of me. He and his boyfriend Eddie anxiously awaited for my arrival. And I Said, oh, that quote. He found himself in New York City was the part where she told you he's gay. And I literally wrote.

[Becca Platsky]

When I saw that, I go in the margins. I was like, he's gay. And then two minus two minutes later,

[Chelsea Devonte]

I was like, yep, okay. So you picked up what she was dropping. I was like, this is. Why are you writing around your friend's sexuality?

[Becca Platsky]

Because. Yeah, that's how white ladies born in the 1960s say that.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

She was like, wink.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I'm like, okey dokey.

[Becca Platsky]

It's like he's a very effeminate man. That's like the equivalent.

[Chelsea Devonte]

He's very theatrical. Yes, yes, absolutely. And I mean, this person is such an incredible person in her life and helping her with her family and her daughter. I mean, they're so close. It makes me extremely sad for.

[Becca Platsky]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Where she's ended up.

[Becca Platsky]

There's pictures where the two of them are in it, seemingly in the hospital with her when she gives birth to her daughter, Paul Beckett and his husband Eddie.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah. So then we've got a Dringo now. She left Florida to go to California. And she said, I was in bed, eyes closed, but not yet asleep. Suddenly I felt a strange presence next to me. That's right, Dringo. It's your psychic moment. Oh, yeah. I very distinctly, very clearly heard a man's voice whisper in my left ear. You know the joke. I said, please be Jesus. Jesus Christ going, you know the joke, girlfriend? And she said that's how she knows she's supposed to become a comedian. What do you. What do we make of this psychic moment? Who. Who was whispering in her here? You know the joke?

[Becca Platsky]

Well, she has a couple of these. It seems that the veil for her is very thin. You know, she has another one later in the book too, where she speaks to her late brother.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah. Visiting her.

[Becca Platsky]

You know what? I buy it. I always. I'm always leaning towards, like, when people say they have moments where they are speaking to the dead or something happens paranormal to them, I'm always like, yeah, I love it. Tell me more.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Oh, so I'm fully in. I just am dying to know which archangel decided, you know, the joke was the sign. Oh, you know the joke.

[Becca Platsky]

Get on out there and start your path.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Okay. So she has some really sweet moments trying to make it in Hollywood as an actress. She got her breakfast on curb when she was 34 years old, which she writes as geriatric in Hollywood, which, while true, she only got there when she was 26. So I was like, calm down, like, honestly, you made it in a phenomenal amount of time. And as she's struggling, there was one story that I thought was, like, so sweet, which is that her sister knows that she's struggling with money. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Becky is her sister?

[Becca Platsky]

Yes. Oh, that's how badly, guys, this book is written. That it's. Because there's not that many characters. There's not that many important characters, and it's hard to make the connection.

[Chelsea Devonte]

No one gets an intro. I really thought Becky was her friend, but then she would also write about her sister, but her sister's name is Becky, so I'm going to. I think they're the same. Well, anyways, her sister Becky knows that she's struggling with money and mails her her ATM card and her pin. And she's like, I just want to take care of you. Go to the atm, get some cash out. And Charles, like, thank you so much. I'm really struggling. And she goes to the ATM and requests $20 and insufficient funds. And she calls Becky. She's like, you don't have any money. Becky was like, oh, man. We'll try again next week when I get paid. I thought that was really sweet.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah. It seems like her relationships with her siblings, which is interesting because it will certain, like, sibling relationships, will play a bigger part in her life later. But it seems like she genuinely has a very close relationship with her siblings, who are really supportive. At another point, Becky also gets her involved in a pyramid scheme.

[Chelsea Devonte]

And, you know, like, it's funny and. And, like, it's cute. Yeah. They'll do anything for a laugh.

[Becca Platsky]

And I think it's interesting because one thing I. I think Cheryl wants, and it's, like, clear in that. So she gets involved in this. It's like gifting parties. This was really popular in the 90s.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah. I was gonna say it's not a real pyramid scheme. It's like everyone comes and puts money in the pot, and then one person wins all the money. But the ruse behind it is that you have to recruit all the people at the party with the money in. So I guess instead of a pyramid scheme, I think it's a scam, which. Pyramid schemes are also scams. But Cheryl, it was just a party scam.

[Becca Platsky]

Yes. And they were really common in the early 2000s. Okay. And there was actually one in my neighborhood that my dad, who was a local journalist, wrote about, and it was a huge scandal when I was growing up. But one thing I did notice in that story is she's talking about like how she really liked going to the fancy parties. And I think that is another theme for her is like, I mean, and this is not uncommon between people who move from Florida to LA to become actors and actresses. But like, being in rooms with fancy people is important to her.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

And like being seen as a fancy person is important to her. And like, I think we still see that. Yeah, I thought that was really interesting.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

But overall, I don't think she at this point is taking herself too seriously.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah, I agree with that. She's also dating men who, they're all older than her and they always have a tremendous amount of power, which like, you know, age old stereotype of what a woman wants in a husband. But her first husband, Paul, is a entertainment manager and producer. So it's like a big power player in her industry as well. Well, she talks about how she gets the Curb youb Enthusiasm TV special, which was just a special for Larry David's standup. And he was shooting like a mockumentary around his standup special that then became a backdoor pilot into what the TV series is. And the story of Curb, which I know not from this book, is a phenomenal one. Hearing Cheryl's little side of it, I guess was kind of interesting. And also, if I can relate to getting blue balls, it's through this paragraph. She said, I shot the Larry David special while I was still in the Sunday Company, which is a Groundlings, like improv company. When I showed up for the Curb shoot, I had no idea what to expect. There were no lines, no script and no rehearsals. I just appeared on the set. Larry told me the special was about him trying to get back into stand up. We started shooting and after a stand up set, I said, you know, that was pretty good. I just have a few notes. He looked at me annoyed and laughed in irritated disbelief. You're giving me notes? He asked. You turn the page, she moves on.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devonte]

No follow up. Not it was a joke. Not I'm embarrassed. Not this was. This is one of the greatest comedic writers of all time. Not my faux pas endeared me to him. Not he thought about firing me, but I was already his wife. Like, not I'm the dumbest person in the world. Like, what, what is that?

[Becca Platsky]

It's almost like there's no internal dialogue in this memoir, which is kind of crazy.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah, that's.

[Becca Platsky]

I mean, she says, like, these people were important to me. I was sad when they died or whatever, you know. But yeah, it's like there is no. I mean, you'll we'll talk about self reflection at the end.

[Chelsea Devonte]

But you're right, there's no self reflection. There's no thoughtfulness. And there's not even enough thoughtfulness to fully describe who people, things and places are in the book. Like, this is where I went like, did she say this off the cuff in passing to the ghostwriter? The ghostwriter asked to follow up. She. She didn't pick up the phone. And they're like, nah, fuck it, just print it. Like, I, I'm like, how do you put a paragraph in there? That is, that is so wild.

[Becca Platsky]

When I'm listening to these interviews, she's basically repeating the book verbatim. So that is possible. I do. I. It, it's that they just transcribed like a few words. Yeah, yeah, just a few.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I would say if she transcribed an interview with a ghostwriter to become this book, I would say it was one lunch and a morning walk. How much? What do you think?

[Becca Platsky]

No follow up questions? Yeah, it was just whatever you write, I'll just.

[Chelsea Devonte]

And lose my number and send it to print. So when she gets married, she is 37 and she's like, everyone thought I was the oldest crypt keeper in Hollywood. My mom never thought I'd get married. No one ever thought it would happen. And she has her daughter Cat with Paul and she later becomes a stepmom to all of Bobby. Are we calling him Bobby? Rfk. What are we going with here? Bobby?

[Becca Platsky]

I think Bobby Kennedy. That's what she calls him.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yes. Let's go, Bobby. So she'll be becomes a stepmom to his children. But she's really all about Cat, you know what I mean? Like, she's like, I love my children equally, but then it's just like pages on Cat. And when she and Paul get divorced after seven years, she said, we got divorced. We did it in the most considerate, loving way possible. We even took our rings off at the same time. And she said we stayed close as we raised Cat together. Bobby became fast friends with Paul before Paul was remarried in 2022. Paul accompanied us on most of our vacations, skiing with us in the Winners and summering with us at Cape Cod.

[Becca Platsky]

Whoa, that's like one of those things I want. She doesn't say why her and Paul got divorced. She doesn't say how Kat felt about this. I mean, this is one of those things where it's like, I'd love to hear more. What did they bond over? Was it awkward? Get tell me an awkward moment. Tell me a moment that you thought would be Awkward and wasn't like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I. There's nothing. And there's not even, like, how she fell in love with them. Just nothing. And I will say the only really interesting detail about Cheryl, which I guess I had read about in the press, but only struck me in this book, is how good of a poker player she is. And she's. Yes, phenomenal. She describes the competitions she won and the people she played against in these tournaments she attended. And, I mean, she wins them all.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah. You know, there's parts in the book where Larry describes her and says nothing rattles her. And I think certainly that, like, Poker Mental has helped her get through, like, this extreme media scrutiny. But also, like, what you just said is so interesting because, like, when we'll talk about some of the stuff they found about their relationship outside of this book, but a lot of people describe Bobby Kennedy as a prolific liar. So that's a question. I mean, not only being a poker player, you can't tell people when you're lying, but you also have to know when other people are lying.

[Chelsea Devonte]

And it's a game of lies. Like, poker is about lying about what hand you have. So then on page 112, she gets a Hollywood star. Now, I don't mean to be a bitch, but does everyone have a Hollywood star? Why did I think this was, like, just for, like, the Judy Garland of every year, or is this her and I missed it?

[Becca Platsky]

This is a world that I literally know nothing about. But is there anything about the Hollywood stars that's Pay to Play?

[Chelsea Devonte]

Wow. I think there must be. All right. Our producer, Christina, just. I love that you guessed it, Becca, because I'm just like, this is not making sense to me. Yes, obviously, it's pay to play. So it's how a lot of things in Hollywood are, like certain award ceremonies where a studio or certain cohort can come in and lobby, both financially and politically to have a person get a thing. Usually when it's around something that they have going on on television or in film. In Cheryl's case, it was the show Suburgatory. And I just, you know, the way they treated a star in the Hollywood Walk of Fame, I still have that, like, glitter and sparkle in my eye of what it's supposed to be. When indeed, instead, it's like how I could buy you a star for your birthday. Like, hey, I bought you a star next to Mars. And you're like, I guess. Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

Or like at Citi Field, like, I could buy a brick.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. It's like, I bought A constellation on the Internet for 49.99. Like that's what it is. Okay. Wow.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah. And to be fair, like, I mean, Curb youb Enthusiasm is one of my favorite shows. I would certainly be struck if I saw her. So I don't want to downplay necessarily like her impact on that show in particular. And I also watched the trailer for that other poker movie that she is in and I really want to watch it. It looks great.

[Chelsea Devonte]

The one with Woody Harrelson?

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah. I'd never seen it. I never even heard of it. Yeah.

[Chelsea Devonte]

You know what? Maybe I'll watch it now too. Why not? It's raining here in la. Her agent is there at the Hollywood Walk of Fame ceremony and she said, quote, that's your sitcom right there. She pointed to the front row where my TV husband Larry David, my future husband Bobby Kennedy Jr. And my ex husband Paul Young Satan, that side by side. And I said, yeah, that actually would have been great. But would absolutely watch that. So this is just a tiny little tangent. It's something called I Hate it here. Are you ready for this? Becca? Do you have any idea what I'm going to read when I say this tangent is called I Hate It Here. Here Being Hollywood?

[Becca Platsky]

No.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Okay, here we go. She's talking about director Barry Sonnenfeld. And she wrote this. Barry loves cowboys. And he directed the film from a western saddle mounted on an apple box. He has never been on a real horse. He sported a magnificent fake country mustache during filming, put in place by the makeup crew each morning. I loved every second I spent with them. Becca. I can't breathe. I need help. I can't breathe. I can't breathe. Can I. As someone who just directed a film, can you imagine if I. If I directed it from a fake sad on an apple box and made the makeup team take time out of the fucking budget and day to put a mustache on me every day so I could live my dreams of being a real cowboy. As I directed a movie,

[Becca Platsky]

it's important for men to live out their fantasies, Chelsea.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I mean, I truly. I don't think I can. I can't breathe. And this isn't even what the memoir is supposed to be about. This is just a little paragraph she put in about a male director. And I'm drowning. I'm drowning in grief from reading that. Like unfucking bearable. I just. Okay.

[Becca Platsky]

I thought you were gonna talk about her being in the hotel room.

[Chelsea Devonte]

You mean the monster, James Toback? Yes. And while we're getting there, did the little cowboy make me cry as well. Little cowboy man made me cry as well. But yes. Let's talk about James Toback. Do you want to repeat the story here for, for all of another theme

[Becca Platsky]

in this book though, and I'm actually curious. I wanted to ask you this. You have found this. I don't know if I want to bring this up in relation to this story, but it's two things that I noticed. She's very naive throughout this entire book. She can't imagine why people would think the way they do about her husband. She didn't know who RFK Jr. Was. She's just like this Florida girl who comes to LA and like is very naive. And so my first question, question before we get into the James Toback is do you find that this is common in memoir? And I know we also heard about it when we did the Careless People book where Sarah Wynn Williams was incredibly naive.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

Do you think that they paint themselves that way so that they can have like an arm's length deniability when it comes to the bad things that they were involved in or did? I'm curious what you think about that.

[Chelsea Devonte]

That's such a good question. I actually, if I was giving this on a whole throughout memoirs, it would be that it's not naivete, especially when it comes to situations like this. Me too. One we're about to talk about James. It's not naivete. It's learned polite good girlness or it is taught, you know, given to whatever's happening and don't listen to internal signals. And so women, I think, and I've definitely experienced this where you, in hindsight you're like, how did I do that? I totally knew better than that. And I think think in recounting it it does seem naive. But I think what it is, in fact is like we've all been trained to just like nod our heads and not make waves. Because I think when Cheryl's talking about RFK and not knowing anything, I think that is her purposefully trying to be like, what me? I'm just a nice weighty. I think that is her line later this James Toback story. She's actually extremely smart about it. She has her friends from the Groundlings come to the bar of the hotel where she's meeting him in his hotel room and says if I don't come out in 30 minutes, come knock on the door, here's my room number. She's in there for 30 minutes. He convinces her to get one shoe off. I'm sure he was coming for the Next one in a moment. It's been 30 minutes, and all her friends knock on the door. She grabbed. They're like, get your boot and let's go. And she runs out. And I think that was actually probably for that year in that time, the most ballsy thing you could do is be like, my friends are gonna knock on the door in 30 minutes. And she told them. She said, my friends are coming. You've got 30 minutes. Yeah, did that. Because that doesn't feel naive to me. That feels like she was watching out.

[Becca Platsky]

You're right. Well, I guess maybe where I was coming from, it is just like, yeah, that wasn't naive. But then there are other times in the. In the book where she kind of plays up the. I had no idea this was so weird.

[Chelsea Devonte]

She does a real Meghan Markle. Like, I'd never Googled a man before. To which I say, I don't care that you want to pretend you don't know who this famous person was. You should Google everyone. You should Google the man who delivers your mail. If he asks you on a date, you should deliver every. You should Google everyone who swipes on you. What do you do? And not put it in the research. My ladies.

[Becca Platsky]

And I guess, you know, I don't think it was very fair of me, because now that I'm thinking about it, when I was reading it, I was like, why would you even take off your shoe? And I'm like, that's not fair. That's not, like, a realistic situation if you're in a director's hotel suite. And she also called her agent, and they said this was fine. And, like, of course, as I'm reading it, I'm like, I know where this is going. But of course, you have to put it in. In context of, like, she's actually experiencing it for the first time.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I also just think, like, for that year, it's the Me Too movement when it really became loud and clear. Don't go to fucking hotel rooms. Not that it should be on you, but that, like, this is just something constantly happening in the business. And I think before that, it was whispered about, and you would think, like, you're going to an important meeting. Yeah. How did he get her to take her boot off? Is he like. He's like, I need to see how your, like, ankles look on screen. Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

Or something with your shoe. Yeah. Like, oh, I need it. It helps with my creative process.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Right, right, right. To have you take your boot off. Well, it gives us another Dringo. Okay. This feels like a good time to take a quick break.

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[Chelsea Devonte]

so I saw the Billie Eilish James Cameron co directed 3D movie of her tour and in it there's scenes where she's talking to camera and she's doing her makeup and there were so many other things going on that are great in that film. But I did say what's that makeup routine? So I looked up Billie Eilish's makeup routine. She has a three minute video online and y' all cannot recommend it more. I just used like the closest thing I had to whatever she was doing for her eye makeup. And of course I use Thrive cosmetics and this makeup looked great. So highly recommend looking up a little Billie Eilish makeup routine and use Thrive cosmetics. Every product is 100% vegan and cruelty free. They have clean skin loving ingredients that work with your skin and every single purchase of a Thrive cosmetics product gives back. So all your purchases directly fuel real impact and it's beauty with purpose and cruelty free and vegan is just so important to me and all my products. Your lips New Best Age defying friend has 18 buildable shades in the Empower Matte Precision Lipstick crayon and and upgrade your everyday eye with the Brilliant eye Brightener. Its waterproof eyeshadow highlighter stick made to brighten and open your eyes. Amplify your summer look with Thrive cosmetics. Go to thrivecosmetics.com glamorous for an exclusive offer of 20% off your first order. That's Thrive Cosmetics. C-A U S E M E T-I C S.com glamorous okay, welcome back. Let's continue the conversation. It wasn't until years later, when I read Gavin de Becker's book the Gift of Fear, that I started to understand how well meaning women and men can get drawn into a dangerous predator's web of premeditated sexual abuse and violence. I'm gonna say Gavin de Becker's the Gift of Fear is the most cited book in celebrity memoirs of all time. Also, Gavin de Becker himself, a boyfriend and friend to many celebrities. So he comes up a lot. A cookie named Tanya DM'd me and was like, you should do a bonus episode where you read the Gift of Fear. But listen, it's been on my show.

[Becca Platsky]

That's interesting.

[Chelsea Devonte]

10 years. I don't know. Yeah, I don't know. Okay, well.

[Becca Platsky]

And that's another chapter where she just ends it so abruptly.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Oh, yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

Like you're just like, whoa. Okay.

[Chelsea Devonte]

And then years later, I found out he was a sexual predator. Anyways, well, then I met Bobby Kennedy, because now we're here, page 122, we've got our Meet Cute with Bobby Boy. And this memoir turns into a Bobby biography. This fully becomes a biography of her husband, where she leaves out 90% of the information about his life and includes the 10% that she thinks might sway you to think she's cool for marrying him. So they meet once at. They're either skiing or in Cape Cod for the rest of the book. They ski or they go to Cape Cod. Those are kind of the two places they are. And they ski everywhere. They're skiing in Italy, they're skiing where all the rich people ski. And she meets him on some ski slope, and then six years later meets him again. Now, this is where I said, this is some brilliant writing. Because she clocks the year she first met him in 2005. Then she writes, it was six years later when I ran into Bobby at another Waterkeeper event, that my Life took a 180 degree turn. How could I forget? It was called a Waterkeeper event. What's a Water Keeper thing?

[Becca Platsky]

So, okay, so Riverkeeper. I guess this might be a good time now to explain.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Oh, yes.

[Becca Platsky]

That he's an environmental thing. Okay, so we'll get it. You'll learn a lot about Bobby Kennedy from this point in the episode on. Bobby Kennedy was caught on an airplane with heroin. He was a heroin user from the time he was 15 until he was 29. But being part of the Kennedy family. And he had a lot of other brushes with the law, but being part of the Kennedy family, he got away with a lot of it. When he was caught with heroin on the plane, he Ended up going to rehab. And then as part of his penance, the judge sentenced him to community service in the form of working for this organization that was later called Waterkeeper. And that's how he got involved in the Hudson. It was like the Hudson River Fisherman's alliance or something. And that's how he got involved in Riverkeeper and then Waterkeeper, which cleaned up the Hudson. And I don't want to underplay this. He had a huge role in cleaning up the Hudson. He worked for 30 years. He was obviously a lawyer. He took a lot of people to court. He got a lot of money to clean it up. And he was also very instrumental in the fracking ban in New York State because he had kind of lobbied Andrew Cuomo, the then governor, who was also married to RFK junior Sister. He kind of shared, hey, here are the environmental rights risks when it comes to fracking. And that ban has since been lifted. But from 2014 to 2025, there was a ban on fracking in New York State because of. Mainly because of RK Jr. Yeah.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Wow. Yeah. That part of the book was shocking for me because he did some amazing things as an environmental lawyer and that he was really pushing forward, like, protections for a lot of things in people. So when Cheryl was writing about it, I kept thinking to myself, when did he change? Or is all of this untrue? And I have to. I have to fact check all this, which, you know, I went and did. And I think it's the same thing with Cheryl. He didn't change. What's so fascinating is this was a. This was community service. That's how this started.

[Becca Platsky]

And one thing that I noticed, she. She mentioned it a little in the book, but then she said it in a couple podcasts. Was one thing that he really liked was going through the airport and having people come up to him and say, oh, my God, the one work that you did on baiting fracking or the work that you did in the Hudson river, like, he was a big deal. He got invited to all of these galas and people were saying what a do gooder he was. And also his. His siblings will say he really likes the attention. He likes. I have a couple quotes I can pull up, but he likes being a savior. He likes coming in and helping, like, what he perceives as underserved communities. And that gets him high. And I think it could have been something that we all objectively think is good, which is getting money for people who got non Hodgkin's lymphoma because they Were spraying Roundup on Weeds. Yeah, the Monsanto case. But it could also be for something that's questionable like, I don't know, lobbying the government of Samoa to cancel MMR vaccinations that led to the death of 85 people because he likes the adoration he gets from anti vaxxers.

[Chelsea Devonte]

That is so well said. He loves attention. And I will say this is where Cheryl and Olivia have something in common. Because while Olivia's book is not out yet, there's an article in the New York Times about it that I read. And one of her quotes is that like, he loves attention and power in that order. And yeah, I think his Kennedy family of Democrats, he got a lot of positive attention for trying to help the environment. That said, just as easily did so many destructive things at the same time. And years later, because he was never in it to do good. He was always in it for attention. So back to this. Meet cute. The reason why I said it was such genius writing, because when she says it was six years later when I run into him again, she said Bobby had filed for divorce a year earlier. And this encounter was a completely different experience because she was now single. And they start to get to know each other. She has not clocked the year. So you have to do the math in your own head to be like, oh, this is 2011. Bobby's ex wife, who he had filed for divorce from, dies by suicide in 2012. Which means one year into him and Cheryl's relationship, that woman, who is the mother of his children, who Cheryl is the stepmother of, is never mentioned in this book.

[Becca Platsky]

No, never, ever, ever.

[Chelsea Devonte]

It's as if she doesn't exist.

[Becca Platsky]

It's a huge part of her life. How could it not be?

[Chelsea Devonte]

It's a huge part of Cheryl's life that it was proposed that she would be living on the property with Hines and Kennedy. And that is happening with the mother of your stepchildren. So all of these children are going through this and that is never, ever mentioned. In fact, one paragraph later, Cheryl's like, his daughter Kira was having a hard time, so he suggested she come live with me in la and he'd keep the other kids in New York. And it's like, because her mom just died, like. But you're not mentioning it, you're just erasing it from the narrative. So talking about erased narratives, let's go back into his marriage with Mary Richardson, who is the wife before Cheryl, but it's not the first wife, she's the second wife. And Becca, can you please talk us about the circumstances with which he left his first wife for Mary Richardson.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, maybe I'll just send. I'll just read you my text.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

So when he divorced his first wife. Wife. He married. Married Richardson three weeks later, who was already six months pregnant with his kid. That kid, by the way, was the one that dated Taylor Swift, Connor Kennedy.

[Chelsea Devonte]

So he divorces his wife three weeks later, marries his mistress, who is already six months pregnant with his child, who then later in life dates Taylor Swift. This is an unbelievable family line. We've always known the Kennedys kind of touch all corners of the world. But then that wife, who he has multiple children with, he is in the middle of divorcing and a lot of trauma while he's with Cheryl. Cheryl erases this from the narrative, which I think is wild. He also, when he's divorcing Mary Richardson, who is it that finds his secret sex diary? Because the press gets a hold of this man's sex diary where he wrote in code, but put in writing, he cheated on her with 37 different women. And his code for sleeping with a woman was, I got mugged tonight. Another mugging. Another mugging. And that would mean, like, a woman accosted him and he had sex with her and cheated on his wife.

[Becca Platsky]

So it was leaked to the New York Post, a scorecard of how far he got with each women. Yeah, he. He reportedly described himself as being plagued by lust demons and being mugged as if to say, like, it's not my fault. These women came on to me. How could I possibly say no?

[Chelsea Devonte]

The lustyman is in the backseat calling out directions. The brain worm drives. I get mugged by these women and have sex with them.

[Becca Platsky]

What am I to do? I, I, Somebody somewhere describes the relationship that the Kennedy men have with women, and I think, you know, that's accurate. I've been in a place of Murdoch recently, and I don't know if you had watched those documentaries about the Alec Murdoch plan down in. Yeah, that's right. Just the ice cream scoops that can be taken out of your brain when you have absolutely no consequences for your actions. And not only that, but, like, rewarded for bad behavior. And it's a little bit of boys can be boys, but it's also, like, to the end, to, like, on steroids, because you're specifically a Kennedy. I think it'd be interesting, I think, just to give people context, because I hadn't, like, necessarily listed out all of the crazy shit that has happened with RFK Jr. S immediate family and all of the drugs and the overdoses and the cheating. And is that helpful? Would that be interesting if I just went through it quickly?

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah. Becca, give us a hot list.

[Becca Platsky]

Okay, let me go through it quick. So let's start with RFK Jr. S brother Michael, who when he is a 39 year old married father of three, began sleeping with the family's babysitter, who was somewhere between 14 and 16 years old. David Kennedy, his younger brother, dies of a drug overdose in 1984, two days after a book is published. And there's a lot of drama because David has allegedly done a ton of drugs with the reporter and into his drug induced haze had released a lot of like, secrets about the Kennedy Klan. And once that book came out, the Kennedys were really upset because loyalty and keeping secrets is really important to them. Two days later, he dies from a drug overdose. David Kennedy and Michael Kennedy's older brother, Joe Kennedy Jr. Was driving in a car back in the 70s with David Kennedy and his then girlfriend Pam Kelly and her sister. He, I don't know if he was drunk, but at some point he swerved at an intersection, flipped over and paralyzed for life. David Kennedy's girlfriend Pam, cousin William Kennedy was tried and acquitted of rape in a highly publicized 1991 trial. You remember Sha Kennedy. This was just a couple years ago. This is Courtney Kennedy's daughter, died at Ethel's house of a drug overdose in 2019. She was only 22.

[Chelsea Devonte]

This is like also just scratching the surface. It's such a. Oh my God. And people talk about the family being haunted or the Kennedy curse, but. But the comparison, I think, to the Murdoch trials is such a good one in that. Is it like, oh, this haunted family or is it like extreme wealth meets patriarchal privilege? And so they're constantly doing dangerous, horrific, horrible things all the time.

[Becca Platsky]

And also trauma like you wouldn't believe. I mean, like, you just talked about this. I listened to your episode on Sister Wives and I was telling you, like I'm a Sister Wives historian and I think one of the things that's becoming incredibly clear with that family is the trauma of being one of 18 kids. Like, and RFK Jr. Is one of 11.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

And watched his father get assassinated four or five years after his uncle got assassinated.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

That type of trauma that not only is never addressed or talked about. Remember, he's like from one of the most famous Irish Catholic families in the country. And not to stereotype, the Kennedys are certainly known for pushing things under the rug, known for not talking about things, things known for loyalty above all else. And when you have this incredible trauma and nobody's talking about it, that can feel very isolating. Yeah. So when people talk about RFK and his feelings about conspiracy theories, I'm like, yeah, his father was assassinated. And the conspiracy theories around that, I mean, he doesn't even believe that the person who's currently in jail for life for killing his father is the one who actually did it. And I understand why he would feel that way. He took Monsanto to trial and in the trial uncovers a huge conspiracy about Monsanto, one of the biggest agriculture brands in the world, in a massive cover up, in a massive conspiracy at the highest levels so that people die.

[Chelsea Devonte]

So he believes in that. That like the conspiracy theories around death and power players and things like that.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Also his brain is. And who scrambled from trauma from childhood on and drugs from heroin, doing heroin at 14, which I think is like, that's the real headline. And the headline we know is the brain worms. Because he. For anyone who's like, why do they keep mentioning brain worms RFK in his own words, Bobby boy is like, I had a brain worm, but it only ate a little bitty bit of my brain. And everyone was like, wow, this is why this guy is absolutely nuts. He had brain worms. It was a parasite. Which the way Cheryl writes about it, she's like, it is not that uncommon to have a parasite when you do as much traveling as him. And also Bobby would be like, like, we're eating live turtles today. Like, let's do it, let's ride. So whatever he was putting in his body could have had a parasite. The fact that there was one in his brain is highly sus. But that language is different than like, I had a brain worm who just ate a bitty bit. And she's like, someone uncovered it from his divorce trial and made it into a big headline. It's like, no. In his divorce proceedings, he said, I can't give this woman money because I have brain worm eating my brain brain.

[Becca Platsky]

And by the way, if I could just add too. I don't think the brain worm is that big of a deal. And I actually don't even think the like taking roadkill from the side of the road and putting it in your car is that big of a deal. I'm actually pro people doing weird. I think it's like, what makes us fun as humans. And I. I don't know. There's part to me that I'm like, let's talk about the heroin.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah. Not the bear and not the brainworm.

[Becca Platsky]

Let people be weird. Like, I'll give you.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I'll give you brainworm and I'll give you roadkill. I'm not giving you the bear. But yes, I do think the headline should be heroin use at 15, not some brain worm that he trying to use to not pay child support. Which, by the way, I would love to see an animated cartoon that you could play for divorced children. I would have benefited from this. Of a brainworm dancing about why your dad can't pay child support, telling you all the reasons why.

[Becca Platsky]

Dad.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Oh, my God, is this our new venture? Okay, so she said, I returned to Los Angeles on cloud nine, blah, blah, blah. He was living in a world completely unfamiliar to mine. He was a prominent environmental attorney, fighting in injustices for people who had no voice. He traveled around the globe with kings and lived in the wilderness with Indian tribes. I was like, what vague fairy tale language? Okay, we've. All right. There were actual words of real things he had done. But you wrote kings and Indian tribes. Nothing about him was ordinary except maybe his pleated khakis. I couldn't wait to see him again. He's stepdad energy man. He like, takes her on boats down the river with roadkill in his van to show her the Statue of Liberty as the sun rises and tells her how he cleaned up the river and is the water keeper. And she's like, oh, my God, I'm in love with you. What a man. And they're all of a sudden, they're together and what does Bobby want to do? Bobby wants to, quote, reconnect with Castro.

[Becca Platsky]

Oh, yes. Oh, my God, the Cuba of it all.

[Chelsea Devonte]

How is he in the Trump administration when he is homies with Fidel Castro and socialism is their Krypton? I like, how is he? I know they've all just decided there's no rules. And this is the week that. That maybe Donald Trump sucked Bill Clinton's dick at Epstein's house. You know, so really anything is possible.

[Becca Platsky]

But what do you mean, though? That reminds me, I did wanted to go back and refresh myself on JFK in Cuba, and I didn't do that, but maybe next time. But I remember pre him being involved in the Trump administration. That's why it was such a big

[Chelsea Devonte]

deal when he's a Democrat. He was a Democrat. I mean, was he.

[Becca Platsky]

He was like, there's. It's not like that unusual.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I'm just surprised that no one within Trump's party or conservative circles cared enough to get RFK out of his place at the table by using The Fidel Castro connection. I'm just. Yeah, no one cared. No one. They were like, yeah, bring him on in. This is great. We'd love to have, you know, Kennedy here or whatever. Well, here's the thing.

[Becca Platsky]

Listen. Obama was going to make take RFK Jr. In 2008, his EPA administrator, the head of the EPA, and there were Republican senators at the time who said, no, he's way too radical. RFK Jr is about as left as you can be.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yes, that is. It's just so shocking. And again, we just have to remember wherever the attention goes, because he does not have a theology or moral compass. He has a, like, where am I getting attention? Because he was born as a Kennedy. He went towards Democrats, but would have gone anywhere else and did and had, has and is currently.

[Becca Platsky]

No, I mean, when you're in that environment, you don't have the time or energy or self reflection to actually create like a set of values for yourself. And like, who even are you?

[Progressive Insurance Announcer]

Right?

[Becca Platsky]

You're just like a descendant of Joe Kennedy Senior.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

Like, oh, my God, that family. We. We got to do more about that because it's like, it's. There's so much.

[Chelsea Devonte]

We've got to come back and read the Kennedy women book, because that's been on my list for a long time. Okay, well, back in Cuba, you know, we could talk about Fidel Castro, we could talk about socialism. Instead, Cheryl's gonna take three pages to tell us how a woman on the beach braided her hair against her will and braided her daughter cat's hair. And you know, this is like the white woman cornrows that you get on the beach on an exotic vacation. But Cheryl's like, no, I don't want braids. But then they just happened to her. Bobby Kennedy comes back from visiting with Fidel and he's like, let's go. You look horrible. And she's like, I know. I got my hair braided against my will. And the woman is like, okay, that'll be 70 DOL dollars. And Bobby Kennedy in Spanish is like, that's too expensive. We fail. It's very ugly. And we're not paying you that. And she's like, if you're not paying me that, I'm calling the cops. And Bobby's like, yes, sick. Instead of us richest family in America here to visit Fidel Castro paying this woman $70 for braiding two white ladies heads of hair. Okay, Regardless of if they wanted it, it happened. And just going about your day, Cheryl, him, they love you. It. They go to Havana court with this woman who braided their hair in order to not pay her $70. Which by the way, this is very like rich white people in another country. Energy of like, this is too expensive. You couldn't get your hair braided here for $70. That is expensive. It's a lot of work. And anyways, he goes to court and tells the judge, my wife looks really ugly, she didn't want these braids. And the judge is like, yeah, don't pay that woman $70. Go about your day. And they all leave it.

[Becca Platsky]

Maybe one of your listeners can tell us who is more familiar with Cuba Dusty justice. But they've just trials on demand for petty crime. Like what, what the. Like, what do you mean? You were just in front of the judge 20 minutes later. Like, there's no process. The other thing is like, for such, for such world travelers, I can't play. What, you're gonna accidentally, accidentally get your hair braided? Listen, like, what do you mean? Have you ever heard of a scam, like, you ever go to like any, any city center, if you got your picture taken taken with Elmo in Times Square and then they ask you for $5, you're going to go to the judge. Like, like, it's just how things work.

[Chelsea Devonte]

That is exactly what I was thinking. You being world class travelers who fly your skis places, okay, so you guys travel, you got a bag for your special skis, okay? And you've taken your own private planes. You don't know how to spot this. And secondly, while getting caught in it, can't even recognize the wealth disparity leading to this to happen. For them to come after tourists in these countries as you are ruining the country and you just give the $70 and maybe there are people out there being like, no, you got scammed, you shouldn't. But this, me, me, I'm handing over the $70. Yes, here you go. I sat there as you braided every piece of my head. Here is $70.

[Becca Platsky]

And as a thin haired girl, I can see, I see one in Cheryl Hines. I know it didn't take up that long.

[Chelsea Devonte]

That long?

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, it's crazy. I mean, I just. Again, this is just no self reflection. What are you trying to show us, Cheryl? Who are you? And that was actually my question for you, Chelsea, is who is she writing this for? Like, who does she think? Her audience.

[Chelsea Devonte]

That goes back to the very beginning. I cannot wrap my head around why this memoir happened. I guess money. Even though it doesn't seem like a lot of money, but yes, my My biggest fear is that she thinks this memoir is for the people and that it does a good job explaining anything. And if she believes in that. I'm so worried for her intelligence emotionally and mentally.

[Becca Platsky]

I don't think she's smart.

[Chelsea Devonte]

That is. It is unbelievable that you would put this piece of writing out and that this is what you would choose to include in your memoir. Again, you're in Havana, Cuba with Fidel Castro and you're taking three pages, which is longer than you're going to talk about your husband's affair, to talk about how a woman braided your hair and you went to court overpaying her. What you probably spend on one loaf of bread at your Cape Cod farmer's market. I want to go on to some more terrible writing. This is how chapter 12 begins. There's a famous line in Ernest Hemingway's the Sun Also Rises quote, how did you go bankrupt? Quote, two ways, gradually and then suddenly. So you're like, oh, wow, okay, we're talking about bankruptcy. My journey had been a slow, steady climb. But with luck, forbearance, faith and hard work, I had built the life of my dreams. A fulfilling acting career, a close knit family and friends that kept me endlessly entertained and loved. All while being with a man who captured my heart and imagination. It had taken me 20 years to get here, but I felt completely content and grateful. In the span of a year, my life was about to take a series of life changing turns. I wasn't going bankrupt, but my life changed with head turns, learning speed. So I said, I'm sorry, are you using the Ernest Hemingway bankruptcy quote to talk about how happy and good your life is?

[Becca Platsky]

It was so. You know, it's funny.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

That. That made no sense. I was like, oh, she's bankrupt. Oh, let's hear about it. The Ernest Hemingway thing is really interesting that she brings up because he famously married and divorced several women and cheated on his next spouse while he was with his current spouse. That happened four times. Times. He was also an alcoholic. He also was very similar to RFK Jr. In that he loved adventure and he had pretty severe CTE and he actually ended up dying by suicide. There's a lot of similarities between RFK Jr and. They're not great.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Not good ones. That. Yeah. That's amazing. And if she knew that connection, I. You'd blow my cord off. I don't think she does.

[Becca Platsky]

Rich people love quoting Ernest Hemingway, but they don't. I don't really understand almost as much

[Chelsea Devonte]

as they love quoting Abraham Lincoln. I'm surprised there's not an Abraham Lincoln quote in here. There is another quote from Oscar Wilde on the next page, which is the very essence of romance is uncertainty. That's Bobby. He is extreme in every way. Blah, blah, blah. Basically, my life is filled with romance. I said, wow, one quote can ruin your life, huh? Because if the essence of romance is uncertainty, and that's how you're telling yourself your life is romantic, because you live in a fucking chaos machine. We gotta burn all quote books, man.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, I don't know. Is my husband gonna cheat on me with 36 women or 37 women?

[Chelsea Devonte]

What's going on? So they get married. And there was one quote I liked about this where she's talking to Ethel, who is Grandma Kennedy, and they were gonna elope, and Ethel couldn't believe they didn't want a wedding. And she said, well, it's my second marriage and it's Bobby's third. And she said, yes, but it's your first marriage to each other. And I said, yeah, that could get me planning a wedding, I bet.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah. I thought that was sweet.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I was like, that's really nice. All right.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, I could.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I could see me being like.

[Becca Platsky]

I was like, in this family, that's pretty standard.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah. She's like, it so party. Another paragraph starts with this sentence. I didn't expect animals to feature so prominently in our lives. She then tells a story about Bobby charging at a yak. The yak charging at her. A story where he and his daughter had to run through a swarm of bees because he'd taken her across some hill and the only way back was through bees. And his daughter's like, it's my favorite memory with him. And she's like, why? And she's like, because we did it together. And Cheryl's like, oh, so it didn't hurt? She's like, no, we got stung. It was painful. There are bees in my shoes and in my mouth. But, like, my dad and I did that together. And I said, you know, maybe I'm a lucky gal for having no memories with my father, rather than the best one being the time he made me run through a thousand bees. That's her best memory.

[Becca Platsky]

You could die from that. I don't know if you've ever seen the movie My Girl. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Chelsea Devonte]

The other stories are like, he picks up roadkill off the road again, as we said we were going to give him a nap. Then another story is he saw a bear be killed by another car. A car hit a bear. He then picked up that Bear put it in his car. He then went drinking with his buddies in New York City who then decided to put the bear in Central park with a bike over it as if the bear had been hit by a bike. And they thought that would be funny. This was a mystery years ago that this then got uncovered as being Bobby Kennedy Jr's fault when he told it to. Who? Who did he tell it to? Do you remember, Becca?

[Becca Platsky]

No, I don't. Was it Joe Rogan?

[Chelsea Devonte]

It was Roseanne Barr. Oh, Roseanne Barr wearing MAGA cosplay. She's in a creme sweater. She's got blonde hair. It's literally curled out with like a 1 inch curling iron. She's like, brought RFK to her house because she wants to be MAGA and she's like. She's literally like holding a tray of muffins and he's telling her the story of how he dropped a dead bear in Central park and people finally make the connection that he's the man behind the bear mystery. You psycho. You psycho. Becca's fine with it. Becca's fine with it. Come back.

[Becca Platsky]

I'm not. I just. I'm just again, pro people being weird. And I think we don't have enough weird people. No.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Okay. What do you think of the whale?

[Becca Platsky]

Wait, I don't remember the whale.

[Chelsea Devonte]

The whale is. Well, Cheryl didn't include it in the book. The whale is. When his daughter talked about, in an interview with like, Town and Country magazine about how when she was like, I don't know, she was like six or nine, he hears about a dead whale washing up on the beach, gets a chainsaw. He chainsaws off the whale's head, puts the body of the whale on top of their car. They have to wear plastic bags over their heads inside the car because the whale quote juice is dripping on them as people on the road are honking and mad at them again. What did you do with the whale carcass? Also, how do you get a bear and a whale on top of your car? This is a multiple person job.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah. Like what kind of car?

[Chelsea Devonte]

What are you doing with it? I mean, I don't.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, I don't know. There's so many people who just do shit with live animals that I'm just like, I don't know.

[Chelsea Devonte]

You're just thrilled that they were dead. Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

There's just this like two sentences that I loved.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yes.

[Becca Platsky]

They're driving in his minivan, which apparently reeked because he always had animal carcasses inside of it. He goes, there's a bird in the road. Cheryl's. I hadn't seen it. He got out, picked up the bird, checked all the feathers on one wing, then the other, then said to the bird, you don't have any broken feathers. You're fine. You can fly. Then he tossed it in the air and it flew away. That was, like, one of the only things in this book that made me guffaw.

[Chelsea Devonte]

That was. I mean, she. Okay. It's actually really. You're right. The animal stuff. If the only animal that was harmed is the worm that ate some of his brain, then I guess they're kind of okay stories. But I think the way she describes it and the fact that he's an environmental lawyer is. Hold on. There's actually. I have to. I have to read this part. So she wrote this. It's not easy understanding Bobby's relationship with animals. He has a love for them like no one I've ever met. He loves the live ones and also finds the dead ones interesting. Why does he bring home dead snakes, turtles, alligators, birds, whale heads, et cetera, et cetera? I don't know. Why did my brother wrestle an alligator on the side of the road? I couldn't tell. You guys are weird.

[Becca Platsky]

But he.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Sorry. Guys are weird actually is my favorite sentence in the whole. That should have been the memoir title. Guys Are Weird by Cheryl Hines. He said, I've never seen him kill an animal. So I guess. Guess. I guess you are like this. That's nice. It's like, okay, well, I guess that's nice. But then she wrote this. She said, he really does have a way with animals. It's almost as if he speaks their language. One time we parked at the beach, and as we made our way toward the water, we saw people running away. My instinct was to get back in the car and find another spot, but Bobby picked up his pace to see what was going on. He asked a guy what was happening. Quote, there's a skunk down there. Everyone's clearing out. He said, of course. Bobby immediately beeline toward the skunk. Skunk. Hey, I just got this car. I don't really want to drive home with you after you've been sprayed. I said, as he walked away and calmly approached the skunk. The beachgoers who were heading out stopped to see what this crazy guy was going to do with the skunk. I was also curious. The skunk stopped, turned to Bobby, and raised her tail. Everyone gasped. Bobby and the skunk just stared at each other, neither of them moving. After a few minutes she put her tail down and started walking again. Bobby walked beside her. Her. Every few steps, she'd stop, look at him, and raise her tail. When she would decide he wasn't a threat to her, she'd lower her tail and start walking again. They just kept walking side by side until he gently guided her off the beach into a grassy area away from all the people. Here's my question for you. Is this a metaphor? And is Cheryl the skunk?

[Becca Platsky]

I. I think Cheryl's the emu. I think Cheryl's like, then you're gonna

[Chelsea Devonte]

have to tell people who the emu is.

[Becca Platsky]

They at one point have an emu that lives in their backyard. RFK doesn't threaten animals, but Cheryl Hines does. And she says at one point, she's going to hit the emu over the head with a shovel.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah, or that. Or that. It's the emu or her. And he finally chooses. Yeah, yeah, the emu. Just terrorizing the lawn as someone threatens it. Yeah, maybe that I. Yeah, maybe, man. So she then talks about how the pandemic happens, and this is really when they should get a divorce. Course. But Cheryl doubles down on the madness that starts to occur in her house, and she starts writing again in the memoir of her life. She took precious paragraphs of her 257 pages to write things like this. On the other hand, we saw people fighting in public places because they didn't like the way someone was wearing their mask or not wearing one at all. There were definitely aspects of it that didn't seem to make sense. You had to wear a mask on the plane, but you could pull it down and take a bite of food and pull it back up. Up. I would have done anything at that point to avoid creating more anxiety for someone else, though. So I just went along with the rules. I said, your brain can't understand why. Why it would be okay to take a bite of food, but, like, mostly keep your mask on for the spread of germs. Like, do not watch an animated germ video in Florida elementary school. Like, we have no basic understanding of germs.

[Becca Platsky]

She does this a lot in the Tucker Carlson interview, too, where she's like, I just don't understand why people were so cra. And I'm like, you're saying this now in 2025? And like, yes, some of the things that happened were weird in 2020, but we can all understand that. We all. We all did go a little crazy and, like, there were things that didn't make sense. But for you to act like you Were confused then. I don't think is honest.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I also don't think it's honest to say you're confused now. Like, yes, there were weird things that happened. Happened is one of them that you could pull your mask down to eat food one. No, that still scientifically makes sense. Point out some of the other crazy things that happened that, like, are true problems. And instead she's On a level 101 United Airlines mask debate in her memoir.

[Progressive Insurance Announcer]

Right?

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah. Like, talk about kids not being able to play on the playground. Like, that would be a good one. You're absolutely right.

[Chelsea Devonte]

It's so weird. Then this is when she's talks about. Amidst all the grim talk, talk of death and disease, I managed to find a new diversion that could make me laugh until I cried. Comedian Tig Notaro and I launched Tig and Cheryl the True Story Podcast. And then she's talking about vaccines as she's talking about this podcast. And then she said the podcast was never supposed to be political. And yet I guess it had to be because of who I was married to, even though it made no sense. And the podcast went away and she wrote. The hostility towards Bobby within my industry became deafening. People warned me about losing work. Some of my friends started to grow distant. A few of them disapproved of Bobby so intensely that it became too emotionally challenging for them to stay close. As Bobby continued to rattle cages, I began getting heat for choosing to stay married to him. It was around that time we decided to take a break from recording Tig and Cheryl True Story. Our show was never political. It was only meant to be entertaining. And we did not want to get caught up in the controversial content conversations swirling around. We. I had never felt the sort of genuine personal connection to so many people before as I had with our listeners. But after 10 million downloads, we said goodbye to the snark bulls. It was heartbreaking, but it seemed like the right thing to do. Neither Tig or I wanted to get bogged down in politics. It would prove inevitable for me, though. And.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, well, she lost her advertisers. That's what happened.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Okay, so. Because all I can think of right now is this administration actively fights against the LGBTQ community and harms their lives politically, both socially and through laws. And Tig is a queer person, and you are helping an administration that is hurting the queer community. How they gonna. How they gonna hop on the mic every day?

[Becca Platsky]

I know it's. It's really frustrating, and she's just continuing. This is where I'm talking about the Naivete of it all where I'm like, I don't believe.

[Chelsea Devonte]

No, this is all fake. This or chosen or it's all chosen ignorance of like it would be too hard to face the truth. Therefore I'm just going to pretend to be extremely stupid. She said, as tired as I was of hearing it, I could understand the two sides of the vaccine argument. And then she goes on to like say the dumbest things you've ever read. She does both sides ism. But like she doesn't do very good job for both sides. She said. It felt inconceivable to me. I worried that Bobby's political campaign would get bogged down in the vaccine debate. You fucking think his campaign is built on the vaccine debate? What are you talking about?

[Becca Platsky]

It's crazy. And like, you know, we just did an episode on Johnson and Johnson and in the episode it's really interesting because I think like there are Johnson and Johnson's vaccine, there were legitimate questions about efficacy and also in the factory, how clean everything was like there, there was legitimate questions about that. And I think in general, I think the Johnson and Johnson book opened my eyes about corporations, specifically pharmaceutical companies pushing out drugs and treatments that not only don't help people, but kill people. And the government goes along with it and we're told don't, you know, don't question doctors, et cetera. And I think that there is a valid questioning and argument that you could have about these corporations. It's so clear to me that Bobby Kennedy's isn't tied down to that as an argument because that is a good argument. He just likes the idea that he can get all these maha people to like him and the anti vaxxers to like him and hold him up as a hero or a savior to them because it's convenient. And because, you know, he talks about mercury in vaccines. Right. That's not an issue. It's not something that actual scientists will tell you is a problem. And he gets really frustrated when it's brought up up because he knows he's full of shit. The Tylenol thing.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Like Tylenol being tied to autism. To autism, yes. And vaccines being tied to autism.

[Becca Platsky]

And there are issues with Tylenol when it comes to overdoses leading to liver failure that they're not being clear about. Right. But he knows this. Like he, he knows he's not a dumb guy. But it's so clear. I mean here, what, what happened with the Tylenol thing is the administration said, said back in April that they were going to Find a cause of autism in September. In September, they chose Tylenol. That was it. And if you listen to that press conference, it's so clear. He's like, well, the Amish, they don't have autism. The only difference between us and them is the fact that they don't take Tylenol.

[Chelsea Devonte]

It's also so ridiculous because autism was discovered years and years and years and years and years and years before Tylenol was even invented. Like, so you just, you can't correlate the two. He's also later given quotes being like, there's not sufficient evidence to say this, but it doesn't matter because the headline goes away. She writes this. Somehow healthcare, something so personal and vital, had become political. And Bobby was at the forefront, end of chapter. The kernels of truth where you could have valid arguments about certain things were so exploited by the conservatives to further cause harm under the guise of having a valid argument or debate or a scientific process to like make things better. And I think that's still what makes me like, I'm like, I don't even want to get into this because I know it's being done in bad faith. And I think the rest of Cheryl's book is being written in bad faith as well. She writes, I didn't know if I was being iced out of Hollywood because no one was working after 2020, but it's like, clearly, clearly these things are going hand in hand. And then he's like, I decided to run for president.

[Becca Platsky]

And.

[Chelsea Devonte]

And she's like, we looked into each other's eyes looking for answers. But okay, he's running for president. And she literally goes out to Donna Karen and buys the first lady dress, which is a three quarter sleeve boat neck fitted midi length dress in a jewel tone. They all fucking wear it. I don't know how they all know to do it. And I would say there is a fifth of the book left at this point. And 70% of that fifth of the book is devoted to being mad that they weren't given Secret Service.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, yeah, she's pissed.

[Chelsea Devonte]

She's pissed. I mean, the amount of anger she has for not being given Secret Service protection while he ran for president is probably the one true emotion in this book. Is how I felt. Would you think?

[Becca Platsky]

And you know what? I actually agree with her. I don't. I mean, listen, tell me, tell me.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Because I was like, hey, I. You made me disagree with you. But by making the entire memoir about tweets you wrote, trying to get Secret Service production and how well your Sister in law who was a Kennedy. And the other Kennedy siblings were being mean to Bobby. And then they took a picture of the whole Kennedy family. And the caption of the photo was the whole Kennedy family, but me and Bobby weren't there. And then we still didn't get Secret Service. And I'm just like, this is go skiing. Go go skiing and stop writing this book.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, listen. Other presidential. Major presidential candidates get Secret Service production far before the election. And she goes through and she says, Obama got it 300 days before the election. Whatever. I wouldn't have agreed with her so much before seeing the Mamdani Cuomo election in New York City. And I see the way the Democratic establishment will try to push somebody out that they don't like. Say what you will about RFK Jr. He absolutely had the right to run. And I think the Democratic establishment is very clear that they didn't want that to happen. They were like, we want you to spend all your money on your own personal security and lawsuits. And his dad was murdered.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah. So that you would be corrupt before you can successfully run for Democratic office. Yeah. Here's the thing. I think because the rest of the book is written so poorly and she's spinning pages on both getting her hair braided and like wearing a mask on a plane, it was hard for me to even sympathize with the fact that the dnc, which we all know the Democratic Party, does so so much fucked up shit to Democrats that they don't like who the majority of populations support. Like Bernie, like bomb Donnie. But this book wasn't getting me there. This book.

[Becca Platsky]

No.

[Chelsea Devonte]

And I will also say, the way you just laid that out, I'm like, okay, okay, fine. Fuck. Good point. Cheryl was just like, my cousin got a security guard. He did it. I had to call Gavin to Becker again. Oh, those guys are hot. It was nice to have someone to talk to while my husband was cheating on me. I'm just like. She's like, I couldn't believe my. And then. And then we still didn't have a bodyguard. And I'm just like, I can't do this again. You're running out of pages. You can't talk about the Secret Service for your entire memoir. But then we reached a section where, here's my note. My note is rich lady go bye bye. She said, regardless of what would play out politically, I had four great years ahead of me with Kat and the rest of my family. Only name checks one kid. I decided to not let politics cover the joyful times. I had ahead of my me. I thought back to the feeling I had during the recount of Gore vs Bush election in 2000. I detested how it was handled and how it was settled. I had to disconnect from politics. Not that I had been extremely involved in the first place, but I had to accept that it was out of my control. The country moved forward with President Bush. A lot of great things happened in my life during those years. I was cast on Curb youb Enthusiasm, nominated for an Emmy, got married to Paul, and I had Kat. I can't imagine what those experiences would have been like if they I had started and ended every day angered by politics. I said, how lovely for you, Cheryl Hines. You put your head in the sand then. You put your head in the sand now. Well, watch out because there's going to be a brain wormy in there and he's going to get your husband again.

[Becca Platsky]

She's going get over it by I'm

[Chelsea Devonte]

going to go start my health care brand with my daughter Cat and my other stepchildren, who I love equally.

[Becca Platsky]

But don't name in this book her skincare company called Heinz and Young, which sounds like a law firm, which sounds

[Chelsea Devonte]

like the name of a pedophile case. Heinz and Young, the skin car company. Get out of here. She starts it with her daughter Kat. Oh, boy. Okay. Well, she name checks a few people on her way out of the memoir. One is Bradley Whitford.

[Becca Platsky]

Oh, God. Yeah.

[Chelsea Devonte]

She hates him because he tweeted, hey. At Cheryl Hines. Way to stay silent while your lunatic husband throws his support behind the adjudicated rapist who brags about stripping women of their fundamental rights. Gutsy. Great example for the kids. Profile and courage. And this is basically when you know he's running as a Democrat. The Democratic Party doesn't want that. They try to sabotage him, possibly successfully. He's like, great, I'm an independent now. And then at the last second is like, actually, I'm Maga. I'm Maha. Whatever Daddy Trump wants. And he throws his support behind. Trump obviously is now in office. There's so many pictures of Cheryl and his him smiling behind Daddy Trump. Cheryl's like, I met Trump. She writes about him with awe. And she said Trump had just been shot at. Quote, we decided to put politics aside and meet with him. How do you even get away with writing something like that?

[Becca Platsky]

These guys are just grifters. Like, that's what it ends up being like.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Then be better at the grift. It's get hire a better ghostwriter.

[Becca Platsky]

Once rfk gave his Anti Black Act's statement. The charity who runs the Children's Health Defense, doubled its revenue in 2020 to 6.8 million. His annual salary went up to 510,000 in 2022 from 40,000 in 2016. Yeah, I mean, I think they were just like, money, Griff, we're running out of money. Cheryl can't get an acting job. All the other Kennedys are cutting us off. We are not being invited to speaking events.

[Chelsea Devonte]

We don't get to go to fancy parties.

[Becca Platsky]

30s we don't get to go to. And. And a lot of people did this at the time. Like, a lot of people are glomming onto Maha because it's a lot of rich, wealthy white people will give them money.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah. Like, yeah. And it's an easy grift because you don't have to have science on your side. You don't got to really back it up. Thank you for calling out the financials on that because if that's. Yeah, you're right. It's just money. It's the only thing that can make sense. The other name check in the book that happens is she says some late night talk show host thought I was blinking too much. Or perhaps I was blinking in SOS and Morse code. Just the mere fact that I was supporting my husband was motivation enough for Lori David, Larry's ex wife, to post on social media, quote, Cheryl Hines and her best and most watched performance yet as the dutiful, adoring wife, setting women back decades. She then follows that up by writing the sentence, Bobby was sworn in as the Secretary of Health and Human Services by President Trump on February 13, 2025. Regardless what anyone else thinks, I feel good about putting my family first and I always will. Becca, will you share with the listener some of the photos you sent me of Lori David and Bobby's no longer with us, ex wife, Mary Richardson.

[Becca Platsky]

So Lori David is also an environmentalist and they knew RFK Jr. From those circles. There are many pictures. I always, in my research, I go to Getty Images. You always go to Getty Instagram that they don't want you to see. You always got Kimberly Guilfoy. Always the same thing. But there are many pictures of Lori David and Mary Richardson, Mary Kennedy, together. They seem like they're hugging very closely. I want to know more like, what does Lori David know about Mary Richardson and how that all went down? The Richardson family apparently blames RFK Jr. For her death. And what does she think about that?

[Chelsea Devonte]

Well, yeah, and also, again, like, she leaves out so much important information. Like she's like, well, Larry David's ex wife said this to me. It's like you're not mentioning that she's extremely close with RFK and was one of an extremely close friend of his ex wife who died by suicide. Like, you're just leaving that out of why she would decide to say this, but you are putting it in your memoir as if it's like something petty she's saying. Yeah, I mean, yeah, I guess it is petty. It's wild.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, there's context there. And I also want to know, like, did Lori David condone this relationship? Did she say, oh, he's getting divorced. You should meet Cheryl Hines? Like, there's a lot of questions there about the six of them that I want.

[Chelsea Devonte]

They're in a close circle. Yeah, absolutely. Well, we're at the end of the book and on page 241, she talks about the Olivia Nutsy affair. Now, while Olivia's book is gonna of supposedly spent a lot of time talking about this affair, Cheryl, I think, tried to delete it. She said it had been a year and a half since Bobby joined the political frenzy that kept him on the road for the majority of that time. The latest story was leaving me, with me feeling being unimportant to him. It felt like a game people were playing and I wasn't interested in participating. It was the end of the line for me. She's writing around it so hard. I'm trying to find the part where she even writes about it. She said. Said. A few weeks later, I took a break from Heinz and Young and went to Italy with my daughters. She's been to Italy multiple times in this book. Again, it's only 257 pages. I was happy to be 6,000 miles away from the loud world of the election. I wasn't there for very long, however, before Bobby called to warn me of another breaking story. At first it was an ambiguous story about a political journalist who said she had some communication with a former reporting subject that had turned personally, stating that it was never physical. There was a lot of speculation as she was referring to Bobby. The press was running wild. My first reaction was a wave of indifference. I didn't care what had happened, who said what, what was real, what wasn't real, who was involved or why they were involved. I was fine with letting them all continue the drama and the politics with. Without me, literally. She says she didn't care. She didn't care. And she said she comes home from Europe, Bobby picks her up from the airport, we pulled into a nearby parking lot and asked security if they could give us some privacy. We probably talked for an hour while the security team stood watch over the car. Wow, that's a long time to talk about your husband cheating on you. A whole hour. I loved. I seemed like the only threads connecting me to Bobby were directly tied to all of our kids. I loved each one of them so much. I respected and adored them too much not to listen to what Bobby had to say. For the next few days, we stopped everything and drilled down on the truth. We locked ourselves in our room and laid it all on the table. We talked about all the painful times we'd been through the last few years and what we meant to each other. We analyzed how we'd become disconnected and what had kept us together. We went through all of the details about the latest story, what was true and what wasn't. Through those soul searching days, we tightened our ties that bind. The end. Never discusses the affair again.

[Becca Platsky]

I read that as he did cheat on me emotionally. They call it, I think, a digital affair. Digital emotional affair. But we're fine. We're over it. So don't bring it up because we're fine. We're even closer than ever.

[Chelsea Devonte]

And I. What I think the quiet part is, is. Well, shit, he's done much worse than that. That didn't care then, don't care now.

[Becca Platsky]

Anyways.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Get rid of that emu and I'm good to stay married to this psychopath who ruins lives and I'd like to ruin them with you. I don't think she's a Melania. I think she's so complacent that she is complicit. And like she. Yeah, she does not care that he had an affair. Cuz she hints at like we believed in different things. We disagree on things politically. I didn't like what he was doing and I didn't like that he ran for president. We didn't see each other for like two years and that's that.

[Becca Platsky]

I mean, the crazy thing is like. Yeah. I think it's not the worst thing he's ever done. It's not. I mean there are a lot of famous people, politicians included, his uncle included, that cheated on their wives.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

And it was a thing. I mean, yeah. Jackie Kennedy, I think she was like,

[Chelsea Devonte]

it's not a secret sex diary and 37 women.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Just a bunch of texty text messages. It could have been with a better health therapist for all I know. Just texting some lady some shit. I'll Never. See? Fine with me. Love, Cheryl. Yeah, I. I think I. I think you're right. I do want to start. I don't know if we're going to do another celebrity memoir awards, but if we did, I would want a category for best word salad metaphor. That says nothing about your divorce. And her and Heather Gay would be up for the best. Heather Gay was like the iceberg crash into the mountain of truth with my husband and I as we sank down. Cheryl has like a table and a drill and some truth. Well, I wrote this. I said, worst ending ever. Let's read the last paragraph. It's impossible to know what the next chapters of my life will be. I couldn't have predicted any of my previous chapters, so there's no point in speculating about my future. But if, quote, the very essence of romance is uncertainty, well, at least it's sure to be full of romance.

[Becca Platsky]

Bye.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Bye, Cheryl. Yeah. Okay, let's do the booktool test. Ready? First question. Was the author vulnerable in the sharing of her trip?

[Progressive Insurance Announcer]

No.

[Chelsea Devonte]

God, I hope not. Or I am worried for her brain. I'm worried for the brain waves and the brain signals. I don't know how you win at a poker tournament and do this book. Really, really great bluffing at poker. Really bad bluffing in the book, I'd say.

[Becca Platsky]

I mean, from the books that we've done together, this is the least. I thought Kimberly Guilfoyle was Kimberly Gargoyle gave more. Oh, way more. Double.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, you're right.

[Chelsea Devonte]

No, this was pretty brutal. Second question. Was it entertaining to read?

[Progressive Insurance Announcer]

Read?

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, it was entertaining to read. I would put it at like a 6, but the post read deep dive was an 11 for me.

[Chelsea Devonte]

You were on a research high with this one. I loved it.

[Becca Platsky]

This was so fun.

[Chelsea Devonte]

This was so funny. This. It was hilarious. Yeah, I had a great time. Final question. Did reading this book elevate your life in any way?

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah. I don't know. I learned a lot more about the Kennedys, which is really interesting to me. Maybe only in that sense. If I read this book in a vacuum, I would say no. But it gave me a jumping off point and a reference point to look up a lot of things that I wouldn't have otherwise looked up. And so that is valuable to me.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I think your research elevated your life, but I don't know that the book elevated your life.

[Becca Platsky]

It's fair. It's fair.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah. Yeah. Did the book elevate my life?

[Becca Platsky]

No.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Absolutely. I couldn't find. I couldn't find a reason if I tried and usually I do try. I'm not even gonna try this time. No, no, not at all. I mean, again, she copy pasted paragraphs within a book that is extremely short. I think it is bonkers bananas. And I have absolutely no insight into how she could live this life or want this life or want this book out here. I think this book does a terrible job of anything she ever would have wanted it to do. You know, like, you don't think she's happy. We don't believe her about Bobby being a great guy. She doesn't come off great. She doesn't make a bid for a political career. She doesn't make a bid to become a TED Talk speaker. She doesn't pivot her career. She certainly doesn't make you think she's funny and should be in Hollywood. I don't know what she's doing. I don't know what she's doing with the book.

[Becca Platsky]

Yeah, I would be curious if she would even have gotten this book deal if it wasn't for the love anything.

[Chelsea Devonte]

So Olivia Nutzi and her fiance, who is another political journalist, they break up. Up when the story breaks. And when she tells him that she had had this affair with Bobby Jr. She and her former fiance had already sold an advanced book deal to talk about being on the road together during the election. And they were going to co write this political book. They had already gotten the book advance. One of them was going, or both of them were going to have to pay that back unless they gave a book. They were like, okay, well, we're not doing that book together. We broke up. But so Olivia is then like, okay, well, I'm not really a journalist anymore because she lost her career for this affair. Again, if you're gonna lose your career over an affair, at least get the dick. At least get the dick. You're. You're going for a dickless affair to blow up your journalist career. There's no sex scene that's good enough. I mean, God, maybe, but I doubt it. At least get eyes on the penis. Get something. Get something to put in your memoir. That's gonna be the last paycheck you receive. So. Seriously, she wrote her memoir, the name Kills Me, American Canto. And that was part of this book deal that she'd already had. She then found out it was coming out within days of Cheryl's book and then pushes it. And again, not smart. Not smart. Get them book sales. Put these books out together, ladies, power in numbers. Hold hands and go for it. Okay, well, I take some of that back. Becca, I guess she was recently hired as the west coast editor of Vanity Fair. Well, okay, Great, great. Well, I guess she didn't need that peen. Ladies, take that as a lesson. You never need the peen. End your life over a text affair, you'll still get yours.

[Becca Platsky]

I'm really curious to read that and see what other gaps we can fill. Yeah.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Which is to say Becca is coming back. We are reading the Olivia Nutzy book, and then we're gonna do a little compare and contrast, you know, a little dueling memoir episode, as is my favorite, only for our bonus subscribers, because we love y' all so much and because Becca is addicted to reading like I am.

[Becca Platsky]

Yes. And I being here, I love your Patreon in particular, is very special. And there's a lot of crossover.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Yeah, there is a lot of crossover. Please plug your podcast to everyone who listens to this one. If you haven't gone and checked out corporate gossip. What is an episode you think the cookies should start with?

[Becca Platsky]

We just did an episode on Outdoor Voices, which was really fun. I always love, like, our millennial nostalgia episodes, so that one was really good. And then also, I think our most popular episode this season was a two parter that we did on Sam Altman and OpenAI, aka the King Dick of Liar Mountain. That one was a real fucking journey and adventure. But basically, we talk about business news, so I'm a CPA and my brother, my co host, is a data scientist. We talk about business news, but we put it in the context of, like, pop culture. We talk about it as if it's, you know, a headline on Page Six. We make it fun, we make it easy and breezy and yeah, we just have of a lot, lot of fun with it. And we have a lot of cookies on our Patreon as well, and some listeners of ours, so I always really appreciate that.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Makes me so happy. Now, as someone who co hosts a podcast with their brother, do you say you relate to Cheryl and her brother as a DJ duo in Florida?

[Becca Platsky]

Oh, believe me. Yeah, like we. Yeah, with our headphones on. Yeah, I mean, that. That was very funny to me. No, but I mean, yeah, the siblings dynamic was so interesting too. I mean, yeah, there's just so much here.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Listen, we're coming back. We're going to discuss more.

[Becca Platsky]

Our family isn't as dramatic as the Kennedys.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Thank God.

[Progressive Insurance Announcer]

Becca.

[Becca Platsky]

I loved it.

[Chelsea Devonte]

So we're going to be back. We have more hot goss coming just for y'.

[Becca Platsky]

All.

[Chelsea Devonte]

And thank you so much for being here. And go check out corporate gossip if you have not yet.

[Becca Platsky]

Thanks Chelsea.

[Chelsea Devonte]

A big thank you to our Senior Managing Producer Christine Christina Lopez, our Executive Producer Jordan Moncada, our Sound Engineer Marcus Hamm and our amazing Associate producer Jaron Padre. I also want to give a huge thank you to our incredible partners over at Thrive Cosmetics and every plate. We will link to those brands in the show notes. Go check them out. Everything else we discussed is also linked in the Show Notes. And if you have questions, thoughts, comments, go to the Patreon sign up. There's a free tier you can join. Leave a comment chat with your fellow cookies. We will keep the book club continuing over there. Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile.

[Becca Platsky]

Now.

[Chelsea Devonte]

I was looking for fun ways to tell you that Mint's offer of unlimited

[Becca Platsky]

premium wireless for $15 a month is back.

[Chelsea Devonte]

So I thought it would be fun if we made $15 bills, but it

[Becca Platsky]

turns out that's very illegal. So there goes my big idea for the commercial.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Give it a [e-mail] Switch upfront payment of $45 for three months, $90 for six months or $180 for a 12 month plan required $15 per month equivalent

[Progressive Insurance Announcer]

to taxes and fees.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Extra initial plan term only greater than 50 gigabytes. Me slow when network is busy. See terms. Traditional home security only alerts you after

[Becca Platsky]

a break in and that's too late.

[Chelsea Devonte]

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[Becca Platsky]

Outdoor Deterrence requires a Simplisafe Active Guard Outdoor protection plan starting at 49. 99amonth.

[Chelsea Devonte]

Visit SimpliSafe.

[Becca Platsky]

Com licenses for alarm license information Tennessee2012.