Jennie Garth’s Memoir I Choose Me (with Doree Shafrir and Elise Hu)

Summary

Glamorous Trash: Jennie Garth’s Memoir I Choose Me (with Doree Shafrir and Elise Hu)

Podcast: Glamorous Trash
Host: Chelsea Devantez
Guests: Doree Shafrir & Elise Hu (Hosts of Forever 35 Podcast)
Episode Date: May 19, 2026
Book Discussed: I Choose Me: Chasing Joy, Finding Purpose and Embracing Reinvention by Jennie Garth (April 14, 2026 release)

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Episode Theme & Purpose

Chelsea Devantez, joined by memoir aficionados Doree Shafrir and Elise Hu, deep-dives into actress Jennie Garth’s second memoir, I Choose Me. The conversation is a witty, incisive “book club” assessment that blends personal insights, pop culture nostalgia, and critical reflections—especially for fans of Beverly Hills 90210. The hosts examine why Garth wrote another memoir, the (lack of) behind-the-scenes scoop, her self-help aspirations, and the missteps and missed opportunities throughout the book.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Expectations vs. Reality: The Disappointing Lack of ‘Tea’

• Early Expectations: Elise, a 90s teen drama fan, looked forward to juicy behind-the-scenes stories from 90210.
  • “I was really interested in reading it…what she was going through. Unfortunately, she did not deliver on all of that.” (Elise, 04:36)
• Underwhelming 90210 Content: The memoir skirts over potentially rich stories—like her real-life relationship with Luke Perry and her fallout with costar Tiffani-Amber Thiessen.
  • “And she had so much freedom there, since Luke Perry is now dead…There’s just nothing.” (Elise, 07:32)
  • “That is not what happened. Tell us what happened with Tiffany.” (Chelsea, 08:30)
• Vague treatment of her dynamic with Shannon Doherty and the 90210 reboot left listeners wanting.
• [06:44–09:57]

2. “Fell Into Acting”—Zero Struggle Story

• Chelsea and guests discuss frustration at Garth’s lackadaisical narrative on how she entered acting, making Hollywood success sound like an accidental stumble.
  • “There’s almost no real reflection about that...it sounds relatively easy. Yes. Which I wonder if that’s the truth.” (Chelsea, 12:15)
• The manager ‘Mr. Showbiz’ as a stock villain is noted but under-explored.
• [10:25–13:25]

3. The Self-Help Structure & Memoir Mash-up

• The memoir is positioned as both a story and a series of “heal yourself” lessons and exercises. The hosts find the “self-help” framework deeply muddled.
  • “Each chapter is about choosing yourself...but really, it just felt like mush.” (Chelsea, 20:03)
  • “The first six chapters are the same self help lesson, which is like, love yourself.” (Elise, 20:22)
• Intermittent “inspirational” charts, lists, and “Oprah Pie Chart” moments feel generic and out of place.
• [20:03–21:26], [41:08–43:05]

4. Marriage and Relationships: Red Flags & Missed Reflection

• Garth’s romantic trajectory (three marriages) is recounted, with guests zeroing in on the spectacle and questionable choices—rushing romance, impulsive remarriage, “love bombing,” and poor boundaries with her children.
• The Peter Facinelli Divorce: Garth’s tumultuous split from her second husband is covered, including a chaotic Arizona therapy session and a near-overdose.
  • “This is a bad, unqualified, shitty therapist who makes your life worse, is like a Dringo in memoirs…Jenny, don’t go get in the car.” (Chelsea, 22:44)
• Rush to Introduce Third Husband (Dave): She introduces Dave to her daughters two weeks after meeting him.
  • “I definitely got, like, big ‘I can’t be alone’ vibes from her, and it made me sad...” (Dorie, 30:43)
  • “This should not happen forever. It should not happen until it is guaranteed...This is so troubling.” (Chelsea, 33:05)
• The rollercoaster of dating—drummers, startup guys, and “foodie” first dates that involve only salted gluten-free noodles.
  • “That has got to be the craziest first date meal I’ve ever heard of.” (Chelsea, 27:03)
• Multiple red flags in her relationship with Dave, including proposed impulsivity and unresolved communication patterns, culminating in learning of her own divorce via TMZ.
• [13:25–16:01], [27:03–37:08]

5. Substance Use, Disordered Eating, and Mental Health

• Garth’s struggles with substance use and body image are discussed but glossed over in the memoir. Sobriety is mentioned late and only in passing.
  • “She glossed over getting sober, because I don’t think she did…” (Chelsea, 24:06)
• Her detailed disordered eating regimens and inconsistent approach to veganism are explored. The hosts note barely-there introspection regarding the roots or recovery process for these issues.
• Mental health crises—including a suicide attempt witnessed by her daughter—are recounted with disturbing lack of reflection and sensitivity.
  • “This is horrendous...This is what your daughter’s gonna carry.” (Chelsea, 44:20)
• [24:25–27:03], [43:27–44:44]

6. IVF and Miscommunication

• Garth’s emotionally and physically taxing IVF journey is recounted, with Dorie (who’s experienced IVF herself) noting a missed opportunity for depth.
  • “She did not do in her memoir...Just wild to miscommunicate that intensely.” (Chelsea, 39:33)
• The couple’s unclear motives about having children add to the narrative of confusion.
• [37:06–40:00]

7. Missed Opportunities and Lack of Vulnerability

• Across themes—friendship loss, divorce, grief over Luke Perry, and motherhood—Garth’s lack of introspection and glossing over of “messy” moments are repeatedly critiqued.
  • “This is a woman who has spent the last 50 some odd years trying...has yet to really become integrated.” (Elise, 40:00)
• Guests analyze her decision not to attend Luke Perry’s funeral as exemplifying avoidant behavior.
  • “She was like, I couldn’t face it. I’m sorry, are you 12? You’re a grown woman.” (Dorie, 45:56)
• [44:44–46:42]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the memoir’s structure:
  “I think because of this self help structure, the idea was like: in this chapter is about choosing yourself...But really, it just felt like mush.” (Chelsea, 20:03)

• On Hollywood beginnings:
  “There’s like almost no real reflection about that...she was just like, here I am.” (Dorie, 12:15)

• On Dave and the wedding night:
  “To me, it feels like your wedding night should be one of those nights [you spend together]...you aren’t even on the same page about how to celebrate your marriage.” (Chelsea, 36:02)

• On the memoir’s lack of depth:
  “Her mission mistakes and missteps seem so obvious, zoomed out, you know, like when we’re looking at it externally, even having to read between the lines because she doesn’t paint that picture. But again, missed opportunity.” (Elise, 40:43)

• On missed healing and emotional impact:
  “It’s your memoir, but this is Luca’s story now. This is something your daughter’s gonna carry.” (Chelsea, 44:20)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [04:36] – Expectations vs. reality of Garth’s second memoir; 90210 tea critique.
• [10:25] – Garth’s career beginnings (“fell into acting”); Mr. Showbiz.
• [13:25] – Discussion of marriages, breakups, and therapy gone wrong.
• [19:55] – Self-help structure; muddled life-lessons and “inspirational” exercises.
• [24:25] – Alcohol struggles and Garth’s avoidance of sobriety narrative.
• [27:03] – Odd dating stories and the infamous salted noodles date.
• [32:40] – Introducing new partner to her kids two weeks in.
• [39:33] – IVF coverage and specter of miscommunication.
• [43:27] – Mental health crisis and Garth’s daughter intervening.
• [45:51] – Skipping Luke Perry’s funeral; unresolved grief and relationships.

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Booktool Test: Was the Memoir Successful?

1. Was the author vulnerable?
   Mixed. Some deeply personal moments are included, but with little reflection or insight. (Chelsea: "yes"; Elise/Dorie: "no") [47:17]
2. Was it entertaining?
   Generally, a struggle to finish—“extractive” of time and energy, not particularly funny or revealing. [47:52]
3. Did it elevate your life?
   Unanimous “no,” except a tiny nod to veganism as a very minor positive takeaway. [48:15]

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Overall Tone & Takeaway

This episode gleefully skewers the missed opportunities and confounding decisions in Jennie Garth’s memoir, with wit, candor, and a clear affection for the genre. While hoping for nostalgic pop culture revelations and genuine reflection, listeners instead discover a messy but not particularly insightful story about self-avoidance, rushed relationships, and surface-level “self-help.”

For 90210 fans, this is more a “study in avoidance” than a backstage tell-all. For memoir nerds, it’s a cautionary lesson in how not to combine self-help and personal storytelling.

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Listen & Connect

• Forever 35 Podcast: wherever podcasts stream (Instagram: @dorreshafrier, @elisewho)
• Glamorous Trash: Patreon, Apple Podcasts, and show notes via Instagram

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Choose you, but maybe choose a different memoir.

Transcript

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[Chelsea Devontes]

Welcome to Glamorous Trash. This is a podcast that book clubs, viral articles, celebrity memoir, trashy discourse to elevate your life. I'm your host Chelsea Devontes. I'm a TV writer, comedian, filmmaker, author and sometimes I'm in stuff too. And today we are book clubbing. I Choose Me Chasing Joy, Finding Purpose and Embracing Reinvention by actor Jenny Garth, released just last month, April 14, 2026. You probably know Jenny Best as Kelly Taylor from the hit 90s teen drama series that leads to lives on forever. That is of course Beverly Hills 90210, which ran for 10 seasons. You also might know her as Val Tyler from what I Like about you, starring Amanda Bynes, which ran for four seasons. And she was also the star, I guess of a CMT reality show which we will get into in the book. And yeah, I gotta tell you, this is actually Jenny Garth's second memoir. Her first was Deep Thoughts From a Hollywood Blonde in 2014. And I gotta tell you, after reading this book, did she need a second one? I don't know you guys, but let me bring my guests in so we can just dive into all of the juice. And here is your trigger warning for talk of suicide, as well as substance use and disordered eating. So always take care when listening. Now let's dive in. Brandon, I can't accept this.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Wait, please.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Dylan.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Have a nice trip.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I can't go with you. Not this time. I've made my choice and I choose me.

[Dorie Shafrier]

I hope you understand.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I'll love you both till the day I die. My guests are Dory Shafrier and Elise Hu, host of the podcast Forever 35. Hi, you both. Hello. Okay, I just want to give some hot, hot credits from your bios. Dorie is a writer and podcaster whose work has been in BuzzFeed News, Rolling Stone, the New York Times, Gawker, the New Yorker. She's also an author and memoir. First novel, Startup was published in 2017 and she just announced her second novel, Cedar Drive, which is so exciting. Congratulations on that.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Thank you so much.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And Elise is a Los Angeles based journalist, podcast host and author who reported for NPR for more than a decade. Her experiences opening NPR's first ever Soul Bureau. Am I reading that right? That's awesome. In 2015 inspired her debut nonfiction book, Flawless Lessons in Looks and Culture from the K Beauty Capital. That's so sick. She's also working on a documentary titled Windswept about teens. Display by the January 2025 LA fires. Wow. I hadn't read your bios yet and I'm like, you both are so cool. Thank you so much for being here.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Thanks for having us.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yes. I know from your podcast producer that you were both memoir fans.

[Elise Hu]

Yes, yes. I mean, we're just both big readers. I love reading. It was really interesting choosing this one in particular because I happened to start it right after finishing Fame Sick, Lena Dunham's memoir, which is so well rendered and well done. And then I went into this and

[Chelsea Devontes]

so it was very jarring.

[Elise Hu]

I do not feel the same way about I Choose Me by Jennie Garth. I was actually excited to read it because I did grow up in the 90s, like during the height of 90210. And then I also saw LA as kind of this culturally aspirational place because I was growing up in St. Louis and then in the suburbs of Texas and Kelly Taylor was like the coolest, cool girl. So I was really interested in reading it and reading like kind of the Tea and that, what she was and what she was going through. Unfortunately, she did not deliver on all of that.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah, I will say we have some. There's probably like four incredibly juicy stories to get into. But for 90210 fans, we will read some of the tea. They might be disappointed. Okay, so let's just dive in. Okay. The very first paragraph goes like this. In 1995, Kelly Taylor, her character on 90210 made a choice. She stood between Brandon and Dylan, two of the most beloved characters on Beverly Hills 90210, and said, I choose me. And my note was, oh, no, because this is the title of the book and it's coming from the 9021 episode. But then it's going to be self help and. And then a few paragraphs later she wrote, this book is about that journey, the hard earned lessons, the painful moments of reckoning, the small decisions that slowly, steadily brought me home to myself. I'm looking back at some of the toughest, darkest moments of my life. Not to dwell or romanticize the pain, but to understand it, to give it context, meaning and purpose. I'm revisiting the confusion, the heartbreak, the pivots, the unravelings, because that's where the real transformation happened. I'm telling the truth about those moments and I'm reclaiming them. In doing so, I hope to remind you that it's never too late to return to yourself, to choose a different path, to write a new ending or to finally begin again. And I do wanna give. She's gonna revisit some really dark moments. And she did give us some pretty intense truths.

[Elise Hu]

She did.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I don't. Yeah, but then that's kind of like the thrust of the book. So my very first question for you both, let's just get to the top is, Was there any 90210T in this entire book that was enjoyable, new or fun to learn?

[Elise Hu]

I didn't know the backstory well. She didn't even give it to us, though she shares that she was in love with Luke Perry, who was her romantic partner on the show, or at least one of them in the triangle. Right. And she said it was really confusing, both being in love with him in real life and then acting as if they were. And that other actors would come on the set and she would be really jealous of them. But I don't actually know what happened between them, what transpired, like how intense that relationship was, how transformed she was by it. There's just nothing. And she had so much freedom there since Luke Perry is now dead. So it's not like he is going to come out and be like, oh, wait, your version of the events is untrue.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I wonder if that's what made her maybe be more vague about it, because maybe she didn't have positive things to say. And that wouldn't feel good to share because he's passed. Because later she wrote about his passing in a very touching, beautiful way. But. But over all, kind of wrote nothing about that. Right.

[Elise Hu]

And so there wasn't more tea there. There is a bit towards the end where she talks about how she was really close with Tiffany Amber Thiessen, who comes on the show after season five, but then their friendship ended. And sometimes friends are just for a season and not for a lifetime. And I'm like, that's all you're gonna say about that?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. And she introduced Tiffany to her husband, who she is still with, and they have a beautiful family and kids, and she met him and was like, you have to meet Tiffany. Which really indicates a pretty deep closeness, I imagine. At the wedding, Jenny Garth was shouted out like, thank you, Jenny. And now they don't speak anymore. And there was no. She was like. And that's just because friendships pass.

[Elise Hu]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devontes]

It's like, that is not what happened. Tell us what happened with Tiffany.

[Dorie Shafrier]

I felt like. Also, she was vague about her relationship with Shannen Doherty.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Very, very.

[Dorie Shafrier]

It was a lot of, like, it was complicated.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. And she said, like. But we had made peace and we were polite acquaintances.

[Elise Hu]

And they did the reboot together in Vancouver.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. Now, did either of you watch the 90210 reboot?

[Dorie Shafrier]

I did not.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Okay.

[Elise Hu]

I didn't even finish watching 90210. I think that I, like, didn't watch Beyond Tiffani Amber Thiessen joining the show.

[Chelsea Devontes]

The way she wrote about the reboot, I was like, I never want to see this. She said they had to get five of the cast members back together in order to get the green light. But they were not going to play their characters. They were going to play fictionalized versions of themselves so that they could explore new storylines. And I was like, in what way is this a TV show? So we're getting like, it's like the cast of 9021 0, but it's totally different. Also fictionalized characters, somewhat related to the actors themselves. And it sounds like the people who said yes, like Shannon, who may have been on the fence, were like, yes, I would love a paycheck and I'll be there.

[Elise Hu]

She only came on board. She had originally said no. She came on board after Luke Perry died.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

So Luke Perry died. And then she was like, okay.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I mean, I'll be there now. That's dramatic as hell, but I don't think that's what we write.

[Elise Hu]

We know.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yes. That was kind of as much as we got about 90210. And then also I had a hard time placing the year. But she got married very young and she was on the show when she got married. I think she was 21. And she married this guy who she described as having long blonde hair and kind of looking like her twin. Oh, yeah, the drummer.

[Dorie Shafrier]

The drummer.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And she sort of bankrolls his rock star career. And apparently everyone at the wedding was like, taking bets on how long it would last, which was not. So he's her first estimate. So this is also going on when she's on the show. So then I want to read page 17, which is how she got her start. She said, I didn't grow up dreaming of being an actress. It wasn't some long held childhood plan. I kind of fell into it. Now, this is me being candid. There's like no worse sentence you could write in a memoir for me. When you. It's like when someone achieves a career that's so hard to get.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devontes]

That you are also striving for and they're like, whoopsies. You're like, oh. So she didn't want to do this. And then she said she signed up for a beauty pageant in Nevada. And she's like, I told myself this for scholarship money, but really it was kind of about the looks. And a guy at this pageant was a New York City casting director turned talent manager named Randy James. And then for the rest of the book, because he remains her manager for the rest of her career, which I have to say is very impressive. She calls him Mr. Showbiz Villain. What a villain. Because she's like. And then my life fell apart. But Mr. Showbiz said it was time to get back to work. What did you all think of Mr. Showbiz and really just her career trajectory?

[Dorie Shafrier]

Well, here's something that annoyed me, like, which kind of relates to the first point you were making about her being like, oops. I wanted, like, the real dirt, the behind the scenes on how she got cast and, like, what happened. But it sounded like there was no dirt. Like she literally just showed up and they were like, you'. And I was like, this is so weird. Like, she was 18. I mean, she had no period of, like, trying to make it in Hollywood.

[Chelsea Devontes]

She's from Nevada, literally Nevada to Hollywood,

[Dorie Shafrier]

came to town and got cast on 90210. And there's like almost no Real reflection about that.

[Elise Hu]

Well, she did do some jobs before that. Remember, she was. What's her name?

[Dorie Shafrier]

Daughter. A few. But it was like less than a year before she moved to LA, I think when she was 17. Like, the show started when she was 18. And also she had parts before. It wasn't like she was like, oh, I went to so many auditions and I never got cast. It was like she was just like, here I am.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah, yeah. And if there was struggle to that she just didn't convey. No. And it is so fascinating in this business that is notoriously excruciating for her. It sounds relatively easy. Yes. Which I wonder if that's the truth.

[Elise Hu]

I don't even know who's to say until after 90210. I mean, her period after 90210 she describes as one filled with rejection and jealousy. And she was like going out for all these parts and she never had to audition for pre, you know, during the height of 90210. And then she had to audition again. But again, she says this without actually illustrating it, so who knows? And it's also uninteresting this way.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And also, like, if you do come into this career, oopsie doopsie your way into a part and never put any work or strategy into what's gonna happen after the show. Like, that is what will happen. So. Yeah, I don't know. Well, there were two juicy parts of the book for me, which unfortunately, it would be great if the juiciest parts were about her life, but the juiciest parts are about husband number two and husband number three to me. And she starts chapter two with the break that built me. And this is brutal. She basically is taken to the hospital and has her stomach pumped after getting so drunk and dealing with possible suicidal thoughts. I don't know if there's other things involved. And she said her friend had called her assistant Liz to check on her. Her assistant has to get on A flight from LA to Phoenix, Arizona, finds her in the hotel room unconscious, calls 911, and she goes into the hospital. And then how she got there is from the divorce with her second husband, Peter Facinelli, who I know best as hot dumb doctor on Nurse Jackie. What do you know him as? Because I feel like if you don't know who he is, if you looked him up, you would immediately recognize him.

[Elise Hu]

He was a dad on something. Oh, oh, Twilight. He's in Twilight. Yeah.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Great. Yeah. So this is who he is. And she said she was married to him for 12 years. They had three daughters together. However, when they met, they were filming a movie together and she said I was in the process of seeing separating from my first husband when we met on set. That's right. At 23, I was divorced after less than two year marriage to that drummer. I was working on 90210 at the time. And then she's in the middle of divorcing him as she meets Peter. He's 21, she's 23, and then at 24 she becomes a mother. They are married for 12 years and then they go through a divorce. That is so young on both their parts to be married. Okay, we're gonna take a quick break right now and we'll be right back. I've been trying to be more intentional about what I wear day to day, picking pieces that last forever so I can be more sustainable and honestly make getting dressed simpler. And Quince has really done up my wardrobe. We were just rewatching the movie Something's gotta Give where Diane Keaton is in all these like really expensive cashmere sweaters. And I thought to myself, I know where I can get those on a discount.

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[Chelsea Devontes]

Okay, welcome back. Let's continue the conversation. I felt so much empathy for this divorce that later happens because they grew up together and grew apart. What did you both think of that? And then, and then we'll get into how she ends up in that hotel room.

[Elise Hu]

I think that premise would have been rich for storytelling.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Yes.

[Elise Hu]

I thought the same thing. Of course, I was like, oh my God, you were a mother at 23 or 24 or whatever. And it was like, and in your in Hollywood, why didn't you share anything from that?

[Dorie Shafrier]

Right? There's like no reflection.

[Elise Hu]

Instead, you have a chapter later towards the end of the book devoted to family. And it's just like, I want my kids to grow up confident and empathetic. It's like, you know, what a missed opportunity. And also speaking of this dark moment that begins chapter one or whatever, the first chapter after the introduction, why was this book structured this way? It was such a strangely structured book. I really want to be in the room to where they were laying this out.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I don't think that happened. I think that's giving it too much credit. Had they laid this out, there's no way they would have sent it to print.

[Elise Hu]

What in the world?

[Chelsea Devontes]

I think because of this self help structure, the idea was like in this chapter is about choosing yourself and this chapter is about when you break down in this chapter. I don't think that worked, but I think that was the idea around it. Like there's a self help Lesson guiding each set of stories. But really, it just felt like mush. Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

Because I would say, like, the first six chapters are the same self help lesson, which is like, love yourself.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Kind of. It's. But it's also like, but maybe love Dave. Okay, so. All right, so back into this chapter. She said, we had begun talks with CMT to film a reality series called A Little Bit country, which would follow our family, meaning her and Peter, as they moved to a ranch outside of LA and embraced country living. And then before that happens, he's like, I don't want to do that. I'm moving out. She is like, no, I still want to work on our marriage. The show is like, you already signed up for this. We're reframing this as Jenny Garth starts over in the country. Even though she's like, I'm actively trying to get back together with my husband. She wrote this. We had a fun crew of people around us, which brought the energy up. My assistant in the show, Corinne, was cast just for filming. An excellent comedic foil. We leaned into her being the city girl learning about the country life angle, and we had lots of laughs together. I said, I mean, listen, we know reality shows are fake. This is a step too far. You have an assistant. Her name's Liz. You talked about her in the last chapter.

[Elise Hu]

She also has her assistant Adele, who is her best friend. So I was like, does this woman have any women friend or any friends? Like, she doesn't have any male friends really, like, from the cast, because she was. Had complicated relationships.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Tori.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah, Tori Spelling.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Tori is her friend.

[Elise Hu]

And then Adele, her best friend, worked for her.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And Corinne is cast. Like, why are we casting? Okay, whatever. So clearly that's how fake it was. And then during this time, Peter is like, hey, I am done. We are divorcing. She tries to make it work. And Adele. Now, I thought Adele was a therapist herself.

[Elise Hu]

Oh, no. Well, maybe she has a therapy background. But Adele started off as her assistant.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Okay, well, she was like, Adele recommended an amazing therapist in Arizona. How Adele knows this person, I don't know. I thought she said Adele had therapy credentials, and so maybe she took this with more weight. But she asked Peter to fly to Arizona to meet with a couples therapist so that they could be together again. And she's like, I was so happy that Peter said yes. They fly to Arizona. This is a bad, unqualified, shitty therapist who makes your life worse, is like a Dringo in memoirs. And basically, she gets to this appointment, and Peter was already sitting there with her. And she was like, why would she start the session without me? So this couple's therapist is actively setting up a sabotage, which, you know, I

[Elise Hu]

thought that was uncool. Yeah, that's unprofessional.

[Chelsea Devontes]

This is crazy. So then she said. She looked at me without any hesitation. This is how she started the session. Didn't say anything else. She said, jenny, why would you want to be with someone who doesn't love you? She then goes into full trauma, shock runs out of the office, and the next thing she knows, she's, like, on a dirt road in Arizona, and her therapist and Peter pull up in the car next to her, and they're like, jenny, don't go get in the car.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Weird. Y', all.

[Chelsea Devontes]

What would you do if your husband divorced you? And then he and a therapist, and I'm gonna go say a Camry pulled up alongside the road, and they're like, come on, girlfriend. It'll be okay. And then drop you off at a hotel room alone. Like, should this therapist be sued?

[Elise Hu]

Probably.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Also, like, wouldn't you be annoyed at Adele?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yes, I'm annoyed at Adele. Which clearly, Jenny's like, no, it's fine. But it's like this therapist meeting you for the first time with your husband behind your back. You had such a traumatic response. Then she's like, getting in the car with your husband. It's so getting so weird. And then they take her to a hotel room, and they're like, you'll be cool, right? And she's like, for sure. Locks her in the hotel room. Locks herself in the hotel room, Drinks so much that she ends up in the hospital getting her stomach pumped because she struggles with alcohol. I was just like, what? And then literally two pages later, she said, I always do what Adele tells me she thinks is best.

[Dorie Shafrier]

I also felt, like, related to this. She very much, like, glossed over getting

[Chelsea Devontes]

sober, because I don't think she did.

[Dorie Shafrier]

No, she says she did, but did

[Chelsea Devontes]

she say, I got sober? She would say things like, I was dealing with drinking wine. And then later, she'd be like, I started with the wine again. And then as she speaks later and she's on a date with Dave, she's like, come over to my house for a drink. I think she stopped. Stopped drinking as much, but I don't think she.

[Dorie Shafrier]

I think I. No, but I think she mentions it literally in passing. She says, dave got sober. So I've been sober for two years or something. Like.

[Elise Hu]

And then it's like, sober, maybe in her 50s.

[Dorie Shafrier]

And then it's like, not Mentioned again, but I'm like.

[Chelsea Devontes]

But also, like, it was not during this part. She's taken to real.

[Dorie Shafrier]

No, no, no, it's not. No, it's much, much later. Much.

[Elise Hu]

But this is the problem. This goes back to my.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

Which is the problem with the structure of the book.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Book.

[Elise Hu]

So she had mentioned getting sober, but, like, when she actually does delve into it, it was in her 50s.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

It's like, it's very.

[Dorie Shafrier]

It's much later and it's. And she barely talks about it.

[Elise Hu]

I mean, she spends a few paragraphs on sobriety, like in her 50s, but.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

And then also her eating is kind of strange throughout. She talks about her extreme diets, like where she was only going to have a handful of food or something every two hours.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yes.

[Elise Hu]

And then now she's a vegan again. She started out as a vegan because she grew up on a farm. Her attempts to control her separation from her second husband.

[Chelsea Devontes]

She deals with a lot of body image stuff without. Without really totally dealing with it. Right, let's talk about that before we get to her husband, Dave, because she does do a whole chapter on that at one point. She talks about getting a breast augmentation. And then while she's under, getting liposuction and how she just felt the intense pressure while on 90210 is when she did these things to look even hotter, look even better. And how when she later goes through ivf, she gains weight. That's when she kind of. She talks around it. But yeah, it sounds like an eating disorder. Like, I'm gonna have a handful of tomatoes and then I'll have a handful of carrots. I'm like, I'm. This is the thing I can control. And then I found the vegan thing separate from that because she's talking about animals and, like, wanting to care for them. But did you think the veganism was tied to the food stuff?

[Elise Hu]

I don't know. Because she brings up becoming vegan again somewhere around being sober later. And when she talks about veganism, she was like, I return to it because when I was young and growing up on a farm and we had chickens and pigs, like, I always thought it was strange to see them on the table. Yeah. All of this to say, like, her food stuff is very strange and, like, papered over. When she first went out with Dave, this perhaps gets us to Dave. When she first went out with Dave, she was like, a big test for me was whether he was going to be judgmental of all my things about food and we were at this foodie restaurant in Silver Lake and I could only order salted gluten free noodles. And he didn't blink and he didn't bat an eye.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Let's pause on that. Let's pause. Hello. I will take a bowl of gluten free noodles with only salt. No oil, no lemon juice. I don't know, just gluten, no pepper, gluten free noodles and only salt. I said, that has got to be the craziest first date meal I've ever heard of. If I. Okay, let's go into the Dave stuff. So a woman we need to check on on this podcast is Adele. Because I think she's maybe a menace running wild. She said, Adele tried to set me up a few times. Once with the energetic and brave TV writer who wanted to move way too fast. He was around my age and seemed very ready for commitment, but I just didn't feel a spark. Do we have any guesses, any guesses as to who the brave and energetic TV writer? I can think of so many on Raya. Who went for it? The very young drummer from Colorado I met through an Instagram comment. Jenny.

[Elise Hu]

She should have learned about drummers.

[Chelsea Devontes]

You should have learned about drummers. Also, you are famous. What do you mean? You are meeting a drummer. A young drummer from Colorado via Instagram. Instagram comments. This is not how we meet people. Jenny, your famous person, she already made

[Elise Hu]

the mistake with the drummer in her.

[Dorie Shafrier]

She also reaches out to Naomi Watts over Instagram DM to ask her to come on her podcast.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Like, but that's chill. That's how you make friendships. Why would a strange young boy commenting on your Instagram, you're like, you know, we should date.

[Elise Hu]

I don't know, maybe he was super hot.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Yeah, there were. There. Yeah, there were a lot of red flags.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. And then she said, I tried that touring musician life on. As you said, Elise. She already learned this lesson. What are we doing? Then she said, a hot crew guy from an Old Navy commercial shoot. Then the West Virginian startup guy who insisted on buying my daughter a pet bunny. The fuck? The mysterious younger guy from Austin who confused me and somehow appealed to me. He was, however, blessed in certain ways. Let's just say sick. And the photographer who didn't want to be photographed with me, afraid his career might be hijacked by association. Okay, so she's like been dating, dating, dating, dating. And then she gets set up on a date with Dave and we already know from the book that she's married him. So I was not Expecting certain details about Dave. She said, Dave claimed He'd never seen 90210, but then I realized he was nine years younger than me. Then he doesn't freak out about her noodle order, so that's fine. And then at the end, she said, we barely said three sentences to each other. But then Dave asked for my number. I didn't feel ready to give him my number, but there was something about him. So instead I said, why don't you follow me? In a line that shows our age gap better than anything. He responded on Instagram. I said, ha. No, in your car. She then leads him to Cafe Stella in Silver Lake. Now, quick side note. Did you guys laugh at how many restaurants were name checked in this book?

[Elise Hu]

I was kind of excited. I was like, oh, instead of describing the restaurant, you're just gonna share the name? That's cool.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Again, I'm like, you are a famous person. Please do not tell us the 10 exact spots you hang out at in LA. All right. Cafe Stella, she said. I learned he had just quit his job at Ruth's Chris Steakhouse.

[Elise Hu]

Name check.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Where he worked as a server for nine years while going on commercial auditions and living with his best friend Johnny. Pause. Do either of you continue to date this man at this juncture? He has just quit his job of nine years while living with his friend Johnny and doing commercial auditions.

[Elise Hu]

I'm a no on guys with roommates.

[Dorie Shafrier]

I mean, at this point, she's. She's in her early 40s, I believe.

[Elise Hu]

Oh, okay.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Or very early 30s.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Or very late 30s.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Dorie Shafrier]

I definitely got, like, big I can't be alone vibes from her, and it made me sad and just, like, her lack of self awareness around that was troubling. There's also some weird. Well, you'll get to this. There's some intense impulse control stuff that

[Chelsea Devontes]

I was like, okay, yeah, well, okay. So at this point in the day, I was like, why is this happening? But then I did love the next move she made. She said, we ended our drink, we shared a kiss. And then she said, as I was driving away, I didn't want the night to end. It was Tuesday at 11, but I had a feeling. We exchanged numbers. So I texted Dave and said, do you want one more drink? Meet me at the Babe Bar. I, I thoughts on that in a second. Basically, she gives him an address, and when he shows up, it's her house. And she's like, surprise, I've invited you over to my house. I call this the Babe Bar, which is tough Tough to have named your apartment that. But she surprise invited him over, and I said, that's fun, I guess. What'd we think of that?

[Elise Hu]

Go for it, girl. She was into him. She was into this Ruth Chris server with a roommate.

[Dorie Shafrier]

I with currently no job.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Get it, girl had just quit it. And she didn't say he quit for blahbity blah. She just said, he's quit.

[Elise Hu]

I just don't understand because the sparks didn't fly. They apparently had kind of an stilted dinner together, a double date or whatever. So how did this turn into, like, come over to my house?

[Chelsea Devontes]

I.

[Dorie Shafrier]

This is what I'm saying. Like, yes, she can't be alone. And I don't know. I just, like, there was just something about it. Like, yes, you go, girl. Get. Get it. But I was also kind of like, you don't know this guy well.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And that leads us to our next paragraph. I introduced him to my daughters two weeks after we met. Jenny. Garth, can I.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Okay, I need.

[Chelsea Devontes]

What are you doing?

[Dorie Shafrier]

Elise, I need to ask you about this because I have my own thoughts about this, but I'm not divorced. So when do you think, as a person who is divorced, when is an appropriate time to introduce your children to your significant other? Is it two weeks after you meet?

[Elise Hu]

I. I thought two weeks sounded early. I thought two weeks sounded early, but she seemed to have conviction that they were going to be together forever.

[Chelsea Devontes]

That's so psychotic. It's like, even if you do, you still, as a child of many divorces, who can. Who is the person meeting, like, the new partner? This should not happen forever. It should not happen until it is guaranteed. This is going to be a long lasting, healthy relationship. This is so troubling.

[Dorie Shafrier]

This was my reaction as well. My parents are not divorced, so I also never went through it on that end, but I was like. Because I also got the vibe that at least her oldest daughter has been a little bit, like, literally putting distance between them. Like, I think there's like, tension there that she has not fully reconciled with. But introducing him to her kids two weeks in, I was just like. Because I feel like a lot of times we're like, we accuse men of being love bombers. I think she's the love bomber.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. Ooh. I. I would absolutely agree with that. Because then she writes about six months later, we took the girls on a spring break trip to an all inclusive resort in Tulum.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Rent.

[Elise Hu]

I'm sure she paid for it.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah, we.

[Dorie Shafrier]

We took the kids.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Of course. We. Such a good point. We told them on Our second night, we were getting married. We always wanted to be together, but I didn't want to have this man in my home with three young daughters without a significant commitment. Which also is sort of sounds like her pressure there. And then she said, I was nervous and excited to tell them. Fiona was very happy. Lola had an emotional breakdown, and Luca was silent. And I, again, as the daughter of divorce, is like, jenny, this isn't, like a funny anecdote. This is, like, what Luca and Fiona are talking to their therapists about currently.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Yes. And she has no. There's no self awareness about it.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. Yeah. And then I'll get to our final red flag, which is like, they, like, immediately get married, and actually, maybe it's not a red flag. I want. I want both your opinion on this. She said. I loved how the night of our wedding ended with me choosing to stay up late with my friends while he went to bed early. There was something comforting in how he could take care of his own needs while giving me the space to do the same. Elise, I'll go to you first. We love this or hate this.

[Elise Hu]

I'm just glad she has friends, because this book gives the impression that she doesn't. So she said she got to stay out late and hang out with her friends. Great. Good for you. Mm.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Okay. I like that.

[Elise Hu]

Also, I think, you know, as somebody who's been in very long term relationships, I think there's many nights that you can be with your partner, or there are many nights that you can go to bed with your partner. So I don't care, you know, if she was with him or not, like, when they went to bed.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Okay.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Okay. I love that take.

[Elise Hu]

What about you?

[Dorie Shafrier]

I agree there are many nights where you can be with your partner. To me, it feels like your wedding night should be one of those nights, but

[Chelsea Devontes]

where I was at is, like, your wedding night is, like, such a rare. It's only gonna happen once. There's only one night, and then you have a million nights to do whatever you both need and want. To me, I was like, y' all weren't even on the same page about how to celebrate your marriage. Like, y' all were already under separate pages about how one singular night where the theme is you two have decided to be together are on separate pages. However, maybe if the rest of this relationship sounded better, I would find this beautiful. I think there's a world where I could be like, this is so sweet that you guys support each other in different ways. I think, given all of the other red flags.

[Elise Hu]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devontes]

It maybe led to me not liking this.

[Elise Hu]

Nothing can really be understood without the context, Right? So, yes, it's easy to be judgy about this particular relationship.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yes. Totally agree. Okay. So then she and Dave get pregnant on the honeymoon, and she has a miscarriage four months later, which is heartbreaking. And then she goes into what sounds like she was like, I know Dave wants to have a biological child of his own because he's younger.

[Elise Hu]

Or she assumed it.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah, Dave never really said that. Every time Dave was like, I don't really care. She was like, you're lying just to make me feel better about being older than you. And then they go through what sounds like brutal rounds of ivf, and then she says that stress and tension, plus the idea that they don't communicate, breaks them apart. And she found out from TMZ that he filed for divorce. Yeah, okay, I'll. I'll just skip to that sucks. Skip to the next part, which is that she keeps trying to make it work. She's like, as you can read in this book, I love to stay. I love to hold on. I wasn't ready to let go. And they go and meet in Joshua Tree to sign the divorce papers. And that's when they finally talk and heal and decide they're not going to get divorced, they're going to get back together. And then he, as you said, Dory carries the divorce papers around in his car for years after that as a reminder that he's choosing to stay.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Like, I'm sorry, what the fuck? No, you put those in the shredder. That's. To me, that was bananas.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Put them in a. Like, put them in the bottom drawer of your desk where Jenny doesn't have to see them in your car.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Also, look, I will say, as someone who did do ivf, it is horrible. And it is like, a huge stressor on relationships, even if you have, like, the best relationship, which I don't think they did.

[Chelsea Devontes]

So what do you think it is? Like, is it all the hormone changes? Is it the schedule?

[Elise Hu]

Like, what?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Really?

[Dorie Shafrier]

It's the hormone changes. It's the schedule, but it's also, like, the expectations. You know, no one ever guarantees that you're gon get pregnant from ivf, but it's sort of portrayed as, like, it's science. It'll just work. And like, that is not the case. There's these, like, constantly shifting goal posts. She was already pretty old to have her own biological children when she started doing it. So she says they only got two embryos, which is not A ton. And they didn't work. And so every step of the way you have your hopes and expectations sort of raised and then they are dashed constantly.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And with a huge financial burden attached to each of them. Massive.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Massive. Yeah. So I think it's just. It's really like psychological torture.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Thank you for breaking that down. I think that's what makes it.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Which she did not do in her memoir.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Agree, agree. I think that's what makes it epic. Extra wild in that when they get back together, she admits that she doesn't really want to have a kid. So to have put yourself through that for years when she just truly did not want to have another kid again. And he was like, yeah, me neither. That's what I've been saying. Feels wild to miscommunicate that intensely.

[Elise Hu]

I think she's miscommunicating with herself.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yes, I agree. This portion of that, right.

[Elise Hu]

This is a woman who has. Has spent the last 50 some odd years trying to understand herself better and doing every like, MLM conference room scheme and Buddhist teacher and four agreements and ancient wisdom from wherever, and has yet to really become integrated, as they say, or become conscious and sat. Her mission mistakes and missteps seem so obvious, zoomed out, you know, like when we're looking at it externally, even having to read between the lines because she doesn't paint that picture. But again, missed opportunity. Missed opportunity.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. I have to say, can you imagine? It's Jennie Garth memoir and then the tagline is a portrait of miscommunicating with myself for six years. Now that would be stunning.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah. But then you're. Then you're at least marketing it correctly.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

I also thought it was super strange. This is like a little bit off topic, but I thought it's super strange that some chapters ended with exercises. For us, it was like charts. Write down circle, square, circle.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Oh, my God.

[Elise Hu]

Like, what would it. You said, we'll see to these sorts of things. Then I was like, wait a second, is this Chicken Soup for the Soul or this. Is this a memoir? Like, what is this book supposed to be? I just had a really hard time

[Chelsea Devontes]

closest to an oprah magazine in 2004 where I did that goal chart. Oprah gave me the goal pie chart, where it's like your career, your health.

[Elise Hu]

Oh, yes, the goal pie chart is in here. Yes, it's in.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And I'm like, oprah's pie chart. I'm sure it's not Oprah's. I'm sure it's someone else. Okay. In that vein, she Made a list of qualities she wanted in a man before she met Dave. And I would love to ask you both what you thought of that list of qualities. Let me find it and just read out a couple. Okay. A man who keeps his word. Someone who could make me laugh. Someone who is confident enough to let me shine and not get upset if someone calls him Mr. Garth. Someone who understands chivalry. I'm old fashioned. I like my man to open doors for me. So then she's like, you know, you make your list. Have you all ever made a list? And if so, what was Elise?

[Dorie Shafrier]

No.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Dory, have you ever made a list?

[Dorie Shafrier]

I did at one point make a sort of like voice vision board list.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. What was on it?

[Dorie Shafrier]

I honestly don't remember. I think it was like someone funny, like someone kind. It wasn't anything like earth shattering.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Listen, I made that list.

[Elise Hu]

What was on yours?

[Chelsea Devontes]

So here's my thing about her advice. I don't think you can be like, make a list. And one of the qualities is like, likes to laugh. Because if we were to survey a hundred men, 99 of them are going to be like, I love to laugh stuff. It's like they all think that. I think you have to get really, really specific. On my list was he has a therapist and he has at least one close male friend who he talks to about things. And I think you've got to get specific and like, how someone likes to spend their time. But I think those vague qualities of

[Elise Hu]

like, nice, live, laugh, love.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. You're like, well, yeah, we're all like, everyone on Tinder loves to live, laugh, love. We gotta drill down here. But I think that's what I didn't like about all the charts and exercises being given to us at the end of the chapters. Because the chapters would be like. And then Dave and I had some horrible thing. Now here's your exercise to find your love. Oh, that reminds me of one story we have to read before we conclude this book.

[Elise Hu]

Okay, okay.

[Chelsea Devontes]

This one's brutal. Brutal, brutal, brutal. She said when she and Dave went through the first divorce.

[Elise Hu]

Oh, yeah.

[Chelsea Devontes]

One day her daughter Luca came home from college. Jenny was in the bedroom drinking wine and breaking frames. Breaking glass of like, framed pictures of her and Dave and smashing them and crying and then using the glass to attempt to cut herself. And her daughter walks in and is like, oh, stop doing that. And then her daughter gives her a routine to follow and her daughter helps her get her life back together. And she wrote about that so positively. And I just thought, this is Horrendous. This. This is her. Your daughter's 24. This is not like being honest with your child is good for them. This is like your child found you, their mother, their protector, in the most precarious, unhealed situation. I don't know. What did you guys think?

[Elise Hu]

I thought that was probably the. I was actually reflecting on this book after finishing it, because I knew we were going to be talking about it. And I'm like, what struck me about this book? What do I even remember from this book? What was a scene from the book that I actually recall among all the pablum that set itself apart from the pablum? And that was probably the only one. And it was very painful, I think.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Really painful. I just kept thinking the story's being told from your point of view, which I get. Cause it's your memoir, but this is Luca's story. Now. This is something your daughter's gonna carry. Well, to wrap up this memoir, I wanna read two little paragraphs. One is, it's page 281. We're almost at the end. And she says, I told Mr. Showbiz and my team that my 50s are to be a decade of pushing. I want to work harder, make every moment count. I said, quote, we're gonna do everything we can in these next 10 years, and we're gonna do it all at once. I want to work my ass off until I'm 60, and then I want the freedom to be able to walk away and hand it off. And I said, ah, yes. I am writing this memoir for money. This is why we've written a memoir. And then. Yeah. And then she ends it and says, you are allowed to change. You are allowed to rest. You are allowed to begin again. You are allowed to choose you. I choose me still. Again. Always. And now it's your turn.

[Elise Hu]

Thanks, Jenny.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Garth, it's your turn.

[Elise Hu]

Elise, I feel so motivated to choose.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Can I bring up just one other thing from the book before we wrap, which is how she didn't go to Luke Perry's funeral.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. Talk about that.

[Dorie Shafrier]

That was another thing where I was like, what is going on here?

[Elise Hu]

What's going on here?

[Dorie Shafrier]

She was like, I couldn't face it. I'm sorry. Are you 12? You're a grown woman. This was one of your closest, like, such an important person in your life, and you couldn't even bring yourself to go to his funeral. And she also was like. And I didn't post about it on social media. I regret that. Moving on. I don't know I just felt like there was a selfishness there when you're like, okay, I choose me, but also maybe like, how about like, being there for other people or write about your

[Chelsea Devontes]

relationship with Luke that makes us understand, of course you can't go.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Right.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Or of course you don't want to post something because clearly there's something intensely complicated that's making it difficult for you to process his death, especially publicly, but yet instead it comes off as uncaring, selfish, and weird. Yeah.

[Dorie Shafrier]

Yes. Okay, thank you. I just needed to address that.

[Chelsea Devontes]

No, thank you, Elise. Anything else I missed that stuck out to you?

[Elise Hu]

Just remember to choose you, Chelsea.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Okay. Yeah, sure. All right.

[Elise Hu]

You can sometimes. One tactic that I learned from Jenny Garrett Arts book is that you can look yourself in the mirror and just say, I love you.

[Chelsea Devontes]

It's really nice. And you know what, listeners? Take that with you. It is time to do the booktool test. There are three questions to the booktal test. We're all going to answer all three of them. First question, was the author vulnerable in the sharing of their truth?

[Elise Hu]

Somewhat. If I had to say yes or no. Maybe no.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Okay.

[Elise Hu]

Love that.

[Dorie Shafrier]

I also. No. It felt very surface level.

[Chelsea Devontes]

You know what? I'm gonna say yes. Because I think when you're sharing that story about your daughter walking in on you or the hotel story, I think that was her deepest, darkest moments. I don't think it was written well. And the stuff with Dave. There's a lot of stuff with Dave where it's like, I don't know that you should share this. And she did choose to, so I'm gonna give her a yes. Okay, second question. Was it entertaining to read? Read. I'll go first. Absolutely not.

[Elise Hu]

I had a really hard time. But entertaining, like funny? Haha. This is absurd. I guess it was mildly entertaining there.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah.

[Dorie Shafrier]

I found it to be a struggle as well. I found myself skimming a lot of it.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah, it was a tough. It was a tough one. Okay, final question. Now we never know. You never know what your answer is to this. Did reading this book elevate your life in any way?

[Elise Hu]

No, I found it extractive of my time and energy.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And thank you so much for coming on this podcast and I just appreciate you so much. And don't forget you chose this book.

[Elise Hu]

I'm so sorry, everybody else. Sorry, everybody else.

[Dorie Shafrier]

I don't think it elevated my life.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah, I would say I'm also a no. With the one exception, which I don't think I can give credit to. Ginny Garth, which is that it was just my birthday. And one of the surprises is that my husband took me to an animal sanctuary. And we already try and be vegetarian, but we're going for like a 60% veganism week. We're trying because. Because it just makes sense. And reading about that in her book, I was like, yeah, now I don't know if that's life elevating, but it was maybe like a page in the book that I thought was good. Anyways, where can people listen to your podcast, find you both, follow you, all of that.

[Elise Hu]

You can find forever 35 everywhere you listen. So all the podcast platforms where we also have a [e-mail] I hang out, I guess on Instagram the most. Yeah, to the extent I hang out on social media at all.

[Dorie Shafrier]

It's leasewho and I am ory d o r e e on Instagram.

[Chelsea Devontes]

We're all Instagram gals. It's my favorite app. It's my only app.

[Elise Hu]

I mean, you can try to friend me on LinkedIn.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Oh, Lise, LinkedIn. Thank you both so much for reading this entire book and joining me here. This was so wonderful and I appreciate you both.

[Elise Hu]

This was so fun.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Thank you. Thank you. A big thank you to our senior managing producer, Christina Lopez, our executive producer, Jordan Moncada, our sound engineer, Marcus Hamm, and our amazing associate producer, Dominique Banas. I also want to give a huge thank you to our incredible partners over at Thrive Cosmetics and Quince. We will link those incredible brands in the show notes, so go check them out. Everything is always linked in the show notes on Apple. There's also transcripts and if you ever have questions, go to the Patreon Chat Lounge and I will see you there.

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