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- [00:00]
Workday Ad
When you're a forward thinker, the only thing you're afraid of is business as usual. Workday is the AI platform that transforms the way you manage your people and money today so you can transform tomorrow. Workday, moving business forever forward.
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Kirby
Glam Los Angeles.
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Sarah
Hi, Kirby.
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Joyce
Hi, Sarah. Welcome to Los Angeles. Joyce, welcome to Gloss Angeles.
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Kirby
Thank you for having me. We were just talking about your addiction to drybar chokehold. I can't leave.
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Sarah
Listen, they have a good business model.
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Joyce
They do, but someone you know. There has to be something better.
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Kirby
I don't know.
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Joyce
Let's brainstorm.
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Kirby
Yeah, let's brainstorm, please. But, yeah, they're great.
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Joyce
We have you here because we partnered with Rare on this amazing new launch. This is a brand new category for the brand. And if you are a Glamlino, who is a part of our seating. It was so funny when we announced that it was Rare that we were partnering with the Bananas. The most submissions ever for our signups.
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Kirby
Oh, that's so great.
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Joyce
We had people, like, trying to cheat the system, so. And I'm a stickler for the system.
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Kirby
Okay.
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Joyce
I am going through. So I am like. So if you got picked for this, truly, like, you were a chosen one because do you live in the US that was, like, one of the stipulations. You had to live in the US I'm going through and, like, people from India are checking the Indiana box.
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Kirby
Oh, my gosh.
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Joyce
Updating different fields. And I'm like, girl, we can't. I can't send it to you. I'm like, that doesn't look like a US town.
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Kirby
That doesn't look right.
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Joyce
Google this right now. And then I'm like, oh, India. I'm like, okay. So people really. They really wanted whatever this was because we were not. We didn't tell them. We just said, we're partnering with Rare and they just said, sight unseen. Don't care what it is, just give it to me.
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Sarah
And then once they were added to the channel and found out they made it, they were like, thank you so much.
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Kirby
Oh, my gosh.
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Joyce
I was threatening lives basically because I was like, you have to understand how confidential this is. You cannot share this with a singular soul. We will take legal action. You do not understand.
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Kirby
I love that you have this perspective on it. You're doing our work for. I am militant about this. I love it. And then all of them were, like.
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Joyce
Responding like, mom's the word. Like, little emojis.
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Kirby
Oh, my God.
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Joyce
The little.
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Sarah
That's also the fun part about it is that, you know it's like this exclusive.
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Kirby
Yeah, for sure. I mean, it's been. Every morning I wake up and I'm like, did it get, like. Like, you know, even with Selena? Because she loves it and she's been asking me, and I'm, like, trying to send it to her in, like, unmarked, like, bottles and stuff. And she's so funny because she's so protective of it. And there was once, I think it was, like, for find comfort. When we launched, she just, like, posted this innocuous picture. And, like, the fans get really into it.
- [02:59]
Sarah
Oh.
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Kirby
They are zooming in, and they're like, what is that? And I'm like, all right. Have to be, like, super careful.
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Sarah
And when you came in here, you were like, I'm already in 2027 in my head.
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Joyce
Yeah.
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Sarah
So you're just living a life of secrecy.
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Kirby
So much secrecy. And every morning is a panic of, like, did something get out? Did I carry something? And, like, I just was. She was telling me this funny story because we just launched this last spring. Find comfort in a new fragrance. Awaken Confidence. Yes. And it has this beautiful body cream that, like, has a water breakage texture, and it's, like, really moisturizing, but, like, lightweight on the skin. And she's been carrying this around for, like, the last year and a half. And she was at the airport and going through TSA and forgot that she'd. And it's like a 250 gram, like, huge thing. And they were like, you can't have this. And she was like, oh, my gosh. And they took it to, like, throw it away, but because she has me on her shoulder being like, don't release any images or whatever, that she basically took her hand, scooped out the bulk, threw it out, and was like, give me the jar back. Cause she was so afraid so someone would see it in the trash or, like, something like that. Did they.
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Sarah
Did they say it was okay?
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Kirby
They said it was okay.
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Joyce
She was like.
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Sarah
And then they're like, yeah, they said it was okay. I think it's okay.
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Kirby
Yeah. I love the commitment. She told me. And I was like, yes. I love that. You know, So I think I've just scared her to die.
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Joyce
Yeah.
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Kirby
Yeah.
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Joyce
So, Joyce, you're the Chief Product Officer at Rare Beauty. You've been with the brand since its inception.
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Kirby
Yes.
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Joyce
Which is incredible. So for people that may not be familiar with the Chief Product Officer, or what does your day to day look like? What are your job responsibilities? And then what are some of the things that you've helped bring to life? For the brand.
- [04:34]
Kirby
Wow. Okay, so I was loaded. Question lots of things. First of all, I'm so blessed to have the role that I have and the team that I have. We're so interconnected and we have so much trust with each other, but all of it is really like, we want to bring Selena's vision to life in the most, like, time efficient way. In the most. Efficiency is my love language. So she. To me, I'm like, you dream up what you want and it's me to make it like, my job to make it a reality. Like, whether it's from a production timeline, whether it's from efficacious, like, if the formula is right, if it works, it's stable, all of these things. The responsibility is really about, like, concepts. So partnering with Selena about what that concept of that product is all the way till it basically hits shelf. So I'm not solely responsible, obviously, for all of that. Collaborate with so many integral departments to get there. But product is really like the. The hub of the wheel, right, because it dictates the storytelling, the timing of when you're launching something is important, the season, that kind of thing, how it looks on shelf, if there's room on shelf at the gondola. Like, all these things kind of take into play and that includes like, packaging and then formulation and all of that. So it's always. I always describe it as like, concept to shelf. Yeah.
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Sarah
Wow.
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Joyce
And you were a part of bringing the best selling liquid blush to market.
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Kirby
Wild.
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Joyce
Which is so crazy. I think it was 20, 23, $70 million worth of that blush.
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Kirby
Crazy. Yeah, absolutely.
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Sarah
That accounts for 26.16% of Sephora's total blush sales.
- [06:14]
Kirby
Wild. That is insane. We never saw ourselves as, like, day one was not like, hey, let's be a Blush brand. I'm here for it. I love it and I love that blush has become this, like, phenomenon. Right? It's crazy. I find myself just layering more and more blush. Even, like on the car right here, I was like, do I have enough blush on my face actually eats blush? Like, I just have to, like, it's crazy. It's like whatever pigment I layer every finish, every texture, all of that. But yeah, we never imagined ourselves to be in this place, but I love it. It's. It, I think, you know, with the name itself. And it just brought so much joy, I think, from like, just your disposition at a time when we were all, like, trapped in our homes and, like, not wearing a lot of makeup. And it really came from Selena. Like, she was Filming Selena and Jeff at home couldn't have a makeup artist, couldn't have a hair person. So we were like, just turn on your phone and just at least we can get some content of you doing makeup application. And we would just get hours of these videos and just kind of watch them and see, you know, like, what's her makeup routine like? Because she's always approached beauty as, like, consumer focused. Obviously, she works with amazing makeup artist Hong Man Go, who's taught her a lot of techniques. But her purpose and perspective is really about, like, how does the normal everyday person wear makeup and what does that ritual look like? Not just testing products, but learning about products, sharing products, applying products. So it's really about, like, ease of use. And we would watch her put this really vibrant blush on and blend it out, and her face just, like, lit up and she was just like, camera ready for a show. We were watching, we were like, wow, like, that blush is really like, changing how, like, her disposition, you know, bringing joy to her face. And we never thought it would be where it's at today, but now it's its own, you know, it's a beast. Beast. Yeah.
- [08:04]
Joyce
I'm curious. The fact that it's a liquid blush, I think is really what stands out about it. Because it was. It's not like you guys launched with a powder blush and then the liquid, like, this was the blush.
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Kirby
Yeah, this was the only blush.
- [08:18]
Joyce
And at a time before people were obsessed with blush, I feel like in the past two or three years, we've got blush blindness, blushes everywhere. Everybody's launched a blush. But it's incredible that you started with a liquid blush and then it blew up to this level. Like, did you have any qualms? Like, how did that even come to life?
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Sarah
Or is that. Cause Selena, when you're watching these videos of her preferred, like, a creamy liquid blush.
- [08:41]
Kirby
Well, from day one when I met her, like, and I, for me, I was like, okay, I want to bring your vision to life and bring my expertise from the back end side of how to, like, do this. But I needed to have an understanding of her perspective on, like, product. And, like, obviously everything is authentic to her. So when I listen to her talk about her makeup routine and what she looks for, she's super into texture, like, feeling things. So, like, you know, I just discovered this about my son. Anything I give him something to eat, he just smells it. Like, the first thing he does is like, I wanna smell it. And I'm like, where is this coming from? Because I'm such Like a visual person. She's a sensorial person. Like, before she puts it on, she wants to feel what it's like. And at the time, she was like, I am, like, on the go, so if I'm doing my own makeup, it's really, like, put it on. I use my hands a lot. And so we had made the entire line basically liquid when we launched, so the blush was a liquid blush. And she also loved the ease of, like, the applicator of just, like, dotting and going. And so that's where we netted out with a liquid format. Now we actually reduced the pigment load on these by, like, 20%.
- [09:48]
Joyce
Really?
- [09:49]
Kirby
Yes, before we went. Because, I mean, it was like, even for me, I'm like, it's blendable, but it's, like, super intense.
- [09:56]
Sarah
Goes a long way.
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Kirby
I mean, it literally. Yeah, there's been some content where someone took, like, a paperclip and put, like, the tiniest, and it was like, the perfect and the perfect. But we also have seen kind of where people have, like, gone through an entire bottle. I just went through one of Hope, my favorite color. But, yeah, I mean, we were kind of apprehensive because it was so pigmented. And mind you, like, this is the world of, like, Covid, where, like, no one's really, like, wearing.
- [10:17]
Sarah
Wearing masks.
- [10:18]
Kirby
Yeah, everyone's wearing masks and everything. And so, like, right before, literally, like, production, we were like, I think we should reduce the pigment load, because I think people will be a little overwhelmed by this for sure. And then fast forward. I think the most viral video on TikTok was someone not realizing how pigmented it was putting it on, and she's like, oh, my God. But then blending it out. And so to think it could have been even more pigmented is just a fun little anecdote.
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Joyce
I remember it launched, and then I remember several months later, there were several black influencers that were like, you guys are sleeping on this blush. This is incredible. Like, I didn't really know how it was gonna pan out for me, and it actually shows up on my complexion. Did you guys go into it with the intention of making sure it was going to show up on every skin tone?
- [11:09]
Kirby
Oh, for sure. I mean, when I think about brand pillars, like what we wanted rare to be known for, obviously product is a huge part of mission, is a huge part of it with rare impact and what she's doing for the mental health space, but inclusion. Right. And that's evolved not just from diversity and having products that work for all different skin tones, all different skin Types and ages and then all the way to like our made accessible initiative. But yeah, I mean, out the gate, you know, for us, in all honesty, we were in that space of like Rihanna had did this amazing thing with Fenty, right. Putting women of color first, showcasing the breadth of shades when it comes to foundation first. And we were living in a. Okay, we're launching a mission based brand with someone who happens to be one of the most biggest celebrities in the world. And how do we come with authenticity on the table with like a perspective of like really knowing what they're talking about? And out the gate we were like, this is my job to be like, we need to launch with like a foundation or mascara because those are loyalty driven products that if someone likes, you mean business. If you come with that. If you're launching with. Not to say like a blush or a lip is not as important or equally like moving, you know, but at the end of the day, like when a girl finds her go to foundation or mascara, it's over, you know, like you're like committed. And so those were the categories. We were like, we're going to go deep. And so from there it was really about breadth of shades. And so if we're going to have 48 shades of foundation and really have a really breath of like diverse undertones and everything, then we have to have the blushes that go with those. So from day one, that was definitely part of it. Yeah.
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Sarah
So it sounds like Selena is very involved.
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Kirby
I just left her in the office actually.
- [12:59]
Joyce
She's like, where are you going?
- [13:00]
Kirby
Yeah, she's. We're like double booked with all these things that we're working on. But yeah, we just. Yeah, she's great. She's really good. Amazing.
- [13:07]
Sarah
What's something that fans of hers or fans of the brand might not know about her when it comes to rare and the products that you guys develop?
- [13:16]
Kirby
I think that people think she's far removed. Not because like in the weeds of like the details, but like I bet people would think that she's far removed of knowing what like for quote unquote, regular people are looking for. But she's so in tune with just what her friends are using, her peers. Like, she's very. She'll go into a Sephora. Like the mask situation was great for her because she literally like floats around and people don't realize it's her. And she just watches and observes and she will text me and be like, hey, I'm here and I'm seeing a ton of people shop this. Like, what have you heard about it? I'm gonna buy one and test it. So she's testing, like, competitors products out there and, like, very much, like, giving her feedback about, like, what I love about this. Have we thought about doing something like this? And she's much more, like, aware of consumer behavior, I think, than most people probably wouldn't think because she's just so busy and doing all these other things. Right. So, yeah.
- [14:17]
Sarah
Interesting. Is she, like, watching what consumers are saying on, like, social media about the product?
- [14:22]
Kirby
Is she watching reviews about ours? Yeah, I would assume that she's kind of like me, where we wait for people to send us the good stuff. You know what I mean? Like, we just launched our lip gloss, our Positive light lip gloss. And I'm the type of person and I may have taught this to her because it's so, like, stressful. Like, you want people to love what. What you've been working on, but it's scary. It's like putting your heart on your sleeve and being like, all right, community. Say what you want about it, you know, and, like, I wait for my extended team to be, like, things have been really positive in the reviews, and I think she waits for me to kind of deliver that, but I think it's unavoidable. Right. Like, our algorithms are crazy and, like, she's certainly on TikTok and, like, watching things and creating content for us too. So I'm sure she's seeing things. And then we had an event last night that she was at, and the sentiment was really positive. So for her, I think she loves, like, the energy of being around people when they're discovering rare beauty for the first time. That's why she kind of, like, hides and watches people at the gondola and stuff like that. Oh, my God.
- [15:23]
Sarah
Next time you're at Sephora, if you.
- [15:25]
Kirby
See someone in a mask, it may be Selena, you know, breathing down your shoulder, being like, what are you doing? Do you like it? You know, it's also super personal.
- [15:33]
Joyce
So has there ever been a product that you've gotten feedback on that you were surprised by? That you didn't expect people to either really love or felt that it missed the mark. And were you able to go back and quote, unquote, fix it?
- [15:47]
Kirby
You know, we launched with this, and I die on this hill. Our stay Vulnerable glossy lip balm is like my everyday. It's no shimmer, just a touch of color. The texture is so amazing. It's super moisturizing. It has the one of the highest ratings for a Rare on Sephora.com and there's, like, a small following of people that, like, love it. And we did, like, an exclusive shade in a set that people also loved it as well. It just never got, like, the traction. And it makes me sad because it's so great. It's like my every everyday bomb. And I mean, it's hard to, like, go back and fix something that we're, like, we love already as is. And when I'm in the office, every girl has one. Like, obviously at Rare, like, you're gonna, you know, carry around, but people also buy competitively, so I don't expect them only to have rare stuff, but it's really in their bag as their go to Everyday Lip balm. And it just never got, like, maybe it'll get love now, but it never just, like, pick, you know, we got stuck trapped in this Blush world, and we're like, you know, just in that so totally.
- [16:48]
Sarah
I like that product a lot.
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Kirby
Me too. I know.
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Joyce
That's a beautiful product.
- [16:52]
Kirby
Yeah.
- [16:52]
Joyce
I feel the same way about the Blot and Glow Touch up kit.
- [16:55]
Kirby
Oh, my gosh. Yes.
- [16:56]
Sarah
So good.
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Kirby
Okay, that feels like a lifetime ago.
- [16:58]
Joyce
But, yes, truly a product that launched at launch.
- [17:02]
Kirby
Yes.
- [17:03]
Joyce
I still have mine.
- [17:04]
Kirby
Shut up.
- [17:05]
Joyce
I will not get rid of it. Oh, my God. I refuse to. And I actually, like, fill up my puff with loose powder and, like, we'll put it in there. I was telling Jess White, actually, who works at Rare, I was like, can y' all just make it in a smaller. Like, cut it in half? Yeah, so, like, so you can actually put it in your purse. Cause I'm like, this would be great for red carpets. Like, this is, like, a very Selena centric product.
- [17:26]
Kirby
And that was all her. Like, she was like, if I can, like, impose myself in being like, I really need to have this. Cause strategy wise, I talked to her about timing and what, you know, what the potential of the business is, those kind of things. But she was like, I really. I need this. Like, I need it in my bag for, you know, red carpet stuff. Like, can we make it? And I was like, let's do it. And it was really fun to go through. And really taking, like, her vision from packaging everything and being like, all right, let's do it. And it just. It's also. No one was going out. You know what I mean? I know.
- [17:58]
Joyce
And it's so sad because this is such a good product. I mean, the amount of powder that the puff held, I just felt like I could never. It was never gonna run out.
- [18:07]
Kirby
Yeah.
- [18:08]
Joyce
I was like, this is incredible. And then obviously, you have the blotting papers, which are great. So you're not adding more powder.
- [18:12]
Kirby
Yes.
- [18:13]
Joyce
The only thing was just, I think, how big it was.
- [18:15]
Kirby
Yeah. If I look back, I would have probably stacked it so that it's a little bit more compact. In our minds, we were like, it's as big as an iPhone. If you can carry an iPhone, you can carry this. But then, now that I think about it, I'm like, who wants to carry around two iPhones? Although there's a lot of people that do that from, like, a work perspective. And I'm like, I just. Yeah, but okay, please go back to.
- [18:35]
Joyce
The team and say, kirby desperately would like for you to figure this out. Yeah.
- [18:40]
Sarah
And, like, mini are popular.
- [18:41]
Kirby
And that's like, oh, my gosh. Could you imagine that in, like, a mini set?
- [18:45]
Joyce
My day would be made. I love all of the little mini blushes. Mini brushes are, like, the perfect amount, in my opinion.
- [18:52]
Sarah
I just, like, can't. I can't use it because it's so cute.
- [18:55]
Joyce
But with the little baby bags. With the bags, I, like, put them in front of my dog and pretend like they're. But it is.
- [19:01]
Sarah
It's perfect for your purse.
- [19:02]
Kirby
It's perfect. The office is, like, super obsessed with labubus right now. We all are. Right. And we just have all our labubus lined up with the mini bags and the mini blushes.
- [19:13]
Joyce
The mini bags are so smart. One thing I really like that rare has done. And I'm actually not sure if this falls under you, because it's technically merchandise.
- [19:21]
Kirby
I guess, but, like, it's on our team. Yeah.
- [19:23]
Joyce
No way. So, like, the bags, the puffy bags, the puffy makeup bags, the mini bags, even the dog toys. My favorite. My dog's favorite toys are the rare mascara. No way. And the blush.
- [19:36]
Kirby
I love it.
- [19:37]
Joyce
Loves them. She loves that they crackle, and she loves that they squeak.
- [19:40]
Kirby
Yeah. I never would have thought this would be in my wheelhouse when we were doing dog toys. But, I mean, when we have moments like that, like, the team loves it, like, actually, like, our merch, you know, not to pat ourselves on the back, but it's just, like, gotten huge for us. Like, people really identify that silhouette, that material, our colors with the brand. And we love that people come to, obviously, our website to get more of an immersed feeling of, like, the brand ethos and everything. And the bags are just, like, another opportunity to show brand love. Right. And we try to keep them not so logo driven. Something that can be used all the time when we see them in the wild, though, I literally was at an airport terminal, and I saw one of the peach bags coming out of the luggage thing, and I was like, what sociopath is checking in this peach bag? Right? Like, I would never, because it's just gonna get so dirty. It looked pretty good, but I was literally like, oh, my gosh. It's out in the wild. No, that is a carry on bag.
- [20:38]
Sarah
That is a carry on bag.
- [20:39]
Joyce
I love that bag. I am shocked.
- [20:41]
Kirby
And we made a black one. A lot of, like, men in the office were like, all right, we got a black one. The peach does by far. Way, way more than the black. Yeah.
- [20:49]
Joyce
But I think that kind of also speaks to, you know, the merchandise, the. The sweatsuits, the. The products. It all kind of. I. We love when a brand really comes together and, like, makes a lot of sense. And obviously, she has an amazing team around her. She would not have any. Anything less. But soft is a word that I think of when I think of rare. Is that, like, a key word for.
- [21:12]
Kirby
You guys when you're making things cozy, soft, weightless, airy. Like, as we look at formulas, we're in that world as we think about visuals, you know, it's a weightlessness, a levity. It's not so serious. You know, it's about being approachable, and those are definitely, like, keywords as we tackle anything, you know?
- [21:34]
Sarah
So I also feel like I feel safe with all the products. Right. It's like, you feel seen, so that's, like, a part of the safety.
- [21:42]
Kirby
Right.
- [21:43]
Sarah
It's, like, inclusive, but just. It, like, brings you joy and comfort.
- [21:47]
Kirby
Yeah. And I think that's, you know, it's music to my ears without us having to, like, explicitly explain what our brand values are or, like, the culture at the company. But day one, it was, you know, when we were working with Selena on, like, visual campaigning of, like, what do we want people to feel when they're immersed into rare beauty? And her comment was, at the time, she was living with her friends, her roommates, not in show business. Do people say show business anymore? Not celebrity. I don't know. Not celebrity. Whatever. And that's how she was discovering makeup, which was, like, enlightening to me. Right? Like, as, like, meeting her for the first time. She brought her best friend with her to the meeting and was like, okay, my friend has trouble skin. She's looking for, like, a more fuller coverage eye. Like, am lucky and don't need that. But I want to make sure her needs are met, you know, and that's just her as a person is always like, how do others feel about this? Which is an amazing partnership to have with somebody when they're not just, like, in their tunnel vision of things. But when we were thinking about brand cues and visuals, she's like, I want people. Like, she's like, I think about putting on makeup in, like, my bathroom with all my girlfriends getting ready together. And I think we all can really think of a moment like that when you're, like, excited to go out and you're like, like, oh, you need a mascara. Like, God forbid we share these things now, but, like, oh, you need a mascara or you need a lip. And, like, being like, oh, I just found this and I love it. You should try it. You know, that type of sharing of information and feeling not judged about things like, that was the ethos of, like, how we wanted to create that feeling in, like, every capacity with the brand.
- [23:27]
Joyce
So since we have you, we're like, okay, we have to ask her a few questions just about the industry that Sarah and I don't know. We have never created a brand before. Why do we see so many brands launching this same type of product at the same time? Is there a calendar or something that is telling different brands, like, okay, you launch a powder this time of year, you launch this this time, or even just from, like, a trending standpoint?
- [23:50]
Kirby
Well, that's a good question. That's a good question. So another thing to bring back is, like, I worked at a different brand before Nyx Professional Makeup, which was, like, Tony, eight years of my life, which I loved. The Nyx girl was a very specific type of person. And then to switch to this girl is, like, such, like, mind, you know, whatever, but, like, the product assortment. From day one, Selena was like, I don't want to be a trend chaser. She's like, I don't want to live in the world. And we all lived in this. I think it was, like 2016 of unicorn everything, you know, and it was gorgeous then. But, like, everyone was launching Prismatics or whatever, and I certainly was. I think I made unicorn everything. But it was, you know, short, right? It's. And then it's like the next thing. And, like, we didn't want to live in this space where we're, like, constantly chasing what's happening in the moment. Like, we wanted to. Her phrase was, I want to be, like, the go to brand. I want to be the go to mascara, the go to, you know, lip gloss, the go to all these things. And, like, I just want to have, like, really good product that resonates with people where it's something that's like, their hero product, and we can have fun and dabble in those areas, like a shimmery lip gloss, which really probably wasn't on our radar when we first launched, obviously, but, like, doing it in a way that makes sense for us. So not so prismatic, Just a nice subtle glow. More about the texture and the hydrating aspects of it. But, yeah, I mean, trying to forecast what's gonna happen for us. We just lean on the fact that, like, we have a white space within our portfolio. We're so consumer centric of, like, what are people needing? Or can we improve on an experience, especially with, like, packaging and things like that, of, like, how do we approach it in the rare way versus, like, chasing trends, I guess. I think the blush movement that's happened. I would love to attribute it all to, like, oh, rare had this great blush, but everyone was kind of needing some levity and some brightness, and here we are, and we're always trying to, like, re. Innovate in that category. I mean, that's what beauty is, right? There are just some products that are, like, my mom used that when I was younger. I remember. And I, I, I'll still gravitate and use it, but, yeah, it's hard to, like, project that. And I think that everyone's kind of looking, especially with social media and seeing what's on social media at the same time, which is kind of dictating, like, trends. Right. I came from before I got into beauty in the apparel and footwear industry for a skateboarding brand. Super random. I know, but we used to do, like, these brand inspiration trips where we would travel to different markets because we didn't have social media where it was so instant. Right. Live or anything like that. So us going to France to see what people were wearing or Japan was part of the development process because for, you know, in apparel and footwear, they were far ahead in terms of, like, trends and different fabrics and different cuts. Like, we just don't have that anymore. It's like a global, like, movement in fashion as well, but also specifically in makeup, outside of, like, Korea, Japan, and China, who do their own thing, everyone else is, like, on the same wavelength, so.
- [27:02]
Sarah
Totally.
- [27:02]
Kirby
Yeah.
- [27:03]
Sarah
So then on that note, how does rare then decide what category they're gonna go into next if it's not based on, you know, unicorn, whatever's trending at the moment? Like, for example, fragrance? Like, how do you decide? Okay, you and Selena, like, how do you Decide that's where you want to go next.
- [27:21]
Kirby
I think timing is everything for us. We, like, we launched Find Comfort, which was such a natural progression for us because the whole messaging around rare is just makeup made to feel good in. And when we announced the launch, which was, I'm trying to remember, like, five months prior to actually launching in store, her fans were like, give us fragrance. Like, we want fragrance. Like, could it be hair? All of these different things, but overwhelmingly like fragrance. So, like, even before we launched, it kind of was like in the back of our mind, but we were like, okay. But fragrance at that time was very like. I mean, Selena, even in her younger days did like the her fragrance, which somebody on our team actually bought one on ebay. And it's like, I don't know why people are using it, because I'd be terrified to. But, like, it was like this purple genie bottle with, like, wires and, like, lips on it. It's hilarious.
- [28:15]
Sarah
I bet you Joby had it.
- [28:16]
Joyce
Yeah.
- [28:17]
Sarah
Our social media manner is, like, Selena obsessed.
- [28:20]
Joyce
Oh, my God, She.
- [28:21]
Sarah
I bet she has it.
- [28:22]
Kirby
Well, someone ordered it, brought it into the office. I took a picture of it, and I sent it to Selena, and I was like, look at what we got off ebay. She's like, oh, my God. Like, she's like, the choice is made for that. She's like, I remember thinking this was so cool, you know, so, like, in what smell? Like, I couldn't even tell you if it was meant to smell like that because it's so old, you know, and none of us wanted to, like, actually wear it because we don't know. But, yeah, like, so fragrance was always in the back of our minds and more of, like, a timing thing. Like, when does it make sense for us? We know our. Her community, you know, her fans wanted. And so Find Comfort was this great, like, opportunity for us to, like, go into another category. But it was so organic and made sense. It's like body care that makes you feel good, right? So smell good, feel good, all of that connection, emotional connection. And while we were developing the fragrance for our first Find Comfort collection, we were like, okay, let's just kind of dabble and see, like, development wise, like, if we were to do a fragrance, like, because it's such a long lead time and it's so personal, we were like, let's start and see what that looks like. How do we want to approach the category together? And we were thinking, wow, there's a lot of already, like, celebrity fragrance brands, just, like celebrity makeup brands. And so we Said, you know, hands down, we need to approach this in a more disruptive way. So we looked at it from a packaging lens, which we're, like, super proud of, from a gesture lens with these layering bombs that we're also launching at the same time, just taking into consideration how personal fragrance is to people. And we're in an age where people want customization. They don't. You know what I mean? Like, they want to be able to inherently create something on their own that's indicative or representative of how they're feeling that day. Yeah.
- [30:12]
Joyce
They want a wardrobe, not necessarily a signature scent anymore. It's very different. It's evolved. And by the way, we didn't even announce this. They launched a fragrance. The fragrance is being launched.
- [30:24]
Sarah
So let's go. Can you walk us through? Like, walk us through.
- [30:27]
Joyce
This is Rare eau de parfum.
- [30:30]
Kirby
So fancy twist cap.
- [30:32]
Sarah
Genius.
- [30:33]
Joyce
So that's the packaging aspect. I love that there's the little lock to tell you when it's open and closed. I remember when Rare first launched, we had Selena on the podcast. It was via Zoom. We were like, okay, we're writing this for our website. Like, we wanted it to, like, blow it out, make it a big deal. We're like, we keep seeing videos on TikTok saying, oh, yeah, and because she has lupus, that these end caps on the blush and things like that are actually meant to help with people's dexterity challenges. I remember I asked Jess, and she was like, that's not necessarily exactly, like, how it came to be.
- [31:08]
Kirby
Yes.
- [31:09]
Joyce
But we love that people are able. They gave us, like, a full quote, like, we're glad that people see it this way. That wasn't necessarily the intention from the jump, but now I feel like the brand has really jumped on that.
- [31:22]
Kirby
Yeah. I mean, we were delighted. We were like, wow. A community that doesn't feel seen is finding joy in our products. Amazing. You know, and we started seeing this viral content of people relating the ease of use for some of the packaging with Selena and her own dexterity challenges. And for us, we were like, how do we like? It wasn't intentional by, like, hey, let's design these that are easy to open. But by personal preference, I mean, as you can imagine, we went through many designs and iterations, models being made. She went through all of them and picked what the silhouette is. So a byproduct of perhaps, like, what her dexterity challenges are. She leaned towards. That design could potentially, for sure, have been the case for us. We were like, wow. Like, the Community keeps asking. And for us, from like a branding perspective, anytime you make, you know, in a product claim, whether it's something like waterproof, you have to substantiate that with showing that it actually does these things. So we were very familiar about what is the process to do that from like a formula perspective. But something like this like just didn't exist in the market. And we kept trying to like research and reach out to like designers that make like ergonomic things like how do you validate? And there was this amazing brand guide that's already in the market that like the founder worked with her doctor to design things. But again like how do you take like a larger population of statistics and like really show that it works? And instead we were like, you know what, there's nothing out there. It's been like a couple of years since this story and virality has taken place and now we're being even more intentional with our designs. We should really just create something and partner with the authority, authoritative figures in these worlds and really do our research and hope that people make that process better. Right. Like we want to make something but you know, we're not the end all, be all. I just hope that people, you know, see the community and the need for that and then just elevate it. Right. And so we worked with Dr. Esther Bay, she's a occupational therapist. She connected us with Casa Colina, which is a research rehabilitation center in Southern California. And we worked with them to create like a claims verification like process. So they reached out to their patients and got volunteers of people that use makeup on a regular basis, which between a certain age with mild to moderate dexterity issues. And then the physical therapist like worked with them to create kind of like evaluation criteria. And it was like a year long process of just like getting the people sending them all the things, training the, you know, the physical therapist on like what is the usage intention? And even from a formula perspective they were like, oh, this is so like fluid. It's like easier for me to apply versus something that's like much thicker, like heavier, that kind of thing. And so through all of that we created the made accessible initiative. And it's just been like one of the driving forces as we look through like new product development and fragrance was in like a category where we were like, all these beautiful bottles exist, but most of them have like a very precision actuator which we found out and learned through the design process of this is that like, like the muscles in your fingertips are like the weakest. So like when you lose that dexterity, it's really hard to, like, have normal function capability, right? So, like, if as one phalange. Not the right technical term at all, but, like, as you lose that usage, it's harder for you to do things that require precision and, like, movement. So we were like, let's make an oversized actuator. Like, at the end of the day, we're not even dealing with just. Just finger mobility issues. But if they don't have functionality in their hands altogether, could they use a different body part? Could they leverage the flat rigidness of a table top to, like, spray? And so that's how we kind of positioned ourselves. And then we worked with a group of hand therapists, specifically hand therapists led with a doctor within that works for the Veterans affairs office. She brought our community together, which was so cool because all these hand therapists came and they're like, wait, you should do this and add this. And we were. We were like, okay, but it still has to look cute. They're like, put some rubber on the bottom. And I'm like, okay, let's. What are the things that we can do, though? Like, cute, but no, but, yeah. So we, like, came up with the right proportions. Like, the cutout on the back is intentional, so your hand can wrap around it. So it's meant to, you know, you can use your thumb as the base and use multiple fingers on top, or you can just hug it and use your main finger or your palm or your palm. Or if you need to have the table, you. You can, like, elbow, forearm, all these things. And I think it was like, 96% of the study of people with mild to moderate dexterity issues found that the design made it much easier to use, which is great.
- [36:11]
Sarah
Hey, super cute.
- [36:13]
Kirby
Thank you. Yeah, super cute.
- [36:15]
Joyce
Was there anything that the hand therapists taught you that you were surprised by? Like, you think of, again, these fragrance bottles that are really ornate with was. What were the absolute nos, besides the smaller.
- [36:28]
Kirby
The smaller. I mean, like, how it holds in your hand, the shape. I mean, some of these are beautiful. Like, you display them on your vanity, right? But in reality, like, painful to hold. Painful to hold if you don't have that strength in your hand. And most of them are glass, if not all of them. Like, it's really challenging. And so it was really eye opening. Because I think Dr. Esther Bay also told us, like, like a statistic that was like, 80% of the people in this. In this world, like, have some sort of disability, like, physical disability. It may. What the moderation Is varies, but, like, if that's not something that people are addressing because we have the luxury of it not being, like, our reality. Right. But when we hear just one person go online and say, I feel seen and heard, and this is, like, made for me, like, that's why we do this Right. As, like, for those moments. So. Yeah.
- [37:18]
Sarah
Amazing.
- [37:19]
Joyce
So it's in the warm and spicy fragrance family.
- [37:22]
Kirby
Yeah.
- [37:22]
Sarah
It smells so good.
- [37:23]
Joyce
Is that different from Gourmand?
- [37:25]
Kirby
Yeah. So I would say Gourmand is more of, like, a yummy, delicious, decadent fragrance. We have pink pepper and ginger to add that element of spiciness to it. So it's not so sweet, I would say. So it's layered. Yeah.
- [37:38]
Sarah
I'm not a Gourmand girl.
- [37:40]
Kirby
Yes.
- [37:40]
Sarah
But I love spice, and I. But I love that this still smells sweet, but there's still sort of that, like, edgy, right? Yeah. So how did you land on that?
- [37:52]
Kirby
Oh, my gosh, like, 20 iterations later, it was crazy. Like, we've had these two magical moments in the brand in terms of, like, development and everything, where everyone that tested it was on the same page, which is, like, really hard because we have so many different, you know, wants and needs and skin types and ages and ethnicities and all of these things. The first was our mascara, which is wild to me that it even happened. We had. I mean, I was like, if you have lashes, you're testing. And so we would have these huge product sessions where the office admin all the way to, you know, the intern was in there. And we were just like, okay, we're applying mascara. And we landed at where we landed because everyone came and, like, loved it as their go to everyday mascara. And we positioned the mascara of, like, wait, what is your lash type? Which is so, like, personal as well, to, like, your hair type, your skin type, all of that. And so we actually did. We like to do these fun claims testing that doesn't exist. But we narrowed down the mascara into four different lash types that people have and then did claims testing for all lash types and how the mascara performs. So when we call it a universal volumizing mascara, it's really a perspective of, like. Cause my fine, thin, straight lashes that I have, like, five of are not gonna be the same. That, you know, someone on the team that has, like, really beautiful lashes that are blessed, you know? But everyone loved the brush, the formula, et cetera. And it was like, a really, really weird, surreal moment where everyone at the table was like, I would totally wear this blush or this Mascara. Because, like, it just, like, never happens. The fragrance was another one when we finally netted out at this. And it's. The journey was wild. It started with, like, all right, we want, like, a second skin fragrance, because that's, like, during COVID everyone was like, you know, wanting to just have a light, you know, every day wear just easy get step into it, smell like themselves, fragrance, and. But then at the end of the day, like, talking to everybody in the company, it was like, no, I want long wear. I want people to know that it's, like, me when I step into, like, a room, I want to have some, like, people to, like, be able to smell what that is. And then obviously taking into account, like, what are. What do people want right now? You know, like, vanillas have been having a minute for a really long time. But it's like, how do you create something that's more layered and complex and ownable than what's already out there? You know? And it now I feel like I am also not a gourmand girl. But adding just that spice to it made me feel like, oh, this is something I could wear, like, on the daily. And it was, like, unisex. Like, men in the office were loving it, women were loving it, and it was one of these, wow. Like, hands down, we did blind tests and, like, smells, and people checked the boxes, and we were like, this is crazy. Like, everyone loves it, which is great.
- [40:33]
Joyce
So the notes that we have are caramel, pistachio, and pink pepper for the top. The heart is vanilla ginger and cocoa beans. And then it says dry sandalwood, tonka beans, and skin musks. Then we have these balms.
- [40:46]
Kirby
Yes.
- [40:47]
Joyce
Can you tell us a little bit? There's four of them, and you briefly mentioned them earlier while we were going.
- [40:51]
Kirby
Through the process of kind of, like, educating everyone in the office about fragrance. Because when originally we would do these smell tests, and people were like, I love it or I hate it, and, like, no other feedback, right? I was like, okay, that doesn't help me. Like, what do you not like? And then I realized, oh, oh, I need them to tell me, what is your olfactory preference? Like, if I know you're not a gourmand person, and I'm giving you all of these to tests that are, like, very sugary, vanilla forward, you're never gonna like it. Right? So we did this whole roundtable. I want you to try this one. It's my favorite.
- [41:23]
Joyce
Oh, I love how nice.
- [41:24]
Sarah
This one's my favorite.
- [41:25]
Kirby
Oh, the vanilla is. Yeah. The amber Vanilla is the one.
- [41:27]
Joyce
The amber vanilla is great, but I love how the balm, it melts. Yeah, it's not oil.
- [41:33]
Kirby
A lot of.
- [41:34]
Joyce
A lot of these fragrance balms, really.
- [41:36]
Kirby
They leave a shade, and it's kind of sticky, right? Exactly.
- [41:39]
Sarah
Wait. This is my favorite.
- [41:40]
Kirby
See, that's my world. I live in this world. I like to smell like, man.
- [41:44]
Sarah
No, totally.
- [41:44]
Kirby
No.
- [41:45]
Sarah
And I. Yeah, it's, like, clean.
- [41:46]
Kirby
You like it to be like I, which I am also.
- [41:48]
Joyce
It's almost like a mattifying balm for your face, the way there's a lot of scent. My hair looks awesome.
- [41:54]
Kirby
There's a lot of similarities, so. Sure.
- [41:56]
Sarah
Oh, I love it.
- [41:57]
Kirby
So we wanted to create this, like, layering story, right? And these are all based on different olfactory families. So we have amber vanilla, which is, like, your traditional, like, gourmandy sweet, like, family. We have floral peony blossom, which is obviously your floral family. Then you have fresh bergamot, which is like, the bright, sparkly, fresh family. And then woody oak, which obviously leans more into woody oak. Like, what I call it woody oak, man.
- [42:25]
Joyce
It's definitely.
- [42:25]
Kirby
Man. It is. It's my favorite. And that's what I layer. So, like, on those days where I'm like, I want to create something a little bit different for myself because I'm feeling like. I don't know. You know what I mean? But, like, if it's during the day and you're, like, going on and I want something more bright, then I might blend it with fresh bergamot.
- [42:43]
Sarah
But, I mean, they all smell really.
- [42:46]
Kirby
Amazing on its own, standing alone. So we're like.
- [42:48]
Sarah
You're like, do I need to spray?
- [42:50]
Kirby
Yes. Yes, Sarah. Because it also extends the light, it extends the wear, and then it really, you know, becomes this. This, like, customized.
- [42:59]
Sarah
Wait, can you make it in a bigger bottle, though? Like, come on, put this all over me.
- [43:05]
Kirby
We love the texture. Again, leading with sensoriality. You know, to your point, most like, fragrance, fragrance bombs have this, like, oily, sticky. They're, like, in a stick residue. We wanted something that was equally easy to put on, throw in your bag. And then also from, like, a price point perspective, it's, like, great. You can, you know, create basically two different fragrances with one. Two. Yeah. With your fragrance.
- [43:27]
Joyce
Are these going to be sold separately?
- [43:29]
Kirby
Yes.
- [43:29]
Joyce
And individually?
- [43:30]
Kirby
Yes.
- [43:30]
Joyce
Okay, great. And then the fragrance itself, it's called rare. I think we mentioned that.
- [43:34]
Kirby
Yes.
- [43:35]
Joyce
$75. Very. For a fragrance, affordable price point. In my humble opinion. I. I feel like these are gonna go gangbusters with gen Alpha the bombs.
- [43:47]
Kirby
Because they're gonna like create, mix and match, that kind of thing.
- [43:49]
Joyce
How much are the bombs?
- [43:51]
Kirby
I think they're 19. Oh, 20. Don't listen to me on anything. Okay.
- [43:54]
Sarah
So the bombs are 20 each sold separately. Individually.
- [43:57]
Joyce
I just think Gen Alpha is going to lose.
- [43:59]
Sarah
No, totally.
- [44:00]
Joyce
I think that they're going to want.
- [44:01]
Sarah
To pick them up cocktailing with like.
- [44:03]
Kirby
Yes. Yeah, for sure.
- [44:04]
Sarah
But again, like, fragrance is so personal.
- [44:07]
Kirby
Yeah.
- [44:07]
Sarah
You can't mess that up.
- [44:08]
Kirby
That's what it is. But also it's like people like have. We all know what the great fragrances are because we're on fragrance talk. Or like we go into the store and stuff. But people still want to have some individuality. Right. Like, it's great to be like, this is my hero fragrance. But like, I discovered it first. Or this is like ice. This is my signature fragrance. That kind of thing. Like, I think people want more and more to like, have the ability to control that. And like, layering has been around for like ages, for sure. But for us, we were like, we want to have an option to do that that's a little bit more fun, you know, and like, affordable, I would say, versus having to get like two full sized fragrance bottles to like. Totally.
- [44:48]
Joyce
So I also just love how the fragrance itself and the balms, you can smell them. I feel like sometimes with a lot of these newer fragrances launching mists, it's hard to smell them and it's hard to have them stay. They don't have the longevity.
- [45:01]
Kirby
Longevity.
- [45:02]
Joyce
But when I've put on rare and then left the house, I've had people be like, oh, what is that? I'm like, but this is my first time trying the balms. And I mean, I keep smelling myself. Honestly, I can actually smell it.
- [45:13]
Kirby
Yeah. I was. Because we may be working on more, but I was smelling. I had them on my, like, forearms, like.
- [45:20]
Sarah
Yeah.
- [45:20]
Kirby
Testing them. And it was literally like, end of the day, I was like, what is that lovely smell? It was myself.
- [45:25]
Joyce
Right.
- [45:25]
Kirby
But like, I didn't. I forgot that I had.
- [45:27]
Sarah
I will wear this. Go buy. Go buy the perfume. But honestly, I feel like, just alone. Yeah. I'm like, oh, I could slap it a solid.
- [45:34]
Joyce
But also I keep touching it.
- [45:35]
Kirby
I know.
- [45:36]
Joyce
So good. This should be like a body balm with milk fragrance for the people that want to put it all over their body body.
- [45:41]
Kirby
Like a huge 400 gram.
- [45:43]
Joyce
No, because look, it's literally. I mean, it mattified and smoothed my hand.
- [45:47]
Sarah
Yeah. But I also want to smell what it looks like. When you layer this on top and.
- [45:51]
Kirby
Like create little woody oak, that's my jam with our.
- [45:55]
Joyce
You're the rare with woody oak. I'm probably gonna be rare with the amber vanilla.
- [45:59]
Sarah
I think I'm blue. What's the blue?
- [46:01]
Kirby
I like the bergamot.
- [46:02]
Sarah
Yeah. I think I am a bergamot.
- [46:05]
Kirby
Wow.
- [46:06]
Joyce
This is fab. Joyce, thank you so much for coming on the podcast Genius. If you are watching or listen this, you can go and read real verified reviews from our glamielinos about the fragrance. And you'll be able to buy the fragrance when?
- [46:24]
Kirby
August 7th.
- [46:26]
Joyce
Amazing.
- [46:26]
Kirby
Yeah.
- [46:27]
Joyce
Okay, so you'll have to wait a week, but it's coming.
- [46:29]
Kirby
You love it.
- [46:30]
Sarah
If you could smell us, guys.
- [46:31]
Joyce
Yeah, I know. Smell o vision. We figured everything else out.
- [46:35]
Kirby
I know. We put a man on the moon. We still can't do this Monday. Exactly.
- [46:39]
Joyce
Thank you, Joyce.
- [46:40]
Kirby
Thank you for having me.
- [46:41]
Joyce
Wow.
- [46:41]
Kirby
It went by so fast. It was so great, guys.
- [46:55]
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