B (3:22)

You found a backpack?

A (3:23)

Yeah. Now I would say I'm the kind of parent whose friends text me, becky, you might have missed the email. Oh, back. I'm packing the list. Here it is. And I'm like, I love you and thank you. And I am also now the parent with my third kid where he just knows he does it. I feel like he's probably packing his brother's backpack who is six years older than him. And so I've been all the parents.

B (3:50)

Why do you think back to school feels like such a high stress moment?

A (3:53)

Well, I'm not sure you mean for parent or kids or both?

B (3:57)

Anyone?

A (3:57)

I mean, the summer to school transition is rough. I mean, summer. And I think we struggle a little bit with summer because there's no schedule. The mornings can feel long. You're like, oh, is it only 10:19? I feel like I've lived a whole day and gone through all my snacks. But there's also something we love about that. Like, our kids are out late. It's like, all right, whatever. We have nothing to do. And there's something on the weekends where your kids like my kids. In the summer, there's no soccer practice and then lacrosse tournament and then, you know, ballet. And your weekends have more openness. And again, while that can bring some unique problems, that freedom and feeling like you just have more agency and more time, I think as soon as we sense that that's about to go, it feels really, really bad. I also think the transition is hard for kids for the same reasons Right. They stay up late. There's a popsicle every day. There's maybe more time with friends and maybe even more time with family and more time for creativity and play and being outside. But I also think one of the reasons back to school is so hard for kids kind of coincides with why it's hard for parents. Like, we're a little bit in denial a lot. Like, I know for me, in the Northeast, we go back to school in September. For other people, it's August. And you're like, I don't want to think about it. I want to think about it. I want to think about it because we want to soak up every moment of summer. And yet we know kids do best when they know what to expect. See, we know what to expect. We know about the first day. We can hold a lot of information in our mind. We remember last year. We know we're gonna have to get a carpool. Whatever the things are, our kids don't hold that. And so because we want to kind of deny school starting, we also sometimes get in our own way of giving our kids the information in advance that would make their start of school a lot smoother. And then it all explodes. Cause we're like, oh, see, I really did have something to dread. And my kid really is freaking out. And my kid is acting like they'd never been to any school before, even though actually they're in third grade. Right. And so I think all of that comes together and makes it feel really stressful.

B (6:07)

How would you say that our own experiences with school shaped the way we respond or approach the season as parents so much?

A (6:14)

I mean, I think this brings me to something you and I talk about a lot. The fast forward error. Right? So you see your kid have some challenging moment. Let's say they're clinging to you on day one, or they say to you on day four. I have no friends. No one played with me at recess. It's almost like our body scans itself. And it's like, did I have trouble separating at school? Did I feel left out at recess? I know for me, being left out at recess is still. It's a painful, visceral memory. Like, I know where I was on that hill. I know where my friends or people I thought were my friends were playing without me. Right? And so I have this built up memory. My kid says something like, I had no one to play with. And instead of just responding to that moment, I've now fast forwarded like 30 years of their life. And between that moment for them and My own history and the strength of my feelings that have more to do with me than anything to do with them. A moment doesn't become a moment. It becomes this whole story. And then I'm not even responding to whatever happened today. I'm responding to them as if I need to stop this horrible future from happening, which is honestly more about quelling my own anxiety than anything to do with them. Right. And then I lead with my anxiety. They feel it in. The moment does become bigger. And so, yeah, I think there is this intense interaction between our kind of painful experience or even unprocessed experience and then their lived reality.

B (7:37)

Becky, each of your kids are so different from one another. Do you approach this transition differently with each of them?

A (7:43)

Oh, good question. My kids are so different. It's amazing to have three kids where, if you had to say, like, who's most similar? I think it's like this perfect triangle where they're all, you know, equally different. I feel like that must be true. Four or five kids, they're just all so many possibilities. Yeah. You know, like, for my deeply feeling kid, it's this interesting dance where deeply feeling kids really orient around control. They definitely don't like to be surprised. But too far in advance also can lead to, like, a lot of rumination. Right. My youngest kid really orients around capability. He likes to do things independently, like I've referred to at as, you know. And so I need to give him just enough kind of information for him to kind of flex the way he likes to feel old and in charge and doing things for himself.

B (8:28)

And how would you do that with him?

A (8:30)

Yeah, okay. Like, for example, like, he is a kid where he doesn't get as emotionally worked up about the transition, but he just likes to feel agency and, like, he can kind of have a role in something as opposed to something being done to him. So I might say something like, hey, here are the supplies we need. What do you think we should do? And leave it at that. And he's like, well, let's go to the store and I want to pick out my own folder. And, you know, I mean, I feel like it's not too long from now, I'll be like, here's some money. Go do it yourself. Because he really could do that at a really young age. But we'll go and he'll pick out the things and in the picking out and the putting it into his backpack, like, that's his way, I know, of being like, I'm here, I'm good. He doesn't get as stressed about what friends are in his class or what teacher he has, or do I have the best teacher. He's, you know, not as thrown off by those things I would say my other kids have, you know, are different. And so I think, again, my reaction when I get the class list. I remember one of my kids getting the class list and thinking like, oh, he's gonna be really upset. He's not with any of his friends. And, you know, I had the list first and I kind of somehow had this wise voice in me being like, don't lead with that. Which is easy to do. Oh, I found that the list, sweetie. I was like, just lead with the truth. Hey, I found out the list. Here it is. I gave it to him. I was like, spiraling. He's got the horrible school year holding.

B (9:51)

It inside, just waiting.

A (9:52)

Exactly. And he just kind of stated simply, like, oh, I'm with this kid. A lot of my friends are in this class. What are we doing today? And I was like, wow, I'm so glad I didn't lead with, we're gonna be okay and don't worry and you're resilient, you know. But he's a kid who also likes to feel prepared and does need a little bit more space around, kind of what something's gonna be like a imagining something in advance. And so, yeah, I mean, I think they all need something a little different. I would say all of them need information. Nobody likes to be surprised by the first day. And all of them, I think, require me to at first check in with myself, regulate my own emotions, and then kind of a little bit let them take the lead. You know how people say they need a vacation from their vacation? I never got it. Okay, then. I experienced summer break. As a parent, summer parenting can feel like a full time job. So by the time back to school rolls around, I find myself wondering, okay, when is the real break happening? Because honestly, the most enjoyable trips we've taken as a family tend to happen during long weekends and fall breaks. No pressure for picture perfect moments. No meltdowns from the heat, and no built up tension after weeks of constant togetherness. My go to for these short and sweet trips. Booking an Airbnb. There's space for everyone to spread out, a kitchen for easy meals, and separate bedrooms that let the grown up stay up after the kids go down. But you know what's even better? While you're away, you can list your own home on Airbnb too. Hosting on Airbnb is simple, flexible, and gives you a little extra Income to put toward your own trip or those mounting back to school costs. Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much@airbnb.com host.

B (11:45)

So we know separation struggles look different for deeply feeling kids than other kids. And I know you had a difficult experience with your own deeply feeling kid going to preschool. I was wondering, would you share a little more about that?

A (11:56)

Yeah. You know, it's so interesting as I've talked to so many parents of deeply feeling kids, and again, I know you know this, but deeply feeling kids, they are. They're kids who feel things more deeply. They experience the world in a more intense way. They take more in, and so they get filled up more quickly. And then when it all comes out, it comes out more intensely. Right. They also. They're just like, amazing perceivers of the world. They know. This is new. They know, hey, I don't know that adult. You're telling me who the teacher is. And all these other kids are like, oh, teacher, you look nice. I don't know who that woman is. I don't know who that dude is. I'm not trusting that person right away. There's something amazing about those kids. You're like, you are onto something. You are correct.

B (12:33)

Hold onto that for when you're older.

A (12:34)

Exactly. And so, not surprisingly for me, with my dfk, and I honestly think every single parent I know who has a DFK would say their arc just looks different. Yes. There's more clinginess, there's more tears, there's more protests, there's more swinging. Today was great. The next morning, I'm not going to school ever again. You're like, what just happened? It's like a little bit of whiplash. And so to me, and I know you know this when we remove the surprise, both for our kids but for ourselves, like, okay, I have a deeply feeling kid. They're always more attuned to transition and separation. School is separation and transition. Like, some kids take longer to learn how to swim. Some kids take longer to separate smoothly. Like, kids who take longer to learn how to swim can still be great swimmers. Kids who take longer to separate smoothly can still have a great year. Right. But when I really dug deep, not just to tactics and scripts, but to deeply understanding and kind of then knowing what to expect, I think that's the thing that gave me the sturdiness, something.

B (13:39)

That I love, you say that relates this a bit, is that resistance is part of your kid's arc?

A (13:44)

Yes.

B (13:45)

Can you tell more about that?

A (13:46)

Yeah, you know, I think so. Many times we see resistance for school. DFKs. Non DFKs. I'm not going to school today. And again, we do a fast forward error. Oh, my kids. Never going to school. They're not going to school today, they're not going to school tomorrow. I'm gonna have to quit my job and I'm never gonna have a life. And I didn't plan to homeschool my kid. I guess I'm homeschooling my kid now. Where do I get the curriculum? And like, all of that happened and your kid is still in bed. Okay, so this is a moment of resistance. Here's how I like to think about it. The truth is we all have multiple parts of us. Like, if you talked to me in the morning before I got out of bed, if I was in my most mature state, what I would say to you is, part of me doesn't wanna go to work today. Part of me wants to stay in bed and watch Netflix all day. It's actually a really big part of me.

B (14:34)

It's a loud part.

A (14:35)

Yeah. And there's another part of me that's looking forward to the day, even though it's more kind of long term thinking. That would be very sophisticated. I don't know a lot of adults who say a part of me X and a part of me Y. Right. But that is true. I have resistance to getting out of bed and going to work as an adult. I figured out how to make sense of that and work through that. Right. I talk to myself. We have our routines, we have better emotion regulation. We can plan. Our prefrontal cortex is more developed. All the things not our kids. So when I hear a kid say, I'm not going to school today, I know about the fast forward error. If I catch myself, can remind myself, hold on a second. This is a moment of resistance. This is my kid's resistant part. Do I really expect my 4 year old or even my 14 year old to say, you know, mom, a part of me doesn't want to go to school today. Kind of wish I could just stay in bed. Like, if that happened, I'd be like, I literally have the most emotionally mature child in the world. I think I should get a prize. But when a kid says, I'm not going to school, I think what's underneath that is a part of me doesn't want to go to school. But we respond on the surface. We take the bait. We either fast forward and panic or we just double down like, oh, you are going to school. Which makes anyone's resistant part. Act out more. Oh, I'm not going. And I kind of feel like this part of the kid is like, I was just trying to tell you a part of me doesn't want to go to school. Why did you have to blow this whole thing up and make me? Yeah, like, please chill. And so, yes, that idea of resistance, it's not a sign that your kid isn't cooperating. It's actually just part of the kind of cooperation, transition process. It's like just a part of the road. Like, we all want the road to be straight. I get my kid out of bed, they do the next step. They breakfast, they put on their shoes, they go to school. Okay, not my house, for any of my kids. If you think about the road, it's a little curvier. Then the curvy part is just the resistance. And if we don't make so much out of it and we don't latch onto it, we don't stop our kid there. And they often, you know, keep going.

B (16:41)

So you don't take the bait. And then what do you do?

A (16:44)

I mean, there's so many different things we can do and there's. And this is where I think understanding your kid, like, for me, my deeply feeling kid, is very different from my youngest, like, my kind of, like, resilient, rebel type kid. I think step one is my favorite strategy in the world. Doing nothing. That is definitely, I think, a go to response. And I'll just act that out. I'm not going to school today. And for anyone who wants to know what I was just doing, I did nothing. Okay? That's what I just did.

B (17:13)

If you wanted to see it, if.

A (17:14)

They wanted to see it, it's on YouTube. You can see what? Doing nothing. Major, major. Take notes. But the thing about doing nothing is, what it really requires you to do is do something inside. Take a deep breath. Remind yourself it's not an emergency. Right? Don't fast forward. Okay? So just do nothing. And then what's so interesting is this kind of becomes a formula. I'm not going to school today. You do nothing. Your kid will say this, did you hear me? I'm not going. And then you can say, I heard you. You're not latching onto it. You're not ignoring it. You're just like, I haven't pictured. I'm just gonna, like, watch it go by. The I'm not going to school today is like, thrown up in the air. I'm not gonna use all my energy to swat it down. Cause I'm not scared of it, but I'm also not gonna ignore it. It's just like coming at me. And again, if you can watch on YouTube, I'm a little like, hmm, there you go, right? And then I just think you move the routine along. Like, you're not rejecting it or attaching it. Oh, well, you still need breakfast. Do you want a bagel? Oh, do you want yogurt? Or this? Oh, either way, you know, do you want water bottle with ice or no ice? Like, you're. You're just a little unimpressed, you know, but without being rude, right?

B (18:20)

You're kind of not getting stuck in that moment. You're just showing an option out of the moment for your kid to take. That's not the power struggle. It's not the you're doing this.

A (18:27)

It's kind of like, oh, that's what it is like. And I often think in these moments, I'm not going to school today. I'm not doing my soccer team anymore. And you're like, my kid loves soccer. I feel like when my kids sang to me is like, do you want to attend this power struggle party I'm inviting you to? Let me tell you about it. I'm gonna say something intense, and then you're gonna say something intense, and then we're gonna escalate and get more intense and both say things we actually do not mean. And then we're gonna end up yelling at each other and both feeling awful. Like, I just. Like, I'm an adult. Like, yeah, like, first of all, I've been to that party with. Not just you, with lots of people in my life. It's not that fun. Okay. And you're gonna continue to invite me because you're a kid, but as an adult, it is my job to continue RSVPing. No, not with rudeness. Not how dare you invite me. Just like, no, that's not a party I'm gonna attend. And I'm gonna lightly steer us to something that we're both gonna enjoy a little bit more.

B (19:20)

So we know a lot of parents dread drop off, especially that first day. Maybe it's pre K kindergarten, first grade, even third. Dropping off your kid. When they're crying, they're melting down, they're clinging to you. What would you say to a parent in that moment if you could whisper in their ear?

A (19:37)

First of all, I just want to say how my body feels remembering some of those drop offs with different ones of my kids. It is so painful. It's so real. I mean, you love the heck out of your kid. And no matter like how many things you've read or how many good inside mantras you've told yourself, okay, my job is not to make my kid happy. My job is to be sturdy through the turbulence, not avoid the turbulence. Me too. It doesn't take away the pain. So painful. So I guess what would I whisper? A couple things. I've been there too. I'm right here with you. Good parents have kids who cry at drop off. Your kids tears are not a barometer for whether you did a good job. Your kids tears are not even a good indicator of whether they're going to have a good day. And then what I would say is, I hope you have something planned after. Because the way we do need some connection and community and release self care right after this kind of moment that disguises itself as an easy moment with a no name drop off sounds so simple, is such a full heart, full body, full energy moment that the letdown is real. And so I would say to that parent, let's honor that and make sure you have something for yourself right after. What would you do? I can tell you what I did do. I think about the friends that were around the preschool with me who right before, you know, difficult, hard drop off would look at me kind of like, game on. You got this, you got this. The moment's coming. You know, anyone after would walk out and give me a hug, we'd go get coffee. They'd say the things to me that I just whispered that even though they were my words, I did not believe for a second and needed to hear from someone else. You know, sometimes like a little bit of distraction, like I can be prone to rumination. So I'm like, oh wait, did I do that right? Wish I've lingered a little bit more. If I linger too long, that's not good. But maybe it was too short. It's just not that useful. Is like not some exercise in perfection. And so I don't know, I'd like go exercise or you know, just do something to give me a slightly different experience. That that was sometimes part of my routine as well. I had this moment last year where I thought maybe my kid's school calendar was going to get the best of me picture Day volunteer signups, early dismissal on Tuesday. Wait, which kid has which game? If that sounds familiar, let me tell you about a Lifesaver Skylight calendar. It's designed to bring calm to your family's chaotic schedule. It pulls everyone's appointments, events, tasks, and lists into one simple touchscreen. Right there in your own home. Skylight Calendar syncs seamlessly with all of your existing calendars, Google, Apple, Outlook, even directly from your email, giving you custom views for daily, weekly, or monthly planning. My favorite feature is tasks. Tasks helps kids build healthy routines. And you can even assign colors to each family member. I always choose good inside yellow for myself, eliminating confusion and those endless I just forgot moments. And with the Skylight app, you can instantly add or update anything on the go. Right now, Skylight is offering our listeners $30 off their 15 inch calendars by going to skylight.com/becky. Go to skylight.combecky for $30 off your 15 inch calendar. That's s K Y L I G H t c a l.com Becky.

B (23:29)

Let'S move now to a school transition win that you had.

A (23:34)

I'm thinking about my oldest and I don't know, it was a couple years ago. He was fifth grade. I don't know. There are these moments I feel like when we hear our kids say something or do something, and I know me and my husband look at each other and we just think that was 10 years in the making, literally. Parents always say to me, well, how long until something we're working on will show up? Or how long if I'm doing this approach, where will my kids stop having such big meltdowns? And I always say the same thing. Longer than you want it. It just takes longer than you want it. And sometimes it takes really long. Doesn't mean we don't see glimmers, but like the big kind of moment where you're like, yes, that's can take a while. So, you know, I saw my oldest sitting down to do some homework and there was this really hard math problem, right? And I know there was kind of chatter amongst the kids. One of my friends who I happened to be in touch with happened to say something like, math homework's really hard this year. Like, are my kids really struggling with this problem? My son does this homework pretty independently, so I didn't even really know, but he happened to come out and say, I'm working on the bonus problem. I've been working on it for 20 minutes. Wow, that's a long time to be working on a bonus problem. And he showed it to me. I mean, like, I literally would have no ability to help him. It was, I don't even know I need to go to school for it. Exactly. And this is what he ended up saying to me. I know I need to erase it and start again. This is a really challenging One. But that's okay. I can do challenging things. My husband and I looked at each other. He's like, do you have that on camera? No one would even believe it. Okay. And it's not to say my home is filled with these comments all the time. It is not. But that is something I've been saying to him since he was pre verbal when he was doing tummy time. This is challenging. You're a kid who can do challenging things. A puzzle. You're right. This is a challenging puzzle, and it is frustrating. And you're a kid who can deal with frustration and take on challenges. When he was learning to read. Reading is hard for everyone. Did you know that there's not one person who's ever had an easy time learning how to read? Reading is a challenge. And you're a kid who can do challenging things. I actually see you're a kid who's starting to like challenging things. Not even because you think you're gonna get it right, but just because, you know your mind is really going. I remember a time that things were tricky with friends. Yeah, this is a challenging time. And remember what we always say. You're a kid who can do challenging things. He worked on that math problem. I don't even know if it was almost an hour. And when he was in that break, I mean, to work for 20 minutes and race and we have to start again. And I heard him say the thing that, yes, we had said to him for 10, 11 years. And he felt it. It became part of his identity. His identity as a learner was not about getting something right. It was not about seeking ease. It actually was about finding purpose in the challenge. And again, that didn't come naturally. I think it felt like such a win because it involves so many moments of tolerating the whining and not fixing the thing and saying, okay, I can just stay in this and be less scared of this feeling than he is and let him know that I see him as a kid who eventually can figure things out, or at least who can work through it. And then to hear him actually say that out loud about himself, I don't know what else he's gonna do in school, but I know that self talk and how he sees himself is going to be one of the most important things that makes him successful in legitimate ways down the road.

B (27:13)

I think you have such an interesting way of finding these wins.

A (27:17)

Right?

B (27:17)

Cause I think most parents might think he spent 20 minutes and then he got the problem right, and he had an A plus on the Homework. And it was amazing. I think that's such an amazing shift to make for people of how to really find these wins that aren't just focused on the outcome.

A (27:33)

Yeah. You know, it's funny, I remember that moment. I remember exactly where he was when he said those words. What I don't remember is if he ended up getting the problem right. And I mean, he might have. He might not have. I actually have no memory of it, which maybe speaks to. We all end up remembering what we put focus on. Right. And our kids really pick up on what we value. You know, the irony is I'm someone call me traditional. I think doing well, you know, not in a crazy way in school matters. Like, you know, I think working hard, you know, but I think my way about it is completely reversed. That to me, the kids who end up really, quote, doing well in school are the ones who actually focus a lot less on outcome and whose families truly, truly value grit and hard work and learning to tolerate frustration, not run away from it. And they see the win as the trying again, not the potentially getting it. Right. Yeah.

B (28:29)

And one other thing that I always hear you saying is something like frustration tolerance.

A (28:35)

Right.

B (28:35)

It's built and it's messy. No one's building it overnight. It's not easy. There's whining. There's nothing. There's so much that goes into it. And you always say along the lines of like, we have to tolerate our kids frustration in order for them to tolerate themselves.

A (28:49)

Yeah. You know this word resilience. We want our kids to be resilient. Right. We want them to be anti. Fragile. When I think about the word resilience, there's. There's real wholeness in it, like resilience. There's. I just picture strength and having it together. I think the fact that that word resilience has that valence does us a disservice. To us, building resilience is anything but resilient looking. Building resilience is messy, is whining, is frustration, is. I can't, is. This is too hard. You have to do it for me. You have to do it for me. You have to do it for me. That is the moment where I know our brain's like, oh, really? I have five minutes with my kid and this is what it is. But if we do a little shift and I know, you know what I call this, like, the sick joy of like, all right, it's not my most enjoyable five minutes, but boy, is this my most impactful. I'm so glad I'm here for this moment because if I can tolerate this feeling, I am telling my kid that this feeling is tolerable. And again, that doesn't mean the next day they're going to say, remember how you tolerated the feeling about the puzzle? Now I could do my homework. And I love challenging things. No thanks, mom. Thanks. That was great. You know, one and done. But that is the process. And I think that's the thing. I love helping parents with so much. That's always the kind of story I get the most joy from myself is parents who tell me their wins come in the moments they used to think they were failing, but they've just kind of redefined what their goal is, what their role is. And they've shifted from short term ease and comfort to kind of long term grit and resilience.

B (30:35)

All right, something new. Back to school. Speed round as fast as you can.

A (30:40)

Okay.

B (30:41)

Number one lunchbox must have. What was your go to snack?

A (30:44)

Peanut butter and jelly when I was a kid, but they don't allow that anymore.

B (30:47)

What color folder did you use for science?

A (30:49)

Blue.

B (30:49)

Math?

A (30:50)

Blue. Literature? Red. Dark blue. Light blue? Red.

B (30:55)

Thank you.

A (30:55)

I was gonna say it's a little.

B (30:56)

Crazy to go two the same blue, please.

A (30:58)

Way too disorganized.

B (30:59)

Were you an eraser collector?

A (31:01)

No.

B (31:01)

Last one.

A (31:02)

Weirdest school habit. I had to set my alarm where the second two numbers were a multiple of the first.

B (31:10)

Doing math in my head real quick.

A (31:12)

For example, 7o, 7, 7 14, 7 21, 7 28. There was no waking up at 7:25 or 7:30. Just come, get out of bed. Wouldn't happen.

B (31:21)

Try again tomorrow.

A (31:22)

Bad luck. So here's what I hope you take from today's episode. I hope you take one or two things that were useful. I hope you feel a little bit more prepared. I hope you know the things that you can do to make the back to school transition a little bit easier. I also hope you might have had a laugh or two. And maybe the most important thing you learned is that I never knew what the snooze button was until I was an adult. As the emails come in and all of the lists arrive and you wonder, do I really need to get my kid a new lunchbox? Get a new backpack? Get a million new outfits. I hope you take a deep breath and recognize all that you're already doing. It's not the backpack or the lunchbox or the outfit that's going to make the biggest difference. It's your kid's connection with you. And that really comes from your connection with yourself. So, on that note, let's end by putting our feet on the ground, placing a hand on your heart, and just reminding yourself, even as I struggle on the outside, I remain good inside. Can't wait to see you next time. Thank you to our sponsors, Airbnb, Chomps and Skylight, for sponsoring this episode.