Bryan Cranston Didn't Have to Be Covered in Bees, and Yet!

Summary

Good One: Bryan Cranston Didn't Have to Be Covered in Bees, and Yet!

Podcast: Good One
Date: April 9, 2026
Host: Jesse David Fox (Vulture senior writer)
Guest: Bryan Cranston

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Episode Overview

This episode features an in-depth conversation with acclaimed actor Bryan Cranston, exploring the evolution of his iconic comedic and dramatic roles, the creative process behind "Malcolm in the Middle" and "Breaking Bad," and his recent experiences working on a "Malcolm in the Middle" revival and other creative projects. Cranston shares personal anecdotes from his career, discusses the nuances of acting in comedy versus drama, reveals behind-the-scenes stories, and reflects on family, fame, and the craft of acting.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Recent Projects and Life Experiences

• Venice & “The Studio”
  • Cranston describes shooting in Venice, Italy for over two weeks with Seth Rogen, Ike Barinholtz, Kathryn Hahn, Chase Sui Wonders, Julia Garner, Michael Keaton, Madonna, and Donald Glover.
  • “The city itself is astonishingly beautiful… you’re just wandering and looking at the age and marveling at the idea that all these buildings were built on wooden posts… It’s incredible.” (02:20)
  • Contrasts the shift from a serious Arthur Miller play ("All My Sons" in London) to the lighthearted fun of his new TV project.
  • "It just reminded me of how lucky I am…" (03:28)

2. Malcolm in the Middle Revival: Origins and Character Evolution

• Reviving Hal and Reuniting the Family:
  • Cranston pushed for the revival, observing slight shifts in creator Linwood Boomer’s stance over the years until Boomer pitched "a really, really clever, great idea." (04:12–05:50)
  • “I noticed the slight distinction between ‘absolutely not’ and ‘I don't think so.’ It was like, ooh, there’s a crack... and I just started working in through his comment.” (04:45–05:07)
• Returning to Hal:
  • Describes the evolution of Hal, deliberately making him the “opposite” of Lois (his TV wife, played by Jane Kaczmarek) to create comedic balance.
  • “She is in charge… fearless… I would write the opposite of exactly what she was. Fearful. He could collapse. He's vulnerable. He's soft.” (07:41–08:55)
  • Fox execs wanted Hal recast for lacking humor, but Boomer defended Cranston: “It’s not him. I didn’t flesh him out. I didn’t write enough.” (09:37–10:06)
• Creative Process:
  • Shares how character discovery is dynamic, using early episodes (roller skating disco scene) as pivotal moments in figuring out Hal’s depth. (12:05–13:56)
• Notable Moment – Bee Suit Episode:
  • On wearing 60,000 bees for an episode: “Linwood Boomer always told me, 'I will never ask you to do something I wouldn’t do myself, but this, I won’t do.’ So I’m breaking that promise… I said, ‘Yeah, I’ll do it.’” (17:16–17:52)
  • “I got stung twice. Once in my shoulder and once on my scrotum, to which the beekeeper was at the ready…” (18:06–18:28)

3. Character Development & Family Dynamics

• Aging with Hal:
  • The revival features a natural progression: “He’s actually more calm now because all the boys are gone. We have a non-binary child at home—it’s actually kind of boring to us… He loves all his kids.” (21:15–21:55)
  • On stepping back into the role after 20 years: “It was like we didn’t miss a beat.” (20:57)
• Personal Resonance:
  • Cranston reflects on his real-life tumultuous childhood and how playing Hal offered healing through a “tumultuous family that stays together.”
  • “We have dinner together at that table every night... At the core of the show is love.” (24:25–25:13)

4. Parenting, Safetyism, and Social Change

• Parenting Philosophy:
  • Discussion about the shift in modern parenting towards “safetyism” and how “Malcolm in the Middle’s” depiction aligns more with older, freer approaches.
  • “When I was a boy growing up in the 60s, we were on our bikes and we took off… None of our parents knew anything about where we were.” (29:03–30:11)

5. Comedy vs. Drama: Technique and Mindset

• Comedic Timing & Dramatic Weight:
  • “There’s an added element to comedy that is not present in drama, and that is timing.” (31:41)
  • On blending genres: “Any good comedy has a nice dose of dramatic sensibility… Likewise, any good drama has to buoyed by a little comedy.” (32:39)
• Translating Physical Comedy:
  • Reflects on playing pratfalls (e.g., the “Fly” episode on Breaking Bad): “You can’t be in on the joke… as the character you have to be absolutely sincere and serious. The more I was, the funnier it is to other people.” (46:46)

6. Character Approach: Hal vs. Walter White

• Costume as Character:
  • Differentiating wearing “tighty whities” between Hal and Walter White:
    • “With Hal it’s endearing, with Walter White, it’s pathetic.” (39:24–41:17)
    • “His mustache—I wanted it to look impotent... He is invisible to himself and society. That was Walter White.” (41:17–43:14)
• Emotional Core:
  • For Hal: Fear. For Walter: “He doesn’t care. He got stalled out and that’s where he ended up.” (39:24–41:17)

7. The Craft and Impact of Acting

• Handling Difficult Scenes:
  • Describes how the emotional weight of scenes (e.g., letting Jane die in Breaking Bad) requires vulnerability and self-care.
  • “That was just—when you have a moment like that, it really works, and it was jolting. But that is the risk you do, you as an actor have to be emotionally open to anything possible happening.” (53:35–54:23)
  • “…it’s a magic trick. The real art of acting is to create the illusion. It’s no different than a magician.” (55:51)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On the Creative Process for Malcolm in the Middle

• “I would be a fool to try to compete with that dynamo of a character. Just go opposite, go opposite, go opposite.” (08:35 – Bryan Cranston)
• “If he can dance on roller skates, maybe he has some good moves... It's another thing you add to him.” (13:56 – Bryan Cranston)

On Wearing a Suit of Bees

• “The writers said, what about–how about this crazy idea? What about… And they came up with this idea about wearing bees. And Linwood Boomer always told me, ‘I will never ask you to do something I wouldn’t do myself, but this I won’t do. So I’m breaking that promise.’” (17:16 – Bryan Cranston)
• “I got stung twice. Once in my shoulder and once on my scrotum… I said, ‘I think I got stung.’ He goes, ‘Where?’ I go, ‘In my ball sack.’ And he goes, ‘Yeah, you’re on your own.’” (18:06 – Bryan Cranston)

On Walter White’s Underwear

• “When I did it on Malcolm, it was kind of the same thing… I think Hal—what do you think about Hal being in tighty whitey? He’s like a boy. Yeah, he’s… just a boy... But with Walter White it's like, you don’t laugh—it’s pathetic.” (39:24–41:17 – Bryan Cranston)

On the Emotional Risks of Acting

• “That is the risk you do is that you as an actor have to be emotionally open to anything possible happening. And you’re… open, but it affects you.” (54:23 – Bryan Cranston)

On the Difference Between Comedy and Drama

• “There’s an added element to comedy that is not present in drama, and that is timing.” (31:41 – Bryan Cranston)
• “You can’t be in on the joke. If you’re in on the joke, it dies.” (46:46 – Bryan Cranston)

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Fun & Insightful Segments

Credit History (57:21 – 62:22)

Cranston reminisces on various lesser-known (and more famous) roles:

• Power Rangers: Voiced villains and contributed his surname to “Billy Cranston” the Blue Ranger. (57:36–58:22)
• Walker, Texas Ranger: Admits to a mild hotel food prank on a rude director. (59:27–60:33)
• That Thing You Do!: “My wife and I both looked at each other and we went, she’s a star,” after meeting Charlize Theron. (61:52)
• Sabrina the Teenage Witch: “For some reason, I didn’t have my pants on, which is normal for… You know, they’re right, let’s get Cranston and he’ll take his pants off.” (62:03)

Lightning Round: Jokes & Celebrity Stories (98:33 – 104:28)

• Favorite Joke: Told a classic “Veronica wears red nail polish, and Bob has a…” joke (99:02–100:07).
• Legendary Encounter: Once opened Alfred Hitchcock’s car door as a security guard, to which Hitch left him with wordless “wisdom.” (100:21–102:59)

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Reflections on Acting, Fame, and Family

Workmanlike Attitude

• “All I’d love to do is to be a good working actor. If I can make a living as an actor, that’s my success. And to this day, that’s my most cherished accomplishment…” (74:30–75:33)

On Family and Generations in Acting

• Praises his daughter Taylor’s commitment, insists children interested in acting pursue it for “the right reasons.” (81:35–83:42)
• Shares the process for Taylor’s Breaking Bad audition and the importance of earning roles. (84:36–86:03)

On Taking a Break

• Clarifies the “retirement” rumor; aims not for retirement, but for a necessary pause to regain inspiration:
  • “The goal is to go to neutral so that I can become inspired by new stimuli.” (93:18)
  • “Once you become a celebrity, you now become the observed and can no longer observe.” (94:15)

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Notable Segment Timestamps

• Malcolm in the Middle Revival Origins: 04:12–06:12
• Developing Hal: 07:41–10:06
• Bee Suit Story: 16:11–18:06
• Comedy vs Drama: 31:41–32:39
• “Tighty Whities” Comparison: 36:47–41:17
• Fly Episode in Breaking Bad: 44:20–48:50
• Letting Jane Die Scene: 49:48–54:23
• Family & Career Philosophy: 74:30–75:33
• Acting with His Daughter: 84:35–86:26
• Pause/Retirement Discussion: 90:18–94:15

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Tone, Language, and Takeaways

Bryan Cranston’s warm, candid humor and humility are on full display throughout the episode, peppered with self-deprecating anecdotes, thoughtful reflections on craft and family, and reverence for his collaborators. He gracefully balances personal vulnerability with analytical insights about comedy, drama, fame, and the lessons learned over a 45+ year career.

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For listeners and fans, the episode provides rare access to the depth and humanity of one of TV’s most celebrated actors, and Bryan Cranston’s journey from bumbling sitcom dad to dramatic antihero, and back again.

Transcript

[Jesse David Fox]

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[Bryan Cranston]

Larry contacts me and says, I'd like you to be in the show. Do you want to be in the show? Yeah, I'd like to, Larry. Okay, okay, listen, here's how we do it. I give you a couple, an outline, you know, what we're going to talk about, and then we talk about it. You have a responsibility about getting out a couple things. You know, you have two things you got to get out and you're going to play my therapist. Okay. All right, we'll see you then.

[Jesse David Fox]

This is good one. I am Jesse David Fox, senior writer, Vulture and author of comedy book. My guest this week is Bryan Granston. We've talked about Malcolm the Middle, which is back for a four episode revival this month. Breaking Bad and stories from Brian's 45 years as a working actor. Expect some unexpected Power Rangers trivia. So here is Bryan Cranston. I am here with Bryan Cranston. Thank you for. Wait, I said your name Weird.

[Bryan Cranston]

I hope you keep that in.

[Jesse David Fox]

I hope you're in. I'm here with Bryan Cranston. Thank you so much for joining me.

[Bryan Cranston]

Nice to see you, Jesse.

[Jesse David Fox]

Nice to see you. So the first question we ask, what is the funniest, strangest, or most fascinating thing that happened to you this week?

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, that's kind of easy for me, actually. Now, on Monday, I was in Venice, Italy, shooting on a boat with Seth Rogen and Ike Barinholtz and Kathryn Hahn and Chase Sui Wonders. And we're shooting a scene from the studio. So we were there for a little over two weeks shooting two episodes of the studio, and it was bonkers. Yeah, I mean, the city itself is astonishingly beautiful. I love Venice and I love getting lost in it. So you have all that and there's no cars, there's no bicycles, there's no scooters. You don't have to worry about any of that stuff. You're just wandering and looking at the age and marveling at the idea that all these buildings were built on wooden posts that sort of, you know, became hardened like petrified wood. And that's what's holding all these things. It's incredible. And then we have the show, the studio, which is just insane fun. And we worked with Julia Garner and Michael Keaton, Madonna, Donald Glover. I mean, you know, I mean, it's like, it's been a great time.

[Jesse David Fox]

Is part of what's so fascinating is the contrast of, like, you're in Venice being. And it is Venice, like, as beautiful as it is, and then you're making this show. That is a different energy than Venice.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah. I would say the bigger contrast for me personally was I had just left London after five months. I was doing a very serious play there, All My Sons by Arthur Miller. And so that was a very driving, emotional, devastating thing. And then to go doing this frivolous thing in this gorgeous place, it just reminded me of how lucky I am in being able to experience so many different things that it's just bizarre. Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

We're here partly talking about Malcolm the Middle, which is coming back after 20 years. I believe you really were the driving force to make this happen creatively. What was driving you to see this to happen, the show coming back?

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, 20 years ago, when we stopped shooting the show, Malcolm was just going off to college and there was a lot of unanswered questions, a lot of open chapters. And so about 10 years ago, I started talking to Linwood Boomer, who created the show, and I said, wouldn't it be interesting to find out what happened to the boys? Did Malcolm go further in college or what's he doing now? And what are. What are the other boys doing? And, you know, and, ah, no. And it was an absolute no, I'm done. I have no idea. I'm. I can't even enter the. That realm of thinking about. And then about a year after that, I said, well, what do you think? I mean. And he goes, well, I don't think so. I don't think so. I think we're moving on from something. But I noticed that the slight distinction between absolutely not and I don't think so. It was like, ooh, there's a crack, There's a little crack. A Fisher just started working in through his comment. And then. So I waited another year and a half or some, and I pitched him again with the idea. You know, every time I meet fans, they're. They're asking me what happened to them. I go, I don't know. Wouldn't that be interesting? And, yeah, I'd love to see what happened. So I told Lin with that, and he go, well, I mean, if there's a great idea, then I might consider it. But. So I. I knew we were on the pathway until finally I of broke him down to at least just think about it. In. In. With all sincerity. And so he said he would. And knowing him, he wouldn't have done this had he not come up with this really, really clever, great idea. And so he pitched it to me, and I thought, this is amazing. I'm all in. Let's make a call and see if the cast is all in. And they were. And it was like, okay, let's take it further.

[Jesse David Fox]

What is it for you to play Halligan? Was it you were just curious where the story goes? Cause the story ends? Someone on a cliffhanger? Is it you knew this person. You were playing this person for seven years. You're personally curious what it's like to see what this person is at the age that you are. You were both aging at the same time.

[Bryan Cranston]

You remember Richard Linklater's boyhood, And it was like 12 years after they shot that first section. And I thought, hey, that's kind of really interesting filmmaking. We have the opportunity to do something similar to that 20 years later. You don't need any. I mean, we're all gray. Except now I dyed my hair for the studio.

[Jesse David Fox]

Got it.

[Bryan Cranston]

But I'm gray and Jane is gray. And the boys in Malcolm in the Middle are right around the same age I was when we first started the show in 1999. And now they have kids of their own. I mean, it's like, it's a great feeling to reintroduce ourselves into a relationship that has gone over, you know, 26 years. Yeah. Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

I want to talk about who the character is now, but I want to start with how the character became who it became. So from the first episode, Hal does not say much. He's mostly kind of a sight gag.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

How did you figure out who he was?

[Bryan Cranston]

Interesting bit of trivia there that I didn't know is that. That Linwood wrote this character and he didn't quite flesh him out. He was like. I think I had maybe five lines in the entire pilot. And so I was trying to think, who is this man? What. How do I approach this? I can't just deliver lines without knowing my point of view and how I feel in those scenes that I'm there but silent. So I. I was kind of lost and then I looked at the Lois character, and I thought, my God, this character is fantastic. I mean, she is. She is in charge. She is domineering, she is fearless. She is tough. She. And I thought. I got out of legal pad and I started writing down all those things that Lois was fearless, domineering, tough, you know, impenetrable. And I would write the opposite of exactly what she was. Fearful. He could collapse. He's vulnerable. He's soft. And I thought, wait a minute. This is a descriptive of a character. It is in contrast to Lois, but I think in a nice way, you have to have balance. And I thought I would be a fool to try to compete with that dynamo of a character. And Jane just personifies that woman so magnificently. And so I thought, just go opposite, go opposite, go opposite. And that's how I started come up with the ideas. Now, what's interesting is the pilot went. And Fox at the time said, we love this show. It's great. The only thing is the father, he's not funny.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

So you need to. You need to recast. And to my great good fortune, Linwood Boomer said, no. Yeah, it's not. It's not that. It's not him. I didn't flesh him out. I didn't write enough. I didn't really have where that guy should be placed, you know, what. What his role is, and he can do it. And, no, we're not. We're. And they said, I think he shouldn't be. We should recast any. And he said, no, not happening. Not gonna do it.

[Jesse David Fox]

It's amazing that he would admit, like, essentially that it's not your fault. Like, there's a lot of creators who be like, yeah, yeah, actually, their actor messed up. I.

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, I mean, you know, he had to focus on the dynamic between the two main characters. Malcolm certainly had to figure out what's his domain. And then Lois, to counter that as the matriarch and calling the shots in the family. So where does another parent fit in that? And I thought, oh, fill in the attributes that she might be lacking. Sweetness, softness, gullibility. I mean, all these things that she wasn't. And it just started. And that's where the fearful. I got a hold of that. And all of a sudden, Hal, she's fearless. I'm fearful, so I'm fearful of everything. Of spiders, of heights, of someone walking in on me, of everything. Was. Was. And I thought, oh, this is. This is a template for a comedic character.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. Because I think comedy sitcoms are often about dynamics. Right. So you, you had less of a character, but you're like, what is the dynamic will be, will be the joke engine between me and this character. And you had to figure. And by figuring out the dynamic, you're like, oh, I'm the person that would fit this dynamic.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yes. I can fulfill this need as the. Because the, the boys, you know, they were roughhouse and they were, they were figuring things out, but they were all ambitious.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

And how I wrote, not ambitious, you know, he's fearful of getting fired, of losing his kid, you know, being a bad parent of it all these things. And I realized, oh, this, this is something that I could really lean into. And for an actor's standpoint, we, we always feel we need something to hold onto.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

If we can hold onto something, I have a better understanding of that character and I know how to deliver a line for that character.

[Jesse David Fox]

And then I think through the first season, you figure out exactly what makes you funny. I think a breakthrough was the roller skating episode where at this point, as you said, you only know so much about this character and then you realize they are sort of this expert disco dancing roller skater and you do it. Do you remember shooting that episode, learning how good of a roller skater were you before?

[Bryan Cranston]

No, no. The last time I was on roller skates, they were made of metal.

[Jesse David Fox]

Sure.

[Bryan Cranston]

Okay. Now it's like, woo, they were very slippery. But our choreographer, Fred Tallakson, who was terrific and patient with me and I had a little head start. I knew that this episode was going to shoot in two weeks. I think I had two weeks to. And so every day after work, I would meet up with him in the area that was the schoolyard where we were gonna shoot those sequences. And with every pad imaginable because I was going down all the time, but at a certain point, something clicks. It's the same thing when you're teaching a child to swim. It's like, oh, I don't know. And then all of a sudden, boom. And they go, oh, they've crossed over a threshold and they're okay, they're gonna figure this out. And that's the. Was for me, I crossed over. I was hesitant and scared of it. And. And then I fell enough times to stop being afraid of falling. And then now here we go. Just go and just try the moves. And I'm spinning and now I'm shoot the duck. And I can, you know, do all these kinds of spins and turns and things like that that I never thought I could be able to do.

[Jesse David Fox]

And then once you do it. You're like, oh, I'm. Now I now know more about the body of the characters. Does it? Sort of. You're like, okay, well, now I need to do the. Now I know how to roller skate enough that I can dance as well as the character does.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah, pretty much. And, you know, it's an improv. It's a. Yes. And. And so we accept new characteristics about your character, and you go, okay, how can that. How can we build on that? If he can dance on roller skates, then, you know, maybe he has some good moves and, you know, and it's another thing you add to him as

[Jesse David Fox]

a character and also, like the. The musicality. Right.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

One of the great stories in the. Your book is about how you learned that you became a member of ASCAP or bmi because of the.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah, I was. I was doing. I. I got a call from the music department clearing department at Fox, and they said, can I talk to you a second? Yeah, sure. What's up? And they said, well, I have to record every half second to second, every half second and more of any music that's on the show and. And properly give it its due. Who. Who was the author of that? Who was the producer of that? And so otherwise, I. I will get in trouble and maybe fired. And I say, oh, okay, but why are you talking to me? What? Well, you. Because you hum and you whistle on the show a lot. And the question I have for you is that, are any of those tunes that you hum or whistle, you know, from a legitimate song or something? I said, how dare you? I don't plagiarize. I create my own. And they said, you were the author then and you might as well be paid for that. So I thought, oh, my God, this is great. So I joined bmi, and to this day, I get a check quarterly, like a couple hundred dollars. It's the most ridiculous thing. So I would take that check and I would say, hey to the crew, and I would buy some. Some, you know, some cocktail paraphernalia so that we would have a nice little party on every other Friday or so.

[Jesse David Fox]

The sense I get is, I imagine at some point the writers would have days where they just made lists of things for your character to do and then be like, okay, how can we have a story that justifies. Well, yeah, yeah, doing that. Can you think of what was the wildest, craziest thing they had you to do, your reaction to it, and then how you were convinced to do it?

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, I was probably the section of the bots and bees where the boys have to. That they're trying to figure out a robot competition to destroy the other, you know, schools entry. And Hal, for some reason gets involved in that and the boys get lose interest. And he's now fascinated with this idea of creating this robot that can attack another robot and you know, everything. Trial and error, trial and error. And he comes up with this idea that he's going to have bees. And Malcolm says, but it's a robot that we're attacking. It's metal, but. Yeah. But he attacks the person operating the robot and then they can't operate the robot. And I mean, you know, and so what happens is I end up with like, I think it was something like 60,000 honeybees on me. It felt like chain mail I was wearing. And they took just some insect repellent and put it on, you know, just wiped it up.

[Jesse David Fox]

Make sure they knew it was you.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah. Because we can't.

[Jesse David Fox]

What's the point of you doing.

[Bryan Cranston]

So my face is that. Like that. And you see, you see it's me. And, and. But how that came about is that they came up with. The writers said, what about. How about this crazy idea? What about. And they came up with this idea about wearing bees. And Linwood Boomer always told me, he said, I will never ask you to do something that I wouldn't do myself, but this I won't do. So I'm breaking that promise. And he told me about it. I said, yeah, I'll do it. And so then they had to reverse engineer the story to justify how this could possibly be. You know, so that's.

[Jesse David Fox]

That's when you're covered in bees. Yeah. Are you acting like. Because in many ways that looks like a thing that'd be on Jackass or whatever. Like, it's a stunned. But in that moment, are you still. Do you feel like you're in character?

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah. I mean, I didn't have a lot to do.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

When I. When I was eventually covered in bees, but I got stung twice. Once in my shoulder and once on my scrotum, to which the beekeeper was at the ready when I got. Okay, let's see if we can scrape it up. And. And then when I. He says, I said, I. I think I got stung. He goes, where, where, where? I go in my ball sack. And he goes, yeah, you're on your own. But I will say that the thing you discover, what I realized is that a bee sting really isn't. It's not painful. Yeah. What is painful? And I would say about 85 to 90% of a bee sting. Pain is the element of surprise and shock. What was that? You know, it's just. It's just a surprise. But I'm standing there with 60,000 bees, the likelihood of getting stung. Yeah, it's pretty high.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah. So when it happened, I just went, wait, I think I had to shift a little bit. Yeah, yeah, I think I got stung and that was the extent of it. Almost like getting a shot, you know, a needle in the arm.

[Jesse David Fox]

It was just to cover kids and bees all the time. Then they won't be scared.

[Bryan Cranston]

They won't be scared.

[Jesse David Fox]

You play this character for seven years, which well over a hundred episodes. Sitcom characters inherently necessarily change the way we think of. Maybe a film character does. Do you feel like he changes? Do you feel like your understanding of him deepens and that sort of informs it? How's that different? How do you think of what the creative arc for you is when you're doing a character like this?

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, I think the first season. I don't know how many episodes we did the first season. Maybe 20 or so. 22. I don't know. I think the first season, you're still looking for new things. And like you said, the Rosegates episode, oh, he's a disco, okay. And you're still collecting ideas and thoughts about the character and building your bouquet of who this person is. But then after that, you kind of got him. And then it's almost like going to work like Mr. Rogers and you put on your comfortable sweater and you slip on your comfortable indoor shoes and there you are. And the strange thing is that when we did this new iteration of Malcolm, I had no idea how we would all react, even myself, to going into those characters after they've been lying dormant in their coffins for 20 years. And when we had the first table read of the. Of the episodes, I was just blown away because all of a sudden, everybody, it was like, that's him, that's her, that's him, that's me. Oh, my God, we're back. Yeah, it was like we didn't miss a beat.

[Jesse David Fox]

What is it? Playing him in 2026 versus playing him 20 years ago?

[Bryan Cranston]

It's, you know, he's, he's. He's got more aches and pains. He's got. He's a little. He's a little different in, in that the family structure is different. He's actually more calm now because all the boys are gone. We have a non binary child at home that is a perfect child. Never gets in trouble, which is actually kind of boring to us. You know, it was like, what's happening with this one? You know? And Hal still struggles with the right pronoun. Does them want to go shopping? You know, And. But. But he's trying and trying to embrace. He loves all his kids, you know, and. Yeah, it's. It's. I think it's. I think it's the. It's a natural progression. It didn't feel, like, cut off, and then I have to leap this chasm in order to make sense of where he is now. It felt natural. I mean, when I was 41 and I started the series in 99, I. I was like, I'm a dad. I'm a husband. This is familiar to me. So it's. And then now, you know, it's like, oh, yeah, all these kids around. I'm. I'm not a grandfather yet, unfortunately, but. But. But I am a godfather to kids and things. And it's like, oh, this is. This is how it is. It just felt natural.

[Jesse David Fox]

Do you think about the 20 years in between, like, did you spend time, like, what did he do when this happened? How did you respond to that? Or you just sort of, like, take him as he is right now?

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, I think I took him as he is right now because once we said goodbye, I wasn't contemplating it. It was like I was closing that chapter and moving on. And then when it was. When it came back, it was a new chapter. It was so different. It's kind of like a previous marriage. It's like your previous marriage, and you look back and you go, God, it seems like it was someone else's life that was married before.

[Jesse David Fox]

There's also a quality that kind of gets echoed in the show itself, which is when kids return home, they are the person they were when they were a kid in many ways. And you see Malcolm is this new person, but then when the family dynamic reemerges, he is the character from the show.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

I was curious what the show means for you personally. I was thinking about. I was reading your book, and obviously you describe a sort of more tumultuous childhood you had, and your father left when you were 11. And what was it like to have this experience of playing a tumultuous family that stays together, that loves each other through the tumult. Do you feel like it helped you? Do you feel like it's maybe healing in some ways? I think about. There are studies that when parents have kids, there's something about that heals a Sort of part of their brain that has a certain dynamic. They understand about parent relationships if they act differently than their parent did. Is there something about returning to this family that's meaningful to you in that way?

[Bryan Cranston]

Very meaningful. I mean, when you spend every day for seven years with these people, you form that kind of bond and familial sensibility. And so. And Jane and I would. Would dispute the fact when someone would say, this dysfunctional family. And I go, you know what? It's actually very functional. We have dinner together at that table every night. We figure things out. Do we have problems? Of course we have problems. And we're trying to figure things out. Are the kids crazy? Of course they're crazy. But that's the magic potion that made Malcolm in the Middle work in its original concept. And I think how it carries over into this new iteration is that at the core of the show is love. And when push comes to shove, you know that that family would congeal and make it work and fight off the demons that are attacking the family, and then they would splinter again. But it would work. And so I think there is some comfort to it in my own personal life. When I was 11, my father left and I didn't quite understand that my mother was very despondent by that and started drinking. And so she wasn't really available to me emotionally. She was there for. And my father wasn't available at all. So I'm left to my own devices. And that's not a great thing for an 11 or 12 year old to figure out. Well, that's the easier way to go. And then we go that way. And so that's where my uncle dubbed me a Sneaky Pete. He called me Sneaky Pete. And I know. What do you mean, Sneaky Pete? Well, you're kind of sneaky. You kind of, you know, you kind of. You don't answer questions. You kind of, you know. So, like this. And I go. And I realize in retrospect, oh, that was me just trying to figure it out. Since I didn't have parental guidance, I had to make my own. And I wasn't prepared to make my own parental guidance. I was 11 and 12 and 13 and 14. And it was like, oh, and so that's what. And so finally I created a show called Sneaky Pete because it was such a part of me that I said, okay, I think I have to get this out, figure out who that guy is, who I would have become if I didn't find acting, if I didn't find something that I Could be some become so passionate about and put all my energies into.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. And then it changes all the time. So there's different direction. You know, it is constantly renewing. I mean, like the thing about, you know, you different roles and you're like, okay, be this. You can supportive things. There's something where, like, it reminds me of play therapy, like how kids go to therapy, which is like they. They don't have the language to describe certain things that happen, but they're like play with these toys. And you observe them that way. And there is something to acting, especially how you describe it, that does feel like, oh, this person is doing a version of play therapy. We're like, oh, I'll use this and see how this. What this brings out of me and what then I could channel that. What it brings out into a role.

[Bryan Cranston]

I would actually, now that you brought it up, it makes me think. I would love to. To talk to therapists and psychologists to say, did. Did you see anything in the way that. That Lois and Hal parent. That is any is effective at all? I used to say, you know, we. Because we got parents that go, oh man, you. You're killing me. You're killing me. You're letting these boys go crazy and things like this. And I used to say, no, no, we're. We're actually very effective parents. How do you. How do you mean effective? You know, I go, just watch how we parent do the opposite and you'll be fine.

[Jesse David Fox]

What is interesting is, in many ways, I would be not surprised if some child psychologists write about Malcolm Middle with this because your show came out at exact time where there was a sort of shift in parenting where parents were much more concerned about the safety of their kids. And it was called what is now called safetyism, which is they need to make sure at all times the kids are safe. So, like even people who had childhoods where eight, nine, they were just allowed roam free, they would raise their kids 8, 9. You can't be alone in your house. You can't be alone in the front yard. And now there is a sort of backlash that to happening where there are studies and psychologists saying that kids benefit from being. Being able to navigate dangerous situations themselves because life is dangerous. So in many ways, I think that is the model that they will applaud you for.

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, it is very interesting, but the term dangerous is a full spectrum. But you're right. I'm 70 years old, and when I was a boy growing up in the 60s, we were on our bikes and we took off our parents none of my friends in the neighborhood, none of our parents knew anything about where we were at all.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

And we use kind of a connective tissue of like. Like, my mother used to yell out, kia, ki, kiaki. Like a key in Spanish. Here, here, come here. I don't know why. And so we'd be riding our bikes and some other kid would go by and go, Brian, what? Your mother said kiki. You're saying, Oh, I know what she means. Okay, thanks, man. You know, and we. We do it. Your mom was looking for you. She was pretty mad, you know, okay, I'll get home. You kind of knew that you'd get home before it got dark.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

Once the. Once dusk happens, you better head home. Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

And.

[Bryan Cranston]

Because that's about the way, you know, it was. But they had no clue where we were at any time.

[Jesse David Fox]

And I think that is soon to come more in vogue. The idea that maybe we should go back to something closer to that. I literally was reading an article today about. Interesting that studies are showing that it. It helps kids to have the freedom to navigate certain situations. I mean, like, because the idea of safety has been really broadly defined, which is like, oh, can kids play sports by themselves without parents watching them? You know, when I was growing up, we played touch football, tackle football. And then, you know, my parents knew where it was but didn't feel like they needed to be the ref when that was happening. And I think that has come more in vogue. But now there's more studies saying, like, maybe we need to allow kids to.

[Bryan Cranston]

You just had a baby recently. Is this your first?

[Jesse David Fox]

Yes.

[Bryan Cranston]

Do you think you'll be that parent?

[Jesse David Fox]

I'm working on it.

[Bryan Cranston]

I'm telling you because it's interesting for new parents. It's like, oh, this is an experience that I've never felt before. I've. I'm. I will die for this child. You know, I will do anything for this child. And then. So your own sensibility changes when you're single. Like, oh, I would never do that as a parent. And you go, well, just hang on.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. I mean, it's easy to read the articles. It's different to be like, okay, see you later.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

You know, there are. Obviously, Malcolm was partly pioneering because it's a single cam sitcom, but, like, so there were more dramatic moments. Not like hard drama, but, like, dramatic moments, your serious moments. And there are comedic moments and other things you've done. Like, Breaking Bad has a lot of comedic moments in your opinions. Is there a difference between acting in a comedy or acting in A drama.

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, there's a technical difference. I mean, there's an added element to comedy that is not present in drama, and that is timing. As you know, being a comedic guy, you can't just take as much time as you want to deliver a line in comedy. You can kill it. And yet, you know, I think any good comedy has a nice dose of dramatic sensibility to ground it a little bit. And conversely, any good drama has to be buoyed by. You gotta give your audience a break. You cannot go bang and keep pounding them in the head with some dramatic effect. You have to give them a break to be able to have some different emotion reset. I'm ready to go. I'll go back into this drama. And that's really good narrative concert. It really is.

[Jesse David Fox]

So John C. Reilly, I asked him the same question. Cause he's done both. And he says, I do a similar thing, except for there's a light in your eyes when you do comedy. You have to let the audience know a little bit that you're having fun for them to have fun as well.

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, it depends on the character you're playing. If you're playing an obtuse character who says something that's funny, but the character doesn't know it's funny, if you're going, hey, then that's not it. But you take someone like Tina Fey, who is just brilliant. And I did a thing with Catherine O'. Hara. I played her husband on an episode of 30 Rock. And there was. I remember I talk about this because it's like she wrote a line. Her character is looking at something. I forget it was a brochure or something of some idyllic, just utopian place. Place with palm trees and sand and water. And she said the words, I want to go to there. You know, and she added the word to I want to go to there, as opposed to, oh, I want to go there. That one little change of adding the word to before the word there changed it from just a statement of fact to a comedic twist. Subtle, but a comedic twist. And I just think it's just genius when someone can identify that. I had that experience on Seinfeld to watch Jerry and Larry and these great actors on the show sculpt just kind of like it's clay and they have a sharp knife and they're just sliding through and slicing out time and beats and moments that enhance the comedic value. And it's like a souffle. If you pull it out too soon and the thing flattens and it's like

[Jesse David Fox]

oh, you mentioned Catherine o'. Hare.

[Bryan Cranston]

Who You.

[Jesse David Fox]

You were on. You did? You. I believe you played a married couple on 30 Rock, and then you got to be in the studio together. Do you have a memory of working with her that stands out?

[Bryan Cranston]

Oh, yeah. I've played her husband on three different projects. And then on the studio, her nemesis. Yeah. I don't know why. I mean, we just kept getting coupled, and anytime I heard Catherine Stoney, I'd like, oh, I want to be in there. Because she was such a comedic genius. I mean, she just knew what was going to be funny at any given time. But the real beauty about Catherine was that when you're seen is over. It's like cotton. Go sit down. We'll do another scene or we'll do another thing. You just wanted to stay there and hang out with her because she was such a beautiful human. I mean, she was unlike some comedic people that still try to, you know, hey, she just went, okay, let's reset. And was just a person and lovely, and I just miss her. And, you know, we were just, like I said, in. In Venice, shooting the. The studio, and we talked about her almost every day and said, you know, how. How much we all missed her, and I missed her character. And it really. But Seth Rogen said it. He said, you know, I. I just feel that. That she would have said, all right, enough. Get back to work. Enough, enough. Thank you. I appreciate it. I appreciate it. Now get back to work. Go, go, go. And. And we all. That's really. That's really true.

[Jesse David Fox]

I think a good way of delineating how you see sort of the comedy in a comedy and a comedy in a drama was the story of. When you read that, that, oh, my God, I can't believe. When you. When you read this pilot for Breaking Bad and you saw that he was going to be wearing tighty whities as well, and you're presenting it and then having to figure out what that means, because obviously in Malcolm Minow, you're wearing underwear throughout much of it.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

Can you talk about how you then figured out how to. Where Teddy White is as a different character?

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah, my initial sense was, oh, no. When I went to the opening call, and I had forgotten that. True. In. In the pilot of Breaking Bad, it says Walter White, you know, in tighty, whitey underwear and, you know, green shirt or whatever like that. And, you know, he's out in the middle of the desert, and who is this man? What the hell is he doing? You know? And then I forgot about that. And I went to the initial once I got the job, and I went to the initial wardrobe call, and there were, you know, shirts and shirts and slacks and pants and things like that and underwear. And I said, oh, yeah, let's. Let's not do that. And. And we. We talked about it, and I went to. To Vince and I said, before we. You know, I just did seven years of being in tight whitey underwear. And he goes, oh, I didn't realize that when I wrote it. Yeah. I said, do you mind if we don't do tight? No, okay, that's fine. And I go, okay, good. So he gave me permission to not do it. And then I said, okay, well, and I'm trying on different things. And I kept thinking, but why would he write tighty whitey underwear? I mean, there must have been. Even if he wasn't consciously thinking, this is the look I want, there's something subconsciously that. That he wrote that for some reason. And I tried to figure out what that was, as opposed to just uniformly just going, that's done. We did that. Now, when I did it on Malcolm, it was kind of the same thing. 1999, going into my wardrobe call, and I first passed by the table where all the boys clothes were, and I went, oh, look how cute those were. And all the different sizes of tighty whitey underwear. And I said, And. And she said, yeah, I think Heidi Kaczynski, the wardrobe designer, said, yeah, I just think that, you know, they're a poor family, and so they just hand down clothes and there's different sizes. And I went. And they. I don't think they had him in tidy white hand or. And I was saying, I think Hal. What do you think about Hal being in tighty whitey? He's like a boy. Yeah, he's, you know, he's just a boy. And we could save my underwear for the oldest boy. Exactly. You know, and. And it just worked because Hal was a big bo. And so I easily wrap my arms around it. And quite frankly, because it's funny, when you see a grown man in tidy white underwear, it's immediately a funny picture.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yes, 100%.

[Bryan Cranston]

So now you go to Breaking Bad. And I go, but I don't want it to be funny. And then I thought, but why did he write that? Why did he write that? And as I'm formulating this character of Walter White, I realized that fear was at the center of Hal. What was at the center of Walt? I always try to find that emotional core, and I couldn't find it I couldn't find it. Couldn't find it. And I went, what the hell's happening? I can't get this guy. And I realized at some point, Epiphany, because I was thinking about is that it's. He doesn't. He doesn't even know it's calloused over. He doesn't know who he is. He's a forgotten man. He's socially. I'll say this in the term socially retarded. In his development as a human being, he stopped growing and evolving because he got depressed and because. And I saw, oh, oh, oh, oh, I'm onto it, I'm onto it. And then. And that's where I went back to. I said, that's why he would wear tighty whitey underwear. Because he doesn't care. Because he doesn't think, no, I need to wear boxers now. No. He got stalled out and that's where he ended up. Yeah. So the look on Walter White in tighty whitey underwear is actually pathetic. It's not. It's. It's like you don't laugh When Hal wears. It's like, oh, my God, it's so cute and so bizarre. When Walter White wears tidy white, it's like, oh, this poor bastard.

[Jesse David Fox]

It's fascinating.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

Because it's the. They're opposite. Right. There's almost something empowering. You're like, look how free Hal is. And then look. And same item of clothing. And you're like, look how stunted and meek and feeble this Walter is.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah. And so that kicked it off. And so from there I went, oh, and he's always a few pounds overweight. He has a mustache that. I said, I want it to look impotent. And we're like, what does that mean? I don't know. But I want it to look like your mustache is full and nice. It's a mustache. But I wanted this mustache to look like, hey, bud, you're going to grow that out or shave it off. And I wanted it to be nebulous. It's not in any one camp. So the way we figured that out is you have to cut it off before it dips. Yours dips a little bit too manly. It's too manly. I'm sorry, Jeff.

[Jesse David Fox]

I can't be cast to play Walter White.

[Bryan Cranston]

You can't be a Walter White because it's too manly. Anytime you dip a facial mustache. A facial mustache. A mustache that goes below the edge of the lip. Too manly. So I had to make sure it was above that. And then my Makeup person, Frida Valenzuela, she went in there and she thinned it out so you can see clear skin underneath. It thinned it, thinned it, thinned it. And we looked. Ooh, a little more. Thinned it, thinned it, thinned it. It's like, there it is.

[Jesse David Fox]

There he is.

[Bryan Cranston]

Because I want. And I. So I took the color out of my face, so I have a normally Irish ruddy face. Took that color out. Took the color out of my hair. At the time, it was brown with some red highlights. Took the red out completely. He is a man. And then that informed the wardrobe. It's like, oh, he should be in taupe and beige and light yellow and, you know, off white and something that he would blend into the wall. He's nondescript. He is invisible to himself and society. That was Walter White. So once. Once you lock in on something, it's like you get excited because it informs everything else.

[Jesse David Fox]

Is that something you then tell Vince or. Vince is like, I trust you. You seem to get it. Is it like a conversation with. Clearly you've had all this process, and then you go, okay, Vince, here it is.

[Bryan Cranston]

And he's like, it's definitely a conversation, because I got excited about it, went to him and said, here it is. And some of it was already there. Some of it was already there. It was like the breadcrumbs, and just kind of follow the breadcrumbs. And the writing was so superb that it kind of leads you to that point, and then you enhance it. You find it on your own. And then it worked because he knew that once Walter White becomes Heisenberg, everything changes. We change the color, pal. He's wearing reds and blacks, and he's. And I had lost weight, and instead of my shoulders rolled over like a. Like an aged man, his shoulders go back. He's got money in his pocket. He's. Everything changed. Yeah. So we changed him emotionally, physically, intellectually. He felt empowered. Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

As you said, I'm a comedy guy. So my favorite episodes are the episodes that lean a little bit more comedy. So I want to ask you about the Fly episode, because it is. Obviously, there's dramatic things to it, but in my head, I think of it like a comedy, like a Pinter play or like a Beckett play where it's like tragic comedy or a comedy of menace where you're like, there's something looming, but there's, like, legitimately, like, sitcom, like, pratfalls in this episode. Do you remember shooting that episode?

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

What do you remember?

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, there was Originally asked by the studio to do a bottle episode.

[Jesse David Fox]

An episode all shot on location. To save.

[Bryan Cranston]

To save money. Yeah, to save money. We were shooting it in nine days usually, and I think they were targeting to try to. Can you do this? Can you do this? And impulsively, Vince Gilligan said, no, please don't dictate what to do or how to run the show. I will do the show and we'll hand it over to you. But, you know, he's a. He's a good guy. And he. And he. He. He's appreciative of the studio and the network giving us the money to do this show. So it. It was in the back of his head, and he said. And he finally told them, if I think of something that is absolutely on target with the show, doesn't hurt the story in any way, but has a sensibility of being condensed and some. Yeah, okay. So he conceived this show, this idea that Walter White was hypersensitive to any kind of contamination that may diminish the quality of his work. And he does this fly. This fly could contaminate. And so he gets obsessed with killing this fly for those who haven't seen it. And almost all of it takes place in that.

[Jesse David Fox]

There's a scene where you and Jesse fight with the flyswatter thing. And it is a very goofy. If you saw just that scene and didn't know anything else about, you'd be like, it's a funny scene. You're acting funny. Your physicality is kind of funny in it. How do you approach a scene like that, being like, well, I can't fully goofy it up, but, like, you want to play it some because you said to. You want. Part of what's interesting about the show is the dynamics of it. How do you approach the sort of clearly comedic things in the show to make sure it hits an exact level?

[Bryan Cranston]

Not to contradict John C. Reilly, because what he said is true in some cases, but in this case, you can't be in on the joke. If you're in on the joke, it dies. So as the character, you have to be absolutely sincere and serious. And as a matter of fact, the more I was, the funnier it is to other people, but the more insistent he is, he needs that fly swatter because that is the weapon of choice to. To kill a fly. And God damn it, you. I'm going to. You know, it's like.

[Jesse David Fox]

It's funny even thinking about it. Yeah, because there's. That. There's a moment where you're trying. You're reaching on like a pedestal of support. And you do. And I remember in the office just laugh so loudly because it is such a funny fall. Because he is like the amount of energy he's putting towards this thing and how unimportant this thing is. Yeah, but you still kept. But you're playing still. This is Walter.

[Bryan Cranston]

He.

[Jesse David Fox]

That energy is the same Walter that leads to all the other decisions. It's just where he's pointing it at this.

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, how many times have we done something stupid and hurt ourselves? And you think back and you go, oh, my, what an idiot. It's like, oh, I can't quite. The little step stool I have doesn't quite mean I'll put some books down and I'll put the step stool on top of the books and then I'll step on the top step, which is actually not a step. It's supposed to be a shelf. And you're like, you know, it's like, well, that's what it is.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. And in that moment, you're being a person. You're not being like, I'm looking me right now.

[Bryan Cranston]

No, it's like, I need to get this thing and I'm going to do it. And. And that kind of Rube Goldberg kind of construction of a joke, of a. Of a situation is funny because there's a level of. Of reality to it because especially men go, I've done. I've done stupid stuff like that before. You know, I wonder if this is the switch on or off. Oh, that's on. It's on. It's like, I should have did.

[Jesse David Fox]

What am I doing? And Walter pursues his. It's the same Rube Goldberg thing that he does. You're seeing him do the entire series inventing new types of drugs, but he's applying to trying to get this fly. And he's like, I did it. I've invented the best type of fly swatter. Yeah, it's this thing. So I read your book. I love your book.

[Bryan Cranston]

Oh, thanks.

[Jesse David Fox]

I think it is. It's just a great depiction of an actor's life. And there is a almost Robert Caro esque quality to. You're setting up. Watch it now while I'm currently reading the Power Broker. So there is something very similar to how you just tell stories of your life, early life. And it pays off in scenes that we all sort of know. You're like. And the best example is the scene in which Jane dies in season two. And you sort of are complicit in. Let's Say you're. You watch it happen, and you open the book with this story. Can you tell the experience, what it was like for you, what happened in that moment when we were filming that?

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah. And, you know, just for my own edification, I need to. Whenever there's a scene that is. Has such emotional depth that you want to make sure that you've explored all the options to get there, I do a little backstory, like. Well, in this case, it was a scene in season two where Jane and Jesse are strung out on heroin. And I discover her, and she's. She's choking on her own vomit as an addict, and I don't save her. Yeah. And so that was the dilemma. Why doesn't he save her? He's not saving the life of a human being. He could. Boy, there's a Rubicon there that I crossed. And I. I had to understand why Walter White, at this transition in the show, why he would make this decision here. And so I wrote down, just simply, again, doing the comparisons like I did on Malcolm, I thought, save her, let her die. What are the reasons to save her? Well, she's a human being. What are. You know. Well, she's. Reason to let her die. She's got Jesse on heroin. You know, what are the reasons to save her? She's young enough to be my daughter. She could be my daughter. What about this? You know? And so I'm doing this whole pro and con, save her, don't save her. Just as. As a. Like a filter, not to hold on to anything, but just a filter. Knowing that somewhere in the recesses when I'm shooting this scene, those opt might be percolating through my mind. And if I think of it, that'll show. Yeah. And that's all you need to do is think of it. Trust that it's showing as opposed to show it.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah, yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

So I'm there, and Kristen is doing such a great job of acting off screen, doing the full choking for me and Kristen Ritter. And so she's doing that, and. And all of a sudden, I'm there emotionally going. My impulse to save her, don't save her, save her, don't save her. And at that moment, one of those things that I wrote down popped into my head and so strongly in that vulnerable state that I was in of she's young as she could be my daughter. Sure enough, Kristen Ritter's face disappears for a second in my own real daughter's face is there in bed, choking to death. And it made me jump. And that's what they used in the thing because it was such a jolt. It's something I didn't plan. I didn't say, oh, and here I'm going to jolt. No, it was just something that struck me, and just as soon as it came, it vanished. And there it was in. This decision of omission to act was very telling. Yeah. And she dies. And that was just. But that's typical of places that actors need to go. It's a vulnerable, dangerous, emotionally dangerous place to go sometimes physically dangerous, intellectually challenging, but emotionally, it's dangerous. It's risky.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. I mean, as a person who's not an actor, I was like, well, then what's the rest of your day like? How do you not be in that space anymore?

[Bryan Cranston]

You can't. You have to recover. And I went. And I. It just so happens that Anna Gunn was on the set that day. And I. I just came over to her and put my head on her shoulder and she hugged me. And Aaron was there as well, and I just got hugs. And it was like. And I told him what happened, and it was like, oh, my God. And, you know, and I thanked Kristen for giving that to me because that was a moment that really worked, and it was jolting. But that is the risk that you do is that you as an actor have to be emotionally open to anything possible happening. And you're. You're from your own personal life, from your imagination, but it affects you.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

I mean, I just did this play in London, and every night at the conclusion of this play, it's a gut punch. And what happens is, yeah, you're wiped out. And the next morning you have a hangover, an exhaustion hangover, and you kind of have to shake it out and. And find some way to get out of it.

[Jesse David Fox]

I mean, even talking about it, it feels like I can feel the sense memory you have from that experience, as if that was as much as you were able to in that moment, imagine your daughter's face on this person even telling the story. You remember it's there.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah. You have recall to it. And that's the thing. That's really the thing that actors have to do. You get used to it. And so I've been doing this for 47 years now, and I'm so used to allowing myself to be vulnerable that it. It's. It doesn't take much for me to just open up and go, okay, here. Here goes. I'm diving in. I don't know what's going to happen, but here it is.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. How do you feel about Sort of the idea of in character all day, type of method acting of a person who's like, I'm. For the months we're shooting, I'm Walter White. Address me as Walter White. I'm gonna be wearing the hat. You know, how do you feel about that approach?

[Bryan Cranston]

I can't do it. I would be a wreck. I wouldn't survive. Because the energy it would take to stay in character all day. And I think in film and television, the waiting is the toughest part about it. You're waiting and waiting and waiting to do the actual work. Work. I can't imagine, you know, three quarters of your day waiting to do a quarter of the work. I. I don't know what you would do. If you're doing a period piece. Right. Then you have no computer, you have no phone. You know, what. What do you. You'd have no dressing room, really. You don't have television, you know. You know, you don't have those things. So are you just looking at a rock or. I mean, you got some parchment out and, you know, I mean, I guess, but. But instead acting, the real art of acting is to create the illusion. It's a magic trick. Yeah. It's no different than a magician. It's. It's creating the illusion of something that isn't. So when an audience sits in a theater or at home or in a movie theater, whatever, they are suspending their belief system willingly, they want to be told a story. And that's the genius thing about human beings. And the lovely thing about human beings, no matter if you're 2 or 102, you want to be told a story.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. So I want to do a little segment called Credit History where I'm just going to pick some roles from your varied career, some more well known than other ones, and see if you remember anything about that experience. Do you remember in 1993 shooting Power

[Bryan Cranston]

Rangers and in 1993. 93.

[Jesse David Fox]

Well, who knows when you shot it? But, like.

[Bryan Cranston]

Oh, when I. Well, but no, it wasn't. You mean the movie?

[Jesse David Fox]

I. I honestly. It just says you were in Power Rangers.

[Bryan Cranston]

Power Rangers. I did in. In night in 1980. 1980. I think I started doing voices on the Power Rangers when it came over from Japan, and I did all these voices. I forget I shall defeat you, you know, and all these things. So I was doing all these voices and they had to give, by the way, a little trivia question. The Blue Power Ranger. You know what his name is?

[Jesse David Fox]

No.

[Bryan Cranston]

Billy Cranston. They didn't want to say. Bryan Cranston. So his name. Well, we have to give him Americanized names. So how about Billy? You know, okay, but what's his last name? And I happened to be in the booth and they're saying, hey, we're putting names down for these characters. Do you mind if we use yours? And I go, no. And so he became Billy Cranston. So then years later, they asked me if I wanted to be in the movie. And I said, kind of a nice bookend. Yeah, let's do that. I'm. What's his name? Jordan. Jordan. The guy in the wall, you know. And that was interesting because I had to put my chin in a cradle and I couldn't move. I can only move my eyes, but I couldn't. And I would talk like this and what's the matter with you? And everyone was in front of me so my face would move across this thing. And it was really interesting to shoot that way. But no makeup, no hair, no wardrobe. Count me in.

[Jesse David Fox]

1994, you're in Walker, Texas Ranger. Chuck Norris, recently deceased.

[Bryan Cranston]

R.I.P. chuck. Yeah, yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

Do you remember shooting that?

[Bryan Cranston]

The only thing I remember shooting about, there was an actress, I forget, we were down in it, shot in Dallas, I believe. And I was an actor for hire. And I don't remember the name of the director, but I found him to be very rude. So there you are, I am calling you out and IMDb is going to reveal that name. And I found. He was kind of yelling at the crew and yelling. And Athena thought, God, this is so unnecessary. Why don't you just say, oh, could we have quiet please? You know, and like, be a person. Yeah, yeah. So at the hotel, we, we, we. We found out the other guest stars and I found out what room he was in. And so we ordered all our food and drink. And under his name and room number, I am now admitting to a crime that was committed in. What year was that?

[Jesse David Fox]

94. The episode aired. Who knows when he got it?

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah, 93.

[Jesse David Fox]

I feel like the statute of limitations on whatever that is.

[Bryan Cranston]

I hope so.

[Jesse David Fox]

I hope so. 1996, that thing you do.

[Bryan Cranston]

That thing you do was Tom Hanks's brilliant little movie about a would be successful band and what usually happens to bands. I love that movie. I thought it was clever and funny and sweet and I got to play an astronaut in that movie on stage with Peter Scolari and who I had worked with a couple times. And it was so much fun and the snappy little tune, that thing you do. And that's when I first met Charlize Theron. And she was in that movie. I think it was one of her first things ever. And my wife and I met her at the. I think I bumped into her while we were shooting something, and then I met her at the cast party, and she was so impressive and so beautiful and so talented that we said, oh, yeah, well, nice talking to you. Yeah, goodbye. And my wife and I both looked at each other and we went, she's a star. This woman is going to be a star.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

And it's just like, boom. She was so incredible.

[Jesse David Fox]

One more from the 90s. 1997. You were in Sabrina the Teenage Witch.

[Bryan Cranston]

Okay. I think I played a warlock in that one. I think I was a. And for some reason, I didn't have my pants on, which is normal for. You know, they're right. Let's get Cranston and he'll take his pants off. Yeah. Something like. I don't really remember too much about that.

[Jesse David Fox]

Jump cut. What do you remember? 2010, your. Your week hosting Saturday Night Live?

[Bryan Cranston]

Oh, was it 2010?

[Jesse David Fox]

I believe so. Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

Wow. I. It's like being shot out of a cannon. Steve Higgins, who was the head writer at the time, he's now executive producer with. With Seth Meyers. He told me two things. He said, trust the cards. Trust the cards. Don't think you have this memorized, right. Trust the cards and let go of perfection. This is not a perfect medium. There is no way that you can strive for perfection here. You work hard, you reach, you reach. You reach, you go. But trust the cards. And. And don't be a perfectionist. And that was really good advice. But it was amazing. I had a blast. It was such a rush. And I'm standing backstage at 11:30 at night on that Saturday night, and I hear the famous voice of Don Pardo going, I'm the host this week, Bryan Cranston. And I had a moment going like, oh, my God. And the door opens and I go through. And it was just stunning, because when you're standing behind that door, it's not finished on the other side. And I scrawled my name on it, and everybody's name is there. And you're having an oh, my God moment, because I was 19 years old when it first premiered, so I have a complete history of Saturday Night Live life, and I got to know Lauren Michaels a little bit, and I like the guy. And he knows I do when I. He knows his stuff.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. You know, you are in a sketch. I absolutely love the Balan Brothers. It's also One of Seth Meer's favorite sketches. Go look. If you have not seen it, watch it. Do you. I don't know if it. Do you recall the tune you sing? Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah. It's like, I want to give you a bottle of sparkling. How's it going? Apple juice to your house. Did you get it? Yeah. I sent a bottle of sparkling apple juice to your house. Okay, so now picture this Wednesday in the big pitch meeting when there's, like, 80 scenes to read, and they're figuring out what. What they're going to do for Saturday. Fred Armisen comes in and he says, well, let me sing it with you, and it will do it. Okay. And just imagine I say, okay, these two brothers, and they're doing a concert. Now. They had one big hit, and here's the hit. And he and I were singing this song, and the look of blank faces across the room, like, really? And it's so. Fred is so brilliant that it's like, yeah, really? And it's so nothing that it becomes something. I would never have been able to go there. I have to think it's something and then try to make it an enhanced something. He sees the nothing, and then you push the nothing into the realm of something. And I was like, oh, my God. You know, Just brilliant.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. I want to ask you about all the Way, which you did on for theater for a while, and then you filmed a version of it. And specifically the first scene in the White House, which is. You're redoing a famous call that LBJ does, where he talks about. He's talking to his tailor while talking to his editor. And it's such a silly scene out of context. Do you remember how to play it? This is a serious work. But you're playing this guy who is funny. He's obviously being. He's talking about his bung hole.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah. Oh, he's. He's talking to Hager. He owns the Hager slacks. And he's. Well, listen, as I'll tell you, I need them slacks. I like them. I'll get. And you can tell he's eating, too, because I listened to the tape. This is actually on tape?

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. No, it's lost. Yeah, I know. I've listened to it before, and I was like, I'm so excited.

[Bryan Cranston]

This is so exciting. I'm showing everybody. So I'm repeating this. It's like, you know, listen, I need some more room. I need more room between my nut sack and my bunghole. And he just says it like it's nothing. And he's eating and. But he often did that in. In getting to know the idiosyncratic world of lbj. He knew he. How he could get people off their game. He would have a situation if, like, he would. He was so tall. He was like 6, 3, 6 4. And he would. He would put his hand on your shoulder as a friend. Now, Jesse, now, I know you said your mother wasn't feeling well. I hope that's gone now. And I gave you that name of the doctor. I hope you called. And it's like such a friendly. And he's talking about you. And you then go, oh, yeah, Mr. President, yes, I did call. And she is feeling much better. Good, good. And then the hand would slip from the shoulder to around the neck and go, now listen, Jesse, I need your vote on this bill. Bill, now don't let me down. And he just praised you and he just helped you, and all of a sudden you feel like a little boy. Now, Jesse, I need your help on this bill. Don't let me down. God damn it. You're going to come through on me and on your. Yes, Mr. President. It didn't matter if it was Republican or Democrat. Everybody was like, yes, yes. And then, good God, I got shit to do. Now go on, get on. He would get you out before you could say, but, Mr. President, I really. No, yeah, come on, go and get up. You know, like, all of a sudden, oh, my God, I just committed to the bill. My party is going to hate me for. You know, it's like, he was amazing. Yeah. And then, of course, he, you know, he took a shit in front of people all the time. He would drop trowel, go into his bathroom right off the Oval Office. Come on here, come here, come here, come here. Jesse, I need to talk to you. Come here. Now, listen there. We got. We got a lot of stuff to do. We want to do some good things. Mr. Brad. No, no. Come on, come on. And he leave the door open, and he would just. Just take his pants down and he'd sit on the toilet.

[Jesse David Fox]

Unbelievable.

[Bryan Cranston]

And these, they're like, people are going, I don't want to look at this or what? And he would just talk to you and get you so off your game that he'd con. You'd get confused. And that. He was amazing. And I was very honored to be able to play him both on Broadway and in the movie.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. 2017 Curb youb Enthusiasm. So you talk a little bit about what you learned from Seinfeld and then be back with the Masters.

[Bryan Cranston]

So Larry Contacts me and says, is it, I'd like you to be in the show. Do you want to be in the show? Yeah, I'd like to, Larry. Okay, okay, listen, here's how we do it. I give you a couple, an outline, you know, what we're going to talk about, and then we talk about it. You have a responsibility about getting out a couple things, you know, you have to, you have two things you got to get out, and you're going to play my therapist. Okay. All right, we'll see you then. You know, I was like, okay, okay. And so I had seen the show, of course, and so I got to play as therapist. And as long as I got my two responsible plot line points out, at some point during this conversation, I could say anything I want. And so, you know, one time I said, okay, Larry, in the last session that we had, you were talking about how much you enjoyed going to the zoo and watching animals fornicate. Is that still something you, you enjoy doing? You know? And he would laugh and then, and then Schaefer, the director would go, stop, stop laughing. Stop laughing. Which was reminiscent of Seinfeld. Yeah, because Larry would scold Jerry for laughing. And that show was, I mean, so both those shows, I was just so blessed and lucky to be on them.

[Jesse David Fox]

There's one thing in your book you say in passing, but you say you've tried stan up.

[Bryan Cranston]

Oh, yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

What? How much? What was it like? What? Tell me your Brian Cranston stand up comedian story.

[Bryan Cranston]

Oh, yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

This is prime standup comedy times.

[Bryan Cranston]

Prime standup comedy time. You're not old enough to know, but in the, in the late 70s, early 80s, there were comedy clubs all over the place. And in New York, the seller, of course, and all the Catch A Rising Star and all that. I mean, there was all kinds of things in LA also. There was, of course, the improv, the Comedy Store. There was the Playboy Club in Century City. There was the Laugh Stop in different places. There was the Ice House. There was, I mean, you can go every single night. And so I decided that I should try my hand at stand up because it scared me. I couldn't think of anything more frightening than a microphone and a light go, yeah. And a broom full of people who've been drinking. Hey, what could be better? So I, I, I said, I got to get over this fear. So I took a class and I was like, okay, how to structure it. Okay, that, that makes sense. And I just got to get out and do it. So I started doing it, and I only did for the Like I almost eight, nine months that I did it. And I only got to the level. I rose gratefully from terrible to mediocrity. I never got past that. There was one night I was at the Laugh Stop in Encino, which is in a strip mall in the corner of a strip mall. It was the best night I had. For some reason. It was early enough, someone didn't show up, I got a slot and I did my material and I got laughs. I was like, oh my God. I quickly got in the car, I drove to the improv, convinced the guy, you gotta let me out. I finally got it, I've got it. He goes, okay, you'll be on in an hour. Hour. Okay. So I. The neighborhood of the improv. I walked around the block doing my routine, just talking about my routine around the block. And about an hour comes up. Now it's about, I don't know, 12:15, 12:30 in the evening. And, you know, people are juiced. And I get up there and I do the same routine, same night. It's not the same. No, it's not the same. And I, I think I've, I think I noticeably felt, felt so insecure at that moment because I thought I had the trigger. I thought I found the key to the lock. No, I didn't find the key to lock. I had a lucky day and I did, you know, I don't know why. And. And so I realized, okay, my agent then says to me, you blew off that interview the other day. And I go, yeah, it's good, Meg. I'm so tired because I'm going to bed around 4 o' clock in the morning. Is it? Oh, so you're gonna be your stand up comedian then? You know, I don't handle standups. You don't want to be an actor anymore? Well, of course I want to be an actor. Oh, well, I'm. Auditions you want. And I started realizing, oh, wait a minute, what am I doing? I did this only to overcome fear. But it's not, it wasn't part of my soul. Like, you know, the standups who were really belong there, they have no choice but to do this. And so that wasn't me. So I went, oh, I gotta stop. And I went back to being an actor.

[Jesse David Fox]

The overall perception, if you read the book, is you treat an acting as a job. You see a person, you go, this is a person whose acting is it? They treat it like a job, which does not mean you don't love it, but like you treat it with this sort of workmanlike quality and almost egolessness of just like, this is a job, and you should treat it with like a person would treat a job. Where does that instinct come from, from you?

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, my father was an actor.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

And always struggled. And he had a point of view of, I gotta be a star. I want to be a big star. I'm gonna be a star. And that crushed him. Yeah. I mean, that's almost figuratively and literally reaching for a star. Good luck with it. That. So I think from that, you know, just like the. The lesson on Malcolm in the Middle, watch what we do and do the opposite. I kind of did that with my parents. I watched what they did. What didn't work for was for the most part, and I did the opposite. So my dad, reaching for the star, I gotta be a star. I gotta be a star. I went, no. All I'd love to do is to be a good working actor. If I can make a living as an actor, that's my success. And to this day, that's my most cherished accomplishment, is saying that at the age of 25, from that point on, I have only acted. That's all I've done.

[Jesse David Fox]

So, you know, in the book, you quote Stanislavski's love the art in yourself, not yourself in the art, which is this idea. What then happens where you are. You then are a star. The thing that you are not. Not aiming for, you just are that. How do you reconcile that? How does that help or hinder your desire to just be a working actor?

[Bryan Cranston]

No, you just. It's. There's no course in how to be a celebrity. Yeah. You had to be famous. It's almost like, you know, you see famous people and you see how they handle it and things like that. On a talk show or in person. Oh, look at these waving. Or look at this guy doesn't want to pay any attention to his fans or whatever. So you kind of have a distant understanding. Same thing with being a parent. You kind of kind of know, but you don't know until you're a parent. You don't know. And so it's this kind of same thing with fame. You kind of have to step through and figure out, well, what does this mean to me? The first couple times you're recognized? Oh, you know who I am. Oh, wow. That's kind of cool, you know, well, you want a picture with me? Oh, you want my autograph? Oh, that. Wow, that's kind of neat. But then you realize that's a byproduct of doing something else. It doesn't excite me. It excites the fans. And I'm happy that the fans are excited. And when I do a play, I'm out there every single night. I'm signing every single playbill, taking a picture with every single fan who came to the show because I want to give thanks. And I said, you know what? I'm very, very lucky and thank you for coming to see my play and whatever. And same thing with, you know, we see people on the street and stuff. But I've stopped signing the autographs of merchandise because that's, That's a transactional thing that I. If it's a picture with you, sure, I'll take a picture with you, and that's personal, but I don't want you to go and sell things and stuff like that.

[Jesse David Fox]

I imagine also doing theater is when you get to a level celebrity. It's nice because it's like, oh, this is a way of interacting with the fans directly. But I have more control of the situation. It's more directly tied to the art, opposed to the meeting fans on the street and they want something else from. It's like, no, the thing I give you is the acting or whatever. So I imagine you've done multiple theaters. There's that nice. Where it's like, okay, now we get to have this intimate experience, but without having to be. Be so driven about fame and much more focused on the acting.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah. And, and, you know, for me, it's like the, the, the business of live theater is in jeopardy. You know, the cost of Broadway and West End is climbing so much that it's becoming an elitist activity.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

If you're rich, you can go. If you're not rich, you can't go. It's like, oof. So I, you know, I always try to figure out ways to stimulate people who are coming. You know, I always ask, whose first play is this? And. And I'm honored. Like, oh, my God, this you can. Your first play is the one I was in that was like, fantastic. But there's got to be other ways to be able to stimulate new works and people getting interested at a very, very inexpensive costs. I know that Hugh Jackman and Leah Shriver are working together on a theater beat down at the Banana Lane. And they have a tiered structure. So I went to see Hughes play a little while ago and paid 200 per ticket because I can. On the other side of the spec, the same seats next to me, $15 per person, depending on your. And. And that's the way it has to be. So, you know, I'm. I'm fine. And more than willing to pay the 200, the whatever the top price is so that we can have other people who, who don't have that level of income to be able to enjoy live theater as well.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. In your book, you said your daughter had an interest in acting at a young age, but you supported, but you directed her to classes and experiences that didn't professionalize her, which I thought was a really interesting sentence. What does that practice, especially in la? How do you avoid that aspect? Where I imagined it's. It is the. The world.

[Bryan Cranston]

Once your child is, you know, able to communicate with you verbally, she will start negotiating with, oh, honey, I need you to go to bed. No, it's like, oh, God, okay. How can we. You know, so you're constantly doing that with your child as you go. And she, Taylor showed. Showed keen interest in being in acting when she was very young. She was doing, like, little plays in school and she was doing all the way middle school, high school, college. And so we knew that was where she was going, that she was going to fall into the family business, which, when you think about it, is the most common thing in the world.

[Jesse David Fox]

Sure. Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

There are more people in the world who go into the family business than not. And by far, actually, that quote you have about Stanislavski has always stayed with me because that means exactly where a person should or should not go into this business as a career. It should be love the art within you, not you within the art. So if you are. If it's part of your being and you are energized and empowered by what you're doing, doing, that's a good sign that you may want to follow that. But if you're thinking. And I get some questions like seminars and high school getting, hey, man, so have you ever worked with so and so and you know what. What kind of house do you have and what car do you drive? And it's like all those people who ask those questions. You should probably consider some other business than going into being an actor.

[Jesse David Fox]

You mentioned the family business quality. And you say in your book. I love this sentence, which is, my parents met, like most people do in an acting class in Hollywood. What is it about your family that is like, clearly, obviously there is. You see a person be an actor, you're like, oh, I can. That, you know, that's a job. You. A lot of kids think about doing the job their parents have regardless, but clearly there's something genetically or some predisposition to all you have that like leads to this thing because there's lots of jobs in Hollywood someone could have. Have. Do you have a sense of like what connects the Cranstons?

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, actually Taylor is now a fourth generation actor because my grandfather was a vaudeville actor. My dad started out in radio and then did television, some films. So. But what. It's what you can share.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah. What's it like seeing her career now?

[Bryan Cranston]

My wife and I, her mother, are so excited for her. She, Taylor got into acting for all the right reasons. She is in love. And that's what I tell anyone. I said if you, if you know that you're not in love, you're not ready for.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

To be a professional. And you don't need to be a professional there. You can get your acting chops out in community theater, a student film or do that. That's fun. But if you really are daydreaming about it, you wake up, you're thinking in character, you're writing stories, you're taking your iPhone and you're making little movies and it's like then you're already in the lean, you're already there. And that's what Taylor was. So we kind of knew. When she was 16, I was directing an episode of Breaking Bad. And when you're directing, you're slotted in television director, you're slotted. This is the time that I'm doing this, but you don't know what episode that's going to be.

[Jesse David Fox]

Right.

[Bryan Cranston]

So all of a sudden this episode that I'm directing, I can't wait to read it because I don't know what I'm doing but this is when I'm doing it and it's, oh, they're ready with this one and here's the next one. And I look at it and it's the plane crash and we're at the student. There's a school assembly and this 16 year old sad face girl stands up and say, why would God allow this to happen? To have a plane crash? And I read this and how old is my daughter? Taylor's 16 at the time. So I go to Robin and I say, babe, I think if we don't at least explore this, we might regret it. And she might regret it. It. This is an opportunity. This fell into the lap. So I said, we agreed that it would be. We were going to present it to her and said. And so we.

[Jesse David Fox]

It's like you're her team.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah, but we presented it to her in a sense. I said there might be A role for you in this, but you have to audition for it. Yeah. No one's going to hand you anything. You need to work for this if you want it, and if you don't, that's cool.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

So I slid it to her. She read it. I go, what do you think? And she goes, nervous? And I go, yeah, that's natural. She goes, that scares me. Yeah, that's natural, too. Do you want to do. Try it or not? Do you want to audition? Yeah, I think I. I think I need to. She was really apprehensive about it. First one. Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

So I said, okay. So I had the casting people set it up as a normal casting. I then told AMC and Sony, our network and studio, I'm not going to watch this. I'm going to watch everyone else's tape except this one. I'm not going to decide on this. I want you to decide. But here's the codicil. She's got to be the best. If she is not the best, we will not hire her. And I'm absolutely fine with that. I'm absolutely good with that.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

Because the next best thing to getting a job is not getting a job that tells you, oh, God, I thought I did really well. And I would say to people who go, I thought I was going to get that right. You did so well. They go, you did. But that's just the way it is.

[Jesse David Fox]

And that's the. That's the job.

[Bryan Cranston]

That's it. Yeah. So she auditioned, and I didn't see it. I didn't see her audition until after Sony and AMC said, we want to hire her. And I said, you got to tell me, you better not be doing this because I'm directing. It's gotta be. She's the best. No, I swear to God, she was the best. We saw him all. She was, okay.

[Jesse David Fox]

Are you able to watch the Pit and see it as a TV show or ultimately you're seeing your daughter acting?

[Bryan Cranston]

You know, I am able to watch it because it's so well crafted. It's so well. Well executed from episode to episode. It's just phenomenal. It's a. It's a really beautiful, beautiful story. And I'm a fan.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

When Taylor's working, we don't, you know, we ask her, how's work? And there was a thing that happened, and it was good. And it was like, ooh, today was tough. I had three different medical terms, both with multiple syllables, that had the.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah, yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

And I tell. I tell everybody the work that the actors playing Doctors and nurses on that show. That's the hardest work you can do. That's another language. And I tell. That's harder than what I'm doing.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah, yeah. So I was watching Trumbo, and I was thinking about your family, and in many ways, like show business, not acting, but show business really hurt your father as you depict it. Like the idea of being a star and as conceived by Hollywood was arguably harmful to your family in some ways. And then you have the experience of Trumbo, and all the potential ills of Hollywood's past are explored to you in general, what gives you faith in show business?

[Bryan Cranston]

What gives me faith in show business, if anything?

[Jesse David Fox]

Because I do think at a time where people are particularly. And not to get into the particulars of the industry, but I think people are particularly cynical about it. What gives you. You still believe in it?

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, I mean, I think there's always been cynicism regarding people who are doing things that are kind of extraordinary. To make an hour of television on the pit is very hard to do. Yeah. To make a half an hour of the studio, believe me, it's excruciatingly difficult to do it because the people who do it really well in those two cases and many others, they don't accept. Good enough. It's not good enough. We gotta get better. We gotta do it better. What's better? What's the best? Keep pushing, keep pushing, keep pushing. And we gotta stop. We're all exhausted. We have to stop and go home. But I don't look at it like it's some beacon on the hill. If you're capable of doing something, I think you do it to the best of your ability, no matter what it is. I don't think show business is any different than making shoes or painting a house. It is a craft. You learn certain things. And there is a talent to painting a house. There's talent, certainly to making a shoe. It's like you or being a farmer and raising a beautiful crop. I mean, there's ability, talent, and there's craft to it. And you rely on all those things, sometimes not. And they fluctuate. And what's really needed here sometimes when you are in the 15th hour and you're like, I am drained of any more energy, I don't think I have any thoughts left. I'm going to lean on my craft right now to get through this scene, to get it done and to lean on the craft, get it done and rest. And then sometimes you do have to relax it.

[Jesse David Fox]

You.

[Bryan Cranston]

You talk if that Answers your question.

[Jesse David Fox]

I think it's. The work is ultimately the. You've talked pretty publicly about. Some people thought it was a retirement, but ultimately a sabbatical that you're hoping to take in 2026, which we're now in 2026. No scripts, no social media. Village in France, I believe, is the idea. Is that still the plan? When you imagine waking up? What are you hoping to feel?

[Bryan Cranston]

So I think what was going on is that I was. This is an interview I did three years ago, Three, four years ago, something like that. And in the interview, I said, they, you know, this person was saying you had, you know, a variety of different characters and things, and to go, yeah, I've been very active for the last 25, 30 years, really, that I haven't stopped working. And I said, but the last 30 years, I haven't had a lot of life experience. It. I've been spending, I've been spending, spending, spending, spending doing character ideas, offers. Yeah, grab, you know, it's like, oh, yeah, this, you know, going in a bubble from a movie set to a live theater to a television set is not, not. That's not real life. So I'm depleted. I felt it. I felt that my ability to come up with unique ideas to develop a character were getting less. They were lessened. And I thought, oh, I'm. I need, I'm getting empty. I need to push into another area so that I can have more life experience and a rest. And so I said, I, I, I need to hit the reset. Reset. I need to hit the pause button. That's all I said, reset, pause. I need to pause for a while. I don't know, maybe six months to a year or something and just kind of get my head straight or something. Well, the, the article came out and said he has to hit the pause button. A retirement of sorts. And I went, what? I, I never used those words.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yeah, yeah.

[Bryan Cranston]

It's like, so, yeah, that's how, that's how it works. And then so all of a sudden that becomes you're retiring. And I go, so. No. So I've been having to not even walk back, just clarify.

[Jesse David Fox]

So, but is the pause. The pause is still happening after this.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah. Well, I learned that, that when, when you've extended yourself. And I have a production company, I have a Mezcal and business, you know, it's just going incredibly well. And those business entities I have responsibility to, and I will not shirk my responsibility. So. So my Moonshot Entertainment is production company, Dos Hombres Mezcal Is, you know, those are important things and people are working for me into those entities and I'm responsible for that. So I won't take that lightly. I need to make sure that when I shift in or out of something that it's at the right time and that it's well taken care of and that's. There's not a drop or a. You know, so I need to just, just be careful in how those things are. So the plan is working. It just takes time to be able

[Jesse David Fox]

to properly give a vision for what your career would look like after. No, that's the goal. The goal is to create the vision.

[Bryan Cranston]

The goal is to go to neutral so that I can become inspired by new stimuli.

[Jesse David Fox]

Be observer, not the observer. Observed.

[Bryan Cranston]

Well, yeah, I mean, you read that. Yeah. David Covney told me that when he was a star on, On X Files, and I thought that was a brilliant observation, is that I used to observe people all the time. And I still tell young actors, you're working constantly, go to a park, go to a restaurant, go to a Starbucks or whatever, and you're watching people study them, imagine what their life is going through right now, and then come and file it away. That's human behavior, and that's what we need to be able to do. And Duchovny said, yeah, once you become a celebrity, you now become the observed and can no longer observe. I went, oh, my God, that's brilliant.

[Jesse David Fox]

One thought I had. In your book, you talked about working with Robert Forster in the final season of Breaking Bad, where he played Ed, the disappearer in the final season of the show who brings you to New Hampshire to hide out. And you're describing before that had a huge career, larger career, you say, in those last few days of shooting Breaking Bad with him. I reflected on the arc of Bob's career. He did it right. He understood the ebb and flow of this business. An accomplished movie star, he now does small roles and enjoys every minute of it. He never developed a sense of entitlement on set. He said quite often in Happy to be here, he meant it. Is that the goal?

[Bryan Cranston]

I, well, the, the, the words are in that sentence. Happy to be here. Yeah. Bob was that way. And I will recall I was a production assistant on a movie called Alligator that he was the star of. And one time I was, I don't know, 21, 22 years old, 22. And I was, I was making the Blood that Goes in the Alligator and he popped into a, a transport van that we were going to the set and and he said, can I come in here? Well, you know what, the actors. You can get your own van. He goes, nah. And he popped in and he sat next to me. And I'm thinking, I'm just kind of quiet. That's the star of the movie. And he said, hey, how are you? And I go, fine. And he goes, I'm Bob. Hi, Bob. I'm Brian. Hey, Brian. What do you do? And I thought, jesus, he's talking to me. He's like a human being. He's, like, kind and engaging. Wow, you could do that. You can be the star of a movie and still to a pa and it's like, I'm learning all this. And I told him that. And when it was so interesting, when he came on Breaking Bad, of which I was the star on, and he was a guest star on, and I told him the story. Story. And I said, do you remember that, Bob? He goes, no. And I go, of course not, because it was my memory, not your memory. It had an impact on me. But you were just being you. And I thought, bob, you're my guy. And so I adored him. And I thought, that's the way to be. Look for happiness in whatever you're doing. And if you think that you should only be a star, you need to be a star. You cannot ever not be a star. Boy, that's a. That's a lot of energy you're spending. Just let it go like this. Oh, oh, oh.

[Jesse David Fox]

W. Oh, okay.

[Bryan Cranston]

Yeah, yeah. Hey. Oh. You know, it's just. It the. It's like you're on one of those roads that you get the Wii as you're. And then, you know, if you're on a. If you're like roller coasters, you have to tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick.

[Jesse David Fox]

You need.

[Bryan Cranston]

That's part the of of it. That's part of the excitement. And it's like, oh, boy, here it comes, here it comes, here it comes. You know, you have to do the climb.

[Jesse David Fox]

K Pop Demon Hunters, Haja Boy's Breakfast Meal and Hunt Trick's Meal have just dropped at McDonald's. They're calling this a battle for the fans. What do you say to that, Rumi?

[Bryan Cranston]

It's not a battle. So glad the Saja boys could take breakfast and give our meal the rest of the day. It is an honor to share. No, it's our honor.

[Jesse David Fox]

It is our larger honor.

[Bryan Cranston]

No, really, stop.

[Jesse David Fox]

You can really feel the respect in this battle. Pick a meal to pick a side and participate in McDonald's while supplies last.

[Bryan Cranston]

Amazon presents Jeff versus taco truck salsa. Whether it's verde roja or the orange one, for Jeff, trying any salsa is like playing Russian roulette with a flamethrower. Luckily, Jeff saved with Amazon and stocked up on antacids, ginger tea and milk. Habanero. More like habanero. Yes. Save the everyday with Amazon. Tomorrow morning is knocking. Stock your fridge now. How about a creamy mocha frappuccino drink? Or a sweet vanilla smooth caramel, maybe? Or a white chocolate milk? Whichever you choose, delicious coffee awaits.

[Jesse David Fox]

Find Starbucks frappuccino drinks wherever you buy your groceries. So now it's time for the final segment. It's like a lightning round, but you can take as much time as you want. It's just. These are just the questions we asked at the end.

[Bryan Cranston]

Is it a lightning round?

[Jesse David Fox]

It's too late. We already have delineated that. That's this section of questions.

[Bryan Cranston]

That's okay, isn't it? It's like.

[Jesse David Fox]

Well, think if you have a new name. I guess it's like it's. I guess you can say this is the. The final segment. It's the final segment.

[Bryan Cranston]

It's a lightning round with snails. Yes.

[Jesse David Fox]

Well, you can answer questions quickly. You can decide. You can also pass on these. Do you have a favorite joke? Like a joke joke?

[Bryan Cranston]

Okay. Can I.

[Jesse David Fox]

Yes. This could be as dirty as they do. Okay, so usually the preamble when people have an answer to this question.

[Bryan Cranston]

So I think it was Richard Kind who told me this joke, and he said, all right. These two friends bump into each other, older guys, and they haven't seen each other in a couple years.

[Jesse David Fox]

Years.

[Bryan Cranston]

Oh, my God. How are you? Good to see you. Good. Yeah. You look. One guy says, you look fantastic. I mean, you're thin, you've got color to your face, you look strong, and you look younger than I, you know, like 10, 20 years. And he goes, oh, well, I'm. I mean, I'm having the time of my life. I'm dating twins. And the guy goes, what? He goes, yeah, I'm dating twins. And, man, is it hot. He's going to. My God, you're hitting a fantasy. That. What. How is this positive? You're dating to. Yeah, I'm dating twins. And they go, well, how do you. How do you tell them apart? He says, well, Veronica wears red nail polish and Bob has a cock. That's. That's beautiful. That's a good joke.

[Jesse David Fox]

It's good.

[Bryan Cranston]

Bob has a cock. It's good. All right.

[Jesse David Fox]

Right. Do you have a Short. I didn't know where I was going, which is exciting. Do you have a short story of an interaction with a legendary celebrity actor, director, writer, living or dead, you're willing to share?

[Bryan Cranston]

Oh, okay. So I was going to a junior college taking police science courses, because that's what I thought it was going to become, a policeman. And I. And at night, I was working as a security guard and basically in a. In a. A gated community. I was in the booth all day. I was doing my homework, and I was like, this is perfect. And they said, no, we need you at. There's the DGA Awards at, you know, Directors Guild Awards in Hollywood. We need you to be there. Oh, that's kind of exciting. Okay. So I went there, and they're all gathered, and you're going to be over. You're going to be. And what am I doing? Oh, you're going to be in the back. Going to the back. No, why don't I stay in the front? No, no, we need you in the back. Like, okay, So I go in the back. It's much darker this. And I said, what happens here to a. To a security guard back there? And he goes, oh, we're just there. Nothing. Nothing happens back here. The people who don't want to go on the red carpet come back here. They come in. They go in, they do a presentation, they give out an award. They go back out the back door, get in the car, and leave. Oh, and then all we're doing is, if any fans happen to come over here, you got to keep them way. Who's coming? We have no idea. So all of a sudden, the car pulls up, and out steps Alfred Hitchcock. And I went, oh, my God, this Alfred Hitchcock. And he lumbering and he goes into the back door. Oh, my God. And I recognized the. The driver, and I, oh, my God, I gotta say hello to Alfred Hitchcock. I'm like, my God, this is an opportunity. And I said, no, no, you can't talk to him. Don't say a word to the them. Okay. All right. And so as soon as I noticed that the driver was coming around, he was notified Mr. Hitchcock is now leaving. And so I went. I positioned myself by the door, by the. You know, by the back door, kind of surreptitiously. And then, sure enough, the door opens. Mr. Hitchcock walks out. And before the driver can get to his door, I reach for the door and open it for Mr. Hitchcock. And I said to him, Good evening, Mr. Hitchcock. Did you have a nice time? To which he replied something that I Will never forget. It's always stayed with me. So I said, good evening, Mitch Hitchcock. Did you have a nice time? And he said, And he got in the back of the car and the other guys go talk to you about that time. But I'll never forget the words of wisdom that Mr. Alfred Hitchcock gave me.

[Jesse David Fox]

Perfect advice. Whatever this means to you. Who is the best actor alive or the greatest actor alive?

[Bryan Cranston]

Alive, Alive. I'm going actor, actress could be whatever Anthony Hopkins pops into my head. I, I think he had a brilliant career and, and still works. Not much anymore, but. And Meryl's like, you know, Meryl is like, oh my God. Extraordinary work. And I love watching good actors. You know, I don't feel any sense of competition with them. I don't feel like, oh, I gotta get as good as I have to be the jockey. I have to, you know, ah, there's plenty of room for everybody. Do the best you can. And wherever you, you are, you are. Yeah.

[Jesse David Fox]

Was there an actor, especially coming up that you often were auditioning for the same parts?

[Bryan Cranston]

Yes and no. I mean, yes, there were several people that I recognized but.

[Jesse David Fox]

But you didn't have the, the. There wasn't like Philip Seymour Hoffman and Jack Black famously were like, often would be.

[Bryan Cranston]

Oh, no, I never, I never felt that there was another person that, that I recalled. And I think it's because of that. It's. I didn't zero to go there. He's always here and I'm always. I, I got away from n. I don't think of that way.

[Jesse David Fox]

Do you have a story of the best time you ever bombed or a day on set or in theater where you just.

[Bryan Cranston]

Aside from the comedy standup experience. Well, my worst experience on a set was in a show called Brooklyn south where I played a internal affairs cop. But we never got a script. Script. It was. David Milch wrote this. He's a brilliant writer, but he just didn't write them. He was tied to NYPD Blue. And by the time he was. I mean, I literally got faxed my sides for the next day, like at 8:30, quarter to 9 at night. And I had to be there at 6:30 in the morning. Memorize. It's like, it was insane. And I had paragraphs and paragraphs and so I had a migraine headache the entire week. And I had had my muscle. Everything was wrong and bad. And I hated that experience to the point where I said, okay, now I know how hellish this could be on that side when you have no time to prepare. I didn't know what I was saying or why I was saying anything. I just had to memorize. I told the series stars of that, like James Sicking, Titus Wellover, John Tenney. I said at the time, I said, please, please don't tell me your real name. I can't put anything more in don't tell me your real name. I'm just going to call you by your character name. I. I'm so exhausted. I don't know what I'm doing. And. And that's the way it came out too, I think. I never saw it actually.

[Jesse David Fox]

Thank you so much.

[Bryan Cranston]

Hey, appreciate it.

[Jesse David Fox]

That's it for another episode of Good One. Good One is produced by myself, Zachary Mack, Neal Janowitz and Ann Victoria Clark. Music Composed by Brandon McFarland. Write, review and rate the show on Apple Podcasts. 5 stars please I am Jesse David Fox and you can follow me at Jesse David Fox. Buy my book, comedy book, wherever books are sold. Thanks for listening to Good One from New York Magazine. You can subscribe to the [e-mail] pod we're back with a new episode next week. Have a good one. The right window treatments change everything. Your sleep, your privacy, the way every room looks and feels. @blinds.com We've spent 30 years making it surprisingly simple to get exactly what your home needs. We've covered over 25 million windows and have 50,000 five star reviews to prove we deliver. Whether you DIY it or want a pro to handle everything from measure to install, we have you covered. Real design professionals, free samples, zero pressure right now. Get up to 45% off with minimum purchase plus get a free professional [e-mail] rules and restrictions apply.