Jesus’ Preincarnate Appearances – Adam / Joshua / Abraham – Pt 01

Summary

Grace in Focus – Jesus’ Preincarnate Appearances: Adam, Joshua, Abraham – Pt 01

Podcast: Grace in Focus
Hosts: Bob Wilkin & David Renfrow
Date: July 13, 2026
Duration: ~13 minutes

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Episode Overview

This episode delves into the fascinating topic of Jesus’ preincarnate appearances—also known as theophanies or christophanies—in the Old Testament. Bob Wilkin and David Renfrow discuss classic examples where the Messiah appears in bodily form long before the incarnation in Bethlehem. They distinguish between theological terms, examine scriptural cases (Adam & Eve, Joshua, Abraham), and highlight how these appearances are understood within Free Grace Theology.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Introduction to Theophanies and Christophanies

• Preincarnate Appearances:
  • The hosts clarify what is meant by Old Testament appearances of Jesus before His human birth in Bethlehem.
  • Theological Terms:
    • Theophany: Manifestation of God (Greek: theos = God) [02:22]
    • Christophany: Appearance of Christ (Greek: Christos = Christ) [02:50]

Notable Quote:

“An appearance of God in the Old Testament would always be an appearance of Christ. That is, every Old Testament theophany would be a christophany. If no one has ever seen God the Father…”
— Bob Wilkin [02:57]

• Biblical Basis:
  • John 1:18 cited as proof that no one has seen the Father; thus, Old Testament appearances are of the second person of the Trinity (Jesus) [03:24].

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2. Biblical Examples of Preincarnate Appearances

A. Adam and Eve – Genesis 3

• Description:
  • The Lord God is heard “walking in the Garden of Eden” after Adam and Eve sinned [03:54].
  • This physical manifestation is seen as Christ, not God the Father, since the Father is non-corporeal [06:22].
• Discussion of God’s Names:
  • “Yahweh” as God’s covenant name; “Elohim” as the creator God (used in creation passages) [04:15].
  • In many English translations (e.g., NKJV), “Yahweh” is shown as “LORD” in all caps [05:14].

Memorable Moment:

“Adam and Eve were created with language, they were created with knowledge, and they were geniuses. …Probably the smartest people that ever lived.”
— Bob Wilkin [05:51]

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B. Joshua’s Encounter – Joshua 5

• Context:
  • Before the Battle of Jericho, Joshua meets a mysterious “man” standing with a drawn sword [07:09].
• Key Dialogue:
  • Joshua asks, “Are you on our side or their side?”
  • The answer: “‘No, but as Commander of the army of the LORD I have now come.’” [08:24]
• Identity:
  • The “man” is identified as the preincarnate Christ (Commander of Yahweh’s army).
  • Joshua responds by worshipping Him—an act reserved for God, indicating divinity [09:09].
• Dr. Charles Ryrie Reference:
  • Noted for preaching that everyone who encounters the Lord in the Bible “falls on their face” [09:21].

Notable Quote:

“He answers, ‘No.’ I’m on my own side.”
— Bob Wilkin [08:24]

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C. Abraham’s Visitors – Genesis 18

• Event:
  • Abraham greets three men, prepares a meal; two later go to Sodom and are revealed as angels [10:05].
  • The third is identified as “the LORD” (Yahweh), staying and conversing with Abraham [10:30].
• Abraham’s Plea:
  • Abraham negotiates with the Lord to spare Sodom if righteous people are found there (from 50 down to 10) [10:51].
• Theological Insight:
  • Emphasis that these righteous were those “living righteously” by Yahweh’s standards—not necessarily “born again” [11:43].

Notable Quote:

“He ends up getting into a little dickering with him about how many righteous people do there need to be in Sodom... That’s grace, by the way.”
— Bob Wilkin [10:48]

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3. Broader Significance and Future Episodes

• Messianic Thread:
  • Reference to Phillipe Sterling’s series showing Messiah’s recurring presence throughout the Old Testament [12:11].
  • The “Messianic thread”—visualized in the GES Old Testament Commentary—is woven through every book, especially the Pentateuch [12:56].

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Timestamps for Main Segments

• [01:09] – Opening question: Did Jesus appear in bodily form in the Old Testament?
• [02:22] – Explanation of theophany and christophany
• [03:22] – No one has seen the Father; all OT appearances are of the Son
• [03:54] – Adam and Eve encounter in Genesis 3
• [04:15] – Yahweh (covenant God) vs. Elohim (creator God)
• [05:14] – Genesis 3:8 and the Lord walking in the garden
• [07:01] – Joshua’s encounter in Joshua 5
• [08:24] – “No, but as Commander of the army of the LORD…”
• [09:21] – Dr. Ryrie on learning in the Lord’s presence
• [09:48] – Abraham and the three visitors, Genesis 18
• [10:48] – Abraham bartering with the Lord for Sodom’s fate
• [12:11] – Messianic thread in every Old Testament book

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Notable Quotes

• On Theophanies:

  “Every Old Testament theophany would be a christophany.”
  — Bob Wilkin [02:57]

• On Divine Identity:

  “It couldn’t be God the Father, because God the Father can’t walk. God the Father has no body.”
  — Bob Wilkin [06:22]

• On Joshua’s Question:

  “Are you on our side or their side? And I love what the Lord says… ‘No.’”
  — David Renfrow, Bob Wilkin [08:24]

• On Worship:

  “He does what all people do in the presence of the Lord. He falls on his face, which we call worship.”
  — David Renfrow [09:09]

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Episode Tone and Style

The conversation is warm, enthusiastic, and slightly humorous, especially as the hosts riff on theological vocabulary and Old Testament stories. There’s a clear sense of reverence paired with a commitment to clarity and in-depth Bible study—a hallmark of the Grace Evangelical Society's approach.

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Conclusion and Next Steps

This episode set the stage for a multi-part dive into Old Testament Christophanies, providing both scriptural foundation and theological context. The hosts signal that further examples will be explored in upcoming episodes, reinforcing the richness of Christ’s presence “from the beginning.”

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Transcript

[A]

The following is a listener supported ministry from the Grace Evangelical Society. All this week on Grace in Focus Radio, we are looking at the Old Testament prehistoric pre incarnate appearances of Christ in bodily form. We call them theophanies or Christophanies. But how is this able to happen? Thank you friend for joining us today. We're glad to have you with us. This is a ministry of the Grace Evangelical Society. Our web site is faithalone.org and we have an online seminary, Grace Evangelical Theological Seminary, which is underwritten by our generous donors and offers scholarships for those who want to study and earn an M. Div. Degree. If this sounds interesting to you, we are right now in our application window and also in our registration window for the fall semester. So why don't you go to our website and get the information you need, go through the application process and get signed up. We would love to hear from you. It is faithalone.org seminary. Now with today's discussion, here's Bob Wilken along with David Renfrow.

[B]

Well, David, our next question is about appearances of the Messiah, the Lord Jesus Christ before he was born. Did Jesus appear to people in bodily form in the Old Testament? And of course, this is kind of like the Outer Limits or some of those things, because how could someone appear before they were born?

[C]

This is the time to have really creepy music. I like it.

[B]

Okay, so here's the point I would make, is that the Lord Jesus Christ was born in Bethlehem probably a few years BC Maybe three or four years BC because our calendar is off a bit. But that doesn't mean that was the first time he had bodily form. We know that there are appearances of God in the Old Testament. What do we call theologically an appearance of God?

[C]

Manifestations.

[B]

A manifestation, yes. But if we use the Greek word theos, what kind of an appearance is it?

[C]

Theophany.

[B]

That is correct. Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. And if you have an appearance of Jesus, the Messiah, the mashiach, or in Greek, the Christian, what do we call that? Christos. That's in modern Greek, because Christos is the way you learned it in the seminary. But Christos is. If you were in Athens, if you

[C]

were in Athens, you'd have to say Christos, otherwise they'd make fun of your Greek.

[B]

So an appearance of the Christ in the Old Testament was called a christophany. Christophany. Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. That's correct. So an appearance of God in the Old Testament would always be an appearance of Christ. That is, every Old Testament theophany would be a christophany. If no one has ever seen God the Father. Well, is there any verse in the Bible that says no one has seen God at any time, but his only Son has revealed him? Doesn't that sound familiar?

[C]

Sounds very familiar. Where is that?

[B]

John, chapter one, verse 18. We have the same thing in first John. And the point is, if no one's ever seen God at any time, then any Old Testament appearance of God is an appearance of the second member of the Trinity. So can you give me some examples, David? Give me an example of somebody in the Old Testament that saw God.

[C]

Well, there's several. The first one is Adam and Eve.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

Adam and Eve in Genesis. And what is interesting about that passage is it talks about the Lord God walking around in the Garden of Eden.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Adam and Eve heard the Lord God walking.

[B]

And by the way, the Lord God is Yahweh.

[C]

Elohim, Yahweh, Elohim.

[B]

And so it's got both those names of God.

[C]

Right. And just to quickly understand the difference, based on my studies, Yahweh is the covenant name for God. We know him by heaven, the one who keeps covenant, the one that we have a covenant with. Yeah. Elohim is the creator God. He's the God of everything. And it implies or emphasizes his all power, omnipotence, that kind of thing. In the beginning, Elohim created the heavens and the earth, you see? And Elohim is used all the way through the creation passage, not Yahweh. Yahweh doesn't occur until later. So that's how, when I see Elohim used or Yahweh used, it says to me a lot. And of course, in the new King James, Yahweh, you'll see the word Lord in all capital letters. And so you're not going to see the word Yahweh in that translation.

[B]

So Genesis 3:8. After Adam and Eve had sinned, they were hiding behind trees in the garden as they heard the Lord God walking through the garden. And they were hiding because they now knew that they were sinners. And they knew they had sinned. And they were only covered by fig leaves. So they were kind of embarrassed that

[C]

they said that they sewed the fig leaves together. Who taught them how to sew?

[B]

Yeah, See, that's the thing. It was.

[C]

I get the idea. There was a lot of fellowship.

[B]

Adam and Eve were created with language, they were created with knowledge, and they were geniuses. And so I would think they developed needles, they developed thread, they developed all that. And whether the Lord taught them that or not they were smart. Probably the smartest people that ever lived. But anyway, there's one example, and it couldn't be God the Father, because God the Father can't walk. God the Father has no body.

[A]

We will return to our program content shortly, but we're taking this break to let you know that Grace and Focus is shortly going to be transitioning to digital delivery only. We've appreciated this fine radio station, and being part of its lineup has been a privilege indeed. But we're going to say goodbye to this time slot and make room for another ministry right here. You can continue to listen to Grace in Focus. Just pick the time of day anytime 24 7. And find us on Spotify, Apple, and many other podcast outlets.

[B]

How about somebody else that the Lord Jesus appeared to in the Old Testament?

[C]

The one I like, which I think is fascinating, is Joshua.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

Joshua, chapter five.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

What it says is. This is right before the big battle of.

[B]

In Jericho.

[C]

Yeah. Where the walls come tumbling.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Joshua fought the battle of Jericho.

[C]

I like to sing soprano and. Yeah. And what it. It's interesting. It says right before the battle, and this is at the very beginning of the conquest of the land, the promised land. Joshua sitting in his tent. You know, every time I study this passage, I went, what was going through Joshua's mind? Am I up to this? You know, all sorts of things come to your mind. And what happens is that he's sitting there by himself, and all of a sudden he looked up and behold, a man, capital M, of course, stood opposite him with his sword drawn in his hand. And of course, that would cause a lot of anxiety, I would think. And so Joshua asked the correct question. Are you on our side or their side? And I love what the Lord says in verse 14, Joshua 5, 14. He said, no. Isn't that interesting?

[B]

No, I'm on my own side. Yeah.

[C]

The answer is no. And that jumps out at you in the text. He says no, but as the commander of the army of Yahweh. And actually, the word there for army is part of another word for the Lord, Yahweh, Tsabaoth, which is Lord of hosts, and it is the Lord of armies, but it's that same word, and he's the Lord of the army. And I've come the whole point. And of course, what happens is Joshua realizes who's. He recognizes them as the Yahweh of the Old Testament. And so he does what all people do in the presence of the Lord. He falls on his face, which we call worship. Yeah.

[B]

He Worships him.

[C]

Many, many years ago, I heard a sermon by Dr. Charles Ryrie. And I love the title of his sermon. It was called Learning in the Lord's Presence.

[B]

Amen.

[C]

And he makes that point that if you go through the Bible, everybody that sees the Lord like Joshua did, what do they do physically? They fall on their face. They fall down, they bow down. And of course, Ryrie says they all do that. So that's not the sermon.

[B]

Right.

[C]

But he says, what did they learn in the Lord's presence? And he would go. He went through several examples, and it was one of the best sermons I've ever heard.

[B]

Absolutely. Well, okay, how about Genesis 18? Three men come up to Abraham.

[C]

Right.

[B]

And so Abraham prepares a great meal for them and he meets with them. And who are these three men that. That Abraham meets?

[C]

Wow.

[B]

Well, we know that two of them end up going over to Sodom, and Lot evidently brings them into his house. And the men of Sodom are wanting to have carnal knowledge of them. And it turns out those two were angels, right?

[C]

I would think so. Yeah.

[B]

But who's the third man?

[C]

Well, if you read the text, it talks about Abraham standing before the Lord.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Before Yahweh.

[B]

And he ends up getting into a little dickering with him about how many righteous people do there need to be

[C]

in Sodom, let's make a bet kind of thing.

[B]

Well, yeah. And he says, look, if there are 50 righteous people in Sodom, will you spare it? Yeah, let's make a deal. That's better. Will you spare the city if there are 50 righteous? And the Lord's like, okay, that's grace, by the way. Right. And then he says, don't get mad, but how about 45? Okay, how about please don't get mad, but 40? So then he keeps going, 30. Okay, 20. Okay, how about just 10 if we can find 10 righteous people.

[C]

Right.

[B]

Well, you've already got Lot and his wife and his two daughters. Can't you find six more people? If there are just 10 righteous people in the city, would you spare it? Now, by the way, I don't think he's talking about 10 born again people. I think he's talking about 10 people who are living righteously according based on

[C]

the standards of Yahweh.

[B]

Right, right. So in other words, you might have 50 born again people in Sodom, but if there aren't 10 that are living righteously, that wouldn't qualify. So the lord agrees to 10. Well, the angels get over there. There aren't 10. And so he tells Lot and his wife and his two daughters to flee because he's about to destroy the well. They met the pre incarnate Lord Jesus Christ too.

[C]

Absolutely.

[B]

And so there are lots of examples. Well, look, we just scratched the surface so we're going to continue this David on the next one because there are so many more examples of Old Testament people that the Lord Jesus met with. Phillipe Sterling did a series in our magazine called the Messianic Thread and he talks about how the Messiah is found in pretty much every book in the Old Testament. And in fact, if you look at our Old Testament Commentary Volume one at the bottom, there's a thread that goes along and extends to the back cover. And that thread is meant to illustrate the Messianic thread found not just in the Pentateuch, which is what volume one is about, but in the entire Old Testament.

[C]

That's amazing.

[B]

Well, thanks so much y' all and thank you David. And let's keep Grace in in focus.

[A]

We invite you to check out our Monday, Wednesday and Friday five minute YouTube videos at YouTube Grace Evangelical Society. You will love the content and learn a lot. There are a lot of costs involved in staying on the air. That's why we so much appreciate our financial partners. If you'd like to learn how to become one, you can find out more by going to faithalone.org on our next episode. Prepare prehistoric Christophanies to Abraham. We would love you to join us. In the meantime, keep Grace in focus. The proceeding has been a listener supported ministry from the Grace Evangelical Society.