62 | Vance Roush – A System of Generosity - Overflow

Summary

GrowLeader Podcast Episode 62 Summary

Guest: Vance Roush
Host: Pastor Chris Hodges
Date: September 16, 2024
Title: Vance Roush – A System of Generosity - Overflow

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Overview

This episode features Vance Roush, founder of Overflow, in conversation with Pastor Chris Hodges. They explore the intersection of technology and generosity in the church, focusing on systems that make giving easier and more impactful. Vance shares his unique tech-to-ministry journey, practical stories of church growth and innovation, and deep insights about creating a "system of generosity" that helps churches scale their mission.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Vance’s Journey from Tech to Ministry

• Background:

  • Vance and his wife moved to Silicon Valley after college; Vance began his career at Google, working on machine learning to fight ad fraud.
  • “I was on the machine learning team before it was called AI... the good guys trying to fight the bad guys in terms of fraudsters.” (01:57–02:10)

• Church Planting Begins:

  • Both wanted to serve in the local church but struggled to find one in the Bay Area. Despite reaching out to over 20 churches, none responded.
  • A chance DM from Australian pastors led to co-founding Vibe Church—starting with just seven people in a San Jose living room.
  • “We planted a church... in their living room, we started the church with seven people. Today, about 4,000 people across 12 locations.” (06:29–07:02)

Insights on Explosive yet Organic Church Growth

• No Overnight Success:
  • Growth from 7 to 4,000 was “one dinner party at a time… one invitation at a time.” (08:01–08:16)
  • They joined CrossFit gyms not for fitness, but to build community and invite people.
  • Pastor Chris calls this organic discipleship: “It’s intentional... every week, just one dinner party at a time." (08:30–08:36)

The Birth of Overflow: Tech Meeting Ministry

• Identifying a Problem:

  • Donors in Silicon Valley wanted to give stock or crypto, but the process was clunky and difficult.
  • Vance built a simple web application to automate non-cash giving. Launched as Overflow in 2020.

• Immediate Impact:

  • “By November 11th, within three days, 32 people respond. We raised $1.1 million in three days.” (00:00–00:11; 10:57–11:12)
  • Pastor Adam, Vance’s lead pastor, had a key realization: “This is not just for Vibe Church. This is for the kingdom of God.” (11:17–11:32)

Overflow’s Growth during COVID

• Funding and Expansion:
  • Launched officially during the pandemic; overcame initial rejections in pitching to VCs over Zoom.
  • “My first 50 pitches were all rejections, all Nos. But God was refining me.” (12:23–13:22)
  • Secured $20M from the Wesleyan Investment Foundation, expanding beyond stock/crypto to core giving and innovations like “tap disks” for in-seat digital giving.
  • “We serve 600 [churches] now... we’ve already eclipsed over $200 million in giving through our platform.” (14:31–14:34)

Notable Success Stories

• Ocean’s Church, Orange County:
  • “In the first four weeks [after implementing Overflow], they raised over $400,000 in non-cash assets, which was an accelerant to buy their building.” (15:32–15:48)
• Live Atlanta (Pastor Mayo):
  • With tap disks, “700 people at that service, over 600 people tapped and filled out a connection card.” (15:48–16:08)
• Equip/John Maxwell:
  • Upon implementing Overflow, someone donated $80,000 the first day. (21:18–21:31)

Making Technology Accessible for All Churches

• Ease of Implementation:

  • Overflow is designed for simplicity—"a couple lines of code," “literally minutes” to get running.
  • “You don’t have to change what you’re doing. You can add to this.” (21:35–21:51)
  • Integrates with popular church management systems.

• Pragmatism over Technical Skills:

  • Pastor Chris emphasizes trusting the right leaders and partners over personal tech skills.
  • “Once I know... if something works, I’m in.” (19:31–19:35)

Deep Insights on Generosity

• Science & Scripture Align:

  • Cites Proverbs 11:24 “the world of the generous gets larger and larger.”
  • UC Berkeley research: giving money releases oxytocin—“to the level of when you eat food and when you get shelter... we are biblically and physiologically wired by God to give.” (18:36–18:46)

• Leaders’ Perspective Shift:

  • “You don’t have to twist people’s arms... When you can change your perspective, and remove friction from the process, people have an appetite to want to be part of what we’re doing.” (18:45–19:15)

Practical Advice for Pastors

• Overcoming Intimidation:
  • Staff for tech roles just like churches began hiring sound engineers, lighting experts, etc. “In the same way we hired for production coordinators and sound engineers… do that in the next decade for tech and generosity.” (23:03–24:04)
• Technology is a Tool for the Kingdom:
  • “If we do that as a local church, we’re going to be able to use technology. Technology is just a tool to build the kingdom.” (24:18–24:24)

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Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• “We raised $1.1 million in three days.”
  — Vance Roush [00:00] & [11:12]
• “This is not just for Vibe Church. This is for the kingdom of God.”
  — Pastor Adam via Vance Roush [11:32]
• “Numbers are names, numbers are people.”
  — Vance Roush [15:33]
• “You don’t have to twist people’s arms… Biblically or scientifically.”
  — Vance Roush [18:02]
• “I have to trust the person at the head of it. And I do trust Vance.”
  — Pastor Chris Hodges [20:16]
• “In the same way we hired for production coordinators and sound engineers in the past decade is the same way we should in the next decade [for tech].”
  — Vance Roush [23:52]

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Timestamps of Important Segments

• Vance’s Tech & Faith Background: 01:38–04:43
• Planting Vibe Church: 04:43–07:02
• Church Growth Strategy: 08:00–09:04
• What is Overflow & Its Impact: 09:55–11:57
• Building Overflow during COVID: 12:23–13:22
• Innovations with Overflow: 13:27–14:34
• Success Stories/Ocean’s & Live Atlanta: 14:31–16:15
• How to Get Started: 16:51–17:33
• Insights on Generosity (Scripture & Science): 18:02–19:15
• Implementation Made Easy: 21:38–22:53
• Advice to Tech-Resistant Pastors: 23:03–24:24

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Conclusion & Next Steps

• Overflow offers an easy-to-use, frictionless solution for church giving—expanding generosity by making non-cash giving and modern engagement simple for all sizes of churches.
• Churches interested in learning more can visit overflow.co or follow @overflowapp on social channels.

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For links and more partner info, check GrowLeader.com/podcast.

Transcript

[Vance Roush]

And so I thought we were going to raise a few thousand dollars, Right. I sent that November 8th. By November 11th, within three days, 32 people respond. We raised $1.1 million in three days.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Wow. Just by offering this different way to.

[Vance Roush]

Give, just by making it easier.

[Matt]

Well, hey, everybody, and welcome to the Grow Leader Podcast, where we grow leaders that grow churches by helping them reach their full potential. My name is Matt. So glad to have you with us here today, sitting as always, beside the one and only Pastor Chris Hodges, PC.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

And one of my favorite places on Earth, which is at the Highlands College campus. I mean, I just love. We have pastors here right now. So I'm looking out the windows because our studio just has windows everywhere. In fact, there's some pastors leaning in right now. I'm just going to wave out, hey, guys, what's going on? And so we have all over the building looking at this facility.

[Matt]

It's like a fishbowl.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Yeah. I love it. I love it, though. We have a lot of guests on campus today. This is Vance Roush, who's our dear friend, who's the founder of Overflow, one of our partners. And one of the things we would love for you always to know about our partners is that we never bring someone to you that we do not use. I would never do this. We are not for sale. Okay? So we bring you people that we're saying, okay, now, if they knew this person and they had this tool, it would help you grow your church. So that's my promise to you always. And this is one that's been a game changer for us. Vance. We really value you and what you're doing, not only for Highlands, but for the greater body of Christ. We'll tell them all about Overflow in just a minute. But you have the most interesting background and kind of your testimony it is that led to the creation of this company. Let's start there. Come on. Just. Just let us get to know you a little bit.

[Vance Roush]

We got to rewind a little bit about 12 years ago when my wife and I just got married up in Seattle, Washington. University of Washington. Go Dogs. Huskies. And right after we graduated, got married, we moved to the Silicon Valley because I got a job at Google. That was my first job out of college.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

What did you do there?

[Vance Roush]

So I was on the machine learning team before it was called AI.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Oh, wow.

[Vance Roush]

Actually before artificial intelligence was kind of coined.

[Matt]

I have so many industry.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Yeah, yeah. And I don't even understand it. I have un. Artificial intelligence right now.

[Vance Roush]

So we were actually what we called it internally, the good guys trying to fight the bad guys in terms of fraudsters trying to defraud the ad system. And so we created ML models, machine learning models to detect it ahead of time. And so that was my intro to Business, my Intro to Technology.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

And you were doing that. That's the career you thought you were gonna be in?

[Vance Roush]

That's the career that I thought I was gonna be in. Simultaneous to starting my career at Google, my wife, she got a job teaching in a tougher part of San Jose. We were just starting our lives together. We knew that we wanted to be part of the local church. We met at a local church up in Seattle. That's where we fell in love. That's where we got married, officiated over there. And we knew we wanted to serve in a local church. And so churches in the Bay Area, long story short, we couldn't really find one. We really resonated with. I mean, we signed up for all the connection cards. Okay, 20 churches never got a call back. What systems are important? We would even check that we would serve in kids ministry. Still no call back. Like, it was like wild.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

The thing we say around Highlands is responsiveness wins.

[Vance Roush]

Right? It really does.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Just respond, like, do it as quickly as you can.

[Matt]

That's a great takeaway right there. Just talking about responses this week in the staff meeting. All right, keep going.

[Vance Roush]

No, that's right. And you know, the other thing too was we were looking for a house of vision, right? I mean, the Bible says, you know, without vision, the people perish. It's so true. I was in town hall meetings at my company at the time Google. And the CEO Larry Page would remind us of the mission of Google. He would remind us every single Friday that the mission is to democratize the world's information, to make it accessible to all my goodness. So I was in a staff meeting at Google and then I would go to visit a church on a Sunday. And you didn't even know what the vision was. Right. And so there's all these elements. And long story short, I sensed that maybe God was preserving us for something. And he was. Because, you know, two months into the journey of searching for a local church we could be a part of and call home, we got a DM on Twitter by these pastors that were in Australia at the time. They had a call from God to plant a church, a life giving church in the Silicon Valley, but they had never been.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

And how did they even know to DM you?

[Vance Roush]

So, you know, one of those churches that didn't contact us. They just forwarded us our information to them.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Are you kidding me?

[Vance Roush]

I'm not kidding you. That's. I'm not kidding you.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Yeah, we don't have time for you. But these guys might. I mean, my goodness.

[Vance Roush]

Well, because I think that they saw that we were living down south in the Bay Area and this church was in San Francisco, okay. And so they were making the connection, and I'm grateful for that connection because that DM on Twitter, I call Twitter now the Holy Dove, because it was kind of a divine connection. I know it's called X now, but it led to us responding to that dm, saying, yeah, we're interested, to connect. Are you guys in the Bay Area? They said, hold that thought, we got to book a flight. That next week they booked a flight from Sydney, Australia to the Silicon Valley. And we met them and we spent a few hours with them, touring them around Google, my alma mater, touring them around Stanford. And after three hours, and if you know any Aussies in your life, they become fast friends.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Okay?

[Vance Roush]

They're crazy, they're awesome. And so after three hours of knowing them, we end up at a Thai restaurant, okay. And they start pitching this vision of vibe church. They say, hey, we've been doing research. God's been speaking to us that this is a place that is the modern day Rome. The same way that all roads led to Rome is the same way all Internet highways lead to the Silicon Valley. If Paul was writing letters today, he would write a letter to the Silicon Valley saying, I desire to be there. And they were talking about how people in the Silicon Valley, Apple, Facebook, Google are creating products that are impacting billions of people around the world. But what if there was a life giving church that reached these people and they would get a deeper purpose for the products that they were building by meeting their creator.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Wow.

[Vance Roush]

And so they're giving this vision pitch. We were 22 years old, bright eyed, and they look us right in the eyes. I'm just trying to eat my pad Thai. But they look us right in the eyes and they say, why don't you join us? Why don't you start this church with us? And based off of mainly naivety, but the Bible says a mustard seed level faith, maybe a little bit of faith. We said yes. We said yes. That was a yes. That changed the trajectory of our lives. So we planted a church. A month later, they sold everything in Australia, moved over, officially got a rental property in San Jose, California in their living room. We started the church with seven people with seven people. We wish we knew about Ark at the time, we didn't know about Ark. It was just kind of organic. Seven people in the living room. Today we have about 4,000 people across 12 locations.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Wow, that's amazing. Yeah. Yeah. That's spectacular.

[Vance Roush]

God is moving. About a year into that journey, they ordained my wife and I, Kim, as executive pastors of the church. I think that's because we're the only people at the church that knew how to do a spreadsheet at the time. Yeah, yeah, that was a qualification. It's very important. And I still know how to do spreadsheets, but that was the journey. And so we've been on every team. Bump in, bump out. We've been on driving trucks and, you know, all those type of things, planning campuses. Fast forward to 2019. I'm still in technology. I've been bi, vocational pretty much this whole past decade. I'm not paid by the church. Right. I volunteer. And so 2019.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

So all those years you were volunteering.

[Vance Roush]

So there was a stint where I was part time.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Wow.

[Vance Roush]

But most of it, yeah, I've been volunteer. And today.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

And before you get into the rest of the story, how did it grow that fast? I mean, give us. This is grow leader. Give the people that are listening a little nugget on what did they do right for that to have that kind of explosive growth.

[Matt]

7 to 4000.

[Vance Roush]

7 to 4000. Grow leader. This is what I'd say. And I tell people this all the time. There was no hockey stick growth. There was no exponential curve in our growth. And I know that some churches story and praise God for that. It was one dinner party at a time.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

There you go.

[Vance Roush]

One baked dinner at a time. One coffee at a time, one invitation at a time. We would sign up for just three CrossFit gyms just to invite people to church. Obviously, I'm not doing CrossFit right now. And so. And so it was just diligence.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

I call that organic discipleship. It's intentional. And every week, just one. Yeah. One dinner party at a time.

[Matt]

Which is not a part of our story at Highlands, as you tell very often, but I've heard people say that your office was Starbucks. You were eight hours every day, meeting.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

After meeting after meeting is one of the things that people don't know about Highlands and about the growth of our church. I think it was that hockey stick. Just exponential growth. And it wasn't. It was hard work every day.

[Matt]

Every day.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Something we enjoyed. I mean, but it was still hard. We in very intentional Organic discipleship.

[Vance Roush]

So it really was, and it compounds over time.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Okay, so 2019. Now go back.

[Vance Roush]

Fast forward to 2019. You know, the church is growing at that point. We were about to launch, you know, into more locations. We were 10 at the time. All bump in, bump out, reaching out to the community. We had an outreach arm that was impacting the community. And so we had a lot of donors, supporters, givers, really getting inspired to awaken people to the reality of Jesus and bring heaven to. To earth. And they would say, hey, Vance, we know you, right? As executive pastor, I'm also the treasurer on the board. I would love to give. I can give so much more, though, if you allow me to give from my stock portfolio. I thought this was just a Silicon Valley phenomena, because people in the Valley, they get paid from Facebook, Apple, Google in the form of stock compensation. And so at the time, this is a little bit embarrassing. We didn't really have a way to receive it easily.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Right.

[Vance Roush]

People had done it kind of one off, but it was very clunky. And I started digging into it because more and more people were asking about it. And I realized that there was a bit of friction with giving from a stock portfolio and definitely cryptocurrency at the time. And so, coming from a technology background, I just simply wanted to solve a problem for our church. And so I created a web application that would automate the process of somebody connecting to their brokerage account and sending a generous stock gift to directly to the church's brokerage account and automating the process of getting them their tax receipt and their acknowledgement letter. I wrote code alongside an engineer friend of mine, and we built it. October 2019. And with the permission of my pastor, we sent it to 1,000 active recurring donors on November 8, 2019, with a simple note. Pastor Chris I just said many of you have asked me about wanting to give stock, and I did some research. There's some tax advantages, there's some tax savings opportunities if you do it this way. There's been a little bit of friction before, but you could do so now completely online through this platform called Overflow. And so I thought we were going to raise a few thousand dollars, Right. I sent that November 8th. By November 11th, within three days, 32 people respond. We raised $1.1 million in three days.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Wow. Just by offering this different way to.

[Vance Roush]

Give, just by making it easier.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Yeah.

[Vance Roush]

And so, as any executive pastor would be to their lead pastor, I'm pumped to tell him the news. And Pastor Adam, he's a great man of faith. He said something that would then shift another trajectory in my life. He said, vance, this is not just for Vibe Church. This is for the kingdom of God. And it felt like a great permission, like a holy permission, like a starting gun moment where we built a staff, we raised some venture capital. It's a well funded company now at this point. And we were off to the races. July 2020 is when we officially launched the company. And shortly after, and within that year, we started working with people like Church of the Highlands and all the amazing churches at arc.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

That's awesome. And so tell us some of the, some of the results since then. So it's interesting that you started this in the middle of COVID too, the product of the pandemic. You got any fun stories around that? I mean, like, how hard is it to start a company in the middle of when everybody has their attention on a pandemic? I mean, it might have been kind of good though, in a way, because they were needed ways to give without actually physically being in church too. So how did that actually work out?

[Vance Roush]

Yeah, I mean, there was definitely a burden to it and there was a big blessing in it for sure. There was both polarities. I would say the burden part of it was that in the Silicon Valley, Sand Hill Road is the place where 90% of venture capital lives right in that street. And it's in my backyard. And so typically before the pandemic, you would meet venture capitalists in person, but I was meeting them on Zoom. And so I didn't get to really build rapport. My first 50 pitches were all rejections, were all Nos. And so through that process, God was refining me. And I'm grateful now that those rejections were insight. But that was the burden part. Eventually we saw breakthrough. We raised money. The blessing part, to your point, Pastor Chris, is that it was a time and space where if you were questionable about online giving, there's no arguments anymore. Like it was a requirement. You had to have a robust online giving solution if you were going to survive and even thrive in that season.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

And so it is an online giving solution beyond stock. Now tell us what overflow is today.

[Vance Roush]

So today, fast forward. You know, most recently, we just announced that we got a $20 million funding round for from the Wesleyan Investment foundation, another kingdom minded organization that saw what we were doing and wanted to put booster rockets on it. And what that's allowed us to do is really expand our offerings. We're not just known for stock and crypto anymore, but we're really known as an innovation company to help increase generosity. So we do the core giving, we do ACH debit credit. Our most recent innovation outside of the core giving, where we save on processing fees, is we created this tap disc that's installed on the back of seats. We actually have it for art conference here while we're recording, where it's been increasing engagement because instead of QR codes, you can just simply tap to give or tap to put in a connection card. And we're seeing phenomenal results. And so I would say that while churches we serve 600 now, I've learned, have a spirit of generosity in their church. All they need is to be paired with this system of generosity. And that's what Overflow really is, a system of generosity. Now.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

So tell us some of the success stories. I want to hear some of them.

[Vance Roush]

Yeah. So my favorite success stories is really about how we're moving the needle for churches on an aggregate level. We've already eclipsed over 200 million in giving through our platform across 600 churches. And all the non cash gifts that are coming through, it's pretty much net new giving. It's gifts that otherwise wouldn't have happened if it wasn't for Overflow. And so those are amazing stories for us because they're funding, they're fueling, they're accelerating outreach projects, they're accelerating building projects. We have an amazing partner. I think you all know him, Pastor Mark Francie, Ocean's church. That is one of my favorite stories because right when they got into Overflow, in the first four weeks, they raised over $400,000 in non cash assets, which was an accelerant to buy their building in Orange County. If you know anything about Ocean's church, they've been meeting in a tent and it's like tent revival.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

You can do that in California, you.

[Vance Roush]

Can do that in Cali. You can do that in Cali. But now they are fitting out a building that they're going to be moving into this summer. I know our mutual friends, Mayo, right over in Live Atlanta, Pastor Mayo, doing an incredible job. They just implemented our tap disk at one of their services when they had 700 people at that service, over 600 people tapped and filled out a connection card. And so we care about numbers because numbers are names, numbers are people. And we're tracking these alongside our partners and it's really increasing engagement.

[Matt]

Talked to Mayo this morning and he just said, I said, hey, you know what the disc is? Oh, man, we use it and our engagement is through the roof because of it. Because it's right there, and it's easy.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Yeah. I don't like the QR code on the screen because you have to lift your phone. Yeah. And now I was like, okay, everybody look at me. I'm. I'm giving church. You know, it's like. I don't know, but it's so obvious. It's like there's nothing inconspicuous about it, you know, like, you gotta. You gotta let everybody see. But where the tap is right there in front of you, you can.

[Vance Roush]

Right in front of you.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Which is important, I think, where you can be a little bit private in your giving. So it's right. It's right there. You don't have to make a show of it in that kind of way. What if there are pastors that are listening in churches that are listening to saying, wait a minute, I didn't even know there were. That tool was out there. What can it do for me? And then how do I sign up for it? How do I get involved in it?

[Vance Roush]

Yeah. Yeah. So what we say is that we really want to be the system of generosity that helps grow engagement, grow disciples, and grow givers. Right. And if you want to learn more about overflow, it's pretty simple. Overflow code. We don't have.com yet. That's $2 million. So we're being good stewards.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Good.

[Vance Roush]

That's great. Overflow Co, Overflow Co, and then overflowapp on Instagram and all the social channels. But we communicate a lot through those channels, and we do a lot of content like this so that we can continue to what we learned. It's not just about a button on a website. It's not just about a tool on an app, really. It's about education. And so we see ourselves as a generosity partner alongside our platform.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

So what are you learning about generosity? I mean, you're in this space.

[Vance Roush]

Yeah.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Day in, day out. And I don't think I've ever met a pastor who doesn't want to know two things. How do I. How do I get more people, and how do I get more money? You know, they all want to know, and. And they say it out of the purest of hearts. I don't say that in Jess. I. Yeah, I'm. I'm saying that people really, genuinely care. Like, I don't. I'm not very good at communicating about generosity, and. But they all have vision. So I know you have people's attention right now on this podcast. What are you learning about? Just the space of generosity.

[Vance Roush]

The biggest thing that I've learned is that a lot of times as pastors, we could think that, ah, this giving moment, or when I'm teaching about generosity, it's like I have to twist arms. That couldn't be further from the truth, Biblically or even scientifically. Proverbs 11:24, which our company is built off, says in the message version, the world of the generous gets larger and larger. So we know it's spiritually true. But also UC Berkeley in our backyard in the Bay Area, they did a study. It's called the Science of Generosity. When you give money, not of your time, and giving of time is awesome, volunteering is awesome. But when you give money, it releases, specifically a dopamine called oxytocin to the level of when you eat food and when you get to shelter.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Wow.

[Vance Roush]

We are biblically wired by God to give, but we are also scientifically, physiologically wired by God to give. And so what I've learned is that when you can, and when we can change our perspective, that we don't have to twist people's arms. We actually just need to be clear in our communication and also remove friction from the process. People actually have an appetite to want to be part of what we're doing to build the local church.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

So if they want to be a part of this, again, if they're listening. You said the social media channels. Is that all just go to the website or go to the social media channels? And so is it hard to install this? I mean, what. I'm, I'm the least technology person, which.

[Matt]

I want to ask you about that in a second. Because you, you embrace this.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Well, yeah, once I know. Well, I'm a pragmatist, so once, if something works, I'm in.

[Matt]

But I'm thinking for the person who's listening, who's going, I mean, I'm not a tech person. I'll understand this and.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Oh, you couldn't possibly understand it less than me.

[Matt]

My pastor's not a tech person. But you said.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

But not because I don't have the brain for it. I don't. I choose not to. Right. I don't like, I don't like the space that it pulls me into, honestly. So I love having smart people around me that I trust and I trust. I trust Vance and this company implicitly. Thank you. And, But I, I, I want them to know, but I don't want to know. I hate the space. For some reason. I, I'm trying to, I don't know. It's. That's for another podcast, another but how.

[Matt]

Did, how did you decide how, how you made a decision? At some point, hey, we need to use this as a tool. We need to use. And was it because it made giving so much easier for the, for the giver or for us for processing?

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Well, actually, it'll surprise you. Neither one of those. Actually. The first thing that I'm drawn to everything that I'm involved in, I have to trust the person that's at the head of it. And I do trust Vance. I have to know people. And when I got to know Vance and my son David worked for the company and still does to a degree and just kept bringing back this glowing report of how it's serving the churches, I'm all in. And then anything that's going to help churches, that's probably my second filter. If it's going to help a church reach their vision that God's given them, I'm all in with it too. But then just the reputation of doing it well, and honestly, you guys, I think you make it available to churches in a way that's not overwhelming to them. So, you know, of course you want to be the tool of choice, but I mean, you're happy to be an add on to what they might already have in the process. I mean, speak to that just a little bit. I think you've made it so easy for people. And that's what I. When I'm trying to not sell it. But when I'm trying to say, hey, you might want to consider this, I tell him, you don't have to change what you're doing. You can add to this. In fact, John Maxwell, because I serve on the board of Equip, I said, john, listen to me. At Equip, we need to add this because there's some people trying to give this particular way that doesn't currently exist. We don't have to stop what we're doing at Equip. We can add this to it. And the first day that Equip added overflow, somebody gave 80,000. $80,000 to John's nonprofit. Exactly. So it absolutely works. But speak to that a little bit more.

[Vance Roush]

Yeah, yeah. So we make it really easy. Right. If we're going to call ourselves a frictionless generosity platform, it shouldn't be hard to sign up for it and to implement it.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

Right.

[Vance Roush]

And so it's just a couple lines of code. It's a URL based solution. You can add on the URL as a button onto your website. Any person that's managing a website, they would know how to do it in few minutes, right? Literally minutes. You can get up and running with overflow. Like Pastor Chris said, we would love to be your system of generosity and totality, but you can get started with any product line that we have. You get started with tap, stock, crypto, all the above, and you can simply just add it onto your current system so that you can get additive benefit from it. What we do too is we are all about partnership and so a lot of people use CRM solutions and we will never probably be a CRM. I've seen technology companies want to be all things to the church, but then they become master at none. We want to be laser focused on anything that is related to finances, but we integrate with the pcos of the world, we integrate with rock, we integrate with all these different systems so that wherever you want to see your consolidated information, if there's some information in overflow, you can get it in the system of choice.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

So you are brilliant with technology. Close the podcast today. What is your advice for a pastor that's listening going, man, this is kind of overwhelms me a little bit. And what would you say to them?

[Vance Roush]

Well, I think it's been in plain sight, this whole podcast. I want to pull on the thread. And the spirit of, of what you've introduced here is you hire the right people around you, right? And this is my analogy for where tech is going in the past couple decades with incredible churches that have had global renown, they've introduced us to the worship experience that most of us adopt today with high production, high sound quality, right. Lights that are intentional and things of that nature. And a couple of decades ago, you guys know this better than me, but I would assume that a sound engineer, a lighting engineer, a production coordinator, those staff roles probably weren't as common a couple days decades ago. But when we had a vision as a church to want to see this effectuated in our services, we had to staff for it. And so a lot of times our intimidation around something like overflow stocks, crypto, our intimidation around, let's talk AI, is really unfounded if we're willing to staff it. I mean, if you think about it, how many churches have a cto? How many churches are hiring for data scientists in the same way we hired for production coordinators and sound engineers in the past decade is the same way we should in the next decade. And if we do that as a local church, we're going to be able to use technology. Technology is just a tool to build the kingdom.

[Pastor Chris Hodges]

One of the, One of the tracks. One of the degree majors here at Hounds College is in technical arts and so beautiful. Yeah, thank you so much. What a blessing is to have you here today. I appreciate our partnership with you.

[Matt]

We appreciate everything Overflow does. Love that they want to be frictionless. We want to do that as well. And so if you're looking for all of the Overflow things, we're going to put that on the website for you. So so growleader.com podcast we'll put all of Overflow's information in the show notes. Vance, we appreciate appreciate you so much and we'll see everybody next time on the Grow Leader Podcast. Hey everybody, thank you so much for listening to this episode. And we also want to say a big thank you to all of our partners that help make the Grow Leader podcast happen. Each and every month for over 80 years, the Western Investment foundation has helped churches with their borrowing and their investing needs. Whether you're dreaming of a new opportunity or seeking wise counsel about resource management, WIF can assist you. You can learn more about [e-mail] GROWLEADER Next is our newest partner, Studio C. Studio C can help you know your people and grow your church. They combine strategy, technology and communications to maximize church member engagement. You can bridge the engagement gap and transform your church's impact with Studio C. Learn more about them at their website site. It's thestudioc.org growleader.