GTM Live Episode Summary: "Designing GTM Like a System with Dave Boyce of Winning by Design"
Release Date: July 7, 2025
Introduction
In this episode of GTM Live, host Carolyn Dilks welcomes Dave Boyce, Executive Chair and EVP of Product at Winning by Design. The discussion centers around Go To Market (GTM) systems design, emphasizing the importance of systems thinking in optimizing GTM strategies for high-performing B2B SaaS companies.
Guest Background
Dave Boyce shares his extensive experience in building and selling five SaaS companies since 1999, including exits to giants like Oracle and Amazon. Currently, at Winning by Design, he collaborates with innovative B2B firms to redefine growth strategies, particularly focusing on product-led growth (PLG). Dave also mentions his upcoming book, "Freemium," set to release in August 2025.
"Growth needs to be architected and systematic." [02:46]
Systems Thinking in Go To Market
Carolyn and Dave delve into systems thinking within the GTM framework. They discuss how changes in one area of GTM inevitably impact others, highlighting the interconnectedness of marketing, sales, and customer success.
"Growth for a recurring revenue business...it's a whole system." [03:14]
Challenges of Siloed Execution
A significant portion of the conversation addresses the pitfalls of siloed GTM operations. Dave illustrates how isolated departments with individual metrics can hinder overall company growth and lead to inefficient practices.
"We're either winning or we're not winning. We're playing as a team." [05:01]
Rethinking Compensation Structures
The duo explores how traditional commission-based compensation can create conflicts and undermine collaborative efforts. Dave argues for OTE-centric (On-Target Earnings) models that align individual incentives with company-wide goals, fostering a more unified approach to revenue generation.
"Eliminate commission to remove self-interest from the equation." [10:24]
Case Studies: Atlassian and Canva
Dave highlights Atlassian and Canva as exemplary companies that have successfully implemented customer-centric GTM systems. Atlassian's Customer Advocates receive high base salaries with minimal commissions, ensuring their focus remains on customer success rather than individual sales targets. Similarly, Canva offers flexible support options, allowing customers to choose between human assistance and AI-driven help, enhancing overall customer experience.
"They have customer-centric objectives programmed right into the machine." [31:02]
Importance of Measurement and Data Architecture
A critical theme is the need for robust data architecture to enable effective measurement across the entire customer journey. Dave introduces the Bowtie Model, which encompasses both the acquisition funnel and post-sale activities like onboarding, renewal, and expansion. He emphasizes the importance of cohort analysis to identify and address specific leakage points within the GTM system.
"Measure cohorts to see where improvements make an impact." [34:18]
Role of Leadership in Implementing Systems
Carolyn and Dave discuss the pivotal role of CEOs and FP&A leaders in driving the adoption of system-wide GTM strategies. They argue that top-level commitment is essential for breaking down silos and fostering cross-functional alignment, ensuring that GTM efforts are cohesive and effectively measured.
"The CEO has to be committed and work shoulder to shoulder as an architect." [43:32]
Conclusion and Resources
The episode wraps up with reflections on the discussed strategies and a nod to Dave's upcoming book, "Freemium," which delves deeper into product-led growth and its role in modern GTM systems. Carolyn encourages listeners to implement these insights to enhance their own GTM frameworks.
"Freemium is available for pre-order now." [47:00]
For more information, listeners are directed to Dave's Substack at productledgtm.com, where they can find links to purchase his book and access additional resources.
Key Takeaways:
- Systems Thinking: Viewing GTM as an interconnected system rather than isolated departments enhances overall performance.
- Compensation Alignment: Moving away from commission-based structures to OTE-centric models fosters collaboration and aligns individual goals with company growth.
- Customer-Centric Models: Companies like Atlassian and Canva demonstrate the effectiveness of prioritizing customer success over individual sales targets.
- Robust Measurement: Implementing comprehensive data architectures and cohort analyses is crucial for identifying and addressing inefficiencies in the GTM process.
- Leadership Commitment: Strong involvement from CEOs and financial leaders is essential to drive systemic changes and ensure cross-functional alignment.
This episode offers valuable insights for CEOs, CFOs, and Revenue Leaders aiming to transform their GTM strategies through systems thinking, robust measurement, and customer-centric models. By adopting these approaches, companies can achieve more efficient growth, improved unit economics, and sustained long-term success.