Does going through a rough time make you untrusting of fleeting joyful moments, or make you lean into them harder? For Dannii Minogue it’s the latter.

In this chat with Fearne, Dannii explains why getting divorced and having to borrow money from family, coping with sister Kylie’s cancer, and having her body critiqued by the press have taught her to appreciate happiness when it comes.

Fearne and Dannii worked together on The X Factor for a bit, and they both discuss what it was like to work on such a juggernaut programme, and chat about how to understand what boundaries you might need to set in your career. They also talk about why Dannii’s so passionate about wrapping queer and non-conforming people in so much love and joyful celebration.

Plus, a little PSA from Dannii: try not to get bitten by a poisonous spider, it won’t end well...!

Dannii’s back as the host of I Kissed A Boy on BBC Three in May.

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