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Medieval relic hunters: the quest for Notre-Dame's crown of thorns
00:39:55
From intrepid friars to glorious processions, Emily Guerry explores the story of how the crown of thorns ended up in Notre Dame in the Middle Ages
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- [00:01]
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Emily Gerry
Welcome to the History Extra Podcast. Fascinating historical conversations from the makers of BBC History magazine. Five years ago in April 2019, the Holy Crown of Thorns was heroically saved from destruction in the Notre Dame fire in Paris following the cathedral's recent reopening. The religious relic is set to return there in a special ceremony today. So for this episode, Emily Gerry tells David Musgrove the remarkable story of how the Crown of Thorns was brought to Paris in the first place in the 13th century by King Louis IX. Its arrival was accompanied by a fabulous procession in probably the greatest unboxing episode that history has ever seen.
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David Musgrove
Can you kick us off by just telling us a little bit about the Crown of Thorns in the biblical story. What's the backstory here?
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Shopify Representative
Yes, well, the crown of thorns might be familiar to anyone who looks at pictures of Christ and knows his passion. And out of the four gospels, three of the authors talk about how Christ was mocked as part of that passion. His mockery occurred before he's crucified. And in the Gospel of John, it's a sort of longer narrative. So we're told in Matthew, Mark and John that some Roman soldiers were sort of making fun of Christ and they twisted a band of thorns together and pressed that into his head to make fun of him. And they said, oh, look, all hail the King of the Jews. And in the Gospel of John, that sort of humiliation is extended. And he's then wrapped in a sort of imperial looking robe and presented before people as this sort of sad king. Christ looks really, really awful. It looks like he has been defeated. And this is part of our understanding of the sacrifice he's about to undertake. But that's where the crown of thorns features in the Bible in three gospels as part of the mockery. It's not actually really a part of the crucifixion, but we can talk more about that later.
- [04:03]
David Musgrove
And what then is the sort of the material story of this artifact after the time of Jesus?
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Shopify Representative
You might assume that the crown of thorns would be a really desirable relic for early Christians, but in fact, you might be surprised to know it was not around the time St. Helena, who's the mother of Emperor Constantine, around the time she supposedly finds the relic of the true cross in Jerusalem, which is meant to have been located at Golgotha, where Christ was crucified. This probably took place in the 330s, 340s. She then is the patron of the construction with her son of the Holy Sepulcher as that beautiful gigantic basilica is taking form. At the heart of its devotional strategy is the tomb in which Christ's resurrection occurred and the holy tokens of Christ's chief sacrifice, namely objects related to his crucifixion. So that might include, for example, some of the holy nails. And the true cross was the real sort of feature. Aside from the tomb, there is not a single reference to a crown of thorns for decades thereafter, even when there are streams of hundreds of pilgrims traveling thousands of miles to come to venerate the site where Christ died. We have an account, for example, by a woman called Egeria or etheria in the 4th century, who describes her thirst and excitement to venerate the relics of Christ's Passion at the Holy Sepulchre. No mention of the crown. Our first reference to any sort of relic of the crown of Thorns is not until about the year 409, 410, when we have an epistle by someone called St. Paulinus of Nola, and he refers to people venerating the crown of thorns in Jerusalem. But it's nowhere near the Holy Sepulchre. It's on a very different place. It's in the Church of Mount Zion. So its beginning is a bit shadowy and a bit later than one might expect.
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David Musgrove
And quite often with relics like this, there tends to be more than one. People are so keen to get one that they sort of multiply a bit. Were there more than one relics of the crown of Thorns at any one point?
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Shopify Representative
Yes. I mean, the crown of thorns, it can replicate, it can duplicate, it can triplicate, and it is not the sort of corporeal relic where you have a multitude of problems with it. So John Calvin would refer to the fact that John the Baptist had so many heads. In contemporary historiography, we talk about, was John the Baptist a hydra then? There are so many splinters of the true cross. Maybe you could make a boat, says John Calvin. The crown of Thorns has a slightly different set of opportunities because of its form. Since it is comprised of many thorns, There are many, many, many fragments of the band itself, including the one now in Paris. But there are countless more relics of holy thorns, and that's where the possibilities are really numerous and innumerable. In fact, there was actually a study by a French antiquarian in the 19th century called Charles Fleury, in which he tried to count all of the holy thorns and all of the fragments of Christ's crown. And he gets into the hundreds and hundreds and says there were probably many more. Still, one of the most special things about this relic is later on in history, when King Louis IX acquired it, he actually probably touched thorns to the crown of thorns. That then made them sort of secondary contact relics and disseminated those to sort of diplomats and allies.
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David Musgrove
Let's take the story up to the time of Louis then. So that's in the 13th century. Where is the crown of fauns, the one that we're talking about, before it comes to Paris? Who owns it and what's its situation?
- [07:44]
Shopify Representative
It was in Jerusalem from about the 5th century. It somehow gets to Constantinople. There is no clear reference as to when that occurred. That probably occurred in the 10th century, because a fragment of the crown of thorns appears in a really beautiful reliquary with lots of other bits of fragments of relics from what's called the Pharaoh's Chapel in Constantinople, the Imperial collection of relics. And so that sort of suggests that its provenance was there. When it's in Constantinople, it's part of the emperor's special treasury. And that gives it a lot of power and authority. And we learn around the year 1200 that that chapel was known in Constantinople, the Pharaoh's Chapel, as the Holy Chapel, the Sachapelle, which is very interesting when you think of the name Louis chooses for his chapel in Paris. By the time of the 1230s, you have Latin emperors in Constantinople. Those Latin emperors are running out of money. The co emperor at the time is a man called Baldwin ii. He is so broke that he goes to Europe on a fundraising mission. And while he's away, he leaves a sort of collection of barons to work as rulers of Constantinople advisors. And they go so broke that they end up pawning off treasures in the Imperial collection to ensure they have enough money to keep the city safe. One of those items they pawn is the Crown of Thorns, and they pawn it to a Cistercian abbess, who's a very wealthy woman. Baldwin gets word of this around the year 1237 when he's in France and he mentions to Louis IX, oh, you won't believe what's happened. We've had to pawn the Crown of Thorns. Louis is obviously invested. He's a very sort of pious king, and he also sees an opportunity when it's presented to him and he agrees to therefore undertake the mortgage for the Crown of Thorns. Thus begins the story of the next episode in the relic's history, its long and arduous journey from Constantinople to Paris.
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David Musgrove
Before we dip into that, do we know how much it cost to pawn it and to mortgage this important relic?
- [09:54]
Shopify Representative
Yes. So the thing to say simply is it was an exorbitant sum in terms of what the Cistercian abbess paid. That loan was aggregated with other loans, and the technical amount was something. Something like 13,000 hyperpiria, which is a very sort of pure gold kind of currency. An attempt was made to equate that to sort of money today. But I think the safest thing to say is basically half his annual income is one of the wealthiest rulers in Christendom. This was an exorbitant mortgage. It was attached to the crown as collateral, but it also accompanied some castles in Flanders. There was a huge amount of money here. But the thing I must clarify, not just for our sakes, but for Louis sake, is, let's be clear, this was Not a sale. Since the Fourth Lateran Council in 1215, when Pope Innocent III presided over a series of rules that were made that prelates around Christendom agreed to. Canon 62, Chapter 62, says explicitly, you cannot sell relics, nor can you exhibit them outside of their reliquaries. So we have to understand that the documentary sources surrounding how Louis gets the crown are very gentle and cautious in their language. And today, again, we use the term mortgage. The crown had been used to seal these agreements. It's not like he bought the relic for a lot of cash. That would not be okay, especially for the most Christian king.
- [11:22]
David Musgrove
So Louis there sat in France chatting to Baldwin, hears that the Crown of Fauns is in a sort of a parlous, precarious situation, and decides to do something about it. Can you sort of briefly summarize how he manages to get this important, difficult item, this wildly expensive item, transported across Europe over to Paris?
- [11:45]
Shopify Representative
Yes. Well, he has to act fast because people are closing in on attacking Constantinople. So in autumn of 1238, he receives a letter from those barons saying, we're expecting you. Come now. So he dispatches two Dominican friars. We know their names. They're called Jacques and Andre. Now, Dominican friars at the time would have been probably really talented diplomats, linguists. We're told that Jacques had lived in Constantinople, so he would have known the lay of the land. And Andre, this guy, Andre de Longjamot, was one of the most fascinating people in the 13th century. When he starts this mission at just the beginning of his career, he spends the rest of his life going to places like Karakorum, Tunisia, to Mongolia and back. He's an amazing diplomat, so this is his first big gig. So they set off in that autumn. They go down to the south of France, they depart, they sail across the Mediterranean and they land in Constantinople. But they are greeted with very disappointing news because a certain payment deadline had passed. That Cistercian abbess I mentioned, her name's Marie, she had agreed to another loan from a very wealthy Venetian merchant called Niccolo Corino. So Corino, in taking this loan, said that if he doesn't get his cash for the mortgage by a certain date, he's going to move the Crown of Thorns back to Venice. That date had passed. So despite the friars going as quickly as they could through the winter to Constantinople, they'd missed the payment deadline. There was still time if they hustled then to Venice. So taking all of that gold with them, which is a really risky business, they then sailed back across the Mediterranean and were told in One of these extraordinary accounts that they avoided attacks from pirates, who really would have benefited from that ship. When they get to Venice, they're excited, but they're greeted with even more bad news. The Doge and his kind of comrades say, yeah, because you've missed the deadline, you now owe us more. So Jacques then goes back up to France to get more money, leaving Andre to guard the relic. And during this period in spring of 1239, the crown of Thorns was kept in Venice, in San Marco. Jacques comes back with more cash and then they're able to secure the relic. And then they sort of leave Venice together, march over the Alps, go through into France, and eventually arrange to meet up with Louis. And it could have been one of the happiest days of his life.
- [14:27]
David Musgrove
So I love these guys, Jacques and Andre, these relic chasers, the Indiana Jones type characters in my imagination. But I suppose they wouldn't have had the hats and the bullwhips.
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Shopify Representative
No, no hats, but a toncer, a tonsure.
- [14:40]
David Musgrove
Of course, they're trekking around what's quite a dangerous place with lots of conflict going on across the place. And pirates, as you said, carrying bags of cash.
- [14:50]
Shopify Representative
Yes, bags of cash and patent letters. So they could make these arrangements possible. They even had one from sort of the Holy Roman Emperor on them just in case they needed some help.
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David Musgrove
Wow. And presumably they must have had like a bunch of burly men as well.
- [15:05]
Shopify Representative
Yes. No, you're right. We know the name of one of those knights, Nicholas Cerello, a kind of really reliable knight. So, yes, they had some security, but I think they even had patent letters with them that said, you know, if one or both of us should die, this is what should happen next.
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Archbishop Cornu
So I think they were fully prepared for danger.
- [15:24]
David Musgrove
Do we know much about them? You've sort of studied their lives a bit. Do we know much about their backstories and what happened to them afterwards?
- [15:30]
Shopify Representative
Yes. So it's the last time we hear from Jacques, who would have been the sort of the older brother figure in the duo. Presumably he had already had a long and distinguished career. It's possible that he might have been one of the first priors of the kind of Dominican convent in Constantinople called St. Paul. But Andre's life is only just starting. He's so exceptional. And here's where sort of French historians have dedicated a lot of their focus because of his extraordinary travels. He becomes a sort of right hand man, diplomat to King Louis IX of France, but also various popes. He goes to Cyprus, he does deals with people in Jordan he carries relics to the emperor in Caracarum. He's trying to set up Christianity in the East. It's possible, too, that he was one of the most sort of beloved people to Louis IX himself. Late in Louis's life, when he's launched his second crusade, he's sort of dying in Tunis, Carthage. And when he's dying, some of his last words, were told by his hagiographers, are about the future of bringing the Christian mission to this part of North Africa. And we're told that on his deathbed he named someone, a certain reliable figure, a certain Dominican, a certain Jacobin who could do the job. And it's assumed that that was Andre. So on Louis sort of dying day, he's saying, maybe Andre could help me with this mission. So what a career. I mean, the mileage of Andre, the longjameau and the toolkit of skills, engaging in all those languages and brokering all these deals and not getting killed. He must have been very persuasive and also quite patient.
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- [18:52]
David Musgrove
There's probably some of our listeners who are wondering what a Dominican friar is and how that differs from a monk.
- [18:58]
Shopify Representative
For instance, yeah, it's a really important question. And the distinction is important to the story of the Crown of Thorns. So in the start of the 13th century, one thing that happens then is the so called rise of the mendicant orders. These are men and women who follow some of the ideas set up by people like St Francis of Assisi and St Dominic, who are really kind of passionate preachers. These are people who live in the world and who share their thoughts in the sort of vernacular. They're not just reading Latin and chanting in their monasteries, they're out in the world sharing their sort of vision. They're distinctive in terms of their dress. Often the Franciscans appear in sort of gray robes for that reason, in English we sometimes see terms like the Grey Friars church, whereas the Dominicans wore mainly black. So that's why we say things like the Blackfriars Church. And in terms of understanding why two Dominicans might have been helping Louis, again, because their mission is to preach, they have lots of experience sort of pressing on the frontiers of Christendom. This is also around the time that in Paris we have kind of a university that's taking form. And most of those lecturers in the 1220s, 30s, 40s tend to be mendicants, Franciscans or Dominicans. They're teachers, they're theologians, they're good at oratory, they're good at persuasion. So all of these skills are the kind of things you would want for a diplomat.
- [20:28]
David Musgrove
So let's take the story back. So Louis ix, he's now got the Crown of Thorns. The friars have got it to him. Tell us a little bit about Louis. We haven't heard much about him. What sort of guy is he? Obviously he's very holy.
- [20:41]
Shopify Representative
I would be delighted to tell you a bit about Louis and what happened on that joyous day when he first held the Crown of Thorns in his hand. And all of the information I'll share with you now comes from one extraordinary text that we call the History of the Reception of the Crown of Thorns. And this text is attributed to a very interesting and powerful man called Archbishop Cornu. And Archbishop Cornu was the most powerful prelate in France at the time. So the Archbishop of Sens at the time tells us what happens when Louis first touches the relic. Our friars, Jacques and Andre, have come all the way up by foot to Troyes, and they then send a letter to Paris to say to Louis, we're nearly there. Louis is delighted. And we're told in Cornu's text that he grabs everyone he could to dash a Little bit south, to meet the friars. They meet at a place called Villeneuve la Chevec, where they stage not a sort of kind of opening ceremony, but an inspection ceremony, because authenticating the relic is very important to its sort of origins in France.
- [21:53]
David Musgrove
Is this like an unboxing?
- [21:55]
Shopify Representative
It's like an unboxing, but it's a sort of Russian doll unboxing, where you're digging deeper into its own layered history. So they meet the friars, they get the object, which is in a giant wooden box. They open the giant wooden box, and then there's a beautiful silver box. They then open the beautiful silver box, and inside is that inestimable pearl, this golden reliquary. Maybe it was even in the shape of a circlet, like a crown. That's highly probable. In fact, they then open the golden circlet, and inside we're told that they see the first thing is a seal from the Doge of Venice, and they break that seal to open the next level, which is kind of again, like Christmas morning. There's another seal, presumably from the barons in Constantinople, and they keep on breaking these seals to open to get at the relic itself. And then there's the crescendo. We're told by Cornu that when they first lay eyes on the crown of thorns relic, they burst into tears, tears of joy. And then something extraordinary happens. He says that everyone there imagines seeing Christ crowned in those very thorns. So there was a kind of collective witnessing moment, a collective authenticating moment when they're opening up the reliquaries and laying eyes on the crown. And it was so inspiring, we're told, that it almost generated a miraculous vision, a sort of devotional image at the very least. So what a moment. What a present to open up.
- [23:34]
David Musgrove
This is very dramatic. It's like Christmas Day magnified a hundred times, isn't it? It sounds amazing. So what does Louis do then, when he's clamped eyes on this glorious item? There's been this quasi miraculous event going on. What does he do then?
- [23:48]
Shopify Representative
Well, I would say that the party's not even started yet. It's about to begin, and we're now in August of 1239. And if you're looking at a map of this part of France, were a little bit sort of south of Paris, but there's this beautiful network of tributaries of the River Seine. So what happens next is lots of big, beautiful royal ships going up the tributaries of the River Seine and pausing along the way to give alms to celebrate and commemorate this joyous occasion. For all of France, for the kingdom. So they pause, for example, on the feast day of the Assumption of the Virgin Mary, which is the 15th of August, and give loads of money to local lepers and give loads of money to the local church. They're making their way up to the royal palace of Vincennes, but the first big stop along the way is the seat of power for Cornu himself, that is Sens. Now, at Sens, we have a preview party for the big party that is to come in Paris. The whole cortege gets on land and marches in procession from this really, really important ancient church of St. Pierre to the city center, to the Cathedral of St. Etienne of Sens. And it's very interesting that while this royal parade is happening, even though there's all this splendid, generous largess in donation, we're told by Cornu that Louis removes his own crown, takes off all of his royal robes, and wears just a humble tunic, notably, like King David himself, when he brought the ark to the Holy Sepulcher. And he marches barefoot through the streets of Sens, carrying the relic in a double beer on his shoulders, with his second brother, Robert of Artois, carrying the other end. Thus they process through the street chanting hymns, and the people are astonished to see their king in such an austere, solemn manner. When they enter the church, or rather the cathedral of Saint Etienne, Cornu presides over the ceremony, and we're told that owing to such joyfulness, he opens up the relic. What we assume that to be is not sort of taking it out of its reliquary, but rather perhaps shows them the beautiful sort of golden container. And this was such a special occasion, but we still have to get to Paris. And what then happens next would have been perhaps the most spectacular procession anyone had ever seen in France.
- [26:24]
David Musgrove
So tell us about this big event. And what Louis does is in many respects sort of the antithesis of what we kind of expect a medieval king to do. They're not generally seen to be sort of unassuming sorts who are willing to subjugate themselves. They tend to be people who want to project a lot of military power. He's projecting a different sort of power, I guess. So what happens? What's he trying to do?
- [26:45]
Shopify Representative
Yes, I think you're completely right about that. And so the main event takes place in Paris on 19 August, in 1239. And at dawn at the royal palace of Vincennes, which is in the sort of to the west of the city, Louis stages the beginning of this amazing parade and he's greeted by the monks from St. Denis, who've walked all the way down to join this gigantic long tail that's going to snake all the way to the Ile de la Cite.
- [27:16]
Archbishop Cornu
Louis removes his own royal crown as he carries Christ's crown. And once again, he's walking barefoot. This is multiple miles. Now, wearing just a tunic, you're seeing your most sort of powerful ruler look completely humiliated, but doing so for Christ, in honor of Christ, because he is unworthy, as it were, to bear the burden of carrying his crown. So this procession essentially moves from west to east. Louis has no shoes on, and he actually asks his soldiers to march with him with no shoes on. But there are also countless prelates, clerics, monks, normal people in the procession, all types of men, women, and children without regard to their rank. And there, this kind of united community singing hymns together reaches a place called the Specula, which is a big open field. Today, it's sort of where Bastille is. And in that big open field, they do this really amazing thing. They've organized a sort of festival. So the parade reaches the field, and there, waiting for them, near the Cistercian abbey of San Antoine, is this makeshift tower. And this makeshift tower is sort of the place where the next big event's gonna happen. We're told in Cornu's text that the tower's covered in gold and images of the saints. Louis and his family ascend the tower with Archbishop Cornu and the relic. And looking down on a crowd of thousands of people, a sermon is then delivered to ensure that people understand the significance of this event. And this is corroborated in a number of sources. There was this amazing sermon, and again, owing to such joyfulness, he reveals the golden reliquary inside. And people throw their hands up and cry and say, oh, it's the crown of Christ. So this must have been a spectacular occasion that really united people behind the king, and it sort of must have made them feel like Louis was bringing them into this devotional experience. There's one other very interesting detail about this celebration in the Specula outside of Paris, which is we learn that Louis had compelled every church in Paris to carry out the relics of their saints to effectively greet Christ in his crown relic. So not only do we have this, like, united congregation of everyone in Paris welcoming Christ's crown, it's as if the saints of Paris were also welcoming Christ to their city. So it's operating on all these different levels of symbolism. And perhaps one of the most important elements of that symbolism is after the specula, they enter the city gates. Thus Paris becomes a new Jerusalem, and the crown is like the new Ark of the Covenant. Which means that Louis is again like a new King David. So that's the real sort of crescendo of the parade. And there's still more to come thereafter.
- [30:36]
David Musgrove
So what does Louis do next? He has to find somewhere to put this relic, doesn't?
- [30:40]
Archbishop Cornu
Yes. The terminus of the parade is going to be the royal palace. We've just had thousands of people screaming praise of Louis and his crown of thorns. All of the city's holy saints are present in their reliquaries, which are joining the parade now entering the city gates. We're actually told in Cornu's text that they chant something very interesting. Blessed is he who comes in honor of the Lord. Which is again, very similar to the psalm that they would have chanted when Christ entered Jerusalem on Palm Sunday on a donkey. So they knew what they were doing. The choreography is very meaningful. The procession then continues eastward towards the Ile de la Cite, the island in the center of Paris. And there they stage another extraordinary, jubilant ceremony inside the Cathedral of Notre Dame, the city's cathedral, the kind of beating heart of Paris. And again, here we are in the year 1239. Notre Dame is where polyphony had just been invented a couple decades before. You can't imagine how beautiful this music could have been. We've got sort of composers like Leonine pertain, the chant, the harmonies. This would have been extraordinary and very moving. After that very special kind of celebration inside the cathedral, the final phase of the parade is before them, and it's a much more private occasion. They enter the Palatine walls of the palace on the Illa la Cite, which and then celebrate one big service inside of the chapel of San Nicola. Now, this was a quite old chapel at the time, probably 11th century, in its fabric. And they blessed the Crown of Thorns and they welcomed the Crown of Thorns.
- [32:30]
Shopify Representative
To the royal palace.
- [32:31]
Archbishop Cornu
And we have some sources that imply that at the very end of this amazing day, Louis takes the crown and effectively with his coterie, they bless a foundation stone that will become the first step in the construction of the Sainte Chapelle of Paris, the Holy Chapel, designed.
- [32:52]
Shopify Representative
To enshrine the Crown of Thorns for.
- [32:54]
Archbishop Cornu
The Kingdom of France, which was one of the fastest building projects at the time. It only takes about nine years to build it from that very moment afterwards. And probably one of the most expensive.
- [33:04]
Shopify Representative
Buildings in French history.
- [33:06]
Archbishop Cornu
So what a way to end the parade with another project.
- [33:09]
David Musgrove
Okay, so this sounds like an absolutely amazing event, and one which would have been, you know, remarkable to be at, and the sounds and the scenes would have been phenomenal. Now, look, we're kind of running out of time, so we need to take the story up to recent history and the terrible events of the fire in Notre Dame a few years ago, which we talked to you about on the podcast, I think, and you've certainly written for us on that topic. So the relic was at that point in Notre Dame, am I right?
- [33:35]
Archbishop Cornu
Well, yes. So, I mean, the Sainte Chapelle held the relic for centuries. It was the sort of the supreme item in the collection of the kings of France. One way in which my research is especially sort of invested in the power of the crown of Thorns is kind of thinking through how it changes iconography. So in the Sainte Chapelle, there was a gigantic wall painting in the east end of Christ's crucifixion. And it's probably the first time in the history of art that we see Christ crucified still wearing the crown of thorns. And of course, today that iconography is ubiquitous, but the chapel doesn't hold it forever. Fast forward to, of course, the French Revolution, when the Anciem regime represents all that is wrong. And places like the Sainte Chapelle are systematically targeted by revolutionaries because of what it symbolizes about royal power and authority. We're told that they broke every image of a crown they could find. And in the sort of 1790s, the Sainte Chapelle was closed, and what was left of its relics were taken to St. Denis, the Abbey, for safekeeping. By about 1803, they were reunited with the Ile de la Cite, but they were brought into the Cathedral of Notre Dame, which had, for a brief period, been a temple to reason. But they're brought back around the time of Napoleon's coronation, which is very interesting again, to see the relics important place in the symbolism of French kingship and French power. So when they entered the sort of treasury of Notre Dame, they're no longer really the private object of a king. They become an object for the entire community of Paris. And so there the Crown of Thorns was kept alongside other special relics that Louis had acquired, including a fragment of the Holy Lance that Longinus had used to pierce Christ's side on the cross, and, of course, a little bit of a holy nail, too. So you have these three extraordinary passion relics that go to Notre Dame at the start of the 19th century, and they were there until April 15, 2019, when that horrible fire started to spread across the Charpent or the roof of Notre Dame Cathedral.
- [35:50]
David Musgrove
And was it touch and go as to whether the relics would survive?
- [35:54]
Archbishop Cornu
Oh, gosh, it was very, very scary. So, first of all, what an extraordinary achievement by the Pompiers. The firefighters on the Cite, they're absolute heroes. They saved so much. It could have been so much worse. The crossing collapsed. Violet Leduc's 19th century spire effectively melted into the top of the cathedral. I mean, such destruction, such horror. Seeing pictures of it still brings tears to my eyes. But I think when it comes to the relics, something very strange happened, because once people knew that everyone was safe and all the priests and members of the public were certainly evacuated from the site, there was a sort of a mission to save the relics and precious works of art in the cathedral, too. And the chaplain of the Pompiers sort of helped set this up, and he's a real hero for doing this. As they are evacuating relics, there's a moment when they can't find the Crown of Thorns, and that's because it was so carefully hidden inside one of the chapels. So the firefighters actually go in and come out and go in and come out about three times and attempt to save the relic of the Crown of Thorns. They eventually get the right key, they get the right coordinates, and they unlock it from its safekeeping place. And it was safe. It has been kept in a few places in the past couple of years at the Hotel de Ville and most recently at the Musee du Louvre, where it's been safe. But it's about to go back to its home.
- [37:22]
Emily Gerry
That was Emily Gerry, tutor in Medieval History at the University of Oxford and an expert on relics and holy images in medieval Europe. Thanks for listening. This podcast was produced by Jack Bateman.