History Extra Podcast Summary: "Princes in the Tower: Could This New Discovery Solve the Mystery?"

Release Date: December 3, 2024
Host: Ellie Cawthorn
Guests: Professor Tim Thornton, Dr. Tracy Borman
Produced by: Immediate Media

Introduction to the Princes in the Tower Mystery

The episode delves into one of British history's most enduring enigmas: the disappearance of the young princes, Edward V and his brother Richard, from the Tower of London in 1483. Host Ellie Cawthorn introduces the topic by highlighting its persistent intrigue and the mystery surrounding the fate of the princes, setting the stage for a groundbreaking discussion with experts Professor Tim Thornton and Dr. Tracy Borman.

Historical Context and Background

Dr. Tracy Borman provides a comprehensive overview of the events leading up to the princes' disappearance:

"[...] the Princes were the young sons of King Edward IV who died in April 1483. The elder, Edward, was 12, and his younger brother, Richard, was 9. Their uncle, Richard of Gloucester, was appointed Lord Protector until Edward was old enough to rule. They were placed in the Tower of London, initially seen as guests, but later moved to more secure inner chambers before vanishing by the end of the summer of 1483."
[02:28]

Historical accounts suggest that their uncle, Richard III, may have orchestrated their murder after declaring them illegitimate, paving his way to the throne. However, definitive evidence has long been elusive, maintaining the mystery for centuries.

Professor Tim Thornton's Groundbreaking Discovery

Professor Tim Thornton introduces his recent research that challenges longstanding skepticism about the princes' fate:

"I've discovered a record of the survival of something very personal and highly valued that belonged to King Edward V, the elder of the two princes, his chain."
[13:31]

Thornton's discovery centers on a gold chain mentioned in the 1516 will of Margaret Lady Capel, sister-in-law to Sir James Tyrrell—the man Thomas More identified as responsible for the princes' murders. This chain is believed to have originally belonged to Edward V, making it a significant physical artifact linked directly to the princes.

Connecting Historical Figures Through the Chain

The conversation deepens as Thornton explains the implications of the chain's provenance:

"The chain is described in a will [...] Margaret Capel, the sister-in-law of Sir James Tyrrell [...] This adds to the suspicions around what had happened to the boys before the chain changed hands."
[14:56]

He further reveals a fascinating connection:

"When Thomas More was writing his history of Richard III, the man carrying messages between his embassy in Bruges and the English court was Miles Forrest Jr., the son of Miles Forrest, one of the murderers identified by More."
[08:17]

This linkage suggests that the chain's presence in the Capel family could indicate a direct connection to Tyrrell and, by extension, to Richard III himself.

Dr. Tracy Borman's Insights and Reactions

Dr. Tracy Borman, chief curator at Historic Royal Palaces, expresses her excitement and the significance of the discovery:

"This is the most exciting, I think, the most important discovery in this whole controversy to be made. [...] It adds credibility to an account that for 500 years has been dismissed as Tudor propaganda."
[20:57]

Borman underscores the rarity of such personal artifacts surviving for royal figures from that era, which amplifies the discovery's importance.

Implications for Historical Debate

The new evidence shifts the balance in the longstanding debate over the princes' fate. Thornton argues that the likelihood of the chain ending up with Margaret Capel through neutral means is slim, thereby strengthening the case against Richard III:

"The chances that the Prince's possessions were dispersed in a more neutral way are entirely credible. But it's the possession by a connection of James Tyrrell which to me adds to the suspicions around what had happened to the boys before the chain changed hands."
[18:29]

However, the discovery also opens avenues for alternative interpretations, prompting historians to reconsider established narratives.

Challenges in Historical Proof

Thornton addresses the challenges historians face in establishing definitive proofs for events like the princes' disappearance:

"When you're working on a topic like this, it's almost impossible to achieve levels of proof beyond reasonable doubt. [...] We have to work with the limited body of evidence that remains."
[22:54]

He emphasizes the necessity of working on a balance of probabilities rather than seeking absolute certainty, given the constraints of historical research.

Future Research and Ongoing Investigations

The episode concludes with a look ahead:

"This is ongoing research. It's a live story, so we'd love to hear from listeners about what they think happened because there'll be lots of people with lots of opinions on this, I'm sure."
[27:23]

Both Thornton and Borman highlight the importance of continued exploration and open-mindedness in uncovering more about the princes' fate. Thornton mentions the imminent publication of his findings in an academic journal, inviting the public to engage with and reflect on the evolving narrative.

Conclusion

This episode of the History Extra Podcast presents a compelling examination of a pivotal historical mystery, enriched by Professor Tim Thornton's recent discovery of Edward V's chain. The discussion not only sheds new light on the possible circumstances surrounding the princes' disappearance but also invigorates the academic debate, inviting listeners to reconsider long-held beliefs about Richard III and the tumultuous period of British history in which these events transpired.

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. Tracy Borman on the significance of the discovery:
  "This is the most exciting, I think, the most important discovery in this whole controversy to be made."
  [20:57]

• Professor Tim Thornton on historical proof:
  "We have to work with the limited body of evidence that remains, and we have to do so in the context of often ferociously contested arguments."
  [22:54]

• Dr. Tracy Borman on Thomas More's account:
  "We need to take Thomas More's account of the princes in the Tower very seriously."
  [25:38]

For a deeper dive into Professor Tim Thornton's research, listeners are encouraged to watch the documentary "Princes in the Tower: A Damning Discovery" airing on Channel 5 or access the full academic overview available on HistoryExtra.com.