The Business of Watches [024] Oris CEO Rolf Studer

Summary

---

HODINKEE Podcasts — The Business of Watches [024]: Oris CEO Rolf Studer

Release Date: May 6, 2026
Host: Andy (HODINKEE)
Guests: Tan Tan Wang (HODINKEE Editor), Rolf Studer (Oris CEO)

Episode Overview

In this episode, the HODINKEE podcast explores the enduring role and philosophy of Oris, the independent Swiss watchmaker. Host Andy converses with Oris CEO Rolf Studer at the company's Holstein headquarters, delving into Oris's unique challenger position within the Swiss watch industry, its historical and modern fight for independence, the realities of producing approachable Swiss watches in a landscape dominated by luxury conglomerates, and the importance of value, community, and environmental responsibility. The episode also recaps key trends from Watches and Wonders 2026, especially as they relate to Oris and the shifting currents of the wider industry.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Watches & Wonders 2026 Recap (00:54–14:58)

• Year of Commercial Iteration:
  Tan Tan Wang describes this year's fair as notably commercial with many brands focusing on classic, successful designs rather than ambitious complications or innovations seen the previous year.
  • “It kind of felt like many of the hits were iterations of classic ideas… it was literally a best of compilation of years past.” ([01:19], Tan Tan Wang)
• Examples of Iteration and Refinement:
  • Cartier’s Prive collection: best-of compilation approach.
  • Vacheron Constantin Overseas Dual Time (titanium) and Chopard L.U.C. 1860 (blue dial): Iterative color and material changes rather than new designs.
• Exception – Parmigiani Fleurier:
  Noted Parmigiani Fleurier PF Tonde Chronograph Mysterieux as a standout for delivering fresh functional innovation within established design codes.
  • “A steel watch that costs about 44,000 bucks, which sounds really expensive, but at the same time, I think, you know, it was innovative and new…” ([03:57], Andy)
• Focus on Customer Listening:
  Brands are increasingly attentive to collector desires and sensitive to pricing concerns—e.g., Cartier's revival of the Roadster driven by popular demand.
• Oris’s Distinct Presence:
  Acknowledgement of Oris as a brand that embraces its individuality, independence, and value proposition, especially evident in its two 2026 launches:
  • The Star Edition (vintage reissue)
  • The redesigned Artelier Complication

2. Oris 2026 New Releases (06:57–13:54)

Oris Star Edition

• Perfected Vintage Reissue:
  A faithful 35mm reissue of a 1966 model. Noted for its authentic vintage feel, including acrylic crystal and detailed case shape.
  • “They somehow got this sort of charm in that watch that I haven’t seen in a lot of brands that have tried to do something like this.” ([08:05], Tan Tan Wang)
• Historic Significance:
  Released to mark the anniversary of Oris’s fight for the right to produce Swiss lever escapements.
  • “This watch is meant to celebrate… Oris being able to make Swiss lever escapements for their watches, you know, before they were really held back in that regard due to some really interesting laws and lobbying.” ([09:07], Tan Tan Wang)

Oris Artelier Complication

• Modern Youthful Revitalization:
  A new contemporary take on a classic Oris dress line, designed by 24-year-old Lena Huwweiler, with a moonphase and second time zone, minimalistic dial, and upgraded typography.
  • “…a really fresh revival of this line… I think the revamped typefaces for the Artelier actually go a long, long way.” ([11:31], Tan Tan Wang)
• Targeting New Audiences:
  Priced at $3,150, aimed at younger, urban consumers desiring understated complications.

---

3. Interview: Oris CEO Rolf Studer (15:00–58:39)

Oris’s Historic Home & Brand Identity (16:13–19:26)

• Holstein Roots & Peach Rose Identity:
  Oris has been rooted in Holstein since 1904. The signature peach rose color of HQ now extends to Oris’s retail and event spaces, reflecting its distinct, non-conformist philosophy.

Oris’s Place in Swiss Watchmaking History (19:26–24:36)

• Government Roots & Industrial Upheaval:
  Oris’s establishment was government-facilitated in response to local economic change as Switzerland shifted away from other trades.
• Fight Against the Watch Cartel:
  Oris played a pivotal role in dismantling the restrictive Swiss "Watch Statutes."
  • Hired Dr. Portman to lobby for the right to use Swiss lever escapements. The law was weakened after 10 years, allowing Oris to debut its first Swiss lever escapement movement in 1966.
  • “This historical moment really shows who we are and shows our spirit. Right. Independence is core to who we are and trying to strive for the next level…” ([23:42], Rolf Studer)

Independence & Philosophy (25:35–30:36)

• Changing Meaning of Independence:
  Once perceived as a weakness, Oris’s independence is now seen as a strength worldwide for its ability to chart its own course.
  • “If you have a role within a group… this is the limits of what you can do. It is such a different situation to who we are. Independently owned, free to develop whatever we want…” ([26:25], Rolf Studer)

Oris’s Place in the Market & Price Philosophy (30:36–35:59)

• Resisting Premiumization:
  Oris intentionally remains at a reasonable price point despite industry pressure toward luxury pricing.
  • “We have always been the citoyen in this feudalist world. The citizen, the enlightened person. And we've always also made watches for these people. People who work hard for their money…” ([30:36], Rolf Studer)
• Industry Relevance for the Masses:
  Oris’s mission is to offer high mechanical value watches that are attainable and spiritually for everyone, not just collectors or the ultra-rich.
  • “If we become an industry for just a very happy few…we will lose the importance and relevance within the world.” ([34:18], Rolf Studer)

Navigating Economic & Industry Headwinds (35:59–41:49)

• Impact of Strong Swiss Franc & Global Market Pressures:
  Strong currency, rising production costs, and tariffs make maintaining approachable pricing challenging.
  • “When you have currencies in Asia that lost half of their value...that means that the very same product…would be double the price.” ([38:01], Rolf Studer)
• Swiss Watchmaking as Cultural Export & Lifestyle:
  Mechanical watches are likened to fine wine—a luxury, not a necessity, but deeply meaningful as cultural objects meant to last.

Oris’s Management Buyout & Mechanical Focus (41:50–45:31)

• Management Re-Acquisition and Quartz Crisis Response:
  After being briefly owned by what became the Swatch Group, Oris’s management boldly repurchased the company in 1982, recommitting to mechanical watchmaking when quartz was in ascendancy.
  • “In a time when people still saw the future of the watch in quartz movements...this company decided, no, we are going to make only mechanical watches.” ([44:05], Rolf Studer)

Planning Amid Global Uncertainty (46:10–49:39)

• Coping Strategies During Volatility:
  Strategic planning is challenged by shifting tariffs, war, and economic uncertainty. Focus remains on storytelling, product integrity, and customer resonance.
  • “All we can do is make the best product, we can tell the most interesting story...and just make beautiful watches that people want.” ([47:07], Rolf Studer)

The Role of Community, Design, and Market Trends (49:39–53:18)

• Product Response in Uncertain Times:
  Oris continues leveraging its own history and signature details, like the Bullseye’s point-to-date complication, to create relevant, approachable models.
• Industry Competition & Consolidation:
  Unlike many, Studer rejects the idea that there are “too many brands”: he celebrates the diversity and creativity of microbrands and newcomers.
  • “With all these micro brands…everyone of them has their own vision…this really makes me happy. And I don't think this is a competition at all…” ([51:56], Rolf Studer)

Growth Outlook & Environmental Commitment (53:41–58:33)

• Pragmatic Optimism:
  Oris aims for growth in 2026 despite geopolitical and economic risks, focusing on customer happiness and adaptability.
  • “We will do the best we can to make as many people smile as we can with our products…” ([53:41], Rolf Studer)
• Sustained Ecological Values:
  Oris remains steady in its commitment to environmental causes and sustainability, regardless of shifting trends or declining public focus.
  • “We don't want to teach [our customers], we want to inspire them…we will continue to support good causes...and continued to do the right thing.” ([55:36], Rolf Studer)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Brand Identity & Industry Context:
  “At Oris, you don’t have to [subordinate], because we are on an eye to eye level with our customers. And I believe this is what you feel when you come to our booth at Watches and Wonders.”
  — Rolf Studer ([17:29])
• On Value & Community:
  “We’ve been a brand for people who get into the passion of collecting or owning watches. And we owe these people a lot. We want to stay true to them...”
  — Rolf Studer ([32:47])
• On Why to Wear Oris:
  “Because you show that you know about watches. You show that you are independent and you show that you care.”
  — Rolf Studer ([33:43])
• On Enduring Ecological Responsibility:
  “Why should we shy away from our values just because the topics of discussion have changed? We will continue to support good causes...and continued to do the right thing.”
  — Rolf Studer ([55:36])
• On Industry Competition:
  “I don’t think this is a competition at all...it's a mutual pushing things to the next level, creating interest for what we do...”
  — Rolf Studer ([51:56])
• On Product Philosophy:
  “Just because times are difficult now, we will not change who we are.”
  — Rolf Studer ([50:14])

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

| Time | Segment / Topic | |-----------|-------------------------------------------------------------| | 00:54 | Watches & Wonders 2026 Recap | | 06:57 | Review of Oris’s Star Edition & Its Historical Ties | | 11:31 | Oris Artelier Complication Re-Design | | 15:00 | Interview Begins with Rolf Studer (Oris CEO) | | 19:26 | Oris’s Historic Location and Government Roots | | 21:49 | The Fight Against the Swiss Watch Cartel | | 25:35 | The Value and Role of Independence | | 30:36 | Brand Philosophy: Resisting Premiumization | | 35:59 | Coping with Swiss Franc Strength and Global Economics | | 41:50 | The 1982 Management Buy-Out & Mechanical Focus | | 46:10 | Planning for an Uncertain Future | | 49:39 | Product Design in Challenging Times | | 51:56 | Discussion: Industry Competition/Microbrands | | 53:41 | 2026 Growth Outlook | | 55:36 | Sustained Ecological & Environmental Commitments |

---

Conclusion

This episode offers a nuanced, candid look behind the curtain at Oris’s approach to maintaining independence, offering value, and staying true to its community and environmental values, even as it navigates industry-wide headwinds and rapid global change. Rolf Studer’s perspective reveals not just Oris’s business strategy, but also its philosophical underpinnings and cultural mission—making mechanical watchmaking relevant, accessible, and meaningful for a future generation of enthusiasts.

---

Transcript

[A]

Welcome to the business of Watches, the Hodinkee podcast, where horology meets high finance. And we go behind the scenes to talk to the executives at the heart of the watch industry. This week, we're in Hurstein, Switzerland at the headquarters of Aorus for a chat with Rolf Studer, the brand's chief executive officer. We talk about Oris history and its perennial challenger role as a brand that promises to deliver the best value possible with its distinctive designs and unique positioning that offers customers the chance to be part of something different. But first, I'm joined by my most excellent colleague, Hodinkee editor Tan Tan Wang, who's just back from Geneva and Watches and Wonders. Tan Tan, welcome. Thank you for joining me.

[B]

Thank you, Andy. It's always good to be here.

[A]

Excellent. So I just saw you very recently at Watches and Wonders. You were a total renaissance man for Hodinkee this year, writing great pieces, taking photos, charming all the Bren representatives that you met. Eddie, you know, at this point, I guess we're over a week out from that. Any big takeaways or standouts that you're still thinking about from watches and wonders 2026?

[B]

Yeah, that's a great question. It's funny because I think this still feels too soon to have properly digest everything, you know, Watches and Wonders is such an overwhelming experience in the quantity of both people and watches you get to see in a very short time. You know, to us, I think working during Watches and Wonders, a week kind of feels like an eternity. But, you know, it's not all that much when it comes to how many watches you're seeing. So, you know, so I've still been thinking about that, obviously partially for selfish reasons to think about, you know, what watches I might dream about one day. But overall, people have, I think, said this, but I think it's a very true point. This year felt like a very commercial year. I think, you know, some can read between the lines that there didn't feel like a wave of maximalist watchmaking like we maybe saw last year. You know, last year was a lot of, you know, a lot of records were broken, a lot of new complications, all that kind of stuff. But this year, it kind of felt like many of the hits were iterations of classic ideas. You know, like I'll give you an example, you know, Cartier's Prive showing this year, you know, while all, I would say, mostly at least great watches, it was literally a best of compilation of years past. Right? So this year was 10 years of prive in sort of the new modern version. And in past years, everything would focus on sort of a revival of a new model, if you will. But this year was sort of, hey, you know, let's just celebrate, I guess, by bringing all it back. And, you know, I think that was an interesting pivot for the brand.

[A]

Bring out the hits.

[B]

Yeah, bring up. Bring out the hits. Which, you know, again, I've always been of this opinion. Right. But I think sometimes we do have to remind ourselves that as, you know, more than anyone else, brands are here to sell watches. Right. And so, you know, obviously there's a lot of meaning towards collectors, but, you know, the people that buy watches are far more than us talking and chatting on the show, you know, so I think they always have to keep that in mind. So I don't blame them for this kind of stuff. And certainly my two favorite releases of the show are extremely not groundbreaking, you know, by any stretch of the imagination. If you gave me a blank check today, the two watches I'd probably buy from the show are the Vacheron overseas dual time Cardinal points, you know, the new titanium overseas and the Chopard, the Luc 1860 with the new blue dial. Right. So these are very much not new watches. These are mixes of different metals and colors. But, you know, maybe the alternative interpretation here is that this is the year of refinement, you know.

[A]

Absolutely. Yeah. No, I think that's right. I mean, I think, you know, we heard from everyone from executives on down that, you know, the brands wanted to be demonstrating to customers that they were listening, listening, that they were trying to show value in what they were doing. And they were well aware that due to various factors that pricing and positioning for a lot of brands has moved to a place that has made some folks on the consumer side uncomfortable. And so indeed, we heard from. You mentioned Cartier, and we heard from some Cartier executives telling us that they're listening very closely to their clients and customers and trying to connect with them and give them what they want. And that was one of the reasons they said they brought back the Roadster, is that that is what some clients were asking for. And for me, I think one watch, though, that maybe stood out as sort of separate from that trend was the Parmigiano Fleurier PF Tende Chronograph Mysterieux. Ah, yes. Which was, you know, in some ways an iteration on a sort of design language and a, you know, technology that we first saw with the GMT Rattropont, then we saw with the minute retropon. But it was still surprising and Sort of revelatory to see that done with a chronograph with five hands on, on, on a single axis there, and yet continuing to have that sort of elegant, refined, quiet luxury design language that the brand has, you know, made its own over the past little while. So I think, you know, and so there's a steel watch that costs about 44,000 bucks, which sounds really expensive, but at the same time, I think, you know, it was innovative and new and yet, you know, still working within that scope that the brand has sort of established for itself. So, so, yeah, I mean, I think, I agree it was very much a client focused, customer focused, commercial driven sort of batch of new watches. But the level of enthusiasm and openness was surprising to me considering sort of where we are in the world right now with geopolitics and uncertainty and so forth. So we're going to be talking to Ralph Shuter from Oris and you talk about value and sort of, you know, iterating on, on what works for the brand. You know, they had, they, they brought some, some interesting, just a couple of pieces to the show this year. I know you're a big fan of oris. Yeah. What, what did you make of, of what we saw from them?

[B]

Yeah, you know, as, as, you know, I very much have a soft spot for Oris. You know, they're a brand, I think, that sticks to their own lane, if you will not. And that kind of sounds a little harsh. No, I just mean like, you know, they have their own SO and philosophy and design language and they just kind of stick to it. And as a result, I think they've sort of carved themselves a niche where, you know, sometimes it's easy to forget that they're an independent brand that kind of caters to a very unique price point for an independent brand. And I think that's really, really special. And so I think this year, I would say the two highlights for me were two watches that kind of stick at completely opposite ends of the spectrum. And I think that's kind of cool for a launch strategy in the year. So, you know, I think the first one is the Oris Star Edition, which is, you know, a vintage reissue of a 35 millimeter watch from 1966. And when we saw it in person, you know, I remember remarking, like, I was like, wow, like this really feels like a vintage watch from 1966.

[A]

Right.

[B]

They, I think they really got, you know, I think it's easy to just get the technical specs correct on trying to do a reissue, but they somehow Got this sort of charm in that watch that I haven't seen in a lot of brands that have tried to do something like this. So I think that was really great to see. And you know, I think most importantly, the Star Edition brings forward a story that's so important to Oris, you know, and I believe you will be talking about this a little bit later in the show, so I won't kind of spoil it. But long story short, I mean, this watch is meant to celebrate, you know, an anniversary of Oris being able to make Swiss lever escapements for their watches, you know, before they were really held back in that regard due to some really interesting laws and lobbying. So again, I won't spoil anything. But long story short, the Star Edition is here to celebrate that anniversary and to celebrate a man called Dr. Rolf Portman, who was initially hired on as a lawyer to fight this, eventually, you know, came to acquire Oris and is now, I believe, the brand's honorary chairman.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So, you know, here to celebrate this really important part of Oris heritage that I think is really, really cool. But, you know, you have a 35 millimeter case which you don't really see that often anymore. You even have an acrylic crystal, which, you know, I'm personally of the broad, you know, broad opinion that modern reissues should still be using sapphire. But I 100%, you know, I 100% understand the decision here. But again, it just feels like a new, old stock, vintage watch, which I think is great. And usually we see these reissues come in a bit larger than the original. So I'm really glad they kind just stuck to the classic. It's not identical. I believe the dial, you know, some typefaces are different. You have some, you know, I believe you have the more sort of traditional, you know, dial text of like automatic and stuff like that, where the original had something a bit more stylized. But I would assume, you know, that's maybe down to, you know, typeface licensing and whatnot, but it's a decent price point, you know, $2,300 with a Solita based movement inside. Sure, you're not beating, you know, micro brands, but Micro brands don't have the exact heritage, you know, that they're wearing. So I think it's nice that it's not a limited edition. So I think it'll sit well as a, you know, kind of a unique option within the Aorus catalog. Right. When you go to a, go to an Aorus display, seeing that little guy kind of amongst everything else, it's A nice bit of refreshing, you know, horology there.

[A]

Absolutely. Yeah. No, it does certainly give that nice, you know, different case shape and size option in the permanent catalog. And yeah, I mean it reminds us of Oris important historical position in the Swiss industry. And its long term position is sort of, you know, a bit of an outsider, an independent that had to fight for everything that it's received and continues to do so today. And so I think, you know, you'll hear more of that from our conversation with Rolf Studer. So yeah, the Star wasn't the only new release we saw from Oris this year at Watches and Wonders. We also got a sort of redesign design of the atelier, which is another sort of, you know, dressier watch that's long been in the catalog. And yeah, we saw it in quite a different form and factor from Oris this year. What did you make of that one?

[B]

Yeah, I think, you know, as I mentioned before, the Artelier and specifically I think I want to focus on the new atelier complication, you know, so they, I believe they came out with a few sort of time only versions. They brought back, you know, the business calendar in some larger ateliers. But the Atelier complications is the other launch that I mentioned that sits on the other end of the spectrum, opposite of the Aorus Star Edition. You know, whereas the Star Edition Oris kind of pays tribute to an iconic figure in the brand's history, they're really championing a new young designer for this artelier, which I think is really, really interesting and it shows in the designs. You know, the new watches, they're credited to a 24 year old product designer at Oris and I apologize if I mispronounce his name, but it's goes to a young woman called Lena Huwweiler and you get a very modern dial design with a moon phase at 12, a second time zone sub dial at 6. It's very much cleaned up from a lot of the ateliers which you've seen in the past, which I would argue honestly felt a little dated at this point. So I think this is a really fresh revival of this line. And for me, something that's really important to me in in watch design is typography. It's something that I think most brands don't get right or at least don't get 90% right. And I think the sort of new revamped typefaces for the atelier actually go a long, long way. And you know, at $3,150 on bracelet, you know, there are Some compromises for the watch to kind of hit that price point for Oris. You know, I think one thing to point out is you don't really have quick adjust for the moon phase, which we kind of saw when handling the watch. But as you know, I think the watch is a unique option for a moonphase and gmt, you know, combined at this price point. And I think it'll do really well to attract a newer and younger audience to Oris. I think that's what the brand certainly needs. Right. When we think about Oris as sort of collectors, we think about things like, you know, diver 65 or, you know, we think about the Big Crown pro pilots atelier. I think we don't really give a ton of love to, but I think Oris has an opportunity now to take this line and kind of point it in a different direction. And I think this will get people that might not really know too much about watches really interested in something that's a little more complicated than they might be used to.

[A]

Yeah, no, exactly. And I think what we heard from the designer herself was that indeed she was attempting to make a watch. I think she's 24, so she's quite young and she's certainly in that age bracket of the target group that they're looking to attract with this, which is an urban sort of young audience. And yeah, very minimalist, quite understated and yet offering a bit of value in terms of the complications and a moon phase used in a way that I think we don't necessarily think of as being front and center as a complication there. So, yeah, it's quite a unique and interesting take on the atelier complication for sure. So Tintin, thank you very much. That was always a pleasure to chat with you and get your take on things and I hope it won't be long until I see you again soon.

[B]

I'll see you on the next one. Thanks, Andy.

[A]

And now as we throw to our conversation with Rolf Stutter, please note that this episode was recorded just before Watches and Wonders and before Rolf became the sole CEO of Aorus as his co CEO Claudine Goetheiser moved up to the position of Deputy Chair while continuing her role on the financial ledger as Chief Financial officer. So with all that said, here's our conversation with Aura CEO Rolf Steuter. Good morning. We are in Hulstad at the headquarters of Oris and I am with Rolf Stutter, the co chief executive Officer of Oris. Rolf, thank you for joining us on the business of watches.

[C]

Hi Andy. Good to have you?

[A]

Thank you so much for welcoming me. This is my first time visiting your manufacturer and your headquarters here. And it is as envisioned. I mean, let's just talk about the color of the building here and the history of the building here. What should people know about Oris home here?

[C]

Well, we have been here in Holstein since 1904. This was always our home since the beginning. This is where everything Oris starts. The color you're talking about is the color of the building, which is Peach Rose, which is also our corporate color. It hasn't always been peach rose, but for a number of decades. And our chairman Ulrich at some point decided that he didn't want to have a boring gray building anymore, but that it's. That he wanted it to stand out a little bit more. That's why it's Peach rose now.

[A]

Indeed. And we see that I got to visit your new retail store in Zurich last year. And indeed we see that colorway, that theme continue there. And when we see you at Watches and Wonders, at least in the past, which is coming up just in a couple of weeks now, you carry on that colorway and talk about what you do with your booth and theme at Watches and Wonders. I mean, we were just chatting off mic here and it's a different experience and feel that you're going for as compared to maybe some of the other brands.

[C]

Yes, Here we are near Basel. So for decades we used to go to Baselworld, which was kind of our home. Right. With Watches and Wonders coming up. It was quite a thing for us, honestly, to go to Geneva, to go there where watchmaking comes from, where the big old brands come from. We here from the Waldenburg Valley now go to Geneva. Honestly, I had a lot of respect doing that. But we decided to stay true to ourselves and go there with the values that we have, that we stand for. And in this show where you have the palazzos of all brands, the big houses, we decided to have not a castle, but a piazza. This piazza layout stands for a place of interaction, of exchange, of diversity, a place where people meet and feel comfortable. When you are in a hall, often it's. Yeah, you feel that there is a master. Right. You subordinate to something. At Oris, you don't have to because we are on an eye to eye level with our customers. And I believe this is what you feel when you come to our booth at Watches and Wonders.

[A]

Yeah. And for those who don't know, I mean, Oris obviously is a historic brand here in a part of Switzerland which, you know, not the western part, of Switzerland. Not the part of Switzerland that we think of as the sort of center of watchmaking. You know, you're an approachably priced brand, you're independent. You know, talk about this location and why we are here in this part of Switzerland and what the sort of industrial history is here and how it ended up with a watch brand like Oris.

[C]

The Waldenburg Valley used to be on the routes from Bern to Basel. Used to be that old transport way over the Hauenstein to the Waldenburg Valley. And at the beginning of the 20th century, they built a railroad from Bern to Basel. So that whole business that people had here with looking after travelers vanished. At the same time, fashion changed. We also had an industry for colored ribbon bands, silk bands that people made here and they went out of fashion. These colors, by the way, are the base of what today is the Basel pharmaceutical industry.

[A]

Right, the chemical industry, which sort of evolved into the pharmaceutical industry.

[C]

Absolutely. And local governments tried to take care of their people who were unemployed and incentivized entrepreneurs who created work. So they brought here people from the western part of Switzerland to open watchmaking facilities. This is how ORIS was established in 1904. And that's where it all started.

[A]

And you know, now that is certainly a sort of government aided, government facilitated initiative and program that ended up creating certainly this brand that persists today more than a century later. Let's jump to where we are in the current economic reality. Being in Switzerland, you are a Swiss watchmaker. In the Swiss industry, what role does government support and help play in the industry right now on both a local and a federal level? Obviously we hear from every CEO that the strength of the Swiss franc is difficult.

[C]

Yes, it's interesting how government was always involved in this industry. Just talked about the origins of forest and the watch statutes. The watch cartel in Switzerland that was started 1934, then was abandoned under leadership of Horace, actually.

[A]

Indeed. Well, let's talk about this. I mean, this is a sort of key moment in ORIS history and talk about the people that were involved with this and how Oris sort of led a legal fight or a lobbying challenge to really transform the structure of the Swiss industry.

[C]

Yes. Following the economical crisis of the 1920s, in 1934, there was a law imposed that led to the regulation of the watch industry. And in the case of Oris, kept us at making pin lever movements, which were good movements, but not movements of superior quality.

[A]

So you couldn't make movements with Swiss levers.

[C]

Exactly, exactly. And obviously leadership at Auris, Mr. Herzog, who was CEO for many decades, from the 1920s to the 1970s. He wanted to challenge that and fight that. So he hired Dr. Portman in 1956, who was a long lawyer, being the son of the sales director of Horace at the time. And he was tasked with lobbying against a law. Law took him 10 years. And in 1965 the law was weakened to a level that Oris could present. In 1966, the first Swiss labor escapement movement, which was a big victory for Horus indeed.

[A]

And it's interesting you're tying that back to a current offering or a novelty, the Auris Star. I mean, talk about how that new watch sort of calls back and reminds us of that, that critical moment and victory in Oris history.

[C]

I think this historical moment really shows who we are and shows our spirit. Right. Independence is core to who we are and trying to strive for the next level, doing things better. This is what makes us. Even though we had to make, we were forced to make pin level movements, we. We brought them to a level of quality that we got chronometry certificates for them. This is the spirit at Oris. So to be able now to make Swiss leverage escapement watches was really a big moment for us. And this we celebrate this year with an anniversary edition. We celebrate 60 years of the abandonment of the Swiss watch cartel with the Oris Star that we will show and launch at Washington Wonderset coming up very soon indeed.

[A]

And talk about the design of the iWatch. We were just taking a look at it and to me it looks very classic. It's got sort of not a traditional round case, but it certainly makes me think back to that era, the 60s and 70s. Very cool design, but quite minimalist too. But as you were saying, I mean at the time it was kind of, you were pushing things forward in terms of pretty.

[C]

Yeah. Now you look at this watch and it looks like a vintage piece. Right. But at the time it was very modern, very contemporary. Classic watches at the time were rounds and golden. And this watch is of steel and in a cushion shape. So very much forward driven, as we always were, showing that we always want to reach for the next level. And yeah, this spirit is with Oris to this indeed.

[A]

And let's talk about, you know, being an independent brand because I think that that position and that image of independent brands has certainly come into focus a lot more in the pandemic and post pandemic era with, you know, consumers being better informed about the brands and who's making their watches and where they come from. So talk about you know, it's actually quite unusual for a watchmaker of your size and with your h history to be independent. What role do you see a sort of volume brand like Oris, an approachably priced brand like Oris having as an independent these days? What does it mean to be independent and a historical Swiss watchmaker?

[C]

It's really interesting how the role of independence has changed over the past few years. I remember, I remember when I went to China 10 or 12 years ago, they didn't really want me to talk about that so much because it was a sign of strength to belong to a group. And only recently that has changed also in China that they want me to talk about that because it's a sign of an individual approach, of. Of hard plots, of passion, of emotion to be independent. And I think this is very much true. If you have a role within a group that's defined and this is the limits of what you can do. It is such a different situation to who we are. Independently owned, free to develop whatever we want, only responsible to the brands and to doing the right thing for. For the next generation. There is so much energy coming from being independent and at Oris it really defines who we are. And also for me, it's very important also as a culture within our organization. I don't want to have people of the same opinion. I want to have a team with the same attitude. And everyone is free to have their opinion. If you have the same attitude, you go, you push into the same direction with what you're good at and not limited to what someone tells you to do. And I think this is really what makes us and makes a big difference to if you're just in a conglomerate of some kind. And to me, it's a very important part of my personal quality of work and also quality of life.

[A]

Indeed. And you know, talk about how many people, how many employees you have here, how many watches that Oris produces a year. I think Morgan Stanley estimates between 30 and 40,000 with revenue of around 50 million Swiss francs. There's been a lot of talk about the Morgan Stanley estimates lately. Talk about the size of your operation and what you think about those published numbers.

[C]

Yes, we are about 90 people here. We are about 200 around the world. We are a very lean organization. We have to be as an independent company. We do everything ourselves, from finance to IT to product development. Thinks that when you are within a group, you have shared services. This is all on our own. When you are truly independent like we are. Yes, the Morgan Stanlow report has been very much a topic of discussion. We don't publish our numbers. So I don't think it's fair to comment on that or to complain about it. Either you publish your numbers, then it's clear, or you let them do their work and their analysis. But to comment on that while not giving details to these figures I don't think is the right thing to do.

[A]

Fair enough. You are a privately held company and have every right to do so. For sure. Being an independent privately held company. It's interesting though. I mean obviously the, the trend or trajectory of the industry over the past decade or so has been lower volume, more price premiumization. Aurus has certainly decided to stick within its price point and at times has moved up a bit. But talk about that decision and why you haven't decided to premiumize like so many others.

[C]

Yes, this really is the foundation of our brand. You know, if you think about this industry, it's one of the few industries that still lives in feudalist times that hasn't seen the age of enlightenment. What do you mean? You go to a court, you drink a glass of champagne, you're happy to bow and you don't realize that you are not free. Grown up people who are very successful in what they do do stand in line to purchase a very expensive timepiece. I really wonder what's going on. Right. I think it's very interesting. And we at oris, being away from the big centers of this industry, we have always been the citoyen in this feudalist world. The citizen, the enlightened person. And we've always also made watches for these people. People who work hard for their money, who are happy to spend their money, but who think before they do. So for these people, we make watches. We always have, we always will. And with that comes an obligation to also remain reasonable with your price point. We've always been a brand for the community. Community. We've been a brand for people who get into the passion of collecting or owning watches. And we owe these people a lot. We want to stay true to them also as they have stayed true to us. And these are the people we make watches for with our own movements, with calibre 400 plus calibre 110. We've also introduced higher price points. Points. But still we offer mechanical watchmaking that really makes sense in itself from a mechanical perspective, also from a pricing perspective. And this is who we are and this will not change. And this is what we do.

[A]

And talk about what role though producers like yourselves play in the industry now, to be Making approachably priced. These are expensive objects. But I mean the industry doesn't seem to be set up and certainly what we see in the statistics from the Swiss watch exports is that these categories are the ones that are most challenged. I mean, why should watch consumers be looking to products like yours, well made, Swiss made, approachably private products, for an object that isn't a necessary tool anymore? Right. I mean it's an affectation. Why do I want to be seen wearing an Oris watch as opposed to something else?

[C]

Yes, because you show that you know about watches. You show that you are independent and you show that you care with all the things that we do for the environment, you show that you're yourself. This is why you wear Norris and this is why you should wear Norris. Because you always challenge for the next step because you're forward driven and you're not just living in a status quo because you're not someone who stands in line just because others stand in line. You go your own way.

[A]

Right.

[C]

This is why to be Oris. Now about the price point. To me the relevance of this industry doesn't come from being able to ask for higher and higher price points. It comes from being able to talk to as many people as possible to have a relevance, to have a cultural relevance that has a certain audience that you talk to about. And I personally think it's dangerous the way the industry has risen also we have risen with the industry. I think we must be very careful to continue to offer products and price points that are within reach for people. If we become an industry for just a very happy few, first of all, we won't be in industry anymore. We will lose the industrial competence here in Switzerland. And second, we really lose the importance and relevance within the world. If you are just talking to a secluded group of people, you are not relevant to the world anymore. And I think we as an industry should avoid that. And also it is my personal belief that we need, need to stay relevant and with people like you and me who work for their money to have a base for Swiss mechanical watchmaking.

[A]

But how do you, as the economics change and the challenges financially become greater, with the strong Swiss franc, with the cost of production, the cost of materials, how does Switzerland making approachably prices priced watches continue? How do you continue to do that? Is it about taking less margin? Is it about. Yeah, how do you continue to do that when there's so much pressure and competition?

[C]

Yeah, it's really interesting and it's tough at the moment. People think our products get more and more Expensive. There are two things behind that. First, we saw especially during the pandemic and after the pandemic that people knew much, much more about mechanical watches. They understood much more what mechanical watches are, what is possible and they were asking for higher level products also. This didn't necessarily lead everyone to make higher level products, but also led to price increases for similar products. Of course, but also, and that is what we saw with the caliber 4, 5 day power reserve, 10 year warranty anti magnetic own movement that we introduced during the pandemic, that people saw what this is about and why they should pay a premium for it. So if it's packed up by technology, people are very much willing to pay for it. But we should not forget people who just end enter that game. Right. And the other thing is the strong Swiss franc which we can't do much about. You mentioned the role of government in Switzerland before. There has been complaints that Swiss government isn't doing enough against the strong Swiss franc.

[A]

I've heard that from lots.

[C]

I believe that's too. And this really makes it different. When you have currencies in Asia that lost half of their value towards the Swiss franc in five or six years, that means that the very same product without us taking more margin would be double the price. The US dollar last year lost 13% plus there were the tariffs. So it's a very challenging situation. You don't want to out price yourself out of the market, but you can't swallow it all yourself. So you also see it with the numbers that the big groups publish these days that their profits really have shrunk compared to previous years. And the Swiss franc has a lot to do with that. So unfortunately our products get more expensive because the Swiss franc is so strong. And I hope that we will find ways to keep it at a level that people still can appreciate or we make.

[A]

I mean in a sentence here, what we're trying to portray here is that the equation for buying a Swiss watch and a Swiss watch that comes from an industry that's been around here for so long and has developed this savoir faire and this skill set and is an industry made up of various disparate parts and suppliers and it literally takes a village and a country to make a watch. I mean, yeah. How and why should the industry here continue to be making that case?

[C]

Because it's a culture. It's a culture that informs people and that I personally think is of great value to the world. You could have the same argument with wine for example. Right. You don't need it, but. But you like to have it. And there is very different wine across all segments. And it would be such a pity and such a loss of joy in life if we wouldn't have wine anymore. And to me, the same is for watches. And we see now how watches also bring people together, right. These communities around the world who spend and time and passion talking about watches, enjoying mechanical watchmaking, talking about that, celebrating that. I think that is of a lot of value. Plus it is also, that's a very important aspect to me of our industry. It's a strong statement against the throwaway culture we live in today. A mechanical watch is made here to stay, like a good tool, like other traditionally made things. And we need more of that back. And my hope is that when people get into appreciating the joyful mechanical watch, that they also appreciate the joy of something being well made, being more expensive, but being here to stay. And if we would have more of that in our daily lives, I think this would make this world a better place.

[A]

So if I'm hearing you right, I mean, you know, we should certainly be thinking of Swiss watches as a cultural export.

[C]

Absolutely.

[A]

Let's go back to the, you know, most sort of significant ownership shift for ORIS in the past few decades. And so that involves, and I only learned about this a little while ago, but that involved sort of management by like, talk about, you know, basically ORIS was part of a group at this time and management was able to do a transaction to acquire the company. And so talk about how that happened and you know, how it sort of set the tone for the company going forward.

[C]

Yes. When Oscar Herzog died in 1971, which was also in a very difficult time for the Swiss watch industry, the company was sold to Azuag, that later became the swatch group. And Dr. Portman, who joined the company in 1956, was still here at the helm of the company. Ulrich Herzog, our now chairman, he joined in 1978. And at that very difficult time in this industry, this is the quartz crisis, was the quartz crisis. Almost every brand was for sale. And in 1982, the then management, led by Dr. Portman and Ulric Herzog, they decided to buy the company together with a small group of people from Azuag, and to be independent again in a very dark hour of this industry, they made this very bold move because although they had this desire to be independent, to be free, and yes, that's what they did in 82, and the rest is history indeed.

[A]

And how did that set the tone, do you think, for both the products and the attitude and philosophy of Aorus going forward? I mean, we were talking, is Aorus a disruptor? Is it an outsider? How has that set the tone and the pathway for the company?

[C]

Well, it certainly brought back this fighter spirit, this independent mind that we have that informs our values. And that led to another bold decision at the time, which today seems very natural. But at the time, it was not at all to only make mechanical watches. In a time when people still saw the future of the watch in quartz movements, including the very big and biggest companies of this industry, this company decided, no, we are going to make only mechanical watches. And it came because Ulrich was traveling the world and in Japan, the country that brought us quartz, he felt a desire with young people for the mechanical watch again. And. And he thought that if Japan wants mechanical watches again, then this will come to other markets within a few years. And so it was. And there we were, one of the few brands at the time, at our price point, to only make mechanical watches, which was really a standalone selling point at the time.

[A]

Definitely a differentiator. And that's the path that you've continued on. So here we are, we're at the end of March in 2026. Last year. I mean, we spoke a number of times last year. So much uncertainty, so many surprises, so many challenges from geopolitics. We still have plenty of those challenges, and it seems like there's new ones every day. How do you make a business plan for the year? How do you budget for the year? I mean, what is your outlook for the industry in. In the short and medium term from a business perspective?

[C]

It's really very difficult to plan these days. You don't know what's happening, what's happening next. All you can do is influencing the things that you can influence and not care about things that are beyond your control. And planning is. Yeah, is difficult to a level that last year when we started a process for the United States with the tariffs in place at 39% on top, it was just not possible to plan for our biggest market to make profitable results. And that is so frustrating. Until it changed and was reversed from 39 to 20 plus now 10 then, plus 15 or 15.

[A]

I think we're at 15 now. I think.

[C]

Yeah, who knows? Exactly, right? And this shows the level of uncertainty we are in. All we can do is make the best product, we can tell the most interesting story, we can advance that cultural thing we do to the next level and just make beautiful watches that People want, want and talk about and everything else is really beyond control at the moment.

[A]

But all that volatility and the surprises and challenges with the U.S. market. And the U.S. is your biggest market, I think, by quite a margin. Does it make you reconsider though, targeting markets and looking for new markets and countries to find customers for your watches

[C]

when you are in Switzerland? Yes, it does, because there are many markets around where you see a fast growth in appreciation of what we do. The industry grows very well. When you're in the U.S. you feel the love for Swiss mechanical watchmaking and there's so much passion there. And this doesn't want you to stop investing there because the community is growing and appreciating what the industry does, what we do. So no, we certainly won't stop pushing in the U.S. but yes, we want to push also in other places where we see that things develop also in a very good way.

[A]

Would it be right to think that consumers for your products in that price point are certainly more susceptible to shifts in consumer confidence and that decision to buy a watch for 2,000 or up to $5,000 francs, I mean, you're more vulnerable at this price point to shifts in consumer confidence? Is that the way you see it?

[C]

Yes, it certainly is the case. Our customer is more affected by rising cost of living, rising cost of energy, uncertainty for the future. Every customer is, but ours may be a little more. But this is just how the world is. No reason to complain about it. Just cope with it and make the best watch as we can.

[A]

And you've done some really some lovely design and novelties lately. We started the year with the Bullseye, which is certainly a design or design cues that you've had in the past. How is these sort of more challenging times, how is it being reflect in the new products that you're doing, if at all, how elastic are you or how much do you respond to shifts or try to anticipate consumer tastes changing?

[C]

Yes, who we are is given. We make mechanical watch since 1904 and there have always been difficult times. This is a cyclical industry and just because times are difficult now, we will not change who we are. Of course. Nevertheless, you try to cope with the times. I think the Bullseye is a good example for that. It is a piece that has its roots in our history. It tells a lot about who we are point to date complication that we made since 1938 that is somewhat our signature complication. A price point. That's right, has sold very well. That's the kind of watch that resonates with our customer in these times, we will not stop pushing with our own movements, and we'll see that also this year. But a watch like the Bullseye certainly is a product that's right for this time.

[A]

Do you think Oris sort of stands out singularly, Certainly has its own legitimacy and history. Do you think, though there are too many watch brands, too many products competing for the same consumer? Obviously we're seeing some of the groups consider or in some cases actually sell brands to other buyers out of the group. Does this industry need more consolidation and what role might Aorus play in that kind of scenario?

[C]

Well, no, I don't think that there are too many brands at the end. That's a decision the market is going to make itself. In our industry, where it's about creativity, where it's about making people smile and making people dream, there are so many different visions of making people do that. And with all these micro brands that you have seen coming the last few years, I really love what they are doing. And everyone of them has their own vision of realizing his or her own dream of making people dream. And when you go at fairs, like to wind up, for example, and in such a small space, you see so many ways of approaching the idea of watchmaking, of mechanical watchmaking. This really makes me happy. And I don't think this is a competition at all. Quite the opposite. I think it's a mutual pushing things to the next level, creating interest for what we do for a product that you want, that you don't need. And if brands vanish, we lose one view of how to approach that, one aspect of creativity.

[A]

Indeed. And you know, last thing, I mean, what is your outlook for the year? Are you looking to increase sales? Do you think the industry can increase sales this year? Or is it. Are we still in a period where people have to be conservative and hope for the best amid all these economic challenges?

[C]

Well, we plan for increase. We started into this year. Well, now we have on top of all these things that happen around the world, we also have the situation in the Middle East. It's really hard to, to predict how the year will end. And also it doesn't matter so much. We will do the best we can to make as many people smile as we can with our products. And there we put all our efforts and all our energy and then a year from now, we can see how 2026 turned out to be.

[A]

Have you seen any indication of shifts in consumer behavior since the start of the conflict in the Middle East? I mean, obviously some Locations have been closed for a bit, but I mean, yeah, I mean, are you seeing the

[C]

effect, of course, in these markets that are directly affected. There you see that. And also it adds another element of uncertainty to this world. And uncertainty is, is always a thing that's not very welcome, especially in our industry. But it's how the world is and it's how things are. And we will do the best to make oris thrive in 2026.

[A]

Obviously, the global political winds have shifted in that perhaps it's not so in fashion or favor to be as concerned about environmental issues in the. In general, but you have long created products and part of the business philosophy is to be ecological and environmentally focused. Is that going to continue?

[C]

Well, you're right, it's not that much in the focus topic than it used to be. But that doesn't make it go away. And I think it's more important than, than ever to be conscious about the world we live in and do the right thing. And we at oris, we believe that our customer who can afford to buy a mechanical watch is the one who can make a difference. And we see our role in inspiring our customers to make a right choice. We don't want to teach them, we want to inspire them. And why should we shy away from our values just because the topics of discussion have changed? We will continue to support good causes. We will continue to try to inspire people to make good choices when it comes to the environment. And times will come back when we will talk about that more again, and then people will know what brands just were opportunistic and gave it up at all, or what brands stood by what they said and by their values and continued to do the right thing. And I don't think that this time will be that far away.

[A]

So indeed you think there's certainly no plans to roll any of that back. And you think that that attitude will. And that commitment will remain for the company? For sure.

[C]

Absolutely. And also, it's really, it's our values. You know, the most ecological thing you can do is to look after your own means and to be careful in how you do things. And as an independent company going through decades of good and bad times, you always had to do that. So it's really in our DNA to behave in that way. And I hope this will come, continue to inspire people. And it's part of who we are.

[A]

Indeed. And it resonates with some consumers. I mean, you recently launched a piece focused on sort of environmental issues in Asia. And indeed there are plenty of consumers that these issues and ideas still resonate with?

[C]

Yes. And I think we shouldn't think about it the way how many people does it still resonate with? It's who we are. It's what we do. And if that is not so much in fashion right now, that is okay, that will change. Again, no reason to be untrue to your values.

[A]

Very good, sir. We will leave it there. Ralph Studer, co CEO of ORIS thank you, thank you.

[C]

Thank you, Andy.

[A]

And that's the business of watches for this episode. We hope you enjoyed. Please head on over to Hodinkee.com where you can join the discussion and leave any comments or questions about this episode or the business of watches in general. Who knows, we might even answer your question on a future episode. Thanks for listening and see you next time.

[B]

It.