The Sports Thing Podcast - Holmberg, Hellestrae And Nash - Episode 7 - 09-18-25

Summary

Holmberg's Morning Sickness: The Sports Thing Podcast

Episode 7 | September 19, 2025

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Episode Overview

This week’s “The Sports Thing” brings hosts John Holmberg, Dale Hellestrae, and Dave Nash together for an unfiltered, comedic, and opinionated dive into everything sports – from the latest NFL drama and rule changes, to controversial social media moments, to the ever-morphing landscape of fan loyalty and athlete accountability. As usual, the trio’s banter blends grumpy wisdom, locker-room storytelling, and a dash of wild-eyed conspiracy.

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Main Discussion Topics & Insights

1. Weddings, NFL Parallels & Social Commentary

• Weddings and Weddings as the ‘Super Bowl’ of Life:
  • Nash just returned from a Michigan wedding, prompting a back-and-forth about the repetitive nature of weddings.
    • Holmberg: “The receptions are good. Weddings are awful. They all look alike. The dress is a little bit meh here and there. The 12 by 12 dance floor is the same. The DJ plays the same music.” [05:23]
  • Comparisons to the NFL and Super Bowl:
    • Nash: "Weddings are like the super bowl of regular life... If the Steelers are in the super bowl, you're watching that one and it's special. It’s different, but that's what it is." [05:53]

2. NFL Quick Hits – Injuries, Sacks, and Brady as Double Agent

• Key Current Issues:
  • NFL dealing with injuries, a sack problem, and a “field goal issue.”
  • Holmberg flags his “Tom Brady is rearing his head” theory:
    • Brady’s insider role as 5% Raiders owner and Fox broadcaster keeps him privy to team intel and raises questions of conflict and ethics.
    • Hellestrae: “I think it’s a bad look. I think... perception is worse than the reality..." [10:01]
    • Debate over how much “inside info” truly gives competitive edge. Nash argues: “If you’re looking to get an advantage, you’d be much better off going to someone in NFL Films... The practice is what I’m talking [about].” [12:48]

3. Kyler Murray’s Michael Vick Jersey Post

• Controversy:
  • Murray posted Instagram pics with his pit bull while wearing a Michael Vick jersey, sparking backlash.
  • Hosts debate whether it was ignorance or calculated for attention.
    • Holmberg: "That’s off limits, is it not? The Michael Vick plus your dog... professional photo shoot, Instagram." [14:51]
    • Hellestrae: “It’s a dumb move. I don’t think there’s anything vicious or mean about it.” [15:10]
    • Holmberg: “He’s got Little man syndrome… He’s got no resume that allows you to have this kind of [attitude].” [15:25]

4. Athlete Redemption, Accountability, and ‘Forbidden Jerseys’

• Which ex-star jerseys are ‘off limits’ due to notorious off-field behavior?
  • Discussion of Vick, Aaron Hernandez, O.J. Simpson, Ray Rice, Ray Lewis, and more.
  • Hellestrae: “When you just hear the word ‘domestic abuse’ versus seeing it... video changes everything.” [20:15]
  • Noted Teflon cases: Ray Lewis, Michael Irvin, Ben Roethlisberger.
  • Fan loyalty (‘cheering for laundry’ not morality):
    • Holmberg: “At a certain point, you’re just cheering for the laundry, not the people in it.” [26:02]

5. Fan Loyalty versus Morality: College Scandals

• Ohio State and other schools put under the microscope:
  • Referencing NCAA sexual abuse scandals (Penn State, OSU, MSU), with tales and personal anecdotes revealing the pressures and naiveté of young athletes.
    • Nash: “I had to go do a physical... He was extremely rough.” [29:31]
    • Holmberg: “So I think that's the thing… at the time, you're like, that [must be] normal, right? Am I going to lose my scholarship if I say this guy?” [31:12]
  • Reflection: Fans (and even athletes) can end up protecting ‘colors’ over clear right and wrong.

6. NFL’s ‘Mathematical Eliminations’ & Coaching Hot Seats

• Early-season predictions: Who’s already out?
  • Browns, Saints, Texans, Dolphins, Jets, Giants dissected.
  • Hellestrae: “...You don’t realize when you’re going to fall off the table... It’s not a gradual decline.” [32:44]
  • On Mike McDaniel (Miami): “They're 0 and 2 and they have no life and they're soft and physically..." [34:03]
  • Talk on presence/leadership: “If you’re a coach and you wear capri pants on the sidelines, you should be fired immediately...” - Nash [36:38]

7. Kicking, Rule Changes, and How Analytics Change the Game

• Field Goal Explosion:
  • New ‘kicking ball’ allows for longer field goals. Already 8 field goals of 57+ yards in two weeks vs 8 all last season!
  • Nash: “Now, if you can kick a 60 yard field goal to tie it, the game is never... you’re never out of the game.” [58:13]
  • Holmberg: "Isn't it a disservice to the game?" [58:32]
  • Debate about what’s ‘fair’ and what’s “pussification of America” in baseball and football. [65:01]

8. Backup Quarterback Value & Squad Depth

• On Jets losing Justin Fields, but having veteran Tyrod Taylor: “The importance of an experienced backup is massive.” [54:33]
• Concerns for Bengals surviving without Burrow: “You’ve got a guy who’s got to take you through the rest of the year... It’s going to be tough.” [54:44]

9. Classic Sports Fails and ‘Punchable Faces’

• Memorable mistakes (Leon Lett’s “Thanksgiving snow” play, Steeler rookie kickoff gaffe).
• Grayson Allen, J.J. McCarthy, and “players with punchable faces.” [51:54]

10. Baseball, Analytics, and ‘Pussification’

• Frustration with pitch counts and pulling starters during no-hitters.
  • Nash: "Forget about fans. It's just... pussification of America." [65:01]

11. Lunatic with a Bullhorn: Nash’s Conspiracy Theories

• Nash speculates on the “real” reasons for Charlie Kirk’s death, Israeli border security, JFK et al.
  • “If you think John F. Kennedy was killed by Oswald alone...” [70:57]
• Holmberg objects but defends free speech and hearing out lunatics, “I say you let lunatics like Nash speak...” [71:28]

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Holmberg (on weddings): "You could drop me into a wedding right now and say, are you in the past, the future, the present? I wouldn't know. They all look the same." [05:51]
• Hellestrae (on offensive linemen): “You tell me the next NFL offensive lineman who gets arrested for domestic abuse... they have a protective gene in their body.” [21:42]
• Nash (on Kyler Murray): “He’s a little edgy today... He’s got Little man syndrome.” [15:25]
• Holmberg (on athlete jerseys): “Which former great has a jersey you can't wear anymore because of his off the field nonsense?” [17:49]
• Hellestrae (on Ray Lewis): “He went to jail for obstruction of justice for what, three days? … Only Ray knows.” [19:11]
• Holmberg (on cheering for laundry): “[Chael Sonnen told me] at a certain point, you're just cheering for the laundry, not the people in it.” [26:02]
• Nash (on coach style): "If you're a coach and you wear capri pants on the sidelines, you should be fired immediately..." [36:38]
• Holmberg (on football changes): “I love that the NFL changes, but sometimes they change... is this one of those changes?” [59:19]
• Nash (on baseball analytics): "If we as a society and fans say this is nonsense.... Why are we watching non-men play a sport that should be played by Men?" [66:29]

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Key Timestamps

• Weddings & NFL Parallels: 03:00–07:00
• Brady’s Broadcast Ethics: 08:13–13:45
• Kyler Murray & Michael Vick: 14:52–17:28
• Forbidden Jerseys, Ray Lewis, Accountability: 17:49–21:26
• College Scandals, OSU, Athlete Abuse: 26:33–31:36
• NFL Mathematical Eliminations & Coaches: 31:40–38:59
• Rule Changes, Sack Problems, Field Goals: 43:44–47:02, 56:19–63:51
• Analytics & Baseball ‘Pussification’: 64:39–66:43
• Lunatic with a Bullhorn (Conspiracies): 68:37–72:22

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Tone & Style

True to “Holmberg’s Morning Sickness,” the episode features biting humor, sarcasm, and offbeat perspectives, balanced by brief moments of insight and sincerity. The group steers toward brutally honest, sometimes politically incorrect, sports talk, never shying from controversial or awkward territory. The mood shifts rapidly between locker-room nostalgia, sharp current-events analysis, and raucous tangents.

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Conclusion

This episode weaves together rants on weddings, NFL drama on and off the field, controversies in sports marketing and social media, shifting team fan-bases, and the ever-present tension between what fans want and what analytics (and business) dictate. As a bonus, Nash’s “Lunatic with a Bullhorn” segment serves up edgy conspiracy in the purest spirit of the show.

For those who missed the broadcast, this summary gives you the flavor, facts, and the fun—minus the commercials and formalities, and with plenty of the show's irreverence.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

Here we go, everybody. It starts. I don't know which week this is. Six, seven, something like that. But it's still what I was just realizing.

[C]

I. I pushed the mute button to. For the cough button. Yeah, this thing works.

[B]

Well, how do you know?

[D]

You don't have a headphone.

[C]

I'm gonna turn it off right now.

[B]

All right, go.

[E]

No.

[C]

Okay. It works, huh?

[B]

Keep it off. I liked it better. I liked it better the way you do it.

[D]

He's back.

[B]

Look who's back. Everybody. It is time for this sports thing.

[D]

I am the host.

[B]

My name is John Holmberg. And hopefully we can make this as wildly successful as Holmberg's morning sickness. Heard weekday mornings at 98 KUPD. With me, as always is Dale Hellistray, three time world champion with the Dallas Cowboys and the Clinton administration. And of course, local madman, entrepreneur, co.

[D]

Host of the main event with Steve McCollum.

[B]

That's you. I'm talking about him. You're not the madman. That's him. Oh, yeah, you're co host of this. Yeah, throw it in there. Co host of your other show, host.

[D]

Of the main event with Steve McCollum.

[B]

Found on iHeart. Really blue heart. And no, you don't know where it is. Google search the main event and they spell Maine right now.

[D]

M A N A I N. Not.

[B]

M A N. It's not a horse show. Okay, good. And then of course, our local madman and. And he's a little edgy today.

[D]

Very edgy.

[B]

Two weeks gone. Comes back from Michigan a little bit.

[D]

He was a little bit hangry this morning, but then all of a sudden. And he held off on the snacks until about five minutes before we go on the show. And then he just.

[C]

I didn't know. We had a two hour delay.

[B]

He just went nuts. It is literally eight minutes past when I expected to start this show.

[C]

That's all right.

[B]

I know it's all right because it's on time. You're the one who got here at 10.

[C]

I didn't think. I didn't I was trying to get here early for you.

[B]

I appreciate that. Even though I said 11. Do you go to the doctor and say that? I know my appointment's at 11:15, but I showed up at 9 for you.

[C]

No, I didn't show up that early. I'm just thinking. I was thinking, what the hell are you doing after your show all the way to 11? That's about an hour.

[B]

Dale. Or Sorry, Dave. I'm so used to yelling at Dale. Dave, when a show is wildly successful, and I know you've never had a.

[C]

Taste, that's the thing.

[B]

You have so much to do off the air to continue that massive boulder rolling down the hill that you don't even realize it's not just over at 10:15. The fart jokes need to be cultivated for the next day's program.

[E]

Got it.

[C]

Now I know.

[B]

Now we know.

[C]

Now I know.

[B]

Now I got a little extra work to do. Plus, I had a charity event to jump to, and I did that real fast. So we're good here, ready to go for another great week of sports talk and nonsense that goes on here. And we start off with welcome back. First of all, Nash. That's pretty good. What do you mean? No, I say welcome back. Can you shrug your shoulders? What is that? What is.

[D]

Didn't you miss your family? You miss your family? Your kids?

[B]

They came.

[C]

They came. I was going to say most of them came.

[B]

Vacation for two weeks. And you didn't take anybody with?

[C]

We went back for a wedding. Very important wedding. Towards love, the family.

[B]

That doesn't mean you want to be at a wedding.

[C]

It was a huge, big party. It was one of the best, Best times I've had in a while.

[B]

Receptions are good. Weddings are awful.

[C]

No, everyone's. Oh, Dave, this family. Most of these families are much more mouthy and. And. And goofy than I am.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[C]

And so everyone's talking while everything's going on. It's just a. Whatever.

[D]

Hey, I gotta tell you one thing. When you bring up weddings.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

Some reason my daughter Hillary, when she got married, she wanted Nash. There she went. Yeah. She'd met Nash a couple times, liked him, and so invited Nash and his wife.

[B]

Oh, boy.

[D]

Nash could have sat anywhere in the sanctuary.

[B]

Sure.

[D]

Where he sat, he was literally at the back row on the aisle. And he was in damn near every wedding picture. Every picture. Everybody was coming down the aisle. There's Nash with that mean, ugly head.

[B]

Grouchy. I don't want to be here, Fitz.

[D]

I'm like, come on now. We gotta be able to fade him out of here somehow.

[B]

Could you clip him?

[D]

Yeah, I think he got clipped in a couple.

[C]

Yeah, well, you definitely should. But I thought I was doing a favor because any. If I'm in a picture, I'm making everyone else look better.

[B]

Yeah, that's true. Right now. Did you take that seat in the effort to be like, we're first ones out of here when this is over? That's why I back row aisle. Because I'm like, when this is over, we're gone.

[D]

I said, why don't you put your beautiful wife.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

One inside.

[B]

Very pretty wife. That would have been a smarter move. And you should have just waited in the car. Yes, I think more importantly, that would have been. That's attendance still. That counts.

[C]

Listen, I'm gonna blame it on him. He should have told me, stay the hell away from them where the cameras are.

[B]

You need to treat the cameras like Native Americans. It steals your soul. You can't be photographed like you were.

[C]

Doing anything else there.

[B]

Just true.

[C]

Do your job.

[B]

You had one job, basically, which was like, okay. And then you sit down and cry, probably. But I don't understand weddings. I don't get why anybody wants to go to a wedding. The reception.

[E]

Yes.

[B]

The weddings are. And women think weddings are their special day and that it's all for them. And they go through such unique planning and it takes forever. And it's the same exact blueprint as the last 30 weddings I've been to. They all look alike. There's nothing different. The dress is a little bit meh here and there. The 12 by 12 dance floor is the same. The DJ plays the same music. Everybody looks alike. I, I, you couldn't. You could drop me into a wedding right now and say, are you in the past? The future, the present? I wouldn't know. They all look the same.

[C]

Let's make the comparison to football.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

Weddings. Weddings are like the super bowl of regular life. You watch all your games, but if the Steelers are in the super bowl, you're watching that one and it's special. It's different, but that's what it is.

[B]

Super Bowl. That's not a fair comparison.

[D]

Yeah, it's a really good.

[B]

People love Super Bowls. Yeah.

[C]

That's the people of weddings.

[B]

If you got invited to the super bowl, it'd be exciting.

[C]

I was. Any Super Bowl, I was extremely excited to be invited to this wedding.

[B]

Any super bowl, you get invited. Well, any wedding.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

You're going to turn down some tickets.

[C]

I scored the best wedding.

[B]

Okay. You had a good wedding. There did it look just like all the other weddings? So is my argument that they're all the same?

[C]

No, not really.

[B]

What was different?

[C]

People were fun.

[B]

Many, many weddings. There are a lot of unfun people sometimes. Yeah.

[D]

Okay, so I will go along with the argument. The receptions are the.

[B]

That's what I like.

[D]

If you keep the ceremony down about 15, 20 minutes and then get to the reception.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

And then you got idiots like him who think he can dance.

[B]

That is fun.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

The drunk kicks in.

[D]

Yes.

[B]

And then you go, he wasn't even drunk. Well, he doesn't have to be. He's kind of naturally that way. I'm 53 years old. I have no kids. I have already told everyone I know I will not be attending any more weddings in my lifetime. It's funerals from here on out. I've graduated out. I've been to enough weddings. I won't go to somebody's second wedding if I've been to their first. I owe everybody one.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

If I stand and watch you under an altar saying, you make me a better man, you're the one. And I have to watch that twice.

[D]

I'm calling them out on Tell Death Do Us Part. Yeah.

[B]

Except for. Unless you get squirrely on.

[C]

I. You know what? I think that's. I didn't know that. I never heard that before. But I think that's a great rule.

[B]

It's a great rule. One. I got one.

[C]

I think it's a great rule. I will pass on someone's second wedding if I went to the first.

[B]

If you went and get gifts for the first. Oh, yeah. And then Brady, my co host on the show, has a great rule that it's just because he's cheap and he forgot to buy these people a gift. And he waited and waited, and in seven months, their wedding broke up and he's like, well, that's my new rule. Six month rule. They have to stay together for at least six months before I consider getting them again.

[C]

That's a good rule, too.

[B]

Solid rule.

[C]

Very good rule.

[B]

That's a solid rule. But weddings are. Yeah, that's. That's not why we're here.

[D]

No.

[B]

Since you brought it up. Sorry. Yeah, it's all right. You missed a lot of football and a lot of fun here.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

To go dance drunk at someone's wedding. Let's get into it. The NFL is in full swing. We're feeling pretty good after two weeks. They have an injury problem. They have a sack problem in the NFL.

[D]

Field goal problem.

[B]

Field goal issue. We'll get into. I think that issue is definitely going to be a thing. And I'd also like to point out that this very show may be the only one that other than the wildly successful Homework's morning sickness where I said it there too, so it doesn't really count that the Tom Brady thing is rearing its head now. And there are some people complaining that maybe he's not only you're getting a bad deal on his Fox broadcast because he can't do any interviews, but a few people have raised the idea that maybe this is a little bit sideways. Once we saw Tom sitting in the booth and.

[D]

And her coaches booth.

[B]

Coaches booth. And we heard that he is sitting with Chip Kelly two or three times a week on the phone, zoom calls and whatever, consulting the offensive play calling for the Raiders and has access to all the other teams.

[C]

How many points did they score against?

[B]

I know it wasn't good, but I'm just saying, okay, it may not kick in right away, but again, he's perception caught before. You got to keep an eye on him. He's up to something. He learned from the best on how to squirrel around the edges. And there he was just right in front of us going, yeah, I'm up here in that Raiders booth, 5% owner. And he's in the coaches booth.

[C]

All right, let me get a comparison.

[D]

You're.

[C]

You. You basically run this radio station because your. Your show is wildly more popular than everything else combined. Add it all up.

[B]

You can't lie.

[C]

So if someone came in here and they're talking, you're going to be able to get to places others can't.

[E]

Yes.

[C]

Here. Because of your cachet. Okay, that's Tom Brady. Same thing. That's what, like, that's life.

[B]

But what I'm not going to do is wander over to one of the other stations during their promo meetings and their ideas sessions and be allowed in that room.

[D]

No, but they come and tell you they would not.

[B]

After it's done. After it's done. I can't go over there and go, hey, we're planning these. I just bets we're going to do. I'll steal them.

[D]

I think it's a bad look. I think their perception is worse than the reality because like Dave said, it's not like, oh, they scored 52 points because Tom's now advising them.

[B]

But it's also the possibility based on the perception of what could happen when you've got an owner who has access to the other teams. I told you this before. If Jerry Jones wandered onto the Cardinals facility during a practice. Even if they didn't have a game together that year, everything stops.

[D]

Right.

[B]

No more. Jerry's here.

[D]

We're showing you. And I would be looking at. If I'm Fox.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

Saying hold on. Well, you. You're a disadvantage for broadcasting our gains that we're paying you a ton of money.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

If you're not in on those meetings and all that. Or is. Who's the guy who does the games with.

[E]

I just want to.

[B]

Joe Buck.

[D]

Joe Buck. Is Joe Buck recording the meetings and then giving it a guy to do it.

[B]

And the bigger thing to know is if you're on a practice facility and Dale, you know this. The language the quarterback uses. Everybody knows each other's plays. It's the cadence, the. The language, the audible calls, they're all based on something else. What are we going after we say Omaha.

[E]

Right.

[B]

You know, what's that cue. What's that? What's that indicate. And then that's what you're learning. You can give a playbook to another team.

[E]

Right.

[B]

So long as you don't have the language. The language is huge. And I think Tom Brady has kind of got access about the language.

[D]

Is, you know, at playbook, you got 100 plays. Okay. Well, you don't know when they're going to run them, and they can run them out of six different formations and all that. But if you do get the language.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

And you get the shortcut call. Boom. Whatever that is. It's power, right?

[E]

Yep.

[B]

There's a linebacker in that gap.

[E]

Yep.

[B]

And he's waiting on it where he was supposed to be washed out on the initial play fake. But he already knew not to go.

[C]

Yeah, well, like you just said, you can pay someone else to get the information.

[B]

Well, that's my point.

[C]

So. So what Tom Brady, you think is. Is. Is. Is all of a sudden a double agent secret spy because he's got. He doesn't. He's got. So he doesn't have enough time to be a spy.

[B]

He doesn't and he does. He would give any idiot a few thousand dollars to be sitting in those.

[C]

Weekly meetings, as could any owner to give any other idiot from a TV show the same thing.

[B]

You just said it. He's an owner and you're allowing him access. That's the difference. You're not allowing any other owners access. Could he pay someone? Sure. But right now, Tom Brady doesn't have to pay anybody. His Fox broadcast team goes in without him and gets all the information. And Tom could tell a kid on A Tuesday, when you go in there Thursday, pay close attention to how they're running there. What words are they using? Because a guy knows football would know, okay, when they're. When they're calling the audible, if he says, you know, 50 is the mic, is it basically going to break down? Whether that's a block for him or if you're actually calling out the other line, I still think you.

[C]

So if you're. If you're looking to get an advantage that way, you'd be much better off going to someone in NFL Films. They have the audio there, and then you get the audio of all the film.

[B]

Practice. NFL films.

[C]

I'm talking about the game.

[B]

Well, the game doesn't matter. The practice is what I'm talking.

[C]

If they film the game before and the game before and the game before, and they know the audio is coming up, are they.

[B]

Dale.

[C]

Are they changing their audio?

[D]

It's hard to change your vocal command.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

Correct.

[B]

During the game, that's one thing, because you get game tape from the other team. That's supposed to happen.

[D]

But if you got audio with it. I did not know you could get audio.

[B]

You get the all 22, right? You don't. You get the soundless overhead shots.

[C]

I'm just saying you could go to NFL Films. You want. If you want to be the spy and say, listen, give you this amount of money, give me a copy of all the plays for Buffalo.

[B]

If you're playing Buffalo, you're dancing with fire there, and you're. And I'm not saying this is the only way to cheat. I'm just saying it's reared up.

[D]

I brought it up.

[B]

You guys pooh, poohed it. You're still doing it. And yet now other executives are like, well, hold on.

[C]

Hey, again, stupid people listen to stupid people, and then they just get lost in the stupid universe.

[B]

You went to Michigan and you got indoctrinated with anger.

[D]

That's what Ron is gonna say, because he really wasn't fighting you on it. I saw him kind of go down like a little puppy. And that means he went to Michigan, and he probably hung around Dearborn, and he got indoctrinated. And now he goes back to soft shell of a man.

[B]

That's right.

[C]

If you get me in here when? After lunch, and I'm hungry. I'm angry at everything.

[B]

You're already turning red on that. But I know you're normally pretty red. But this is getting out of hand. All right, let's get into this. We've got. And then, of course, Here locally in Phoenix, the Kyler Murray situation happened. We talked about this a little earlier where he posed at his home with his dog, a pit bull, and his Michael Vick jersey and then walked and then had his, you know, a couple extra pictures taken. He put it up on his Instagram without really saying anything. But that's off limits, is it not? The Michael Vick plus your dog, you know, professional photo shoot, Instagram.

[C]

Did anyone ask him? Did he have a thought process? Did anyone.

[B]

That's my point. Did anyone say to him, hey, what are you doing? Someone else took the photo, right?

[D]

So it could have been that person.

[B]

Is he just surrounded by Kyler Murray sycophants that are like, never tell him he's doing anything wrong because that's pretty clear cut stupid.

[D]

It's a dumb move. I don't think there's anything vicious or mean about it.

[B]

Did you read what Michael Vick did to those dogs?

[D]

No, no. I know, I know, I understand it, but I'm saying from Kyle's, I don't think this was. He sat down and go, I'm going to send a message.

[B]

I think.

[D]

You think?

[B]

I think I was basically that smart. He was basically. That is, you know, the strong argument there is that he wouldn't be that smart. I don't think he's so dumb to be that naive either. That was a. Watch what I do. I'm going to get some attention. He's got Little man syndrome. I'm done defending Kyler. He's got Little man syndrome. He's got a little problem with his, his take the NFL. He's got no resume that allows you to have this kind of.

[D]

But it's easy. I mean, can you, I can't for a million years imagine Josh Allen ever, Ever. I can't imagine. Even as weird as Aaron Rodgers is, I can't imagine Aaron Rodgers doing something like that.

[B]

Could you imagine Travis Kelsey walking around in an Aaron Hernandez jersey and saying, oh, yeah, I could.

[C]

He's. He's a, he's a Pfizer criminal.

[D]

Oh, Jesus.

[B]

Here we go with the shots.

[C]

Here we go.

[B]

Somebody's feeling it today. But if he walks around in his Hernandez Jers jersey, the Chiefs would probably suspend him. Especially if it was at some. If, let's say he walked around in a Hernandez jersey in front of a family or a funeral. Essentially, that's what Kyler did. It's like he invoked the idea of Michael Vick and dogs again, actually.

[C]

What do you think's worse?

[B]

I, I, well, obviously all of it's. Horrible. But having read what Michael Vick did to those dogs, you realize what a, what a monster he was. Now, can he have been redeemed? Yes. But doesn't that make it so? Nobody in the league can do this kind of stuff. You can never have an OJ jersey walking in. I don't care. OJ ran for 2000 yards in a 14 game season, arguably the greatest running back of all time. We're not talking about that anymore. You can love OJ. You're not walking into the stadium in OJ's gear. That's a statement.

[E]

Right.

[B]

And somebody has to be in your camp at a certain point and say, I don't know how you feel about this. This is not a good look for the face of the.

[D]

And that's what I said when we were talking about earlier. The fact that I wish Trump had somebody who would say, hey, yeah, you can pipe down, temper this down a little bit. Somebody should be whoever's taking the pictures, whoever set up the photo shoot should go, yeah, hey, you want to change that jersey? How about putting your jersey, not have.

[B]

The dog, you know, you know, one or the other. Right, right. Take the shirt off with the dog or no dog. We're not, we're not. This brings up imagery that is going to trigger the incident and make you look bad.

[E]

Yes.

[B]

I don't, I, I just, I, you know, nobody's going to do Ray Carruth at a, you know, you know, a woman's abuse.

[C]

There's a lot of jerseys out there that are off limits.

[B]

A question I was going to ask which former, which former great has a jersey you can't wear anymore because of his off the field nonsense? I mean, Hernandez, obviously.

[C]

Hernandez in the top of the list for me.

[B]

Ray Carruth's up.

[D]

And Ray Carruth, although I don't know how many people nobody would want that knew him.

[E]

Right?

[B]

Yeah, he wasn't great.

[D]

Right.

[B]

He was good. Lawrence Taylor, that's a tight one.

[C]

Yeah, but he didn't kill anyone, did he? Or not?

[B]

He knows underage girl in a hotel room doing coke after we already knew he had some problems.

[D]

Okay, see, again, I, I don't remember that. She was a rough shot over us.

[B]

He wrecked a few Cowboys games.

[D]

Yeah, you were hoping he's on cocaine on Sunday when you're playing him.

[B]

Well, actually probably might have made him stronger. The guy loved this stuff. But, you know, you start looking at that even in any sport, you know, in baseball and stuff like that. I always, as a fan of the Cubs, I wouldn't wear a Sammy Sosa because it just brings up the. Oh, okay, so he cheated. He did this. He was. You know, it was all artificial.

[C]

It's minor.

[B]

It is minor. And I still won't wear the jersey.

[D]

To me. So you're talking about two separate things. One is when you're talking about loss of human life or an animal abuse in any way or whatever, everyone you.

[C]

Brought up is really, really egregious felonies.

[D]

Ray Lewis.

[B]

Ray Lewis is the one who's got Teflon all over because he. He went to jail for obstruction of.

[D]

Justice for what, three days? Yeah.

[B]

And it was. And paid, like. Tried to say he paid for the family's funerals or something like that. He was. If you. And then he actually had the nerve to say God did this to him to make him a better man. And I remember Steve Young saying on espn, because that was when Ray wrote his book, and that was his big quote. He's like, God did this so I'd be a better man. And Steve Young said, two people had to die for you to be a better man. I was on the ESPN Monday Night Football, and Ray just said, no, he put you in places. And he just went on. It was like, Steve caught him, like, that law degree kicked in right there. And Ray Lewis got away with one. He's got a statue. He's got all that stuff. And I'm not saying everybody's squeaky clean. And I'm not sure. Ray. That's the thing with Ray Lewis. No one knows what happened.

[D]

Right.

[B]

Only Ray knows.

[E]

Right.

[D]

Well, and that's what I've always said. Who's the running back? Ray Rice.

[B]

Ray Rice.

[D]

What is always fascinating to me is when you talk about a Ray Rice, you. We all know what domestic abuse is.

[E]

Yes.

[D]

We all know what it is.

[E]

Yep.

[D]

But when you just hear the word domestic abuse versus seeing it.

[B]

Totally different.

[D]

It's a completely different effect.

[B]

Video changes everything.

[D]

Yes.

[E]

Yep.

[D]

You know, and you can. Yes. Hey, Domestic abuse is horrendous.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

And, you know, it's a guy pushing a girl around, but then when you see a video of it, I think it takes on a whole new life.

[B]

Remember when that happened and the Ravens had that press conference and John Harbaugh said, we don't need to see any videos to know how bad this is. He suspended for, like two or four games or whatever it was. And then they. And the press guy said, you haven't seen the video. And he goes, we don't need to see it. We know it's bad. And I was like, okay. Then they saw the video and immediately announced, he's off the team.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

And the guy, the same guy in Baltimore, to his credit, was like, well, you didn't need the video to know how bad it was. And he goes, it's worse than we thought. He's like, you need to see the video next time. You don't jump to these conclusions. It's bad. And you need to know when your team, you know, and that's the thing with Ray Lewis. Ray Rice got, you know, ostracized and rightfully so. That video was horrendous. And there's a lot of things that, especially these days. You see the video and then you wonder, how can anybody see that and think anything other than what this is.

[D]

Is just awful and come back from that?

[B]

And, yeah, you can't. And then the people who haven't seen it will have their opinion of, you know, naivete to say, I didn't know it was that bad.

[D]

Right.

[B]

So that's their excuse. Yeah. There's a lot of players. It's a sad statement, but there's a lot of guys who have done stuff. You cannot wear their jerseys anymore.

[D]

You know what position, group you can wear their jersey.

[B]

Offensive line.

[D]

You tell me. And I've told anybody this, you tell me the next NFL offensive lineman who gets arrested, gets served, whatever, for domestic abuse. They're the biggest guys most of the time. They're the strongest guys, but they have a protective gene in their body.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

How about.

[C]

How about.

[D]

That's a good point there because the only time I ever get mad.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

If I see someone getting bullied, picked on.

[E]

Right.

[D]

Or some. One of my family members, something being wrong.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

Otherwise, he can make fun of me. You can make fun of me. We can all have fun. I don't have a temper.

[E]

Right.

[D]

And that's until. Until. And that's most offensive lineman. So I always challenge people. You tell me the next time NFL offensive lineman gets arrested for domestic is.

[C]

Trafficking cocaine to kids with Nate Newton. Does that count?

[D]

No, it's just marijuana.

[C]

What's that?

[D]

It wasn't the kids. Hey, did you hear his quote here he goes. He said he was one of the best offensive lineman NFL. He wanted to be one of the best marijuana.

[B]

He was good at what he does. Richie Incognito is the only one that could go against your argument. And there's always. There's always going to be one. I don't want to be the guy.

[D]

That goes, but what about.

[B]

Because for the Most part, It's probably a 98% success thing. What you just described. Offensive linemen stay out of trouble.

[E]

Right.

[B]

So Richie Incognito was the one. Oh, yeah. You're kind of like this dude, but.

[C]

Have you heard all the things he did?

[D]

Yeah, but he also had some demons and he had some.

[C]

That's no excuse me.

[B]

To Richie Incognito's credit. Kind of turned it around. Made a career out of it. Even after the fact. It's. But again, you're furrowing your eyebrows at a Richie Incognito thing, which is essentially a guy saying terrible things and. But never really harming anyone to the point of that.

[D]

And physically.

[B]

And you would. You would question somebody in his jersey, would you not? Like, oh, yes, Rich Incognito was a high school player here in Arizona and had trouble in school here. So it was. You're right, he had trouble going in. But if Incognito jersey started to wander around, you'd go, what's this guy's deal? Michael vick, Aaron Hernandez, O.J. simpson, Ray Rice, O.J. simpson. I throw Lawrence Taylor in that mix. And you know who should be in that. But talk about Teflon is Michael Irvin. Yeah. I mean, literally. And he is a. Again, Dale, I know he's your buddy. He is a wonderful human being. I've spoken with him three or four times. He makes a room better.

[E]

Yes.

[B]

But having watched that documentary and gone back over and have him sit there and have to hear it.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

You realize, man, that dude could very easily still be in a jail cell. I don't know about that. Stabbing the dude in the neck thing. On probation.

[D]

Get out of the chair, Michael. Get a haircut. Crying out loud.

[B]

But there are plenty of them who've done stuff and. And continue on. I mean, Ben Roethlisberger, if you want to go to my team. There's some questionable whether or not that's a good thing. But again, if you didn't prove that it happened, we are very forgiving as a fan.

[D]

Is he the. Is he the most. Would you quote, unquote, notorious Steeler or is there somebody else?

[B]

Well, Antonio Brown became the most notorious dealer, but he's not. I mean, he's pulling guns.

[D]

He did a lot of that stuff when he left.

[B]

After he left, he became kind of a problem after. I don't know. There's. There's. I mean, there's been guys that have, you know, Jack Lambert got in some trouble in the late 70s and was in court and had some problems with this. And that wasn't terrible though, pre social media. Yeah. Way before it became national News and just 24 hour cycles and stuff.

[D]

Think about that. We used to get that way for the newspaper. We get a little box goal or maybe a. A nugget or two. Now the game's not over with yet and you got stories you can.

[B]

While it's going on. Like, what happened? That coach said something to the player. We're in the third quarter. Like we're still fighting about that.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

You get into. And then North Dallas 40, the book and movie that came out about the Cowboys in the 70s.

[E]

Right.

[B]

Nobody knew this stuff, but those guys were all criminals. It's fun to think about because the NFL, it is. As a fan, you start to wonder. And I've used this phrase before. I took it from UFC fighter Chael Sonnen when came on the show and he told me, he goes, at a certain point, you're just cheering for laundry. And you have to check yourself as to what you're actually cheering for.

[E]

Right.

[B]

And because I told him that was at the time Michael Vick became a Steeler. And I said, I haven't missed a steeler game since 1991 and I'm not watching this weekend.

[E]

Right.

[B]

And he's like, yeah. He says it's a good stance. He goes, at a certain point, you're just cheering for the laundry, not the people in it.

[D]

Me in the uniform.

[B]

The uniform. And he goes just the colors that fly around on the field. So you don't really care about it. And NFL wants to make a big deal about how, oh, we're great for the community, we do so much for the city and everything else, but they'll turn a blind eye when they're. The problem.

[C]

That, that brings back the memories of Sandusky, the coach at Penn State. Yeah, I mean, he's, he's. He's raping kids. And the fans were more concerned about the team getting. Being on probation than exactly what was going on behind the scenes.

[B]

Ohio State and the documentary that came out, Michigan State. Ohio State's got a thing still lingering. They've never, they have not closed the door on what. What had turned out to be. I can't remember the exact number, but there were hundreds of complaints about sexual assault from one guy.

[E]

Right.

[B]

And it was over a span of about 14 years and it was proven true. And Ohio State still hasn't rectified it and they're still trying to get away with it. And everybody's just like, don't mess with Scarlett.

[D]

And your co host is a big Ohio State fan and defended it.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

Really?

[B]

Absolutely.

[C]

See, that's crazy. People lose track of important.

[B]

It's the danger of cheering for colors instead of like what they actually stand for. If I was an Ohio State fan, I've got a couple friends who are. One of them walked away after he watched the documentary. He goes, I can't do it.

[E]

Right.

[B]

He said, I can't do this. He goes, I've got a daughter in college, she's an athlete. And he's like, can't do it. He goes, I would have loved to have sent her there. And in my mind I'd have thought nothing bad can happen at Ohio State because I love it so much. It's just a great. And he said, and in the, in the underbelly, my daughter would have been in that mix. She was a gymnast, I think. I don't remember tennis or gym.

[E]

I don't remember.

[B]

But he's like, and I think about her. She's at a Texas school. And he said, I think about her there. And if that ever came out later, like 20 years from now, that she was afraid to say something.

[C]

There's evil everywhere.

[B]

There's evil everywhere. And that's, you know, and that's the dangers. We get a little bit locked in on the. My team has no problems. My team, they're all. They're all doing something weird.

[D]

I just. We always look at things I like, what would I do in that situation?

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

And I just can't imagine me being a player for Ohio State and allowing that to go on without making. Again, it kind of ranks where you are on the team. If you're. If you're good enough, you can say something. If you're not good enough, probably can't say.

[B]

But how about if you're the long snapper at Ohio State, you're an offensive lineman and you. And they. At the time, it's the 80s, I don't know who was there at the time, but let's say Randy Gratisar wasn't there at that time, but somebody great was playing at Ohio State and he has the same story. The doctor did it to him too, but he didn't touch him. He did a weird examination and he's done it to everybody. And you're the low man on the totem pole. You're like, well, he's doing it to everybody.

[D]

No, that's what I'm saying. It really depends. Like Jimmy Johnson always said, find where you rank on that totem pole.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

And if you're all Big ten and you're coming back for your senior year, your junior year and whatever, your word's gonna carry a little more weight.

[B]

Well, they did know. People did say. And then everybody, even the guy who's the senator now, Jim Jordan, was like, yeah, well, he's a good guy.

[C]

That happened to me.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

Where I was recruited. I told Dale, I didn't tell him about this, but I was recruited to play college football. I chose baseball instead. But to go through that process, to go to the Air Force Academy. Yeah, I was recruited by the Air Force Academy and they. I had to go do a physical. And this guy, if you've had a physical and a rectum thing or whatever.

[B]

That'S called, a rectal exam.

[D]

Prostate exam.

[C]

Prostate exam. You know what it was? He was extremely rough.

[B]

Whoa.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

I had one when I was 21.

[D]

And no, you don't need to tell this.

[B]

I'm not going to tell that story. But things happened, but I didn't know it was bad until recently.

[C]

I didn't either. Yeah, I mean, I didn't know anything. And because I'm 18 years old.

[B]

Yeah, same. I was young and I just assumed that was right.

[C]

So there's, there's these doctors out there that take advantage of these kids, have no idea. Now, I didn't die and nothing happened to me and I didn't even think about it after.

[B]

I was naive. So it didn't affect you.

[D]

No. But I might explain some things now.

[B]

Well, that's why he's so goddamn mad all the time. But I, I, I, I, I had a similar. The exam was extremely thorough for a 20 year old, a 21 year old who was like, you don't my prostate at 20. But he did.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. And, and to, to the point where. And this may be graphic, but, but he kind of picked me up.

[B]

Oh my God. Yeah, he. Like off the ground.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

No kidding.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

You weren't laying down for this?

[C]

No.

[B]

You standing up. I think you were dancing. I'm not sure this was a doctor. No.

[C]

And now, now when I played with the San Francisco Giants in the minor league system, we would get a exam every year and they would do the same thing. They chef there too.

[B]

Even young guys. No kidding.

[C]

It.

[D]

What?

[C]

But, but you would lay down on your side. Yeah, that was a lot easier.

[B]

That's how I had to do mine. But I still think it was too much to. He was, he was. Look, I, it hurt to pee.

[C]

That's why I went to him.

[B]

The, the giant, the Thing was, there's just an exam that was fine.

[C]

That was no, that was just normal. There was no funny business. But as an 18 year old, as part of the Air Force thing.

[B]

Yikes.

[C]

And. And as I didn't know anything. Yeah, I didn't know it better.

[B]

So I think that's the thing. When people talk about that, with that Ohio State, things like, well, I would have done this, I'd have done that. Well, now, knowing what you know at the time, you're like that normal, right? Am I going to lose my scholarship if I say this guy?

[D]

I guarantee you, you're going to go to your locker buddy, and go, hey, the doctor did this.

[B]

He does that to me too.

[E]

Yeah. Oh, oh.

[B]

It's normal. And then you're like, oh. And then. Yeah, with the Ohio State thing is that. Yeah, that's definitely out there. All right, let's get into something less horrifying.

[C]

Right.

[B]

Nash's life. Jeez, thanks for that. Welcome back from Michigan.

[C]

Sorry.

[B]

Which teams do you believe in the NFL are already through injury, through just bad drafts, through just everything. Already mathematically eliminated after two weeks. Not an overreaction. Who is Plant? Who's already on the clock? There's a lot of 02 teams right.

[C]

Now, I would say. I think the Saints were going to be the worst team in the league. I bet them to have under six wins, under five wins. They're garbage anyways. They're 0 and 2 and they're already on their way. But the only reason I can't discount them is because I think they're in a bad division that if they come.

[B]

Spiel out a couple, but they're on the clock. They're not going anywhere that's on the clock. Yeah. What about teams you may not have expected? Houston?

[D]

Well, obviously Kansas City being owned. You're not in that. That to happen now. Again, you and I were talking off the air. The fact that. And I told you before the season, I said the thing like, I've been almost through what the Chiefs have been through a ton of success in the 90s as a team, as a player. You don't realize when you're going to fall off the table.

[E]

Right.

[B]

And.

[D]

And was it going to be last year? No, obviously not for Kansas City. They got the Super Bowl. Was it going to be this year? And in Dallas, it was two years after our last super bowl where we just went. It's not a gradual decline, it's a whoa. Where, you know, we're Super bowl two years ago and now we're 6 and 10.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

And, and fairly lucky to be 6.

[B]

And 10 and the same players at the court.

[D]

Yes. Yeah, we're just older, we've been through a bunch and, and, and all that. But I'm going to tell you the two teams that jump out to me as, as, as far as who I think are going to be horrendous. Number one, if you don't say Cleveland, they. You kind of knew they're going to be bad and they're Cleveland.

[B]

I didn't expect them to be this, in this disarray.

[C]

Listen, they should have won that first game against Cincinnati.

[B]

That's true.

[C]

That's what a missed but 25 yard field goal.

[B]

25 yarder. But Flacco's throwing bad picks two weeks in a row and they're just going to be like, go ahead, get them. When do they go to one of the rookies in Cleveland?

[E]

Right.

[C]

That they, they. That's a, that's a very difficult schedule coming out of the shoot for Cleveland. Brutal, right? So brutal. I'm going to give them, I'm going to, I'm going to, I'm going to wait on them for the fact that I think they have a pretty good defense.

[D]

I'm going to tell you the team that probably is going to get their coach. It's, it's a chase between two of them. But I believe the coaches could be fired. First is down in Miami.

[B]

Oh yeah, that's.

[D]

I, I, I, I. They're 0 and 2 and they have no life and they're soft and physically.

[B]

And as we tape this, the game tonight, Thursday and we're taping Thursday afternoon. Thursday night, Buffalo and Miami. I would venture to guess if that team looks like it's quit on Mike McDaniel tonight. It could happen.

[D]

It could happen. It could happen very quickly. And I don't see, I don't see.

[C]

I would have guessed a 120 pound computer nerd can't coach a football team.

[D]

Yeah, but he was the hottest thing the first year they made the playoffs.

[B]

Stevie wasn't exactly like, but he was like a frail old man. But the dude could coast.

[C]

Dale said this before and you gotta agree that it's your presence. When you're a leader of men. You have to have a presence like the Lions coach. That guy has a presence. But I also think Johnson had a presence. I think that guy could walk in and they'd go, they'd throw him the towels. He thinks the towel boys here take care of this towels.

[B]

He's a coordinator. Dale's talked about that on the show before. He's a coordinator. You don't need to revere him or anything else. He's just the genius, the mad scientist that's going to pop in with a game plan. He's not in charge of grown men. And that's. And he gets in somebody's face, it's not going to matter.

[C]

It happened here a couple years ago with Cardinals and Cliff Kingsbury, a great offense. Look what he's doing in Washington. Yeah, but he's not a head coach. He is an offensive coordinator. And, and although for some teams to keep that offense going, sometimes if you had a coaching head vacancy and you go, well, all right, let's bring him in. Let's get. Let's make this happen. Same thing might be going on in Chicago, I don't know, with Ben Johnson.

[B]

Yeah, Ben Johnson's going to get at least two years on that.

[C]

No, I, that. And, and he might be great because I don't think he's a, you know, someone that doesn't command respect. But there's a wait and see there.

[B]

There's also I, I walked into this thing. Ben Johnson is. And so he's in an assessment year where he can actually probably because I like his presence. I agree. He's got that. Dave Canales has that too in, in Carolina and I think they're a mess, but I think he's the type of coach has to be in the right spot. I think that because they actually against the Cardinals last week, they, they were getting beat. They're not talented and they still fought back. And that's the same thing I saw with the Cardinals last year.

[D]

No, they were in every game that they fought. And the other thing, and I brought this up on, on your show, John. The fact that. And I heard it for the first time and I've never really, never really dawned on me. But teams tend to pick up in the cities that they're pick up the vibe of the city resort towns. And if you're in Miami and you got south beach and you got the beach and you got the nightclubs and everything's cool and.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

And all. But the team is kind of like that.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

Listen, if you're a coach and you wear capri pants on the sidelines, you should be fired immediately in the middle of the game.

[B]

If you're a man in capri pants and you have a title at your office, you should probably be fired for it. I agree with that. Although most men's suits are getting a little bit strange with the high water end of it anyway. So we look at other 0 and 2 teams. Houston kind of a shocker that they're owing to. I think that they rode that C.J. stroud rookie year may have been a bit of a flash and now we're kind of back to reality. He looks okay, but I don't know that you can ride that guy right now to a, to a title. And also d' Amico had his first year with that defense. They've got an amazing pass rush. I can't see Houston staying down.

[D]

Right.

[B]

But are they out of the playoffs.

[D]

Especially in that division? Yeah, I know Indianapolis is surprised, everybody. I think that all year.

[E]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

But Taylor running the way he is makes Daniel Jones so much better. But I look at that 0 and 2, that statistic of teams that start Owen 2 and I remember when Dale's Cowboys did it and that was a big topic back then. 71% of teams that are starting 0 and 2 don't make the playoffs. That never been to a Super Bowl. And you guys changed all that. And since then it has happened here and there where teams are 0 and 2 and they get a little better, they make it to the playoffs. It's awfully hard to dig a hole with the schedule and the parody in the NFL, Right. To have Houston, who's not wildly talented or can't just be like the Dallas Cowboys and go when we get this together, we're unstoppable. Houston can't have two dings against them going in because they're going to lose five or six games this year.

[C]

That's eight.

[B]

And now you're looking at, you know, are we in or out?

[D]

But who's going to again, Colts are pretty good. Yeah, but are the Colts going to end up with 11 wins?

[B]

Right. But here's the thing. You also have hiccups when you're a team like Houston. Maybe. Maybe you're a 9 and 17. If things go well, you start owing to. Now you have to be a 9 and 5 team going out, right. And that's going to be tough because you'll have the hiccup against Tennessee. You'll have that weird game in your division where you're like, how do we lose that? Jacksonville is going to come up and smack you. You didn't see it coming. So now there's nine and seven start of the season. You got to go nine and five after your bad start. Starts looking at seven and nine pretty easily after an Owen two start.

[D]

Well, then you look at Houston. They scored 28 points in two games.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

28 points.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

I still think they'll be there because they're in a weak division. I don't believe in Jacksonville. I think I want to bring in another rule that if your head coach's name is Liam.

[D]

Right.

[C]

That's. That's, that's not.

[B]

What if Liam wore capri pants? Would that balance itself out or would it somehow another get worse?

[C]

Two negatives make a positive?

[B]

I don't know. I don't think we go with that.

[C]

I think, I think actually the team disbands after the year gets relegated.

[B]

Yeah. They. They go. Go play soccer. You're dressing like a soccer coach. Yeah, I look at that. I see the Giants and the jets as teams that are never really had a shot in the first place. Jets played really well against the Steelers. As far as, you know, did they.

[C]

Play really well or did the Steelers.

[B]

Steelers were bad. Yeah, they played even to each other. But I will say that it was fundamentally sound football. There were not a lot of like wild mistakes and stupid moves like that. Now let's get into stupid things that happened and talk about my Steelers.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

Because beautiful Caleb Johnson, the rookie from Iowa, took him six quarters to have the career mistake no one will forget by letting that kickoff go right past him in a tie game.

[E]

Yep.

[B]

And watch this 14 point swing happen in two plays. And he just didn't know the rule. And his answer afterwards when asked was like, did you know the rule? And he goes, if I did or I didn't, it still doesn't matter. It was stupid.

[D]

Well, the thing is, think about this, because the two things that happen, huge difference between college and the NFL. And I. And I know you talk about it in training camp and mini camps and all that, but in college, you notice ball goes over the goal line on a kickoff 9. 90% of the time, the college guy just waves his arms.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

And starts jogging off the field. Because it's a dead ball.

[B]

Because it used to be that it would roll in and you could grab it.

[D]

Yes.

[E]

Right.

[D]

And then the other one is a receiver. In college, you catch a ball, you touch the ground, you're down.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

And you'll see some young wide receivers.

[B]

Drop the ball or.

[D]

Yeah, that. Or just stop. You know, stop with. They catch the ball. And so that's the only reason I could think of that. But yes, in that situation, because I've other people. But Steve McCollum was asking me, do you go over those every Friday in Dallas? We do that, but that doesn't mean that Leon let. Even though there's 10 other guys yelling, stay away, stay away, stay away. That he's not going to go try and pounce on the ball.

[B]

That was on a Thanksgiving Day when he went after a ball.

[D]

It was a block, a field goal, and if you just jog off, feel we win, Right? And he goes and tries to recover it, kicks it.

[B]

It was in the snow.

[D]

Yes.

[B]

And it was the only. That little hole in the stadium was.

[D]

Just football field all day. It was miserable.

[B]

And he slides the ball into the ends against the Dolphins, if I'm not mistaken.

[D]

And I promise you, that was when that went. Was. Went over a multitude of times. If a field goes blocked, cross the line of scrimmage. Peter, Peter, Peter. Stay away from it.

[B]

Yeah, that's the word.

[E]

Yes.

[B]

Stay away. Yeah. It's crazy, but it is memorable. And did Leon have the other one where he went after Don Beebe chased him down in the Super Bowl? Was that.

[D]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

And you're remembered for stupid. The good news for Caleb Johnson is he got it out of the way in six quarters.

[D]

Right.

[B]

The better part is a lot of times guys will have like, Brett Favre's first pass was a completion to himself after. It was just an absolute. Or it was actually an interception, if I remember. Or maybe it was that, but it was a dumb play. It was bad. It was everything. And you're like, oh, this kid's not going to make it.

[E]

He's an idiot.

[B]

And then he goes on and has that. My hope as a Steeler fan is that Caleb Johnson will be like, yeah, he's the idiot who did that thing. And then he has a Hall of Fame career. Doesn't look good right now.

[D]

And he's probably not going to tell you this. For. For every Brett Favre, there's about a hundred other guys that didn't become.

[B]

That is a pretty dumb moment. That is a pretty. And especially with Danny Smith, the special teams coach who's so revered as a detail guy. And boy, you know, they've gone over that new kickoff, especially with the rookie.

[E]

Yes.

[B]

And to have him stand there and watch these dudes blow by, you're like, man. And I've. I've.

[D]

Did you see any. Did. Was the other. What was the other returner doing?

[B]

I think he ran up, assuming he had it.

[D]

Okay.

[B]

And then he turned around, he was like, what's going on the end zone. I think everybody thought that Caleb just kind of was like, oh, it bounced through. Yeah, it wasn't good. It was bad. And I watched the All 22 again, as I always do after the game, and boy, did the wheels fall off after that. That is a mental catastrophe.

[E]

Yes.

[B]

So, yeah, you see that and you just kind of hope. Did you ever have one of those Dale, those don't look at me moments?

[D]

Well, yeah, but when I came back from the Baltimore Ravens, I mean, hey, as a long snapper, when. When the entire stadium cheers when you finally get a punt off, that's a pretty damning performance.

[B]

That's not dumb. That's just bad.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, did you ever just throw it the wrong way? Because that's what it would have to be.

[C]

I know the story. He's dumb because it was cold and he wore like eight layers and he couldn't.

[D]

I couldn't bend over.

[C]

He looked like the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man. How are you gonna bend over and snap?

[B]

That's a good point.

[D]

All I know is that add another year to my pension for the rest of my wife's life.

[B]

Keep the money coming. Don't take the embarrassment. I'll get paid to be stupid. Yeah, I do it for a l. The also the other thing in the NFL right now, there's a couple of things I want to talk about. There's a sack problem. The quarterbacks are getting sacked like crazy. And it is a lot.

[D]

Right.

[B]

The pressure is huge and they want to keep these guys safe. But also, we've gone into this running quarterback era where mobility is huge. Justin Herbert just hit 20 miles an hour on Monday night running. And I mean, this dude is a six foot, six inch beast.

[D]

230, 240 pound dude, throwing 20 miles.

[B]

An hour at you with a wide open lane because the pocket opened up. They're like, if that can happen, we got to stop protecting them so much because if they're in the. They can. That dude's huge. And he can. He can run. You got to put a lick on him. And then you see stuff like that. Well, who do you protect? Who don't you protect? I've always, again, go back to my Steelers, Ben Roethlisberger at his nose broken the year they changed the rules to don't touch the quarterback's head and no flag flew, right. And they're like, well, that's Ben. But then you get a guy like Robert Griffin, who was a spindly little fella and he. You touched him wrong. It was terrible. Patrick Mahomes, who's bigger than people think. You can't touch him.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Who do you protect? He's a. Yeah, he's but there's the thing. You got to lay a lick on a nifty runner. You cannot protect that.

[D]

We did not, we did not touch on it last week. The fact that Patrick Mahomes running out of bounds, running out of bounds. The defender slows up because he knows if he pushes them or touched him, it's gonna be a penalty. And Patrick lowers his shoulder. Yeah, there's got to be that.

[B]

That can't be fair. And Patrick Mahomes is notorious for the fake out on the sideline and they'll flag it and he knows that. I don't blame Patrick Mahomes for that. That's taking advantage of the rules and that's what you do to win.

[D]

But it sucks.

[B]

It sucks if you're the other guy. And it also sucks if there's like a Lamar Jackson type guy who's not going to lower his shoulder but he can spin out of a thing and he looks like he's going out of bounds and you lay one on him. The refs. And I'm going to defend Lamar Jackson.

[D]

Listen what's happened.

[B]

The refs would, would need to protect Lamar Jackson in that case and definitely flag a guy who goes after him.

[C]

Well, I will disagree. And the reason is because now we're going to, we're going to protect quarterbacks more and more and more to the point where you won't be able to tackle them. It'll just be too hand touched. The game is not going to be as good. It already isn't as good as. And we as fans just have to realize when you're watching these great players do what they're doing, it's, it's fantastic to watch because there's danger involved. They could get hurt. And if you take that away again, that's not as impressive.

[B]

No, we love the physicality.

[D]

Two different things. One in the pocket, drop back to pass. Again, we talked about it. You don't have to agree with the rule.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

But anytime you as a defender, you hit the quarterback in the head with your head, with your helmet, with your hand. But It's a penalty.

[B]

15 years.

[D]

It's pretty simple. Now the falling on them and body weight and we're going to use judgment and I think that sucks. Well, once they're out of the pocket, I think all the rules need to be gone.

[B]

But again then you get into the Joe Burrow thing where the guy fell on his foot and he's got a terrible. I've never. And you know this Dale turf toe getting a surgery on turf Toe. And people don't realize turf toe is basically if you took your finger and bent it back at the middle. Knuckle.

[E]

Knuckle.

[B]

And then put it right on your big toe. On your big toe.

[E]

Yes.

[B]

And your big toe is kind of an important balance machine.

[D]

Yes.

[B]

And so Joe Burrow going out for the Bengals with that injury. Everybody's like, it's a toe. It ended Jack Lambert. It's ended plenty of careers. But you think of a guy like Jack Lambert is tough as nails.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

Couldn't walk anymore in 1981. He's like, I got to walk away from football after nine years because my toes destroyed.

[D]

Well, what I try and tell people again, I've told you, too, I'll tell our listeners fact that there's two injuries in the NFL that need to have the names changed. One is turf toe, because I hear people all the time. Oh, he's got a little turf toe.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

Turf toe is taking a nail and a hammer and pounding it into the big joint of your big toe and then saying, now you're £300, you're gonna fire off, push off your big toe to try and block somebody. Agonizing. The other one is he's got a little stinger. No, it's not a little stinger. The little stinger, the pain goes out through your arm. Feels like your arms on fire for 45 seconds. Yeah, I'd rather have any other pain than that. And then for the next two minutes, you can't lift your arm because there's no feeling. Yeah, that's what a little stinger is.

[B]

I told somebody this the other day because they were laughing at Joe Burrow and they were making fun of it, and I fine with Joe Burrow's turf toe. Let me be frank about it all. It's a Steeler fan watching a Bengals quarterback go down for three months. I don't root for injuries, but if it's something as simple as that. All right, he'll be back. We're good here three months. Enjoy your rest. But he's like, it's a toe. What kind of pants you can't play with? And I'm like, rip your toenail off because it's, it's, it's still not turf toe.

[D]

No.

[B]

And then go walk around and feel that, because push off.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

Stand.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

For a long period of time with a torn off toenail. It's brutal. And when your toe is affected, your whole balance is off. Your push offs off everything else. Do the Bengals survive this?

[D]

Boy, I, I, you Think their defense was the, The. The. The side that they needed to work on of their. Of their team. Offensively, you got those two wide receivers that are really, really good. The offense seemed to be fine. I don't think so. I don't think whoever you bring in is going to be Joe Burrow.

[C]

No way. But they had a very impressive win.

[B]

Can it be like when Tom Brady went down and Matt Castle came in and earned a career out of that? Because the talent around him was so good. He had 11 wins the year Tom was out.

[D]

Did Belichick retire from North Carolina? He's taking over Cincinnati.

[B]

That's a good point. But that's the thing. I don't know. Zach Taylor's not necessarily the greatest coach.

[D]

No. But, you know, he's okay.

[B]

He's got a lot of talent on that offense. So, I mean, if you're a backup quarterback, that's a pretty nice situation and that.

[D]

I just think the long term. You know, one thing. If it's three weeks.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

Once they get tape on this Browning guy, that's who it is, right?

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

Once they get tape on him, it's three weeks before you're like, all right, these are the new Bengals. This is what they do. These are their trends. Will. Will they be able to survive it? I don't think their defense allows that.

[D]

Not in that division.

[B]

I don't think so. And against. Yeah, against teams like Baltimore, you've got to keep up. Yeah, it's. That's a thing for sure. Is there anybody else you think that, like, how about the J.J. mcCarthy thing in Minnesota? That. That did not go as planned with the way they were talking about him coming out of camp.

[C]

No, listen, he played great the fourth quarter against the Bears. I mean, he was.

[B]

He did play well in that game, but, I mean, the fourth quarter, they were disaster offensively for three quarters and then another four the next week.

[C]

I agree. Wholeheartedly.

[B]

Played one good quarter.

[C]

I agree.

[B]

And basically, Jefferson kind of saved his ass a couple of times in that fourth quarter, too, because those throws weren't exactly.

[C]

So the question is, I always feel if you can do it, it's like. It's like golf. I mean, if you can. If you can play nine holes, shoot par.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

And then the next nine holes, you shoot like a thousand. I mean, you should be able to continue to do it. There's. There's some disconnect there. So he has. He has what? It takes one of them. Now you got it. Now you got it.

[B]

Well, because you could either spike for One and this is who you really are. Or you can be bad and spike and go, this is who I am going to.

[D]

I was surprised at his start because of the things that I had heard.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

When your teammates are. Are glowing about you, usually they know what's going on.

[B]

It was beyond glowing.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

And I'm with you. Leo and I talked about a while ago when a teammates are, no, we're fine. The season's going to be good. You're like, all right. They're not real kind of confident, but those guys were going out of their way to say, just wait till you see.

[D]

We're not going to miss.

[C]

I think he's a good leader. I've heard a lot of things he's doing just. Just being a leader. And I think teammates appreciate that, and I think that's why they have the respect for him. But you're right. He's got to do it on the field.

[B]

Have you seen the meme that's going around the Internet that says, all right? And it's just a guy with a mic says, all right, everybody clap once if you've never won a championship. And then they just show a whole of Minnesota. Go, Skull. It's a great meme.

[D]

And it's.

[B]

It's true. Is there? And you know what the other thing about JJ McCarthy is? This is me. I. There's certain times when you see a dude's face in a helmet, you just want. He's got that punchable. There's something about him that makes me hate. I've never hated the Vikings. Never cared about.

[D]

No.

[B]

But I look at J.J. mcCarthy and I'm like, you. Like, if this was a movie, you'd be the bad boyfriend that's treating a girl wrong. And I'm the good guy that's like, has a crush on her. But. But you're the one that's going to be. And then she's going to fall for me eventually. But right now you've got her. It's Bradley Cooper and Wedding Crashers. Or.

[D]

Or it's the Phoenix Suns guy, Grayson Allen, who has that.

[B]

It's a punchable face. Grayson's got it a little.

[D]

He used to. It's a little bit different out the tan.

[B]

And again the muscles in the tan and the resort. And then it showed in his play. He was pointless last year. But, yeah, I look at that. Is there, like, players that you look at and you're like, did that ever happen while you were playing? It's like, I don't know what it is about this guy just want to punch him.

[D]

Oh, well. And I've talked with people about this in recent months. I used to be able to look at a guy's media picture, like a guy named Ray Childress. All right. He played Texas A and M. Him and I battled for three years and six. Six. Ended up being the third pick overall. Good football player. But he had this long neck. And I just, in my mind, I had convinced myself he's the most arrogant piece of crap just from the picture I have just with me. And I'd stare at it on Saturday for an hour before the game. I go, I hate you. I literally hate your face. I hate you. And. And I did that with a couple other players.

[B]

Did it ever go the other way? It's like this very attractive man.

[D]

Yeah. I don't want to hit him that hard.

[B]

I think I like this guy.

[D]

In fact, Ray Children got. So far, he's the only guy that I've really ever done anything dirty to. Actual dirty. We're on the bottom of a pile. My kind of found my hand inside his face mask and I mean there's six, seven people on top. And so I grabbed his face mask and I literally said, I'm gonna try and twist his neck off.

[B]

Oh my God. Because you hated him.

[D]

I hated him so much. And we never said a word.

[B]

Was the picture. Was the picture equal to the live face?

[D]

Yes. Arrogant, ugly. But I had his helmet almost completely turned around. He gets up, he starts swinging at me. But his face mask is like it's facing backwards. Hitting or his swing. He gets a 15 yard penalty and that's really one of those.

[B]

We need to have him on this show. We need to get Ray on this show.

[D]

Guess what? He signed with the Dallas Cowboys in the mid to late 90s for. For a year.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

Became good friends.

[B]

Oh, okay. We gotta get Ray on the show and talk to your good friend Ray about how much he looked at your picture. How many guys looked at your picture.

[D]

I mean, look at this face.

[B]

Exactly. Oh, I want to punch it.

[D]

So.

[C]

Good thing I didn't eat lunch yet.

[D]

No kidding.

[B]

Lose.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

So, yeah, I think there's a few teams like the jets are going to lose. They lost Justin Fields. I don't think that's a big hit for them because Tyrod Taylor's an experienced backup.

[C]

I agree.

[B]

The importance of an experienced backup is massive.

[D]

You got one here in. In. In Arizona with Jacoby Brissette and get you through a few.

[B]

Yeah. If. If you've got a guy who's Got to take you through the rest of the year like the Bengals do. Yeah, it's going to be tough.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

But if you've got, you know, three.

[C]

Shown it, he's done a good job.

[B]

He can play, but there's no tape on him yet. There's no trends. There's no three, you know, three, four games in a row. The next thing you're going to say is like, all right, here's what you're talking about.

[C]

The whole is. I mean, it's burrow out for the.

[B]

Whole 12, 12 weeks. More than likely three months.

[D]

Yeah, more than that.

[B]

Since everything goes smooth and that's if, yeah, if this. And then if he comes back and he's not, you know, they may shut him down.

[E]

Right.

[B]

They're not. I don't know why you would bring him back if this team is, you know, five and seven.

[C]

Well, yeah, they're in a very tough division. They're. They're not going to have success.

[B]

I would not look at that and say, you know, and if they do.

[C]

Then they're paying Joe Burrow too much.

[B]

Yeah, there's truth to that too.

[D]

Right.

[C]

If, if anyone can come in and, and guide them to the playoffs or when I say anyone, second string quarterback, whatever, then what. What kind of salary structure do we have here for these starting quarterbacks?

[B]

Yeah, well, there's, there's, there's the fear, probably the starting quarterback getting 50 million a year that sees the backup do okay. Again, we weren't paying quarterbacks 50 million when Brady went down and Matt Castle came in and got 25 million a year based on his one year with. And didn't do anything or even more.

[D]

So how about when the guy before Brady. Oh, Drew Bledsoe. Drew Bledsoe goes down and all of a sudden six round pick comes in.

[B]

Yeah, well, you think about all those guys that left New England and became starters based on sitting there and having a couple good games. Jimmy Garoppolo, I mean, there's dudes who came. Brian Hoyer, for God's sakes. People started looking at him as a starter for a little while just because he had.

[C]

Didn't he play 25 years because of that? Because he played one good game with New Eng.

[B]

All right, let's get into the other thing. Dale and I've talked about this, Nash, we need your opinion on it as well. I. And you're a gambler, Nash, so this is a big deal. The kicking ball has changed football to the point where gamblers are now. This is a dangerous thing. The Kickoff goes, let's say you score a touchdown and you take a two point lead in a football game, you kick off to the other team, they let it go through the end zone or something. They're on the 30, 35 yard line.

[C]

Is it 35 or 40?

[B]

It's the 35. If it goes out of the end zone, if it lands in the landing zone, then it's the 25 or 50.

[C]

Short of the 20.

[B]

If it's, if it's short of the 20, they get it on the 40.

[C]

That's what I'm saying.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

40 yard line, you wouldn't do that. You're already in field goal range for the Dallas kicker.

[B]

Well, that's what I'm saying. This new kicking ball, you're now 60 yard field goals are there. So you get the ball in the 35, you've got to go 15 yards for a game winning field goal. As we saw with the Giants and Cowboys last week, that was a massive field goal that nobody, five years ago last year maybe even nobody runs their kicker out for that at 64 yards on second down. Whenever they kicked it, they were trying to get a few extra yards. No, 60 yards is easy for some of these guys. At least the distance putting it between the uprights is this, it's 50 yards used to be like, oh boy, they're probably not going to hit this. It used to be a guy with 50.

[D]

50.

[E]

Yeah, maybe.

[B]

What was it, 15%? Maybe. And these guys were kicking two, three 50 yard plus kicks a year. They've already kicked eight field goals longer than 57 yards this season in two weeks. Last year that number was eight for the season. They've already made eight this year. That's remarkable. And does it change as a gambler, Dave, as somebody who looks at this and says, man, this is, this is over. Unders like, it's like the gambling community has got to be looking at this going, this just changed the whole game.

[C]

Well, it seems like, you know, sometimes I just take the opposite opinion just to be the big dick here.

[B]

Yeah, but you're great at it.

[C]

Yeah, it's fantastic. But, but I will say this now, if, if, if you can kick a 60 yard field goal to tie it, the game is never, you're never out of the game.

[D]

No.

[E]

Right.

[C]

So there's, there's, you are, you're going to be hanging in there until the last minute of the game.

[B]

But isn't it a disservice to the game?

[C]

We can go back to. You can't throw a forward Pass. Let's go back to the.

[B]

I mean there's, there's, I mean that's an obvious easy one. But I mean if they, if they made the football easy, like again, you go back to the deflated ball. He made the, the football for the offense was easier to throw or they put a fin on the back of it so quarterbacks could throw 90 yards. It changes what we've watched for years into this, like defense doesn't matter, which I think is the goal.

[C]

This game is not anything like the game I grew up with. No, in the 70s, the game has been changing and now you can't, like you just said, you can't hit a quarterback in there. You can't brush the guy's head.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

You can't even, even wave at his.

[B]

And that's because they're getting 60 million a year. So you've got to do that.

[C]

But so the game is changing.

[B]

I love that the NFL changes, but sometimes they change. And is this one of those changes? They have to go, all right, this one's not good. People don't like 63 yards.

[C]

I would rather watch them kick 100 yard field goals and be able to hit the quarterback. I think that's part of the game. I know.

[B]

What would you need a quarterback for if you've got a hundred yard field goal?

[C]

If he gets hurt, then put another guy in. And if you're worried about the guy getting hurt, protect him, make sure he's not hurt. Yeah, I mean, that's part of the game. I didn't play to Dale's level, but again, as I said, I could have played in college. And for me, the defense, when I play defense, I'm about trying to hurt their guy.

[B]

Explode that.

[C]

Yes, yes, I am. And that to me, that's part of the game. There is Dale. I don't know where you think on this and I want to hear your opinion, but to me, intimidation is part of the game. It was when I played. Want to intimidate people. You want to make them feel like they might get lit up that next play. Intimidation is part of the game in my eyes and right now it's out of it.

[B]

Well, I wonder how much I want to hear daily. Well, I wonder how much since they've protected people, what the statistic is on how it's worked. Because every year we're talking about quarterbacks that are out, that are out and everything else.

[D]

Yeah, well, the same thing is with the preseason. Oh, don't play, don't play anybody. Don't play. Anybody? Well, how many quarterbacks are out this week?

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

How many starting quarterbacks? Yeah, there's a ton already. So why, why not play then preseason? I'm with you. The intimidation factor. Yes. You knew my first game ever was against the 1985 Chicago Bears. I called my dad after the game and said, I don't think I'm cut out for this. If every NFL team is like that.

[B]

Horrifying.

[D]

I'm, I'm, I'm, I don't think I can, can handle this stuff. But they intimidated you.

[C]

Yes.

[D]

And that, that was part of it. Whenever you talk about a fit, whether it's fighting, whether it's boxing, whether it's mma.

[B]

The mental physics. Yes.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

And if you win that battle before the game starts or before the match starts. Yeah, you got to one up on.

[B]

But going back to what we're saying and tying this together, if you've got a, if you've got to go 15 yards to get in field goal range and you can't hit a quarter, let that dude run twice. He gets two eight yard scrambles on the dude. All you got to do is scramble out to these five receiver sets, have him run all the way down the field. You got a three man rush and everybody. And then he just jumped forward seven or eight yards twice, and you're in field goal range. They've got to fix that because I don't think that is competitively interesting.

[D]

I told John, I went through two things in my career. The fact that when I first got in the league, the kicking balls were what the quarterback used. They were worn in. They banged them against walls and all that, and guys could kick him a little further. Then they said, hey, enough of that.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

So they introduced the K ball, which was only used for the kicking. You'd see people scrambling.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

Kicking a field goal and get the kicking ball out there that was just straight out of a box. You know, it wasn't worn in. It's harder to kick it. It's harder to kick it for distance. And you brought something up earlier that they might. Because the one thing I think is great about the NFL, they, they will look at someone go, you know what, we made a mistake here. And we'll go back to something.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

That's one thing. When Goodell talks about stuff, he's like, ah, we're still analyzing the dynamic kickoff. It's got some flaws we're seeing. And I like that they do that. I just think this kicking ball this year has made it so that Dallas game would have Been more interesting to me if they didn't.

[C]

If you're really concerned about that, I'll give you the answer. They can change right now.

[E]

What is it?

[C]

All right. If you kick it out of the end zone, you start at the 20.

[B]

I'm fine.

[C]

You start 25. Who's starting at the 35 or 40? That's an asinine.

[D]

They want more kickoffs because they're. Because they're exciting.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

It used to be where you. That's when you go to the bathroom.

[C]

I get that.

[D]

So. So.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

There are. There are ways around it. And I do kind of like the idea that if it lands before the goal line, if you don't return it, you're. You're getting killed. It's 20 and you got a chance because these guys aren't running. You got four seconds before they're going to be on you.

[D]

Right.

[B]

But you got to catch it on the goal line. If you don't, it's trouble. You can't just let it roll through.

[D]

Through.

[B]

There's, you know, there's some things that are good and some are bad. I just think the competitive advantage of having an offense have to lead a team to a reasonable field goal because we're looking at 70 yard line, 50 yard line is.

[D]

Is you can attempt to.

[B]

They should make it so you can't kick one until you're on the other side of the field.

[D]

That. Or.

[C]

Or you just shrink this width of the goal.

[D]

I guess. I say you could go indoor football league on the goal post.

[B]

That's not a terrible idea. All right.

[C]

There's things you can do. And, And I promise you this. They won't do anything until everyone is screaming about it. Because they are.

[B]

Yeah, they're.

[C]

They're the least proactive business.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

On the planet.

[B]

You got grumpy at that. Jeez. All right, before we go other sports, we should talk about. Dale and I talked about this last week. The Dodgers, no hitter in the seventh inning. Glass now is like, that's 105 pitches. I'm done here. And the fans, you know, again, this was on the heels of having a no hitter three days earlier with the Dodgers 8 1/3 innings and they lose the game in the ninth, walking in runs. And then four days later, Glass now goes out for six innings, throws no hitter for. I'm going to sit out. It's 105 pitches. I don't know if he wanted back in, but Dave Roberts pulled him. Almost lose that. Then again, the other night, Shohei Ohtani goes Six innings, no hit. Pull him, save him.

[E]

Them.

[B]

This is killing me for fans. We. I went to a game for the Diamondbacks yesterday and Brandon fought, had a no hitter going and then a one hitter through a zero zero. And he went the eight innings like he went. But it was like, look, we're in a 00 game here. We gotta be smarter than this. When do they start thinking of the fans rather than these analytics for that?

[C]

Dave, I think, I think you forget about fans. It's just.

[B]

Can I use the word stuff?

[C]

Can I use the word pussification of America?

[B]

Yes, it is that. I think that's true.

[C]

That's it.

[B]

It really is.

[C]

How many? I mean you don't have to go back in my lifetime, guys with Nolan ryan threw like 383innings.

[B]

We talked about it last week. 235 pitch, 13 inning performance. You know, we didn't talk about last week with that was. It was, it was a like a 33 game. The guy pitching for the other team was Louis the. He went 13 innings as well and threw over 200 pitches.

[C]

Did people's arms become less strong?

[D]

There's more surgeries now and less innings. Correct. And what's that correlation?

[B]

They both pitched three days later. I don't understand this 105 being the magic number. I don't, I know the analytics, they don't go through the third time in the lineup. The dude's thrown 85 pitches, 100 pitches. They haven't seen his whole arsenal.

[C]

I will give a team a fact that the more you see the pitcher, the more you're going to zero in him. But, but if he's, but if he's throwing a one hitter or no hitter, they don't got it.

[B]

Shohei left the game, it was 68 pitches through six innings and a no hitter and he sat at out. And now granted he had Tommy John surgery last year. So they're scared to death at the $700 million man.

[D]

And he does other things and he's.

[B]

Yeah, they cannot risk this again.

[C]

But do you think if I just sat behind the dugout and ragged on the. The players and the manager about how they're all weenies, that after a while they're just going to go, all right, shut up. We'll let, we'll get them back out there.

[D]

No, because they're going to say analytics say why in the world.

[C]

I mean if we as a society and fans say this is nonsense. You got. Why are we watching non men play a sport that should be played by Men.

[B]

That's right. Yes, that's right. I need some political music for this. I need a little Team America action. Behind you there. That's beautiful, David. It's glorious.

[D]

All right.

[B]

The Ryder Cups this week, I believe, as well. The golf course next week. Okay, next week. Very exciting. We'll talk about the next. And of course, the big thing everybody's talking about out. It's a WNBA playoff Mercury title, one one coming back. Let me talk about a team that has a PR problem. Let's start our playoffs the same week the NFL gets going and play a.

[D]

Bunch of them on Sunday, Sunday afternoon.

[C]

I don't think. I think that's actually very wise.

[B]

Why?

[C]

Because no one. No, no real man is watching the wnba.

[B]

No one's watching the wnba.

[C]

But you're gonna find. I think WNBA has a niche audience of a lot of lesbians.

[B]

Yeah, that's right. A lot of people do watch.

[C]

They don't watch men's stuff.

[B]

I think they do. I think what you're saying is butch women don't watch football. And I disagree.

[C]

Well, there's the lipstick lesbians.

[B]

Pretty ones, maybe not.

[C]

And they're like. And they're gonna make the butch lesbians watch the wnba.

[B]

All right, here we go. All right, the end of this show. We got there. We still. One last segment here. That's the end of this sports thing. I am John Holmberg host, the wildly successful morning sickness on 98 KUPD. Dale Hellistrate joins us. He's a three time Super bowl champion and also has another show he does.

[D]

Called the Main Event. The wildly successful Main Event.

[B]

You can claim that to be true. I think maybe with all that's going on, you better be careful. We're FCC regulated. I don't know if we are, but they'll shut you down for that misinformation. And of course, it is time now for the last five minutes of the show. We call this lunatic with a bullhorn. And here he is, the madman himself, Dave Nash. Take it away with your theory.

[C]

Well, I was greatly affected by Charlie Kirk's death. I think a lot of people were. And if you think it was just some snot nosed kid that has a trans boy girlfriend or whatever you want to call it, and it wasn't. It wasn't a bigger, larger organization behind that. I think you need to look into that.

[E]

You do?

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

I think the Deep State is behind.

[C]

Either Deep State or the Mossad.

[B]

Okay. And again, four reasons.

[C]

Charlie Kirk had a lot of influence with young kids. He had recently come out and started to question what was going on in Israel. He was Starting to question October 7, the tragedy where Hamas allegedly came in and attacked Israel. Listen, if you know anything about Israel, that border is the most heavily fortified border in the universe. In the universe. If a beetle crawled across the border, they would know about it. Yet people in pickup trucks, hang gliders. Hang gliders are coming over and nobody did anything. Nobody knew anything. I think everyone in Israel owns a machine gun and yet nobody knew anything.

[B]

So you're saying there is no reason to believe what we're being told about what happened for real in the Utah Valley University.

[C]

Absolutely.

[B]

And do you have a theory again.

[C]

Charlie Kirk is actually, and this was reported that Bibi Netanyahu went to him and said, we will support you with $150 million. And he, he turned them down. And, and Netanyahu wanted that because he wanted Charlie Kirk to be less.

[B]

To influence the people he talks.

[C]

Correct.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

So buying his.

[C]

Correct. And Charlie Kirk said thanks, but no thanks. And then I think they really.

[B]

Yeah. Dave Nash, not as loony as normal, but still not touching that with a ten foot.

[C]

Listen. Yeah, listen. I don't know.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

I don't know.

[B]

You have questions, but, but.

[C]

Right. And, and everything. Generally there's things I do know, but this one I don't know. But this has happened before. If you think John F. Kennedy was killed by Oswald alone.

[B]

See, I do.

[C]

Oh, okay.

[B]

After all the studying and all the things that went into that. I think that just, it's, it's humans inability to accept that one guy can pull that off.

[C]

Oh, one guy can pull it. But, but, but that was way bigger than that. And that there's so much information on Kennedy and the same thing with Robert F. Kennedy. Same thing with Martin Luther King.

[D]

Sorry.

[C]

All of that. Those things are going on. That's not generally just crackpots. No, it's not.

[B]

It's interesting. And this is what Charlie Kirk was all about. I say you let lunatics like Nash speak and you hear them.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

You don't quiet them.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And you let people who say things you absolutely hate or disagree with say them.

[C]

I didn't follow Charlie Kirk. I didn't listen to all this stuff. But when, you know when stuff would come up and on. If you're on your phone and it's him speaking. The, the things I saw, I never argued with. I love the guy. And I was really.

[B]

It affected you.

[C]

I was really affected by it. But I will tell you this. If someone wants to talk badly about him.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

Or or. Or. Or be negative about him. I. I don't. They have that right to do salute the flag when they do speech.

[E]

Yep. Agree.

[C]

You have free speech. I would want to know who these lunatics are so I can stay away from. But they should have the right to say what they want. We all should have that right. As soon as we don't have it, we don't have a country.

[B]

Listen to that. Dave Nash, everybody.

[D]

We missed it.

[B]

That was. I know. I do miss that. That wasn't as loony as it's normally.

[D]

Pretty well stated.

[E]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

Look at you.

[E]

All right.

[B]

My name is John Holberg. There's Dale Hell, and there's the lunatic Dave Nash. That's the sports thing. We're done. Once again.