How Did This Get Made? — "Reindeer Games" w/ Howard Kremer (HDTGM Matinee)

Date: December 2, 2025
Hosts: Paul Scheer, June Diane Raphael, Jason Mantzoukas
Guest: Howard Kremer (with additional participation from Ben Schwartz)

Overview: A Holiday Heist Gone Hilariously Wrong

This festive episode of HDTGM dives into the 2000 action "classic" Reindeer Games—an ill-fated heist flick starring Ben Affleck, Charlize Theron, and Gary Sinise, and directed by John Frankenheimer in his last film. In dubious holiday spirit, the panel (with guest Howard Kremer) gleefully unpacks the movie's baffling plot twists, cringey romance, questionable casting, and abundance of wet kisses and Santa suits—all while pondering: How did this get made and who was this for?

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Release Date Blunders and Holiday Movie Irony

• The film missed the mark as a Christmas movie: Released in late February, months past the holiday season it’s supposedly anchored to.
  • Jason Mantzoukas [03:22]: "It came out February 25th. It missed the Christmas mark."

2. John Frankenheimer’s Legacy: A Rough Farewell

• Panelists lament Frankenheimer's reputable career coming to an end with Reindeer Games, after classics like The Manchurian Candidate.
  • Jason Mantzoukas [02:53]: “He directed some great movies in the past ... and it all ended with this Ben Affleck movie.”
• Charlize Theron's well-publicized regret about the film is brought up for comic effect.
  • Jason Mantzoukas [35:22]: "Charlize Theron publicly came out and said, this is a very, very bad mov. ... I only did it because John Frankenheimer did it..."

3. Graphic Sex and Weird Kissing

• The panel fixates on the movie’s bizarre and weirdly explicit sex scenes—especially between Ben Affleck and Charlize Theron—and the abundance of what they deem "gross" open-mouthed kissing.
  • June Diane Raphael [04:32]: "You don't normally see the part of the man that connects from the woman waist to the upper butt cheek. It's like a weird area."
  • Ben Schwartz [05:09]: "They fuck so much that they fall asleep on the floor next to the bed. ... The only thing in this room is a bed."
  • June Diane Raphael [05:49]: "A lot of open-mouthed kissing. That's very disgusting. ... Super wet, wide kisses that are not appealing."

4. The Absurd, Convoluted Plot

• The hosts break down the Rube Goldberg heist plot, featuring identity swaps, fake deaths, and double/triple crosses.
  • Howard Kremer [10:21]: “This plan could get. It had so many moving parts.”
  • Ben Schwartz [29:56]: “Double double cross. Nick, the prisoner who was Ben Affleck's best friend in prison is not dead. ... And the whole thing has been a con on Ben Affleck.”

Major Plot Confusion:

• Multiple rounds of trying (and failing) to keep track of who knew what, when, and why.
  • June Diane Raphael [33:01]: "Guys. I'm completely caught up in a reindeer game right now. I've really lost."
  • Howard Kremer [33:09]: "Even the screenwriters didn't bother to figure this out."

5. "Rudy" and the Rudolph Parallels

• Epiphany strikes as the group realizes the not-so-subtle Christmas symbolism: Ben Affleck’s character is named Rudy and his cellmate is Nick, paralleling Rudolph and St. Nick.
  • Jason Mantzoukas [17:00]: “Well, his name is Rudy.”
  • June Diane Raphael [17:31]: “Nick. Nick.”
  • Ben Schwartz [17:16]: “That's the amazing. Holy shit. My mind just imploded.”

6. Tone and Genre Mash-Ups Gone Awry

• Uneasy tonal shifts from grim violence to slapstick, and nonsensical comic relief moments (ordering pay-per-view and minibar blows through $1,200; [50:05]).
  • Howard Kremer [49:57]: "Another egregious tone shift where you're scared for this guy's life, and then all of a sudden, he's just dicking around and... toothless villains."

7. The Santa Heist and Other Visual Hilarity

• The gang rips into the image of multiple armed Santas robbing a nowhere casino on the least busy night of the year.
  • Howard Kremer [50:56]: "A closet full of neatly hung Santa suits."
  • Jason Mantzoukas [52:13]: "The plan is walk in and shoot the police. Guess who you don't need for that? Ben Affleck."
• The squad notes that dressing Ben up as a cowboy to “conceal his identity” felt more Foghorn Leghorn than tactical genius.
  • Jason Mantzoukas [34:27]: "Like a comical cowboy outfit. Like, almost like if Foghorn Leghorn had formal wear..."

8. Action Logics and Indestructible Affleck

• Absurd violence with no real consequences; Affleck "recovers so easily from brutal beatings" ([14:06]) and escapes danger despite constant, improbable peril.

9. Rip-Roaring Memorable Quotes & Banter

• The episode is full of instantly quotable, deeply silly banter—where the confusion over plot and character motivations often becomes the bit itself.
• Ben Schwartz [33:35]: "Now, that was amazing."
• Howard Kremer [59:49]: "He dispatches Charlize Theron. She's on the hood of the car and she goes over the cliff. And then now it's time to get rid of the real villain, her brother. And it's just the same exact thing. Just sends him over the cliff. Same two deaths right in a row."
• June Diane Raphael [58:17]: "A lot of casino workers were killed."

Notable Quotes (w/ Timestamps)

• On missing the holiday release:
  Jason Mantzoukas [03:22]: “It came out February 25th. It missed the Christmas mark.”

• On sex scenes:
  June Diane Raphael [04:32]: “You don't normally see the part of the man that connects from the woman waist to the upper butt cheek... It was very weird, that sex scene.”

• On embarrassing TV-inspired attempts at French kissing:
  Jason Mantzoukas [06:30]: “I tried to French kiss my mom when I saw the Love Boat one time.”

• On the baffling heist plan:
  Ben Schwartz [10:28]: "At any point something could have gone wrong. ... It's impossible to have been executed."

• On the “Reindeer Games” title:
  June Diane Raphael [15:41]: “I've never heard the expression reindeer games.”

• On Rudy/Rudolph/Nick/Saint Nicholas parallels epiphany:
  Jason Mantzoukas [17:13]: “Rudy just, this got interesting.”

• On comic violence:
  Jason Mantzoukas [54:42]: “Shoots some quick rum at him and lights this guy on fire. In the most Hollywood I’m-on-fire... Like, special effects are amazing.”

Important Segments (w/ Timestamps)

• Introduction & Holiday Movie Setup: [01:38–03:53]
• Discussion of Frankenheimer’s Directorial Career: [03:02–03:22]
• Sex Scene & Romance Analysis: [04:08–07:25]
• Prison Break-Down (“Monsters in the Gelatin”): [09:10–10:47]
• Plot Confusion, Twists Galore (“You guys, wait… I’m in a reindeer game now”): [29:55–33:35]
• Symbolism Revelation (“Rudy” ≈ Rudolph, “Nick” ≈ St. Nick): [16:44–17:39]
• Comic Relief Moments—Minibar, Pay Per View: [49:46–50:17]
• Heist Preparation—Santa Suits Reveal: [50:47–51:27]
• Casino Robbery Execution: [52:22–53:13]
• Ridiculous Deaths & The Santa Suit Problem: [55:44–57:16]
• Final Scene, "Robin Hood" Ending: [57:28–58:41]
• Second Opinions—Five Star Amazon Reviews: [61:22–64:22]

Memorable Moments & Running Jokes

• The hosts' ongoing struggle to keep track of plot twists.
• Extended riffing on the awkward, overly wet on-screen kissing.
• The sudden realization that character names are not-so-subtle Christmas references.
• Howard Kremer noting repetitive deaths-by-cliff ("same two deaths right in a row" [59:56]).
• The debate over whether Charlize Theron's 50% store discount is even plausible.
• The future-past shock of Ashton Kutcher’s silent cameo.
• Running joke about panelists getting "caught up in a reindeer game" whenever the plot gets too convoluted.

Takeaway: Did They Recommend Watching It?

Unanimous consensus: Watch only for absurdity—fast forward liberally, or just listen to the podcast instead.

• Jason Mantzoukas [70:34]: “I wouldn't think it's a necessity to see it. I think you could pass on it. I think if you want to watch that Icefall scene is pretty good. And maybe the end is pretty good too.”
• Ben Schwartz [70:43]: “Yeah, you can watch. This is a watch while fast forwarding.”

Final Thoughts

Reindeer Games is dissected as a holiday heist movie that utterly misses on tone, timing, believability, and basic coherence—making it prime fodder for comedic discussion. The hosts embrace the chaos, turning plot confusion and cinematic missteps into a rollicking, laugh-out-loud breakdown perfectly tailored to fans of bad movies and schadenfreude-laced holiday cheer.

For more hilariously bad cinema recaps, check out new episodes of HDTGM every Friday.