
Jean Claude Van Damme’s directorial debut was 1996's The Quest, a.k.a. a more watered-down version of Bloodsport that takes place in the past and is not nearly as good. JCVD aficionado Jon Gabrus (Staying Alive, Action Boyz) helps Paul, June, and Jason discuss Old Man Van Damme, French clown Van Damme, if men should be flexible, the blimp, the child street gang, and so much more. (Ep. #133 Originally Released 04/01/2016)
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Paul Scheer
Let me tell you something, people.
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Paul Scheer
It's like Bloodsport meets Bloodsport, but in the past and with slightly less kicks to the balls. We saw the quest, so you know what that means.
John Gabrus
Now it's time for.
Jason Manzoukas
Me. Let's follow in the mediocrity of subpar art.
John Gabrus
Perhaps we'll find the answer to the question, how did this get Made?
Paul Scheer
Hello, people of Earth, and welcome to how did this Get Made? I am your host, Paul Scheer, joined as always by Jason Manzoukas. How are you, Jason?
Jason Manzoukas
I'm good. Paul, how are you?
Paul Scheer
Very good. And June, Diane Rayfield.
Sponsor/Ad Voice
How are you, June?
June Diane Raphael
I'm good. How are you, Paul?
Sponsor/Ad Voice
Very good, thank you for asking.
Paul Scheer
We have a very special guest joining us today.
Jason Manzoukas
Guys, dial down the heat.
Paul Scheer
You know, look, you know, we can't control. We can't control the chemistry that's coming out of these microphones.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, God. Everybody listening is just so turned on.
Paul Scheer
June, I hope you have a great podcast.
June Diane Raphael
Thanks, you too, Paul.
Paul Scheer
Thank you so much.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, God. Get a room. Great. Now everybody's pushing. Pause to just jack it.
Paul Scheer
And that is our hope that you do this at least three times during this episode.
Jason Manzoukas
Welcome to the Jackcast of How did this get made?
Paul Scheer
I actually think we were written up on the Onion AV Club as a podcast to jack it.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Paul Scheer
It's.
Jason Manzoukas
They have podcasts and now they have podjack. Yeah, podjack. All the pods work.
Paul Scheer
We do not have that. We don't.
Jason Manzoukas
Guys, we don't. Much as they like you to believe that we have something for podjacking. We do not.
Paul Scheer
Now back to our coverage of Gimlet Shows. We have a very special guest today. You might know him from Guy Code. You might know him from the TV show Younger or his podcast High and Mighty. I consider him a Jean Claude Van Damme aficionado. Please welcome John Gabrius.
John Gabrus
Oh, thank you for having me, Gabriel. Good to see you, everybody.
Jason Manzoukas
A long time coming.
John Gabrus
Oh, yeah. And I consider myself a Jean Claude Van Damme aficionado as well.
Paul Scheer
Well, when I wrote you to tell you to ask you to come on the show and I told you the movie, you said no.
Jason Manzoukas
You told him.
Paul Scheer
I told him you come on this show.
Jason Manzoukas
That's Paul Scheer right there. He writes and he says, you're coming on the show.
Paul Scheer
I dictate it. Well, people were. There was an uproar because we just did Bloodsport. That was the last episode we did,
John Gabrus
and they said, we're gonna see Uproar in.
Jason Manzoukas
It was an uproar. It was a small.
Paul Scheer
A podcast uproar that you were not involved in the Bloodsport episode because of your Die Hard love of Bloodsport.
John Gabrus
Die Hard, Bloodsport fan, Die Hard JCVD fan, Seagal all what you think this is your jam. Yeah. I was born in 1982 and the early 90s to late 90s. I was taking karate classes.
Paul Scheer
I'm all with you.
John Gabrus
My dad had a ponytail. Like, we were just. I was full blown martial arts white trash. That's why I was obsessed with.
Jason Manzoukas
I love that part of your. Part of your backstory involves your dad having a ponytail.
John Gabrus
Because I started taking. I started taking karate classes and a ponytail, and then he joined after watching one of my karate classes.
Paul Scheer
That's amazing. That's like. And we're both from Long island, and that's a very Long island dad thing to do. Now I'm getting into it.
Jason Manzoukas
Can I ask you guys a question, though? Do you think your dad got into it because he couldn't handle the idea that you might be able to beat him at something? And he was like, oh, I gotta learn these skills so if he comes after me, I can shut this kid down?
Paul Scheer
Yeah, he can't Be the man of the house.
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah. Too early.
John Gabrus
He's going to get me back for beating me all those years.
Paul Scheer
My dad. I took a karate class in Long island, but my dad was a dad who was like, we should get out of this one, because the dojo closed down. Then the guy started doing classes in his house. And one of the classes was he had a bucket of sand.
John Gabrus
Oh, the hand tub.
Paul Scheer
And the hand. Yeah, the hand. And my dad's like, what do we do? I'm not paying to put your hand in a bucket like a straw.
Jason Manzoukas
I don't even know what that is.
John Gabrus
My karate classes were in a dude's garage in Freeport, and he was a Vietnam vet.
June Diane Raphael
But I learned in the bucket of sand that you were.
Paul Scheer
Well, it's like. It's strength testing, right?
John Gabrus
It's like sand in the bucket. And you just put your. And you press your hands into it over and over again to toughen up your joints and the skin on your hands.
Jason Manzoukas
So you're just like, burying your fingers in the sand.
John Gabrus
You're jamming your hand into the bucket of sand and pulling.
June Diane Raphael
It's like wet sand.
John Gabrus
No, it's dry sand.
Paul Scheer
Yeah.
John Gabrus
You're just trying to get us further and further in so that your fingers and hands toughen up and strengthen. Yeah, it's not a good idea, especially for a child.
Paul Scheer
A child should not be doing that.
John Gabrus
Yeah, it's like breaking boards.
Jason Manzoukas
I'd be much more into a wet sand hand jam than dry sand.
Paul Scheer
Hanging wet sand feels like you would break a finger.
Jason Manzoukas
I mean, I guess if you're a pussy, maybe you're right.
Paul Scheer
So when I asked you to do this podcast and I told you the movie, you replied by Saying it's your 11th favorite Jean Claude Van Damme film.
Jason Manzoukas
Can you run down the top 10? Do you know them?
John Gabrus
I don't off the top of my head. But I could tell you that literally almost everything up to including Double Team knockoff and Sudden death are all ahead of Quest in Death Warrant, Double Impact Hard. These are all like. These are some.
Paul Scheer
Universal Soldier one and two.
John Gabrus
Universal Soldier one and two. Cyborg, the precursor.
Jason Manzoukas
Street Fighter.
John Gabrus
Street Fighter was a bad movie.
Paul Scheer
Yeah.
John Gabrus
All these other movies. When I was a kid, though, all these other movies weren't bad to me.
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah, sure.
John Gabrus
You know what I mean? But I think this movie that we're about to talk about was like, for me, seeing my dad cry for the first time, it undid. Like, I was like, oh, maybe he's not good in anything.
Paul Scheer
Well, this is an interesting movie. Because there is something really amazing about Bloodsport. And we just talked about it a bunch and we didn't get to hear on Bloodsport, but you can maybe share some of it today. But it was great. Cause it's like the height of everything. But now this is kind of. And I was thinking about this on the way over. This is like Jean Claude Van Damme's independent movie. Like, it's like his. Like, he's making choices here. He's directing it.
Jason Manzoukas
Poorly. Poorly, I might add.
Paul Scheer
He has teamed up with Frank Dukes. And if you haven't read the article on Frank Dukes and slash film, it will blow your mind. But Frank Dukes again to write this. But it's very. It takes away all the fun of Van Damme, but then replaces it with, like, acting Van Damme.
John Gabrus
It takes everything that you liked about Blood. This is the dumb and dumberer of Bloodsport. Like, it takes everything you liked about the original and waters it down and makes. It's so, like, redundant. It's so repetitive. It's so similar to Bloodsport, but so worse. Like, it's not. There's not. It's not ratcheted up in any way.
Jason Manzoukas
Well, yeah, no, you would think the move would be like, okay, that worked. So let's take that and let's add this other thing and make it even better. No, let's subtract a lot of the interesting stuff. The splits, the buns, the, you know, like the bunches.
John Gabrus
There was no buns.
Jason Manzoukas
I thought the buns were splits.
June Diane Raphael
I was glad there weren't any splits. I learned something about myself watching Bloodsport, which is. I'm very uncomfortable and I'm looking at this. Don't worry. But I'm very uncomfortable seeing a man in a split.
Jason Manzoukas
Really?
June Diane Raphael
It does something to my insides where I feel like, stop.
John Gabrus
You have to turn away. When Paul is doing his practicing in the morning.
June Diane Raphael
The amount of flexibility in a man, I don't like to see.
Paul Scheer
Really?
Jason Manzoukas
You'd like your men to be unable to stretch very well. Now, let me ask you, honestly.
June Diane Raphael
Now, Paul has no flexibility in his legs.
John Gabrus
Yeah. Thank you. Yeah.
Jason Manzoukas
And we've heard the electric sexuality that is between you.
June Diane Raphael
His legs are like, we don't have
Paul Scheer
to get into my flexibility in this podcast.
John Gabrus
Yes.
Paul Scheer
I don't have great flexibility.
John Gabrus
We'll have pictures of Paul's legs in the show notes. Check them out.
Jason Manzoukas
That's why I love to show you.
June Diane Raphael
We've worked out together a bunch and the trainers are shocked that he has zero flexibility.
Jason Manzoukas
Well, that's why we don't.
June Diane Raphael
It's like tree trunk legs, like, they don't give. They don't go anywhere.
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah. I will say this is why we don't do video podcasts, is because Paul's. None of Paul's joints are flexible.
Paul Scheer
No, I am standing.
John Gabrus
Paul stands. He's leaning against the wall at like a 45 degree angle.
Paul Scheer
My legs are the size of Groots. I have two Groots for legs. And it's very difficult.
June Diane Raphael
I don't know what it is, but seeing a man in splits like that for so long. And it's interesting too, because I do like male gymnasts. I think that's a nice physique and I can appreciate that. But seeing him in splits was so upsetting to me. So I personally was happy that there wasn't any splits.
Jason Manzoukas
But let me ask you this, June. Do you mind? If you were to be in a yoga class or something and a guy was to show himself to be very flexible, would you find that unattractive?
June Diane Raphael
If I'm gonna be very honest, I
Jason Manzoukas
would ask you be only honest.
June Diane Raphael
I don't again, realize it.
Jason Manzoukas
Watching a symbol of a healthy body, the flexibility of one's joints, and you are like, no, thank you.
June Diane Raphael
Barf in a man. Yes.
John Gabrus
I don't. You're old school.
Narrator/Advertiser
Love it.
John Gabrus
That's old school. You're more of a Jim Varney gal now.
Jason Manzoukas
Let me ask you this.
John Gabrus
What if. Yes.
Jason Manzoukas
What if he's.
June Diane Raphael
I don't know why they're so flexible.
Jason Manzoukas
You don't know why? You don't know what is trans, why
June Diane Raphael
they're spending their time getting that flexible. But I don't like it.
Paul Scheer
It's a sign of a wasted life. Or a man not providing if he can be that flexible. He's like, clearly just working on himself, by the way.
June Diane Raphael
Maybe it's a primitive thing where I'm like, what's going on in your groins? Like, are you. What is happening?
Jason Manzoukas
Is your problem?
June Diane Raphael
Like, I don't know, is your problem
Jason Manzoukas
that you find flexibility to be feminine or you're worried they're hurting their dick and balls?
June Diane Raphael
Thinking I think maybe a little bit of both.
Jason Manzoukas
Interesting.
John Gabrus
It's like, puts you in a very weak, terrifying position to be that open. Like, your taint is completely like that. It just. You're smashing it onto the ground. Or.
Paul Scheer
I always think about how your balls feel because your balls at that point are hitting the ground before you're looking.
John Gabrus
Yours would.
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah.
Paul Scheer
Mine as you're going down. Like, Well, I guess if you're not doing it on the ground. He's always on chairs, I'm assuming.
Jason Manzoukas
Well, no, no, he does it on the ground too.
John Gabrus
You just sit on the.
June Diane Raphael
No, I've stretched Paul out number of times.
Paul Scheer
I don't know why.
Jason Manzoukas
Please continue.
Paul Scheer
I don't know why my flexibility is on trial here. This is not a show about how did this get stretched? Is our spin off show on hal and it's all about stretching, people.
John Gabrus
It's behind a paywall, but you're gonna love it.
June Diane Raphael
How do I stretch him? A number of times. And I have done it, and I want you to have given it my all. I haven't held back from trying to make you more flexible.
Jason Manzoukas
I have held that. You haven't. I haven't.
June Diane Raphael
I have not. I have not. I want you to know that.
John Gabrus
But aren't you a little concerned that he's gonna become too flexible and you're gonna lose it for him? No, no. You just need him to be functioning. You need to be able to bend down and pick up that soda can, please.
Paul Scheer
Yeah, I can bend down. Please don't. Don't think me of someone who can't bend down.
John Gabrus
You're like Rowan Gardner in Rookie of the Year.
Jason Manzoukas
A lot of people, I have noticed that you, in order to pick stuff up off the ground, you have one of those grabbers.
Paul Scheer
Yes, of course, but because it's just. It's cumbersome to get down and pick a penny off the. So, yes, also.
Jason Manzoukas
Also, like, maybe leave the pennies. I mean, like, if it's heads up.
Paul Scheer
If it's Jason. If it's heads up, then it's good luck. And I am not leaving good luck out there.
John Gabrus
Not until anybody else for my 12th TV show will I stop picking up pennies off the ground.
Jason Manzoukas
Get me my penny grabber.
John Gabrus
June, you asked, how are we with flexibility? I would like to say I am surprisingly flexible.
Sponsor/Ad Voice
Really?
John Gabrus
6 foot 2, 300 pound guy. It was. I. I did a lot of martial arts when I was a kid and was really into it.
June Diane Raphael
But you can't do.
John Gabrus
I can't do splits, but I can, like, I could sit in a full squat for a while. You know, I could do like the Paleo chair.
June Diane Raphael
I think it's just splits.
Paul Scheer
I can do that.
June Diane Raphael
I mean, Jason, can you do a split?
Jason Manzoukas
No, I can't do a split, but I am very flexible.
Paul Scheer
Really? How flexible are you?
Jason Manzoukas
I'm pretty flexible.
John Gabrus
He could do the French roll.
Paul Scheer
He could do.
John Gabrus
You can't do a split, but he could do the French oyster, which is a very.
Jason Manzoukas
I don't even know what that is. The French oyster.
John Gabrus
If there is anyone.
Jason Manzoukas
Sex position, it is.
John Gabrus
If there was anyone in the world I thought would know what a French oyster is, it would be you, Jason.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, man, I feel bad now.
John Gabrus
It's not a fingering position, so you don't have to pass.
Jason Manzoukas
But I'm a hard pass.
John Gabrus
I remember the French oyster from my parents. The Art of Love book.
Jason Manzoukas
You remember that?
John Gabrus
Like, they, like, had it up and I took it off the shelf one
Jason Manzoukas
time, like on an upper shelf when you were like, wait, there are shelves? There are books up here, guys.
June Diane Raphael
Yeah.
John Gabrus
For those of you listening to this, before the Internet, you used to have to jerk off to your mom's stolen books.
Jason Manzoukas
Yes. Or something new. Our bodies, ourselves.
Paul Scheer
Yeah.
John Gabrus
Yeah.
Paul Scheer
I just saw somebody walking around the other day, and I was like, how do you find this acceptable? It was like a black T shirt, and on the back it was just a bunch of sexual positions. And it was like, yeah. I guess when I was a kid, we were wearing these big Johnson T shirts, which were really funny.
John Gabrus
Soccer players do it for 90 minutes. Yeah.
Paul Scheer
But I just thought that was such a funny, crazy thing to be like, I'm gonna put this. I'm gonna put on my sex positions T shirt. I can't imagine.
Jason Manzoukas
I need people to know that I need a visual aid to tell me how to fuck, and I'm gonna put it on my body.
Paul Scheer
And it's basically treating other people like I help them.
John Gabrus
Right.
Paul Scheer
Because I know this. It's on my back for you.
Jason Manzoukas
I endorse this.
Paul Scheer
When you're waiting in line at 7:11, you can pick up a few pointers.
John Gabrus
Before I go in the room with my wife, I like to look at the back of my shirt and go, all right, number 6A is what I'm going to do in there.
Paul Scheer
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Paul Scheer
So, all right, this movie, like, going back to the idea that it is very much the same exact idea of bloodsport taking out a lot of the fun. It's eight years later and the first thing that. Well, first of all, it's a period movie.
John Gabrus
When I thought when that comes out, just 1920, I'm like, why does he have to do that?
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, I got excited.
John Gabrus
No. So I remember seeing this when I was a kid. The two things that broke my heart were PG 13. If they came up in a movie that I was about to watch, I got so mad because that means no tits, buns or murder.
Paul Scheer
Well, you could get buns in a PG13.
John Gabrus
You can get buns, I think for a quick.
Paul Scheer
Buns, dude.
Jason Manzoukas
Buns? Yeah, dude, buns.
Paul Scheer
But maybe it's a different time.
John Gabrus
And then when it said 1920, I was like, oh, fuck this movie.
Paul Scheer
Basically a period movie and an action movie. It's, you know, besides like the Untouchables or something, it takes away, you know, the fun is not gonna be there 100%.
Jason Manzoukas
Well, I mean, like, you know, there's a version of this movie like. Like I, for example, loved like the movie the.
Paul Scheer
By the way. I just thought of like 10 examples where I'm totally wrong.
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah. Like, I loved the movie Ong Bok.
Paul Scheer
Right, Right.
Jason Manzoukas
And that's like a period movie. Yeah, yeah. It's a Muay Thai fighting movie that's like amazing. Like, unbelievable fight sequences. And it's like, in the past, you know, in like, a distant past, blah, blah, blah. This could have had the fun of that. It simply did not.
Paul Scheer
Well, and. Well, go ahead.
June Diane Raphael
No, I was gonna say I did fall asleep for 15 minutes of the movie.
Paul Scheer
Yes. You didn't miss much.
June Diane Raphael
I have to. That's a major disclaimer. And I had a very hard time. I had a very hard time watching this movie. I was really checking out a lot. So forgive that. But I could not follow this. I could not follow what. I actually want someone to distill what.
John Gabrus
I do have a couple.
Paul Scheer
I do have a couple of plot point issues. I think before we even get into the main meat, we just have to talk about the opening scene, which is amazing.
Jason Manzoukas
You mean the bookend, old man?
Paul Scheer
Yeah, old Man Van Damme.
John Gabrus
You can tell that Van Damme directed this movie because he's trying. He's like, there must have been 20 things he wishes he could have done, and he does it all in this movie.
Paul Scheer
That's what I think is so fucking interesting about this movie. It's like, all right, here is. It's.
Sponsor/Ad Voice
I'm an action star, but this is
Paul Scheer
my chance to show people they're wrong about the muscles from Brussels. I'm also the actor from Brussels and the director.
John Gabrus
And the story by. From Brussels. Yes, he is.
Paul Scheer
And so he comes in an old man makeup. And then, you know, in this weird sequence with, like, a very prominent Schlitz sign, almost distractingly so. Giant neon sign.
John Gabrus
I thought when I saw that, I was like, oh, man. You get, like, brand sponsorship, and this movie could only get schliss. We'll give you 80 bucks if you put this neon sign up in the wall.
Paul Scheer
Or six packs and $80. So whatever you want. And then, like, characters that are straight up out of the warriors walk in.
John Gabrus
That's a great 90s movie trope, though. Is that the bad guys? Cause they didn't want to make them all black or all Latino in those gangs where it's just like one of each race and they all dress like cyberpunks.
Jason Manzoukas
Yes. That's like every movie.
John Gabrus
Yeah.
Jason Manzoukas
The most threatening they are is a switchblade.
John Gabrus
Yeah, they always have a switch.
Jason Manzoukas
Come on, old man, give us the money.
John Gabrus
And they come in a FR of a second after Jean Claude Van Damme does.
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah.
Paul Scheer
In an empty bar. That doesn't seem like, by the way, even if they took the till of
Jason Manzoukas
that bar, what are they taking, like 25 bucks?
John Gabrus
Yeah. Why don't I put a little bit of whiskey in that coffee? I was like, who the fuck is this actor?
Paul Scheer
Yeah.
John Gabrus
He's, like, looking down the barrel saying,
Paul Scheer
not fair to Irish people in this movie either, because he's a little Irish in that movie. And the cops are super Irish.
John Gabrus
But that whole. I mean, I don't want to keep pounding forward, but after this scene where we see old Van Damme, we see the other Van Damme that he always wanted to be. French clown.
Jason Manzoukas
French clown Van Damme.
Sponsor/Ad Voice
Yeah.
Jason Manzoukas
Arlecchino Van Damme.
John Gabrus
That was when I was. I remember seeing this when I was a kid. First of all, this came out the same year as bloodsport2. How fucking weird is that? That they both came out the same year?
Paul Scheer
And he is not in Bloodsport 2.
John Gabrus
He's not in Bloodsport 2. This is like a spiritual sequel. It's the 10 Cloverfield Lane. And that broke my heart. I saw this one in the theaters. Bloodsport. I watch on vhs. I saw this in the theaters. And when I. When my fucking idol, the Muscles from Brussels. This guy's such a big. When he shows up in clown makeup and, like, fucking period gear.
Jason Manzoukas
It's 1925 and he's on stilts. He's wearing, like, a newsy cap and has, like, French clown. Like a face. Like a Marcel Marceau face.
John Gabrus
Yes. Like mime face. Yeah.
Jason Manzoukas
And then he stands up and he is on stilts. And I just about lost my mind.
John Gabrus
It's just he so clearly wanted doing
Paul Scheer
a joke, too, because I feel like when he was sitting down, he's getting his shoe shine. But to be on stilts, I feel like in his mind, he's like, it's a joke.
Jason Manzoukas
He also is the leader of a gang of street children.
Paul Scheer
He's like a Fagan.
John Gabrus
He's a bad guy.
June Diane Raphael
Right.
Jason Manzoukas
Does he think he is a child dude?
June Diane Raphael
Well, I want to get into his journey for the entire movie. And this is why I was really baffled. Okay? And this is jumping ahead a little bit, but when we find out that his mother died and I guess sent him to America with a governess, who I think then abandoned him on the
John Gabrus
street, she just straight gives him a note and walks.
Jason Manzoukas
You wait right here. I'll be right back. Gonzo.
June Diane Raphael
But did anyone else. Are we supposed to believe that what she read was not actually in the note.
Paul Scheer
Because he picks it up.
Jason Manzoukas
He picks the note up. I thought he would at some point pull the note out of his pocket or something.
John Gabrus
At this moment, we should also probably say that none of this ever comes into play in the film whatsoever. This flashback is exclusively for Van Damme to work out. Mom. Shit.
June Diane Raphael
Strangest that. You have no idea why. I don't know what he's after for the entire movie. I really don't. I don't know. And again, maybe it was in the 15 minutes I missed, but it keeps on changing. Yeah, I don't know if he does really want to go back to America to be with the street children. I mean, is that it?
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah, I think he wants to go back to America to rescue the street kids.
John Gabrus
But by the way. But he does leave them for a couple of years.
Jason Manzoukas
Easily. But this is at a time where years meant nothing.
Paul Scheer
But here's my question. He seems to be the leader of a child gang, like Fagin. Like go out and rob the rich and bring it back to us.
Jason Manzoukas
Yes.
Paul Scheer
And that to me, seems like he's a bad dude.
June Diane Raphael
No, he's not a bad dude.
John Gabrus
No, no, that's like a. He's selling himself as a little bit of a Robin Hood situation, I think.
Jason Manzoukas
And he's stealing from like the mob.
John Gabrus
Yeah, he's okay.
Jason Manzoukas
He's stealing from the bad guys or whoever.
Paul Scheer
So he's a rob. Yeah. So, Robin, can we listen to Jean Claude Van Damme talk to children? Just.
June Diane Raphael
I don't think you can criminalize street children anyway. I mean, even if they were just stealing from.
Paul Scheer
Wait a second, so you.
June Diane Raphael
Because what you're implying is that like even Fag and the street children and Oliver are bad somehow for sure.
Paul Scheer
Well, I think Fagin is bad.
Jason Manzoukas
Okay, how are you don't think Fagin is bad?
June Diane Raphael
I don't really remember Fagan. I just remember I feel like Fagan's
Paul Scheer
like, hey, kids, work for me and I'll give you some food and stuff like that, but we'll steal money.
June Diane Raphael
Oh, okay.
John Gabrus
I feel like that's what he's doing.
Jason Manzoukas
At what age does a criminal. Does a child become a legitimate criminal? Junior.
June Diane Raphael
18.
Jason Manzoukas
18. Up until 18, kids can do whatever they want.
John Gabrus
Street kids. Specifically street kids. If you have a house.
Jason Manzoukas
Urchins, you're urchins. Your newsies, they could do whatever they want.
Paul Scheer
So their free will.
Jason Manzoukas
Your hoodlums, your no good vagrants, your hobos.
June Diane Raphael
How about your drive turkeys when they're tried as adults and not juvies.
Paul Scheer
Okay, so Juvies. Now, what we have not realized about June. Yes, I have a lack of flexibility. But June also was a juvie. She went to. How many years did you do a juvie?
Jason Manzoukas
A few. A few.
Paul Scheer
Wait, so you believe that as long as, like, these kids aren't criminals? Because they're not. They're only being told by Jean. Jean Claude's the criminal.
June Diane Raphael
I don't think he's a criminal. I don't know why you're saying any of them are criminals. He's trying to feed children.
Jason Manzoukas
Wait, but wait a second. He fights police. He, like, kicks a policeman in the face.
June Diane Raphael
Those. Okay, that police force, by the way, was opening up fire with machine guns on children.
Paul Scheer
That was the moss.
John Gabrus
That was the boss. That was the mob boss.
June Diane Raphael
Okay?
Paul Scheer
So by the way, I want to talk about that. The police were the ones like, all
John Gabrus
right, Dubois, get down off those things.
Jason Manzoukas
Everybody knows Chris Dubois.
John Gabrus
They're all Officer Krumkes, right?
Paul Scheer
They're all like, listen to the Irish. This is. Here are their voices. They're pretty great.
Jason Manzoukas
Dubois, I want you and your kids off the street. I mean it, Dubois.
John Gabrus
This is it.
Paul Scheer
So that's a little taste of, like, what their voices are like. But he. He.
June Diane Raphael
I don't want to get into, like, police politics here, but I do feel like to.
Jason Manzoukas
You don't think this is the place to. I don't think this is the place
June Diane Raphael
or the time, but to say, get your kids off the street. I mean, we're. Where should they go? What resources and services are available?
Paul Scheer
He's clearly a criminal that's running a child criminal.
John Gabrus
He's doing, like, a distraction for them to pickpocket people. Right. And I think that's what they're stealing
June Diane Raphael
from the mob and they're getting food,
Paul Scheer
but doesn't make a difference what they're doing with the money. They're still stealing it.
June Diane Raphael
Okay, well, show me the social services that are available to them.
John Gabrus
I can tell you this is pre New Deal. This is twenties. This is pre New Deal. This is pre New Deal.
Paul Scheer
So there's not a lot of.
June Diane Raphael
There's not a lot going on.
Paul Scheer
So it's okay to.
Jason Manzoukas
I believe, and I might be wrong, but I think that all of these boys that he's running with eventually mate with all of the girls that are in Annie.
John Gabrus
Yes, yes.
Paul Scheer
And by the way, I do want to be fair. Just. If you are listening to the podcast, you should know, and we put this disclaimer here, that June does run an organized group of children to do her bidding. And kind of stealing and stuff like that.
Jason Manzoukas
And because she knows that legally they cannot be held responsible for anything they do until they are 18.
Paul Scheer
What's the oldest person in your group?
June Diane Raphael
You remember, by the way, when we were watching the scene, I said, I will have to. If a child gets hurt here, I will have to leave the room and stop watching the movie. I mean, I felt so deeply for those little street urchins.
John Gabrus
But lucky for you, nothing in this film has consequences. That's true. Like literally.
Paul Scheer
Let's listen to JCVD talk to kids. This is a great speech. So they just come and they rob the mob and here's the. Here we go.
John Gabrus
Wow.
Paul Scheer
Did I tell you what?
Jason Manzoukas
We're rich
John Gabrus
with this, with my respect,
Jason Manzoukas
if we want something, we take it forever and ever. These are not good life lessons.
June Diane Raphael
I'm just realizing something right now.
John Gabrus
That's also not how money works.
June Diane Raphael
I think, and I hear now in this speech why you think he's a bad guy. But, but I do think what must have happened was that governess or whoever that was left town. He was a street kid, probably had his own gang. And those kids that he came up with, who knows what happened to them. And he just stayed within the community of street urchins.
Paul Scheer
And he like rose to the top
John Gabrus
as a bad guy as a 38 year old. He is not young in this movie.
Jason Manzoukas
Like, what. And by the way, what is going on? Like, who is he dating from this pool of children? Like, what's going on?
Paul Scheer
And he's basically saying, if we now we have money and now whatever we want, we're gonna take, not buy.
Jason Manzoukas
If we see something, we'll take it.
John Gabrus
This buys us respect. And then he goes forever and ever. These poor kids are being so misled. That's a bag with like $9,000 in it, which in the 20s, that's a lot of money. But that's not in perpetuity. They're not investing.
Paul Scheer
And there's like about 30 kids in there.
June Diane Raphael
Show me their road to opportunity. You know, I don't know where it is.
Jason Manzoukas
Every single one of these kids is on opium by the end of the movie. Like in the two years that he's away, they are all dead from opium.
John Gabrus
That's what's. Like you said you fell asleep for 15 minutes. I did not, but I thought I did because I kept going, like, wait a minute, how did he get to this island?
Paul Scheer
That's what I wrote.
John Gabrus
What about the kids? And I kept like going like, does he revisit America?
Jason Manzoukas
Every island they also keep giving us like time markers. Like when Roger Moore says to him, okay, there's gonna be a boat to take you back to America in a month. The next cut is six months later,
John Gabrus
and it's not even two. Van Damme, the cut you never see, they're like. When they. Now we're pushing ahead, but they're like, he's become a Muay Thai master. I'm like, we saw him carry bamboo. And then cut six months later. And he's like, you're the best fighter we've ever had.
Paul Scheer
And here's the other problem with it. The movie opens after the old man image. It opens with these scrolls being delivered all around the world.
Jason Manzoukas
And love, by the way, loved this.
Paul Scheer
The scrolls in the beginning.
Jason Manzoukas
My favorite is James Remar gets his scroll, inviting him to the match, and has to open it while wearing boxing gloves.
Paul Scheer
And the way that they deliver these messages, it's kind of great. Like, there's a dinner theater fighting experience
John Gabrus
where people are like the French guy in suspenders.
Paul Scheer
It's amazing. So, but everyone gets delivered these scrolls. And then I'm assuming because like, scroll, scroll, scroll, that when we see Jean Claude Van Damme, all of a sudden he's gonna have this run with the cops. And then someone's gonna be like, there's a scroll.
Jason Manzoukas
Yep.
June Diane Raphael
No, no.
Paul Scheer
Then he has a whole plot. He goes on a boat. Let's say, conservatively, he's on that boat for at least a month, maybe two months.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, much more than that.
John Gabrus
Enough to get that little.
Jason Manzoukas
From Thailand.
Paul Scheer
Right. Okay. From New York to Thailand.
John Gabrus
From New York City.
Jason Manzoukas
From New York City. He stows away on a boat, becomes a boat slave.
Paul Scheer
Yes.
Jason Manzoukas
For months.
Paul Scheer
So, okay, so we say, let's say conservatively, three months. All right, Conservatively.
Jason Manzoukas
All right, conserv. You're saying conservatively?
Paul Scheer
Yeah.
John Gabrus
Okay.
June Diane Raphael
Conservatively, three months pointed out on that boat. He's just simply moving like, oh, why is he moving?
John Gabrus
Wait, especially. That's clearly more than a month into the boat ride. They're like, you know what, let's get those sandbags. Rain today.
Jason Manzoukas
We gotta bring those bags downstairs.
John Gabrus
It's like, why they're running guns from New York York. Under the auspices that it's grains from New York. And that's the other crazy thing is Van Damme. They're like a 10 year old kid goes to Van Damme who just got shot, who was shot by a gangster,
Paul Scheer
who, by the way, took a great bullet. Ooh, it was a real kid.
John Gabrus
The reason he got caught was he Was looking through. They were arguing with Van Damme. And then he just shoves the boxes he's standing behind. It's not like a cliche, like where a cat makes a noise. He just shoves the boxes. The guy turns, shoots a child. And then the kid is hurt and he goes, fuck it, you gotta run. No, no, no. The mob is gonna get you. The mob doesn't kill kids. Cause they're the mob. Question mark.
Paul Scheer
And also, it's like they're gonna blame you, but there's mafia dudes all around. There's like machine guns that they're holding. It doesn't make any sense.
John Gabrus
And then he just gets on a boat and leaves these kids that all he cares about is taking care of them. And then he.
Paul Scheer
And conservatively, how long you say he's on that boat?
John Gabrus
Conservatively.
Paul Scheer
Yeah.
John Gabrus
See, I'm gonna go liberally, three and a half months.
Jason Manzoukas
Liberally.
John Gabrus
Liberally, three and a half months.
Paul Scheer
I do wan. I'm just gonna say, just for the
Jason Manzoukas
timeline argument, I'm gonna say, like, independently. Yeah, like four months.
Paul Scheer
Greenly, June, matter of factly, how long do you think you've done that boat?
June Diane Raphael
I don't know. I honestly thought it could have been years. Okay, so I had no idea.
John Gabrus
Now we know when you fell asleep.
June Diane Raphael
I didn't know. The whole marking of time in this movie was insane to me.
Paul Scheer
So he's on this boat for a number of months. He then goes to Muay Thai island for six months. We know that.
Jason Manzoukas
No, he's there longer than six months. There's just a six month jump. Oh, okay.
John Gabrus
To Roger Moore.
Jason Manzoukas
He doesn't leave immediately after that. He's still there, I think, for some period of time.
Paul Scheer
So, like, at least say we can argue that a year has passed from when the scrolls were delivered to when the fight begins, at least. And there seems to be like, it
John Gabrus
seems to be like James Remar. A year to get there. It took the fencer guy a year to get there.
Paul Scheer
It's not like they send those scrolls out, like, hey, in two years, come
June Diane Raphael
to the special wedding invitation.
John Gabrus
The other thing about this movie, there's not a better thing in the. For me as a, as an action movie fan, there's not a better thing than, like, look at all these different type, like, bloodsport doing it literally the best of, like, monkey man, sumo wrestler guy. These are such watered down versions of these badasses that they try to make a fat man standing up out of a hot tub seem intense.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, yeah.
John Gabrus
Like his tits bounce and it's like, dun, dun. He's like, Japan. It's like, wait a minute. That guy looks just like me. Like, I have the same exact body as that guy. And they're saying, like, oh, fuck.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, he. He's terrifying.
Paul Scheer
I mean, basically, they go to. I mean, the whole movie revolves around a stereotype fight. It's like, what stereotype from what country can we get away with?
John Gabrus
The Spanish guy who's doing the flamenco. That's not a martial art.
Jason Manzoukas
All his moves are flamenco based. He's crazy.
John Gabrus
He's doing spin kicks, not flamenco style. But he does stand with one arm. No, it's not.
Jason Manzoukas
Also, what this movie posits is that every single country has its own unique fighting style. You know what I mean? So that, like, Japan is represented by sumo, Brazil is represented by Capoeira. Like, Thailand is represented by Muay Thai. Like, every. Whatever.
John Gabrus
And then there's like, a British fencer, and he gets the scroll, and they're like, oh, P.S. you can't use a sword. So I hope you can translate fencing, which is literally not dangerous at all. I hope you can translate to that. To bare knuckle fist fighting, hardcore fist fighting. And then just.
Paul Scheer
I mean. And we're going out of order, but who cares? There's, like, the guy who he trains with on Muay Thai island who he doesn't seem to have a great relationship with. They don't really even show him a Mr. Miyagi relationship, which is, again, he's taken out all the things that make Bloodsport interesting. Yes.
June Diane Raphael
He didn't see him train unless I was asleep.
John Gabrus
No, that's when I thought I fell asleep, because I literally was like, okay, they're just at Hobbs. Lord Hobbs playing. You know, they must have just needed to get more Roger Moore screen time, to be honest.
Paul Scheer
By the way, Roger Moore, amazing in this movie. I am a big fan.
John Gabrus
I mean, he's great in everything.
Jason Manzoukas
And another. Another opportunity for him to pronounce the name Smith as Smythe.
Paul Scheer
Right.
June Diane Raphael
I have to ask, did you notice a difference between. I mean, I don't know Muay Thai that well, but I felt like I never saw a difference in the way he was fighting.
John Gabrus
No, that's what's crazy is. And the other crazy thing is that Hob says that's he's the best fighter I've ever seen. And he watched him do 30 seconds of his hands chained together, choking a guy on a butt while there was a gunfight going on. He's like, we're gonna sell him for big bucks. It's like, where the fuck did you get that idea from?
Paul Scheer
And why would you sell a guy who's a fighter to an island full of fighters? Like, we don't need any.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, I think. I think he was. He was basically like. Sold him onto Muay Thai island to be like, this guy's a fighter. You can use him. You can.
Paul Scheer
For what purpose?
John Gabrus
The whole island. I think they were just trying to get some bucks off him. They're trying to get some bucks.
June Diane Raphael
Made no sense. But then the guy he sold him to on the Muay Thai island. And again, maybe I was asleep, but it seemed like he felt he got the raw end of the bargain.
John Gabrus
Yes.
Jason Manzoukas
That's why he doesn't understand, I think, because it appeared in the beginning, like he thought maybe he'd paid too much for jcvd.
John Gabrus
He said about John Claude Van Damme, he's like, if he loses in the first round, this is not an investment.
Jason Manzoukas
Exactly.
John Gabrus
But that makes sense. There's so much shit. This whole part that they show him twice on Muay Thai island, once carrying bamboo sticks, watching guys kicking on the beach. And then they show him defend two kids, a kid from being bullied. That's the only time they show him on the island. There's no training sequence. How does this not have a moment where he's doing splits or learning Muay Thai? That's the biggest and best trope from these movies. He's his training montage.
June Diane Raphael
My problem with this movie. And again, maybe I was a. You know, important parts.
Paul Scheer
I will tell you, when you were
June Diane Raphael
asleep this, by the way, but it felt to me like never, you know, he was sold as a slave, it seems. Almost twice. Once to the boat. Yes. And then back to.
Jason Manzoukas
Well, he wasn't sold the first time. He was just a slave on the boat.
Paul Scheer
Because he was fine.
Jason Manzoukas
He was a stowaway.
June Diane Raphael
He was on the boat and then he was like a fighter slave to the guy in the Muay Thai island mti. Yes. But it seemed like, wow, if I was in that position, I would revolt against fighting. I would feel like fighting, to me, is being a slave. Cause he's really being trained as a
Jason Manzoukas
slave of the fight. But fighting. But fighting, I think is his only way out.
Paul Scheer
But wouldn't you make the argument that
Jason Manzoukas
if you're making a movie, otherwise you're just gonna be like, moving bamboo forever?
June Diane Raphael
But then he cares so much about fighting the rest of the movie, and I couldn't understand.
Paul Scheer
Get the gold dragon to free the kids.
John Gabrus
The motivation Makes no sense. He's like, once I get this gold Dragon, I split the money with this guy who's already sold me into slavery. Yes.
Paul Scheer
And he was untrustworth.
John Gabrus
And then I could take that money and bring it back to the kids who have all definitely been killed at this point.
Paul Scheer
And at this point, we're saying it's at least nine months, if not more conservatively. Conservatively.
Jason Manzoukas
This is what's even weirder is, okay, so Roger, James Bond, Roger Moore sells JCVD to the guy on Mti Muay Thai Island. Okay. Disappears. Six months later, Roger Moore comes back and he's like, oh, look, you're still here.
Paul Scheer
Hahaha.
John Gabrus
Oh, no.
Jason Manzoukas
I think six months later, Bangkok.
Paul Scheer
Bangkok Star even expect to see him,
Jason Manzoukas
but because JCVD is not just like, fighting normal fights, I guess. But then JCVD comes to Roger Moore and is like, this is where I got confused. He's like, do you know about the Lost City and this big secret fight?
John Gabrus
That whole exchange is like a who's on first?
Jason Manzoukas
Yes.
John Gabrus
It's like, lost City. Lost City. Golden Dragon. Golden Dragon. It's like, this is a fucking comedy sketch.
Jason Manzoukas
And it's like all exposition. And it basically sets up up the point of the movie, which we are like, conservatively one hour in now.
John Gabrus
Yes, dude, they set this up. They do the scrolls thing, then do 7 minutes, 17 minutes of Van Damme backstory, and then they're like, all right, remember that scroll thing now? It's.
June Diane Raphael
Why would he ever want to partner up with his previous owner?
John Gabrus
I know, right?
Paul Scheer
That's what he's so bad slave mentality.
Jason Manzoukas
He has no options.
Paul Scheer
That's like that. You get in that. You get in that zone that was it called the syndrome.
John Gabrus
Stockholm Syndrome.
Jason Manzoukas
Stockholm Syndrome.
June Diane Raphael
But then he goes so far as to even free them when they're enslaved later in the movie.
Paul Scheer
There's something so weird here, because my gut would be. Just simplify it. He's a guy who gets in trouble with the law, falls in the boat, has no martial arts training, goes to Muay Thai island, becomes an amazing fighter,
John Gabrus
and then fights that's the most.
Jason Manzoukas
And then fights as the representative of
John Gabrus
Muay Thai island because they've given him an identity. And then he's able to win the Golden Dragon and bring it back to the kids. I'm a new man. I learned martial arts.
Jason Manzoukas
Free all of Muay Thai island, then go and free all of the kids. He frees everyone instead. He's just like the pawn of con men.
June Diane Raphael
So you think everyone on Muay Thai island is a slave.
John Gabrus
I think they want to be there. I think they want to. They sound like they're a revolutionary group and that's why they buy the guns. Oh, oh, oh, that's true. I think they're like trying to do a coup.
Paul Scheer
But then why does the owner of Muay Thai island go when he finds out that JCVD is gonna fight in the big tournament? He's like, oh, why would you do that after all this training I just gave you? But then you cut to big fight tournament and he's got his own guy there too. Oh, fuck it. I mean, you know, I'm gonna, I'm gonna get. I'm a mid
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Paul Scheer
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John Gabrus
The other thing this movie's missing is how is he a good fighter? All we see is that he's a street performer. And then he's like a total.
Jason Manzoukas
And then everybody, James Remar, everybody is like, he's literally the best fighter I've ever seen.
John Gabrus
He gets always.
Jason Manzoukas
After like two small demonstrations of fighting.
John Gabrus
The James Remar scene you're talking about is a boxer squares up Van Damme kicks him in the leg and he goes, that's the best fighter I've ever been involved. It's like a boxer. You've never been kicked.
Jason Manzoukas
He is also James Remar.
Paul Scheer
This is where June fellas sight.
Jason Manzoukas
James remarried.
John Gabrus
He puts his life on the line.
Jason Manzoukas
Yes. He basically James Remar, who has been invited to the top secret Lost City fight. He's gotten a scroll cuz he's the heavy champion of the world.
Paul Scheer
By the way, James Remar is amazing in this movie. I want to play this scene. So basically James Remar gets one kick and he's like, I'm out of here. And he runs away into the desert.
Jason Manzoukas
Just to make sure. If people don't know James Remar, Dexter's dad. Oh, Dexter's dad. I know him as Richard, Samantha's boyfriend on the billionaire on Sex and the City.
John Gabrus
If you don't think I have the Sex and the City box set, I do. The one that comes in Lucite with a heel on it.
Jason Manzoukas
Worse. You're married, I'm not.
John Gabrus
Yeah, fair enough. But the show came out when I was like 17.
Paul Scheer
Let's listen to. This is the craziest moment. Because basically they steal James Remar's invite and again like his identity.
John Gabrus
Arguably they're like pretending to be him.
Paul Scheer
Exactly.
June Diane Raphael
So this is a piece of information I needed.
Paul Scheer
Yeah, this is where you now it all locks in.
Jason Manzoukas
What if you were like, oh, that makes entire sense.
June Diane Raphael
Everything's lined up.
Paul Scheer
So now take a listen to this. This is the craziest, in my opinion the craziest scene in the movie. Because now JCVD is like, I am Maxie. I am the American heavyweight champion of the world. And then this happens.
Jason Manzoukas
Maxi Divine of America.
Paul Scheer
He stands up. That's me.
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Paul Scheer
Then James Grimar walks in. Maxi Divine, heavyweight champion of the world. This man is a better fighter than me. And as the former heavyweight champion, I
Jason Manzoukas
turn my title over to him.
Paul Scheer
And he's carrying a belt on him.
John Gabrus
Yes.
Jason Manzoukas
This here's your man, Christopher Dubois.
John Gabrus
Dubois will be granted a chance to prove if he is a worthy combatant in the first round. This. If not, this is the. Crazy Divine shall pay the penalty and never leave the Lost City. What? What? What the fuck?
Paul Scheer
All right, that's good.
John Gabrus
I'm dupont. In that moment, I go, you know what? That seems like too much pressure, Maxi. You just fight.
Jason Manzoukas
Just jk. I will fight.
June Diane Raphael
So why does Maxey give up his own title, though? Just out of respect?
John Gabrus
Because he's.
June Diane Raphael
Respect.
John Gabrus
Because he lost. They sort of justify it. In the next line, he goes, I want to see the American flag flying at the end of this tournament. So what he means is he just wants America to win.
Jason Manzoukas
America as represented by Jean Claude Van Damme, who is definitively not America and
Paul Scheer
not fighting in an American style.
Jason Manzoukas
Right, Right.
Paul Scheer
Yeah.
John Gabrus
The thing about it is that he. What they're not saying is that Remar's like, oh, I didn't know you're allowed to kick in this thing. And I'm gonna be fucked. I normally just box. I wear gloves. I'm 50. I'm like, maybe conservatively 49 years old.
Jason Manzoukas
49 years old. I am the heavyweight champion of the world, but am maximum 175. Five, eight.
Paul Scheer
And no definition really either, to be fair. In 1920s.
John Gabrus
20s, like, pugilist style. Pull the waistband up above your chest.
Jason Manzoukas
I have a lot. June. Okay, Sorry, go ahead.
Paul Scheer
Well, my issue was also. Then we can go to June, too, was that the judge was so loosey goosey, he was like, okay, yeah, sure. And then, like, later on.
Jason Manzoukas
And then later, they changed the rules again. He's like, okay. They're constantly changing the rules of this ancient tournament just to make it easier for JCVD to compete and win.
John Gabrus
I was just like. I sent all these monks. I taught them English. I taught them how to travel around the world to deliver these scrolls. And now people are just wandering into my tournament.
Jason Manzoukas
And you. You fucks from America think you can just, like, let somebody else fight in your stead. Well, screw you.
Paul Scheer
That would be like, the equivalent of, like, in this March madness right now, like, if just, like, a community college was like, hey, we kind of want to play. I think we're pretty good. We'd love to play. And they'd be like, yeah, all right. Get in here.
Jason Manzoukas
No, it would be like if a community college randomly, in one game, beat Duke, and Duke was like, you know what? Put them in the Final Four. Not us.
John Gabrus
No. Beat them in a game of horse. If we want to keep this analogy going, Two guys, two street ballers, beat Duke in a game of horse. Duke goes to the NCAA and goes, I can't do this.
Jason Manzoukas
Put them in the Final Four. They're the best team we've ever seen. We will.
June Diane Raphael
Here's my question, though. At one point, doesn't Jean Claude Van Damme, isn't he conspiring to just steal the golden horse?
Paul Scheer
Right.
Jason Manzoukas
That's Roger Moore and Jack McGee's plan.
John Gabrus
That's their plan.
June Diane Raphael
That's their plan.
John Gabrus
That he is.
Jason Manzoukas
Yes. That he's kind of along for the ride.
June Diane Raphael
I had trouble with that.
John Gabrus
No, I think he thinks he's going to. To win it.
Jason Manzoukas
Yes.
John Gabrus
He thinks he's going to win it legally because that's the prize. Well, no, he does.
Jason Manzoukas
I don't know that he does. Because until James Remar lets him also. Yes, but until, like, when they get. When they are pretending to be James Remar's, like, valet and whatever. Jean Claude Van Damme doesn't think he's going to get to fight.
John Gabrus
Oh, no, he's. Because they. I thought their plan was to steal Remar's identity so he could.
Paul Scheer
No, no. But then Roger Moore goes, when he's busy thinking about fighting, will steal.
John Gabrus
Yeah.
Jason Manzoukas
Because I don't think they can steal Maxi's, by the way. They're trying to steal him. Maxi.
Paul Scheer
They're trying to steal a giant fucking. Like, it would be the Equ. I mean, I'm trying to think of how big this dragon is.
John Gabrus
It's the size of the bull down by the.
Paul Scheer
By Wall Street.
John Gabrus
Yeah, yeah.
Jason Manzoukas
Solid gold.
Paul Scheer
Solid gold. And, oh, we got to talk about.
Jason Manzoukas
We got to talk about the Nazi blimp.
John Gabrus
Did Germans get it out of here?
Jason Manzoukas
Talk about the blimp.
Paul Scheer
Well, you had a question for June. I know. I.
Jason Manzoukas
We. We're not there yet.
Paul Scheer
Okay. Yeah.
Jason Manzoukas
And I think it's gonna be a real. We'll see how it goes.
Paul Scheer
To me, I felt like stealing that thing was a flawed idea because they're in a lost city with practically an unmovable, undisguisable object. Like, they can't just get out of town with and that they have to
John Gabrus
put on a boat. Right? Like, that's the only thing that they can get it out of there. On. And I don't know how you add 3 tons of gold to a boat and still get it back to the States or London or wherever they're from.
Paul Scheer
Well, you first have to put it on a horse, then you have to put it on an elephant, then have to put it on a.
June Diane Raphael
None of them like riding elephants.
Jason Manzoukas
Well, the other thing.
Paul Scheer
Although JCVD did write an elephant to the premiere.
Jason Manzoukas
Bye. Oh, my God. Amazing.
Paul Scheer
I have pictures of it, and I will put them up.
Jason Manzoukas
By the way, this is a movie. This, I think, maybe speaks to your PG13 problem is where multiple characters refer to their butts and their buns as rumps. Like, two different characters are like, oh, my rump is sore. And I was like, what?
June Diane Raphael
Felt to me like a translation issue. Like, yeah, that's like what Jean Claude Van Damme calls his body. Yeah.
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah.
John Gabrus
Another great moment is when. Now we're jumping back a little bit, but when he is chained up and the slaver who enslaved him is going to kill him now because they're arriving at the island. It's like you have a slave that's working for you. You could sell him, too.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, yeah.
John Gabrus
But instead you're going to keep him for the next round, right? Exactly. But instead you're gonna kill him. He's handcuffed in a bicep pose. Like, he's handcuffed in a double bicep pose where it's over the gate and he's just standing there flexing. His AR are huge. And he allegedly has no fight training or something like that. He's been just a street performer. And he's not even a street performer. Like, why wasn't he an acrobat or something? That would justify why he's flexible and insanely ripped. Yeah, no, he's a. He's a street clown who happens to be.
June Diane Raphael
Well, I will say this takes some physical ability to get on those.
Jason Manzoukas
I will say this. Like, if shit goes down, I do. If shit goes down, what I am going to do is I am going to round up as many clowns and acrobats as I can. And because those are going to be the best fighters. You know what, Love where it's at. My army is an army of clowns.
Paul Scheer
Mr. Miyagi taught painters and car waxers how to be the best karate.
June Diane Raphael
I have to say, I was bummed in that opening sequence that they didn't play that out a bit longer. Him on stilts, his clowning. Well, just him fighting on stilts.
Jason Manzoukas
Sure.
Paul Scheer
I'd like to have seen him do more clowning, too.
June Diane Raphael
Interesting. Well, look, I.
John Gabrus
You're a theater buff.
Paul Scheer
June does, like, legit, like, clowning.
June Diane Raphael
I do like clowning, but I also. But I also wanted to see. I mean, it is fascinating, these people who walk around on stilts.
Jason Manzoukas
It is.
John Gabrus
You're talking about a movie in which a.
Jason Manzoukas
Well, you know, they don't do it in real life. They just do it as a performative.
June Diane Raphael
No, they're always. They're always in their stilts.
John Gabrus
I like that. This is a movie about an ancient fighting tournament where people from all over the world fight each other to death. And you're like, it is pretty interesting that people walk on stilts.
June Diane Raphael
Yeah. As I was watching them, I'm like, wow, that's. That's a crazy thing that people do very high up.
Jason Manzoukas
When I was a kid. When I was a kid, I had very high.
Paul Scheer
I love that.
Jason Manzoukas
When I was a kid, I had an idea for a restaurant where all the tables were, like, 15ft in the air and all the seats were lifeguard chairs.
Paul Scheer
Oh, fun.
Jason Manzoukas
And all the waiters were on stilts.
John Gabrus
Fun, Jason, that's awesome.
Paul Scheer
Don't say that out loud. Now you've just given up that amazing idea.
Jason Manzoukas
Boom. Put it out there.
June Diane Raphael
I just wonder. I mean, I guess you guys aren't that interested in it, but at what point do you get on stilts? Cause it seems to me one of those skills where it's just like, one day you're on them.
Jason Manzoukas
Do you think those people have spent their whole lives being like, I need to be up to. I need to be up there? And stilts is like opportunity.
June Diane Raphael
I think it's similar to being a very small person in this world, a little person where you're more vulnerable when you're up there.
Paul Scheer
Wow.
John Gabrus
I feel like it's a kid whose dad didn't put him on his shoulders at a parade or something like that, so now he insists to never miss. No one will ever stand in front of me again.
Jason Manzoukas
Let me give you a counter argument.
Paul Scheer
I think.
Jason Manzoukas
I think these stilt fucks want to look down on us. I think they want to be up there looking down on us, thinking they're better than us, these fucking giants.
John Gabrus
I think, honestly, if a performer's on stilts and they see anyone in this room, they look at us and go, God, I wish my career was more in fucking line. Why am I a stilt knocker, for fuck's sake?
Paul Scheer
To me, stilts are the old. Are what hipsters are to people before us, because people on big bicycles and stuff like that. I just want to be seen as different and odd. I'm wearing stilts. I'm riding a big bicycle with one big wheel and one small. Like, I just want to be weird. I'm like. I'm like.
John Gabrus
I ride on a typewriter at the coffee shop.
Jason Manzoukas
I definitely think stilts.
June Diane Raphael
I think there's a performance art to what they do.
Paul Scheer
Well, then what? Why then? I think it would have been great that in the last fight, he would, like, bring me my stilts.
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah.
John Gabrus
And then he fought on stilts.
June Diane Raphael
There was just so much more fun to be had with him on stilts. Fighting and jumping over things and using his stilts to.
John Gabrus
I mean, or seeing him.
June Diane Raphael
He hopped off of them so quickly.
John Gabrus
Or doing clowning or some sort of arbitrary scene when he's in Bangkok where he grabs two tent poles and kind of, like, improvise stilts. Like, nothing of that pays off. Or like a little kid is crying and clowns form.
Jason Manzoukas
None of his clown training comes into play.
Paul Scheer
He's not a good clown.
John Gabrus
But I think what we're supposed to believe from this movie is that the clown training set him up to be a pretty decent fighter. Cause he kind of, like, does parkour to get away from those guys.
Jason Manzoukas
This is what I think.
John Gabrus
And I'm like, this is fucking insane. Why can't we just show him fighting?
Jason Manzoukas
Like, here's what I think. I think, controversially, I think he is not a clown. I don't think he has clown training. I think that is the front he uses as a criminal mastermind of a children's gang.
John Gabrus
I'm kind of with you.
Jason Manzoukas
And that's why the cops know who he is, and that's why the mob knows who he is. They don't know him as the guy who's the clown. They know him as, like, a thief.
John Gabrus
No.
Paul Scheer
I would argue that they know him because it's so fucking obvious. Like, oh, yeah. We don't let the. The clown. Because he's the one always stealing from us. Like, you can't blend in.
Jason Manzoukas
It's arguably because he's the monster is, like, come work for me.
June Diane Raphael
I discredit the fact, though, that he did learn how to get on.
Jason Manzoukas
Right.
John Gabrus
That's what I was about to say. He still has the skill set regardless.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, yeah.
Paul Scheer
But I don't.
John Gabrus
That makes you both right. That he's. He's doing it under criminal auspices. But he does have the talent.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, yeah.
John Gabrus
And if he just knew. If he just knew that there were stilt fans in the World like you. He could have. He would have never had to fight in the tow.
Jason Manzoukas
It's one of those classic. You know, he. It's a classic con man, you know, like, he has the skills to exist in the real world successfully, but he'd rather use it for crime.
John Gabrus
Someone edit June into a scene in this movie, putting like $1,000 into a hat and going, a rich lady from New York in old New York.
Paul Scheer
I just come down to watch the poor people on stills. Here's a hay penny.
John Gabrus
So let's talk about the bar scene. That helps set up the main bad guy that he. Who's also the same bad guy from Lionheart that looks like Steve.
Paul Scheer
Yes.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, the Mongolian.
Paul Scheer
When she said that to me, I was like, he looks just like Steve Harvey.
John Gabrus
He has the worst facial hair known to man. Cause it's the ring.
Paul Scheer
Yes.
John Gabrus
Not the goatee, not the mustache. But when you do a mustache and then a line of hair, it's a second set of hair. Lips that go around your mouth.
Paul Scheer
And now you are Jean Claude Van Damme expert. So I'll ask you this. In Bloodsport, I believe that the guy he fought was deaf, because he was never really. He never really spoke. He just. Just kind of like vocalized as if he was going to say something, but no words came out. And this guy doesn't really speak at all.
Jason Manzoukas
This guy says nothing.
John Gabrus
I think this is more about casting based on looks than like or, like, oral abilities.
Paul Scheer
So, like, his voice could be like, hi.
John Gabrus
I did think they demonstrate that this guy's a badass by having him knock out Remar in one punch. Which I also think leads Maxi to go, I'm not fighting this fucking tournament.
Jason Manzoukas
I think Remar is like, I'm out. This movie for James, Remar's character is a real gut punch.
John Gabrus
He went back to business school. His character goes to business school.
Jason Manzoukas
At the end of this, he fucking is the heavyweight champion of the world. Travels to Tibet and gets his ass repeatedly handed to him, knocked out by
John Gabrus
a homeless clown and then knocked out by Genghis Khan.
Paul Scheer
Like a Moss play, by the way, this bad guy. This serves for a point to talk about some of the direction in this film. The slow mo is used to not great effect in this because that table, right, he breaks the table, but they do it in some slow mo. I would think that breaking a table in fast motion is way more engaging.
June Diane Raphael
Like, it's interesting you say that, because I felt that too. Like, when they cut to slo mo, the fighting looked worse.
John Gabrus
Oh, it's this is peak editing fighting. This is peak. Like, Bloodsport has it a lot. And you like. You know, like the Van Damme where he lands one kick, but the editing shows three of the same kicks in a row. And this is peak that where it's like it slows down at moments where there is no one is making contact with each other. And it's like when he does, like, the flip backwards and kicks the sand into the guy's face, I'm like, that is physically, literally impossible to do a flip with your feet from under the sand and get the sand to go horizontal into someone's eyes. But they show it in slow motion, and it looks like they cut away at the moment. That would be the thing you would want to show. They just show a guy getting ready to jump in slow motion, which is not something you want to see.
June Diane Raphael
Yeah, I felt like the slow mo was all gearing up.
John Gabrus
They had to slow mo that fist thing because they shot that slow. I feel like they just go, put your hand on the. The table.
Jason Manzoukas
Will.
John Gabrus
A prop guy will pull a rope and the whole thing because it shatters. And that doesn't shatter even. It crumbles. It like turns to powder. It's so obviously artificial.
Paul Scheer
Well, and it's like. And everything in this thing, it's like the fight, it is just like it is. It seems like when Bloodsport, they didn't use any doubles. Right. That was the whole argument. And. But here I feel like they probably used a lot of.
John Gabrus
Oh, yeah. I don't think James Remar is taking a punch from some random Mongolian.
June Diane Raphael
Quick question. Why do Roger Moore and Jack McGee want that reporter who we have talked about? Oh, the reporter come along for this ride.
John Gabrus
We haven't talked about this yet. Right. And I think it's because Roger Moore wants to bone her.
Jason Manzoukas
Can I ask a question? I have a real question.
John Gabrus
Finally.
Jason Manzoukas
What does she get from the news feed? The ticker tape?
June Diane Raphael
No idea.
Jason Manzoukas
She has, like, a prized possession that she's like, I have everything you need or whatever. And she's holding a piece of paper. Paper. And we never find out what was on it.
John Gabrus
I think I know what that is. I think that is like permission or bankroll from the newspaper, from her dad to cover this article. Which means the cost of the boat ride and all the other things. I think it's gonna get them.
Jason Manzoukas
She's financing this trip and is that
June Diane Raphael
why they're using her?
John Gabrus
They are using her, I think. Cause Roger Moore wants to have sex with her because she's beautiful. And that is a Jean Claude Van Damme trope. Right. Is that the first of all, a beautiful blonde horror. These movies destroy Bechdel. They annihilate the Bechd. There's only always only one woman, and she's a reporter. And in Bloodsport, she's a reporter who has to pretend to be a whore to get into something here.
Paul Scheer
She's a reporter who is like, you know, she's just again, just wandering Bangkok looking for a story.
John Gabrus
Yeah, the only doesn't even know about
Paul Scheer
again, like, why doesn't she know about this tournament? Why doesn't she, like, introduce this idea?
Jason Manzoukas
She has nothing going on.
Paul Scheer
And neither does her. And Jean Claude Van Damme.
John Gabrus
They're not even love interest.
Jason Manzoukas
They are not very low.
Paul Scheer
Last minute, where he puts his arm around her, I'm like, oh, they're together.
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah. No, I don't think so.
Paul Scheer
They seem more together, the New York guy.
Jason Manzoukas
And Roger Moore seems to give up on her as well. Like I would have. Like the minute they get to. Well, that's the thing, is this movie has indiscriminate plot points all the way up until the last 45 minutes, which are just a man saying the names of two countries and then those two people fight.
Paul Scheer
Yes.
Jason Manzoukas
And that's all.
John Gabrus
That's all this movie needs to be. I listened to all the episodes of how this get made. And when. If I was. I know I need a job. If I was on the Street Fighter episode, I would have said that Street Fighter should have just been Bloodsport. Like, it should have just been like the video game where all the best characters just fight each other. It's a big tournament that there happens to be a guy named Blanka at.
Paul Scheer
But don't you think that that was the deficit of this movie? Because there's no breaks in this movie. And you're just like another fight with no stakes. And like, when is it gonna.
John Gabrus
Well, cause there's no one that could act in between scenes. Like in Bloodsport, they got Ogre that he can, like, deliver a line, at least in between. That's sort of interesting. This shit has nothing. What goes good with tonic. Don't say it, Gin. I told you not to say it.
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah, and then the horse.
Paul Scheer
Yeah.
Jason Manzoukas
And the horse says something. He goes, oh, quiet you. I know.
Paul Scheer
That's why Roger Moore.
June Diane Raphael
I can't believe we were only on the semifinals when we were. I was.
John Gabrus
Oh, I know.
June Diane Raphael
We've been fighting forever.
Jason Manzoukas
Forever.
John Gabrus
They show every fight. That's the thing. They show every fight and. But every Fight is seven punches. Yes.
June Diane Raphael
Well, and here's the thing. You've already been introduced to the fighting styles of each country, and then they just mix and match everywhere.
Jason Manzoukas
Yeah.
Paul Scheer
Now it's. Okay, now you see the winners.
June Diane Raphael
Well, we've seen all of these people.
John Gabrus
That's like Chekhov, sumo wrestler. You see him in the first act. Better fight by the end.
Jason Manzoukas
Exactly.
John Gabrus
But that's why you're going to this movie. Like, if you're going. That's why you saw Bloodsport. That's why you liked it. At least for me, growing up.
Paul Scheer
You wanna watch the fights.
John Gabrus
I was like, oh, monkey man versus sumo. Oh, the guy who does Muay Thai versus the guy who is arbitrarily Arab, you know?
Paul Scheer
Well, I had an issue about the monkey guy, the snake guy.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, dude, are you talking about the.
John Gabrus
In this movie. In this movie, it's China.
Paul Scheer
Yeah, China. Because it goes. First of all, the best line in the whole movie to me was, he's moving like an animal. More like a snake. Yeah, I said that. I kind of said that.
John Gabrus
An animal. And then in adr, in the next sequence, he goes. Now he's more of a monkey. It's like.
Jason Manzoukas
And then in the third one, he goes, tiger.
Paul Scheer
But to me, I said. I was like, I don't understand the mindset of this guy because it seems like he's also acting like a monkey, tiger and snake when he doesn't eat. Well, after the fact that he's won.
Jason Manzoukas
And. Well, before. Yeah, before and after.
John Gabrus
That's part of, like, the stereo to really, like. Because if this is a real fighting tournament that has any kind of semblance of rules, which it doesn't, you'd probably say, like, hey, you're not allowed to play the bongos while the capoeira guy fights.
Paul Scheer
Come on, like, everyone, bring your bongo.
Jason Manzoukas
You guys got backup musicians? Fine.
John Gabrus
Yeah. I would have a guy on an electric guitar just ripping it up and. Yeah, I would have Doof Warrior shooting. I'd be out there like, that's. If they had that in Bloodsport. That's what Jackson would have had. Would have had Leonard Skin Slash playing
Jason Manzoukas
welcome to the Jungle. That's what I would do. No, I wouldn't. I would for real, just tell Jordans, this is how we do it.
John Gabrus
Who is your favorite of all? Right, no full disclosure. I only. I can only get up to this game.
Jason Manzoukas
I would only fight. I will only fight and fuck Demontell. Jordan, this is how we do it.
John Gabrus
Who is your favorite? Who is your favorite of the fighters?
Paul Scheer
Well, to me, I'm gonna go just jump right in and say, the capoeira guy.
Jason Manzoukas
Love him.
Paul Scheer
Was amazing. And I called that, like, the epcot of fights because it was like, everyone was so, like, so I am my country. Like, this is when you go to the.
John Gabrus
What about the Scottish guys? And when the fight at the end and they cut to the audience, everyone is in their cliched outfits.
Paul Scheer
You're like, it's like, there's a Nazi guy with a Nazi helmet.
John Gabrus
He fights in jackboots and suspenders.
Jason Manzoukas
I now want to get to. That's a perfect segue. June, what did you think about what Jean Claude Van Damme wore to fight? Do you have any thoughts on what he was wearing?
June Diane Raphael
I'm trying to remember.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, interesting.
John Gabrus
He's wearing some serious touch.
Jason Manzoukas
He's wearing loose shorts, loose pants, shorts, sweat shorts. Like loose shorts, white socks and work boots.
John Gabrus
He's dressed like two very specific archetypes. 1980s bodybuilders and 1990s gay guys.
Jason Manzoukas
I was like, he is dressed like he scrunched up with blue Beethoven from like 10, 15 years ago. I was like, what is going on?
John Gabrus
And the bandana cartoon and the rope bandana.
June Diane Raphael
JCBD is a beautiful man. I think he's a gorgeous man.
John Gabrus
You're not gonna find anyone to disagree with.
June Diane Raphael
I thought he looked great in this movie. I thought he looked great in Bloodsport.
John Gabrus
My wife, I'm saying Tiffany. Like, everyone knows who she is. My wife walked in when I was watching this and she goes, is that Jean Claude Van Damme in the sequence on the boat when he has a beard? She's obviously into bearded dude and she goes, shit, he's really hot.
Paul Scheer
I liked him with the beard.
John Gabrus
He looked good with the beard.
Paul Scheer
He looked very Wolverine. He looked a little bit like Hugh Jackman back then.
John Gabrus
Yes, he did.
Jason Manzoukas
He also, in this era where you've got Seagal, Stallone, Schwarzenegger, all these, like, Dolph Lundgren, all these kind of A to C level action stars. He is genuinely leading man. Handsome, right?
June Diane Raphael
Oh, yeah. In a way that none of them are in Bloodsport. I was so upset to see him in so many splits.
Paul Scheer
Yeah, because you want him to keep
Jason Manzoukas
his chest because it's only ruining your lady boner forehead.
June Diane Raphael
I feel like you for half of the movie.
John Gabrus
I feel like you might be in the minority on that, to be honest. I don't want to speak for women,
June Diane Raphael
but I think ladies liked him in splits.
Paul Scheer
Oh, I think ladies like the splits in the bumps.
Jason Manzoukas
Here's the Thing. Let's get it out there. How did this get made, fans?
Paul Scheer
If you have an opinion, call us at 619-Paul-P A U L Ask A S K and you can leave a message. We can talk about.
Sponsor/Ad Voice
Really?
June Diane Raphael
The question is not like, oh, is that cool that he's in or can do a split.
John Gabrus
Is it a turn on or a turn off? Turn on or turn off?
Jason Manzoukas
Turn on it. Yeah, yeah. Like, I want to see a forum party that really digs in on this.
Paul Scheer
I'll tell you what a real turn off is, and I want it to
Jason Manzoukas
be splits and buns.
Paul Scheer
All right, we'll go, guys. Bring it to the phone line. Bring it to the forums. The turn off literally was when the Kiltman got his balls literally turned.
John Gabrus
That's by Turkey. I rewound it three times to hear how the guy announced his country because I could not sort it out. And he's not a visible race. He's like a short tan dude with long. He's like a mini Manzoukas. And you're gone.
Jason Manzoukas
How dare you?
June Diane Raphael
The fuck.
Jason Manzoukas
How dare you? How dare you compare me to the Turks. By the way, that Turk gets taken up pretty quick. The Greek guy does. The Greek guy does. Okay.
John Gabrus
The Greek guy, by the way, who has got shoulder length blonde hair. This guy is a. He's a Venice surfer from Cyprus.
Jason Manzoukas
This guy's from fucking Cyprus.
Paul Scheer
And by the way, his move of serving people spanakopita until they collapse is really bizarre.
June Diane Raphael
By the way, though, the one question I did have about Jean Clark Claude's outfit is this is my problem with him being a representative of Muay Thai is like, is that what those guys were wearing?
John Gabrus
No, that's what's crazy is that's not what he's worn at all in the movie. No, he didn't wear it on the boat. He didn't wear it in New York.
Paul Scheer
He didn't.
June Diane Raphael
You know what it is reminiscent of, though, is the street urchins.
John Gabrus
He is dressed a little.
June Diane Raphael
Ultimately he's fighting for.
John Gabrus
Right? But he brought all that gear he brought. It's weird that he's not in Muay Thai outfit. He wears a Muay Thai Thai outfit in fucking bloodsport.
Jason Manzoukas
Well, he wears a Muay Thai outfit in the first round of fights before the Lost City, when he's fighting in the Muay Thai fight, when he's still owned by the Muay Thai island guys.
Paul Scheer
But sometimes when he's just chilling out, he's wearing a nice collared striped shirt, like a chambray Shirt to hang out.
John Gabrus
And look at the Van Damme's ability to rock a tucked in dress shirt is like unbeknownst to every movie features him with a tucked in, you know, like the 90s tuck where you pull
Jason Manzoukas
it out a little 25 pleats. His pants like his, like, it's like literally like 42 pleats across.
John Gabrus
Wouldn't they be graded like chompers?
Paul Scheer
Yes, if it's like one of those, like, like one of those fans where like his head so many pleats. But when he does a split, it becomes like a big image. Like it's like a real crane landing
Jason Manzoukas
in a sunset, basically, like, like MC Hammer.
Paul Scheer
I wanted to just bring up one thought to you guys. If it's a fight of the best fighters in the world, can we just, hey, we know that everyone here can kick someone in the balls and disable them. Can we just take that off the table? No ball kicking in the best fights in the world.
June Diane Raphael
Because I feel like, you bet it's a cheap move.
Paul Scheer
I think it's a cheap move. I feel like let's fight without the ball hits.
John Gabrus
I feel like in year 7000, assuming that's a millennial long tournament, that it's got to adapt. Like UFC was the, when it first started was like guys could walk in with boxing gloves and shoes on and fight a guy in a full gi. You know, and then eventually he was like, oh, let's just choke. Why isn't everyone just being choked to death in this fight? It's like, why am I gonna stand back and let a guy spin three times, kicking in the head when I can just hold him by his throat until he says like, mate or whatever? Yes, that's right. None of these fights make sense. It's like, of course you wanna make it good for movies. But everyone is show. Everyone's style is showmanship.
Paul Scheer
Everyone is doing a pre show for their actual fight and it's Ultraman. And then there's also.
Jason Manzoukas
Except for the Russian guy who just walks in and like gets his ass.
John Gabrus
Oh, he was, I thought he was gonna be the cool character too. I was like, I love this guy. Looks just like a. He looks like the worst dude to run into in Brighton beach and he's gonna beat the fuck out of you.
Paul Scheer
I also like the, the school field trip that was clearly at the show. Like they, they, at one point they cut to a group of kids like, hi, the Lost City kids. Like, all right, so tomorrow do your algebra. But tomorrow we go into the big fight.
John Gabrus
Like, everyone get your Permission slips in and grab your little juice boxes.
Paul Scheer
Go ahead.
John Gabrus
One thing is crazy is the guy that fought on the behalf of Spain.
Paul Scheer
Yeah.
Jason Manzoukas
He's not flamenco.
John Gabrus
He's got a belt on it. He's got a flag on his belt. Yeah, he's fighting. He's like the most Spanish you could be. But that's not the Spanish flag.
Jason Manzoukas
No. Oh, I don't know.
John Gabrus
It was not the Spanish flag because I remember that the Spanish flag was yellow. And I was like, this guy's got a different flag on. I looked it up. He's wearing an Albanian flag because the actor is from Albania. That just made it all the way through to the final cut. He's like.
June Diane Raphael
He's also wearing, like, slacks.
John Gabrus
Like, he's not wearing three guys fighting in dress pants and dress shoes.
Jason Manzoukas
And like. And like, jazz.
John Gabrus
They were like waiters a minute ago serving someone a drink, and they're like, oh, shit. I'm sorry. I'm from Siam.
Jason Manzoukas
I have to represent my country right now in a fight to the death.
John Gabrus
And everything is a country and then a continent is the one black dude.
Jason Manzoukas
It's like Africa.
John Gabrus
And he's like. He's like, literally like a voodoo priest. Like, please.
Jason Manzoukas
And he also has. Has drums. He's the other guy that has a backing gun.
John Gabrus
The two black guys have music, unfortunately, it's like a movie made in the 90s.
Jason Manzoukas
Impossibly racist.
Paul Scheer
The one thing I want to talk about, and it probably will not ring true to anybody but me, because I love this movie so much. But the stealing of the dragon at the end with the Nazi blimp is almost shot for shot identical to the Superman II breakout of Lex Luthor and Ned Beatty. They're in a Jack McGee can't get on the ladder. He almost gets on the ladder. He falls off the thing. And then Lex Luthor's like, see you later. I'm leaving. It's comically the same exact scene. And the plan is so terrible. Let's steal a blimp, hoist this thing. And a blimp is not gonna be able to lift.
Jason Manzoukas
And by the way, you're in a lost city. You gotta go. You have to go far.
John Gabrus
Also, you stole a Nazi blimp. Those guys, not forgiving.
Jason Manzoukas
And by the way, it's 1926. They're just getting up and running.
John Gabrus
But yeah, also you. You can make that any nationality. This movie takes place. It's a global movie. You can leave the Nazis out of the. Like, why does it have to be Nazis? This movie wasn't made in the 1990s.
Paul Scheer
That's like Indiana Jones said, man. Indiana Jones said the same thing.
Jason Manzoukas
I would have loved it if Indiana Jones had entered this movie.
John Gabrus
But at least in Indiana Jones, they're bad guys in this movie.
Paul Scheer
You're like. They're just kind of like.
June Diane Raphael
The weird thing about Roger MOORE and Jack McGee, though, why at this point, do they not think that Van Damme could win? Yeah. Why steal it at this point?
Jason Manzoukas
Yep.
John Gabrus
Right. Why don't we wait and see? There's a slight chance we get it for real.
June Diane Raphael
Are we. So are we to believe that every year this tournament happens and every year there's a golden horse that goes a.
Jason Manzoukas
I think it's a dragon.
June Diane Raphael
Sorry.
John Gabrus
But yes, you can. You can ride.
June Diane Raphael
Okay. And it goes.
Jason Manzoukas
First of all, that's like 100%. I know you fell a swing quote
June Diane Raphael
unquote, but doesn't go home with the winner every year.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, make sure that when June wants to take your kid for a horse ride, make sure that give a heads up.
Paul Scheer
Yeah, I'm very aware.
John Gabrus
But wait, no. June brings up a very valid point. Does that mean that there's been hundreds of years of this tournament? There's hundreds of giant golden dragons? Or does that guy always win?
Paul Scheer
They don't seem to give away the gold. I think the Golden Dragon is just like the full.
Jason Manzoukas
They make a deal. They make a deal so that they don't kill Roger Moore and Jack McGee.
Paul Scheer
Oh, that was the deal.
Jason Manzoukas
Van Damme says you can keep the Golden Dragon if I. You have to set us all free.
John Gabrus
But I think Genghis Khan is the local.
Jason Manzoukas
The Mongolian.
John Gabrus
Yeah, he's like the house champion, it feels like. And it feels like.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, really?
John Gabrus
That's what it feels like? Yeah, he's from the. Like, he's the lost city's representative. Even though he's dressed exactly like a barbarian from a video game. Yeah, that's what these movies are. Video games come to life. And that's why they have to do their little dance or something. Cause that's like their totally shout out. Yeah, like Chun Li's like takes the picture or whatever. You know, all that shit is so fun.
Paul Scheer
By the way, a great moment in this movie when they do take a picture with an old 1920s camera. A great moment to just have a still and make it black and white. But color picture, like, it was like. It's just like a small choice that could have made like. And frozen in time. Nope, color, color. Clearly we had an opinion about this movie, but there's some people out there that had a different opinion. It is now time for second opinions.
John Gabrus
I like second answer. Some people got them. That's crazy.
Paul Scheer
All right. These are five star reviews culled from Amazon. There are not many second opinions on this film. There are not many five star reviews, but there are two that are worth it. And here we go. This is from Ox Bigly and he
John Gabrus
writes Sounds like a bully from. I know.
Paul Scheer
He really does. Hey Ox Biglies.
June Diane Raphael
After me.
Paul Scheer
He's a little raspberry or something. I first saw this on Spanish TV and I was so aggravated I couldn't understand what was being said. But then I went to my video store and I rented it. Fantastic film. Although I do admit the plot could use a little work. But still an awesome movie. If you want to see how they should have done the Mortal Kombat film, get this dvd. Way better than the Street Fighter. Then again, I'm sure the Barney movie was better than that. Five stars.
Jason Manzoukas
Wow.
John Gabrus
Wow.
Jason Manzoukas
The Barney movie. Now this is takes a shot in that one.
Paul Scheer
For the first time ever, we have someone who's done a second opinion on another movie coming to do a second opinion on this movie. And this is the man. His name is Jason vine and he has created the Jean Claude Van Damme Review Matrix. We did this in the Bloodsport episode, so we will see how this stacks up. He's done this for Lionheart, Double Impact, Kickboxer, Universal Soldier, Nowhere To Run, Hard Target, Time Cop, and pretty much everyone. But here we go for the quest. Who is he? Christopher Dubois, whose story is too complicated for a one sentence breakdown.
June Diane Raphael
That's true.
Paul Scheer
Which family or friend must be avenged? No avenging needed. He's got kids to feed. Does he take his shirt off? The closest he gets is a tank top version of a thong, which is true. He doesn't go shirtless. Does he have sex with a C list actress? No sex. All business. Is there a tournament? Oh, yes, there is. Is training needed? Absolutely. And all the training takes place amidst the sweltering squalor of a Bangkok Muay Thai fighting world.
Sponsor/Ad Voice
But we don't see it.
Paul Scheer
We don't see it. Zayed saying, no, there is training, but we don't see it.
John Gabrus
It's all off camera.
Paul Scheer
Does he do splits in the training or in the tournament? No, it probably doesn't count. But after a vicious spin kick in the final battle, JCVD stretches a little in slow mo and it's not really a split shot, but he's saying it's kind of a split Shot.
Jason Manzoukas
No, it's not. I wish it was.
Paul Scheer
No, it's no splits. Does he punch someone in the balls? He delivers the reversed heel to the twins. Is it patented by Ric Flair? So he considers that a punch, but it's a kick.
Jason Manzoukas
Other people get punched in the balls.
Paul Scheer
So does he do a Series of flying or 3 success in slow mo? I guess he does. So is his enemy unbeatable after beating every previous opponent with little more than a stiff jab? The final enemy for JCVD is a Mongolian beast. Part Chong Li from Bloodsport and part Attila from Lionheart. Actually the same actor who played Attila. And does he overcome injury or any other hindrance? A rarity for jcvd. The entire tournament is on the level. Nothing goes wrong. Does he win? Not only does he win, but he delivers what is probably his best overall fight scene in his career.
Jason Manzoukas
What?
Paul Scheer
I don't think so.
Jason Manzoukas
That's not true at all.
Paul Scheer
Part of the fight is in a room that we are not led. We are not seeing.
John Gabrus
I did truly like that moment. I thought it was just a change of pace that that fight.
June Diane Raphael
I liked it.
John Gabrus
So also they had to go outside at that point because someone JCVD who's directing it must have been like, you know, every 60 minutes of this movie have been in this dark fucking warehouse. Why don't we spill out into the street? And then the fight, it's just one of those situations where it wraps up so fast you can never live up to the hype.
Jason Manzoukas
Well, first, he also just appears. The whole fight appears. Like for Jean Claude Van Damme, who is all about kicking, it really is all about punching in this movie. He just is repeatedly punching the guy in the face. Punch, punch, punch, punch, punch, punch, punch. And it's not very exciting.
Paul Scheer
Well, my favorite part of it is that they're fighting inside this house. And the house is like a long. Like a tractor house, like, almost like trailer a. And they move. The audience of the fight moves from left to right as they're going through the house. But the house is fully, like, covered, so they can't see. So just by like, I guess, grunts, they're moving like they're. It's like as if. If they could see it, they would move along. But they're just like, I guess he's over at this point.
John Gabrus
It reminds me of in Fargo season one, when Billy Bob goes into the building.
June Diane Raphael
Oh, yeah.
Paul Scheer
And you see it. Yeah.
John Gabrus
And you just kind of track it. They ripped off the quest. I'll say it.
Paul Scheer
Fucking Noah Hawley. Ripping off the quest once again.
John Gabrus
Yeah.
Jason Manzoukas
Cool, man.
Paul Scheer
So then the fight ends to no celebration at all.
June Diane Raphael
No, actually there's a somber mood that's like.
John Gabrus
Well, I think it's because all the people in the crowd are losers. They're previous people who lost the fight. Why are they sticking around? Who cares who wins at this point? Like when they cut to the crowd and it is the two Scottish guys, I'm like, why are they still here and they don't have a fucking a leg. They don't give a fuck which one of these guys wins.
Jason Manzoukas
Go home.
John Gabrus
Right?
Paul Scheer
And then start your journey home.
Jason Manzoukas
Like a three month journey to get home.
John Gabrus
Conservative.
Paul Scheer
By the time they get home. By the time they get home, they have to start the trip back to go to the next year's tournament.
John Gabrus
There's a monk waiting with the. Oh, you gotta be kidding. Hey, you're one of the best.
Paul Scheer
Let's play what I think is probably the best writing in the entire movie. The wrap up. All right, so now they're gonna go home. Here is jcvd's final voiceover.
John Gabrus
I didn't get the golden dragon, but I returned to New York like I promised. Cut the kids off the streets. In the end, we all did just fine.
June Diane Raphael
Well, how did he do that, though?
John Gabrus
Maxi trained many great fighters and became a big celebrity. Last I heard, Dubs and Harry opened the Trading Post deep in the Amazon.
Jason Manzoukas
Like, that's not John Cliff. It's his old man voice.
Paul Scheer
And then you reveal that he's. He's reading a book backwards because he closes the book on the first chapter.
June Diane Raphael
What really doesn't make sense though, is the book that was written by the female reporter, but in his voice.
John Gabrus
Yes, yes.
Jason Manzoukas
So the entire movie is a story being told by the female reporter. First person as the character that Jean Claude Van Damme is playing.
John Gabrus
That's not even. Why don't they show him. Go back to the kids.
Paul Scheer
They just did just fine. They didn't do great. They didn't have an amazing life.
John Gabrus
There's no way. 9. You leave for nine months and a group of street kids are. They've managed to make it.
Jason Manzoukas
Bunch of those kids are dead.
Paul Scheer
100.
June Diane Raphael
Well, here's my.
Paul Scheer
Just by looking.
June Diane Raphael
Here's the thing. He is coming back with no money.
John Gabrus
Right? That's what I'm saying. He comes back and he just has confidence. From winning to flying.
June Diane Raphael
He's kids off the street.
Paul Scheer
Well, maybe he sold that gold necklace.
Jason Manzoukas
And by the way, there's more street kids like he doesn't eradicate. Like street urchins.
John Gabrus
Yeah. He didn't end Homelessness.
Jason Manzoukas
As far as he's like, I won't. And then no kid was ever without the home.
John Gabrus
I want to say, I don't know what you're about to start.
Paul Scheer
No go. Sorry, but no.
John Gabrus
This movie has. I read the IMDb trivia for every movie I've ever seen. This movie has the best IMDb trivia.
Paul Scheer
I have some here, some notes.
John Gabrus
I'll tell you some from Recall that I remember reading. Not even. And I read it again today, but there's some I remember from when I was.
Paul Scheer
Let me, Let me throw some at you and you tell me if I miss any. The original director of this movie or the one that jcv. Anyone guesses? I mean, you know it.
John Gabrus
I know the answer. I'm not gonna say it.
Paul Scheer
Any guesses? Oliver stone.
Jason Manzoukas
Amazing.
John Gabrus
The IMDb trivia says JCVD asked Oliver Stone to direct this and he politely declined.
Paul Scheer
This is probably my. Well, there's two. I'm gonna read my second favorite.
John Gabrus
I think I know which ones you're gonna read.
Paul Scheer
The one. Well, the Jack McKee one.
John Gabrus
Yes, exactly.
Paul Scheer
But we'll end on the. This one is Tatum o' Neill claims in her autobiography that she was offered the female lead, but things fell apart after a romance with her and JCVD failed.
Jason Manzoukas
Whoa.
June Diane Raphael
So.
John Gabrus
And before you read the Jack McGee one, I just wanna say in the IMDb trivia, there's four trivia pieces that are all about how much Roger Moore hated this movie.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh.
John Gabrus
Like, it's like, it's like he was told. Yeah, he said it's. He said in his biography it's his least favorite movie he's ever been part of. He was told he was gonna get above the line billing and he didn't. There's like, it's like 11 straight complaints. He talks about it's the worst movie he's ever done.
Jason Manzoukas
Amazing.
Paul Scheer
Embarrassed by it. And just. If you wanna know more about this experience and the world of jcvd, you can check outfilm.com because there is now a rebuttal interview to last week's Frank Dukes interview. Cause Sheldon Lettich, who wrote Bloodsport and is involved in this world, read that article, got angered and now is rebutting
John Gabrus
also the writer of Lionheart, which is the better quest.
Paul Scheer
And Frank Dukes is very much involved in a big lawsuit here. Cause he, he claimed that he wrote this movie called the Enter the Dragon. It's a big deal.
John Gabrus
He won arbitration. Wga. Frank Duke's got story by credit on this movie but he didn't win the civil lawsuit that he's won.
Paul Scheer
Right? You lost the court case.
John Gabrus
I could talk to you about Frank Duke slash Count Dante for, like, hours. Are you guys familiar with Count Dante from the back of, like, Boys Life magazine?
Paul Scheer
No.
John Gabrus
He's a very similar to Frank Dukes type character who swears that he fought in all these. Like, he said he killed over 50 people in different kumites and then taught karate in Chicago and was part of what was called the dojo wars where he got. He got arrested for setting up explosives at a rival dojos. And that's all real.
Paul Scheer
This is insane. I love it. This world is amazing.
John Gabrus
Search Count Dante and Frank Dukes and Wikipedia and have a fucking great afternoon.
Paul Scheer
Why don't I have you present the last fact, which is the best fact.
John Gabrus
So there's this piece of trivia that just says, Jack McGee was known to pass wind, parentheses, fart after every take. And everyone laughed at it except Jean Claude Van Damme, who hated it.
Paul Scheer
Like that energy to me makes me. Me laugh more than any after every take.
John Gabrus
That's just the most disgusting person alive. But that's fucked up.
Paul Scheer
Well, we. We have worked with Jack. He's the best.
John Gabrus
He's the guy from McCarthy. He's the dad from McCarthy's.
Paul Scheer
He's the dad from McCarthy'S. He's actually in a party over this party over here sketch. He's great.
John Gabrus
I like that guy. He's great in the movie.
Paul Scheer
The fact that I think he's probably like, fuck this movie.
John Gabrus
Exactly. He's 100%. Him and Roger Moore are sitting there on the boat going, how the fuck did we get involved in this?
Paul Scheer
I'm gonna email Jack and find out if he farted in this thing. I don't want to say it if it wasn't true, but we have said it now. We have said it.
John Gabrus
IMDb said it. So we're quoting somebody.
Paul Scheer
And I'll leave you with this. Before we get into plugs, Jean Claude Van Damme's definition of the movie. This movie is about a dream, but also adventure. It is epic, has many faces, many corners. It is the shape of a diamond.
Jason Manzoukas
Oh, boy.
Paul Scheer
And that is my definition of the class.
John Gabrus
Wow.
June Diane Raphael
The shape of a diamond.
Jason Manzoukas
Many faces and many corners.
John Gabrus
I don't think he's seen a movie, nor a diamond.
Paul Scheer
No. Well, I'm so glad that you're here, John. What do you mean? What would you like to plug right now?
John Gabrus
I guess the only thing I would have to plug is check out my podcast search High and Mighty on itunes. And if you're a fan of I have done some action movie.
Paul Scheer
You have a very extensive Bloodsport episode.
John Gabrus
I have a Bloodsport episode. A. I've done some other action movies and stuff I've actually tried to avoid overlap with. How did this get made?
Paul Scheer
Oh, very nice.
John Gabrus
Thank you so. Cause we passed on doing Cobra. Okay. In honor of you guys.
Jason Manzoukas
More than welcome.
John Gabrus
We've done two Seagal movies and plenty,
Jason Manzoukas
Plenty of room for people talking about movies that they love. So you go right ahead.
John Gabrus
So check out High and Mighty. And if you're a fan of the TV show Banshee, I'm actually starting, like, a weird side project where I'm doing, like, recap and interview episodes about Banshee.
Paul Scheer
I cannot wait.
John Gabrus
And I have nothing to do with that show other than I'm a fan.
Paul Scheer
I can't wait to watch that show. I've heard it's so great. Jason.
Jason Manzoukas
I got nothing.
Paul Scheer
June.
June Diane Raphael
I'll plug the second season of Grace and Frankie, which comes out on May 6th on Netflix. And also a movie that I saw recently and I love and I think might still be out in the theaters, the Bronze, starring Melissa Rauch.
Sponsor/Ad Voice
Oh, yeah, the Bronze.
June Diane Raphael
Hilarious.
Paul Scheer
Well, I'll give a big thank you to everybody here at Earwolf. Avril Halley for pulling all these clips. Nick Kiley for doing all of his research. Marisa Zeitz for all the help. Liana Waldron for designing Amazing. And everybody, Ryan, our engineer. Thank you so much. Thank you guys so much for coming. Bye.
John Gabrus
Bye. Hi, I'm Jenny Slate, and believe it or not, someone is allowing us to have a podcast. I'm Gabe Liedman. I'm Max Silvestri and we've been friends for 20 years. And we like to reach out to kind of get advice on how to live our lives. It's called I need you guys. Should I give my baby fresh vegetables? Can I drink the water at the hospital?
Paul Scheer
My landlord plays the trombone and I can't ask him to stop.
John Gabrus
You should make sure that you subscribe so that you never miss an episode.
Jason Manzoukas
I need to go.
John Gabrus
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Paul Scheer
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John Gabrus
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Released: June 9, 2026
Hosts: Paul Scheer, June Diane Raphael, Jason Mantzoukas
Guest: Jon Gabrus
Topic: Breaking down Jean-Claude Van Damme’s directorial debut (and Bloodsport rip-off), The Quest (1996), and celebrating all the absurdities, plot holes, and missed splits.
This classic episode gathers the HDTGM crew and comedian/JCVD expert Jon Gabrus to revisit The Quest, a 1996 period martial arts movie written, directed by, and starring Jean-Claude Van Damme. Essentially “Bloodsport in the past—but with less fun,” The Quest tries for epic, ends up confounding, and gives the panel ample opportunity for riffing, questions, and memorable tangents on everything from splits to gang of street urchins, from Muay Thai training to Nazi blimps.
“I was full-blown martial arts white trash. That’s why I was obsessed with [Van Damme movies].” (Gabrus, [04:19])
“He’s making choices here. He’s directing it. Poorly, I might add.” (Jason, [07:28])
“No splits, no buns.” (Gabrus, [08:20])
“I learned something about myself watching Bloodsport... I’m very uncomfortable seeing a man in a split.” (June, [08:24])
“I think ladies liked him in splits.” (June, [64:55]) Call to action: “If you have an opinion, call us at 619-PAUL-ASK.” (Paul, [65:02])
“He shows up in clown makeup and fucking period gear.” (Gabrus, [21:14])
“I could not follow what... I actually want someone to distill what’s happening.” (June, [18:34])
“How is he a good fighter? All we see is that he’s a street performer, and then he’s a total killer.” (Gabrus, [42:26])
“Every single country has its own unique fighting style.” (Jason, [33:53])
“a man saying the names of two countries and then those two people fight.” (Jason, [59:53])
“Heavyweight champion of the world. This man is a better fighter than me. And as the former heavyweight champion, I turn my title over to him.” (Remar, [44:27])
“The plan is so terrible... a blimp is not gonna be able to lift [a three-ton gold dragon].” (Paul, [48:10])
The panel agrees: The Quest is a ludicrous, pale imitation of Bloodsport, full of plot holes, baffling choices, and unfulfilled fun. Rather than delivering iconic tournament throwdowns, it’s weighed down by an excess of backstory, misapplied sincerity, and not enough JCVD showing off his splits—or buns.
Jason:
“They set this up... then do 17 minutes of Van Damme backstory, and then they’re like, ‘all right, remember that scroll thing?’”
June:
“I could not follow this... I actually want someone to distill what is happening.”
Gabrus:
“None of these fights make sense. It’s like, of course you want to make it good for movies. But everyone’s style is showmanship.”
Paul (on Van Damme's own description):
“This movie is about a dream, but also adventure... it is the shape of a diamond.” ([84:01])
In sum:
The Quest is perfect HDTGM fodder: mystifying direction, untapped clown potential, international stereotype fighting, and enough asides about splits and stilts to peacefully fill an ancient lost city. They watch these bad movies so you don’t have to—especially this one.