Ep. 385: Design Rules with Elaine Griffin

Summary

Podcast Summary: How to Decorate – Ep. 385: Design Rules with Elaine Griffin

Release Date: October 29, 2024 | Host: Ballard Designs

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1. Introduction

In Episode 385 of How to Decorate, hosts Caroline, Taryn, and Liz welcome renowned interior designer and author Elaine Griffin. The episode delves into Elaine’s expertise, her influential book, and her insights on creating aesthetically pleasing and functional living spaces.

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2. Elaine Griffin’s Background and Expertise

Elaine Griffin, originating from Brunswick, Georgia, splits her time between her hometown and New York City. With a 25-year career in interior design, Elaine has collaborated with esteemed architect Peter Marino and has contributed to prestigious publications like Better Homes and Gardens and Elle Decor. She is also the author of Design: The Insider’s Guide to Becoming Your Own Decorator.

Notable Quote:

"I wanted design rules to be like the joy of cooking. I wanted it to be timeless. I wanted it to be that, like the Encyclopedia Britannica."
— Elaine Griffin [01:14]

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3. Overview of "Design Rules" Book

Although Elaine’s book was published in 2009, it remains a staple in the design community, praised for its enduring relevance and practical advice. The book serves as both a reference guide and an engaging read, making interior design accessible to a broad audience.

Notable Quote:

"The book came out in 2009, which is mind boggling. That is still in print."
— Elaine Griffin [02:37]

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4. Fundamental Design Principles: Proportion and Timelessness

Elaine emphasizes the importance of proportion in design, likening it to mathematical principles. She discusses the golden mean and how proportional relationships dictate the aesthetic harmony of a space.

Notable Quote:

"It's about proportion. Nine times out of ten, it's about proportion. Proportion is mathematically calculated."
— Elaine Griffin [10:43]

Elaine also draws parallels between interior design and fashion, highlighting that just as certain outfits flatter individuals based on their body types, certain design elements enhance spaces through harmonious proportions.

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5. Practical Decorating Tips from Elaine Griffin

Elaine shares several actionable decorating rules that can transform any space:

• Curtain Placement:
  “Curtains should always be hung as close to the ceiling line as possible.”
  — Elaine Griffin [12:01]

• Coffee Table Height:
  “A coffee table must always be lower than the top of the sofa that it's next to.”
  — Elaine Griffin [12:40]

• Furniture Spacing:
  “The distance between your sofa and a coffee table should always be 18 inches.”
  — Elaine Griffin [13:14]

These guidelines ensure functionality and aesthetic balance, making spaces both beautiful and practical.

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6. Defining Your Design Style: Four Key Influences

Elaine introduces a framework for understanding personal design style through four pivotal influences:

1. Where You're From
2. Where You're At (Current Situation)
3. Where You've Been (Past Experiences)
4. Where You're Going (Aspirations)

By examining these aspects, individuals can identify and evolve their unique design aesthetics.

Notable Quote:

"Where you're from, where you're at, where you've been, and where you're going. Those four things influence your personal style."
— Elaine Griffin [17:39]

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7. Managing Your Design Journey: From First Apartment to Forever Home

Elaine offers strategic advice for different stages of life and living situations:

• Early Stages (First Apartment):
  Focus on affordable, versatile pieces like bedding, towels, lamps, and art that can evolve with your taste.

• Mid to Later Stages (Investment Pieces):
  As life settles, invest in quality furniture and timeless pieces that serve as the foundation of your home’s aesthetic.

Notable Quote:

"When you're 25, from 25 to 35, I want you to invest money in three things: Bedding and towels, lamps, and art."
— Elaine Griffin [28:43]

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8. Personal Stories and Anecdotes

Elaine shares personal experiences that illustrate her design philosophy:

• Design Inspirations:
  Growing up in a resort-like environment, Elaine incorporates elements like shells and pastel colors to evoke a sense of tranquility and timelessness.

• Emotional Attachment to Home:
  Elaine discusses the sentimental journey of redecorating her childhood home after her mother's passing, highlighting the balance between personal history and contemporary style.

Notable Quote:

"Homes are the most important things that we have. There's only one decision that is more important than where you live, and that's who you live with."
— Elaine Griffin [24:15]

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9. Listener’s Decorating Dilemma: Painting a Lake Home

A listener, Amanda, seeks advice on choosing paint colors for her two-story lake home. Elaine provides a comprehensive response, emphasizing:

• Consideration of Natural Surroundings:
  Aligning interior colors with the predominant hues of the exterior landscape to create a harmonious connection between indoors and outdoors.

• Color Tolerance and Functionality:
  Selecting colors based on the room’s purpose, natural light availability, and personal comfort with boldness in color palettes.

Notable Quote:

"If you look at a landscape, those are the perfect color palette. One that's most dominant, it most likely is green. Or if it were a beach house, it would be blue."
— Elaine Griffin [59:50]

Elaine recommends soft greens and neutrals for a wooded lake home, ensuring that interior colors complement rather than compete with the natural beauty outside.

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10. Closing Remarks and Future Projects

As the episode wraps up, Elaine hints at her forthcoming book focusing on designing accessible homes for individuals with dementia, addressing a crucial and often overlooked aspect of interior design.

Notable Quote:

"My next one is a girlfriend's guide to living with a dementia person because there's such a journey that's like raising children, if you don't know what you're doing."
— Elaine Griffin [74:50]

Elaine encourages listeners to embrace the evolving nature of their design journeys, emphasizing that style is an ever-expanding aspect of personal growth.

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Conclusion

Episode 385 of How to Decorate offers invaluable insights from Elaine Griffin, blending professional expertise with personal anecdotes. Listeners gain practical decorating advice, a deeper understanding of their design styles, and inspiration to create spaces that are both beautiful and meaningful.

For more tips and to stay updated on future episodes, visit howtodecorate.com/podcast and follow How to Decorate on social media.

Transcript

[Caroline]

Welcome to how to Decorate from Ballard Designs, a weekly podcast all about the trials and triumphs of decorating and redecorating your home. I'm Caroline. I'm on the marketing team.

[Taryn]

And I'm Taryn and I'm a product designer.

[Liz]

I'm Liz. I head of the creative team.

[Caroline]

We're your hosts. Join the expert team at Ballard Designs for tips, tricks and tales from interior designers, stylists, and other talents in the design world.

[Taryn]

Plus, we'll answer your decorating dilemmas at the end of each episode.

[Liz]

We love answering your questions, so don't forget to email [e-mail] now on with the show.

[Caroline]

Today's guest is interior designer and author Elaine Griffin. Originally from the coastal town of Brunswick, Georgia, she splits her time between Brunswick and New York, where her business, Elaine Griffin at Home has been bringing stylish spaces to clients for 25 years. She started her design career working with architect Peter Marino after working in New York and Paris as a publicist for nearly 10 years. She's been a contributing editor for Better Homes and Gardens and Elle Decor and has her own book, design the insider's guide to becoming your own decorator. Elaine, thank you for joining us.

[Elaine Griffin]

It's so wonderful to be here.

[Taryn]

You're the perfect guest for how to Decorate. I mean, in the sense of you wrote the book on it.

[Elaine Griffin]

I wanted design rules to be like the joy of cooking. I wanted it to be timeless. I wanted it to be that, like the Encyclopedia Britannica. I'm a third generation educator, fourth, actually. And so part of what I do is teach. So I want my clients. Julie, my boyfriend, says I'm bossy. And so I want my clients. I want to leave them with a greater understanding of design than when they found them. And I realized at a certain point that I had all of this that I wanted to share with broad, with a broader audience, and that's why I wrote the book.

[Liz]

Well, the book is just fantastic. I know. I personally went through every room in my house and read that chapter in that room, and I was like, oh, well, I need to fix that. Oh, I see. So, and it's. That's one of the great things about this book too, is that it is so informative. And if you're feeling like you're not hitting it in your dining room, you just grab the book, go into your dining room and read that chapter and you're like, oh, okay, I need symmetry on the console. I need function over here. Like, I need this much space between my Chair and the wall or another piece of furniture.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yes.

[Liz]

It is so informative.

[Elaine Griffin]

I want to come over and give you a big kiss because you got it. I mean, the book came out in 2009, which is mind boggling. That is still in print. Thank you, Penguin very much. And so it's, it's it the rules of why. Because there are rules. Why something looks good. It's just like there's such a huge relationship between a house, designing a house and fashion dressing a body. Right. There's a reason that something looks good on you, that doesn't look good on you, that doesn't look good on me, that looks really great on you. And it's because of the relationship between, you know, our bodies and what we're wearing. There's a definite relationship between the four walls that constitute anywhere, any house, anywhere in the world. It's a hut, it has four walls, a ceiling and a fl. There's a relationship between the door of your, you know, the door, the entryway into a room, the windows, and where the furniture goes. That relationship was the same in 1763 as it was in 1957, as it will be in 2526. And I hope my book is still in print then. So that's the whole story of it.

[Caroline]

I mean, you're right, Liz. I loved like it's a reference book. So it's great to, you know, read cover to cover, then go back if you're, you know, working on your room. I loved that about it. And it, you know what, it's so informative. But it's so fun to read. The writing is so good.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yeah.

[Caroline]

And it felt like I was chatting with you.

[Elaine Griffin]

That's it. I wanted it to be because you. I am not. So many designers are pedantic and, you know, God bless their hearts. So bless their. Bless their sweethearts. So Southern. And although the north has co opted that now you have people in New York talking about bless their hearts. I'm like, don't do it. So it's, it's. I want to be the girlfriend decorator. Like your girlfriend next door that you came over and you're like, what, what should I do to fix this? I wanted to be that person. So that's why it's friendly.

[Caroline]

Exactly. Friendly.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yeah.

[Caroline]

It's like, because you, you don't feel like intimidated by it or, you know, it makes it feel, I think, more approachable and easy to accomplish because of, because of the writing. And you make it feel, I guess, like fun and not hard.

[Elaine Griffin]

No.

[Caroline]

If that makes Sense.

[Elaine Griffin]

Here's a secret. If I were to give you $20 to buy a pair of jeans, you $200. A pair of jeans and you 500 bucks. You will.

[Taryn]

Thank you so much.

[Elaine Griffin]

She's headed to Neiman's and so you would be able to do that and bring me back jeans in 10 minutes. Because you have been dressing yourself since you were 12 years old. For most people, until they actually, the college dorm is their first kind of independent living. They don't really get a choice of their rooms because then you're choosing. It's like a new comforter. So we're not going to talk about your childhood bedroom unless your mom has you working with a designer to do it, which does happen, by the way. That's how grand and fancy divas train their daughters to work with designers. We always start with their ownership of their own bedroom when they're like 12. And then I have one family in New York, they're amazing. And the lady has five kids. And I did four of their apartments. Cause you know, the mom and I did it. How cool was that? In any case, for their first apartments. And then of course, they did their own, the second ones by themselves. Until you have your first apartment, you are not thinking about what style sofa I like. You're not really thinking about what's my design style. You're seeing, you know, if you go, if you travel, you see hotels, you might go to museums. Very few people, you know, HGTV has totally transformed. Your catalog has transformed because you're bringing these finished rooms to people. And for some people, that's all they see. They see your catalog, they see design shows on TV which are definitely not reality based. And I can tell you, because I was on one and so that's it. And they see hotels, so that's why it's so intimidating. Only one job you'll ever do is intimidating. And which one is that? The first one. Second one, you have little awkward moments like, what do I do with my sideboard? You know, why is my diagram. But you didn't, you didn't. You know, we have our question coming up, which is great. And so the lady's working on her lake house. She has one color. She has one question. It's about the color of her wall. She's not asking where her sofa should go. She knows that. So. Yeah, right.

[Taryn]

No, it's a great point.

[Elaine Griffin]

That's how, that's how we decorate. So this is really for first timers, which is great because it's all of those things you don't know which way the. Your flooring should go. If you're laying down hardwood floors. Which way? Or LvP. Which way? You know, and there's a rule of, like, which way they should go. It should be like, parallel, right? No, they don't know. They don't know.

[Taryn]

I was thinking when I was reading this, I was like, this would be a great wedding gift.

[Elaine Griffin]

Oh.

[Taryn]

Thinking about you. Because a lot of times there's a lot of compromise right at that. That juncture of your life, too. And so to have the rules. So you're not. I'm not being like, no, this doesn't feel right. And him being like, that's not a good answer. You can be like, well, on 45.

[Elaine Griffin]

I love. Yes.

[Taryn]

I was like, I feel like this is a really good, like, wedding gift.

[Elaine Griffin]

Took a. We're moving in. We're moving in house. Housewarming gift.

[Taryn]

Definitely a good housewarming of like, yeah, maybe not later on life. It might be. Might be considered rude if it's like their fourth house. And it should be.

[Elaine Griffin]

You're like, I have something to tell you.

[Taryn]

Exactly. But probably a good starter. To your point, right?

[Caroline]

Well, yeah, it's like. But to your point about the fashion. You know, I think even when you're dressing and learning to dress, sometimes you might put. And you know, it looks good. You don't know why it looks good.

[Elaine Griffin]

That's it.

[Caroline]

And I think your notes about especially the measurements and the orientation of the room, walking into the room and, like, how the focal points are related to the entries.

[Elaine Griffin]

Right.

[Caroline]

That's articulating why it works. Even though you might have seen it, you feel that it works.

[Elaine Griffin]

You feel that it works. See, that's it. You guys are so happy because you're nailing it. There is a rational why, and it's never because I said so. There is a rational why behind the reason that everything looks good. As a rule. It's about proportion. Nine times out of ten, it's about proportion. Proportion is mathematically calculated. We have the golden mean that we study in design architect and design school. And that's when you. It starts with 2 +3 is 5. Quick learning experience here. It's 2 +3 is 5, and then it's always the sum of the next one. So 5 +5 +2 is 7. And so. And it goes up like that correspondingly. That means that if. And I think I say this in a book talking about baseboards, because people are like, what they're, you know, at a certain point, which size Baseboard should I have, you know, proportionately to that. And it's mathematic. Mathematically calculable. Calculable. Why? Something looks great. When I am, particularly with rug sizes, area rug sizes, I'm flummoxed as to, you know exactly how. Because if you're spending money on a nice rug, you need to know that, you know, this is the right size. And you're doing that often as a professional designer, you're doing that before the walls of a house are even built. So that's a mathematical calculation that you can do. So that's one of the things that I teach my readers, like, how to figure that stuff out.

[Caroline]

Yeah. And I think, if anything, just to make a smart investment the first time in terms of. If you buy a sofa, then, you know, because of your sofa, one coffee table is going to make sense. Or side tables, because you have the measurements of the sofa, and the other three pieces are based off of. It's just there's so much in there. I mean, literally, like, going through and just underlining. Like, I would have underlined the whole book.

[Elaine Griffin]

Oh, yikes.

[Caroline]

Because every page is just.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yay.

[Caroline]

Really chock Full tips.

[Liz]

Yeah. This is definitely a right in the margins. And start flagging as you're supposed to.

[Elaine Griffin]

And that is my number one. I can tell you I have, like, two tips that are going to be on my two. Number one is that curtains should always be hung as close to the ceiling line as possible. You have to leave enough. And it's typically about an inch. You have to leave enough ease for, you know, to actually get them into their little brackets. But other than that, you want them. Cause they can never just. You want them to be as high up as they possibly can. And the second one is that a coffee table must always be lower than the top of the sofa that it's next to. Cause you want to put your drink down. Never in the history of writing have you ever heard anyone putting their drink up. You put it down.

[Taryn]

I'm shocked. That's your number two.

[Elaine Griffin]

Well, here's another one. Number three, while we're there putting drinks down, the distance between your sofa. And we don't say couch in the design world. We have sofas. So the difference I make my clients, I'm like, y'all aren't buying couches. We're buying sofas, people. And so the difference between your sofa and the coffee table is always 18 inches.

[Taryn]

Okay.

[Elaine Griffin]

The chairs on the side can be more or less, never less than 15, because, you know, you have to walk through. Right. But 18 inches is the perfect. Don't do 24, because some people will do that and 24. And if you do 24, you're like scooting it up. You can't reach, you know, you can't reach. It's always 18. The sides are different because, you know, poor side chair. It's like, oh, well, you can't really. That's why we put like a little table next to.

[Taryn]

We love a good drink table.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yes, the drink table. The drink table is because the coffee table is going to be more than 18 inches away.

[Taryn]

And that's when. If you have chairs, a lot of times you'll have something over by. If the chairs are more than 18 away from.

[Elaine Griffin]

Right.

[Taryn]

The coffee table. Right. That drink has to go down somewhere.

[Elaine Griffin]

Somewhere and not on the floor. And your first. And your first apartment, you can put it on the floor. But after that.

[Caroline]

Even, even a stack of design books, you can come up with something. It doesn't have to be a table.

[Taryn]

You know, a plate. You need to. Well, you're going to have something to put down. Sorry. Well, I mean, like even if it's not a drink, you're going to have a plate, you're going to have your phone, you're going to have something to set down and yes. Something on there.

[Caroline]

Do you find that people. Because I feel like often with just friends or you go somewhere and they're kind of doing their first space. I feel like people leave too much room. I mean, because 18 inches between your sofa and your coffee table is really not that much. But I feel like people often like spread everything really apart, thinking it makes the space look bigger, but in reality it just makes it feel.

[Liz]

Or that they're filling the space, but they're really not filling the space at all.

[Caroline]

I mean, I guess they are spreading everything out. It just is uncomfortable. It doesn't look right.

[Elaine Griffin]

You don't feel when you walk into a well designed space. And keep in mind we're talking about the back office, right. We're not talking about what style. That's why I don't really have gorgeous illustrations in my book. I have etchings that are inspired by the French illustrator Pierre Latin. They're like kind of like the ones that you see in the Wall Street Journal, little etchings. Because I wanted to illustrate a point and not have you get, you know, like, I don't like this stripe on that chair, which. Because we have an emotional reaction to rooms. Right. Cause we see we live in rooms. Homes are the most important Things that we have. There's only one decision that is more important than where you live, and that's who you live with. Think about it. Once, you know, you acquire that other partner, even if it's roommates, you know, that's the biggest decision that you make. That's not, like, where you went college, like, once you graduate and all that stuff. So home has this. You know, it's where we keep the things we love, the people we love. We have this emotional attachment to home. And. Oh, this is an interesting point, because I could just ramble, but there are four things that determine your design style. Right. When you're. You know. Because that's the first thing we talked about. How, you know, until you start thinking about your design style for the first time, you haven't really thought about it. But there are four things, and it's a question that you can do, and it's number one. Where you're from, where you're at. That's not proper English. But where you are, where you're at, where you're from, where you're at, where you've been and where you're going. Where you're from, where you're at, where you've been, and where you're going. Those four things I influence your personal style. We have an emotional relationship with home. Either you loved it growing up or you hated it. And you're gonna do. If you loved it, you will replicate it, and if you hated it, you will Flee, you know, 180 degrees. Where'd you grow up? Tell me about the house you grew up in.

[Taryn]

I grew up in Augusta, Georgia.

[Elaine Griffin]

Okay, I already know everything. You can next. Where did you. I can hear your mother's voice right now, Darling. Where did you grow up?

[Liz]

Indiana. Outside of Chicago.

[Elaine Griffin]

Oh, my gosh. We're from the Plains Farm. You have a relative who lived on a farm? At least one. No, no, no, no, no.

[Liz]

Northwest Indiana is not that way.

[Elaine Griffin]

Oh, it's not? Because that's really close to Chicago. Right, right, right.

[Liz]

We consider ourselves more of a suburb of Chicago.

[Elaine Griffin]

Oh, okay. So that's a whole different story. But you still have, like, a Midwesterner's viewpoint of the world.

[Liz]

Sure, I suppose so.

[Elaine Griffin]

Y.

[Taryn]

She's very nice.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yeah, yeah, she's. I'm very nice. I'm gonna stay at your house first. But she's gonna have the best decorated guest room. So it's true.

[Caroline]

I don't know.

[Taryn]

Let Caroline go.

[Elaine Griffin]

I feel like.

[Taryn]

Change your thing.

[Elaine Griffin]

Okay. So where'd you grow up?

[Caroline]

Mobile, Alabama.

[Elaine Griffin]

What? Ah. Where? Oh, Mobile.

[Caroline]

Yes.

[Elaine Griffin]

Oh.

[Caroline]

Yeah. What does that mean?

[Elaine Griffin]

There's one city in the world that is more Southern than Mobile and more Southern than Augusta, and that's Jackson, Mississippi. So se with Mobile. I love Alabama. You throw the best dinner parties.

[Taryn]

Oh, she does. See?

[Liz]

She really does.

[Taryn]

You got pinpointed.

[Elaine Griffin]

See, we're having a party at your house.

[Caroline]

Here's the thing. We don't have much to do there, so we do like to have people over.

[Elaine Griffin]

You know, you entertain, you win of like the entertaining Olympics. You get the goals.

[Caroline]

I don't know. Taryn starts a really good party, too.

[Elaine Griffin]

She's from the gotha.

[Taryn]

She's from the South. So we're still hosting people.

[Elaine Griffin]

Still, Augusta is the most patrician of the Southern cities. More so than Atlanta. Atlanta is, you know, grand and fabulous. And this is Old South. Old.

[Caroline]

What about Brunswick?

[Elaine Griffin]

Brunswick is interesting because we were a really great port city, like back in the day. My great grandfather came to Darien, which is the next county up in near Brunswick, in 18. He was sent by the Presbyterian Church in 1873 to educate the freed slaves. So. And so, you know, I'm an old Georgia family. I had to do my genealogy for the times when I was married for five minutes. And so, because I hadn't really done it before, because my mom never really talked about it, so I had no idea. But the south is. We have a new south now. So. Which is really great and contemporary. But my mother was very, very Southern. Very Southern. And she, you know, if she. If they did not know who your people were for three generations, you would not accept it into black society. I don't care what color you were. It was the same thing. I grew up in Brunswick before St. Simon's was, you know, invented. Really, truly. So and so I remember, you know, Brunswick's glory days. They're coming back. Like downtown was downtown, you know, you know, at the mall. And then. So now it really is the gateway for Saint Simons and Sea island and Jekyll, which has its place. But, you know, it's not as fabulous as it was. So you. I claim the islands as well because we're all one. But if you grow up in a resorty area, no matter where I have lived, I've lived in New York, I went to college in Connecticut, and I lived in Paris for five years. You will always see shells in my spaces because I grew up going to the beach. So resorty. I am always at home in a pink and green room. I love this pink wall. I'm totally like oh, my gosh. It's n. My favorite colors are the colors of, you know, the sunrise and the sunset. Those are always great accent colors, by the way. Sunset colors and sherbet colors are the perfect accent colors. And you always have that slightly resorty feeling.

[Taryn]

Slightly, Slightly, Slightly.

[Elaine Griffin]

You could see, like, oh, this person used to go to the beach a lot. And it's funny, now that I've moved back home, I still have my shelves because, you know, they're part of my design aesthetic. And now I kind of feel like they're touristy because we have shelves right outside.

[Caroline]

Right. Do you. Okay. You said every home always feels a little resorty. Is that, like, the colors? Is that the shelves? Is that colors, materials, Colors, colors.

[Elaine Griffin]

Always the colors. Because, you know, you think of those sherbet pastel colors that you would see truly on, like, Golden Girls. It's true. It's like, thinking about it, it's those kind of pastel.

[Taryn]

I think that's why it's hard. Is a lot of those pastel tones, we. A certain amount of us identify to that era. So, like, again, I know it's hard to be like. But I remember watching the Golden Girls, don't you? So it's hard to transition those colors, I feel, like, into homes today and feel relevant. Like, you're so scared you're gonna make a sherbet. A bad sherbet move.

[Elaine Griffin]

But it's. Did you guys grow up with living rooms that you could actually walk in?

[Taryn]

Oh, you weren't allowed to.

[Elaine Griffin]

No. See, I think you could go into yours. You're in the house. She had free reign over her whole house.

[Taryn]

No, we weren't allowed in the front row.

[Caroline]

No, you weren't allowed in there?

[Elaine Griffin]

No.

[Taryn]

White sofas with big bullion friends.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yes.

[Taryn]

Because the dog. If the dog got in there, too, and sat on the sofa, it was.

[Elaine Griffin]

No, no. When my mother passed, the first thing I did was sit on the sofa as a deliberate act of free. I was like, I can sit here now. No, they didn't do that.

[Taryn]

I agree. Yeah, we had the formal. Like, the front room was even more formal, I feel like, than the dining room.

[Caroline]

Yes.

[Elaine Griffin]

You could eat at the dining table. You could have snacks there. You could do homework there. No.

[Taryn]

And it was just a sitting room.

[Elaine Griffin]

No.

[Caroline]

I mean, we weren't allowed to eat in there, but we could go in there.

[Taryn]

What would you do in the sitting room?

[Caroline]

Like, read, have performances, you know?

[Elaine Griffin]

See, that's it. Have performances. There you go. Go again. There you go again.

[Caroline]

But I don't know, I guess we entertain in there a lot, so it seemed like we were in there a lot, but it's not like that wasn't allowed in there.

[Taryn]

That goes back to. You guys were always entertaining.

[Elaine Griffin]

See?

[Caroline]

See? But, you know, even if it was like having my grandparents over for Sunday dinner or something.

[Elaine Griffin]

Sunday. It wasn't like Sunday. Yeah, Not Wednesday. Wednesday. Which is very Southern, too. The whole concept of Southerners in the world that are still going. We still go to church. And so we still live out our faith in a very public way that, you know, I did not do in New York. And so because you're covert Christians in New York, but down south, you're just like, isn't God good? And so, like, when your delivery's on time, and so bless your heart. Exactly. Right, right, right, right. So I'm just so happy to be here.

[Caroline]

We're so happy that last year. You know what? We should have prefaced this whole recording by saying that we get on tangents all the time, and it is a charming part of our show. So you'll receive no judgment from us.

[Elaine Griffin]

Because I'm like, what was I thinking? It's like, oh, all right. So. But wait, we're not done. So where are you? Where you're from, where you've been? And that's like your travels for most of us. It's like where you went to college. Where'd you go to college?

[Taryn]

Oh, Atlanta.

[Elaine Griffin]

Okay.

[Taryn]

I didn't make it very far.

[Elaine Griffin]

So. Were you in a sorority?

[Taryn]

Of course.

[Elaine Griffin]

Okay.

[Taryn]

See, as a true Southerner, my sister was, so of course I thought I had.

[Elaine Griffin]

What sorority were you in?

[Taryn]

Alpha Delta PI, which was also here.

[Elaine Griffin]

AD PI. Bridget.

[Liz]

Art School in Chicago.

[Elaine Griffin]

Okay.

[Taryn]

Defining.

[Caroline]

I went to Suwanee in Tennessee. In the middle of nowhere.

[Elaine Griffin]

University of the South.

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

So. But they're all very Southern, so there's an introduction to architecture and interiors there that you see. Southern schools all very much are Federal style. You have lots of columns wherever you go that informs. If you go to college in New England, like I did, they're all very, very, very Georgian. Very. They have, like, wood paneling everywhere. And so that's your second introduction after home. That's your second introduction to where and then where you've lived. In my design styles for clients, I always tend towards the French more so than the English. I have a girlfriend who lived in London for junior year abroad, and her design influence is very much English. Mine is very much French. You know, they're first cousins, but they're totally different. It's like where you've been and you know, that was a huge. I was there for five years in my 20s. We'll talk about that in a second. Make a bookmark. Talk about Paris, but also design, Design stages, Write that down. Design stages. We've talked about that. So no, because that's actually interesting and I think that your viewers need to know about that. I was just helping a friend with her daughter with that. So that's my number two. It's, you know, it's how do they entertain? You know, what does that. And that's my biggest influence other than, you know, being down south where we fry everything and it tastes great. Going to college in Connectic, living in New York and then France. So wherever you are, you're seeing, you went to art school. So you have an eye that's trained to look. Most people, until I like, you know, crack the whip and say start looking, start looking. You want to look. Most people don't. You know, they're like scooting from point A to point B and they're not really looking and absorbing and asking themselves, you know, why do I, why did, why does that fleas me, you know, so where are you from, where you've been, where you're at? This is reality sinking in. This is, you know, I'm here. My realistic decorating budget is X. You know, even though I probably have, you know, champagne taste, I'm still on a beer budget. So that's, you know, where you're at. You're a young mom with kids. I mean, if you're going to have white furniture, it better be, you know, stain guarded to within an inch of its life. And I would tell you, not even then, you know, so that's where, where you're realistically at and then where you're going. And that's the aspirational part. That's where like you guys come in. Because that's the flavor.

[Taryn]

Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

You know, that's, it's stuff that's affordable, it's stuff that you'll keep. It's where you're going, it's aspirational, it's how you want people to see you when they come to your house. What do you want people to see? What's your exterior reflection? So when you consider those four things, that is your design, style. And then there's one more. And I think this is really interesting because do you all have children? How old are our kids?

[Liz]

3, 6, 16.

[Elaine Griffin]

Woo.

[Caroline]

Basically, 3, 6. Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

So you guys are in it. You're at the very beginning of Your journey. You're still in the. No white furniture.

[Caroline]

Well, you've got a white soap. I've got a.

[Elaine Griffin]

Do you let them sit on it?

[Taryn]

I do. Ours are our living room. But I, they, I, they're sunbrella and they come off. See, I bleach them once a month.

[Elaine Griffin]

See? See?

[Taryn]

Oh, no, I do.

[Elaine Griffin]

Because it's a commitment. Yeah, it's a commitment.

[Taryn]

Yeah. The Rush bar stools are doing less well.

[Caroline]

Right.

[Taryn]

Because it's a natural material and they can't be cleaned.

[Elaine Griffin]

And so, but you're committed to gorgeous. And so what if they get distracted? Destroyed.

[Taryn]

Yeah. I, I instead get in there with a brush and, and, and get the crumbs out. And get the crumbs out. Do my best to make them laugh.

[Caroline]

Can you just, like, really, like a vac?

[Taryn]

I mean, do you use your hand outside? I beat them with all the crumbs because the weave goes both ways in a rush sheet. And then I've used some oxiclean on it. This is not a recommendation, but I had a lot of blueberries to get out, and it did. I mean, they don't look great. It's like a cleaning a sisal. Right, Right.

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Taryn]

You know, I cleaned it, but it's better this way than it was.

[Elaine Griffin]

But better than having it stained.

[Taryn]

I probably shouldn't look like new.

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Taryn]

Probably should just buy cushions.

[Elaine Griffin]

But then that would diminish the style impact potentially.

[Caroline]

Well, you just know that in five years you're going to upgrade your brush tools.

[Taryn]

I think that's what it is. Or I've thought about even just staining the Rush with dye.

[Caroline]

Oh, like just going garbage.

[Taryn]

That's possibility. See, I've thought about the possibilities.

[Caroline]

Would the dye, like, rub off on clothes?

[Elaine Griffin]

No.

[Caroline]

Well, I was going to say deterioration. They have that material.

[Taryn]

I'll find out if they walk away either way. Pain or paint them.

[Elaine Griffin]

Pain.

[Taryn]

It's one of those things. If they're worth saving. But in five years, I'll more than likely change what I want anyway.

[Elaine Griffin]

Right. And that. Okay, that's my next segue. Take it.

[Caroline]

Run around design stages.

[Elaine Griffin]

Okay, this is interesting because one of my friends just called and said I'm moving my daughter into her first apartment and she's kind of anchoring the apartment. You know, they're gonna have the roommates, as you always do. Rite of passage. And, you know, it's while she has her job, her working job before she goes to medical school. Right. And so, so her mom was like, you know, I want to invest in some Nice things for her that she'll have for the rest of her life. You know, I wanna get her foundational pieces and, you know, I want them to be nice.

[Taryn]

That's so nice.

[Caroline]

That's so nice.

[Elaine Griffin]

Ayesha, don't even think about it.

[Taryn]

You said, let her start with the.

[Elaine Griffin]

Here's why. When you are 25, your style is this. When you were 35, I guarantee you, I speak from experience. Even if you are Ms. Moneybags bottom cash, your style is going to change. Forget about your living conditions. Forget that today you're in Atlanta, tomorrow you might be in Los Angeles, or tomorrow you might be in Miami. You want to have that flexibility because you don't know where your career is going to take you. You don't know who you're going to be living with. You want to. To at most say, like, okay, we're gonna all chip in for this sofa, and then you're gonna buy back my share in the sofa when I leave. Your taste changes. When you're 35, that's when I'm like, okay, it's time to start doing investment pieces. I think that before 25, at 25, from 25 to 35, I want you to input money in three things. Bedding and towels. Anything that your skin touches every day. And you can put those in a box and they can go with you and they last forever. Number two, lamps. Great lamps are hard to find. If you find a lamp that you love, buy two. I do, I do. I do. Buy two. It's two. And also lamps are like the. One of the last things that are matchy matchy. Right. We still love pairs of lamps. And so buy great lamp. And three, art. Because art you'll have with you, and your taste doesn't change in art. It expands, it goes broader. I say to the right. It goes broader. But you still love the same stuff you loved at 12 that you do right now.

[Liz]

Yep. No, that's very true.

[Elaine Griffin]

It expands and you can get it reframed, you know, match your decor. But that's an emotional connection that never dies.

[Liz]

I feel like that's also a connection to where you were when you bought that.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yes.

[Liz]

It's like having memories on your wall.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yes, yes.

[Caroline]

Yeah. You can always find, like, if you've got, you know, small things, group them all together to make one big thing. Or you can split them up. You're always going to have like a sliver of wall or bathroom or, you know, there'll always, always be something. You're always going to have walls.

[Elaine Griffin]

You always have walls, you'll always have room for it. What that particularly looks like. And the rest, it's more strategic. Like I said, I'm a big believer in sharing in furniture because, you know, you want a sofa that you can sit on, right? Because it doesn't you comfortable. So I'm a big believer in like chipping in for like that great, you know, dollar sign sofa, shameless plug. But I believe in, you know, chipping in for. For. For this. But then I also believe in shopping garage sales and being just being frugal with that first. With your first apartment, you know, as you. The closer you get to 35, then that's when you start making your big investments.

[Caroline]

Yeah. The thing I love about that advice is that when you are like buying, you know, thrifted stuff and sort of being more frugal, it like gives you more room to play. And you can try. You can try more stuff.

[Elaine Griffin]

It's not a commitment, right? It's not. It's like dating a whole bunch of people when you're in college.

[Caroline]

Like, you.

[Elaine Griffin]

You could be like, let me would never bring home to your parents. But you're gonna try it out. No, I love it.

[Caroline]

You could. I mean, you could do like an all neutral room and then be like, oh, I don't like that. It's boring. I read today. And then, you know, you can like kind of. I don't know. I feel like you gotta really try playful.

[Taryn]

Though. I do agree that's the time to play too. Yeah, that's the time making the mistakes, right? Yeah, you need to. You need to make those like all life lessons. The area of design, I feel like, is the same.

[Caroline]

Elena, is there anything from your like 20 to 35, 25 to 35 time period that you still have?

[Elaine Griffin]

Oh, my gosh. Let's think. Yes. Oh, my word. Yes. Yes, yes. I still have knives that I bought in Paris at E. Delrayne. No, no, no, no. The piece. The Clignancourt.

[Caroline]

Oh.

[Elaine Griffin]

And so I still have those because they're made. It's totally unpolitically correct. But they're made of horn of like real, like, horn.

[Caroline]

Beautiful, like steak knives or like, these.

[Elaine Griffin]

Are like steak knives. And so. Yeah, but they were like. They're like. I never use them. They're so nice. I never use them. I still have those. I still have art. I still have. One of my greatest treasures is because I identify obviously very much with Josephine Baker, who was like the American chanteuse that went to Paris. And I have a set of lithographs from Paul Collin, who is one of her friends and a great illustrator of the period, of the art deco period. And I'm pleased to report that they have increased. They just had a sale of his and of French stuff and I was like. And so those are literally. They're one of the two things that I would rescue if I had to run out of a burning. I would take my cats and those prints. What else do I have? I have throw pillows.

[Caroline]

Throw pillows.

[Elaine Griffin]

I have throw pillows. I have throw pillows. They're amazing. They're made from antique. I went to Morocco for the weekend and they are that amazing Moroccan embroidery. So they're really antique textiles. But I have those. Oh, and I have a mirror. See Accessories. I have a mirror that was a pier mirror, you know, like tall and narrow, glazed that I've. I've carried with me from apartment to apartment to apartment. So see, those are the little things. But my pull out sofa. No, no, of course not. No. Gone.

[Caroline]

My mirror's a great one. That's another good one. I feel like.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yeah. Cause you will always have room for a mirror over a dresser or at.

[Caroline]

The end of a hallway and you're, you know, entry and a grouping of.

[Taryn]

Again on the wall.

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Taryn]

Good.

[Elaine Griffin]

Good call.

[Caroline]

What about you, Taryn? Do you have any from when you were 25?

[Taryn]

I was literally thinking of it when you were talking and I was like, man, what have I kept? It is hard. I was the same colorful I am now because I remember in college.

[Elaine Griffin]

That's part of your DNA.

[Taryn]

Yeah. I remember this Ralph Lauren warm hue striped comforter I had in college. And I feel like those warm bright colors have followed me since.

[Elaine Griffin]

So my generation had Laura Ashley. She's present. She's still present.

[Taryn]

TJ Max just happened to have that Ralph Lauren cover. That's a good. I have to think of mine. I'll circle back because I know art. Art for sure.

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Liz]

Yeah. I have a card catalog that has come with me everywhere where we've. We've lived.

[Elaine Griffin]

That's with the little drawers. Yes.

[Liz]

And it's fantastic.

[Elaine Griffin]

Did you guys even still have card catalogs when you went to college? Like were they still there?

[Liz]

And it's.

[Caroline]

I never truly learned how to use.

[Liz]

It, but I really remember the decimal system tour.

[Caroline]

I mean I remember the movies. Like do you remember the mov that you learned in library class of like learning. Oh, we had like a movie about the Dewey Decimal Decimal system.

[Liz]

Yeah, I love it.

[Caroline]

Does anyone know what I'm diagnosed.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yes, I. I get the. We get the concept? No, we had like a. We had a seminar. No, we had a seminar where you had to go to the library and they taught you that. It was like, you know, webinar 101 that. No, we had it too.

[Liz]

I just.

[Caroline]

It didn't sink in. But.

[Liz]

Yeah, sorry, go ahead. No, it's totally okay.

[Elaine Griffin]

So you have the card catalog.

[Liz]

We have a card catalog. And our.

[Elaine Griffin]

How big is it?

[Liz]

Oh, it's. It's three. It's stacked three high. So it's. So it's tall. Is it five feet?

[Elaine Griffin]

It's self standing.

[Liz]

It's like on a stand. It's on a stand. It comes apart. So it has a base and then two levels and then a level with the pull out stand so you can write down.

[Taryn]

So they're looking for. So they made pieces of furniture just for libraries? Yeah, and it's modular. Modular. So you could continue to add if.

[Elaine Griffin]

You had a library versus Azure library group.

[Liz]

Right.

[Taryn]

Okay.

[Liz]

Right.

[Taryn]

All right.

[Elaine Griffin]

Where'd you get it?

[Liz]

It came from St. Joe College in Indiana. We're getting rid of it. And my mom found it and yoinked it for me. And we've had since our first apartment in Chicago.

[Elaine Griffin]

What does it do?

[Liz]

And it traveled to LA and to Atlanta. So it has a really fantastic function in our house where you enter into our house directly into the living room. So we don't have an entryway, but it becomes a place where we keep a bowl on top, where we have our keys. All of the drawers are filled with things that we need to go out. There's sunglasses, there's.

[Elaine Griffin]

There's.

[Liz]

I mean, during COVID it was like, okay, mask it up. We had like three drawers full of masks. Like, you know, so there's, it's filled with, you know, batteries in some sections.

[Elaine Griffin]

Right.

[Liz]

Taper candles, chargers, chargers, all of those things that you need on a regular basis. But it, it really is our entry and exit piece. So you pull out the drawer, you set the mail on top.

[Elaine Griffin]

That's so cool.

[Caroline]

And every drawer is labeled correct? Correct.

[Liz]

You know, I used to, I used to label them, but I don't anymore.

[Caroline]

I feel like it would be very organizational until you're like, wait, there are 50 drawers and where the hell are the taper candles? And I've got to open every single drawer to find them.

[Liz]

Yeah, I open a lot of drawers. But to your point, like, the purpose of this piece has shifted from my 20s and 30s.

[Elaine Griffin]

So she's like, it was my dining table once. Well, close.

[Liz]

It was a novelty holder for quite some time, especially in my 20s, as I would collect, like bits and bobbles and things from art school. And so like, you could your treasure, but like, silly treasure. So like, you would open up one drawer and it would be filled with like little plastic animals and another one that would be filled with lenticulars, which I have a collection of, which are winky rings, so. Or like those postcards that, like, you look at it one way and you see one image and you see the other way.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yes.

[Caroline]

Like a hologram.

[Elaine Griffin]

Kind of. Kind of like that?

[Liz]

Kind of. It's two images in one. And there's a rib I spot.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yeah, with a rib. With the ribs. Textured surface.

[Liz]

I have a collection.

[Elaine Griffin]

So it's old school holograms.

[Liz]

So it used to be. It used to house all of my. My odds and ends, oddball collections of things. And now it's a lot more practical.

[Elaine Griffin]

Today I learned the word lenticular. That's what they're called, lenticulars. They're textured. And you look at it one way and you see it. It's like a kind of like a hologram.

[Liz]

Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

And the other way it's like. It looks something else. That's so cool.

[Liz]

So that's. That's what's been with me.

[Elaine Griffin]

What have you got?

[Caroline]

Lamps. I have three lamps. Lamps. Like two. A pair of marble lamps I got at Scott's, like, when I first moved here.

[Elaine Griffin]

Cool.

[Caroline]

This, like, funky acrylic lamp that I, like, saw at an antique store and I told my mom I wanted for my birthday, and she's like, you're not gonna.

[Elaine Griffin]

That's.

[Caroline]

You don't want that. That's ugly. And I was like, no, I really like it. She bought it for me, and I've kept that. And then I have, like an occasional chair. It's sort of like a briger chair that I've had reupholstered. So like an occasional chair. But you can't always have room for that.

[Elaine Griffin]

Right.

[Caroline]

And it floats. It's easy to float.

[Taryn]

That's a good one.

[Liz]

And like a mirror, those are skinny, solid, practical things. And here I am. I've got winky, right?

[Elaine Griffin]

You've got a table. No, but see, that's super cool, though.

[Taryn]

It's very cool.

[Elaine Griffin]

That's super cool.

[Taryn]

And bedding, I feel like that's.

[Liz]

Bedding is so smart.

[Taryn]

I had linen, like a big linen set, like basic linen, but like, it stayed forever because it's just it continuously.

[Elaine Griffin]

Like, I had my Laura Ashley sheets from college longer than I would care to admit. Just keep watching them.

[Caroline]

They get softer.

[Elaine Griffin]

Love it.

[Liz]

That's fantastic.

[Elaine Griffin]

But what I think is important is that not one of us has said dining table, dining chairs, sofa, coffee table, period.

[Caroline]

Yeah, well, because I think, like, anytime you move, you kind of slough off some of that stuff because you're like, well, this coffee table doesn't fit the. In the type of room I have. And. And dining tables, I feel like, are really space specific. People feel like, oh, I'm going to buy this and have it forever. But if you've got. If you buy a house with a square dining room, you got to get rid of your. Your oval dining table because it's not going to work.

[Liz]

Yeah.

[Caroline]

Yeah. So it. And I think that that's probably one where I feel like people get like, they. They want to invest early and it's just something that that's like, can't travel really.

[Elaine Griffin]

No.

[Caroline]

You know.

[Elaine Griffin]

No, that's why, literally, if I could have seminars on that for. Because it blew me away that my buddy was like, I'm going to get really. I really want. Because she called me thinking, like, make me a shopping list. What am I going to get? And I was like, nothing. You are not buying anything that's that nice. Because she's like, and I understand the intention. It's great to be able to do that. To like, you know what? The gift that I can give my daughter is of leg up in the decor department for forever. She'll have some really great investment pieces that she can hand on to her daughter. I'm like, your daughter. Her grandchildren are going to want that even less. And so, like, news flash. So she was like, what? She was kind of bummed out about it because she was really excited. I'm like, no, you have another great journey you can go on. It's just not the one that you thought because now you can start drifting things. And those are the bulletins that I get now. Look what we found. Look what we got. Look what we did. So, you know, they hit, like, great sales and they just this. So there's a time and a place for everything. But what I think is hilarious. And one of my actual very first clients was the Miss Moneybag, Miss Moneybags, who spent tons on her first apartment. And then I didn't work with her in her 30s, but I knew the designer, and I was like, what'd she keep? And she showed me the stuff that she kept. But it was a totally different feeling because the more you see. Because that's what your eye developing your eye is all about the more you see your taste changes. Your taste in clothes changes less, but it still becomes more sophisticated.

[Caroline]

Mm.

[Elaine Griffin]

That's what style really is.

[Caroline]

That is so interesting. I've never heard anyone, like, articulate their. Someone's design style in that way. Like the four, your four, or their design journey.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yeah, yeah.

[Caroline]

I've never thought about that, but it's so true. Like, my mom loves English furniture, which I don't really like because she went and did study abroad in England.

[Elaine Griffin]

See?

[Caroline]

And I went and did study abroad in France. So everything she tries to give me, I'm like. Like, I don't really like that.

[Taryn]

That's funny.

[Caroline]

And she's, like, all perplexed by it, which I just. It had never really, like, occurred to me in that way.

[Elaine Griffin]

But if she were to bring you, like, a French Berger, you'd be like, oh, my God. Thank you so much.

[Caroline]

My occasional chair that I have is a French Berger. That's so funny. Yeah. That is so insightful. I'm so glad you're here. Yay.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yay.

[Taryn]

No problems.

[Elaine Griffin]

That's my greatest joy in the world, is elucidating people, like, sharing that knowledge with, you know, because very few people actually sit around and think, like, I don't know, why does that really work? And I'm like, I've got it. Here's why. You don't have to do the work. So that's it.

[Caroline]

Well, I think, you know, like, for anyone listening, where if they're, like, they went abroad in England or something, then they can go forward and they can be like, okay, I'm going to go to an antique store, and I can then articulate to the person there, I really like English antiques because of the stain or that sort of turned leg or those little drawer handles they all have or whatever. And then they can use that knowledge to then make sure their purchases are more, I guess, in line with what.

[Elaine Griffin]

They design is so huge. Imagine a huge warehouse of everything that you want, like, available, which is called the Internet. And so it's really intimidating to think, like, what is the. I need a side table. Oh, my word. And the more you are more deeply familiar with your own style, aesthetic. You know, I'm going to Google English side tables as opposed to side tables, which, you know, is like, 8,642,000. So English side tables, that helps narrow it down.

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

Which is not to say that it's formulaic, because our taste evolves. It always evolves. But you know that you want to start, and it always expands. It doesn't contract, it expands. And, you know, the older you get, the more it expands and it softens. Because at a certain point, I will tell you in my journey now, because I'm the oldest person at this table, I will tell you, at a certain point, it becomes an attachment to the sentimental. I'm at that stage. You know, I moved back. I moved back to Georgia. I lived in Paris. I lived in New York. I lived in Paris. I returned to New York. I was a publicist for nine years. And then I transitioned and went to design school at the New York School of Interior Design. I have an honorary PhD from them now, which is awesome. Thank you very much. And then I moved back home to Georgia. I worked for Peter Reno, who's like, Captain Grant and fancy architect. And I always tell design students, you can always trickle down. It's hard to trickle up. So always aim for the top as your first jobs. And. And I moved back home in 2015 to take care of my mom, who had dementia. And so at first, I thought I moved back home for the winter because I. You live in a small town, and I'm getting reports that she looked lost in a parking lot. You know, something like when you were getting the reports. And I'm like, well, I'm just gonna go home for the winter. And then I realized after I had been there for two weeks that she deserved an Academy Award for acting, saying. Cause girlfriend sanity had left the building. And so. And I was like, you have moved back home. You have not moved. Move home for the winter. And so, you know, I put my. I had put all of my stuff in storage, thinking that, you know, I would come back and, you know, and acquire a new apartment. But then I'm like, I've moved back home. And now that I've been there since 2015, I'm like, who wants to live in New York anymore? Because, like, I love living. And I go, you know, I fly out of Savannah, and so I could be in New York for a meeting. It's like coming in from Connecticut. I can be in a New York for a meeting. I leave it on the red with the airport, you know, staff at the airline, staff at 6am I can be in a meeting in New York at, like, 10. So, you know, I love being able to come and go and then, you know, not have winter. But I'm back in my childhood home. And now, you know, my mom left us in 2020 just before COVID Her timing was always impeccable. And so. And that's the last design journey that we make, you know, you come, you. It starts with, I'm going to cry. It's. I'm totally going to cry. It starts with, you know, your first. Your dorm room, which is just like a little dipping your toe in it. It's like, you know, dorm rooms are like drag queen. And so then you have your first apartment, you know, with your squad. And then, you know, you have your first marri abode. And then, you know, that shifts. You know, back in the day, we only lived in three homes. We lived in the one we grew up in. We lived in our starter home, and then we lived in our family home, right? So now we're a little bit more transitory, so we move more because we're. We're more peripatetic. But so, you know, then you move into and into the big house, as it were, and then you either downsize or. For me, I moved because so many of us are coming back home to take care of our parents. Now I'm back in my childhood home, and my mom, who was a true style diva, if I am fashionable, she is my style icon. And it's taking that very Southern, very formal because, you know, they were judged. You know, women of that era were judged on their looks. Your husband, dad was, you know, a doctor. Judged on your look. She was great. Beauty, fashion play, the haunting. Archie taught school for, you know, a thousand years. And, you know, they were judged on their house. They were judged. Southerners were the harshest judges of all. Have you seen her house? And so, you know, that era, so taking someone who had such a decidedly personal viewpoint, every single thing, you know, because that was good taste or not good taste. And her house was all about her, right? Because she showed off. You came over, you're supposed to. Your job was supposed to drop because it was her kingdom, her queendom. So taking that and making it mine has been quite the journey. And that's the last journey that I'll make. So at this point, the stuff that I've kept is sentimental, right? And then I blended in her. My favorite pieces of hers, I've blended in. But, like, I let her French provincial bedroom suite go. I was like, no, I brought in my own bedroom furniture. So that's the last, you know, the last step of that journey, which is kind of the equivalent of downsizing, right? Because at that point, you only keep the things you love. And everything I look at now, other than, like, the utilitarian, because there's always a story about a chair in a corner that you needed a chair in the corner. So that is the chair that works in that corner. But the other stuff has a story behind it.

[Caroline]

Has it been hard to reimagine your mom's house?

[Elaine Griffin]

It took a while. It took a while because she, you know, she left us in 2020. And I think that I really stayed there without, you know, I stay there a good year, you know, before, you know, we're very close. So, you know, I talked to her twice a day, whether I wanted to or not. And so I always say she was the original black Jewish mom. I talked to her twice a day, whether I wanted to or not. And. And so I stayed there a whole year before I was like, you know what? I can't, I can't, I can't, I can't. I did sit in the sofa, though. And so. And I put my feet up on the coffee table. I did, but. And then I did like, she had these two oriental carpets that. When they were still oriental carpets. We don't call them that anymore. But, you know, they were her pride and joy. They had to go. Cause I cried every time I looked at them, you know, that I was like, no, you gotta go. But. And then in truly divine intervention, one of my best girlfriends, you know, my best friend from first grade called and said that her daughter in law was moving to, you know, her own apartment. Read between the lines and did I have any old furniture. And I heard my mother's voice say, it's fine, it's fine, that's perfectly fine. I heard her voice say, that's perfectly fine. And so I gave her all of the things that I didn't. I furnished her apartment. And so. But my, my mom adored my best friend in first grade, Molly. And so Molly's daughter in law still has like all of the great stuff. So, you know, I'm sure my mom's over there haunting her right now. I said, if you feel something cold on you in the middle of the night, just say, just say, hi, Mrs. Griffin. So, you know, that's, it's just like downsizing, which is, you know, that's hard to do. Like, what do you keep? What do you not.

[Taryn]

Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

You know, so that, and that's, you know, once again it's, it's that emotional because. And we've gone the full trajectory then. Right. Because you've gone from disposable.

[Taryn]

Yep.

[Elaine Griffin]

To essential. And essential being like the must haves that there's a story behind. Everywhere you look is a story.

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

So that's it. Hello there.

[Caroline]

Ballard Designs. I have a Question for your podcast. We are building a lake home and I'm uncertain what color to paint the two story great room kitchen and two story four seasons room. Wow. These rooms are separated by the kitchen in the middle. And I'm attaching a screenshot of the floor plan.

[Elaine Griffin]

Screenshot.

[Caroline]

The wood flooring color is a light pine. The color of the cabinets are attached. The island is the blue color. I was thinking of the color alabaster by Sherwin Williams for the walls. This will allow some contrast between the white sea ceiling. We will also be putting up wood beams. I'm not sure this is enough contrast. The room does have excellent light and maybe light French gray from Sherwin Williams would work.

[Liz]

Maybe.

[Caroline]

I'm completely off. That's why I'm coming to you for help. Thanks, Amanda.

[Elaine Griffin]

So number one, good job with those colors because the blue is a great color. It's a great neutral. And repose gray is a great color. It's a great neutral. So yay. And to answer the quick version to your question, to answer to make your kitchen, alabaster is great because alabaster is an off white. It's kind of like ivory. And it's a great very, very, very pretty. To me, it is in the top five Sherwin Williams colors that are out there. So.

[Caroline]

Okay, well, never mind. Sorry.

[Elaine Griffin]

Were the other four.

[Caroline]

Yes.

[Elaine Griffin]

I was going to ask it if you didn't. Ceiling white. Duh. Extra white. Extra white is the perfect color for trim. Benjamin Moore's white dove is the perfect color for trim. And extra white. Sherwin Williams is the perfect color for trim. Repro's gray is right there. It's very good. And then there's accessible beige, which is like very, very good. And then sea pearl, which is a color that we use on the coast a lot. It's like, it's a coastal version of alabaster. It has a little bit more green in it. It's very pretty. And sea pearl. And there's another one that I can't remember.

[Caroline]

I love that you could just rattle those off. Shoot the top of your head. Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

Paint. Hello. Is what we. And I can give you those from Benjamin Moore too. But we're not going to do that today because we're having Sherwin Williams moment. Okay, wait. So that's very good. When you're thinking about what color to paint something your rooms, there are four things that you want to take into consideration. One is inside your house. You know what is happening? You know already she said that she's thinking about alabaster for the kitchen. She could have said, I want a pink kitchen. Or she could have, we have neutrals going on in the kitchen. She could have had like, you know, navy counter, navy cabinets, which are still very trendy. And that would have been like a different decision. She could have already made a commitment. I absolutely must have a black wall. And that was very trendy. So what else is happening inside, color wise? You know what. And all your upholstery, your whole design, whatever inside. Number two is outside. What's happening outside? This is a lake house. We can assume that one of these rooms has a view, right? And also if. If you look right below, the great room looks like that's where you enter the house. So when you enter the house, your eye is going to go back to that screen porch. And we assume that beyond that screen porch is a gorgeous space, a lawn that leads to a view of some sort of thing. If it doesn't have a view, she has a backyard with a whole bunch of green in it. You want to ask yourself what's going. We'll get back to that. What's going on outside? And then number three is, what's your color tolerance level? You either love a lot of color. I love a lot of color. Or you're a color phobe and you're like a little bit. Not much. I'm guessing that she's a colorphobe because she was thinking about a pale gray for that. So I was like, she didn't say, I'm thinking about brightness. So I'm assuming she's kind of towards a color phobic, which means you want to go to a little paler palette. And then the fourth one is how much natural light do you get in the room? If it's facing south, does it like southern facing rooms? Southern exposures give you the most light. Northern exposures give you the interesting fact toy back in the day in England, and I do mean, you know, Downton Abbey, England, where they had hot and cold running people. Kitchens of the great houses always face north because it was the least amount of light. So they were, you know, kept the coolest back before we had central air. And so when they still relied on marble pantries to keep them cool. So how much natural light is the room going to get? What time of day? That's another important, important consideration in any, in any space. If it is. If you're a stay at home mom and you are spending a lot of time in your kitchen and your room next to it, those that room needs to be colors that look great during the day, if you are a single person and you are in your den mostly after six, and you're active from the hours of 6pm to midnight, you want that room to look great at night. And, you know, they're color palettes. The, you know, the bigger, the bolder, the stronger you want to think about that. And those are the things that, I mean, how long are you going to be in there? So rooms that are transitory, like a foyer or somewhere that you're just passing through. Dining rooms, those rooms can be brighter. You can have a red dining room because you spend two hours a day maximum in there. Or your foyer can be, like, dramatic because you walk through it. And then the other color rule that's important, since I here is if you are a color fanatic, as am I, and you want to have the green, you know, living room and the red dining room and you and the bold blue bedroom, you have to have a neutral corridor. You cannot have a crazy color, color corridor. It must be neutral because the eye must rest. You can't go from crazy to crazy to crazy. You need to go from crazy to calm. Calm to crazy. But the eye must have a moment to breathe. So you have. And then in that point, when you're doing super duper crazy, which I love to do for my clients, you have to have one color that runs through the house. Typically, it's green, it's yellow. It could be a blue that unifies. Even if it's throw pillows, it always has, you know, it's an accent color, but that serves to unify by the cacophony of color. So that's what I would take into consideration when you're assuming that she has a great view, you know, when you first walk in. Because what do you see when you first walk in? It's most important vista in your house. Assuming that it's a lake. I would want to have colors like literally sit outside and make a list of the colors that you see in your landscape. That's going to be your palette, right? There's one that's the most dominant. It most likely is green. Or if it were a beach house, it would be blue. That's why blue. Blue beach houses are always like blue. And southern beach houses are always blue and white. So you want the room to disappear into the landscape because the landscape is a really star of the ship. That's why you're spending all that money to build your lake house. So you really want to feel that while you're there, you don't want your Interior, your colors to compete with what's outside. Because the whole point of having a lake house is enjoying that lake. Right. So if the most dominant color were green, and I'm guessing that she's a color phobe, I would go with soft greens and whatever hue you see outside, most greens go together. If you look at nature, you know, that's most greens go together and most blues go together. If a color combination exists in nature, in a fruit, a flower, or a landscape, it will go together in your eyes. House. Right.

[Caroline]

You mentioned. Or I guess like her. Her gray color is sort of a warm gray. I feel like that. I don't know. I always think of lake houses being a lot of brown too. Like green and brown. Because, like, it's wooded.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yeah.

[Caroline]

So, yeah, I love that idea of the light greens and then maybe having like those neutrals.

[Elaine Griffin]

Or you could actually do the blues and you could make one. Because here we don't want to go crazy. Cause she's not a crazy person. And also in a floor plan, an open floor plan. Cause we're assuming that there are very few walls here. Excuse me. You want to play with the shades. You could have a darker green here, a lighter green here. You could even go up and down the color chart of your swatch. And one could be lighter, one could be dark, darker. Just variations of the shade. They could. You could make all three. The screen porch. I would make the darkest of it all. I would even consider being daring. Hello, Amanda. Amanda. I would be. I would consider being daring there and going for a very dark green. Because that would just be amazing. Yeah. Because then the other two would bounce off of it.

[Caroline]

You're paying for the screen porch.

[Elaine Griffin]

For the screen porch.

[Caroline]

Okay.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yeah. I would make that the darkest color of all. Because that you really want to disappear. Because it's standing between the living room, the great room, and the view. So we want that to disappear. And another factoid is that your inside. Your inside style statement has to transition to the exterior. You know, if you are mid century modern inside, please do not go like crazy traditional outside and vice versa. Right. You want. They must be stylistically related. And they also need to be color palette related too, because they're extensions. And particularly in the south, when we live outside 10 months of the year, they really need to speak the same language. They need to be first cousins and not complete strangers. I would also encourage her instead of the grays because she has repose gray, which is a very beigey gray. I would encourage her to look at the beige because that Very gray moment was such a big trend that it's leaving us, and it's looking dated. And we don't want to ever decorate for trends because we are timeless, not necessarily trendy. I would say that gray is looking, you know, that gray, gray, gray, gray must be everything gray. And that I would encourage her to look at the beiges, which probably relate more to outside. Right. Because we have that natural color palette. And I'm assuming. Assuming that, you know, it's not a beach house, so she doesn't have blue. I'm assuming it's brackish water in the lake, so it's probably brown in the gray. So I would encourage, like, a very pale beige.

[Caroline]

Like earthy colors.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yeah, yeah.

[Caroline]

Like, nothing too clear. No, like you would do at the beach.

[Elaine Griffin]

Right.

[Caroline]

But she. I mean, that blue that she picked is a pretty.

[Elaine Griffin]

Like, it's a neutral.

[Caroline]

Yeah, it's pretty.

[Elaine Griffin]

It's a neutral because you could go green and blue. The good news is that blue is the color of the sky. Right. All colors take their cues from nature. And then, you know, because I want to demystify everything so you understand it. So if you look at a landscape, those are the. That's a perfect color palette. If we're focusing on the outdoors, it's one thing if you're in a city apartment and you're facing a brick wall, which I had one of those one day. I put up shutters, and so I faced. But I had a brick wall. So what do you do? And that's when you. The whole drama to be inside saying, like, don't look at that window. Don't go out there. Don't. So as a rule, you can't have both. You know, one. You are blessed with one and not the other. She's blessed with this view here. So the view really does need to be the star of the show. And then, you know, your walls are quieter. She could have a little bounce in the upholstery. Cause it's not all calm, calm, calm. It's, you know, it's not a slavish devotion to the outcome doors. Like, you know, I hate it. My big pet peeve. And men love to do this because they're just so devoted to the view, but they're like, I want all the chairs to face. I'm like, no, because you stand up, you're going to see the view at night. The best view in the world disappears. What are you going to do then when your furniture is facing the wrong way?

[Caroline]

Yeah, it's a great point.

[Elaine Griffin]

So that's, you know, that's especially for a lake house, a beach house, any house that has a really great view, even if it's. Oh, and the other thing to think about is. And this is true for almost every house that has a big backyard and lots of windows, a lot of green is reflected.

[Taryn]

Yes. So much. At least here in Atlanta.

[Elaine Griffin]

So much green everywhere. Everywhere. A lot of green. And if you're photographing your house for Instagram or whatever or for Professionally, that's the number one pet peeve of photographers because they have to correct that. Because it reads on the page if you do that. I'm blessed that almost every. Yes. Every apartment I lived in New York was photographed for publication. Thank you, God. And that was the number one complaint, that there was a lot of green on the out. Other than the brick wall. Other than the brick wall.

[Caroline]

It's a luxury in New York to have a green view.

[Elaine Griffin]

To have a green. And it could only be trees. Like, understand we're not seeing grass, but we had trees. Which, like, amazing.

[Caroline]

That is. Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

Right. I mean, that's why I'm like, thank you. But particularly if you have a house, you're going to have a lot of green coming in. So that means if you have green, you have permission to make it a bolder green than you ordinarily would because it's. It's competing already with the green outside.

[Caroline]

Mm.

[Liz]

Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

That's just, like, fun fact to know.

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

Are we good with Amanda?

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

Do we think Amanda has any other.

[Taryn]

Questions if she does come right back in?

[Caroline]

Yes.

[Taryn]

We don't limit people to one question. They're allowed to. We actually love hearing how it's going, so.

[Elaine Griffin]

Oh, good. Amanda, let us know how it's going, girl.

[Taryn]

I think that was great advice.

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Taryn]

I went back to year for where she's at.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yeah. Where she's at. This is where she's at right now.

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

And think about it. It could be like, she has young kids, and this could be like their forever beach house. I mean, how cool is that?

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Liz]

Pretty amazing, right?

[Caroline]

What a, like, amazing project, right?

[Elaine Griffin]

We're coming over, Amanda.

[Caroline]

Yeah.

[Elaine Griffin]

When are we coming?

[Taryn]

We're looking for invite.

[Elaine Griffin]

Exactly. We want a weekend. Labor Day weekend next year. We're coming.

[Taryn]

That's probably finally when you'll have it fully decorated and done, to be honest.

[Caroline]

Yes. Well, Elaine, thank you so much. How much fun I love having you.

[Taryn]

Yes. And everybody, this book is. Came out in 2009, so it's still running.

[Elaine Griffin]

It's still running. You can go to my website, Elaine Griffin.com to get them. Or you can get them on Amazon. I sell them cheaper. So there's a. There's a link@elaine griffin.com and you can get your.

[Caroline]

And on Instagram. You're Elaine Griffin as well.

[Elaine Griffin]

I am, and I have two on Facebook. The one that I think is better is Elaine Griffin nyc because I have the Elaine Griffin from when I was on tv, but I use Elaine Griffin NYC more now on Facebook.

[Caroline]

Well, thank you for joining us.

[Elaine Griffin]

I had such a blast. And coming back.

[Caroline]

I love Atlanta. I'll be back anytime.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yay.

[Caroline]

And when is your second book coming out?

[Elaine Griffin]

You know what? I'm thinking about that right now. But the one next, I want to do a girlfriend's guide to living with a dementia person because there's such a. It's a journey that's like raising children, you know, if you don't know what you're doing.

[Taryn]

We've had a few people write in asking about just making a home more accessible for older generations and younger because we only speak to the younger. We don't talk about the older and accessibility needed there. So I think you're. You might have found your little.

[Elaine Griffin]

Yeah, that's my next one. That's my next one. So we're just getting started with that.

[Caroline]

Well, let us know.

[Elaine Griffin]

I'll let you know. You'll be the first to know.

[Caroline]

That's great. And that's our show. You can find all of the show notes on our blog howtodecorate.com podcast to.

[Taryn]

Send in a decorating dilemma, email your questions to podcast ballard designs.net so we can help you with your space.

[Caroline]

And of course, be sure to follow us on social media at Ballard Designs.

[Liz]

Don't forget to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts so you never miss an episode. And please leave us a review. We'd love to hear your feedback.

[Caroline]

Until next time, happy decorating.