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- [00:02]
Caroline
Welcome to how to Decorate from Ballard Designs, a weekly podcast all about the trials and triumphs of decorating and redecorating your home. I'm Caroline. I'm on the marketing team.
- [00:11]
Taryn
And I'm Taryn and I'm a product designer.
- [00:13]
Caroline
I'm Liz. I head of the creative team.
- [00:15]
Geoffrey Allen
We're your hosts.
- [00:16]
Caroline
Join the expert team at Ballard Designs for tips, tricks and tales from interior designers, stylists, and other talents in the design world.
- [00:23]
Taryn
Plus, we'll answer your decorating dilemmas at the end of each episode.
- [00:25]
Caroline
We love answering your questions, so don't forget to email us@podcastallardesigns.net now, on with the show. You might remember today's guest from his years on Bravo's hit TV show Million Dollar Decorators. Or perhaps his first book, the Meaning of home, published in 2013. Or maybe one of his countless features in design bibles like Elle Decor, Architectural Digest, and How's Beautiful. With roots in California, training in London, and projects all over the country, we're excited to talk about his newest book publishing this month. This is Home with Rizzoli. Welcome to the show. Geoffrey Allen works.
- [01:02]
Geoffrey Allen
Thank you. Thank you for having me.
- [01:04]
Caroline
Yes, we were so thrilled to get a copy of your book and to get to read it, and so we're just thrilled to have you here. So thanks for being here.
- [01:13]
Geoffrey Allen
The book, you know, picks up 10 years later after the first book. You know, things have changed for me personally. I've moved all over the world and back again and married now. And I have a little daughter, which a few of you have seen, who's 5 years old. Her name is James. And that makes writing a book and doing my design practice day to day very different than it looked 10 years ago.
- [01:44]
Caroline
There's a gorgeous picture of your family and like the inside, the very first image, I think all of you on the beach. So that is. Was so. It's beautiful to see what a gorgeous shot. But I love in the introduction, you talk about growing up all over California and then you moved to England and studied and, you know, sort of, I guess had your introduction into your. Into interior design there.
- [02:12]
Geoffrey Allen
I think that really stemmed my style there, too. I mean, working for people like John Stefanides and being an intern at Colfax and Fowler, all the great old interior design houses really changed my view on design and how I look at things.
- [02:30]
Caroline
Well, I loved that. I mean, I think all of that little nugget about your background was the first paragraph of your introduction, and it almost was just the entire sort of thesis of the book wrapped into one. Because that kind of is your style. It's like this California cool and, like, streamlined mixed with this, you know, patina, English coziness. And, like, that's just every project I was like, oh, there's maybe a little more California here or a little more English here. But, like, each one had that, you know, had that combination of styles. So that was the perfect way to kick it off.
- [03:07]
Geoffrey Allen
Oh, thank you.
- [03:08]
Caroline
So, you know, maybe you could kind of tell any of our listeners who are just getting to know you for the first time. You know, you mentioned growing up in California. What is it maybe that you sort of. I also want to mention, actually, just even to start everything happening in California right now. And I. As I was reading the book, I kept thinking back to all of the fires and really kind of worried about your, you know, your projects and your clients.
- [03:38]
Geoffrey Allen
And, you know, it's very sad. We've had some. About eight friends now that have lost their houses completely.
- [03:47]
Taryn
Wow.
- [03:48]
Geoffrey Allen
You know, because I lived in the Palisades for 15 years prior to moving to Santa Barbara, prior to being in Greenwich. So a lot of my early design years were there in the Palisades with. So I've done a lot of houses, and I have a lot of friends. And it is very sad. You know, I know they will rebuild, but it's easier said than done of, you know, it's not going to happen overnight, and it's going to be a lot of work for all of us. And we're. And we're trying to do everything we can right now to just, you know, we've all sort of donated clothes, but they need more than that. They need, you know, beds and sheets and towels and a place to live. And, you know, the rentals in Los Angeles are, you know, crazy now because people are trying to, like, you know, get their kids back in school, and their kids are. Have all sorts of questions, and it's a very hard time. So, yeah, our hearts go out to California. Yes. And I would say most of my design work was based there and will be again.
- [05:01]
Caroline
Yeah, you kick off the book with your own kind of seaside cottage there in Montecito. Maybe tell everybody about that project. Cause I thought that was a fun way to start. It really sort of gave this perfect glimpse into the rest of the book.
- [05:16]
Geoffrey Allen
You know, that was a really important house for me in my evolution, I think, as a designer. It's my first real family house that I designed for a baby and a husband and dogs and whatnot. Entertaining is very different. Now, I love that little house. It's so sweet. It's, you know, it's near Butterfly Beach. Beach. You can walk to the beach. You know, I would say because of the house felt a little bit like being in the Koswalts. We definitely went a little more English with it than California vibe, but I think it works out really well. And it's great light, and I love the gardens. I. I think it's one of the first houses I had that isn't on a hillside. So it was nice to have that garden and to work in the garden. And I found out that I really liked gardening, which is something later in life to learn.
- [06:19]
Caroline
Right.
- [06:20]
Taryn
I don't think you learn it in your 20s. Yeah. You have to learn it.
- [06:23]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah.
- [06:24]
Taryn
No, all of a sudden you're like, this is relaxing and rewarding.
- [06:28]
Geoffrey Allen
And I think, you know, Martha Stewart says it in her documentary, like, if you want a friend for life, like, you know, start a garden, you know, to be happy forever. Yeah. So that's really my happy place these days. Back to my California style, I think it's, you know, it's a mixture of getting that laid back quality mixed with beautiful antiques. And how do you mix that and how do you incorporate that in a way that doesn't feel heavy and like your grandmother did it, you know, I think that's important for me to, you know, bring a lightness to that look that I think the California light and just the California feel. I mean, my house in Connecticut is very, very different and feels more English, and it's a Georgian style house, but people that walk into it can see that it's very inspired by California.
- [07:24]
Caroline
You know, I love that about your style. I think that's what I found. Just the most compelling is you use antiques so liberally throughout your projects, and yet the spaces do not, as a whole, feel traditional. You know, I wouldn't say they don't feel traditional at all, but they don't feel traditional. They feel, you know, fresh and clean, and yet so many of the pieces in there are these, you know, kind of classic shapes. And so I'm curious, like, was that something that you were just kind of inherently. That's just the way you see things put together, or is this sort of something that took you some time to really develop as like a, I guess, a trademark?
- [08:09]
Geoffrey Allen
I think it did take time to develop. I think that, you know, it's all about the mix and what to put next to, you know, an item to make it feel youthful again. And I think it's all about what you. You know, how you incorporate one piece of furniture next to the other and how they merge together is important to me. But also the space itself, I think the architecture has to be. If you do have a lot of antiques, very minimal and clean and airy and not overly, overly decorated. I think it's just. It's about probably moving in slowly. It's funny, we're just moving house again, and I'm keeping this house that we're moving into very sparing right now, because I want the time in that house to be able to breathe and to see where I want to go. And I think a lot of people, as they get older, probably go a little bit more minimal. But, you know, you have to bring also the pieces you've loved throughout your life with you, too. So it's all about the balance of how you. You merge those together, you know?
- [09:33]
Caroline
Yeah. So can you walk us through a little bit? Like you said, it's more about what you're putting next to one another. So say, for example, you've got, like, you know, kind of a traditional house, but. And you've got some traditional pieces. Like, what kind of. Would you then go more clean? Like how. What are sort of like the questions you're asking yourself?
- [09:56]
Geoffrey Allen
I guess I think if you have a traditional house, it's really all about color. I think that's a big one for me. But I think it's about using it sparingly and using it correctly and using it in the right context, I think is important. But to answer that question, I'm never afraid of mixing high, low. Like, you know, I'm happy to mix something that is, you know, West Elm next to a beautiful antique. And I think that makes both pieces stand out and look authentic and youthful and bright and not overly done. I think you can't mix too much of the same thing. You know, you can't use all antiques or you can't use all. West Elm, whether it be that, you know, I think you have to. It's just all about the mix. And I think that what, you know, I'm moving furniture around all the time and seeing how it changes when it moves from room to room. And my husband hates me for it because I, you know, he's tripping over ottomans and things that weren't there yesterday, and now they're there, and I test them out, and maybe they might move again. We don't know. But I think it's always fun for me to see whether it be an old piece or just a piece I, you know, bought at the mall that day next to something and how it brings new life to the whole room.
- [11:36]
Caroline
Kind of on that thread, there was this. There were so many very modern architecturally houses in the book. And I was always so surprised at how you decorated them. You know, some antique rugs or, you know, like a great sort of patina wing back leather chair, that kind of thing. And I, I imagine that if, you know, any of our listeners are out there and they either have a more modern house or they fantasize about it, that's not really sort of the choices you would make. Are there any, you know, kind of like, I guess, guidelines you would think through with a modern house specifically and bringing antiques in? You know, they. They sort of feel like it could be hard to incorporate without doing it, you know, strategically.
- [12:26]
Geoffrey Allen
It is hard to incorporate, I think, you know, I think you need to bring them in one at a time and see how they react in the house, you know, and a contemporary house is very different light than a traditional house only because for the most part they have bigger windows and they have more light and they have lighter floors and it's more open in general. So it is very hard to just bring an old, hand me down antique into a more contemporary house. So it's all about what you put with it, what scale you put it, where you put it. You know, I think it's harder to do a contemporary house than it is a traditional house, because a traditional house you can throw in anything and it looks great and it looks cozy and looks English and, you know, it's a very different look than doing a very sparing contemporary house. And I think that's what I'm going through right now with this house that I'm doing is, you know, you're moving things in from a very traditional house to a, to a contemporary. It's. It's a nice exercise, if you will.
- [13:38]
Caroline
Well, I would think that everything would have to be so, like, I guess, carefully selected because.
- [13:47]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah, yeah, it is.
- [13:49]
Caroline
You know, you don't have the moldings.
- [13:50]
Geoffrey Allen
It's more careful. Yeah, it's much more careful than I love doing traditional work because you can almost throw in anything and it looks great and, you know, it looks cozy and probably where my own personal style was for years, even when I was doing people's houses that were much more contemporary. It's funny how my clients have changed and, you know, this year marks my 30th year doing this job and how my clients have changed in that time. You know, obviously they've were much older than me and now they're much younger than me. So I'm learning from both. I think I took from my clients that were, you know, 60 when I was 30, and now it's the opposite. And it's fun to sort of see where people's heads are today and where they were. And, you know, I think everyone wants their own space, whether it just be a corner out of the room or a 10,000 square foot house. I think they want their space to feel uniquely like them. And that really is what the book is about, is a collection of houses that I've done over the past 10 years that are all very different and the people are all very different and they're all over the place. They're not one's in Greenwich, one's in Austin, ones in Marin, Los Angeles, Manhattan Beach, La Jolla. So I think just having that experience, I think a lot of designers don't get that because my New York, for instance, friends that are designers have only worked in New York City, which is sort of crazy and mind boggling to me that a lot of designers just stay in their own sort of, you know, 30 mile radius, which is great. Nothing wrong with it. It's just I've had the experience of working sort of all over the place and, and got to see how people live in different parts of the country.
- [16:03]
Caroline
What are some of the things that your recent clients have been teaching you? You said they, you've sort of been picking things up.
- [16:12]
Geoffrey Allen
Just.
- [16:12]
Caroline
I'm just curious what some examples are, you know? Cause I think, you know, there was a lot of talk years ago about like the, about COVID and quarantine, really changing people' like approach to living. And I'm curious, like four years past that, is that still kind of like informing?
- [16:32]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah, I mean, I think everyone's into comfort now more so than ever and how they're gonna use the room. And they actually think about it more than they did before. I also think they think about value and how what that plays into it, because I think we realize, and I touch upon this in the book, that there's really no such thing anymore as our forever house. So people are looking at it differently, investment wise, whereas they think for whatever reason it might be, they're not going to be there forever. So let's try it out, let's see, let's test it out. But we don't necessarily need to spend our whole life savings doing this because we might not be here forever. You know what I think? And that's really Covid, that's made that happen. It's just a different mindset.
- [17:29]
Taryn
And you yourself have moved too. And I think that's what's so beautiful about your book is just speaking to the forever home. But really what home is. And it's a collection of homes, of course, in your book, but even for you, has it, with all your moving, has it really changed? You know, you talked about really paring down, but what does that really mean? Just so like something tangible that listeners could get. Does that mean you're not fully designing out rooms or are you just kind of.
- [18:01]
Geoffrey Allen
No, not necessarily. I just. This sounds sort of horrible, but I think I'm a little bit more laissez faire about it now. Like, as long as it looks good and looks good for now. And also like what's wonderful, you know, there's so many outlets now that you can decorate a room and finish a room and accessorize a room very differently than you used to. It's so immediate now I can order it, you know, online and order it in your beautiful catalogs and it shows up, you know, five days later. Yeah, so that's, that's changed. And I think there's so many cute things these days that you don't necessarily. I, you know, I said this before. I don't think you need to spend your whole life savings to decorate a room. I think it's all about. And I think that that's changed my mindset a little bit. Um, but yes, it doesn't seem so permanent. And again, I think that's all in our minds of, you know, if I don't, if I don't love Greenwich, for instance. Okay, let's go try something else out. Whereas I don't think you would be so likely to do that. Ten years ago I was building. When I was 35 years old, I was building all my clients houses that you knew they were gonna die in. You know, they weren't doing this for a five year thing or to flip it or to think about moving cities or whatever it might be. They really, they were there for life. And I think that mindset is changed a little bit today.
- [19:55]
Caroline
What about, you know, you mentioned that you have a five year old now and I imagine that, that we have. Taryn and I both have young kids too. And it's like that is a very trying time on your home and you have a lot of different needs, you know.
- [20:13]
Geoffrey Allen
And your liquor cabinet.
- [20:14]
Caroline
Yes, for sure. So, like, what. How has that changed, has that changed your approach to decor? I have to imagine it has.
- [20:24]
Geoffrey Allen
Yes, it absolutely has. I think that your just general day to day living and how you're going to live in the house and bedtimes change and that nice casual drinks that you're going to have at 7 o'clock doesn't happen so much anymore. It's all about bedtime for two hours. And you know, you guys aren't seeing this on the podcast, but I have a nice black eye shiner on my eye because I was trying to put my daughter to bed a couple of nights ago and she kicked me right in the face, you know, accidentally. But they're growing so fast they don't know their own strength. Obviously. Like now when we go anywhere, it's 100% about her first. And, you know, is she comfortable? Is her bed. There are all her stuffies with her. You know, we travel. When we even go away for the weekend, there's three duffel bags which are quite small, and then there's one full duffel bag that's huge, full of stuff, you know, stuffed animals and whatnot. And they all have to come and that's, you know, that's priority.
- [21:35]
Taryn
Don't forget one. You know, you won't hear the end of it.
- [21:39]
Geoffrey Allen
No.
- [21:40]
Caroline
But the worst is the return trip. God forbid you leave a stuffy where you're visiting. That's the.
- [21:46]
Taryn
I bought a backup of a favorite at one point because I was like. It was a smaller one and I was like, this guy's gonna get left.
- [21:52]
Caroline
We're not.
- [21:53]
Geoffrey Allen
I know, but they know.
- [21:54]
Taryn
They know.
- [21:55]
Geoffrey Allen
I know they know.
- [21:56]
Caroline
They know it's not real. Yeah.
- [21:58]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah.
- [21:59]
Taryn
Well, no, I think kids rooms are kind of hard because of their. For me, I've had trouble because you plan it for this baby, a baby, and then you. And then this baby is only a baby for a year and a half, kind of. And then you have a toddler and then you're planning. And that season of life is so small. And so it is this, you know, like your room probably could last 5 to 10 years of you being content in it and designed well before you're kind of wanting to change things. But like a kid's room, you're like, by the time it settles, you're like, well, we gotta transition the bed. We gotta.
- [22:38]
Geoffrey Allen
I know. Yeah. There's been a lot of transitioning of beds and that itself has been. I'm fortunate enough to go through that exercise that I just didn't know before. I didn't, I didn't grasp it. Even if my clients had two or three kids standing there. I had no idea what they did. After I left.
- [23:02]
Taryn
You were like, it's beautiful. Enjoy.
- [23:04]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, um, that's been an interesting lesson to learn.
- [23:13]
Taryn
Have you looked back at anything that you're like, that was probably a little, like, dangerous?
- [23:19]
Geoffrey Allen
Or a beautiful Gustavian bed when she was 2, like, really, what was I thinking? You know, that's in the book. That's Montecito house. You know, this beautiful bed that I bought her that, you know, lasted a month before we had to get rid of it because she hurt herself on it. And I was just not thinking correctly.
- [23:43]
Caroline
I always, you know, I. The thing I find hard is, like, I, you know, design it and sort of plan everything based on how it's going to look, you know, clean. But it rarely ever looks clean. Right? Like, because if, you know, your own house, your own bedroom and stuff, like, you're imagining the bed being made and the things off the floor. And for the most part, I keep the rest of our house that way. Certainly my own room. But a kid's room, it never looks like it does clean, or at least ours doesn't. So it's like, do you know, how do you design for something to look good when it's messy?
- [24:24]
Geoffrey Allen
Do you know what's so funny is just before I came on, I was discussing. Now, James, my daughter is transitioning to a desk, and we were talking about this desk and what the chair is going to look like in the lamp and like, of. And then you imagine, like, a beautiful, like, thing of pencils that are all matching colors, maybe pink. And then you're like, wait a minute. She's gonna have wicked, like, posters and stickers and everything all over this desk, and it's not gonna look like what I'm thinking. So I don't know. I guess, you know, it's.
- [25:02]
Caroline
Did you just let it go, or do you try to pick things you think will look good?
- [25:06]
Geoffrey Allen
Oh, they're always arranged. There's always, you know, all the mer are lined up every morning. It's definitely the longest pickup of the. You know, just the cleanup of the. Of her room takes five times longer than the whole house every morning. Yeah.
- [25:25]
Caroline
This is great, though. This really makes me feel better.
- [25:27]
Taryn
So people do that.
- [25:28]
Caroline
It does.
- [25:29]
Taryn
I will say my favorite part of probably the morning and working from home. Most days, we're hybrid, and so most days when I'm home is the reset and getting all the beds made and the stuffies lined up. Like you said.
- [25:41]
Caroline
Do you make all the beds, Taryn?
- [25:42]
Taryn
I do. Because again, then I can walk past the room and have that. What we talk about on here is that ease of just like things have places, even if. Yeah, it's hard.
- [25:53]
Geoffrey Allen
And isn't that a nice. Even if it lasts 15 minutes, isn't that a nice sort of breather in your day of like. Oh, the house is in some.
- [26:01]
Taryn
It's eight hours. Right. And I got eight or nine hours till they're home. So there's a. There's a little bit of that. Like. Yes, that. And I know I'm, I'm just grateful I have that opportunity. I didn't. When I'm in office, because you run out the door. You run in the door and, you know. So it's a different situation for sure. But it is the silver lining to the craziness that is this phase of life, I should say.
- [26:22]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [26:25]
Caroline
I just close her door. I'm. I'm in a place now where I'm like, I'm not going to take on cleaning your room. I can't think that's a.
- [26:33]
Geoffrey Allen
Is this a six year old?
- [26:34]
Caroline
Yeah, she's sick. So I'm like, this is.
- [26:36]
Geoffrey Allen
I'm not quite there yet. Yeah.
- [26:38]
Caroline
So we're. There's a lot of like, nagging to clean anyway. It's. It's an ongoing process. But I just close the door and the rest of the house I'll pick up. But.
- [26:46]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [26:50]
Taryn
Well, I'm glad.
- [26:51]
Caroline
Like you said, it's a learning curve.
- [26:52]
Taryn
I was like, I was glad to know that you also have these problems.
- [26:55]
Caroline
Exactly.
- [26:56]
Taryn
I did want to circle back, though, to. We were talking about antiques because you do them so well, and I think your time in Europe really probably influenced how well you layer them into spaces. Especially all these beautiful homes in California that, you know, re. You know, they don't read as just that perfect California, like Caroline was saying. But in the book, you had a few homes, you kind of spoke to the clients not necessarily liking antiques. There was the one dance studio.
- [27:28]
Geoffrey Allen
Oh, yes.
- [27:29]
Taryn
And can you talk a little bit?
- [27:29]
Geoffrey Allen
I met her doing Tracy Anderson, and she said, I hate color and I hate antiques. And I'm like, oh, okay. She's actually one of my favorite people. I've done a couple of houses for her, but they all have to be neutral. She doesn't look at the price tag of things and then all of a sudden does on certain things, but it has to be neutral. I would say she's a lot more plush. She's a lot more like, I don't know, like, the word. It's just so plush and cozy, but in a very minimal. Minimal way. And I've, you know, I've taken a lot of lessons from that, too, of her design aesthetic, which is, you know, wasn't necessarily mine, but some of it, you know, ends up growing on you. And I think that's an interesting lesson for an interior designer to sort of, you know, learn from their clients as well, of what they like and how you. You can incorporate it into your style and merge the two and make it look great. Yeah. But she's an interesting character. I think I've done three houses for them now in Colorado and California. And, yeah, it's definitely. It's funny because it's a lot of people's favorite house in the book, so we'll see. I'm excited to share it.
- [28:55]
Taryn
Yeah. No, it's a beautiful space, and I found that so funny because I think wherever you wrote the words, like, she doesn't like antiques. And then the first picture is this gorgeous old chest on the stucco walls. And I was like, so I snuck that in. I see you won.
- [29:11]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah. Yeah. And actually, she ended up loving that the most.
- [29:17]
Taryn
Of course.
- [29:18]
Geoffrey Allen
It's a very funny thing about it. It's a very funny thing about that client because, you know, it was during COVID and I installed it, and nobody was there. It was very quiet. She was away. She was in Argentina or somewhere. And about a year and a half later, she calls me and she said, this house is amazing. It's so gorgeous. And I'm like, what? And she's like, yeah, I just walked in. I've never seen it before. And I'm like, wow, that's how wild. That's goals.
- [29:56]
Taryn
I mean, wild.
- [29:57]
Geoffrey Allen
Have so many houses that you. That you don't go there for a year and a half. But she was absolutely in love with it. She's like, we gotta do another one like this.
- [30:09]
Caroline
Yeah. Would you do more antique? Could you do more antiques in the next one? Do you think that chest convinced her?
- [30:14]
Geoffrey Allen
I think she's. Yeah, she's coming around. Yeah.
- [30:18]
Caroline
Well, you picked a gray one, because that was a really fabulous sideboard and it.
- [30:23]
Geoffrey Allen
Yes. You know, well, Swedish antiques are my favorite.
- [30:27]
Taryn
Yeah, I think it's the. And tell me if I'm wrong, but the stucco part looks. So Is it gray? Is it taupe?
- [30:35]
Geoffrey Allen
It's actually a Venetian plaster.
- [30:37]
Taryn
Oh, it's a plaster. Excuse me.
- [30:39]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah, yeah.
- [30:40]
Taryn
You say that in here.
- [30:41]
Geoffrey Allen
My fault. It looks very calm in the picture, but there's A lot of movement and a lot of texture, I think.
- [30:48]
Taryn
But it's not.
- [30:49]
Geoffrey Allen
You don't see.
- [30:49]
Taryn
But it's not like the white Venetian plaster. It's like.
- [30:53]
Geoffrey Allen
No, it's. It's more of a sandy textured one.
- [30:56]
Taryn
Okay.
- [30:57]
Geoffrey Allen
That gives it a little bit of rusticity that happens to be up in Aspen, so.
- [31:02]
Caroline
Wow.
- [31:03]
Taryn
It's really beautiful. I mean, it makes it so serene in here. I imagine it's like the calmest space or so. It feels.
- [31:10]
Geoffrey Allen
Yes, yes.
- [31:11]
Taryn
And the tie and the tile too, that you use the checkered.
- [31:15]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah.
- [31:16]
Taryn
I mean, what stone is that?
- [31:17]
Geoffrey Allen
I think when you know the clients too, they're the last thing from calm. So that's always the balance. I think it's always the calm people that have the crazy houses that are very colorful and English and kooky and it's the exact opposite here.
- [31:34]
Taryn
So good.
- [31:34]
Caroline
That's so insightful. I wonder if there is something to that needing that balance or something.
- [31:40]
Geoffrey Allen
I think they're needing that balance. And I think if you really look at who interior designers work for, their client, usually there's a balance within the person too. Of, you know, the calm ones usually hire the more wacky interior designers and vice versa. And I think I'm more the laid back guy. So I always get the crazy client.
- [32:05]
Taryn
Okay. So speaking of crazy clients, so your Sullivan Canyon home or that project. Yeah, can we talk about those clients? Because I would say that one is so crazy. Kooky from like the actual furniture elements and the details.
- [32:22]
Geoffrey Allen
Isn't it?
- [32:22]
Taryn
It's awesome.
- [32:24]
Geoffrey Allen
I will say that that client in particular was probably my most involved client. She was involved in every single thing. Again, hated water and hated the color blue and hated window coverings. Everything. I love.
- [32:39]
Caroline
So the blue in particular.
- [32:43]
Geoffrey Allen
We built that house with Howard Bakken, the late Howard Bakken of Napa. Architect Bakken and Backin. And yeah, that was an interesting process because even she with the architecture, every single thing was had to be visited over and over and over again before she approved.
- [33:10]
Caroline
It's a project. Yeah, yeah.
- [33:12]
Taryn
There's so many natural elements. Like the roof being this tin, like rusty. How do you even again?
- [33:21]
Geoffrey Allen
Oh, every piece.
- [33:22]
Caroline
Every piece was.
- [33:23]
Geoffrey Allen
Stood there for days. Yeah. No, it's too rusty, that one. Move it over. Move it to the left. Move it to the right. Yeah. She stood there, you know, and. And I love that house because there's actually no family room in that house. The family room is that big desk area. And it's more of this sort of. They all like to work around this big work table. You know, it happened long before COVID And what a great thing they had during COVID was this space that they could all sort of communicate and work around this big, huge work table. The whole family. There's two daughters and the parents.
- [33:59]
Taryn
That is crazy that they all worked around that. And just so many old. Again, so many antique objects and, like, again, just crusty things that I'm. I'm. I. Again, I'm just to. To follow each step of that. Right. Again, like you said, even the boards on the wall all are rustic and look like they're all reclaimed. I. I'm shocked. It's beautiful. And the bricks. Where the bricks reclaimed, too. There's like.
- [34:25]
Geoffrey Allen
The bricks are all reclaimed, too.
- [34:27]
Taryn
Oh, my gosh.
- [34:27]
Geoffrey Allen
Exquisite surfaces. Yeah. Everyone handpicked.
- [34:31]
Taryn
Well, I just wanted to talk more about this. This one house, because it is so eclectic that I. I just want to understand. I know the client was really involved, but I. It's so beautifully done. And to describe it to people would be. I. I feel like I. It's got kooky.
- [34:52]
Geoffrey Allen
I mean, the only way I could describe our working together on that house is they're so. It was so convoluted to mix these sort of very rustic old antiques she had and mix them together in this very contemporary space. I mean, all the floors are concrete. There's no window coverings anymore or anywhere. And it looks right out to a horse pasture. And this beautiful garden, this picking garden that, you know, they. And they just live on this compact. And on top of it, it's right in the middle of Brentwood. So. Wow. It's a very interesting. I call it the rock and roll farmhouse. Cause it's just.
- [35:40]
Taryn
I think that's a good. Cause even, like, the light fixtures are retro and. Or you had one handmade or whatever for her to match one she found in France. And the art being old, it just is so. Again, I think that's a great way to describe it. Everyone has to see this house just because, again, it doesn't follow your.
- [36:01]
Geoffrey Allen
Not at all.
- [36:02]
Caroline
It looks completely different from anything in the book. To get to that part of the.
- [36:06]
Taryn
Book, I was like, what is happening? I am in. Yeah, but the way you shot with.
- [36:11]
Caroline
The other sectional, you're like, oh, okay, we're somewhere entirely different now.
- [36:18]
Taryn
But you. But you have done it so well that it's not overwhelming. Like, if I had to take these same elements and put them in a space, I feel like I would look like. Yeah, I was a bad antique shop. And you Know what I mean?
- [36:34]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah.
- [36:35]
Taryn
You've done it so well.
- [36:35]
Geoffrey Allen
It's very hard and a very particular. Each piece. I think that's what I was saying in the beginning of this was each piece was chosen with such care.
- [36:47]
Taryn
Yeah.
- [36:47]
Geoffrey Allen
And it had to be, because otherwise it would look like a junk shop.
- [36:51]
Caroline
How long did that take? How long did that project take?
- [36:54]
Geoffrey Allen
You know, we built that from the ground up. So it definitely was probably three years that we were decorating as we were designing the house.
- [37:05]
Caroline
So in a project like that, when each piece is, you know, it seemed almost like every single piece an antique or nearly, you know, how do you, like, lay out the space and. Because I always find it so intriguing, like how to, I guess, plan something that you really have to rely on, like, happening upon the right piece.
- [37:30]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah.
- [37:30]
Caroline
But then, like. So how do you. What. What's your process there?
- [37:34]
Geoffrey Allen
Well, it's all about intimacy in. In a space, whether it be a conversation space or a homework space or a living room. I always pick one thing first. And, you know, sometimes people think I'm a little crazy. I will come into a project that we're just starting construction, and I'll come in with, like, an antique set of bowls, and they're like, what? And I think, you know, you have to look at the final way you're going to live in the house as you're building. I think that's really important for me to incorporate that and to have this focal point that you're working around that you want the final outcome to achieve something that you. An end goal. An end goal. Whether it be a lampshade or a great bowl or a table, but it's usually something. It's never anything too big. It's not like, oh, I'm gonna. But it's just sort of one thing that sets the tone for the rest of the house.
- [38:44]
Caroline
So in, like, a living room, for example, are you, like, picking. I mean, how do you do the layout, though? You know, like, are you picking the sectional? Because. Because the size of your sectional isn't gonna determine the size of your chairs and your coffee table. But so are you going out knowing, like, I have to have a coffee table that are these dimensions, and I'm just gonna either design something or.
- [39:11]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah, I think there's usually one thing picked, or, you know, I'm. I'm looking at the size of the family or how they entertain or how they don't entertain, and they, you know, they're home with, you know, two kids or whatever it might be. So I'm really looking at their lifestyle, which is sometimes intrusive for them, especially when we're getting to know each other, I think it's important to know how they really live. Not the way they say, you know, I've had so many clients that have said, oh, I cook every night, and, you know, we sit around this table, and there's candlelight and blah, blah, blah. And then you go over there. They've. They. They basically order in every night and sit at the kitchen counter. So you have to get past what they think they live like and actually see what they are actually living like and, you know, go from there. But I think when I start a room, I think it's all about scale. I think, you know, intimacy in a room is very important for me. So I really. Whether it be furniture groupings or how do you make this vast space sometimes feel comfortable and cozy and normal? I think. So you want to sit there or lay there? More importantly, there's a lot that goes into that. I don't think it just happens. And I'm fortunate. I'm very fortunate that most of my work is, I would say, 65% of it is from the ground up. So I have a lot of time to think about it. But also, like, when I do have a house, it's just a renovation. Like, it's sometimes nice to just be standing there looking at the light and going, wow, this is easy. But sometimes it's not.
- [40:58]
Caroline
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [41:00]
Geoffrey Allen
So.
- [41:01]
Caroline
Well, I loved your. I loved the color palettes because, you know, there you have. You have a definite palette. It's sort of like you've got watery blues, but. But the thing that I. I loved about it is, like, you've got every shade and every variation, and so you're really kind of everything from, like, barely blue gray to indigo and every single color in between. And I. I love how. Because the end result is so effortless, right? Like, it feels as though it. It's not kind of overly decorated like you talked about, and it sort of looks like it just evolved. And of course, I know it didn't because you put in a ton of work. But talk to me about the color and, like, I guess how you sort of start adding touches of these blue colors, you know, instead of it matching.
- [42:06]
Geoffrey Allen
Do you know what's funny? You know, I'm known for blue, but if you really go through the book, it's more about the state of blue rather than the actual blue color, because when you really look at it all together, there's not that much blue. It's funny, that black sectional you were just talking about, that's this leather, big sofa in that Sullivan Canyon house. Is it blue? That was actually blue. It's sort of a navy, royal blue. And that was me sneaking blue in, even though she said, I hate blue, blah, blah. You know, I think it was me saying blue because she needed that calming. And especially with her personality, she needed that calming element. And I think blue was a nice grounding force in that room that needed to calm all those warm colors down. Especially being, you know, a mile from the beach. That it just. It felt right in there, and it felt effortless, as you're saying. And I think she, you know, ended up falling in love with it because it was just sort of unexpected to her and not what she had in her mind going into the project. But I think it's. I think blue is a state of mind. I think it's a calming color. And I think whether it be a beach house or a Manhattan, you know, penthouse, I think when you really look at it, and even this in my own house is people that walk into my own house are, you know, which. You see the last house in the book. It's sort of flanked by east coast, west coast house. When you look at the last house, it's so traditional and so formal, and, you know, that Greenwich house, you feel like there's a lot more blue than ever is actually there. And that's a nice compliment to my design because that's what I was striving for.
- [44:06]
Caroline
No, you're right. It's really not that much blue. It just. And even. Even your background right now, you've got the champagne chambray shirt, your boat that has touches of blue. The wallpaper looks like it's got.
- [44:18]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah.
- [44:19]
Caroline
You know, and it just. It's. It's this. You're right. It is more like an overall feeling of blue versus just decorating with blue. But I. You know, there was one room in particular, and I'm gonna. I'm gonna try to find it, but there was, like, two sofas and. Or maybe it was sofa and two chairs, but they were both blue. But they were totally different shades. Different. You know, one was a little bit lighter, one was a little bit darker. Totally different textiles. You know, one might have, I think, was like a. Something a little nubbier. And so is that kind of the secret? Just doing different textures to add dimension?
- [44:59]
Geoffrey Allen
I definitely love dimension. And I think mixing textures is so important. If you're going to have, you know, two or three linen things in A room, you definitely have to mix it with a cashmere or a wool or a nubby something to not make it feel all the same. Cause otherwise it just ends up being flat. And that's what I try and stay away from. Even if you're right on the beach, you know, you still have to give something textural and lovely and luxurious to not feel like you're just right on the beach. So I think that's all about the surprise of what's in the room.
- [45:42]
Caroline
I found the project. It was that Marin county project. And it had those two great blue sort of shelter arm sofas.
- [45:50]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah.
- [45:51]
Caroline
And then the. I can't tell if it's a sofa or a chair, but it had this other blue chair. And, you know, one was a little bit more green. And anyway, I just. We get questions from listeners all the time, like asking, you know, do these colors match? And I think that's something that is.
- [46:08]
Geoffrey Allen
I don't think there's such thing as matching. I think you can, you know, whether it be blues or greens, you can't really. You know, there's definitely colors. When you try and match, that's when you probably start making mistakes and clashing. I think some of the best rooms are just things you brought in that you found. And, yeah, that starts to look decorated. To be honest, I think it's all about the evolution of a piece of furniture. And, you know, I'm one. I. I tend to keep a lot of furniture forever and sort of reupholster it, refinish it, re. You know, and change the life of what it looks like. So I never really buy anything, you know, that doesn't. That I don't love the shape of first. And then the color can always change, whether it be the legs, whether it be the, you know, whatever it is. My refinisher's always in my house refinishing something.
- [47:15]
Caroline
Well, that was a gorgeous project. And there was the. I think the more formal living room in that space had, you know, with the big mirror or the big round mirror.
- [47:27]
Geoffrey Allen
That's one of my favorite rooms. Yeah.
- [47:28]
Caroline
God, that is gorgeous. And again, it's. There's sort of an overall blueness to it. Although truly, it's like a pillow and like, one Swedish armor.
- [47:38]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah. Yeah. So you're absolutely right there. Because she didn't really love blue either, so.
- [47:45]
Caroline
So pretty.
- [47:46]
Geoffrey Allen
She definitely didn't want it. There were a few things that were passed on because she didn't want it to feel like a beach house. And I don't think it does. It Just feels very calming.
- [47:59]
Caroline
In this room in particular, you know, there's a beautiful mix of antiques and we're kind of getting back to this, but, you know, just different wood tones. And is there any sort of, I guess, guideline you would suggest people follow about mixing antiques? Is there?
- [48:19]
Geoffrey Allen
No. I think if you really look at that room, and that's a great example, you know, that parchment, almost very Jean Michel Frank kind of coffee table that I designed is very contemporary and it was pieces of parchment and there's a very contemporary fireplace. I think, you know, I had to do that or else it would look fussy. An old lady. And again, it's just all about thinking and being, you know, very. I don't want to say particular because some of those pieces were just sort of thrown in there, but in a very contrived way. So, yeah, thoughtful. I think you just need to be thoughtful to each piece and really respect it. And I think when you start to do that, it all starts to work together really nicely.
- [49:18]
Caroline
Well, the whole book is just absolutely gorgeous. I. I just felt like it was such a great. For anyone who feels like maybe they need a little refresher course and editing this, you just are such a great editor. You know, your spaces feel so light, but they have so much warmth to them. And that I feel like is a very, very hard balance to strike. So I enjoyed. Enjoyed.
- [49:45]
Geoffrey Allen
Oh, thank you. Thank you. Well, I hope you enjoy. I can't wait to see. I'm getting my hard copy this week, so I'm excited.
- [49:57]
Caroline
Hello, ladies and Jeffrey. I love the down to earth and inclusive design conversations you have on this podcast. I've been renovating my home for the past four years and I'm finally in the home stretch. Just countertops, baseboards, casings, and a few finishing touches like decorative toe kicks are left. But I'm stuck on what to do for my backsplash and planning on green tinged soapstone counters with quite a bit of movement. There will be an overhang on the peninsula for stools, so that will be larger than the temporary plywood tops pictured. I would like to replace the range with a slide in eventually. All the windows.
- [50:30]
Geoffrey Allen
Oh, that would be nice. Yeah.
- [50:31]
Caroline
All the windows in this open concept room are north facing, so I'm concerned about a cave effect if soapstone is used for a full backsplash. I don't love tile, mostly because I find it hard to clean and we cook from scratch almost every night. Subway tile is a different no because I don't like the look. So the biggest issue Is the wall with the sink and the window tiling to the ceiling. Seems like a lot since there are no cabinets. But there would be an awkward cutoff between the counter that will end about 6 inches shy of the sliding glass door and an 18 inch tile backsplash bills to builder grade. I need a backsplash behind the sink, though. So, yes, she's got this sort of open concept. She's got a peninsula and sort of on the other side of the peninsula is a sliding glass door. So where does she end her. What is.
- [51:17]
Geoffrey Allen
What.
- [51:18]
Caroline
What would you do if this were your house?
- [51:20]
Geoffrey Allen
You know, I looked at this earlier, just briefly, and I thought, you know, oh, this would be a perfect excuse to use my summerlin tile from the tile shop that I just designed and tile the entire wall. And I would probably take that tiled wall all the way down the sliding glass door wall. That was one idea, I think. You know, I think painting the baseboards would be an interesting idea too, just to start with the baseboards. But I also thought off to the left, there is a cabinet that I almost want to see at the same color as the kitchen and make it feel like this one unified space somehow. The window itself feels small. And I think there's a way to do the backsplash. I mean, I honestly have just did a kitchen similar to this and layout in that it was small and a little darker. And I did a stainless steel backsplash all the way up to the ceiling. And I know that sounds like industrial kitchen, but it really wasn't. The. The stainless steel gave a nice glow in the kitchen and gave a nice reflective quality. And I really found it kind of warm and nicer and that would be nice mixed with if they wanted to use that soapstone. I think if you're going to do something like a subway tile. And I also loved my. It's called birchwood white ceramic from my summerlin tile collection at the tile store that, you know, just to tile the whole wall, I think always looks so good. And then again, I thought beadboard would be nice too, because then you could take that all the way down you had. You do have a problem behind the stove that you've got to be careful with. But maybe you beadboard the entire room or, you know, like a. Like a shiplap or something, and then you stop it on just that wall and do a tile. It feels to me like the cabinetry itself is a little low if you're going to replace that burner above it. So you might think about taking out that upper. It would also give it a lot more space and feel a little bit more open. But there's so many things you could do with this kitchen. I think it's, you know, cute and cozy and, you know, I think you just need to look at reflective quality. You know, you're gonna get that with Tile 1, especially if you use a light tile, and you're gonna get it from stainless steel. So that's probably what I would do. And I know there's that weird intersection. I think I would just do like a beautiful piece of wood that felt like it was a part of the kitchen right down the line. And maybe you even bring it up and do a little bit of, you know, whether it be a three inch, you know, almost like a shaker style, very simple around the top, where the stainless steel or tile or whatever it is meets that. And then you sort of. You consolidate this kitchen a little bit and make it, like, feel like it's its own self.
- [54:50]
Caroline
Is it strange if the tile ends 6 inches from the sliding glass door? And it kind of sounds like unless you put a piece of wood there, that's a yes.
- [54:58]
Geoffrey Allen
Yeah, it is strange. I mean, I have seen it where if you're going to tile like that and there's this weird sort of intersection. Usually I would lay the tile back a little bit so the tile died right into the drywall and not above it. But that's a big job. That's taking off the drywall. I mean, that's a big job. So I mean, I would at least get a piece of stainless and see how she likes it. It might not be her vibe, and I don't know what the rest of the house looks like, but it certainly would give it this interesting reflective, light quality in that room and make it feel special. And I know that lately people have. There's a paint out there that you can do that look with that zinc or whether that metal look and paint it. But, you know, behind the stove, it's then a. It's again an issue. And you don't want a dark room. So I'm all for light rooms. I think if it was my own room, I'd probably beadboard, or I'd like.
- [56:11]
Caroline
Up one hand, like tongue cap, shiplap.
- [56:13]
Geoffrey Allen
All the way down behind it. And then paint that off to the left the same color as the kitchen.
- [56:20]
Caroline
Okay.
- [56:21]
Geoffrey Allen
And do it white so it's nice and contrasting. I think that would be really pretty. And especially if you mitered it right into the window, it would look very custom and very special.
- [56:30]
Caroline
And then would you do the tile behind the oven and just. Or would you do the. The wood. The. The shiplap behind the oven, too?
- [56:38]
Geoffrey Allen
I don't know what she's doing for a new oven, but if it was going to be a gas oven, I'd probably just do a piece of white marble if I was going to do a shiplap. So it sort of, when you looked at it, it didn't. It kind of went away because I don't mind doing, you know, and there's some great looking white marble again at the tile shop that looks like white marble, but it's not. And you could do that all over the walls, but I definitely wouldn't do. I think she's right on that fact that I wouldn't do the soapstone all the way up the walls. I think she'd feel cavernous in there and a little claustrophobic.
- [57:16]
Caroline
Okay. Well, Devin, thank you for sending in your question and best of luck. We're so glad you enjoyed the show. Thanks for having me, Devin.
- [57:23]
Geoffrey Allen
I hope I'm helpful.
- [57:27]
Caroline
For sure. You know, it's always just helpful to get a second opinion, get some eyes on it. So, yeah. Jeffrey, thank you so much. It was lovely to see your book and lovely to have you.
- [57:39]
Geoffrey Allen
Thank you so much. Thanks for the time and I will see you guys in Atlanta.
- [57:45]
Caroline
Yes, yes. We'll put it on our calendars for.
- [57:48]
Taryn
A physical book signing. I like it.
- [57:51]
Geoffrey Allen
I'd love that.
- [57:53]
Taryn
Well, beautiful work and we've enjoyed your portfolio so much. So thank you so much for your time and all your beautiful work.
- [58:00]
Geoffrey Allen
Oh, thank you.
- [58:03]
Caroline
And that's our show. You can find all of the show notes on our blog howtodecorate.com podcast to.
- [58:08]
Taryn
Send in a decorating dilemma, email your questions to podcastallarddesigns.net so we can help you with your space.
- [58:15]
Caroline
And of course, be sure to follow us on social media. AlardeSigns. Don't forget to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts so you never miss an episode. And please leave us a review. We'd love to hear your feedback. Until next time, happy decorating.