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- [00:02]
Caroline
Welcome to how to Decorate from Ballard Designs, a weekly podcast all about the trials and triumphs of decorating and redecorating your home. I'm Caroline. I'm on the marketing team.
- [00:11]
Taryn
And I'm Taryn and I'm a product designer.
- [00:13]
Liz
I'm Liz. I head up the creative team.
- [00:15]
Caroline
We're your hosts. Join the expert team at Ballard Designs for tips, tricks, and tales from interior designers, stylists, and other talents in the design world.
- [00:23]
Taryn
Plus, we'll answer your decorating dilemmas at the end of each episode.
- [00:25]
Liz
We love answering your questions, so don't.
- [00:27]
Caroline
Forget to email us@podcastallardesigns.net now, on with the show. This week, we're thrilled to welcome interior designer Kate Gutter to the show. Kate started her design firm in 2020 and creates sophisticated interiors that are rich in color while focusing on functionality and timeless design. Kate, welcome to the show.
- [00:47]
Liz
Oh, thanks so much. I'm excited to be here.
- [00:49]
Caroline
Thank you for coming. And anyone watching on YouTube will see that we are in our new podcast studio. It's a little bit under construction. It's not a hundred percent there yet.
- [01:01]
Liz
It looks great to me.
- [01:02]
Taryn
I was gonna say, but Kate's being kind.
- [01:03]
Caroline
Yes, exactly. Going with the flow. Thank you for being our guinea pig.
- [01:06]
Liz
I'm so excited.
- [01:07]
Caroline
Yes. So we're gonna jump in. I wanted to start with your background because your parents like to flip houses. You had a very sort of design focused upbringing, and I was curious how that jump started your career in the design world and what lessons you took away. You took away from your experience growing up.
- [01:31]
Liz
Yes. So my mom was a flipper, and with five kids and never less than three dogs, created a very, like, interesting sort of like you feel settled and then all of a sudden you're packed up and everybody's moving and you're deciding you want turquoise walls and you want this. And she was constantly moving walls, fixing function and making a space feel like thin air out of nothing. Sometimes you'd walk in these places and be like, oh, my gosh, I can't believe this is the house that we're moving into. And she just had this really incredible way of making home out of nothing. And so I was really blessed and fortunate. I didn't even realize that this was kind of different or kind of like that people didn't do this. Yes. No, I didn't. I was just like, we're living here now and, you know, we're just moving around. And it wasn't until I purchased my own home when we were living In Boston and that then I flipped it and did another one. And I was having to fill something out about like getting a mortgage or something. And it was like, list, like your past addresses in the past 10 years or whatever. And I was like, oh, my goodness, I have never lived in a home longer than three years. And then I tracked it back. My whole life, I had never lived in one home more than three years. And that is just a very.
- [02:53]
Caroline
Even to this day.
- [02:54]
Liz
So this day I am in year five of my own home, which is like such an amazing space. My husband. So my mother in law is a designer and my father in law is an architect. And that is a whole nother aspect of my story. They're incredible. And. But they. When they moved back, when my husband moved from Switzerland, that was the house that they buy. They bought. And they are still in today and have constantly sort of changed it with the way that their family sort of changed and grew. And the kitchen has had different looks throughout the years, and chairs move around and sort of like different wallpapers. But it has always fel. Very much like home. And I have loved that about their space because I felt like when we started dating and I was 19 and I would go over there and, you know, now, decades later, I can say like this, I'm so sorry. This feels like home. And I just want my kids to have that. I want there to be this space of, like, familiarity. And while my mom is a magician and could constantly make home out of nothing, I really yearn for a home that could tell a story over time. So that's kind of like my goal is to take this our little fixer upper, and we're constantly, each room doing, you know, a year at a time. But this is definitely the first house that I've been in for more than three years.
- [04:16]
Caroline
Wow. What were some. What were some, like, childhood homes that stick out to you in particular? Was there anything or any project that your mom did that you were like, that really left an impression that.
- [04:29]
Liz
Yes.
- [04:29]
Caroline
You could speak to?
- [04:30]
Liz
Yeah. So definitely there's a. Probably there was a home when I was in middle school, and so I have four older sisters. And we each had our own room, and that was the first time that we each had our own room.
- [04:41]
Taryn
That's big. Yeah, that is.
- [04:42]
Liz
It's a big deal for all the girls. We had our own laundry room upstairs because my mom was like, if y' all are upstairs, you are, like, doing your own laundry. And there was a rule that no boy was allowed to, like, go upstairs stairs because it was girls.
- [04:54]
Taryn
We literally lived the same life. No boys were allowed up the stairs, but we only.
- [04:59]
Liz
Yeah, we were.
- [04:59]
Taryn
We only had four bedrooms. How many bathrooms did you guys have growing up?
- [05:02]
Liz
We had three upstairs. So, okay, two girls shared a room. Two girls shared a room, and then there was a single bathroom. And each room had its own color. So there was, like, my sister Brooke had a green room. My sister Whitney had a blue room. My sister Liz had a yellow room. I had pink, and I think my sister Melissa's was. It was maybe red or it was some shade of pink or something like that. And there was all, like, each room had its own fabric, and then there was, like, a secondary fabric. And, like, the duvet matched the curtains and matched the bed skirt. It was.
- [05:39]
Caroline
Oh, there's a formula.
- [05:40]
Liz
There was a formula. And there was a window seat. We all had our window seat. Oh, window seat.
- [05:44]
Caroline
Oh, fabulous. Oh, my gosh. It sounds like Little Women.
- [05:47]
Liz
Oh, it was so amazing. And I still think about that house because you just walked in there, and we all had our own bulletin board. So, you know, you had all your photos, and so it. It was very much like your own oasis, but your own kind of identity. And each daughter got to pick their color. And then my mom did the design of it and the scheme of it. Yeah. And I. I have not done a room like this, but there is, like, a little bit of, like, an inkling. Like, if there was the right time and space, I would love to bring back that sort of like, 90s.
- [06:17]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [06:18]
Liz
Just the same fabric just came in and took over the space. I love it.
- [06:22]
Taryn
Do you remember the fabrics that were in your pink room?
- [06:24]
Liz
Yes. Mine was like a pink and green toile, and there was, like, a stripe and, like, the front of the duvet was like a pink and green, and it was piped in pink. And then the underside was like a really thin, almost like a ticking stripe on the back, and they were scattered throughout.
- [06:40]
Caroline
I want toile to come back. I know it's kind of coming back, but, like, to the 90s level.
- [06:45]
Taryn
I think it's. Cause it is a core memory probably.
- [06:47]
Caroline
For all of us.
- [06:48]
Taryn
Like, there was false.
- [06:49]
Caroline
It's such a classic.
- [06:50]
Liz
It is.
- [06:51]
Caroline
It's storytelling. I love that, like, all over toile look where it's the wallpaper and the fabric and the.
- [06:56]
Liz
You know, I think it's so great. And I think I've been thinking about this a lot because I do think there's a level definitely for me, and I feel amongst my friends of just kind of bringing back things that felt like, nostalgic to our own childhood for our own children. Because I think we feel like a little bit of childhood today has. Is being taken away by, like, technology and screens and sort of just this different world that we're living in and how we're trying to create what we associate with childhood. And I wonder if that's, like, very similar in design, like, that we're trying to bring back this feeling of what home felt like to us with, like, the sandwood kitchens and, like, just kind of parquet floors and different things that, like, I'm really drawn to just because I think it reminds me of my childhood.
- [07:42]
Taryn
Oh, for sure.
- [07:43]
Caroline
Totally. I love watching, like, the same movies.
- [07:46]
Liz
Yes.
- [07:47]
Caroline
That, you know, like, the Sandlot or, like, Home Alone and all of those movies that, like, were very millennial kids.
- [07:55]
Taryn
Yeah.
- [07:55]
Caroline
Watch.
- [07:56]
Liz
And my kids. Yeah. They, like, love them more than the other movies today. I saw a quote somewhere, and it was saying. Someone was saying that movies, like, in the 90s when we were growing up, weren't better, but they were, like, better at being bad. Like, not, you know, like, those movies that weren't great, but they were, like, so much better at not being great, that it was better than, like, a bad movie today where you're like, oh, gosh, these flashing lights, and it's just too much. Whereas, like, terrible sort of, like, special effects, like, weren't. Weren't viewed as being, like, a mistake, I guess, you know?
- [08:33]
Caroline
Yeah, well, I. I think you're right.
- [08:35]
Taryn
Because we asked you to, you know, do you remember any of the houses growing up? And you can specifically reach into this, like, your memory for this one home, and you remember your room, and there had to be something about, you know, your age and the timing that also made it, again, this, like, comfort. And to your point, probably why, like, a toile will probably live as, like, a wonderful thing or vice versa. I feel like ecots for a while because I just remember them as part of. But in a bad way. Like, I remember them in, like, reds and greens.
- [09:04]
Liz
Like.
- [09:05]
Taryn
Or you're, like, too much. It was. Yeah. And anyway, so in the same similar vein of, like, ones that were good and feel so good, nostalgic, like, and then the ones that you're like, oh.
- [09:16]
Caroline
That have taken a while. Definitely certain patterns that could go either way. Like, a damask, I feel like, is. Oh, yeah, it can. It can go a certain way. Yeah.
- [09:25]
Liz
Yeah. And I think there are some designers who can use it maybe better than others. Yeah. You know, and I would say that that's kind of how I feel about some of those like very specific patterns is I totally can appreciate someone else using it in like a fresh, contemporary way, but I don't know that I'm ready to bring it into my design.
- [09:42]
Taryn
Yeah, yeah. And then also what style of house? Like, like would you need a tutor style to do a dams, you know what I mean? Like what pairs well per se architecturally or like location too?
- [09:57]
Caroline
Yeah. Well, what type of houses were they growing up? Were they like mostly traditional old houses that you were fixing up or was it kind of all over the map?
- [10:05]
Liz
They were mostly all traditional, like Southern. I'm from Louisiana, so that has a pretty specific sort of style of home. So the last one that I was speaking about was a house that they built. So that was really like fun in that process too of like seeing kind of. We would go during the construction phase and look through all of it. And I stepped on a nail once and it went all the way through my foot. I remember that as well. So like I have these. Sometimes I have these like real thick birken sacks and people are like, oh, you should wear, you know, work boots on site. And I'm like, oh no, I know these are thick enough that a whole nail like can't go through. So like I'm, you know, I'm good. Like I'm. I'm smart enough to know what to wear on site. But yeah, they were mostly traditional homes and until, you know, my parents bought a summer camp and we. The first house we lived at was this little cabin. So that was kind of the first sort of like really different style house. And I still, I think my mom did a really good job. I don't know that that really felt like home, you know, just because it's hard to. There was that time in my life of moving at 14 to the mountains and there was a lot of like figuring out kind of who am I and what is home and all of that at that time.
- [11:15]
Caroline
But flipping houses, I imagine. And you. And you mentioned there were a lot of like moving of walls. What were some like, you know, layout or flow or architectural changes that your mom made or you remember that you feel like are really effective. I, I think a lot about like the low of houses when we were kids versus now, you know, and everyone's talking about like open concept and are we, we going back from an open concept or do we like a traditional floor plan? Any thoughts on that?
- [11:47]
Liz
Lots of thoughts on that. I have very strong opinions on. I'm anti open concept. I think that there should be a room and intention for each space. So I. I always start with function when I go into someone's home and then follow with the pretty. Cause I think if it doesn't work for you, then what are we doing here? Like, this house is never gonna like feel right. It's never gonna feel like home if you can't walk in the back door and set your backpack down on a bench or a locker. Like, how does your family live? And so my mom was really great at that. That was something that she really always could walk in and say, we did one house in Asheville and there was a room that was gonna become my room. And it was intentionally. It was like an office or something, but it was a ranch. And she was down at one end, my parents were down at one end, and right across the hall was the other bedroom. And all my sisters were off at college. It was really just kind of like that was a guest room. And because I was like high school teenager, she was like, you deserve to have kind of your own space and don't need to be across the hall from your parents. So she took the one of the hall bathrooms. There were two powder rooms. She took one of those, converted it into being an ensuite to this office and kind of made this office powder room like an amazing space for a teenager. And I was able to kind of have a little bit of autonomy from them. And I. That is something that has really carried through with a lot of my clients. And sometimes I find that when you're in. My clients, when they're in the their homes, they don't even see how things aren't functioning for them anymore because they're just so in it. For example, I just recently completed a project last year and it's one of my most like proud moments. This builder brought me in when the client was having trouble kind of making some design decisions on a bathroom. And I went in thinking we would be selecting tile and plumbing. And when I got there, she was walking me through and showing me her nursery that also had a king bed in it. And she was like, it's our youngest child. And my parents and in laws come a lot. This is the bathroom that I want to redo because it's. My parents are here a lot and I want it to just be a nicer bathroom. And there was a crib in the room. And she was like, I don't think this is going to be our forever home because we're kind of busting out of the seams. Here. So I don't want to spend too much on it, but I do want it to be nicer. And so then I went on to their primary suite, and she had this massive walk in closet, this huge living room off of her bedroom. And she was like, it's really unbalanced. And I don't. You know, I wish we didn't have so much space. And I went home to work on the proposal and was looking through all of sort of the plans, and I just couldn't shake the thought of pouring all this money into these bathrooms when it just didn't work for them. So I pulled out my design software and I kind of made the closet connect to the bathroom and made it a Jack and Jill. And so that way baby could have room, guests could have room. And then we took her her living room and made it a big walk in closet. And I was like, I know that this is not what was built. Bid out by the builder. Sorry, it's gonna be more expensive. But at the end of the day, if the space doesn't function for you, then it really doesn't work. Pouring all of this, the funds into it if you're not gonna make it work. So they ended up moving forward. And she is just like, I cannot believe you changed our lives. Like, this is. We now don't have to leave our neighborhood and our friends and all these things because, like, you, we have everything we need.
- [15:25]
Caroline
Yeah. Yeah.
- [15:26]
Taryn
It's amazing.
- [15:27]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [15:27]
Liz
And I really learned that from my mom because she just was constantly making what seemed like it shouldn't work.
- [15:33]
Caroline
Work. Yeah. And not feeling like what is already there is set in stone. And like, you can move a wall, you can turn a closet into a bedroom in a. Yeah. Like, just being flexible within the footprint that you have, but making the rooms that you need versus just having what's there.
- [15:52]
Liz
Right. And it doesn't have to look pretty. Like, who needs a living room off of their bedroom?
- [15:56]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [15:56]
Liz
I mean, and if you have kids, like, who are you even able to sit in that room? I mean, my kids.
- [16:00]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [16:00]
Liz
Like, I can't even imagine a space where I'd be like, I'm gonna be up here, darlings. Like, see you later. You know, you're like, they would be there. Yeah, they would be there.
- [16:08]
Caroline
Yeah. And plus, it just becomes. Or at least for me, it just becomes like, where can I throw my clothes at the end of the day?
- [16:13]
Taryn
Yeah.
- [16:13]
Caroline
You know, it's like a junk spot.
- [16:17]
Taryn
Well, it's so nice you changed that space. You know, you took again Something they weren't utilizing and. But it sounds like that's how you grew up is, like, watching, you know, how creatively can you make things better? And not, like, pouring money in, but, like, how can we fix this and make this better?
- [16:33]
Liz
Function first, always. And then the beauty. You can get some beautiful things, and if you have leftover funding, you can spend all that you want, or you can save that part for later and get some things that work now and. But the function should always be there. The bones should always make sense.
- [16:50]
Caroline
I'm sure that that was a really expensive renovation. But you know what else is also really expensive?
- [16:55]
Liz
Moving. Oh, my gosh. Right? Yeah.
- [16:57]
Caroline
So if you were to. If they were to move, like, that would be way more than just making what they've already got work for them.
- [17:03]
Liz
Definitely.
- [17:04]
Taryn
You know, plus, so many people love their neighborhood, you know, like, in a good way. Like, they love their neighbors. They have these relationships, and then they outgrow their. And they're like, what do we do?
- [17:14]
Liz
Right? And they had just done this big, beautiful pool during COVID And the kitchen was, you know, so they had all these great bits, and this just one part didn't make sense, and now it makes sense. And, I mean, I get these random text messages where she's like, I'm just sitting, you know, in, you know, my child's new room. And I just want you to know, like, we're so happy. This just works so well. And I'm like, this is why I do what I do. Cause I know it's hard to see it when it's your own space, but I also know that my brain just works differently than other people. Like, don't give me a calculator. I will, like, somehow get the math problem wrong. But I can, like, see things in puzzles. Like, that's just the way that my brain works. It's just different. And so I can walk into a space and be like, well, let's just move here. And that's how my mom is.
- [17:57]
Caroline
So, yeah.
- [17:58]
Taryn
I mean, it probably also helps you to. Again, in your business now, too, to, like, work on all these projects at the same time. Do you find that to be a challenge or, like, putting all those different pieces together of all the different homes?
- [18:12]
Liz
Gosh, it's so interesting. I don't think so. I. I find that I get a lot of inspiration from my clients, like, who they are, what makes them tick, the clothes that they wear, the. The vacations that they go on, and. And that sometimes, like, might influence a project subconsciously. Like, I'LL see something in one discussion in one house and be like, oh, it's my. Even not the same light fixture, but, like, maybe something light and airy in that project. So they don't. I do. I am able to compartmentalize the projects in terms of, like, workflow and. But sometimes there's, like, a little bit of creative inspiration that blends into one over the other.
- [18:56]
Caroline
Yeah. You have three kids. Three kids. You're one of five. So I imagine that you have had your fair share of, like, you know, messes, cleanups. Like, you're used to all. And it sounds like a lot of your clients have family. So I was curious, like, you know what. What are your sort of thoughts on function for families? I feel like most people really agonize over their couch and, like, the main upholstery in a living room just because so much living happened there. So much, so many messes happen there. So. But I noticed in your work that you have a lot of, like, more colored upholstery, more not patterned, but, like, textured upholstery. And I was curious, like, you know what? You kind of guide your clients on upholstery when that's such a big concern for families.
- [19:52]
Liz
Definitely. So I. I love color, and that is, like, seen through all the things that I do. And I actually, in our house, we have a. A big green plaid sofa. It's, like, loud and proud, and I love it. It's got a skirted, like, a fringe skirt on it, and my kids have, like, jumped on it, built forts on it. I mean, it is. The sofa itself is about 15 years old. And leading into the answer of your question, furniture can be reupholstered. It. I think there is. It's not a new thing to me because my mom. Every time we would move houses, the same chair would just get a new facelift.
- [20:32]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [20:32]
Liz
So, like, that just is so. We've always had an upholstery team. We've always had a workroom in every city that they've lived in that we send things to.
- [20:40]
Taryn
That's so good, though. That's so nice. She's, like, found. Yeah.
- [20:43]
Liz
Yeah. So, like, to me, that just is so second nature. We're like, of course it's a new house. It's going to get a new little something.
- [20:49]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [20:50]
Liz
But I do think that there's a lot of fear in people who don't work in this industry when you go to purchase a sofa to be like, well, it's just going to be white or it's just going to be blue. It's just going to. And we'll decorate with pillows. And I think that can be really beautiful. But I don't know that that is all you can do. You can go a little bit further if you want to. Also, patterns and, and color and texture hide stains really well. And performance fabrics have really, like, changed in the past five years for sure, and I think even More so in 10 years. And y' all have a ton of like beautiful performance colored fabrics. So I think it shouldn't be such a scary thing because if you don't like it, it's, it's an expense. But it's not a crazy expense to reupholster a sofa or chair.
- [21:37]
Caroline
Yeah, I mean, you're right. Performance fabrics have come a long way. But if you do get a white couch, even if it's performance, like, you're still going to have to clean it. Absolutely. It can be cleaned, it can be cleaned, but you will have to clean it. So that's something that I've learned. Like. Yeah. And especially like solids or a fabric that's like more flat and doesn't have like a texture.
- [22:03]
Liz
Some give to it.
- [22:04]
Caroline
It will. You will see every imperfection. Now, you can get the imperfections out, but if you've got kids eating snacks on the sofa every afternoon, like, do you want to be getting it out every day?
- [22:14]
Liz
Yeah.
- [22:14]
Caroline
Or can you live with it? Some people can.
- [22:16]
Liz
And that's the next thing that I. When I was thinking about our conversation today, my, my sort of approach to design is that I don't think that a space should be too precious. Like, I don't love walking into someone's house and being like, wow, this is. It's a museum. It's so beautiful. Like, I don't even know if I'm allowed to sit on this chair. I don't want to touch something too much. I don't want to mess anything up. My motto, my house is like, nothing is too precious. Like, you are the precious people to me. Like, come in, sit down. If you want to wear your shoes in the house where your shoes in your house. If you, you know, my little three year old nephew jumping on the sofa, I'm like, he's having so much fun. He's a dinosaur. Like, in the jungle on my green sofa. Like, do not disturb him. Let him live. I want it like, my name is Aunt Bug amongst the family. And I'm like, aunt Bug's house is a place where you can, like, come and be creative and have fun. And like, there's there's no one who's not welcome and not allowed to just be comfortable. And I would just never want anything to feel too precious. And so when I'm. When I'm selecting things, one, you have to. Not everybody is like that. So I understand that. But there should be spaces that are like that within your home, especially when you're a family. So selecting the right fabrics that. Whether it's a velvet that's just got, like, tons of. We just did this beautiful floral chair from Baker, and it's velvet, and it's got, like, a million colors in it. And, like, you probably could just take a crayon and just smear it and you wouldn't even see it because there's so much color on it. And I think it's right in the family room. And there's three little kiddos that spin around in it and are. Make it a spaceship. And I just think that, like, life is for living, and it should be beautiful, but it also should be a place that, like, having a mess and having fun and feeling comfortable. Like, home is a space to feel safe, and the furnishings should follow that.
- [24:06]
Taryn
What other items will you put in?
- [24:08]
Caroline
Because you.
- [24:09]
Taryn
You speak to this comfort. So how else can people get this kind of comfort thing you're talking about?
- [24:13]
Liz
So, like, a rug that's made out of wool that is easy to clean. It's soft underfoot. I have rugs throughout my house that are, like, over 100 years old. There's tears and holes. And like, we had a puppy, and the puppy chewed a little bit on it, and I was like, I'm not going to cry over this. This is like, this rug has, like, seen some days, and now it sees some days at the Cooter household.
- [24:34]
Taryn
Yeah.
- [24:35]
Liz
And I think that is, like, starting from the ground. Something that is easy to be cleaned and also not too precious, like, viscose. You know, if you got a stain in it, it will. It feels great underfoot, but it could. A water stain will never come out of that. Also, like brass that is natural and will patina over time and shows fingerprints on it. I think that that is, like the intention marble. Like, having etchings and scratches and chips like that just to me reads like a home that is well lived in and loved and a perfect marble. I love to cook. So a perfect countertop that has no etches and stains just feels like, oh, I don't even know if I can sit here. Like, walking into a friend's house that has a counter that's, like, got all Sorts of mistakes on. It just feels like warm and like I'm like ready to like have a bowl of spaghetti and like add to the patina and character. And I think it's your approach to your items but kind of investing in long term pieces that have been around forever. Materials. Stone, wood, brass, wool. That is like just that will last this test of time.
- [25:45]
Taryn
So yeah, no, those are good materials because I have a lacquer dining table and I can say that is one that scratches very easily. So it is very much like it's either I'm either on the whatever like live or I'm like don't dare go in there. Don't touch that surface. There's plenty of other tables use those.
- [26:03]
Liz
So what. What where do you end with it now? Like do. Are you letting it be lived in or is it like a day to day.
- [26:08]
Taryn
It's day to day because sometimes I'm just like, okay, you're older, you go do a puzzle in there is fine. But the, but the younger one that's gonna like draw or something. No, no, go go to the breakfast room.
- [26:18]
Caroline
But it is your formal dining room. So it's. Yeah, like it's not like you're kitchen table.
- [26:22]
Taryn
I'm not using it daily. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And I knew that getting it. But your to your point is it is one area where I'm more cautious and not with friends. This is my own kids. They're the ones who are going to ruin it.
- [26:34]
Liz
Yes. Sometimes adults though are the. Are the biggest mischief makers. I mean in terms of like really breaking your stuff in. But that would have it any other way.
- [26:42]
Taryn
But like you said. But then it'd be like living with it. It's either live with it or get it fixed, you know.
- [26:46]
Liz
Right.
- [26:46]
Taryn
To your point. So that was just that and acrylic. I feel like acrylic stretches. Yeah.
- [26:53]
Caroline
But you know, I feel like you can like the important thing is to, to have a mix. Yeah, I guess you don't have to have a mix. But to me I'm like, I can have a mix. I can have some things that are nicer and like be like, okay, like we don't eat our snacks here or. And I can have some places where I'm like, okay, like I'll. I can live with that. And, and so I feel like you can have. But knowing what goes where is really important.
- [27:18]
Liz
Right.
- [27:18]
Caroline
Like picking the correct finishes and materials for the correct rooms is just even just a part of an equip of the equation because we, we are more familiar with that. But yeah, like our listeners, definitely it's good to know what can handle a little bit more.
- [27:38]
Liz
Yeah, like which material should go on a bar stool. And you know, like a faux leather or vinyl, like is so easy to wipe up. And I saw some like beautiful banquettes that y' all had in the store today. And we do a lot of banquettes at our firm with our clients because it's just great for like kids climbing in and everybody like filing and file out. And we do a lot of like faux leather because it looks so much nicer now than it used to. Or real leather if someone's okay with like the scratches and the old stains and stuff like that. But that is like an area where you could go really wrong if you did the wrong material, you might feel.
- [28:13]
Taryn
In it eating it and say like.
- [28:15]
Liz
Oh, this feels so great. This will be so great. And then it's just day one gets totally ruined. And not in a like lived in patina sort of way.
- [28:22]
Taryn
So in a disgusting sort of way. No, that's a good one. And you talked about you love cooking, so what are some things you do in the kitchen to make it that kind of again, comfort and ease for guest?
- [28:36]
Liz
So do you mean like in terms of entertaining or in terms of materiality?
- [28:41]
Caroline
Both.
- [28:42]
Liz
Really?
- [28:42]
Taryn
Like what, what are your favorite go to's in your kitchen? Like, is it the dishes you're giving out to people so you're not worried? Is it the surface you're working on?
- [28:51]
Liz
So we are. Our house is a fixer upper and we have not done the kitchen. So I do feel like I'm speaking at a place of luxury in terms of like, I'm like, please make it, please. You know, I would love to redo my kitchen.
- [29:03]
Taryn
Oh, and you said that though. You said you're going room by room.
- [29:05]
Liz
We are going room by room. We kind of bought the location with the intention of my father in law as an architect and I'm blessed that he is so talented and has been drawing space by space for us kind of as we go. And the kitchen is going to be the last one. But that's because it's so important to me. I have. I'm like a cat. I've had a lot of lives. In one of my previous career I was a wedding cake baker. So I love to bake and I love to cook and the kitchen is going to be like a really big undertaking in terms of like where all of my pieces go and all of that. But when we are hosting, I love to have appetizers out that kind of spread across the island. Cause I want everybody to sit and talk to me and while I'm cooking and have a glass of wine. And we intentionally have a very. Like, we moved some walls and we moved in and we added. There was a little tiny outdoor space that was too tiny even to put like a bistro table. And they had these dual French doors that opened out and. But we didn't have a breakfast table. Like, because the people who had the House of Forest there was a breakfast table. So right when you opened the front door, you saw this like messy table. And that is like one thing that I like make the mess. But like a disoriented table and chairs askew. Like that wouldn't work for me on a daily basis. So we actually took the doors off, did like, made a case opening, enclosed this like little outdoor patio, did a built in banquette. I kept the brick flooring and did these just big windows. Like when you're sitting in it, like looks feels like you're sitting in a tree house. And so it's really great. Like, it's kind of like living in your space and taking it bit by bit. Like. Like we do want a place to sit down casually. We don't want to always eat in the dining room because like you have my grandmother's dining table. And it's like, that is something that I can fix it, but I don't want to fix it all the time, so. Yes, exactly. Actually did a porcelain top. Like a real thin porcelain top that looks like marble on top of our table. So like you can pour nail polish on it. Permanent marker. Like there's. It is indestructible. And so I just let my little dinosaur nephew just run around circles on the table and like, have at it. I love it. Just.
- [31:13]
Taryn
Yeah, so that's a good. That is good one to talk through too. What about bathrooms? What's something you do in there for like all the ages?
- [31:24]
Liz
So bathrooms. This is definitely like a sort of client preference. If a client comes and says, like, this is their primary bathroom and they want it to have this sort of like longevity, they want to be able to love it in 20 years, which most people do when they're redoing a bathroom tile is when I was talking about the sofa earlier and I was like, you can reupholster it. Like, tile is not something you want to redo. That is like, not where you take a risk on trends. And I love like all the beautiful trends of all the like crazy tile work that I see. And it is like, takes everything within me to not do that, because I think it's just like, functionally doesn't. It's so date.
- [32:01]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [32:02]
Liz
The project. And so in. In sticking in that lane. Sticking with things like marble that is forever. It's been around forever. It is outdoor all over Europe. And like, it can patina and age. And if you're okay with that sort of like, you know, the veins, like kind of get more color to them over time. Like it does. It's a living kind of material. It does. Like, I had a client, he always said, like, let the rock be a rock. Like, don't. Don't make it too precious. Let it kind of like. And let it have like a leathered texture. And I love that because, you know, when it's. When it's marble but don't touch it and we polish it and it has to be perfect, it kind of loses that sort of approachability. And to me, like, that doesn't feel long term. So when doing bathrooms, definitely lean towards marble. Now if the budget doesn't allot for it, which in children's room, it does not. And I do like unlacquered brass in primary bathrooms as that patina's too. And if someone doesn't like a patina look, then we'll do like a porcelain, but do a very traditional sort of classic design, like maybe a checkerboard floor or a penny tile. And I usually lean towards like a warm polished nickel. So something that feels timeless. There's. You'll never look at that and say, oh, that's so 2025. It's just. Yeah, yeah. So. And you can have fun with like the wallpaper and the window treatment and all of that.
- [33:26]
Caroline
Yeah. And like a mirror, the window, the. The lighting.
- [33:30]
Liz
Right.
- [33:31]
Caroline
You know, sconce or something.
- [33:33]
Taryn
Yeah, a lot of the more removable, like.
- [33:35]
Caroline
Yeah, yeah.
- [33:36]
Liz
Right.
- [33:36]
Caroline
Yeah, yeah. You're not gonna get anyone in there with a sledgehammer to change out your tile, right?
- [33:41]
Liz
No. Yeah. I mean, if that is like, that is real serious because it's dusty and it's messy and it's not something that you want to do every five years.
- [33:51]
Caroline
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And bad tile, like.
- [33:57]
Liz
Yeah.
- [33:58]
Taryn
Oh, I. Yeah. No, I rem. I remember my first Renault and this was like in 2010. And the. The main contractor just was like, oh, do you want some accent tile in here? And I was like, I don't. I just want you to run the tile normal. He's like, are you sure you don't want, like, A strip.
- [34:14]
Caroline
And I was like, I don't. It's fine.
- [34:16]
Liz
Just leave it.
- [34:17]
Caroline
Just.
- [34:17]
Taryn
Can we just go the hole just the same? And I remember him being like, okay, your decision. And I was like, it was my decision.
- [34:22]
Caroline
Thank. They really wanted to, like, zhuzh it up, you know, the strip.
- [34:27]
Taryn
I'm talking about that.
- [34:28]
Liz
Like.
- [34:29]
Taryn
Yeah, it was one line of, like, brown.
- [34:32]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [34:32]
Taryn
Yeah. Tile.
- [34:34]
Liz
I love all the great tile work. And, like, there's definitely a part of me that is like, oh, man. I just would love to lean into that harder because it's so beautiful. But when you're dealing with people's money and my clients, that is not something that they want to do all the time. Like, they're coming to me because they were like, we need help. This is a big project. They're not wanting to come back in five years or 10 years and redo it.
- [34:57]
Taryn
Totally.
- [34:59]
Caroline
I'm thinking of my. A friend of mine who.
- [35:03]
Taryn
Did a.
- [35:04]
Caroline
Whole project redoing all the bathrooms in her house and, like, did her daughters and sons bathrooms. And, like, one was pink, and it was a Jack and Jill. And then she did one. It was like Lou's for her son, and then found out that she was pregnant with twins and was like, I wish that I hadn't maybe been so specific because had I known I was gonna have two more kids then I might have, like, rearranged their rooms a little bit because we thought we were done. But now, like, she's kind of stuck a little bit. Like, she could probably do a few things and, like, change the wallpaper and stuff, but, yeah, it's.
- [35:46]
Liz
Yeah. Pink is hard. I feel like blue. We're doing a little girl's bathroom right now, and we're doing blue. And it's like, that feels timeless and. And has some legs on it. Pink is. That's harder to kind of.
- [35:57]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [35:58]
Liz
You know, maybe stick to, because.
- [36:00]
Caroline
Yeah. You know, and even. And they weren't even selling it. And, like, if you're selling it, that's. That's one thing you're kind of passing on to someone else who might be annoyed with your tile.
- [36:09]
Liz
Right.
- [36:09]
Caroline
But this was, like, something that she picked and she really loved, but she was just like, yeah, six months ago, I loved it, and then now I'm like, oh, man, I still love it how it looks, but it's.
- [36:20]
Taryn
Yeah.
- [36:21]
Caroline
It's, like, limiting her, you know?
- [36:22]
Liz
Totally.
- [36:23]
Taryn
And we took that approach, and a lot of the listeners know, because we built or whatever, but I. And I ran out of mental capacity to design the boys Room bathrooms.
- [36:32]
Liz
And it was. I just.
- [36:33]
Taryn
I did. I went with all white. I was like, we're just doing white subway in here. Your little boys and white vanity. And we just. Like you were saying. And that way, everything else, you know, from the tile up, I can paint it whatever. We can add whatever window treatments to add pattern. But it has. Has allowed, like, it's a fully. I mean, it is boring in a way, but, like, I added hardware on the cabinets that was a little fun. And a fun mirror.
- [37:00]
Liz
Yeah. Like little sports things. I mean, my boy's bathroom, same thing. We moved in our house. I just did all white towel, but I did go up, you know, 40 inches because I was like, there are two little boys, and they are just running around, splashing around. I mean, like, anyone has any tricks for how to get your kids to not be so messy in the bathroom, I would love it. Because it's just like.
- [37:19]
Taryn
Nope, nope. They're just.
- [37:21]
Liz
They're busy.
- [37:22]
Caroline
Sorry, we can't help.
- [37:23]
Liz
They're busy. They don't have time to, like, use a towel and, you know, hang things in.
- [37:27]
Caroline
Oh, my God. And they're like little tiny pieces of toilet paper all over the floor.
- [37:31]
Liz
Yeah, I think that's what I mean.
- [37:32]
Caroline
Like, do y' all ever have.
- [37:34]
Liz
Yeah. No, I was not, like, I was.
- [37:36]
Taryn
Just going in my brain, my latest story, where he wanted. He wanted the new roll on his thing, so he just, like, used a.
- [37:41]
Caroline
Whole bunch of toilet paper.
- [37:43]
Taryn
And I was like, what are you doing?
- [37:43]
Liz
He's like, oh, it's time for a new role.
- [37:45]
Taryn
And you're like, no, it's not.
- [37:47]
Liz
Is your toilet paper, like, fun? Like, is it, like.
- [37:50]
Taryn
No. Oh, sorry. It's not. It was fun to him.
- [37:52]
Liz
I don't know if it was, like, you know, I don't know, something like a.
- [37:55]
Taryn
A patterned one or whatever.
- [37:56]
Liz
I don't know. I just. I'm, like, intrigued. No, no.
- [37:59]
Caroline
Why are there, like, tiny little, like, flakes of toilet paper all over?
- [38:02]
Liz
I think they mean, like, maybe it was confetti at one point.
- [38:06]
Caroline
Yeah. I don't know.
- [38:06]
Liz
Maybe kids brains work. It's so fun. I mean, I oftentimes I'm like, I wish that my brain worked that way still. Because they can just make this whole magical world out of nothing.
- [38:18]
Taryn
And we see it as messes, just mess after mess.
- [38:24]
Caroline
Is there anything that you. Well, actually, I was thinking about this, sort of goes along with kids rooms. I was thinking about kids rooms because you have several in your. In your portfolio that I loved and are so pretty and I've been thinking recently because I kind of have redone my girl. Not redone, but like, you know, I decorated my girls rooms and I did a wallpaper, a pattern on the headboard and, and when I'm. When I sort of was putting it together, I was putting it together with like it tidy in mind. Right. Like I'm putting it together thinking of what it's going to look like when it's neat.
- [38:58]
Liz
Yeah, right. It's best. Exactly.
- [39:00]
Caroline
But it never looks at its best. It always has like, you know, every single picture she's ever colored and like all of her art projects and, and I love all those things, but it like, it's hard to like live with.
- [39:13]
Liz
Well, I'm.
- [39:14]
Caroline
I thought like, is there something I could have done when I was decorating it to make it to where this looks good every day and looks put together every day instead of like all the little, you know, things that you get from goodie bags like on every surface and like all the trinkets.
- [39:34]
Liz
So I. It's so, it's so interesting because I think every like mom can relate to the story you just told. And all of those beautiful rooms that like were so intentionally designed when we shot them, like we went in and pulled all of the trinkets out and all of the bits and all of the things and you know, ironed all the stuff and got it all looking back to the way that it was designed. But I've just had like a shift in thinking about how when I was little and I was at my grandmother's house and my grandmother, before interior design was like even a trade, she went to Ohio State and had a home EC degree and she would decorate too. So she had beautiful homes and she. Every room had a color very similar to my mom's. So when we would go, there was. The green room had this like beautiful canopy bed and the blue room had two king beds in it and it had this like hidden storage door where you would like go through a closet and then you would open up this hidden door and it like connected around. And I always wanted that room because that was like where the secret fairies lived. And I would pull off these things in there and she either like sweetly left them there or did not know that they were there. I created all these homes and villages like back in this like little storage and I would just spend hours, I'm sure they were like k so entertained. Just leave her up there, like whatever she's doing is fine. And I just, I go back to that memory of how Magical and accessible. Her. That room felt to me and how that sort of, like, creative freedom. We all want that for our kids. Right? Like, we all want them to feel just not attached to a screen, not having to be in a certain box and just being able to really, like, let their mind go there. And when we come in and I'm like, the worst at doing this. I come in, I'm like, everything's going on. Josh.
- [41:32]
Caroline
Kidding.
- [41:34]
Liz
My kids are, like, very creative, all three of them. And there's like a million. They've really. Their rooms are their rooms. And. But I just think back on, like, how that is the safe space that we've created for them. And, like, those little knickknacks and things. That's their world, you know? So to us, it's like this little messy thing, but there's. They're so much smaller, and they. They have, like, where it looks like a little tiny ball to us. To them, it's like, you know, Saturn or something. And they just. So I try to give grace in terms of the mess, and I don't do a very good job at it all the time, but that is my goal. Yeah.
- [42:14]
Taryn
So it's embrace.
- [42:15]
Caroline
I think the answer was embrace.
- [42:16]
Liz
Well, I'm not necessarily trying to get an answer.
- [42:18]
Caroline
Embrace those things. I'm not necessarily trying to get rid of those things. I guess I've just wondered, like, is there something that I could have done to add more of a framework or, like, carve out, I don't know, something to where, like, there's a balance. Right.
- [42:32]
Liz
Pull it out. They would, like, pull it out into those rooms, even if you had a box. And we're like, put all those things in here. Like, my kids have a desk and they have made, like, curtains in a house. And there's all these, like, dolls that they made out of sticks that live in there. And they have real dolls. Like, I don't know why the dolls have to be out of sticks from outside. And, like, there's ants on them and like, moss and like. I know. Don't. Do they have to be stick dolls. But that is the dolls that live in the house. And I don't think that there's anything we could do to. To make it better. I think that they're just.
- [43:03]
Caroline
I don't either.
- [43:04]
Taryn
Because if I. To your point, you throw one of those little things away.
- [43:07]
Liz
It had a name and a family.
- [43:09]
Taryn
Yeah. And they'll. They'll ask where it is. I do a lot of.
- [43:12]
Liz
I don't know where it is or Blaming.
- [43:15]
Caroline
I'm like, if you. If you leave it on the floor in the kitchen or on the T in the. The TV room, it's fair game. I get to decide if it goes in the garbage. Oh, man. Not like a real toy, but, like, for sure.
- [43:28]
Liz
Definitely blame the dog.
- [43:29]
Caroline
It's the goodie bag toys that really get me. I'm like, why is this little tiny piece of plastic? Like, come on.
- [43:34]
Liz
Yes.
- [43:35]
Caroline
We don't need this.
- [43:36]
Liz
Well, I also blame my parents, and I'm like, why did you give that to all of us? Like, yeah, I think you had this great party.
- [43:42]
Caroline
It's a broken slinky.
- [43:43]
Liz
You had a great party. You don't need to give us a bag of. Yeah. Of Slinkies.
- [43:46]
Taryn
You know, I. I don't know. It is part of your childhood, though, right?
- [43:50]
Caroline
Like, I. I guess, like, there's. There's certain things where I'm like, well, I gave you. I have a bulletin board. Like, the bulletin board is for all the art, but then the bulletin board is empty. She takes it all off the bulletin board and, like, steps where I'm like, what?
- [44:02]
Liz
She sounds really good. She might be a designer in her future.
- [44:06]
Taryn
I think that's what it is. Yeah, she will be a designer, but.
- [44:09]
Caroline
Right now it's just a strap.
- [44:10]
Liz
Yeah, she can't. She can't be put in a box. She's got. Yeah.
- [44:14]
Taryn
I mean, it's the same for me. He has a bookshelf, all his books, but he likes to lay them all out. The whole Dogman series. We have to show how they're all in a line and which order. And you're like, yeah, I get it. Just put them on the bookshelf like that. And he's like, no, no.
- [44:29]
Liz
Can't see the COVID Yes, yes. Foolish for me.
- [44:32]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [44:32]
Liz
So I do.
- [44:33]
Taryn
I mean, for me, I have let his closet, like, to your point, be more of that. Like, I'm just like. I've added some shells in there because I'm like, just go ham in there then. Like, make that your world.
- [44:44]
Liz
Like.
- [44:44]
Taryn
Yeah, but it still doesn't help. The counters are covered, like, front to back. New monster trucks in the front, awards in the back. You know, you're like, I could sweep this off today and have no remorse, but he would.
- [44:57]
Caroline
Yeah. Yeah. Lose it.
- [44:58]
Liz
Yeah.
- [44:58]
Caroline
Yeah, yeah. Okay. Well, I guess at least I'm not the only one.
- [45:01]
Liz
You're not like, yeah, at least we're.
- [45:04]
Taryn
Yeah.
- [45:04]
Caroline
The three of us are aligned.
- [45:05]
Taryn
That we haven't figured it out, but maybe we'll just Keep asking and we'll.
- [45:08]
Caroline
Find somebody who will be like, here's the. At some point, I'm like, once they get older, I feel like they have less, less little toys and more just like big stuff, you know what I mean?
- [45:16]
Liz
I don't know. I got a 12 year old and that's. We still got a lot of little stuff.
- [45:19]
Caroline
Darn.
- [45:20]
Taryn
A lot of artwork.
- [45:21]
Liz
Although I will say that, like, he's my art kid, so there's like art all like he tapes it all over his wall and like sometimes he's like a little mad scientist in there and I come in and I'm like, what? His office? He loves history and so he'll paint like these portraits of all these historians. And he like, it's like a little art gallery on his wall.
- [45:39]
Caroline
That sounds cool though. Yeah, high school.
- [45:41]
Liz
But it's like they're like sheets of paper, you know, and some of them I have framed and they actually hang on our gallery wall because I love them. But yeah, there's a lot of them. We might be starting a new business of like oil. Not oil paintings, but like knockoffs of paintings.
- [45:58]
Taryn
I love that. It's even better, really.
- [46:01]
Liz
So if you're in the market, you know, let me know.
- [46:04]
Caroline
Well, I think we were going to.
- [46:05]
Liz
Talk about art, so that's probably a.
- [46:06]
Caroline
Great way to like.
- [46:08]
Taryn
Like, as someone who loves art and collects art, this is something. Again, we. I think we ask a lot of designers on this, but I, you know, we keep.
- [46:16]
Caroline
It's.
- [46:16]
Taryn
Art is so important to a space and we want to make it less intimidating for listeners. So like, how can we do that?
- [46:23]
Liz
It's. Yes, I do think that art is very intimidating. There's some sort of. Because art is such. It's a challenging thing. It's been around forever. There's a lot of like prestige that comes around with some really great art. But you don't have to have, have like a special degree and you know, to be a gallerist, to have like a beautiful collection of art. My husband and I. One of my most favorite and treasured pieces. We were. I was studying abroad in Barcelona and we had only been dating a very short time and I was 19 and he was like tall and had this like long curly hair and he played all these like old hippie songs on a guitar and he was teaching me how to play and I packed up my guitar and like flew across the ocean with it. And my five roommates in like a one bedroom apartment, we're like, get out of here with that guitar. Like you don't even know how to play it. Like, why did you fly to Barcelona with this guitar? And so I would go to this park and I would just sit and like strum terribly. And there was this like artist guy. And it was just this little park outside of our apartment in Barcelona. And so when my now husband, boyfriend at the time came to visit, I was taking him through the park and the street artist had this like 4 by 16, this kind of sketch painting of this like tall, long guitarist. And it was like €15. And we bought it and it hangs in our house today. And I just love it because it was not expensive, but it reminds me, it like gives me goosebumps just like where we were and this like, just like how crazy in love we were that I like brought this guitar across the ocean. And now my son like, you know, is going to art school next year. He's played the guitar. For his audition he played Mr. Tambourine man by Bob Dylan. And so it's just kind of like a full circle moment on how art doesn't have to be anything priceless or like by some big name. Like sometimes it's just something you find from a street vendor and it makes you feel something. And I do have some clients that we, we go on a lot of art sourcing trips. So one of my favorite places is in Charleston and there's one really high end gallery, Myra Vogel that I love and Geor Gallery. Those are both some, like, not everything is high price, but you can get some like really kind of pieces that are more investment pieces. And then there's some more approachable galleries that are down on King street and one that I love is Miller Gallery and just kind of a little funkier and fun. And I've taken a bunch of clients down to Charleston and been like, let's just see what you feel. We have, you know, hop around the galleries and sometimes it's. We're really successful and sometimes they just get one thing that they love. But art isn't so something that you can walk in and just say we have to fill these walls. Like that is. Gives me the biggest ick. Like I think it. I'd rather see a blank wall and have something that takes time for you to fall in love with than for you to just go online and purchase, purchase, purchase. Like it should be something that feels, makes you feel something. And again, going back to function. If the room is meant to be calming and, and studious, like maybe the art reflects that. If the room is meant to be fun and Bright. And maybe the art reflects that. And sometimes the art doesn't make any sense. It's just something that made you feel something, and you want to have it in your house. And I say buy it and we'll find a place for it. So whether it's getting nailed on top of a bookshelf or if it's going on a staircase, I also love for art to be silly sometimes, so it doesn't have to be. Like I was telling you earlier about my sister's tuna, how it, like, judges you while you're eating dinner. My sister is an artist, and she paints. She's a fisher woman, too, so she paints these, like, beautiful fish paintings. And they're very, like, realistic, and I just love them. I think that they, like, have a playfulness and a seriousness to them. There's like, a pull there that I really like. And my husband really loves art. That is something that he takes super seriously. So he's more on that a. On a sort of hunt for something that has a little bit more of a history of a story. Some, like, a little bit more of investment pieces. And I'm grabbing things at flea markets and, like, antique stores. And we were in France recently, and I saw this art for a client, and it was so beautiful. It was a piece of fabric that the artist had taken and just sewn all these, like, crazy, like. Like chaotic stitches throughout of them.
- [51:09]
Taryn
And.
- [51:10]
Liz
And I sewed growing up. And so, you know, when you sew, you. You knot it and then you clip the thread so you can keep the clean line. But she kept the threads, and so they're all sewed on top of. So it's really, like, kind of chaotic feeling. And then she painted with these really beautiful pinks and blues, and it's, like, feminine and floral and. But, like, chaotic, and it's just.
- [51:33]
Caroline
Just cool.
- [51:34]
Liz
And I, like, sent it to a client, and I was like, I think this needs to go in your living room. And she was like, I love it. So sometimes the clients find art because it makes them feel something. A client texted me a couple days ago. She's in Portland. She was like, we love this barn painting. And I was like, get it.
- [51:50]
Caroline
We'll.
- [51:51]
Liz
We'll hang it up there in Chicago. And then sometimes a client feels really intimidated. Even in the galleries, it's hard to see how all of those pieces are going to go together. And so we'll buy things when we are at flea markets or in different places and we have, like, some stock at the office. And so sometimes we'll Pull a bunch of things in and. And lay it out. And the client will be like, this feels right to me. So I really don't think that there's a perfect approach to art, but there's just a lot of different ways to make it work for you and your space.
- [52:24]
Taryn
Yeah. And, I mean, I'm with you on that where I've bought certain pieces, but then it's just either too small, like, where it needs. It needs to live with other things on a wall. And that's a me problem, too, of, like, we have a lot of space, like, a lot of big walls right now because it's a newer build, so there's just a lot of wall, and I'll buy something, or I had things, and it really is like, all right. You can't be alone because you'll just be. There'll be too much space around you. So I've been kind of group, like, you know, holding it and, like, trying to place it with other, like, waiting to get more. It's like a long game, and that part's hard.
- [52:59]
Caroline
But I also love putting, like, a. A smaller piece on a little sliver of wall. You know what I mean? Like, some. Not, like, at the end of a hallway or, like, between two doors. So I always feel like those are.
- [53:11]
Taryn
Yeah, yeah.
- [53:13]
Caroline
No, you overlook, like, because especially, like, in a hallway, you get up or in a bathroom, you get up so much closer to your wall. Whereas in a living room, like, you're never, you know, there's a piece of furniture there, or there's like, a sofa there, or sometimes there's, like, a barrier.
- [53:30]
Liz
Or there's a lot of fabric. And so it's, like, not totally getting the attention.
- [53:33]
Caroline
Yeah. Then in a hallway or some or small room, it's kind of nice to, like, you know, be able to get up close to a small piece. Right.
- [53:42]
Liz
Or even just nailing it on. On a bookshelf, so, you know, just kind of, like, putting it right on up there. I do think I have a client who we went on this big art trip with. We got all these great pieces, and they got just a little, like, nervous about hanging things up because we didn't have all the pieces together to, like, totally see how the room would go. And I gets paint, just throw it up there if you like it. If you buy more, you want to move it, you just patch it up, paint it up, keep on going. I just think art should live on your walls, even if it's not a perfect solution. Put it up, enjoy it. And my husband And I probably twice a month, we, like, rip all the paintings off and move everything.
- [54:20]
Taryn
Oh, my gosh.
- [54:21]
Caroline
Twice a month?
- [54:22]
Liz
Yeah. I mean, not all of the art, but, like, definitely some pieces I'll like. He likes to piddle around and move things around, and that's a lot. He. He loves to do that. And I am like, just leave it there. We just recently we had this one gallery wall going up the stairs, and we just had collected enough pieces to. To start the second one. But until then, they've lived on other walls. The intention was always to go here, but I didn't. I was like, I love these pieces. I don't want the. Them stacked up in a closet. So they're going to live in a powder room. They're going to live on a hall. They're going to live in a place that's maybe not perfect, but now they're all going up there. And it's a. It's a collection of, like, really nice pieces. And also, like, my middle child, he did this great self portrait that I, like, am obsessed with, and it's right up there in the middle of it.
- [55:09]
Taryn
So awesome.
- [55:10]
Liz
It doesn't have to be perfectly curated. So much more interesting when it's not.
- [55:15]
Caroline
Not. That's good advice. It sounds like, Taryn, you just now need to start getting the really big. Like a couple really big. Yeah, I do feel like those are harder to find.
- [55:25]
Taryn
Yes.
- [55:25]
Caroline
You know what I mean?
- [55:26]
Taryn
Or harder to line on.
- [55:28]
Liz
I was gonna say.
- [55:29]
Taryn
It's too. Because they're usually investment pieces. And then to align, I think, with. With whoever you live with.
- [55:35]
Caroline
So.
- [55:35]
Taryn
And from. For me, it's. My husband and I have been where I've seen something, and I have intentionally been like, all right, let's go to this gallery I want you to see yet. And then we've sat there and hemmed and hawed. But I will say we. We intentionally do try to go a few times a year and look at art, because I do want something bigger. Because we do have some big walls. Because there is. You know, it's also like, if you do a bunch of walls with little stuff, you do become like, yes, yes, yes, yes.
- [56:01]
Liz
The gallery wall has to be very intentional. I don't think that every wall deserves a gallery wall. It becomes a little too, like.
- [56:10]
Caroline
Like, then it's too much focal point if you overuse it. You know what I mean? Like, agree. It's in every room. It kind of. It loses its power, I think, you know?
- [56:21]
Taryn
Yeah.
- [56:22]
Caroline
Whereas if you have, like, a couple really good moments, Then, like, they're more dramatic.
- [56:29]
Liz
Yeah. You know, and I do think, like, I think you should go home and you should just hang some things up and move around and who cares if you have a hole in your wall?
- [56:36]
Taryn
Like, I'm gonna do it.
- [56:38]
Liz
Giant painting that I fell in love with. It was so big, it had to. I couldn't even fit it in my car. It's 60 inches by 60 inches. And it was just one of these paintings. I was there for a client and I was so, like, gobsmacked that I was like, oh, my God, I'm just buying it. I just love this. I love this painting. And the woman was like, I'm so sorry. It was just bought by a collector in Boston. And like, it's going on their truck tomorrow. And I was so sad. And she called me and I guess it couldn't fit up the client's staircase. So she was like, it's headed back to Charlotte. Like, do you want it? I was like, don't even bring it back to the gallery. Just like, bring it right on to my house and.
- [57:12]
Taryn
Oh, that's awesome.
- [57:13]
Liz
My husband's like, it's too big for that. Like, over the sofa. And I just think it's so interesting. Cause, like, I want it to also, like, stare everybody else in the face. Like it does to me. Like, I think it's just so amazing. I don't want it to, like, have too much room to breathe. I think that it's interesting over my. My sofa with my kids jumping on the sofa.
- [57:34]
Caroline
Are there any like non art art pieces that you like? You know, whether it's like sculpture, like wall decor, anything that, that someone could use to. To fill a wall space. But that's not like a painting.
- [57:52]
Liz
Yeah. So we just commented on this a few months ago. We have a lot of my grandmother's china that was like hand painted. There's some great little wall mounts that you can buy off Amazon. They're just like little tiny brass bits and you can hang them up and they're in my dining room and they're mismatched and a lot of the pieces broke and I don't have enough to enjoy them to eat on them, but they remind me of eating at her house. Yeah, they live in my dining room, so that's a really fun thing. Also, when I was studying abroad, we were in Morocco, and there was this like, beautiful old window, this Berber window. And it's like, got all these beautiful, like, hand painted details on it. And I don't know why, at 19 I was, like, in love with this window that was on a dirt floor that nobody else wanted, but I bought it in the markets, and it also hangs in our house.
- [58:49]
Caroline
How did you get that home?
- [58:51]
Liz
I, like, don't remember.
- [58:52]
Taryn
I mean, I think I like.
- [58:53]
Liz
Like, they, like, wrapped it in cardboard and like, I. I just. I carried it home through customs. I don't know.
- [59:01]
Taryn
I did.
- [59:02]
Liz
I don't know. I mean, it, like, it's kind of.
- [59:04]
Caroline
Just like, that's something Karen would do.
- [59:05]
Liz
Well, that. My guitar. I was like, all right, here we go.
- [59:08]
Taryn
You literally had. Yeah. You had not a hand free. You were like, I got my window, I got my guitar. I'm ready to.
- [59:15]
Caroline
Oh, that's funny. Yeah, that is funny.
- [59:17]
Taryn
But it is fun. Those pieces, like you said, that you gather that aren't precious and then know to invest in a few, too, so.
- [59:24]
Liz
Great stories, you know, just to kind of remember those different times and. And I love sculpture. I think, you know, there's a lot of different makers and. And people. And I do a lot of high and low, like we talked about earlier, which I know a lot of people say, oh, a mix of high and low. But I do think anything that you can invest in, if. If that's where you're thinking you would like to invest, is putting it up on the wall or hanging it from the ceiling, whether it A light fixture or something, that's just like, a great space to kind of. You can enjoy it without worrying that it's going to be destroyed. So.
- [60:04]
Caroline
Yeah, I always feel like lighting is, like, the best investment if you have kids, because. Yeah, it's. I guess maybe if you have some balls or things in the. In the room. But you're giving me this look like you have no idea.
- [60:17]
Taryn
I'm waiting to see where you're going with this, because I'm like, yes, there's always a. There is always a ball flying in my house.
- [60:21]
Caroline
Like, there's always. Well, yeah, we have less of those bullets. I'm like, it's less likely to get down, like, if I'm going to splurge on something in here. A light fixture that's, like, way up high is probably the safest.
- [60:36]
Taryn
Yeah, no, I think, like, a wool rug is, like, the safest.
- [60:39]
Caroline
I mean, because it is, because it's cleanable, but, like. Yeah, I guess. I don't know.
- [60:44]
Taryn
No, you're right. I mean, in a way, I don't have girls.
- [60:47]
Caroline
Not boys. So way less, you know, baseballs and soccer balls. Then you probably. Yeah, I will say sculpture.
- [60:55]
Taryn
I Do worry about, like, sculpture's still where I'm worried if I put something, it will get knocked just based on running.
- [61:02]
Liz
But it depends on the sculpture. Yeah, yeah.
- [61:05]
Caroline
Or like the height. Put it up on a tall bookcase. Yeah.
- [61:08]
Taryn
And if it does mount to the wall. It totally depends, like you said, kind.
- [61:11]
Liz
Of what it is.
- [61:12]
Taryn
Yes, Yes.
- [61:13]
Liz
I have this big woman from Curry and Company and she's. I'm not sure, like, if y' all have seen them, but she's lying down and she's kicking her leg up and she's much personality, and it's like, you open my door and she's, like, sitting on my foyer. Like, welcome. Like, we're gonna have a great time. And it's just. It is. She. It's super heavy and it's a sculpture. And like, my kids. It's metal.
- [61:37]
Caroline
Okay.
- [61:37]
Taryn
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [61:38]
Liz
And I. I feel like it can really, like, really withstand the chaos of being in an entryway.
- [61:45]
Caroline
Yeah, yeah.
- [61:46]
Taryn
And that. Well, that's a great example of, like, something that can.
- [61:49]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [61:50]
Taryn
You know, work, but still be open art.
- [61:52]
Caroline
Yeah. You were giving me the funniest look.
- [61:56]
Taryn
I literally was like, what. What about a lamp is not going to get broken or she in.
- [62:00]
Caroline
No, no. I feel like lamps are. Are targets. Yes. More vulnerable. More vulnerable. But like a, you know, a ceiling fixture or like sconces feels.
- [62:13]
Liz
Yeah.
- [62:13]
Caroline
You know, less risky. Yeah, yeah, sure.
- [62:17]
Taryn
I'm just in a weird place in life.
- [62:19]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [62:19]
Taryn
I'm like.
- [62:20]
Caroline
Yeah.
- [62:20]
Taryn
Dealing with nerfs and balls.
- [62:23]
Caroline
Nerf guns.
- [62:24]
Taryn
I know.
- [62:24]
Liz
But it doesn't. Like, my 12 year old and 10 year old, like, they run around with all those things. Like, my. There was a game that I walked in on them and they were trying to throw paper airplanes through the front foyer fixture. Like, there was like, they were like. That was like the goal. And they were getting fire and I. Oh, wait, I didn't even think about that. But there you go. Yes. And I'm like, why is. Why is that the goal? Like, go outside and, like, make anything else. Like, why do you have to throw it through the foyer fixture? But, like, they'll just. Yeah, that's just part of it. And I don't know, I think going back to just embracing it.
- [62:57]
Caroline
Yeah, yeah, we embrace.
- [63:00]
Taryn
We do a lot of embracing.
- [63:06]
Caroline
So we'll do a decorating dilemma. I'll read it really quickly. It's from Delita, and I think that's how she says that. I love that name. That's how.
- [63:12]
Taryn
Yeah, I liked it too.
- [63:14]
Caroline
Okay. I really enjoy your Show. Thank you for taking my question. Of course. Thanks for listening. We've downsized to a 1500 square foot home home and are working to maximize our small space for grown children and grandchildren. While we like some aspects of open concept, it doesn't always flow well, especially with multiple activities happening at once. We're planning to remove our kitchen peninsula, upper cabinets and recess the fridge to create an open kitchen with a large farm table that will serve as an island. I also want to add a buffet or a small table in the bay window space. I like to somehow border off the living room from the kitchen dining area area. Most walls are limited, either open space windows or a fireplace. I'm considering a partial wall with a wide opening about 7ft between the spaces. Or maybe a wall extending from the bookshelf side with a shorter opening. I plan to place a wingback chair on the left wall, possibly reconfigure the sofas, either removing one, placing the remaining on the gallery wall or in front of the window, or replacing them with a true corner sectional. The TV is above the fireplace and I'd love to add interior window panes as a divider if budget allows. I've attached a few photos of my plan for visualization. Thanks again. Okay, so she actually included a like a hand drawn floor plan.
- [64:26]
Liz
That's so great.
- [64:28]
Caroline
So she's got what is the current one and then what she sort of imagined. So what are your thoughts?
- [64:43]
Liz
So from what I can gather, I believe that this right here is the peninsula and that the kitchen must extend further past that. Maybe we're not seeing the kitchen on this plan. Does that feel correct?
- [65:00]
Caroline
Yeah, yeah, I guess so.
- [65:03]
Liz
I'm not seeing.
- [65:04]
Taryn
Yeah, there's no indication of an actual kitchen. So I agree with you. I think, think the peninsula right now is.
- [65:11]
Caroline
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [65:12]
Taryn
At the kitchen's past.
- [65:13]
Liz
That's what I was thinking.
- [65:14]
Caroline
Yeah, like that's the peninsula. I think you're right.
- [65:17]
Liz
And I love her idea of kind of creating the room dividers. I think beautiful glass panes would be really nice. You know, not understanding what the style of the home is or the age of the home. Like, I would definitely want to take that kind of into consideration and maybe where she's living in terms of if that's like true to the home. But I love sort of the idea of this opening and kind of having the chairs around the room while not obstructing from the flow. I think she's done a really great job. One piece of advice I had was again, not understanding exactly what the kitchen, where the kitchen goes and what that layout would look like. I see that she has like a one little circle table with two chairs maybe in the bay window. And recently we just put in a banquette in one of those. And I know that Ballard has some banquettes that might look great in there. And I think even if it's floor to ceiling windows or partial windows, you could build the banquette right underneath that. And it's really great with. With grown families and kids. And also maybe if it's just kind of having that space to grow if you're going to have a lot of kids over, but also being great for just one or two of you who might be there. And I think that would offer her more flexibility in this future kitchen design, depending on how much she loves to cook and what other aspects she might want to enjoy in that space. But kind of tucking away that eating area might be really nice for sort of the flow of the space and kind of utilizing that bay in a more functional way.
- [66:59]
Caroline
Yeah, it definitely seems like a good place. Like, if you've got overflow, once you've got lots of grandkids, everyone can't fit at the table. You can kind of overflow over there. Or like. I always love a breakfast table. Like in the mornings when you're like working on email or just the two of them. Yeah.
- [67:17]
Liz
Coffee right by the window. It's really nice. And I think it would kind of offer. Depending on if she's seating at her island. You know, maybe they don't eat at the. The banquet or dining table all the time. So that would be a nice place to sit down and eat, but it wouldn't have to take up so much square footage in the main level of the house.
- [67:35]
Caroline
Yeah. Yeah.
- [67:37]
Taryn
And then I. I was thinking also I. Having the partial wall again, hopefully will give her space maybe for more seating in that living room. Because if it sounds like with the family and so much family, it sounds like having more chairs there because she also attached this picture of her inspiration for the wall.
- [67:56]
Liz
Yeah, I thought that was great. Pretty. Yeah, very pretty.
- [67:59]
Caroline
And it'll help the. I always feel like it's a little. A little awkward sometimes when there's not a divider at all. Right.
- [68:09]
Taryn
Because it's like where do you stop the paint? Where you. Yeah, like finish wise.
- [68:14]
Caroline
Yeah. So having some sort of cased case opening. Cased opening is.
- [68:19]
Liz
And I. I like having flow from room to room and I like how open concept offers that. But I do think it's nice to have like a Clear division. Even if it's just a small one of, like, this room is now transitioning into a new space. Right. So I think she did a really good job with. With that thought process.
- [68:37]
Caroline
And even with this picture, like, you can put, like, you can, like, use the space in front of these windows, right? Like, if you wanted to put like a demiloon or like a little plant stand or like a little side table with keys on it or, like, whatever she needs. But if it's just an open happening, you can't really definitely use it, but, you know, anyway.
- [68:59]
Liz
Yeah, Sounds like she's on the right track to me.
- [69:01]
Caroline
Yes, Agreed. All right. Well, Kate, thank you so much for joining us.
- [69:06]
Liz
Thank you so much.
- [69:07]
Caroline
So much fun.
- [69:08]
Liz
So great to chat with y' all and to be here in your beautiful city of Atlanta and see your new office. So thank you for having me.
- [69:16]
Caroline
Can you tell everyone where they can find you, follow you and see your work?
- [69:19]
Liz
Oh, thank you so much. Yes, you can find me on instagram@cwg.design and my website is actually cwg.design as well. There's no dot com. And, yeah, those are the two best avenues to find me.
- [69:33]
Caroline
So thank you.
- [69:34]
Taryn
Thank you.
- [69:35]
Caroline
That's our show. And that's our show. You can find all of the show notes on our blog howtodecorate.com podcast to.
- [69:43]
Taryn
Send in a decorating dilemma, Email your questions to podcastallarddesigns.net so we can help.
- [69:48]
Liz
You with your space.
- [69:49]
Caroline
And of course, be sure to follow us on social media at ballardesigns. Don't forget to subscribe wherever you get.
- [69:54]
Liz
Your podcast so you never miss an episode.
- [69:56]
Caroline
And please leave us a review. We'd love to hear your feedback. Until next time, happy decorating.