How to Read Women & Make Deep Connections: Dating Influencer Lindsey Metselaar on What Women Want (Encore Episode)

Summary

Podcast Summary: "How to Read Women & Make Deep Connections: Dating Influencer Lindsey Metselaar on What Women Want (Encore Episode)"

Host: Connell Barrett
Guest: Lindsey Metselaar
Release Date: November 24, 2024

In this encore episode of the "How to Get a Girlfriend" podcast, host Connell Barrett teams up with dating influencer Lindsey Metselaar to explore the nuanced dynamics of modern dating. Drawing from their personal experiences and professional expertise, they offer actionable insights into understanding women's desires, effective communication strategies, and building meaningful connections—all rooted in radical authenticity.

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1. Introduction and Episode Overview ([00:09] - [19:06])

Connell Barrett kicks off the episode by announcing it as an encore featuring Lindsey Metselaar, an esteemed Instagram influencer and host of the podcast "We Met at Acme." He highlights Lindsey's expertise in decoding women's signals and her ability to provide valuable dating insights. Connell recommends key timestamps for listeners who may prefer specific segments, emphasizing the deep dive into what women want and common mistakes men make unknowingly.

Notable Quote:

• Connell Barrett ([00:09]): "If you want to know what women want and how to better read women, Lindsey Metzilar has the answer."

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2. Overcoming Approach Anxiety ([06:35] - [13:55])

Lindsey shares her personal struggle with approaching women, recounting a pivotal moment in 2008 when she failed to engage someone she was interested in at Starbucks. This experience fueled her decision to seek coaching and transform her dating approach.

Key Points:

• Self-Worth vs. Dating Challenges: Lindsey emphasizes that inability to approach women isn't a reflection of one's worth but rather the inherent challenges in dating.
• Mindset Shift: Encourages men to move from fearing rejection to understanding that women appreciate genuine, high-value interactions.

Notable Quote:

• Lindsey Metselaar ([10:59]): "Women don't want every man approaching them, but they definitely want a high value, awesome man with a lot to offer to chat with them."

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3. The Millennial Dating Landscape ([19:06] - [24:12])

The conversation shifts to the unique challenges millennials face in the dating scene, primarily due to the plethora of communication mediums and dating apps that can lead to overstimulation and desensitization.

Key Points:

• Multimedia Overload: Millennials juggle numerous platforms like Snapchat, Instagram, TikTok, and various dating apps, complicating genuine connections.
• Choice Paralysis: The abundance of options can make it difficult to commit or focus on a single connection.

Notable Quote:

• Lindsey Metselaar ([23:17]): "Millennials have so many different mediums when it comes to dating. It is all of these different ways to communicate."

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4. Recognizing Women's Interest ([29:50] - [32:29])

Lindsey outlines clear indicators that a woman is interested, such as timely responses, enthusiasm in suggesting dates, and active participation in conversations.

Key Points:

• Positive Signals: Engaging in banter, initiating conversations, and showing consistent interest are strong indicators.
• Negative Signals: Inconsistent communication, rescheduling without valid reasons, and lack of enthusiasm typically signal disinterest.

Notable Quote:

• Lindsey Metselaar ([30:15]): "If a woman answers your texts in, like, a timely manner... those are all signs that a woman is interested in you."

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5. Embracing Vulnerability in Dating ([34:06] - [37:26])

The discussion delves into the role of vulnerability in building deep connections. Lindsey advises balancing openness with positivity to avoid overwhelming the date.

Key Points:

• Strategic Vulnerability: Sharing personal experiences and lessons learned can foster trust and intimacy.
• Maintaining Positivity: It's crucial to present vulnerabilities in a way that highlights growth and resilience rather than dwelling on negativity.

Notable Quote:

• Lindsey Metselaar ([35:39]): "Vulnerability is crucial when dating. I think that it's definitely a dance in terms of, like, when you start to be vulnerable."

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6. Balancing Logic and Emotion ([37:26] - [46:15])

Connell and Lindsey explore the tendency of men to lean too heavily on logic during dates, often at the expense of emotional engagement. They advocate for injecting more emotion and spontaneity to enhance romantic connections.

Key Points:

• Emotional Expression: Encouraging men to share feelings and experiences more openly can create a deeper, more resonant connection.
• Avoiding Over-Analysis: Steering conversations away from purely factual discussions towards more heartfelt topics fosters romance.

Notable Quote:

• Lindsey Metselaar ([43:17]): "I think most men lean towards too logical... and women tend to lean towards, like, what am I feeling about this?"

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7. Mastering Texting Etiquette ([46:15] - [57:16])

Texting remains a critical component of modern dating. Lindsey provides guidelines on maintaining engaging and respectful communication without overstepping boundaries.

Key Points:

• Consistency is Key: Regular communication helps maintain interest and build rapport.
• Content Matters: Sharing memes, funny TikToks, or thoughtful questions keeps conversations lively and meaningful.
• Avoiding Pitfalls: Steering clear of unsolicited pictures and lengthy messages ensures interactions remain comfortable and appropriate.

Notable Quote:

• Lindsey Metselaar ([48:27]): "Don't send any unsolicited pictures, but being, you know, switching up the conversation, sending, like, different things, like a meme or a funny TikTok."

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8. Interactive Segment: What Women Want vs. Don't Want ([50:21] - [57:59])

In a lively game segment, Connell and Lindsey categorize various dating scenarios, delineating what women prefer and what they avoid.

Key Insights:

• First Date Topics: Focus on personal growth, aspirations, and genuine interests rather than negative subjects like ex-relationships or material possessions.
• Approaching Women: Utilize humor and playfulness instead of clichéd compliments like "you're beautiful."
• Dating App Profiles: Incorporate humor and subtle vulnerability while avoiding gym selfies or overt displays of masculinity, such as holding up a fish.

Notable Quote:

• Lindsey Metselaar ([53:17]): "Women want something funny. Women always want to laugh. So leading with something that's gonna make her laugh is so crucial."

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9. Four Game-Changing Dating Tips ([57:59] - [61:56])

Wrapping up the advice portion, Lindsey shares four essential tips for men to enhance their dating experiences:

1. Follow the Rules: Adhere to established dating etiquette, such as paying for dates and being a gentleman.
2. Set Up the Next Date: Proactively plan future meetings to demonstrate interest and commitment.
3. Initiate Conversations and Commitments: Take the lead in discussing relationship milestones and future plans.
4. Be Persistent: Maintain respectful persistence without crossing into overbearing behavior.

Notable Quote:

• Lindsey Metselaar ([59:00]): "Don't be afraid to be persistent... because we're all going to get rejected in life. But it's okay to ask."

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10. Promoting Live Events and Closing Remarks ([62:12] - [63:06])

Lindsey promotes her live events and mixers available in cities like New York, Los Angeles, San Francisco, and Austin, encouraging listeners to engage in real-life interactions to apply the discussed strategies.

Notable Quote:

• Lindsey Metselaar ([62:12]): "We do these live events, some of which are mixers in New York City... you can find them on our website, wemetacme.com."

Connell concludes the episode by commending Lindsey's comprehensive insights and expressing appreciation for her participation, leaving listeners with actionable strategies to navigate the modern dating landscape confidently and authentically.

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This episode serves as a valuable resource for men seeking to understand women's desires, communicate more effectively, and build lasting romantic connections through genuine and respectful interactions.

Transcript

[Connell Barrett]

Welcome back to the how to Get a Girlfriend podcast. I'm your host, dating coach Connell Barrett, as always, here to help you flirt, gain confidence and get a great girlfriend. And we're doing this all with authenticity, radical authenticity, not a bunch of weird toxic pickup moves or alpha male bs. And this is the seventh and final episode of this week's seven episode relaunch. We've done seven straight episodes of the how to Get a Girlfriend podcast and we're going to continue doing two episodes per week forever, pretty much till the end of time. But I thought a great way to finish the seventh straight episode in seven days is to replay a fantastic episode I did with somebody I'm a really big fan of. Her name is Lindsay Metzilar. She's an influencer on Instagram, she is a dating expert. She hosts a kick ass podcast called We Met at Acme and Lindsay and I have a great conversation that you're about to listen to where she's going to tell you, here's what women want. Lindsay is formerly single herself and she's also a dating expert and she really knows how to read women. How to decode the signals that women might send you. Things like how to figure out if a woman is into you or not. How to understand why a woman you're talking to and you think everything's going great. All of a sudden she goes quiet or she gets somehow turned off. Lindsay is fantastic for these kinds of insights because she is a woman, she knows women, she used to be single. She hosts a fantastic dating podcast. So I think you're going to get a lot out of this episode. And if I'm going to give you the look, I hope you listened to the whole thing. It's 45 minutes of your time spent very well. But if you want to go to three or four of my favorite parts, I would definitely go to the 20 minute mark of today's episode where Lindsay talks about her podcast, we met at Acme and how it helps millennials. So if you're of the millennial age, go to the 20 minute mark. She'll talk about how her podcast can help you out. And if you just want to find out if a woman is into you, how to tell if a woman is or isn't into you, how to read those signals. The 29 minute and 50 second mark is a great place to go. And oh, here's a really good one. She talks about something at the 59 minute mark. She talks about something that guys do that they don't know they're Doing that Women absolutely hate when men do it. It's a very simple thing that you might have done on a date. Find out what it is. It's pretty simple. So easy to fix. That's at the 59 minute mark. And then at the very end, I asked Lindsay, I put her on the spot. I said, give me your top four dating tips. Lindsey does this really cool thing on her Instagram. E met is her Instagram. And on her Instagram she does four tips. Everybody needs to know. So I asked her for four dating tips. So at the approximately the 1 hour and 1 minute mark, we end with Lindsay sharing four game changing dating tips that are going to help you out. So if you want to know what women want and how to better read women, Lindsay Metzilar has the answer. And again, check out her Instagram and definitely check out her podcast. We met at Acme. She's great and this episode is really solid and she was amazing on it. So enjoy.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

So when I was approaching, I always wanted that sure thing. But there's just no certainties with approaching. You know, as the saying goes, nothing is certain except death, taxes and sucky Adam Sandler movies. All right, welcome to the Dating Transformation podcast. I am your host, dating coach, Connell Barrett. I'm here to help you gain confidence, learn to flirt and attract an amazing girlfriend and do this all with authenticity as your real best self, not a bunch of sketchy pickup artist nonsense. So welcome to the next episode. This is launch week. By the time you're done listening to this episode, you're going to get some really awesome game changing tips about what women want. About what women want. I've got an amazing guest. She's going to give us game changing tips for. Actually, she's got about 10 game changing tips for how to talk to women, how to text them on the apps, how to approach them, how not to approach them. So stick around for the whole episode because my guest, Lindsay Mezelar is going to give us some great tips and advice and I'm going to jump in and join her. Okay, so today I want to first I want to tell you a story. I want to share with you something that really bothered me because if you're anything like me, and I think you probably are, you want to approach women out in the world, right? You might see a woman at a bar or that really cute stunner, the yoga outfit, who smiles at you sometimes at the gym. Or maybe you, this was a big one for me. Maybe you're at a coffee shop, you're at A Starbucks, a park on a Saturday afternoon. And then you just see a woman sitting on a bench, or she's waiting for her coffee at Starbucks and she's just like three feet away from you. And you would love to break the ice with her, approach her, try to make some conversation happen and potentially get mutual attraction, get a date. But something holds you back, right? You get in your head, you think, oh, I don't know what to say. Or if I approach her, it's going.

[Connell Barrett]

To be weird and creepy, or if.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

I get shot down, these people are going to see it and it's going to feel awkward and weird. And so very likely you rarely or never approach women you find attractive, especially not in the daytime. Maybe you do it at night with a little bit of liquid courage. Dr. Jack Daniels can perform some short term miracles, but long term, alcohol is not the way to approach women.

[Connell Barrett]

So.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

And I totally get how this feels. When I first was working on my dating life, I was basically exactly where you are. I did not approach. I doubted myself. I was afraid. I thought it was weird and creepy to approach women or it might be seen that way. And here was the moment that really was the turning point for me where I decided, okay, I need to. I'm going to get some help. I'm going to get some coaching. I'm going to try. I'm going to fix this somehow. I was at a Starbucks on a Sunday afternoon in 2008, and I saw this really cute brunette sitting by herself on her phone drinking her chai latte. She's wearing a denim miniskirt. Really cute. My crush at the time was Katie Holmes, the actress.

[Connell Barrett]

Katie Holmes.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

She looked a lot like Katie Holmes. And I said, okay, Connell, you're finally gonna do it. You're gonna walk over there and approach this girl. Here you go. And I walked over to her table, and there was even a seat next to her. It was almost like an invitation to sit down. And I walked over and I made a beeline for her. And at the last minute, I took a detour and basically went to the men's room. And I thought, okay, I was getting myself psyched up. Get psyched up, go over to her. Get out of the men's room, go back over to her. I walked to her table again and then I circled it once, maybe twice. And I wanted so badly to approach her, but it was like there was an invisible barrier. It was just. It was almost like there was a force field around her. I couldn't do it. The thoughts that held me back Were, oh, man, these people are going to see me approach a girl. If she shoots me down, I'm going to feel so fucking creepy. I don't want to be a creep. I'm a nice guy. I'm a nice boy from Ohio. I don't want to creep out a girl. I don't want to get shot down. And basically, I circled her. I circled her chair for about, I don't know, off and on for about two or three minutes. And I was kind of like a frightened shark circling but too afraid to bite, quote, unquote. Anyway, I couldn't get the courage up. And finally after a few minutes, I go back to my seat and I see her walk up and she just walks out. And I watch her walk away on Park Avenue and 29th street in Manhattan. And I remember thinking, damn it, what's wrong with you? Why can't you approach a girl? And I remember also thinking, there goes another really cool, potentially awesome, intelligent, fun, definitely beautiful woman who could have been in my life. I could have had a date with her. Maybe I. Who knows? Maybe she would have become my girlfriend. If nothing else, I could have just stepped up and taken an action. But I didn't do it, and I felt like I couldn't do it. And I sat down and I grabbed a pen. I had a pen with me, and I started writing on a Starbucks napkin. You suck, you suck, you suck. And that was when I was really upset at myself. And that's when I went online and found the guy who became my first coach. Anyway, the lesson here, or the kind of. The takeaway I want to share with you is if you are, first of all, just know that you don't suck. I wrote a book called Dating sucks, but you don't. And the message here of this book, among the messages is, hey, man, if you can't approach women, it's not that you suck. It's that dating is hard. It's that approaching can feel very challenging and very scary, but you don't suck. Dating can definitely suck, but you don't. You're awesome. And I had lost a sense of my awesomeness at that time, and I just could not approach women. So I needed help from a coach. You may not need a coach. I want to give you a tip right now that you can take out into the world and use it today that'll make it so much easier to step up, to break the ice with that attractive women who you see at a bar, at the gym, at Starbucks.

[Connell Barrett]

Wherever you might be.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Here's what I wish I had known back in 2008. Basically, it's a mindset fix and it's a practical tip. I could not approach that woman because I thought, number one, it's creepy and weird to hit on girls. And also I didn't, I literally didn't know what to say. I literally had no idea what the right thing to say was. So here's a two part tip. Tip number one is I want you to give yourself permission and remind yourself that it's true. Women don't want every man approaching them, but they definitely want a high value, awesome man with a lot to offer to chat with them. And you have to get in touch with what you offer. You have to get a sense of, hey, I have some really great things about myself, whatever they may be, right? I have this hobby, I have a full time job, I'm a cook, I love to travel, I'm fit, I'm at the gym all the time. You got to remind yourself that women do want men of value to break the ice with them in a charming way. So they don't want to get hit on per se, but they do want a high value man like you to break the ice and make her smile. So I was so worried that day about being creepy, hitting on her, getting blown out. It was a mindset issue. Remind yourself it's okay to approach. You're not hitting on her, you're breaking the ice. You're giving her a small gift. The gift of a short, authentic, brief, positive interaction. And women love that. Women love that. So tip number one is just give yourself permission. I'm not hitting on the girl, I'm giving her something of value moment with me. And the second tip is what to say, right? You might not know what to say. Here's the great way to always know what to say. Look at the woman you want to chat with and notice something about her that's not looks related, that you like and appreciate. So don't make it about, or at least don't make it about her physical features, okay? It can be a compliment on her look, her style, but don't make it about her lips, her body, her T and a. Obviously. Here's a great way to approach compliment something that you appreciate. For example, if I could go back in time to that girl in the Starbucks, I would say, hey, excuse me, miss, I just want to say that you have great style, you're really put together and you have awesome style. That's not hitting on a girl, that's just giving a genuine compliment about her cool denim skirt and her.

[Connell Barrett]

Maybe she.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

I forget it's been so long, but let's say she was wearing cool pink Chuck Taylor sneakers. Excuse me, miss. I love your style. Great sneakers. Awesome denim miniskirt. You got it going on. And let her respond to that. There's something about an authentic, specific, well intentioned compliment that nine out of 10 women will take very well. They'll appreciate it. And then you've broken the ice. You've done the hardest thing. You've said something to a woman with good intentions, and then she'll take it in. And then in terms of what to say next, we'll go into that on a different podcast. But think of it as. Think of it as a compliment. Think of a compliment as a small gift. You're not out in the world trying to take from women. You're not trying to get phone numbers. You're not trying to get attraction. You're not trying to get sex. I mean, not at first. Eventually we want those things in a win win way. But if you want to get rid of approach anxiety today, make it about, I'm going to give genuine, sincere, real compliments to women without agenda. Then let those compliments land and see how she responds. If she smiles and says, oh, my God, thank you so much, you noticed my awesome leather jacket. I appreciate that. Who knows, she might ask you a question or compliment you back. And now you're talking to a really pretty girl who you just approached. And that's when good things can happen. But even if she, even if it doesn't go further than the compliment and she accepts the compliment, I promise you, you feel so much better by taking that action. You feel amazing about yourself as a man by being on that true, authentic path and approaching women from a place of good, courageous, authentic intention. I hope that makes sense. Yeah, don't do what I did. Don't circle her chair for five minutes like a creepy little scared shark. And don't write you suck on a napkin. Life's too short to feel that way about yourself. Okay, that was my little opening gambit for you here today. Stick around. We're going to talk to Lindsey Metzilar. Lindsay, you're going to love Lindsey. Lindsey is a dating expert and an influencer. She's also a very experienced dater. She's married now. She's going to give you the view from the inside. What do women want? How do we text them? How do we approach them from her point of view? You're going to get so many great tips from Lindsey. You're going to love this conversation. Stick around. I'll be right back with Lindsay Metsolar.

[Advertisement Voice]

I'm going to read your mind. Ready? I'll bet that you would love to confidently approach women. Get great matches on the dating apps, flirt with charm and attract your dream girlfriend. Right? But fear keeps you from approaching. You're not sure how to flirt, you struggle on the apps, and desirable women just don't seem into you. Well, I have great news. Dating coach Connell Barrett can help. He's guided thousands of men like you to more confidence and helped them attract their dream girlfriends. So book a free strategy call today to see if Connell's coaching is right for you. On your call, Connell or a team member will give you personalized advice to help you have more confidence, more dates, and more fun. Oh, and you'll be dating women as your best self, a charming gentleman. That's because Connell does not teach creepy pickup artist tricks. He unlocks your most confident self so you can make authentic romantic connections. Your next steps Book your free call [e-mail] contact and grab a time that works for you. Then you'll be on your way to more confidence, better results, and attracting bright, beautiful women. Oh, so you know, soon Connell will stop taking on new clients. So book a call today while you still can. Go to datingtransformation.com contact and transform your love life. Bye.

[Connell Barrett]

And we're back with Lindsey Mezelar. I'm super psyched to have Lindsey here. Lindsay is a native New Yorker and she hosts a podcast called We Met at Acme, which is a popular and I can verify an awesome millennial dating podcast. I know because I was on it even though I'm way too old to be even close to a millennial. We Met at Acme is also a brand about all things dating, from live events, mixers, retreats, and more stuff that I'm sure we're going to get into. And plus, I'm just a huge fan of Lindsey's Instagram, where you can get a lot of really great, practical, quick dating tips. She does this really cool thing where she gives tips in fours, which I love, like four mistakes not to make on first dates and the like. And her Instagram is at Wemet Acme. Get ready because Lindsay's a dating advice machine and I'm super stoked to have her here today. Lindsay, welcome to launch week here at Dating Transformation Podcast.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

I am honored to be here. Thank you for having me.

[Connell Barrett]

Your resume is so long. We have no more time for questions.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

But let's pack it up then.

[Connell Barrett]

But thanks for stopping by. Cool. Well, let's start. Let's get right to it. Let's talk about we met at Acme. I'm sure you get this a lot, so pardon the cliched question, but what does the name mean? Where did it come from? And of course, what is that? What's the core mission? What's the core message of we met at Acme?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

The name came because I was very single at the time of starting my podcast, and I was frequenting Acme, which is a club in the city, and I had met some people there, and I knew some people that met there, and it just kind of rolled off the tongue and sounded really, really nice. And the second part of the question was, remind me again.

[Connell Barrett]

Well, your main mission here, primarily, you primarily talk to millennials, as I understand it. Yeah. What's the. What's the core mission? What's the core message?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

I do talk to millennials. The core message is really, I'm trying to be like a big sister character to a lot of people in the dating world. And the message is like, you are amazing. You know your self worth and date like you are the shit. Basically, date like it's about you choosing them, not them choosing you. And here are some ways to make dating not as stressful. And that's when the rules come in.

[Connell Barrett]

All right. I don't know if you ever want to write a book, but that's a not a bad working title, is date like you're the shit instead of the fuck trope. Maybe you'll start the shit. You're the shit trope.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

The shit tropes. The shit's coming back. Bring back the shits.

[Connell Barrett]

Tell us a little bit more about your origin story. Whether it's meeting people at Acme or even before then. I'm fascinated by how people go from doubtful, struggling, lack of confidence to finding the one. You're happily married. You've obviously done something very right. But can you talk a little bit about your origin story? Maybe when you weren't a dating expert or didn't have kind of a handle on how to do this in a way that's really, really effective?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yeah. Well, what's funny is that I always thought that I was an expert, right? Like, I was that overconfident dater from the beginning where I thought that I was doing everything right all the time until I was really badly dumped. And it was kind of like a wake up call where I was like, oh, my God, you know, I'm not doing the right things or I'm not as good as I think I am. And the reason I thought I was good was because I. I was always great at helping friends text and like, the banter stuff. That was like, something I was confident about that I knew what I was doing. But when it came to. And like, I could get, I could get people to date me, right? But then when it came to, like, long lasting relationships, it was a little bit harder. And so I had a friend come over and we were just kind of talking about our dating life and I was, this was like five years ago. And I was like, why don't we just record this conversation? There is no podcast out there that's about dating right now. It's like news and crime. And I feel like other people can relate to this chaos that is dating, especially in New York City, but as a millennial. And so we just recorded it and we released it, and the rest is history.

[Connell Barrett]

Tell me a bit more about what it's like dating as a millennial, now or then. Basically, what do millennials have to take under consideration? Deal with, endure versus other generations. I'm Gen X and there's people who are younger now than millennials. What is it about millennials that makes them differentiate from others?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Millennials have so many different mediums when it comes to dating. It is all of these different ways to communicate. So Snapchat, Instagram, TikTok, Pinterest, Venmo, like, anything is a dating app to millennials. And so it gets really complicated. Like, we're overstimulated. We. We just have too many different modes of communication that often we're not communicating at all as millennials. And with the dating apps, which everyone has, I guess every generation has, but we get really desensitized to just like swiping and swiping and swiping. And so I think it's just between communication struggles and having too many options. As a millennial dater, it can be really hard to sift through the noise and actually stick with something.

[Connell Barrett]

So when one of my male clients says, connell, I've got all these matches. But every time I ask a woman out, she finds a reason not to go. Or maybe she goes quiet. Even though things are going well, she goes quiet. Can that be because people have so many dating options today?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

That could be. It also could be because women are so complicated and so confusing. And I, like, will talk to women about their dating lives and they'll be like, I just don't understand. Like, this person will talk to me Forever and not ask me out. But then when somebody asks them out, like, right away, they're like, oh, my God, he asked me out right away. And so I think it's just finding, like, a happy medium between the two. I'd imagine in that situation, the woman was just like, oh, my God. It was like, too much too soon, you know?

[Connell Barrett]

Yeah. Okay, we're gonna get back to texting for sure. Because my listener right now is. He's literally sitting on the edge of his seat. Because you're a woman and you're an expert, and you have been single, and there's something about a woman giving men advice that means so much to them. I took my girlfri out with me once doing infield coaching with my clients where we go out on the town for the weekend, and their focus all shifted away from me, and they were just like, and then what do I text next? And what do women want? So you're like, an MVP here. So we'll come back to the texting help, but I just want to maybe share some fun stories about your dating past. One of my favorite tips for men is a fun question to ask early on a first date is asking a woman for any funny dating horror stories she has, because it starts things out in a fun, light place, and also it kind of makes him hopefully look cooler than whatever loser guy she's talking about. So let me ask you, do you have any fun, memorable first date horror stories that from back in the day.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Back in the single days. I never was that good at this answer because I got decently lucky. I mean, I had. I had one date that was just, like, really mean. He told me that I sounded like a farmer, which, like, I guess he meant as an insult. Like, and I didn't really know how to respond to that. And that was just a weird experience. And then I had. So I have, like, the mean guys, and then I've had the guys who are just like, it's pulling teeth to have a conversation with. And it's so funny. It's always those guys that it's pulling teeth to have a conversation with that ask you on a second date, and you're like, were we on the same date? Like, were we? And I wonder. I bet you it's the same for reverse meaning, like, if a guy feels like he's pulling teeth on a date, maybe the girl thinks that it went well. You know what I mean?

[Connell Barrett]

Right. Interesting. I want, by the way, back to the farmer. The guy who called you a farmer. Do you think there might have been. He might have been doing a quote unquote neg where he's like, tease the girl, try to make her feel insecure.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

It's possible, but I don't think negging works in any. Negging came from a place of. I feel like it was created from a place of insecurity. Just like, this person's doing so well, they think they're so cool. So let's, like, knock them down a peg and see if it works. Negging only worked once for me in college, but again, I was in college.

[Connell Barrett]

So that's probably why it worked on you or you did it.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

No, it worked on me. Someone did it to me.

[Connell Barrett]

Do you remember what it was? What do you say?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

A guy came up to me, who I later ended up dating, and he said, your legs are so hairy.

[Connell Barrett]

That's definitely.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

And it was.

That's actually an insult.

[Connell Barrett]

That's not a neg at all.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

That's just an insult.

And by the way, he had no idea if they were or not. He was just saying that. And my legs were hairy. I don't really shave my legs, but I'm not like a hairy person. They just like. It's like peach fuzz. But I was like, what? Like, how do you know? You know? And. But normally does not work.

[Connell Barrett]

I hate it when guys steal my lines because I invented your legs are hairy. That's really annoying. I get no credit for that. I got to start copywriting my best. No, I never. I don't like negs. You totally nailed it. Negs come from this place of, well, she must be above me, so I gotta find a way to bring her down to my level, which, even if it worked, it's, like, gross. But it's coming from such a bad place of, hey, why don't you just lift yourself up and make yourself as most authentically, vulnerably awesome as you can be and see if you guys genuinely connect. That's way more effective.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Totally. Way more.

[Connell Barrett]

Okay, a couple more dating questions for you. I actually. I went to your website the other day, and I saw one tip, like, on the homepage. So it must be an important tip, a little piece of wisdom that read, if you're confused, they're not interested.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yep.

[Connell Barrett]

Can you elaborate on what that means?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

So what that means is that if. And this is more, like, towards women dating men. It's like, if you're. But still for men, too, if you're confused about how they feel about you, like, they're hot and cold or you're still trying to figure out, screenshot the conversation, send it to friends. Do you think they like me? You know, like, waiting on their every last word to try to figure out. Like, it's like. It's like that meme with, like, the math problem on the board. Like, do they like me? They don't. Because you wouldn't be confused if somebody did like you. If somebody. If somebody showed up, consistently, made plans with you, messaged you, you know, every day when you're dating and whatnot. That's what that really means. And that, like, would have saved me so much time when dating in my twenties if I knew that.

[Connell Barrett]

Okay, all right, so there's a little bit of tough love there. It's like, hey, if you're confused, the truth is they're not interested. They're not that into you.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Right. Like, if you're asking a friend if you're like, oh, maybe he, you know, maybe he turned his phone off for the weekend. No.

[Connell Barrett]

Yeah. Okay. Well, again, as a formerly single, eligible woman, what are some signs that a woman either is or isn't interested in a guy so he can get clarity on whether she's probably into it or probably not?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yeah. I think I will say that it's harder, especially if it's a woman who follows lemad Acne's dating rules, because we don't necessarily put all of our cards on the table right away.

[Connell Barrett]

Okay.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

But if a woman answers your texts in, like, a timely manner, if she's continuing to get excited when you suggest going out on dates and she kisses you and, you know, smiles and laughs at your jokes and likes to banter with you and enjoys, like, talking every day, and you have, like, kind of these inside jokes. Like, those are all signs that a woman is interested in you. I think that with women, we are more clear when we're not interested than men. We will usually send, like, what I call, like, an anti ghost text, which is like, you know, it's been great getting to know you. I didn't feel a connection. Blah, blah, blah.

[Connell Barrett]

Okay.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

I feel, and I could be wrong, but most of the women that I know aren't big on, like, the leading guys on for no reason type of thing. And, like, we're human. Just, like, we would feel bad if we were taken on multiple nice dinner dates and still weren't interested. We'd probably cut it off after a while. So I think that if a woman's interested, she's continuing to go out with you. There's kissing maybe a little bit more as you get to know Each other texting. And if a woman's not interested in you, then she's not responding to your messages.

[Connell Barrett]

Right.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

She's, you know, continuing to reschedule, prioritize other things. But what can be complicated from a man's perspective is like, if you are the kind of guy who's not planning these dates ahead, who's sending that like last minute text that's like, oh, like some, like, are you free now? And then you're like, but she's not going out with me, then that's on you. Then she would be interested in you if you like, got your shit together.

[Connell Barrett]

Yeah. For me. And tell me if you.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yeah.

[Connell Barrett]

Agree or not. I tell my clients, is she talking to you? Is she responsive? Is there some good energy or there's some emojis going both ways. And maybe she can't meet up with you right away, but if she's still responsive and there's a good vibe, she might just be a really popular, busy person who is open to it. So I say don't give up. Be persistent, but, but empathetic and stay charming. As charming as you can. I dated a woman a couple years ago and I even send this text exchange to my clients. It's about six weeks of texting from she and myself matching to our first date. I must have asked her four or five times, asked her out, and every time she couldn't go. But she had a good reason and she was still responsive. And she was, it was. The tennis ball was going back and forth. So I stayed persistent and we did end up meeting up and going out. But if she had just gone totally quiet, then I would have just been a creepy stalker if I, if I'd have kept asking her out.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Right, Totally. And I love that you did that and that you stayed with it. And I think that's the one double standard that, that's one of the double standards that men can get away with is that persistency. And like, if, if I were coaching women, I would be like, you know, if he's interested, he's going to want to go out with you. But for women, I think a lot of the time we hear these stories of like, oh, I wasn't like, oh, I like, you know, still had feelings for my ex or I was doing dealing with this, but like, he kept texting me and like showing that he was interested in me and then like, it aligned and worked out. You don't often hear that the other way around.

[Connell Barrett]

Right. Okay, so let's switch to the topic of vulnerability and Dating. I feel one of the things I really like about your podcast is how real and vulnerable you and your guests are. You have an episode. I know that was. It was a tongue in cheek title, but you had an episode that really caught my eye that read, it's titled so I almost got divorced two weeks ago. And you didn't really get divorced, but it was still a real vulnerable thing to write and to talk about on your podcast, this fight you had with your husband. And I thought, what's your view on how vulnerable and real to be on dates? Those first few dates, those first few weeks of texting and getting to know somebody, can you be too vulnerable and can you be too walled off and not vulnerable enough? What are your thoughts on just the topic of vulnerability and dating?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Vulnerability is crucial when dating. I think that it's definitely a dance in terms of, like, when you start to be vulnerable. I would say, like dates one to three, you, like, do like a tiny dive into vulnerability. And then after the third date is when you get a little bit deeper and. But you could sprinkle it in here and that here and there. Like, for example, I think that it's really great to talk about your past relationships on the first few dates. Not, not like extensively, but more so just like, why did. What, like, how come your last relationship ended? What did you, like, take away from it? What's your blind spot when it comes to dating that, like, you're trying to be better at in relationships? I think that just that curiosity is crucial and that curiosity creates vulnerability. So that kind of vulnerability is good. I think if you have like a family trauma, I. Which we all do, I would probably save that for like day four or after. But again, like, going back to the sprinkling, like, if you're in therapy and you think that that's a big part of your life and has shaped you, then talk about that in dates 1, 2, 3. I think that that's like, that shows like, the power in vulnerability. If you're able to, you know, talk about that stuff in a positive way, but just don't bring the energy down with your vulnerability, if that makes sense.

[Connell Barrett]

Yes, because a woman might view that well if a man was. If a man was opened up about something vulnerable but the energy diminished, how. How might a woman take that or how might that hurt the date?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

I think that everybody, when they're dating is looking for somebody to bring lightness and, like, good energy into their lives and levity. And when we kind of dump our shit onto the date, it can Be indicative of like, how that relationship is going to go. Like, oh, this person's going to be complaining or this person's going to bring me down. And so it's not like, don't be yourself. If you have that part of you that's that's okay. But it's more like lead with your good foot or the best foot forward. And so like, for example, with the therapy thing, like, I might bring it up to say, or like, if I were a guy, I bring it up to say, like, therapy has been so amazing for me, made me realize like, that my career wasn't the best for me. Now I'm in this great career as opposed to being like, therapy made me realize that, like I really struggled as a kid. And like, and like dating has been really hard for me. Like, it's just, it's like you want to just bring that positivity into the date because people are expecting to leave in a good mood from a date, not like being brought down.

[Connell Barrett]

Right. And my dog died last week and my boss was mean to me and I'm behind on my rent. So can I see you again next week?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Exactly.

[Connell Barrett]

It's not going to happen.

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[Connell Barrett]

Yeah, one of the quotes from my book that I've dropped every now and then is be on a date. Be an open book, not an open wound. Vulnerable, authentic, which is my whole thing. You can be anything. Anything can be too much of that thing or delivered with the Wrong energy. I remember on my first date with my now girlfriend Jess. I remember it. Somehow the topic of past relationship relationships came up and I talked about, I told a story, two or three minute story about my nine week marriage.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yeah.

[Connell Barrett]

And how I felt rejected by all women and it set me off on this path. And it sounds. The topic might not sound like that textbook dating topic, but it was really through the lens of, look how I learned so much from it. I've grown, my ex and I are fine. And it's not going to bring the date down as long as to your point, you're not. The energy doesn't. It's not about negativity, it's about, oh, hey, this was tough for me, but man, I'm glad I went through it because now I'm a better person. Like that's a good for me.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Exactly. Yeah. Focusing on the lesson, focusing on the takeaway is amazing.

[Connell Barrett]

And then what I think is cool about that, not in a manipulative way, but just in a way of human connection is, is just kind of letting this person showing, not telling this person, but showing this person that, hey, that's who I was then. And look at this awesome guy you see before you now. Not me, Connell. I mean, whoever's listening to this, yeah, I made mistakes. I'm human, I'm flawed, but I've learned from them and here I am. We're all just trying to do our best and I think that kind of vulnerability can be very attractive compared to the guy who's like trying to use cool lines and nagging and acting all cool and bored and that just never worked for me. Plus, it just felt gross.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Exactly. Yeah. No, I think that's great. And like vulnerability shows maturity and shows that like, you are ready to find that connection.

[Connell Barrett]

You had a great conversation with Jordana Abraham about vulnerability on your podcast a while back, and she said something, she had this great quote that I wanted to ask you about. She said she was talking about. You were talking about flirting or just about romantic connection versus not versus disconnecting. And she said, I'm paraphrasing now. I think she said logic is the opposite of romance. And I believe you were talking about relationships, but when she said that, I thought, oh my gosh, so many men go out on first dates and they speak very logically about facts. Figures. This is my IT job. These here are some dates and information. And the conversation might flow, quote unquote, but there's not like the romance, the fun, the emotion tied to it. Again, as a formerly Single woman, What's your take on the idea of being too logical and informational versus more romantic, more, you know, emotionally connected in the way you communicate on a date?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

I think most men lean towards too logical. And I forgot where I was when I learned this, but, oh, yeah, I remember I was in some sort of, like, we work seminar a long time ago, and we were being taught about listening and how men listen and how women listen. And it was like, men usually listen to fix the problem, whereas men. Sorry. Whereas women listen to, like, be empathetic towards the problem and, like, hear you and.

[Connell Barrett]

Right.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

You know, commiserate or whatnot. And that kind of relates to dating. It's like, men lean towards, like, what makes sense of this, and women tend to lean towards, like, what am I feeling about this? And I think that both men and women need to take a page from the other person's book. And so men, I think, need to stop being as logical when it comes to dating. And I actually just had a situation like this. I do like this. Ask me anything on Fridays on my Instagram. And someone had asked me how. Stephen, how my husband knew I was the one and when, and I asked him to answer for me. I was like, send me, like, a little blurb of, you know, how you knew I was one, and I will share it. And I'm actually going to pull it up because he. He was so logical in his first answer that I was like. I was, like, cringing from it. I was like, you need to try again. Right? His first answer was. I wouldn't say. It hit me in a single moment. It was more of a series of moments together over a period of time. With each stage of our relationship, my affection for you grew to a place where I loved you an insane amount. And I knew I'd found a partner with whom I could squeeze the most out of life. Maybe it was a weird combination of adoration and optimism that was something I hadn't felt. Slash, how I knew. I was like, listen, that is so sweet, but there is, like, no, that's so robotic. I was like, there's no, like, emotion in there. Try again.

[Connell Barrett]

Try again, honey.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

And he did it again. And he said, and this is so much better, but I'm curious what you think he said. I was just crazy about you. You were everything I wanted in a partner. There were ups and downs, but the highs were insane and always worth it. I wanted to experience that as long as I could. Like, how much better is that? When he leaned into his emotions versus, like, typing out Some sort of. First we moved in together, then I felt it was the next step. You know what I mean?

[Connell Barrett]

Right. It had more feeling, had more soul.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Totally.

[Connell Barrett]

And I tell men, look, you don't need to worry about the information, the logic. There'll be plenty of facts and figures in what you say. Try to tap in more into that more soulful expression.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yes.

[Connell Barrett]

And there's little, little quick tips to do that. You can just start sentences. These are what my coaches taught me 10 plus years ago. Because I'm so analytical. I will go down the deepest analytical, logical rabbit hole with you if you want, but I know that's just not going to help my dating life or my love life. So just things like starting off sentences by saying, I feel. Here's how I feel about that, or playing. There's an improv game I love called Love Hate, where you have to really love things or really hate things. And it, it's helped a lot of my clients just say, oh my God, I love that you're into Coldplay. I love that you went to Harvard. How'd that feel when you went to Harvard? What you, your favorite movie is, I don't know, Casablanca. I hate that movie. Whatever it is, at least you're injecting some emotion. You're creating some energy that can create some kind of polarity as opposed to two people talking about logical things, which is the opposite of romance, as Jordana said, which I really liked.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Totally.

[Connell Barrett]

I can't let you go without talking about texting. I hear. So the guy listening to this is like, what do I text? What's the, what's the secret? What do women want from texting? Yeah, what do you got? Got any tips, any guidelines, do's and don'ts about how to text in that courtship dating phase of getting to know somebody?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Well, I think that you need, if you, if you intend to continue seeing someone and ultimately date them, you need to be texting consistently. You need to text at least once a day. And you need to be, as the man in the situation, initiating most of those texts. And if, like, you shouldn't be afraid to do that. If you're getting a good response every time, it's very much like just setting the pace for the relationship and you're courting this person. And so you should be sending those texts. You should buy this. You know, whatever stage you're dating, you should have, like, good banter with one another, inside jokes. You should not ask for nudes. I think that's a given.

[Connell Barrett]

Okay.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Don't send any Unsolicited pictures, but being, you know, switching up the conversation, sending, like, different things, like a meme or a funny TikTok or, you know, asking her about her day, following up when she says she has a big presentation the next day. How did the presentation go? You know, thoughtful texts that really show that you care and make her smile and make her day, but not too much like, good morning, beautiful. Good night, angel. You know, it doesn't need to be so like that as much as it's just like bringing that fun conversation into her day.

[Connell Barrett]

Just when you said that, I got chills.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yeah.

[Connell Barrett]

Did the hair on your hairy legs stand up when you said that?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Standing.

[Connell Barrett]

Hey. Hey, Angel. Oh, I once had a client who, by the way, this is years ago. He's now a proud dad with his new partner. And I like to think that I helped that baby come into the world. But after one date with a woman, he sent me this long poem. He was gonna send her, like a love poem about the two of them in a boat, on a pond, and, like, leaves. And I was like, do not send that message, sir.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Never. Never. It's so funny because it's never a good idea to send, like, some long winded paragraph to anyone you're seeing ever. It's just never a good idea. Like, you save that stuff for in person, always. And that's another texting tip. It's like, keep it fun, keep it light. Like if you have to call them out for something or if you want to have like a baby, my girlfriend conversation or I like you type of thing. Like, do it in person. Always in person.

[Connell Barrett]

Yeah. And when in doubt, do something in person. If you can. If you can.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Definitely.

[Connell Barrett]

Okay, so I have a little game I want to play. So one of my favorite things to do in dating was have a couple fun games on a date. And I've been doing this on the pod. So because you're obviously a woman and dating expert, I thought we play a little game called what women want and what Women don't want. Since you can obviously speak for women, I think pretty damn well. So I'm going to name a dating category and if you would just share with us. Oh, here's what women want. Here's what they don't want. Cool. Is that cool?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yeah. Love it. Okay, let's do it.

[Connell Barrett]

Topic number one or category one is first date topics. What do women want to talk about? What do they not want to talk about?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

They want to talk about who you are and who you were and who you plan to be. In the future.

[Connell Barrett]

Ooh, that's great.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

And they don't want to talk about why your ex is a bitch and how much money your car costs.

[Connell Barrett]

Why? I know. I think I know the answer.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

And like drugs. That you do.

[Connell Barrett]

Oh, shoot. No wonder I had so much trouble. Actually, back to an earlier topic, first date horror stories. A woman I was on a first date with, I asked her that question. What's your worst first date ever? She said, well, a guy once had his cocaine dealer who showed up on the date and gave him a delivery.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

I've heard that story, like, happen to someone else. Maybe it's the same guy.

[Connell Barrett]

He must be out there.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Okay.

[Connell Barrett]

I loved your answer there because you said, tell her not just who you were and are, but also who you are becoming, who you're going to be. Can you elaborate on that? Because that was really interesting.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yeah, I think it's like the modern answer to, like, the, where do you see yourself in five years? Like, you should have a grip on that and be able to share that comfortably. Like, what your plans are in the next five years without somebody straight up asking, what is your plan in the next five years?

[Connell Barrett]

Got it. Because ambition, a vision, a goal. That's attractive, right?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

So attractive.

[Connell Barrett]

Right. As opposed to, well, I don't know. Who knows what will happen?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yeah, I don't know. I hate being a lawyer.

[Connell Barrett]

Okay, next category is. Let's say when a man approaches a woman at a bar, what do women want? What do women not want?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Women want something funny. Women always want to laugh. So leading with something that's gonna make her laugh is so crucial. And women don't want the, hey, beautiful. Hey, sexy. Like, it's just. It's too. It sounds, like, sleazy. Even if that's not your intention, you know?

[Connell Barrett]

So open with something funny. Do you have any memories, any examples, anecdotes from even.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Even just a simple. Like, how does it feel to be the most. Like, the most beautiful person here? Like, that's funnier than, hey, beautiful, nice. Like, I. Or like, I feel bad for all these other girls because you're here, you know?

[Connell Barrett]

Yeah.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

What should we do about it?

[Connell Barrett]

One of the funniest approaches I ever did. I was at a club in Vegas years ago, and I saw this woman who I ended up becoming and entering a relationship, and all these guys were hitting on her with the whole, hey, you're hot, you're gorgeous, you're. What have you. And I'd been taking improv classes, so I was learning the art of just being a silly Character. And I unbuttoned my black button down, halfway down, and I just opened up my shirt and I walked over to her, and I said, hello. And I adopted, like, a fake Latin lover accent, and I said, hello, I am Armando. And a skinny, pale, ginger like me saying that it was just so dumb that she found it really funny. And she. She called me Armando for the whole weekend. It was, yeah, that's really funny. Yeah. I think leading with humor and playfulness is better than being all sexy.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Always lean into the silly.

[Connell Barrett]

Yeah, Good example. One more. One more category. A man's dating app profile. From the woman's perspective, what do women want to see that might make them want to swipe? Right? And what do they not want to see?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Women want to see, like, one tiny tidbit of vulnerability. If that's like, I'm in therapy or, like, kind of making something about your life into a funny prompt. And women don't want to see gym selfies. Selfies in general.

[Connell Barrett]

Yeah.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

And, like, pictures of you holding up fish.

[Connell Barrett]

What is it about that?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Men just think that, like, if they show a picture of them having caught a fish, then they're like, I'm a man. So you can trust that I'm a man now because I can catch a fish. And now you can swipe right.

[Connell Barrett]

Right. The working title for my book was it's not you, it's the halibut you're holding. And it ended up being a throwaway line in the online dating chapter. Yeah, I don't. I don't know. I guess I. Yeah, that's why men do it, because they want to show, oh, I'm a provider. Look what I did. I can bring home. Instead of the bacon, I can bring home the mackerel.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Exactly. And by the way, going back to what women do want to see again, always humor. Always humor. Like, if I'm cracking up from your dating app profile, I'm saying yes, no matter what you look like.

[Connell Barrett]

Okay. Do you remember any lines or just themes that made you laugh in the past? Things.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

There was a line once recently, it was very simple. I saw on a guy's dating profile that I was helping a girl with, and it said, believe it or not, I. Which is like a hinge prompt.

[Connell Barrett]

Okay.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Said believe it or not. I took an Uber recently that was less than $50, and I just. It was just like a funny little nice. And then there was another guy who recently had something. He said, all I ask is that you was the prompt. And he said, support Ben and Jen. Like, Ben Affleck and Jennifer Lopez. And I just thought it was silly. Like, I like when guys aren't afraid to lean into, like, a pop culture reference.

[Connell Barrett]

Nice. Yeah, I like pop culture references. I remember I kind of fell a little bit in love once with a woman's profile on a dating app. I'd never even met her. I just love. We just matched and I instantly wanted to meet her or at least go on a date with her and see what happened. She wrote something like, I'm looking for a man on the street, but a dad bod in the sheets. And I love that. I think that's an allusion to a rap song. Jay Z, I don't know. I think it was a. I think it's a rap song, but it was just a funny little rhyme and it just. It just made my soul smile.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

So that's great. I love that.

[Connell Barrett]

All right, let's wrap up with. Usually I ask a guest for what I. What we call the three game changing dating tips, but let's make it four today. Since your Instagram, you give a lot of fours if you.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

I love that. I love that personalization.

[Connell Barrett]

Yes. Let's make it very Lindsay Personalized 4 Game changing dating tips for the man who's listening to this. Anything you want. Anything. Fire away.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yes. Okay. Number one is follow the rules, meaning we met at Acme, has a set of rules for men to follow and for women to follow. Without getting too into them, I would say just like, pay for the date. If you asked her on the date, be a gentleman, Open doors. You don't ask to go up or invite her over after the first date. You know, all of those kinds of things. Follow those rules, get her flowers. And I would say number two, always have the next date set up. Women hate when we're in this sort of limbo where we're like, when are we going to see them again? And, like, are we just going to be, you know, pen pals now or are they going to ask me out on that other next date? Right. Even if they're not free for a week, I still want to have that next date planned. Number three is initiate all of the things. All of the things. And don't be afraid to initiate the I love you. Initiate the let's move in together and initiate the will you be my wife if that comes up? You know, initiate all the things. Don't make her feel like she has to corner you to have these conversations. And number four, which I didn't know we were going to have a number four so give me a second. Number four. I would say don't be afraid to be persistent, which we talked about a little bit, but don't be afraid to be persistent because we're all going to get rejected in life. And it's like, if you don't ask, you won't get. And so you never know what's going on in a person's life. Be persistent. If you. Really, really. Especially for men. I feel like men just are luckier in this instance where, like, they can get away with it. So, yeah, get away with it. Be persistent. And until you're creeping in on stalker territory, just be persistent.

[Connell Barrett]

It's okay. As long as she's responsive.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Yeah.

[Connell Barrett]

And. Or if she says, hey, thanks, but no thanks, I'm not interested, obviously. Move on. The guy who's listening to this, he's very afraid of being seen as creepy or coming across as some kind of weirdo, which is it's coming from a beautiful place of not wanting to be a jerk.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Right.

[Connell Barrett]

But your message seems to be, hey, it's okay to be a man who's going after what he wants with persistence. As long as there's empathy. As long as you're noticing how she feels and then, oh, yeah, play it as it comes. Right?

[Lindsay Metzilar]

And I have to tell you, for the persistent guy, when you stop being persistent, she'll miss that. She will. I know she will, because my friend missed it and now they're married with two kids.

[Connell Barrett]

Nice. Nice. Yeah, I've had years ago, but I had a date from many moons ago who I asked her out a couple of times and she finally said, okay, yeah, I'm free on Friday. I just wanted to see how persistent you are. Happy face, winky face.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

I love that.

[Connell Barrett]

Yeah, persistence, I like to say persistence combined with empathy, with noticing how she's feeling and either way. So you're never going to be a creep as long as you're noticing how you're making a woman feel and you adjust accordingly.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Totally be persistent and self aware.

[Connell Barrett]

Those. That's a really good place to end the advice portion of today. Let's finish by you telling us a little bit about some live shows and events you have coming up in the end of September or in September and also November. Tell us about. We met at Acme Events, please.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Thank you. So we do these live events, some of which are mixers in New York City where, you know, men and women living in New York could meet each other, which are really fun. And we do these live shows as well. We have one in LA SF and Austin. So if you're in any of those places and all of that can be found on our website, we metacme.com fantastic.

[Connell Barrett]

I tried to stump you, Lindsey. Couldn't do it. You had an answer for everything. I'm going to retire the hairy leg pickup line that I started.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

I honestly dare someone to try it. I would just love to hear how that goes.

[Connell Barrett]

Thank you so much for coming on today. It was a blast. And I hope to have you back sometime down the road and see you at one of your events.

[Lindsay Metzilar]

Would love to and would love that. Thank you so much.

[Connell Barrett]

All right. Peace out. Later, guys.