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I Don't Have Enough FAITH to Be an ATHEIST
The Uncomfortable Truth Every Christian Needs to Know About Islam with Pastor Martin Sedra
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- [00:03]
A
Ladies and gentlemen, we brought the blowtorch of truth in the previous podcast with my friend Martin Cedra, all the way from down under in Australia. We're talking about Islam, and we're going to continue our conversation here today. We're going to talk about Hamas, we're going to talk about the Hamas charter, we're going to talk about Israel, we're going to talk about Iran, where what should we think about all this? But we're going to start with evangelizing Muslims, because we love Muslims. We want them to know the truth, and Martin is an expert in this. For those of you who didn't listen to the first podcast, you got to go back and listen to the first one, because Martin tells his story of growing up in, for at least a period of time anyway, in Egypt, where his family was almost murdered by the Muslim Brotherhood and they escaped to Australia now where he has a ministry, and he also comes to the United States quite a bit. So here he is again, ladies and gentlemen, the great Martin Sedra, all the way from down Under. Martin, we got to talk about evangelizing Muslims, if we can. What's your strategy when you're talking to a Muslim?
- [01:16]
B
Yeah, this is the good news, is that God is moving all across the Middle East. I want to tell everybody, God is saving millions of Muslims. And every single year, I mean, In Iran in 2023, a report came out that 50,000 mosques had shut down because Muslims are not going anymore. In Indonesia, hundreds of thousands of Muslims come to Christ every year. I was just preaching in Indonesia, and as I'm preaching, there are women in hijabs repenting of Islam and turning to Christ. In Gaza, 2023, a report came out that 200 Gazans saw visions of Jesus the same night. God is moving in the Middle East. So I want to tell people, man, although we are fighting God to get rid of Islam from America, God is saving them in the Middle East. And this is the key to evangelizing to Muslims. From a macro perspective, we don't want to bring Muslims to America to save them. We want to go to them. That is a Great Commission. The Great Commission is going to the world, not bring the world here. We got to go to them in the Middle East. We got to go to them in Afghanistan, Iraq, Egypt, and save them there. Bringing them here is committing suicide. And then the other thing is, now how do we evangelize to the Muslims that. That are in our world? Everybody has Muslims in the world, colleagues or friends or neighbors. And the truth is, God wants to Save them and you have the gospel, you have the good news and the way I do it, you know obviously there's a Quranic dilemma. There's all these things you can do. But I really try to more talk about the beauty and the character of Jesus Christ. When you compare Jesus versus Muhammad, there is no comparison. I will always follow Jesus. I mean just compare Jesus versus Muhammad. Muhammad had 11 wives and sex slaves. Jesus honored woman and was pure. Muhammad had a six year old wife and slept when she was nine. Jesus honored children and protected them. Muhammad had sex slaves. Jesus says, love your neighbor. Muhammad allowed husbands to beat their wives up. Jesus in the word of God, he says, you know husbands, love your wives. Muhammad says, kill the infidel. Jesus says, love your enemies. Muhammad before he died said, may Allah curse the Jews and the Christians. Jesus said, father forgive them. So just show them the beauty of Jesus Christ and the depravity of Muhammad. All of a sudden like wow, I didn't know that my prophet Muhammad actually did that. Most Muslims by the way don't know that Muhammad married a six year old. Most Muslims don't know that the Quran tells them to kill the infidel. So just by you knowing what their Prophet did and said, you are already opening their eyes and opening the way for the gospel to come in. And lastly Frank, you know one of the things that fascinates me about Islam is that no Muslim is sure of their salvation. I mean in Islam they go the mosque, they go to Mecca pilgrimage, they pray five times a day, they bow the right direction, they fast during Ramadan for 30 days and all this, they do it to try to earn good deeds and try to earn their way to salvation. The truth is you ask any Muslim, are you sure you're going to heaven? They'll say, I'm not sure. But there is one way in Islam where they can be sure that they go to heaven. And there's a verse in the Quran and it says this, it says the martyr is granted forgiveness at the first drop of his blood. This is in the Quran, it says a martyr is granted forgiveness at the first drop of his blood. Muhammad is literally saying the moment your blood touches the ground you can be sure of your salvation. And this is really my way of evangelizing to them. I tell them, your Prophet and your Allah asks you to shed your blood. My Jesus shed his blood for you. Your God asks you to die for him, but my God died for you. Your God tells you die so you can be saved. My God died so you can be Saved. And this really usually shocks the Muslims when you tell them that God became man and died for you. This shocked them. So really telling them the gospel, that he who knew no sin became sin, that you might become not earn righteousness but become the righteousness of God, this usually is a good segue into evangelizing to the Muslims.
- [05:11]
A
Yes. And Islam, your son dies for God and Christianity, God's son dies for you.
- [05:18]
B
Yeah.
- [05:19]
A
In your experience, when you're talking to Muslims about issues like this, Martin, are they in any way moved by the immoral character of Muhammad toward the moral character of Jesus or does that really just upset them? If you come out and say, look, you're, you know, Muhammad was marrying, he was basically a pedophile. I mean, he's marrying six year olds and consummating the marriage at nine. I mean, do they go, oh, I see your pointer. They go, don't talk about the Prophet that way. I mean, how does it go?
- [05:48]
B
Typically, majority of Muslims, when you talk about Muhammad in a way where you say he married a 6 year old and you know, he had wives and 11 wives and sex slaves, most of them get angry at you because really they worship Muhammad. I don't actually believe they worship Allah. In fact, Charles Spurgeon didn't even call them Muslims. He called them Muhammadans because he believed they were followers of Muhammad, not even Allah. So it does touch, you know, it does touch them in the wrong spot sometimes if they idolize Muhammad. But there are a few Muslims, when you tell them this, they're like, really? I didn't know that. If it is an honest Muslim, if you are talking to a Muslim who is genuinely searching for truth, they genuinely humble, they genuinely want to know if who is the true God. That usually will make them begin searching in the Quran. I had a Muslim girl in our church a few weeks ago come to our church and she said to me, I'm a Christian now. I said to her, why? She said, when I found out that my Prophet married a six year old, I couldn't follow him anymore. So if there are true Muslims, if they're sorry, honest Muslims, they will leave Islam when they find out the morality of Muhammad.
- [06:48]
A
You know Jay Smith, I don't know if you're familiar with Jay, but Jay Smith has been ministering to Muslims for years. He was in London for 25 years speaking at Speaker's Corner. So many times he's been stabbed, he's been spit on, he's been beaten, but he keeps coming back. And he said he used the tactic for many years of talking about the immoral aspects of Muhammad and he said he didn't get very far with people. Now he's taking a more historical approach, talking about how the historical evidence for what he calls the three legged stool of Islam is very weak. Muhammad, Mecca and the Quran. In fact, ladies and gentlemen, we had two very well watched shows with Jay back last July. We'll put them in the show notes. Those were eye opening shows. What is your view of the historical evidence for the Quran, for Muhammad, for Mecca? Martin?
- [07:46]
B
Yeah, there is really no strong evidence for Muhammad, Mecca, all these things, you know, but really Muhammad was a plagiarizer. Like when you really read the Quran, Muhammad plagiarized the Torah. He plagiarized a bunch of stories from the New Testament and he also plagiarized from paganism. He took a bunch of stories from every religion around him. Remember Muhammad couldn't read or write, he was illiterate and he just stole a bunch of stories from different people and plagiarized it. So I have heard the argument of maybe he didn't even exist and Mecca doesn't even exist. But I don't, I've never really tried that with the Muslims. I would be, I'll be curious to see if that would work but I don't think I can convince Muslims that Muhammad didn't exist. But maybe I can convince him that he wasn't a good man as much as they think he was.
- [08:34]
A
Yeah, no, I don't think you have to go all the way to the point that Muhammad didn't exist, but to the point showing that the evidence for the Quran is extremely weak. The manuscript evidence and even the life of Muhammad. I mean the Hadith as you know are 200 years after Muhammad. What the Hadith, ladies and gentlemen, what Muhammad allegedly said and did. There are other writings in addition to the Quran and the Quran has very weak manuscript evidence as well. So just from an historical perspective the evidence for Islam is extremely weak and it is to a certain extent a Christian heresy. It's really Arianism, it's reducing Jesus to none. Godhead like Arian Arius wanted to do back that the Council of Nicaea finally resolved. As John of Damascus in 732 basically said, it's basically Arianism on steroids. That's what Islam is. It's making God just monotheistic. There's no trinity, Jesus wasn't God. And the evidence for Muhammad that Mecca was actually a city in the 7th century and the Quran is extremely, extremely weak. But with regard to dreams and visions. I hear a lot about that coming out of the Islamic world. Have you had any experience with that, Martin? Have you heard about people that have had dreams of Jesus and have come to Jesus?
- [10:00]
B
Yes, yes. And I think the reason God meets a lot of Muslims through visions and dreams is a lot of them are so hard hearted and they don't want to listen. I mean, as we said before when you mentioned Muhammad, a lot of them, they're Muhammadans, they worship Muhammad, that they straightaway shut themselves to you. So I guess one of the only ways God can really encounter them is through visions and dreams, signs and wonders. And that's why you know that in the previous podcast, everybody listening needs to go back and watch it. Because I share how the Muslim Brotherhood leader, one of the leaders, wanted to kill my brothers and behead them. And the only way he was able to be saved and turn to Jesus is, is when he had a supernatural encounter with God where as he went to kidnap my brothers to behead them, he felt an angel tie his hands behind his head. And I really wonder, I don't think he would have become a Christian if he didn't have that supernatural encounter. So I really believe that God is meeting Muslims all over the Middle east through visions and dreams. As I said in Gaza, 200 Muslims were recorded in 2023 to see visions of Jesus Christ. So I am praying for that all over the Middle east, in Iran and Egypt, that God will continue to meet the Muslims through visions, dreams, signs and wonders.
- [11:08]
A
Ladies and gentlemen, the object objection always comes up. Okay, I hear of these accounts. Why doesn't God do that to everyone? Or why doesn't God save everybody that is maybe about to be killed by a Muslim? And of course the answer is God is not a formula. He's a person. Or let me say he's personal. He's not just a person like us. He's personal. He has reasons for doing what he does when he does it. And he also has reasons for not doing what he does when he doesn't do it. He's not a formula. You don't just put in like a program and get out exactly what you want. Sometimes he saves people from this, sometimes he doesn't. But because he doesn't, doesn't mean there isn't evidence that sometimes he does. Right, because he doesn't on some occasions. Doesn't mean there isn't evidence that sometimes he does. So God has his reasons. Why didn't God prevent the murder of my friend Charlie Kirk? I don't know, but I know why I don't know. I'm inside of time. God's outside of time. He knows the end from the beginning. He knows where all this is going. He knows all the ripple effects. And the story doesn't end at the grave, it goes on into eternity. So God has his reasons. And there is very good evidence that God is intervening at certain times with certain people in certain situations. And that's up to him when he does. Talk a little bit if you would, Martin, and we'll, we'll put a link to it in the show notes because this is such a very excellent way to talk to Muslims to get them to doubt what the Quran says. Talk a little bit, if you would, about the Islamic dilemma. As I say, we'll put a video in the show notes that goes further. But this shows people who are Muslims that they got a problem. Talk a little bit about the Islamic dilemma, if you would.
- [12:51]
B
Yeah. The Islamic dilemma or the Quranic dilemma is this is that Muslims always say that the Bible is corrupt. They say you can't trust your Bible. But this is a, creates a huge dilemma for the Muslims because the Quran affirms the Torah, the Quran affirms the people of the book, the Bible, the Christians, the Torah. And this is the thing. If the Bible is false, if the Bible is corrupt, as Muslims say, then that makes the Quran false because the Quran affirms the Bible, the Quran says that the Muslims should go to the people of the book and listen to them. And now the other thing, if the Bible is not corrupt and is actually right and it is the word of God and Muslims should actually listen to it, that also means the Quran is false. And that's where the Quranic dilemma comes in. If the Bible is false, the Quran is false. And if the Bible is true, the Quran is still false. So either way, Muslims are really stuck in a corner on that one. And, and most Muslims can't really answer you on what the Quran, how to deal with the Quranic dilemma.
- [13:54]
A
Yeah, you only need to remember two verses from the Quran to do this, ladies and gentlemen. One is Surah 5. 68, where it says, oh, you people of the book, you have no ground to stand on unless you stand on the law and the Gospels and all the revelation given to you by your Lord. In other words, it's telling the Jews and the Christians that you ought to believe what the Old Testament and the New Testament says. Then the problem is if you go one chapter earlier into chapter four of the Quran, Surah 4, 157, it says that Jesus was, was not crucified. So of course he couldn't have risen from the dead. So on one hand in chapter five, it says obey the Bible. On the other hand, in chapter four, it contradicts the Bible. That's why it's a dilemma, because the Quran is saying obey the Bible, but at the same time, the Quran is contradicting the Bible, which means the Quran. Either way, regardless of whether the Bible's true or false, the Quran is false.
- [14:49]
B
Exactly. And one of the dumbest mistakes that Muhammad did was to say that Jesus didn't die on the cross. That was a dumb move from him because every historian claims that there was a man by the name of Jesus who did die under Pontius Pilate. The Romans were experts at killing. And if the, if the person you were killing escaped in Roman time and it was life for life. So for Muhammad to say that, you know, Jesus escaped and Allah saved him and, you know, he didn't really die, that was just a dumb move because there are too many, there's too many writings about a man by the name of Jesus who died and over 500 eyewitnesses who saw Jesus after his death. So from a historical perspective, Islam is just a false religion. You cannot trust a man who came 600 years after Jesus Christ who tells you actually he didn't die. I mean, imagine me and you see a fight and we write about this fight, and then someone comes 600 years later and tells you actually what you wrote about that fight was wrong. I'm the right one. I mean, Muhammad was born in a different country, spoke a different language to Jesus, never saw Jesus. And he claims to know more than the disciples who were eyewitnesses to the crucifixion and resurrection.
- [15:57]
A
You know, the Great Muslim apologist DDOT, in a debate with Josh McDowell Probably 50 years ago, when Josh McDowell brought this point up that in fact Islam is 600 years too late, the Quran is 600 years too late to tell us what happened to Jesus. D dot actually said the logic of the Christians is good. He actually said that. He admitted it. But then he went on to try and say the Quran is true. I mean, yeah, crazy talk about cognitive dissonance, right?
- [16:28]
B
Yeah.
- [16:29]
A
So talk about if you would, before we move on to Hamas and Iran and all this.
- [16:34]
B
Yeah.
- [16:35]
A
When I just have an opportunity with a Muslim. I did this in Saudi Arabia, I did this in Israel. I did this in Egypt. When I was there back in October, I asked certain Muslims the Islamic dilemma question. Have a Question about the Quran, you know, why does it say to obey the Bible at the same time it disagrees with the Bible and they were all befuddled by it. So that's kind of my way in to talk about these issues. And by the way, isn't it true, Martin, that unlike maybe people here in America who are not Muslim, they may be cultural Christians? Cultural Christians and people in America don't really like to talk about religion. It's kind of awkward. But if you go to the Middle east, you talk about religion, it's just fine. Correct?
- [17:13]
B
Yeah, 100%. In the middle east, everyone has a religion. Everybody believes in a God. If you're atheist, you're stupid.
- [17:20]
A
Yeah. So it's okay to bring this up and not be awkward. I start with the Islamic dilemma. What question might you ask somebody who's a Muslim at least to get the conversation started to help our audience? What might you ask?
- [17:33]
B
Man, I think I'm a bit harsh. I'm Egyptian, so I go straight for the tough one. It's probably not the. I'm probably not the best example to listen to, but, man, I like to just talk about the life of Muhammad. I really question him. Are you really okay with your prophet marrying a six year old? Look, sometimes I ignite a fire and it just. They just run away. And I'm like, look, I'm sorry, sometimes it works. But man, for me, they're just shocking. I can't believe that Muslims follow a prophet who was a pedophile. I can't believe that Muslims follow a prophet who married 11 women. I can't believe that Muslims follow a prophet who had sex slaves and told people to kill the infidel. That is just fascinating to me. And what I find fascinating, Frank, is that Muslims are so proud of their pedophile prophet. They're so proud of their prophet who says, kill the infidel. They're so proud of the prophet who never performed miracles, by the way, even according to the Quran. But here we have Christians in America who are ashamed of Jesus Christ when we have the best example in the history of the world, the most perfect man to ever walk the earth, the guy who healed the sick, raised the dead, who lived perfect, didn't get married, didn't sleep with anybody, lived a perfect life, yet we are ashamed. So I like to go in and I just. I'm just proud of my Jesus. I tell them about my God, I tell them how proud I am of him about his life. And hopefully that kind of opens the door.
- [18:54]
A
All right. Yeah. And they, they don't understand. And not just Muslims, just about every other world religion, even 41% of evangelicals don't understand this. And that is the concept of grace, that you're not saved by what you do, you're saved by what he did. Yeah, I would assume that would be very attractive to a group that feels in bondage to law that they really can't keep.
- [19:17]
B
Yeah. And one of the most attractive things for Muslims is that they are promised 72 virgins in heaven if they die for Allah. This is what fascinates me, Frank. Muhammad promises, if you die as a martyr for Allah, you will be blessed with 72 versions. In fact, about a thousand years ago, at the end of the Crusades, the Muslim imams used to get young teenage men and young adult men and women and they used to drug them. Can you believe they used to drug these men? They used to make them hallucinate until they're fully drugged. Then they would put these men in gardens, huge gardens filled with prostitutes. This is a real story. Filled a garden with prostitutes. The man is now drugged. He doesn't know what's going on. The man would go in and sleep with these prostitutes. And after the man would get out and lose, you know, his drug and now he's, you know, sound mind. The Muslim imam would tell him that was a taste of heaven. Do you want more of it? And a young man would say, yeah, we want more of it. And he will tell them, now go die for Allah. And that's how, by the way, you had a bunch of men, you know, during the Crusades, a bunch of Muslim men, until to this day, a bunch of young Muslim men. We had it here in Bondi. A 24 year old go out and shoot some Jews. Why? They are promised 72 virgins. Heaven. Islam is a sexually perverted religion. Islam is a religion made by man for man. In Christianity, we are promised the presence of God in heaven. Jesus said to the criminal on the cross, today, you'll be with me in paradise. Islam, they're not going to heaven because they want to be with God. They go to heaven because they want to be with 72 versions. This is a sexually perverted religion. And that's how you know, by the way, it's a religion made by a man. Because if a man makes up a religion, he will give you everything that your flesh desires. Muhammad knew that men want girls, gold and glory. So what does he promise him? Girls, gold and glory. If you follow Muhammad, you're going to get girls. 72 virgins in heaven, you can have sex slaves. You're going to get gold if you go and plunder a nation. The gold is yours and you're going to get glory pride in killing the men and the pastors and the churches of the town. What does Jesus do? He he tells you to deny yourself. That's how you know Christianity cannot be a man made religion because a man with common sense would not tell you to deny your flesh, but will tell you to go with your flesh. So Islam is a sexually perverted religion. They're waiting for 72 virgins. We're waiting for the presence of Jesus Christ, Martin.
- [21:47]
A
It's obviously man made because no woman would say, when you go to heaven, you're going to get 72 virgin men. That would be a punishment, right?
- [21:57]
B
Yeah, exactly.
- [22:00]
A
What do women get? What do women get when they go?
- [22:03]
B
What happens? Women are the most oppressed in Islam. Everything about Islam is for the sexual perversion of the man. You get 72 virgins in heaven, men get 72 virgins in heaven. Men can have four wives on earth, Men can have sex slaves as long as they're not Muslim on earth. That is true according to the Quran and Hadith. Islam is a religion that made by men for men. If you're a woman, Islam is not for you. In Islam, if you're a woman, your word is half of a man. If you're a woman in Islam, your husband can divorce you simply by saying the word divorce three times. If you're a woman in Islam, your husband can beat you up. Quran, 4:34. Muhammad says, if your wife disobeys you, first warn her, second, send her to the couch. Thirdly, beat her up. If you're a woman in Islam, you, your husband can have up to three more wives, four wives total, without even telling you a word. This is Islam is not a religion for women. And you know, Frank, somebody asked, someone asked a Muslim imam, hey, I know the Muslim woman need to wear a hijab to cover themselves and be modest. What do the men do to be modest? I mean like, women get tempted too. And the Muslim imam said, women wear a literal hijab to cover themselves, but men wear a mental hijab. We wear a mental hijab. I'm like, mental hijab? What are you talking about? This is a sexually perverted religion made by men for men. And you know, Frank, in Afghanistan, in Afghanistan, Muslim women were wearing hijabs. You know, everybody, the Muslim women wear hijabs. And the reason women wear hijabs in Islam is because they don't want to tempt the man. But in 2020, they pass laws that Muslim women don't just wear hijabs. Now they need to cover their whole face. Now you got a step two where they're not just covering their head, they're covering their full face. There's a net on their eyes. Why the Muslim men get tempted. So now their whole body is covered, their eyes are covered, their hands are covered, and guess what? You think the Muslim men in Afghanistan now are not getting tempted. In 2023, the Muslim men in Afghanistan went to the Taliban and told them, we're still getting tempted by the woman. How are they tempting you? I kid you not, the Muslim men said the women are tempting us by their voice. So in 2023, the Taliban passed laws that Muslim women in Afghanistan, they can't speak in public, they can't sing in public, and they can't laugh in public. Why the Muslim men get tempted. That's what you call animalistic culture, where the dog can't control himself. But in Christianity, we actually believe in self control. That God said, if your eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out. So Muslims need to listen to Jesus and stop listening to Muhammad.
- [24:49]
A
It is a serious question, however, because I know on occasion there is a woman suicide bomber. What is she thinking she's going to get in the afterlife?
- [25:00]
B
This is. She's just trying to secure her way into heaven. She's not getting virgins. The Quran explains. So the heaven for men and women is different. Heaven for men is described in the Quran as a massive pavilion filled with prostitutes. Heaven is described for men, a massive pavilion from the east to the west, a huge town filled with women virgins with huge breasts. By the way, the hadith is very pornographic when it comes to describing women. It's very, very pornographic. And the Quran and the Hadith, it describes the woman that when you have sex with them, they'll come back as virgins. So you can keep having sex with them. And they kind of come back with virgins for the woman. Though when you ask them, hey, what's heaven for the Muslims, they just say, it's what no eye has seen and what no ear has heard. It's like, wait, I've heard that number one in the Bible before you plagiarize the Bible. That's what the Bible says. No, I have seen, no way has heard. No man can conceive what God has in store for those who love him. But Muslim women just don't know what's in heaven. For them, is it going to be men? Is it going to be just. Are they going to be the virgins in heaven that get to sleep with those men? I don't know. So it's really not a religion for women. It's a religion for sexually perverted men.
- [26:13]
A
Let's talk about Hamas, Israel, Iran for a minute. Before I do, I want to mention that the Cross Examine Instructor Academy is heading back to Charlotte, North Carolina. It's going to be July 30th through August 1st. In order for you to be a part of CIA, if you want to learn how to be a better apologist and how to better answer questions and be in session with people like Greg Kokel and Alan Parr and Lisa Childers and Natasha Crane and Hillary Morgan Ferrer and Dr. Richard Howe, myself and others, you need to go to cross examine.org click on on events. You'll see CIA there. You have to apply. It's not free, it's not cheap. Even though we subsidize this in order to make it happen, we still charge tuition because it costs quite a bit to bring everybody in and do all this. Yet we have people who have been to CIA six, seven, eight times because they get so much out of it. So go to cross examine.org click on events. You will see it there. Also, I'll be in Knoxville, Tennessee last weekend of May for the Colson center conference. Check all the details there. And then we will be doing on June 1st the final the Bible you never knew series are going to be talking about Esther. We're also going to be talking about all of the typology that we've been through over 13 sessions. So you're not going to want to miss that. That will be live streamed as well on the 1st of June, 7:30pm It'll be just north of Charlotte, North Carolina. Freedom House Church, Cornelius, North Carolina. Let me just start by talking about the if we're going to talk about Hamas in Israel, the Hamas charter. I wrote a book that's coming out in September, Martin. It's called the War on Reality, Recovering Truth in a World that celebrate Lies. I wrote it with my friend Phoenix Hayes, and it shocks me because I go to a lot of college campuses and even churches and I get questions about Israel, Hamas, and I always ask one question to start. Have you read the Hamas charter? Only one person out of dozens said yes. I'm just going to read a section from the War on Reality and then I want you to comment on it. This talks about the Hamas charter. We write this that there are people who are openly siding with Hamas, whose own charter openly calls for the annihilation of the Jews. The charter's introduction says, quote, israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it just as it obliterated others before. Unquote. Article 7 urges urges Muslims to kill Jews because, quote, the Day of Judgment will not come about until Muslims fight Jews and kill them. Unquote. Article 13 baldly states, quote, there is no solution for the Palestinian problem except by jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are but a waste of time and exercise in futility. Unquote. Then I write this again. I will present a translation. Hamas's goal is not peace, but the annihilation of Israel and the Jewish people. That's the very definition of genocide. So let me suggest that if people want to be informed or have an informed opinion on the conflict, instead of blindly parroting the claim that Israel is committing genocide, it would be wise to investigate the group that actually has genocide as their stated goal and appears to be committing it. The truth is that if Hamas laid down their weapons, there would be no more war. If Israel laid down their weapons, there would be no more Israel. Any comment on that?
- [29:56]
B
Yeah, this is the thing. Islam will never stop until they take over Israel. Islam will never stop until they take over Israel. They will not stop until they kill every single Jew. Islam hates the Jews with a passion. They hate them and they will continue to fight until they take over. And I got all my white liberals that are dumb and naive and foolish that keep shouting from the river to the sea, Palestine will be free. From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free. Do you know what river and what sea you're talking about by you saying that? You are saying let's get rid of all Israel collectively. Let's get rid of the Jews. Let's kill all. You are saying let's commit a genocide against all Jews. So you are dumb and you need to stop singing that. From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free. And I always tell Christians this, Frank, there is this new hatred rising. It's demonic. It's demonic hatred rising in Gen Z and Gen Alpha against Israel and the Jews and also in the church. This Jew hatred is a cancer that is rotting the church right now. You have a bunch of young people that hate the Jews. A bunch of young people following all these big false political commentators that claim to be Christians but hate Israel and hate the Jews and every Christian. You need to understand we don't idolize Israel. I'm not telling you don't ask questions. I'm not telling you follow them blindly. I'm not telling you support the government. But we don't idolize Israel, but we evangelize Israel. As Christians, we must love the Jewish people. Our heart must break for them and we must want them to be saved. As Paul says, I would give myself, I would give my salvation. Let me be a curse for my brothers to know Christ. So this Jew hatred needs to stop and we all need to unite to fight the real enemy, which is Islam, not Israel. The real enemy is not the Jews. The real enemy is the jihadis. As you said in the Hamas Shara, they want to get rid of of all of Israel and they are not signing a peace treaty. Just so everybody knows, for all these peace treaty stuff, Islam has never had peace treaties with anybody. The last time Muhammad had a peace treaty with a city, he signed a 12 year peace treaty because he didn't have enough power. After two years, when he had enough power, he went back and killed them. Islam did not sign peace treaties. They do not coexist. They are here to take over Israel completely.
- [32:25]
A
And see, that is also the problem with the Iran situation because President Trump keeps wanting to and by the time this airs, maybe there is a resolution, I don't know. But they keep trying to work out a deal with the mullahs. It doesn't seem to me that that's even possible because the mullahs, as you pointed out earlier, have authorization to lie to the infidel anyway. What do you see is the way out of the situation in Iran right now? Do you think that regime change is absolutely necessary for any sort of lasting peace to take place?
- [33:04]
B
100%. For the last 47 years, Iran has been under Islamic tyranny, under Islamic regime, killing Christians, persecuting people. People cannot choose their faith. People cannot worship God freely. And thank the Lord for President Trump who is not just saying America only. He said America first, but not America only America first. But we care about other nations. Thank God for President Trump who is fighting for the people of Iran to be free. Thank God for President Trump who is fighting for the Christians in Nigeria who are getting slaughtered by the thousands. We as Christians, by the way, we actually don't believe in America, just America first. We believe in Kingdom first. We believe that our brothers all around the world, we just, we have to fight for them and speak up for them. We believe in Kingdom first. We care about our nation, we want America first. But when our brothers in Nigeria are dying, we gotta stand up for them. When our brothers in Iran are dying, we gotta stand up for them. And the only way Iran's gonna be free is for the Islamic regime to fail, for the Islamic regime to be destroyed. And thank God that the ayatollahs have died. And thank God for President Trump was actually strong and courageous. And like, I mean, last time they asked Kamala and Biden, they asked him, what's your message for Iran? And Kamala Harris and Biden, they both said their messages don't. Like, that was their only message is don't. I'm like, what does that even mean?
- [34:27]
A
I don't know.
- [34:28]
B
I don't know. Could they. What's your message to Iran? Kamala Harris said, don't. Biden, what's your message for Iran? Don't. It's like, can you stop talking? And I should do something about it. So thank God for President Trump, who doesn't just talk the talk, but walks the walk and actually is out there to create peace across the nation. So I'm praying for Iran. I'm praying for the people there. The people of Iran have been fighting for a long time to gain freedom, and we got to pray for them, we got to fight for them. And I just pray that they're not going to lose hope because Iranians have fought before for their freedom. It's not the first time. They fought before for their freedom, and the Islamic regime killed them, shot them, and they lost hope, and now they have courage again to fight. So I'm just praying they stay strong.
- [35:10]
A
It's probably not going to happen until the military turns on the mullahs, because as I understand it, the populace doesn't have weapons themselves. So the average person, there's no militia that can bring in a new government. It's probably going to have to happen when they military turns on the mullahs, and that might happen when they're no longer paid. They might go, okay, enough of this. So I don't know what's going to happen, but letting Iran get a nuke is unacceptable. It's been unacceptable for every president. Trump is just the first president to actually physically do something about it. Don't know where it's heading. But if America can't sacrifice 25 or 30 cents a gallon more at the pump in order to ensure Iran doesn't have a nuclear weapon, we're not a serious country.
- [36:01]
B
I mean, you're right 100%. And Donald Trump, President Trump did not start a war with Iran. President Trump is finishing the war with Iran. You have a Bunch of liberals thinking Donald Trump got us in a war we didn't want. Donald Trump got us in a war we didn't like you sent us. No, no, no, no, no. President Trump does not start at war with Iran. Iran has always been in war with the West. Iran shouts death to America. Iran shouts death to the United States. Iran burns the American flag. They burn photos of our president Iran. Iran is not a peaceful country. So them having nuclear weapons is the worst thing that could happen for America. Donald Trump did not start it. He's finishing it. Thank God we. We got rid of the nuclear power. Thank God. Because if Donald Trump did it and next elections a Democrat got in, oh, Lord, we would have been in big trouble. Donald Trump just saved America.
- [37:01]
A
I want to go back to something we touched on briefly in the first podcast, and ladies and gentlemen, you need to listen to the first podcast. We covered a lot of new material there. But I want to go back to something that I've heard, and I just want verification on it from you, Martin. I know that Muslims even fight other Muslims. You've got, you know, the Shia fighting the Sunnis, and the Shia are about 20%. The Sunnis are about 80%. And I want to know, do they have different eschatologies? Because it seems like the Shia want to bring in the 12th Imam, and they think they can do that by starting a world conflict, which means translation, if they get a nuke, they'll take out Israel and they'll try and bring in the caliphate again. That's one reason that they can't have nukes. They'll actually use it in some sort of religious war. Is that as you. Is that how you understand it as well?
- [37:57]
B
From my small knowledge on this specific topic, Islam. Islam's eschatology will not come until Israel is conquered. In fact, Israel existing is a sign that Islam is failing. Every day that Israel exists in is a slap in the face of Allah. Every day that Islam, that Israel exists in the Middle East. And by the way, all my listeners, you gotta understand, Israel's in a very tough spot. They're in the middle of the Middle east, surrounded by Muslim nations. And as long as Israel is there, the Quran is false. As long as Israel exists, Muhammad is false. Because that land belongs to the Muslims and it belongs to Muhammad, and it belongs in their eschatology. So they have to destroy it. They have to build weapons to get rid of Israel. And obviously, they have to build weapons to get rid of the big brother, America, who's helping Israel, who's an ally to Israel. So the Muslims call America the big devil, the big snake, and Israel the little devil and the little snake. So it's a war in the same them fighting Israel, they're gonna fight America. Fighting America, they're gonna fight Israel. And that's why America has to remain allies with is Israel, because they are, they're our only allies in the Middle East. They are moderating the Middle east war and they are kind of, you know, slowing down the Arab world from taking over.
- [39:17]
A
And if you look at the situation there just geographically, I did some research on this recently. I'm looking for the exact figure right now. Egypt is 84 times larger than Israel. Jordan is 10 times larger than Israel. Lebanon is 1.2 times larger than Israel. Syria is about 9 times larger than Israel. These are the Muslim countries surrounding Israel. And we're told Israel must give up land.
- [39:47]
B
Crazy.
- [39:47]
A
I mean, how, how, how? Israel's about the size of New Jersey.
- [39:51]
B
Unbelievable.
- [39:53]
A
And we're told that Israel has to give up land. I know the answer to this. I want to get your perspective on it, though, for our, our listeners. Has there ever been a nation called Palestine?
- [40:04]
B
Yeah. No, there hasn't been a nation of Palestine. There's no archaeological facts. There's nothing. And for all my people, for all my Americans that keep saying, give Palestine back their land, okay, let's assume it was their land. Let's assume, all right, we're gonna give it to them. Will the Muslims give up all the land that they took from the Christians?
- [40:26]
A
Okay, interesting question.
- [40:28]
B
Okay, you want your land, which Palestine doesn't even exist? Okay, we'll give you your land. Okay, we'll play along your false narrative. How about, can you give my country Egypt back to the Christians that owned it in the first place? Can you give Yemen back to the Christians because you conquered Yemen? Muslims, Muslims. Can you give Turkey back to the Christians? Muslims? Can you give Morocco back to the Christians? Muslims. Can you give Iraq back to the Christians? Can you give Iran back to the religion that it originally had? If you're going to play that game, give back their land, which is a false narrative, give back the land to the Christians. Do you know Muhammad owned nothing? Islam owned nothing. And you conquered 70% of the Christian world. I mean, within 100 years of Muhammad's death, Islam conquered nearly 70% of the Christian world. How about you give that back? That's a double standard, Frank. They're never going to give the Christian lands back, and Palestine never existed.
- [41:25]
A
Now, Palestine was actually a name given to the area by hadrian in about 135 AD, the Roman emperor and he. He got it from a variation of the word philistine, because they were the great enemies of the Israelites and he didn't want the Jews coming back to the land, so he named it after their enemies. But there never was a nation known as Palestine. It just never existed. And yet people are trying to create this idea that Palestine was a nation and the people there had their land taken from them. Now, there was a period, as I understand it, in 1948, when Israel came in. The Muslims that were living in that land were told to leave that land because the nations around that land were going to take out the Jews and then they could return. Now, of course, those Muslims left the land and then the Jews fought off those nations, and those people then never were permitted to go back. Although 20% of people that live in Israel now are Jews. We just had a. We just had Jeff on a couple of sessions ago to talk about that, who lives over there in Israel, and he does a ministry out there. 20% of the people that live in Israel are actually Arabs. They're Muslims. And they. They have full voting rights. At one point, I don't know if it's still true, but they had a Muslim on the Supreme Court. We are, we. We all hear this nonsense that Israel is an apartheid state.
- [42:51]
B
Yeah, it's.
- [42:52]
A
It's not an apartheid state. What apartheid state? Saudi Arabia. You can't be a Jew there, you know, you can't be a Jew in these Muslim countries.
- [43:00]
B
Yeah, so. So Muslims claim that Christians are the problem, but they're the ones killing Christians. Muslims claim that the Jews are the problem, but they're the ones that committed October 7th. They're the ones that raped women. They're the ones that mutilated ladies. They're the ones that killed babies and cods. But Jews are the problem. Yeah, Jews are the problem. When was the last time you heard a Jew blow up and kill people in the process? When was the last time you heard of a Christian blow up and kill people in the process? For some reason, every time someone blows up, it's always a Muslim. And I sound. That may sound racist. That's not really racist. That's just facts. You can blame the Jews all you want, mate. Just look at the facts. Jews make up less than 1% of the world population. As you said, Frank, Israel is the size of New Jersey. They only have one state. Like, I mean, Christians, Christianity. We have about 120 Christian nations worldwide. If I'm not mistaken. Muslims have 54 Muslim states worldwide, and the Jews only have one state around the world. And you really got to take that land from. And talking from a biblical theological perspective, as Christians, we believe that that land was promised to Abraham. We believe that that land was promised. And not only that land, if you want to really talk geographically, it wasn't just the land that Israel belongs in now. The land that God promised Israel was a lot bigger than the land they're in now. They're actually not occupying the whole land. They're occupying a small percentage of what God actually promised them. And as you said before, Frank, if you. If Hamas puts down their weapons, there will be peace. But if Israel puts down the weapons, Israel will cease to exist. So we have to just call a spade a spade. Islam is a problem, and wherever Islam goes, there's a problem. I mean, I have. You know, Frank, 20% of my followers on Instagram are Hindus, believe it or not. But 20% of them are Hindus from India because they tell me Muslims are causing a problem for us as well. I get messages all the time from Hindus telling me, thank you for speaking about this. I'm like, man, I'm a Christian. But I get messages from Jews, Hindus, and Christians telling me, thank you for speaking about this. Because Muslims are the common denominator when it comes to violence. Muslims kill Christians, they kill Jews, they kill Hindus, they kill everybody that gets in their ways. It's not Jews or Christians that are
- [45:17]
A
the problem, ladies and gentlemen. Sorry if this is uncomfortable. It just happens to be true. We live in a fallen world. There's evil out there. And we don't advance Christianity. We don't advance truth by denying the truth. This is just the truth. Now, again, there are millions of Muslims who are peaceful that don't believe in violence. The problem is there's a significant minority that do. And even the bigger problem is, is when Islam becomes a majority in a nation, the moderates do not oppose the more violent folks in that country, and Sharia law is put into place. This is not called Islamophobia. This is called reading a history book, ladies and gentlemen. This is just the truth. We're sorry to say it's the truth. We wish it wasn't the truth, but it is the truth. And you don't get anywhere by denying the truth. You've got to deal with the truth. Now, let me caveat this in another way, too, because I want to be fair about this and. And ensure that we cover as many bases as possible. We're not saying that Everything the Israeli government does is right or true. In fact, when we're called to bless Israel, that doesn't mean that you agree with everything Israel does. Just like you don't bless your children by agreeing with everything they do, you correct them when they go wrong. And oh, by the way, when you get the objection, well, you know, Israel's apostate. They're not even Christian believers. How can you support them? News flash. Just about every king in the Old Testament was apostate. And God ultimately judged them, but he didn't say they don't have a right to exist. God may judge the nation of Israel, the current nation of Israel again, but our job is to say they do have a right to exist. They do have a right to that land. And if you don't think so, you just need to read Romans 9 to 11. You can't get around Romans 9 to 11. There is a future for Israel, regardless of your eschatological view. If, if you take Romans 9:11 fairly, there is a future for Israel. Now they have to come to faith just like everybody else in order to be saved. God's not going to force anyone into heaven against their will. They're chosen, but they're not favored. They don't have their own access to. To salvation. They got to go through the Messiah, the Jewish Messiah, just like we do. But we need to be very clear about the idea that the problem in the Middle east and the problem that Israel has to put up with continually is the fact that Islam is at war with Israel and they're at war with the West. Tragically, yes.
- [47:54]
B
And we believe that there is revival coming in Israel if, if you're in.
- [47:58]
A
That's what Romans 11 says.
- [48:00]
B
Yes, exactly. There is revival that is going to come in Israel. God is going to save the Jews. And by the way, we're not saying that Jews are going to heaven. Jews are on their way to hell. They have rejected the Messiah, they have rejected Jesus. And Jesus says, I am the way, the truth and the life, and no one comes to the Father except by me. So the Jews are on their way to hell if they reject the Messiah. We're not saying the Jews are living right. In fact, Tel Aviv has huge pride parades and have accepted homosexuality. They are on their way to hell. But what we are saying is this is our heart loves the Jews and we are praying for their salvation. I can't believe a lot of young people when I tell them, do you want revival in Israel? Do you want the Jews to be saved? They tell me I don't care. I'm like, if you don't care and when I say there is revival coming in Israel, if that doesn't stir your spirit and you crave what I'm telling you right now, there is something wrong with you. You are no longer questioning the government of Israel. Now you have a heart issue and you hate the Jewish people. And there is a huge issue right now in the church, in the American church and the Western church, where people are falling for lies of political commentators. And we have to confront that now and we have to evangelize to Israel so we can save them. Remember, we are not the original branch, we are grafted in. As Romans 9, 11 says, we are not the original branch, we are grafted. And the same way God removed them and they were removed from the vine, God can remove you from the vine. Don't fall in the same pride issue that the Jews fell in. And God will remove you if you fall in that pride issue saying, I'm the new chosen one. No, you're not the new chosen one. God was gracious to you and engrafted you in. And now it's time to pray for them. And God says that our salvation, the Gentiles, the point that the reason God saved you and I as Gentiles is to provoke the Jews to jealousy. God wants to provoke them back to him, provoke them back to his love so they can turn back to Christ.
- [49:57]
A
Ladies and gentlemen, Martin Cedra or Cedra, let me say it right. Martinsedra.com you need to go there. That's my guest today. Obviously a brave man who from personal experience knows that Islam tragically wants to in many cases take over the world and also wants to kill people who are not Muslims. Sorry we have to say this, sorry it's true, but let's. As Rush Limbaugh used to say, this is Realsville. Okay, man, we're just going to tell you the truth. What you do with it is up to you. Pray for Muslims, love them, show them the gospel, show them grace, show them the Islamic dilemma. Talk about the truth of Christianity. And as Martin said before, what we need to do is make sure we vote for freedom, not vote for Sharia law, not vote for politicians are going to allow open borders or unchecked immigration or are going to support abortion. We need to populate the country with babies that are brought up in Christians homes and Christian homes. And we need to make sure that we're not so tolerant our brains fall out, you know, or not so open minded, our brains fall out. Because there's danger in the world, ladies and gentlemen. And we're called to make disciples of all nations, and that includes nations that are Islamic. And we're not going to do that if we don't acknowledge the truth about this. So, Martin, thank you so much for the past two shows. It's been very enlightening. Tell again people where they can learn more about you. And if you have social media out there where people can follow you.
- [51:39]
B
Thank you so much, Frank. What an honor to be with you. You are an inspiration to us. I can't tell you enough how much you bless me. My wife Millicent loves you so much. You have inspired us. You have taught us so much. Thank you for having me. If you want to find me online, you can find me on all platforms. Martin, Cedra Sera or my website, martins.cedra.com. thank you so much. M I. I really appreciate it. All right.
- [52:03]
A
Pray for Martin and his wife Millicent, ladies and gentlemen. It's been great having them on. We'll have them on again, and Lord willing, we'll see you here next time. God bless.